<article>
	<id>http://www.semanticweb.org/ontologies/ConversationInstances.owl#article10_01_31_2327234</id>
	<title>FOSS CAD and 3D Modeling Software?</title>
	<author>timothy</author>
	<datestamp>1264937820000</datestamp>
	<htmltext>Paul server guy writes <i>"I work at a <a href="http://www.openluna.org/">privately funded, open source, manned, return to the moon mission</a> &mdash; Yes really, and Yes, we really are going to put man (and woman) back on the moon. Since we are open source, we want all of our tools to be, too. What we are looking for is CAD software that we can feed into Blender (or the like) to do 3D modeling with. Many of the engineers have tried working with Blender and Art of Illusion, but have not been pleased. They want to just draw the parts, then feed them to the art people who will run them through the 3D modelers for videos, illustrations and such. What is your preference?"</i></htmltext>
<tokenext>Paul server guy writes " I work at a privately funded , open source , manned , return to the moon mission    Yes really , and Yes , we really are going to put man ( and woman ) back on the moon .
Since we are open source , we want all of our tools to be , too .
What we are looking for is CAD software that we can feed into Blender ( or the like ) to do 3D modeling with .
Many of the engineers have tried working with Blender and Art of Illusion , but have not been pleased .
They want to just draw the parts , then feed them to the art people who will run them through the 3D modelers for videos , illustrations and such .
What is your preference ?
"</tokentext>
<sentencetext>Paul server guy writes "I work at a privately funded, open source, manned, return to the moon mission — Yes really, and Yes, we really are going to put man (and woman) back on the moon.
Since we are open source, we want all of our tools to be, too.
What we are looking for is CAD software that we can feed into Blender (or the like) to do 3D modeling with.
Many of the engineers have tried working with Blender and Art of Illusion, but have not been pleased.
They want to just draw the parts, then feed them to the art people who will run them through the 3D modelers for videos, illustrations and such.
What is your preference?
"</sentencetext>
</article>
<comment>
	<id>http://www.semanticweb.org/ontologies/ConversationInstances.owl#comment10_01_31_2327234.30975720</id>
	<title>If I were an astronaut...</title>
	<author>Exitar</author>
	<datestamp>1264944660000</datestamp>
	<modclass>Funny</modclass>
	<modscore>4</modscore>
	<htmltext><p>I'd be quite scared to be launched on the Moon by a company that asked suggestions about the tools to use on Slashdot!</p></htmltext>
<tokenext>I 'd be quite scared to be launched on the Moon by a company that asked suggestions about the tools to use on Slashdot !</tokentext>
<sentencetext>I'd be quite scared to be launched on the Moon by a company that asked suggestions about the tools to use on Slashdot!</sentencetext>
</comment>
<comment>
	<id>http://www.semanticweb.org/ontologies/ConversationInstances.owl#comment10_01_31_2327234.30976658</id>
	<title>Avocad-cad</title>
	<author>Anonymous</author>
	<datestamp>1264951980000</datestamp>
	<modclass>None</modclass>
	<modscore>1</modscore>
	<htmltext>No one's mentioned <a href="http://avocado-cad.sourceforge.net/" title="sourceforge.net">avocad-cad</a> [sourceforge.net] yet?</htmltext>
<tokenext>No one 's mentioned avocad-cad [ sourceforge.net ] yet ?</tokentext>
<sentencetext>No one's mentioned avocad-cad [sourceforge.net] yet?</sentencetext>
</comment>
<comment>
	<id>http://www.semanticweb.org/ontologies/ConversationInstances.owl#comment10_01_31_2327234.30993112</id>
	<title>To the moon</title>
	<author>Anonymous</author>
	<datestamp>1265111520000</datestamp>
	<modclass>None</modclass>
	<modscore>0</modscore>
	<htmltext><p>The Dutch translation of "to the moon" also happens to mean "wasted".</p><p>On a different note: as it is commonly known that the Apollo landings were fake, I think that, for re-creating the Apollo project, you'd better be looking for 3D animation software, video editing software, motion capture software, and a good film studio. And this time, don't forget that flags don't move in vacuum, make sure the shadows point in the right direction, and make some stars visible.</p></htmltext>
<tokenext>The Dutch translation of " to the moon " also happens to mean " wasted " .On a different note : as it is commonly known that the Apollo landings were fake , I think that , for re-creating the Apollo project , you 'd better be looking for 3D animation software , video editing software , motion capture software , and a good film studio .
And this time , do n't forget that flags do n't move in vacuum , make sure the shadows point in the right direction , and make some stars visible .</tokentext>
<sentencetext>The Dutch translation of "to the moon" also happens to mean "wasted".On a different note: as it is commonly known that the Apollo landings were fake, I think that, for re-creating the Apollo project, you'd better be looking for 3D animation software, video editing software, motion capture software, and a good film studio.
And this time, don't forget that flags don't move in vacuum, make sure the shadows point in the right direction, and make some stars visible.</sentencetext>
</comment>
<comment>
	<id>http://www.semanticweb.org/ontologies/ConversationInstances.owl#comment10_01_31_2327234.30978466</id>
	<title>Re:Bwhahahaha - "engineers" drawing pretty parts</title>
	<author>LordAzuzu</author>
	<datestamp>1265016600000</datestamp>
	<modclass>None</modclass>
	<modscore>1</modscore>
	<htmltext><tt>&lt;quote&gt;&lt;p&gt;(...)There's a reason why the USA is the only nation to ever had put humans on the moon(...)&lt;/p&gt;&lt;/quote&gt;<br>(Color) Pics of it never happened.<br><br></tt></div>
	</htmltext>
<tokenext>( ... ) There 's a reason why the USA is the only nation to ever had put humans on the moon ( ... ) ( Color ) Pics of it never happened .</tokentext>
<sentencetext>(...)There's a reason why the USA is the only nation to ever had put humans on the moon(...)(Color) Pics of it never happened.
	</sentencetext>
	<parent>http://www.semanticweb.org/ontologies/ConversationInstances.owl#comment10_01_31_2327234.30975566</parent>
</comment>
<comment>
	<id>http://www.semanticweb.org/ontologies/ConversationInstances.owl#comment10_01_31_2327234.30975480</id>
	<title>Re:You've raised $130 out of $7500</title>
	<author>QuantumG</author>
	<datestamp>1264943100000</datestamp>
	<modclass>Informativ</modclass>
	<modscore>4</modscore>
	<htmltext><p>Ya know, it seems to be a common occurrence to find space projects with horrid web sites.  Consider:</p><p><a href="http://www.copenhagensuborbitals.com/" title="copenhagen...bitals.com">http://www.copenhagensuborbitals.com/</a> [copenhagen...bitals.com]<br><a href="http://www.interorbital.com/" title="interorbital.com">http://www.interorbital.com/</a> [interorbital.com]</p><p>Both real groups doing real hardware right now, with websites that look like scams.</p></htmltext>
<tokenext>Ya know , it seems to be a common occurrence to find space projects with horrid web sites .
Consider : http : //www.copenhagensuborbitals.com/ [ copenhagen...bitals.com ] http : //www.interorbital.com/ [ interorbital.com ] Both real groups doing real hardware right now , with websites that look like scams .</tokentext>
<sentencetext>Ya know, it seems to be a common occurrence to find space projects with horrid web sites.
Consider:http://www.copenhagensuborbitals.com/ [copenhagen...bitals.com]http://www.interorbital.com/ [interorbital.com]Both real groups doing real hardware right now, with websites that look like scams.</sentencetext>
	<parent>http://www.semanticweb.org/ontologies/ConversationInstances.owl#comment10_01_31_2327234.30975208</parent>
</comment>
<comment>
	<id>http://www.semanticweb.org/ontologies/ConversationInstances.owl#comment10_01_31_2327234.30975348</id>
	<title>HeeksCad</title>
	<author>bored\_engineer</author>
	<datestamp>1264942380000</datestamp>
	<modclass>Informativ</modclass>
	<modscore>2</modscore>
	<htmltext><p>HeeksCad is making progress.  I don't know about feeding your parts into Blender, though.  You may be able to shape the project some if you get involved, though.  Somebody else mentioned FreeCAD.  I've not yet tried to use it.</p><p>There's also <a href="http://www.gcad3d.org/" title="gcad3d.org" rel="nofollow">gcad3d</a> [gcad3d.org].  I found that one to be tough to use, though.  For 2D, I don't think that you have many options but qcad.</p></htmltext>
<tokenext>HeeksCad is making progress .
I do n't know about feeding your parts into Blender , though .
You may be able to shape the project some if you get involved , though .
Somebody else mentioned FreeCAD .
I 've not yet tried to use it.There 's also gcad3d [ gcad3d.org ] .
I found that one to be tough to use , though .
For 2D , I do n't think that you have many options but qcad .</tokentext>
<sentencetext>HeeksCad is making progress.
I don't know about feeding your parts into Blender, though.
You may be able to shape the project some if you get involved, though.
Somebody else mentioned FreeCAD.
I've not yet tried to use it.There's also gcad3d [gcad3d.org].
I found that one to be tough to use, though.
For 2D, I don't think that you have many options but qcad.</sentencetext>
</comment>
<comment>
	<id>http://www.semanticweb.org/ontologies/ConversationInstances.owl#comment10_01_31_2327234.30976558</id>
	<title>G'luck with that</title>
	<author>Quarters</author>
	<datestamp>1264950840000</datestamp>
	<modclass>Insightful</modclass>
	<modscore>2</modscore>
	<htmltext>That you are more worried about making art with 3D models, and wanting a CAD package that will easily import into your 3D modeler of choice, instead of being worried about actual engineering makes me think this project will never get off the ground (all puns intended).
<p>
Here's a free CAD package that seems to be just the right caliber for your organization...Google SketchUp.</p></htmltext>
<tokenext>That you are more worried about making art with 3D models , and wanting a CAD package that will easily import into your 3D modeler of choice , instead of being worried about actual engineering makes me think this project will never get off the ground ( all puns intended ) .
Here 's a free CAD package that seems to be just the right caliber for your organization...Google SketchUp .</tokentext>
<sentencetext>That you are more worried about making art with 3D models, and wanting a CAD package that will easily import into your 3D modeler of choice, instead of being worried about actual engineering makes me think this project will never get off the ground (all puns intended).
Here's a free CAD package that seems to be just the right caliber for your organization...Google SketchUp.</sentencetext>
</comment>
<comment>
	<id>http://www.semanticweb.org/ontologies/ConversationInstances.owl#comment10_01_31_2327234.30975730</id>
	<title>Please, please do not donate to this project</title>
	<author>raftpeople</author>
	<datestamp>1264944720000</datestamp>
	<modclass>Troll</modclass>
	<modscore>0</modscore>
	<htmltext>Instead, I would direct you to our privately funded project to get to Mars!  We are just bringing it all together at this point, can't give you actual numbers of dollars raised, and our website isn't up yet, but man it's going to be awesome!</htmltext>
<tokenext>Instead , I would direct you to our privately funded project to get to Mars !
We are just bringing it all together at this point , ca n't give you actual numbers of dollars raised , and our website is n't up yet , but man it 's going to be awesome !</tokentext>
<sentencetext>Instead, I would direct you to our privately funded project to get to Mars!
We are just bringing it all together at this point, can't give you actual numbers of dollars raised, and our website isn't up yet, but man it's going to be awesome!</sentencetext>
	<parent>http://www.semanticweb.org/ontologies/ConversationInstances.owl#comment10_01_31_2327234.30975208</parent>
</comment>
<comment>
	<id>http://www.semanticweb.org/ontologies/ConversationInstances.owl#comment10_01_31_2327234.30975926</id>
	<title>CAE Linux anyone ?</title>
	<author>Anonymous</author>
	<datestamp>1264945980000</datestamp>
	<modclass>None</modclass>
	<modscore>0</modscore>
	<htmltext><p>Try CaeLinux http://www.caelinux.com/CMS/ a bootable CD distribution which is basically a collection of different open source Cad apps<br>I'm hoping to make a reprap 3d printer at some point, so I've been looking into writing some ebuild scripts to get some of the stuff from caelinux into gentoo<br>like Salome, elmerfem, brlcad</p><p>I'm not an expert in CAD mind you but some of the below may be useful</p><p>One of the things I've discovered is that there's a difference between 3D Cad and 3D Modeling software<br>Modeling is about approximating the appearance of an object for appearance sake only, usually using a mesh / grid of some kind, this is a typical use for Blender<br>CAD is about what the object is made of, and it's physical dimensions in real space, typically objects are constructed from primitives such as a hollowed out cylinder for example<br>Modeling = what you can see the outside appearance, CAD = the innards, what it's made of and more of a focus on measurements in real space</p><p>If your going to design something that's going to be built it's probably better to design it in Cad software first<br>then convert it to a modeling form later on for the sake of pretty pictures / animations / appearances in a demonstration etc.<br>This way the original design is stored in a form where there's actual physical measurements (in mm for example)<br>and in a form that can be manufactured (drill holes at these points here and here etc)</p><p>While Blender could in theory support CAD capability, I think it's current features are lacking in that area<br>(although it is open source so if you want to add those features go right ahead)<br>From a commercial perspective I think the 2 main packages are Catia and Solidworks</p><p>Also If you want to simulate the environment on a 3D Cad object, the usual way is via FEM or Finite Element Analysis<br>This is the sort of thing used to simulate the way temperature travels through an object made of different materials for example<br>I think Catia / Solidwords have this sort of thing already inbuilt, in the case of open source software there's a lot of separate packages to play around with (elmerfem for example)<br>I think the linux cae pages have some good tutorials / examples on this<br>http://www.caelinux.org/wiki/index.php/Doc:CAETutorials</p></htmltext>
<tokenext>Try CaeLinux http : //www.caelinux.com/CMS/ a bootable CD distribution which is basically a collection of different open source Cad appsI 'm hoping to make a reprap 3d printer at some point , so I 've been looking into writing some ebuild scripts to get some of the stuff from caelinux into gentoolike Salome , elmerfem , brlcadI 'm not an expert in CAD mind you but some of the below may be usefulOne of the things I 've discovered is that there 's a difference between 3D Cad and 3D Modeling softwareModeling is about approximating the appearance of an object for appearance sake only , usually using a mesh / grid of some kind , this is a typical use for BlenderCAD is about what the object is made of , and it 's physical dimensions in real space , typically objects are constructed from primitives such as a hollowed out cylinder for exampleModeling = what you can see the outside appearance , CAD = the innards , what it 's made of and more of a focus on measurements in real spaceIf your going to design something that 's going to be built it 's probably better to design it in Cad software firstthen convert it to a modeling form later on for the sake of pretty pictures / animations / appearances in a demonstration etc.This way the original design is stored in a form where there 's actual physical measurements ( in mm for example ) and in a form that can be manufactured ( drill holes at these points here and here etc ) While Blender could in theory support CAD capability , I think it 's current features are lacking in that area ( although it is open source so if you want to add those features go right ahead ) From a commercial perspective I think the 2 main packages are Catia and SolidworksAlso If you want to simulate the environment on a 3D Cad object , the usual way is via FEM or Finite Element AnalysisThis is the sort of thing used to simulate the way temperature travels through an object made of different materials for exampleI think Catia / Solidwords have this sort of thing already inbuilt , in the case of open source software there 's a lot of separate packages to play around with ( elmerfem for example ) I think the linux cae pages have some good tutorials / examples on thishttp : //www.caelinux.org/wiki/index.php/Doc : CAETutorials</tokentext>
<sentencetext>Try CaeLinux http://www.caelinux.com/CMS/ a bootable CD distribution which is basically a collection of different open source Cad appsI'm hoping to make a reprap 3d printer at some point, so I've been looking into writing some ebuild scripts to get some of the stuff from caelinux into gentoolike Salome, elmerfem, brlcadI'm not an expert in CAD mind you but some of the below may be usefulOne of the things I've discovered is that there's a difference between 3D Cad and 3D Modeling softwareModeling is about approximating the appearance of an object for appearance sake only, usually using a mesh / grid of some kind, this is a typical use for BlenderCAD is about what the object is made of, and it's physical dimensions in real space, typically objects are constructed from primitives such as a hollowed out cylinder for exampleModeling = what you can see the outside appearance, CAD = the innards, what it's made of and more of a focus on measurements in real spaceIf your going to design something that's going to be built it's probably better to design it in Cad software firstthen convert it to a modeling form later on for the sake of pretty pictures / animations / appearances in a demonstration etc.This way the original design is stored in a form where there's actual physical measurements (in mm for example)and in a form that can be manufactured (drill holes at these points here and here etc)While Blender could in theory support CAD capability, I think it's current features are lacking in that area(although it is open source so if you want to add those features go right ahead)From a commercial perspective I think the 2 main packages are Catia and SolidworksAlso If you want to simulate the environment on a 3D Cad object, the usual way is via FEM or Finite Element AnalysisThis is the sort of thing used to simulate the way temperature travels through an object made of different materials for exampleI think Catia / Solidwords have this sort of thing already inbuilt, in the case of open source software there's a lot of separate packages to play around with (elmerfem for example)I think the linux cae pages have some good tutorials / examples on thishttp://www.caelinux.org/wiki/index.php/Doc:CAETutorials</sentencetext>
</comment>
<comment>
	<id>http://www.semanticweb.org/ontologies/ConversationInstances.owl#comment10_01_31_2327234.30975584</id>
	<title>Engineers who don't know what tools to use?</title>
	<author>Anonymous</author>
	<datestamp>1264943700000</datestamp>
	<modclass>None</modclass>
	<modscore>0</modscore>
	<htmltext>I'm guessing your project has a dim future.</htmltext>
<tokenext>I 'm guessing your project has a dim future .</tokentext>
<sentencetext>I'm guessing your project has a dim future.</sentencetext>
</comment>
<comment>
	<id>http://www.semanticweb.org/ontologies/ConversationInstances.owl#comment10_01_31_2327234.30977182</id>
	<title>Avocad is pre-alpha and not undated</title>
	<author>physburn</author>
	<datestamp>1264957680000</datestamp>
	<modclass>None</modclass>
	<modscore>1</modscore>
	<htmltext>Avocad is pre-alpha software and hasn't been updated since March 2008.
Hope your moon rocket is more reliable than that.
<p>
---
</p><p>
<a href="http://www.feeddistiller.com/blogs/CAD/feed.html" title="feeddistiller.com">CAD</a> [feeddistiller.com] Feed @ <a href="http://www.feeddistiller.com/" title="feeddistiller.com">Feed Distiller</a> [feeddistiller.com]</p></htmltext>
<tokenext>Avocad is pre-alpha software and has n't been updated since March 2008 .
Hope your moon rocket is more reliable than that .
--- CAD [ feeddistiller.com ] Feed @ Feed Distiller [ feeddistiller.com ]</tokentext>
<sentencetext>Avocad is pre-alpha software and hasn't been updated since March 2008.
Hope your moon rocket is more reliable than that.
---

CAD [feeddistiller.com] Feed @ Feed Distiller [feeddistiller.com]</sentencetext>
</comment>
<comment>
	<id>http://www.semanticweb.org/ontologies/ConversationInstances.owl#comment10_01_31_2327234.30977830</id>
	<title>Re:lol</title>
	<author>Anonymous</author>
	<datestamp>1264964280000</datestamp>
	<modclass>Informativ</modclass>
	<modscore>3</modscore>
	<htmltext><p>Actually, we have a large number more than that. That page is just the team leaders. Stop wining and come help.</p></htmltext>
<tokenext>Actually , we have a large number more than that .
That page is just the team leaders .
Stop wining and come help .</tokentext>
<sentencetext>Actually, we have a large number more than that.
That page is just the team leaders.
Stop wining and come help.</sentencetext>
	<parent>http://www.semanticweb.org/ontologies/ConversationInstances.owl#comment10_01_31_2327234.30975558</parent>
</comment>
<comment>
	<id>http://www.semanticweb.org/ontologies/ConversationInstances.owl#comment10_01_31_2327234.30981730</id>
	<title>Real issue</title>
	<author>EvilBudMan</author>
	<datestamp>1265042160000</datestamp>
	<modclass>None</modclass>
	<modscore>1</modscore>
	<htmltext><p>The is a real issue in the lack of CAD software and accounting software that is capable. Flame me if you will, but it's true. I remember a time when AutoCAD supported or tried to support just about every OS. Then sometime int the 90's or late 80's they decided just to support windows only. Of course their might be some real high end Unix stuff that will work but lacking millions of dollars to know, I just couldn't say.</p><p>Look for yourself, most if not all programs are just not there. No parametrics, well not even up to 1990 yet compared with commercial software.<br><a href="http://sourceforge.net/search/?words=CAD&amp;type\_of\_search=soft&amp;pmode=0&amp;words=CAD&amp;Search=Search" title="sourceforge.net">http://sourceforge.net/search/?words=CAD&amp;type\_of\_search=soft&amp;pmode=0&amp;words=CAD&amp;Search=Search</a> [sourceforge.net]</p></htmltext>
<tokenext>The is a real issue in the lack of CAD software and accounting software that is capable .
Flame me if you will , but it 's true .
I remember a time when AutoCAD supported or tried to support just about every OS .
Then sometime int the 90 's or late 80 's they decided just to support windows only .
Of course their might be some real high end Unix stuff that will work but lacking millions of dollars to know , I just could n't say.Look for yourself , most if not all programs are just not there .
No parametrics , well not even up to 1990 yet compared with commercial software.http : //sourceforge.net/search/ ? words = CAD&amp;type \ _of \ _search = soft&amp;pmode = 0&amp;words = CAD&amp;Search = Search [ sourceforge.net ]</tokentext>
<sentencetext>The is a real issue in the lack of CAD software and accounting software that is capable.
Flame me if you will, but it's true.
I remember a time when AutoCAD supported or tried to support just about every OS.
Then sometime int the 90's or late 80's they decided just to support windows only.
Of course their might be some real high end Unix stuff that will work but lacking millions of dollars to know, I just couldn't say.Look for yourself, most if not all programs are just not there.
No parametrics, well not even up to 1990 yet compared with commercial software.http://sourceforge.net/search/?words=CAD&amp;type\_of\_search=soft&amp;pmode=0&amp;words=CAD&amp;Search=Search [sourceforge.net]</sentencetext>
</comment>
<comment>
	<id>http://www.semanticweb.org/ontologies/ConversationInstances.owl#comment10_01_31_2327234.30977958</id>
	<title>Re:lol</title>
	<author>Anonymous</author>
	<datestamp>1264966320000</datestamp>
	<modclass>None</modclass>
	<modscore>0</modscore>
	<htmltext><p>naah you are welcome to keep wasting your time, but please dont post this crap to<nobr> <wbr></nobr>/. to waste ours</p></htmltext>
<tokenext>naah you are welcome to keep wasting your time , but please dont post this crap to / .
to waste ours</tokentext>
<sentencetext>naah you are welcome to keep wasting your time, but please dont post this crap to /.
to waste ours</sentencetext>
	<parent>http://www.semanticweb.org/ontologies/ConversationInstances.owl#comment10_01_31_2327234.30975558</parent>
</comment>
<comment>
	<id>http://www.semanticweb.org/ontologies/ConversationInstances.owl#comment10_01_31_2327234.30990720</id>
	<title>Re:Business model</title>
	<author>Anonymous</author>
	<datestamp>1265037480000</datestamp>
	<modclass>None</modclass>
	<modscore>0</modscore>
	<htmltext><p>But he said 200 kilos, not 200g. 1kg=1000g (of course), so the end result is 400 billion. Which is well over the quoted estimate of the cost.</p></htmltext>
<tokenext>But he said 200 kilos , not 200g .
1kg = 1000g ( of course ) , so the end result is 400 billion .
Which is well over the quoted estimate of the cost .</tokentext>
<sentencetext>But he said 200 kilos, not 200g.
1kg=1000g (of course), so the end result is 400 billion.
Which is well over the quoted estimate of the cost.</sentencetext>
	<parent>http://www.semanticweb.org/ontologies/ConversationInstances.owl#comment10_01_31_2327234.30976118</parent>
</comment>
<comment>
	<id>http://www.semanticweb.org/ontologies/ConversationInstances.owl#comment10_01_31_2327234.30983524</id>
	<title>Re:The most serious post yet</title>
	<author>VisceralLogic</author>
	<datestamp>1265049240000</datestamp>
	<modclass>None</modclass>
	<modscore>1</modscore>
	<htmltext><p><div class="quote"><p>This will sound funny, but you might want to go check with the amateur rocket guys to see what they're using. RockSIM is the gold standard for 6DOF simulations for rockets traveling up to the edge of space, if you're on a budget, but it's not open source. There is an OSS project very similar to RockSIM - I think it's called RASaero.</p></div><p>Check out POST II, NASA's Program to Optimize Simulated Trajectories.  It's in pretty wide use, and should be free from NASA for US persons.</p></div>
	</htmltext>
<tokenext>This will sound funny , but you might want to go check with the amateur rocket guys to see what they 're using .
RockSIM is the gold standard for 6DOF simulations for rockets traveling up to the edge of space , if you 're on a budget , but it 's not open source .
There is an OSS project very similar to RockSIM - I think it 's called RASaero.Check out POST II , NASA 's Program to Optimize Simulated Trajectories .
It 's in pretty wide use , and should be free from NASA for US persons .</tokentext>
<sentencetext>This will sound funny, but you might want to go check with the amateur rocket guys to see what they're using.
RockSIM is the gold standard for 6DOF simulations for rockets traveling up to the edge of space, if you're on a budget, but it's not open source.
There is an OSS project very similar to RockSIM - I think it's called RASaero.Check out POST II, NASA's Program to Optimize Simulated Trajectories.
It's in pretty wide use, and should be free from NASA for US persons.
	</sentencetext>
	<parent>http://www.semanticweb.org/ontologies/ConversationInstances.owl#comment10_01_31_2327234.30975972</parent>
</comment>
<comment>
	<id>http://www.semanticweb.org/ontologies/ConversationInstances.owl#comment10_01_31_2327234.30975458</id>
	<title>BRL-CAD</title>
	<author>RedLeg</author>
	<datestamp>1264943040000</datestamp>
	<modclass>Informativ</modclass>
	<modscore>3</modscore>
	<htmltext><p>A Couple of others have already mentioned it, but take a look at <a href="http://www.brlcad.org/" title="brlcad.org">BRL-CAD.</a> [brlcad.org]</p><p>It's pretty much the standard.  It originated as a US Government backed project and was later open sourced. This is a VERY mature piece of software, unfortunately with a steep learning curve.</p><p>Red</p></htmltext>
<tokenext>A Couple of others have already mentioned it , but take a look at BRL-CAD .
[ brlcad.org ] It 's pretty much the standard .
It originated as a US Government backed project and was later open sourced .
This is a VERY mature piece of software , unfortunately with a steep learning curve.Red</tokentext>
<sentencetext>A Couple of others have already mentioned it, but take a look at BRL-CAD.
[brlcad.org]It's pretty much the standard.
It originated as a US Government backed project and was later open sourced.
This is a VERY mature piece of software, unfortunately with a steep learning curve.Red</sentencetext>
</comment>
<comment>
	<id>http://www.semanticweb.org/ontologies/ConversationInstances.owl#comment10_01_31_2327234.30976508</id>
	<title>Re:You've raised $130 out of $7500</title>
	<author>budgenator</author>
	<datestamp>1264950300000</datestamp>
	<modclass>Interestin</modclass>
	<modscore>3</modscore>
	<htmltext><p>"This female surgeon can't even cook bacon and eggs, what makes the bitch think she can take out my kidney?"<br>Kind of like an engineer that can't even use blender! seriously I've used blender and even liked it. but the UI is an art in itself, the learning curve is very steep and the skills learned fall off rapidly if you don't use it regularly.</p></htmltext>
<tokenext>" This female surgeon ca n't even cook bacon and eggs , what makes the bitch think she can take out my kidney ?
" Kind of like an engineer that ca n't even use blender !
seriously I 've used blender and even liked it .
but the UI is an art in itself , the learning curve is very steep and the skills learned fall off rapidly if you do n't use it regularly .</tokentext>
<sentencetext>"This female surgeon can't even cook bacon and eggs, what makes the bitch think she can take out my kidney?
"Kind of like an engineer that can't even use blender!
seriously I've used blender and even liked it.
but the UI is an art in itself, the learning curve is very steep and the skills learned fall off rapidly if you don't use it regularly.</sentencetext>
	<parent>http://www.semanticweb.org/ontologies/ConversationInstances.owl#comment10_01_31_2327234.30975886</parent>
</comment>
<comment>
	<id>http://www.semanticweb.org/ontologies/ConversationInstances.owl#comment10_01_31_2327234.30989162</id>
	<title>Well, to Answer the Question.</title>
	<author>LifesABeach</author>
	<datestamp>1265027700000</datestamp>
	<modclass>None</modclass>
	<modscore>1</modscore>
	<htmltext>Given the funding for this fine, and noble project.  Maybe suggesting to the Engineers that they, "Do what it takes, and just suck it up."  Or get ready to spend about $200,000 in a MCAD package, and some more money on PLC machine.  About $1,000,000.00 will get them what they need, or they can read books on how to make machines that make parts for machines; then assemble the parts.  I know its sounds like tough love, but this should have been evaluated at the beginning of the project, not at some midpoint, or Mile Stone point.  I wish your project luck, and "God Speed..."</htmltext>
<tokenext>Given the funding for this fine , and noble project .
Maybe suggesting to the Engineers that they , " Do what it takes , and just suck it up .
" Or get ready to spend about $ 200,000 in a MCAD package , and some more money on PLC machine .
About $ 1,000,000.00 will get them what they need , or they can read books on how to make machines that make parts for machines ; then assemble the parts .
I know its sounds like tough love , but this should have been evaluated at the beginning of the project , not at some midpoint , or Mile Stone point .
I wish your project luck , and " God Speed... "</tokentext>
<sentencetext>Given the funding for this fine, and noble project.
Maybe suggesting to the Engineers that they, "Do what it takes, and just suck it up.
"  Or get ready to spend about $200,000 in a MCAD package, and some more money on PLC machine.
About $1,000,000.00 will get them what they need, or they can read books on how to make machines that make parts for machines; then assemble the parts.
I know its sounds like tough love, but this should have been evaluated at the beginning of the project, not at some midpoint, or Mile Stone point.
I wish your project luck, and "God Speed..."</sentencetext>
</comment>
<comment>
	<id>http://www.semanticweb.org/ontologies/ConversationInstances.owl#comment10_01_31_2327234.30979620</id>
	<title>Re:art people</title>
	<author>imakemusic</author>
	<datestamp>1265031360000</datestamp>
	<modclass>None</modclass>
	<modscore>1</modscore>
	<htmltext><p>Because you haven't considered the fact that you'll need money to get there. And people with money can be swayed by sufficiently shiny artwork.</p></htmltext>
<tokenext>Because you have n't considered the fact that you 'll need money to get there .
And people with money can be swayed by sufficiently shiny artwork .</tokentext>
<sentencetext>Because you haven't considered the fact that you'll need money to get there.
And people with money can be swayed by sufficiently shiny artwork.</sentencetext>
	<parent>http://www.semanticweb.org/ontologies/ConversationInstances.owl#comment10_01_31_2327234.30975312</parent>
</comment>
<comment>
	<id>http://www.semanticweb.org/ontologies/ConversationInstances.owl#comment10_01_31_2327234.30979460</id>
	<title>Re:Is that so...</title>
	<author>Anonymous</author>
	<datestamp>1265029680000</datestamp>
	<modclass>None</modclass>
	<modscore>0</modscore>
	<htmltext><p>Then again, there are opening additional funding options by making sure the crew is appropriately diverse, depending of the sexual orientations of the involved.</p></htmltext>
<tokenext>Then again , there are opening additional funding options by making sure the crew is appropriately diverse , depending of the sexual orientations of the involved .</tokentext>
<sentencetext>Then again, there are opening additional funding options by making sure the crew is appropriately diverse, depending of the sexual orientations of the involved.</sentencetext>
	<parent>http://www.semanticweb.org/ontologies/ConversationInstances.owl#comment10_01_31_2327234.30975302</parent>
</comment>
<comment>
	<id>http://www.semanticweb.org/ontologies/ConversationInstances.owl#comment10_01_31_2327234.30976830</id>
	<title>Re:You've raised $130 out of $7500</title>
	<author>rickb928</author>
	<datestamp>1264954080000</datestamp>
	<modclass>None</modclass>
	<modscore>1</modscore>
	<htmltext><p>I don't need mhy surgeon strassing over breakfast.  She can BUY breakfast.</p><p>And these hotshot spacefarers can BUY a functional website.</p><p>If you're serious, you'll do things right.  My surgeon will have proper equipment, competent staff, and access to adequate facilities.  These hotshots either take their website seriously, or they don't, or this is what a serious spacefarer thinks is a serious website.</p><p>Judge them by their appearances?  I choose my surgeon on both recommendation, reputation, and presentation.  Not many private space ventures have recommendations, and reputation is similarly somewhat fragile.</p></htmltext>
<tokenext>I do n't need mhy surgeon strassing over breakfast .
She can BUY breakfast.And these hotshot spacefarers can BUY a functional website.If you 're serious , you 'll do things right .
My surgeon will have proper equipment , competent staff , and access to adequate facilities .
These hotshots either take their website seriously , or they do n't , or this is what a serious spacefarer thinks is a serious website.Judge them by their appearances ?
I choose my surgeon on both recommendation , reputation , and presentation .
Not many private space ventures have recommendations , and reputation is similarly somewhat fragile .</tokentext>
<sentencetext>I don't need mhy surgeon strassing over breakfast.
She can BUY breakfast.And these hotshot spacefarers can BUY a functional website.If you're serious, you'll do things right.
My surgeon will have proper equipment, competent staff, and access to adequate facilities.
These hotshots either take their website seriously, or they don't, or this is what a serious spacefarer thinks is a serious website.Judge them by their appearances?
I choose my surgeon on both recommendation, reputation, and presentation.
Not many private space ventures have recommendations, and reputation is similarly somewhat fragile.</sentencetext>
	<parent>http://www.semanticweb.org/ontologies/ConversationInstances.owl#comment10_01_31_2327234.30975886</parent>
</comment>
<comment>
	<id>http://www.semanticweb.org/ontologies/ConversationInstances.owl#comment10_01_31_2327234.30975546</id>
	<title>Find A Mirror!</title>
	<author>ddillman</author>
	<datestamp>1264943520000</datestamp>
	<modclass>None</modclass>
	<modscore>1</modscore>
	<htmltext>Slashdotted already...</htmltext>
<tokenext>Slashdotted already.. .</tokentext>
<sentencetext>Slashdotted already...</sentencetext>
</comment>
<comment>
	<id>http://www.semanticweb.org/ontologies/ConversationInstances.owl#comment10_01_31_2327234.30978332</id>
	<title>Re:You've raised $130 out of $7500</title>
	<author>damburger</author>
	<datestamp>1265014800000</datestamp>
	<modclass>None</modclass>
	<modscore>1</modscore>
	<htmltext>These guys do not have 'real hardware' - they have some photos of metal tubes. This hardly constitutes a rocket program.</htmltext>
<tokenext>These guys do not have 'real hardware ' - they have some photos of metal tubes .
This hardly constitutes a rocket program .</tokentext>
<sentencetext>These guys do not have 'real hardware' - they have some photos of metal tubes.
This hardly constitutes a rocket program.</sentencetext>
	<parent>http://www.semanticweb.org/ontologies/ConversationInstances.owl#comment10_01_31_2327234.30975480</parent>
</comment>
<comment>
	<id>http://www.semanticweb.org/ontologies/ConversationInstances.owl#comment10_01_31_2327234.30976012</id>
	<title>Re:You've raised $130 out of $7500</title>
	<author>Anonymous</author>
	<datestamp>1264946520000</datestamp>
	<modclass>Interestin</modclass>
	<modscore>5</modscore>
	<htmltext><p>Actually, there is very little evidence that Interorbital has produced any real hardware in the past few years.  Plenty of models and drawings, but no actual hardware (let alone flight tests).</p><p>(Posted AC because I'm in the industry, and Interorbital has made themselves a pain in the past for people who say this sort of thing about them.  But don't take my AC word for it: go try to find evidence they've built or flown something.  If they have, there should be plenty of info, right?)</p><p>If you want real web sites, check out people like <a href="http://www.armadilloaerospace.com/n.x/Armadillo/Home" title="armadilloaerospace.com" rel="nofollow">Armadillo</a> [armadilloaerospace.com], <a href="http://www.xcor.com/" title="xcor.com" rel="nofollow">XCOR</a> [xcor.com], <a href="http://masten-space.com/" title="masten-space.com" rel="nofollow">Masten</a> [masten-space.com], or <a href="http://unreasonablerocket.blogspot.com/" title="blogspot.com" rel="nofollow">Unreasonable</a> [blogspot.com], for example.</p></htmltext>
<tokenext>Actually , there is very little evidence that Interorbital has produced any real hardware in the past few years .
Plenty of models and drawings , but no actual hardware ( let alone flight tests ) .
( Posted AC because I 'm in the industry , and Interorbital has made themselves a pain in the past for people who say this sort of thing about them .
But do n't take my AC word for it : go try to find evidence they 've built or flown something .
If they have , there should be plenty of info , right ?
) If you want real web sites , check out people like Armadillo [ armadilloaerospace.com ] , XCOR [ xcor.com ] , Masten [ masten-space.com ] , or Unreasonable [ blogspot.com ] , for example .</tokentext>
<sentencetext>Actually, there is very little evidence that Interorbital has produced any real hardware in the past few years.
Plenty of models and drawings, but no actual hardware (let alone flight tests).
(Posted AC because I'm in the industry, and Interorbital has made themselves a pain in the past for people who say this sort of thing about them.
But don't take my AC word for it: go try to find evidence they've built or flown something.
If they have, there should be plenty of info, right?
)If you want real web sites, check out people like Armadillo [armadilloaerospace.com], XCOR [xcor.com], Masten [masten-space.com], or Unreasonable [blogspot.com], for example.</sentencetext>
	<parent>http://www.semanticweb.org/ontologies/ConversationInstances.owl#comment10_01_31_2327234.30975480</parent>
</comment>
<comment>
	<id>http://www.semanticweb.org/ontologies/ConversationInstances.owl#comment10_01_31_2327234.30975408</id>
	<title>It could be how you're using it.</title>
	<author>Anonymous</author>
	<datestamp>1264942740000</datestamp>
	<modclass>None</modclass>
	<modscore>0</modscore>
	<htmltext><p><div class="quote"><p>Many of the engineers have tried working with Blender...</p> </div><p>Is it plugged in?</p><p>BTW, what kind of drinks are you making that'll send one to the Moon? It sounds like it has Tequila or at last vodka.</p></div>
	</htmltext>
<tokenext>Many of the engineers have tried working with Blender... Is it plugged in ? BTW , what kind of drinks are you making that 'll send one to the Moon ?
It sounds like it has Tequila or at last vodka .</tokentext>
<sentencetext>Many of the engineers have tried working with Blender... Is it plugged in?BTW, what kind of drinks are you making that'll send one to the Moon?
It sounds like it has Tequila or at last vodka.
	</sentencetext>
</comment>
<comment>
	<id>http://www.semanticweb.org/ontologies/ConversationInstances.owl#comment10_01_31_2327234.30978026</id>
	<title>Re:G'luck with that</title>
	<author>Knacklappen</author>
	<datestamp>1264967100000</datestamp>
	<modclass>None</modclass>
	<modscore>1</modscore>
	<htmltext>Same discussion and same misguided focus as in the OScar project: <a href="http://www.theoscarproject.org/" title="theoscarproject.org">http://www.theoscarproject.org/</a> [theoscarproject.org]
<br> <br>
The OpenLuna project will produce the same results. None.</htmltext>
<tokenext>Same discussion and same misguided focus as in the OScar project : http : //www.theoscarproject.org/ [ theoscarproject.org ] The OpenLuna project will produce the same results .
None .</tokentext>
<sentencetext>Same discussion and same misguided focus as in the OScar project: http://www.theoscarproject.org/ [theoscarproject.org]
 
The OpenLuna project will produce the same results.
None.</sentencetext>
	<parent>http://www.semanticweb.org/ontologies/ConversationInstances.owl#comment10_01_31_2327234.30976558</parent>
</comment>
<comment>
	<id>http://www.semanticweb.org/ontologies/ConversationInstances.owl#comment10_01_31_2327234.30976266</id>
	<title>Re:Several problems</title>
	<author>Anonymous</author>
	<datestamp>1264948440000</datestamp>
	<modclass>None</modclass>
	<modscore>0</modscore>
	<htmltext><p>You have to have sci-fi looking stuff to convince 90 year old billionaires to part with the money - and it has to look like you're serious. How do you think the CSA and NASA got started?</p></htmltext>
<tokenext>You have to have sci-fi looking stuff to convince 90 year old billionaires to part with the money - and it has to look like you 're serious .
How do you think the CSA and NASA got started ?</tokentext>
<sentencetext>You have to have sci-fi looking stuff to convince 90 year old billionaires to part with the money - and it has to look like you're serious.
How do you think the CSA and NASA got started?</sentencetext>
	<parent>http://www.semanticweb.org/ontologies/ConversationInstances.owl#comment10_01_31_2327234.30975688</parent>
</comment>
<comment>
	<id>http://www.semanticweb.org/ontologies/ConversationInstances.owl#comment10_01_31_2327234.30979152</id>
	<title>Re:You've raised $130 out of $7500</title>
	<author>hh4m</author>
	<datestamp>1265025960000</datestamp>
	<modclass>Insightful</modclass>
	<modscore>5</modscore>
	<htmltext>The bizarre occurrence relates to an old saying, which in the<nobr> <wbr></nobr>/. context reads something like: <br>
<br>
"Those who post seldom read, those who read seldom post."</htmltext>
<tokenext>The bizarre occurrence relates to an old saying , which in the / .
context reads something like : " Those who post seldom read , those who read seldom post .
"</tokentext>
<sentencetext>The bizarre occurrence relates to an old saying, which in the /.
context reads something like: 

"Those who post seldom read, those who read seldom post.
"</sentencetext>
	<parent>http://www.semanticweb.org/ontologies/ConversationInstances.owl#comment10_01_31_2327234.30977472</parent>
</comment>
<comment>
	<id>http://www.semanticweb.org/ontologies/ConversationInstances.owl#comment10_01_31_2327234.30975556</id>
	<title>Got your priorities straight I see.</title>
	<author>sunking2</author>
	<datestamp>1264943520000</datestamp>
	<modclass>None</modclass>
	<modscore>1</modscore>
	<htmltext>They key to every massive engineering effort is making sure you can do your model fly throughs form your cad drawings. You'd be sunk without them.</htmltext>
<tokenext>They key to every massive engineering effort is making sure you can do your model fly throughs form your cad drawings .
You 'd be sunk without them .</tokentext>
<sentencetext>They key to every massive engineering effort is making sure you can do your model fly throughs form your cad drawings.
You'd be sunk without them.</sentencetext>
</comment>
<comment>
	<id>http://www.semanticweb.org/ontologies/ConversationInstances.owl#comment10_01_31_2327234.30986790</id>
	<title>Re:Huh? Blender?</title>
	<author>CompMD</author>
	<datestamp>1265018280000</datestamp>
	<modclass>None</modclass>
	<modscore>1</modscore>
	<htmltext><p>I've done aerospace engineering for one of the premier aerospace design houses in the US, and anything going to production was done in Unigraphics/NX.  At Cessna, everything was done in CATIA.  Either of those programs are what you need.  As easy to use and handy as SolidWorks is, I think it is better suited for widgets and small assemblies, not  something as complex as an aircraft or space vehicle.  You're likely to blow yourselves up with anything less than UG or CATIA.  If you care about pretty pictures, both UG and CATIA have rendering packages.</p><p>Use the right tool for the job, even though in this case the right tool is going to be about $100,000 for a single perpetual floating license.</p></htmltext>
<tokenext>I 've done aerospace engineering for one of the premier aerospace design houses in the US , and anything going to production was done in Unigraphics/NX .
At Cessna , everything was done in CATIA .
Either of those programs are what you need .
As easy to use and handy as SolidWorks is , I think it is better suited for widgets and small assemblies , not something as complex as an aircraft or space vehicle .
You 're likely to blow yourselves up with anything less than UG or CATIA .
If you care about pretty pictures , both UG and CATIA have rendering packages.Use the right tool for the job , even though in this case the right tool is going to be about $ 100,000 for a single perpetual floating license .</tokentext>
<sentencetext>I've done aerospace engineering for one of the premier aerospace design houses in the US, and anything going to production was done in Unigraphics/NX.
At Cessna, everything was done in CATIA.
Either of those programs are what you need.
As easy to use and handy as SolidWorks is, I think it is better suited for widgets and small assemblies, not  something as complex as an aircraft or space vehicle.
You're likely to blow yourselves up with anything less than UG or CATIA.
If you care about pretty pictures, both UG and CATIA have rendering packages.Use the right tool for the job, even though in this case the right tool is going to be about $100,000 for a single perpetual floating license.</sentencetext>
	<parent>http://www.semanticweb.org/ontologies/ConversationInstances.owl#comment10_01_31_2327234.30975398</parent>
</comment>
<comment>
	<id>http://www.semanticweb.org/ontologies/ConversationInstances.owl#comment10_01_31_2327234.30979230</id>
	<title>Um...</title>
	<author>Anonymous</author>
	<datestamp>1265026800000</datestamp>
	<modclass>None</modclass>
	<modscore>0</modscore>
	<htmltext><p>It's the 1st of February not the 1st of April!</p><p>This project is a joke.</p></htmltext>
<tokenext>It 's the 1st of February not the 1st of April ! This project is a joke .</tokentext>
<sentencetext>It's the 1st of February not the 1st of April!This project is a joke.</sentencetext>
</comment>
<comment>
	<id>http://www.semanticweb.org/ontologies/ConversationInstances.owl#comment10_01_31_2327234.30975316</id>
	<title>BRL-CAD</title>
	<author>yahooy2uy</author>
	<datestamp>1264942200000</datestamp>
	<modclass>Insightful</modclass>
	<modscore>5</modscore>
	<htmltext>Sure, it looks like he's plugging his website, but is it really necessary to point that out?  I think we all can read.  Maybe instead of boosting your own ego by putting him down, you could actually do something constructive in the minute it took you to reply to his post.

In terms of free CAD software, BRL-CAD is probably the closest to what you're looking for, but I've always found it tiresome to use.  It was developed by the Army for their computer modeling needs in the late 70s.  It's still a fairly active project as well.</htmltext>
<tokenext>Sure , it looks like he 's plugging his website , but is it really necessary to point that out ?
I think we all can read .
Maybe instead of boosting your own ego by putting him down , you could actually do something constructive in the minute it took you to reply to his post .
In terms of free CAD software , BRL-CAD is probably the closest to what you 're looking for , but I 've always found it tiresome to use .
It was developed by the Army for their computer modeling needs in the late 70s .
It 's still a fairly active project as well .</tokentext>
<sentencetext>Sure, it looks like he's plugging his website, but is it really necessary to point that out?
I think we all can read.
Maybe instead of boosting your own ego by putting him down, you could actually do something constructive in the minute it took you to reply to his post.
In terms of free CAD software, BRL-CAD is probably the closest to what you're looking for, but I've always found it tiresome to use.
It was developed by the Army for their computer modeling needs in the late 70s.
It's still a fairly active project as well.</sentencetext>
</comment>
<comment>
	<id>http://www.semanticweb.org/ontologies/ConversationInstances.owl#comment10_01_31_2327234.30976526</id>
	<title>Re:Several problems</title>
	<author>Anonymous</author>
	<datestamp>1264950480000</datestamp>
	<modclass>None</modclass>
	<modscore>0</modscore>
	<htmltext><p>If you have to ask about CAD systems and you're using blender you probably have never met an engineer.  You should find one!</p></htmltext>
<tokenext>If you have to ask about CAD systems and you 're using blender you probably have never met an engineer .
You should find one !</tokentext>
<sentencetext>If you have to ask about CAD systems and you're using blender you probably have never met an engineer.
You should find one!</sentencetext>
	<parent>http://www.semanticweb.org/ontologies/ConversationInstances.owl#comment10_01_31_2327234.30975688</parent>
</comment>
<comment>
	<id>http://www.semanticweb.org/ontologies/ConversationInstances.owl#comment10_01_31_2327234.30978160</id>
	<title>Re:You've raised $130 out of $7500</title>
	<author>fractoid</author>
	<datestamp>1265055540000</datestamp>
	<modclass>None</modclass>
	<modscore>1</modscore>
	<htmltext><p><div class="quote"><p>"This female surgeon can't even cook bacon and eggs, what makes the bitch think she can take out my kidney?</p></div><p>Sounds like she could quite easily do so while trying to make you a ham sammitch. Give her points for trying though!<nobr> <wbr></nobr>:)</p></div>
	</htmltext>
<tokenext>" This female surgeon ca n't even cook bacon and eggs , what makes the bitch think she can take out my kidney ? Sounds like she could quite easily do so while trying to make you a ham sammitch .
Give her points for trying though !
: )</tokentext>
<sentencetext>"This female surgeon can't even cook bacon and eggs, what makes the bitch think she can take out my kidney?Sounds like she could quite easily do so while trying to make you a ham sammitch.
Give her points for trying though!
:)
	</sentencetext>
	<parent>http://www.semanticweb.org/ontologies/ConversationInstances.owl#comment10_01_31_2327234.30975886</parent>
</comment>
<comment>
	<id>http://www.semanticweb.org/ontologies/ConversationInstances.owl#comment10_01_31_2327234.30976352</id>
	<title>Re:art people</title>
	<author>Scrameustache</author>
	<datestamp>1264949040000</datestamp>
	<modclass>None</modclass>
	<modscore>1</modscore>
	<htmltext><p><div class="quote"><p>Why does it seem to me that if I were planning a trip to the moon, I wouldn't really have 'art people'?</p></div><p>Why don't you ask <a href="http://history.msfc.nasa.gov/vonbraun/disney\_article.html" title="nasa.gov">Mr. Von Braun and Mr. Disney</a> [nasa.gov]?</p></div>
	</htmltext>
<tokenext>Why does it seem to me that if I were planning a trip to the moon , I would n't really have 'art people ' ? Why do n't you ask Mr. Von Braun and Mr. Disney [ nasa.gov ] ?</tokentext>
<sentencetext>Why does it seem to me that if I were planning a trip to the moon, I wouldn't really have 'art people'?Why don't you ask Mr. Von Braun and Mr. Disney [nasa.gov]?
	</sentencetext>
	<parent>http://www.semanticweb.org/ontologies/ConversationInstances.owl#comment10_01_31_2327234.30975312</parent>
</comment>
<comment>
	<id>http://www.semanticweb.org/ontologies/ConversationInstances.owl#comment10_01_31_2327234.30977434</id>
	<title>Use the best tools, regardless of license</title>
	<author>harlows\_monkeys</author>
	<datestamp>1264960080000</datestamp>
	<modclass>Informativ</modclass>
	<modscore>3</modscore>
	<htmltext><p>If I were riding a spacecraft to the moon (or riding any vehicle that could easily kill me), I'd want it designed with the <b>best</b> tools for getting the job done. If that's a closed source tool, buy the closed source tool.</p></htmltext>
<tokenext>If I were riding a spacecraft to the moon ( or riding any vehicle that could easily kill me ) , I 'd want it designed with the best tools for getting the job done .
If that 's a closed source tool , buy the closed source tool .</tokentext>
<sentencetext>If I were riding a spacecraft to the moon (or riding any vehicle that could easily kill me), I'd want it designed with the best tools for getting the job done.
If that's a closed source tool, buy the closed source tool.</sentencetext>
</comment>
<comment>
	<id>http://www.semanticweb.org/ontologies/ConversationInstances.owl#comment10_01_31_2327234.30975562</id>
	<title>Re:Is that so...</title>
	<author>Blakey Rat</author>
	<datestamp>1264943580000</datestamp>
	<modclass>None</modclass>
	<modscore>1</modscore>
	<htmltext><p>Hey! Hope springs eternal!!</p><p>With any luck, they won't get close enough to a working rocket to actually kill anybody, though-- I think that's about the best you can hope for. Then it would turn tragic. (Right now it's just hilarious. To me, at least.)</p></htmltext>
<tokenext>Hey !
Hope springs eternal !
! With any luck , they wo n't get close enough to a working rocket to actually kill anybody , though-- I think that 's about the best you can hope for .
Then it would turn tragic .
( Right now it 's just hilarious .
To me , at least .
)</tokentext>
<sentencetext>Hey!
Hope springs eternal!
!With any luck, they won't get close enough to a working rocket to actually kill anybody, though-- I think that's about the best you can hope for.
Then it would turn tragic.
(Right now it's just hilarious.
To me, at least.
)</sentencetext>
	<parent>http://www.semanticweb.org/ontologies/ConversationInstances.owl#comment10_01_31_2327234.30975302</parent>
</comment>
<comment>
	<id>http://www.semanticweb.org/ontologies/ConversationInstances.owl#comment10_01_31_2327234.31027744</id>
	<title>Re:You've raised $130 out of $7500</title>
	<author>sourcerror</author>
	<datestamp>1265281800000</datestamp>
	<modclass>None</modclass>
	<modscore>1</modscore>
	<htmltext><p>It seems I gave you my karma. But at least you're not modded Insightful.</p></htmltext>
<tokenext>It seems I gave you my karma .
But at least you 're not modded Insightful .</tokentext>
<sentencetext>It seems I gave you my karma.
But at least you're not modded Insightful.</sentencetext>
	<parent>http://www.semanticweb.org/ontologies/ConversationInstances.owl#comment10_01_31_2327234.30977472</parent>
</comment>
<comment>
	<id>http://www.semanticweb.org/ontologies/ConversationInstances.owl#comment10_01_31_2327234.30987600</id>
	<title>What about Bezier surfaces design ?</title>
	<author>Anonymous</author>
	<datestamp>1265021220000</datestamp>
	<modclass>None</modclass>
	<modscore>0</modscore>
	<htmltext><p>Hi,<br>As said many times during this thread, you won't find any FOSS software that matches your (huge) requirements. I've been working on ProE, CATIA V4 &amp; V5, SolidWorks, and to be honest, they provide a lot of integrated and proprietary functions that makes the price at the end. You can do some stress simu with FOSS, given the fact you have a meshed model, you can design a few parts with some free softs, but you cannot design a full project with all aspects (assembly, blue prints, stress &amp; vibe analysis, kinetics, tubing and so on...) in only one package. CATIA V5 for example, which is a merely mature project now, is based on many years of coding and integration of customers will (automotive, aerospace, electronic mainly). I do not say it is perfect, but only a few will give you such tools.<br>But I must admit that your question made me think about something, let me explain. I'm working now as a Class A surface modeler for a french automotive brand, which is somewhat between CAD and Blender (or 3DS, or Maya) modeling. I only design complex surfaces (for visible parts of a car), but with the precision of CAD software. The magic key for that are Bezier patches and curves. The difference between you and me is that I do not need anything that moving control points on each surface, connecting them, and facing some of them (besides the fact that I must be able to import CAD surfaces from engineers, such as the engine or the structure, to be able to work - via<nobr> <wbr></nobr>.model,<nobr> <wbr></nobr>.CATpart,<nobr> <wbr></nobr>.iges etc...). That's all ! The software used are mainly ICEM Surf and Alias StudioTools, and apart from some important modules (viz, rendering, cuttings(?), curvature or joint analysis etc..) there are only a few basic functions. I think that these are the main target for an interesting FOSS project, because using some other FOSS libraries, one, with enough skills, could set up the base quickly I think.<br>As anyone heard of such a project ? Or anyone interested in building something like this ? I can help with my modeler experience if needed, but sadly, I'm not a coder... Oh, don't forget that these softwares are sold an arm and a leg, maybe it can help<nobr> <wbr></nobr>;)</p><p>Nico</p><p>PS : check Bezier on wikipedia, there must be an article<br>PS2 : sorry for my asshole english, I'm a fucking froggy !</p></htmltext>
<tokenext>Hi,As said many times during this thread , you wo n't find any FOSS software that matches your ( huge ) requirements .
I 've been working on ProE , CATIA V4 &amp; V5 , SolidWorks , and to be honest , they provide a lot of integrated and proprietary functions that makes the price at the end .
You can do some stress simu with FOSS , given the fact you have a meshed model , you can design a few parts with some free softs , but you can not design a full project with all aspects ( assembly , blue prints , stress &amp; vibe analysis , kinetics , tubing and so on... ) in only one package .
CATIA V5 for example , which is a merely mature project now , is based on many years of coding and integration of customers will ( automotive , aerospace , electronic mainly ) .
I do not say it is perfect , but only a few will give you such tools.But I must admit that your question made me think about something , let me explain .
I 'm working now as a Class A surface modeler for a french automotive brand , which is somewhat between CAD and Blender ( or 3DS , or Maya ) modeling .
I only design complex surfaces ( for visible parts of a car ) , but with the precision of CAD software .
The magic key for that are Bezier patches and curves .
The difference between you and me is that I do not need anything that moving control points on each surface , connecting them , and facing some of them ( besides the fact that I must be able to import CAD surfaces from engineers , such as the engine or the structure , to be able to work - via .model , .CATpart , .iges etc... ) .
That 's all !
The software used are mainly ICEM Surf and Alias StudioTools , and apart from some important modules ( viz , rendering , cuttings ( ?
) , curvature or joint analysis etc.. ) there are only a few basic functions .
I think that these are the main target for an interesting FOSS project , because using some other FOSS libraries , one , with enough skills , could set up the base quickly I think.As anyone heard of such a project ?
Or anyone interested in building something like this ?
I can help with my modeler experience if needed , but sadly , I 'm not a coder... Oh , do n't forget that these softwares are sold an arm and a leg , maybe it can help ; ) NicoPS : check Bezier on wikipedia , there must be an articlePS2 : sorry for my asshole english , I 'm a fucking froggy !</tokentext>
<sentencetext>Hi,As said many times during this thread, you won't find any FOSS software that matches your (huge) requirements.
I've been working on ProE, CATIA V4 &amp; V5, SolidWorks, and to be honest, they provide a lot of integrated and proprietary functions that makes the price at the end.
You can do some stress simu with FOSS, given the fact you have a meshed model, you can design a few parts with some free softs, but you cannot design a full project with all aspects (assembly, blue prints, stress &amp; vibe analysis, kinetics, tubing and so on...) in only one package.
CATIA V5 for example, which is a merely mature project now, is based on many years of coding and integration of customers will (automotive, aerospace, electronic mainly).
I do not say it is perfect, but only a few will give you such tools.But I must admit that your question made me think about something, let me explain.
I'm working now as a Class A surface modeler for a french automotive brand, which is somewhat between CAD and Blender (or 3DS, or Maya) modeling.
I only design complex surfaces (for visible parts of a car), but with the precision of CAD software.
The magic key for that are Bezier patches and curves.
The difference between you and me is that I do not need anything that moving control points on each surface, connecting them, and facing some of them (besides the fact that I must be able to import CAD surfaces from engineers, such as the engine or the structure, to be able to work - via .model, .CATpart, .iges etc...).
That's all !
The software used are mainly ICEM Surf and Alias StudioTools, and apart from some important modules (viz, rendering, cuttings(?
), curvature or joint analysis etc..) there are only a few basic functions.
I think that these are the main target for an interesting FOSS project, because using some other FOSS libraries, one, with enough skills, could set up the base quickly I think.As anyone heard of such a project ?
Or anyone interested in building something like this ?
I can help with my modeler experience if needed, but sadly, I'm not a coder... Oh, don't forget that these softwares are sold an arm and a leg, maybe it can help ;)NicoPS : check Bezier on wikipedia, there must be an articlePS2 : sorry for my asshole english, I'm a fucking froggy !</sentencetext>
</comment>
<comment>
	<id>http://www.semanticweb.org/ontologies/ConversationInstances.owl#comment10_01_31_2327234.30975894</id>
	<title>HEY GUYS</title>
	<author>Anonymous</author>
	<datestamp>1264945860000</datestamp>
	<modclass>Funny</modclass>
	<modscore>1</modscore>
	<htmltext><p>I want to turn my used Toyota into a rocketship to get to the moon. Serious, no joke. However I'm having a hard time trying to program everything in QBasic, it seems the MSDOS console I shoved into the dashboard keeps crashing and my brakes don't work. Can you recommend an open source solution instead?</p></htmltext>
<tokenext>I want to turn my used Toyota into a rocketship to get to the moon .
Serious , no joke .
However I 'm having a hard time trying to program everything in QBasic , it seems the MSDOS console I shoved into the dashboard keeps crashing and my brakes do n't work .
Can you recommend an open source solution instead ?</tokentext>
<sentencetext>I want to turn my used Toyota into a rocketship to get to the moon.
Serious, no joke.
However I'm having a hard time trying to program everything in QBasic, it seems the MSDOS console I shoved into the dashboard keeps crashing and my brakes don't work.
Can you recommend an open source solution instead?</sentencetext>
</comment>
<comment>
	<id>http://www.semanticweb.org/ontologies/ConversationInstances.owl#comment10_01_31_2327234.30976054</id>
	<title>Your official guide to the Jigaboo presidency</title>
	<author>Anonymous</author>
	<datestamp>1264946820000</datestamp>
	<modclass>Offtopic</modclass>
	<modscore>-1</modscore>
	<htmltext><p>Congratulations on your purchase of a brand new nigger! If handled properly, your apeman will give years of valuable, if reluctant, service.</p><p>INSTALLING YOUR NIGGER.<br>You should install your nigger differently according to whether you have purchased the field or house model. Field niggers work best in a serial configuration, i.e. chained together. Chain your nigger to another nigger immediately after unpacking it, and don't even think about taking that chain off, ever. Many niggers start singing as soon as you put a chain on them. This habit can usually be thrashed out of them if nipped in the bud. House niggers work best as standalone units, but should be hobbled or hamstrung to prevent attempts at escape. At this stage, your nigger can also be given a name. Most owners use the same names over and over, since niggers become confused by too much data. Rufus, Rastus, Remus, Toby, Carslisle, Carlton, Hey-You!-Yes-you!, Yeller, Blackstar, and Sambo are all effective names for your new buck nigger. If your nigger is a ho, it should be called Latrelle, L'Tanya, or Jemima. Some owners call their nigger hoes Latrine for a joke. Pearl, Blossom, and Ivory are also righteous names for nigger hoes. These names go straight over your nigger's head, by the way.</p><p>CONFIGURING YOUR NIGGER<br>Owing to a design error, your nigger comes equipped with a tongue and vocal chords. Most niggers can master only a few basic human phrases with this apparatus - "muh dick" being the most popular. However, others make barking, yelping, yapping noises and appear to be in some pain, so you should probably call a vet and have him remove your nigger's tongue. Once de-tongued your nigger will be a lot happier - at least, you won't hear it complaining anywhere near as much. Niggers have nothing interesting to say, anyway. Many owners also castrate their niggers for health reasons (yours, mine, and that of women, not the nigger's). This is strongly recommended, and frankly, it's a mystery why this is not done on the boat</p><p>HOUSING YOUR NIGGER.<br>Your nigger can be accommodated in cages with stout iron bars. Make sure, however, that the bars are wide enough to push pieces of nigger food through. The rule of thumb is, four niggers per square yard of cage. So a fifteen foot by thirty foot nigger cage can accommodate two hundred niggers. You can site a nigger cage anywhere, even on soft ground. Don't worry about your nigger fashioning makeshift shovels out of odd pieces of wood and digging an escape tunnel under the bars of the cage. Niggers never invented the shovel before and they're not about to now. In any case, your nigger is certainly too lazy to attempt escape. As long as the free food holds out, your nigger is living better than it did in Africa, so it will stay put. Buck niggers and hoe niggers can be safely accommodated in the same cage, as bucks never attempt sex with black hoes.</p><p>FEEDING YOUR NIGGER.<br>Your Nigger likes fried chicken, corn bread, and watermelon. You should therefore give it none of these things because its lazy ass almost certainly doesn't deserve it. Instead, feed it on porridge with salt, and creek water. Your nigger will supplement its diet with whatever it finds in the fields, other niggers, etc. Experienced nigger owners sometimes push watermelon slices through the bars of the nigger cage at the end of the day as a treat, but only if all niggers have worked well and nothing has been stolen that day. Mike of the Old Ranch Plantation reports that this last one is a killer, since all niggers steal something almost every single day of their lives. He reports he doesn't have to spend much on free watermelon for his niggers as a result. You should never allow your nigger meal breaks while at work, since if it stops work for more than ten minutes it will need to be retrained. You would be surprised how long it takes to teach a nigger to pick cotton. You really would. Coffee beans? Don't ask. You have no idea.</p><p>MAKING YOUR NIGGER WORK.<br>Niggers are very, very averse to work of any kind. The nigger's most</p></htmltext>
<tokenext>Congratulations on your purchase of a brand new nigger !
If handled properly , your apeman will give years of valuable , if reluctant , service.INSTALLING YOUR NIGGER.You should install your nigger differently according to whether you have purchased the field or house model .
Field niggers work best in a serial configuration , i.e .
chained together .
Chain your nigger to another nigger immediately after unpacking it , and do n't even think about taking that chain off , ever .
Many niggers start singing as soon as you put a chain on them .
This habit can usually be thrashed out of them if nipped in the bud .
House niggers work best as standalone units , but should be hobbled or hamstrung to prevent attempts at escape .
At this stage , your nigger can also be given a name .
Most owners use the same names over and over , since niggers become confused by too much data .
Rufus , Rastus , Remus , Toby , Carslisle , Carlton , Hey-You ! -Yes-you ! , Yeller , Blackstar , and Sambo are all effective names for your new buck nigger .
If your nigger is a ho , it should be called Latrelle , L'Tanya , or Jemima .
Some owners call their nigger hoes Latrine for a joke .
Pearl , Blossom , and Ivory are also righteous names for nigger hoes .
These names go straight over your nigger 's head , by the way.CONFIGURING YOUR NIGGEROwing to a design error , your nigger comes equipped with a tongue and vocal chords .
Most niggers can master only a few basic human phrases with this apparatus - " muh dick " being the most popular .
However , others make barking , yelping , yapping noises and appear to be in some pain , so you should probably call a vet and have him remove your nigger 's tongue .
Once de-tongued your nigger will be a lot happier - at least , you wo n't hear it complaining anywhere near as much .
Niggers have nothing interesting to say , anyway .
Many owners also castrate their niggers for health reasons ( yours , mine , and that of women , not the nigger 's ) .
This is strongly recommended , and frankly , it 's a mystery why this is not done on the boatHOUSING YOUR NIGGER.Your nigger can be accommodated in cages with stout iron bars .
Make sure , however , that the bars are wide enough to push pieces of nigger food through .
The rule of thumb is , four niggers per square yard of cage .
So a fifteen foot by thirty foot nigger cage can accommodate two hundred niggers .
You can site a nigger cage anywhere , even on soft ground .
Do n't worry about your nigger fashioning makeshift shovels out of odd pieces of wood and digging an escape tunnel under the bars of the cage .
Niggers never invented the shovel before and they 're not about to now .
In any case , your nigger is certainly too lazy to attempt escape .
As long as the free food holds out , your nigger is living better than it did in Africa , so it will stay put .
Buck niggers and hoe niggers can be safely accommodated in the same cage , as bucks never attempt sex with black hoes.FEEDING YOUR NIGGER.Your Nigger likes fried chicken , corn bread , and watermelon .
You should therefore give it none of these things because its lazy ass almost certainly does n't deserve it .
Instead , feed it on porridge with salt , and creek water .
Your nigger will supplement its diet with whatever it finds in the fields , other niggers , etc .
Experienced nigger owners sometimes push watermelon slices through the bars of the nigger cage at the end of the day as a treat , but only if all niggers have worked well and nothing has been stolen that day .
Mike of the Old Ranch Plantation reports that this last one is a killer , since all niggers steal something almost every single day of their lives .
He reports he does n't have to spend much on free watermelon for his niggers as a result .
You should never allow your nigger meal breaks while at work , since if it stops work for more than ten minutes it will need to be retrained .
You would be surprised how long it takes to teach a nigger to pick cotton .
You really would .
Coffee beans ?
Do n't ask .
You have no idea.MAKING YOUR NIGGER WORK.Niggers are very , very averse to work of any kind .
The nigger 's most</tokentext>
<sentencetext>Congratulations on your purchase of a brand new nigger!
If handled properly, your apeman will give years of valuable, if reluctant, service.INSTALLING YOUR NIGGER.You should install your nigger differently according to whether you have purchased the field or house model.
Field niggers work best in a serial configuration, i.e.
chained together.
Chain your nigger to another nigger immediately after unpacking it, and don't even think about taking that chain off, ever.
Many niggers start singing as soon as you put a chain on them.
This habit can usually be thrashed out of them if nipped in the bud.
House niggers work best as standalone units, but should be hobbled or hamstrung to prevent attempts at escape.
At this stage, your nigger can also be given a name.
Most owners use the same names over and over, since niggers become confused by too much data.
Rufus, Rastus, Remus, Toby, Carslisle, Carlton, Hey-You!-Yes-you!, Yeller, Blackstar, and Sambo are all effective names for your new buck nigger.
If your nigger is a ho, it should be called Latrelle, L'Tanya, or Jemima.
Some owners call their nigger hoes Latrine for a joke.
Pearl, Blossom, and Ivory are also righteous names for nigger hoes.
These names go straight over your nigger's head, by the way.CONFIGURING YOUR NIGGEROwing to a design error, your nigger comes equipped with a tongue and vocal chords.
Most niggers can master only a few basic human phrases with this apparatus - "muh dick" being the most popular.
However, others make barking, yelping, yapping noises and appear to be in some pain, so you should probably call a vet and have him remove your nigger's tongue.
Once de-tongued your nigger will be a lot happier - at least, you won't hear it complaining anywhere near as much.
Niggers have nothing interesting to say, anyway.
Many owners also castrate their niggers for health reasons (yours, mine, and that of women, not the nigger's).
This is strongly recommended, and frankly, it's a mystery why this is not done on the boatHOUSING YOUR NIGGER.Your nigger can be accommodated in cages with stout iron bars.
Make sure, however, that the bars are wide enough to push pieces of nigger food through.
The rule of thumb is, four niggers per square yard of cage.
So a fifteen foot by thirty foot nigger cage can accommodate two hundred niggers.
You can site a nigger cage anywhere, even on soft ground.
Don't worry about your nigger fashioning makeshift shovels out of odd pieces of wood and digging an escape tunnel under the bars of the cage.
Niggers never invented the shovel before and they're not about to now.
In any case, your nigger is certainly too lazy to attempt escape.
As long as the free food holds out, your nigger is living better than it did in Africa, so it will stay put.
Buck niggers and hoe niggers can be safely accommodated in the same cage, as bucks never attempt sex with black hoes.FEEDING YOUR NIGGER.Your Nigger likes fried chicken, corn bread, and watermelon.
You should therefore give it none of these things because its lazy ass almost certainly doesn't deserve it.
Instead, feed it on porridge with salt, and creek water.
Your nigger will supplement its diet with whatever it finds in the fields, other niggers, etc.
Experienced nigger owners sometimes push watermelon slices through the bars of the nigger cage at the end of the day as a treat, but only if all niggers have worked well and nothing has been stolen that day.
Mike of the Old Ranch Plantation reports that this last one is a killer, since all niggers steal something almost every single day of their lives.
He reports he doesn't have to spend much on free watermelon for his niggers as a result.
You should never allow your nigger meal breaks while at work, since if it stops work for more than ten minutes it will need to be retrained.
You would be surprised how long it takes to teach a nigger to pick cotton.
You really would.
Coffee beans?
Don't ask.
You have no idea.MAKING YOUR NIGGER WORK.Niggers are very, very averse to work of any kind.
The nigger's most</sentencetext>
	<parent>http://www.semanticweb.org/ontologies/ConversationInstances.owl#comment10_01_31_2327234.30975208</parent>
</comment>
<comment>
	<id>http://www.semanticweb.org/ontologies/ConversationInstances.owl#comment10_01_31_2327234.30977352</id>
	<title>Re:Business model</title>
	<author>Shatrat</author>
	<datestamp>1264959300000</datestamp>
	<modclass>None</modclass>
	<modscore>1</modscore>
	<htmltext>It's only that valuable because nobody is bringing any back.<br>
If someone is bringing down 200 kilos every few months you had better believe the price will drop to nothing.<br>
It's not as though it's actually useful for anything but study, and once you have some to study you don't need more just like it.</htmltext>
<tokenext>It 's only that valuable because nobody is bringing any back .
If someone is bringing down 200 kilos every few months you had better believe the price will drop to nothing .
It 's not as though it 's actually useful for anything but study , and once you have some to study you do n't need more just like it .</tokentext>
<sentencetext>It's only that valuable because nobody is bringing any back.
If someone is bringing down 200 kilos every few months you had better believe the price will drop to nothing.
It's not as though it's actually useful for anything but study, and once you have some to study you don't need more just like it.</sentencetext>
	<parent>http://www.semanticweb.org/ontologies/ConversationInstances.owl#comment10_01_31_2327234.30975934</parent>
</comment>
<comment>
	<id>http://www.semanticweb.org/ontologies/ConversationInstances.owl#comment10_01_31_2327234.30987926</id>
	<title>Re:Bwhahahaha - "engineers" drawing pretty parts</title>
	<author>Anonymous</author>
	<datestamp>1265022540000</datestamp>
	<modclass>None</modclass>
	<modscore>0</modscore>
	<htmltext><p>The fact that they even mention Blender in an engineering context should tell you something...</p></htmltext>
<tokenext>The fact that they even mention Blender in an engineering context should tell you something.. .</tokentext>
<sentencetext>The fact that they even mention Blender in an engineering context should tell you something...</sentencetext>
	<parent>http://www.semanticweb.org/ontologies/ConversationInstances.owl#comment10_01_31_2327234.30975566</parent>
</comment>
<comment>
	<id>http://www.semanticweb.org/ontologies/ConversationInstances.owl#comment10_01_31_2327234.30982198</id>
	<title>Re:gnu moon mission</title>
	<author>HeckRuler</author>
	<datestamp>1265044080000</datestamp>
	<modclass>None</modclass>
	<modscore>1</modscore>
	<htmltext>Admit it, you're just trying to setup the plot from "the moon is a hard mistress" aren't you?<br>
A massive AI built up by the first colonists.<br>
Gender imbalance.<br>
How about we starts farms there as well? Ship it back with a massive rail fun?</htmltext>
<tokenext>Admit it , you 're just trying to setup the plot from " the moon is a hard mistress " are n't you ?
A massive AI built up by the first colonists .
Gender imbalance .
How about we starts farms there as well ?
Ship it back with a massive rail fun ?</tokentext>
<sentencetext>Admit it, you're just trying to setup the plot from "the moon is a hard mistress" aren't you?
A massive AI built up by the first colonists.
Gender imbalance.
How about we starts farms there as well?
Ship it back with a massive rail fun?</sentencetext>
	<parent>http://www.semanticweb.org/ontologies/ConversationInstances.owl#comment10_01_31_2327234.30975828</parent>
</comment>
<comment>
	<id>http://www.semanticweb.org/ontologies/ConversationInstances.owl#comment10_01_31_2327234.30976078</id>
	<title>Slashdotted</title>
	<author>selven</author>
	<datestamp>1264947000000</datestamp>
	<modclass>None</modclass>
	<modscore>1</modscore>
	<htmltext><p><a href="http://74.125.93.132/search?q=cache:LwZanTvcfSkJ:www.openluna.org/+openluna&amp;hl=en&amp;gl=ca&amp;strip=1" title="74.125.93.132">Google Cache link</a> [74.125.93.132]</p></htmltext>
<tokenext>Google Cache link [ 74.125.93.132 ]</tokentext>
<sentencetext>Google Cache link [74.125.93.132]</sentencetext>
</comment>
<comment>
	<id>http://www.semanticweb.org/ontologies/ConversationInstances.owl#comment10_01_31_2327234.30977538</id>
	<title>Put a woman back on the moon?</title>
	<author>dukw\_butter</author>
	<datestamp>1264960980000</datestamp>
	<modclass>None</modclass>
	<modscore>1</modscore>
	<htmltext>You're going to "put a man (and woman) back on the moon?"  Not possible.  No woman has ever been to the moon.</htmltext>
<tokenext>You 're going to " put a man ( and woman ) back on the moon ?
" Not possible .
No woman has ever been to the moon .</tokentext>
<sentencetext>You're going to "put a man (and woman) back on the moon?
"  Not possible.
No woman has ever been to the moon.</sentencetext>
</comment>
<comment>
	<id>http://www.semanticweb.org/ontologies/ConversationInstances.owl#comment10_01_31_2327234.30976210</id>
	<title>2d and 3d CAD</title>
	<author>Anonymous</author>
	<datestamp>1264948020000</datestamp>
	<modclass>None</modclass>
	<modscore>0</modscore>
	<htmltext><p>Tate a look at GraphietOne, I don't know that the files can be imported into blender, but otherwise the application is worth a look. It's available in both free and proprietary versions, depending on how you intend to use the software.</p></htmltext>
<tokenext>Tate a look at GraphietOne , I do n't know that the files can be imported into blender , but otherwise the application is worth a look .
It 's available in both free and proprietary versions , depending on how you intend to use the software .</tokentext>
<sentencetext>Tate a look at GraphietOne, I don't know that the files can be imported into blender, but otherwise the application is worth a look.
It's available in both free and proprietary versions, depending on how you intend to use the software.</sentencetext>
</comment>
<comment>
	<id>http://www.semanticweb.org/ontologies/ConversationInstances.owl#comment10_01_31_2327234.30976280</id>
	<title>Here's a link that lists some potential sites</title>
	<author>alexschmidt</author>
	<datestamp>1264948620000</datestamp>
	<modclass>None</modclass>
	<modscore>1</modscore>
	<htmltext><a href="http://www.junauza.com/2009/12/free-and-open-source-cad-software-for.html" title="junauza.com" rel="nofollow">http://www.junauza.com/2009/12/free-and-open-source-cad-software-for.html</a> [junauza.com]

You can also try VariCad at www.varicad.com

Honestly, I think it's better to pony up the cash and get version of SolidWorks. See if you can split the costs with someone else. Then you will know for sure that is can handle the file formats of the other products.</htmltext>
<tokenext>http : //www.junauza.com/2009/12/free-and-open-source-cad-software-for.html [ junauza.com ] You can also try VariCad at www.varicad.com Honestly , I think it 's better to pony up the cash and get version of SolidWorks .
See if you can split the costs with someone else .
Then you will know for sure that is can handle the file formats of the other products .</tokentext>
<sentencetext>http://www.junauza.com/2009/12/free-and-open-source-cad-software-for.html [junauza.com]

You can also try VariCad at www.varicad.com

Honestly, I think it's better to pony up the cash and get version of SolidWorks.
See if you can split the costs with someone else.
Then you will know for sure that is can handle the file formats of the other products.</sentencetext>
</comment>
<comment>
	<id>http://www.semanticweb.org/ontologies/ConversationInstances.owl#comment10_01_31_2327234.30976406</id>
	<title>Re:OSS CAD?</title>
	<author>i.r.id10t</author>
	<datestamp>1264949340000</datestamp>
	<modclass>None</modclass>
	<modscore>1</modscore>
	<htmltext><p>Or spend that $$ improving and fixing one of hte F/OSS ones...</p></htmltext>
<tokenext>Or spend that $ $ improving and fixing one of hte F/OSS ones.. .</tokentext>
<sentencetext>Or spend that $$ improving and fixing one of hte F/OSS ones...</sentencetext>
	<parent>http://www.semanticweb.org/ontologies/ConversationInstances.owl#comment10_01_31_2327234.30975318</parent>
</comment>
<comment>
	<id>http://www.semanticweb.org/ontologies/ConversationInstances.owl#comment10_01_31_2327234.30978370</id>
	<title>Re:You've raised $130 out of $7500</title>
	<author>Anonymous</author>
	<datestamp>1265015280000</datestamp>
	<modclass>None</modclass>
	<modscore>0</modscore>
	<htmltext><p>There are two and only two sorts of people, those who RTFA and those who comment.</p></htmltext>
<tokenext>There are two and only two sorts of people , those who RTFA and those who comment .</tokentext>
<sentencetext>There are two and only two sorts of people, those who RTFA and those who comment.</sentencetext>
	<parent>http://www.semanticweb.org/ontologies/ConversationInstances.owl#comment10_01_31_2327234.30977472</parent>
</comment>
<comment>
	<id>http://www.semanticweb.org/ontologies/ConversationInstances.owl#comment10_01_31_2327234.30980128</id>
	<title>Re:Very Viable Project.</title>
	<author>TheKidWho</author>
	<datestamp>1265035320000</datestamp>
	<modclass>None</modclass>
	<modscore>1</modscore>
	<htmltext><p><i>and assume the cost of the mission will come down a couple orders of magnitude, but these aren't unreasonable assumptions</i></p><p>Yeah, barring a complete change in the laws of physics or the construction of space elevator...</p></htmltext>
<tokenext>and assume the cost of the mission will come down a couple orders of magnitude , but these are n't unreasonable assumptionsYeah , barring a complete change in the laws of physics or the construction of space elevator.. .</tokentext>
<sentencetext>and assume the cost of the mission will come down a couple orders of magnitude, but these aren't unreasonable assumptionsYeah, barring a complete change in the laws of physics or the construction of space elevator...</sentencetext>
	<parent>http://www.semanticweb.org/ontologies/ConversationInstances.owl#comment10_01_31_2327234.30976980</parent>
</comment>
<comment>
	<id>http://www.semanticweb.org/ontologies/ConversationInstances.owl#comment10_01_31_2327234.30977944</id>
	<title>Slow and steady</title>
	<author>steveha</author>
	<datestamp>1264966140000</datestamp>
	<modclass>Interestin</modclass>
	<modscore>4</modscore>
	<htmltext><p>Here is my advice: plan a slow-and-steady strategy, rather than a "space race" strategy.  Plan for effectiveness over the long haul, rather than short-term results.</p><p>That means you will be doing things rather differently than Apollo.</p><p>For software, as far as I can tell, nothing exists that will meet your needs.  Thus your first step is to figure out what free software has a hope of someday meeting your needs, then figure out how to get developers to work on it until it does meet your needs.  So, actually, your very first step is to find an expert in rocket design who can tell you what features you need, what software exists that can do what you need (even if you don't want to use it because it is proprietary).  If you are very very lucky, you might find a retired aerospace project manager who will give you advice for free.  (I don't think this is far-fetched.  Anyone who worked on rockets in the glory days will be old enough to be retired now, and you might find someone who shares your dream and will give advice for free.)</p><p>For simulations and engineering computations, you should look at <a href="http://www.scipy.org/" title="scipy.org">SciPy</a> [scipy.org].  As I said above, it probably doesn't meet your needs now, but it has a solid foundation and lots of people working on it.</p><p>As far as a strategy for going to the moon, I don't claim to be an expert, but here is my advice.</p><p>You really, really do not want to try to re-create the Saturn V rocket.  In fact, you don't want any design where you use up one rocket per moon trip.  The slow-and-steady plan goes like this:  First you get a "space pickup truck", some sort of launch vehicle that can reliably go to Earth orbit with a small payload (say, 1000 KG or so). Second, using many "space pickup" flights, you build a space station, and stock it with lots of oxygen, food, fuel, etc.  Third, you build a "moon shuttle" in orbit, a vehicle that will never land on Earth and never land on the moon, but will safely travel between the fuel.  Fourth, you build your "moon lander", which will be carried by the moon shuttle.  Finally, you fuel up the moon shuttle and lander, and send a mission to the moon.</p><p>At that point, you have the infrastructure to visit the moon as often as you find convenient.  You ferry up some more fuel, oxygen, and supplies, refuel the moon shuttle and lander, and off you go.</p><p>I'll point out that there are plenty of small companies trying to build a "space pickup truck" right now.  You could sensibly just plan on hiring one of those, rather than trying to build your own launch vehicle.  You won't get this project done tomorrow anyway, so you might as well start designing your space station and moon-specific hardware now, and just assume you can hire the orbital transport by the time you need it.</p><p>If someone gets a "space cannon" operational in time for you, so much the better.  Use the cannon to send up lots of fuel and oxygen and such as cheaply as possible.  In this case, you will want to build a "space tug" vehicle that can scoot around and collect the canisters shot up by the cannon.</p><p>The USA sent men to the moon using a cost-is-no-object, win-the-race strategy.  You will do much better to incrementally build the infrastructure to go to the moon conveniently.</p><p>Good luck with your grand dream.</p><p>steveha</p></htmltext>
<tokenext>Here is my advice : plan a slow-and-steady strategy , rather than a " space race " strategy .
Plan for effectiveness over the long haul , rather than short-term results.That means you will be doing things rather differently than Apollo.For software , as far as I can tell , nothing exists that will meet your needs .
Thus your first step is to figure out what free software has a hope of someday meeting your needs , then figure out how to get developers to work on it until it does meet your needs .
So , actually , your very first step is to find an expert in rocket design who can tell you what features you need , what software exists that can do what you need ( even if you do n't want to use it because it is proprietary ) .
If you are very very lucky , you might find a retired aerospace project manager who will give you advice for free .
( I do n't think this is far-fetched .
Anyone who worked on rockets in the glory days will be old enough to be retired now , and you might find someone who shares your dream and will give advice for free .
) For simulations and engineering computations , you should look at SciPy [ scipy.org ] .
As I said above , it probably does n't meet your needs now , but it has a solid foundation and lots of people working on it.As far as a strategy for going to the moon , I do n't claim to be an expert , but here is my advice.You really , really do not want to try to re-create the Saturn V rocket .
In fact , you do n't want any design where you use up one rocket per moon trip .
The slow-and-steady plan goes like this : First you get a " space pickup truck " , some sort of launch vehicle that can reliably go to Earth orbit with a small payload ( say , 1000 KG or so ) .
Second , using many " space pickup " flights , you build a space station , and stock it with lots of oxygen , food , fuel , etc .
Third , you build a " moon shuttle " in orbit , a vehicle that will never land on Earth and never land on the moon , but will safely travel between the fuel .
Fourth , you build your " moon lander " , which will be carried by the moon shuttle .
Finally , you fuel up the moon shuttle and lander , and send a mission to the moon.At that point , you have the infrastructure to visit the moon as often as you find convenient .
You ferry up some more fuel , oxygen , and supplies , refuel the moon shuttle and lander , and off you go.I 'll point out that there are plenty of small companies trying to build a " space pickup truck " right now .
You could sensibly just plan on hiring one of those , rather than trying to build your own launch vehicle .
You wo n't get this project done tomorrow anyway , so you might as well start designing your space station and moon-specific hardware now , and just assume you can hire the orbital transport by the time you need it.If someone gets a " space cannon " operational in time for you , so much the better .
Use the cannon to send up lots of fuel and oxygen and such as cheaply as possible .
In this case , you will want to build a " space tug " vehicle that can scoot around and collect the canisters shot up by the cannon.The USA sent men to the moon using a cost-is-no-object , win-the-race strategy .
You will do much better to incrementally build the infrastructure to go to the moon conveniently.Good luck with your grand dream.steveha</tokentext>
<sentencetext>Here is my advice: plan a slow-and-steady strategy, rather than a "space race" strategy.
Plan for effectiveness over the long haul, rather than short-term results.That means you will be doing things rather differently than Apollo.For software, as far as I can tell, nothing exists that will meet your needs.
Thus your first step is to figure out what free software has a hope of someday meeting your needs, then figure out how to get developers to work on it until it does meet your needs.
So, actually, your very first step is to find an expert in rocket design who can tell you what features you need, what software exists that can do what you need (even if you don't want to use it because it is proprietary).
If you are very very lucky, you might find a retired aerospace project manager who will give you advice for free.
(I don't think this is far-fetched.
Anyone who worked on rockets in the glory days will be old enough to be retired now, and you might find someone who shares your dream and will give advice for free.
)For simulations and engineering computations, you should look at SciPy [scipy.org].
As I said above, it probably doesn't meet your needs now, but it has a solid foundation and lots of people working on it.As far as a strategy for going to the moon, I don't claim to be an expert, but here is my advice.You really, really do not want to try to re-create the Saturn V rocket.
In fact, you don't want any design where you use up one rocket per moon trip.
The slow-and-steady plan goes like this:  First you get a "space pickup truck", some sort of launch vehicle that can reliably go to Earth orbit with a small payload (say, 1000 KG or so).
Second, using many "space pickup" flights, you build a space station, and stock it with lots of oxygen, food, fuel, etc.
Third, you build a "moon shuttle" in orbit, a vehicle that will never land on Earth and never land on the moon, but will safely travel between the fuel.
Fourth, you build your "moon lander", which will be carried by the moon shuttle.
Finally, you fuel up the moon shuttle and lander, and send a mission to the moon.At that point, you have the infrastructure to visit the moon as often as you find convenient.
You ferry up some more fuel, oxygen, and supplies, refuel the moon shuttle and lander, and off you go.I'll point out that there are plenty of small companies trying to build a "space pickup truck" right now.
You could sensibly just plan on hiring one of those, rather than trying to build your own launch vehicle.
You won't get this project done tomorrow anyway, so you might as well start designing your space station and moon-specific hardware now, and just assume you can hire the orbital transport by the time you need it.If someone gets a "space cannon" operational in time for you, so much the better.
Use the cannon to send up lots of fuel and oxygen and such as cheaply as possible.
In this case, you will want to build a "space tug" vehicle that can scoot around and collect the canisters shot up by the cannon.The USA sent men to the moon using a cost-is-no-object, win-the-race strategy.
You will do much better to incrementally build the infrastructure to go to the moon conveniently.Good luck with your grand dream.steveha</sentencetext>
</comment>
<comment>
	<id>http://www.semanticweb.org/ontologies/ConversationInstances.owl#comment10_01_31_2327234.30975352</id>
	<title>That didn't take long...</title>
	<author>kevin\_j\_morse</author>
	<datestamp>1264942380000</datestamp>
	<modclass>None</modclass>
	<modscore>1</modscore>
	<htmltext><p>... for the website to be slashdotted. I think his attempt at getting traffic worked a little to well.</p></htmltext>
<tokenext>... for the website to be slashdotted .
I think his attempt at getting traffic worked a little to well .</tokentext>
<sentencetext>... for the website to be slashdotted.
I think his attempt at getting traffic worked a little to well.</sentencetext>
</comment>
<comment>
	<id>http://www.semanticweb.org/ontologies/ConversationInstances.owl#comment10_01_31_2327234.30979034</id>
	<title>CYCAS</title>
	<author>rusl</author>
	<datestamp>1265024280000</datestamp>
	<modclass>None</modclass>
	<modscore>1</modscore>
	<htmltext><p>I've made some things in CYCAS 3d. It's not too bad but it is limited. I was using the free version. I'm not sure the license is free or not... I thought it was. It's more architectural software really. It was the only thing I could figure out how to use on linux anyway. There is also the Google CAD thing... but that is probably free only as beer.</p><p>Recently I got a chance to use Solidworks and I don't think I'm going back to CYCAS. If I was more into architecture though... it did have some features that I can't equate to Solidworks... but not nearly as many as vice versa.</p></htmltext>
<tokenext>I 've made some things in CYCAS 3d .
It 's not too bad but it is limited .
I was using the free version .
I 'm not sure the license is free or not... I thought it was .
It 's more architectural software really .
It was the only thing I could figure out how to use on linux anyway .
There is also the Google CAD thing... but that is probably free only as beer.Recently I got a chance to use Solidworks and I do n't think I 'm going back to CYCAS .
If I was more into architecture though... it did have some features that I ca n't equate to Solidworks... but not nearly as many as vice versa .</tokentext>
<sentencetext>I've made some things in CYCAS 3d.
It's not too bad but it is limited.
I was using the free version.
I'm not sure the license is free or not... I thought it was.
It's more architectural software really.
It was the only thing I could figure out how to use on linux anyway.
There is also the Google CAD thing... but that is probably free only as beer.Recently I got a chance to use Solidworks and I don't think I'm going back to CYCAS.
If I was more into architecture though... it did have some features that I can't equate to Solidworks... but not nearly as many as vice versa.</sentencetext>
</comment>
<comment>
	<id>http://www.semanticweb.org/ontologies/ConversationInstances.owl#comment10_01_31_2327234.30976652</id>
	<title>Re:Is that so...</title>
	<author>Arbition</author>
	<datestamp>1264951860000</datestamp>
	<modclass>None</modclass>
	<modscore>1</modscore>
	<htmltext>How may community space projects are there? For something as big as space exploration, they can't afford to have lots of different organisations simply because of minor differences in principals. There seems to be spacehack.org (which isn't so much about launch as just bringing people together), which links to cstart.org. Also, as linked in another post (http://ask.slashdot.org/comments.pl?sid=1531702&amp;cid=30975480), copenhagensuborbitals.com. I'm sure some digging around will pull up some more.</htmltext>
<tokenext>How may community space projects are there ?
For something as big as space exploration , they ca n't afford to have lots of different organisations simply because of minor differences in principals .
There seems to be spacehack.org ( which is n't so much about launch as just bringing people together ) , which links to cstart.org .
Also , as linked in another post ( http : //ask.slashdot.org/comments.pl ? sid = 1531702&amp;cid = 30975480 ) , copenhagensuborbitals.com .
I 'm sure some digging around will pull up some more .</tokentext>
<sentencetext>How may community space projects are there?
For something as big as space exploration, they can't afford to have lots of different organisations simply because of minor differences in principals.
There seems to be spacehack.org (which isn't so much about launch as just bringing people together), which links to cstart.org.
Also, as linked in another post (http://ask.slashdot.org/comments.pl?sid=1531702&amp;cid=30975480), copenhagensuborbitals.com.
I'm sure some digging around will pull up some more.</sentencetext>
	<parent>http://www.semanticweb.org/ontologies/ConversationInstances.owl#comment10_01_31_2327234.30975302</parent>
</comment>
<comment>
	<id>http://www.semanticweb.org/ontologies/ConversationInstances.owl#comment10_01_31_2327234.30987256</id>
	<title>Re:You've raised $130 out of $7500</title>
	<author>DrifterX79</author>
	<datestamp>1265019960000</datestamp>
	<modclass>None</modclass>
	<modscore>1</modscore>
	<htmltext>Why can engineer not use Blender? Blender easy. Put material into Blender, press Blend. Voila! Two easy steps to Blender.</htmltext>
<tokenext>Why can engineer not use Blender ?
Blender easy .
Put material into Blender , press Blend .
Voila ! Two easy steps to Blender .</tokentext>
<sentencetext>Why can engineer not use Blender?
Blender easy.
Put material into Blender, press Blend.
Voila! Two easy steps to Blender.</sentencetext>
	<parent>http://www.semanticweb.org/ontologies/ConversationInstances.owl#comment10_01_31_2327234.30976508</parent>
</comment>
<comment>
	<id>http://www.semanticweb.org/ontologies/ConversationInstances.owl#comment10_01_31_2327234.31111352</id>
	<title>Blender??!!! WTF??</title>
	<author>tigersha</author>
	<datestamp>1265978220000</datestamp>
	<modclass>None</modclass>
	<modscore>1</modscore>
	<htmltext>"Blender" and "Moon Rocket" are two words which do not belong in the same sentence. You are joking, right?</htmltext>
<tokenext>" Blender " and " Moon Rocket " are two words which do not belong in the same sentence .
You are joking , right ?</tokentext>
<sentencetext>"Blender" and "Moon Rocket" are two words which do not belong in the same sentence.
You are joking, right?</sentencetext>
</comment>
<comment>
	<id>http://www.semanticweb.org/ontologies/ConversationInstances.owl#comment10_01_31_2327234.30982464</id>
	<title>Re:Use the best tools, regardless of license</title>
	<author>sebock</author>
	<datestamp>1265044980000</datestamp>
	<modclass>None</modclass>
	<modscore>1</modscore>
	<htmltext><p>One would think you wanted the best Minds doing the design work rather than just using the best tools.  Give a chimp a plasma torch and a kiln...</p><p>It was possible to send man to the moon using slide rulers and calculators, and less power than a computer with a '286 had.</p></htmltext>
<tokenext>One would think you wanted the best Minds doing the design work rather than just using the best tools .
Give a chimp a plasma torch and a kiln...It was possible to send man to the moon using slide rulers and calculators , and less power than a computer with a '286 had .</tokentext>
<sentencetext>One would think you wanted the best Minds doing the design work rather than just using the best tools.
Give a chimp a plasma torch and a kiln...It was possible to send man to the moon using slide rulers and calculators, and less power than a computer with a '286 had.</sentencetext>
	<parent>http://www.semanticweb.org/ontologies/ConversationInstances.owl#comment10_01_31_2327234.30977434</parent>
</comment>
<comment>
	<id>http://www.semanticweb.org/ontologies/ConversationInstances.owl#comment10_01_31_2327234.30978496</id>
	<title>Re:You've raised $130 out of $7500</title>
	<author>mwvdlee</author>
	<datestamp>1265016900000</datestamp>
	<modclass>None</modclass>
	<modscore>1</modscore>
	<htmltext><p>I'm guessing you're part of that "Unreasonable" thing? Why else would somebody post that one as an example of a real website.</p></htmltext>
<tokenext>I 'm guessing you 're part of that " Unreasonable " thing ?
Why else would somebody post that one as an example of a real website .</tokentext>
<sentencetext>I'm guessing you're part of that "Unreasonable" thing?
Why else would somebody post that one as an example of a real website.</sentencetext>
	<parent>http://www.semanticweb.org/ontologies/ConversationInstances.owl#comment10_01_31_2327234.30976012</parent>
</comment>
<comment>
	<id>http://www.semanticweb.org/ontologies/ConversationInstances.owl#comment10_01_31_2327234.30989332</id>
	<title>Re:You've raised $130 out of $7500</title>
	<author>Anonymous</author>
	<datestamp>1265028480000</datestamp>
	<modclass>None</modclass>
	<modscore>0</modscore>
	<htmltext>And if you check out their <a href="http://www.interorbital.com/Sponsor\%20Page\_1.htm" title="interorbital.com" rel="nofollow">sponsor page</a> [interorbital.com], they seem to be funded by the <a href="http://www.technomysticism.com/Main.Page.htm" title="technomysticism.com" rel="nofollow">technomystics</a> [technomysticism.com].  Not that that necessarily means anything, but come on.  If they have a serious business plan they shouldn't have to result to such quackery.<br> <br>
Posted AC because im working to get into the industry and parents boilerplate scared me<nobr> <wbr></nobr>:D</htmltext>
<tokenext>And if you check out their sponsor page [ interorbital.com ] , they seem to be funded by the technomystics [ technomysticism.com ] .
Not that that necessarily means anything , but come on .
If they have a serious business plan they should n't have to result to such quackery .
Posted AC because im working to get into the industry and parents boilerplate scared me : D</tokentext>
<sentencetext>And if you check out their sponsor page [interorbital.com], they seem to be funded by the technomystics [technomysticism.com].
Not that that necessarily means anything, but come on.
If they have a serious business plan they shouldn't have to result to such quackery.
Posted AC because im working to get into the industry and parents boilerplate scared me :D</sentencetext>
	<parent>http://www.semanticweb.org/ontologies/ConversationInstances.owl#comment10_01_31_2327234.30976012</parent>
</comment>
<comment>
	<id>http://www.semanticweb.org/ontologies/ConversationInstances.owl#comment10_01_31_2327234.30976344</id>
	<title>Re:Several problems</title>
	<author>Anonymous</author>
	<datestamp>1264948980000</datestamp>
	<modclass>None</modclass>
	<modscore>0</modscore>
	<htmltext><p><div class="quote"><p>If you were seriously planning on saving costs by not buying professional software for an AEROSPACE project then you are already fucked. You may as well blow all the investor's money on a massive party because it's lost anyways.</p></div><p>They are looking for an easy way to make snazzy animations, so that they can attract more investors during the massive party.</p></div>
	</htmltext>
<tokenext>If you were seriously planning on saving costs by not buying professional software for an AEROSPACE project then you are already fucked .
You may as well blow all the investor 's money on a massive party because it 's lost anyways.They are looking for an easy way to make snazzy animations , so that they can attract more investors during the massive party .</tokentext>
<sentencetext>If you were seriously planning on saving costs by not buying professional software for an AEROSPACE project then you are already fucked.
You may as well blow all the investor's money on a massive party because it's lost anyways.They are looking for an easy way to make snazzy animations, so that they can attract more investors during the massive party.
	</sentencetext>
	<parent>http://www.semanticweb.org/ontologies/ConversationInstances.owl#comment10_01_31_2327234.30975688</parent>
</comment>
<comment>
	<id>http://www.semanticweb.org/ontologies/ConversationInstances.owl#comment10_01_31_2327234.30977472</id>
	<title>Re:You've raised $130 out of $7500</title>
	<author>MobileTatsu-NJG</author>
	<datestamp>1264960440000</datestamp>
	<modclass>Funny</modclass>
	<modscore>4</modscore>
	<htmltext><p>You know, that's a bizarre occurance.  Slashdot takes down sites so much the name has become a verb.  Yet, nobody reads the article before posting.  How do so many geeks manage that?  I mean, I post my knee-jerk reactions to a site, but at least I have the courtesy to not cost them bandwidth.</p></htmltext>
<tokenext>You know , that 's a bizarre occurance .
Slashdot takes down sites so much the name has become a verb .
Yet , nobody reads the article before posting .
How do so many geeks manage that ?
I mean , I post my knee-jerk reactions to a site , but at least I have the courtesy to not cost them bandwidth .</tokentext>
<sentencetext>You know, that's a bizarre occurance.
Slashdot takes down sites so much the name has become a verb.
Yet, nobody reads the article before posting.
How do so many geeks manage that?
I mean, I post my knee-jerk reactions to a site, but at least I have the courtesy to not cost them bandwidth.</sentencetext>
	<parent>http://www.semanticweb.org/ontologies/ConversationInstances.owl#comment10_01_31_2327234.30975534</parent>
</comment>
<comment>
	<id>http://www.semanticweb.org/ontologies/ConversationInstances.owl#comment10_01_31_2327234.30976930</id>
	<title>Cenon - More CAM than CAD, but a possibility</title>
	<author>Rubinstien</author>
	<datestamp>1264955220000</datestamp>
	<modclass>None</modclass>
	<modscore>1</modscore>
	<htmltext><p>http://www.cenon.info/frame\_gb.html</p></htmltext>
<tokenext>http : //www.cenon.info/frame \ _gb.html</tokentext>
<sentencetext>http://www.cenon.info/frame\_gb.html</sentencetext>
</comment>
<comment>
	<id>http://www.semanticweb.org/ontologies/ConversationInstances.owl#comment10_01_31_2327234.30980890</id>
	<title>Re:Use the best tools, regardless of license</title>
	<author>Anonymous</author>
	<datestamp>1265038740000</datestamp>
	<modclass>None</modclass>
	<modscore>0</modscore>
	<htmltext><p>Sorry to pick on you, as you're not the only one with that view here, but...</p><p>The point is, this guy was asking <i>what software</i>, not if he should be doing this at all. "Man in sheds" have achieved a lot over the years, and if these guys want to do this (either in their free time, or as a job, or whatever) then that's up to them, isn't it?</p><p>I would expect, with sufficient will alone, these guys could get something viable together that could get into space. From then on, it's just about getting money to actually build and then fly. I'll bet you if they manage all that on a shoe-string that the Big Money will get interested and solutions will become easier for them. Who cares what software they used? If it works, it works - they could design it with an Etcher Sketch for all I care.</p><p>These guys <i>think</i> they can do this. That puts them one step ahead of me, because I'm pretty sure I can't do it. I (like you) might think they're bonkers, but at the same time, I say "good on 'em" - at least they're giving it a go, which is several steps ahead of most of us.</p></htmltext>
<tokenext>Sorry to pick on you , as you 're not the only one with that view here , but...The point is , this guy was asking what software , not if he should be doing this at all .
" Man in sheds " have achieved a lot over the years , and if these guys want to do this ( either in their free time , or as a job , or whatever ) then that 's up to them , is n't it ? I would expect , with sufficient will alone , these guys could get something viable together that could get into space .
From then on , it 's just about getting money to actually build and then fly .
I 'll bet you if they manage all that on a shoe-string that the Big Money will get interested and solutions will become easier for them .
Who cares what software they used ?
If it works , it works - they could design it with an Etcher Sketch for all I care.These guys think they can do this .
That puts them one step ahead of me , because I 'm pretty sure I ca n't do it .
I ( like you ) might think they 're bonkers , but at the same time , I say " good on 'em " - at least they 're giving it a go , which is several steps ahead of most of us .</tokentext>
<sentencetext>Sorry to pick on you, as you're not the only one with that view here, but...The point is, this guy was asking what software, not if he should be doing this at all.
"Man in sheds" have achieved a lot over the years, and if these guys want to do this (either in their free time, or as a job, or whatever) then that's up to them, isn't it?I would expect, with sufficient will alone, these guys could get something viable together that could get into space.
From then on, it's just about getting money to actually build and then fly.
I'll bet you if they manage all that on a shoe-string that the Big Money will get interested and solutions will become easier for them.
Who cares what software they used?
If it works, it works - they could design it with an Etcher Sketch for all I care.These guys think they can do this.
That puts them one step ahead of me, because I'm pretty sure I can't do it.
I (like you) might think they're bonkers, but at the same time, I say "good on 'em" - at least they're giving it a go, which is several steps ahead of most of us.</sentencetext>
	<parent>http://www.semanticweb.org/ontologies/ConversationInstances.owl#comment10_01_31_2327234.30977434</parent>
</comment>
<comment>
	<id>http://www.semanticweb.org/ontologies/ConversationInstances.owl#comment10_01_31_2327234.30993188</id>
	<title>Re:The most serious post yet</title>
	<author>Anonymous</author>
	<datestamp>1265112480000</datestamp>
	<modclass>None</modclass>
	<modscore>0</modscore>
	<htmltext><p>You people are pansies! Just throw it into Maxima via TexMacs and process the output with Python. Feed it to gnuplot for your artists or output it to their favorite blender format. I'm so tired of NASA, Lockheed, and Boeing retards who think they need $100,000 software because they are too lazy to take advantage of the FOSS libraries.</p><p>I worked on programming dark matter search software and while it's not trivial, you don't need to spend a dime because ALL of the best software is produced by universities and open source... well known.</p></htmltext>
<tokenext>You people are pansies !
Just throw it into Maxima via TexMacs and process the output with Python .
Feed it to gnuplot for your artists or output it to their favorite blender format .
I 'm so tired of NASA , Lockheed , and Boeing retards who think they need $ 100,000 software because they are too lazy to take advantage of the FOSS libraries.I worked on programming dark matter search software and while it 's not trivial , you do n't need to spend a dime because ALL of the best software is produced by universities and open source... well known .</tokentext>
<sentencetext>You people are pansies!
Just throw it into Maxima via TexMacs and process the output with Python.
Feed it to gnuplot for your artists or output it to their favorite blender format.
I'm so tired of NASA, Lockheed, and Boeing retards who think they need $100,000 software because they are too lazy to take advantage of the FOSS libraries.I worked on programming dark matter search software and while it's not trivial, you don't need to spend a dime because ALL of the best software is produced by universities and open source... well known.</sentencetext>
	<parent>http://www.semanticweb.org/ontologies/ConversationInstances.owl#comment10_01_31_2327234.30975972</parent>
</comment>
<comment>
	<id>http://www.semanticweb.org/ontologies/ConversationInstances.owl#comment10_01_31_2327234.30985108</id>
	<title>Re:OSS CAD?</title>
	<author>jonaskoelker</author>
	<datestamp>1265055960000</datestamp>
	<modclass>None</modclass>
	<modscore>1</modscore>
	<htmltext><p><div class="quote"><p>Drop your ideology and purchase some professionally developed proprietary software.</p></div><p>That wouldn't help OpenLuna fulfil their mission; in fact, it would be completely counter to it:</p><p><div class="quote"><p>The OpenLuna Foundation seeks to return mankind to the lunar surface, first through robotic missions, followed by manned exploration, culminating in an eight person permanent outpost, and to do all of this in a way that it is accessible to everyone. Our research and technology will be <b>open-source</b>, we are privately funded, and <b>one of our specific goals is to reach out to the community and educational systems</b> to spread interest, enthusiasm, and involvement.</p></div><p>The point isn't just getting to the moon again.  With that in mind, I don't think they will take your advice.</p></div>
	</htmltext>
<tokenext>Drop your ideology and purchase some professionally developed proprietary software.That would n't help OpenLuna fulfil their mission ; in fact , it would be completely counter to it : The OpenLuna Foundation seeks to return mankind to the lunar surface , first through robotic missions , followed by manned exploration , culminating in an eight person permanent outpost , and to do all of this in a way that it is accessible to everyone .
Our research and technology will be open-source , we are privately funded , and one of our specific goals is to reach out to the community and educational systems to spread interest , enthusiasm , and involvement.The point is n't just getting to the moon again .
With that in mind , I do n't think they will take your advice .</tokentext>
<sentencetext>Drop your ideology and purchase some professionally developed proprietary software.That wouldn't help OpenLuna fulfil their mission; in fact, it would be completely counter to it:The OpenLuna Foundation seeks to return mankind to the lunar surface, first through robotic missions, followed by manned exploration, culminating in an eight person permanent outpost, and to do all of this in a way that it is accessible to everyone.
Our research and technology will be open-source, we are privately funded, and one of our specific goals is to reach out to the community and educational systems to spread interest, enthusiasm, and involvement.The point isn't just getting to the moon again.
With that in mind, I don't think they will take your advice.
	</sentencetext>
	<parent>http://www.semanticweb.org/ontologies/ConversationInstances.owl#comment10_01_31_2327234.30975318</parent>
</comment>
<comment>
	<id>http://www.semanticweb.org/ontologies/ConversationInstances.owl#comment10_01_31_2327234.30976876</id>
	<title>Re:Business model</title>
	<author>CrazyJim1</author>
	<datestamp>1264954620000</datestamp>
	<modclass>Redundant</modclass>
	<modscore>0</modscore>
	<htmltext>Thats no moon.</htmltext>
<tokenext>Thats no moon .</tokentext>
<sentencetext>Thats no moon.</sentencetext>
	<parent>http://www.semanticweb.org/ontologies/ConversationInstances.owl#comment10_01_31_2327234.30976074</parent>
</comment>
<comment>
	<id>http://www.semanticweb.org/ontologies/ConversationInstances.owl#comment10_01_31_2327234.30981000</id>
	<title>Re:You've raised $130 out of $7500</title>
	<author>laederkeps</author>
	<datestamp>1265039340000</datestamp>
	<modclass>None</modclass>
	<modscore>1</modscore>
	<htmltext><p><div class="quote"><p>You know, that's a bizarre occurance.  Slashdot takes down sites so much the name has become a verb.  Yet, nobody reads the article before posting.  How do <b>so many</b> geeks manage that?  I mean, I post my knee-jerk reactions to a site, but at least I have the courtesy to not cost them bandwidth.</p></div><p>There's your answer. Those who make comments don't read the articles. Those who read the articles don't comment.<br>
I didn't RTFA.</p></div>
	</htmltext>
<tokenext>You know , that 's a bizarre occurance .
Slashdot takes down sites so much the name has become a verb .
Yet , nobody reads the article before posting .
How do so many geeks manage that ?
I mean , I post my knee-jerk reactions to a site , but at least I have the courtesy to not cost them bandwidth.There 's your answer .
Those who make comments do n't read the articles .
Those who read the articles do n't comment .
I did n't RTFA .</tokentext>
<sentencetext>You know, that's a bizarre occurance.
Slashdot takes down sites so much the name has become a verb.
Yet, nobody reads the article before posting.
How do so many geeks manage that?
I mean, I post my knee-jerk reactions to a site, but at least I have the courtesy to not cost them bandwidth.There's your answer.
Those who make comments don't read the articles.
Those who read the articles don't comment.
I didn't RTFA.
	</sentencetext>
	<parent>http://www.semanticweb.org/ontologies/ConversationInstances.owl#comment10_01_31_2327234.30977472</parent>
</comment>
<comment>
	<id>http://www.semanticweb.org/ontologies/ConversationInstances.owl#comment10_01_31_2327234.30977150</id>
	<title>Existing OSS SW to fly to the moon?</title>
	<author>Anonymous</author>
	<datestamp>1264957320000</datestamp>
	<modclass>None</modclass>
	<modscore>0</modscore>
	<htmltext><p>If you're interested in seeing open-source engineering software for getting to the moon, looks like the people developing it will be *you*. That wasn't part of your plan? What exactly is your plan, and how is it "open source" if that's not the case?</p></htmltext>
<tokenext>If you 're interested in seeing open-source engineering software for getting to the moon , looks like the people developing it will be * you * .
That was n't part of your plan ?
What exactly is your plan , and how is it " open source " if that 's not the case ?</tokentext>
<sentencetext>If you're interested in seeing open-source engineering software for getting to the moon, looks like the people developing it will be *you*.
That wasn't part of your plan?
What exactly is your plan, and how is it "open source" if that's not the case?</sentencetext>
</comment>
<comment>
	<id>http://www.semanticweb.org/ontologies/ConversationInstances.owl#comment10_01_31_2327234.30975300</id>
	<title>sounds like a scam</title>
	<author>Anonymous</author>
	<datestamp>1264942080000</datestamp>
	<modclass>None</modclass>
	<modscore>0</modscore>
	<htmltext><p>This sounds like a scam.  At least these people, both the OP and the people they're trying to convince to give them money,  haven't thought through the entire ordeal.</p></htmltext>
<tokenext>This sounds like a scam .
At least these people , both the OP and the people they 're trying to convince to give them money , have n't thought through the entire ordeal .</tokentext>
<sentencetext>This sounds like a scam.
At least these people, both the OP and the people they're trying to convince to give them money,  haven't thought through the entire ordeal.</sentencetext>
</comment>
<comment>
	<id>http://www.semanticweb.org/ontologies/ConversationInstances.owl#comment10_01_31_2327234.30978734</id>
	<title>I think this is a troll</title>
	<author>Anonymous</author>
	<datestamp>1265019840000</datestamp>
	<modclass>None</modclass>
	<modscore>0</modscore>
	<htmltext><p>I think this is a troll trying to claim that one cannot get specialist CAD software as FOSS.</p><p>Apart from the fact that one actually CAN:</p><p>http://brlcad.org/<br>http://sourceforge.net/apps/mediawiki/free-cad/index.php?title=Main\_Page</p><p>It should also be noted that one can get very good commercial CAD software for a FOSS OS:</p><p>http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/VariCAD<br>http://www.varicad.com/en/home/</p></htmltext>
<tokenext>I think this is a troll trying to claim that one can not get specialist CAD software as FOSS.Apart from the fact that one actually CAN : http : //brlcad.org/http : //sourceforge.net/apps/mediawiki/free-cad/index.php ? title = Main \ _PageIt should also be noted that one can get very good commercial CAD software for a FOSS OS : http : //en.wikipedia.org/wiki/VariCADhttp : //www.varicad.com/en/home/</tokentext>
<sentencetext>I think this is a troll trying to claim that one cannot get specialist CAD software as FOSS.Apart from the fact that one actually CAN:http://brlcad.org/http://sourceforge.net/apps/mediawiki/free-cad/index.php?title=Main\_PageIt should also be noted that one can get very good commercial CAD software for a FOSS OS:http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/VariCADhttp://www.varicad.com/en/home/</sentencetext>
</comment>
<comment>
	<id>http://www.semanticweb.org/ontologies/ConversationInstances.owl#comment10_01_31_2327234.30978668</id>
	<title>Re:You've raised $130 out of $7500</title>
	<author>daffmeister</author>
	<datestamp>1265019000000</datestamp>
	<modclass>None</modclass>
	<modscore>1</modscore>
	<htmltext><p>Well, the delays to updating the site might have something to do with the fact that the <a href="http://www.openluna.org/team.php" title="openluna.org">web-master is currently operating out of the Sahara desert in Morocco</a> [openluna.org] (go to the bottom of the page).</p></htmltext>
<tokenext>Well , the delays to updating the site might have something to do with the fact that the web-master is currently operating out of the Sahara desert in Morocco [ openluna.org ] ( go to the bottom of the page ) .</tokentext>
<sentencetext>Well, the delays to updating the site might have something to do with the fact that the web-master is currently operating out of the Sahara desert in Morocco [openluna.org] (go to the bottom of the page).</sentencetext>
	<parent>http://www.semanticweb.org/ontologies/ConversationInstances.owl#comment10_01_31_2327234.30975208</parent>
</comment>
<comment>
	<id>http://www.semanticweb.org/ontologies/ConversationInstances.owl#comment10_01_31_2327234.30977744</id>
	<title>Re:You've raised $130 out of $7500</title>
	<author>GF678</author>
	<datestamp>1264963140000</datestamp>
	<modclass>Insightful</modclass>
	<modscore>4</modscore>
	<htmltext><blockquote><div><p>They probably thought "Hey, why don't we just cobble together a small web presence in case anyone wants to donate any money or otherwise contribute to our project. Let's not spend much time on it though as our aim is space travel, not web development.</p></div></blockquote><p>The following I learnt the harsh way:</p><p>Image sells.</p><p>Present a nice image for your company, people will think better of you than a company which just slaps some crap together. Doesn't matter if the company with a crap website produces better product, image is important in getting the attention necessary for whatever goals you seek. It's the same reason why the geeks who get all the success are the ones who have learnt that social skills are more important than technical know-how.</p></div>
	</htmltext>
<tokenext>They probably thought " Hey , why do n't we just cobble together a small web presence in case anyone wants to donate any money or otherwise contribute to our project .
Let 's not spend much time on it though as our aim is space travel , not web development.The following I learnt the harsh way : Image sells.Present a nice image for your company , people will think better of you than a company which just slaps some crap together .
Does n't matter if the company with a crap website produces better product , image is important in getting the attention necessary for whatever goals you seek .
It 's the same reason why the geeks who get all the success are the ones who have learnt that social skills are more important than technical know-how .</tokentext>
<sentencetext>They probably thought "Hey, why don't we just cobble together a small web presence in case anyone wants to donate any money or otherwise contribute to our project.
Let's not spend much time on it though as our aim is space travel, not web development.The following I learnt the harsh way:Image sells.Present a nice image for your company, people will think better of you than a company which just slaps some crap together.
Doesn't matter if the company with a crap website produces better product, image is important in getting the attention necessary for whatever goals you seek.
It's the same reason why the geeks who get all the success are the ones who have learnt that social skills are more important than technical know-how.
	</sentencetext>
	<parent>http://www.semanticweb.org/ontologies/ConversationInstances.owl#comment10_01_31_2327234.30975886</parent>
</comment>
<comment>
	<id>http://www.semanticweb.org/ontologies/ConversationInstances.owl#comment10_01_31_2327234.30975870</id>
	<title>Next question...</title>
	<author>Anonymous</author>
	<datestamp>1264945740000</datestamp>
	<modclass>None</modclass>
	<modscore>0</modscore>
	<htmltext><p>Ok guys, thanx for the CAD recommendations.</p><p>now, I have to ask... can you sugest good books (preferable free) about calculus, differential equations, mechanics, and chemistry?</p></htmltext>
<tokenext>Ok guys , thanx for the CAD recommendations.now , I have to ask... can you sugest good books ( preferable free ) about calculus , differential equations , mechanics , and chemistry ?</tokentext>
<sentencetext>Ok guys, thanx for the CAD recommendations.now, I have to ask... can you sugest good books (preferable free) about calculus, differential equations, mechanics, and chemistry?</sentencetext>
</comment>
<comment>
	<id>http://www.semanticweb.org/ontologies/ConversationInstances.owl#comment10_01_31_2327234.30975482</id>
	<title>some earlier discussions</title>
	<author>Trepidity</author>
	<datestamp>1264943100000</datestamp>
	<modclass>Informativ</modclass>
	<modscore>3</modscore>
	<htmltext><p>In addition to the comments here, you might find useful suggestions in <a href="http://ask.slashdot.org/article.pl?sid=05/11/15/0214207" title="slashdot.org">this 2005</a> [slashdot.org] and <a href="http://ask.slashdot.org/article.pl?sid=03/12/19/0459232" title="slashdot.org">this 2003</a> [slashdot.org] Slashdot discussion.</p></htmltext>
<tokenext>In addition to the comments here , you might find useful suggestions in this 2005 [ slashdot.org ] and this 2003 [ slashdot.org ] Slashdot discussion .</tokentext>
<sentencetext>In addition to the comments here, you might find useful suggestions in this 2005 [slashdot.org] and this 2003 [slashdot.org] Slashdot discussion.</sentencetext>
</comment>
<comment>
	<id>http://www.semanticweb.org/ontologies/ConversationInstances.owl#comment10_01_31_2327234.30975998</id>
	<title>Obligatory...</title>
	<author>Third Position</author>
	<datestamp>1264946400000</datestamp>
	<modclass>None</modclass>
	<modscore>0</modscore>
	<htmltext><p><div class="quote"><p>Offtopic, but it needs to be asked any time somebody has a scheme like this: what's your business model?</p></div><p>1. Build website.<br>2. Whore it on Slashdot.<br>3. ?????<br>4. Profit!</p></div>
	</htmltext>
<tokenext>Offtopic , but it needs to be asked any time somebody has a scheme like this : what 's your business model ? 1 .
Build website.2 .
Whore it on Slashdot.3 .
? ? ? ? ? 4. Profit !</tokentext>
<sentencetext>Offtopic, but it needs to be asked any time somebody has a scheme like this: what's your business model?1.
Build website.2.
Whore it on Slashdot.3.
?????4. Profit!
	</sentencetext>
	<parent>http://www.semanticweb.org/ontologies/ConversationInstances.owl#comment10_01_31_2327234.30975574</parent>
</comment>
<comment>
	<id>http://www.semanticweb.org/ontologies/ConversationInstances.owl#comment10_01_31_2327234.30979524</id>
	<title>I have an idea!</title>
	<author>Anonymous</author>
	<datestamp>1265030220000</datestamp>
	<modclass>None</modclass>
	<modscore>0</modscore>
	<htmltext><p>It looks like you have others issues (money) than finding good CAD software. However, you need to model something that goes moon and back, using only few dollars. Try this :</p><p>http://www.x-plane.com/index\_desktop.html</p><p>It comes with advanced 3D modeller, moon and mars.<nobr> <wbr></nobr>:)</p></htmltext>
<tokenext>It looks like you have others issues ( money ) than finding good CAD software .
However , you need to model something that goes moon and back , using only few dollars .
Try this : http : //www.x-plane.com/index \ _desktop.htmlIt comes with advanced 3D modeller , moon and mars .
: )</tokentext>
<sentencetext>It looks like you have others issues (money) than finding good CAD software.
However, you need to model something that goes moon and back, using only few dollars.
Try this :http://www.x-plane.com/index\_desktop.htmlIt comes with advanced 3D modeller, moon and mars.
:)</sentencetext>
</comment>
<comment>
	<id>http://www.semanticweb.org/ontologies/ConversationInstances.owl#comment10_01_31_2327234.30977604</id>
	<title>Anybody know how hard it is to</title>
	<author>Anonymous</author>
	<datestamp>1264961640000</datestamp>
	<modclass>None</modclass>
	<modscore>0</modscore>
	<htmltext><p>write a decent looking website when your thirsty, and riding a camel?</p><p>"Katya designed and will continue to update and maintain the current OpenLuna website. She is currently operating from the Sahara Desert in Morocco."</p><p>Apparently very.</p></htmltext>
<tokenext>write a decent looking website when your thirsty , and riding a camel ?
" Katya designed and will continue to update and maintain the current OpenLuna website .
She is currently operating from the Sahara Desert in Morocco .
" Apparently very .</tokentext>
<sentencetext>write a decent looking website when your thirsty, and riding a camel?
"Katya designed and will continue to update and maintain the current OpenLuna website.
She is currently operating from the Sahara Desert in Morocco.
"Apparently very.</sentencetext>
</comment>
<comment>
	<id>http://www.semanticweb.org/ontologies/ConversationInstances.owl#comment10_01_31_2327234.30975446</id>
	<title>Use a probe</title>
	<author>quantumpineal</author>
	<datestamp>1264942980000</datestamp>
	<modclass>None</modclass>
	<modscore>1</modscore>
	<htmltext>Put a remote controlled or autonomous probe up there first. And try land near that weird castle thing on the dark side<nobr> <wbr></nobr>:P</htmltext>
<tokenext>Put a remote controlled or autonomous probe up there first .
And try land near that weird castle thing on the dark side : P</tokentext>
<sentencetext>Put a remote controlled or autonomous probe up there first.
And try land near that weird castle thing on the dark side :P</sentencetext>
</comment>
<comment>
	<id>http://www.semanticweb.org/ontologies/ConversationInstances.owl#comment10_01_31_2327234.30976074</id>
	<title>Re:Business model</title>
	<author>Anonymous</author>
	<datestamp>1264946940000</datestamp>
	<modclass>None</modclass>
	<modscore>1</modscore>
	<htmltext>I can see it now...in 500 years, there is no moon, because it has been mined by corporations for moon rocks.</htmltext>
<tokenext>I can see it now...in 500 years , there is no moon , because it has been mined by corporations for moon rocks .</tokentext>
<sentencetext>I can see it now...in 500 years, there is no moon, because it has been mined by corporations for moon rocks.</sentencetext>
	<parent>http://www.semanticweb.org/ontologies/ConversationInstances.owl#comment10_01_31_2327234.30975934</parent>
</comment>
<comment>
	<id>http://www.semanticweb.org/ontologies/ConversationInstances.owl#comment10_01_31_2327234.30975854</id>
	<title>Blender</title>
	<author>LetterRip</author>
	<datestamp>1264945680000</datestamp>
	<modclass>None</modclass>
	<modscore>1</modscore>
	<htmltext><p>If they didn't care for previous versions of Blender, they might want to try Blender 2.50alpha or a more recent test build (next testing build within 2 months), it is much more similar to maya and 3DS Max in layout and can have bindings customized.</p><p>LetterRip</p></htmltext>
<tokenext>If they did n't care for previous versions of Blender , they might want to try Blender 2.50alpha or a more recent test build ( next testing build within 2 months ) , it is much more similar to maya and 3DS Max in layout and can have bindings customized.LetterRip</tokentext>
<sentencetext>If they didn't care for previous versions of Blender, they might want to try Blender 2.50alpha or a more recent test build (next testing build within 2 months), it is much more similar to maya and 3DS Max in layout and can have bindings customized.LetterRip</sentencetext>
</comment>
<comment>
	<id>http://www.semanticweb.org/ontologies/ConversationInstances.owl#comment10_01_31_2327234.30976576</id>
	<title>Huh?</title>
	<author>socceroos</author>
	<datestamp>1264951020000</datestamp>
	<modclass>None</modclass>
	<modscore>1</modscore>
	<htmltext>Mark Shuttleworth, is that you?</htmltext>
<tokenext>Mark Shuttleworth , is that you ?</tokentext>
<sentencetext>Mark Shuttleworth, is that you?</sentencetext>
</comment>
<comment>
	<id>http://www.semanticweb.org/ontologies/ConversationInstances.owl#comment10_01_31_2327234.30978682</id>
	<title>Re:Several problems</title>
	<author>ALoopingIcon</author>
	<datestamp>1265019060000</datestamp>
	<modclass>None</modclass>
	<modscore>1</modscore>
	<htmltext>I do not completely agree with the above post.
While it is true that there are fields where the cost of the sw is not a real issue it is also true that some of these software niches are filled by FOSS tools. For example in 3D printing/rapid prototyping one of the best tools around for cleaning up models is an open source tool, called MeshLab ( <a href="http://meshlab.sourceforge.net/" title="sourceforge.net" rel="nofollow">http://meshlab.sourceforge.net/</a> [sourceforge.net] ) .</htmltext>
<tokenext>I do not completely agree with the above post .
While it is true that there are fields where the cost of the sw is not a real issue it is also true that some of these software niches are filled by FOSS tools .
For example in 3D printing/rapid prototyping one of the best tools around for cleaning up models is an open source tool , called MeshLab ( http : //meshlab.sourceforge.net/ [ sourceforge.net ] ) .</tokentext>
<sentencetext>I do not completely agree with the above post.
While it is true that there are fields where the cost of the sw is not a real issue it is also true that some of these software niches are filled by FOSS tools.
For example in 3D printing/rapid prototyping one of the best tools around for cleaning up models is an open source tool, called MeshLab ( http://meshlab.sourceforge.net/ [sourceforge.net] ) .</sentencetext>
	<parent>http://www.semanticweb.org/ontologies/ConversationInstances.owl#comment10_01_31_2327234.30975688</parent>
</comment>
<comment>
	<id>http://www.semanticweb.org/ontologies/ConversationInstances.owl#comment10_01_31_2327234.30975534</id>
	<title>Re:You've raised $130 out of $7500</title>
	<author>auntieNeo</author>
	<datestamp>1264943460000</datestamp>
	<modclass>Funny</modclass>
	<modscore>5</modscore>
	<htmltext><p><div class="quote"><p>Or is the a scheme to get money out of stupid geeks by driving traffic to your website?</p></div><p>Drive geeks to their website? Everyone knows<nobr> <wbr></nobr>/. readers don't RTFA.</p></div>
	</htmltext>
<tokenext>Or is the a scheme to get money out of stupid geeks by driving traffic to your website ? Drive geeks to their website ?
Everyone knows / .
readers do n't RTFA .</tokentext>
<sentencetext>Or is the a scheme to get money out of stupid geeks by driving traffic to your website?Drive geeks to their website?
Everyone knows /.
readers don't RTFA.
	</sentencetext>
	<parent>http://www.semanticweb.org/ontologies/ConversationInstances.owl#comment10_01_31_2327234.30975208</parent>
</comment>
<comment>
	<id>http://www.semanticweb.org/ontologies/ConversationInstances.owl#comment10_01_31_2327234.30979292</id>
	<title>Re:You've raised $130 out of $7500</title>
	<author>houghi</author>
	<datestamp>1265027580000</datestamp>
	<modclass>None</modclass>
	<modscore>1</modscore>
	<htmltext><blockquote><div><p>This female surgeon can't even cook bacon and eggs, what makes the bitch think she can take out my kidney?</p></div></blockquote><p>Reminds me of something that was actually asked at a docter who was becoming a surgeon. It went like "If you can not even control your hand to hold a pen and produce something readable, how do you think you can become a surgeon and not slice open things you should not?" Not sure what the answer was, but apparently sufficient to pass.</p></div>
	</htmltext>
<tokenext>This female surgeon ca n't even cook bacon and eggs , what makes the bitch think she can take out my kidney ? Reminds me of something that was actually asked at a docter who was becoming a surgeon .
It went like " If you can not even control your hand to hold a pen and produce something readable , how do you think you can become a surgeon and not slice open things you should not ?
" Not sure what the answer was , but apparently sufficient to pass .</tokentext>
<sentencetext>This female surgeon can't even cook bacon and eggs, what makes the bitch think she can take out my kidney?Reminds me of something that was actually asked at a docter who was becoming a surgeon.
It went like "If you can not even control your hand to hold a pen and produce something readable, how do you think you can become a surgeon and not slice open things you should not?
" Not sure what the answer was, but apparently sufficient to pass.
	</sentencetext>
	<parent>http://www.semanticweb.org/ontologies/ConversationInstances.owl#comment10_01_31_2327234.30975886</parent>
</comment>
<comment>
	<id>http://www.semanticweb.org/ontologies/ConversationInstances.owl#comment10_01_31_2327234.30977558</id>
	<title>Re:lol</title>
	<author>Homburg</author>
	<datestamp>1264961160000</datestamp>
	<modclass>None</modclass>
	<modscore>1</modscore>
	<htmltext><p><em>You have a fricken artist before having a real engineering team, or anything solid to promote.</em></p><p>Well, that makes sense to me. You need the artist to produce the concept materials to get people to invest the money so that you can employ an engineering team and produce something solid.</p></htmltext>
<tokenext>You have a fricken artist before having a real engineering team , or anything solid to promote.Well , that makes sense to me .
You need the artist to produce the concept materials to get people to invest the money so that you can employ an engineering team and produce something solid .</tokentext>
<sentencetext>You have a fricken artist before having a real engineering team, or anything solid to promote.Well, that makes sense to me.
You need the artist to produce the concept materials to get people to invest the money so that you can employ an engineering team and produce something solid.</sentencetext>
	<parent>http://www.semanticweb.org/ontologies/ConversationInstances.owl#comment10_01_31_2327234.30975558</parent>
</comment>
<comment>
	<id>http://www.semanticweb.org/ontologies/ConversationInstances.owl#comment10_01_31_2327234.30976230</id>
	<title>Re:You've raised $130 out of $7500</title>
	<author>sopssa</author>
	<datestamp>1264948200000</datestamp>
	<modclass>None</modclass>
	<modscore>1</modscore>
	<htmltext><p><div class="quote"><p> <a href="http://masten-space.com/" title="masten-space.com">Masten</a> [masten-space.com] </p></div><p><div class="quote"><p>Masten Space Systems will fly anything you want into space and back for $250/kg:</p></div><p>Not at all that pricey actually. Could easily launch a few pizzas there, just as a pleasant surprise for some astronauts walking by.</p><p>Launching myself would still be like $25 000 though, even if I go without a space suit.</p></div>
	</htmltext>
<tokenext>Masten [ masten-space.com ] Masten Space Systems will fly anything you want into space and back for $ 250/kg : Not at all that pricey actually .
Could easily launch a few pizzas there , just as a pleasant surprise for some astronauts walking by.Launching myself would still be like $ 25 000 though , even if I go without a space suit .</tokentext>
<sentencetext> Masten [masten-space.com] Masten Space Systems will fly anything you want into space and back for $250/kg:Not at all that pricey actually.
Could easily launch a few pizzas there, just as a pleasant surprise for some astronauts walking by.Launching myself would still be like $25 000 though, even if I go without a space suit.
	</sentencetext>
	<parent>http://www.semanticweb.org/ontologies/ConversationInstances.owl#comment10_01_31_2327234.30976012</parent>
</comment>
<comment>
	<id>http://www.semanticweb.org/ontologies/ConversationInstances.owl#comment10_01_31_2327234.30978544</id>
	<title>Re:Business model</title>
	<author>CAIMLAS</author>
	<datestamp>1265017500000</datestamp>
	<modclass>None</modclass>
	<modscore>1</modscore>
	<htmltext><p>If there were additional moon rock for sale, it would deflate its relative value. If multiple companies start doing it, funding from such a venture would cease to be possible.</p></htmltext>
<tokenext>If there were additional moon rock for sale , it would deflate its relative value .
If multiple companies start doing it , funding from such a venture would cease to be possible .</tokentext>
<sentencetext>If there were additional moon rock for sale, it would deflate its relative value.
If multiple companies start doing it, funding from such a venture would cease to be possible.</sentencetext>
	<parent>http://www.semanticweb.org/ontologies/ConversationInstances.owl#comment10_01_31_2327234.30976118</parent>
</comment>
<comment>
	<id>http://www.semanticweb.org/ontologies/ConversationInstances.owl#comment10_01_31_2327234.30975626</id>
	<title>Re:art people</title>
	<author>Blakey Rat</author>
	<datestamp>1264944060000</datestamp>
	<modclass>None</modclass>
	<modscore>1</modscore>
	<htmltext><p>I think the theory is to create spectacular-looking images to attract investors. Either that, or they're only faking a moon landing...</p></htmltext>
<tokenext>I think the theory is to create spectacular-looking images to attract investors .
Either that , or they 're only faking a moon landing.. .</tokentext>
<sentencetext>I think the theory is to create spectacular-looking images to attract investors.
Either that, or they're only faking a moon landing...</sentencetext>
	<parent>http://www.semanticweb.org/ontologies/ConversationInstances.owl#comment10_01_31_2327234.30975312</parent>
</comment>
<comment>
	<id>http://www.semanticweb.org/ontologies/ConversationInstances.owl#comment10_01_31_2327234.30976920</id>
	<title>to paraphrase the "up with people" song</title>
	<author>ClosedSource</author>
	<datestamp>1264955220000</datestamp>
	<modclass>None</modclass>
	<modscore>1</modscore>
	<htmltext><p>They used cheap engineering software and the moon-shot missed a mile,</p><p>The fellas in that rocket won't be back for quite a while.</p></htmltext>
<tokenext>They used cheap engineering software and the moon-shot missed a mile,The fellas in that rocket wo n't be back for quite a while .</tokentext>
<sentencetext>They used cheap engineering software and the moon-shot missed a mile,The fellas in that rocket won't be back for quite a while.</sentencetext>
</comment>
<comment>
	<id>http://www.semanticweb.org/ontologies/ConversationInstances.owl#comment10_01_31_2327234.30980800</id>
	<title>Re:You've raised $130 out of $7500</title>
	<author>KDR\_11k</author>
	<datestamp>1265038320000</datestamp>
	<modclass>None</modclass>
	<modscore>1</modscore>
	<htmltext><p>That does constitute evidence of WMDs though.</p></htmltext>
<tokenext>That does constitute evidence of WMDs though .</tokentext>
<sentencetext>That does constitute evidence of WMDs though.</sentencetext>
	<parent>http://www.semanticweb.org/ontologies/ConversationInstances.owl#comment10_01_31_2327234.30978332</parent>
</comment>
<comment>
	<id>http://www.semanticweb.org/ontologies/ConversationInstances.owl#comment10_01_31_2327234.30975558</id>
	<title>lol</title>
	<author>Anonymous</author>
	<datestamp>1264943580000</datestamp>
	<modclass>Insightful</modclass>
	<modscore>5</modscore>
	<htmltext><p>Is this a joke?  Your <a href="http://74.125.155.132/search?q=cache:pEhX4wxjJcQJ:www.openluna.org/team.php+/search\%3Fhl\%3Den\%26safe\%3Doff\%26client\%3Dsafari\%26rls\%3Den\%26q\%3D\%2Bsite:www.openluna.org\%2Bopenluna&amp;cd=1&amp;hl=en&amp;ct=clnk&amp;gl=us" title="74.125.155.132" rel="nofollow">team page</a> [74.125.155.132] shows you have at most four engineers, who are mostly IT geeks, not experts in propulsion, aerospace structures or astrodynamics, with the possible exception of Dr Snyder.  You have a <i>fricken artist</i> before having a real engineering team, or anything solid to promote.  You guys make <a href="http://armadilloaerospace.com/n.x/Armadillo/Home" title="armadilloaerospace.com" rel="nofollow">Armadillo Aerospace</a> [armadilloaerospace.com] look like Lockheed Martin.  At least SpaceX etc. while lacking other things, started with <i>something</i> (usually money), you guys don't have <i>anything</i>. Quit wasting your time.</p></htmltext>
<tokenext>Is this a joke ?
Your team page [ 74.125.155.132 ] shows you have at most four engineers , who are mostly IT geeks , not experts in propulsion , aerospace structures or astrodynamics , with the possible exception of Dr Snyder .
You have a fricken artist before having a real engineering team , or anything solid to promote .
You guys make Armadillo Aerospace [ armadilloaerospace.com ] look like Lockheed Martin .
At least SpaceX etc .
while lacking other things , started with something ( usually money ) , you guys do n't have anything .
Quit wasting your time .</tokentext>
<sentencetext>Is this a joke?
Your team page [74.125.155.132] shows you have at most four engineers, who are mostly IT geeks, not experts in propulsion, aerospace structures or astrodynamics, with the possible exception of Dr Snyder.
You have a fricken artist before having a real engineering team, or anything solid to promote.
You guys make Armadillo Aerospace [armadilloaerospace.com] look like Lockheed Martin.
At least SpaceX etc.
while lacking other things, started with something (usually money), you guys don't have anything.
Quit wasting your time.</sentencetext>
</comment>
<comment>
	<id>http://www.semanticweb.org/ontologies/ConversationInstances.owl#comment10_01_31_2327234.30976596</id>
	<title>Re:BRL-CAD</title>
	<author>pipingguy</author>
	<datestamp>1264951140000</datestamp>
	<modclass>Informativ</modclass>
	<modscore>2</modscore>
	<htmltext>I seem to remember that is was used for ballistic simulations for the Abrams tank.</htmltext>
<tokenext>I seem to remember that is was used for ballistic simulations for the Abrams tank .</tokentext>
<sentencetext>I seem to remember that is was used for ballistic simulations for the Abrams tank.</sentencetext>
	<parent>http://www.semanticweb.org/ontologies/ConversationInstances.owl#comment10_01_31_2327234.30975316</parent>
</comment>
<comment>
	<id>http://www.semanticweb.org/ontologies/ConversationInstances.owl#comment10_01_31_2327234.30976614</id>
	<title>Just bite the bullet and use ProE or Solidworks.</title>
	<author>Beltonius</author>
	<datestamp>1264951380000</datestamp>
	<modclass>None</modclass>
	<modscore>1</modscore>
	<htmltext>Post the models and analysis online - that's better in keeping with the ideal of a F/OSS project anyway. I use ProE professionally and had used Solidworks 2003-2007 while at school. ProE has all the required features and is improving with the UI, while Solidworks is the other way around. On the balance, they're both perfectly viable engineering tools.
<br> <br>
However, getting all the features included (assemblies, full GTOL support in drafting, harnesses, ECAD integration etc) while maintaining a vaguely usable UI seems to be currently beyond what FOSS projects can deliver. The CAD market is growing and highly competitive - and even then the professionally-developed software has trouble getting these things right. A couple of weeks ago I was involved with a plastic part redesign because the ECAD -&gt; ProE interface lost a couple capacitors in the translation and prototype parts ended up interfering.
<br> <br>
FEA and CAM are two other areas that require a significant amount of effort to get 'right'. ANSYS (FEA) has been developed since at least the 1980's and is still either 'easy to use' or 'fully featured'. CAM (CNC pathing, etc) is critical for prototyping components quickly and accurately.
<br> <br>
Add to all that, the fact that none of the open interchange CAD formats (STEP, IGES, STL for 3d) contain all/any of the metadata (parametric model data, dimensioning and tolerances, for example) that proprietary formats do. For CAD software to be useful, it must be able to interchange data with other systems - every company/effort will need to exchange CAD data with another at some point, to communicate with a partner, vendor, consultant etc.
<br> <br>
Long story short, proprietary CAD packages are the best ones available, which should be the real concern for a manned space program (since people's lives are clearly immediately at stake). They have the experienced people in the jobs market and the extensive knowledgebase needed to work through day-to-day problems. I can just google something to find out how I can do what I need to in ProE, or walk down the hall and talk to the guy who's been using it for 20 years. If I needed to submit a bug request and wait for a response and work-around, I wouldn't be able to do my job.</htmltext>
<tokenext>Post the models and analysis online - that 's better in keeping with the ideal of a F/OSS project anyway .
I use ProE professionally and had used Solidworks 2003-2007 while at school .
ProE has all the required features and is improving with the UI , while Solidworks is the other way around .
On the balance , they 're both perfectly viable engineering tools .
However , getting all the features included ( assemblies , full GTOL support in drafting , harnesses , ECAD integration etc ) while maintaining a vaguely usable UI seems to be currently beyond what FOSS projects can deliver .
The CAD market is growing and highly competitive - and even then the professionally-developed software has trouble getting these things right .
A couple of weeks ago I was involved with a plastic part redesign because the ECAD - &gt; ProE interface lost a couple capacitors in the translation and prototype parts ended up interfering .
FEA and CAM are two other areas that require a significant amount of effort to get 'right' .
ANSYS ( FEA ) has been developed since at least the 1980 's and is still either 'easy to use ' or 'fully featured' .
CAM ( CNC pathing , etc ) is critical for prototyping components quickly and accurately .
Add to all that , the fact that none of the open interchange CAD formats ( STEP , IGES , STL for 3d ) contain all/any of the metadata ( parametric model data , dimensioning and tolerances , for example ) that proprietary formats do .
For CAD software to be useful , it must be able to interchange data with other systems - every company/effort will need to exchange CAD data with another at some point , to communicate with a partner , vendor , consultant etc .
Long story short , proprietary CAD packages are the best ones available , which should be the real concern for a manned space program ( since people 's lives are clearly immediately at stake ) .
They have the experienced people in the jobs market and the extensive knowledgebase needed to work through day-to-day problems .
I can just google something to find out how I can do what I need to in ProE , or walk down the hall and talk to the guy who 's been using it for 20 years .
If I needed to submit a bug request and wait for a response and work-around , I would n't be able to do my job .</tokentext>
<sentencetext>Post the models and analysis online - that's better in keeping with the ideal of a F/OSS project anyway.
I use ProE professionally and had used Solidworks 2003-2007 while at school.
ProE has all the required features and is improving with the UI, while Solidworks is the other way around.
On the balance, they're both perfectly viable engineering tools.
However, getting all the features included (assemblies, full GTOL support in drafting, harnesses, ECAD integration etc) while maintaining a vaguely usable UI seems to be currently beyond what FOSS projects can deliver.
The CAD market is growing and highly competitive - and even then the professionally-developed software has trouble getting these things right.
A couple of weeks ago I was involved with a plastic part redesign because the ECAD -&gt; ProE interface lost a couple capacitors in the translation and prototype parts ended up interfering.
FEA and CAM are two other areas that require a significant amount of effort to get 'right'.
ANSYS (FEA) has been developed since at least the 1980's and is still either 'easy to use' or 'fully featured'.
CAM (CNC pathing, etc) is critical for prototyping components quickly and accurately.
Add to all that, the fact that none of the open interchange CAD formats (STEP, IGES, STL for 3d) contain all/any of the metadata (parametric model data, dimensioning and tolerances, for example) that proprietary formats do.
For CAD software to be useful, it must be able to interchange data with other systems - every company/effort will need to exchange CAD data with another at some point, to communicate with a partner, vendor, consultant etc.
Long story short, proprietary CAD packages are the best ones available, which should be the real concern for a manned space program (since people's lives are clearly immediately at stake).
They have the experienced people in the jobs market and the extensive knowledgebase needed to work through day-to-day problems.
I can just google something to find out how I can do what I need to in ProE, or walk down the hall and talk to the guy who's been using it for 20 years.
If I needed to submit a bug request and wait for a response and work-around, I wouldn't be able to do my job.</sentencetext>
</comment>
<comment>
	<id>http://www.semanticweb.org/ontologies/ConversationInstances.owl#comment10_01_31_2327234.30975318</id>
	<title>OSS CAD?</title>
	<author>Anonymous</author>
	<datestamp>1264942200000</datestamp>
	<modclass>Insightful</modclass>
	<modscore>1</modscore>
	<htmltext><p>You're kidding, right?  OSS CAD software is very amateurish and useless for any serious design purposes.</p><p>Drop your ideology and purchase some professionally developed proprietary software.</p></htmltext>
<tokenext>You 're kidding , right ?
OSS CAD software is very amateurish and useless for any serious design purposes.Drop your ideology and purchase some professionally developed proprietary software .</tokentext>
<sentencetext>You're kidding, right?
OSS CAD software is very amateurish and useless for any serious design purposes.Drop your ideology and purchase some professionally developed proprietary software.</sentencetext>
</comment>
<comment>
	<id>http://www.semanticweb.org/ontologies/ConversationInstances.owl#comment10_01_31_2327234.30976358</id>
	<title>Re:You've raised $130 out of $7500</title>
	<author>khallow</author>
	<datestamp>1264949100000</datestamp>
	<modclass>None</modclass>
	<modscore>1</modscore>
	<htmltext><p><div class="quote"><p>Offtopic, but it needs to be asked any time somebody has a scheme like this: what's your business model?</p></div><p>If it's a non-profit and they aren't looking to create a sustainable business, then they don't need a great business model. One very useful purpose for such organizations is risk retirement and technology demonstrations. They can try new technologies and approaches (here, if they're remotely serious, then they'll at least help explore the use of FOSS software for designing space projects). A more advanced non-profit that is actually doing stuff in space can explore common obstacles to space activities (like ISRU, teleoperations, how to do stuff in space on a shoestring budget, etc).<br> <br>

My thinking on this is simply that there are huge obstacles to space activities. Some like the cost of access to space are beyond the resources of a small organization to change. Others are simply things that haven't been tried yet (like communication/control of a space vehicle with off-the-shelf hardware and software). An organization like this might reduce the cost of low-end creation of space engineering designs for all future participants by a few hundred to few thousand dollars just with the proposed activity mentioned in the Slashdot summary.<br> <br>

Retiring risks like this reduce barrier of entry for new companies. Now, knocking $300 off a billion dollar in development costs is a drop in the ocean, but over the long term, retirement of risks can greatly reduce the cost of a startup or business expansion. For example, a good part of the reason why SpaceX and Scaled Composites had extremely cheap development programs for their respective vehicles is because of the research done by others (NASA, Roscosmos (and the Soviet predecessor), private US businesses, etc). The EELV program (Boeing and Lockheed building rockets, Delta IV and Atlas V with payloads in the 10-25 ton range) exists in part because the companies in question had figured out (and demonstrated to the US Department of Defense that they knew) how to design, develop, and launch rockets.</p></div>
	</htmltext>
<tokenext>Offtopic , but it needs to be asked any time somebody has a scheme like this : what 's your business model ? If it 's a non-profit and they are n't looking to create a sustainable business , then they do n't need a great business model .
One very useful purpose for such organizations is risk retirement and technology demonstrations .
They can try new technologies and approaches ( here , if they 're remotely serious , then they 'll at least help explore the use of FOSS software for designing space projects ) .
A more advanced non-profit that is actually doing stuff in space can explore common obstacles to space activities ( like ISRU , teleoperations , how to do stuff in space on a shoestring budget , etc ) .
My thinking on this is simply that there are huge obstacles to space activities .
Some like the cost of access to space are beyond the resources of a small organization to change .
Others are simply things that have n't been tried yet ( like communication/control of a space vehicle with off-the-shelf hardware and software ) .
An organization like this might reduce the cost of low-end creation of space engineering designs for all future participants by a few hundred to few thousand dollars just with the proposed activity mentioned in the Slashdot summary .
Retiring risks like this reduce barrier of entry for new companies .
Now , knocking $ 300 off a billion dollar in development costs is a drop in the ocean , but over the long term , retirement of risks can greatly reduce the cost of a startup or business expansion .
For example , a good part of the reason why SpaceX and Scaled Composites had extremely cheap development programs for their respective vehicles is because of the research done by others ( NASA , Roscosmos ( and the Soviet predecessor ) , private US businesses , etc ) .
The EELV program ( Boeing and Lockheed building rockets , Delta IV and Atlas V with payloads in the 10-25 ton range ) exists in part because the companies in question had figured out ( and demonstrated to the US Department of Defense that they knew ) how to design , develop , and launch rockets .</tokentext>
<sentencetext>Offtopic, but it needs to be asked any time somebody has a scheme like this: what's your business model?If it's a non-profit and they aren't looking to create a sustainable business, then they don't need a great business model.
One very useful purpose for such organizations is risk retirement and technology demonstrations.
They can try new technologies and approaches (here, if they're remotely serious, then they'll at least help explore the use of FOSS software for designing space projects).
A more advanced non-profit that is actually doing stuff in space can explore common obstacles to space activities (like ISRU, teleoperations, how to do stuff in space on a shoestring budget, etc).
My thinking on this is simply that there are huge obstacles to space activities.
Some like the cost of access to space are beyond the resources of a small organization to change.
Others are simply things that haven't been tried yet (like communication/control of a space vehicle with off-the-shelf hardware and software).
An organization like this might reduce the cost of low-end creation of space engineering designs for all future participants by a few hundred to few thousand dollars just with the proposed activity mentioned in the Slashdot summary.
Retiring risks like this reduce barrier of entry for new companies.
Now, knocking $300 off a billion dollar in development costs is a drop in the ocean, but over the long term, retirement of risks can greatly reduce the cost of a startup or business expansion.
For example, a good part of the reason why SpaceX and Scaled Composites had extremely cheap development programs for their respective vehicles is because of the research done by others (NASA, Roscosmos (and the Soviet predecessor), private US businesses, etc).
The EELV program (Boeing and Lockheed building rockets, Delta IV and Atlas V with payloads in the 10-25 ton range) exists in part because the companies in question had figured out (and demonstrated to the US Department of Defense that they knew) how to design, develop, and launch rockets.
	</sentencetext>
	<parent>http://www.semanticweb.org/ontologies/ConversationInstances.owl#comment10_01_31_2327234.30975574</parent>
</comment>
<comment>
	<id>http://www.semanticweb.org/ontologies/ConversationInstances.owl#comment10_01_31_2327234.30977918</id>
	<title>Re:Business model</title>
	<author>barfy</author>
	<datestamp>1264965720000</datestamp>
	<modclass>None</modclass>
	<modscore>1</modscore>
	<htmltext><p>for 2000 dollars a gram, it better get me REALLY fucking high!</p></htmltext>
<tokenext>for 2000 dollars a gram , it better get me REALLY fucking high !</tokentext>
<sentencetext>for 2000 dollars a gram, it better get me REALLY fucking high!</sentencetext>
	<parent>http://www.semanticweb.org/ontologies/ConversationInstances.owl#comment10_01_31_2327234.30975934</parent>
</comment>
<comment>
	<id>http://www.semanticweb.org/ontologies/ConversationInstances.owl#comment10_01_31_2327234.30975798</id>
	<title>There's a price going open source</title>
	<author>Anonymous</author>
	<datestamp>1264945260000</datestamp>
	<modclass>None</modclass>
	<modscore>0</modscore>
	<htmltext><p>Most of the graphics and CAD software that are open source just don't stack up. It's like Blender. Why is anyone still using the pro packages given what Blender can do for free? Ever tried to use Blender? It'll have you run screaming for Maya before the day is out. Most open source graphics software is more about what the programmers want than the end users. There's some amazing open source software like Open Office, I'd pay for it quicker than Microsoft Office. Gimp is perfectly usable so long as you aren't doing high end graphics for publishing. Blender represents the clunky end of open source for me. If you're honestly trying to do designs that some day may be built I'd find a way to get pro software like Solid Works. Converting models for graphic is a pain but I have done it before. At least you can output files ready for CNC mills or rapid prototyping. It even does a nice job of rendering for graphics and it's easier to use than Blender for rendering. I know we're supposed to be pro open source but there are times when there simply aren't options that make sense. Most high end CAD softwares have roots going back 20 years or more. Open source still needs to catch up.</p></htmltext>
<tokenext>Most of the graphics and CAD software that are open source just do n't stack up .
It 's like Blender .
Why is anyone still using the pro packages given what Blender can do for free ?
Ever tried to use Blender ?
It 'll have you run screaming for Maya before the day is out .
Most open source graphics software is more about what the programmers want than the end users .
There 's some amazing open source software like Open Office , I 'd pay for it quicker than Microsoft Office .
Gimp is perfectly usable so long as you are n't doing high end graphics for publishing .
Blender represents the clunky end of open source for me .
If you 're honestly trying to do designs that some day may be built I 'd find a way to get pro software like Solid Works .
Converting models for graphic is a pain but I have done it before .
At least you can output files ready for CNC mills or rapid prototyping .
It even does a nice job of rendering for graphics and it 's easier to use than Blender for rendering .
I know we 're supposed to be pro open source but there are times when there simply are n't options that make sense .
Most high end CAD softwares have roots going back 20 years or more .
Open source still needs to catch up .</tokentext>
<sentencetext>Most of the graphics and CAD software that are open source just don't stack up.
It's like Blender.
Why is anyone still using the pro packages given what Blender can do for free?
Ever tried to use Blender?
It'll have you run screaming for Maya before the day is out.
Most open source graphics software is more about what the programmers want than the end users.
There's some amazing open source software like Open Office, I'd pay for it quicker than Microsoft Office.
Gimp is perfectly usable so long as you aren't doing high end graphics for publishing.
Blender represents the clunky end of open source for me.
If you're honestly trying to do designs that some day may be built I'd find a way to get pro software like Solid Works.
Converting models for graphic is a pain but I have done it before.
At least you can output files ready for CNC mills or rapid prototyping.
It even does a nice job of rendering for graphics and it's easier to use than Blender for rendering.
I know we're supposed to be pro open source but there are times when there simply aren't options that make sense.
Most high end CAD softwares have roots going back 20 years or more.
Open source still needs to catch up.</sentencetext>
</comment>
<comment>
	<id>http://www.semanticweb.org/ontologies/ConversationInstances.owl#comment10_01_31_2327234.30984266</id>
	<title>Re:lol</title>
	<author>Anonymous</author>
	<datestamp>1265052240000</datestamp>
	<modclass>None</modclass>
	<modscore>0</modscore>
	<htmltext><p><div class="quote"><p>Stop wining and come help.</p></div><p>Yeah, stop winning, it's making them look bad.</p></div>
	</htmltext>
<tokenext>Stop wining and come help.Yeah , stop winning , it 's making them look bad .</tokentext>
<sentencetext>Stop wining and come help.Yeah, stop winning, it's making them look bad.
	</sentencetext>
	<parent>http://www.semanticweb.org/ontologies/ConversationInstances.owl#comment10_01_31_2327234.30977830</parent>
</comment>
<comment>
	<id>http://www.semanticweb.org/ontologies/ConversationInstances.owl#comment10_01_31_2327234.30976410</id>
	<title>Looking for 3D software to fake a moon landing</title>
	<author>Anonymous</author>
	<datestamp>1264949400000</datestamp>
	<modclass>None</modclass>
	<modscore>0</modscore>
	<htmltext><p>Anyone know any good 3D open source software to fake a moon landing?</p></htmltext>
<tokenext>Anyone know any good 3D open source software to fake a moon landing ?</tokentext>
<sentencetext>Anyone know any good 3D open source software to fake a moon landing?</sentencetext>
</comment>
<comment>
	<id>http://www.semanticweb.org/ontologies/ConversationInstances.owl#comment10_01_31_2327234.30977880</id>
	<title>They need a building.</title>
	<author>Animats</author>
	<datestamp>1264965180000</datestamp>
	<modclass>None</modclass>
	<modscore>1</modscore>
	<htmltext><p>
I once met the CEO of Rotary Rocket (remember them? SSTO?)  He told me that people started taking him seriously after they built their own <a href="http://wilhelm-aerospace.org/Photos/grand-tour-2003/105-roton-hangar-dark.jpg" title="wilhelm-aerospace.org">vertical assembly building</a> [wilhelm-aerospace.org] at Mojave.
</p><p>
Rotary Rocket failed because the proposed ultra-light rotary engine didn't work, and the off-the-shelf engine they substituted was too heavy to make it to orbit.</p></htmltext>
<tokenext>I once met the CEO of Rotary Rocket ( remember them ?
SSTO ? ) He told me that people started taking him seriously after they built their own vertical assembly building [ wilhelm-aerospace.org ] at Mojave .
Rotary Rocket failed because the proposed ultra-light rotary engine did n't work , and the off-the-shelf engine they substituted was too heavy to make it to orbit .</tokentext>
<sentencetext>
I once met the CEO of Rotary Rocket (remember them?
SSTO?)  He told me that people started taking him seriously after they built their own vertical assembly building [wilhelm-aerospace.org] at Mojave.
Rotary Rocket failed because the proposed ultra-light rotary engine didn't work, and the off-the-shelf engine they substituted was too heavy to make it to orbit.</sentencetext>
	<parent>http://www.semanticweb.org/ontologies/ConversationInstances.owl#comment10_01_31_2327234.30975558</parent>
</comment>
<comment>
	<id>http://www.semanticweb.org/ontologies/ConversationInstances.owl#comment10_01_31_2327234.30979572</id>
	<title>Re:Business model</title>
	<author>Mikkeles</author>
	<datestamp>1265030820000</datestamp>
	<modclass>None</modclass>
	<modscore>1</modscore>
	<htmltext><p>Maybe so, but that scenario seems not to have affected the price of diamonds.</p></htmltext>
<tokenext>Maybe so , but that scenario seems not to have affected the price of diamonds .</tokentext>
<sentencetext>Maybe so, but that scenario seems not to have affected the price of diamonds.</sentencetext>
	<parent>http://www.semanticweb.org/ontologies/ConversationInstances.owl#comment10_01_31_2327234.30976726</parent>
</comment>
<comment>
	<id>http://www.semanticweb.org/ontologies/ConversationInstances.owl#comment10_01_31_2327234.30978206</id>
	<title>Re:Business model</title>
	<author>fractoid</author>
	<datestamp>1265056260000</datestamp>
	<modclass>None</modclass>
	<modscore>1</modscore>
	<htmltext><p><div class="quote"><p>When you start bringing in those rocks by the ton, price will drop significantly. Nobody is going to pay $2000 per gram when they know you're sitting on 5 tons of that stuff. They'll just wait until you are forced to sell at a lower price.</p></div><p>That's why you don't do a NASA-scale expedition and bring back a ton. You do a small-scale automated mission to bring back a couple of kilos, and you do it on a shoestring budget, and you sell it 1g-5g at a time on your website.</p></div>
	</htmltext>
<tokenext>When you start bringing in those rocks by the ton , price will drop significantly .
Nobody is going to pay $ 2000 per gram when they know you 're sitting on 5 tons of that stuff .
They 'll just wait until you are forced to sell at a lower price.That 's why you do n't do a NASA-scale expedition and bring back a ton .
You do a small-scale automated mission to bring back a couple of kilos , and you do it on a shoestring budget , and you sell it 1g-5g at a time on your website .</tokentext>
<sentencetext>When you start bringing in those rocks by the ton, price will drop significantly.
Nobody is going to pay $2000 per gram when they know you're sitting on 5 tons of that stuff.
They'll just wait until you are forced to sell at a lower price.That's why you don't do a NASA-scale expedition and bring back a ton.
You do a small-scale automated mission to bring back a couple of kilos, and you do it on a shoestring budget, and you sell it 1g-5g at a time on your website.
	</sentencetext>
	<parent>http://www.semanticweb.org/ontologies/ConversationInstances.owl#comment10_01_31_2327234.30976726</parent>
</comment>
<comment>
	<id>http://www.semanticweb.org/ontologies/ConversationInstances.owl#comment10_01_31_2327234.30976170</id>
	<title>Re:Several problems</title>
	<author>LetterRip</author>
	<datestamp>1264947540000</datestamp>
	<modclass>None</modclass>
	<modscore>1</modscore>
	<htmltext><blockquote><div><p>First, engineering software is a very specialized beast in exactly the wrong way to exist as a FOSS project. For FOSS projects to exist you first need someone who is capable of doing the programing. Then they have to have a need that they want to fulfill. And they can't need it urgently enough that simply going out any buying a working package makes sense. None of this describes the type of people who are trying to design next-generation parts of anything.</p><p>That describes some, but not all FOSS tools.  In CAD and FEA tools there are government and research facility sponsored tools.</p><p><a href="http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/List\_of\_finite\_element\_software\_packages" title="wikipedia.org">http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/List\_of\_finite\_element\_software\_packages</a> [wikipedia.org] </p><blockquote><div><p>It comes down to this: if you have the funding to actually make anything that you plan on designing you have the funding that paying for a high quality industry standard package is peanuts. And if you don't have the funding then it doesn't matter, does it?</p></div></blockquote><p>The exact same thing was said for feature film animation.  The first feature film done almost entirely with Blender premieres in a month <a href="http://www.blendernation.com/plumiferos-to-premiere-on-februari-18th/" title="blendernation.com">http://www.blendernation.com/plumiferos-to-premiere-on-februari-18th/</a> [blendernation.com]</p><p>It isn't to the same quality as Avatar or a typical Pixar film, however Blender was to a productive quality and production speed to get the job done.</p><blockquote><div><p>It's the same reason that film and television production has always been happy to pick up FOSS solutions that already work but have never particularly cared about developing them. If you are operating at the professional level where you need these tools the cost of them is almost meaningless. It something that always confuses GIMP and Blender supporters who view it as personal software. For them shelling out $5000 a pop for software is such a big deal and they can never understand how the pros don't seem to care.</p></div></blockquote><p>Actually the reason is more due to a established pipeline, the majority of the available workforce is already trained in the existing tools, and until recently the productivity of the tools was not competitive, among other issues.  You should see a dramitic shift to Blender usage over the next 10 years, since it is becoming in widespread usage in universities.</p><p>[quote]However, beyond the FOSS issue what you are trying to do will not work. Period. These types of software packages are very specialized for specific types of work and beyond a basic level are no good beyond that. 3D modeling software such as Blender or AoI (or Maya or Lightwave or 3DS Max...) are not CAD software. They are not even remotely CAD software. Yes, they appear superficially similar but they are NOT. 3D modeling software is intended to fake the appearance of large numbers of real objects. CAD software is intended to do what is basically visual math. 3D modeling packages have margins of error built in. Many of them will auto-round any equations or numbers entered. As such they are not suitable for real-world design of any complexity.[/quote]</p><p>Precision is definitely an issue when comparing a 3D Animation package to CAD.  That said, precision is actually a fairly solvable problem.  And as long as the work is not done in drastically different scales in the same file adequate accuracy can be maintained.</p><p>That said it is far from clear from his description what they are trying to do.  Ie I'd assume that they are not going to be outputting this to a 3D printer etc.</p><blockquote><div><p>The types of data that CAD and modeling software generate are also not particularly similar. If you try and just toss engineering blueprints into animation software your artists will not thank you are the end result will look like ass. CAD tends to have too much and the wrong type of detail where animation software is looking for simplification and tends to simplify areas that need detail to look proper once animated. It takes almost more work to clean up a CAD model for animation that it takes to create one from scratch.</p></div></blockquote><p>It is fairly common to import DXFs into Blender for arch viz/mechanical viz, that is probably what about 60\% of those employed using Blender are doing.  Some rework and clean up is needed.</p></div><div class="quote"><p>You can't really even send a CAD design right to a 3D printer without a significant amount of clean-up unless it was designed with that in mind.</p></div><div><p>You can send a blender exporter STL file directly to a 3D printer though.</p></div><div class="quote"><p>So, to summarize, decide what you want each section of your operation to do and shell out the cash for whatever it takes to let them do it properly. Let everyone worry about their own needs and don't try and meddle by forcing the internal needs of other departments on them. If you were seriously planning on saving costs by not buying professional software for an AEROSPACE project then you are already fucked. You may as well blow all the investor's money on a massive party because it's lost anyways.</p></div><div><p>There are plenty of places where brains and sweat are in greater supply than cash.  I suspect that what can be put together in terms of free software is greatly superior to the computer tools used for most of the history of the space program and most of the history of aerospace engineering.</p><p>LetterRip</p></div></blockquote></div>
	</htmltext>
<tokenext>First , engineering software is a very specialized beast in exactly the wrong way to exist as a FOSS project .
For FOSS projects to exist you first need someone who is capable of doing the programing .
Then they have to have a need that they want to fulfill .
And they ca n't need it urgently enough that simply going out any buying a working package makes sense .
None of this describes the type of people who are trying to design next-generation parts of anything.That describes some , but not all FOSS tools .
In CAD and FEA tools there are government and research facility sponsored tools.http : //en.wikipedia.org/wiki/List \ _of \ _finite \ _element \ _software \ _packages [ wikipedia.org ] It comes down to this : if you have the funding to actually make anything that you plan on designing you have the funding that paying for a high quality industry standard package is peanuts .
And if you do n't have the funding then it does n't matter , does it ? The exact same thing was said for feature film animation .
The first feature film done almost entirely with Blender premieres in a month http : //www.blendernation.com/plumiferos-to-premiere-on-februari-18th/ [ blendernation.com ] It is n't to the same quality as Avatar or a typical Pixar film , however Blender was to a productive quality and production speed to get the job done.It 's the same reason that film and television production has always been happy to pick up FOSS solutions that already work but have never particularly cared about developing them .
If you are operating at the professional level where you need these tools the cost of them is almost meaningless .
It something that always confuses GIMP and Blender supporters who view it as personal software .
For them shelling out $ 5000 a pop for software is such a big deal and they can never understand how the pros do n't seem to care.Actually the reason is more due to a established pipeline , the majority of the available workforce is already trained in the existing tools , and until recently the productivity of the tools was not competitive , among other issues .
You should see a dramitic shift to Blender usage over the next 10 years , since it is becoming in widespread usage in universities .
[ quote ] However , beyond the FOSS issue what you are trying to do will not work .
Period. These types of software packages are very specialized for specific types of work and beyond a basic level are no good beyond that .
3D modeling software such as Blender or AoI ( or Maya or Lightwave or 3DS Max... ) are not CAD software .
They are not even remotely CAD software .
Yes , they appear superficially similar but they are NOT .
3D modeling software is intended to fake the appearance of large numbers of real objects .
CAD software is intended to do what is basically visual math .
3D modeling packages have margins of error built in .
Many of them will auto-round any equations or numbers entered .
As such they are not suitable for real-world design of any complexity .
[ /quote ] Precision is definitely an issue when comparing a 3D Animation package to CAD .
That said , precision is actually a fairly solvable problem .
And as long as the work is not done in drastically different scales in the same file adequate accuracy can be maintained.That said it is far from clear from his description what they are trying to do .
Ie I 'd assume that they are not going to be outputting this to a 3D printer etc.The types of data that CAD and modeling software generate are also not particularly similar .
If you try and just toss engineering blueprints into animation software your artists will not thank you are the end result will look like ass .
CAD tends to have too much and the wrong type of detail where animation software is looking for simplification and tends to simplify areas that need detail to look proper once animated .
It takes almost more work to clean up a CAD model for animation that it takes to create one from scratch.It is fairly common to import DXFs into Blender for arch viz/mechanical viz , that is probably what about 60 \ % of those employed using Blender are doing .
Some rework and clean up is needed.You ca n't really even send a CAD design right to a 3D printer without a significant amount of clean-up unless it was designed with that in mind.You can send a blender exporter STL file directly to a 3D printer though.So , to summarize , decide what you want each section of your operation to do and shell out the cash for whatever it takes to let them do it properly .
Let everyone worry about their own needs and do n't try and meddle by forcing the internal needs of other departments on them .
If you were seriously planning on saving costs by not buying professional software for an AEROSPACE project then you are already fucked .
You may as well blow all the investor 's money on a massive party because it 's lost anyways.There are plenty of places where brains and sweat are in greater supply than cash .
I suspect that what can be put together in terms of free software is greatly superior to the computer tools used for most of the history of the space program and most of the history of aerospace engineering.LetterRip</tokentext>
<sentencetext>First, engineering software is a very specialized beast in exactly the wrong way to exist as a FOSS project.
For FOSS projects to exist you first need someone who is capable of doing the programing.
Then they have to have a need that they want to fulfill.
And they can't need it urgently enough that simply going out any buying a working package makes sense.
None of this describes the type of people who are trying to design next-generation parts of anything.That describes some, but not all FOSS tools.
In CAD and FEA tools there are government and research facility sponsored tools.http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/List\_of\_finite\_element\_software\_packages [wikipedia.org] It comes down to this: if you have the funding to actually make anything that you plan on designing you have the funding that paying for a high quality industry standard package is peanuts.
And if you don't have the funding then it doesn't matter, does it?The exact same thing was said for feature film animation.
The first feature film done almost entirely with Blender premieres in a month http://www.blendernation.com/plumiferos-to-premiere-on-februari-18th/ [blendernation.com]It isn't to the same quality as Avatar or a typical Pixar film, however Blender was to a productive quality and production speed to get the job done.It's the same reason that film and television production has always been happy to pick up FOSS solutions that already work but have never particularly cared about developing them.
If you are operating at the professional level where you need these tools the cost of them is almost meaningless.
It something that always confuses GIMP and Blender supporters who view it as personal software.
For them shelling out $5000 a pop for software is such a big deal and they can never understand how the pros don't seem to care.Actually the reason is more due to a established pipeline, the majority of the available workforce is already trained in the existing tools, and until recently the productivity of the tools was not competitive, among other issues.
You should see a dramitic shift to Blender usage over the next 10 years, since it is becoming in widespread usage in universities.
[quote]However, beyond the FOSS issue what you are trying to do will not work.
Period. These types of software packages are very specialized for specific types of work and beyond a basic level are no good beyond that.
3D modeling software such as Blender or AoI (or Maya or Lightwave or 3DS Max...) are not CAD software.
They are not even remotely CAD software.
Yes, they appear superficially similar but they are NOT.
3D modeling software is intended to fake the appearance of large numbers of real objects.
CAD software is intended to do what is basically visual math.
3D modeling packages have margins of error built in.
Many of them will auto-round any equations or numbers entered.
As such they are not suitable for real-world design of any complexity.
[/quote]Precision is definitely an issue when comparing a 3D Animation package to CAD.
That said, precision is actually a fairly solvable problem.
And as long as the work is not done in drastically different scales in the same file adequate accuracy can be maintained.That said it is far from clear from his description what they are trying to do.
Ie I'd assume that they are not going to be outputting this to a 3D printer etc.The types of data that CAD and modeling software generate are also not particularly similar.
If you try and just toss engineering blueprints into animation software your artists will not thank you are the end result will look like ass.
CAD tends to have too much and the wrong type of detail where animation software is looking for simplification and tends to simplify areas that need detail to look proper once animated.
It takes almost more work to clean up a CAD model for animation that it takes to create one from scratch.It is fairly common to import DXFs into Blender for arch viz/mechanical viz, that is probably what about 60\% of those employed using Blender are doing.
Some rework and clean up is needed.You can't really even send a CAD design right to a 3D printer without a significant amount of clean-up unless it was designed with that in mind.You can send a blender exporter STL file directly to a 3D printer though.So, to summarize, decide what you want each section of your operation to do and shell out the cash for whatever it takes to let them do it properly.
Let everyone worry about their own needs and don't try and meddle by forcing the internal needs of other departments on them.
If you were seriously planning on saving costs by not buying professional software for an AEROSPACE project then you are already fucked.
You may as well blow all the investor's money on a massive party because it's lost anyways.There are plenty of places where brains and sweat are in greater supply than cash.
I suspect that what can be put together in terms of free software is greatly superior to the computer tools used for most of the history of the space program and most of the history of aerospace engineering.LetterRip
	</sentencetext>
	<parent>http://www.semanticweb.org/ontologies/ConversationInstances.owl#comment10_01_31_2327234.30975688</parent>
</comment>
<comment>
	<id>http://www.semanticweb.org/ontologies/ConversationInstances.owl#comment10_01_31_2327234.30975972</id>
	<title>The most serious post yet</title>
	<author>Overzeetop</author>
	<datestamp>1264946280000</datestamp>
	<modclass>Insightful</modclass>
	<modscore>4</modscore>
	<htmltext><p>The parent has given you the answer you don't want, but it is nonetheless the correct one. There are several intellicad based products which are fairly mature (BricsCAD, for example) which are also interoperable with commercial software to an extent. Still, they're even more limited than the commercial products - both in capability and in productivity.</p><p>It's been 10 years since I was in aerospace (NASA and Orbital Sciences, FWIW), but the big push at the time was Pro/Engineer.  They were, back in the late 90s, where AutoCAD is today. The learning curve was difficult and the software expensive - but it was damned impressive, and it got the job done on several complex geometry products.</p><p>It sounds like you're not going to the moon, but rather are exploring funding options and sources for a startup who's ultimate goal is intended to be a moon landing. If you were going to the moon, I would suggest you start looking at FEM and CFD modeling software for the structures (my area of expertise), and the myriad custom software bits for each of the critical components. I believe NASTRAN is open source, though I'm not aware of a GUI front end (which you will dearly want). FLAGRO (Also a NASA project) should be open source for fracture mechanics analysis, but it was really in its infancy when I left NASA.</p><p>This will sound funny, but you might want to go check with the amateur rocket guys to see what they're using. RockSIM is the gold standard for 6DOF simulations for rockets traveling up to the edge of space, if you're on a budget, but it's not open source. There is an OSS project very similar to RockSIM - I think it's called RASaero.</p><p>There has been a lot of money invested in creating tools for much of what you want to do - you'll be better served in the long run to leverage the closed source options, focusing on keeping \_your\_ IP free for anyone to use - if that's your intent. You can always give away your CADD - and most packages have output/converters to fully defined - of not OSS - formats.</p></htmltext>
<tokenext>The parent has given you the answer you do n't want , but it is nonetheless the correct one .
There are several intellicad based products which are fairly mature ( BricsCAD , for example ) which are also interoperable with commercial software to an extent .
Still , they 're even more limited than the commercial products - both in capability and in productivity.It 's been 10 years since I was in aerospace ( NASA and Orbital Sciences , FWIW ) , but the big push at the time was Pro/Engineer .
They were , back in the late 90s , where AutoCAD is today .
The learning curve was difficult and the software expensive - but it was damned impressive , and it got the job done on several complex geometry products.It sounds like you 're not going to the moon , but rather are exploring funding options and sources for a startup who 's ultimate goal is intended to be a moon landing .
If you were going to the moon , I would suggest you start looking at FEM and CFD modeling software for the structures ( my area of expertise ) , and the myriad custom software bits for each of the critical components .
I believe NASTRAN is open source , though I 'm not aware of a GUI front end ( which you will dearly want ) .
FLAGRO ( Also a NASA project ) should be open source for fracture mechanics analysis , but it was really in its infancy when I left NASA.This will sound funny , but you might want to go check with the amateur rocket guys to see what they 're using .
RockSIM is the gold standard for 6DOF simulations for rockets traveling up to the edge of space , if you 're on a budget , but it 's not open source .
There is an OSS project very similar to RockSIM - I think it 's called RASaero.There has been a lot of money invested in creating tools for much of what you want to do - you 'll be better served in the long run to leverage the closed source options , focusing on keeping \ _your \ _ IP free for anyone to use - if that 's your intent .
You can always give away your CADD - and most packages have output/converters to fully defined - of not OSS - formats .</tokentext>
<sentencetext>The parent has given you the answer you don't want, but it is nonetheless the correct one.
There are several intellicad based products which are fairly mature (BricsCAD, for example) which are also interoperable with commercial software to an extent.
Still, they're even more limited than the commercial products - both in capability and in productivity.It's been 10 years since I was in aerospace (NASA and Orbital Sciences, FWIW), but the big push at the time was Pro/Engineer.
They were, back in the late 90s, where AutoCAD is today.
The learning curve was difficult and the software expensive - but it was damned impressive, and it got the job done on several complex geometry products.It sounds like you're not going to the moon, but rather are exploring funding options and sources for a startup who's ultimate goal is intended to be a moon landing.
If you were going to the moon, I would suggest you start looking at FEM and CFD modeling software for the structures (my area of expertise), and the myriad custom software bits for each of the critical components.
I believe NASTRAN is open source, though I'm not aware of a GUI front end (which you will dearly want).
FLAGRO (Also a NASA project) should be open source for fracture mechanics analysis, but it was really in its infancy when I left NASA.This will sound funny, but you might want to go check with the amateur rocket guys to see what they're using.
RockSIM is the gold standard for 6DOF simulations for rockets traveling up to the edge of space, if you're on a budget, but it's not open source.
There is an OSS project very similar to RockSIM - I think it's called RASaero.There has been a lot of money invested in creating tools for much of what you want to do - you'll be better served in the long run to leverage the closed source options, focusing on keeping \_your\_ IP free for anyone to use - if that's your intent.
You can always give away your CADD - and most packages have output/converters to fully defined - of not OSS - formats.</sentencetext>
	<parent>http://www.semanticweb.org/ontologies/ConversationInstances.owl#comment10_01_31_2327234.30975688</parent>
</comment>
<comment>
	<id>http://www.semanticweb.org/ontologies/ConversationInstances.owl#comment10_01_31_2327234.30976860</id>
	<title>Re:You've raised $130 out of $7500</title>
	<author>Ricken</author>
	<datestamp>1264954500000</datestamp>
	<modclass>None</modclass>
	<modscore>0</modscore>
	<htmltext>What website?</htmltext>
<tokenext>What website ?</tokentext>
<sentencetext>What website?</sentencetext>
	<parent>http://www.semanticweb.org/ontologies/ConversationInstances.owl#comment10_01_31_2327234.30975534</parent>
</comment>
<comment>
	<id>http://www.semanticweb.org/ontologies/ConversationInstances.owl#comment10_01_31_2327234.30976180</id>
	<title>CAE Linux</title>
	<author>The\_Dougster</author>
	<datestamp>1264947720000</datestamp>
	<modclass>None</modclass>
	<modscore>1</modscore>
	<htmltext><p>There is one bright shining star in the otherwise empty void of free engineering software packages. I would suggest that you investigate <a href="http://www.caelinux.com/CMS/" title="caelinux.com">CAE Linux</a> [caelinux.com] . From their website </p><p><div class="quote"><p>Based on the open-source CAE softwares Salom&#233;, Code\_Aster, Code\_Saturne and OpenFOAM , you can load your CAD geometry in Salom&#233; and start partitionning and meshing your problem in just 5 minutes.</p></div><p>That being said, I'm a mechanical engineer, and I've messed around with CAE Linux, and this is *not* anything even close to what you get with Solidworks or Autodesk Inventor. While the FEA end is good, maybe even great, the modeling functionality is very basic and more akin to what you get with ANSYS or ALGOR rather than a full blown 3D drafting package. Nevertheless, its a great package for engineers and students who want to do some meshing and otherwise learn the basics of finite element analysis. The site even offers a standalone distribution of <a href="http://caelinux.com/CMS/index.php?option=com\_content&amp;task=view&amp;id=47&amp;Itemid=2" title="caelinux.com">Salome-Meca-2009.1</a> [caelinux.com] which is the core FEA bundle that comes with CAE Linux. I have successfully installed their blob in Gentoo into<nobr> <wbr></nobr>/opt and it runs on my system at least.</p><p>
As far as full featured free 3D drafting packages, there really isn't any such animal yet. Yes, I've tried BRL-CAD, and no, I wouldn't consider it to be a viable option. You're going to have to look towards some sort of professional CAD package for that. At home, I use <a href="http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/TurboCAD" title="wikipedia.org">TurboCAD</a> [wikipedia.org] as a reasonably full-featured yet relatively inexpensive solution. There are a great many lower priced 3D drafting packages out there, so look around.</p><p>And I must say, I really admire your ambition here... hope it works out for you.</p></div>
	</htmltext>
<tokenext>There is one bright shining star in the otherwise empty void of free engineering software packages .
I would suggest that you investigate CAE Linux [ caelinux.com ] .
From their website Based on the open-source CAE softwares Salom   , Code \ _Aster , Code \ _Saturne and OpenFOAM , you can load your CAD geometry in Salom   and start partitionning and meshing your problem in just 5 minutes.That being said , I 'm a mechanical engineer , and I 've messed around with CAE Linux , and this is * not * anything even close to what you get with Solidworks or Autodesk Inventor .
While the FEA end is good , maybe even great , the modeling functionality is very basic and more akin to what you get with ANSYS or ALGOR rather than a full blown 3D drafting package .
Nevertheless , its a great package for engineers and students who want to do some meshing and otherwise learn the basics of finite element analysis .
The site even offers a standalone distribution of Salome-Meca-2009.1 [ caelinux.com ] which is the core FEA bundle that comes with CAE Linux .
I have successfully installed their blob in Gentoo into /opt and it runs on my system at least .
As far as full featured free 3D drafting packages , there really is n't any such animal yet .
Yes , I 've tried BRL-CAD , and no , I would n't consider it to be a viable option .
You 're going to have to look towards some sort of professional CAD package for that .
At home , I use TurboCAD [ wikipedia.org ] as a reasonably full-featured yet relatively inexpensive solution .
There are a great many lower priced 3D drafting packages out there , so look around.And I must say , I really admire your ambition here... hope it works out for you .</tokentext>
<sentencetext>There is one bright shining star in the otherwise empty void of free engineering software packages.
I would suggest that you investigate CAE Linux [caelinux.com] .
From their website Based on the open-source CAE softwares Salomé, Code\_Aster, Code\_Saturne and OpenFOAM , you can load your CAD geometry in Salomé and start partitionning and meshing your problem in just 5 minutes.That being said, I'm a mechanical engineer, and I've messed around with CAE Linux, and this is *not* anything even close to what you get with Solidworks or Autodesk Inventor.
While the FEA end is good, maybe even great, the modeling functionality is very basic and more akin to what you get with ANSYS or ALGOR rather than a full blown 3D drafting package.
Nevertheless, its a great package for engineers and students who want to do some meshing and otherwise learn the basics of finite element analysis.
The site even offers a standalone distribution of Salome-Meca-2009.1 [caelinux.com] which is the core FEA bundle that comes with CAE Linux.
I have successfully installed their blob in Gentoo into /opt and it runs on my system at least.
As far as full featured free 3D drafting packages, there really isn't any such animal yet.
Yes, I've tried BRL-CAD, and no, I wouldn't consider it to be a viable option.
You're going to have to look towards some sort of professional CAD package for that.
At home, I use TurboCAD [wikipedia.org] as a reasonably full-featured yet relatively inexpensive solution.
There are a great many lower priced 3D drafting packages out there, so look around.And I must say, I really admire your ambition here... hope it works out for you.
	</sentencetext>
</comment>
<comment>
	<id>http://www.semanticweb.org/ontologies/ConversationInstances.owl#comment10_01_31_2327234.30978664</id>
	<title>FOSS - the cheapest of the cheap OUTSOURCING</title>
	<author>Anonymous</author>
	<datestamp>1265018880000</datestamp>
	<modclass>None</modclass>
	<modscore>0</modscore>
	<htmltext><p>What fools works for free?  Oh, right, slashdot fools you fool you</p></htmltext>
<tokenext>What fools works for free ?
Oh , right , slashdot fools you fool you</tokentext>
<sentencetext>What fools works for free?
Oh, right, slashdot fools you fool you</sentencetext>
</comment>
<comment>
	<id>http://www.semanticweb.org/ontologies/ConversationInstances.owl#comment10_01_31_2327234.30976408</id>
	<title>Re:You've raised $130 out of $7500</title>
	<author>w0mprat</author>
	<datestamp>1264949400000</datestamp>
	<modclass>Funny</modclass>
	<modscore>3</modscore>
	<htmltext>Yet, if the websites were TOO slick and polished you wouldn't believe they were out there doing real work would you?</htmltext>
<tokenext>Yet , if the websites were TOO slick and polished you would n't believe they were out there doing real work would you ?</tokentext>
<sentencetext>Yet, if the websites were TOO slick and polished you wouldn't believe they were out there doing real work would you?</sentencetext>
	<parent>http://www.semanticweb.org/ontologies/ConversationInstances.owl#comment10_01_31_2327234.30975480</parent>
</comment>
<comment>
	<id>http://www.semanticweb.org/ontologies/ConversationInstances.owl#comment10_01_31_2327234.30976810</id>
	<title>NASA did this with NO CAD software</title>
	<author>maxrate</author>
	<datestamp>1264953900000</datestamp>
	<modclass>None</modclass>
	<modscore>1</modscore>
	<htmltext>Ah, NASA already put someone on the moon - WITHOUT CAD SOFTWARE.  Please, the costs of putting someone on the moon far exceed the cost of AutoCAD.  Splurge a little.</htmltext>
<tokenext>Ah , NASA already put someone on the moon - WITHOUT CAD SOFTWARE .
Please , the costs of putting someone on the moon far exceed the cost of AutoCAD .
Splurge a little .</tokentext>
<sentencetext>Ah, NASA already put someone on the moon - WITHOUT CAD SOFTWARE.
Please, the costs of putting someone on the moon far exceed the cost of AutoCAD.
Splurge a little.</sentencetext>
</comment>
<comment>
	<id>http://www.semanticweb.org/ontologies/ConversationInstances.owl#comment10_01_31_2327234.30993882</id>
	<title>Re:You've raised $130 out of $7500</title>
	<author>Rhaban</author>
	<datestamp>1265118720000</datestamp>
	<modclass>None</modclass>
	<modscore>1</modscore>
	<htmltext><p><div class="quote"><p>You know, that's a bizarre occurance.  Slashdot takes down sites so much the name has become a verb.  Yet, nobody reads the article before posting.  How do so many geeks manage that?  I mean, I post my knee-jerk reactions to a site, but at least I have the courtesy to not cost them bandwidth.</p></div><p>I usually open the link in a new tab, post a comment, then read the article (or just close the tab without reading it)</p></div>
	</htmltext>
<tokenext>You know , that 's a bizarre occurance .
Slashdot takes down sites so much the name has become a verb .
Yet , nobody reads the article before posting .
How do so many geeks manage that ?
I mean , I post my knee-jerk reactions to a site , but at least I have the courtesy to not cost them bandwidth.I usually open the link in a new tab , post a comment , then read the article ( or just close the tab without reading it )</tokentext>
<sentencetext>You know, that's a bizarre occurance.
Slashdot takes down sites so much the name has become a verb.
Yet, nobody reads the article before posting.
How do so many geeks manage that?
I mean, I post my knee-jerk reactions to a site, but at least I have the courtesy to not cost them bandwidth.I usually open the link in a new tab, post a comment, then read the article (or just close the tab without reading it)
	</sentencetext>
	<parent>http://www.semanticweb.org/ontologies/ConversationInstances.owl#comment10_01_31_2327234.30977472</parent>
</comment>
<comment>
	<id>http://www.semanticweb.org/ontologies/ConversationInstances.owl#comment10_01_31_2327234.30978190</id>
	<title>Re:Business model</title>
	<author>fractoid</author>
	<datestamp>1265055900000</datestamp>
	<modclass>None</modclass>
	<modscore>1</modscore>
	<htmltext><p><div class="quote"><p>If a company can bring 200 kilos of moon rocks back from the moon, a mission could pay for itself from sale of the rocks. Easily $2000 a gram, perhaps more if some more interesting specimens could be searched out and returned.</p></div><p>You're saying $2mil per kilogram? Taking inflation into account, that's more valuable than Unobtanium! O.o</p><p><div class="quote"><p>Ask yourself how much a kilogram of martian soil would sell for, too.</p></div><p>Depends whether you can convince Chinese businessmen that it'll give more yang to their wang.</p></div>
	</htmltext>
<tokenext>If a company can bring 200 kilos of moon rocks back from the moon , a mission could pay for itself from sale of the rocks .
Easily $ 2000 a gram , perhaps more if some more interesting specimens could be searched out and returned.You 're saying $ 2mil per kilogram ?
Taking inflation into account , that 's more valuable than Unobtanium !
O.oAsk yourself how much a kilogram of martian soil would sell for , too.Depends whether you can convince Chinese businessmen that it 'll give more yang to their wang .</tokentext>
<sentencetext>If a company can bring 200 kilos of moon rocks back from the moon, a mission could pay for itself from sale of the rocks.
Easily $2000 a gram, perhaps more if some more interesting specimens could be searched out and returned.You're saying $2mil per kilogram?
Taking inflation into account, that's more valuable than Unobtanium!
O.oAsk yourself how much a kilogram of martian soil would sell for, too.Depends whether you can convince Chinese businessmen that it'll give more yang to their wang.
	</sentencetext>
	<parent>http://www.semanticweb.org/ontologies/ConversationInstances.owl#comment10_01_31_2327234.30975934</parent>
</comment>
<comment>
	<id>http://www.semanticweb.org/ontologies/ConversationInstances.owl#comment10_01_31_2327234.30975208</id>
	<title>You've raised $130 out of $7500</title>
	<author>zonky</author>
	<datestamp>1264941600000</datestamp>
	<modclass>Informativ</modclass>
	<modscore>3</modscore>
	<htmltext>It looks like that campaign was supposed to end last year, on Dec 31st.

Why should we waste time answering your questions now, given the seemingly unrealistic goal, when you can't even format a donation box?

Or is the a scheme to get money out of stupid geeks by driving traffic to your website?</htmltext>
<tokenext>It looks like that campaign was supposed to end last year , on Dec 31st .
Why should we waste time answering your questions now , given the seemingly unrealistic goal , when you ca n't even format a donation box ?
Or is the a scheme to get money out of stupid geeks by driving traffic to your website ?</tokentext>
<sentencetext>It looks like that campaign was supposed to end last year, on Dec 31st.
Why should we waste time answering your questions now, given the seemingly unrealistic goal, when you can't even format a donation box?
Or is the a scheme to get money out of stupid geeks by driving traffic to your website?</sentencetext>
</comment>
<comment>
	<id>http://www.semanticweb.org/ontologies/ConversationInstances.owl#comment10_01_31_2327234.30976758</id>
	<title>Re:Business model</title>
	<author>adamkennedy</author>
	<datestamp>1264953120000</datestamp>
	<modclass>Informativ</modclass>
	<modscore>4</modscore>
	<htmltext><p>Supply, meet Demand.</p><p>Moon rocks are $2000 a gram because they are astonishly rare, something you'll happily be taking care of for us.</p><p>Your income isn't the price now, it's the area under the curve of the price as your 200 kilograms of rock drives the price down.</p></htmltext>
<tokenext>Supply , meet Demand.Moon rocks are $ 2000 a gram because they are astonishly rare , something you 'll happily be taking care of for us.Your income is n't the price now , it 's the area under the curve of the price as your 200 kilograms of rock drives the price down .</tokentext>
<sentencetext>Supply, meet Demand.Moon rocks are $2000 a gram because they are astonishly rare, something you'll happily be taking care of for us.Your income isn't the price now, it's the area under the curve of the price as your 200 kilograms of rock drives the price down.</sentencetext>
	<parent>http://www.semanticweb.org/ontologies/ConversationInstances.owl#comment10_01_31_2327234.30975934</parent>
</comment>
<comment>
	<id>http://www.semanticweb.org/ontologies/ConversationInstances.owl#comment10_01_31_2327234.30975688</id>
	<title>Several problems</title>
	<author>Telvin\_3d</author>
	<datestamp>1264944360000</datestamp>
	<modclass>Informativ</modclass>
	<modscore>5</modscore>
	<htmltext><p>Doesn't work, and I speak from experience. I have done work for the CSA (Canadian Space Agency) doing similar things and what you are looking for doesn't exist on all sorts of levels.</p><p>First, engineering software is a very specialized beast in exactly the wrong way to exist as a FOSS project. For FOSS projects to exist you first need someone who is capable of doing the programing. Then they have to have a need that they want to fulfill. And they can't need it urgently enough that simply going out any buying a working package makes sense. None of this describes the type of people who are trying to design next-generation parts of anything.</p><p>It comes down to this: if you have the funding to actually make anything that you plan on designing you have the funding that paying for a high quality industry standard package is peanuts. And if you don't have the funding then it doesn't matter, does it?</p><p>It's the same reason that film and television production has always been happy to pick up FOSS solutions that already work but have never particularly cared about developing them. If you are operating at the professional level where you need these tools the cost of them is almost meaningless. It something that always confuses GIMP and Blender supporters who view it as personal software. For them shelling out $5000 a pop for software is such a big deal and they can never understand how the pros don't seem to care.</p><p>If you are seriously attempting to design aerospace hardware then you have moved into the realm where these types of software costs are basically meaningless. Suck it up and act like it. If, however, you are actually trying to become a proof-of-concept for FOSS in engineering work then I wish you the best of luck. However, those are two different goals and likely not compatible.</p><p>However, beyond the FOSS issue what you are trying to do will not work. Period. These types of software packages are very specialized for specific types of work and beyond a basic level are no good beyond that. 3D modeling software such as Blender or AoI (or Maya or Lightwave or 3DS Max...) are not CAD software. They are not even remotely CAD software. Yes, they appear superficially similar but they are NOT. 3D modeling software is intended to fake the appearance of large numbers of real objects. CAD software is intended to do what is basically visual math. 3D modeling packages have margins of error built in. Many of them will auto-round any equations or numbers entered. As such they are not suitable for real-world design of any complexity.</p><p>The types of data that CAD and modeling software generate are also not particularly similar. If you try and just toss engineering blueprints into animation software your artists will not thank you are the end result will look like ass. CAD tends to have too much and the wrong type of detail where animation software is looking for simplification and tends to simplify areas that need detail to look proper once animated. It takes almost more work to clean up a CAD model for animation that it takes to create one from scratch.</p><p>You can't really even send a CAD design right to a 3D printer without a significant amount of clean-up unless it was designed with that in mind.</p><p>So, to summarize, decide what you want each section of your operation to do and shell out the cash for whatever it takes to let them do it properly. Let everyone worry about their own needs and don't try and meddle by forcing the internal needs of other departments on them. If you were seriously planning on saving costs by not buying professional software for an AEROSPACE project then you are already fucked. You may as well blow all the investor's money on a massive party because it's lost anyways.</p></htmltext>
<tokenext>Does n't work , and I speak from experience .
I have done work for the CSA ( Canadian Space Agency ) doing similar things and what you are looking for does n't exist on all sorts of levels.First , engineering software is a very specialized beast in exactly the wrong way to exist as a FOSS project .
For FOSS projects to exist you first need someone who is capable of doing the programing .
Then they have to have a need that they want to fulfill .
And they ca n't need it urgently enough that simply going out any buying a working package makes sense .
None of this describes the type of people who are trying to design next-generation parts of anything.It comes down to this : if you have the funding to actually make anything that you plan on designing you have the funding that paying for a high quality industry standard package is peanuts .
And if you do n't have the funding then it does n't matter , does it ? It 's the same reason that film and television production has always been happy to pick up FOSS solutions that already work but have never particularly cared about developing them .
If you are operating at the professional level where you need these tools the cost of them is almost meaningless .
It something that always confuses GIMP and Blender supporters who view it as personal software .
For them shelling out $ 5000 a pop for software is such a big deal and they can never understand how the pros do n't seem to care.If you are seriously attempting to design aerospace hardware then you have moved into the realm where these types of software costs are basically meaningless .
Suck it up and act like it .
If , however , you are actually trying to become a proof-of-concept for FOSS in engineering work then I wish you the best of luck .
However , those are two different goals and likely not compatible.However , beyond the FOSS issue what you are trying to do will not work .
Period. These types of software packages are very specialized for specific types of work and beyond a basic level are no good beyond that .
3D modeling software such as Blender or AoI ( or Maya or Lightwave or 3DS Max... ) are not CAD software .
They are not even remotely CAD software .
Yes , they appear superficially similar but they are NOT .
3D modeling software is intended to fake the appearance of large numbers of real objects .
CAD software is intended to do what is basically visual math .
3D modeling packages have margins of error built in .
Many of them will auto-round any equations or numbers entered .
As such they are not suitable for real-world design of any complexity.The types of data that CAD and modeling software generate are also not particularly similar .
If you try and just toss engineering blueprints into animation software your artists will not thank you are the end result will look like ass .
CAD tends to have too much and the wrong type of detail where animation software is looking for simplification and tends to simplify areas that need detail to look proper once animated .
It takes almost more work to clean up a CAD model for animation that it takes to create one from scratch.You ca n't really even send a CAD design right to a 3D printer without a significant amount of clean-up unless it was designed with that in mind.So , to summarize , decide what you want each section of your operation to do and shell out the cash for whatever it takes to let them do it properly .
Let everyone worry about their own needs and do n't try and meddle by forcing the internal needs of other departments on them .
If you were seriously planning on saving costs by not buying professional software for an AEROSPACE project then you are already fucked .
You may as well blow all the investor 's money on a massive party because it 's lost anyways .</tokentext>
<sentencetext>Doesn't work, and I speak from experience.
I have done work for the CSA (Canadian Space Agency) doing similar things and what you are looking for doesn't exist on all sorts of levels.First, engineering software is a very specialized beast in exactly the wrong way to exist as a FOSS project.
For FOSS projects to exist you first need someone who is capable of doing the programing.
Then they have to have a need that they want to fulfill.
And they can't need it urgently enough that simply going out any buying a working package makes sense.
None of this describes the type of people who are trying to design next-generation parts of anything.It comes down to this: if you have the funding to actually make anything that you plan on designing you have the funding that paying for a high quality industry standard package is peanuts.
And if you don't have the funding then it doesn't matter, does it?It's the same reason that film and television production has always been happy to pick up FOSS solutions that already work but have never particularly cared about developing them.
If you are operating at the professional level where you need these tools the cost of them is almost meaningless.
It something that always confuses GIMP and Blender supporters who view it as personal software.
For them shelling out $5000 a pop for software is such a big deal and they can never understand how the pros don't seem to care.If you are seriously attempting to design aerospace hardware then you have moved into the realm where these types of software costs are basically meaningless.
Suck it up and act like it.
If, however, you are actually trying to become a proof-of-concept for FOSS in engineering work then I wish you the best of luck.
However, those are two different goals and likely not compatible.However, beyond the FOSS issue what you are trying to do will not work.
Period. These types of software packages are very specialized for specific types of work and beyond a basic level are no good beyond that.
3D modeling software such as Blender or AoI (or Maya or Lightwave or 3DS Max...) are not CAD software.
They are not even remotely CAD software.
Yes, they appear superficially similar but they are NOT.
3D modeling software is intended to fake the appearance of large numbers of real objects.
CAD software is intended to do what is basically visual math.
3D modeling packages have margins of error built in.
Many of them will auto-round any equations or numbers entered.
As such they are not suitable for real-world design of any complexity.The types of data that CAD and modeling software generate are also not particularly similar.
If you try and just toss engineering blueprints into animation software your artists will not thank you are the end result will look like ass.
CAD tends to have too much and the wrong type of detail where animation software is looking for simplification and tends to simplify areas that need detail to look proper once animated.
It takes almost more work to clean up a CAD model for animation that it takes to create one from scratch.You can't really even send a CAD design right to a 3D printer without a significant amount of clean-up unless it was designed with that in mind.So, to summarize, decide what you want each section of your operation to do and shell out the cash for whatever it takes to let them do it properly.
Let everyone worry about their own needs and don't try and meddle by forcing the internal needs of other departments on them.
If you were seriously planning on saving costs by not buying professional software for an AEROSPACE project then you are already fucked.
You may as well blow all the investor's money on a massive party because it's lost anyways.</sentencetext>
</comment>
<comment>
	<id>http://www.semanticweb.org/ontologies/ConversationInstances.owl#comment10_01_31_2327234.30976980</id>
	<title>Very Viable Project.</title>
	<author>Anonymous</author>
	<datestamp>1264955820000</datestamp>
	<modclass>None</modclass>
	<modscore>1</modscore>
	<htmltext>Despite what everyone seems to be saying. I think I should point out two things. One, yes free CAD all sucks right now. Two this project is very viable. You just need to design and develop a concept, start a nest egg, begin investing in the projects future. If you can raise a few million dollars in the next couple of years, in fifty, or seventy-five years you'll have enough money to start building the mission. (You have to invest wisely, bank on the power of compound interest, and assume the cost of the mission will come down a couple orders of magnitude, but these aren't unreasonable assumptions.)</htmltext>
<tokenext>Despite what everyone seems to be saying .
I think I should point out two things .
One , yes free CAD all sucks right now .
Two this project is very viable .
You just need to design and develop a concept , start a nest egg , begin investing in the projects future .
If you can raise a few million dollars in the next couple of years , in fifty , or seventy-five years you 'll have enough money to start building the mission .
( You have to invest wisely , bank on the power of compound interest , and assume the cost of the mission will come down a couple orders of magnitude , but these are n't unreasonable assumptions .
)</tokentext>
<sentencetext>Despite what everyone seems to be saying.
I think I should point out two things.
One, yes free CAD all sucks right now.
Two this project is very viable.
You just need to design and develop a concept, start a nest egg, begin investing in the projects future.
If you can raise a few million dollars in the next couple of years, in fifty, or seventy-five years you'll have enough money to start building the mission.
(You have to invest wisely, bank on the power of compound interest, and assume the cost of the mission will come down a couple orders of magnitude, but these aren't unreasonable assumptions.
)</sentencetext>
</comment>
<comment>
	<id>http://www.semanticweb.org/ontologies/ConversationInstances.owl#comment10_01_31_2327234.30977638</id>
	<title>Ah you kids, you make me laugh</title>
	<author>Anonymous</author>
	<datestamp>1264962120000</datestamp>
	<modclass>None</modclass>
	<modscore>0</modscore>
	<htmltext><p>Ahahahahahahahahaha... ahahahahahahhahahahahahaaa! (deep breath) Ahahahahahahahahahahahahahahah ahahahaha ahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahaha</p><p>Yeah right... and your space rocket, I bet it looks like the ones in the tintin books. Are you making helmets out of ice cream tubs?</p><p>Ahahhahahahhahahahahahahahahahaha...</p></htmltext>
<tokenext>Ahahahahahahahahaha... ahahahahahahhahahahahahaaa ! ( deep breath ) Ahahahahahahahahahahahahahahah ahahahaha ahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahaYeah right... and your space rocket , I bet it looks like the ones in the tintin books .
Are you making helmets out of ice cream tubs ? Ahahhahahahhahahahahahahahahahaha.. .</tokentext>
<sentencetext>Ahahahahahahahahaha... ahahahahahahhahahahahahaaa! (deep breath) Ahahahahahahahahahahahahahahah ahahahaha ahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahaYeah right... and your space rocket, I bet it looks like the ones in the tintin books.
Are you making helmets out of ice cream tubs?Ahahhahahahhahahahahahahahahahaha...</sentencetext>
</comment>
<comment>
	<id>http://www.semanticweb.org/ontologies/ConversationInstances.owl#comment10_01_31_2327234.30983138</id>
	<title>Use the best - including out sourcing the hardware</title>
	<author>UnderCoverPenguin</author>
	<datestamp>1265047740000</datestamp>
	<modclass>None</modclass>
	<modscore>1</modscore>
	<htmltext><p>That's what the Artemis Project did (http://www.asi.org/adb/index.html). Their plan might actually have worked except it depended on using either the Titan IV or the Space Shuttle to get their trans-Lunar vehicle into LEO.</p><p>But they had the right ideas: Assemble existing components and sell the film rights. The SpaceHab modules were a great idea. Could still be <b>if</b> there were another launch vehicle that could carry a payload that large.</p><p>Nevertheless, their website appears to still have a lot of useful information on it,</p></htmltext>
<tokenext>That 's what the Artemis Project did ( http : //www.asi.org/adb/index.html ) .
Their plan might actually have worked except it depended on using either the Titan IV or the Space Shuttle to get their trans-Lunar vehicle into LEO.But they had the right ideas : Assemble existing components and sell the film rights .
The SpaceHab modules were a great idea .
Could still be if there were another launch vehicle that could carry a payload that large.Nevertheless , their website appears to still have a lot of useful information on it,</tokentext>
<sentencetext>That's what the Artemis Project did (http://www.asi.org/adb/index.html).
Their plan might actually have worked except it depended on using either the Titan IV or the Space Shuttle to get their trans-Lunar vehicle into LEO.But they had the right ideas: Assemble existing components and sell the film rights.
The SpaceHab modules were a great idea.
Could still be if there were another launch vehicle that could carry a payload that large.Nevertheless, their website appears to still have a lot of useful information on it,</sentencetext>
</comment>
<comment>
	<id>http://www.semanticweb.org/ontologies/ConversationInstances.owl#comment10_01_31_2327234.30975708</id>
	<title>site is dead</title>
	<author>Anonymous</author>
	<datestamp>1264944540000</datestamp>
	<modclass>Funny</modclass>
	<modscore>1</modscore>
	<htmltext><p>" privately funded, open source, manned"<nobr> <wbr></nobr>...you may now add "slashdotted"</p></htmltext>
<tokenext>" privately funded , open source , manned " ...you may now add " slashdotted "</tokentext>
<sentencetext>" privately funded, open source, manned" ...you may now add "slashdotted"</sentencetext>
</comment>
<comment>
	<id>http://www.semanticweb.org/ontologies/ConversationInstances.owl#comment10_01_31_2327234.30980622</id>
	<title>Re:Business model</title>
	<author>sensei moreh</author>
	<datestamp>1265037480000</datestamp>
	<modclass>None</modclass>
	<modscore>1</modscore>
	<htmltext>Have you ever looked at moon rocks?  For the most part, they look a lot like rocks one finds right here on Earth. I think $2K/g is a bit overpriced.</htmltext>
<tokenext>Have you ever looked at moon rocks ?
For the most part , they look a lot like rocks one finds right here on Earth .
I think $ 2K/g is a bit overpriced .</tokentext>
<sentencetext>Have you ever looked at moon rocks?
For the most part, they look a lot like rocks one finds right here on Earth.
I think $2K/g is a bit overpriced.</sentencetext>
	<parent>http://www.semanticweb.org/ontologies/ConversationInstances.owl#comment10_01_31_2327234.30975934</parent>
</comment>
<comment>
	<id>http://www.semanticweb.org/ontologies/ConversationInstances.owl#comment10_01_31_2327234.30977546</id>
	<title>Re:Business model</title>
	<author>Idiomatick</author>
	<datestamp>1264961040000</datestamp>
	<modclass>None</modclass>
	<modscore>1</modscore>
	<htmltext>Spacex has done it for well less than a billion. Not to the moon but they have put satellites into LEO and have lunar (orbit/impact, 4500kg) capabilities as well as a space ship to dock with the ISS... Times have changed<nobr> <wbr></nobr>:D<nobr> <wbr></nobr>...... Not to belittle the problems involved in actually landing on and getting off the moon. But I think they can manage.</htmltext>
<tokenext>Spacex has done it for well less than a billion .
Not to the moon but they have put satellites into LEO and have lunar ( orbit/impact , 4500kg ) capabilities as well as a space ship to dock with the ISS... Times have changed : D ...... Not to belittle the problems involved in actually landing on and getting off the moon .
But I think they can manage .</tokentext>
<sentencetext>Spacex has done it for well less than a billion.
Not to the moon but they have put satellites into LEO and have lunar (orbit/impact, 4500kg) capabilities as well as a space ship to dock with the ISS... Times have changed :D ...... Not to belittle the problems involved in actually landing on and getting off the moon.
But I think they can manage.</sentencetext>
	<parent>http://www.semanticweb.org/ontologies/ConversationInstances.owl#comment10_01_31_2327234.30976118</parent>
</comment>
<comment>
	<id>http://www.semanticweb.org/ontologies/ConversationInstances.owl#comment10_01_31_2327234.30976338</id>
	<title>Re:Several problems</title>
	<author>Anonymous</author>
	<datestamp>1264948980000</datestamp>
	<modclass>Insightful</modclass>
	<modscore>2</modscore>
	<htmltext>Thank you!

I keep telling people: When it comes to business DON'T F*CK AROUND! Get the RIGHT advice and the the tools from the pro's. If you do anything else, it will just look home made and no one will take you seriously.</htmltext>
<tokenext>Thank you !
I keep telling people : When it comes to business DO N'T F * CK AROUND !
Get the RIGHT advice and the the tools from the pro 's .
If you do anything else , it will just look home made and no one will take you seriously .</tokentext>
<sentencetext>Thank you!
I keep telling people: When it comes to business DON'T F*CK AROUND!
Get the RIGHT advice and the the tools from the pro's.
If you do anything else, it will just look home made and no one will take you seriously.</sentencetext>
	<parent>http://www.semanticweb.org/ontologies/ConversationInstances.owl#comment10_01_31_2327234.30975688</parent>
</comment>
<comment>
	<id>http://www.semanticweb.org/ontologies/ConversationInstances.owl#comment10_01_31_2327234.30975298</id>
	<title>gnu moon mission</title>
	<author>Anonymous</author>
	<datestamp>1264942080000</datestamp>
	<modclass>Funny</modclass>
	<modscore>2</modscore>
	<htmltext><p>Put a Stallman on the moon, Im shure you will get funding</p></htmltext>
<tokenext>Put a Stallman on the moon , Im shure you will get funding</tokentext>
<sentencetext>Put a Stallman on the moon, Im shure you will get funding</sentencetext>
</comment>
<comment>
	<id>http://www.semanticweb.org/ontologies/ConversationInstances.owl#comment10_01_31_2327234.30982776</id>
	<title>Computer Aided Engineering Linux</title>
	<author>Anonymous</author>
	<datestamp>1265046240000</datestamp>
	<modclass>None</modclass>
	<modscore>0</modscore>
	<htmltext><p>http://www.caelinux.com/CMS/</p><p>This distribution gives an excellent overview of which CAE applications exist for Linux.</p></htmltext>
<tokenext>http : //www.caelinux.com/CMS/This distribution gives an excellent overview of which CAE applications exist for Linux .</tokentext>
<sentencetext>http://www.caelinux.com/CMS/This distribution gives an excellent overview of which CAE applications exist for Linux.</sentencetext>
</comment>
<comment>
	<id>http://www.semanticweb.org/ontologies/ConversationInstances.owl#comment10_01_31_2327234.30989036</id>
	<title>My preference is mute</title>
	<author>Anonymous</author>
	<datestamp>1265027220000</datestamp>
	<modclass>None</modclass>
	<modscore>0</modscore>
	<htmltext><p><div class="quote"><p>What is your preference?</p></div><p>I prefer we send remote rovers or other machines up. They are a much lighter and work 24/7. Also they don't complain about lack of oxygen, water or food and rarely poop.</p><p>Why would we want to send living people up there again? Maybe to see if our new metal clubs can hit the balls further now? Seriously tho. We already did so and it was pointless (value way less then expense). Besides PR, why would we ever want to put humans on the moon again? Don't forget that the PR value of walking on the moon is almost 0\% compared to our first successes.</p><p>Now if you want to talk about getting satellites into space cheaply... there is something to discuss.</p></div>
	</htmltext>
<tokenext>What is your preference ? I prefer we send remote rovers or other machines up .
They are a much lighter and work 24/7 .
Also they do n't complain about lack of oxygen , water or food and rarely poop.Why would we want to send living people up there again ?
Maybe to see if our new metal clubs can hit the balls further now ?
Seriously tho .
We already did so and it was pointless ( value way less then expense ) .
Besides PR , why would we ever want to put humans on the moon again ?
Do n't forget that the PR value of walking on the moon is almost 0 \ % compared to our first successes.Now if you want to talk about getting satellites into space cheaply... there is something to discuss .</tokentext>
<sentencetext>What is your preference?I prefer we send remote rovers or other machines up.
They are a much lighter and work 24/7.
Also they don't complain about lack of oxygen, water or food and rarely poop.Why would we want to send living people up there again?
Maybe to see if our new metal clubs can hit the balls further now?
Seriously tho.
We already did so and it was pointless (value way less then expense).
Besides PR, why would we ever want to put humans on the moon again?
Don't forget that the PR value of walking on the moon is almost 0\% compared to our first successes.Now if you want to talk about getting satellites into space cheaply... there is something to discuss.
	</sentencetext>
</comment>
<comment>
	<id>http://www.semanticweb.org/ontologies/ConversationInstances.owl#comment10_01_31_2327234.30977622</id>
	<title>Re:lol</title>
	<author>Anonymous</author>
	<datestamp>1264961940000</datestamp>
	<modclass>None</modclass>
	<modscore>0</modscore>
	<htmltext><p>Say what you want about these jokers, but Armadillo Aerospace is nothing to be making fun of.<br>Carmack fanboyism aside, considering the time that they've been around, and the budget they have, they're doing great work.</p></htmltext>
<tokenext>Say what you want about these jokers , but Armadillo Aerospace is nothing to be making fun of.Carmack fanboyism aside , considering the time that they 've been around , and the budget they have , they 're doing great work .</tokentext>
<sentencetext>Say what you want about these jokers, but Armadillo Aerospace is nothing to be making fun of.Carmack fanboyism aside, considering the time that they've been around, and the budget they have, they're doing great work.</sentencetext>
	<parent>http://www.semanticweb.org/ontologies/ConversationInstances.owl#comment10_01_31_2327234.30975558</parent>
</comment>
<comment>
	<id>http://www.semanticweb.org/ontologies/ConversationInstances.owl#comment10_01_31_2327234.30985848</id>
	<title>Re:Business model</title>
	<author>Anonymous</author>
	<datestamp>1265015160000</datestamp>
	<modclass>None</modclass>
	<modscore>0</modscore>
	<htmltext><p>Or even better,  ask yourself what people would pay for a kilogram of cocaine from the moon.  At least its a product with some utility.</p></htmltext>
<tokenext>Or even better , ask yourself what people would pay for a kilogram of cocaine from the moon .
At least its a product with some utility .</tokentext>
<sentencetext>Or even better,  ask yourself what people would pay for a kilogram of cocaine from the moon.
At least its a product with some utility.</sentencetext>
	<parent>http://www.semanticweb.org/ontologies/ConversationInstances.owl#comment10_01_31_2327234.30975934</parent>
</comment>
<comment>
	<id>http://www.semanticweb.org/ontologies/ConversationInstances.owl#comment10_01_31_2327234.30975440</id>
	<title>Good CAD Sofware Is Hard</title>
	<author>Anonymous</author>
	<datestamp>1264942980000</datestamp>
	<modclass>None</modclass>
	<modscore>0</modscore>
	<htmltext><p>I think it will be a long time before there are competitive open source CAD tools.  BRL-CAD uses constructive solid geometry which is so horribly primitive that I never even bothered to download it.  Blender is not a CAD tool.  Thanks for the link to FreeCAD though.  I'll be checking that out right now.</p><p>Regards,<br>Jason</p></htmltext>
<tokenext>I think it will be a long time before there are competitive open source CAD tools .
BRL-CAD uses constructive solid geometry which is so horribly primitive that I never even bothered to download it .
Blender is not a CAD tool .
Thanks for the link to FreeCAD though .
I 'll be checking that out right now.Regards,Jason</tokentext>
<sentencetext>I think it will be a long time before there are competitive open source CAD tools.
BRL-CAD uses constructive solid geometry which is so horribly primitive that I never even bothered to download it.
Blender is not a CAD tool.
Thanks for the link to FreeCAD though.
I'll be checking that out right now.Regards,Jason</sentencetext>
</comment>
<comment>
	<id>http://www.semanticweb.org/ontologies/ConversationInstances.owl#comment10_01_31_2327234.30978828</id>
	<title>Advice:</title>
	<author>guyminuslife</author>
	<datestamp>1265021160000</datestamp>
	<modclass>Flamebait</modclass>
	<modscore>0</modscore>
	<htmltext><p>I had an idea like this once.</p><p>Then I threw away my Adderall prescription. And/or hit puberty.</p><p>Seriously, lay off the uppers.</p></htmltext>
<tokenext>I had an idea like this once.Then I threw away my Adderall prescription .
And/or hit puberty.Seriously , lay off the uppers .</tokentext>
<sentencetext>I had an idea like this once.Then I threw away my Adderall prescription.
And/or hit puberty.Seriously, lay off the uppers.</sentencetext>
</comment>
<comment>
	<id>http://www.semanticweb.org/ontologies/ConversationInstances.owl#comment10_01_31_2327234.30975302</id>
	<title>Is that so...</title>
	<author>Anonymous</author>
	<datestamp>1264942080000</datestamp>
	<modclass>Insightful</modclass>
	<modscore>5</modscore>
	<htmltext><p>"Yes really, and Yes, we really are going to put man (and woman) back on the moon"</p><p>No you're not.</p></htmltext>
<tokenext>" Yes really , and Yes , we really are going to put man ( and woman ) back on the moon " No you 're not .</tokentext>
<sentencetext>"Yes really, and Yes, we really are going to put man (and woman) back on the moon"No you're not.</sentencetext>
</comment>
<comment>
	<id>http://www.semanticweb.org/ontologies/ConversationInstances.owl#comment10_01_31_2327234.30978010</id>
	<title>Re:You've raised $130 out of $7500</title>
	<author>Paul server guy</author>
	<datestamp>1264966860000</datestamp>
	<modclass>None</modclass>
	<modscore>1</modscore>
	<htmltext><p><div class="quote"><p>They've got plenty of traffic now. Rather more than they can handle, it seems. If they can't build a web server that scales up, what makes them think they can build a spaceship?</p></div><p>Because they aren't necessarily related, and the guys who are doing the rocket science aren't the guys (well girl) handling the web space...</p><p><div class="quote"><p>Offtopic, but it needs to be asked any time somebody has a scheme like this: what's your business model? Because the big problem with space travel is that there's never been one. Yeah, yeah, if Congress hadn't cut off the tap, blah, blah, blah. The fact is that space travel is going to have to start paying for itself eventually. Otherwise you'll never see anything except political vanity projects like Apollo and the ISS. These do produce some good science and technological spinoffs, but never enough to justify the billions poured into them.</p></div><p>You Sir, are right. You have completely hit the nail on the head. Contrary to what the people below are saying, The tech is easy. (Well, Relatively so.) We have known how to do this for 40 years, what we don't know how to do, not even NASA knows how to do, is pay for it!</p><p>We have several business models, one for the Open and donated side of things, one for the pay for and get paid for side of things. (There will be hardware and services for sale. Hardware like toy rovers, usable Space/Lunar surface suits, outposts, (Call them quick assembling emergency, self sufficient housing), All sorts of goodies) right down to the simple NASCAR style "Pay me and I'll give you a big sticker on the hardware!"  We will indeed (Of course) sell samples, and seats to space, and in the outpost, etc...</p><p>Think about what America's Cup teams cost, or even NASCAR teams cost. This is certainly doable.</p><p>So, come by, donate some, and, for now, more importantly, come and volunteer.</p></div>
	</htmltext>
<tokenext>They 've got plenty of traffic now .
Rather more than they can handle , it seems .
If they ca n't build a web server that scales up , what makes them think they can build a spaceship ? Because they are n't necessarily related , and the guys who are doing the rocket science are n't the guys ( well girl ) handling the web space...Offtopic , but it needs to be asked any time somebody has a scheme like this : what 's your business model ?
Because the big problem with space travel is that there 's never been one .
Yeah , yeah , if Congress had n't cut off the tap , blah , blah , blah .
The fact is that space travel is going to have to start paying for itself eventually .
Otherwise you 'll never see anything except political vanity projects like Apollo and the ISS .
These do produce some good science and technological spinoffs , but never enough to justify the billions poured into them.You Sir , are right .
You have completely hit the nail on the head .
Contrary to what the people below are saying , The tech is easy .
( Well , Relatively so .
) We have known how to do this for 40 years , what we do n't know how to do , not even NASA knows how to do , is pay for it ! We have several business models , one for the Open and donated side of things , one for the pay for and get paid for side of things .
( There will be hardware and services for sale .
Hardware like toy rovers , usable Space/Lunar surface suits , outposts , ( Call them quick assembling emergency , self sufficient housing ) , All sorts of goodies ) right down to the simple NASCAR style " Pay me and I 'll give you a big sticker on the hardware !
" We will indeed ( Of course ) sell samples , and seats to space , and in the outpost , etc...Think about what America 's Cup teams cost , or even NASCAR teams cost .
This is certainly doable.So , come by , donate some , and , for now , more importantly , come and volunteer .</tokentext>
<sentencetext>They've got plenty of traffic now.
Rather more than they can handle, it seems.
If they can't build a web server that scales up, what makes them think they can build a spaceship?Because they aren't necessarily related, and the guys who are doing the rocket science aren't the guys (well girl) handling the web space...Offtopic, but it needs to be asked any time somebody has a scheme like this: what's your business model?
Because the big problem with space travel is that there's never been one.
Yeah, yeah, if Congress hadn't cut off the tap, blah, blah, blah.
The fact is that space travel is going to have to start paying for itself eventually.
Otherwise you'll never see anything except political vanity projects like Apollo and the ISS.
These do produce some good science and technological spinoffs, but never enough to justify the billions poured into them.You Sir, are right.
You have completely hit the nail on the head.
Contrary to what the people below are saying, The tech is easy.
(Well, Relatively so.
) We have known how to do this for 40 years, what we don't know how to do, not even NASA knows how to do, is pay for it!We have several business models, one for the Open and donated side of things, one for the pay for and get paid for side of things.
(There will be hardware and services for sale.
Hardware like toy rovers, usable Space/Lunar surface suits, outposts, (Call them quick assembling emergency, self sufficient housing), All sorts of goodies) right down to the simple NASCAR style "Pay me and I'll give you a big sticker on the hardware!
"  We will indeed (Of course) sell samples, and seats to space, and in the outpost, etc...Think about what America's Cup teams cost, or even NASCAR teams cost.
This is certainly doable.So, come by, donate some, and, for now, more importantly, come and volunteer.
	</sentencetext>
	<parent>http://www.semanticweb.org/ontologies/ConversationInstances.owl#comment10_01_31_2327234.30975574</parent>
</comment>
<comment>
	<id>http://www.semanticweb.org/ontologies/ConversationInstances.owl#comment10_01_31_2327234.30975828</id>
	<title>Re:gnu moon mission</title>
	<author>AstrumPreliator</author>
	<datestamp>1264945560000</datestamp>
	<modclass>Funny</modclass>
	<modscore>2</modscore>
	<htmltext>Yeah, but then they'd never get a woman on the moon!</htmltext>
<tokenext>Yeah , but then they 'd never get a woman on the moon !</tokentext>
<sentencetext>Yeah, but then they'd never get a woman on the moon!</sentencetext>
	<parent>http://www.semanticweb.org/ontologies/ConversationInstances.owl#comment10_01_31_2327234.30975298</parent>
</comment>
<comment>
	<id>http://www.semanticweb.org/ontologies/ConversationInstances.owl#comment10_01_31_2327234.30977998</id>
	<title>Re:OSS CAD?</title>
	<author>dbIII</author>
	<datestamp>1264966800000</datestamp>
	<modclass>None</modclass>
	<modscore>1</modscore>
	<htmltext><blockquote><div><p>You're kidding, right? OSS CAD software is very amateurish and useless for any serious design purposes.</p></div></blockquote><p>That is of course exactly what we used to say about AutoCAD when it was all a small company or poorly funded engineering school could afford.  Effort over time makes things useful for serious design purposes.  There may be something out there that fits the bill.</p></div>
	</htmltext>
<tokenext>You 're kidding , right ?
OSS CAD software is very amateurish and useless for any serious design purposes.That is of course exactly what we used to say about AutoCAD when it was all a small company or poorly funded engineering school could afford .
Effort over time makes things useful for serious design purposes .
There may be something out there that fits the bill .</tokentext>
<sentencetext>You're kidding, right?
OSS CAD software is very amateurish and useless for any serious design purposes.That is of course exactly what we used to say about AutoCAD when it was all a small company or poorly funded engineering school could afford.
Effort over time makes things useful for serious design purposes.
There may be something out there that fits the bill.
	</sentencetext>
	<parent>http://www.semanticweb.org/ontologies/ConversationInstances.owl#comment10_01_31_2327234.30975318</parent>
</comment>
<comment>
	<id>http://www.semanticweb.org/ontologies/ConversationInstances.owl#comment10_01_31_2327234.30976118</id>
	<title>Re:Business model</title>
	<author>TBoon</author>
	<datestamp>1264947180000</datestamp>
	<modclass>Interestin</modclass>
	<modscore>3</modscore>
	<htmltext><p><div class="quote"><p>The cost of the Apollo space program is commonly given as $25 billion. When adjusted to 2005 dollars this would approximate to $135 billion.</p></div><p>200.000g * $2000  = $400 million. Granted, there was a bunch of first-time research and pesky human requirements to take care of back then, so presumably an unmanned rock-collector should be cheaper. Wonder what the cost per mission would be, how many trips they would have to do before breaking even, and if they would have affected the price of moon-rocks enough to affect their revenue by then...</p></div>
	</htmltext>
<tokenext>The cost of the Apollo space program is commonly given as $ 25 billion .
When adjusted to 2005 dollars this would approximate to $ 135 billion.200.000g * $ 2000 = $ 400 million .
Granted , there was a bunch of first-time research and pesky human requirements to take care of back then , so presumably an unmanned rock-collector should be cheaper .
Wonder what the cost per mission would be , how many trips they would have to do before breaking even , and if they would have affected the price of moon-rocks enough to affect their revenue by then.. .</tokentext>
<sentencetext>The cost of the Apollo space program is commonly given as $25 billion.
When adjusted to 2005 dollars this would approximate to $135 billion.200.000g * $2000  = $400 million.
Granted, there was a bunch of first-time research and pesky human requirements to take care of back then, so presumably an unmanned rock-collector should be cheaper.
Wonder what the cost per mission would be, how many trips they would have to do before breaking even, and if they would have affected the price of moon-rocks enough to affect their revenue by then...
	</sentencetext>
	<parent>http://www.semanticweb.org/ontologies/ConversationInstances.owl#comment10_01_31_2327234.30975934</parent>
</comment>
<comment>
	<id>http://www.semanticweb.org/ontologies/ConversationInstances.owl#comment10_01_31_2327234.30976126</id>
	<title>Re:art people</title>
	<author>Anonymous</author>
	<datestamp>1264947300000</datestamp>
	<modclass>None</modclass>
	<modscore>0</modscore>
	<htmltext><p>Maybe this is article is an IQ test.  Anyone who replies with a serious suggestion or question gets put on some sort of mailing list to be sold to the likes of First Madoff Securities, Tahoe Finest Real Estate, The Pennsylvania Mint, etc.</p></htmltext>
<tokenext>Maybe this is article is an IQ test .
Anyone who replies with a serious suggestion or question gets put on some sort of mailing list to be sold to the likes of First Madoff Securities , Tahoe Finest Real Estate , The Pennsylvania Mint , etc .</tokentext>
<sentencetext>Maybe this is article is an IQ test.
Anyone who replies with a serious suggestion or question gets put on some sort of mailing list to be sold to the likes of First Madoff Securities, Tahoe Finest Real Estate, The Pennsylvania Mint, etc.</sentencetext>
	<parent>http://www.semanticweb.org/ontologies/ConversationInstances.owl#comment10_01_31_2327234.30975312</parent>
</comment>
<comment>
	<id>http://www.semanticweb.org/ontologies/ConversationInstances.owl#comment10_01_31_2327234.30977810</id>
	<title>Re:BRL-CAD</title>
	<author>Paul server guy</author>
	<datestamp>1264963980000</datestamp>
	<modclass>None</modclass>
	<modscore>1</modscore>
	<htmltext><p>Thank you...</p></htmltext>
<tokenext>Thank you.. .</tokentext>
<sentencetext>Thank you...</sentencetext>
	<parent>http://www.semanticweb.org/ontologies/ConversationInstances.owl#comment10_01_31_2327234.30975316</parent>
</comment>
<comment>
	<id>http://www.semanticweb.org/ontologies/ConversationInstances.owl#comment10_01_31_2327234.30978364</id>
	<title>Are you insane?</title>
	<author>Anonymous</author>
	<datestamp>1265015160000</datestamp>
	<modclass>Interestin</modclass>
	<modscore>4</modscore>
	<htmltext><p>I lived with Windows my entire life until I left college, and embraced the FOSS community. Taught myself Linux. Taught myself a lot of things over the years.<br>I honestly would bleed for the concept of FOSS. To me, it's like handing the first man to own a model T his own torque wrench- totally freeing him to do something<br>he's never done before, with something he'll be experiencing for the first time.</p><p>But I'm sorry, FOSS CAD &amp; Parametric CAD is total crap now, both from a usability and functionality standpoint. It's the one area that FOSS, I feel,<br>will never fill well. Why? 2 simple reasons:</p><p>1. User Interface- FOSS community, are you listening? Stop with all the damn menus. Learn how to make a decent GUI layer for some aspects of your<br>program. Even engineers are human- they need something to not only be easy to learn, but INTUITIVE. I'm not sugguesting it look like Fischer Price designed the<br>layout- just speak with a symbologist/iconographer. Seriously. Ask what your users do, and create usable icons and common actions.</p><p>Get over all your sanctimonious insistence on coding a program for numeric and input style- make even a single program with a decent GUI interface. Don't think I'm<br>calling out Linux people specifically- I use Autodesk Inventor 2010. Yes, legally. I learn it at a community college, and the new version is guilty of that too- older versions<br>had a more intuitive GUI. The new version takes a LOT of getting used to.</p><p>2. GOOD 3D support and rendering-</p><p>With all I've seen the FOSS community capable of in graphic rendering (blender, gimp, etc.), why do we lag so far behind in 3D processing? Gaming support famously<br>suffers massively, and along with it, decent parametric modeling in real time. I have yet to find any native FOSS CAD program, for any OS, that actually renders in 3D<br>well, or mostly, at all. This is something harder to fix. If the FOSS community could pool their resources to one massive program, like Shuttleworth did for Ubuntu, we<br>might have a chance. It's a Herculean task, and one I've seen FOSS struggle with for years.</p><p>I use Inventor now because it works (with a TERRIBLE interface in 2010), but in 3D mode, extrusion modeling/building makes part design like sculpting clay, one I understand<br>the commands. It's another ballgame entirely. I *WISH* I could do that with a FOSS program- bad GUI or no!</p><p>Inventor also has full kinematic modeling, for testing motion of interacting parts, and integrated stress analysis. Considering NASTRAN is coded in FORTRAN, if I remember<br>right, even stress analysis software is pretty proprietary, and noone has updated that on a massive scale since the 1960s! We're talking software initially developed for NASA,<br>and hasn't been re-coded in almost 50 YEARS. Fifty. If NASA can't fund it, who the hell can? (insert jokes about Richard Branson here)</p><p>3D CAD and such specialized software in FOSS has a long way to go. I hope I'm wrong. I have yet to see even one that was usable for extrusion style modeling, which almost<br>anyone can pick up easily once they know how to navigate the interface. Last FOSS CAD program I tried was Q-CAD- among many others like it, did no 3D, no extrusions,<br>and was a very poor UI. Did 2D well, but it, and many other small CAD programs in native Linux did the same thing. Hell, the only FOSS CAD I've ever seen that COULD do 3D<br>was by EmachineShop.com, and for free software, the rendering was decent- but the GUI is overly simple, only icons, very limited in modeling scope, and constantly had issues<br>with basic lines joining together.</p><p>I'm sure flames await me- as I am a basic, and probably average Linux user with almost no coding skills, but I have much experience hands-on with this style of software in<br>Windows AND Linux. And you know what, for a guy like me that reads<nobr> <wbr></nobr>/. daily, for 10 years, and has tried every program I could find in this area, I hope I'm wrong. I really do.<br>I hope I've only scratched the surface- but everything I've seen till now pales in comparison to Inventor. And with a UI as bad as it, that's pretty bad.</p></htmltext>
<tokenext>I lived with Windows my entire life until I left college , and embraced the FOSS community .
Taught myself Linux .
Taught myself a lot of things over the years.I honestly would bleed for the concept of FOSS .
To me , it 's like handing the first man to own a model T his own torque wrench- totally freeing him to do somethinghe 's never done before , with something he 'll be experiencing for the first time.But I 'm sorry , FOSS CAD &amp; Parametric CAD is total crap now , both from a usability and functionality standpoint .
It 's the one area that FOSS , I feel,will never fill well .
Why ? 2 simple reasons : 1 .
User Interface- FOSS community , are you listening ?
Stop with all the damn menus .
Learn how to make a decent GUI layer for some aspects of yourprogram .
Even engineers are human- they need something to not only be easy to learn , but INTUITIVE .
I 'm not sugguesting it look like Fischer Price designed thelayout- just speak with a symbologist/iconographer .
Seriously. Ask what your users do , and create usable icons and common actions.Get over all your sanctimonious insistence on coding a program for numeric and input style- make even a single program with a decent GUI interface .
Do n't think I'mcalling out Linux people specifically- I use Autodesk Inventor 2010 .
Yes , legally .
I learn it at a community college , and the new version is guilty of that too- older versionshad a more intuitive GUI .
The new version takes a LOT of getting used to.2 .
GOOD 3D support and rendering-With all I 've seen the FOSS community capable of in graphic rendering ( blender , gimp , etc .
) , why do we lag so far behind in 3D processing ?
Gaming support famouslysuffers massively , and along with it , decent parametric modeling in real time .
I have yet to find any native FOSS CAD program , for any OS , that actually renders in 3Dwell , or mostly , at all .
This is something harder to fix .
If the FOSS community could pool their resources to one massive program , like Shuttleworth did for Ubuntu , wemight have a chance .
It 's a Herculean task , and one I 've seen FOSS struggle with for years.I use Inventor now because it works ( with a TERRIBLE interface in 2010 ) , but in 3D mode , extrusion modeling/building makes part design like sculpting clay , one I understandthe commands .
It 's another ballgame entirely .
I * WISH * I could do that with a FOSS program- bad GUI or no ! Inventor also has full kinematic modeling , for testing motion of interacting parts , and integrated stress analysis .
Considering NASTRAN is coded in FORTRAN , if I rememberright , even stress analysis software is pretty proprietary , and noone has updated that on a massive scale since the 1960s !
We 're talking software initially developed for NASA,and has n't been re-coded in almost 50 YEARS .
Fifty. If NASA ca n't fund it , who the hell can ?
( insert jokes about Richard Branson here ) 3D CAD and such specialized software in FOSS has a long way to go .
I hope I 'm wrong .
I have yet to see even one that was usable for extrusion style modeling , which almostanyone can pick up easily once they know how to navigate the interface .
Last FOSS CAD program I tried was Q-CAD- among many others like it , did no 3D , no extrusions,and was a very poor UI .
Did 2D well , but it , and many other small CAD programs in native Linux did the same thing .
Hell , the only FOSS CAD I 've ever seen that COULD do 3Dwas by EmachineShop.com , and for free software , the rendering was decent- but the GUI is overly simple , only icons , very limited in modeling scope , and constantly had issueswith basic lines joining together.I 'm sure flames await me- as I am a basic , and probably average Linux user with almost no coding skills , but I have much experience hands-on with this style of software inWindows AND Linux .
And you know what , for a guy like me that reads / .
daily , for 10 years , and has tried every program I could find in this area , I hope I 'm wrong .
I really do.I hope I 've only scratched the surface- but everything I 've seen till now pales in comparison to Inventor .
And with a UI as bad as it , that 's pretty bad .</tokentext>
<sentencetext>I lived with Windows my entire life until I left college, and embraced the FOSS community.
Taught myself Linux.
Taught myself a lot of things over the years.I honestly would bleed for the concept of FOSS.
To me, it's like handing the first man to own a model T his own torque wrench- totally freeing him to do somethinghe's never done before, with something he'll be experiencing for the first time.But I'm sorry, FOSS CAD &amp; Parametric CAD is total crap now, both from a usability and functionality standpoint.
It's the one area that FOSS, I feel,will never fill well.
Why? 2 simple reasons:1.
User Interface- FOSS community, are you listening?
Stop with all the damn menus.
Learn how to make a decent GUI layer for some aspects of yourprogram.
Even engineers are human- they need something to not only be easy to learn, but INTUITIVE.
I'm not sugguesting it look like Fischer Price designed thelayout- just speak with a symbologist/iconographer.
Seriously. Ask what your users do, and create usable icons and common actions.Get over all your sanctimonious insistence on coding a program for numeric and input style- make even a single program with a decent GUI interface.
Don't think I'mcalling out Linux people specifically- I use Autodesk Inventor 2010.
Yes, legally.
I learn it at a community college, and the new version is guilty of that too- older versionshad a more intuitive GUI.
The new version takes a LOT of getting used to.2.
GOOD 3D support and rendering-With all I've seen the FOSS community capable of in graphic rendering (blender, gimp, etc.
), why do we lag so far behind in 3D processing?
Gaming support famouslysuffers massively, and along with it, decent parametric modeling in real time.
I have yet to find any native FOSS CAD program, for any OS, that actually renders in 3Dwell, or mostly, at all.
This is something harder to fix.
If the FOSS community could pool their resources to one massive program, like Shuttleworth did for Ubuntu, wemight have a chance.
It's a Herculean task, and one I've seen FOSS struggle with for years.I use Inventor now because it works (with a TERRIBLE interface in 2010), but in 3D mode, extrusion modeling/building makes part design like sculpting clay, one I understandthe commands.
It's another ballgame entirely.
I *WISH* I could do that with a FOSS program- bad GUI or no!Inventor also has full kinematic modeling, for testing motion of interacting parts, and integrated stress analysis.
Considering NASTRAN is coded in FORTRAN, if I rememberright, even stress analysis software is pretty proprietary, and noone has updated that on a massive scale since the 1960s!
We're talking software initially developed for NASA,and hasn't been re-coded in almost 50 YEARS.
Fifty. If NASA can't fund it, who the hell can?
(insert jokes about Richard Branson here)3D CAD and such specialized software in FOSS has a long way to go.
I hope I'm wrong.
I have yet to see even one that was usable for extrusion style modeling, which almostanyone can pick up easily once they know how to navigate the interface.
Last FOSS CAD program I tried was Q-CAD- among many others like it, did no 3D, no extrusions,and was a very poor UI.
Did 2D well, but it, and many other small CAD programs in native Linux did the same thing.
Hell, the only FOSS CAD I've ever seen that COULD do 3Dwas by EmachineShop.com, and for free software, the rendering was decent- but the GUI is overly simple, only icons, very limited in modeling scope, and constantly had issueswith basic lines joining together.I'm sure flames await me- as I am a basic, and probably average Linux user with almost no coding skills, but I have much experience hands-on with this style of software inWindows AND Linux.
And you know what, for a guy like me that reads /.
daily, for 10 years, and has tried every program I could find in this area, I hope I'm wrong.
I really do.I hope I've only scratched the surface- but everything I've seen till now pales in comparison to Inventor.
And with a UI as bad as it, that's pretty bad.</sentencetext>
</comment>
<comment>
	<id>http://www.semanticweb.org/ontologies/ConversationInstances.owl#comment10_01_31_2327234.30978456</id>
	<title>Re:You've raised $130 out of $7500</title>
	<author>mwvdlee</author>
	<datestamp>1265016540000</datestamp>
	<modclass>None</modclass>
	<modscore>1</modscore>
	<htmltext><p>But they're doing rocket-science design schematics in Blender; obviously they're on the right track.</p></htmltext>
<tokenext>But they 're doing rocket-science design schematics in Blender ; obviously they 're on the right track .</tokentext>
<sentencetext>But they're doing rocket-science design schematics in Blender; obviously they're on the right track.</sentencetext>
	<parent>http://www.semanticweb.org/ontologies/ConversationInstances.owl#comment10_01_31_2327234.30975208</parent>
</comment>
<comment>
	<id>http://www.semanticweb.org/ontologies/ConversationInstances.owl#comment10_01_31_2327234.30976726</id>
	<title>Re:Business model</title>
	<author>Diddlbiker</author>
	<datestamp>1264952700000</datestamp>
	<modclass>None</modclass>
	<modscore>1</modscore>
	<htmltext>The outrageous price for moonrocks is largely based on how incredible rare they are (<i>on earth, at least</i>).<br>
When you start bringing in those rocks by the ton, price will drop significantly. Nobody is going to pay $2000 per gram when they know you're sitting on 5 tons of that stuff. They'll just wait until you are forced to sell at a lower price.</htmltext>
<tokenext>The outrageous price for moonrocks is largely based on how incredible rare they are ( on earth , at least ) .
When you start bringing in those rocks by the ton , price will drop significantly .
Nobody is going to pay $ 2000 per gram when they know you 're sitting on 5 tons of that stuff .
They 'll just wait until you are forced to sell at a lower price .</tokentext>
<sentencetext>The outrageous price for moonrocks is largely based on how incredible rare they are (on earth, at least).
When you start bringing in those rocks by the ton, price will drop significantly.
Nobody is going to pay $2000 per gram when they know you're sitting on 5 tons of that stuff.
They'll just wait until you are forced to sell at a lower price.</sentencetext>
	<parent>http://www.semanticweb.org/ontologies/ConversationInstances.owl#comment10_01_31_2327234.30975934</parent>
</comment>
<comment>
	<id>http://www.semanticweb.org/ontologies/ConversationInstances.owl#comment10_01_31_2327234.30976634</id>
	<title>Re:Business model</title>
	<author>Anonymous</author>
	<datestamp>1264951680000</datestamp>
	<modclass>None</modclass>
	<modscore>0</modscore>
	<htmltext><p>Yes, but.. would it still be profitable AFTER the cost of taking it back with you is deducted?</p></htmltext>
<tokenext>Yes , but.. would it still be profitable AFTER the cost of taking it back with you is deducted ?</tokentext>
<sentencetext>Yes, but.. would it still be profitable AFTER the cost of taking it back with you is deducted?</sentencetext>
	<parent>http://www.semanticweb.org/ontologies/ConversationInstances.owl#comment10_01_31_2327234.30975934</parent>
</comment>
<comment>
	<id>http://www.semanticweb.org/ontologies/ConversationInstances.owl#comment10_01_31_2327234.30975588</id>
	<title>Re:gnu moon mission</title>
	<author>Anonymous</author>
	<datestamp>1264943700000</datestamp>
	<modclass>None</modclass>
	<modscore>1</modscore>
	<htmltext>Put Balmer there and you'll get way more funding.</htmltext>
<tokenext>Put Balmer there and you 'll get way more funding .</tokentext>
<sentencetext>Put Balmer there and you'll get way more funding.</sentencetext>
	<parent>http://www.semanticweb.org/ontologies/ConversationInstances.owl#comment10_01_31_2327234.30975298</parent>
</comment>
<comment>
	<id>http://www.semanticweb.org/ontologies/ConversationInstances.owl#comment10_01_31_2327234.30975574</id>
	<title>Re:You've raised $130 out of $7500</title>
	<author>fm6</author>
	<datestamp>1264943580000</datestamp>
	<modclass>Insightful</modclass>
	<modscore>3</modscore>
	<htmltext><p>They've got plenty of traffic now. Rather more than they can handle, it seems. If they can't build a web server that scales up, what makes them think they can build a spaceship?</p><p>Offtopic, but it needs to be asked any time somebody has a scheme like this: what's your business model? Because the big problem with space travel is that there's never been one. Yeah, yeah, if Congress hadn't cut off the tap, blah, blah, blah. The fact is that space travel is going to have to start paying for itself eventually. Otherwise you'll never see anything except political vanity projects like Apollo and the ISS. These do produce some good science and technological spinoffs, but never enough to justify the billions poured into them.</p></htmltext>
<tokenext>They 've got plenty of traffic now .
Rather more than they can handle , it seems .
If they ca n't build a web server that scales up , what makes them think they can build a spaceship ? Offtopic , but it needs to be asked any time somebody has a scheme like this : what 's your business model ?
Because the big problem with space travel is that there 's never been one .
Yeah , yeah , if Congress had n't cut off the tap , blah , blah , blah .
The fact is that space travel is going to have to start paying for itself eventually .
Otherwise you 'll never see anything except political vanity projects like Apollo and the ISS .
These do produce some good science and technological spinoffs , but never enough to justify the billions poured into them .</tokentext>
<sentencetext>They've got plenty of traffic now.
Rather more than they can handle, it seems.
If they can't build a web server that scales up, what makes them think they can build a spaceship?Offtopic, but it needs to be asked any time somebody has a scheme like this: what's your business model?
Because the big problem with space travel is that there's never been one.
Yeah, yeah, if Congress hadn't cut off the tap, blah, blah, blah.
The fact is that space travel is going to have to start paying for itself eventually.
Otherwise you'll never see anything except political vanity projects like Apollo and the ISS.
These do produce some good science and technological spinoffs, but never enough to justify the billions poured into them.</sentencetext>
	<parent>http://www.semanticweb.org/ontologies/ConversationInstances.owl#comment10_01_31_2327234.30975208</parent>
</comment>
<comment>
	<id>http://www.semanticweb.org/ontologies/ConversationInstances.owl#comment10_01_31_2327234.31010612</id>
	<title>Re:Bwhahahaha - "engineers" drawing pretty parts</title>
	<author>Anonymous</author>
	<datestamp>1264956960000</datestamp>
	<modclass>None</modclass>
	<modscore>0</modscore>
	<htmltext><p>...and because it's totally pointless. Wonder when the USA are going to finally admit they lost the space race? The Russians got into space first, got to the dark side of the moon first, and landed on the moon first.</p><p>The Americans don't want to admit unmanned space flight is future, because then they'd have to admit that the Soviets won the space race.</p></htmltext>
<tokenext>...and because it 's totally pointless .
Wonder when the USA are going to finally admit they lost the space race ?
The Russians got into space first , got to the dark side of the moon first , and landed on the moon first.The Americans do n't want to admit unmanned space flight is future , because then they 'd have to admit that the Soviets won the space race .</tokentext>
<sentencetext>...and because it's totally pointless.
Wonder when the USA are going to finally admit they lost the space race?
The Russians got into space first, got to the dark side of the moon first, and landed on the moon first.The Americans don't want to admit unmanned space flight is future, because then they'd have to admit that the Soviets won the space race.</sentencetext>
	<parent>http://www.semanticweb.org/ontologies/ConversationInstances.owl#comment10_01_31_2327234.30975566</parent>
</comment>
<comment>
	<id>http://www.semanticweb.org/ontologies/ConversationInstances.owl#comment10_01_31_2327234.30981922</id>
	<title>Re:You've raised $130 out of $7500</title>
	<author>Jon\_S</author>
	<datestamp>1265042880000</datestamp>
	<modclass>None</modclass>
	<modscore>1</modscore>
	<htmltext><p>Those sites are so busy nobody goes there anymore.</p></htmltext>
<tokenext>Those sites are so busy nobody goes there anymore .</tokentext>
<sentencetext>Those sites are so busy nobody goes there anymore.</sentencetext>
	<parent>http://www.semanticweb.org/ontologies/ConversationInstances.owl#comment10_01_31_2327234.30977472</parent>
</comment>
<comment>
	<id>http://www.semanticweb.org/ontologies/ConversationInstances.owl#comment10_01_31_2327234.30976052</id>
	<title>CAE Linux anyone?</title>
	<author>garlicbready</author>
	<datestamp>1264946820000</datestamp>
	<modclass>None</modclass>
	<modscore>1</modscore>
	<htmltext><p>Try CaeLinux <a href="http://www.caelinux.com/CMS/" title="caelinux.com">http://www.caelinux.com/CMS/</a> [caelinux.com] a bootable CD distribution which is basically a collection of different open source Cad apps<br>I'm hoping to make a reprap 3d printer at some point, so I've been looking into writing some ebuild scripts to get some of the stuff from caelinux into gentoo<br>like Salome, elmerfem, brlcad</p><p>I'm not an expert in CAD mind you but some of the below may be useful</p><p>One of the things I've discovered is that there's a difference between 3D Cad and 3D Modeling software<br>Modeling is about approximating the appearance of an object for appearance sake only, usually using a mesh / grid of some kind, this is a typical use for Blender<br>CAD is about what the object is made of, and it's physical dimensions in real space, typically objects are constructed from primitives such as a hollowed out cylinder for example<br>Modeling = what you can see the outside appearance, CAD = the innards, what it's made of and more of a focus on measurements in real space</p><p>If your going to design something that's going to be built it's probably better to design it in Cad software first<br>then convert it to a modeling form later on for the sake of pretty pictures / animations / appearances in a demonstration etc.<br>This way the original design is stored in a form where there's actual physical measurements (in mm for example)<br>and in a form that can be manufactured (drill holes at these points here and here etc)</p><p>While Blender could in theory support CAD capability, I think it's current features are lacking in that area<br>(although it is open source so if you want to add those features go right ahead)<br>From a commercial perspective I think the 2 main packages are Catia and Solidworks</p><p>Also If you want to simulate the environment on a 3D Cad object, the usual way is via FEM or Finite Element Analysis<br>This is the sort of thing used to simulate the way temperature travels through an object made of different materials for example<br>I think Catia / Solidwords have this sort of thing already inbuilt, in the case of open source software there's a lot of separate packages to play around with (elmerfem for example)<br>I think the linux cae pages have some good tutorials / examples on this<br><a href="http://www.caelinux.org/wiki/index.php/Doc:CAETutorials" title="caelinux.org">http://www.caelinux.org/wiki/index.php/Doc:CAETutorials</a> [caelinux.org]</p></htmltext>
<tokenext>Try CaeLinux http : //www.caelinux.com/CMS/ [ caelinux.com ] a bootable CD distribution which is basically a collection of different open source Cad appsI 'm hoping to make a reprap 3d printer at some point , so I 've been looking into writing some ebuild scripts to get some of the stuff from caelinux into gentoolike Salome , elmerfem , brlcadI 'm not an expert in CAD mind you but some of the below may be usefulOne of the things I 've discovered is that there 's a difference between 3D Cad and 3D Modeling softwareModeling is about approximating the appearance of an object for appearance sake only , usually using a mesh / grid of some kind , this is a typical use for BlenderCAD is about what the object is made of , and it 's physical dimensions in real space , typically objects are constructed from primitives such as a hollowed out cylinder for exampleModeling = what you can see the outside appearance , CAD = the innards , what it 's made of and more of a focus on measurements in real spaceIf your going to design something that 's going to be built it 's probably better to design it in Cad software firstthen convert it to a modeling form later on for the sake of pretty pictures / animations / appearances in a demonstration etc.This way the original design is stored in a form where there 's actual physical measurements ( in mm for example ) and in a form that can be manufactured ( drill holes at these points here and here etc ) While Blender could in theory support CAD capability , I think it 's current features are lacking in that area ( although it is open source so if you want to add those features go right ahead ) From a commercial perspective I think the 2 main packages are Catia and SolidworksAlso If you want to simulate the environment on a 3D Cad object , the usual way is via FEM or Finite Element AnalysisThis is the sort of thing used to simulate the way temperature travels through an object made of different materials for exampleI think Catia / Solidwords have this sort of thing already inbuilt , in the case of open source software there 's a lot of separate packages to play around with ( elmerfem for example ) I think the linux cae pages have some good tutorials / examples on thishttp : //www.caelinux.org/wiki/index.php/Doc : CAETutorials [ caelinux.org ]</tokentext>
<sentencetext>Try CaeLinux http://www.caelinux.com/CMS/ [caelinux.com] a bootable CD distribution which is basically a collection of different open source Cad appsI'm hoping to make a reprap 3d printer at some point, so I've been looking into writing some ebuild scripts to get some of the stuff from caelinux into gentoolike Salome, elmerfem, brlcadI'm not an expert in CAD mind you but some of the below may be usefulOne of the things I've discovered is that there's a difference between 3D Cad and 3D Modeling softwareModeling is about approximating the appearance of an object for appearance sake only, usually using a mesh / grid of some kind, this is a typical use for BlenderCAD is about what the object is made of, and it's physical dimensions in real space, typically objects are constructed from primitives such as a hollowed out cylinder for exampleModeling = what you can see the outside appearance, CAD = the innards, what it's made of and more of a focus on measurements in real spaceIf your going to design something that's going to be built it's probably better to design it in Cad software firstthen convert it to a modeling form later on for the sake of pretty pictures / animations / appearances in a demonstration etc.This way the original design is stored in a form where there's actual physical measurements (in mm for example)and in a form that can be manufactured (drill holes at these points here and here etc)While Blender could in theory support CAD capability, I think it's current features are lacking in that area(although it is open source so if you want to add those features go right ahead)From a commercial perspective I think the 2 main packages are Catia and SolidworksAlso If you want to simulate the environment on a 3D Cad object, the usual way is via FEM or Finite Element AnalysisThis is the sort of thing used to simulate the way temperature travels through an object made of different materials for exampleI think Catia / Solidwords have this sort of thing already inbuilt, in the case of open source software there's a lot of separate packages to play around with (elmerfem for example)I think the linux cae pages have some good tutorials / examples on thishttp://www.caelinux.org/wiki/index.php/Doc:CAETutorials [caelinux.org]</sentencetext>
</comment>
<comment>
	<id>http://www.semanticweb.org/ontologies/ConversationInstances.owl#comment10_01_31_2327234.30975344</id>
	<title>Sure you are</title>
	<author>quantaman</author>
	<datestamp>1264942380000</datestamp>
	<modclass>None</modclass>
	<modscore>1</modscore>
	<htmltext><p>You're going to put a man on the moon.</p><p>With your organization that doesn't even have a <a href="http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/OpenLuna" title="wikipedia.org">wikipedia page</a> [wikipedia.org] (okay, maybe it will now since I posted the link).</p><p>And your server, which you posted to<nobr> <wbr></nobr>/., can't even handle the<nobr> <wbr></nobr>/. effect!!</p><p>I hope you and the other readers get some interesting suggestions about modelling tools, but I'm sorry, you don't have a remote possibility of making a moon shot.</p></htmltext>
<tokenext>You 're going to put a man on the moon.With your organization that does n't even have a wikipedia page [ wikipedia.org ] ( okay , maybe it will now since I posted the link ) .And your server , which you posted to /. , ca n't even handle the / .
effect ! ! I hope you and the other readers get some interesting suggestions about modelling tools , but I 'm sorry , you do n't have a remote possibility of making a moon shot .</tokentext>
<sentencetext>You're going to put a man on the moon.With your organization that doesn't even have a wikipedia page [wikipedia.org] (okay, maybe it will now since I posted the link).And your server, which you posted to /., can't even handle the /.
effect!!I hope you and the other readers get some interesting suggestions about modelling tools, but I'm sorry, you don't have a remote possibility of making a moon shot.</sentencetext>
</comment>
<comment>
	<id>http://www.semanticweb.org/ontologies/ConversationInstances.owl#comment10_01_31_2327234.30979784</id>
	<title>Re:You've raised $130 out of $7500</title>
	<author>Blakey Rat</author>
	<datestamp>1265033520000</datestamp>
	<modclass>None</modclass>
	<modscore>0</modscore>
	<htmltext><p>The people who visit the links don't post in the comments.</p><p>So you have a ton of people who visit the links, take down the server, then just shrug and do something else. Then you have an entire other set of people who hardly ever visit the links, but when they try the first group has already taken the site down, and you post a gripe about it in the comments.</p><p>Considering the quality of most Slashdot submissions, I'm guessing the people who *don't* visit and read the links are better-educated than the ones who read the comments-- especially since the first few comments usually correct inaccuracies (or plain lies) in the story.</p><p>Woe be to those who only read the summary without reading the comments *or* visiting the links, God knows what crap those people are loading their brains with.</p></htmltext>
<tokenext>The people who visit the links do n't post in the comments.So you have a ton of people who visit the links , take down the server , then just shrug and do something else .
Then you have an entire other set of people who hardly ever visit the links , but when they try the first group has already taken the site down , and you post a gripe about it in the comments.Considering the quality of most Slashdot submissions , I 'm guessing the people who * do n't * visit and read the links are better-educated than the ones who read the comments-- especially since the first few comments usually correct inaccuracies ( or plain lies ) in the story.Woe be to those who only read the summary without reading the comments * or * visiting the links , God knows what crap those people are loading their brains with .</tokentext>
<sentencetext>The people who visit the links don't post in the comments.So you have a ton of people who visit the links, take down the server, then just shrug and do something else.
Then you have an entire other set of people who hardly ever visit the links, but when they try the first group has already taken the site down, and you post a gripe about it in the comments.Considering the quality of most Slashdot submissions, I'm guessing the people who *don't* visit and read the links are better-educated than the ones who read the comments-- especially since the first few comments usually correct inaccuracies (or plain lies) in the story.Woe be to those who only read the summary without reading the comments *or* visiting the links, God knows what crap those people are loading their brains with.</sentencetext>
	<parent>http://www.semanticweb.org/ontologies/ConversationInstances.owl#comment10_01_31_2327234.30977472</parent>
</comment>
<comment>
	<id>http://www.semanticweb.org/ontologies/ConversationInstances.owl#comment10_01_31_2327234.30977682</id>
	<title>Re:Several problems</title>
	<author>Anonymous</author>
	<datestamp>1264962540000</datestamp>
	<modclass>None</modclass>
	<modscore>0</modscore>
	<htmltext><p>Free FEA that is adequate IS available it's called  code-aster (http://www.code-aster.org/V2/spip.php?rubrique2 )<br>There are excellent data visualisation tools available for free as well like Paraview (http://www.paraview.org/)<br>However on the 3D CAD front - forget it. It doesn't exist.<br>The cheapest usable mechanical 3D cad is probably Alibre but it's nowhere near adequate for any kind of aerospace project - NX4, Catia or maybe a couple of others are your choices for a project of that kind. I would love to be able to use a GPL CAD system instead of Pro/E but everything I have seen is not to put too fine a point on it - junk.<br>The mid-range won't cut it on a project that size either, to intergrate dozens of people on a CAD model, have it accurate, robust, user tolerant and not have people tripping over each other is a major headache. (BRL-CAD??? I've seen it -I hope you're fucking kidding)<br>There is some promise in architectural 3d Cad (Octree) but for mechanical or aerospace stuff forget it.</p><p>Cheers</p><p>Stephen</p></htmltext>
<tokenext>Free FEA that is adequate IS available it 's called code-aster ( http : //www.code-aster.org/V2/spip.php ? rubrique2 ) There are excellent data visualisation tools available for free as well like Paraview ( http : //www.paraview.org/ ) However on the 3D CAD front - forget it .
It does n't exist.The cheapest usable mechanical 3D cad is probably Alibre but it 's nowhere near adequate for any kind of aerospace project - NX4 , Catia or maybe a couple of others are your choices for a project of that kind .
I would love to be able to use a GPL CAD system instead of Pro/E but everything I have seen is not to put too fine a point on it - junk.The mid-range wo n't cut it on a project that size either , to intergrate dozens of people on a CAD model , have it accurate , robust , user tolerant and not have people tripping over each other is a major headache .
( BRL-CAD ? ? ? I 've seen it -I hope you 're fucking kidding ) There is some promise in architectural 3d Cad ( Octree ) but for mechanical or aerospace stuff forget it.CheersStephen</tokentext>
<sentencetext>Free FEA that is adequate IS available it's called  code-aster (http://www.code-aster.org/V2/spip.php?rubrique2 )There are excellent data visualisation tools available for free as well like Paraview (http://www.paraview.org/)However on the 3D CAD front - forget it.
It doesn't exist.The cheapest usable mechanical 3D cad is probably Alibre but it's nowhere near adequate for any kind of aerospace project - NX4, Catia or maybe a couple of others are your choices for a project of that kind.
I would love to be able to use a GPL CAD system instead of Pro/E but everything I have seen is not to put too fine a point on it - junk.The mid-range won't cut it on a project that size either, to intergrate dozens of people on a CAD model, have it accurate, robust, user tolerant and not have people tripping over each other is a major headache.
(BRL-CAD??? I've seen it -I hope you're fucking kidding)There is some promise in architectural 3d Cad (Octree) but for mechanical or aerospace stuff forget it.CheersStephen</sentencetext>
	<parent>http://www.semanticweb.org/ontologies/ConversationInstances.owl#comment10_01_31_2327234.30975688</parent>
</comment>
<comment>
	<id>http://www.semanticweb.org/ontologies/ConversationInstances.owl#comment10_01_31_2327234.30975340</id>
	<title>Did anyone grab a snapshot of the site?</title>
	<author>ATestR</author>
	<datestamp>1264942380000</datestamp>
	<modclass>None</modclass>
	<modscore>1</modscore>
	<htmltext>By the time I clicked the link, it was already slashdotted.  If not, I'll have to check it out tomorrow (or not at all).</htmltext>
<tokenext>By the time I clicked the link , it was already slashdotted .
If not , I 'll have to check it out tomorrow ( or not at all ) .</tokentext>
<sentencetext>By the time I clicked the link, it was already slashdotted.
If not, I'll have to check it out tomorrow (or not at all).</sentencetext>
</comment>
<comment>
	<id>http://www.semanticweb.org/ontologies/ConversationInstances.owl#comment10_01_31_2327234.30983868</id>
	<title>The bitch can't cook!</title>
	<author>Tetsujin</author>
	<datestamp>1265050680000</datestamp>
	<modclass>None</modclass>
	<modscore>1</modscore>
	<htmltext><p><div class="quote"><p>"This female surgeon can't even cook bacon and eggs, what makes the bitch think she can take out my kidney?"</p></div><p>Hey, you laugh, but this happened to me.  Sure enough, kidney was burnt to a crisp on one side, and all runny on the other...</p></div>
	</htmltext>
<tokenext>" This female surgeon ca n't even cook bacon and eggs , what makes the bitch think she can take out my kidney ?
" Hey , you laugh , but this happened to me .
Sure enough , kidney was burnt to a crisp on one side , and all runny on the other.. .</tokentext>
<sentencetext>"This female surgeon can't even cook bacon and eggs, what makes the bitch think she can take out my kidney?
"Hey, you laugh, but this happened to me.
Sure enough, kidney was burnt to a crisp on one side, and all runny on the other...
	</sentencetext>
	<parent>http://www.semanticweb.org/ontologies/ConversationInstances.owl#comment10_01_31_2327234.30975886</parent>
</comment>
<comment>
	<id>http://www.semanticweb.org/ontologies/ConversationInstances.owl#comment10_01_31_2327234.30977134</id>
	<title>Re:You've raised $130 out of $7500</title>
	<author>Eil</author>
	<datestamp>1264957140000</datestamp>
	<modclass>Informativ</modclass>
	<modscore>4</modscore>
	<htmltext><p>You'll take note that Artist and Webmaster are #1 and #2 respectively on their "help wanted" list. Perhaps you could volunteer instead of complaining?</p></htmltext>
<tokenext>You 'll take note that Artist and Webmaster are # 1 and # 2 respectively on their " help wanted " list .
Perhaps you could volunteer instead of complaining ?</tokentext>
<sentencetext>You'll take note that Artist and Webmaster are #1 and #2 respectively on their "help wanted" list.
Perhaps you could volunteer instead of complaining?</sentencetext>
	<parent>http://www.semanticweb.org/ontologies/ConversationInstances.owl#comment10_01_31_2327234.30975208</parent>
</comment>
<comment>
	<id>http://www.semanticweb.org/ontologies/ConversationInstances.owl#comment10_01_31_2327234.30975934</id>
	<title>Business model</title>
	<author>ThreeGigs</author>
	<datestamp>1264946040000</datestamp>
	<modclass>Interestin</modclass>
	<modscore>3</modscore>
	<htmltext><p>If a company can bring 200 kilos of moon rocks back from the moon, a mission could pay for itself from sale of the rocks. Easily $2000 a gram, perhaps more if some more interesting specimens could be searched out and returned.</p><p>If one could do a shot similar to Apollo, but unmanned, several metric tons could be returned, and be quite profitable.</p><p>Ask yourself how much a kilogram of martian soil would sell for, too.</p></htmltext>
<tokenext>If a company can bring 200 kilos of moon rocks back from the moon , a mission could pay for itself from sale of the rocks .
Easily $ 2000 a gram , perhaps more if some more interesting specimens could be searched out and returned.If one could do a shot similar to Apollo , but unmanned , several metric tons could be returned , and be quite profitable.Ask yourself how much a kilogram of martian soil would sell for , too .</tokentext>
<sentencetext>If a company can bring 200 kilos of moon rocks back from the moon, a mission could pay for itself from sale of the rocks.
Easily $2000 a gram, perhaps more if some more interesting specimens could be searched out and returned.If one could do a shot similar to Apollo, but unmanned, several metric tons could be returned, and be quite profitable.Ask yourself how much a kilogram of martian soil would sell for, too.</sentencetext>
	<parent>http://www.semanticweb.org/ontologies/ConversationInstances.owl#comment10_01_31_2327234.30975574</parent>
</comment>
<comment>
	<id>http://www.semanticweb.org/ontologies/ConversationInstances.owl#comment10_01_31_2327234.30983194</id>
	<title>Time Effective</title>
	<author>visionbeyond</author>
	<datestamp>1265047920000</datestamp>
	<modclass>None</modclass>
	<modscore>1</modscore>
	<htmltext>Looking at what your trying to accomplish, there is much more to consider than just being able to create 3D objects.  While there are some free CAD software programs out there that can do a very nice job of limited spanning functionality, it would take a dedicated team years to develop any FOSS project to the level of AutoCAD.  While Adobe is porting Photoshop to Linux, and GIMP is a very impressive alternative, it takes years for professionals to realize all that Photoshop can do.  AutoCAD is the same, and has become the industry standard.  Not only has amazing built-in functionality, like structural analysis, stress testing, and the lates version can do 3D renderings and animations built right into it.  In the long run, you'll have spent enough time and resources trying to work with a FOSS CAD program, then it would have cost to just purchase AutoCAD.  Sad, but true, and is an area I wish there was at least a competitive FOSS application available.</htmltext>
<tokenext>Looking at what your trying to accomplish , there is much more to consider than just being able to create 3D objects .
While there are some free CAD software programs out there that can do a very nice job of limited spanning functionality , it would take a dedicated team years to develop any FOSS project to the level of AutoCAD .
While Adobe is porting Photoshop to Linux , and GIMP is a very impressive alternative , it takes years for professionals to realize all that Photoshop can do .
AutoCAD is the same , and has become the industry standard .
Not only has amazing built-in functionality , like structural analysis , stress testing , and the lates version can do 3D renderings and animations built right into it .
In the long run , you 'll have spent enough time and resources trying to work with a FOSS CAD program , then it would have cost to just purchase AutoCAD .
Sad , but true , and is an area I wish there was at least a competitive FOSS application available .</tokentext>
<sentencetext>Looking at what your trying to accomplish, there is much more to consider than just being able to create 3D objects.
While there are some free CAD software programs out there that can do a very nice job of limited spanning functionality, it would take a dedicated team years to develop any FOSS project to the level of AutoCAD.
While Adobe is porting Photoshop to Linux, and GIMP is a very impressive alternative, it takes years for professionals to realize all that Photoshop can do.
AutoCAD is the same, and has become the industry standard.
Not only has amazing built-in functionality, like structural analysis, stress testing, and the lates version can do 3D renderings and animations built right into it.
In the long run, you'll have spent enough time and resources trying to work with a FOSS CAD program, then it would have cost to just purchase AutoCAD.
Sad, but true, and is an area I wish there was at least a competitive FOSS application available.</sentencetext>
</comment>
<comment>
	<id>http://www.semanticweb.org/ontologies/ConversationInstances.owl#comment10_01_31_2327234.31059714</id>
	<title>i know this is an old thread</title>
	<author>Anonymous</author>
	<datestamp>1265636880000</datestamp>
	<modclass>None</modclass>
	<modscore>0</modscore>
	<htmltext><p>Ive been playing with cad stations for over 20 years as i am sure many who have read this thread have also. My experience mostly centers around that ubiquitous CAD we all know the name of. I have read much of the pontificating and have a few thoughts. The first one is to all the geniuses who blather on about how cad programs are cobbled together yada yada yada. Get off you ass and at least help the community get a real start if you are so brilliant or shut up. So much furor is made about how superior linux/unix is yet when it comes to graphics (not raster images) it sux plain, simple, and to the point. There are those that would judge a system's capabilities by its graphic ability and I'm not talking photoshop either. Its not a small group either its some of the real "technical" people of industry, science, engineering, medicine, and construction. Now I know that most of the "geek" types here would call them a bunch of stupid doo doo heads because they don't luv or understand the wonderful environment that most linux distributions offer but the failing is not theirs. Dual booting is a joke, virtualization is a joke if it doesn't work for their needs why even consider it. Like some eloquent person so aptly phrased is; go pay your money. This is exactly what we do. The cost of the O/S, TCOA, all are irrelevant. We have a job to do and linux/unix is just plain fail. I'm not interested in the pontifications of a bunch of PFY's (BOFH) ranting about this and that. Either show a real effort of just get off it. When it comes to one of the most important field areas of computers - "Graphics" - Linux is not only not ready for prime time it is the MS/Paint of platforms and I am being generous. So this conversation is nothing more than navel gazing...<nobr> <wbr></nobr>/. not just irreverent but, not irrelevant ; not news just the boring prattling of l337 script kiddies</p></htmltext>
<tokenext>Ive been playing with cad stations for over 20 years as i am sure many who have read this thread have also .
My experience mostly centers around that ubiquitous CAD we all know the name of .
I have read much of the pontificating and have a few thoughts .
The first one is to all the geniuses who blather on about how cad programs are cobbled together yada yada yada .
Get off you ass and at least help the community get a real start if you are so brilliant or shut up .
So much furor is made about how superior linux/unix is yet when it comes to graphics ( not raster images ) it sux plain , simple , and to the point .
There are those that would judge a system 's capabilities by its graphic ability and I 'm not talking photoshop either .
Its not a small group either its some of the real " technical " people of industry , science , engineering , medicine , and construction .
Now I know that most of the " geek " types here would call them a bunch of stupid doo doo heads because they do n't luv or understand the wonderful environment that most linux distributions offer but the failing is not theirs .
Dual booting is a joke , virtualization is a joke if it does n't work for their needs why even consider it .
Like some eloquent person so aptly phrased is ; go pay your money .
This is exactly what we do .
The cost of the O/S , TCOA , all are irrelevant .
We have a job to do and linux/unix is just plain fail .
I 'm not interested in the pontifications of a bunch of PFY 's ( BOFH ) ranting about this and that .
Either show a real effort of just get off it .
When it comes to one of the most important field areas of computers - " Graphics " - Linux is not only not ready for prime time it is the MS/Paint of platforms and I am being generous .
So this conversation is nothing more than navel gazing... /. not just irreverent but , not irrelevant ; not news just the boring prattling of l337 script kiddies</tokentext>
<sentencetext>Ive been playing with cad stations for over 20 years as i am sure many who have read this thread have also.
My experience mostly centers around that ubiquitous CAD we all know the name of.
I have read much of the pontificating and have a few thoughts.
The first one is to all the geniuses who blather on about how cad programs are cobbled together yada yada yada.
Get off you ass and at least help the community get a real start if you are so brilliant or shut up.
So much furor is made about how superior linux/unix is yet when it comes to graphics (not raster images) it sux plain, simple, and to the point.
There are those that would judge a system's capabilities by its graphic ability and I'm not talking photoshop either.
Its not a small group either its some of the real "technical" people of industry, science, engineering, medicine, and construction.
Now I know that most of the "geek" types here would call them a bunch of stupid doo doo heads because they don't luv or understand the wonderful environment that most linux distributions offer but the failing is not theirs.
Dual booting is a joke, virtualization is a joke if it doesn't work for their needs why even consider it.
Like some eloquent person so aptly phrased is; go pay your money.
This is exactly what we do.
The cost of the O/S, TCOA, all are irrelevant.
We have a job to do and linux/unix is just plain fail.
I'm not interested in the pontifications of a bunch of PFY's (BOFH) ranting about this and that.
Either show a real effort of just get off it.
When it comes to one of the most important field areas of computers - "Graphics" - Linux is not only not ready for prime time it is the MS/Paint of platforms and I am being generous.
So this conversation is nothing more than navel gazing... /. not just irreverent but, not irrelevant ; not news just the boring prattling of l337 script kiddies</sentencetext>
</comment>
<comment>
	<id>http://www.semanticweb.org/ontologies/ConversationInstances.owl#comment10_01_31_2327234.30989428</id>
	<title>Re:You've raised $130 out of $7500</title>
	<author>Anonymous</author>
	<datestamp>1265028900000</datestamp>
	<modclass>None</modclass>
	<modscore>0</modscore>
	<htmltext><p>I regularly use and appreciate Blender, AutoCAD and Vectorworks and I can assure you that Blender is NOT a CAD program and that there is a difference between a 3D rendering and animation program like Blender and a 2D/3D modelling and drafting program like AutoCAD and vectorworks, for which I would love to have a FOSS replacement for.</p></htmltext>
<tokenext>I regularly use and appreciate Blender , AutoCAD and Vectorworks and I can assure you that Blender is NOT a CAD program and that there is a difference between a 3D rendering and animation program like Blender and a 2D/3D modelling and drafting program like AutoCAD and vectorworks , for which I would love to have a FOSS replacement for .</tokentext>
<sentencetext>I regularly use and appreciate Blender, AutoCAD and Vectorworks and I can assure you that Blender is NOT a CAD program and that there is a difference between a 3D rendering and animation program like Blender and a 2D/3D modelling and drafting program like AutoCAD and vectorworks, for which I would love to have a FOSS replacement for.</sentencetext>
	<parent>http://www.semanticweb.org/ontologies/ConversationInstances.owl#comment10_01_31_2327234.30976508</parent>
</comment>
<comment>
	<id>http://www.semanticweb.org/ontologies/ConversationInstances.owl#comment10_01_31_2327234.30975628</id>
	<title>Re:gnu moon mission</title>
	<author>arielCo</author>
	<datestamp>1264944060000</datestamp>
	<modclass>None</modclass>
	<modscore>1</modscore>
	<htmltext>Send both and charge big $$ for the tickets to the fight. There's your business model!</htmltext>
<tokenext>Send both and charge big $ $ for the tickets to the fight .
There 's your business model !</tokentext>
<sentencetext>Send both and charge big $$ for the tickets to the fight.
There's your business model!</sentencetext>
	<parent>http://www.semanticweb.org/ontologies/ConversationInstances.owl#comment10_01_31_2327234.30975588</parent>
</comment>
<comment>
	<id>http://www.semanticweb.org/ontologies/ConversationInstances.owl#comment10_01_31_2327234.30977862</id>
	<title>Re:You've raised $130 out of $7500</title>
	<author>Paul server guy</author>
	<datestamp>1264964880000</datestamp>
	<modclass>None</modclass>
	<modscore>1</modscore>
	<htmltext><p>That was a brief look at a membership drive. The project is ongoing. Ironically, the tool that manages the membership and donations needs some work. (The tool works fine, we are just learning how to use it.) Why don't you stop by and help clean that up?</p></htmltext>
<tokenext>That was a brief look at a membership drive .
The project is ongoing .
Ironically , the tool that manages the membership and donations needs some work .
( The tool works fine , we are just learning how to use it .
) Why do n't you stop by and help clean that up ?</tokentext>
<sentencetext>That was a brief look at a membership drive.
The project is ongoing.
Ironically, the tool that manages the membership and donations needs some work.
(The tool works fine, we are just learning how to use it.
) Why don't you stop by and help clean that up?</sentencetext>
	<parent>http://www.semanticweb.org/ontologies/ConversationInstances.owl#comment10_01_31_2327234.30975208</parent>
</comment>
<comment>
	<id>http://www.semanticweb.org/ontologies/ConversationInstances.owl#comment10_01_31_2327234.30978178</id>
	<title>To the moon, Alice!</title>
	<author>Quiet\_Desperation</author>
	<datestamp>1265055840000</datestamp>
	<modclass>None</modclass>
	<modscore>1</modscore>
	<htmltext><p><div class="quote"><p>OpenLuna is a volunteer organization: we welcome and encourage your participation beyond basic membership. If you desire active involvement, introduce yourself to us and we will find a way to use your talents.</p></div><p>"We're particularly interested in people who might have one or more engines lying around capable of driving a multi-ton payload to a translunar injection. Oh, and any radiation shielded crew modules and/or several billion dollars in venture capital would be an added plus!"</p><p>"We have a <a href="http://www.prints4kids.co.uk/boy-paintings/rocket-canvas.jpg" title="prints4kids.co.uk">prototype</a> [prints4kids.co.uk] all drawed up and everything!"</p><p>"We'd like to thank the Sustainable Farming Student Collective at Berkeley for the astronaut garb. Who would have thought you could make a spacesuit out of hemp?""</p></div>
	</htmltext>
<tokenext>OpenLuna is a volunteer organization : we welcome and encourage your participation beyond basic membership .
If you desire active involvement , introduce yourself to us and we will find a way to use your talents .
" We 're particularly interested in people who might have one or more engines lying around capable of driving a multi-ton payload to a translunar injection .
Oh , and any radiation shielded crew modules and/or several billion dollars in venture capital would be an added plus !
" " We have a prototype [ prints4kids.co.uk ] all drawed up and everything !
" " We 'd like to thank the Sustainable Farming Student Collective at Berkeley for the astronaut garb .
Who would have thought you could make a spacesuit out of hemp ?
" "</tokentext>
<sentencetext>OpenLuna is a volunteer organization: we welcome and encourage your participation beyond basic membership.
If you desire active involvement, introduce yourself to us and we will find a way to use your talents.
"We're particularly interested in people who might have one or more engines lying around capable of driving a multi-ton payload to a translunar injection.
Oh, and any radiation shielded crew modules and/or several billion dollars in venture capital would be an added plus!
""We have a prototype [prints4kids.co.uk] all drawed up and everything!
""We'd like to thank the Sustainable Farming Student Collective at Berkeley for the astronaut garb.
Who would have thought you could make a spacesuit out of hemp?
""
	</sentencetext>
</comment>
<comment>
	<id>http://www.semanticweb.org/ontologies/ConversationInstances.owl#comment10_01_31_2327234.30975398</id>
	<title>Huh? Blender?</title>
	<author>Anonymous</author>
	<datestamp>1264942680000</datestamp>
	<modclass>Insightful</modclass>
	<modscore>4</modscore>
	<htmltext><p>Being able to import CAD files into Blender should be the least of your concerns when choosing a CAD package. There isn't a free CAD package out there that will cope with designing a rocket and lunar lander. Spend your hard earned $130 (plus a lot more) on a high-end CAD package like Catia or Unigraphics.</p></htmltext>
<tokenext>Being able to import CAD files into Blender should be the least of your concerns when choosing a CAD package .
There is n't a free CAD package out there that will cope with designing a rocket and lunar lander .
Spend your hard earned $ 130 ( plus a lot more ) on a high-end CAD package like Catia or Unigraphics .</tokentext>
<sentencetext>Being able to import CAD files into Blender should be the least of your concerns when choosing a CAD package.
There isn't a free CAD package out there that will cope with designing a rocket and lunar lander.
Spend your hard earned $130 (plus a lot more) on a high-end CAD package like Catia or Unigraphics.</sentencetext>
</comment>
<comment>
	<id>http://www.semanticweb.org/ontologies/ConversationInstances.owl#comment10_01_31_2327234.31010198</id>
	<title>Stay thy venom</title>
	<author>Anonymous</author>
	<datestamp>1264955280000</datestamp>
	<modclass>None</modclass>
	<modscore>0</modscore>
	<htmltext><p>The comments on this article are ridiculously negative.</p><p>What does it cost you to give them a little advice and not crush their dreams.  Their goals may be lofty, maybe virtually unobtainable, but history if full of success stories of people trying the "impossible" and succeeding. That's the biggest problem with society right now defeatism. "We can't win so why try." I hope they do try and do succeed. The cost/difficulty might not be as bad as you think, it's been 50 years imagine what it would cost to make a Nexus One 50 years ago. And it's not like aerospace is a dormant field with out any innovation in the past 50 years.  You can buy space shuttle parts for cheap, they are giving away engines to anyone who can take them away. Then reverse engineer most of the tech as the patents that do exist are expiring. It's not like the physics of getting to the moon is super advanced it's only rocket science not brain surgery. You cover most of what you need to plan the trips in physics 1.  Or just FOIA your way to a flight plan. And what is the worst that happens, they put 10-20 years of solid work into a task they love and don't get people onto the moon. Oh no that destroys my life. They maybe just get something into orbit and improve the quality of open source CAD Software.</p><p>I use QCAD it probably isn't the most advanced CAD software.  I learned CAD on CADkey lite in a mechanical drawing class in high school. It reminds me of that and is fine for generating rooms layouts and supports many standard formats for information sharing.</p><p>God Speed</p></htmltext>
<tokenext>The comments on this article are ridiculously negative.What does it cost you to give them a little advice and not crush their dreams .
Their goals may be lofty , maybe virtually unobtainable , but history if full of success stories of people trying the " impossible " and succeeding .
That 's the biggest problem with society right now defeatism .
" We ca n't win so why try .
" I hope they do try and do succeed .
The cost/difficulty might not be as bad as you think , it 's been 50 years imagine what it would cost to make a Nexus One 50 years ago .
And it 's not like aerospace is a dormant field with out any innovation in the past 50 years .
You can buy space shuttle parts for cheap , they are giving away engines to anyone who can take them away .
Then reverse engineer most of the tech as the patents that do exist are expiring .
It 's not like the physics of getting to the moon is super advanced it 's only rocket science not brain surgery .
You cover most of what you need to plan the trips in physics 1 .
Or just FOIA your way to a flight plan .
And what is the worst that happens , they put 10-20 years of solid work into a task they love and do n't get people onto the moon .
Oh no that destroys my life .
They maybe just get something into orbit and improve the quality of open source CAD Software.I use QCAD it probably is n't the most advanced CAD software .
I learned CAD on CADkey lite in a mechanical drawing class in high school .
It reminds me of that and is fine for generating rooms layouts and supports many standard formats for information sharing.God Speed</tokentext>
<sentencetext>The comments on this article are ridiculously negative.What does it cost you to give them a little advice and not crush their dreams.
Their goals may be lofty, maybe virtually unobtainable, but history if full of success stories of people trying the "impossible" and succeeding.
That's the biggest problem with society right now defeatism.
"We can't win so why try.
" I hope they do try and do succeed.
The cost/difficulty might not be as bad as you think, it's been 50 years imagine what it would cost to make a Nexus One 50 years ago.
And it's not like aerospace is a dormant field with out any innovation in the past 50 years.
You can buy space shuttle parts for cheap, they are giving away engines to anyone who can take them away.
Then reverse engineer most of the tech as the patents that do exist are expiring.
It's not like the physics of getting to the moon is super advanced it's only rocket science not brain surgery.
You cover most of what you need to plan the trips in physics 1.
Or just FOIA your way to a flight plan.
And what is the worst that happens, they put 10-20 years of solid work into a task they love and don't get people onto the moon.
Oh no that destroys my life.
They maybe just get something into orbit and improve the quality of open source CAD Software.I use QCAD it probably isn't the most advanced CAD software.
I learned CAD on CADkey lite in a mechanical drawing class in high school.
It reminds me of that and is fine for generating rooms layouts and supports many standard formats for information sharing.God Speed</sentencetext>
</comment>
<comment>
	<id>http://www.semanticweb.org/ontologies/ConversationInstances.owl#comment10_01_31_2327234.30976774</id>
	<title>Re:gnu moon mission</title>
	<author>Anonymous</author>
	<datestamp>1264953360000</datestamp>
	<modclass>None</modclass>
	<modscore>0</modscore>
	<htmltext><p>A slightly more hairy monkey has already been in orbit.</p></htmltext>
<tokenext>A slightly more hairy monkey has already been in orbit .</tokentext>
<sentencetext>A slightly more hairy monkey has already been in orbit.</sentencetext>
	<parent>http://www.semanticweb.org/ontologies/ConversationInstances.owl#comment10_01_31_2327234.30975588</parent>
</comment>
<comment>
	<id>http://www.semanticweb.org/ontologies/ConversationInstances.owl#comment10_01_31_2327234.30975886</id>
	<title>Re:You've raised $130 out of $7500</title>
	<author>ajlisows</author>
	<datestamp>1264945740000</datestamp>
	<modclass>Insightful</modclass>
	<modscore>5</modscore>
	<htmltext><p>"This female surgeon can't even cook bacon and eggs, what makes the bitch think she can take out my kidney?</p><p>"This dork can't even find himself a single woman to have sex with him, what makes him think he can write software that will attract millions of users?"</p><p>You see, it is possible to be highly competent at one thing and be not very competent in another.  Even if they have the loose relationship of being two things that geeks tend to think are pretty cool, such as Engineering Spaceships and developing web sites and maintaining a web server.</p><p>Obviously I have not been able to view the web page due to it being slashdotted, but it is a good possibility that they didn't put much thought or effort into it.  They probably thought "Hey, why don't we just cobble together a small web presence in case anyone wants to donate any money or otherwise contribute to our project.  Let's not spend much time on it though as our aim is space travel, not web development.</p></htmltext>
<tokenext>" This female surgeon ca n't even cook bacon and eggs , what makes the bitch think she can take out my kidney ?
" This dork ca n't even find himself a single woman to have sex with him , what makes him think he can write software that will attract millions of users ?
" You see , it is possible to be highly competent at one thing and be not very competent in another .
Even if they have the loose relationship of being two things that geeks tend to think are pretty cool , such as Engineering Spaceships and developing web sites and maintaining a web server.Obviously I have not been able to view the web page due to it being slashdotted , but it is a good possibility that they did n't put much thought or effort into it .
They probably thought " Hey , why do n't we just cobble together a small web presence in case anyone wants to donate any money or otherwise contribute to our project .
Let 's not spend much time on it though as our aim is space travel , not web development .</tokentext>
<sentencetext>"This female surgeon can't even cook bacon and eggs, what makes the bitch think she can take out my kidney?
"This dork can't even find himself a single woman to have sex with him, what makes him think he can write software that will attract millions of users?
"You see, it is possible to be highly competent at one thing and be not very competent in another.
Even if they have the loose relationship of being two things that geeks tend to think are pretty cool, such as Engineering Spaceships and developing web sites and maintaining a web server.Obviously I have not been able to view the web page due to it being slashdotted, but it is a good possibility that they didn't put much thought or effort into it.
They probably thought "Hey, why don't we just cobble together a small web presence in case anyone wants to donate any money or otherwise contribute to our project.
Let's not spend much time on it though as our aim is space travel, not web development.</sentencetext>
	<parent>http://www.semanticweb.org/ontologies/ConversationInstances.owl#comment10_01_31_2327234.30975574</parent>
</comment>
<comment>
	<id>http://www.semanticweb.org/ontologies/ConversationInstances.owl#comment10_01_31_2327234.30976048</id>
	<title>Re:OSS CAD?</title>
	<author>selven</author>
	<datestamp>1264946820000</datestamp>
	<modclass>None</modclass>
	<modscore>1</modscore>
	<htmltext><p>Their website can't even handle a slashdotting. This is probably a hobbyist rocket type project, not a giant commercial enterprise. The only way they can afford professionally designed software is by pirating it.</p></htmltext>
<tokenext>Their website ca n't even handle a slashdotting .
This is probably a hobbyist rocket type project , not a giant commercial enterprise .
The only way they can afford professionally designed software is by pirating it .</tokentext>
<sentencetext>Their website can't even handle a slashdotting.
This is probably a hobbyist rocket type project, not a giant commercial enterprise.
The only way they can afford professionally designed software is by pirating it.</sentencetext>
	<parent>http://www.semanticweb.org/ontologies/ConversationInstances.owl#comment10_01_31_2327234.30975318</parent>
</comment>
<comment>
	<id>http://www.semanticweb.org/ontologies/ConversationInstances.owl#comment10_01_31_2327234.30977230</id>
	<title>Going beyond CAD to simulation</title>
	<author>Anonymous</author>
	<datestamp>1264958040000</datestamp>
	<modclass>None</modclass>
	<modscore>1</modscore>
	<htmltext><p>The parent poster is very informative, and practical, although misses the open source point as a cultural thing, as well as does not discuss the issue of open standards, which may be even more important than open source for a big project (since with open standards, you can at least replace tools over time).</p><p>Also, since much work related to rocketry is considered some form of munitions, that is another stumbling block. Although hopefully OpenLuna can avoid most of those issues and focus on the habitat aspect?</p><p>But there is one other aspect that is even more important than CAD, and this is simulation and related standards for storing that data connected to simulations. And there are all sorts of simulation tools emphasizing all sorts of different things at all sorts of different levels of detail. And there are all sorts of very interesting simulations that can be made about how to make things that have both on-Earth benefits and advance the cause of making space habitats.</p><p>Take for example these ideas for the US National Institute of Standards And Technologies:<br>
  "Sustainable and Lifecycle Information-based Manufacturing"<br>
  <a href="http://www.mel.nist.gov/programs/slim.htm" title="nist.gov">http://www.mel.nist.gov/programs/slim.htm</a> [nist.gov] <br>"The United States needs to prepare for a future where products are 100\% recyclable, manufacturing itself has a zero net impact on the environment, and complete disassembly and disposal of a product at its end of life is routine. To document and monitor these changes, US industry will require key resources and methods that will enable it to measure sustainability along several dimensions (such as carbon foot print, energy accounting and recyclability of materials) allowing accurate assessment of status and progress."</p><p>That is exactly the kind of information you need in designing a space habitat too, whether on the Moon, Mars, the asteroids, or even anywhere on Earth (like under the sea, or in Antarctica, or in the desert).</p><p>Over the last ten years this paper I co-wrote for the Space Studies Institute conference on space manufacturing has gone from unimaginable to mostly obsolete, now that so many people are doing open source design.<nobr> <wbr></nobr>:-)<br>
  "A Review of Licensing and Collaborative Development with Special Attention to the Design of Self-Replicating Space Habitat Systems"<br>
  <a href="http://www.kurtz-fernhout.com/oscomak/SSI\_Fernhout2001\_web.html" title="kurtz-fernhout.com">http://www.kurtz-fernhout.com/oscomak/SSI\_Fernhout2001\_web.html</a> [kurtz-fernhout.com] </p><p>But, one big issue to consider is to save design costs, you ideally need a good simulation framework for doing virtual testing of concepts. And to do detailed simulations, you ideally might need millions of people to donate spare CPU cycles. If you can get to the point where you can launch an automated seed factory to the moon that would then build infrastructure, all you would need is a billion dollars to build it and launch it (which hundreds of individuals could swing today). But to get to that point you need a credible design. Getting that design together, with as much virtual testing as possible, is something that could productively occupy many people for years, and the best value for a small group might be to put together enough seed information to make the equivalent (maybe not web based) of a Wikipedia of space habitation and open manufacturing information. Three fizzled attempts by me in those directions from years gone by (roughly two, ten, and twenty years ago, respectively):<br>
  <a href="http://www.oscomak.net/" title="oscomak.net">http://www.oscomak.net/</a> [oscomak.net] <br>
  <a href="http://www.kurtz-fernhout.com/oscomak/prototype.htm" title="kurtz-fernhout.com">http://www.kurtz-fernhout.com/oscomak/prototype.htm</a> [kurtz-fernhout.com] <br>
  <a href="http://www.pdfernhout.net/sunrise-sustainable-technology-ventures.html" title="pdfernhout.net">http://www.pdfernhout.net/sunrise-sustainable-technology-ventures.html</a> [pdfernhout.net] </p><p>James P. Hogan, the sci-fi writer, has been a big inspiration to me, especially with these with two books:</p></htmltext>
<tokenext>The parent poster is very informative , and practical , although misses the open source point as a cultural thing , as well as does not discuss the issue of open standards , which may be even more important than open source for a big project ( since with open standards , you can at least replace tools over time ) .Also , since much work related to rocketry is considered some form of munitions , that is another stumbling block .
Although hopefully OpenLuna can avoid most of those issues and focus on the habitat aspect ? But there is one other aspect that is even more important than CAD , and this is simulation and related standards for storing that data connected to simulations .
And there are all sorts of simulation tools emphasizing all sorts of different things at all sorts of different levels of detail .
And there are all sorts of very interesting simulations that can be made about how to make things that have both on-Earth benefits and advance the cause of making space habitats.Take for example these ideas for the US National Institute of Standards And Technologies : " Sustainable and Lifecycle Information-based Manufacturing " http : //www.mel.nist.gov/programs/slim.htm [ nist.gov ] " The United States needs to prepare for a future where products are 100 \ % recyclable , manufacturing itself has a zero net impact on the environment , and complete disassembly and disposal of a product at its end of life is routine .
To document and monitor these changes , US industry will require key resources and methods that will enable it to measure sustainability along several dimensions ( such as carbon foot print , energy accounting and recyclability of materials ) allowing accurate assessment of status and progress .
" That is exactly the kind of information you need in designing a space habitat too , whether on the Moon , Mars , the asteroids , or even anywhere on Earth ( like under the sea , or in Antarctica , or in the desert ) .Over the last ten years this paper I co-wrote for the Space Studies Institute conference on space manufacturing has gone from unimaginable to mostly obsolete , now that so many people are doing open source design .
: - ) " A Review of Licensing and Collaborative Development with Special Attention to the Design of Self-Replicating Space Habitat Systems " http : //www.kurtz-fernhout.com/oscomak/SSI \ _Fernhout2001 \ _web.html [ kurtz-fernhout.com ] But , one big issue to consider is to save design costs , you ideally need a good simulation framework for doing virtual testing of concepts .
And to do detailed simulations , you ideally might need millions of people to donate spare CPU cycles .
If you can get to the point where you can launch an automated seed factory to the moon that would then build infrastructure , all you would need is a billion dollars to build it and launch it ( which hundreds of individuals could swing today ) .
But to get to that point you need a credible design .
Getting that design together , with as much virtual testing as possible , is something that could productively occupy many people for years , and the best value for a small group might be to put together enough seed information to make the equivalent ( maybe not web based ) of a Wikipedia of space habitation and open manufacturing information .
Three fizzled attempts by me in those directions from years gone by ( roughly two , ten , and twenty years ago , respectively ) : http : //www.oscomak.net/ [ oscomak.net ] http : //www.kurtz-fernhout.com/oscomak/prototype.htm [ kurtz-fernhout.com ] http : //www.pdfernhout.net/sunrise-sustainable-technology-ventures.html [ pdfernhout.net ] James P. Hogan , the sci-fi writer , has been a big inspiration to me , especially with these with two books :</tokentext>
<sentencetext>The parent poster is very informative, and practical, although misses the open source point as a cultural thing, as well as does not discuss the issue of open standards, which may be even more important than open source for a big project (since with open standards, you can at least replace tools over time).Also, since much work related to rocketry is considered some form of munitions, that is another stumbling block.
Although hopefully OpenLuna can avoid most of those issues and focus on the habitat aspect?But there is one other aspect that is even more important than CAD, and this is simulation and related standards for storing that data connected to simulations.
And there are all sorts of simulation tools emphasizing all sorts of different things at all sorts of different levels of detail.
And there are all sorts of very interesting simulations that can be made about how to make things that have both on-Earth benefits and advance the cause of making space habitats.Take for example these ideas for the US National Institute of Standards And Technologies:
  "Sustainable and Lifecycle Information-based Manufacturing"
  http://www.mel.nist.gov/programs/slim.htm [nist.gov] "The United States needs to prepare for a future where products are 100\% recyclable, manufacturing itself has a zero net impact on the environment, and complete disassembly and disposal of a product at its end of life is routine.
To document and monitor these changes, US industry will require key resources and methods that will enable it to measure sustainability along several dimensions (such as carbon foot print, energy accounting and recyclability of materials) allowing accurate assessment of status and progress.
"That is exactly the kind of information you need in designing a space habitat too, whether on the Moon, Mars, the asteroids, or even anywhere on Earth (like under the sea, or in Antarctica, or in the desert).Over the last ten years this paper I co-wrote for the Space Studies Institute conference on space manufacturing has gone from unimaginable to mostly obsolete, now that so many people are doing open source design.
:-)
  "A Review of Licensing and Collaborative Development with Special Attention to the Design of Self-Replicating Space Habitat Systems"
  http://www.kurtz-fernhout.com/oscomak/SSI\_Fernhout2001\_web.html [kurtz-fernhout.com] But, one big issue to consider is to save design costs, you ideally need a good simulation framework for doing virtual testing of concepts.
And to do detailed simulations, you ideally might need millions of people to donate spare CPU cycles.
If you can get to the point where you can launch an automated seed factory to the moon that would then build infrastructure, all you would need is a billion dollars to build it and launch it (which hundreds of individuals could swing today).
But to get to that point you need a credible design.
Getting that design together, with as much virtual testing as possible, is something that could productively occupy many people for years, and the best value for a small group might be to put together enough seed information to make the equivalent (maybe not web based) of a Wikipedia of space habitation and open manufacturing information.
Three fizzled attempts by me in those directions from years gone by (roughly two, ten, and twenty years ago, respectively):
  http://www.oscomak.net/ [oscomak.net] 
  http://www.kurtz-fernhout.com/oscomak/prototype.htm [kurtz-fernhout.com] 
  http://www.pdfernhout.net/sunrise-sustainable-technology-ventures.html [pdfernhout.net] James P. Hogan, the sci-fi writer, has been a big inspiration to me, especially with these with two books:</sentencetext>
	<parent>http://www.semanticweb.org/ontologies/ConversationInstances.owl#comment10_01_31_2327234.30975688</parent>
</comment>
<comment>
	<id>http://www.semanticweb.org/ontologies/ConversationInstances.owl#comment10_01_31_2327234.30975566</id>
	<title>Bwhahahaha - "engineers" drawing pretty parts</title>
	<author>iggymanz</author>
	<datestamp>1264943580000</datestamp>
	<modclass>Insightful</modclass>
	<modscore>4</modscore>
	<htmltext><p>oh man, what a load - if you had real engineers working on actual moon project you'd be more worried about nonlinear FEA software  at this point.  There's a reason why the USA is the only nation to ever had put humans on the moon - it's way too complex, way too expensive, and requires way too many PhD level man-decade equivalents of effort.</p></htmltext>
<tokenext>oh man , what a load - if you had real engineers working on actual moon project you 'd be more worried about nonlinear FEA software at this point .
There 's a reason why the USA is the only nation to ever had put humans on the moon - it 's way too complex , way too expensive , and requires way too many PhD level man-decade equivalents of effort .</tokentext>
<sentencetext>oh man, what a load - if you had real engineers working on actual moon project you'd be more worried about nonlinear FEA software  at this point.
There's a reason why the USA is the only nation to ever had put humans on the moon - it's way too complex, way too expensive, and requires way too many PhD level man-decade equivalents of effort.</sentencetext>
</comment>
<comment>
	<id>http://www.semanticweb.org/ontologies/ConversationInstances.owl#comment10_01_31_2327234.30975782</id>
	<title>pen + paper works</title>
	<author>Anonymous</author>
	<datestamp>1264945140000</datestamp>
	<modclass>None</modclass>
	<modscore>0</modscore>
	<htmltext><p><i>Many of the engineers have tried working with Blender and Art of Illusion</i></p><p>I hope this is some kind of joke. You're going to end up killing someone!</p><p><i>They want to just draw the parts,</i></p><p>Then why don't they just grab a pen and some paper and draw the parts. Since I assume you're trying to \_build\_ the parts - not just draw them - you'll find that most fabricators would rather have a well documented set of hand-drawn diagrams than some data for a CAD system they probably don't use.</p></htmltext>
<tokenext>Many of the engineers have tried working with Blender and Art of IllusionI hope this is some kind of joke .
You 're going to end up killing someone ! They want to just draw the parts,Then why do n't they just grab a pen and some paper and draw the parts .
Since I assume you 're trying to \ _build \ _ the parts - not just draw them - you 'll find that most fabricators would rather have a well documented set of hand-drawn diagrams than some data for a CAD system they probably do n't use .</tokentext>
<sentencetext>Many of the engineers have tried working with Blender and Art of IllusionI hope this is some kind of joke.
You're going to end up killing someone!They want to just draw the parts,Then why don't they just grab a pen and some paper and draw the parts.
Since I assume you're trying to \_build\_ the parts - not just draw them - you'll find that most fabricators would rather have a well documented set of hand-drawn diagrams than some data for a CAD system they probably don't use.</sentencetext>
</comment>
<comment>
	<id>http://www.semanticweb.org/ontologies/ConversationInstances.owl#comment10_01_31_2327234.30995598</id>
	<title>AC3D is good</title>
	<author>Anonymous</author>
	<datestamp>1265127600000</datestamp>
	<modclass>None</modclass>
	<modscore>0</modscore>
	<htmltext><p>AC3D does well for me as a simple modeler, should be good for CAD in an engineering sense, it certailnly isn't a tool for building organic forms but it's good at what it does.</p><p>http://www.inivis.com/</p></htmltext>
<tokenext>AC3D does well for me as a simple modeler , should be good for CAD in an engineering sense , it certailnly is n't a tool for building organic forms but it 's good at what it does.http : //www.inivis.com/</tokentext>
<sentencetext>AC3D does well for me as a simple modeler, should be good for CAD in an engineering sense, it certailnly isn't a tool for building organic forms but it's good at what it does.http://www.inivis.com/</sentencetext>
</comment>
<comment>
	<id>http://www.semanticweb.org/ontologies/ConversationInstances.owl#comment10_01_31_2327234.30979330</id>
	<title>Re:You've raised $130 out of $7500</title>
	<author>vegiVamp</author>
	<datestamp>1265028060000</datestamp>
	<modclass>None</modclass>
	<modscore>1</modscore>
	<htmltext><p>Reputation. The httpd hears it's site is on slashdot and instinctively falls over and starts bleeding.</p></htmltext>
<tokenext>Reputation .
The httpd hears it 's site is on slashdot and instinctively falls over and starts bleeding .</tokentext>
<sentencetext>Reputation.
The httpd hears it's site is on slashdot and instinctively falls over and starts bleeding.</sentencetext>
	<parent>http://www.semanticweb.org/ontologies/ConversationInstances.owl#comment10_01_31_2327234.30977472</parent>
</comment>
<comment>
	<id>http://www.semanticweb.org/ontologies/ConversationInstances.owl#comment10_01_31_2327234.30981540</id>
	<title>Re:lol</title>
	<author>Anonymous</author>
	<datestamp>1265041380000</datestamp>
	<modclass>None</modclass>
	<modscore>0</modscore>
	<htmltext><p>Paul server guy? Your page got slashdotted and you call yourself a server guy, how or why should anyone take you seriously?</p></htmltext>
<tokenext>Paul server guy ?
Your page got slashdotted and you call yourself a server guy , how or why should anyone take you seriously ?</tokentext>
<sentencetext>Paul server guy?
Your page got slashdotted and you call yourself a server guy, how or why should anyone take you seriously?</sentencetext>
	<parent>http://www.semanticweb.org/ontologies/ConversationInstances.owl#comment10_01_31_2327234.30977830</parent>
</comment>
<comment>
	<id>http://www.semanticweb.org/ontologies/ConversationInstances.owl#comment10_01_31_2327234.30975312</id>
	<title>art people</title>
	<author>Anonymous</author>
	<datestamp>1264942200000</datestamp>
	<modclass>None</modclass>
	<modscore>1</modscore>
	<htmltext><p>Why does it seem to me that if I were planning a trip to the moon, I wouldn't really have 'art people'?</p></htmltext>
<tokenext>Why does it seem to me that if I were planning a trip to the moon , I would n't really have 'art people ' ?</tokentext>
<sentencetext>Why does it seem to me that if I were planning a trip to the moon, I wouldn't really have 'art people'?</sentencetext>
</comment>
<comment>
	<id>http://www.semanticweb.org/ontologies/ConversationInstances.owl#comment10_01_31_2327234.30979584</id>
	<title>Re:You've raised $130 out of $7500</title>
	<author>tokul</author>
	<datestamp>1265030880000</datestamp>
	<modclass>None</modclass>
	<modscore>1</modscore>
	<htmltext><blockquote><div><p>How do so many geeks manage that?</p></div>
</blockquote><p>One geek putting interesting content on inadequate hardware or network connection.
</p><p>Summary must be interesting enough to attract site viewers.</p></div>
	</htmltext>
<tokenext>How do so many geeks manage that ?
One geek putting interesting content on inadequate hardware or network connection .
Summary must be interesting enough to attract site viewers .</tokentext>
<sentencetext>How do so many geeks manage that?
One geek putting interesting content on inadequate hardware or network connection.
Summary must be interesting enough to attract site viewers.
	</sentencetext>
	<parent>http://www.semanticweb.org/ontologies/ConversationInstances.owl#comment10_01_31_2327234.30977472</parent>
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