<article>
	<id>http://www.semanticweb.org/ontologies/ConversationInstances.owl#article10_03_28_2017236</id>
	<title>Do Car Safety Problems Come From Outer Space?</title>
	<author>timothy</author>
	<datestamp>1269770280000</datestamp>
	<htmltext><a href="http://hughpickens.com/" rel="nofollow">Hugh Pickens</a> writes <i>"As electronic devices are made to perform more and more functions on smaller circuit chips, the systems become more sensitive and vulnerable to corruption from single event upsets. This is especially true of Toyota, which has <a href="http://www.livescience.com/technology/toyota-recall-cosmic-rays-100326.html">led the auto industry in its widespread inclusion of electronic controls</a> in the manufacture of their various car models. 'These circuit families store not just data, but their basic function electrically,' says Lloyd W. Massengill, director of engineering at the Vanderbilt Institute for Space and Defense Electronics at Vanderbilt University. 'In the unfortunate event of a particle flipping just the right bit, a circuit configured to carry out a benign action may be reprogrammed to carry out some unintended action.'  Denise Chow writes in Live Science that some scientists are <a href="http://www.dallasnews.com/sharedcontent/dws/classifieds/news/automotive/latestnews/stories/DN-detroit\_21bus.ART.State.Edition1.3db2cdb.html">pointing to cosmic ray radiation as a plausible mechanism behind the sudden, unexplained acceleration</a> reported to have occurred with the late model Toyotas."</i></htmltext>
<tokenext>Hugh Pickens writes " As electronic devices are made to perform more and more functions on smaller circuit chips , the systems become more sensitive and vulnerable to corruption from single event upsets .
This is especially true of Toyota , which has led the auto industry in its widespread inclusion of electronic controls in the manufacture of their various car models .
'These circuit families store not just data , but their basic function electrically, ' says Lloyd W. Massengill , director of engineering at the Vanderbilt Institute for Space and Defense Electronics at Vanderbilt University .
'In the unfortunate event of a particle flipping just the right bit , a circuit configured to carry out a benign action may be reprogrammed to carry out some unintended action .
' Denise Chow writes in Live Science that some scientists are pointing to cosmic ray radiation as a plausible mechanism behind the sudden , unexplained acceleration reported to have occurred with the late model Toyotas .
"</tokentext>
<sentencetext>Hugh Pickens writes "As electronic devices are made to perform more and more functions on smaller circuit chips, the systems become more sensitive and vulnerable to corruption from single event upsets.
This is especially true of Toyota, which has led the auto industry in its widespread inclusion of electronic controls in the manufacture of their various car models.
'These circuit families store not just data, but their basic function electrically,' says Lloyd W. Massengill, director of engineering at the Vanderbilt Institute for Space and Defense Electronics at Vanderbilt University.
'In the unfortunate event of a particle flipping just the right bit, a circuit configured to carry out a benign action may be reprogrammed to carry out some unintended action.
'  Denise Chow writes in Live Science that some scientists are pointing to cosmic ray radiation as a plausible mechanism behind the sudden, unexplained acceleration reported to have occurred with the late model Toyotas.
"</sentencetext>
</article>
<comment>
	<id>http://www.semanticweb.org/ontologies/ConversationInstances.owl#comment10_03_28_2017236.31651446</id>
	<title>The "Oh My God" Particle excuse</title>
	<author>Camel Pilot</author>
	<datestamp>1269778740000</datestamp>
	<modclass>None</modclass>
	<modscore>1</modscore>
	<htmltext><p>We had a system quit working that had not been modified in years. Upon investigation the problem was found in a Perl script.  The date on file was years in the past. The error was due to a change to a single character and the character was changed by one bit.  Someone suggested that this was caused by an <a href="http://www.fourmilab.ch/documents/OhMyGodParticle/" title="fourmilab.ch">"Oh-My-God"</a> [fourmilab.ch] particle interaction - who knows?<br>
&nbsp; &nbsp;</p></htmltext>
<tokenext>We had a system quit working that had not been modified in years .
Upon investigation the problem was found in a Perl script .
The date on file was years in the past .
The error was due to a change to a single character and the character was changed by one bit .
Someone suggested that this was caused by an " Oh-My-God " [ fourmilab.ch ] particle interaction - who knows ?
   </tokentext>
<sentencetext>We had a system quit working that had not been modified in years.
Upon investigation the problem was found in a Perl script.
The date on file was years in the past.
The error was due to a change to a single character and the character was changed by one bit.
Someone suggested that this was caused by an "Oh-My-God" [fourmilab.ch] particle interaction - who knows?
   </sentencetext>
</comment>
<comment>
	<id>http://www.semanticweb.org/ontologies/ConversationInstances.owl#comment10_03_28_2017236.31671780</id>
	<title>Stats on toyota issues vs age/country?</title>
	<author>Fastfwd</author>
	<datestamp>1269967200000</datestamp>
	<modclass>None</modclass>
	<modscore>1</modscore>
	<htmltext><p>I have only seen a single news source doing stats on this and it pointed to the fact that the problem seems to discriminate by age even after accounting for age repartition among toyota owners.</p><p>It seems to me that seeing a simple review of accidents blamed on this correlated with age/country could easily disprove the whole thing unless it's a real problem. My gut tells me that somehow the problem would happen mostly to older people as 2 persons already demonstrated but also that it seems to happen mostly in the USA where the media is milking this story.</p></htmltext>
<tokenext>I have only seen a single news source doing stats on this and it pointed to the fact that the problem seems to discriminate by age even after accounting for age repartition among toyota owners.It seems to me that seeing a simple review of accidents blamed on this correlated with age/country could easily disprove the whole thing unless it 's a real problem .
My gut tells me that somehow the problem would happen mostly to older people as 2 persons already demonstrated but also that it seems to happen mostly in the USA where the media is milking this story .</tokentext>
<sentencetext>I have only seen a single news source doing stats on this and it pointed to the fact that the problem seems to discriminate by age even after accounting for age repartition among toyota owners.It seems to me that seeing a simple review of accidents blamed on this correlated with age/country could easily disprove the whole thing unless it's a real problem.
My gut tells me that somehow the problem would happen mostly to older people as 2 persons already demonstrated but also that it seems to happen mostly in the USA where the media is milking this story.</sentencetext>
</comment>
<comment>
	<id>http://www.semanticweb.org/ontologies/ConversationInstances.owl#comment10_03_28_2017236.31651266</id>
	<title>Re:I was proofed right</title>
	<author>Anonymous</author>
	<datestamp>1269777300000</datestamp>
	<modclass>None</modclass>
	<modscore>0</modscore>
	<htmltext><p>Actually, you'd be surprised at what a decent anti-materiel rifle can do to your slant six, to say nothing of a GPMG if collateral damage is deemed unimportant in the circumstances.</p><p>Signed, your local corrupt police sniper.</p></htmltext>
<tokenext>Actually , you 'd be surprised at what a decent anti-materiel rifle can do to your slant six , to say nothing of a GPMG if collateral damage is deemed unimportant in the circumstances.Signed , your local corrupt police sniper .</tokentext>
<sentencetext>Actually, you'd be surprised at what a decent anti-materiel rifle can do to your slant six, to say nothing of a GPMG if collateral damage is deemed unimportant in the circumstances.Signed, your local corrupt police sniper.</sentencetext>
	<parent>http://www.semanticweb.org/ontologies/ConversationInstances.owl#comment10_03_28_2017236.31651168</parent>
</comment>
<comment>
	<id>http://www.semanticweb.org/ontologies/ConversationInstances.owl#comment10_03_28_2017236.31656458</id>
	<title>Re:Weird</title>
	<author>Anonymous</author>
	<datestamp>1269874560000</datestamp>
	<modclass>None</modclass>
	<modscore>0</modscore>
	<htmltext><p>yes they are,  if its not a sports car (and that's becoming rare) it has an automatic.</p></htmltext>
<tokenext>yes they are , if its not a sports car ( and that 's becoming rare ) it has an automatic .</tokentext>
<sentencetext>yes they are,  if its not a sports car (and that's becoming rare) it has an automatic.</sentencetext>
	<parent>http://www.semanticweb.org/ontologies/ConversationInstances.owl#comment10_03_28_2017236.31654692</parent>
</comment>
<comment>
	<id>http://www.semanticweb.org/ontologies/ConversationInstances.owl#comment10_03_28_2017236.31653818</id>
	<title>Hmm...</title>
	<author>lennier1</author>
	<datestamp>1269803340000</datestamp>
	<modclass>None</modclass>
	<modscore>1</modscore>
	<htmltext><p>I'm sure there's a connection to Xenu in there.</p></htmltext>
<tokenext>I 'm sure there 's a connection to Xenu in there .</tokentext>
<sentencetext>I'm sure there's a connection to Xenu in there.</sentencetext>
</comment>
<comment>
	<id>http://www.semanticweb.org/ontologies/ConversationInstances.owl#comment10_03_28_2017236.31657604</id>
	<title>backup program about safely shutting down the car.</title>
	<author>Anonymous</author>
	<datestamp>1269879360000</datestamp>
	<modclass>None</modclass>
	<modscore>0</modscore>
	<htmltext><p>do we really fucking need this in our cars?</p><p>
&nbsp; WTF, can we just not have a few critical systems untouched by code, its fucking overkill,</p><p>Be it on/off, throttle, shiting, braking and steering, leave it alone</p></htmltext>
<tokenext>do we really fucking need this in our cars ?
  WTF , can we just not have a few critical systems untouched by code , its fucking overkill,Be it on/off , throttle , shiting , braking and steering , leave it alone</tokentext>
<sentencetext>do we really fucking need this in our cars?
  WTF, can we just not have a few critical systems untouched by code, its fucking overkill,Be it on/off, throttle, shiting, braking and steering, leave it alone</sentencetext>
</comment>
<comment>
	<id>http://www.semanticweb.org/ontologies/ConversationInstances.owl#comment10_03_28_2017236.31650992</id>
	<title>So ?</title>
	<author>Anonymous</author>
	<datestamp>1269775260000</datestamp>
	<modclass>None</modclass>
	<modscore>0</modscore>
	<htmltext><p>Yes the universal instruction in action "JFM" Jump and F*** Memory.</p><p>So what ?, embedded programmers have been dealing with this for years.</p><p>The minimum fix would be a hardware watchdog circuit.<br>Add to that defensive software - pack all unused memory with noops followed by jumps to a restart routine , if necessary make space in the code for those.</p><p>It's not - oh yeah sorry it *IS* rocket science folks - if Toyota were actually stupid enough to trust the processors to behave properly all the time then they are probably negligent. It wouldn't be a surprise - they've probably drunk the cool-aid and migrated to high level languages and believed the hardware manufacturers - but the problem and the solutions have been available for a loooong time.</p></htmltext>
<tokenext>Yes the universal instruction in action " JFM " Jump and F * * * Memory.So what ? , embedded programmers have been dealing with this for years.The minimum fix would be a hardware watchdog circuit.Add to that defensive software - pack all unused memory with noops followed by jumps to a restart routine , if necessary make space in the code for those.It 's not - oh yeah sorry it * IS * rocket science folks - if Toyota were actually stupid enough to trust the processors to behave properly all the time then they are probably negligent .
It would n't be a surprise - they 've probably drunk the cool-aid and migrated to high level languages and believed the hardware manufacturers - but the problem and the solutions have been available for a loooong time .</tokentext>
<sentencetext>Yes the universal instruction in action "JFM" Jump and F*** Memory.So what ?, embedded programmers have been dealing with this for years.The minimum fix would be a hardware watchdog circuit.Add to that defensive software - pack all unused memory with noops followed by jumps to a restart routine , if necessary make space in the code for those.It's not - oh yeah sorry it *IS* rocket science folks - if Toyota were actually stupid enough to trust the processors to behave properly all the time then they are probably negligent.
It wouldn't be a surprise - they've probably drunk the cool-aid and migrated to high level languages and believed the hardware manufacturers - but the problem and the solutions have been available for a loooong time.</sentencetext>
</comment>
<comment>
	<id>http://www.semanticweb.org/ontologies/ConversationInstances.owl#comment10_03_28_2017236.31652844</id>
	<title>Re:Why they tell you to turn off your phone...</title>
	<author>dudpixel</author>
	<datestamp>1269792840000</datestamp>
	<modclass>None</modclass>
	<modscore>1</modscore>
	<htmltext><p>how about a big red button on the dash that allows some kind of manual override...</p><p>The point is that there shouldn't be a single point of failure in any electronics where human life is placed in its hands.  If one component fails, it shouldn't bring down the entire system.  We still cant get that right on computers.</p></htmltext>
<tokenext>how about a big red button on the dash that allows some kind of manual override...The point is that there should n't be a single point of failure in any electronics where human life is placed in its hands .
If one component fails , it should n't bring down the entire system .
We still cant get that right on computers .</tokentext>
<sentencetext>how about a big red button on the dash that allows some kind of manual override...The point is that there shouldn't be a single point of failure in any electronics where human life is placed in its hands.
If one component fails, it shouldn't bring down the entire system.
We still cant get that right on computers.</sentencetext>
	<parent>http://www.semanticweb.org/ontologies/ConversationInstances.owl#comment10_03_28_2017236.31650922</parent>
</comment>
<comment>
	<id>http://www.semanticweb.org/ontologies/ConversationInstances.owl#comment10_03_28_2017236.31651286</id>
	<title>Re:No.</title>
	<author>Anonymous</author>
	<datestamp>1269777600000</datestamp>
	<modclass>Interestin</modclass>
	<modscore>1</modscore>
	<htmltext><p><div class="quote"><p>There's a reason it's always hitting the same system in the car.</p></div><p>It may be that the system or packaging in which the processor or memory is embedded emits alpha particles at an unusually high rate. It wouldn't be the first instance of that happening.</p></div>
	</htmltext>
<tokenext>There 's a reason it 's always hitting the same system in the car.It may be that the system or packaging in which the processor or memory is embedded emits alpha particles at an unusually high rate .
It would n't be the first instance of that happening .</tokentext>
<sentencetext>There's a reason it's always hitting the same system in the car.It may be that the system or packaging in which the processor or memory is embedded emits alpha particles at an unusually high rate.
It wouldn't be the first instance of that happening.
	</sentencetext>
	<parent>http://www.semanticweb.org/ontologies/ConversationInstances.owl#comment10_03_28_2017236.31650804</parent>
</comment>
<comment>
	<id>http://www.semanticweb.org/ontologies/ConversationInstances.owl#comment10_03_28_2017236.31655688</id>
	<title>Re:Weird</title>
	<author>Anonymous</author>
	<datestamp>1269870180000</datestamp>
	<modclass>None</modclass>
	<modscore>0</modscore>
	<htmltext><p>No. Just common sense.</p></htmltext>
<tokenext>No .
Just common sense .</tokentext>
<sentencetext>No.
Just common sense.</sentencetext>
	<parent>http://www.semanticweb.org/ontologies/ConversationInstances.owl#comment10_03_28_2017236.31654692</parent>
</comment>
<comment>
	<id>http://www.semanticweb.org/ontologies/ConversationInstances.owl#comment10_03_28_2017236.31650854</id>
	<title>Checksums?</title>
	<author>game kid</author>
	<datestamp>1269774480000</datestamp>
	<modclass>None</modclass>
	<modscore>1</modscore>
	<htmltext><blockquote><div><p> 'These circuit families store not just data, but their basic function electrically,' says Lloyd W. Massengill, director of engineering at the Vanderbilt Institute for Space and Defense Electronics at Vanderbilt University. 'In the unfortunate event of a particle flipping just the right bit, a circuit configured to carry out a benign action may be reprogrammed to carry out some unintended action.'</p></div></blockquote><p>Shouldn't there then be a well-insulated ROM copy in the car that can replace corrupt values with reasonable defaults from time to time, or a "Check Chips at Mechanic" light that, well, tells the driver to send the car with its chips to the mechanic?</p><p>--and <em>bloody Hell</em>, change that <a href="http://www.google.com/search?q=massengill+douche" title="google.com">family name</a> [google.com] before your discoveries end up on Slashdot!</p></div>
	</htmltext>
<tokenext>'These circuit families store not just data , but their basic function electrically, ' says Lloyd W. Massengill , director of engineering at the Vanderbilt Institute for Space and Defense Electronics at Vanderbilt University .
'In the unfortunate event of a particle flipping just the right bit , a circuit configured to carry out a benign action may be reprogrammed to carry out some unintended action .
'Should n't there then be a well-insulated ROM copy in the car that can replace corrupt values with reasonable defaults from time to time , or a " Check Chips at Mechanic " light that , well , tells the driver to send the car with its chips to the mechanic ? --and bloody Hell , change that family name [ google.com ] before your discoveries end up on Slashdot !</tokentext>
<sentencetext> 'These circuit families store not just data, but their basic function electrically,' says Lloyd W. Massengill, director of engineering at the Vanderbilt Institute for Space and Defense Electronics at Vanderbilt University.
'In the unfortunate event of a particle flipping just the right bit, a circuit configured to carry out a benign action may be reprogrammed to carry out some unintended action.
'Shouldn't there then be a well-insulated ROM copy in the car that can replace corrupt values with reasonable defaults from time to time, or a "Check Chips at Mechanic" light that, well, tells the driver to send the car with its chips to the mechanic?--and bloody Hell, change that family name [google.com] before your discoveries end up on Slashdot!
	</sentencetext>
</comment>
<comment>
	<id>http://www.semanticweb.org/ontologies/ConversationInstances.owl#comment10_03_28_2017236.31651128</id>
	<title>Voting logic needed</title>
	<author>DigiShaman</author>
	<datestamp>1269776220000</datestamp>
	<modclass>None</modclass>
	<modscore>1</modscore>
	<htmltext><p>Why not just have three ECUs instead of just one? Just link them up and apply some voting logic. Two of the three will provide the right answer. If all three disagree, a fail-safe goes into action and all three ECUs process data on the next round of sensory input.</p></htmltext>
<tokenext>Why not just have three ECUs instead of just one ?
Just link them up and apply some voting logic .
Two of the three will provide the right answer .
If all three disagree , a fail-safe goes into action and all three ECUs process data on the next round of sensory input .</tokentext>
<sentencetext>Why not just have three ECUs instead of just one?
Just link them up and apply some voting logic.
Two of the three will provide the right answer.
If all three disagree, a fail-safe goes into action and all three ECUs process data on the next round of sensory input.</sentencetext>
</comment>
<comment>
	<id>http://www.semanticweb.org/ontologies/ConversationInstances.owl#comment10_03_28_2017236.31652664</id>
	<title>Re:Checksums?</title>
	<author>Anonymous</author>
	<datestamp>1269790320000</datestamp>
	<modclass>None</modclass>
	<modscore>0</modscore>
	<htmltext><p><div class="quote"><p>--and bloody Hell, change that family name [google.com] before your discoveries end up on Slashdot!</p></div><p>Sure, you're the kind of insensitive bloke that tells poor <a href="http://www.google.com/search?hl=en&amp;rlz=1G1GGLQ\_ENUS240&amp;q=gaylord+crapper&amp;aq=f&amp;aqi=&amp;aql=&amp;oq=&amp;gs\_rfai=" title="google.com" rel="nofollow">Gaylord Crapper</a> [google.com] to change his name.</p><p><nobr> <wbr></nobr></p><div class="quote"><p>...or a "Check Chips at Mechanic" light that, well, tells the driver to send the car with its chips to the mechanic?</p></div><p>It would be just like the "Service Engine" light, completely ignored. It'd be better if some part of the dash made realistic popping noises, and emitted foul odors. And, if that was ignored for a week, <a href="http://images.google.com/imgres?imgurl=http://www.techfix.net/stuff/monkeydrown.jpg&amp;imgrefurl=http://ihatehumans.org/&amp;usg=\_\_wrZuH4caD5xK0jr\_9ihO05kirkU=&amp;h=400&amp;w=341&amp;sz=43&amp;hl=en&amp;start=6&amp;um=1&amp;itbs=1&amp;tbnid=MVQFUGBRezsubM:&amp;tbnh=124&amp;tbnw=106&amp;prev=/images\%3Fq\%3D\%2522die\%2Bhumans\%2522\%26um\%3D1\%26hl\%3Den\%26rlz\%3D1G1GGLQ\_ENUS240\%26tbs\%3Disch:1" title="google.com" rel="nofollow">a secret compartment</a> [google.com] would open and release this, to end the car's problem.</p></div>
	</htmltext>
<tokenext>--and bloody Hell , change that family name [ google.com ] before your discoveries end up on Slashdot ! Sure , you 're the kind of insensitive bloke that tells poor Gaylord Crapper [ google.com ] to change his name .
...or a " Check Chips at Mechanic " light that , well , tells the driver to send the car with its chips to the mechanic ? It would be just like the " Service Engine " light , completely ignored .
It 'd be better if some part of the dash made realistic popping noises , and emitted foul odors .
And , if that was ignored for a week , a secret compartment [ google.com ] would open and release this , to end the car 's problem .</tokentext>
<sentencetext>--and bloody Hell, change that family name [google.com] before your discoveries end up on Slashdot!Sure, you're the kind of insensitive bloke that tells poor Gaylord Crapper [google.com] to change his name.
...or a "Check Chips at Mechanic" light that, well, tells the driver to send the car with its chips to the mechanic?It would be just like the "Service Engine" light, completely ignored.
It'd be better if some part of the dash made realistic popping noises, and emitted foul odors.
And, if that was ignored for a week, a secret compartment [google.com] would open and release this, to end the car's problem.
	</sentencetext>
	<parent>http://www.semanticweb.org/ontologies/ConversationInstances.owl#comment10_03_28_2017236.31650854</parent>
</comment>
<comment>
	<id>http://www.semanticweb.org/ontologies/ConversationInstances.owl#comment10_03_28_2017236.31651194</id>
	<title>Re:Why they tell you to turn off your phone...</title>
	<author>Anonymous</author>
	<datestamp>1269776760000</datestamp>
	<modclass>Informativ</modclass>
	<modscore>4</modscore>
	<htmltext><p>If red cars are an indication of the problem, it's more widespread than engineers used to believe. On a more serious note: Fault tolerant design is the answer. Have three systems calculate the result (ideally using three different algorithms) and let them vote on the correct result. Don't assume that a set state persists, recalculate frequently and set the state even if it should be already set. Feed the control and the sensor data into a watchdog circuit (in triplicate...) to detect mismatches. Etc.</p></htmltext>
<tokenext>If red cars are an indication of the problem , it 's more widespread than engineers used to believe .
On a more serious note : Fault tolerant design is the answer .
Have three systems calculate the result ( ideally using three different algorithms ) and let them vote on the correct result .
Do n't assume that a set state persists , recalculate frequently and set the state even if it should be already set .
Feed the control and the sensor data into a watchdog circuit ( in triplicate... ) to detect mismatches .
Etc .</tokentext>
<sentencetext>If red cars are an indication of the problem, it's more widespread than engineers used to believe.
On a more serious note: Fault tolerant design is the answer.
Have three systems calculate the result (ideally using three different algorithms) and let them vote on the correct result.
Don't assume that a set state persists, recalculate frequently and set the state even if it should be already set.
Feed the control and the sensor data into a watchdog circuit (in triplicate...) to detect mismatches.
Etc.</sentencetext>
	<parent>http://www.semanticweb.org/ontologies/ConversationInstances.owl#comment10_03_28_2017236.31650906</parent>
</comment>
<comment>
	<id>http://www.semanticweb.org/ontologies/ConversationInstances.owl#comment10_03_28_2017236.31653228</id>
	<title>Ionizing v/s Non-Ionizing</title>
	<author>Ozoner</author>
	<datestamp>1269796500000</datestamp>
	<modclass>None</modclass>
	<modscore>1</modscore>
	<htmltext><p>I realise that I'm wasting my breath, but it is appalling how ignorant most SlashDot posters are when it comes to basic science.</p><p>For what it's worth:</p><p>Electromagnetic radiation (from cell phones, RFID, etc) is non-ionising. EM Interference (EMI) is well understood and manufactures go to enormous lengths to design out (and test for) EMI, especially with critical automotive systems.</p><p>Cosmic rays are in the completely different category of Ionizing radiation. This is also well understood, and is carefully considered in the design of critical systems (especially space craft, planes and military).</p><p>If Cosmic rays could seriously affect the relatively simple electronics in cars, then your (much more complex) desktop computer would be completely unusable.</p></htmltext>
<tokenext>I realise that I 'm wasting my breath , but it is appalling how ignorant most SlashDot posters are when it comes to basic science.For what it 's worth : Electromagnetic radiation ( from cell phones , RFID , etc ) is non-ionising .
EM Interference ( EMI ) is well understood and manufactures go to enormous lengths to design out ( and test for ) EMI , especially with critical automotive systems.Cosmic rays are in the completely different category of Ionizing radiation .
This is also well understood , and is carefully considered in the design of critical systems ( especially space craft , planes and military ) .If Cosmic rays could seriously affect the relatively simple electronics in cars , then your ( much more complex ) desktop computer would be completely unusable .</tokentext>
<sentencetext>I realise that I'm wasting my breath, but it is appalling how ignorant most SlashDot posters are when it comes to basic science.For what it's worth:Electromagnetic radiation (from cell phones, RFID, etc) is non-ionising.
EM Interference (EMI) is well understood and manufactures go to enormous lengths to design out (and test for) EMI, especially with critical automotive systems.Cosmic rays are in the completely different category of Ionizing radiation.
This is also well understood, and is carefully considered in the design of critical systems (especially space craft, planes and military).If Cosmic rays could seriously affect the relatively simple electronics in cars, then your (much more complex) desktop computer would be completely unusable.</sentencetext>
</comment>
<comment>
	<id>http://www.semanticweb.org/ontologies/ConversationInstances.owl#comment10_03_28_2017236.31652674</id>
	<title>Re:Why they tell you to turn off your phone...</title>
	<author>countertrolling</author>
	<datestamp>1269790380000</datestamp>
	<modclass>None</modclass>
	<modscore>1</modscore>
	<htmltext><p>Won't work. The controlling computer will just filibuster..</p></htmltext>
<tokenext>Wo n't work .
The controlling computer will just filibuster. .</tokentext>
<sentencetext>Won't work.
The controlling computer will just filibuster..</sentencetext>
	<parent>http://www.semanticweb.org/ontologies/ConversationInstances.owl#comment10_03_28_2017236.31650922</parent>
</comment>
<comment>
	<id>http://www.semanticweb.org/ontologies/ConversationInstances.owl#comment10_03_28_2017236.31663834</id>
	<title>Re:Weird</title>
	<author>cffrost</author>
	<datestamp>1269865080000</datestamp>
	<modclass>None</modclass>
	<modscore>1</modscore>
	<htmltext><p><div class="quote"><p>Are manual gearboxes that rare in the States?</p></div><p>Yes. The added burden of shifting makes holding a beer or telephone damn near impossible.</p></div>
	</htmltext>
<tokenext>Are manual gearboxes that rare in the States ? Yes .
The added burden of shifting makes holding a beer or telephone damn near impossible .</tokentext>
<sentencetext>Are manual gearboxes that rare in the States?Yes.
The added burden of shifting makes holding a beer or telephone damn near impossible.
	</sentencetext>
	<parent>http://www.semanticweb.org/ontologies/ConversationInstances.owl#comment10_03_28_2017236.31654692</parent>
</comment>
<comment>
	<id>http://www.semanticweb.org/ontologies/ConversationInstances.owl#comment10_03_28_2017236.31655038</id>
	<title>Re:Is there realy a problem?</title>
	<author>Anonymous</author>
	<datestamp>1269863520000</datestamp>
	<modclass>None</modclass>
	<modscore>0</modscore>
	<htmltext><p>Its more difficult for most people than you think.  For three years I worked for a car wash that had a conveyor that pulled the cars through.  With a big flashing neon sign that TOLD the customers in no uncertain terms, "Vehicle In Neutral, Foot Off Brake, DO NOT Touch Steering Wheel."  Yet almost 1 in 4 drivers thought park was neutral and would get seriously offended when I tried to explain it to them.  And most of the time, once they figured out that park is not neutral, they shifted to neutral and promptly engaged the parking brake because their car might roll in neutral.  Which opened a whole other can of worms when I tried to explain why its not good to forcibly drag their car through the wash with the parking brake on.  There were even several times when the customer would put the car in neutral until they got in the wash, then hit the brakes or put it in park causing the next car to be pulled into them. Individuals can be smart, but people are STOOPID.  Especially when they think they are right.</p></htmltext>
<tokenext>Its more difficult for most people than you think .
For three years I worked for a car wash that had a conveyor that pulled the cars through .
With a big flashing neon sign that TOLD the customers in no uncertain terms , " Vehicle In Neutral , Foot Off Brake , DO NOT Touch Steering Wheel .
" Yet almost 1 in 4 drivers thought park was neutral and would get seriously offended when I tried to explain it to them .
And most of the time , once they figured out that park is not neutral , they shifted to neutral and promptly engaged the parking brake because their car might roll in neutral .
Which opened a whole other can of worms when I tried to explain why its not good to forcibly drag their car through the wash with the parking brake on .
There were even several times when the customer would put the car in neutral until they got in the wash , then hit the brakes or put it in park causing the next car to be pulled into them .
Individuals can be smart , but people are STOOPID .
Especially when they think they are right .</tokentext>
<sentencetext>Its more difficult for most people than you think.
For three years I worked for a car wash that had a conveyor that pulled the cars through.
With a big flashing neon sign that TOLD the customers in no uncertain terms, "Vehicle In Neutral, Foot Off Brake, DO NOT Touch Steering Wheel.
"  Yet almost 1 in 4 drivers thought park was neutral and would get seriously offended when I tried to explain it to them.
And most of the time, once they figured out that park is not neutral, they shifted to neutral and promptly engaged the parking brake because their car might roll in neutral.
Which opened a whole other can of worms when I tried to explain why its not good to forcibly drag their car through the wash with the parking brake on.
There were even several times when the customer would put the car in neutral until they got in the wash, then hit the brakes or put it in park causing the next car to be pulled into them.
Individuals can be smart, but people are STOOPID.
Especially when they think they are right.</sentencetext>
	<parent>http://www.semanticweb.org/ontologies/ConversationInstances.owl#comment10_03_28_2017236.31651856</parent>
</comment>
<comment>
	<id>http://www.semanticweb.org/ontologies/ConversationInstances.owl#comment10_03_28_2017236.31655012</id>
	<title>Or</title>
	<author>kc2keo</author>
	<datestamp>1269863220000</datestamp>
	<modclass>None</modclass>
	<modscore>1</modscore>
	<htmltext>We could simply replace some of the electronic drive-by-wire systems with traditional mechanical ones. There problem solved. Don't need any fancy electrical error checking and less complicated systems=easier to fix.</htmltext>
<tokenext>We could simply replace some of the electronic drive-by-wire systems with traditional mechanical ones .
There problem solved .
Do n't need any fancy electrical error checking and less complicated systems = easier to fix .</tokentext>
<sentencetext>We could simply replace some of the electronic drive-by-wire systems with traditional mechanical ones.
There problem solved.
Don't need any fancy electrical error checking and less complicated systems=easier to fix.</sentencetext>
</comment>
<comment>
	<id>http://www.semanticweb.org/ontologies/ConversationInstances.owl#comment10_03_28_2017236.31651050</id>
	<title>Problem IS from outer space...</title>
	<author>AliasMarlowe</author>
	<datestamp>1269775560000</datestamp>
	<modclass>Funny</modclass>
	<modscore>2</modscore>
	<htmltext><p><div class="quote"><p>Since the biggest Toyota runaway story has turned out to be a problem exists between seat and pedals situation..</p></div><p>Ignorant alien between seat and pedals. Toyotas were designed for humans to drive. 'nuff said.</p></div>
	</htmltext>
<tokenext>Since the biggest Toyota runaway story has turned out to be a problem exists between seat and pedals situation..Ignorant alien between seat and pedals .
Toyotas were designed for humans to drive .
'nuff said .</tokentext>
<sentencetext>Since the biggest Toyota runaway story has turned out to be a problem exists between seat and pedals situation..Ignorant alien between seat and pedals.
Toyotas were designed for humans to drive.
'nuff said.
	</sentencetext>
	<parent>http://www.semanticweb.org/ontologies/ConversationInstances.owl#comment10_03_28_2017236.31650786</parent>
</comment>
<comment>
	<id>http://www.semanticweb.org/ontologies/ConversationInstances.owl#comment10_03_28_2017236.31650752</id>
	<title>Why they tell you to turn off your phone...</title>
	<author>LostCluster</author>
	<datestamp>1269773880000</datestamp>
	<modclass>Informativ</modclass>
	<modscore>5</modscore>
	<htmltext><p>Interference from radiation doesn't just come from outer space, it comes from cell phones, TV/radio stations, microwaves.... you see where this is going. I once worked in an office where there was a cell phone relay antenna too close to a PC, and we were constantly reinstalling the OS until I told them to move things around in the area.</p><p>Thing is, when Windows gets a corrupted OS... it BSODs and we move on. Single-bit errors shouldn't send the car out of control... there should be some checksum that shouldn't add up. When a fault is detected, it should go to a backup program about safely shutting down the car.</p></htmltext>
<tokenext>Interference from radiation does n't just come from outer space , it comes from cell phones , TV/radio stations , microwaves.... you see where this is going .
I once worked in an office where there was a cell phone relay antenna too close to a PC , and we were constantly reinstalling the OS until I told them to move things around in the area.Thing is , when Windows gets a corrupted OS... it BSODs and we move on .
Single-bit errors should n't send the car out of control... there should be some checksum that should n't add up .
When a fault is detected , it should go to a backup program about safely shutting down the car .</tokentext>
<sentencetext>Interference from radiation doesn't just come from outer space, it comes from cell phones, TV/radio stations, microwaves.... you see where this is going.
I once worked in an office where there was a cell phone relay antenna too close to a PC, and we were constantly reinstalling the OS until I told them to move things around in the area.Thing is, when Windows gets a corrupted OS... it BSODs and we move on.
Single-bit errors shouldn't send the car out of control... there should be some checksum that shouldn't add up.
When a fault is detected, it should go to a backup program about safely shutting down the car.</sentencetext>
</comment>
<comment>
	<id>http://www.semanticweb.org/ontologies/ConversationInstances.owl#comment10_03_28_2017236.31655172</id>
	<title>Re:Is there realy a problem?</title>
	<author>osu-neko</author>
	<datestamp>1269864960000</datestamp>
	<modclass>None</modclass>
	<modscore>1</modscore>
	<htmltext><p><div class="quote"><p>I've personally felt like the whole thing was a scam from the beginning. But I tend to be skeptical of government in general. I just feel like it's easier to run a smear campaign on Toyota than to fix the reputations of General Motors and Ford.<nobr> <wbr></nobr>...</p></div><p>I'm sorry, but you're misusing the word "skeptical".  It is not a synonym for "paranoid kook".</p></div>
	</htmltext>
<tokenext>I 've personally felt like the whole thing was a scam from the beginning .
But I tend to be skeptical of government in general .
I just feel like it 's easier to run a smear campaign on Toyota than to fix the reputations of General Motors and Ford .
...I 'm sorry , but you 're misusing the word " skeptical " .
It is not a synonym for " paranoid kook " .</tokentext>
<sentencetext>I've personally felt like the whole thing was a scam from the beginning.
But I tend to be skeptical of government in general.
I just feel like it's easier to run a smear campaign on Toyota than to fix the reputations of General Motors and Ford.
...I'm sorry, but you're misusing the word "skeptical".
It is not a synonym for "paranoid kook".
	</sentencetext>
	<parent>http://www.semanticweb.org/ontologies/ConversationInstances.owl#comment10_03_28_2017236.31651970</parent>
</comment>
<comment>
	<id>http://www.semanticweb.org/ontologies/ConversationInstances.owl#comment10_03_28_2017236.31650804</id>
	<title>No.</title>
	<author>stonecypher</author>
	<datestamp>1269774180000</datestamp>
	<modclass>Insightful</modclass>
	<modscore>4</modscore>
	<htmltext><p>There's a reason that our entire modern world doesn't come crashing to a halt around us every 30 seconds.  If every CPU was vulnerable to bit flips from random radiation, every part of your house would be on fire and arcing electricity.  Times Square would look like the bridge of the 60s enterprise under attack.</p><p>This is just some douchebag professor trying to ride the tragedies to fame.  There's a reason it's always hitting the same system in the car.  It's because the system is defective.  There's a reason the professor has nothing but speculation to back himself up.</p><p>This is the worst kind of charlatanry from someone who should know better.  I hope his hosting school takes this very, very seriously.</p></htmltext>
<tokenext>There 's a reason that our entire modern world does n't come crashing to a halt around us every 30 seconds .
If every CPU was vulnerable to bit flips from random radiation , every part of your house would be on fire and arcing electricity .
Times Square would look like the bridge of the 60s enterprise under attack.This is just some douchebag professor trying to ride the tragedies to fame .
There 's a reason it 's always hitting the same system in the car .
It 's because the system is defective .
There 's a reason the professor has nothing but speculation to back himself up.This is the worst kind of charlatanry from someone who should know better .
I hope his hosting school takes this very , very seriously .</tokentext>
<sentencetext>There's a reason that our entire modern world doesn't come crashing to a halt around us every 30 seconds.
If every CPU was vulnerable to bit flips from random radiation, every part of your house would be on fire and arcing electricity.
Times Square would look like the bridge of the 60s enterprise under attack.This is just some douchebag professor trying to ride the tragedies to fame.
There's a reason it's always hitting the same system in the car.
It's because the system is defective.
There's a reason the professor has nothing but speculation to back himself up.This is the worst kind of charlatanry from someone who should know better.
I hope his hosting school takes this very, very seriously.</sentencetext>
</comment>
<comment>
	<id>http://www.semanticweb.org/ontologies/ConversationInstances.owl#comment10_03_28_2017236.31650906</id>
	<title>Re:Why they tell you to turn off your phone...</title>
	<author>beakerMeep</author>
	<datestamp>1269774780000</datestamp>
	<modclass>None</modclass>
	<modscore>1</modscore>
	<htmltext>Redundancy.  You have a second car follow you around in case one of the bit of the first car goes rouge or 'evil'</htmltext>
<tokenext>Redundancy .
You have a second car follow you around in case one of the bit of the first car goes rouge or 'evil'</tokentext>
<sentencetext>Redundancy.
You have a second car follow you around in case one of the bit of the first car goes rouge or 'evil'</sentencetext>
	<parent>http://www.semanticweb.org/ontologies/ConversationInstances.owl#comment10_03_28_2017236.31650848</parent>
</comment>
<comment>
	<id>http://www.semanticweb.org/ontologies/ConversationInstances.owl#comment10_03_28_2017236.31655128</id>
	<title>Re:How about safe languages?</title>
	<author>WarpGiGA</author>
	<datestamp>1269864480000</datestamp>
	<modclass>None</modclass>
	<modscore>1</modscore>
	<htmltext><p>Redundant systems on various platforms is clearly needed for a car to be fully safe!</p></htmltext>
<tokenext>Redundant systems on various platforms is clearly needed for a car to be fully safe !</tokentext>
<sentencetext>Redundant systems on various platforms is clearly needed for a car to be fully safe!</sentencetext>
	<parent>http://www.semanticweb.org/ontologies/ConversationInstances.owl#comment10_03_28_2017236.31650884</parent>
</comment>
<comment>
	<id>http://www.semanticweb.org/ontologies/ConversationInstances.owl#comment10_03_28_2017236.31652520</id>
	<title>Re:Space Rays, My Ass</title>
	<author>Anonymous</author>
	<datestamp>1269789060000</datestamp>
	<modclass>None</modclass>
	<modscore>0</modscore>
	<htmltext><p>LIAR!!!! Its aliens and you know it! Stop covering them up you government spy you!!</p></htmltext>
<tokenext>LIAR ! ! ! !
Its aliens and you know it !
Stop covering them up you government spy you !
!</tokentext>
<sentencetext>LIAR!!!!
Its aliens and you know it!
Stop covering them up you government spy you!
!</sentencetext>
	<parent>http://www.semanticweb.org/ontologies/ConversationInstances.owl#comment10_03_28_2017236.31650852</parent>
</comment>
<comment>
	<id>http://www.semanticweb.org/ontologies/ConversationInstances.owl#comment10_03_28_2017236.31650974</id>
	<title>Hardened cars?</title>
	<author>dasdrewid</author>
	<datestamp>1269775140000</datestamp>
	<modclass>None</modclass>
	<modscore>1</modscore>
	<htmltext>So, if they start building shielded circuitry in cars, does that mean that those annoying EM pulse traps the police have been trying to deploy to shut down cars will no longer work?  You know, the little things they throw out in the roadway with a couple wires sticking up that zap the underside of the car and shut it down...</htmltext>
<tokenext>So , if they start building shielded circuitry in cars , does that mean that those annoying EM pulse traps the police have been trying to deploy to shut down cars will no longer work ?
You know , the little things they throw out in the roadway with a couple wires sticking up that zap the underside of the car and shut it down.. .</tokentext>
<sentencetext>So, if they start building shielded circuitry in cars, does that mean that those annoying EM pulse traps the police have been trying to deploy to shut down cars will no longer work?
You know, the little things they throw out in the roadway with a couple wires sticking up that zap the underside of the car and shut it down...</sentencetext>
</comment>
<comment>
	<id>http://www.semanticweb.org/ontologies/ConversationInstances.owl#comment10_03_28_2017236.31651060</id>
	<title>Re:No.</title>
	<author>The Wild Norseman</author>
	<datestamp>1269775620000</datestamp>
	<modclass>None</modclass>
	<modscore>1</modscore>
	<htmltext><p><div class="quote"><p>This is just some <b>douchebag</b> professor trying to ride the tragedies to fame.</p> </div><p>What do you expect?  The guy's name is <a href="http://www.wekenshop.com/images/804427.jpg" title="wekenshop.com" rel="nofollow">Massengill</a> [wekenshop.com], after all...</p></div>
	</htmltext>
<tokenext>This is just some douchebag professor trying to ride the tragedies to fame .
What do you expect ?
The guy 's name is Massengill [ wekenshop.com ] , after all.. .</tokentext>
<sentencetext>This is just some douchebag professor trying to ride the tragedies to fame.
What do you expect?
The guy's name is Massengill [wekenshop.com], after all...
	</sentencetext>
	<parent>http://www.semanticweb.org/ontologies/ConversationInstances.owl#comment10_03_28_2017236.31650804</parent>
</comment>
<comment>
	<id>http://www.semanticweb.org/ontologies/ConversationInstances.owl#comment10_03_28_2017236.31655850</id>
	<title>Re:McMurdo</title>
	<author>Shimbo</author>
	<datestamp>1269871440000</datestamp>
	<modclass>Insightful</modclass>
	<modscore>2</modscore>
	<htmltext><p><div class="quote"><p> "You said this router's at the South Pole, right? So that means it's at very high altitude, with very little ozone shielding, right?" "Umm, yeah." "Well there you go. There's a lot more radiation at that altitude than at sea level.</p> </div><p>His explanation sounds a bit off; a few molecules of ozone may be good for stopping UV but I doubt it makes a lot of difference to cosmic rays.</p><p>Just being at the South Pole is a much greater risk factor than mere altitude though, because it's where the magnetosphere funnels all the crap.</p></div>
	</htmltext>
<tokenext>" You said this router 's at the South Pole , right ?
So that means it 's at very high altitude , with very little ozone shielding , right ?
" " Umm , yeah .
" " Well there you go .
There 's a lot more radiation at that altitude than at sea level .
His explanation sounds a bit off ; a few molecules of ozone may be good for stopping UV but I doubt it makes a lot of difference to cosmic rays.Just being at the South Pole is a much greater risk factor than mere altitude though , because it 's where the magnetosphere funnels all the crap .</tokentext>
<sentencetext> "You said this router's at the South Pole, right?
So that means it's at very high altitude, with very little ozone shielding, right?
" "Umm, yeah.
" "Well there you go.
There's a lot more radiation at that altitude than at sea level.
His explanation sounds a bit off; a few molecules of ozone may be good for stopping UV but I doubt it makes a lot of difference to cosmic rays.Just being at the South Pole is a much greater risk factor than mere altitude though, because it's where the magnetosphere funnels all the crap.
	</sentencetext>
	<parent>http://www.semanticweb.org/ontologies/ConversationInstances.owl#comment10_03_28_2017236.31652220</parent>
</comment>
<comment>
	<id>http://www.semanticweb.org/ontologies/ConversationInstances.owl#comment10_03_28_2017236.31652142</id>
	<title>My gut feeling would be: Dereferenced pointer</title>
	<author>CrazyJim1</author>
	<datestamp>1269785460000</datestamp>
	<modclass>None</modclass>
	<modscore>1</modscore>
	<htmltext>Its funny how dereferenced pointers can work so well without bugs, then you change something seemingly unrelated like another variable, and then it triggers craziness.  I've learned my lessons with pointers and only use them when absolutely necessary.</htmltext>
<tokenext>Its funny how dereferenced pointers can work so well without bugs , then you change something seemingly unrelated like another variable , and then it triggers craziness .
I 've learned my lessons with pointers and only use them when absolutely necessary .</tokentext>
<sentencetext>Its funny how dereferenced pointers can work so well without bugs, then you change something seemingly unrelated like another variable, and then it triggers craziness.
I've learned my lessons with pointers and only use them when absolutely necessary.</sentencetext>
</comment>
<comment>
	<id>http://www.semanticweb.org/ontologies/ConversationInstances.owl#comment10_03_28_2017236.31650786</id>
	<title>Is there realy a problem?</title>
	<author>Anonymous</author>
	<datestamp>1269774120000</datestamp>
	<modclass>Insightful</modclass>
	<modscore>5</modscore>
	<htmltext><p>Since the biggest Toyota runaway story has turned out to be a <a href="http://autos.aol.com/article/prius-driver-scam/" title="aol.com">problem exists between  seat and pedals</a> [aol.com] situation... is this all hype with no science behind it?</p></htmltext>
<tokenext>Since the biggest Toyota runaway story has turned out to be a problem exists between seat and pedals [ aol.com ] situation... is this all hype with no science behind it ?</tokentext>
<sentencetext>Since the biggest Toyota runaway story has turned out to be a problem exists between  seat and pedals [aol.com] situation... is this all hype with no science behind it?</sentencetext>
</comment>
<comment>
	<id>http://www.semanticweb.org/ontologies/ConversationInstances.owl#comment10_03_28_2017236.31651856</id>
	<title>Re:Is there realy a problem?</title>
	<author>drsmithy</author>
	<datestamp>1269782580000</datestamp>
	<modclass>None</modclass>
	<modscore>1</modscore>
	<htmltext><p> <i>Basically its a bunch of innuendo, like he [i]might[/i] have been late on payments on the car (since proven false) or that he should have shifted it to neutral (not an intuitive action for someone who has never driven a manual transmission - and certainly a last resort that does not negate the existence of a problem to begin with).</i>
</p><p>Every automatic transmission I've ever seen has neutral.  Most of them don't even require pressing the release button to move from Reverse or Drive into neutral.  Anyone who doesn't understand, at the very least, that "N" means the car doesn't go, shouldn't be driving.</p></htmltext>
<tokenext>Basically its a bunch of innuendo , like he [ i ] might [ /i ] have been late on payments on the car ( since proven false ) or that he should have shifted it to neutral ( not an intuitive action for someone who has never driven a manual transmission - and certainly a last resort that does not negate the existence of a problem to begin with ) .
Every automatic transmission I 've ever seen has neutral .
Most of them do n't even require pressing the release button to move from Reverse or Drive into neutral .
Anyone who does n't understand , at the very least , that " N " means the car does n't go , should n't be driving .</tokentext>
<sentencetext> Basically its a bunch of innuendo, like he [i]might[/i] have been late on payments on the car (since proven false) or that he should have shifted it to neutral (not an intuitive action for someone who has never driven a manual transmission - and certainly a last resort that does not negate the existence of a problem to begin with).
Every automatic transmission I've ever seen has neutral.
Most of them don't even require pressing the release button to move from Reverse or Drive into neutral.
Anyone who doesn't understand, at the very least, that "N" means the car doesn't go, shouldn't be driving.</sentencetext>
	<parent>http://www.semanticweb.org/ontologies/ConversationInstances.owl#comment10_03_28_2017236.31651340</parent>
</comment>
<comment>
	<id>http://www.semanticweb.org/ontologies/ConversationInstances.owl#comment10_03_28_2017236.31650848</id>
	<title>Re:Why they tell you to turn off your phone...</title>
	<author>Anonymous</author>
	<datestamp>1269774480000</datestamp>
	<modclass>Funny</modclass>
	<modscore>1</modscore>
	<htmltext><p>How can you protect yourself from that checksum algorithm not getting flipped? What if that single-bit error caused the checksum algo to do some assembly magic and start injecting its benign code into places where it would be malignant!?</p><p>This just proves how vulnerable electric cars really are!</p></htmltext>
<tokenext>How can you protect yourself from that checksum algorithm not getting flipped ?
What if that single-bit error caused the checksum algo to do some assembly magic and start injecting its benign code into places where it would be malignant !
? This just proves how vulnerable electric cars really are !</tokentext>
<sentencetext>How can you protect yourself from that checksum algorithm not getting flipped?
What if that single-bit error caused the checksum algo to do some assembly magic and start injecting its benign code into places where it would be malignant!
?This just proves how vulnerable electric cars really are!</sentencetext>
	<parent>http://www.semanticweb.org/ontologies/ConversationInstances.owl#comment10_03_28_2017236.31650752</parent>
</comment>
<comment>
	<id>http://www.semanticweb.org/ontologies/ConversationInstances.owl#comment10_03_28_2017236.31652644</id>
	<title>I know the Guy</title>
	<author>Anonymous</author>
	<datestamp>1269790020000</datestamp>
	<modclass>None</modclass>
	<modscore>0</modscore>
	<htmltext><p>Lloyd W. Massengill and his team are some among the best in this kind of work. They do a lot of work with the government. However, I thing that his point is just a ploy to get some more research money from the automotive industry.</p></htmltext>
<tokenext>Lloyd W. Massengill and his team are some among the best in this kind of work .
They do a lot of work with the government .
However , I thing that his point is just a ploy to get some more research money from the automotive industry .</tokentext>
<sentencetext>Lloyd W. Massengill and his team are some among the best in this kind of work.
They do a lot of work with the government.
However, I thing that his point is just a ploy to get some more research money from the automotive industry.</sentencetext>
</comment>
<comment>
	<id>http://www.semanticweb.org/ontologies/ConversationInstances.owl#comment10_03_28_2017236.31654586</id>
	<title>Mind control</title>
	<author>jurgemaister</author>
	<datestamp>1269857160000</datestamp>
	<modclass>None</modclass>
	<modscore>1</modscore>
	<htmltext>I for one welcome our car controlling overlords</htmltext>
<tokenext>I for one welcome our car controlling overlords</tokentext>
<sentencetext>I for one welcome our car controlling overlords</sentencetext>
</comment>
<comment>
	<id>http://www.semanticweb.org/ontologies/ConversationInstances.owl#comment10_03_28_2017236.31653658</id>
	<title>OJ Toyota</title>
	<author>unchiujar</author>
	<datestamp>1269801420000</datestamp>
	<modclass>None</modclass>
	<modscore>1</modscore>
	<htmltext>If  a cosmic ray will fit, you must acquit !!!</htmltext>
<tokenext>If a cosmic ray will fit , you must acquit ! !
!</tokentext>
<sentencetext>If  a cosmic ray will fit, you must acquit !!
!</sentencetext>
</comment>
<comment>
	<id>http://www.semanticweb.org/ontologies/ConversationInstances.owl#comment10_03_28_2017236.31652256</id>
	<title>Re:Long Answer: No</title>
	<author>Anonymous</author>
	<datestamp>1269786540000</datestamp>
	<modclass>None</modclass>
	<modscore>0</modscore>
	<htmltext>Duh, of course they worked fine! It's *lead*ville!</htmltext>
<tokenext>Duh , of course they worked fine !
It 's * lead * ville !</tokentext>
<sentencetext>Duh, of course they worked fine!
It's *lead*ville!</sentencetext>
	<parent>http://www.semanticweb.org/ontologies/ConversationInstances.owl#comment10_03_28_2017236.31651556</parent>
</comment>
<comment>
	<id>http://www.semanticweb.org/ontologies/ConversationInstances.owl#comment10_03_28_2017236.31656190</id>
	<title>Re:Weird</title>
	<author>Urban Garlic</author>
	<datestamp>1269873420000</datestamp>
	<modclass>None</modclass>
	<modscore>1</modscore>
	<htmltext><p>&gt; Are manual gearboxes that rare in the States?</p><p>Yes.  It's basically impossible to rent a car with a manual gearbox ("standard transmission", we say here), and when you buy one, the sales people give you all kinds of raised eyebrows and warnings about how you might <i>think</i> you're saving money, but actually the trade-in/resale value of a standard-transmission vehicle is effectively zero.</p><p>I got one anyways, to satisfy my control freak ("certainty enthusiast", we say here) tendencies.</p></htmltext>
<tokenext>&gt; Are manual gearboxes that rare in the States ? Yes .
It 's basically impossible to rent a car with a manual gearbox ( " standard transmission " , we say here ) , and when you buy one , the sales people give you all kinds of raised eyebrows and warnings about how you might think you 're saving money , but actually the trade-in/resale value of a standard-transmission vehicle is effectively zero.I got one anyways , to satisfy my control freak ( " certainty enthusiast " , we say here ) tendencies .</tokentext>
<sentencetext>&gt; Are manual gearboxes that rare in the States?Yes.
It's basically impossible to rent a car with a manual gearbox ("standard transmission", we say here), and when you buy one, the sales people give you all kinds of raised eyebrows and warnings about how you might think you're saving money, but actually the trade-in/resale value of a standard-transmission vehicle is effectively zero.I got one anyways, to satisfy my control freak ("certainty enthusiast", we say here) tendencies.</sentencetext>
	<parent>http://www.semanticweb.org/ontologies/ConversationInstances.owl#comment10_03_28_2017236.31654692</parent>
</comment>
<comment>
	<id>http://www.semanticweb.org/ontologies/ConversationInstances.owl#comment10_03_28_2017236.31662250</id>
	<title>Re:Weird</title>
	<author>Anonymous</author>
	<datestamp>1269857040000</datestamp>
	<modclass>None</modclass>
	<modscore>0</modscore>
	<htmltext><p>&gt; Are manual gearboxes that rare in the States?</p><p>Yes, they are.  Not only that: some car makers will only sell models with auto.  A few years ago I wanted to upgrade my (manual, 4x2) American-made pickup to a (4x4) Toyota, and was told there was not a manual Toyota model I could buy at any price, not even their sporty Spyder MR2.  So years later, when I was in the market for a sports car (and c'mon, what's the point of an automatic-geared sports car??) I knew better than look into Toyota's direction<nobr> <wbr></nobr>... But then I found out Mercs sold in the States also were auto-gearbox only!</p><p>As I said this was a few years ago so I don't know if the situation is still exactly like that.  But there's no doubt that manual gearboxes are the rare exception rather than the norm 'round here.</p></htmltext>
<tokenext>&gt; Are manual gearboxes that rare in the States ? Yes , they are .
Not only that : some car makers will only sell models with auto .
A few years ago I wanted to upgrade my ( manual , 4x2 ) American-made pickup to a ( 4x4 ) Toyota , and was told there was not a manual Toyota model I could buy at any price , not even their sporty Spyder MR2 .
So years later , when I was in the market for a sports car ( and c'mon , what 's the point of an automatic-geared sports car ? ?
) I knew better than look into Toyota 's direction ... But then I found out Mercs sold in the States also were auto-gearbox only ! As I said this was a few years ago so I do n't know if the situation is still exactly like that .
But there 's no doubt that manual gearboxes are the rare exception rather than the norm 'round here .</tokentext>
<sentencetext>&gt; Are manual gearboxes that rare in the States?Yes, they are.
Not only that: some car makers will only sell models with auto.
A few years ago I wanted to upgrade my (manual, 4x2) American-made pickup to a (4x4) Toyota, and was told there was not a manual Toyota model I could buy at any price, not even their sporty Spyder MR2.
So years later, when I was in the market for a sports car (and c'mon, what's the point of an automatic-geared sports car??
) I knew better than look into Toyota's direction ... But then I found out Mercs sold in the States also were auto-gearbox only!As I said this was a few years ago so I don't know if the situation is still exactly like that.
But there's no doubt that manual gearboxes are the rare exception rather than the norm 'round here.</sentencetext>
	<parent>http://www.semanticweb.org/ontologies/ConversationInstances.owl#comment10_03_28_2017236.31654692</parent>
</comment>
<comment>
	<id>http://www.semanticweb.org/ontologies/ConversationInstances.owl#comment10_03_28_2017236.31650968</id>
	<title>Excuse me?</title>
	<author>drolli</author>
	<datestamp>1269775080000</datestamp>
	<modclass>None</modclass>
	<modscore>1</modscore>
	<htmltext><p>This would be a shame. It is very well known that the size of the chips influences their susceptibility to charged particles. I am sure the people estimating the reliability have numbers about that. And there is no reason to use hi density electronics for this purpose, besides saving 10cents.</p></htmltext>
<tokenext>This would be a shame .
It is very well known that the size of the chips influences their susceptibility to charged particles .
I am sure the people estimating the reliability have numbers about that .
And there is no reason to use hi density electronics for this purpose , besides saving 10cents .</tokentext>
<sentencetext>This would be a shame.
It is very well known that the size of the chips influences their susceptibility to charged particles.
I am sure the people estimating the reliability have numbers about that.
And there is no reason to use hi density electronics for this purpose, besides saving 10cents.</sentencetext>
</comment>
<comment>
	<id>http://www.semanticweb.org/ontologies/ConversationInstances.owl#comment10_03_28_2017236.31650790</id>
	<title>How about safe languages?</title>
	<author>Anonymous</author>
	<datestamp>1269774120000</datestamp>
	<modclass>Funny</modclass>
	<modscore>3</modscore>
	<htmltext><p>I bet they still use C for these kinds of things, how about something safer, such as Eiffel?</p></htmltext>
<tokenext>I bet they still use C for these kinds of things , how about something safer , such as Eiffel ?</tokentext>
<sentencetext>I bet they still use C for these kinds of things, how about something safer, such as Eiffel?</sentencetext>
</comment>
<comment>
	<id>http://www.semanticweb.org/ontologies/ConversationInstances.owl#comment10_03_28_2017236.31651042</id>
	<title>I, for one.</title>
	<author>Rysc</author>
	<datestamp>1269775500000</datestamp>
	<modclass>Redundant</modclass>
	<modscore>0</modscore>
	<htmltext><p>Insert some appropriate joke here.</p></htmltext>
<tokenext>Insert some appropriate joke here .</tokentext>
<sentencetext>Insert some appropriate joke here.</sentencetext>
</comment>
<comment>
	<id>http://www.semanticweb.org/ontologies/ConversationInstances.owl#comment10_03_28_2017236.31651124</id>
	<title>If it is due to such errors, why not others?</title>
	<author>Anonymous</author>
	<datestamp>1269776220000</datestamp>
	<modclass>None</modclass>
	<modscore>0</modscore>
	<htmltext><p>There should be all sorts of other flakiness if these types of errors are significant.  Why would they lead to uncontrolled acceleration rather than, say, uncontrolled braking?  The most error-prone piece of equipment in these machines is the <a href="http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/2009\%E2\%80\%932010\_Toyota\_vehicle\_recalls#Driver\_error" title="wikipedia.org" rel="nofollow">human behind the wheel</a> [wikipedia.org].  They can do strange things like push the accelerator to the floor while thinking they are pushing the brake.</p><p>The part I don't get with all these cases is why the drivers don't put the transmission in neutral or pull the key out of the ignition.  Although I can understand it for events that are brief, how do people drive along the highway at high speed for several minutes without thinking of that option?</p></htmltext>
<tokenext>There should be all sorts of other flakiness if these types of errors are significant .
Why would they lead to uncontrolled acceleration rather than , say , uncontrolled braking ?
The most error-prone piece of equipment in these machines is the human behind the wheel [ wikipedia.org ] .
They can do strange things like push the accelerator to the floor while thinking they are pushing the brake.The part I do n't get with all these cases is why the drivers do n't put the transmission in neutral or pull the key out of the ignition .
Although I can understand it for events that are brief , how do people drive along the highway at high speed for several minutes without thinking of that option ?</tokentext>
<sentencetext>There should be all sorts of other flakiness if these types of errors are significant.
Why would they lead to uncontrolled acceleration rather than, say, uncontrolled braking?
The most error-prone piece of equipment in these machines is the human behind the wheel [wikipedia.org].
They can do strange things like push the accelerator to the floor while thinking they are pushing the brake.The part I don't get with all these cases is why the drivers don't put the transmission in neutral or pull the key out of the ignition.
Although I can understand it for events that are brief, how do people drive along the highway at high speed for several minutes without thinking of that option?</sentencetext>
</comment>
<comment>
	<id>http://www.semanticweb.org/ontologies/ConversationInstances.owl#comment10_03_28_2017236.31655832</id>
	<title>Re:Is there realy a problem?</title>
	<author>s122604</author>
	<datestamp>1269871320000</datestamp>
	<modclass>None</modclass>
	<modscore>1</modscore>
	<htmltext>No, it isn't..

Just because one douche tried to cash in on this issue, doesn't mean that its entirely not an issue.  There very much <i>was</i> a problem with several toyota vehicles, that they first denied, then blamed on something else, and now have begrudingly accepted after the NHTSTA stepped in...

So again, this isn't "all hype", this isn't a repeat of the Audi 5000... Toyota messed up...</htmltext>
<tokenext>No , it is n't. . Just because one douche tried to cash in on this issue , does n't mean that its entirely not an issue .
There very much was a problem with several toyota vehicles , that they first denied , then blamed on something else , and now have begrudingly accepted after the NHTSTA stepped in.. . So again , this is n't " all hype " , this is n't a repeat of the Audi 5000... Toyota messed up.. .</tokentext>
<sentencetext>No, it isn't..

Just because one douche tried to cash in on this issue, doesn't mean that its entirely not an issue.
There very much was a problem with several toyota vehicles, that they first denied, then blamed on something else, and now have begrudingly accepted after the NHTSTA stepped in...

So again, this isn't "all hype", this isn't a repeat of the Audi 5000... Toyota messed up...</sentencetext>
	<parent>http://www.semanticweb.org/ontologies/ConversationInstances.owl#comment10_03_28_2017236.31650786</parent>
</comment>
<comment>
	<id>http://www.semanticweb.org/ontologies/ConversationInstances.owl#comment10_03_28_2017236.31651758</id>
	<title>Re:Voting logic needed</title>
	<author>Bigjeff5</author>
	<datestamp>1269781440000</datestamp>
	<modclass>None</modclass>
	<modscore>1</modscore>
	<htmltext><p>That's what they use in airplanes to prevent this sort of thing.  It's kinda surprising nobody at Toyota thought about a problem fly-by-wire has had from the get go when they implemented their own fly-by-wire.</p><p>Does nobody do a google search first?</p></htmltext>
<tokenext>That 's what they use in airplanes to prevent this sort of thing .
It 's kinda surprising nobody at Toyota thought about a problem fly-by-wire has had from the get go when they implemented their own fly-by-wire.Does nobody do a google search first ?</tokentext>
<sentencetext>That's what they use in airplanes to prevent this sort of thing.
It's kinda surprising nobody at Toyota thought about a problem fly-by-wire has had from the get go when they implemented their own fly-by-wire.Does nobody do a google search first?</sentencetext>
	<parent>http://www.semanticweb.org/ontologies/ConversationInstances.owl#comment10_03_28_2017236.31651128</parent>
</comment>
<comment>
	<id>http://www.semanticweb.org/ontologies/ConversationInstances.owl#comment10_03_28_2017236.31653848</id>
	<title>Re:No.</title>
	<author>Anonymous</author>
	<datestamp>1269803640000</datestamp>
	<modclass>None</modclass>
	<modscore>0</modscore>
	<htmltext><p>i completely agree.. they (toyota) won't admit true fault with their systems, ever. The legal fallout would send them under like most of the other major car manufacturers of late (GFC anyone..?) just admit it's design/programming error, fix it (properly this time), move on, and start potentially saving lives or serious injury. these people have a duty of care to us and our families...</p></htmltext>
<tokenext>i completely agree.. they ( toyota ) wo n't admit true fault with their systems , ever .
The legal fallout would send them under like most of the other major car manufacturers of late ( GFC anyone.. ?
) just admit it 's design/programming error , fix it ( properly this time ) , move on , and start potentially saving lives or serious injury .
these people have a duty of care to us and our families.. .</tokentext>
<sentencetext>i completely agree.. they (toyota) won't admit true fault with their systems, ever.
The legal fallout would send them under like most of the other major car manufacturers of late (GFC anyone..?
) just admit it's design/programming error, fix it (properly this time), move on, and start potentially saving lives or serious injury.
these people have a duty of care to us and our families...</sentencetext>
	<parent>http://www.semanticweb.org/ontologies/ConversationInstances.owl#comment10_03_28_2017236.31650804</parent>
</comment>
<comment>
	<id>http://www.semanticweb.org/ontologies/ConversationInstances.owl#comment10_03_28_2017236.31651870</id>
	<title>BOFH</title>
	<author>Arancaytar</author>
	<datestamp>1269782700000</datestamp>
	<modclass>None</modclass>
	<modscore>1</modscore>
	<htmltext><p>"I flip through my excuse calendar.</p><p>Electronic Disruption due to Cosmic Radiation.</p><p>Ah, this day is going to be fun."</p><p>Or something like that, anyway.<nobr> <wbr></nobr>:P</p></htmltext>
<tokenext>" I flip through my excuse calendar.Electronic Disruption due to Cosmic Radiation.Ah , this day is going to be fun .
" Or something like that , anyway .
: P</tokentext>
<sentencetext>"I flip through my excuse calendar.Electronic Disruption due to Cosmic Radiation.Ah, this day is going to be fun.
"Or something like that, anyway.
:P</sentencetext>
</comment>
<comment>
	<id>http://www.semanticweb.org/ontologies/ConversationInstances.owl#comment10_03_28_2017236.31652888</id>
	<title>Re:Why they tell you to turn off your phone...</title>
	<author>Anonymous</author>
	<datestamp>1269793440000</datestamp>
	<modclass>None</modclass>
	<modscore>0</modscore>
	<htmltext><p>That's what they did in Minority Report, and look how that turned out...</p></htmltext>
<tokenext>That 's what they did in Minority Report , and look how that turned out.. .</tokentext>
<sentencetext>That's what they did in Minority Report, and look how that turned out...</sentencetext>
	<parent>http://www.semanticweb.org/ontologies/ConversationInstances.owl#comment10_03_28_2017236.31650922</parent>
</comment>
<comment>
	<id>http://www.semanticweb.org/ontologies/ConversationInstances.owl#comment10_03_28_2017236.31651732</id>
	<title>Re:Space Rays, My Ass</title>
	<author>Bigjeff5</author>
	<datestamp>1269781140000</datestamp>
	<modclass>None</modclass>
	<modscore>1</modscore>
	<htmltext><p><div class="quote"><p>This type of thing is just plain bat shit crazy.</p></div><p>It's not batshit crazy, as cosmic rays are well known and little understood as far as their potential effects go - it's a term for a group of several types of radiation anywhere from X-rays to Gamma-rays that do indeed penetrate the atmosphere and can potentially have noticeable affects on the earth.  SETI has been sifting through cosmic radiation for decades looking for little green men, their job would be ultra easy if there were no cosmic radiation to get in the way.</p><p>It is, however, not anywhere near as likely as someone just fucking up, so yeah you're right on point with the thrust of your argument there.</p></div>
	</htmltext>
<tokenext>This type of thing is just plain bat shit crazy.It 's not batshit crazy , as cosmic rays are well known and little understood as far as their potential effects go - it 's a term for a group of several types of radiation anywhere from X-rays to Gamma-rays that do indeed penetrate the atmosphere and can potentially have noticeable affects on the earth .
SETI has been sifting through cosmic radiation for decades looking for little green men , their job would be ultra easy if there were no cosmic radiation to get in the way.It is , however , not anywhere near as likely as someone just fucking up , so yeah you 're right on point with the thrust of your argument there .</tokentext>
<sentencetext>This type of thing is just plain bat shit crazy.It's not batshit crazy, as cosmic rays are well known and little understood as far as their potential effects go - it's a term for a group of several types of radiation anywhere from X-rays to Gamma-rays that do indeed penetrate the atmosphere and can potentially have noticeable affects on the earth.
SETI has been sifting through cosmic radiation for decades looking for little green men, their job would be ultra easy if there were no cosmic radiation to get in the way.It is, however, not anywhere near as likely as someone just fucking up, so yeah you're right on point with the thrust of your argument there.
	</sentencetext>
	<parent>http://www.semanticweb.org/ontologies/ConversationInstances.owl#comment10_03_28_2017236.31650852</parent>
</comment>
<comment>
	<id>http://www.semanticweb.org/ontologies/ConversationInstances.owl#comment10_03_28_2017236.31651210</id>
	<title>Likely?</title>
	<author>Anonymous</author>
	<datestamp>1269777000000</datestamp>
	<modclass>Insightful</modclass>
	<modscore>1</modscore>
	<htmltext><p>The likelihood of a bit being flipped is already ludicrously small.  The likelihood of a random bit-flipping causing anything but a nonfunctional car is also extraordinarily low; It is exceedingly unlikely that an event like this will flip just the right bit to cause a car to careen out of control.  It seems that Toyota would have noticed an unusually high failure rate in general.</p></htmltext>
<tokenext>The likelihood of a bit being flipped is already ludicrously small .
The likelihood of a random bit-flipping causing anything but a nonfunctional car is also extraordinarily low ; It is exceedingly unlikely that an event like this will flip just the right bit to cause a car to careen out of control .
It seems that Toyota would have noticed an unusually high failure rate in general .</tokentext>
<sentencetext>The likelihood of a bit being flipped is already ludicrously small.
The likelihood of a random bit-flipping causing anything but a nonfunctional car is also extraordinarily low; It is exceedingly unlikely that an event like this will flip just the right bit to cause a car to careen out of control.
It seems that Toyota would have noticed an unusually high failure rate in general.</sentencetext>
</comment>
<comment>
	<id>http://www.semanticweb.org/ontologies/ConversationInstances.owl#comment10_03_28_2017236.31660828</id>
	<title>easy fix</title>
	<author>ILuvRamen</author>
	<datestamp>1269893460000</datestamp>
	<modclass>None</modclass>
	<modscore>1</modscore>
	<htmltext>You know, it's not that hard to send all data in triplicate a few milliseconds apart and then error correct it using the odd man out gets ignored style.  They're just too lazy to do it or too cheap to put in a processor 3x faster.  It's not going to flip the same exact bit in two different streams of data at different times and if it did, it's probably enough radiation to melt you and your car.</htmltext>
<tokenext>You know , it 's not that hard to send all data in triplicate a few milliseconds apart and then error correct it using the odd man out gets ignored style .
They 're just too lazy to do it or too cheap to put in a processor 3x faster .
It 's not going to flip the same exact bit in two different streams of data at different times and if it did , it 's probably enough radiation to melt you and your car .</tokentext>
<sentencetext>You know, it's not that hard to send all data in triplicate a few milliseconds apart and then error correct it using the odd man out gets ignored style.
They're just too lazy to do it or too cheap to put in a processor 3x faster.
It's not going to flip the same exact bit in two different streams of data at different times and if it did, it's probably enough radiation to melt you and your car.</sentencetext>
</comment>
<comment>
	<id>http://www.semanticweb.org/ontologies/ConversationInstances.owl#comment10_03_28_2017236.31651562</id>
	<title>Re:Checksums?</title>
	<author>SeekerDarksteel</author>
	<datestamp>1269779700000</datestamp>
	<modclass>None</modclass>
	<modscore>1</modscore>
	<htmltext>Insulating the ROM would be much more expensive than just adding error correcting codes or having multiple copies of the ROM and comparing the contents periodically.  The problem is no matter what you do, it's going to add cost and complexity, so unless you can show that single event upsets are indeed causing a problem there's no reason to prevent them.</htmltext>
<tokenext>Insulating the ROM would be much more expensive than just adding error correcting codes or having multiple copies of the ROM and comparing the contents periodically .
The problem is no matter what you do , it 's going to add cost and complexity , so unless you can show that single event upsets are indeed causing a problem there 's no reason to prevent them .</tokentext>
<sentencetext>Insulating the ROM would be much more expensive than just adding error correcting codes or having multiple copies of the ROM and comparing the contents periodically.
The problem is no matter what you do, it's going to add cost and complexity, so unless you can show that single event upsets are indeed causing a problem there's no reason to prevent them.</sentencetext>
	<parent>http://www.semanticweb.org/ontologies/ConversationInstances.owl#comment10_03_28_2017236.31650854</parent>
</comment>
<comment>
	<id>http://www.semanticweb.org/ontologies/ConversationInstances.owl#comment10_03_28_2017236.31651756</id>
	<title>Cosmic Connection?</title>
	<author>Anonymous</author>
	<datestamp>1269781440000</datestamp>
	<modclass>Insightful</modclass>
	<modscore>2</modscore>
	<htmltext><p>So, in the case of Toyota, these cosmic rays are very clever. They targeted cars in the US and not cars in Japan or other countries. How did the rays target selective areas of the planet? Did they choose highly litigious geographical areas?</p><p>I predict government grants will be spawned to finance new careers (and even a new federal agency) in Terrorist Cosmic Ray Detection and Analysis (TCRDA) to protect the US from these rogue rays.</p></htmltext>
<tokenext>So , in the case of Toyota , these cosmic rays are very clever .
They targeted cars in the US and not cars in Japan or other countries .
How did the rays target selective areas of the planet ?
Did they choose highly litigious geographical areas ? I predict government grants will be spawned to finance new careers ( and even a new federal agency ) in Terrorist Cosmic Ray Detection and Analysis ( TCRDA ) to protect the US from these rogue rays .</tokentext>
<sentencetext>So, in the case of Toyota, these cosmic rays are very clever.
They targeted cars in the US and not cars in Japan or other countries.
How did the rays target selective areas of the planet?
Did they choose highly litigious geographical areas?I predict government grants will be spawned to finance new careers (and even a new federal agency) in Terrorist Cosmic Ray Detection and Analysis (TCRDA) to protect the US from these rogue rays.</sentencetext>
</comment>
<comment>
	<id>http://www.semanticweb.org/ontologies/ConversationInstances.owl#comment10_03_28_2017236.31651880</id>
	<title>Re:Is there realy a problem?</title>
	<author>sjames</author>
	<datestamp>1269782820000</datestamp>
	<modclass>None</modclass>
	<modscore>1</modscore>
	<htmltext><p>You're reading an awful lot into the bit of innuendo presented by the article about one of many reported incidents. Perhaps his incident was real and perhaps it wasn't, but there's plenty of other incidents that look to be very real complete with police reporting that the brakes on other runaway toyotas were obviously burning. The latter report eliminates the usual claims that the driver stepped on the wrong pedal.</p></htmltext>
<tokenext>You 're reading an awful lot into the bit of innuendo presented by the article about one of many reported incidents .
Perhaps his incident was real and perhaps it was n't , but there 's plenty of other incidents that look to be very real complete with police reporting that the brakes on other runaway toyotas were obviously burning .
The latter report eliminates the usual claims that the driver stepped on the wrong pedal .</tokentext>
<sentencetext>You're reading an awful lot into the bit of innuendo presented by the article about one of many reported incidents.
Perhaps his incident was real and perhaps it wasn't, but there's plenty of other incidents that look to be very real complete with police reporting that the brakes on other runaway toyotas were obviously burning.
The latter report eliminates the usual claims that the driver stepped on the wrong pedal.</sentencetext>
	<parent>http://www.semanticweb.org/ontologies/ConversationInstances.owl#comment10_03_28_2017236.31650786</parent>
</comment>
<comment>
	<id>http://www.semanticweb.org/ontologies/ConversationInstances.owl#comment10_03_28_2017236.31654052</id>
	<title>Quick, call the department of redundancy dept!</title>
	<author>edittard</author>
	<datestamp>1269806160000</datestamp>
	<modclass>None</modclass>
	<modscore>1</modscore>
	<htmltext>Cosmic ray radiation?  Better get some radiation shielding shields!</htmltext>
<tokenext>Cosmic ray radiation ?
Better get some radiation shielding shields !</tokentext>
<sentencetext>Cosmic ray radiation?
Better get some radiation shielding shields!</sentencetext>
</comment>
<comment>
	<id>http://www.semanticweb.org/ontologies/ConversationInstances.owl#comment10_03_28_2017236.31650884</id>
	<title>Re:How about safe languages?</title>
	<author>Anonymous</author>
	<datestamp>1269774600000</datestamp>
	<modclass>Insightful</modclass>
	<modscore>2</modscore>
	<htmltext><p>If a cosmic ray flips a bit in the (insert safe language here) array boundary checker, then what?</p></htmltext>
<tokenext>If a cosmic ray flips a bit in the ( insert safe language here ) array boundary checker , then what ?</tokentext>
<sentencetext>If a cosmic ray flips a bit in the (insert safe language here) array boundary checker, then what?</sentencetext>
	<parent>http://www.semanticweb.org/ontologies/ConversationInstances.owl#comment10_03_28_2017236.31650790</parent>
</comment>
<comment>
	<id>http://www.semanticweb.org/ontologies/ConversationInstances.owl#comment10_03_28_2017236.31652280</id>
	<title>Re:Why they tell you to turn off your phone...</title>
	<author>gnapster</author>
	<datestamp>1269786780000</datestamp>
	<modclass>None</modclass>
	<modscore>1</modscore>
	<htmltext>Then all code checksums fail, and your car won't go anywhere.</htmltext>
<tokenext>Then all code checksums fail , and your car wo n't go anywhere .</tokentext>
<sentencetext>Then all code checksums fail, and your car won't go anywhere.</sentencetext>
	<parent>http://www.semanticweb.org/ontologies/ConversationInstances.owl#comment10_03_28_2017236.31650848</parent>
</comment>
<comment>
	<id>http://www.semanticweb.org/ontologies/ConversationInstances.owl#comment10_03_28_2017236.31652238</id>
	<title>Re:Space Rays, My Ass</title>
	<author>DrDitto</author>
	<datestamp>1269786420000</datestamp>
	<modclass>None</modclass>
	<modscore>1</modscore>
	<htmltext>You don't have a clue.  Alpha particle strikes in microprocessors are a real and growing problem.  They were never a problem before because the CMOS gates were too big to matter.  Now the gates are so small and hold so little charge that a single alpha particle strike is increasingly flipping bits.  Its been happening to DRAM for a long time...hence ECC.</htmltext>
<tokenext>You do n't have a clue .
Alpha particle strikes in microprocessors are a real and growing problem .
They were never a problem before because the CMOS gates were too big to matter .
Now the gates are so small and hold so little charge that a single alpha particle strike is increasingly flipping bits .
Its been happening to DRAM for a long time...hence ECC .</tokentext>
<sentencetext>You don't have a clue.
Alpha particle strikes in microprocessors are a real and growing problem.
They were never a problem before because the CMOS gates were too big to matter.
Now the gates are so small and hold so little charge that a single alpha particle strike is increasingly flipping bits.
Its been happening to DRAM for a long time...hence ECC.</sentencetext>
	<parent>http://www.semanticweb.org/ontologies/ConversationInstances.owl#comment10_03_28_2017236.31650852</parent>
</comment>
<comment>
	<id>http://www.semanticweb.org/ontologies/ConversationInstances.owl#comment10_03_28_2017236.31651912</id>
	<title>Re:No.</title>
	<author>DrDitto</author>
	<datestamp>1269783180000</datestamp>
	<modclass>None</modclass>
	<modscore>1</modscore>
	<htmltext>You are misinformed.  Alpha particle strikes are a real problem as process technology shrinks.  Certain cars and systems could very well be more vulnerable than others due to process variation.  There is a reason why microprocessors are adding ECC and parity protection to L2/L3 caches and even L1 caches.  The problem nailed Sun in the 90s.  It nailed Virginia Tech (when they had to replace every server in their supercomputer since they didn't use ECC memory).  It probably happens to your own laptop/PC more often than you might think.
<br> <br>
Intel has an entire research group devoted to mitigating transient errors caused by alpha particle strikes. <br> <br>
And you might be surprised at the number of home PC crashes blamed on Windows but really caused by bit flips.</htmltext>
<tokenext>You are misinformed .
Alpha particle strikes are a real problem as process technology shrinks .
Certain cars and systems could very well be more vulnerable than others due to process variation .
There is a reason why microprocessors are adding ECC and parity protection to L2/L3 caches and even L1 caches .
The problem nailed Sun in the 90s .
It nailed Virginia Tech ( when they had to replace every server in their supercomputer since they did n't use ECC memory ) .
It probably happens to your own laptop/PC more often than you might think .
Intel has an entire research group devoted to mitigating transient errors caused by alpha particle strikes .
And you might be surprised at the number of home PC crashes blamed on Windows but really caused by bit flips .</tokentext>
<sentencetext>You are misinformed.
Alpha particle strikes are a real problem as process technology shrinks.
Certain cars and systems could very well be more vulnerable than others due to process variation.
There is a reason why microprocessors are adding ECC and parity protection to L2/L3 caches and even L1 caches.
The problem nailed Sun in the 90s.
It nailed Virginia Tech (when they had to replace every server in their supercomputer since they didn't use ECC memory).
It probably happens to your own laptop/PC more often than you might think.
Intel has an entire research group devoted to mitigating transient errors caused by alpha particle strikes.
And you might be surprised at the number of home PC crashes blamed on Windows but really caused by bit flips.</sentencetext>
	<parent>http://www.semanticweb.org/ontologies/ConversationInstances.owl#comment10_03_28_2017236.31650804</parent>
</comment>
<comment>
	<id>http://www.semanticweb.org/ontologies/ConversationInstances.owl#comment10_03_28_2017236.31721712</id>
	<title>Re:Weird</title>
	<author>Anonymous</author>
	<datestamp>1270319160000</datestamp>
	<modclass>None</modclass>
	<modscore>0</modscore>
	<htmltext><p>I think in the US they are approximately 5-10\% of all cars sold.  Certainly most of the people I know have never driven one unless they are either relatively old (50s) or car enthusiasts, though there are exceptions, of course.</p></htmltext>
<tokenext>I think in the US they are approximately 5-10 \ % of all cars sold .
Certainly most of the people I know have never driven one unless they are either relatively old ( 50s ) or car enthusiasts , though there are exceptions , of course .</tokentext>
<sentencetext>I think in the US they are approximately 5-10\% of all cars sold.
Certainly most of the people I know have never driven one unless they are either relatively old (50s) or car enthusiasts, though there are exceptions, of course.</sentencetext>
	<parent>http://www.semanticweb.org/ontologies/ConversationInstances.owl#comment10_03_28_2017236.31654692</parent>
</comment>
<comment>
	<id>http://www.semanticweb.org/ontologies/ConversationInstances.owl#comment10_03_28_2017236.31654552</id>
	<title>SEU tolerant hardware</title>
	<author>orbitalia</author>
	<datestamp>1269856620000</datestamp>
	<modclass>None</modclass>
	<modscore>1</modscore>
	<htmltext><p>What's the problem, there are open source SEU tolerant CPUs you can use out there</p><p><a href="http://www.gaisler.com/cms/index.php?option=com\_content&amp;task=section&amp;id=4&amp;Itemid=33" title="gaisler.com">http://www.gaisler.com/cms/index.php?option=com\_content&amp;task=section&amp;id=4&amp;Itemid=33</a> [gaisler.com]</p><p>Leon FT, space grade, VHDL IP cores available.</p></htmltext>
<tokenext>What 's the problem , there are open source SEU tolerant CPUs you can use out therehttp : //www.gaisler.com/cms/index.php ? option = com \ _content&amp;task = section&amp;id = 4&amp;Itemid = 33 [ gaisler.com ] Leon FT , space grade , VHDL IP cores available .</tokentext>
<sentencetext>What's the problem, there are open source SEU tolerant CPUs you can use out therehttp://www.gaisler.com/cms/index.php?option=com\_content&amp;task=section&amp;id=4&amp;Itemid=33 [gaisler.com]Leon FT, space grade, VHDL IP cores available.</sentencetext>
</comment>
<comment>
	<id>http://www.semanticweb.org/ontologies/ConversationInstances.owl#comment10_03_28_2017236.31655090</id>
	<title>Re:Why is everyone picking on Toyota?</title>
	<author>PigleT</author>
	<datestamp>1269863880000</datestamp>
	<modclass>None</modclass>
	<modscore>1</modscore>
	<htmltext><p>Those of us who own a toyota have been to their website and checked the system that tells us whether our cars are affected.</p><p>I'm lucky - my Rav4 is a particular vintage that claims not to have the problem.</p><p>The greater majority of other Toyota owners probably do have the problem, if a check of the affected models (most) and vintages (most) is anything to go by.</p><p>The fact that they have a webpage addressing the problem tells me (a) it's got big publicity (b) they sort of care (c) their investigations have led them to find some criteria whereby they can tell a particular car is susceptible or not. That tells me maybe they know what it is, and that talk of cosmic radiation is just speculative BS.</p></htmltext>
<tokenext>Those of us who own a toyota have been to their website and checked the system that tells us whether our cars are affected.I 'm lucky - my Rav4 is a particular vintage that claims not to have the problem.The greater majority of other Toyota owners probably do have the problem , if a check of the affected models ( most ) and vintages ( most ) is anything to go by.The fact that they have a webpage addressing the problem tells me ( a ) it 's got big publicity ( b ) they sort of care ( c ) their investigations have led them to find some criteria whereby they can tell a particular car is susceptible or not .
That tells me maybe they know what it is , and that talk of cosmic radiation is just speculative BS .</tokentext>
<sentencetext>Those of us who own a toyota have been to their website and checked the system that tells us whether our cars are affected.I'm lucky - my Rav4 is a particular vintage that claims not to have the problem.The greater majority of other Toyota owners probably do have the problem, if a check of the affected models (most) and vintages (most) is anything to go by.The fact that they have a webpage addressing the problem tells me (a) it's got big publicity (b) they sort of care (c) their investigations have led them to find some criteria whereby they can tell a particular car is susceptible or not.
That tells me maybe they know what it is, and that talk of cosmic radiation is just speculative BS.</sentencetext>
	<parent>http://www.semanticweb.org/ontologies/ConversationInstances.owl#comment10_03_28_2017236.31650902</parent>
</comment>
<comment>
	<id>http://www.semanticweb.org/ontologies/ConversationInstances.owl#comment10_03_28_2017236.31650902</id>
	<title>Why is everyone picking on Toyota?</title>
	<author>Anonymous</author>
	<datestamp>1269774720000</datestamp>
	<modclass>None</modclass>
	<modscore>1</modscore>
	<htmltext>Airplanes use X-by-wire for a much longer time than cars. What's this anti-Toyota FUD all about?</htmltext>
<tokenext>Airplanes use X-by-wire for a much longer time than cars .
What 's this anti-Toyota FUD all about ?</tokentext>
<sentencetext>Airplanes use X-by-wire for a much longer time than cars.
What's this anti-Toyota FUD all about?</sentencetext>
</comment>
<comment>
	<id>http://www.semanticweb.org/ontologies/ConversationInstances.owl#comment10_03_28_2017236.31651696</id>
	<title>More likely than you think</title>
	<author>Anonymous</author>
	<datestamp>1269780780000</datestamp>
	<modclass>None</modclass>
	<modscore>0</modscore>
	<htmltext><p>A couple of weeks ago I was at a red light when suddenly the car's interior lights and radio began to fluctuate, while this was happening I noticed that everything in sight was doing the same thing, other car's headlights, the apartments nearby and the gas station at the intersection</p></htmltext>
<tokenext>A couple of weeks ago I was at a red light when suddenly the car 's interior lights and radio began to fluctuate , while this was happening I noticed that everything in sight was doing the same thing , other car 's headlights , the apartments nearby and the gas station at the intersection</tokentext>
<sentencetext>A couple of weeks ago I was at a red light when suddenly the car's interior lights and radio began to fluctuate, while this was happening I noticed that everything in sight was doing the same thing, other car's headlights, the apartments nearby and the gas station at the intersection</sentencetext>
</comment>
<comment>
	<id>http://www.semanticweb.org/ontologies/ConversationInstances.owl#comment10_03_28_2017236.31659330</id>
	<title>Re:Is there realy a problem?</title>
	<author>WindShadow</author>
	<datestamp>1269886800000</datestamp>
	<modclass>None</modclass>
	<modscore>1</modscore>
	<htmltext><p><div class="quote"><p>Since the biggest Toyota runaway story has turned out to be a <a href="http://autos.aol.com/article/prius-driver-scam/" title="aol.com" rel="nofollow">problem exists between  seat and pedals</a> [aol.com] situation... is this all hype with no science behind it?</p></div><p>And this happen only with Toyota? This would imply one of three things:<br>
-People who buy Toyotas are worse drivers than other makes.<br>
-Toyota has human engineering flaws which make them hard to control.<br>
-There is really a flaw and behavior of expert drivers testing doesn't trigger it.</p><p>
<i>Hint:</i>Steve Wozniack, co-founder of Apple, <a href="http://news.cnet.com/8301-13924\_3-10445564-64.html?tag=newsLatestHeadlinesArea.0" title="cnet.com" rel="nofollow">
says it's software</a> [cnet.com] and he can demonstrate the flaw with his Prius on demand.
</p></div>
	</htmltext>
<tokenext>Since the biggest Toyota runaway story has turned out to be a problem exists between seat and pedals [ aol.com ] situation... is this all hype with no science behind it ? And this happen only with Toyota ?
This would imply one of three things : -People who buy Toyotas are worse drivers than other makes .
-Toyota has human engineering flaws which make them hard to control .
-There is really a flaw and behavior of expert drivers testing does n't trigger it .
Hint : Steve Wozniack , co-founder of Apple , says it 's software [ cnet.com ] and he can demonstrate the flaw with his Prius on demand .</tokentext>
<sentencetext>Since the biggest Toyota runaway story has turned out to be a problem exists between  seat and pedals [aol.com] situation... is this all hype with no science behind it?And this happen only with Toyota?
This would imply one of three things:
-People who buy Toyotas are worse drivers than other makes.
-Toyota has human engineering flaws which make them hard to control.
-There is really a flaw and behavior of expert drivers testing doesn't trigger it.
Hint:Steve Wozniack, co-founder of Apple, 
says it's software [cnet.com] and he can demonstrate the flaw with his Prius on demand.

	</sentencetext>
	<parent>http://www.semanticweb.org/ontologies/ConversationInstances.owl#comment10_03_28_2017236.31650786</parent>
</comment>
<comment>
	<id>http://www.semanticweb.org/ontologies/ConversationInstances.owl#comment10_03_28_2017236.31651774</id>
	<title>Re:I was proofed right</title>
	<author>Bigjeff5</author>
	<datestamp>1269781620000</datestamp>
	<modclass>None</modclass>
	<modscore>1</modscore>
	<htmltext><p>Wow man, take off the tin foil hat.  Even if you're right, you'll be a lot happier pretending you aren't.<nobr> <wbr></nobr>;)</p></htmltext>
<tokenext>Wow man , take off the tin foil hat .
Even if you 're right , you 'll be a lot happier pretending you are n't .
; )</tokentext>
<sentencetext>Wow man, take off the tin foil hat.
Even if you're right, you'll be a lot happier pretending you aren't.
;)</sentencetext>
	<parent>http://www.semanticweb.org/ontologies/ConversationInstances.owl#comment10_03_28_2017236.31651168</parent>
</comment>
<comment>
	<id>http://www.semanticweb.org/ontologies/ConversationInstances.owl#comment10_03_28_2017236.31651682</id>
	<title>Re:Why they tell you to turn off your phone...</title>
	<author>Anonymous</author>
	<datestamp>1269780720000</datestamp>
	<modclass>None</modclass>
	<modscore>1</modscore>
	<htmltext><p>Good old EM is "easy" to defend against. One can use shielding etc. to great effect.
</p><p>
Defense against gamma rays is more difficult but doable, through checks and balances in soft- and hardware.
</p><p>
But the worst of them all is poor programming. Somehow there seems to be no defense against that, which is mind boggling in itself.
</p></htmltext>
<tokenext>Good old EM is " easy " to defend against .
One can use shielding etc .
to great effect .
Defense against gamma rays is more difficult but doable , through checks and balances in soft- and hardware .
But the worst of them all is poor programming .
Somehow there seems to be no defense against that , which is mind boggling in itself .</tokentext>
<sentencetext>Good old EM is "easy" to defend against.
One can use shielding etc.
to great effect.
Defense against gamma rays is more difficult but doable, through checks and balances in soft- and hardware.
But the worst of them all is poor programming.
Somehow there seems to be no defense against that, which is mind boggling in itself.
</sentencetext>
	<parent>http://www.semanticweb.org/ontologies/ConversationInstances.owl#comment10_03_28_2017236.31650818</parent>
</comment>
<comment>
	<id>http://www.semanticweb.org/ontologies/ConversationInstances.owl#comment10_03_28_2017236.31650922</id>
	<title>Re:Why they tell you to turn off your phone...</title>
	<author>pitchpipe</author>
	<datestamp>1269774840000</datestamp>
	<modclass>Interestin</modclass>
	<modscore>3</modscore>
	<htmltext><p><div class="quote"><p>there should be some checksum that shouldn't add up. When a fault is detected, it should go to a backup program about safely shutting down the car.</p></div><p>Or how about a computer redundancy system where a group of computers that are all capable of controlling the car watch the behavior of the computer that is actually controlling the car.  Through a voting system they could decide to hand the control of the car over to a another computer in the event that the controlling computer doesn't act in a way that was deemed safe.  This way the car could continue to operate normally while signaling that there is a problem that needs to be addressed.</p></div>
	</htmltext>
<tokenext>there should be some checksum that should n't add up .
When a fault is detected , it should go to a backup program about safely shutting down the car.Or how about a computer redundancy system where a group of computers that are all capable of controlling the car watch the behavior of the computer that is actually controlling the car .
Through a voting system they could decide to hand the control of the car over to a another computer in the event that the controlling computer does n't act in a way that was deemed safe .
This way the car could continue to operate normally while signaling that there is a problem that needs to be addressed .</tokentext>
<sentencetext>there should be some checksum that shouldn't add up.
When a fault is detected, it should go to a backup program about safely shutting down the car.Or how about a computer redundancy system where a group of computers that are all capable of controlling the car watch the behavior of the computer that is actually controlling the car.
Through a voting system they could decide to hand the control of the car over to a another computer in the event that the controlling computer doesn't act in a way that was deemed safe.
This way the car could continue to operate normally while signaling that there is a problem that needs to be addressed.
	</sentencetext>
	<parent>http://www.semanticweb.org/ontologies/ConversationInstances.owl#comment10_03_28_2017236.31650752</parent>
</comment>
<comment>
	<id>http://www.semanticweb.org/ontologies/ConversationInstances.owl#comment10_03_28_2017236.31653406</id>
	<title>Shielding</title>
	<author>wonkavader</author>
	<datestamp>1269798840000</datestamp>
	<modclass>None</modclass>
	<modscore>1</modscore>
	<htmltext><p>I'm sure 18 people here can tell me without much effort the answer to this:</p><p>Are cosmic rays so high energy that they pass right through a steel car hood?</p><p>Or are the components in question placed somewhere in the car where they are not well shielded?</p></htmltext>
<tokenext>I 'm sure 18 people here can tell me without much effort the answer to this : Are cosmic rays so high energy that they pass right through a steel car hood ? Or are the components in question placed somewhere in the car where they are not well shielded ?</tokentext>
<sentencetext>I'm sure 18 people here can tell me without much effort the answer to this:Are cosmic rays so high energy that they pass right through a steel car hood?Or are the components in question placed somewhere in the car where they are not well shielded?</sentencetext>
</comment>
<comment>
	<id>http://www.semanticweb.org/ontologies/ConversationInstances.owl#comment10_03_28_2017236.31654010</id>
	<title>Seems unlikely</title>
	<author>grimsnaggle</author>
	<datestamp>1269805680000</datestamp>
	<modclass>None</modclass>
	<modscore>1</modscore>
	<htmltext><p>10e-34 error rate overall, cosmic rays at earth's surface included</p><p>Assume we check 8 bits of acceleration data 20 times per second</p><p>Assume each car runs for 10000 hours</p><p>Assume there are on order of 100 million Toyotas in the US</p><p>Multiply all these together and you find that the odds of this happening even once are on the order of 10e-17</p></htmltext>
<tokenext>10e-34 error rate overall , cosmic rays at earth 's surface includedAssume we check 8 bits of acceleration data 20 times per secondAssume each car runs for 10000 hoursAssume there are on order of 100 million Toyotas in the USMultiply all these together and you find that the odds of this happening even once are on the order of 10e-17</tokentext>
<sentencetext>10e-34 error rate overall, cosmic rays at earth's surface includedAssume we check 8 bits of acceleration data 20 times per secondAssume each car runs for 10000 hoursAssume there are on order of 100 million Toyotas in the USMultiply all these together and you find that the odds of this happening even once are on the order of 10e-17</sentencetext>
</comment>
<comment>
	<id>http://www.semanticweb.org/ontologies/ConversationInstances.owl#comment10_03_28_2017236.31651308</id>
	<title>Do car safety problems come from outer space?</title>
	<author>Anonymous</author>
	<datestamp>1269777780000</datestamp>
	<modclass>None</modclass>
	<modscore>0</modscore>
	<htmltext><p>No.<br>
&nbsp; <br>Next question.</p></htmltext>
<tokenext>No .
  Next question .</tokentext>
<sentencetext>No.
  Next question.</sentencetext>
</comment>
<comment>
	<id>http://www.semanticweb.org/ontologies/ConversationInstances.owl#comment10_03_28_2017236.31657354</id>
	<title>Re:Why they tell you to turn off your phone...</title>
	<author>left00coaster</author>
	<datestamp>1269878340000</datestamp>
	<modclass>None</modclass>
	<modscore>1</modscore>
	<htmltext>You mean 'rogue' don't you? I think red cars are no more evil than black ones.</htmltext>
<tokenext>You mean 'rogue ' do n't you ?
I think red cars are no more evil than black ones .</tokentext>
<sentencetext>You mean 'rogue' don't you?
I think red cars are no more evil than black ones.</sentencetext>
	<parent>http://www.semanticweb.org/ontologies/ConversationInstances.owl#comment10_03_28_2017236.31650906</parent>
</comment>
<comment>
	<id>http://www.semanticweb.org/ontologies/ConversationInstances.owl#comment10_03_28_2017236.31651530</id>
	<title>Re:No.</title>
	<author>SeekerDarksteel</author>
	<datestamp>1269779400000</datestamp>
	<modclass>Informativ</modclass>
	<modscore>4</modscore>
	<htmltext><i>There's a reason that our entire modern world doesn't come crashing to a halt around us every 30 seconds. If every CPU was vulnerable to bit flips from random radiation, every part of your house would be on fire and arcing electricity. Times Square would look like the bridge of the 60s enterprise under attack.</i> <br>
<br>
Actually, every CPU \_IS\_ vulnerable to bit-flips from radiation.  That part of it is not speculation.  It does occur in commodity processors, and with probabilities large enough that we have ECC ram, and ECC and/or parity in caches.  Some servers actually come with built in hardware fault tolerance methods, because when you run hundreds of servers non-stop for years, the probability that a particle strike screws up a register on chip is non-negligible.  Now, still, the probability isn't \_huge\_.  Definitely not high enough to be causing these specific problems, especially when the failure is always in the same manner.  \_That\_ part of it is pretty much bullshit.</htmltext>
<tokenext>There 's a reason that our entire modern world does n't come crashing to a halt around us every 30 seconds .
If every CPU was vulnerable to bit flips from random radiation , every part of your house would be on fire and arcing electricity .
Times Square would look like the bridge of the 60s enterprise under attack .
Actually , every CPU \ _IS \ _ vulnerable to bit-flips from radiation .
That part of it is not speculation .
It does occur in commodity processors , and with probabilities large enough that we have ECC ram , and ECC and/or parity in caches .
Some servers actually come with built in hardware fault tolerance methods , because when you run hundreds of servers non-stop for years , the probability that a particle strike screws up a register on chip is non-negligible .
Now , still , the probability is n't \ _huge \ _ .
Definitely not high enough to be causing these specific problems , especially when the failure is always in the same manner .
\ _That \ _ part of it is pretty much bullshit .</tokentext>
<sentencetext>There's a reason that our entire modern world doesn't come crashing to a halt around us every 30 seconds.
If every CPU was vulnerable to bit flips from random radiation, every part of your house would be on fire and arcing electricity.
Times Square would look like the bridge of the 60s enterprise under attack.
Actually, every CPU \_IS\_ vulnerable to bit-flips from radiation.
That part of it is not speculation.
It does occur in commodity processors, and with probabilities large enough that we have ECC ram, and ECC and/or parity in caches.
Some servers actually come with built in hardware fault tolerance methods, because when you run hundreds of servers non-stop for years, the probability that a particle strike screws up a register on chip is non-negligible.
Now, still, the probability isn't \_huge\_.
Definitely not high enough to be causing these specific problems, especially when the failure is always in the same manner.
\_That\_ part of it is pretty much bullshit.</sentencetext>
	<parent>http://www.semanticweb.org/ontologies/ConversationInstances.owl#comment10_03_28_2017236.31650804</parent>
</comment>
<comment>
	<id>http://www.semanticweb.org/ontologies/ConversationInstances.owl#comment10_03_28_2017236.31655422</id>
	<title>I Got Them Ole Kozmic Blues Again Mama</title>
	<author>ElmoGonzo</author>
	<datestamp>1269868140000</datestamp>
	<modclass>None</modclass>
	<modscore>1</modscore>
	<htmltext>In 1991, our general manager was fond of blaming "stray cosmic rays" for hard-to-reproduce bugs in our software.  I never found a case where the bug was not reproducible but there were many when it took a lot of communication with the customer to tease out the necessary preconditions. (In one case it required having them ship one of their workstations to us and it turned out to be a lying graphics adapter that claimed it was a type with a known refresh rate when its refresh rate was different.  Combine that with an overly ambitious developer who wrote his own graphics i/o code to improve performance and you get total system lockup.)
<br>
My guess is that there is a set of conditions that causes loss of significance resulting in division by nearly zero and producing a number large enough to be interpreted as "Floor it!".</htmltext>
<tokenext>In 1991 , our general manager was fond of blaming " stray cosmic rays " for hard-to-reproduce bugs in our software .
I never found a case where the bug was not reproducible but there were many when it took a lot of communication with the customer to tease out the necessary preconditions .
( In one case it required having them ship one of their workstations to us and it turned out to be a lying graphics adapter that claimed it was a type with a known refresh rate when its refresh rate was different .
Combine that with an overly ambitious developer who wrote his own graphics i/o code to improve performance and you get total system lockup .
) My guess is that there is a set of conditions that causes loss of significance resulting in division by nearly zero and producing a number large enough to be interpreted as " Floor it !
" .</tokentext>
<sentencetext>In 1991, our general manager was fond of blaming "stray cosmic rays" for hard-to-reproduce bugs in our software.
I never found a case where the bug was not reproducible but there were many when it took a lot of communication with the customer to tease out the necessary preconditions.
(In one case it required having them ship one of their workstations to us and it turned out to be a lying graphics adapter that claimed it was a type with a known refresh rate when its refresh rate was different.
Combine that with an overly ambitious developer who wrote his own graphics i/o code to improve performance and you get total system lockup.
)

My guess is that there is a set of conditions that causes loss of significance resulting in division by nearly zero and producing a number large enough to be interpreted as "Floor it!
".</sentencetext>
</comment>
<comment>
	<id>http://www.semanticweb.org/ontologies/ConversationInstances.owl#comment10_03_28_2017236.31660112</id>
	<title>mechanical throttle  electronic throttle</title>
	<author>logicassasin</author>
	<datestamp>1269890220000</datestamp>
	<modclass>None</modclass>
	<modscore>1</modscore>
	<htmltext><p>Seriously, when I had first heard of electronically controlled throttle, braking, and steering systems in cars, each time I thought it was just a matter of time before one goes haywire and causes accidents. There's a place for computer control for things... This is simply not it. Owners of cars with traditional mechanical throttles and hydraulic braking system simply don't have anything like this to worry about and WON'T have to worry about it.</p><p>Steering is one place where computer control really terrifies me. As we've already seen, this type of system cannot be trusted with braking and throttle, so next we're going to see cars turning harder than the driver intended due to some "cosmic ray" caused glitch. That person, trying to merge into traffic will end up cutting hard across traffic, likely being killed in the process.</p><p>The what are they going to blame it on??? Terrans launching an EMP Shockwave from their floating Science Vessel???</p></htmltext>
<tokenext>Seriously , when I had first heard of electronically controlled throttle , braking , and steering systems in cars , each time I thought it was just a matter of time before one goes haywire and causes accidents .
There 's a place for computer control for things... This is simply not it .
Owners of cars with traditional mechanical throttles and hydraulic braking system simply do n't have anything like this to worry about and WO N'T have to worry about it.Steering is one place where computer control really terrifies me .
As we 've already seen , this type of system can not be trusted with braking and throttle , so next we 're going to see cars turning harder than the driver intended due to some " cosmic ray " caused glitch .
That person , trying to merge into traffic will end up cutting hard across traffic , likely being killed in the process.The what are they going to blame it on ? ? ?
Terrans launching an EMP Shockwave from their floating Science Vessel ? ?
?</tokentext>
<sentencetext>Seriously, when I had first heard of electronically controlled throttle, braking, and steering systems in cars, each time I thought it was just a matter of time before one goes haywire and causes accidents.
There's a place for computer control for things... This is simply not it.
Owners of cars with traditional mechanical throttles and hydraulic braking system simply don't have anything like this to worry about and WON'T have to worry about it.Steering is one place where computer control really terrifies me.
As we've already seen, this type of system cannot be trusted with braking and throttle, so next we're going to see cars turning harder than the driver intended due to some "cosmic ray" caused glitch.
That person, trying to merge into traffic will end up cutting hard across traffic, likely being killed in the process.The what are they going to blame it on???
Terrans launching an EMP Shockwave from their floating Science Vessel??
?</sentencetext>
</comment>
<comment>
	<id>http://www.semanticweb.org/ontologies/ConversationInstances.owl#comment10_03_28_2017236.31651318</id>
	<title>Re:Why is everyone picking on Toyota?</title>
	<author>Mashiki</author>
	<datestamp>1269777840000</datestamp>
	<modclass>None</modclass>
	<modscore>1</modscore>
	<htmltext><p>Wiring on fly-by-wire on planes are double or triple weave shielded.  They aren't on Toyota's, they're just plastic coated wires.</p></htmltext>
<tokenext>Wiring on fly-by-wire on planes are double or triple weave shielded .
They are n't on Toyota 's , they 're just plastic coated wires .</tokentext>
<sentencetext>Wiring on fly-by-wire on planes are double or triple weave shielded.
They aren't on Toyota's, they're just plastic coated wires.</sentencetext>
	<parent>http://www.semanticweb.org/ontologies/ConversationInstances.owl#comment10_03_28_2017236.31650902</parent>
</comment>
<comment>
	<id>http://www.semanticweb.org/ontologies/ConversationInstances.owl#comment10_03_28_2017236.31655992</id>
	<title>What codswallop.</title>
	<author>Anonymous</author>
	<datestamp>1269872340000</datestamp>
	<modclass>None</modclass>
	<modscore>0</modscore>
	<htmltext><p>This Massengill fellow sounds like a real douche.</p></htmltext>
<tokenext>This Massengill fellow sounds like a real douche .</tokentext>
<sentencetext>This Massengill fellow sounds like a real douche.</sentencetext>
</comment>
<comment>
	<id>http://www.semanticweb.org/ontologies/ConversationInstances.owl#comment10_03_28_2017236.31656790</id>
	<title>Re:Yes, he's speculating</title>
	<author>Anonymous</author>
	<datestamp>1269876000000</datestamp>
	<modclass>None</modclass>
	<modscore>0</modscore>
	<htmltext><blockquote><div><p>What's not known is what direction Toyota and other automakers are taking in terms of finding and correcting these issues</p></div></blockquote><p>What he really means is "What's not known to him". People in the industry have been dealing with randomness and various odd hardware failures for decades. This is being formally addressed in the upcoming ISO 26262 standard. So yes, this guy is writing pure speculation and someone is apparently publishing his unqualified babble - probably because he's got a PhD.</p></div>
	</htmltext>
<tokenext>What 's not known is what direction Toyota and other automakers are taking in terms of finding and correcting these issuesWhat he really means is " What 's not known to him " .
People in the industry have been dealing with randomness and various odd hardware failures for decades .
This is being formally addressed in the upcoming ISO 26262 standard .
So yes , this guy is writing pure speculation and someone is apparently publishing his unqualified babble - probably because he 's got a PhD .</tokentext>
<sentencetext>What's not known is what direction Toyota and other automakers are taking in terms of finding and correcting these issuesWhat he really means is "What's not known to him".
People in the industry have been dealing with randomness and various odd hardware failures for decades.
This is being formally addressed in the upcoming ISO 26262 standard.
So yes, this guy is writing pure speculation and someone is apparently publishing his unqualified babble - probably because he's got a PhD.
	</sentencetext>
	<parent>http://www.semanticweb.org/ontologies/ConversationInstances.owl#comment10_03_28_2017236.31650804</parent>
</comment>
<comment>
	<id>http://www.semanticweb.org/ontologies/ConversationInstances.owl#comment10_03_28_2017236.31651418</id>
	<title>Re:Why is everyone picking on Toyota?</title>
	<author>budgenator</author>
	<datestamp>1269778560000</datestamp>
	<modclass>None</modclass>
	<modscore>1</modscore>
	<htmltext><p>Are you talking about Airbus style fly-by-wire or Boeing style Fly-by-wire? In the Airbus the pilot flies the computer and the computer flies the plane, computers crash and so does the Airbus; In the Boeing style the pilot flies the plane the computer helps but the pilot is boss.</p></htmltext>
<tokenext>Are you talking about Airbus style fly-by-wire or Boeing style Fly-by-wire ?
In the Airbus the pilot flies the computer and the computer flies the plane , computers crash and so does the Airbus ; In the Boeing style the pilot flies the plane the computer helps but the pilot is boss .</tokentext>
<sentencetext>Are you talking about Airbus style fly-by-wire or Boeing style Fly-by-wire?
In the Airbus the pilot flies the computer and the computer flies the plane, computers crash and so does the Airbus; In the Boeing style the pilot flies the plane the computer helps but the pilot is boss.</sentencetext>
	<parent>http://www.semanticweb.org/ontologies/ConversationInstances.owl#comment10_03_28_2017236.31650902</parent>
</comment>
<comment>
	<id>http://www.semanticweb.org/ontologies/ConversationInstances.owl#comment10_03_28_2017236.31655670</id>
	<title>Re:Weird</title>
	<author>Anonymous</author>
	<datestamp>1269870000000</datestamp>
	<modclass>None</modclass>
	<modscore>0</modscore>
	<htmltext><p>Unfortunately, yes,  Unless you've grown up on a farm, in the country, or drive some vehicle for work that requires a stick shift, then yes, most vehices here are automatic.  Personally, I think this is a problem. People here have the mentality that you just get in and push the peddle to go without any further really basic understanding of how a vehicle works.  Every time I hear a story about some driver unable to turn off their car all I can really think is "what a dumbass".  If you are going to operate something that has the potential to kill you then at least understand how it works.</p></htmltext>
<tokenext>Unfortunately , yes , Unless you 've grown up on a farm , in the country , or drive some vehicle for work that requires a stick shift , then yes , most vehices here are automatic .
Personally , I think this is a problem .
People here have the mentality that you just get in and push the peddle to go without any further really basic understanding of how a vehicle works .
Every time I hear a story about some driver unable to turn off their car all I can really think is " what a dumbass " .
If you are going to operate something that has the potential to kill you then at least understand how it works .</tokentext>
<sentencetext>Unfortunately, yes,  Unless you've grown up on a farm, in the country, or drive some vehicle for work that requires a stick shift, then yes, most vehices here are automatic.
Personally, I think this is a problem.
People here have the mentality that you just get in and push the peddle to go without any further really basic understanding of how a vehicle works.
Every time I hear a story about some driver unable to turn off their car all I can really think is "what a dumbass".
If you are going to operate something that has the potential to kill you then at least understand how it works.</sentencetext>
	<parent>http://www.semanticweb.org/ontologies/ConversationInstances.owl#comment10_03_28_2017236.31654692</parent>
</comment>
<comment>
	<id>http://www.semanticweb.org/ontologies/ConversationInstances.owl#comment10_03_28_2017236.31654486</id>
	<title>Re:I was proofed right</title>
	<author>hardburlyboogerman</author>
	<datestamp>1269855840000</datestamp>
	<modclass>None</modclass>
	<modscore>1</modscore>
	<htmltext><p>I like the classic cars &amp; trucks better than the newer ones.Those I can work on myself..Current project is a 1967 Chevy van being turned into a real version of the Mystery Machine..Next Up:the Adam West Batmobile.using a 1961 Dodge Dart  former police car with the 383 interceptor engine (original).<br>Some see this as work,but it's fun for me.</p></htmltext>
<tokenext>I like the classic cars &amp; trucks better than the newer ones.Those I can work on myself..Current project is a 1967 Chevy van being turned into a real version of the Mystery Machine..Next Up : the Adam West Batmobile.using a 1961 Dodge Dart former police car with the 383 interceptor engine ( original ) .Some see this as work,but it 's fun for me .</tokentext>
<sentencetext>I like the classic cars &amp; trucks better than the newer ones.Those I can work on myself..Current project is a 1967 Chevy van being turned into a real version of the Mystery Machine..Next Up:the Adam West Batmobile.using a 1961 Dodge Dart  former police car with the 383 interceptor engine (original).Some see this as work,but it's fun for me.</sentencetext>
	<parent>http://www.semanticweb.org/ontologies/ConversationInstances.owl#comment10_03_28_2017236.31651346</parent>
</comment>
<comment>
	<id>http://www.semanticweb.org/ontologies/ConversationInstances.owl#comment10_03_28_2017236.31700850</id>
	<title>probem may lie in pre-testing..</title>
	<author>Anonymous</author>
	<datestamp>1270141080000</datestamp>
	<modclass>None</modclass>
	<modscore>0</modscore>
	<htmltext><p>Well it seems that everyone is concentrating on the high tech while the problem could be lying in the lack of pre-testing or much shorter time for pre-testing.</p><p>when new car were designed 20 years, it used to 3-5 years with molding and all that.<br>There was enough time to test all the parts and accessories to go with that but now with superior cad tech, it takes 3-6 months to design a car so how much time is spent on testing all the parts and accessories?</p><p>well someone should look into this to see how much pre-tesing was with the gas pedals and we might have the answer for the problem!</p></htmltext>
<tokenext>Well it seems that everyone is concentrating on the high tech while the problem could be lying in the lack of pre-testing or much shorter time for pre-testing.when new car were designed 20 years , it used to 3-5 years with molding and all that.There was enough time to test all the parts and accessories to go with that but now with superior cad tech , it takes 3-6 months to design a car so how much time is spent on testing all the parts and accessories ? well someone should look into this to see how much pre-tesing was with the gas pedals and we might have the answer for the problem !</tokentext>
<sentencetext>Well it seems that everyone is concentrating on the high tech while the problem could be lying in the lack of pre-testing or much shorter time for pre-testing.when new car were designed 20 years, it used to 3-5 years with molding and all that.There was enough time to test all the parts and accessories to go with that but now with superior cad tech, it takes 3-6 months to design a car so how much time is spent on testing all the parts and accessories?well someone should look into this to see how much pre-tesing was with the gas pedals and we might have the answer for the problem!</sentencetext>
</comment>
<comment>
	<id>http://www.semanticweb.org/ontologies/ConversationInstances.owl#comment10_03_28_2017236.31658196</id>
	<title>Re:Is there realy a problem?</title>
	<author>ShakaUVM</author>
	<datestamp>1269881640000</datestamp>
	<modclass>None</modclass>
	<modscore>1</modscore>
	<htmltext><p>&gt;&gt;You replicate it and see if it happens again</p><p>That's the problem with byzantine failures - you can't replicate them. My car never went out of control again.</p><p>&gt;&gt;Loose floormats have been confirmed to cause it</p><p>When my car when out of control (the accelerator floored) my first thought was that a floormat had covered it so I reached down and, nope. I even pulled the accelerator pedal out with my hands. After that I put it in neutral and then turned it off when the engine redlined. This is eliding all of the oh shit oh shit stuff that was going on at the time.</p><p>&gt;&gt;But "the car accelerated, I applied the brake and only the brake once the acceleration started and pushed it as hard as I could and the vehicle continued to accelerate out of control" cases have, as far as I know, *never* been replicated.</p><p>That's great for you, but is exactly what happened to me. I was pushing on the brakes as hard as I could with both feet, and the car still accelerated out of control.</p><p>&gt;&gt;The brakes are somewhere around ten times more powerful than the engine.</p><p>That's a great theory you have there. The truth of the matter is, you're wrong.</p><p>&gt;&gt;It was the cruise control that got stuck in the "accelerate" position.</p><p>I also flicked the cruise control on and off when it was out of control, and it did nothing.</p></htmltext>
<tokenext>&gt; &gt; You replicate it and see if it happens againThat 's the problem with byzantine failures - you ca n't replicate them .
My car never went out of control again. &gt; &gt; Loose floormats have been confirmed to cause itWhen my car when out of control ( the accelerator floored ) my first thought was that a floormat had covered it so I reached down and , nope .
I even pulled the accelerator pedal out with my hands .
After that I put it in neutral and then turned it off when the engine redlined .
This is eliding all of the oh shit oh shit stuff that was going on at the time. &gt; &gt; But " the car accelerated , I applied the brake and only the brake once the acceleration started and pushed it as hard as I could and the vehicle continued to accelerate out of control " cases have , as far as I know , * never * been replicated.That 's great for you , but is exactly what happened to me .
I was pushing on the brakes as hard as I could with both feet , and the car still accelerated out of control. &gt; &gt; The brakes are somewhere around ten times more powerful than the engine.That 's a great theory you have there .
The truth of the matter is , you 're wrong. &gt; &gt; It was the cruise control that got stuck in the " accelerate " position.I also flicked the cruise control on and off when it was out of control , and it did nothing .</tokentext>
<sentencetext>&gt;&gt;You replicate it and see if it happens againThat's the problem with byzantine failures - you can't replicate them.
My car never went out of control again.&gt;&gt;Loose floormats have been confirmed to cause itWhen my car when out of control (the accelerator floored) my first thought was that a floormat had covered it so I reached down and, nope.
I even pulled the accelerator pedal out with my hands.
After that I put it in neutral and then turned it off when the engine redlined.
This is eliding all of the oh shit oh shit stuff that was going on at the time.&gt;&gt;But "the car accelerated, I applied the brake and only the brake once the acceleration started and pushed it as hard as I could and the vehicle continued to accelerate out of control" cases have, as far as I know, *never* been replicated.That's great for you, but is exactly what happened to me.
I was pushing on the brakes as hard as I could with both feet, and the car still accelerated out of control.&gt;&gt;The brakes are somewhere around ten times more powerful than the engine.That's a great theory you have there.
The truth of the matter is, you're wrong.&gt;&gt;It was the cruise control that got stuck in the "accelerate" position.I also flicked the cruise control on and off when it was out of control, and it did nothing.</sentencetext>
	<parent>http://www.semanticweb.org/ontologies/ConversationInstances.owl#comment10_03_28_2017236.31652608</parent>
</comment>
<comment>
	<id>http://www.semanticweb.org/ontologies/ConversationInstances.owl#comment10_03_28_2017236.31652780</id>
	<title>Re:Space Rays, My Ass</title>
	<author>Anonymous</author>
	<datestamp>1269791940000</datestamp>
	<modclass>None</modclass>
	<modscore>0</modscore>
	<htmltext><p>"Whether you subscribe to Occam's razor,"</p><p>How much for one year? Is it cheaper if you pay for 2 years?<br>How much per issue?</p></htmltext>
<tokenext>" Whether you subscribe to Occam 's razor , " How much for one year ?
Is it cheaper if you pay for 2 years ? How much per issue ?</tokentext>
<sentencetext>"Whether you subscribe to Occam's razor,"How much for one year?
Is it cheaper if you pay for 2 years?How much per issue?</sentencetext>
	<parent>http://www.semanticweb.org/ontologies/ConversationInstances.owl#comment10_03_28_2017236.31650852</parent>
</comment>
<comment>
	<id>http://www.semanticweb.org/ontologies/ConversationInstances.owl#comment10_03_28_2017236.31652062</id>
	<title>Cosmic rays really work...</title>
	<author>Anonymous</author>
	<datestamp>1269784380000</datestamp>
	<modclass>None</modclass>
	<modscore>0</modscore>
	<htmltext><p>In the early '80's, it was discovered that a PC would hang on the average of about every three weeks due to the ionizing effect of cosmic rays here in Denver. BSOD every three weeks on computers doing nothing but waiting for a login, in other words. They figured out how to alter the design of the chips so that this is no longer a problem, even with much much smaller scales of construction with much less apparent area to dissipate the charge of ionizing radiation over. That is the reason the world does not come crashing to a halt every few minutes today: we have learned to design around the problems of ionizing radiation flipping bits in microprocessors. Given that Toyota has apparently pursued their own design practices which differ apparently from industry usual practice, it is not so absurd that cosmic rays could have an impact, and the nature of those problems would be pretty random. Given the effort that has been put into locating the source of the Toyota problems, you have to look beyond the "obvious" at this point, and this looks like a credible avenue to pursue.</p></htmltext>
<tokenext>In the early '80 's , it was discovered that a PC would hang on the average of about every three weeks due to the ionizing effect of cosmic rays here in Denver .
BSOD every three weeks on computers doing nothing but waiting for a login , in other words .
They figured out how to alter the design of the chips so that this is no longer a problem , even with much much smaller scales of construction with much less apparent area to dissipate the charge of ionizing radiation over .
That is the reason the world does not come crashing to a halt every few minutes today : we have learned to design around the problems of ionizing radiation flipping bits in microprocessors .
Given that Toyota has apparently pursued their own design practices which differ apparently from industry usual practice , it is not so absurd that cosmic rays could have an impact , and the nature of those problems would be pretty random .
Given the effort that has been put into locating the source of the Toyota problems , you have to look beyond the " obvious " at this point , and this looks like a credible avenue to pursue .</tokentext>
<sentencetext>In the early '80's, it was discovered that a PC would hang on the average of about every three weeks due to the ionizing effect of cosmic rays here in Denver.
BSOD every three weeks on computers doing nothing but waiting for a login, in other words.
They figured out how to alter the design of the chips so that this is no longer a problem, even with much much smaller scales of construction with much less apparent area to dissipate the charge of ionizing radiation over.
That is the reason the world does not come crashing to a halt every few minutes today: we have learned to design around the problems of ionizing radiation flipping bits in microprocessors.
Given that Toyota has apparently pursued their own design practices which differ apparently from industry usual practice, it is not so absurd that cosmic rays could have an impact, and the nature of those problems would be pretty random.
Given the effort that has been put into locating the source of the Toyota problems, you have to look beyond the "obvious" at this point, and this looks like a credible avenue to pursue.</sentencetext>
	<parent>http://www.semanticweb.org/ontologies/ConversationInstances.owl#comment10_03_28_2017236.31650804</parent>
</comment>
<comment>
	<id>http://www.semanticweb.org/ontologies/ConversationInstances.owl#comment10_03_28_2017236.31651340</id>
	<title>Re:Is there realy a problem?</title>
	<author>Anonymous</author>
	<datestamp>1269778080000</datestamp>
	<modclass>Informativ</modclass>
	<modscore>2</modscore>
	<htmltext><p><div class="quote"><p>Since the biggest Toyota runaway story has turned out to be a problem exists between seat and pedals situation...</p> </div><p>The article you linked to does not even begin to support that conclusion.  Basically its a bunch of innuendo, like he [i]might[/i] have been late on payments on the car (since proven false) or that he should have shifted it to neutral (not an intuitive action for someone who has never driven a manual transmission - and certainly a last resort that does not negate the existence of a problem to begin with).  Even information released after that article was published has been far from damning - basically toyota has said "we couldn't reproduce the problem" - as if "works for me" means there are no software bugs.</p><p>The undisputed facts are that the brakes were severely worn (although Toyota claims that the wear is not consistent with emergency braking - huh?) and that the car's black-box showed that the guy hit the brakes over 200 times during the time of the incident and that a cop witnessed the guy practically standing on the brakes.</p><p>Unless there is more that's come out recently, all <i>facts</i> released so far point to a failure with the car, not the nut behind the wheel.</p></div>
	</htmltext>
<tokenext>Since the biggest Toyota runaway story has turned out to be a problem exists between seat and pedals situation... The article you linked to does not even begin to support that conclusion .
Basically its a bunch of innuendo , like he [ i ] might [ /i ] have been late on payments on the car ( since proven false ) or that he should have shifted it to neutral ( not an intuitive action for someone who has never driven a manual transmission - and certainly a last resort that does not negate the existence of a problem to begin with ) .
Even information released after that article was published has been far from damning - basically toyota has said " we could n't reproduce the problem " - as if " works for me " means there are no software bugs.The undisputed facts are that the brakes were severely worn ( although Toyota claims that the wear is not consistent with emergency braking - huh ?
) and that the car 's black-box showed that the guy hit the brakes over 200 times during the time of the incident and that a cop witnessed the guy practically standing on the brakes.Unless there is more that 's come out recently , all facts released so far point to a failure with the car , not the nut behind the wheel .</tokentext>
<sentencetext>Since the biggest Toyota runaway story has turned out to be a problem exists between seat and pedals situation... The article you linked to does not even begin to support that conclusion.
Basically its a bunch of innuendo, like he [i]might[/i] have been late on payments on the car (since proven false) or that he should have shifted it to neutral (not an intuitive action for someone who has never driven a manual transmission - and certainly a last resort that does not negate the existence of a problem to begin with).
Even information released after that article was published has been far from damning - basically toyota has said "we couldn't reproduce the problem" - as if "works for me" means there are no software bugs.The undisputed facts are that the brakes were severely worn (although Toyota claims that the wear is not consistent with emergency braking - huh?
) and that the car's black-box showed that the guy hit the brakes over 200 times during the time of the incident and that a cop witnessed the guy practically standing on the brakes.Unless there is more that's come out recently, all facts released so far point to a failure with the car, not the nut behind the wheel.
	</sentencetext>
	<parent>http://www.semanticweb.org/ontologies/ConversationInstances.owl#comment10_03_28_2017236.31650786</parent>
</comment>
<comment>
	<id>http://www.semanticweb.org/ontologies/ConversationInstances.owl#comment10_03_28_2017236.31660348</id>
	<title>Fantastic Car</title>
	<author>HTH NE1</author>
	<datestamp>1269891360000</datestamp>
	<modclass>None</modclass>
	<modscore>1</modscore>
	<htmltext><p>On a cross-country adventure<br>It got hit by cosmic rays<br>And the car was changed forever<br>In some most fantastic ways</p><p>No need to steer<br>It's here<br>Just call the Car<br>Fantastic Car</p><p>"Don't need OnStar."<br>"That's anticompetitive!"</p><p>Oh, the gas pedal's on elastic<br>The brakes just fade from sight<br>Johnny is The Human Torch<br>The pedestrians run with fright</p><p>From the Car<br>Fantastic Car<br>Fantastic Car</p></htmltext>
<tokenext>On a cross-country adventureIt got hit by cosmic raysAnd the car was changed foreverIn some most fantastic waysNo need to steerIt 's hereJust call the CarFantastic Car " Do n't need OnStar .
" " That 's anticompetitive !
" Oh , the gas pedal 's on elasticThe brakes just fade from sightJohnny is The Human TorchThe pedestrians run with frightFrom the CarFantastic CarFantastic Car</tokentext>
<sentencetext>On a cross-country adventureIt got hit by cosmic raysAnd the car was changed foreverIn some most fantastic waysNo need to steerIt's hereJust call the CarFantastic Car"Don't need OnStar.
""That's anticompetitive!
"Oh, the gas pedal's on elasticThe brakes just fade from sightJohnny is The Human TorchThe pedestrians run with frightFrom the CarFantastic CarFantastic Car</sentencetext>
</comment>
<comment>
	<id>http://www.semanticweb.org/ontologies/ConversationInstances.owl#comment10_03_28_2017236.31650912</id>
	<title>Single event upset</title>
	<author>Anonymous</author>
	<datestamp>1269774780000</datestamp>
	<modclass>None</modclass>
	<modscore>0</modscore>
	<htmltext><p>The Avionics industry has been designing around neutron single event upset for decades now.  Check out <a href="http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Single\_event\_upset" title="wikipedia.org" rel="nofollow">http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Single\_event\_upset</a> [wikipedia.org] (and the links) for details.  There are also several reference to "neutron single event upset" when you do a web search.</p></htmltext>
<tokenext>The Avionics industry has been designing around neutron single event upset for decades now .
Check out http : //en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Single \ _event \ _upset [ wikipedia.org ] ( and the links ) for details .
There are also several reference to " neutron single event upset " when you do a web search .</tokentext>
<sentencetext>The Avionics industry has been designing around neutron single event upset for decades now.
Check out http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Single\_event\_upset [wikipedia.org] (and the links) for details.
There are also several reference to "neutron single event upset" when you do a web search.</sentencetext>
</comment>
<comment>
	<id>http://www.semanticweb.org/ontologies/ConversationInstances.owl#comment10_03_28_2017236.31653250</id>
	<title>Re:Is there realy a problem?</title>
	<author>HBoar</author>
	<datestamp>1269796860000</datestamp>
	<modclass>None</modclass>
	<modscore>1</modscore>
	<htmltext>That's a good anecdote to show that you should keep your vehicles brakes in good order, nothing else.  There is absolutely no way that a brake system in reasonable order wouldn't provide enough torque to stop the engine -- even in 1st gear, let alone a higher gear.</htmltext>
<tokenext>That 's a good anecdote to show that you should keep your vehicles brakes in good order , nothing else .
There is absolutely no way that a brake system in reasonable order would n't provide enough torque to stop the engine -- even in 1st gear , let alone a higher gear .</tokentext>
<sentencetext>That's a good anecdote to show that you should keep your vehicles brakes in good order, nothing else.
There is absolutely no way that a brake system in reasonable order wouldn't provide enough torque to stop the engine -- even in 1st gear, let alone a higher gear.</sentencetext>
	<parent>http://www.semanticweb.org/ontologies/ConversationInstances.owl#comment10_03_28_2017236.31651256</parent>
</comment>
<comment>
	<id>http://www.semanticweb.org/ontologies/ConversationInstances.owl#comment10_03_28_2017236.31651274</id>
	<title>How about tinfoil hats for the engine compartment?</title>
	<author>marciot</author>
	<datestamp>1269777540000</datestamp>
	<modclass>None</modclass>
	<modscore>1</modscore>
	<htmltext><p>Oh, right. Hoods and bonnets. They already have those.</p><p>They should start making them out of lead, maybe?</p></htmltext>
<tokenext>Oh , right .
Hoods and bonnets .
They already have those.They should start making them out of lead , maybe ?</tokentext>
<sentencetext>Oh, right.
Hoods and bonnets.
They already have those.They should start making them out of lead, maybe?</sentencetext>
</comment>
<comment>
	<id>http://www.semanticweb.org/ontologies/ConversationInstances.owl#comment10_03_28_2017236.31659764</id>
	<title>Re:Weird</title>
	<author>CompMD</author>
	<datestamp>1269888600000</datestamp>
	<modclass>None</modclass>
	<modscore>1</modscore>
	<htmltext><p>Yes, they are that rare.</p><p>It pisses me off that I have a European car that was *impossible* to buy in the US with a manual gearbox.  Every other country it is sold in, a manual transmission is standard.  To top it off, the automatic was an additional $2000 "option" when it was new.  Luckily though, I talked with my local friendly dealer, and when the automatic eventually fails, I can get a manual transmission fitted as a replacement.</p></htmltext>
<tokenext>Yes , they are that rare.It pisses me off that I have a European car that was * impossible * to buy in the US with a manual gearbox .
Every other country it is sold in , a manual transmission is standard .
To top it off , the automatic was an additional $ 2000 " option " when it was new .
Luckily though , I talked with my local friendly dealer , and when the automatic eventually fails , I can get a manual transmission fitted as a replacement .</tokentext>
<sentencetext>Yes, they are that rare.It pisses me off that I have a European car that was *impossible* to buy in the US with a manual gearbox.
Every other country it is sold in, a manual transmission is standard.
To top it off, the automatic was an additional $2000 "option" when it was new.
Luckily though, I talked with my local friendly dealer, and when the automatic eventually fails, I can get a manual transmission fitted as a replacement.</sentencetext>
	<parent>http://www.semanticweb.org/ontologies/ConversationInstances.owl#comment10_03_28_2017236.31654692</parent>
</comment>
<comment>
	<id>http://www.semanticweb.org/ontologies/ConversationInstances.owl#comment10_03_28_2017236.31661824</id>
	<title>Re:Weird</title>
	<author>Anonymous</author>
	<datestamp>1269855060000</datestamp>
	<modclass>None</modclass>
	<modscore>0</modscore>
	<htmltext><p>Yes</p></htmltext>
<tokenext>Yes</tokentext>
<sentencetext>Yes</sentencetext>
	<parent>http://www.semanticweb.org/ontologies/ConversationInstances.owl#comment10_03_28_2017236.31654692</parent>
</comment>
<comment>
	<id>http://www.semanticweb.org/ontologies/ConversationInstances.owl#comment10_03_28_2017236.31659308</id>
	<title>Re:Weird</title>
	<author>Anonymous</author>
	<datestamp>1269886740000</datestamp>
	<modclass>None</modclass>
	<modscore>0</modscore>
	<htmltext><p>Yes.</p></htmltext>
<tokenext>Yes .</tokentext>
<sentencetext>Yes.</sentencetext>
	<parent>http://www.semanticweb.org/ontologies/ConversationInstances.owl#comment10_03_28_2017236.31654692</parent>
</comment>
<comment>
	<id>http://www.semanticweb.org/ontologies/ConversationInstances.owl#comment10_03_28_2017236.31652028</id>
	<title>End-to-End Protection</title>
	<author>selectiontimeout</author>
	<datestamp>1269784200000</datestamp>
	<modclass>None</modclass>
	<modscore>1</modscore>
	<htmltext><a href="http://www.t10.org/ftp/t10/document.03/03-224r0.pdf" title="t10.org" rel="nofollow">http://www.t10.org/ftp/t10/document.03/03-224r0.pdf</a> [t10.org]

Storage systems have standards in place where every data path is protected by CRC to ensure data integrity.  Short of keeping cost low, there should be no reason not to implement something similar to automotive applications.</htmltext>
<tokenext>http : //www.t10.org/ftp/t10/document.03/03-224r0.pdf [ t10.org ] Storage systems have standards in place where every data path is protected by CRC to ensure data integrity .
Short of keeping cost low , there should be no reason not to implement something similar to automotive applications .</tokentext>
<sentencetext>http://www.t10.org/ftp/t10/document.03/03-224r0.pdf [t10.org]

Storage systems have standards in place where every data path is protected by CRC to ensure data integrity.
Short of keeping cost low, there should be no reason not to implement something similar to automotive applications.</sentencetext>
</comment>
<comment>
	<id>http://www.semanticweb.org/ontologies/ConversationInstances.owl#comment10_03_28_2017236.31651388</id>
	<title>If I were a janitor I'd work at Toyota...</title>
	<author>Anonymous</author>
	<datestamp>1269778440000</datestamp>
	<modclass>None</modclass>
	<modscore>0</modscore>
	<htmltext><p>cuz their shit don't stink!</p></htmltext>
<tokenext>cuz their shit do n't stink !</tokentext>
<sentencetext>cuz their shit don't stink!</sentencetext>
</comment>
<comment>
	<id>http://www.semanticweb.org/ontologies/ConversationInstances.owl#comment10_03_28_2017236.31652014</id>
	<title>Not even a software problem</title>
	<author>ymgve</author>
	<datestamp>1269784080000</datestamp>
	<modclass>None</modclass>
	<modscore>1</modscore>
	<htmltext><p>They might have a slight point if the stuck accelerator problem actually was caused a software problem.</p><p>But since the problem has been shown to be <a href="http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/2009-2010\_Toyota\_vehicle\_recalls#Floor\_mat\_recall" title="wikipedia.org">a floor mat</a> [wikipedia.org], or, in some other cases, <a href="http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/2009-2010\_Toyota\_vehicle\_recalls#Accelerator\_pedal\_recall" title="wikipedia.org">a faulty mechanical design</a> [wikipedia.org], what does this article have to do with anything?</p></htmltext>
<tokenext>They might have a slight point if the stuck accelerator problem actually was caused a software problem.But since the problem has been shown to be a floor mat [ wikipedia.org ] , or , in some other cases , a faulty mechanical design [ wikipedia.org ] , what does this article have to do with anything ?</tokentext>
<sentencetext>They might have a slight point if the stuck accelerator problem actually was caused a software problem.But since the problem has been shown to be a floor mat [wikipedia.org], or, in some other cases, a faulty mechanical design [wikipedia.org], what does this article have to do with anything?</sentencetext>
</comment>
<comment>
	<id>http://www.semanticweb.org/ontologies/ConversationInstances.owl#comment10_03_28_2017236.31652990</id>
	<title>SO many ways to confuse digital circuits</title>
	<author>Anonymous</author>
	<datestamp>1269794520000</datestamp>
	<modclass>Interestin</modclass>
	<modscore>1</modscore>
	<htmltext><p>Having worked in digital electronics for 30 years, I have seen some pretty strange ways to introduce noise into digital circuits:<br>1) Inadequate grounding - two circuits are communicating, but are grounded to two different ground planes. Over time they build up a potential difference, and the 5 volts necessary to form a "1" bit starts to look like 3 or 4 volts to the other side. The signal just "stops", until you power down and the charge bleeds off. It won't reoccur during short tests.<br>2) Static electricity. Cars develop thousands of volts in static electric potential from air friction, just like airplanes. You may laugh, but static can be devastating to digital circuits. It can make craters in chips and even when it doesn't destroy them it can flip bits undetected until they are accessed. I worked on one system that would reboot whenever my boss walked by and brushed against it wearing  a wool suit jacket - true story.<br>3) Temperature sensitive dielectric in the capacitors. Capacitors are shielding the power lines on the bus from digital information - which behaves just like high frequency noise. The capacitors get hot from engine heat, the dielectric looses its resistance to electrons, the capacitors fail temporarily and allow digital noise onto the power lines which then bleeds into the circuits attached - causing random errors all over the place.<br>4) The antenna effect - circuits operating in the multi-hundred megahertz to gigahertz frequencies start to radiate from copper conductors on the circuit board - these signals can be picked up by other copper traces on the circuit board and cause "ghost" signals. It is often necessary to use micro-coax cable instead of etched copper traces to quell this problem.</p><p>Toyota should let their computer geeks go back to playing WoW, and give a couple of good high-frequency electrical engineers look a the problem.</p></htmltext>
<tokenext>Having worked in digital electronics for 30 years , I have seen some pretty strange ways to introduce noise into digital circuits : 1 ) Inadequate grounding - two circuits are communicating , but are grounded to two different ground planes .
Over time they build up a potential difference , and the 5 volts necessary to form a " 1 " bit starts to look like 3 or 4 volts to the other side .
The signal just " stops " , until you power down and the charge bleeds off .
It wo n't reoccur during short tests.2 ) Static electricity .
Cars develop thousands of volts in static electric potential from air friction , just like airplanes .
You may laugh , but static can be devastating to digital circuits .
It can make craters in chips and even when it does n't destroy them it can flip bits undetected until they are accessed .
I worked on one system that would reboot whenever my boss walked by and brushed against it wearing a wool suit jacket - true story.3 ) Temperature sensitive dielectric in the capacitors .
Capacitors are shielding the power lines on the bus from digital information - which behaves just like high frequency noise .
The capacitors get hot from engine heat , the dielectric looses its resistance to electrons , the capacitors fail temporarily and allow digital noise onto the power lines which then bleeds into the circuits attached - causing random errors all over the place.4 ) The antenna effect - circuits operating in the multi-hundred megahertz to gigahertz frequencies start to radiate from copper conductors on the circuit board - these signals can be picked up by other copper traces on the circuit board and cause " ghost " signals .
It is often necessary to use micro-coax cable instead of etched copper traces to quell this problem.Toyota should let their computer geeks go back to playing WoW , and give a couple of good high-frequency electrical engineers look a the problem .</tokentext>
<sentencetext>Having worked in digital electronics for 30 years, I have seen some pretty strange ways to introduce noise into digital circuits:1) Inadequate grounding - two circuits are communicating, but are grounded to two different ground planes.
Over time they build up a potential difference, and the 5 volts necessary to form a "1" bit starts to look like 3 or 4 volts to the other side.
The signal just "stops", until you power down and the charge bleeds off.
It won't reoccur during short tests.2) Static electricity.
Cars develop thousands of volts in static electric potential from air friction, just like airplanes.
You may laugh, but static can be devastating to digital circuits.
It can make craters in chips and even when it doesn't destroy them it can flip bits undetected until they are accessed.
I worked on one system that would reboot whenever my boss walked by and brushed against it wearing  a wool suit jacket - true story.3) Temperature sensitive dielectric in the capacitors.
Capacitors are shielding the power lines on the bus from digital information - which behaves just like high frequency noise.
The capacitors get hot from engine heat, the dielectric looses its resistance to electrons, the capacitors fail temporarily and allow digital noise onto the power lines which then bleeds into the circuits attached - causing random errors all over the place.4) The antenna effect - circuits operating in the multi-hundred megahertz to gigahertz frequencies start to radiate from copper conductors on the circuit board - these signals can be picked up by other copper traces on the circuit board and cause "ghost" signals.
It is often necessary to use micro-coax cable instead of etched copper traces to quell this problem.Toyota should let their computer geeks go back to playing WoW, and give a couple of good high-frequency electrical engineers look a the problem.</sentencetext>
</comment>
<comment>
	<id>http://www.semanticweb.org/ontologies/ConversationInstances.owl#comment10_03_28_2017236.31652586</id>
	<title>More like space aliens</title>
	<author>davidwr</author>
	<datestamp>1269789480000</datestamp>
	<modclass>None</modclass>
	<modscore>1</modscore>
	<htmltext><p>If by "car safety problems" you mean the driver in the car next to me who based on his lack of driving skills is obviously new to this planet, then yes.</p></htmltext>
<tokenext>If by " car safety problems " you mean the driver in the car next to me who based on his lack of driving skills is obviously new to this planet , then yes .</tokentext>
<sentencetext>If by "car safety problems" you mean the driver in the car next to me who based on his lack of driving skills is obviously new to this planet, then yes.</sentencetext>
</comment>
<comment>
	<id>http://www.semanticweb.org/ontologies/ConversationInstances.owl#comment10_03_28_2017236.31650852</id>
	<title>Space Rays, My Ass</title>
	<author>Anonymous</author>
	<datestamp>1269774480000</datestamp>
	<modclass>Funny</modclass>
	<modscore>4</modscore>
	<htmltext>Whether you subscribe to Occam's razor, or just plain old common sense, <i>rays from outer space</i> are not Toyota's problem (though they <b>may</b> be the author's problem). <br> <br>
This type of thing is just plain bat shit crazy. There is a problem somewhere in Toyota's system somewhere. Either a software bug or bad chips or something real and tangible<nobr> <wbr></nobr>... but <i>rays from outer space</i>? Please.<br> <br>
If someone here on<nobr> <wbr></nobr>/. had posted that in the last Toyota story they would have gotten a +5 Funny.</htmltext>
<tokenext>Whether you subscribe to Occam 's razor , or just plain old common sense , rays from outer space are not Toyota 's problem ( though they may be the author 's problem ) .
This type of thing is just plain bat shit crazy .
There is a problem somewhere in Toyota 's system somewhere .
Either a software bug or bad chips or something real and tangible ... but rays from outer space ?
Please . If someone here on / .
had posted that in the last Toyota story they would have gotten a + 5 Funny .</tokentext>
<sentencetext>Whether you subscribe to Occam's razor, or just plain old common sense, rays from outer space are not Toyota's problem (though they may be the author's problem).
This type of thing is just plain bat shit crazy.
There is a problem somewhere in Toyota's system somewhere.
Either a software bug or bad chips or something real and tangible ... but rays from outer space?
Please. 
If someone here on /.
had posted that in the last Toyota story they would have gotten a +5 Funny.</sentencetext>
</comment>
<comment>
	<id>http://www.semanticweb.org/ontologies/ConversationInstances.owl#comment10_03_28_2017236.31651192</id>
	<title>Re:No.</title>
	<author>OrangeCatholic</author>
	<datestamp>1269776760000</datestamp>
	<modclass>None</modclass>
	<modscore>1</modscore>
	<htmltext><p>&gt;There's a reason the professor has nothing but speculation to back himself up.</p><p>Yeah, it's because we can't see the code.  What's worse, I've heard the <a href="http://www.thecarconnection.com/marty-blog/1042836\_nhtsa-has-no-software-engineers-or-ees-to-analyze-toyotas" title="thecarconnection.com" rel="nofollow">NHTSA has <i>no</i> software experts on staff to evaluate automotive code.</a> [thecarconnection.com]</p><p>&gt;This is just some douchebag professor trying to ride the tragedies to fame.</p><p>Is that why he submitted it anonymously?  I'd say the original flamebait mod was correct.</p></htmltext>
<tokenext>&gt; There 's a reason the professor has nothing but speculation to back himself up.Yeah , it 's because we ca n't see the code .
What 's worse , I 've heard the NHTSA has no software experts on staff to evaluate automotive code .
[ thecarconnection.com ] &gt; This is just some douchebag professor trying to ride the tragedies to fame.Is that why he submitted it anonymously ?
I 'd say the original flamebait mod was correct .</tokentext>
<sentencetext>&gt;There's a reason the professor has nothing but speculation to back himself up.Yeah, it's because we can't see the code.
What's worse, I've heard the NHTSA has no software experts on staff to evaluate automotive code.
[thecarconnection.com]&gt;This is just some douchebag professor trying to ride the tragedies to fame.Is that why he submitted it anonymously?
I'd say the original flamebait mod was correct.</sentencetext>
	<parent>http://www.semanticweb.org/ontologies/ConversationInstances.owl#comment10_03_28_2017236.31650804</parent>
</comment>
<comment>
	<id>http://www.semanticweb.org/ontologies/ConversationInstances.owl#comment10_03_28_2017236.31651398</id>
	<title>Re:Is there realy a problem?</title>
	<author>FrankieBaby1986</author>
	<datestamp>1269778440000</datestamp>
	<modclass>Flamebait</modclass>
	<modscore>0</modscore>
	<htmltext><p>Just listened to the 911 call. The guy was only going 80 mph and couldn't even manage to answer the 911 operator verbally, but he was able to dial them? WTF? Was he on drugs or retarded or something? I could see freaking out if my car was doing 110 or something, but 80? I mean please, just put ur blinkers on, keep tapping the horn, and make it clear to the other vehicles that you have a problem. They will get out of your way, and 80mph on the highway shouldn't be difficult to drive.</p><p> Finally, what the hell is with people not knowing how to operate a multi-ton machine but doing it anyway? What kinda moron drives a car without knowing how to disengage or shut off the engine?</p><p>The man should lose his license for being incompetent!</p></htmltext>
<tokenext>Just listened to the 911 call .
The guy was only going 80 mph and could n't even manage to answer the 911 operator verbally , but he was able to dial them ?
WTF ? Was he on drugs or retarded or something ?
I could see freaking out if my car was doing 110 or something , but 80 ?
I mean please , just put ur blinkers on , keep tapping the horn , and make it clear to the other vehicles that you have a problem .
They will get out of your way , and 80mph on the highway should n't be difficult to drive .
Finally , what the hell is with people not knowing how to operate a multi-ton machine but doing it anyway ?
What kinda moron drives a car without knowing how to disengage or shut off the engine ? The man should lose his license for being incompetent !</tokentext>
<sentencetext>Just listened to the 911 call.
The guy was only going 80 mph and couldn't even manage to answer the 911 operator verbally, but he was able to dial them?
WTF? Was he on drugs or retarded or something?
I could see freaking out if my car was doing 110 or something, but 80?
I mean please, just put ur blinkers on, keep tapping the horn, and make it clear to the other vehicles that you have a problem.
They will get out of your way, and 80mph on the highway shouldn't be difficult to drive.
Finally, what the hell is with people not knowing how to operate a multi-ton machine but doing it anyway?
What kinda moron drives a car without knowing how to disengage or shut off the engine?The man should lose his license for being incompetent!</sentencetext>
	<parent>http://www.semanticweb.org/ontologies/ConversationInstances.owl#comment10_03_28_2017236.31650786</parent>
</comment>
<comment>
	<id>http://www.semanticweb.org/ontologies/ConversationInstances.owl#comment10_03_28_2017236.31651908</id>
	<title>Frontline Auto Engineer's Perspective</title>
	<author>jim\_k\_3038</author>
	<datestamp>1269783120000</datestamp>
	<modclass>Informativ</modclass>
	<modscore>5</modscore>
	<htmltext>While working for Motorola, I worked on electronic throttle control (ETC). We spent a ton of time working to make the system "fail safe". I think we all had in the back of our minds that it was only a mater of time before we would have to testify as to our engineering decisions.
<br> <br>
My little part of ETC involved adding a sub processor which watch-dogged the main micro. The little micro asked a series of questions of the main micro. Both processors would need to agree on all the inputs and output of the system. The little micro would also ask question regarding real time OS (RTOS) of the main micro. The main micro would need to have tasks executing in the right order to satisfy the small micro. Lastly, the small micro would ask the main micro to perform math operations to verify accuracy. Oh, and the main micro was continuously checksumming it's memory too.
<br> <br>
Both micros had a direct hardware disable path to the H-bridge which was delivering power to the throttle plate. The throttle plate was spring loaded, so, with power cut, the throttle plate would snap to an idle position.
<br> <br>
Next came the electro / magnetic compatibility testing (EMC). We spent months inside huge chambers testing both radiation and susceptibility. One of the tests for susceptibility involved using a zap gun to spark a 20kV spark on each pin of our ECU. Not satisfied with that, our customer opened one of our modules and used a sparking spark plug to slowly zap our board to failure. Bottom line, that throttle plate better never stick one way, or the other.
<br> <br>
In the end, it always amazed me that the whole thing would work at all. Seemed to me that the system was always seconds away from going into some kind of fail safe mode.
<br> <br>
No, a stray bit flip is not going to facilitate a run away car. Least not on my system!</htmltext>
<tokenext>While working for Motorola , I worked on electronic throttle control ( ETC ) .
We spent a ton of time working to make the system " fail safe " .
I think we all had in the back of our minds that it was only a mater of time before we would have to testify as to our engineering decisions .
My little part of ETC involved adding a sub processor which watch-dogged the main micro .
The little micro asked a series of questions of the main micro .
Both processors would need to agree on all the inputs and output of the system .
The little micro would also ask question regarding real time OS ( RTOS ) of the main micro .
The main micro would need to have tasks executing in the right order to satisfy the small micro .
Lastly , the small micro would ask the main micro to perform math operations to verify accuracy .
Oh , and the main micro was continuously checksumming it 's memory too .
Both micros had a direct hardware disable path to the H-bridge which was delivering power to the throttle plate .
The throttle plate was spring loaded , so , with power cut , the throttle plate would snap to an idle position .
Next came the electro / magnetic compatibility testing ( EMC ) .
We spent months inside huge chambers testing both radiation and susceptibility .
One of the tests for susceptibility involved using a zap gun to spark a 20kV spark on each pin of our ECU .
Not satisfied with that , our customer opened one of our modules and used a sparking spark plug to slowly zap our board to failure .
Bottom line , that throttle plate better never stick one way , or the other .
In the end , it always amazed me that the whole thing would work at all .
Seemed to me that the system was always seconds away from going into some kind of fail safe mode .
No , a stray bit flip is not going to facilitate a run away car .
Least not on my system !</tokentext>
<sentencetext>While working for Motorola, I worked on electronic throttle control (ETC).
We spent a ton of time working to make the system "fail safe".
I think we all had in the back of our minds that it was only a mater of time before we would have to testify as to our engineering decisions.
My little part of ETC involved adding a sub processor which watch-dogged the main micro.
The little micro asked a series of questions of the main micro.
Both processors would need to agree on all the inputs and output of the system.
The little micro would also ask question regarding real time OS (RTOS) of the main micro.
The main micro would need to have tasks executing in the right order to satisfy the small micro.
Lastly, the small micro would ask the main micro to perform math operations to verify accuracy.
Oh, and the main micro was continuously checksumming it's memory too.
Both micros had a direct hardware disable path to the H-bridge which was delivering power to the throttle plate.
The throttle plate was spring loaded, so, with power cut, the throttle plate would snap to an idle position.
Next came the electro / magnetic compatibility testing (EMC).
We spent months inside huge chambers testing both radiation and susceptibility.
One of the tests for susceptibility involved using a zap gun to spark a 20kV spark on each pin of our ECU.
Not satisfied with that, our customer opened one of our modules and used a sparking spark plug to slowly zap our board to failure.
Bottom line, that throttle plate better never stick one way, or the other.
In the end, it always amazed me that the whole thing would work at all.
Seemed to me that the system was always seconds away from going into some kind of fail safe mode.
No, a stray bit flip is not going to facilitate a run away car.
Least not on my system!</sentencetext>
</comment>
<comment>
	<id>http://www.semanticweb.org/ontologies/ConversationInstances.owl#comment10_03_28_2017236.31651540</id>
	<title>Cosmic rays attack the US?</title>
	<author>Anonymous</author>
	<datestamp>1269779460000</datestamp>
	<modclass>None</modclass>
	<modscore>0</modscore>
	<htmltext><p>Der Spiegel sums it up quite nicely:</p><p>"The same cars exist around the world, but no accidents of this type have occurred anywhere outside of North America. There were also cases of stuck Toyota gas pedals in Germany. The drivers braked successfully, and notified their car dealerships. None of them met their deaths."</p><p>http://www.spiegel.de/international/business/0,1518,682417,00.html</p></htmltext>
<tokenext>Der Spiegel sums it up quite nicely : " The same cars exist around the world , but no accidents of this type have occurred anywhere outside of North America .
There were also cases of stuck Toyota gas pedals in Germany .
The drivers braked successfully , and notified their car dealerships .
None of them met their deaths .
" http : //www.spiegel.de/international/business/0,1518,682417,00.html</tokentext>
<sentencetext>Der Spiegel sums it up quite nicely:"The same cars exist around the world, but no accidents of this type have occurred anywhere outside of North America.
There were also cases of stuck Toyota gas pedals in Germany.
The drivers braked successfully, and notified their car dealerships.
None of them met their deaths.
"http://www.spiegel.de/international/business/0,1518,682417,00.html</sentencetext>
</comment>
<comment>
	<id>http://www.semanticweb.org/ontologies/ConversationInstances.owl#comment10_03_28_2017236.31651136</id>
	<title>Coincidentally...</title>
	<author>AndrewBC</author>
	<datestamp>1269776340000</datestamp>
	<modclass>None</modclass>
	<modscore>1</modscore>
	<htmltext>This is the excuse I used on my Computer Science professor for why I didn't have my assignment. It didn't work.</htmltext>
<tokenext>This is the excuse I used on my Computer Science professor for why I did n't have my assignment .
It did n't work .</tokentext>
<sentencetext>This is the excuse I used on my Computer Science professor for why I didn't have my assignment.
It didn't work.</sentencetext>
</comment>
<comment>
	<id>http://www.semanticweb.org/ontologies/ConversationInstances.owl#comment10_03_28_2017236.31654692</id>
	<title>Weird</title>
	<author>Anonymous</author>
	<datestamp>1269858780000</datestamp>
	<modclass>Interestin</modclass>
	<modscore>3</modscore>
	<htmltext>Having heard all these stories really makes me wonder, i live in Belgium where cars with manual gear boxes are the common norm, and i've had my car accelerate like nuts once (pedal got stuck because of the floormat) i shifted to neutral, turned of the engine &amp; used my momentum to get to the side of the road where i could dislodge the mat.<br>
<br>
Are manual gearboxes that rare in the States?</htmltext>
<tokenext>Having heard all these stories really makes me wonder , i live in Belgium where cars with manual gear boxes are the common norm , and i 've had my car accelerate like nuts once ( pedal got stuck because of the floormat ) i shifted to neutral , turned of the engine &amp; used my momentum to get to the side of the road where i could dislodge the mat .
Are manual gearboxes that rare in the States ?</tokentext>
<sentencetext>Having heard all these stories really makes me wonder, i live in Belgium where cars with manual gear boxes are the common norm, and i've had my car accelerate like nuts once (pedal got stuck because of the floormat) i shifted to neutral, turned of the engine &amp; used my momentum to get to the side of the road where i could dislodge the mat.
Are manual gearboxes that rare in the States?</sentencetext>
</comment>
<comment>
	<id>http://www.semanticweb.org/ontologies/ConversationInstances.owl#comment10_03_28_2017236.31651988</id>
	<title>Too much trouble</title>
	<author>Jawcracker Fuzz</author>
	<datestamp>1269783780000</datestamp>
	<modclass>None</modclass>
	<modscore>1</modscore>
	<htmltext>Just use the LHC with some extra magnets or mirrors or<br>
something to shoot back at these cosmic dickweeds.</htmltext>
<tokenext>Just use the LHC with some extra magnets or mirrors or something to shoot back at these cosmic dickweeds .</tokentext>
<sentencetext>Just use the LHC with some extra magnets or mirrors or
something to shoot back at these cosmic dickweeds.</sentencetext>
	<parent>http://www.semanticweb.org/ontologies/ConversationInstances.owl#comment10_03_28_2017236.31650884</parent>
</comment>
<comment>
	<id>http://www.semanticweb.org/ontologies/ConversationInstances.owl#comment10_03_28_2017236.31652614</id>
	<title>Re:Why they tell you to turn off your phone...</title>
	<author>Anonymous</author>
	<datestamp>1269789720000</datestamp>
	<modclass>None</modclass>
	<modscore>0</modscore>
	<htmltext><p>Congratulations!  You just tripled the cost!</p></htmltext>
<tokenext>Congratulations !
You just tripled the cost !</tokentext>
<sentencetext>Congratulations!
You just tripled the cost!</sentencetext>
	<parent>http://www.semanticweb.org/ontologies/ConversationInstances.owl#comment10_03_28_2017236.31650922</parent>
</comment>
<comment>
	<id>http://www.semanticweb.org/ontologies/ConversationInstances.owl#comment10_03_28_2017236.31651550</id>
	<title>So if this theory checks out...</title>
	<author>Anonymous</author>
	<datestamp>1269779580000</datestamp>
	<modclass>None</modclass>
	<modscore>0</modscore>
	<htmltext><p>FTFA:<br><i>Testing for the problem would involve putting vehicles in front of a particle accelerator and showering them with radiation.</i></p><p>In Soviet Russia, particle accelerate you!</p></htmltext>
<tokenext>FTFA : Testing for the problem would involve putting vehicles in front of a particle accelerator and showering them with radiation.In Soviet Russia , particle accelerate you !</tokentext>
<sentencetext>FTFA:Testing for the problem would involve putting vehicles in front of a particle accelerator and showering them with radiation.In Soviet Russia, particle accelerate you!</sentencetext>
</comment>
<comment>
	<id>http://www.semanticweb.org/ontologies/ConversationInstances.owl#comment10_03_28_2017236.31652202</id>
	<title>Soft errors are far less probable than bugs</title>
	<author>Theovon</author>
	<datestamp>1269786060000</datestamp>
	<modclass>None</modclass>
	<modscore>1</modscore>
	<htmltext><p>My specialization is low-power processor architecture, and so I quite familiar with soft errors (single event upsets).  As transistors have gotten smaller, and the voltage has gone down, the probability of a soft error has gone up significantly.  And as a result, error correction techniques are making their way into more commodity hardware.  For instance, all flash drives now use at least SECDED, but many use BCH codes (e.g. Reed-Solomon).  Still, the reason that we're paying attention to these is not that they're an every-day problem, but that the probability has gone up to the point that mean time between failures (single bit) has gone down from years to months.  In your video game console, this isn't a problem, but in banking software, we need to be extra specially careful.  As you add more and more bits to your DRAM, the probability of one bit being flipped doesn't go up much, but the probably of one of that huge number of bits being flipped becomes significant.  (Like how evolution happens faster when you have larger populations.)</p><p>That all being said, by far and away, the more likely thing is programmer error.  I can't tell you how many times I've want to blame mysterious bugs on soft errors.  But so far, I've always been able to find the source of the problem as being my mistake (or someone else's).  More over, even if you don't have ECC protection, soft errors are STILL no excuse, because there should be failsafes and sanity checks.  Moreover, this is also true about programmer errors.  Every system you deploy will have bugs, so oftentimes, you write more code to sanity-check the results of some other code, and if they disagree, you fall back to something very conservative.</p><p>I remember one time, I was writing a driver for a graphics card, and we found that every time someone would turn on this huge CRT we had, the software would crash.  Basically, the EMP from the monitor degaussing would interfere with the PCI bus or something inside the chip, and we'd get back incorrect values from status registers.  So we "hardened" it by triple-reading certain status registers and making sure to choose the most conservative value.  Learning from that, we put in various other protections as well, whatever we could think of.  After that, we were able to degauss that monitor all we wanted, and we never even saw drawing errors.</p></htmltext>
<tokenext>My specialization is low-power processor architecture , and so I quite familiar with soft errors ( single event upsets ) .
As transistors have gotten smaller , and the voltage has gone down , the probability of a soft error has gone up significantly .
And as a result , error correction techniques are making their way into more commodity hardware .
For instance , all flash drives now use at least SECDED , but many use BCH codes ( e.g .
Reed-Solomon ) . Still , the reason that we 're paying attention to these is not that they 're an every-day problem , but that the probability has gone up to the point that mean time between failures ( single bit ) has gone down from years to months .
In your video game console , this is n't a problem , but in banking software , we need to be extra specially careful .
As you add more and more bits to your DRAM , the probability of one bit being flipped does n't go up much , but the probably of one of that huge number of bits being flipped becomes significant .
( Like how evolution happens faster when you have larger populations .
) That all being said , by far and away , the more likely thing is programmer error .
I ca n't tell you how many times I 've want to blame mysterious bugs on soft errors .
But so far , I 've always been able to find the source of the problem as being my mistake ( or someone else 's ) .
More over , even if you do n't have ECC protection , soft errors are STILL no excuse , because there should be failsafes and sanity checks .
Moreover , this is also true about programmer errors .
Every system you deploy will have bugs , so oftentimes , you write more code to sanity-check the results of some other code , and if they disagree , you fall back to something very conservative.I remember one time , I was writing a driver for a graphics card , and we found that every time someone would turn on this huge CRT we had , the software would crash .
Basically , the EMP from the monitor degaussing would interfere with the PCI bus or something inside the chip , and we 'd get back incorrect values from status registers .
So we " hardened " it by triple-reading certain status registers and making sure to choose the most conservative value .
Learning from that , we put in various other protections as well , whatever we could think of .
After that , we were able to degauss that monitor all we wanted , and we never even saw drawing errors .</tokentext>
<sentencetext>My specialization is low-power processor architecture, and so I quite familiar with soft errors (single event upsets).
As transistors have gotten smaller, and the voltage has gone down, the probability of a soft error has gone up significantly.
And as a result, error correction techniques are making their way into more commodity hardware.
For instance, all flash drives now use at least SECDED, but many use BCH codes (e.g.
Reed-Solomon).  Still, the reason that we're paying attention to these is not that they're an every-day problem, but that the probability has gone up to the point that mean time between failures (single bit) has gone down from years to months.
In your video game console, this isn't a problem, but in banking software, we need to be extra specially careful.
As you add more and more bits to your DRAM, the probability of one bit being flipped doesn't go up much, but the probably of one of that huge number of bits being flipped becomes significant.
(Like how evolution happens faster when you have larger populations.
)That all being said, by far and away, the more likely thing is programmer error.
I can't tell you how many times I've want to blame mysterious bugs on soft errors.
But so far, I've always been able to find the source of the problem as being my mistake (or someone else's).
More over, even if you don't have ECC protection, soft errors are STILL no excuse, because there should be failsafes and sanity checks.
Moreover, this is also true about programmer errors.
Every system you deploy will have bugs, so oftentimes, you write more code to sanity-check the results of some other code, and if they disagree, you fall back to something very conservative.I remember one time, I was writing a driver for a graphics card, and we found that every time someone would turn on this huge CRT we had, the software would crash.
Basically, the EMP from the monitor degaussing would interfere with the PCI bus or something inside the chip, and we'd get back incorrect values from status registers.
So we "hardened" it by triple-reading certain status registers and making sure to choose the most conservative value.
Learning from that, we put in various other protections as well, whatever we could think of.
After that, we were able to degauss that monitor all we wanted, and we never even saw drawing errors.</sentencetext>
</comment>
<comment>
	<id>http://www.semanticweb.org/ontologies/ConversationInstances.owl#comment10_03_28_2017236.31653434</id>
	<title>Re:Why they tell you to turn off your phone...</title>
	<author>nonguru</author>
	<datestamp>1269799080000</datestamp>
	<modclass>None</modclass>
	<modscore>1</modscore>
	<htmltext>If there is no Error Correction on the RAM, then there is no protection.

As for "Assembly magic" - I don't think so. The microcode is embedded within commercial micros and any compiled and assembled code will be programmed in flash memory.

"...vulnerable electric cars..." Also don't think so. SEU effects DRAM. That could possibly impact any and every modern vehicle. Though to save cost and idle  power consumtpion I imagine many vendors would introduce their electronics code in flash memory. I don't know what Toyota uses for an engine controller, but generally their electronics don't use RAM.</htmltext>
<tokenext>If there is no Error Correction on the RAM , then there is no protection .
As for " Assembly magic " - I do n't think so .
The microcode is embedded within commercial micros and any compiled and assembled code will be programmed in flash memory .
" ...vulnerable electric cars... " Also do n't think so .
SEU effects DRAM .
That could possibly impact any and every modern vehicle .
Though to save cost and idle power consumtpion I imagine many vendors would introduce their electronics code in flash memory .
I do n't know what Toyota uses for an engine controller , but generally their electronics do n't use RAM .</tokentext>
<sentencetext>If there is no Error Correction on the RAM, then there is no protection.
As for "Assembly magic" - I don't think so.
The microcode is embedded within commercial micros and any compiled and assembled code will be programmed in flash memory.
"...vulnerable electric cars..." Also don't think so.
SEU effects DRAM.
That could possibly impact any and every modern vehicle.
Though to save cost and idle  power consumtpion I imagine many vendors would introduce their electronics code in flash memory.
I don't know what Toyota uses for an engine controller, but generally their electronics don't use RAM.</sentencetext>
	<parent>http://www.semanticweb.org/ontologies/ConversationInstances.owl#comment10_03_28_2017236.31650848</parent>
</comment>
<comment>
	<id>http://www.semanticweb.org/ontologies/ConversationInstances.owl#comment10_03_28_2017236.31652796</id>
	<title>Yes they can</title>
	<author>mysidia</author>
	<datestamp>1269792180000</datestamp>
	<modclass>None</modclass>
	<modscore>1</modscore>
	<htmltext><p>Rather than repeat myself, i'll link to <a href="http://developers.slashdot.org/comments.pl?sid=1581742&amp;cid=31465298" title="slashdot.org" rel="nofollow">my comment</a> [slashdot.org] on this matter.
</p><p>
Things in your environment such as radiation, and the behavior of your hardware under varying conditions, are just as significant and can cause issues just as readily as a defect in the code you write.
</p><p>
They could use ECC memory, perhaps, they do, but even that is not infallible.
</p><p>
You will need to reboot your car's computer every few days, to make sure it loads fresh code, eliminating any undetected multi-bit errors<nobr> <wbr></nobr>:)
</p></htmltext>
<tokenext>Rather than repeat myself , i 'll link to my comment [ slashdot.org ] on this matter .
Things in your environment such as radiation , and the behavior of your hardware under varying conditions , are just as significant and can cause issues just as readily as a defect in the code you write .
They could use ECC memory , perhaps , they do , but even that is not infallible .
You will need to reboot your car 's computer every few days , to make sure it loads fresh code , eliminating any undetected multi-bit errors : )</tokentext>
<sentencetext>Rather than repeat myself, i'll link to my comment [slashdot.org] on this matter.
Things in your environment such as radiation, and the behavior of your hardware under varying conditions, are just as significant and can cause issues just as readily as a defect in the code you write.
They could use ECC memory, perhaps, they do, but even that is not infallible.
You will need to reboot your car's computer every few days, to make sure it loads fresh code, eliminating any undetected multi-bit errors :)
</sentencetext>
</comment>
<comment>
	<id>http://www.semanticweb.org/ontologies/ConversationInstances.owl#comment10_03_28_2017236.31651810</id>
	<title>The Japanese find Higgs-Boson and the Neutrino</title>
	<author>oscarwumpus</author>
	<datestamp>1269782040000</datestamp>
	<modclass>Troll</modclass>
	<modscore>0</modscore>
	<htmltext>they were trying to compete with the LHC but didn't have enough real estate, so they built a world wide detection network in their automobiles called the Large Vehicle Collider. Every time a vehicle has a sudden unattributed acceleration, it means it was hit by some sort of particle and an investigation could be begun on that controller. They just packaged the detectors in dual-function machinery. Way to go Toyota!</htmltext>
<tokenext>they were trying to compete with the LHC but did n't have enough real estate , so they built a world wide detection network in their automobiles called the Large Vehicle Collider .
Every time a vehicle has a sudden unattributed acceleration , it means it was hit by some sort of particle and an investigation could be begun on that controller .
They just packaged the detectors in dual-function machinery .
Way to go Toyota !</tokentext>
<sentencetext>they were trying to compete with the LHC but didn't have enough real estate, so they built a world wide detection network in their automobiles called the Large Vehicle Collider.
Every time a vehicle has a sudden unattributed acceleration, it means it was hit by some sort of particle and an investigation could be begun on that controller.
They just packaged the detectors in dual-function machinery.
Way to go Toyota!</sentencetext>
</comment>
<comment>
	<id>http://www.semanticweb.org/ontologies/ConversationInstances.owl#comment10_03_28_2017236.31660568</id>
	<title>Re:Weird</title>
	<author>Renevith</author>
	<datestamp>1269892440000</datestamp>
	<modclass>None</modclass>
	<modscore>1</modscore>
	<htmltext><p>You've gotten a number of replies already but I'll say two things that I didn't see covered:</p><ol> <li>The Prius physically cannot have a manual transmission. It is a "continuously variable" transmission (for efficiency purposes), so there are no discrete gears to shift between. More details here, including cool interactive animations: <a href="http://eahart.com/prius/psd/" title="eahart.com" rel="nofollow">http://eahart.com/prius/psd/</a> [eahart.com]</li><li>You can still shift an automatic transmission car into neutral and coast to a stop on the side of the road. It just requires driver awareness and presence of mind in an emergency situation. On a related note, deaths due to "sudden acceleration" seem to disproportionately affect older drivers: <a href="http://overlawyered.com/2010/03/toyota-acceleration-why-im-skeptical/" title="overlawyered.com" rel="nofollow">http://overlawyered.com/2010/03/toyota-acceleration-why-im-skeptical/</a> [overlawyered.com]</li> </ol></htmltext>
<tokenext>You 've gotten a number of replies already but I 'll say two things that I did n't see covered : The Prius physically can not have a manual transmission .
It is a " continuously variable " transmission ( for efficiency purposes ) , so there are no discrete gears to shift between .
More details here , including cool interactive animations : http : //eahart.com/prius/psd/ [ eahart.com ] You can still shift an automatic transmission car into neutral and coast to a stop on the side of the road .
It just requires driver awareness and presence of mind in an emergency situation .
On a related note , deaths due to " sudden acceleration " seem to disproportionately affect older drivers : http : //overlawyered.com/2010/03/toyota-acceleration-why-im-skeptical/ [ overlawyered.com ]</tokentext>
<sentencetext>You've gotten a number of replies already but I'll say two things that I didn't see covered: The Prius physically cannot have a manual transmission.
It is a "continuously variable" transmission (for efficiency purposes), so there are no discrete gears to shift between.
More details here, including cool interactive animations: http://eahart.com/prius/psd/ [eahart.com]You can still shift an automatic transmission car into neutral and coast to a stop on the side of the road.
It just requires driver awareness and presence of mind in an emergency situation.
On a related note, deaths due to "sudden acceleration" seem to disproportionately affect older drivers: http://overlawyered.com/2010/03/toyota-acceleration-why-im-skeptical/ [overlawyered.com] </sentencetext>
	<parent>http://www.semanticweb.org/ontologies/ConversationInstances.owl#comment10_03_28_2017236.31654692</parent>
</comment>
<comment>
	<id>http://www.semanticweb.org/ontologies/ConversationInstances.owl#comment10_03_28_2017236.31655036</id>
	<title>Chip marginality</title>
	<author>Cacadril</author>
	<datestamp>1269863460000</datestamp>
	<modclass>None</modclass>
	<modscore>1</modscore>
	<htmltext>There is another factor here, beyond cosmic rays. The way circuits are produced has a statistical element. The doping process introduces interstitial atoms along the conductive paths, but the density has random fluctuations. Some circuits may be more marginal than others, and it may be hard to discover when some such density fluctuations sit in places where they have effects only in rather special circumstances.</htmltext>
<tokenext>There is another factor here , beyond cosmic rays .
The way circuits are produced has a statistical element .
The doping process introduces interstitial atoms along the conductive paths , but the density has random fluctuations .
Some circuits may be more marginal than others , and it may be hard to discover when some such density fluctuations sit in places where they have effects only in rather special circumstances .</tokentext>
<sentencetext>There is another factor here, beyond cosmic rays.
The way circuits are produced has a statistical element.
The doping process introduces interstitial atoms along the conductive paths, but the density has random fluctuations.
Some circuits may be more marginal than others, and it may be hard to discover when some such density fluctuations sit in places where they have effects only in rather special circumstances.</sentencetext>
</comment>
<comment>
	<id>http://www.semanticweb.org/ontologies/ConversationInstances.owl#comment10_03_28_2017236.31651346</id>
	<title>Re:I was proofed right</title>
	<author>Pentium100</author>
	<datestamp>1269778080000</datestamp>
	<modclass>None</modclass>
	<modscore>1</modscore>
	<htmltext><p>I agree.</p><p>I trust mechanical systems more than I do some software. Yes, the mechanics also fail, but they can be inspected better ("It looks like this this linkage is rusty/cracked. I should replace it just in case") and people seem to be able to design mechanics better than software (a TV or a tape recorder does not need constant patches to fix various bugs like Firefox or other software do, it works right the first time). Mechanical systems are not affected by small intensity cosmic rays like microchips are.</p></htmltext>
<tokenext>I agree.I trust mechanical systems more than I do some software .
Yes , the mechanics also fail , but they can be inspected better ( " It looks like this this linkage is rusty/cracked .
I should replace it just in case " ) and people seem to be able to design mechanics better than software ( a TV or a tape recorder does not need constant patches to fix various bugs like Firefox or other software do , it works right the first time ) .
Mechanical systems are not affected by small intensity cosmic rays like microchips are .</tokentext>
<sentencetext>I agree.I trust mechanical systems more than I do some software.
Yes, the mechanics also fail, but they can be inspected better ("It looks like this this linkage is rusty/cracked.
I should replace it just in case") and people seem to be able to design mechanics better than software (a TV or a tape recorder does not need constant patches to fix various bugs like Firefox or other software do, it works right the first time).
Mechanical systems are not affected by small intensity cosmic rays like microchips are.</sentencetext>
	<parent>http://www.semanticweb.org/ontologies/ConversationInstances.owl#comment10_03_28_2017236.31651168</parent>
</comment>
<comment>
	<id>http://www.semanticweb.org/ontologies/ConversationInstances.owl#comment10_03_28_2017236.31651168</id>
	<title>I was proofed right</title>
	<author>hardburlyboogerman</author>
	<datestamp>1269776580000</datestamp>
	<modclass>Troll</modclass>
	<modscore>0</modscore>
	<htmltext><p>I had told many friends and family that adding computers to cars would eventually cause unexpected problems.Looks like I was right.<br>That's why I rebuild older cars and drive them instead of the newer ones.<br>No computers to go apeshit,Simpler to design &amp; repair.AND NO ABILITY OF THE CORRUPT POLICE TO REMOTELY SHUT DOWN YOUR RIDE!!!<br>Insurance is much cheaper,too.</p></htmltext>
<tokenext>I had told many friends and family that adding computers to cars would eventually cause unexpected problems.Looks like I was right.That 's why I rebuild older cars and drive them instead of the newer ones.No computers to go apeshit,Simpler to design &amp; repair.AND NO ABILITY OF THE CORRUPT POLICE TO REMOTELY SHUT DOWN YOUR RIDE ! !
! Insurance is much cheaper,too .</tokentext>
<sentencetext>I had told many friends and family that adding computers to cars would eventually cause unexpected problems.Looks like I was right.That's why I rebuild older cars and drive them instead of the newer ones.No computers to go apeshit,Simpler to design &amp; repair.AND NO ABILITY OF THE CORRUPT POLICE TO REMOTELY SHUT DOWN YOUR RIDE!!
!Insurance is much cheaper,too.</sentencetext>
</comment>
<comment>
	<id>http://www.semanticweb.org/ontologies/ConversationInstances.owl#comment10_03_28_2017236.31651332</id>
	<title>Re:Space Rays, My Ass</title>
	<author>Anonymous</author>
	<datestamp>1269777960000</datestamp>
	<modclass>None</modclass>
	<modscore>1</modscore>
	<htmltext><p>If there is a hard to define race condition locking up systems on the cars due to a software bug, it may be triggered by a bit getting flipped that is assumed to be an impossible event, this could be caused by a hardware glitch, a voltage spike, a cosmic ray strike or any combination.</p></htmltext>
<tokenext>If there is a hard to define race condition locking up systems on the cars due to a software bug , it may be triggered by a bit getting flipped that is assumed to be an impossible event , this could be caused by a hardware glitch , a voltage spike , a cosmic ray strike or any combination .</tokentext>
<sentencetext>If there is a hard to define race condition locking up systems on the cars due to a software bug, it may be triggered by a bit getting flipped that is assumed to be an impossible event, this could be caused by a hardware glitch, a voltage spike, a cosmic ray strike or any combination.</sentencetext>
	<parent>http://www.semanticweb.org/ontologies/ConversationInstances.owl#comment10_03_28_2017236.31650852</parent>
</comment>
<comment>
	<id>http://www.semanticweb.org/ontologies/ConversationInstances.owl#comment10_03_28_2017236.31656012</id>
	<title>NFW</title>
	<author>Chelloveck</author>
	<datestamp>1269872460000</datestamp>
	<modclass>None</modclass>
	<modscore>1</modscore>
	<htmltext><p>Yes, cosmic rays and alpha particles can and do cause bits to flip. You might be able to argue that for a single isolated case. But for them to flip the <i>right</i> bit at the <i>right</i> time in multiple vechicles? Ain't gonna happen.

</p><p>On the other hand, I've been in a car which experienced a sudden acceleration problem.  In this case it was a '70s era Ford.  We were sitting at a stop sign and the car lurched forward.  The driver <i>swore</i> she was pressing the brake.  Naturally, when this happened she pressed the brake harder, and the car lurched forward even faster! In fact, there was a direct correlation between pressing the "brake" and the car accelerating. Hmmm...  Surely the driver, who'd had her license for a good 30 years or so, couldn't have made such a basic mistake. Mysteriously, when I was driving the car home (because she was pretty shaken by the incident) the problem had cleared itself up. I guess it <i>had</i> to be cosmic rays after all! Who knew they could physically pull a throttle linkage?

</p><p>FWIW, '70s era Ford beats '90s era Toyota in crash testing.</p></htmltext>
<tokenext>Yes , cosmic rays and alpha particles can and do cause bits to flip .
You might be able to argue that for a single isolated case .
But for them to flip the right bit at the right time in multiple vechicles ?
Ai n't gon na happen .
On the other hand , I 've been in a car which experienced a sudden acceleration problem .
In this case it was a '70s era Ford .
We were sitting at a stop sign and the car lurched forward .
The driver swore she was pressing the brake .
Naturally , when this happened she pressed the brake harder , and the car lurched forward even faster !
In fact , there was a direct correlation between pressing the " brake " and the car accelerating .
Hmmm... Surely the driver , who 'd had her license for a good 30 years or so , could n't have made such a basic mistake .
Mysteriously , when I was driving the car home ( because she was pretty shaken by the incident ) the problem had cleared itself up .
I guess it had to be cosmic rays after all !
Who knew they could physically pull a throttle linkage ?
FWIW , '70s era Ford beats '90s era Toyota in crash testing .</tokentext>
<sentencetext>Yes, cosmic rays and alpha particles can and do cause bits to flip.
You might be able to argue that for a single isolated case.
But for them to flip the right bit at the right time in multiple vechicles?
Ain't gonna happen.
On the other hand, I've been in a car which experienced a sudden acceleration problem.
In this case it was a '70s era Ford.
We were sitting at a stop sign and the car lurched forward.
The driver swore she was pressing the brake.
Naturally, when this happened she pressed the brake harder, and the car lurched forward even faster!
In fact, there was a direct correlation between pressing the "brake" and the car accelerating.
Hmmm...  Surely the driver, who'd had her license for a good 30 years or so, couldn't have made such a basic mistake.
Mysteriously, when I was driving the car home (because she was pretty shaken by the incident) the problem had cleared itself up.
I guess it had to be cosmic rays after all!
Who knew they could physically pull a throttle linkage?
FWIW, '70s era Ford beats '90s era Toyota in crash testing.</sentencetext>
</comment>
<comment>
	<id>http://www.semanticweb.org/ontologies/ConversationInstances.owl#comment10_03_28_2017236.31651164</id>
	<title>No.</title>
	<author>Cornwallis</author>
	<datestamp>1269776520000</datestamp>
	<modclass>Troll</modclass>
	<modscore>0</modscore>
	<htmltext><p>Car safety problems come from the jerk behind the wheel...</p><p>Who is programming his iPod, eating is lunch, fiddling with his Bluetooth earpiece while dialing his cellphone and booting his laptop to get the latest updates into his GPS... and so on.</p><p>In other words he is doing everything but "driving" which is ALL he should be doing.</p><p>Instead, the marketers have sold the public on the car-as-comfortable-living-room as a vehicle that should be as anti-brainworthy as possible.</p><p>Get rid of all the complicated systems. Reduce the machine to its simplest functions. Oh, and it probably wouldn't hurt to plug in some personal responsibility while unplugging all the extraneous crap.</p><p>The safest car I ever owned was my old MG. Why? Because I could feel the road and I knew that everyone was trying to kill me so I kept my guard up while driving it!</p></htmltext>
<tokenext>Car safety problems come from the jerk behind the wheel...Who is programming his iPod , eating is lunch , fiddling with his Bluetooth earpiece while dialing his cellphone and booting his laptop to get the latest updates into his GPS... and so on.In other words he is doing everything but " driving " which is ALL he should be doing.Instead , the marketers have sold the public on the car-as-comfortable-living-room as a vehicle that should be as anti-brainworthy as possible.Get rid of all the complicated systems .
Reduce the machine to its simplest functions .
Oh , and it probably would n't hurt to plug in some personal responsibility while unplugging all the extraneous crap.The safest car I ever owned was my old MG. Why ? Because I could feel the road and I knew that everyone was trying to kill me so I kept my guard up while driving it !</tokentext>
<sentencetext>Car safety problems come from the jerk behind the wheel...Who is programming his iPod, eating is lunch, fiddling with his Bluetooth earpiece while dialing his cellphone and booting his laptop to get the latest updates into his GPS... and so on.In other words he is doing everything but "driving" which is ALL he should be doing.Instead, the marketers have sold the public on the car-as-comfortable-living-room as a vehicle that should be as anti-brainworthy as possible.Get rid of all the complicated systems.
Reduce the machine to its simplest functions.
Oh, and it probably wouldn't hurt to plug in some personal responsibility while unplugging all the extraneous crap.The safest car I ever owned was my old MG. Why? Because I could feel the road and I knew that everyone was trying to kill me so I kept my guard up while driving it!</sentencetext>
</comment>
<comment>
	<id>http://www.semanticweb.org/ontologies/ConversationInstances.owl#comment10_03_28_2017236.31652476</id>
	<title>Re:I was proofed right</title>
	<author>Reziac</author>
	<datestamp>1269788700000</datestamp>
	<modclass>None</modclass>
	<modscore>1</modscore>
	<htmltext><p>Absolutely. I'm reminded of this every time I'm at my mechanic's... his shop is always full of newish vehicles with mystery ailments due to some fault in the computerized controls or components. Conversely, NO mechanical control system on my truck has failed, and it is 32 years old.</p></htmltext>
<tokenext>Absolutely .
I 'm reminded of this every time I 'm at my mechanic 's... his shop is always full of newish vehicles with mystery ailments due to some fault in the computerized controls or components .
Conversely , NO mechanical control system on my truck has failed , and it is 32 years old .</tokentext>
<sentencetext>Absolutely.
I'm reminded of this every time I'm at my mechanic's... his shop is always full of newish vehicles with mystery ailments due to some fault in the computerized controls or components.
Conversely, NO mechanical control system on my truck has failed, and it is 32 years old.</sentencetext>
	<parent>http://www.semanticweb.org/ontologies/ConversationInstances.owl#comment10_03_28_2017236.31651346</parent>
</comment>
<comment>
	<id>http://www.semanticweb.org/ontologies/ConversationInstances.owl#comment10_03_28_2017236.31651016</id>
	<title>Cop-out</title>
	<author>Celeste R</author>
	<datestamp>1269775320000</datestamp>
	<modclass>None</modclass>
	<modscore>1</modscore>
	<htmltext><p>This sounds more like a cop-out for Toyota's design practices than anything.  If it's not reliable enough for the road, then don't sell it!  (safety laws and all).</p><p>What's so wrong with simple and effective that good design philosophy gets thrown out in favor of industry buzzwords?</p></htmltext>
<tokenext>This sounds more like a cop-out for Toyota 's design practices than anything .
If it 's not reliable enough for the road , then do n't sell it !
( safety laws and all ) .What 's so wrong with simple and effective that good design philosophy gets thrown out in favor of industry buzzwords ?</tokentext>
<sentencetext>This sounds more like a cop-out for Toyota's design practices than anything.
If it's not reliable enough for the road, then don't sell it!
(safety laws and all).What's so wrong with simple and effective that good design philosophy gets thrown out in favor of industry buzzwords?</sentencetext>
</comment>
<comment>
	<id>http://www.semanticweb.org/ontologies/ConversationInstances.owl#comment10_03_28_2017236.31651614</id>
	<title>Re:Space Rays, My Ass</title>
	<author>John Hasler</author>
	<datestamp>1269780180000</datestamp>
	<modclass>None</modclass>
	<modscore>1</modscore>
	<htmltext><p>&gt; If there is a hard to define race condition locking up systems on the cars<br>&gt; due to a software bug, it may be triggered by a bit getting flipped that is<br>&gt; assumed to be an impossible event...</p><p>That assumption is a design error.</p></htmltext>
<tokenext>&gt; If there is a hard to define race condition locking up systems on the cars &gt; due to a software bug , it may be triggered by a bit getting flipped that is &gt; assumed to be an impossible event...That assumption is a design error .</tokentext>
<sentencetext>&gt; If there is a hard to define race condition locking up systems on the cars&gt; due to a software bug, it may be triggered by a bit getting flipped that is&gt; assumed to be an impossible event...That assumption is a design error.</sentencetext>
	<parent>http://www.semanticweb.org/ontologies/ConversationInstances.owl#comment10_03_28_2017236.31651332</parent>
</comment>
<comment>
	<id>http://www.semanticweb.org/ontologies/ConversationInstances.owl#comment10_03_28_2017236.31655136</id>
	<title>Re:Is there realy a problem?</title>
	<author>Anonymous</author>
	<datestamp>1269864540000</datestamp>
	<modclass>None</modclass>
	<modscore>0</modscore>
	<htmltext><p>I had a '95 Dodge spirit; The battery got old, and somehow dribbled acid onto the tubes coming from the vacuum pump, which had 2 noticable effects.</p><p>1) the power brakes lost power (bad)<br>2) the cruise control lost power (not nearly as bad)</p></htmltext>
<tokenext>I had a '95 Dodge spirit ; The battery got old , and somehow dribbled acid onto the tubes coming from the vacuum pump , which had 2 noticable effects.1 ) the power brakes lost power ( bad ) 2 ) the cruise control lost power ( not nearly as bad )</tokentext>
<sentencetext>I had a '95 Dodge spirit; The battery got old, and somehow dribbled acid onto the tubes coming from the vacuum pump, which had 2 noticable effects.1) the power brakes lost power (bad)2) the cruise control lost power (not nearly as bad)</sentencetext>
	<parent>http://www.semanticweb.org/ontologies/ConversationInstances.owl#comment10_03_28_2017236.31652608</parent>
</comment>
<comment>
	<id>http://www.semanticweb.org/ontologies/ConversationInstances.owl#comment10_03_28_2017236.31651188</id>
	<title>4 dead aliens in the trunk</title>
	<author>voodoo cheesecake</author>
	<datestamp>1269776760000</datestamp>
	<modclass>None</modclass>
	<modscore>1</modscore>
	<htmltext><p>...... allow you to time travel (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Repo\_Man\_\%281984\_film\%29)! But the most sophisticated electronics in the Chevy Malibu were in its radio. Anyway, to stay on topic - Scientists need not to just point to cosmic radiation, they need to test this.  What about pointing to the manufacturing process also!</p></htmltext>
<tokenext>...... allow you to time travel ( http : //en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Repo \ _Man \ _ \ % 281984 \ _film \ % 29 ) !
But the most sophisticated electronics in the Chevy Malibu were in its radio .
Anyway , to stay on topic - Scientists need not to just point to cosmic radiation , they need to test this .
What about pointing to the manufacturing process also !</tokentext>
<sentencetext>...... allow you to time travel (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Repo\_Man\_\%281984\_film\%29)!
But the most sophisticated electronics in the Chevy Malibu were in its radio.
Anyway, to stay on topic - Scientists need not to just point to cosmic radiation, they need to test this.
What about pointing to the manufacturing process also!</sentencetext>
</comment>
<comment>
	<id>http://www.semanticweb.org/ontologies/ConversationInstances.owl#comment10_03_28_2017236.31652220</id>
	<title>McMurdo</title>
	<author>Unxmaal</author>
	<datestamp>1269786240000</datestamp>
	<modclass>Interestin</modclass>
	<modscore>5</modscore>
	<htmltext><p>When I was working for NASA, on the NISN network, we'd get these weird router crashes for the old Cisco router located at (or very near) the South Pole in Antarctica. It was always a memory problem, and I'd always have to call someone to get them to powercycle the router. It irritated me to keep bothering those guys, so I opened a case with Cisco TAC.</p><p>The TAC guy sent a terse response, saying that particular crash was a "transient memory error" due to "alpha radiation or sun spots." That really pissed me off -- Cisco TAC just gave me a standard BOFH response! I escalated, and swung the NASA club around some, and finally got a senior engineer on the phone. "You said this router's at the South Pole, right? So that means it's at very high altitude, with very little ozone shielding, right?" "Umm, yeah." "Well there you go. There's a lot more radiation at that altitude than at sea level. Our stuff's only rated for sea level. See if they can<nobr> <wbr></nobr>.. I dunno, put a lead blanket over it or something."</p><p>I relayed the info to my contact at McMurdo, and he laughed and said he'd figure something out.</p><p>On a hunch, I checked the other two "high-altitude" routers we had, and sure enough, they both had a statistically higher failure rate for "transient memory errors".</p></htmltext>
<tokenext>When I was working for NASA , on the NISN network , we 'd get these weird router crashes for the old Cisco router located at ( or very near ) the South Pole in Antarctica .
It was always a memory problem , and I 'd always have to call someone to get them to powercycle the router .
It irritated me to keep bothering those guys , so I opened a case with Cisco TAC.The TAC guy sent a terse response , saying that particular crash was a " transient memory error " due to " alpha radiation or sun spots .
" That really pissed me off -- Cisco TAC just gave me a standard BOFH response !
I escalated , and swung the NASA club around some , and finally got a senior engineer on the phone .
" You said this router 's at the South Pole , right ?
So that means it 's at very high altitude , with very little ozone shielding , right ?
" " Umm , yeah .
" " Well there you go .
There 's a lot more radiation at that altitude than at sea level .
Our stuff 's only rated for sea level .
See if they can .. I dunno , put a lead blanket over it or something .
" I relayed the info to my contact at McMurdo , and he laughed and said he 'd figure something out.On a hunch , I checked the other two " high-altitude " routers we had , and sure enough , they both had a statistically higher failure rate for " transient memory errors " .</tokentext>
<sentencetext>When I was working for NASA, on the NISN network, we'd get these weird router crashes for the old Cisco router located at (or very near) the South Pole in Antarctica.
It was always a memory problem, and I'd always have to call someone to get them to powercycle the router.
It irritated me to keep bothering those guys, so I opened a case with Cisco TAC.The TAC guy sent a terse response, saying that particular crash was a "transient memory error" due to "alpha radiation or sun spots.
" That really pissed me off -- Cisco TAC just gave me a standard BOFH response!
I escalated, and swung the NASA club around some, and finally got a senior engineer on the phone.
"You said this router's at the South Pole, right?
So that means it's at very high altitude, with very little ozone shielding, right?
" "Umm, yeah.
" "Well there you go.
There's a lot more radiation at that altitude than at sea level.
Our stuff's only rated for sea level.
See if they can .. I dunno, put a lead blanket over it or something.
"I relayed the info to my contact at McMurdo, and he laughed and said he'd figure something out.On a hunch, I checked the other two "high-altitude" routers we had, and sure enough, they both had a statistically higher failure rate for "transient memory errors".</sentencetext>
</comment>
<comment>
	<id>http://www.semanticweb.org/ontologies/ConversationInstances.owl#comment10_03_28_2017236.31654650</id>
	<title>Re:Why they tell you to turn off your phone...</title>
	<author>Joce640k</author>
	<datestamp>1269858180000</datestamp>
	<modclass>None</modclass>
	<modscore>1</modscore>
	<htmltext><p>I don't buy the "poor programming" thing.</p><p>There's millions of Toyota's out there being driven billions of miles per year. If it was a bug in the program there'd be a *lot* more cases on file.</p><p>Nope, this is something far more random. Cosmic rays is actually plausible. If there's a design fault it's that the system doesn't have enough redundancy in it</p><p>(disclaimer: I don't know how much there is, even triple redundancy can fail if you clock up enough hours for the statistics to do their thing).</p></htmltext>
<tokenext>I do n't buy the " poor programming " thing.There 's millions of Toyota 's out there being driven billions of miles per year .
If it was a bug in the program there 'd be a * lot * more cases on file.Nope , this is something far more random .
Cosmic rays is actually plausible .
If there 's a design fault it 's that the system does n't have enough redundancy in it ( disclaimer : I do n't know how much there is , even triple redundancy can fail if you clock up enough hours for the statistics to do their thing ) .</tokentext>
<sentencetext>I don't buy the "poor programming" thing.There's millions of Toyota's out there being driven billions of miles per year.
If it was a bug in the program there'd be a *lot* more cases on file.Nope, this is something far more random.
Cosmic rays is actually plausible.
If there's a design fault it's that the system doesn't have enough redundancy in it(disclaimer: I don't know how much there is, even triple redundancy can fail if you clock up enough hours for the statistics to do their thing).</sentencetext>
	<parent>http://www.semanticweb.org/ontologies/ConversationInstances.owl#comment10_03_28_2017236.31651682</parent>
</comment>
<comment>
	<id>http://www.semanticweb.org/ontologies/ConversationInstances.owl#comment10_03_28_2017236.31651198</id>
	<title>Re:Space Rays, My Ass</title>
	<author>Anonymous</author>
	<datestamp>1269776820000</datestamp>
	<modclass>None</modclass>
	<modscore>0</modscore>
	<htmltext><a href="http://www.filibeto.org/~aduritz/ecache-sram-data-parity-err.html" title="filibeto.org" rel="nofollow">
It's not like this hasn't been put forward as an hypothesis before</a> [filibeto.org]</htmltext>
<tokenext>It 's not like this has n't been put forward as an hypothesis before [ filibeto.org ]</tokentext>
<sentencetext>
It's not like this hasn't been put forward as an hypothesis before [filibeto.org]</sentencetext>
	<parent>http://www.semanticweb.org/ontologies/ConversationInstances.owl#comment10_03_28_2017236.31650852</parent>
</comment>
<comment>
	<id>http://www.semanticweb.org/ontologies/ConversationInstances.owl#comment10_03_28_2017236.31654492</id>
	<title>Re:Cop-out</title>
	<author>Anonymous</author>
	<datestamp>1269855960000</datestamp>
	<modclass>None</modclass>
	<modscore>0</modscore>
	<htmltext><p>It's like removing one type of failsafe while not implementing another. Say... Like thinking it's suddenly a good idea to remove the lower speed threshold from cruise control so you can engage it whenever right from 0 MPH. It's not like there would be a short in the cruise control activation circuit, or that somebody might accidentally push the button when stopped at a red light while pedestrians are on the crosswalk.</p><p>Oh wait, isn't that electronic throttle control does in some regard?</p><p>Yeah, sometimes they need to think these things over a bit more before implementing them.</p></htmltext>
<tokenext>It 's like removing one type of failsafe while not implementing another .
Say... Like thinking it 's suddenly a good idea to remove the lower speed threshold from cruise control so you can engage it whenever right from 0 MPH .
It 's not like there would be a short in the cruise control activation circuit , or that somebody might accidentally push the button when stopped at a red light while pedestrians are on the crosswalk.Oh wait , is n't that electronic throttle control does in some regard ? Yeah , sometimes they need to think these things over a bit more before implementing them .</tokentext>
<sentencetext>It's like removing one type of failsafe while not implementing another.
Say... Like thinking it's suddenly a good idea to remove the lower speed threshold from cruise control so you can engage it whenever right from 0 MPH.
It's not like there would be a short in the cruise control activation circuit, or that somebody might accidentally push the button when stopped at a red light while pedestrians are on the crosswalk.Oh wait, isn't that electronic throttle control does in some regard?Yeah, sometimes they need to think these things over a bit more before implementing them.</sentencetext>
	<parent>http://www.semanticweb.org/ontologies/ConversationInstances.owl#comment10_03_28_2017236.31651016</parent>
</comment>
<comment>
	<id>http://www.semanticweb.org/ontologies/ConversationInstances.owl#comment10_03_28_2017236.31650936</id>
	<title>Re:Is there realy a problem?</title>
	<author>Anonymous</author>
	<datestamp>1269774840000</datestamp>
	<modclass>Flamebait</modclass>
	<modscore>0</modscore>
	<htmltext><p>
Indeed. There have been scares of this type before and virtually all cases have turned out to involve driver error or fraud. Confirmed cases of runaway acceleration are virtually non-existent. Before speculating on possible causes, we should find out if there is a real problem.
</p></htmltext>
<tokenext>Indeed .
There have been scares of this type before and virtually all cases have turned out to involve driver error or fraud .
Confirmed cases of runaway acceleration are virtually non-existent .
Before speculating on possible causes , we should find out if there is a real problem .</tokentext>
<sentencetext>
Indeed.
There have been scares of this type before and virtually all cases have turned out to involve driver error or fraud.
Confirmed cases of runaway acceleration are virtually non-existent.
Before speculating on possible causes, we should find out if there is a real problem.
</sentencetext>
	<parent>http://www.semanticweb.org/ontologies/ConversationInstances.owl#comment10_03_28_2017236.31650786</parent>
</comment>
<comment>
	<id>http://www.semanticweb.org/ontologies/ConversationInstances.owl#comment10_03_28_2017236.31651440</id>
	<title>Re:Is there realy a problem?</title>
	<author>Venik</author>
	<datestamp>1269778740000</datestamp>
	<modclass>None</modclass>
	<modscore>1</modscore>
	<htmltext>Some science is definitely behind this. The question is: how far behind? Physicists discussing software problems are not nearly as hopeless as programmers discussing physics. This is exactly how one gets gamma radiation from outer space appear in the same sentence with cell phones and microwave ovens as a possible cause for malfunctioning electronic circuits and sloppy coding.</htmltext>
<tokenext>Some science is definitely behind this .
The question is : how far behind ?
Physicists discussing software problems are not nearly as hopeless as programmers discussing physics .
This is exactly how one gets gamma radiation from outer space appear in the same sentence with cell phones and microwave ovens as a possible cause for malfunctioning electronic circuits and sloppy coding .</tokentext>
<sentencetext>Some science is definitely behind this.
The question is: how far behind?
Physicists discussing software problems are not nearly as hopeless as programmers discussing physics.
This is exactly how one gets gamma radiation from outer space appear in the same sentence with cell phones and microwave ovens as a possible cause for malfunctioning electronic circuits and sloppy coding.</sentencetext>
	<parent>http://www.semanticweb.org/ontologies/ConversationInstances.owl#comment10_03_28_2017236.31650786</parent>
</comment>
<comment>
	<id>http://www.semanticweb.org/ontologies/ConversationInstances.owl#comment10_03_28_2017236.31654198</id>
	<title>great headline</title>
	<author>Anonymous</author>
	<datestamp>1269894360000</datestamp>
	<modclass>None</modclass>
	<modscore>0</modscore>
	<htmltext><p>should be a movie</p><p>"Car Safety Problems from Outer Space!"</p></htmltext>
<tokenext>should be a movie " Car Safety Problems from Outer Space !
"</tokentext>
<sentencetext>should be a movie"Car Safety Problems from Outer Space!
"</sentencetext>
</comment>
<comment>
	<id>http://www.semanticweb.org/ontologies/ConversationInstances.owl#comment10_03_28_2017236.31652608</id>
	<title>Re:Is there realy a problem?</title>
	<author>AK Marc</author>
	<datestamp>1269789720000</datestamp>
	<modclass>Interestin</modclass>
	<modscore>2</modscore>
	<htmltext><i>And how do you confirm it?</i> <br> <br>You replicate it and see if it happens again, or look for physical causes that might come to that result.  Loose floormats have been confirmed to cause it.  rusty/sticky throttle cables have been confirmed to cause it.  Bad cruise control units have been confirmed to cause it (mostly because of physical errors, not all are electronic).<br> <br>But "the car accelerated, I applied the brake and only the brake once the acceleration started and pushed it as hard as I could and the vehicle continued to accelerate out of control" cases have, as far as I know, *never* been replicated.  The brakes are somewhere around ten times more powerful than the engine.  If you slam the brake pedal to the floor with all your might, you will stop all cars, unless your brakes failed before you tried to use them.  So, every case of "I pressed the brakes as hard as I could with my foot off the throttle" defaults to someone that didn't have their foot on the brake and off their throttle.<br> <br> <i>And to the snarky people posting on this - it's terrifying as fuck for your car to accelerate arbitrarily fast (especially when you run a stop and have to dodge pedestrians), and no, the brakes didn't work. Long story short, I had to kill the gas and use non-power assist brakes to come to a stop, fortunately without killing anyone.</i> <br> <br>Another reason why manuals are better.  You just put in the clutch, and the car stops accelerating.  And turning off the car or putting it in neutral is so easy one wonders about the competency of the California trooper who was out of control for over a minute.<br> <br>But for brakes to not stop a car means the brakes are so bad that their failure should have been evident before the incident.  Would you say the car you were in when this happened was in excellent mechanical shape without any problems braking or accelerating ever before that incident?  I had a Cutlass Ciera of about that age that accelerated out of control once.  It was the cruise control that got stuck in the "accelerate" position.  The brakes worked.  But the car is so crappy that if I'd used the brakes to hold the constant speed for 10+ seconds before trying to stop as fast as possible, they would have faded to the point they would be useless.  So when people make reports, it's also interesting to me how long people are holding the brakes at low pressure before going to high pressure.  Because, especially in crappy American cars, like Oldsmobiles, the brakes fade fast.  They have more than enough power to stop you from 100+ mph under full acceleration, but can't do so after riding them for a mile.</htmltext>
<tokenext>And how do you confirm it ?
You replicate it and see if it happens again , or look for physical causes that might come to that result .
Loose floormats have been confirmed to cause it .
rusty/sticky throttle cables have been confirmed to cause it .
Bad cruise control units have been confirmed to cause it ( mostly because of physical errors , not all are electronic ) .
But " the car accelerated , I applied the brake and only the brake once the acceleration started and pushed it as hard as I could and the vehicle continued to accelerate out of control " cases have , as far as I know , * never * been replicated .
The brakes are somewhere around ten times more powerful than the engine .
If you slam the brake pedal to the floor with all your might , you will stop all cars , unless your brakes failed before you tried to use them .
So , every case of " I pressed the brakes as hard as I could with my foot off the throttle " defaults to someone that did n't have their foot on the brake and off their throttle .
And to the snarky people posting on this - it 's terrifying as fuck for your car to accelerate arbitrarily fast ( especially when you run a stop and have to dodge pedestrians ) , and no , the brakes did n't work .
Long story short , I had to kill the gas and use non-power assist brakes to come to a stop , fortunately without killing anyone .
Another reason why manuals are better .
You just put in the clutch , and the car stops accelerating .
And turning off the car or putting it in neutral is so easy one wonders about the competency of the California trooper who was out of control for over a minute .
But for brakes to not stop a car means the brakes are so bad that their failure should have been evident before the incident .
Would you say the car you were in when this happened was in excellent mechanical shape without any problems braking or accelerating ever before that incident ?
I had a Cutlass Ciera of about that age that accelerated out of control once .
It was the cruise control that got stuck in the " accelerate " position .
The brakes worked .
But the car is so crappy that if I 'd used the brakes to hold the constant speed for 10 + seconds before trying to stop as fast as possible , they would have faded to the point they would be useless .
So when people make reports , it 's also interesting to me how long people are holding the brakes at low pressure before going to high pressure .
Because , especially in crappy American cars , like Oldsmobiles , the brakes fade fast .
They have more than enough power to stop you from 100 + mph under full acceleration , but ca n't do so after riding them for a mile .</tokentext>
<sentencetext>And how do you confirm it?
You replicate it and see if it happens again, or look for physical causes that might come to that result.
Loose floormats have been confirmed to cause it.
rusty/sticky throttle cables have been confirmed to cause it.
Bad cruise control units have been confirmed to cause it (mostly because of physical errors, not all are electronic).
But "the car accelerated, I applied the brake and only the brake once the acceleration started and pushed it as hard as I could and the vehicle continued to accelerate out of control" cases have, as far as I know, *never* been replicated.
The brakes are somewhere around ten times more powerful than the engine.
If you slam the brake pedal to the floor with all your might, you will stop all cars, unless your brakes failed before you tried to use them.
So, every case of "I pressed the brakes as hard as I could with my foot off the throttle" defaults to someone that didn't have their foot on the brake and off their throttle.
And to the snarky people posting on this - it's terrifying as fuck for your car to accelerate arbitrarily fast (especially when you run a stop and have to dodge pedestrians), and no, the brakes didn't work.
Long story short, I had to kill the gas and use non-power assist brakes to come to a stop, fortunately without killing anyone.
Another reason why manuals are better.
You just put in the clutch, and the car stops accelerating.
And turning off the car or putting it in neutral is so easy one wonders about the competency of the California trooper who was out of control for over a minute.
But for brakes to not stop a car means the brakes are so bad that their failure should have been evident before the incident.
Would you say the car you were in when this happened was in excellent mechanical shape without any problems braking or accelerating ever before that incident?
I had a Cutlass Ciera of about that age that accelerated out of control once.
It was the cruise control that got stuck in the "accelerate" position.
The brakes worked.
But the car is so crappy that if I'd used the brakes to hold the constant speed for 10+ seconds before trying to stop as fast as possible, they would have faded to the point they would be useless.
So when people make reports, it's also interesting to me how long people are holding the brakes at low pressure before going to high pressure.
Because, especially in crappy American cars, like Oldsmobiles, the brakes fade fast.
They have more than enough power to stop you from 100+ mph under full acceleration, but can't do so after riding them for a mile.</sentencetext>
	<parent>http://www.semanticweb.org/ontologies/ConversationInstances.owl#comment10_03_28_2017236.31651256</parent>
</comment>
<comment>
	<id>http://www.semanticweb.org/ontologies/ConversationInstances.owl#comment10_03_28_2017236.31651556</id>
	<title>Long Answer: No</title>
	<author>Sitnalta</author>
	<datestamp>1269779640000</datestamp>
	<modclass>None</modclass>
	<modscore>1</modscore>
	<htmltext><p>If this were true then more electronics would go haywire at higher altitudes. They do not. I used to live in Leadville, CO and our computers (and cars) worked just fine. In fact, I'd say that a car receives more radiation from the trace amounts of Uranium in the asphalt than from the cosmos.</p><p>As long as I can remember people have been blaming cosmic rays for all sorts of unexplained problems. It's just a convenient scapegoat for shoddy workmanship because few people understand comic rays or even what radiation is for that matter.</p></htmltext>
<tokenext>If this were true then more electronics would go haywire at higher altitudes .
They do not .
I used to live in Leadville , CO and our computers ( and cars ) worked just fine .
In fact , I 'd say that a car receives more radiation from the trace amounts of Uranium in the asphalt than from the cosmos.As long as I can remember people have been blaming cosmic rays for all sorts of unexplained problems .
It 's just a convenient scapegoat for shoddy workmanship because few people understand comic rays or even what radiation is for that matter .</tokentext>
<sentencetext>If this were true then more electronics would go haywire at higher altitudes.
They do not.
I used to live in Leadville, CO and our computers (and cars) worked just fine.
In fact, I'd say that a car receives more radiation from the trace amounts of Uranium in the asphalt than from the cosmos.As long as I can remember people have been blaming cosmic rays for all sorts of unexplained problems.
It's just a convenient scapegoat for shoddy workmanship because few people understand comic rays or even what radiation is for that matter.</sentencetext>
</comment>
<comment>
	<id>http://www.semanticweb.org/ontologies/ConversationInstances.owl#comment10_03_28_2017236.31651940</id>
	<title>Not cosmic</title>
	<author>mirix</author>
	<datestamp>1269783300000</datestamp>
	<modclass>None</modclass>
	<modscore>1</modscore>
	<htmltext><p>I remember reading an article years ago. ionizing radiation is all around us, in low amounts. Naturally, small amounts of radioactive particles will make it into the epoxy and such surrounding ICs, and at some point it will decay.</p><p>From what I remember reading, it was inevitable, so they had to change the design of the [memory, I think] to make it resistant to occasional decay events.</p><p>I seem to recall the article being from the dawn of solid state memory, i.e. right after core. I'm thinking it was about DRAM, as SRAM is inherently harder to flip a bit in.</p><p>That said, all the oldschool car computers from the 80's generally had a 680x micro, with 256b or so of SRAM on board, and maybe 64k of program ROM - So it shouldn't be prone to problems.<br>Modern computers running.. whatever.. 68000's? x86? with globs of DRAM for infotainment stuff might be a little more prone to radiation flipping bits. I don't know.</p><p>I guess if they want to be hardass about it, they can use radhard RAM and ROM and a silicon-on-sapphire COSMAC [vomit] micro for the crucial driving bits, and a normal machine for the infotainment. This is the stuff they use (used?) in space.</p><p>Last I checked, Intersil still sold rad hardened 8086's and 1802's, at stupid prices - so presumably NASA and/or the army are still buying them.</p><p>Here's their rad hard 8086:<br><a href="http://www.intersil.com/products/deviceinfo.asp?pn=HS-80C86RH" title="intersil.com">http://www.intersil.com/products/deviceinfo.asp?pn=HS-80C86RH</a> [intersil.com]<br>Apparently good to 100k rad dose - any humans nearby will be pushing daises a <i> very</i> long time before that.</p></htmltext>
<tokenext>I remember reading an article years ago .
ionizing radiation is all around us , in low amounts .
Naturally , small amounts of radioactive particles will make it into the epoxy and such surrounding ICs , and at some point it will decay.From what I remember reading , it was inevitable , so they had to change the design of the [ memory , I think ] to make it resistant to occasional decay events.I seem to recall the article being from the dawn of solid state memory , i.e .
right after core .
I 'm thinking it was about DRAM , as SRAM is inherently harder to flip a bit in.That said , all the oldschool car computers from the 80 's generally had a 680x micro , with 256b or so of SRAM on board , and maybe 64k of program ROM - So it should n't be prone to problems.Modern computers running.. whatever.. 68000 's ?
x86 ? with globs of DRAM for infotainment stuff might be a little more prone to radiation flipping bits .
I do n't know.I guess if they want to be hardass about it , they can use radhard RAM and ROM and a silicon-on-sapphire COSMAC [ vomit ] micro for the crucial driving bits , and a normal machine for the infotainment .
This is the stuff they use ( used ?
) in space.Last I checked , Intersil still sold rad hardened 8086 's and 1802 's , at stupid prices - so presumably NASA and/or the army are still buying them.Here 's their rad hard 8086 : http : //www.intersil.com/products/deviceinfo.asp ? pn = HS-80C86RH [ intersil.com ] Apparently good to 100k rad dose - any humans nearby will be pushing daises a very long time before that .</tokentext>
<sentencetext>I remember reading an article years ago.
ionizing radiation is all around us, in low amounts.
Naturally, small amounts of radioactive particles will make it into the epoxy and such surrounding ICs, and at some point it will decay.From what I remember reading, it was inevitable, so they had to change the design of the [memory, I think] to make it resistant to occasional decay events.I seem to recall the article being from the dawn of solid state memory, i.e.
right after core.
I'm thinking it was about DRAM, as SRAM is inherently harder to flip a bit in.That said, all the oldschool car computers from the 80's generally had a 680x micro, with 256b or so of SRAM on board, and maybe 64k of program ROM - So it shouldn't be prone to problems.Modern computers running.. whatever.. 68000's?
x86? with globs of DRAM for infotainment stuff might be a little more prone to radiation flipping bits.
I don't know.I guess if they want to be hardass about it, they can use radhard RAM and ROM and a silicon-on-sapphire COSMAC [vomit] micro for the crucial driving bits, and a normal machine for the infotainment.
This is the stuff they use (used?
) in space.Last I checked, Intersil still sold rad hardened 8086's and 1802's, at stupid prices - so presumably NASA and/or the army are still buying them.Here's their rad hard 8086:http://www.intersil.com/products/deviceinfo.asp?pn=HS-80C86RH [intersil.com]Apparently good to 100k rad dose - any humans nearby will be pushing daises a  very long time before that.</sentencetext>
</comment>
<comment>
	<id>http://www.semanticweb.org/ontologies/ConversationInstances.owl#comment10_03_28_2017236.31651656</id>
	<title>Re:Is there realy a problem?</title>
	<author>adolf</author>
	<datestamp>1269780540000</datestamp>
	<modclass>None</modclass>
	<modscore>1</modscore>
	<htmltext><p>Whatever.</p><p>As a member of the local Corvette Owners Club, I imagine the subject in question had a fair understanding of cars in general.</p><p>Because, see:  One might own a Corvette because they look nice.  One might own a Corvette because they're fast.  But only car-lovers do one of those <i>and</i> join the local Corvette Owners Club, let alone <a href="http://www.democraticunderground.com/discuss/duboard.php?az=view\_all&amp;address=389x7922418" title="democratic...ground.com">wear the jacket</a> [democratic...ground.com].</p></htmltext>
<tokenext>Whatever.As a member of the local Corvette Owners Club , I imagine the subject in question had a fair understanding of cars in general.Because , see : One might own a Corvette because they look nice .
One might own a Corvette because they 're fast .
But only car-lovers do one of those and join the local Corvette Owners Club , let alone wear the jacket [ democratic...ground.com ] .</tokentext>
<sentencetext>Whatever.As a member of the local Corvette Owners Club, I imagine the subject in question had a fair understanding of cars in general.Because, see:  One might own a Corvette because they look nice.
One might own a Corvette because they're fast.
But only car-lovers do one of those and join the local Corvette Owners Club, let alone wear the jacket [democratic...ground.com].</sentencetext>
	<parent>http://www.semanticweb.org/ontologies/ConversationInstances.owl#comment10_03_28_2017236.31651340</parent>
</comment>
<comment>
	<id>http://www.semanticweb.org/ontologies/ConversationInstances.owl#comment10_03_28_2017236.31656008</id>
	<title>Re:Weird</title>
	<author>Anonymous</author>
	<datestamp>1269872460000</datestamp>
	<modclass>None</modclass>
	<modscore>0</modscore>
	<htmltext><p>Yep.  very rare.  It's a shame too.<br>
&nbsp; I don't think Toyota even offers a manual transmission in anything larger than their Corolla model here in the states, unless you look at their pickup trucks.<br>It's difficult to find a GM or Ford vehicle with a manual box unless it's on the extreme ends of the $ amounts.<br>Honda's and are a little easier to find in manual.</p></htmltext>
<tokenext>Yep .
very rare .
It 's a shame too .
  I do n't think Toyota even offers a manual transmission in anything larger than their Corolla model here in the states , unless you look at their pickup trucks.It 's difficult to find a GM or Ford vehicle with a manual box unless it 's on the extreme ends of the $ amounts.Honda 's and are a little easier to find in manual .</tokentext>
<sentencetext>Yep.
very rare.
It's a shame too.
  I don't think Toyota even offers a manual transmission in anything larger than their Corolla model here in the states, unless you look at their pickup trucks.It's difficult to find a GM or Ford vehicle with a manual box unless it's on the extreme ends of the $ amounts.Honda's and are a little easier to find in manual.</sentencetext>
	<parent>http://www.semanticweb.org/ontologies/ConversationInstances.owl#comment10_03_28_2017236.31654692</parent>
</comment>
<comment>
	<id>http://www.semanticweb.org/ontologies/ConversationInstances.owl#comment10_03_28_2017236.31652218</id>
	<title>Soft errors usually cause crashes</title>
	<author>Anonymous</author>
	<datestamp>1269786240000</datestamp>
	<modclass>None</modclass>
	<modscore>0</modscore>
	<htmltext><p>Cosmic neutron caused soft errors are real, but they usually cause crashes, not some random action.  If Toyota's systems were susceptible, we'd see hundred (thousands) ?) of failures for every unintended acceleration.  That hasn't happened, so this theory is BS.</p></htmltext>
<tokenext>Cosmic neutron caused soft errors are real , but they usually cause crashes , not some random action .
If Toyota 's systems were susceptible , we 'd see hundred ( thousands ) ?
) of failures for every unintended acceleration .
That has n't happened , so this theory is BS .</tokentext>
<sentencetext>Cosmic neutron caused soft errors are real, but they usually cause crashes, not some random action.
If Toyota's systems were susceptible, we'd see hundred (thousands) ?
) of failures for every unintended acceleration.
That hasn't happened, so this theory is BS.</sentencetext>
</comment>
<comment>
	<id>http://www.semanticweb.org/ontologies/ConversationInstances.owl#comment10_03_28_2017236.31651642</id>
	<title>DRAM, not SRAM or FLASH</title>
	<author>Anonymous</author>
	<datestamp>1269780360000</datestamp>
	<modclass>None</modclass>
	<modscore>1</modscore>
	<htmltext><p>Soft errors from Alpha particles are only induced in DRAM. They do not affect SRAM or FLASH, which is what most mission-critical controllers use. Those that don't use an EDAC to detect and correct single and sometimes multibit errors.</p></htmltext>
<tokenext>Soft errors from Alpha particles are only induced in DRAM .
They do not affect SRAM or FLASH , which is what most mission-critical controllers use .
Those that do n't use an EDAC to detect and correct single and sometimes multibit errors .</tokentext>
<sentencetext>Soft errors from Alpha particles are only induced in DRAM.
They do not affect SRAM or FLASH, which is what most mission-critical controllers use.
Those that don't use an EDAC to detect and correct single and sometimes multibit errors.</sentencetext>
</comment>
<comment>
	<id>http://www.semanticweb.org/ontologies/ConversationInstances.owl#comment10_03_28_2017236.31651040</id>
	<title>Stupid.</title>
	<author>Anonymous</author>
	<datestamp>1269775500000</datestamp>
	<modclass>None</modclass>
	<modscore>0</modscore>
	<htmltext><p>This is stupid as hell. If cosmic rays cause this, it would be a problem with other car makes.</p></htmltext>
<tokenext>This is stupid as hell .
If cosmic rays cause this , it would be a problem with other car makes .</tokentext>
<sentencetext>This is stupid as hell.
If cosmic rays cause this, it would be a problem with other car makes.</sentencetext>
</comment>
<comment>
	<id>http://www.semanticweb.org/ontologies/ConversationInstances.owl#comment10_03_28_2017236.31650940</id>
	<title>Re:No.</title>
	<author>Anonymous</author>
	<datestamp>1269774900000</datestamp>
	<modclass>None</modclass>
	<modscore>1</modscore>
	<htmltext>Parent is not Flamebait. Disgusted? You bet. Angry that this type of crazy has made its way to the pages of<nobr> <wbr></nobr>/.? Indeed.<br> <br>I'm standing in line with SC on this one. This story needs to be tagged "unicorns, ponies and space rays".</htmltext>
<tokenext>Parent is not Flamebait .
Disgusted ? You bet .
Angry that this type of crazy has made its way to the pages of /. ?
Indeed. I 'm standing in line with SC on this one .
This story needs to be tagged " unicorns , ponies and space rays " .</tokentext>
<sentencetext>Parent is not Flamebait.
Disgusted? You bet.
Angry that this type of crazy has made its way to the pages of /.?
Indeed. I'm standing in line with SC on this one.
This story needs to be tagged "unicorns, ponies and space rays".</sentencetext>
	<parent>http://www.semanticweb.org/ontologies/ConversationInstances.owl#comment10_03_28_2017236.31650804</parent>
</comment>
<comment>
	<id>http://www.semanticweb.org/ontologies/ConversationInstances.owl#comment10_03_28_2017236.31654636</id>
	<title>The Prof Is No Dummy</title>
	<author>mbstone</author>
	<datestamp>1269858000000</datestamp>
	<modclass>None</modclass>
	<modscore>1</modscore>
	<htmltext><p>1. Prof testifies as an expert witness about stuck accelerators being caused by cosmic rays.<br>2. Idiot jurors buy his story and let Toyota off the hook.<br>3. Prof profits!!</p></htmltext>
<tokenext>1 .
Prof testifies as an expert witness about stuck accelerators being caused by cosmic rays.2 .
Idiot jurors buy his story and let Toyota off the hook.3 .
Prof profits !
!</tokentext>
<sentencetext>1.
Prof testifies as an expert witness about stuck accelerators being caused by cosmic rays.2.
Idiot jurors buy his story and let Toyota off the hook.3.
Prof profits!
!</sentencetext>
	<parent>http://www.semanticweb.org/ontologies/ConversationInstances.owl#comment10_03_28_2017236.31650804</parent>
</comment>
<comment>
	<id>http://www.semanticweb.org/ontologies/ConversationInstances.owl#comment10_03_28_2017236.31652122</id>
	<title>Cosmic Ray's: A lawyer's dream.</title>
	<author>kurt555gs</author>
	<datestamp>1269785220000</datestamp>
	<modclass>None</modclass>
	<modscore>1</modscore>
	<htmltext><p>Let's look at this from a personal injury attorneys perspective. Cosmic rays are made by God. God's richest representative here on Earth is the Catholic Church. Since the Catholic Church is the local distributor of "God's will" and that action caused harm to my client, I will sue the Holy See.</p><p>Profit!</p></htmltext>
<tokenext>Let 's look at this from a personal injury attorneys perspective .
Cosmic rays are made by God .
God 's richest representative here on Earth is the Catholic Church .
Since the Catholic Church is the local distributor of " God 's will " and that action caused harm to my client , I will sue the Holy See.Profit !</tokentext>
<sentencetext>Let's look at this from a personal injury attorneys perspective.
Cosmic rays are made by God.
God's richest representative here on Earth is the Catholic Church.
Since the Catholic Church is the local distributor of "God's will" and that action caused harm to my client, I will sue the Holy See.Profit!</sentencetext>
</comment>
<comment>
	<id>http://www.semanticweb.org/ontologies/ConversationInstances.owl#comment10_03_28_2017236.31656290</id>
	<title>Solution: Tin Foil</title>
	<author>jduhls</author>
	<datestamp>1269873840000</datestamp>
	<modclass>None</modclass>
	<modscore>0</modscore>
	<htmltext>So a tin foil hat for my Prius should fix 'er right up?</htmltext>
<tokenext>So a tin foil hat for my Prius should fix 'er right up ?</tokentext>
<sentencetext>So a tin foil hat for my Prius should fix 'er right up?</sentencetext>
</comment>
<comment>
	<id>http://www.semanticweb.org/ontologies/ConversationInstances.owl#comment10_03_28_2017236.31650818</id>
	<title>Re:Why they tell you to turn off your phone...</title>
	<author>Anonymous</author>
	<datestamp>1269774300000</datestamp>
	<modclass>Informativ</modclass>
	<modscore>4</modscore>
	<htmltext><p><a href="http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Non-ionizing\_radiation" title="wikipedia.org">http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Non-ionizing\_radiation</a> [wikipedia.org]</p><p>Granted, an unshielded circuit can be vulnerable to any EM field, but gamma rays affect electronics in a completely different way than microwaves do.</p></htmltext>
<tokenext>http : //en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Non-ionizing \ _radiation [ wikipedia.org ] Granted , an unshielded circuit can be vulnerable to any EM field , but gamma rays affect electronics in a completely different way than microwaves do .</tokentext>
<sentencetext>http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Non-ionizing\_radiation [wikipedia.org]Granted, an unshielded circuit can be vulnerable to any EM field, but gamma rays affect electronics in a completely different way than microwaves do.</sentencetext>
	<parent>http://www.semanticweb.org/ontologies/ConversationInstances.owl#comment10_03_28_2017236.31650752</parent>
</comment>
<comment>
	<id>http://www.semanticweb.org/ontologies/ConversationInstances.owl#comment10_03_28_2017236.31651390</id>
	<title>OR....</title>
	<author>Anonymous</author>
	<datestamp>1269778440000</datestamp>
	<modclass>None</modclass>
	<modscore>0</modscore>
	<htmltext><p>or, the more reasonable explanation... Toyota just royally f'ed up!</p></htmltext>
<tokenext>or , the more reasonable explanation... Toyota just royally f'ed up !</tokentext>
<sentencetext>or, the more reasonable explanation... Toyota just royally f'ed up!</sentencetext>
</comment>
<comment>
	<id>http://www.semanticweb.org/ontologies/ConversationInstances.owl#comment10_03_28_2017236.31654234</id>
	<title>Occam's razor</title>
	<author>paylett</author>
	<datestamp>1269894960000</datestamp>
	<modclass>None</modclass>
	<modscore>1</modscore>
	<htmltext>Simplest explanation is the most likely: someone stuffed up.</htmltext>
<tokenext>Simplest explanation is the most likely : someone stuffed up .</tokentext>
<sentencetext>Simplest explanation is the most likely: someone stuffed up.</sentencetext>
</comment>
<comment>
	<id>http://www.semanticweb.org/ontologies/ConversationInstances.owl#comment10_03_28_2017236.31651970</id>
	<title>Re:Is there realy a problem?</title>
	<author>AmberBlackCat</author>
	<datestamp>1269783660000</datestamp>
	<modclass>Flamebait</modclass>
	<modscore>0</modscore>
	<htmltext>I've personally felt like the whole thing was a scam from the beginning. But I tend to be skeptical of government in general. I just feel like it's easier to run a smear campaign on Toyota than to fix the reputations of General Motors and Ford. But it seems like if the Toyotas have as many problems as the media makes it seem, we would actually see Toyotas having problems. Also, it didn't seem to affect sales. It seems like the only people who don't trust Toyota anymore are people who drive non-Toyota vehicles. It reminds me of the Linux users who say Windows crashes all the time. Also, I noticed recently millions of General Motors vehicles were recalled due to power steering problems. They didn't get nearly as much publicity as Toyota.</htmltext>
<tokenext>I 've personally felt like the whole thing was a scam from the beginning .
But I tend to be skeptical of government in general .
I just feel like it 's easier to run a smear campaign on Toyota than to fix the reputations of General Motors and Ford .
But it seems like if the Toyotas have as many problems as the media makes it seem , we would actually see Toyotas having problems .
Also , it did n't seem to affect sales .
It seems like the only people who do n't trust Toyota anymore are people who drive non-Toyota vehicles .
It reminds me of the Linux users who say Windows crashes all the time .
Also , I noticed recently millions of General Motors vehicles were recalled due to power steering problems .
They did n't get nearly as much publicity as Toyota .</tokentext>
<sentencetext>I've personally felt like the whole thing was a scam from the beginning.
But I tend to be skeptical of government in general.
I just feel like it's easier to run a smear campaign on Toyota than to fix the reputations of General Motors and Ford.
But it seems like if the Toyotas have as many problems as the media makes it seem, we would actually see Toyotas having problems.
Also, it didn't seem to affect sales.
It seems like the only people who don't trust Toyota anymore are people who drive non-Toyota vehicles.
It reminds me of the Linux users who say Windows crashes all the time.
Also, I noticed recently millions of General Motors vehicles were recalled due to power steering problems.
They didn't get nearly as much publicity as Toyota.</sentencetext>
	<parent>http://www.semanticweb.org/ontologies/ConversationInstances.owl#comment10_03_28_2017236.31650786</parent>
</comment>
<comment>
	<id>http://www.semanticweb.org/ontologies/ConversationInstances.owl#comment10_03_28_2017236.31651924</id>
	<title>Redundancy</title>
	<author>Anonymous</author>
	<datestamp>1269783180000</datestamp>
	<modclass>None</modclass>
	<modscore>0</modscore>
	<htmltext>So, what happened to physical redundancy, (or redundancy at all, even) for life- and mission-critical systems?<br> <br>I don't buy this whole "Cosmic Ray" business, I think it's just a copout for shoddy programming.</htmltext>
<tokenext>So , what happened to physical redundancy , ( or redundancy at all , even ) for life- and mission-critical systems ?
I do n't buy this whole " Cosmic Ray " business , I think it 's just a copout for shoddy programming .</tokentext>
<sentencetext>So, what happened to physical redundancy, (or redundancy at all, even) for life- and mission-critical systems?
I don't buy this whole "Cosmic Ray" business, I think it's just a copout for shoddy programming.</sentencetext>
</comment>
<comment>
	<id>http://www.semanticweb.org/ontologies/ConversationInstances.owl#comment10_03_28_2017236.31654740</id>
	<title>Re:Is there realy a problem?</title>
	<author>CharlyFoxtrot</author>
	<datestamp>1269859440000</datestamp>
	<modclass>None</modclass>
	<modscore>1</modscore>
	<htmltext><p><div class="quote"><p>Since the biggest Toyota runaway story has turned out to be a <a href="http://autos.aol.com/article/prius-driver-scam/" title="aol.com">problem exists between  seat and pedals</a> [aol.com] situation... is this all hype with no science behind it?</p></div><p>It sounds like someone just pulled an excuse out of the <a href="http://zork.net/fortunes/bofh-excuses" title="zork.net">"BOFH excuses file"</a> [zork.net] (clickety clickety) :</p><p>"BOFH excuse #254:</p><p>Interference from lunar radiation"</p></div>
	</htmltext>
<tokenext>Since the biggest Toyota runaway story has turned out to be a problem exists between seat and pedals [ aol.com ] situation... is this all hype with no science behind it ? It sounds like someone just pulled an excuse out of the " BOFH excuses file " [ zork.net ] ( clickety clickety ) : " BOFH excuse # 254 : Interference from lunar radiation "</tokentext>
<sentencetext>Since the biggest Toyota runaway story has turned out to be a problem exists between  seat and pedals [aol.com] situation... is this all hype with no science behind it?It sounds like someone just pulled an excuse out of the "BOFH excuses file" [zork.net] (clickety clickety) :"BOFH excuse #254:Interference from lunar radiation"
	</sentencetext>
	<parent>http://www.semanticweb.org/ontologies/ConversationInstances.owl#comment10_03_28_2017236.31650786</parent>
</comment>
<comment>
	<id>http://www.semanticweb.org/ontologies/ConversationInstances.owl#comment10_03_28_2017236.31652306</id>
	<title>Re:Why is everyone picking on Toyota?</title>
	<author>/dev/trash</author>
	<datestamp>1269786960000</datestamp>
	<modclass>None</modclass>
	<modscore>1</modscore>
	<htmltext><p>GM is now owned by the taxpayers and dammit we need to buy more!</p></htmltext>
<tokenext>GM is now owned by the taxpayers and dammit we need to buy more !</tokentext>
<sentencetext>GM is now owned by the taxpayers and dammit we need to buy more!</sentencetext>
	<parent>http://www.semanticweb.org/ontologies/ConversationInstances.owl#comment10_03_28_2017236.31650902</parent>
</comment>
<comment>
	<id>http://www.semanticweb.org/ontologies/ConversationInstances.owl#comment10_03_28_2017236.31651256</id>
	<title>Re:Is there realy a problem?</title>
	<author>ShakaUVM</author>
	<datestamp>1269777240000</datestamp>
	<modclass>Interestin</modclass>
	<modscore>2</modscore>
	<htmltext><p>&gt;&gt;Confirmed cases of runaway acceleration are virtually non-existent.</p><p>And how do you confirm it? Ask the person?</p><p>My '84 Cutlass Supreme went out of control accelerating when I was driving on the campus loop (back in '97 or so), but how could you confirm this? It did happen, but how can you verify it? (I've posted the story on Slashdot before, if you really dig back into my history, long before the runaway Toyota thing entered our national consciousness.)</p><p>And to the snarky people posting on this - it's terrifying as fuck for your car to accelerate arbitrarily fast (especially when you run a stop and have to dodge pedestrians), and no, the brakes didn't work. Long story short, I had to kill the gas and use non-power assist brakes to come to a stop, fortunately without killing anyone.</p></htmltext>
<tokenext>&gt; &gt; Confirmed cases of runaway acceleration are virtually non-existent.And how do you confirm it ?
Ask the person ? My '84 Cutlass Supreme went out of control accelerating when I was driving on the campus loop ( back in '97 or so ) , but how could you confirm this ?
It did happen , but how can you verify it ?
( I 've posted the story on Slashdot before , if you really dig back into my history , long before the runaway Toyota thing entered our national consciousness .
) And to the snarky people posting on this - it 's terrifying as fuck for your car to accelerate arbitrarily fast ( especially when you run a stop and have to dodge pedestrians ) , and no , the brakes did n't work .
Long story short , I had to kill the gas and use non-power assist brakes to come to a stop , fortunately without killing anyone .</tokentext>
<sentencetext>&gt;&gt;Confirmed cases of runaway acceleration are virtually non-existent.And how do you confirm it?
Ask the person?My '84 Cutlass Supreme went out of control accelerating when I was driving on the campus loop (back in '97 or so), but how could you confirm this?
It did happen, but how can you verify it?
(I've posted the story on Slashdot before, if you really dig back into my history, long before the runaway Toyota thing entered our national consciousness.
)And to the snarky people posting on this - it's terrifying as fuck for your car to accelerate arbitrarily fast (especially when you run a stop and have to dodge pedestrians), and no, the brakes didn't work.
Long story short, I had to kill the gas and use non-power assist brakes to come to a stop, fortunately without killing anyone.</sentencetext>
	<parent>http://www.semanticweb.org/ontologies/ConversationInstances.owl#comment10_03_28_2017236.31650936</parent>
</comment>
<comment>
	<id>http://www.semanticweb.org/ontologies/ConversationInstances.owl#comment10_03_28_2017236.31657562</id>
	<title>Re:Weird</title>
	<author>DCFusor</author>
	<datestamp>1269879180000</datestamp>
	<modclass>None</modclass>
	<modscore>1</modscore>
	<htmltext>Manuals are getting to be fairly rare, yes, though my nice new 2010 Camaro has one.<p>
I had to re-learn how to drive a manual, especially on something that powerful.
(Wow, is it ever a fun car to drive, like strapping on a jet fighter)</p><p>
What I find interesting in all this is that for one thing, that shouldn't matter -- why not take the automatic to neutral?  The engine might blow if full throttle unloaded but if it's that or your life.....well, people aren't all that smart I guess, or we wouldn't see in the movies how people are asked to dig their own graves -- and they do it!
</p><p>
Over half the cars I've recently owned won't let you turn them off unless in park...with the wheel locked.  So I guess we can't expect people to do that, but if there was ever a stupider safety feature, I don't know what it is.  This originally was a CYA move by the car manufacturers to avoid suits caused by people starting cars in gear and having wrecks (so they claimed).
</p><p>
I have yet to own a car (and I've owned cars since the '60s) that you couldn't stop with the brakes....even at full throttle so little or no vacuum boost, but of course since I understand how power brakes work, I'd never wimpishly tap the pedal and use up the vacuum in the reservoir before trying that in an emergency!  But again, people aren't that smart about the things they put their lives on the line with.
</p><p>
Gosh, I mean if you're really in a life ending situation, you can't muster a little extra foot pedal pressure?
</p><p>
As someone who spent decades writing code and designing high reliability systems (6 9's or more), I can say from here without even checking that it's a software problem.  We were constantly trying to hire more people with the skills and mindset to be able to do this, and there just aren't many pickings who can do it without (or even with) ridiculous things like triple redundancy, "safe languages" and all the expensive other approaches that try to substitute method for skill and due dilligence (and which all fail anyway).  It's not like we weren't offering top of the line money, far more than enough to buy a code jock from a car maker...there just wasn't the talent pool.</p></htmltext>
<tokenext>Manuals are getting to be fairly rare , yes , though my nice new 2010 Camaro has one .
I had to re-learn how to drive a manual , especially on something that powerful .
( Wow , is it ever a fun car to drive , like strapping on a jet fighter ) What I find interesting in all this is that for one thing , that should n't matter -- why not take the automatic to neutral ?
The engine might blow if full throttle unloaded but if it 's that or your life.....well , people are n't all that smart I guess , or we would n't see in the movies how people are asked to dig their own graves -- and they do it !
Over half the cars I 've recently owned wo n't let you turn them off unless in park...with the wheel locked .
So I guess we ca n't expect people to do that , but if there was ever a stupider safety feature , I do n't know what it is .
This originally was a CYA move by the car manufacturers to avoid suits caused by people starting cars in gear and having wrecks ( so they claimed ) .
I have yet to own a car ( and I 've owned cars since the '60s ) that you could n't stop with the brakes....even at full throttle so little or no vacuum boost , but of course since I understand how power brakes work , I 'd never wimpishly tap the pedal and use up the vacuum in the reservoir before trying that in an emergency !
But again , people are n't that smart about the things they put their lives on the line with .
Gosh , I mean if you 're really in a life ending situation , you ca n't muster a little extra foot pedal pressure ?
As someone who spent decades writing code and designing high reliability systems ( 6 9 's or more ) , I can say from here without even checking that it 's a software problem .
We were constantly trying to hire more people with the skills and mindset to be able to do this , and there just are n't many pickings who can do it without ( or even with ) ridiculous things like triple redundancy , " safe languages " and all the expensive other approaches that try to substitute method for skill and due dilligence ( and which all fail anyway ) .
It 's not like we were n't offering top of the line money , far more than enough to buy a code jock from a car maker...there just was n't the talent pool .</tokentext>
<sentencetext>Manuals are getting to be fairly rare, yes, though my nice new 2010 Camaro has one.
I had to re-learn how to drive a manual, especially on something that powerful.
(Wow, is it ever a fun car to drive, like strapping on a jet fighter)
What I find interesting in all this is that for one thing, that shouldn't matter -- why not take the automatic to neutral?
The engine might blow if full throttle unloaded but if it's that or your life.....well, people aren't all that smart I guess, or we wouldn't see in the movies how people are asked to dig their own graves -- and they do it!
Over half the cars I've recently owned won't let you turn them off unless in park...with the wheel locked.
So I guess we can't expect people to do that, but if there was ever a stupider safety feature, I don't know what it is.
This originally was a CYA move by the car manufacturers to avoid suits caused by people starting cars in gear and having wrecks (so they claimed).
I have yet to own a car (and I've owned cars since the '60s) that you couldn't stop with the brakes....even at full throttle so little or no vacuum boost, but of course since I understand how power brakes work, I'd never wimpishly tap the pedal and use up the vacuum in the reservoir before trying that in an emergency!
But again, people aren't that smart about the things they put their lives on the line with.
Gosh, I mean if you're really in a life ending situation, you can't muster a little extra foot pedal pressure?
As someone who spent decades writing code and designing high reliability systems (6 9's or more), I can say from here without even checking that it's a software problem.
We were constantly trying to hire more people with the skills and mindset to be able to do this, and there just aren't many pickings who can do it without (or even with) ridiculous things like triple redundancy, "safe languages" and all the expensive other approaches that try to substitute method for skill and due dilligence (and which all fail anyway).
It's not like we weren't offering top of the line money, far more than enough to buy a code jock from a car maker...there just wasn't the talent pool.</sentencetext>
	<parent>http://www.semanticweb.org/ontologies/ConversationInstances.owl#comment10_03_28_2017236.31654692</parent>
</comment>
<comment>
	<id>http://www.semanticweb.org/ontologies/ConversationInstances.owl#comment10_03_28_2017236.31650928</id>
	<title>War of the Worlds</title>
	<author>Anonymous</author>
	<datestamp>1269774840000</datestamp>
	<modclass>None</modclass>
	<modscore>0</modscore>
	<htmltext><p>Aliens saw cars consuming humans and made the sensible deduction that cars were the master race and at the top of the food chain. The radiation is an attempt to destroy the master race and save the pink apes from extinction. Next up is to stop the flying creatures that eat the apes through long feeding tubes. They seem to mostly gather in major cities in breeding areas with long black paths that help them take off and land.</p></htmltext>
<tokenext>Aliens saw cars consuming humans and made the sensible deduction that cars were the master race and at the top of the food chain .
The radiation is an attempt to destroy the master race and save the pink apes from extinction .
Next up is to stop the flying creatures that eat the apes through long feeding tubes .
They seem to mostly gather in major cities in breeding areas with long black paths that help them take off and land .</tokentext>
<sentencetext>Aliens saw cars consuming humans and made the sensible deduction that cars were the master race and at the top of the food chain.
The radiation is an attempt to destroy the master race and save the pink apes from extinction.
Next up is to stop the flying creatures that eat the apes through long feeding tubes.
They seem to mostly gather in major cities in breeding areas with long black paths that help them take off and land.</sentencetext>
</comment>
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