<article>
	<id>http://www.semanticweb.org/ontologies/ConversationInstances.owl#article10_01_05_0357226</id>
	<title><em>EVE Online</em> Battle Breaks Records (And Servers)</title>
	<author>Soulskill</author>
	<datestamp>1262714940000</datestamp>
	<htmltext><a href="http://captainktaineratyahoodotcom/" rel="nofollow">captainktainer</a> writes <i>"In one of the largest tests of <em>EVE Online's</em> new player sovereignty system in the <em>Dominion</em> expansion pack, a fleet of ships attempting to retake a lost star system was effectively annihilated amidst controversy. Defenders IT Alliance, a coalition succeeding the infamous Band of Brothers alliance (whose disbanding was covered in <a href="http://games.slashdot.org/story/09/02/06/0714218/Massive-EVE-Online-Alliance-Disbanded">a previous story</a>), effectively annihilated the enemy fleet, destroying thousands of dollars' worth of in-game assets. A representative of the alliance <a href="http://www.kugutsumen.com/showthread.php?5300-Bi-daily-0-0-political-updates-v3-0&amp;p=58974&amp;viewfull=1#post58974">claimed to have destroyed</a> a minimum of four, possibly five or more of the game's most expensive and powerful ship class, known as Titans. Both official and unofficial forums are filled with debate about whether the one-sided battle was due to difference in player skill or the well-known network failures after the release of the expansion. One of the attackers, a member of the GoonSwarm alliance, <a href="http://eve-search.com/thread/1243981#11">claims that because of bad coding</a>, 'Only 5\% of [the attackers] loaded,' meaning that lag prevented the attackers from using their ships, even as the defenders were able to destroy those ships unopposed. Even members of the victorious IT Alliance <a href="http://www.kugutsumen.com/showthread.php?5300-Bi-daily-0-0-political-updates-v3-0&amp;p=58981&amp;viewfull=1#post58981">expressed disappointment at the outcome of the battle</a>. CCP, <em>EVE Online's</em> publisher, has recently acknowledged poor network performance, especially in the advertised 'large fleet battles' that <em>Dominion</em> was supposed to encourage, and has asked players to <a href="http://eve-search.com/thread/1238523/page/1#1">help them stress test their code</a> on Tuesday. Despite the admitted network failure, leaders of the attacking force do not expect CCP to replace lost ships, claiming that <a href="http://www.kugutsumen.com/showthread.php?5300-Bi-daily-0-0-political-updates-v3-0&amp;p=58980&amp;viewfull=1#post58980">it was their own fault</a> for not accounting for server failures. The incident raises questions about CCP's ability to cope with the increased network use associated with their <a href="http://www.eurogamer.net/articles/eve-surpasses-300-000-subscribers">rapid growth in subscriptions</a>."</i></htmltext>
<tokenext>captainktainer writes " In one of the largest tests of EVE Online 's new player sovereignty system in the Dominion expansion pack , a fleet of ships attempting to retake a lost star system was effectively annihilated amidst controversy .
Defenders IT Alliance , a coalition succeeding the infamous Band of Brothers alliance ( whose disbanding was covered in a previous story ) , effectively annihilated the enemy fleet , destroying thousands of dollars ' worth of in-game assets .
A representative of the alliance claimed to have destroyed a minimum of four , possibly five or more of the game 's most expensive and powerful ship class , known as Titans .
Both official and unofficial forums are filled with debate about whether the one-sided battle was due to difference in player skill or the well-known network failures after the release of the expansion .
One of the attackers , a member of the GoonSwarm alliance , claims that because of bad coding , 'Only 5 \ % of [ the attackers ] loaded, ' meaning that lag prevented the attackers from using their ships , even as the defenders were able to destroy those ships unopposed .
Even members of the victorious IT Alliance expressed disappointment at the outcome of the battle .
CCP , EVE Online 's publisher , has recently acknowledged poor network performance , especially in the advertised 'large fleet battles ' that Dominion was supposed to encourage , and has asked players to help them stress test their code on Tuesday .
Despite the admitted network failure , leaders of the attacking force do not expect CCP to replace lost ships , claiming that it was their own fault for not accounting for server failures .
The incident raises questions about CCP 's ability to cope with the increased network use associated with their rapid growth in subscriptions .
"</tokentext>
<sentencetext>captainktainer writes "In one of the largest tests of EVE Online's new player sovereignty system in the Dominion expansion pack, a fleet of ships attempting to retake a lost star system was effectively annihilated amidst controversy.
Defenders IT Alliance, a coalition succeeding the infamous Band of Brothers alliance (whose disbanding was covered in a previous story), effectively annihilated the enemy fleet, destroying thousands of dollars' worth of in-game assets.
A representative of the alliance claimed to have destroyed a minimum of four, possibly five or more of the game's most expensive and powerful ship class, known as Titans.
Both official and unofficial forums are filled with debate about whether the one-sided battle was due to difference in player skill or the well-known network failures after the release of the expansion.
One of the attackers, a member of the GoonSwarm alliance, claims that because of bad coding, 'Only 5\% of [the attackers] loaded,' meaning that lag prevented the attackers from using their ships, even as the defenders were able to destroy those ships unopposed.
Even members of the victorious IT Alliance expressed disappointment at the outcome of the battle.
CCP, EVE Online's publisher, has recently acknowledged poor network performance, especially in the advertised 'large fleet battles' that Dominion was supposed to encourage, and has asked players to help them stress test their code on Tuesday.
Despite the admitted network failure, leaders of the attacking force do not expect CCP to replace lost ships, claiming that it was their own fault for not accounting for server failures.
The incident raises questions about CCP's ability to cope with the increased network use associated with their rapid growth in subscriptions.
"</sentencetext>
</article>
<comment>
	<id>http://www.semanticweb.org/ontologies/ConversationInstances.owl#comment10_01_05_0357226.30651806</id>
	<title>Thousands? Far from accurate...</title>
	<author>mr\_da3m0n</author>
	<datestamp>1262632920000</datestamp>
	<modclass>None</modclass>
	<modscore>0</modscore>
	<htmltext><p><nobr> <wbr></nobr></p><div class="quote"><p>...effectively annihilated the enemy fleet, destroying <strong>thousands of dollars' worth of in-game assets.</strong></p> </div><p>If you have played eve, at this point you will know that a thousand ISK is small change. Even a million is pretty much small change. In fact, the Titan ships mentionned in there are rumored to cost around 60 billions. Sixty billions. That's far from thousands.</p></div>
	</htmltext>
<tokenext>...effectively annihilated the enemy fleet , destroying thousands of dollars ' worth of in-game assets .
If you have played eve , at this point you will know that a thousand ISK is small change .
Even a million is pretty much small change .
In fact , the Titan ships mentionned in there are rumored to cost around 60 billions .
Sixty billions .
That 's far from thousands .</tokentext>
<sentencetext> ...effectively annihilated the enemy fleet, destroying thousands of dollars' worth of in-game assets.
If you have played eve, at this point you will know that a thousand ISK is small change.
Even a million is pretty much small change.
In fact, the Titan ships mentionned in there are rumored to cost around 60 billions.
Sixty billions.
That's far from thousands.
	</sentencetext>
</comment>
<comment>
	<id>http://www.semanticweb.org/ontologies/ConversationInstances.owl#comment10_01_05_0357226.30656064</id>
	<title>Re:I'm not sure about their policy...</title>
	<author>rrhal</author>
	<datestamp>1262712120000</datestamp>
	<modclass>None</modclass>
	<modscore>1</modscore>
	<htmltext>The stupidity is that you trusted CCP yet again.  Fool me once shame on you; fool me twice shame on me.  CCP's lame ass buggy code exposes you to impossible situations where you can't fight back because the server isn't listening to you yet.  By the time you get any control of your character you are "respawning" with out your stuff.</htmltext>
<tokenext>The stupidity is that you trusted CCP yet again .
Fool me once shame on you ; fool me twice shame on me .
CCP 's lame ass buggy code exposes you to impossible situations where you ca n't fight back because the server is n't listening to you yet .
By the time you get any control of your character you are " respawning " with out your stuff .</tokentext>
<sentencetext>The stupidity is that you trusted CCP yet again.
Fool me once shame on you; fool me twice shame on me.
CCP's lame ass buggy code exposes you to impossible situations where you can't fight back because the server isn't listening to you yet.
By the time you get any control of your character you are "respawning" with out your stuff.</sentencetext>
	<parent>http://www.semanticweb.org/ontologies/ConversationInstances.owl#comment10_01_05_0357226.30651772</parent>
</comment>
<comment>
	<id>http://www.semanticweb.org/ontologies/ConversationInstances.owl#comment10_01_05_0357226.30666408</id>
	<title>Re:Why Am I Not Surprised</title>
	<author>Anonymous</author>
	<datestamp>1262720820000</datestamp>
	<modclass>None</modclass>
	<modscore>0</modscore>
	<htmltext><p>Last time CCP spoke on the subject, they said that there's more CCP employees in Goonswarm than in any other alliance.</p></htmltext>
<tokenext>Last time CCP spoke on the subject , they said that there 's more CCP employees in Goonswarm than in any other alliance .</tokentext>
<sentencetext>Last time CCP spoke on the subject, they said that there's more CCP employees in Goonswarm than in any other alliance.</sentencetext>
	<parent>http://www.semanticweb.org/ontologies/ConversationInstances.owl#comment10_01_05_0357226.30653896</parent>
</comment>
<comment>
	<id>http://www.semanticweb.org/ontologies/ConversationInstances.owl#comment10_01_05_0357226.30652278</id>
	<title>Re:I'm not sure about their policy...</title>
	<author>Anonymous</author>
	<datestamp>1262724360000</datestamp>
	<modclass>Informativ</modclass>
	<modscore>2</modscore>
	<htmltext><p>I never got refunded when I lost ships due to Goons and their lag inducing tactics. Why should they get any refund when they get lag pwned?</p></htmltext>
<tokenext>I never got refunded when I lost ships due to Goons and their lag inducing tactics .
Why should they get any refund when they get lag pwned ?</tokentext>
<sentencetext>I never got refunded when I lost ships due to Goons and their lag inducing tactics.
Why should they get any refund when they get lag pwned?</sentencetext>
	<parent>http://www.semanticweb.org/ontologies/ConversationInstances.owl#comment10_01_05_0357226.30651772</parent>
</comment>
<comment>
	<id>http://www.semanticweb.org/ontologies/ConversationInstances.owl#comment10_01_05_0357226.30653162</id>
	<title>Re:Here is video of the battle...</title>
	<author>MartinSchou</author>
	<datestamp>1262691960000</datestamp>
	<modclass>None</modclass>
	<modscore>1</modscore>
	<htmltext><p>Look again.</p><p>There are what? 300+ huge ships all clustered together in a box that appears to be no larger than maybe 10 ships on each side. It's absolutely cramped. Where should they go? If you're in the middle, you're fucked, because if you start moving about, you've just turned yourself and the ships around you into kinetic missiles.</p><p>Those on the outer edges of the box could move around, sure. They can back away. But if they have to turn around to face their engines towards the centre mass and their weapons away, that's a complete waste of time from their perspective.</p><p>I don't even play the game, nor have I ever done so, but to me it seemed a bit like <a href="http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=XX0IXHMuy7U" title="youtube.com">the space battle scene from Serenity just multiplied by ten and with MUCH bigger ships. The only reason the Serenity scene looks as intense as it does, is we're following a tiny ship in the midst of a massive battle. But if you look closely, the only big ships moving about are the Reaver ships, and that's because they were already moving when they came out of the cloud.</a> [youtube.com]</p></htmltext>
<tokenext>Look again.There are what ?
300 + huge ships all clustered together in a box that appears to be no larger than maybe 10 ships on each side .
It 's absolutely cramped .
Where should they go ?
If you 're in the middle , you 're fucked , because if you start moving about , you 've just turned yourself and the ships around you into kinetic missiles.Those on the outer edges of the box could move around , sure .
They can back away .
But if they have to turn around to face their engines towards the centre mass and their weapons away , that 's a complete waste of time from their perspective.I do n't even play the game , nor have I ever done so , but to me it seemed a bit like the space battle scene from Serenity just multiplied by ten and with MUCH bigger ships .
The only reason the Serenity scene looks as intense as it does , is we 're following a tiny ship in the midst of a massive battle .
But if you look closely , the only big ships moving about are the Reaver ships , and that 's because they were already moving when they came out of the cloud .
[ youtube.com ]</tokentext>
<sentencetext>Look again.There are what?
300+ huge ships all clustered together in a box that appears to be no larger than maybe 10 ships on each side.
It's absolutely cramped.
Where should they go?
If you're in the middle, you're fucked, because if you start moving about, you've just turned yourself and the ships around you into kinetic missiles.Those on the outer edges of the box could move around, sure.
They can back away.
But if they have to turn around to face their engines towards the centre mass and their weapons away, that's a complete waste of time from their perspective.I don't even play the game, nor have I ever done so, but to me it seemed a bit like the space battle scene from Serenity just multiplied by ten and with MUCH bigger ships.
The only reason the Serenity scene looks as intense as it does, is we're following a tiny ship in the midst of a massive battle.
But if you look closely, the only big ships moving about are the Reaver ships, and that's because they were already moving when they came out of the cloud.
[youtube.com]</sentencetext>
	<parent>http://www.semanticweb.org/ontologies/ConversationInstances.owl#comment10_01_05_0357226.30652356</parent>
</comment>
<comment>
	<id>http://www.semanticweb.org/ontologies/ConversationInstances.owl#comment10_01_05_0357226.30654324</id>
	<title>Re:Kinda Cool</title>
	<author>jollyreaper</author>
	<datestamp>1262704560000</datestamp>
	<modclass>Interestin</modclass>
	<modscore>2</modscore>
	<htmltext><p><div class="quote"><p>I still don't think I'll sign over my credit card to a MM online game, but a game that lets you destroy THOUSANDS of dollars of stuff that other people value for the sheer malicious joy . . . well, that's perversely COOL!</p></div><p>I noodled about in EVE years ago. It's got the harshest cost factor of any MMO out there. It can take weeks of grinding to get a good ship and you can lose it in seconds if you're not careful. You have many, many hours spread between the ship you buy and your pilot and the pilot has both XP and implants that boost stats. You can buy clone insurance for the pilot but implants are always lost upon death.</p><p>There are a lot of chinese farmers in the game as well as OCD no-life guys who amass virtual fortunes. You get kill mails when you nail someone in PVP showing what you managed to blow up. There was one I saw that was amazing in the perverse fashion you mentioned. Someone was making a run from base to market in a giant freighter with no escort. A pvp pirate popped him and just about shat himself when he saw the kill mail. That ship had like a zillion credits worth of loot in it. In real world dollars it was something ridiculous like $10k. You make your money in the game by one form of grinding or another. Noobs are making thousands per hour and veteran players can make millions per hour but even the most veteran player is going to have to play for a very long time to earn $10k. I don't even know how much time $10k would represent to a gold farmer. The output of a whole shop for a month? I just don't know.</p><p>Things like that convinced me there was more money to be made grinding in real life.<nobr> <wbr></nobr>:)</p></div>
	</htmltext>
<tokenext>I still do n't think I 'll sign over my credit card to a MM online game , but a game that lets you destroy THOUSANDS of dollars of stuff that other people value for the sheer malicious joy .
. .
well , that 's perversely COOL ! I noodled about in EVE years ago .
It 's got the harshest cost factor of any MMO out there .
It can take weeks of grinding to get a good ship and you can lose it in seconds if you 're not careful .
You have many , many hours spread between the ship you buy and your pilot and the pilot has both XP and implants that boost stats .
You can buy clone insurance for the pilot but implants are always lost upon death.There are a lot of chinese farmers in the game as well as OCD no-life guys who amass virtual fortunes .
You get kill mails when you nail someone in PVP showing what you managed to blow up .
There was one I saw that was amazing in the perverse fashion you mentioned .
Someone was making a run from base to market in a giant freighter with no escort .
A pvp pirate popped him and just about shat himself when he saw the kill mail .
That ship had like a zillion credits worth of loot in it .
In real world dollars it was something ridiculous like $ 10k .
You make your money in the game by one form of grinding or another .
Noobs are making thousands per hour and veteran players can make millions per hour but even the most veteran player is going to have to play for a very long time to earn $ 10k .
I do n't even know how much time $ 10k would represent to a gold farmer .
The output of a whole shop for a month ?
I just do n't know.Things like that convinced me there was more money to be made grinding in real life .
: )</tokentext>
<sentencetext>I still don't think I'll sign over my credit card to a MM online game, but a game that lets you destroy THOUSANDS of dollars of stuff that other people value for the sheer malicious joy .
. .
well, that's perversely COOL!I noodled about in EVE years ago.
It's got the harshest cost factor of any MMO out there.
It can take weeks of grinding to get a good ship and you can lose it in seconds if you're not careful.
You have many, many hours spread between the ship you buy and your pilot and the pilot has both XP and implants that boost stats.
You can buy clone insurance for the pilot but implants are always lost upon death.There are a lot of chinese farmers in the game as well as OCD no-life guys who amass virtual fortunes.
You get kill mails when you nail someone in PVP showing what you managed to blow up.
There was one I saw that was amazing in the perverse fashion you mentioned.
Someone was making a run from base to market in a giant freighter with no escort.
A pvp pirate popped him and just about shat himself when he saw the kill mail.
That ship had like a zillion credits worth of loot in it.
In real world dollars it was something ridiculous like $10k.
You make your money in the game by one form of grinding or another.
Noobs are making thousands per hour and veteran players can make millions per hour but even the most veteran player is going to have to play for a very long time to earn $10k.
I don't even know how much time $10k would represent to a gold farmer.
The output of a whole shop for a month?
I just don't know.Things like that convinced me there was more money to be made grinding in real life.
:)
	</sentencetext>
	<parent>http://www.semanticweb.org/ontologies/ConversationInstances.owl#comment10_01_05_0357226.30651784</parent>
</comment>
<comment>
	<id>http://www.semanticweb.org/ontologies/ConversationInstances.owl#comment10_01_05_0357226.30655454</id>
	<title>Re:EVE Online.</title>
	<author>Anonymous</author>
	<datestamp>1262709840000</datestamp>
	<modclass>None</modclass>
	<modscore>1</modscore>
	<htmltext><p>That's your example?  Really?</p><p>What about the patch that in certain situations destroyed windows by overwriting an important system file?  Don't make your file the same as a vitally important system file.  Definitely don't do it and then overwrite said file without an explicit path to the install location.</p><p>I love EvE and still play from time to time but yeah their programmers make some of the stupidest mistakes.</p><p>Every patch has a great bug thread along the lines of "How did the "BSes explode when undocking bug make it to production?  We told you about it on test, there was a huge thread, and all you have to do to recreate it is undock a BS and watch it explode."</p><p>I love reading those threads.</p></htmltext>
<tokenext>That 's your example ?
Really ? What about the patch that in certain situations destroyed windows by overwriting an important system file ?
Do n't make your file the same as a vitally important system file .
Definitely do n't do it and then overwrite said file without an explicit path to the install location.I love EvE and still play from time to time but yeah their programmers make some of the stupidest mistakes.Every patch has a great bug thread along the lines of " How did the " BSes explode when undocking bug make it to production ?
We told you about it on test , there was a huge thread , and all you have to do to recreate it is undock a BS and watch it explode .
" I love reading those threads .</tokentext>
<sentencetext>That's your example?
Really?What about the patch that in certain situations destroyed windows by overwriting an important system file?
Don't make your file the same as a vitally important system file.
Definitely don't do it and then overwrite said file without an explicit path to the install location.I love EvE and still play from time to time but yeah their programmers make some of the stupidest mistakes.Every patch has a great bug thread along the lines of "How did the "BSes explode when undocking bug make it to production?
We told you about it on test, there was a huge thread, and all you have to do to recreate it is undock a BS and watch it explode.
"I love reading those threads.</sentencetext>
	<parent>http://www.semanticweb.org/ontologies/ConversationInstances.owl#comment10_01_05_0357226.30652150</parent>
</comment>
<comment>
	<id>http://www.semanticweb.org/ontologies/ConversationInstances.owl#comment10_01_05_0357226.30652222</id>
	<title>Re:Thousands? Say it isn't so!</title>
	<author>Anonymous</author>
	<datestamp>1262723880000</datestamp>
	<modclass>None</modclass>
	<modscore>1</modscore>
	<htmltext><p>Sorry to be blunt, but an event that affects multiple hundred people is more newsworthy than one that affects only one. But thanks for your participation.</p><p>To be more sensible, certainly we're talking makebelieve money here. Then again, given the current economy, I'm not so sure the stuff we use to buy goods and services is anything better.</p></htmltext>
<tokenext>Sorry to be blunt , but an event that affects multiple hundred people is more newsworthy than one that affects only one .
But thanks for your participation.To be more sensible , certainly we 're talking makebelieve money here .
Then again , given the current economy , I 'm not so sure the stuff we use to buy goods and services is anything better .</tokentext>
<sentencetext>Sorry to be blunt, but an event that affects multiple hundred people is more newsworthy than one that affects only one.
But thanks for your participation.To be more sensible, certainly we're talking makebelieve money here.
Then again, given the current economy, I'm not so sure the stuff we use to buy goods and services is anything better.</sentencetext>
	<parent>http://www.semanticweb.org/ontologies/ConversationInstances.owl#comment10_01_05_0357226.30651794</parent>
</comment>
<comment>
	<id>http://www.semanticweb.org/ontologies/ConversationInstances.owl#comment10_01_05_0357226.30654652</id>
	<title>Re:Why Am I Not Surprised</title>
	<author>Zeelan</author>
	<datestamp>1262706360000</datestamp>
	<modclass>None</modclass>
	<modscore>1</modscore>
	<htmltext>Large fleet battles are not a surprise anymore and fleet lagging of this kind is well known now. My own alliance lost 300 ships to just such a lag shortly after the new expansion came out. Anymore we actually get in system four to six hours before the main battle, and sit there bored to tears just so that we have the lag advantage. Goons never did have the discipline to do something with that level of dedication.

Full Disclosure: I fly with IT and was there in system when this happened. I also flew with BoB before and after its fall.</htmltext>
<tokenext>Large fleet battles are not a surprise anymore and fleet lagging of this kind is well known now .
My own alliance lost 300 ships to just such a lag shortly after the new expansion came out .
Anymore we actually get in system four to six hours before the main battle , and sit there bored to tears just so that we have the lag advantage .
Goons never did have the discipline to do something with that level of dedication .
Full Disclosure : I fly with IT and was there in system when this happened .
I also flew with BoB before and after its fall .</tokentext>
<sentencetext>Large fleet battles are not a surprise anymore and fleet lagging of this kind is well known now.
My own alliance lost 300 ships to just such a lag shortly after the new expansion came out.
Anymore we actually get in system four to six hours before the main battle, and sit there bored to tears just so that we have the lag advantage.
Goons never did have the discipline to do something with that level of dedication.
Full Disclosure: I fly with IT and was there in system when this happened.
I also flew with BoB before and after its fall.</sentencetext>
	<parent>http://www.semanticweb.org/ontologies/ConversationInstances.owl#comment10_01_05_0357226.30652126</parent>
</comment>
<comment>
	<id>http://www.semanticweb.org/ontologies/ConversationInstances.owl#comment10_01_05_0357226.30654106</id>
	<title>Re:Why Am I Not Surprised</title>
	<author>magamiako1</author>
	<datestamp>1262703180000</datestamp>
	<modclass>None</modclass>
	<modscore>1</modscore>
	<htmltext>Just an FYI, you can't really compare Eve's "single world" design with WoW's, as there are some interesting considerations to take into account here.<br><br>-WoW has 4 continents, each continent is on its own server/cluster of servers. Every player therefore sees every other player. Continents otherwise are not "instanced". Every player can see and interact with every other player. There's no "rooms"-style selection for this. You log in, you go into a city, and you're there with everyone else.<br><br>-Cities are the most popular areas of WoW, usually a single capital city. Come Cataclysm (next expansion) it will be broken into 2 cities again (horde and alliance).<br><br>Even can get away with splitting off players because it's a virtually limitless world, and there's a loading screen in between most areas. WoW favors far fewer loading screens than most other MMORPG games.<br><br>-Battlegrounds, Dungeons, Raids, and Arenas are all instanced.</htmltext>
<tokenext>Just an FYI , you ca n't really compare Eve 's " single world " design with WoW 's , as there are some interesting considerations to take into account here.-WoW has 4 continents , each continent is on its own server/cluster of servers .
Every player therefore sees every other player .
Continents otherwise are not " instanced " .
Every player can see and interact with every other player .
There 's no " rooms " -style selection for this .
You log in , you go into a city , and you 're there with everyone else.-Cities are the most popular areas of WoW , usually a single capital city .
Come Cataclysm ( next expansion ) it will be broken into 2 cities again ( horde and alliance ) .Even can get away with splitting off players because it 's a virtually limitless world , and there 's a loading screen in between most areas .
WoW favors far fewer loading screens than most other MMORPG games.-Battlegrounds , Dungeons , Raids , and Arenas are all instanced .</tokentext>
<sentencetext>Just an FYI, you can't really compare Eve's "single world" design with WoW's, as there are some interesting considerations to take into account here.-WoW has 4 continents, each continent is on its own server/cluster of servers.
Every player therefore sees every other player.
Continents otherwise are not "instanced".
Every player can see and interact with every other player.
There's no "rooms"-style selection for this.
You log in, you go into a city, and you're there with everyone else.-Cities are the most popular areas of WoW, usually a single capital city.
Come Cataclysm (next expansion) it will be broken into 2 cities again (horde and alliance).Even can get away with splitting off players because it's a virtually limitless world, and there's a loading screen in between most areas.
WoW favors far fewer loading screens than most other MMORPG games.-Battlegrounds, Dungeons, Raids, and Arenas are all instanced.</sentencetext>
	<parent>http://www.semanticweb.org/ontologies/ConversationInstances.owl#comment10_01_05_0357226.30652656</parent>
</comment>
<comment>
	<id>http://www.semanticweb.org/ontologies/ConversationInstances.owl#comment10_01_05_0357226.30652394</id>
	<title>Re:Here is video of the battle...</title>
	<author>Anonymous</author>
	<datestamp>1262682780000</datestamp>
	<modclass>Interestin</modclass>
	<modscore>1</modscore>
	<htmltext><p>So this is supposed to be fun?</p></htmltext>
<tokenext>So this is supposed to be fun ?</tokentext>
<sentencetext>So this is supposed to be fun?</sentencetext>
	<parent>http://www.semanticweb.org/ontologies/ConversationInstances.owl#comment10_01_05_0357226.30651912</parent>
</comment>
<comment>
	<id>http://www.semanticweb.org/ontologies/ConversationInstances.owl#comment10_01_05_0357226.30653592</id>
	<title>Re:EVE Online.</title>
	<author>MstrFool</author>
	<datestamp>1262697900000</datestamp>
	<modclass>None</modclass>
	<modscore>1</modscore>
	<htmltext><p>Personally, I found that I could make a diff in a battle by the first month. And now that I know what I am doing, I could make a new CHR and make that diff a positive one for my side<nobr> <wbr></nobr>;). I took a group of new players, 1 to 4 months in the game, and with just 2 weeks of helping them pick skills and learn to work as a team, a group of 4 noobies were able to annihilate a 3 year old player in a tech 3 ship using tech 2 fittings. On your own as a new person, it's ruff. But, get together and a hand full of new folks can hand one or two older folks their heads, quite unexpectedly. CCP did some amazing things in the balancing of the game. It's true you'll need an older player to point it out and organize, but new players are far from powerless and can do far more then I see in other MMOs. As for favoring BoB, that was a few bad folks in CCP, and folks got fired over it. Sadly, there are bad people in every corp and every game, it happens. It is good to know that on average the Eve players are adult enough to know that and be able to deal with it. Fly safe.</p></htmltext>
<tokenext>Personally , I found that I could make a diff in a battle by the first month .
And now that I know what I am doing , I could make a new CHR and make that diff a positive one for my side ; ) .
I took a group of new players , 1 to 4 months in the game , and with just 2 weeks of helping them pick skills and learn to work as a team , a group of 4 noobies were able to annihilate a 3 year old player in a tech 3 ship using tech 2 fittings .
On your own as a new person , it 's ruff .
But , get together and a hand full of new folks can hand one or two older folks their heads , quite unexpectedly .
CCP did some amazing things in the balancing of the game .
It 's true you 'll need an older player to point it out and organize , but new players are far from powerless and can do far more then I see in other MMOs .
As for favoring BoB , that was a few bad folks in CCP , and folks got fired over it .
Sadly , there are bad people in every corp and every game , it happens .
It is good to know that on average the Eve players are adult enough to know that and be able to deal with it .
Fly safe .</tokentext>
<sentencetext>Personally, I found that I could make a diff in a battle by the first month.
And now that I know what I am doing, I could make a new CHR and make that diff a positive one for my side ;).
I took a group of new players, 1 to 4 months in the game, and with just 2 weeks of helping them pick skills and learn to work as a team, a group of 4 noobies were able to annihilate a 3 year old player in a tech 3 ship using tech 2 fittings.
On your own as a new person, it's ruff.
But, get together and a hand full of new folks can hand one or two older folks their heads, quite unexpectedly.
CCP did some amazing things in the balancing of the game.
It's true you'll need an older player to point it out and organize, but new players are far from powerless and can do far more then I see in other MMOs.
As for favoring BoB, that was a few bad folks in CCP, and folks got fired over it.
Sadly, there are bad people in every corp and every game, it happens.
It is good to know that on average the Eve players are adult enough to know that and be able to deal with it.
Fly safe.</sentencetext>
	<parent>http://www.semanticweb.org/ontologies/ConversationInstances.owl#comment10_01_05_0357226.30651868</parent>
</comment>
<comment>
	<id>http://www.semanticweb.org/ontologies/ConversationInstances.owl#comment10_01_05_0357226.30657268</id>
	<title>Re:EVE Online.</title>
	<author>Anonymous</author>
	<datestamp>1262716080000</datestamp>
	<modclass>None</modclass>
	<modscore>0</modscore>
	<htmltext><p>Thank you for your post. I found it very informative, and exciting. I was never excited about EvE before<nobr> <wbr></nobr>:)</p></htmltext>
<tokenext>Thank you for your post .
I found it very informative , and exciting .
I was never excited about EvE before : )</tokentext>
<sentencetext>Thank you for your post.
I found it very informative, and exciting.
I was never excited about EvE before :)</sentencetext>
	<parent>http://www.semanticweb.org/ontologies/ConversationInstances.owl#comment10_01_05_0357226.30652158</parent>
</comment>
<comment>
	<id>http://www.semanticweb.org/ontologies/ConversationInstances.owl#comment10_01_05_0357226.30656362</id>
	<title>Re:Kinda Cool</title>
	<author>dnoyeb</author>
	<datestamp>1262713140000</datestamp>
	<modclass>None</modclass>
	<modscore>1</modscore>
	<htmltext><p>Because farming is legal in China.  That is why there is a Chinese server meant for those players.  Or at least it was in the works.</p><p>In eve, most farmers are Russians.</p></htmltext>
<tokenext>Because farming is legal in China .
That is why there is a Chinese server meant for those players .
Or at least it was in the works.In eve , most farmers are Russians .</tokentext>
<sentencetext>Because farming is legal in China.
That is why there is a Chinese server meant for those players.
Or at least it was in the works.In eve, most farmers are Russians.</sentencetext>
	<parent>http://www.semanticweb.org/ontologies/ConversationInstances.owl#comment10_01_05_0357226.30654324</parent>
</comment>
<comment>
	<id>http://www.semanticweb.org/ontologies/ConversationInstances.owl#comment10_01_05_0357226.30652862</id>
	<title>Re:It was their own fault</title>
	<author>Anonymous</author>
	<datestamp>1262687640000</datestamp>
	<modclass>None</modclass>
	<modscore>0</modscore>
	<htmltext><p>You sound like you're either in IT or have an axe to grind with Goonswarm. So I'm guessing we should have done nothing and let SoT hand IT a system right next to Delve without a fight? PL jumping Titans in before the lag was tested was an idiot move, granted. But I for one would like to actually play this internet spaceship game I was formally paying for as opposed to sitting in station spinning ships.</p><p>And no, as far as I'm aware there was no intent to crash the node though you and every one else on CAOD can keep spouting that as much as you want. The situation of the node crashing was taken into account in case it would happen, but it was not the plan.</p></htmltext>
<tokenext>You sound like you 're either in IT or have an axe to grind with Goonswarm .
So I 'm guessing we should have done nothing and let SoT hand IT a system right next to Delve without a fight ?
PL jumping Titans in before the lag was tested was an idiot move , granted .
But I for one would like to actually play this internet spaceship game I was formally paying for as opposed to sitting in station spinning ships.And no , as far as I 'm aware there was no intent to crash the node though you and every one else on CAOD can keep spouting that as much as you want .
The situation of the node crashing was taken into account in case it would happen , but it was not the plan .</tokentext>
<sentencetext>You sound like you're either in IT or have an axe to grind with Goonswarm.
So I'm guessing we should have done nothing and let SoT hand IT a system right next to Delve without a fight?
PL jumping Titans in before the lag was tested was an idiot move, granted.
But I for one would like to actually play this internet spaceship game I was formally paying for as opposed to sitting in station spinning ships.And no, as far as I'm aware there was no intent to crash the node though you and every one else on CAOD can keep spouting that as much as you want.
The situation of the node crashing was taken into account in case it would happen, but it was not the plan.</sentencetext>
	<parent>http://www.semanticweb.org/ontologies/ConversationInstances.owl#comment10_01_05_0357226.30651812</parent>
</comment>
<comment>
	<id>http://www.semanticweb.org/ontologies/ConversationInstances.owl#comment10_01_05_0357226.30660246</id>
	<title>Re:Tried EVE...</title>
	<author>Secshunayt</author>
	<datestamp>1262684700000</datestamp>
	<modclass>None</modclass>
	<modscore>1</modscore>
	<htmltext>No offense, but you must have been pretty terrible to have that experience in highsec, or you talked a lot of smack and pissed people off.

I've played the game for over two years, spending significant amounts of time in highsec, lowsec, and nullsec, and I have never been killed in highsec by another player. Not once. Avoiding conflict in high security space is quite easy if you keep your wits about you and don't smack like a child.</htmltext>
<tokenext>No offense , but you must have been pretty terrible to have that experience in highsec , or you talked a lot of smack and pissed people off .
I 've played the game for over two years , spending significant amounts of time in highsec , lowsec , and nullsec , and I have never been killed in highsec by another player .
Not once .
Avoiding conflict in high security space is quite easy if you keep your wits about you and do n't smack like a child .</tokentext>
<sentencetext>No offense, but you must have been pretty terrible to have that experience in highsec, or you talked a lot of smack and pissed people off.
I've played the game for over two years, spending significant amounts of time in highsec, lowsec, and nullsec, and I have never been killed in highsec by another player.
Not once.
Avoiding conflict in high security space is quite easy if you keep your wits about you and don't smack like a child.</sentencetext>
	<parent>http://www.semanticweb.org/ontologies/ConversationInstances.owl#comment10_01_05_0357226.30654560</parent>
</comment>
<comment>
	<id>http://www.semanticweb.org/ontologies/ConversationInstances.owl#comment10_01_05_0357226.30657444</id>
	<title>Re:Why Am I Not Surprised</title>
	<author>Anonymous</author>
	<datestamp>1262716680000</datestamp>
	<modclass>None</modclass>
	<modscore>0</modscore>
	<htmltext><p>Really?  From each side, you say?</p><p>I played EvE Online for a while.  It's not a binary world when it comes to alliances.</p><p>In the fleet battles they are talking about - there might be 3, 4 or even 5 total "sides".  Players could be shooting at others from the same alliance, deliberately or not.  Covert operatives - some undercover for months if not YEARS - might be playing for "unfriendlies".  Alliances may switch teams partway through battles.</p><p>EVE is very much about enlightened self interest - do what you can to get yourself rich, screw everyone else.  It's incredibly cutthroat.  And remember - almost all corporations use NBSI to determine their targets - "if it's Not Blue [a known friendly], SHOOT IT!".  There are sometimes even corporations that are both under the same umbrella that will shoot at each other.  Rare, but it happens.</p></htmltext>
<tokenext>Really ?
From each side , you say ? I played EvE Online for a while .
It 's not a binary world when it comes to alliances.In the fleet battles they are talking about - there might be 3 , 4 or even 5 total " sides " .
Players could be shooting at others from the same alliance , deliberately or not .
Covert operatives - some undercover for months if not YEARS - might be playing for " unfriendlies " .
Alliances may switch teams partway through battles.EVE is very much about enlightened self interest - do what you can to get yourself rich , screw everyone else .
It 's incredibly cutthroat .
And remember - almost all corporations use NBSI to determine their targets - " if it 's Not Blue [ a known friendly ] , SHOOT IT ! " .
There are sometimes even corporations that are both under the same umbrella that will shoot at each other .
Rare , but it happens .</tokentext>
<sentencetext>Really?
From each side, you say?I played EvE Online for a while.
It's not a binary world when it comes to alliances.In the fleet battles they are talking about - there might be 3, 4 or even 5 total "sides".
Players could be shooting at others from the same alliance, deliberately or not.
Covert operatives - some undercover for months if not YEARS - might be playing for "unfriendlies".
Alliances may switch teams partway through battles.EVE is very much about enlightened self interest - do what you can to get yourself rich, screw everyone else.
It's incredibly cutthroat.
And remember - almost all corporations use NBSI to determine their targets - "if it's Not Blue [a known friendly], SHOOT IT!".
There are sometimes even corporations that are both under the same umbrella that will shoot at each other.
Rare, but it happens.</sentencetext>
	<parent>http://www.semanticweb.org/ontologies/ConversationInstances.owl#comment10_01_05_0357226.30653896</parent>
</comment>
<comment>
	<id>http://www.semanticweb.org/ontologies/ConversationInstances.owl#comment10_01_05_0357226.30663124</id>
	<title>Ho hum.</title>
	<author>Anonymous</author>
	<datestamp>1262697240000</datestamp>
	<modclass>None</modclass>
	<modscore>0</modscore>
	<htmltext>Is there a 'crymeariver' tag that I'm supposed to use for stories like this? Or how about a "worldssmallestviolin"?</htmltext>
<tokenext>Is there a 'crymeariver ' tag that I 'm supposed to use for stories like this ?
Or how about a " worldssmallestviolin " ?</tokentext>
<sentencetext>Is there a 'crymeariver' tag that I'm supposed to use for stories like this?
Or how about a "worldssmallestviolin"?</sentencetext>
</comment>
<comment>
	<id>http://www.semanticweb.org/ontologies/ConversationInstances.owl#comment10_01_05_0357226.30653930</id>
	<title>BoB</title>
	<author>Anonymous</author>
	<datestamp>1262701740000</datestamp>
	<modclass>None</modclass>
	<modscore>0</modscore>
	<htmltext><p>Yes, CCP personnel are known for favoring BoB, given this bug was specifically reintroduced, one can reasonably conclude the CCP wants to favor BoB's playstyle.</p></htmltext>
<tokenext>Yes , CCP personnel are known for favoring BoB , given this bug was specifically reintroduced , one can reasonably conclude the CCP wants to favor BoB 's playstyle .</tokentext>
<sentencetext>Yes, CCP personnel are known for favoring BoB, given this bug was specifically reintroduced, one can reasonably conclude the CCP wants to favor BoB's playstyle.</sentencetext>
	<parent>http://www.semanticweb.org/ontologies/ConversationInstances.owl#comment10_01_05_0357226.30651868</parent>
</comment>
<comment>
	<id>http://www.semanticweb.org/ontologies/ConversationInstances.owl#comment10_01_05_0357226.30651828</id>
	<title>Re:Thousands? Far from accurate...</title>
	<author>Rakshasa Taisab</author>
	<datestamp>1262633100000</datestamp>
	<modclass>None</modclass>
	<modscore>1</modscore>
	<htmltext>You seem to have RL and virtual life mixed up. Try going outside your house, but be careful.. The bright fire in the sky can burn unprotected skin.</htmltext>
<tokenext>You seem to have RL and virtual life mixed up .
Try going outside your house , but be careful.. The bright fire in the sky can burn unprotected skin .</tokentext>
<sentencetext>You seem to have RL and virtual life mixed up.
Try going outside your house, but be careful.. The bright fire in the sky can burn unprotected skin.</sentencetext>
	<parent>http://www.semanticweb.org/ontologies/ConversationInstances.owl#comment10_01_05_0357226.30651806</parent>
</comment>
<comment>
	<id>http://www.semanticweb.org/ontologies/ConversationInstances.owl#comment10_01_05_0357226.30654808</id>
	<title>Re:Why Am I Not Surprised</title>
	<author>Zeelan</author>
	<datestamp>1262707020000</datestamp>
	<modclass>Insightful</modclass>
	<modscore>2</modscore>
	<htmltext>How would culling players have been fair? The people on the IT side logged in and got into system four to six hours before the battle was reasonable expected to start, and goonswarm was told by all of their allies about the fleet lag and grip opening issue and chose to go in anyway.<br>
<br>
From another thread I found out about leaked logs that they were aware of the problem and jumped so many people in at once with the intent of crashing the server outright and the plan failed.</htmltext>
<tokenext>How would culling players have been fair ?
The people on the IT side logged in and got into system four to six hours before the battle was reasonable expected to start , and goonswarm was told by all of their allies about the fleet lag and grip opening issue and chose to go in anyway .
From another thread I found out about leaked logs that they were aware of the problem and jumped so many people in at once with the intent of crashing the server outright and the plan failed .</tokentext>
<sentencetext>How would culling players have been fair?
The people on the IT side logged in and got into system four to six hours before the battle was reasonable expected to start, and goonswarm was told by all of their allies about the fleet lag and grip opening issue and chose to go in anyway.
From another thread I found out about leaked logs that they were aware of the problem and jumped so many people in at once with the intent of crashing the server outright and the plan failed.</sentencetext>
	<parent>http://www.semanticweb.org/ontologies/ConversationInstances.owl#comment10_01_05_0357226.30653896</parent>
</comment>
<comment>
	<id>http://www.semanticweb.org/ontologies/ConversationInstances.owl#comment10_01_05_0357226.30661392</id>
	<title>Re:Kinda Cool</title>
	<author>Blakey Rat</author>
	<datestamp>1262689140000</datestamp>
	<modclass>None</modclass>
	<modscore>1</modscore>
	<htmltext><p><i>I still don't think I'll sign over my credit card to a MM online game, but a game that lets you destroy THOUSANDS of dollars of stuff that other people value for the sheer malicious joy . . . well, that's perversely COOL!</i></p><p>In the time it took you to grind the equipment/ships required to destroy THOUSANDS of dollars of stuff, you could have made TENS OF THOUSANDS of dollars if you had, for example, knitted dolls and sold them at craft fairs instead of playing EVE in the first place.</p></htmltext>
<tokenext>I still do n't think I 'll sign over my credit card to a MM online game , but a game that lets you destroy THOUSANDS of dollars of stuff that other people value for the sheer malicious joy .
. .
well , that 's perversely COOL ! In the time it took you to grind the equipment/ships required to destroy THOUSANDS of dollars of stuff , you could have made TENS OF THOUSANDS of dollars if you had , for example , knitted dolls and sold them at craft fairs instead of playing EVE in the first place .</tokentext>
<sentencetext>I still don't think I'll sign over my credit card to a MM online game, but a game that lets you destroy THOUSANDS of dollars of stuff that other people value for the sheer malicious joy .
. .
well, that's perversely COOL!In the time it took you to grind the equipment/ships required to destroy THOUSANDS of dollars of stuff, you could have made TENS OF THOUSANDS of dollars if you had, for example, knitted dolls and sold them at craft fairs instead of playing EVE in the first place.</sentencetext>
	<parent>http://www.semanticweb.org/ontologies/ConversationInstances.owl#comment10_01_05_0357226.30651784</parent>
</comment>
<comment>
	<id>http://www.semanticweb.org/ontologies/ConversationInstances.owl#comment10_01_05_0357226.30651868</id>
	<title>EVE Online.</title>
	<author>MindlessAutomata</author>
	<datestamp>1262633400000</datestamp>
	<modclass>Informativ</modclass>
	<modscore>3</modscore>
	<htmltext><p>I'm not trolling, but I fail to see the point of EVE for several reasons.  I used to play EVE myself for a few months but quit...</p><p>One, why play a game that takes you at least a year to be able to do anything fun and useful?  That's not a game at all, that's a job.</p><p>Two, CCP has shown themselves in the past to be shady and unreliable, having developers specifically favor certain alliances and otherwise abuse their powers for their own in-game corporations.</p><p>Three, the amount of bugs and inability to cope for server stress for large battles (which is the meat and potatoes of this game--large space wars!) has apparently been evident for quite some time now.</p><p>I understand that EVE online fills a niche few other games do, and EVE is probably the only one that even attempts what it does, but, IMO, that in no way means the CCP has displayed what I would consider a necessary amount of competence or good game design to make me want to play it.  I mean, if Age of Conan (no, EVE is nowhere near the mess that game was at) was the only MMO out there I still wouldn't play it even though I like MMOs.</p><p>It's pretty poor form when CCP will claim that subscribers need to account for their own ineptitude when playing their game and not take responsibility for their own, and not even fire the developers that gave unfair advantages to their own corporations way back when.  And I hear the game masters are incompetent jerks, too...</p></htmltext>
<tokenext>I 'm not trolling , but I fail to see the point of EVE for several reasons .
I used to play EVE myself for a few months but quit...One , why play a game that takes you at least a year to be able to do anything fun and useful ?
That 's not a game at all , that 's a job.Two , CCP has shown themselves in the past to be shady and unreliable , having developers specifically favor certain alliances and otherwise abuse their powers for their own in-game corporations.Three , the amount of bugs and inability to cope for server stress for large battles ( which is the meat and potatoes of this game--large space wars !
) has apparently been evident for quite some time now.I understand that EVE online fills a niche few other games do , and EVE is probably the only one that even attempts what it does , but , IMO , that in no way means the CCP has displayed what I would consider a necessary amount of competence or good game design to make me want to play it .
I mean , if Age of Conan ( no , EVE is nowhere near the mess that game was at ) was the only MMO out there I still would n't play it even though I like MMOs.It 's pretty poor form when CCP will claim that subscribers need to account for their own ineptitude when playing their game and not take responsibility for their own , and not even fire the developers that gave unfair advantages to their own corporations way back when .
And I hear the game masters are incompetent jerks , too.. .</tokentext>
<sentencetext>I'm not trolling, but I fail to see the point of EVE for several reasons.
I used to play EVE myself for a few months but quit...One, why play a game that takes you at least a year to be able to do anything fun and useful?
That's not a game at all, that's a job.Two, CCP has shown themselves in the past to be shady and unreliable, having developers specifically favor certain alliances and otherwise abuse their powers for their own in-game corporations.Three, the amount of bugs and inability to cope for server stress for large battles (which is the meat and potatoes of this game--large space wars!
) has apparently been evident for quite some time now.I understand that EVE online fills a niche few other games do, and EVE is probably the only one that even attempts what it does, but, IMO, that in no way means the CCP has displayed what I would consider a necessary amount of competence or good game design to make me want to play it.
I mean, if Age of Conan (no, EVE is nowhere near the mess that game was at) was the only MMO out there I still wouldn't play it even though I like MMOs.It's pretty poor form when CCP will claim that subscribers need to account for their own ineptitude when playing their game and not take responsibility for their own, and not even fire the developers that gave unfair advantages to their own corporations way back when.
And I hear the game masters are incompetent jerks, too...</sentencetext>
</comment>
<comment>
	<id>http://www.semanticweb.org/ontologies/ConversationInstances.owl#comment10_01_05_0357226.30657234</id>
	<title>Eve chinese farmers</title>
	<author>Atreide</author>
	<datestamp>1262715960000</datestamp>
	<modclass>None</modclass>
	<modscore>1</modscore>
	<htmltext><p>first semester 2009 CCP deleted 30'000 accounts they identified as farmers</p><p>their team of economics analysts confirmed impact with saner enconomy after the "holy rage" operation<br>(google : video eve online fanfest 2009 economy : <a href="http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=IHYcrow4ZUU" title="youtube.com">http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=IHYcrow4ZUU</a> [youtube.com])</p></htmltext>
<tokenext>first semester 2009 CCP deleted 30'000 accounts they identified as farmerstheir team of economics analysts confirmed impact with saner enconomy after the " holy rage " operation ( google : video eve online fanfest 2009 economy : http : //www.youtube.com/watch ? v = IHYcrow4ZUU [ youtube.com ] )</tokentext>
<sentencetext>first semester 2009 CCP deleted 30'000 accounts they identified as farmerstheir team of economics analysts confirmed impact with saner enconomy after the "holy rage" operation(google : video eve online fanfest 2009 economy : http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=IHYcrow4ZUU [youtube.com])</sentencetext>
	<parent>http://www.semanticweb.org/ontologies/ConversationInstances.owl#comment10_01_05_0357226.30654324</parent>
</comment>
<comment>
	<id>http://www.semanticweb.org/ontologies/ConversationInstances.owl#comment10_01_05_0357226.30651872</id>
	<title>Re:Thousands? Far from accurate...</title>
	<author>fake\_name</author>
	<datestamp>1262633460000</datestamp>
	<modclass>None</modclass>
	<modscore>1</modscore>
	<htmltext><p>You do know that an isk is not worth a dollar right?</p><p>Consider either the cost to buy 60B isk from currency sellers, or take the total man-hours needed to make a Titan and multiply by minimum wage, and then you'll have a much more useful figure representing how my *real* value was invested in those ships.</p></htmltext>
<tokenext>You do know that an isk is not worth a dollar right ? Consider either the cost to buy 60B isk from currency sellers , or take the total man-hours needed to make a Titan and multiply by minimum wage , and then you 'll have a much more useful figure representing how my * real * value was invested in those ships .</tokentext>
<sentencetext>You do know that an isk is not worth a dollar right?Consider either the cost to buy 60B isk from currency sellers, or take the total man-hours needed to make a Titan and multiply by minimum wage, and then you'll have a much more useful figure representing how my *real* value was invested in those ships.</sentencetext>
	<parent>http://www.semanticweb.org/ontologies/ConversationInstances.owl#comment10_01_05_0357226.30651806</parent>
</comment>
<comment>
	<id>http://www.semanticweb.org/ontologies/ConversationInstances.owl#comment10_01_05_0357226.30652136</id>
	<title>Re:EVE Online.</title>
	<author>Anonymous</author>
	<datestamp>1262722920000</datestamp>
	<modclass>Informativ</modclass>
	<modscore>2</modscore>
	<htmltext><p>A year to do anything useful? That's what you got from playing for a few months? </p><p>I don't really see any difference between that and say WoW where what everyone tells you the first goal is to get to level 80. How long does that take you assuming you don't have a pal leveling you through everything or you were not so devoted that you went out and found a leveling guide and followed it to the letter. All games like this take HUGE amounts of time. I don't see how eve is any different.</p><p>The major problem with eve besides huge fleet battles is the repeating cycle of quests...but again this is seen in other games as well like eve. </p><p>There are some people in game saying it was closer to 1,300 ships...not just a couple hundred...I mean come on...how many games out there can handle a battle in real time with 1300 players? Eve has done a lot and there are many things unique in it...but I'd agree...it's just a game...no point in making it a job.</p></htmltext>
<tokenext>A year to do anything useful ?
That 's what you got from playing for a few months ?
I do n't really see any difference between that and say WoW where what everyone tells you the first goal is to get to level 80 .
How long does that take you assuming you do n't have a pal leveling you through everything or you were not so devoted that you went out and found a leveling guide and followed it to the letter .
All games like this take HUGE amounts of time .
I do n't see how eve is any different.The major problem with eve besides huge fleet battles is the repeating cycle of quests...but again this is seen in other games as well like eve .
There are some people in game saying it was closer to 1,300 ships...not just a couple hundred...I mean come on...how many games out there can handle a battle in real time with 1300 players ?
Eve has done a lot and there are many things unique in it...but I 'd agree...it 's just a game...no point in making it a job .</tokentext>
<sentencetext>A year to do anything useful?
That's what you got from playing for a few months?
I don't really see any difference between that and say WoW where what everyone tells you the first goal is to get to level 80.
How long does that take you assuming you don't have a pal leveling you through everything or you were not so devoted that you went out and found a leveling guide and followed it to the letter.
All games like this take HUGE amounts of time.
I don't see how eve is any different.The major problem with eve besides huge fleet battles is the repeating cycle of quests...but again this is seen in other games as well like eve.
There are some people in game saying it was closer to 1,300 ships...not just a couple hundred...I mean come on...how many games out there can handle a battle in real time with 1300 players?
Eve has done a lot and there are many things unique in it...but I'd agree...it's just a game...no point in making it a job.</sentencetext>
	<parent>http://www.semanticweb.org/ontologies/ConversationInstances.owl#comment10_01_05_0357226.30651868</parent>
</comment>
<comment>
	<id>http://www.semanticweb.org/ontologies/ConversationInstances.owl#comment10_01_05_0357226.30654884</id>
	<title>Re:Here is video of the battle...</title>
	<author>Anonymous</author>
	<datestamp>1262707260000</datestamp>
	<modclass>Informativ</modclass>
	<modscore>1</modscore>
	<htmltext><p><div class="quote"><p>I have no clue about how this game work, but judging by the video the big vessels clearly should have gone into Ludicrous Speed mode!</p></div><p>You see that bubble in the video?  That is warp disruption bubble disabling the Titans' warp drives.  They were going nowhere, except the scrapheap!  Epic fight, loved every minute of it!  I'm still a confused how I only used 2 cycles of stront during a 30 minute battle, but oh well.<nobr> <wbr></nobr>:)</p></div>
	</htmltext>
<tokenext>I have no clue about how this game work , but judging by the video the big vessels clearly should have gone into Ludicrous Speed mode ! You see that bubble in the video ?
That is warp disruption bubble disabling the Titans ' warp drives .
They were going nowhere , except the scrapheap !
Epic fight , loved every minute of it !
I 'm still a confused how I only used 2 cycles of stront during a 30 minute battle , but oh well .
: )</tokentext>
<sentencetext>I have no clue about how this game work, but judging by the video the big vessels clearly should have gone into Ludicrous Speed mode!You see that bubble in the video?
That is warp disruption bubble disabling the Titans' warp drives.
They were going nowhere, except the scrapheap!
Epic fight, loved every minute of it!
I'm still a confused how I only used 2 cycles of stront during a 30 minute battle, but oh well.
:)
	</sentencetext>
	<parent>http://www.semanticweb.org/ontologies/ConversationInstances.owl#comment10_01_05_0357226.30652014</parent>
</comment>
<comment>
	<id>http://www.semanticweb.org/ontologies/ConversationInstances.owl#comment10_01_05_0357226.30654710</id>
	<title>Re:EVE Online.</title>
	<author>fitten</author>
	<datestamp>1262706600000</datestamp>
	<modclass>None</modclass>
	<modscore>1</modscore>
	<htmltext><p>Except that you can be useful from day 1. All you need is a frigate and a warp disruptor or warp scrambler to be useful in a fleet fight and you can do that from just about character creation time. EQ/WOW (traditional MMOs) have trained its players into the mindset that you aren't useful until you're maximum level the game allows (raids, etc.). EVE isn't like other MMOs and it's difficult for some players to adjust.</p></htmltext>
<tokenext>Except that you can be useful from day 1 .
All you need is a frigate and a warp disruptor or warp scrambler to be useful in a fleet fight and you can do that from just about character creation time .
EQ/WOW ( traditional MMOs ) have trained its players into the mindset that you are n't useful until you 're maximum level the game allows ( raids , etc. ) .
EVE is n't like other MMOs and it 's difficult for some players to adjust .</tokentext>
<sentencetext>Except that you can be useful from day 1.
All you need is a frigate and a warp disruptor or warp scrambler to be useful in a fleet fight and you can do that from just about character creation time.
EQ/WOW (traditional MMOs) have trained its players into the mindset that you aren't useful until you're maximum level the game allows (raids, etc.).
EVE isn't like other MMOs and it's difficult for some players to adjust.</sentencetext>
	<parent>http://www.semanticweb.org/ontologies/ConversationInstances.owl#comment10_01_05_0357226.30651868</parent>
</comment>
<comment>
	<id>http://www.semanticweb.org/ontologies/ConversationInstances.owl#comment10_01_05_0357226.30652158</id>
	<title>Re:EVE Online.</title>
	<author>Korin43</author>
	<datestamp>1262723160000</datestamp>
	<modclass>Informativ</modclass>
	<modscore>3</modscore>
	<htmltext>I don't play anymore, but I think you're wrong about your first point. One of the reasons the Goonswarm is so powerful is that they recruit noobs in frigates and cruisers and then swarm the enemy. It's not like other games where a level 70 player could stand around being hit by a lower level character all day. You can destroy a titan using frigates (and the titan likely wouldn't even be able to fight back, it's only options would be to call for help or run away). If you think you need to have a big ship to do anything fun or "be useful", you're missing the point.</htmltext>
<tokenext>I do n't play anymore , but I think you 're wrong about your first point .
One of the reasons the Goonswarm is so powerful is that they recruit noobs in frigates and cruisers and then swarm the enemy .
It 's not like other games where a level 70 player could stand around being hit by a lower level character all day .
You can destroy a titan using frigates ( and the titan likely would n't even be able to fight back , it 's only options would be to call for help or run away ) .
If you think you need to have a big ship to do anything fun or " be useful " , you 're missing the point .</tokentext>
<sentencetext>I don't play anymore, but I think you're wrong about your first point.
One of the reasons the Goonswarm is so powerful is that they recruit noobs in frigates and cruisers and then swarm the enemy.
It's not like other games where a level 70 player could stand around being hit by a lower level character all day.
You can destroy a titan using frigates (and the titan likely wouldn't even be able to fight back, it's only options would be to call for help or run away).
If you think you need to have a big ship to do anything fun or "be useful", you're missing the point.</sentencetext>
	<parent>http://www.semanticweb.org/ontologies/ConversationInstances.owl#comment10_01_05_0357226.30651868</parent>
</comment>
<comment>
	<id>http://www.semanticweb.org/ontologies/ConversationInstances.owl#comment10_01_05_0357226.30652808</id>
	<title>Re:EVE Online.</title>
	<author>Anonymous</author>
	<datestamp>1262686980000</datestamp>
	<modclass>None</modclass>
	<modscore>0</modscore>
	<htmltext><p>Eve drama and politics are like nothing else you will ever find in any other game. If you are in an alliance that kind of knows what's going on and explains it to their members (basically only Goonswarm as far as I'm aware, IT/KenBobKu are notorious for giving their members the rosey censored view of everything) it's some of the most intriguing stuff you'll ever hear. Oh and PS. Don't go by anything you read on Scrapheap or CAOD as they are notoriously biased and unreliable. Kugu's not too bad but even he doesn't always get it right.</p></htmltext>
<tokenext>Eve drama and politics are like nothing else you will ever find in any other game .
If you are in an alliance that kind of knows what 's going on and explains it to their members ( basically only Goonswarm as far as I 'm aware , IT/KenBobKu are notorious for giving their members the rosey censored view of everything ) it 's some of the most intriguing stuff you 'll ever hear .
Oh and PS .
Do n't go by anything you read on Scrapheap or CAOD as they are notoriously biased and unreliable .
Kugu 's not too bad but even he does n't always get it right .</tokentext>
<sentencetext>Eve drama and politics are like nothing else you will ever find in any other game.
If you are in an alliance that kind of knows what's going on and explains it to their members (basically only Goonswarm as far as I'm aware, IT/KenBobKu are notorious for giving their members the rosey censored view of everything) it's some of the most intriguing stuff you'll ever hear.
Oh and PS.
Don't go by anything you read on Scrapheap or CAOD as they are notoriously biased and unreliable.
Kugu's not too bad but even he doesn't always get it right.</sentencetext>
	<parent>http://www.semanticweb.org/ontologies/ConversationInstances.owl#comment10_01_05_0357226.30651868</parent>
</comment>
<comment>
	<id>http://www.semanticweb.org/ontologies/ConversationInstances.owl#comment10_01_05_0357226.30655886</id>
	<title>The old cylon trick</title>
	<author>Anonymous</author>
	<datestamp>1262711460000</datestamp>
	<modclass>None</modclass>
	<modscore>0</modscore>
	<htmltext><p>Fuck their networks up and take out disabled ships!</p></htmltext>
<tokenext>Fuck their networks up and take out disabled ships !</tokentext>
<sentencetext>Fuck their networks up and take out disabled ships!</sentencetext>
</comment>
<comment>
	<id>http://www.semanticweb.org/ontologies/ConversationInstances.owl#comment10_01_05_0357226.30651774</id>
	<title>Easy fix</title>
	<author>Darkness404</author>
	<datestamp>1262632500000</datestamp>
	<modclass>None</modclass>
	<modscore>0</modscore>
	<htmltext>The thing about network issues is, they are an easy fix. Get a faster internet connection and buy more servers. Yeah, you can optimize your code and get similar results, but its usually one of the few problems in technology you can throw money at and get good results.</htmltext>
<tokenext>The thing about network issues is , they are an easy fix .
Get a faster internet connection and buy more servers .
Yeah , you can optimize your code and get similar results , but its usually one of the few problems in technology you can throw money at and get good results .</tokentext>
<sentencetext>The thing about network issues is, they are an easy fix.
Get a faster internet connection and buy more servers.
Yeah, you can optimize your code and get similar results, but its usually one of the few problems in technology you can throw money at and get good results.</sentencetext>
</comment>
<comment>
	<id>http://www.semanticweb.org/ontologies/ConversationInstances.owl#comment10_01_05_0357226.30660148</id>
	<title>Re:Here is video of the battle...</title>
	<author>zAPPzAPP</author>
	<datestamp>1262684460000</datestamp>
	<modclass>Insightful</modclass>
	<modscore>2</modscore>
	<htmltext>The whole point here and of this news is, that the victims of this battle (the big ships you see being shot at) were not able to to anything.
The players supposed to control these ships were staring at a black screen for at least an hour. With no reaction from their targets there was no reason for the attacking fleet to do anything else besides just sitting there shooting them one by one. Compared to your average battle, this one was exceptionally boring.

In a "real" EvE fight, you might have seen them reposition themselves from time to time, although they arent really suited for such maneuvres when being pinned down by faster ships. Smaller ships would be warping from spot to spot trying to get a good shot in and while staying alive.</htmltext>
<tokenext>The whole point here and of this news is , that the victims of this battle ( the big ships you see being shot at ) were not able to to anything .
The players supposed to control these ships were staring at a black screen for at least an hour .
With no reaction from their targets there was no reason for the attacking fleet to do anything else besides just sitting there shooting them one by one .
Compared to your average battle , this one was exceptionally boring .
In a " real " EvE fight , you might have seen them reposition themselves from time to time , although they arent really suited for such maneuvres when being pinned down by faster ships .
Smaller ships would be warping from spot to spot trying to get a good shot in and while staying alive .</tokentext>
<sentencetext>The whole point here and of this news is, that the victims of this battle (the big ships you see being shot at) were not able to to anything.
The players supposed to control these ships were staring at a black screen for at least an hour.
With no reaction from their targets there was no reason for the attacking fleet to do anything else besides just sitting there shooting them one by one.
Compared to your average battle, this one was exceptionally boring.
In a "real" EvE fight, you might have seen them reposition themselves from time to time, although they arent really suited for such maneuvres when being pinned down by faster ships.
Smaller ships would be warping from spot to spot trying to get a good shot in and while staying alive.</sentencetext>
	<parent>http://www.semanticweb.org/ontologies/ConversationInstances.owl#comment10_01_05_0357226.30652384</parent>
</comment>
<comment>
	<id>http://www.semanticweb.org/ontologies/ConversationInstances.owl#comment10_01_05_0357226.30652356</id>
	<title>Re:Here is video of the battle...</title>
	<author>Anonymous</author>
	<datestamp>1262682420000</datestamp>
	<modclass>Insightful</modclass>
	<modscore>4</modscore>
	<htmltext>That really looks terribly boring. After decades of big budget sci-fi movies, not to mention epic space battle video games like Homeworld, <i>this</i> is the best space combat system that EVE can offer? There didn't seem to be any maneuvering involved at all... might as well be a text based game.</htmltext>
<tokenext>That really looks terribly boring .
After decades of big budget sci-fi movies , not to mention epic space battle video games like Homeworld , this is the best space combat system that EVE can offer ?
There did n't seem to be any maneuvering involved at all... might as well be a text based game .</tokentext>
<sentencetext>That really looks terribly boring.
After decades of big budget sci-fi movies, not to mention epic space battle video games like Homeworld, this is the best space combat system that EVE can offer?
There didn't seem to be any maneuvering involved at all... might as well be a text based game.</sentencetext>
	<parent>http://www.semanticweb.org/ontologies/ConversationInstances.owl#comment10_01_05_0357226.30651912</parent>
</comment>
<comment>
	<id>http://www.semanticweb.org/ontologies/ConversationInstances.owl#comment10_01_05_0357226.30660184</id>
	<title>Re:Here is video of the battle...</title>
	<author>zerocool^</author>
	<datestamp>1262684520000</datestamp>
	<modclass>Informativ</modclass>
	<modscore>2</modscore>
	<htmltext><p>This gives you an idea of the size of the ships involved:<br><a href="http://www.gossipgamers.com/images/eve1.jpg" title="gossipgamers.com">http://www.gossipgamers.com/images/eve1.jpg</a> [gossipgamers.com]</p><p>Anyway, yeah, Titans are huge, and the rest of the ships there are dreadnoughts mostly (they're also huge).  Check the chart - in my opinion, most of the fun combat is in cruiser sized ships.  Find the Caracal or the Rupture or the Vexor to see a size comparison.  There's lots of maneuvering with those kind of ships.</p><p>Something like <a href="http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Aeyt-T\_U2Vg" title="youtube.com">http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Aeyt-T\_U2Vg</a> [youtube.com] gives you a better idea, but even that ship is more of an up-close slug fest kind of ship.  <a href="http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=tUDLQEZf9J8" title="youtube.com">http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=tUDLQEZf9J8</a> [youtube.com] is another idea of combat.  Keep in mind, if you zoom in you get great visuals but after a while, you stay zoomed out to get an idea of the arena of combat.  It's strategical, not twitch, so much.</p><p>~X</p></htmltext>
<tokenext>This gives you an idea of the size of the ships involved : http : //www.gossipgamers.com/images/eve1.jpg [ gossipgamers.com ] Anyway , yeah , Titans are huge , and the rest of the ships there are dreadnoughts mostly ( they 're also huge ) .
Check the chart - in my opinion , most of the fun combat is in cruiser sized ships .
Find the Caracal or the Rupture or the Vexor to see a size comparison .
There 's lots of maneuvering with those kind of ships.Something like http : //www.youtube.com/watch ? v = Aeyt-T \ _U2Vg [ youtube.com ] gives you a better idea , but even that ship is more of an up-close slug fest kind of ship .
http : //www.youtube.com/watch ? v = tUDLQEZf9J8 [ youtube.com ] is another idea of combat .
Keep in mind , if you zoom in you get great visuals but after a while , you stay zoomed out to get an idea of the arena of combat .
It 's strategical , not twitch , so much. ~ X</tokentext>
<sentencetext>This gives you an idea of the size of the ships involved:http://www.gossipgamers.com/images/eve1.jpg [gossipgamers.com]Anyway, yeah, Titans are huge, and the rest of the ships there are dreadnoughts mostly (they're also huge).
Check the chart - in my opinion, most of the fun combat is in cruiser sized ships.
Find the Caracal or the Rupture or the Vexor to see a size comparison.
There's lots of maneuvering with those kind of ships.Something like http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Aeyt-T\_U2Vg [youtube.com] gives you a better idea, but even that ship is more of an up-close slug fest kind of ship.
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=tUDLQEZf9J8 [youtube.com] is another idea of combat.
Keep in mind, if you zoom in you get great visuals but after a while, you stay zoomed out to get an idea of the arena of combat.
It's strategical, not twitch, so much.~X</sentencetext>
	<parent>http://www.semanticweb.org/ontologies/ConversationInstances.owl#comment10_01_05_0357226.30652384</parent>
</comment>
<comment>
	<id>http://www.semanticweb.org/ontologies/ConversationInstances.owl#comment10_01_05_0357226.30655536</id>
	<title>Re:Here is video of the battle...</title>
	<author>thoth</author>
	<datestamp>1262710140000</datestamp>
	<modclass>Insightful</modclass>
	<modscore>2</modscore>
	<htmltext><p>As others have noted, you're watching the equivalent of aircraft carriers fighting each other - those don't dodge or pivot much.</p><p>More exciting action is much scale, 5 on 5 or fewer.  In those type fights, one person will try to slow a ship (web stasis field), prevent it from escaping (warp disruptor), make it more visible electonically (target painting), scramble it (electronic scrambling), drain its energy (nosferatu modules), etc.  Though set in a sci-fi game, smaller scale battles play out reasonably realistically.</p><p>Granted, it still isn't X-wing space fighter style combat.  If you want that you would look for a different game.</p></htmltext>
<tokenext>As others have noted , you 're watching the equivalent of aircraft carriers fighting each other - those do n't dodge or pivot much.More exciting action is much scale , 5 on 5 or fewer .
In those type fights , one person will try to slow a ship ( web stasis field ) , prevent it from escaping ( warp disruptor ) , make it more visible electonically ( target painting ) , scramble it ( electronic scrambling ) , drain its energy ( nosferatu modules ) , etc .
Though set in a sci-fi game , smaller scale battles play out reasonably realistically.Granted , it still is n't X-wing space fighter style combat .
If you want that you would look for a different game .</tokentext>
<sentencetext>As others have noted, you're watching the equivalent of aircraft carriers fighting each other - those don't dodge or pivot much.More exciting action is much scale, 5 on 5 or fewer.
In those type fights, one person will try to slow a ship (web stasis field), prevent it from escaping (warp disruptor), make it more visible electonically (target painting), scramble it (electronic scrambling), drain its energy (nosferatu modules), etc.
Though set in a sci-fi game, smaller scale battles play out reasonably realistically.Granted, it still isn't X-wing space fighter style combat.
If you want that you would look for a different game.</sentencetext>
	<parent>http://www.semanticweb.org/ontologies/ConversationInstances.owl#comment10_01_05_0357226.30652384</parent>
</comment>
<comment>
	<id>http://www.semanticweb.org/ontologies/ConversationInstances.owl#comment10_01_05_0357226.30651788</id>
	<title>Why Am I Not Surprised</title>
	<author>GammaKitsune</author>
	<datestamp>1262632560000</datestamp>
	<modclass>Funny</modclass>
	<modscore>5</modscore>
	<htmltext>Only in EVE would the players decide that network failures are a factor they should take into consideration.</htmltext>
<tokenext>Only in EVE would the players decide that network failures are a factor they should take into consideration .</tokentext>
<sentencetext>Only in EVE would the players decide that network failures are a factor they should take into consideration.</sentencetext>
</comment>
<comment>
	<id>http://www.semanticweb.org/ontologies/ConversationInstances.owl#comment10_01_05_0357226.30653290</id>
	<title>Re:EVE Online.</title>
	<author>Anonymous</author>
	<datestamp>1262693520000</datestamp>
	<modclass>None</modclass>
	<modscore>0</modscore>
	<htmltext><p>Regards your first point, I played EVE for a while a few years ago and had a completely different experience.  Given that I tend to go for a jack-of-all-trades, master-of-none approach, I was very impressed with the way in which I progressed through the game.</p><p>I also loved being in a system with loads of other players running around.  This was basically what made me want to play the game; human generated background content.</p><p>I stopped playing because I wasn't really interested in playing with other players, preferring to do missions which eventually became too hard to do singly.  This might seem contradictory, but I like the feeling of a 'real' environment while I don't really want to have to interact with others.</p></htmltext>
<tokenext>Regards your first point , I played EVE for a while a few years ago and had a completely different experience .
Given that I tend to go for a jack-of-all-trades , master-of-none approach , I was very impressed with the way in which I progressed through the game.I also loved being in a system with loads of other players running around .
This was basically what made me want to play the game ; human generated background content.I stopped playing because I was n't really interested in playing with other players , preferring to do missions which eventually became too hard to do singly .
This might seem contradictory , but I like the feeling of a 'real ' environment while I do n't really want to have to interact with others .</tokentext>
<sentencetext>Regards your first point, I played EVE for a while a few years ago and had a completely different experience.
Given that I tend to go for a jack-of-all-trades, master-of-none approach, I was very impressed with the way in which I progressed through the game.I also loved being in a system with loads of other players running around.
This was basically what made me want to play the game; human generated background content.I stopped playing because I wasn't really interested in playing with other players, preferring to do missions which eventually became too hard to do singly.
This might seem contradictory, but I like the feeling of a 'real' environment while I don't really want to have to interact with others.</sentencetext>
	<parent>http://www.semanticweb.org/ontologies/ConversationInstances.owl#comment10_01_05_0357226.30651868</parent>
</comment>
<comment>
	<id>http://www.semanticweb.org/ontologies/ConversationInstances.owl#comment10_01_05_0357226.30652064</id>
	<title>Re:I'm not sure about their policy...</title>
	<author>Anonymous</author>
	<datestamp>1262721960000</datestamp>
	<modclass>Insightful</modclass>
	<modscore>2</modscore>
	<htmltext>There is a legal way to get money into the game that is exchange real money for virtual money, so things in the game have real value.  Conversely, there are illegal (violation of EULA) but doable methods to get real money out of the game. Also, these virtual things were created by the people in game and their time spent can be valued by the cost of the subscription. So it's pretty easy to calculate the value on these nonexistent in game items.  The approximate cost of one of those large ships mentioned is $10000 real world.</htmltext>
<tokenext>There is a legal way to get money into the game that is exchange real money for virtual money , so things in the game have real value .
Conversely , there are illegal ( violation of EULA ) but doable methods to get real money out of the game .
Also , these virtual things were created by the people in game and their time spent can be valued by the cost of the subscription .
So it 's pretty easy to calculate the value on these nonexistent in game items .
The approximate cost of one of those large ships mentioned is $ 10000 real world .</tokentext>
<sentencetext>There is a legal way to get money into the game that is exchange real money for virtual money, so things in the game have real value.
Conversely, there are illegal (violation of EULA) but doable methods to get real money out of the game.
Also, these virtual things were created by the people in game and their time spent can be valued by the cost of the subscription.
So it's pretty easy to calculate the value on these nonexistent in game items.
The approximate cost of one of those large ships mentioned is $10000 real world.</sentencetext>
	<parent>http://www.semanticweb.org/ontologies/ConversationInstances.owl#comment10_01_05_0357226.30651934</parent>
</comment>
<comment>
	<id>http://www.semanticweb.org/ontologies/ConversationInstances.owl#comment10_01_05_0357226.30651912</id>
	<title>Here is video of the battle...</title>
	<author>Anonymous</author>
	<datestamp>1262634120000</datestamp>
	<modclass>Informativ</modclass>
	<modscore>5</modscore>
	<htmltext><a href="http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=WERqUb0G6vQ" title="youtube.com" rel="nofollow">http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=WERqUb0G6vQ</a> [youtube.com]</htmltext>
<tokenext>http : //www.youtube.com/watch ? v = WERqUb0G6vQ [ youtube.com ]</tokentext>
<sentencetext>http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=WERqUb0G6vQ [youtube.com]</sentencetext>
</comment>
<comment>
	<id>http://www.semanticweb.org/ontologies/ConversationInstances.owl#comment10_01_05_0357226.30664138</id>
	<title>Hrmm</title>
	<author>Anonymous</author>
	<datestamp>1262702820000</datestamp>
	<modclass>None</modclass>
	<modscore>0</modscore>
	<htmltext><p>If there is next time you jump into numerous cynos on different grids and you will have much more success. The grid load is the problem, so if you spread it out you will have the ability to load the grid much faster than jumping into a single cyno on a single grid. It forces the defender to reload the grid you are on and debate on the effectiveness of moving from the safety of the deathstar and capitals around their TCU's.</p></htmltext>
<tokenext>If there is next time you jump into numerous cynos on different grids and you will have much more success .
The grid load is the problem , so if you spread it out you will have the ability to load the grid much faster than jumping into a single cyno on a single grid .
It forces the defender to reload the grid you are on and debate on the effectiveness of moving from the safety of the deathstar and capitals around their TCU 's .</tokentext>
<sentencetext>If there is next time you jump into numerous cynos on different grids and you will have much more success.
The grid load is the problem, so if you spread it out you will have the ability to load the grid much faster than jumping into a single cyno on a single grid.
It forces the defender to reload the grid you are on and debate on the effectiveness of moving from the safety of the deathstar and capitals around their TCU's.</sentencetext>
</comment>
<comment>
	<id>http://www.semanticweb.org/ontologies/ConversationInstances.owl#comment10_01_05_0357226.30653580</id>
	<title>Re:EVE Online.</title>
	<author>Anonymous</author>
	<datestamp>1262697720000</datestamp>
	<modclass>None</modclass>
	<modscore>0</modscore>
	<htmltext><p>lol you quit cos the ingame browser wouldnt import your bookmarks LOL can i haz your stuff?</p></htmltext>
<tokenext>lol you quit cos the ingame browser wouldnt import your bookmarks LOL can i haz your stuff ?</tokentext>
<sentencetext>lol you quit cos the ingame browser wouldnt import your bookmarks LOL can i haz your stuff?</sentencetext>
	<parent>http://www.semanticweb.org/ontologies/ConversationInstances.owl#comment10_01_05_0357226.30652150</parent>
</comment>
<comment>
	<id>http://www.semanticweb.org/ontologies/ConversationInstances.owl#comment10_01_05_0357226.30653778</id>
	<title>Re:well... if you think about it</title>
	<author>Anonymous</author>
	<datestamp>1262700420000</datestamp>
	<modclass>None</modclass>
	<modscore>0</modscore>
	<htmltext>In fact, the mountain gorilla has a very tiny penis, no more than two inches long and more often closer to 1.</htmltext>
<tokenext>In fact , the mountain gorilla has a very tiny penis , no more than two inches long and more often closer to 1 .</tokentext>
<sentencetext>In fact, the mountain gorilla has a very tiny penis, no more than two inches long and more often closer to 1.</sentencetext>
	<parent>http://www.semanticweb.org/ontologies/ConversationInstances.owl#comment10_01_05_0357226.30651944</parent>
</comment>
<comment>
	<id>http://www.semanticweb.org/ontologies/ConversationInstances.owl#comment10_01_05_0357226.30652298</id>
	<title>Re:Easy fix</title>
	<author>Opportunist</author>
	<datestamp>1262724660000</datestamp>
	<modclass>None</modclass>
	<modscore>1</modscore>
	<htmltext><p>Is it the internet connection? Or is it the throughput of the NIC, the loading time of the HDs, the processing time necessary, or is it...</p><p>Not always it's easy to identify the bottleneck. Throwing more resources at something is not always an option, there are physical, and technical, limits.</p></htmltext>
<tokenext>Is it the internet connection ?
Or is it the throughput of the NIC , the loading time of the HDs , the processing time necessary , or is it...Not always it 's easy to identify the bottleneck .
Throwing more resources at something is not always an option , there are physical , and technical , limits .</tokentext>
<sentencetext>Is it the internet connection?
Or is it the throughput of the NIC, the loading time of the HDs, the processing time necessary, or is it...Not always it's easy to identify the bottleneck.
Throwing more resources at something is not always an option, there are physical, and technical, limits.</sentencetext>
	<parent>http://www.semanticweb.org/ontologies/ConversationInstances.owl#comment10_01_05_0357226.30651774</parent>
</comment>
<comment>
	<id>http://www.semanticweb.org/ontologies/ConversationInstances.owl#comment10_01_05_0357226.30654578</id>
	<title>Re:Offline alternatives ?</title>
	<author>wfolta</author>
	<datestamp>1262706000000</datestamp>
	<modclass>None</modclass>
	<modscore>1</modscore>
	<htmltext><p>Yeah, X3 TC is what got me interested in trying EVE... Didn't like EVE, but still have X3... I did run into a bug in X3 that prevented saves from working -- perhaps due to the MARS targetting  scripts -- but otherwise, enjoyable.</p></htmltext>
<tokenext>Yeah , X3 TC is what got me interested in trying EVE... Did n't like EVE , but still have X3... I did run into a bug in X3 that prevented saves from working -- perhaps due to the MARS targetting scripts -- but otherwise , enjoyable .</tokentext>
<sentencetext>Yeah, X3 TC is what got me interested in trying EVE... Didn't like EVE, but still have X3... I did run into a bug in X3 that prevented saves from working -- perhaps due to the MARS targetting  scripts -- but otherwise, enjoyable.</sentencetext>
	<parent>http://www.semanticweb.org/ontologies/ConversationInstances.owl#comment10_01_05_0357226.30652174</parent>
</comment>
<comment>
	<id>http://www.semanticweb.org/ontologies/ConversationInstances.owl#comment10_01_05_0357226.30651866</id>
	<title>Thousands? Try multi BILLIONS</title>
	<author>Anonymous</author>
	<datestamp>1262633340000</datestamp>
	<modclass>None</modclass>
	<modscore>0</modscore>
	<htmltext><p>When you write about something like Titans, your talking about multi-BILLIONS in game assets. To have lost 4 or 5 is enough to bankrupt many Corps. Not to mention all the cap ships and support fleets that went down. Its always nice to see GoonSwarm get the smackdown.</p></htmltext>
<tokenext>When you write about something like Titans , your talking about multi-BILLIONS in game assets .
To have lost 4 or 5 is enough to bankrupt many Corps .
Not to mention all the cap ships and support fleets that went down .
Its always nice to see GoonSwarm get the smackdown .</tokentext>
<sentencetext>When you write about something like Titans, your talking about multi-BILLIONS in game assets.
To have lost 4 or 5 is enough to bankrupt many Corps.
Not to mention all the cap ships and support fleets that went down.
Its always nice to see GoonSwarm get the smackdown.</sentencetext>
</comment>
<comment>
	<id>http://www.semanticweb.org/ontologies/ConversationInstances.owl#comment10_01_05_0357226.30652120</id>
	<title>Re:I'm not sure about their policy...</title>
	<author>Anonymous</author>
	<datestamp>1262722740000</datestamp>
	<modclass>Insightful</modclass>
	<modscore>4</modscore>
	<htmltext><blockquote><div><p>They're not real ships, and "thousands of dollars" were not lost.</p></div></blockquote><p>But it did take a lot of time to build up the in game credits to buy those ships. And you do literally pay real money for time in game.</p></div>
	</htmltext>
<tokenext>They 're not real ships , and " thousands of dollars " were not lost.But it did take a lot of time to build up the in game credits to buy those ships .
And you do literally pay real money for time in game .</tokentext>
<sentencetext>They're not real ships, and "thousands of dollars" were not lost.But it did take a lot of time to build up the in game credits to buy those ships.
And you do literally pay real money for time in game.
	</sentencetext>
	<parent>http://www.semanticweb.org/ontologies/ConversationInstances.owl#comment10_01_05_0357226.30651934</parent>
</comment>
<comment>
	<id>http://www.semanticweb.org/ontologies/ConversationInstances.owl#comment10_01_05_0357226.30652166</id>
	<title>Re:Easy fix</title>
	<author>bonch</author>
	<datestamp>1262723280000</datestamp>
	<modclass>None</modclass>
	<modscore>1</modscore>
	<htmltext><p>If it was easy, don't you think it would have been done already?  Even Blizzard can't handle the load of an entire server in one area and had to create a random queue to let people into Wintergrasp.</p></htmltext>
<tokenext>If it was easy , do n't you think it would have been done already ?
Even Blizzard ca n't handle the load of an entire server in one area and had to create a random queue to let people into Wintergrasp .</tokentext>
<sentencetext>If it was easy, don't you think it would have been done already?
Even Blizzard can't handle the load of an entire server in one area and had to create a random queue to let people into Wintergrasp.</sentencetext>
	<parent>http://www.semanticweb.org/ontologies/ConversationInstances.owl#comment10_01_05_0357226.30651774</parent>
</comment>
<comment>
	<id>http://www.semanticweb.org/ontologies/ConversationInstances.owl#comment10_01_05_0357226.30654028</id>
	<title>Incorrect</title>
	<author>Anonymous</author>
	<datestamp>1262702700000</datestamp>
	<modclass>None</modclass>
	<modscore>0</modscore>
	<htmltext>I took my cleric up to level 70 in two month and a half. It took only a few week to go up to level 50, then nearly two month to go to 70. I haven't the latest expansion, but it does not take MONTHES to see most of the content and be involved in raid and stuff. Whereas for eve it clearly take much more, and one of your "co-player" above even said it would be a waste to give powerful ship on newbie.</htmltext>
<tokenext>I took my cleric up to level 70 in two month and a half .
It took only a few week to go up to level 50 , then nearly two month to go to 70 .
I have n't the latest expansion , but it does not take MONTHES to see most of the content and be involved in raid and stuff .
Whereas for eve it clearly take much more , and one of your " co-player " above even said it would be a waste to give powerful ship on newbie .</tokentext>
<sentencetext>I took my cleric up to level 70 in two month and a half.
It took only a few week to go up to level 50, then nearly two month to go to 70.
I haven't the latest expansion, but it does not take MONTHES to see most of the content and be involved in raid and stuff.
Whereas for eve it clearly take much more, and one of your "co-player" above even said it would be a waste to give powerful ship on newbie.</sentencetext>
	<parent>http://www.semanticweb.org/ontologies/ConversationInstances.owl#comment10_01_05_0357226.30652136</parent>
</comment>
<comment>
	<id>http://www.semanticweb.org/ontologies/ConversationInstances.owl#comment10_01_05_0357226.30653802</id>
	<title>Re:well... if you think about it</title>
	<author>Anonymous</author>
	<datestamp>1262700660000</datestamp>
	<modclass>None</modclass>
	<modscore>0</modscore>
	<htmltext><p>Real apes actually have rather small cocks.</p></htmltext>
<tokenext>Real apes actually have rather small cocks .</tokentext>
<sentencetext>Real apes actually have rather small cocks.</sentencetext>
	<parent>http://www.semanticweb.org/ontologies/ConversationInstances.owl#comment10_01_05_0357226.30651944</parent>
</comment>
<comment>
	<id>http://www.semanticweb.org/ontologies/ConversationInstances.owl#comment10_01_05_0357226.30651772</id>
	<title>I'm not sure about their policy...</title>
	<author>Anonymous</author>
	<datestamp>1262632440000</datestamp>
	<modclass>None</modclass>
	<modscore>1</modscore>
	<htmltext><p>I mean, its great that they won't give you a refund for your ships if you got them destroyed because of stupidity... but if the network code destroyed your fleet? Isn't that CCP's fault entirely?</p></htmltext>
<tokenext>I mean , its great that they wo n't give you a refund for your ships if you got them destroyed because of stupidity... but if the network code destroyed your fleet ?
Is n't that CCP 's fault entirely ?</tokentext>
<sentencetext>I mean, its great that they won't give you a refund for your ships if you got them destroyed because of stupidity... but if the network code destroyed your fleet?
Isn't that CCP's fault entirely?</sentencetext>
</comment>
<comment>
	<id>http://www.semanticweb.org/ontologies/ConversationInstances.owl#comment10_01_05_0357226.30749784</id>
	<title>Re:Why Am I Not Surprised</title>
	<author>Anonymous</author>
	<datestamp>1263394680000</datestamp>
	<modclass>None</modclass>
	<modscore>0</modscore>
	<htmltext><p><div class="quote"><p>EVE has an actual functioning economy and the main story is actually driven by the players themselves.  You are encouraged to use everything at your disposal even play multiple accounts so it only makes sense network issues would become part of the game.</p></div><p>Storyline isn't driven by players.  Weren't you paying attention a while ago before when some players found out the storyline and events were rigged?  It's not a sandbox when the referee is playing for the other team.</p></div>
	</htmltext>
<tokenext>EVE has an actual functioning economy and the main story is actually driven by the players themselves .
You are encouraged to use everything at your disposal even play multiple accounts so it only makes sense network issues would become part of the game.Storyline is n't driven by players .
Were n't you paying attention a while ago before when some players found out the storyline and events were rigged ?
It 's not a sandbox when the referee is playing for the other team .</tokentext>
<sentencetext>EVE has an actual functioning economy and the main story is actually driven by the players themselves.
You are encouraged to use everything at your disposal even play multiple accounts so it only makes sense network issues would become part of the game.Storyline isn't driven by players.
Weren't you paying attention a while ago before when some players found out the storyline and events were rigged?
It's not a sandbox when the referee is playing for the other team.
	</sentencetext>
	<parent>http://www.semanticweb.org/ontologies/ConversationInstances.owl#comment10_01_05_0357226.30651838</parent>
</comment>
<comment>
	<id>http://www.semanticweb.org/ontologies/ConversationInstances.owl#comment10_01_05_0357226.30670588</id>
	<title>Re:Why Am I Not Surprised</title>
	<author>AP31R0N</author>
	<datestamp>1262797560000</datestamp>
	<modclass>None</modclass>
	<modscore>1</modscore>
	<htmltext><p>i wonder, is that the same Band of Brothers from PlanetSide?  SOE bitch slapped them for hacking PlanetSide.</p></htmltext>
<tokenext>i wonder , is that the same Band of Brothers from PlanetSide ?
SOE bitch slapped them for hacking PlanetSide .</tokentext>
<sentencetext>i wonder, is that the same Band of Brothers from PlanetSide?
SOE bitch slapped them for hacking PlanetSide.</sentencetext>
	<parent>http://www.semanticweb.org/ontologies/ConversationInstances.owl#comment10_01_05_0357226.30653896</parent>
</comment>
<comment>
	<id>http://www.semanticweb.org/ontologies/ConversationInstances.owl#comment10_01_05_0357226.30652846</id>
	<title>Re:Kinda Cool</title>
	<author>syousef</author>
	<datestamp>1262687340000</datestamp>
	<modclass>None</modclass>
	<modscore>1</modscore>
	<htmltext><p><i>I still don't think I'll sign over my credit card to a MM online game, but a game that lets you destroy THOUSANDS of dollars of stuff that other people value for the sheer malicious joy . . . well, that's perversely COOL!</i></p><p>Destroy thousands of dollars of stuff? You mean donate it to CCP games don't you?</p></htmltext>
<tokenext>I still do n't think I 'll sign over my credit card to a MM online game , but a game that lets you destroy THOUSANDS of dollars of stuff that other people value for the sheer malicious joy .
. .
well , that 's perversely COOL ! Destroy thousands of dollars of stuff ?
You mean donate it to CCP games do n't you ?</tokentext>
<sentencetext>I still don't think I'll sign over my credit card to a MM online game, but a game that lets you destroy THOUSANDS of dollars of stuff that other people value for the sheer malicious joy .
. .
well, that's perversely COOL!Destroy thousands of dollars of stuff?
You mean donate it to CCP games don't you?</sentencetext>
	<parent>http://www.semanticweb.org/ontologies/ConversationInstances.owl#comment10_01_05_0357226.30651784</parent>
</comment>
<comment>
	<id>http://www.semanticweb.org/ontologies/ConversationInstances.owl#comment10_01_05_0357226.30653630</id>
	<title>Re:Here is video of the battle...</title>
	<author>WinstonWolfIT</author>
	<datestamp>1262698500000</datestamp>
	<modclass>None</modclass>
	<modscore>0</modscore>
	<htmltext>Ah but there's nothing like the rush of jumping into certain death flying in a time investment of multiple months and fighting like you're already dead and have nothing left to lose. Brings back lots of fun fun memories (3 tri 3 3 vsq)</htmltext>
<tokenext>Ah but there 's nothing like the rush of jumping into certain death flying in a time investment of multiple months and fighting like you 're already dead and have nothing left to lose .
Brings back lots of fun fun memories ( 3 tri 3 3 vsq )</tokentext>
<sentencetext>Ah but there's nothing like the rush of jumping into certain death flying in a time investment of multiple months and fighting like you're already dead and have nothing left to lose.
Brings back lots of fun fun memories (3 tri 3 3 vsq)</sentencetext>
	<parent>http://www.semanticweb.org/ontologies/ConversationInstances.owl#comment10_01_05_0357226.30652356</parent>
</comment>
<comment>
	<id>http://www.semanticweb.org/ontologies/ConversationInstances.owl#comment10_01_05_0357226.30652694</id>
	<title>Re:Here is video of the battle...</title>
	<author>Opportunist</author>
	<datestamp>1262686020000</datestamp>
	<modclass>Insightful</modclass>
	<modscore>2</modscore>
	<htmltext><p>It was basically a one sided battle, shooting fish in a barrel because the other side was caught in lagland (server transition isn't so great in EvE when a few hundred ships are already in the system). So I guess if you're expecting to see a "battle", you have to end up disappointed. It's a bit like shooting sitting ducks that had their wings cut off.</p></htmltext>
<tokenext>It was basically a one sided battle , shooting fish in a barrel because the other side was caught in lagland ( server transition is n't so great in EvE when a few hundred ships are already in the system ) .
So I guess if you 're expecting to see a " battle " , you have to end up disappointed .
It 's a bit like shooting sitting ducks that had their wings cut off .</tokentext>
<sentencetext>It was basically a one sided battle, shooting fish in a barrel because the other side was caught in lagland (server transition isn't so great in EvE when a few hundred ships are already in the system).
So I guess if you're expecting to see a "battle", you have to end up disappointed.
It's a bit like shooting sitting ducks that had their wings cut off.</sentencetext>
	<parent>http://www.semanticweb.org/ontologies/ConversationInstances.owl#comment10_01_05_0357226.30652356</parent>
</comment>
<comment>
	<id>http://www.semanticweb.org/ontologies/ConversationInstances.owl#comment10_01_05_0357226.30651836</id>
	<title>Reminds me of the recent Star Trek film...</title>
	<author>VinylRecords</author>
	<datestamp>1262633100000</datestamp>
	<modclass>None</modclass>
	<modscore>1</modscore>
	<htmltext><p>The scene where Kirk is facing off against Spock's unbeatable scenario and shuts down the servers temporarily, disabling the shields all of Spock's ships, before blowing them up.</p></htmltext>
<tokenext>The scene where Kirk is facing off against Spock 's unbeatable scenario and shuts down the servers temporarily , disabling the shields all of Spock 's ships , before blowing them up .</tokentext>
<sentencetext>The scene where Kirk is facing off against Spock's unbeatable scenario and shuts down the servers temporarily, disabling the shields all of Spock's ships, before blowing them up.</sentencetext>
</comment>
<comment>
	<id>http://www.semanticweb.org/ontologies/ConversationInstances.owl#comment10_01_05_0357226.30656514</id>
	<title>Re:Why Am I Not Surprised</title>
	<author>dnoyeb</author>
	<datestamp>1262713800000</datestamp>
	<modclass>None</modclass>
	<modscore>1</modscore>
	<htmltext><p>Correction:  Typically several star systems are handled by a single server.  Note that "single server" does not mean 1 computer, but could be several working together on that 1 star system.</p><p>With this new type of thing, if you let CCP know ahead of time where the fight will be, they will assign that star system to just 1 server.  The ability to do this is appearantly new.  But theoretically, this only helps if the other star systems had a significant number of pilots in them.  Relative to the number of people fighting in large fleet battles, and where these usually take place, the single server to star system is not likely to help much.  Unless this is a special jumbo server of some sort.</p><p>From what I hear, it may add 5-10\% more playability.</p></htmltext>
<tokenext>Correction : Typically several star systems are handled by a single server .
Note that " single server " does not mean 1 computer , but could be several working together on that 1 star system.With this new type of thing , if you let CCP know ahead of time where the fight will be , they will assign that star system to just 1 server .
The ability to do this is appearantly new .
But theoretically , this only helps if the other star systems had a significant number of pilots in them .
Relative to the number of people fighting in large fleet battles , and where these usually take place , the single server to star system is not likely to help much .
Unless this is a special jumbo server of some sort.From what I hear , it may add 5-10 \ % more playability .</tokentext>
<sentencetext>Correction:  Typically several star systems are handled by a single server.
Note that "single server" does not mean 1 computer, but could be several working together on that 1 star system.With this new type of thing, if you let CCP know ahead of time where the fight will be, they will assign that star system to just 1 server.
The ability to do this is appearantly new.
But theoretically, this only helps if the other star systems had a significant number of pilots in them.
Relative to the number of people fighting in large fleet battles, and where these usually take place, the single server to star system is not likely to help much.
Unless this is a special jumbo server of some sort.From what I hear, it may add 5-10\% more playability.</sentencetext>
	<parent>http://www.semanticweb.org/ontologies/ConversationInstances.owl#comment10_01_05_0357226.30652656</parent>
</comment>
<comment>
	<id>http://www.semanticweb.org/ontologies/ConversationInstances.owl#comment10_01_05_0357226.30654738</id>
	<title>Re:Why Am I Not Surprised</title>
	<author>Zeelan</author>
	<datestamp>1262706720000</datestamp>
	<modclass>None</modclass>
	<modscore>1</modscore>
	<htmltext>Oh, I didn't know about the leaked logs and went looking for them. I know damn well that their allies told them that this was a problem. (one of them lost a 300 man fleet to just this problem) That just adds topping to the cake.

Love it.</htmltext>
<tokenext>Oh , I did n't know about the leaked logs and went looking for them .
I know damn well that their allies told them that this was a problem .
( one of them lost a 300 man fleet to just this problem ) That just adds topping to the cake .
Love it .</tokentext>
<sentencetext>Oh, I didn't know about the leaked logs and went looking for them.
I know damn well that their allies told them that this was a problem.
(one of them lost a 300 man fleet to just this problem) That just adds topping to the cake.
Love it.</sentencetext>
	<parent>http://www.semanticweb.org/ontologies/ConversationInstances.owl#comment10_01_05_0357226.30652656</parent>
</comment>
<comment>
	<id>http://www.semanticweb.org/ontologies/ConversationInstances.owl#comment10_01_05_0357226.30653950</id>
	<title>Re:EVE Online.</title>
	<author>Ephemeriis</author>
	<datestamp>1262701920000</datestamp>
	<modclass>None</modclass>
	<modscore>1</modscore>
	<htmltext><p><div class="quote"><p>One, why play a game that takes you at least a year to be able to do anything fun and useful? That's not a game at all, that's a job.</p></div><p>Most games out there have some kind of level cap.  You kill monsters, gain experience, get loot, get levels...  And eventually cap out.  Maybe it's 50, or 60, or 99, or whatever.  Eventually you can't go any further.</p><p>To keep players interested, this is often where developers put all the cool stuff.  The big raids, the fancy gear.  All the <b>epic</b> stuff.</p><p>What this does is it shifts the focus from the leveling grind to the endgame.  It turns the game into a race to the finish line.  All those levels from 1 to the cap are basically filler.  Folks race to the endgame just as quick as they can so that they can get into the good stuff.</p><p>EVE has no level cap.  You could play for literally years and never hit any artificial limit.</p><p>EVE isn't about the endgame, it's about what you can do <b>now</b>.</p><p>You do not need to wait for a year to be able to do fun and useful things.  You need to get off your ass, stop waiting for something to finish training, and go do something with the skills that you have <b>now</b>.</p><p>Granted, a brand new character with just the starter skills is pretty useless...  But with just a week of training you can have yourself in a tackle frigate and actually do something useful in a PvP battle.</p><p>If you're just sitting around waiting until you can fly a cruiser, or a battlecruiser, or a battleship, or a dreadnought, or whatever - you're doing it wrong.</p><p><div class="quote"><p>Two, CCP has shown themselves in the past to be shady and unreliable, having developers specifically favor certain alliances and otherwise abuse their powers for their own in-game corporations.</p></div><p>This is true...  But the important bit is "<i>in the past</i>"...  Things have gotten much better.  With the CSM and the internal affairs folks there's far less shady-ness going on.</p><p><div class="quote"><p>Three, the amount of bugs and inability to cope for server stress for large battles (which is the meat and potatoes of this game--large space wars!) has apparently been evident for quite some time now.</p></div><p>Yes and no.</p><p>The game is very playable.  There are certainly bugs, but they're no more game-crushing than those in WoW or any other MMOG.</p><p>There is a limit to what the hardware can handle.  Folks work around that - by not going to Jita on the weekend, for example.  Maybe it shouldn't be this way...  But I don't think there's really a good way to fix it.  When you've got that many people trying to travel to a single system you're going to have issues whether you want them or not.</p><p>This can be mitigated, to a certain degree, by letting CCP know about fleet battles ahead of time.  They'll move the target system to beefier hardware to give you the best experience possible.  It isn't perfect, but they're trying.</p><p><div class="quote"><p>It's pretty poor form when CCP will claim that subscribers need to account for their own ineptitude when playing their game and not take responsibility for their own</p></div><p>One of the things that makes EVE what it is, is the largely hands-off approach that CCP takes to the game.</p><p>With the exception of a few explicitly stated exploits, everything is legal.</p><p>This means that if you aren't taking advantage of everything you can to give yourself the best chance of succeeding, you have nobody to blame but yourself.</p><p>If you know a remote system is heavily defended, and jump in a big fleet to try to recapture it, you know ahead of time that there's a good chance the hardware will not be able to handle the load.  They knew this.  They took the gamble, and lost.</p></div>
	</htmltext>
<tokenext>One , why play a game that takes you at least a year to be able to do anything fun and useful ?
That 's not a game at all , that 's a job.Most games out there have some kind of level cap .
You kill monsters , gain experience , get loot , get levels... And eventually cap out .
Maybe it 's 50 , or 60 , or 99 , or whatever .
Eventually you ca n't go any further.To keep players interested , this is often where developers put all the cool stuff .
The big raids , the fancy gear .
All the epic stuff.What this does is it shifts the focus from the leveling grind to the endgame .
It turns the game into a race to the finish line .
All those levels from 1 to the cap are basically filler .
Folks race to the endgame just as quick as they can so that they can get into the good stuff.EVE has no level cap .
You could play for literally years and never hit any artificial limit.EVE is n't about the endgame , it 's about what you can do now.You do not need to wait for a year to be able to do fun and useful things .
You need to get off your ass , stop waiting for something to finish training , and go do something with the skills that you have now.Granted , a brand new character with just the starter skills is pretty useless... But with just a week of training you can have yourself in a tackle frigate and actually do something useful in a PvP battle.If you 're just sitting around waiting until you can fly a cruiser , or a battlecruiser , or a battleship , or a dreadnought , or whatever - you 're doing it wrong.Two , CCP has shown themselves in the past to be shady and unreliable , having developers specifically favor certain alliances and otherwise abuse their powers for their own in-game corporations.This is true... But the important bit is " in the past " ... Things have gotten much better .
With the CSM and the internal affairs folks there 's far less shady-ness going on.Three , the amount of bugs and inability to cope for server stress for large battles ( which is the meat and potatoes of this game--large space wars !
) has apparently been evident for quite some time now.Yes and no.The game is very playable .
There are certainly bugs , but they 're no more game-crushing than those in WoW or any other MMOG.There is a limit to what the hardware can handle .
Folks work around that - by not going to Jita on the weekend , for example .
Maybe it should n't be this way... But I do n't think there 's really a good way to fix it .
When you 've got that many people trying to travel to a single system you 're going to have issues whether you want them or not.This can be mitigated , to a certain degree , by letting CCP know about fleet battles ahead of time .
They 'll move the target system to beefier hardware to give you the best experience possible .
It is n't perfect , but they 're trying.It 's pretty poor form when CCP will claim that subscribers need to account for their own ineptitude when playing their game and not take responsibility for their ownOne of the things that makes EVE what it is , is the largely hands-off approach that CCP takes to the game.With the exception of a few explicitly stated exploits , everything is legal.This means that if you are n't taking advantage of everything you can to give yourself the best chance of succeeding , you have nobody to blame but yourself.If you know a remote system is heavily defended , and jump in a big fleet to try to recapture it , you know ahead of time that there 's a good chance the hardware will not be able to handle the load .
They knew this .
They took the gamble , and lost .</tokentext>
<sentencetext>One, why play a game that takes you at least a year to be able to do anything fun and useful?
That's not a game at all, that's a job.Most games out there have some kind of level cap.
You kill monsters, gain experience, get loot, get levels...  And eventually cap out.
Maybe it's 50, or 60, or 99, or whatever.
Eventually you can't go any further.To keep players interested, this is often where developers put all the cool stuff.
The big raids, the fancy gear.
All the epic stuff.What this does is it shifts the focus from the leveling grind to the endgame.
It turns the game into a race to the finish line.
All those levels from 1 to the cap are basically filler.
Folks race to the endgame just as quick as they can so that they can get into the good stuff.EVE has no level cap.
You could play for literally years and never hit any artificial limit.EVE isn't about the endgame, it's about what you can do now.You do not need to wait for a year to be able to do fun and useful things.
You need to get off your ass, stop waiting for something to finish training, and go do something with the skills that you have now.Granted, a brand new character with just the starter skills is pretty useless...  But with just a week of training you can have yourself in a tackle frigate and actually do something useful in a PvP battle.If you're just sitting around waiting until you can fly a cruiser, or a battlecruiser, or a battleship, or a dreadnought, or whatever - you're doing it wrong.Two, CCP has shown themselves in the past to be shady and unreliable, having developers specifically favor certain alliances and otherwise abuse their powers for their own in-game corporations.This is true...  But the important bit is "in the past"...  Things have gotten much better.
With the CSM and the internal affairs folks there's far less shady-ness going on.Three, the amount of bugs and inability to cope for server stress for large battles (which is the meat and potatoes of this game--large space wars!
) has apparently been evident for quite some time now.Yes and no.The game is very playable.
There are certainly bugs, but they're no more game-crushing than those in WoW or any other MMOG.There is a limit to what the hardware can handle.
Folks work around that - by not going to Jita on the weekend, for example.
Maybe it shouldn't be this way...  But I don't think there's really a good way to fix it.
When you've got that many people trying to travel to a single system you're going to have issues whether you want them or not.This can be mitigated, to a certain degree, by letting CCP know about fleet battles ahead of time.
They'll move the target system to beefier hardware to give you the best experience possible.
It isn't perfect, but they're trying.It's pretty poor form when CCP will claim that subscribers need to account for their own ineptitude when playing their game and not take responsibility for their ownOne of the things that makes EVE what it is, is the largely hands-off approach that CCP takes to the game.With the exception of a few explicitly stated exploits, everything is legal.This means that if you aren't taking advantage of everything you can to give yourself the best chance of succeeding, you have nobody to blame but yourself.If you know a remote system is heavily defended, and jump in a big fleet to try to recapture it, you know ahead of time that there's a good chance the hardware will not be able to handle the load.
They knew this.
They took the gamble, and lost.
	</sentencetext>
	<parent>http://www.semanticweb.org/ontologies/ConversationInstances.owl#comment10_01_05_0357226.30651868</parent>
</comment>
<comment>
	<id>http://www.semanticweb.org/ontologies/ConversationInstances.owl#comment10_01_05_0357226.30651934</id>
	<title>Re:I'm not sure about their policy...</title>
	<author>Anonymous</author>
	<datestamp>1262634240000</datestamp>
	<modclass>Insightful</modclass>
	<modscore>4</modscore>
	<htmltext>They're not real ships, and "thousands of dollars" were not lost.</htmltext>
<tokenext>They 're not real ships , and " thousands of dollars " were not lost .</tokentext>
<sentencetext>They're not real ships, and "thousands of dollars" were not lost.</sentencetext>
	<parent>http://www.semanticweb.org/ontologies/ConversationInstances.owl#comment10_01_05_0357226.30651772</parent>
</comment>
<comment>
	<id>http://www.semanticweb.org/ontologies/ConversationInstances.owl#comment10_01_05_0357226.30651812</id>
	<title>It was their own fault</title>
	<author>Anonymous</author>
	<datestamp>1262632920000</datestamp>
	<modclass>Insightful</modclass>
	<modscore>4</modscore>
	<htmltext><p>It's well known and not even contested that the forces bridging in to the system black-screened and never got to fight.</p><p>However, they got what they deserved. The node in question was not reinforced due to the unexpected nature of the fight (as in; the notification system was not used to put the system on a dedicated server). And jumping into large fights was well know to be bugged since the expansion and the Fleet Commander was made aware by an alliance member that the specific way in which they were going to enter the fight would trigger the bug.</p><p>They ignored all those warnings and decided to go ahead. Sources claim the intent was to crash the node and get a more even fight once it got up, multiple accounts even got banned for spamming local chat. Funny thing is the bug seems to be in the simultaneous transfer of 100+ ships into an overloaded system, and doesn't affect people warping around within a system once they are there. This being the worst possible situation for the attempted rescue of the system.</p></htmltext>
<tokenext>It 's well known and not even contested that the forces bridging in to the system black-screened and never got to fight.However , they got what they deserved .
The node in question was not reinforced due to the unexpected nature of the fight ( as in ; the notification system was not used to put the system on a dedicated server ) .
And jumping into large fights was well know to be bugged since the expansion and the Fleet Commander was made aware by an alliance member that the specific way in which they were going to enter the fight would trigger the bug.They ignored all those warnings and decided to go ahead .
Sources claim the intent was to crash the node and get a more even fight once it got up , multiple accounts even got banned for spamming local chat .
Funny thing is the bug seems to be in the simultaneous transfer of 100 + ships into an overloaded system , and does n't affect people warping around within a system once they are there .
This being the worst possible situation for the attempted rescue of the system .</tokentext>
<sentencetext>It's well known and not even contested that the forces bridging in to the system black-screened and never got to fight.However, they got what they deserved.
The node in question was not reinforced due to the unexpected nature of the fight (as in; the notification system was not used to put the system on a dedicated server).
And jumping into large fights was well know to be bugged since the expansion and the Fleet Commander was made aware by an alliance member that the specific way in which they were going to enter the fight would trigger the bug.They ignored all those warnings and decided to go ahead.
Sources claim the intent was to crash the node and get a more even fight once it got up, multiple accounts even got banned for spamming local chat.
Funny thing is the bug seems to be in the simultaneous transfer of 100+ ships into an overloaded system, and doesn't affect people warping around within a system once they are there.
This being the worst possible situation for the attempted rescue of the system.</sentencetext>
</comment>
<comment>
	<id>http://www.semanticweb.org/ontologies/ConversationInstances.owl#comment10_01_05_0357226.30652660</id>
	<title>Re:EVE Online.</title>
	<author>jameslore</author>
	<datestamp>1262685600000</datestamp>
	<modclass>None</modclass>
	<modscore>1</modscore>
	<htmltext><p>You can only reinforce a node at downtime. Hence, the problem here: no one knew there would be a fight until after downtime had passed.</p></htmltext>
<tokenext>You can only reinforce a node at downtime .
Hence , the problem here : no one knew there would be a fight until after downtime had passed .</tokentext>
<sentencetext>You can only reinforce a node at downtime.
Hence, the problem here: no one knew there would be a fight until after downtime had passed.</sentencetext>
	<parent>http://www.semanticweb.org/ontologies/ConversationInstances.owl#comment10_01_05_0357226.30651974</parent>
</comment>
<comment>
	<id>http://www.semanticweb.org/ontologies/ConversationInstances.owl#comment10_01_05_0357226.30652724</id>
	<title>Re:I'm not sure about their policy...</title>
	<author>Paradigma11</author>
	<datestamp>1262686380000</datestamp>
	<modclass>None</modclass>
	<modscore>1</modscore>
	<htmltext><p>If there are people who would have paid thousands of dollars for it then that is the amount that was lost. And it doesn't matter that you can't get the money out of the system in accordance with their policy otherwise illegal drugs would have no value either.</p></htmltext>
<tokenext>If there are people who would have paid thousands of dollars for it then that is the amount that was lost .
And it does n't matter that you ca n't get the money out of the system in accordance with their policy otherwise illegal drugs would have no value either .</tokentext>
<sentencetext>If there are people who would have paid thousands of dollars for it then that is the amount that was lost.
And it doesn't matter that you can't get the money out of the system in accordance with their policy otherwise illegal drugs would have no value either.</sentencetext>
	<parent>http://www.semanticweb.org/ontologies/ConversationInstances.owl#comment10_01_05_0357226.30651934</parent>
</comment>
<comment>
	<id>http://www.semanticweb.org/ontologies/ConversationInstances.owl#comment10_01_05_0357226.30653022</id>
	<title>Re:I'm not sure about their policy...</title>
	<author>icebike</author>
	<datestamp>1262689860000</datestamp>
	<modclass>None</modclass>
	<modscore>1</modscore>
	<htmltext><p>A life!  A life!  My Kingdom for a Life!</p></htmltext>
<tokenext>A life !
A life !
My Kingdom for a Life !</tokentext>
<sentencetext>A life!
A life!
My Kingdom for a Life!</sentencetext>
	<parent>http://www.semanticweb.org/ontologies/ConversationInstances.owl#comment10_01_05_0357226.30651934</parent>
</comment>
<comment>
	<id>http://www.semanticweb.org/ontologies/ConversationInstances.owl#comment10_01_05_0357226.30654046</id>
	<title>Re:I'm not sure about their policy...</title>
	<author>Kamokazi</author>
	<datestamp>1262702760000</datestamp>
	<modclass>None</modclass>
	<modscore>1</modscore>
	<htmltext><p>As others mentioned, there are legitimate and illegitimate means to exchange the virtual currency of Eve, ISK, to US Dollars.  Going by the legitimate route of Game Time Codes/Cards, the ISK value of the ships lost would allow you to purchase thousands of dollars worth of game time.  Illegitimately, you can sell your ISK directly for cash, but I do not know if that exchange rate would number in the thousands.</p><p>So yes, they are quite obviously not real ships, and as they were they had no direct value, but had those players desired, they could have exchanged their ships for thousands of REAL US Dollars.  So whether or not you want to believe it, "thousands of dollars" worth of ships were indeed lost.</p></htmltext>
<tokenext>As others mentioned , there are legitimate and illegitimate means to exchange the virtual currency of Eve , ISK , to US Dollars .
Going by the legitimate route of Game Time Codes/Cards , the ISK value of the ships lost would allow you to purchase thousands of dollars worth of game time .
Illegitimately , you can sell your ISK directly for cash , but I do not know if that exchange rate would number in the thousands.So yes , they are quite obviously not real ships , and as they were they had no direct value , but had those players desired , they could have exchanged their ships for thousands of REAL US Dollars .
So whether or not you want to believe it , " thousands of dollars " worth of ships were indeed lost .</tokentext>
<sentencetext>As others mentioned, there are legitimate and illegitimate means to exchange the virtual currency of Eve, ISK, to US Dollars.
Going by the legitimate route of Game Time Codes/Cards, the ISK value of the ships lost would allow you to purchase thousands of dollars worth of game time.
Illegitimately, you can sell your ISK directly for cash, but I do not know if that exchange rate would number in the thousands.So yes, they are quite obviously not real ships, and as they were they had no direct value, but had those players desired, they could have exchanged their ships for thousands of REAL US Dollars.
So whether or not you want to believe it, "thousands of dollars" worth of ships were indeed lost.</sentencetext>
	<parent>http://www.semanticweb.org/ontologies/ConversationInstances.owl#comment10_01_05_0357226.30651934</parent>
</comment>
<comment>
	<id>http://www.semanticweb.org/ontologies/ConversationInstances.owl#comment10_01_05_0357226.30651838</id>
	<title>Re:Why Am I Not Surprised</title>
	<author>Anonymous</author>
	<datestamp>1262633160000</datestamp>
	<modclass>None</modclass>
	<modscore>1</modscore>
	<htmltext>EVE has an actual functioning economy and the main story is actually driven by the players themselves.  You are encouraged to use everything at your disposal even play multiple accounts so it only makes sense network issues would become part of the game.</htmltext>
<tokenext>EVE has an actual functioning economy and the main story is actually driven by the players themselves .
You are encouraged to use everything at your disposal even play multiple accounts so it only makes sense network issues would become part of the game .</tokentext>
<sentencetext>EVE has an actual functioning economy and the main story is actually driven by the players themselves.
You are encouraged to use everything at your disposal even play multiple accounts so it only makes sense network issues would become part of the game.</sentencetext>
	<parent>http://www.semanticweb.org/ontologies/ConversationInstances.owl#comment10_01_05_0357226.30651788</parent>
</comment>
<comment>
	<id>http://www.semanticweb.org/ontologies/ConversationInstances.owl#comment10_01_05_0357226.30653354</id>
	<title>Re:Easy fix</title>
	<author>ihavnoid</author>
	<datestamp>1262694180000</datestamp>
	<modclass>Informativ</modclass>
	<modscore>2</modscore>
	<htmltext><p>If money and sheer 'raw performance' could solve the problem, I'd bet that they would have already done that.  The (salary of the engineers + server downtime + crashses (resulting in bad reputation) + etc.) are much more expensive than the hardware cost.</p><p>The problem in this situation is that they are trying to put too many people inside a small region.</p><p>For example, if you develop some kind of chat server, which can have 10 people inside a single room, and assuming that each person types one message per second, you have 10 messages per second on the room for 10 people, resulting in 100 messages transmitted per second.  Make that 1000, and you have 1,000,000 messages to broadcast per second.</p><p>The problem is that, all that data has to get out of your server farm.  Even worse, is that the required bandwidth grows square-proportional of the number of users on the battlefield.  Now, add the 'computing load distribution' when the computation (and the interaction between the users) also grows square-proportional of the number of users. Things will get ugly quickly.  That's why most MMOs put queues and user caps on individual 'servers' or 'instances' or whatever, because potentially everything inside the region need to interact with each other.</p><p>Actually, I heard that EVE online had done a tremendous job scaling the size of battlefields up to remarkable sizes.  Well, at least they are trying.</p></htmltext>
<tokenext>If money and sheer 'raw performance ' could solve the problem , I 'd bet that they would have already done that .
The ( salary of the engineers + server downtime + crashses ( resulting in bad reputation ) + etc .
) are much more expensive than the hardware cost.The problem in this situation is that they are trying to put too many people inside a small region.For example , if you develop some kind of chat server , which can have 10 people inside a single room , and assuming that each person types one message per second , you have 10 messages per second on the room for 10 people , resulting in 100 messages transmitted per second .
Make that 1000 , and you have 1,000,000 messages to broadcast per second.The problem is that , all that data has to get out of your server farm .
Even worse , is that the required bandwidth grows square-proportional of the number of users on the battlefield .
Now , add the 'computing load distribution ' when the computation ( and the interaction between the users ) also grows square-proportional of the number of users .
Things will get ugly quickly .
That 's why most MMOs put queues and user caps on individual 'servers ' or 'instances ' or whatever , because potentially everything inside the region need to interact with each other.Actually , I heard that EVE online had done a tremendous job scaling the size of battlefields up to remarkable sizes .
Well , at least they are trying .</tokentext>
<sentencetext>If money and sheer 'raw performance' could solve the problem, I'd bet that they would have already done that.
The (salary of the engineers + server downtime + crashses (resulting in bad reputation) + etc.
) are much more expensive than the hardware cost.The problem in this situation is that they are trying to put too many people inside a small region.For example, if you develop some kind of chat server, which can have 10 people inside a single room, and assuming that each person types one message per second, you have 10 messages per second on the room for 10 people, resulting in 100 messages transmitted per second.
Make that 1000, and you have 1,000,000 messages to broadcast per second.The problem is that, all that data has to get out of your server farm.
Even worse, is that the required bandwidth grows square-proportional of the number of users on the battlefield.
Now, add the 'computing load distribution' when the computation (and the interaction between the users) also grows square-proportional of the number of users.
Things will get ugly quickly.
That's why most MMOs put queues and user caps on individual 'servers' or 'instances' or whatever, because potentially everything inside the region need to interact with each other.Actually, I heard that EVE online had done a tremendous job scaling the size of battlefields up to remarkable sizes.
Well, at least they are trying.</sentencetext>
	<parent>http://www.semanticweb.org/ontologies/ConversationInstances.owl#comment10_01_05_0357226.30651774</parent>
</comment>
<comment>
	<id>http://www.semanticweb.org/ontologies/ConversationInstances.owl#comment10_01_05_0357226.30654208</id>
	<title>Re:EVE Online.</title>
	<author>Drethon</author>
	<datestamp>1262703900000</datestamp>
	<modclass>None</modclass>
	<modscore>0</modscore>
	<htmltext>Actually they have an office in Atlanta too.  Unfortunately my wife doesn't want to move there...</htmltext>
<tokenext>Actually they have an office in Atlanta too .
Unfortunately my wife does n't want to move there.. .</tokentext>
<sentencetext>Actually they have an office in Atlanta too.
Unfortunately my wife doesn't want to move there...</sentencetext>
	<parent>http://www.semanticweb.org/ontologies/ConversationInstances.owl#comment10_01_05_0357226.30652150</parent>
</comment>
<comment>
	<id>http://www.semanticweb.org/ontologies/ConversationInstances.owl#comment10_01_05_0357226.30652042</id>
	<title>Re:Thousands? Say it isn't so!</title>
	<author>Anonymous</author>
	<datestamp>1262721720000</datestamp>
	<modclass>None</modclass>
	<modscore>0</modscore>
	<htmltext><p>Slashdot has been posting stories like this since its inception, and your self-righteous whining about it isn't going to change that. So shut the fuck up. Also, no one gives a tin shit about your fucking mom.</p></htmltext>
<tokenext>Slashdot has been posting stories like this since its inception , and your self-righteous whining about it is n't going to change that .
So shut the fuck up .
Also , no one gives a tin shit about your fucking mom .</tokentext>
<sentencetext>Slashdot has been posting stories like this since its inception, and your self-righteous whining about it isn't going to change that.
So shut the fuck up.
Also, no one gives a tin shit about your fucking mom.</sentencetext>
	<parent>http://www.semanticweb.org/ontologies/ConversationInstances.owl#comment10_01_05_0357226.30651794</parent>
</comment>
<comment>
	<id>http://www.semanticweb.org/ontologies/ConversationInstances.owl#comment10_01_05_0357226.30661464</id>
	<title>Re:It was their own fault</title>
	<author>Anonymous</author>
	<datestamp>1262689440000</datestamp>
	<modclass>None</modclass>
	<modscore>0</modscore>
	<htmltext><p>We didn't really have a choice though. Our options were limited to</p><p>1. Jump in and try to defend our system and hope for the best or</p><p>2. We go and ride bikes and let IT take the system.</p><p>Given the nature of the game at the moment it's all stacked in IT's favour. Since they are a Euro based alliance they can always stack the system immediately after down time so they will always have the numbers advantage making it nigh on impossible for us to do anything.</p></htmltext>
<tokenext>We did n't really have a choice though .
Our options were limited to1 .
Jump in and try to defend our system and hope for the best or2 .
We go and ride bikes and let IT take the system.Given the nature of the game at the moment it 's all stacked in IT 's favour .
Since they are a Euro based alliance they can always stack the system immediately after down time so they will always have the numbers advantage making it nigh on impossible for us to do anything .</tokentext>
<sentencetext>We didn't really have a choice though.
Our options were limited to1.
Jump in and try to defend our system and hope for the best or2.
We go and ride bikes and let IT take the system.Given the nature of the game at the moment it's all stacked in IT's favour.
Since they are a Euro based alliance they can always stack the system immediately after down time so they will always have the numbers advantage making it nigh on impossible for us to do anything.</sentencetext>
	<parent>http://www.semanticweb.org/ontologies/ConversationInstances.owl#comment10_01_05_0357226.30651812</parent>
</comment>
<comment>
	<id>http://www.semanticweb.org/ontologies/ConversationInstances.owl#comment10_01_05_0357226.30652854</id>
	<title>Re:Here is video of the battle...</title>
	<author>L4t3r4lu5</author>
	<datestamp>1262687520000</datestamp>
	<modclass>None</modclass>
	<modscore>1</modscore>
	<htmltext>Here's a <a href="http://lh6.ggpht.com/\_ahmprYw6wqo/SWsB\_TnVy5I/AAAAAAAAAtk/LRqIgROYmHg/\%5BUNSET\%5D.jpg" title="ggpht.com">screenshot</a> [ggpht.com] from the losing side!</htmltext>
<tokenext>Here 's a screenshot [ ggpht.com ] from the losing side !</tokentext>
<sentencetext>Here's a screenshot [ggpht.com] from the losing side!</sentencetext>
	<parent>http://www.semanticweb.org/ontologies/ConversationInstances.owl#comment10_01_05_0357226.30651912</parent>
</comment>
<comment>
	<id>http://www.semanticweb.org/ontologies/ConversationInstances.owl#comment10_01_05_0357226.30651794</id>
	<title>Thousands?  Say it isn't so!</title>
	<author>Anonymous</author>
	<datestamp>1262632680000</datestamp>
	<modclass>Flamebait</modclass>
	<modscore>-1</modscore>
	<htmltext>Oh, no, thousands of dollars of assets were destroyed!  Despite the fact that they only provided value for an incredibly small slice of the human race, this tragedy is surely front-page material for any website.<p>And in other news, this morning while my mom was on the way to work, she couldn't avoid a piece of road debris, causing thousands of dollars of assets to be destroyed.  She had to pull over and call a tow truck.</p></htmltext>
<tokenext>Oh , no , thousands of dollars of assets were destroyed !
Despite the fact that they only provided value for an incredibly small slice of the human race , this tragedy is surely front-page material for any website.And in other news , this morning while my mom was on the way to work , she could n't avoid a piece of road debris , causing thousands of dollars of assets to be destroyed .
She had to pull over and call a tow truck .</tokentext>
<sentencetext>Oh, no, thousands of dollars of assets were destroyed!
Despite the fact that they only provided value for an incredibly small slice of the human race, this tragedy is surely front-page material for any website.And in other news, this morning while my mom was on the way to work, she couldn't avoid a piece of road debris, causing thousands of dollars of assets to be destroyed.
She had to pull over and call a tow truck.</sentencetext>
</comment>
<comment>
	<id>http://www.semanticweb.org/ontologies/ConversationInstances.owl#comment10_01_05_0357226.30668258</id>
	<title>LOL the Perps got Pwned</title>
	<author>Anonymous</author>
	<datestamp>1262785680000</datestamp>
	<modclass>None</modclass>
	<modscore>0</modscore>
	<htmltext><p>Hopefully Jumpgate Evolution when it comes out learns from EvE's mistake...</p><p>Jumpgate is for hardcore space sim folks.... This sounds like a complete and bullshit attempt to take down a server and the perps got raped instead...</p><p>If that happened in JG, they would be hunted until the end of time for such a lame ass act.</p></htmltext>
<tokenext>Hopefully Jumpgate Evolution when it comes out learns from EvE 's mistake...Jumpgate is for hardcore space sim folks.... This sounds like a complete and bullshit attempt to take down a server and the perps got raped instead...If that happened in JG , they would be hunted until the end of time for such a lame ass act .</tokentext>
<sentencetext>Hopefully Jumpgate Evolution when it comes out learns from EvE's mistake...Jumpgate is for hardcore space sim folks.... This sounds like a complete and bullshit attempt to take down a server and the perps got raped instead...If that happened in JG, they would be hunted until the end of time for such a lame ass act.</sentencetext>
</comment>
<comment>
	<id>http://www.semanticweb.org/ontologies/ConversationInstances.owl#comment10_01_05_0357226.30652154</id>
	<title>Re:well... if you think about it</title>
	<author>Anonymous</author>
	<datestamp>1262723160000</datestamp>
	<modclass>None</modclass>
	<modscore>1</modscore>
	<htmltext>I'm guessing the ape is the IT Alliance and GoonSwarm is the zoo worker.</htmltext>
<tokenext>I 'm guessing the ape is the IT Alliance and GoonSwarm is the zoo worker .</tokentext>
<sentencetext>I'm guessing the ape is the IT Alliance and GoonSwarm is the zoo worker.</sentencetext>
	<parent>http://www.semanticweb.org/ontologies/ConversationInstances.owl#comment10_01_05_0357226.30651944</parent>
</comment>
<comment>
	<id>http://www.semanticweb.org/ontologies/ConversationInstances.owl#comment10_01_05_0357226.30654124</id>
	<title>Re:I'm not sure about their policy...</title>
	<author>wisnoskij</author>
	<datestamp>1262703420000</datestamp>
	<modclass>None</modclass>
	<modscore>1</modscore>
	<htmltext>A house is not real money but when it burns down do you not lose thousands of dollars (the amount you could of sold it for)?<br>
the ships were not real but if you could of sold your account/ship for thousands of dollars(real dollars) then thousands of dollars are lost.</htmltext>
<tokenext>A house is not real money but when it burns down do you not lose thousands of dollars ( the amount you could of sold it for ) ?
the ships were not real but if you could of sold your account/ship for thousands of dollars ( real dollars ) then thousands of dollars are lost .</tokentext>
<sentencetext>A house is not real money but when it burns down do you not lose thousands of dollars (the amount you could of sold it for)?
the ships were not real but if you could of sold your account/ship for thousands of dollars(real dollars) then thousands of dollars are lost.</sentencetext>
	<parent>http://www.semanticweb.org/ontologies/ConversationInstances.owl#comment10_01_05_0357226.30651934</parent>
</comment>
<comment>
	<id>http://www.semanticweb.org/ontologies/ConversationInstances.owl#comment10_01_05_0357226.30664936</id>
	<title>Re:I'm not sure about their policy...</title>
	<author>Anonymous</author>
	<datestamp>1262707980000</datestamp>
	<modclass>None</modclass>
	<modscore>0</modscore>
	<htmltext><p>thousands of dollars were never lost on those ships, at least definitely not lost by the players that owned them</p><p>they were all bought with in game money that was made by moon mining in most 0.0 space that takes 1 person refueling those POS (a starbase in space at the moon with the valuable minerals) and moving the mined materials one to two days a month, times the moons mined by well over 20 and this alliance made enough in game money (ISK) in 1-2 months of easily to buy a Titan for a member costing about 80-90 billion isk</p><p>said alliance that lost these titans still has more titans from all the isk they have made in the game from these valuable moons and nothing else. no real money involved or hundreds of hours put in building it, other people in other alliances or in empire produced the ships in question</p></htmltext>
<tokenext>thousands of dollars were never lost on those ships , at least definitely not lost by the players that owned themthey were all bought with in game money that was made by moon mining in most 0.0 space that takes 1 person refueling those POS ( a starbase in space at the moon with the valuable minerals ) and moving the mined materials one to two days a month , times the moons mined by well over 20 and this alliance made enough in game money ( ISK ) in 1-2 months of easily to buy a Titan for a member costing about 80-90 billion isksaid alliance that lost these titans still has more titans from all the isk they have made in the game from these valuable moons and nothing else .
no real money involved or hundreds of hours put in building it , other people in other alliances or in empire produced the ships in question</tokentext>
<sentencetext>thousands of dollars were never lost on those ships, at least definitely not lost by the players that owned themthey were all bought with in game money that was made by moon mining in most 0.0 space that takes 1 person refueling those POS (a starbase in space at the moon with the valuable minerals) and moving the mined materials one to two days a month, times the moons mined by well over 20 and this alliance made enough in game money (ISK) in 1-2 months of easily to buy a Titan for a member costing about 80-90 billion isksaid alliance that lost these titans still has more titans from all the isk they have made in the game from these valuable moons and nothing else.
no real money involved or hundreds of hours put in building it, other people in other alliances or in empire produced the ships in question</sentencetext>
	<parent>http://www.semanticweb.org/ontologies/ConversationInstances.owl#comment10_01_05_0357226.30651934</parent>
</comment>
<comment>
	<id>http://www.semanticweb.org/ontologies/ConversationInstances.owl#comment10_01_05_0357226.30652844</id>
	<title>It may have cost -real money-</title>
	<author>SlashDread</author>
	<datestamp>1262687280000</datestamp>
	<modclass>None</modclass>
	<modscore>1</modscore>
	<htmltext><p>You can accumulate Interstellar Kredits (ISK) by gaming, or you can actually BUY it with real money.<br>After all you can sell PLEX (Pilot License EXtentions, essentially game cards) in game (for ISK)  bought outside of the game with real money.</p></htmltext>
<tokenext>You can accumulate Interstellar Kredits ( ISK ) by gaming , or you can actually BUY it with real money.After all you can sell PLEX ( Pilot License EXtentions , essentially game cards ) in game ( for ISK ) bought outside of the game with real money .</tokentext>
<sentencetext>You can accumulate Interstellar Kredits (ISK) by gaming, or you can actually BUY it with real money.After all you can sell PLEX (Pilot License EXtentions, essentially game cards) in game (for ISK)  bought outside of the game with real money.</sentencetext>
	<parent>http://www.semanticweb.org/ontologies/ConversationInstances.owl#comment10_01_05_0357226.30652120</parent>
</comment>
<comment>
	<id>http://www.semanticweb.org/ontologies/ConversationInstances.owl#comment10_01_05_0357226.30652656</id>
	<title>Re:Why Am I Not Surprised</title>
	<author>Anonymous</author>
	<datestamp>1262685600000</datestamp>
	<modclass>Informativ</modclass>
	<modscore>5</modscore>
	<htmltext><p>In this particular case, there were 1340 people in the same star system at peak. A star system is handled by a single server, due to code limitations - CCP have stated that they want to improve the code so that a single system can be managed by multiple servers, but they are not yet there. About a year ago, this number of people fighting in the same system would've been next to impossible. CCP later improved their code to be able to handle fleet fights of 1500+ players with reasonable responsiveness (IE, lagged but playable). Due to the fact that eve is more of a tactical simulator than an action sim, lag is not always such a big issue. A five or ten second weapons activation lag is actually playable in a fashion, unlike many other games.</p><p>Now, keep in mind that this is actually 1340 players fighting on a single physical server, with upwards of 50,000 players logged in at the same time on the single world shard of eve. Compare this to many other MMOs, where you may have 1340 players total on a shard cluster.</p><p>Now, EVE is not designed for 1340 players. The fact that that many players are able to play in a single solar system at all is a testament to the sandbox nature of eve, where the developers have decided to try to avoid hard limits as much as possible (IE, no 25-man raids or maximum players on the server), but instead allow the players to use as much as they can and want. This obviously results in situations where the servers cannot cope, which is a known problem with fleet fights. CCP's response has traditionally been "Yes, we allow you to do this, but be aware of the potential consequences - we won't reimburse you for lag or poor server performance". The alternative would've been hard limits on the number of people on a node, which would've favoured those who made it in first, with the most people on their side - there are no defined sides in eve, so you cannot for instance let in 100 red and 100 blue.</p><p>The battle that the OP refers to was one of those cases. It was well known that server performance was unreliable after the Dominion patch. In many cases, this would prevent fleet fights from occurring, and when they did occur, they were often one-sided massacres. Knowing this, and despite being warned by their allies numerous times, the opposing force still decided to enter the system. Not only that, but they also decided to jump in at the same time, instead of staggering their jumpins - something that has been proven to reduce lag and avoid people getting stuck in loading - or jumping in to different "grids". In fact, leaked logs indicate that they did this knowingly with the intent of crashing an already overloaded node, so that they'd be at an even footing when the server came back up.</p><p>In the end, this backfired and they lost their entire fleet as a result.</p><p>Once again, CCP allows fleetfights with no hard limit on the number of participants, but their stance is "Yes, we allow you to do this, but be aware of the potential consequences - we won't reimburse you for lag or poor server performance".</p></htmltext>
<tokenext>In this particular case , there were 1340 people in the same star system at peak .
A star system is handled by a single server , due to code limitations - CCP have stated that they want to improve the code so that a single system can be managed by multiple servers , but they are not yet there .
About a year ago , this number of people fighting in the same system would 've been next to impossible .
CCP later improved their code to be able to handle fleet fights of 1500 + players with reasonable responsiveness ( IE , lagged but playable ) .
Due to the fact that eve is more of a tactical simulator than an action sim , lag is not always such a big issue .
A five or ten second weapons activation lag is actually playable in a fashion , unlike many other games.Now , keep in mind that this is actually 1340 players fighting on a single physical server , with upwards of 50,000 players logged in at the same time on the single world shard of eve .
Compare this to many other MMOs , where you may have 1340 players total on a shard cluster.Now , EVE is not designed for 1340 players .
The fact that that many players are able to play in a single solar system at all is a testament to the sandbox nature of eve , where the developers have decided to try to avoid hard limits as much as possible ( IE , no 25-man raids or maximum players on the server ) , but instead allow the players to use as much as they can and want .
This obviously results in situations where the servers can not cope , which is a known problem with fleet fights .
CCP 's response has traditionally been " Yes , we allow you to do this , but be aware of the potential consequences - we wo n't reimburse you for lag or poor server performance " .
The alternative would 've been hard limits on the number of people on a node , which would 've favoured those who made it in first , with the most people on their side - there are no defined sides in eve , so you can not for instance let in 100 red and 100 blue.The battle that the OP refers to was one of those cases .
It was well known that server performance was unreliable after the Dominion patch .
In many cases , this would prevent fleet fights from occurring , and when they did occur , they were often one-sided massacres .
Knowing this , and despite being warned by their allies numerous times , the opposing force still decided to enter the system .
Not only that , but they also decided to jump in at the same time , instead of staggering their jumpins - something that has been proven to reduce lag and avoid people getting stuck in loading - or jumping in to different " grids " .
In fact , leaked logs indicate that they did this knowingly with the intent of crashing an already overloaded node , so that they 'd be at an even footing when the server came back up.In the end , this backfired and they lost their entire fleet as a result.Once again , CCP allows fleetfights with no hard limit on the number of participants , but their stance is " Yes , we allow you to do this , but be aware of the potential consequences - we wo n't reimburse you for lag or poor server performance " .</tokentext>
<sentencetext>In this particular case, there were 1340 people in the same star system at peak.
A star system is handled by a single server, due to code limitations - CCP have stated that they want to improve the code so that a single system can be managed by multiple servers, but they are not yet there.
About a year ago, this number of people fighting in the same system would've been next to impossible.
CCP later improved their code to be able to handle fleet fights of 1500+ players with reasonable responsiveness (IE, lagged but playable).
Due to the fact that eve is more of a tactical simulator than an action sim, lag is not always such a big issue.
A five or ten second weapons activation lag is actually playable in a fashion, unlike many other games.Now, keep in mind that this is actually 1340 players fighting on a single physical server, with upwards of 50,000 players logged in at the same time on the single world shard of eve.
Compare this to many other MMOs, where you may have 1340 players total on a shard cluster.Now, EVE is not designed for 1340 players.
The fact that that many players are able to play in a single solar system at all is a testament to the sandbox nature of eve, where the developers have decided to try to avoid hard limits as much as possible (IE, no 25-man raids or maximum players on the server), but instead allow the players to use as much as they can and want.
This obviously results in situations where the servers cannot cope, which is a known problem with fleet fights.
CCP's response has traditionally been "Yes, we allow you to do this, but be aware of the potential consequences - we won't reimburse you for lag or poor server performance".
The alternative would've been hard limits on the number of people on a node, which would've favoured those who made it in first, with the most people on their side - there are no defined sides in eve, so you cannot for instance let in 100 red and 100 blue.The battle that the OP refers to was one of those cases.
It was well known that server performance was unreliable after the Dominion patch.
In many cases, this would prevent fleet fights from occurring, and when they did occur, they were often one-sided massacres.
Knowing this, and despite being warned by their allies numerous times, the opposing force still decided to enter the system.
Not only that, but they also decided to jump in at the same time, instead of staggering their jumpins - something that has been proven to reduce lag and avoid people getting stuck in loading - or jumping in to different "grids".
In fact, leaked logs indicate that they did this knowingly with the intent of crashing an already overloaded node, so that they'd be at an even footing when the server came back up.In the end, this backfired and they lost their entire fleet as a result.Once again, CCP allows fleetfights with no hard limit on the number of participants, but their stance is "Yes, we allow you to do this, but be aware of the potential consequences - we won't reimburse you for lag or poor server performance".</sentencetext>
	<parent>http://www.semanticweb.org/ontologies/ConversationInstances.owl#comment10_01_05_0357226.30652126</parent>
</comment>
<comment>
	<id>http://www.semanticweb.org/ontologies/ConversationInstances.owl#comment10_01_05_0357226.30651784</id>
	<title>Kinda Cool</title>
	<author>MarkvW</author>
	<datestamp>1262632560000</datestamp>
	<modclass>Interestin</modclass>
	<modscore>4</modscore>
	<htmltext><p>I still don't think I'll sign over my credit card to a MM online game, but a game that lets you destroy THOUSANDS of dollars of stuff that other people value for the sheer malicious joy . . . well, that's perversely COOL!</p></htmltext>
<tokenext>I still do n't think I 'll sign over my credit card to a MM online game , but a game that lets you destroy THOUSANDS of dollars of stuff that other people value for the sheer malicious joy .
. .
well , that 's perversely COOL !</tokentext>
<sentencetext>I still don't think I'll sign over my credit card to a MM online game, but a game that lets you destroy THOUSANDS of dollars of stuff that other people value for the sheer malicious joy .
. .
well, that's perversely COOL!</sentencetext>
</comment>
<comment>
	<id>http://www.semanticweb.org/ontologies/ConversationInstances.owl#comment10_01_05_0357226.30663746</id>
	<title>Re:I'm not sure about their policy...</title>
	<author>Coren22</author>
	<datestamp>1262700180000</datestamp>
	<modclass>None</modclass>
	<modscore>1</modscore>
	<htmltext><p>Actually, from speaking to people after the fight, it was Goon's intention to crash the node.  There is a procedure to "reinforce" the node for these fights which makes one solar system run on one server which would have handled this fight I imagine (1500 is a huge number in one fight)  Goons chose to not submit an application for reinforcement of the system in order to crash the node and possibly win the fight, they failed, boohoo for them.<nobr> <wbr></nobr>:)</p></htmltext>
<tokenext>Actually , from speaking to people after the fight , it was Goon 's intention to crash the node .
There is a procedure to " reinforce " the node for these fights which makes one solar system run on one server which would have handled this fight I imagine ( 1500 is a huge number in one fight ) Goons chose to not submit an application for reinforcement of the system in order to crash the node and possibly win the fight , they failed , boohoo for them .
: )</tokentext>
<sentencetext>Actually, from speaking to people after the fight, it was Goon's intention to crash the node.
There is a procedure to "reinforce" the node for these fights which makes one solar system run on one server which would have handled this fight I imagine (1500 is a huge number in one fight)  Goons chose to not submit an application for reinforcement of the system in order to crash the node and possibly win the fight, they failed, boohoo for them.
:)</sentencetext>
	<parent>http://www.semanticweb.org/ontologies/ConversationInstances.owl#comment10_01_05_0357226.30651772</parent>
</comment>
<comment>
	<id>http://www.semanticweb.org/ontologies/ConversationInstances.owl#comment10_01_05_0357226.30652624</id>
	<title>Re:Here is video of the battle...</title>
	<author>Anonymous</author>
	<datestamp>1262685240000</datestamp>
	<modclass>None</modclass>
	<modscore>0</modscore>
	<htmltext><p>Those are all capital ships, they can hardly move anyway. And dreadnoughts are in siege mode, so they can't move at all.<br>When using subcapitals fighting requires maneuvering.</p></htmltext>
<tokenext>Those are all capital ships , they can hardly move anyway .
And dreadnoughts are in siege mode , so they ca n't move at all.When using subcapitals fighting requires maneuvering .</tokentext>
<sentencetext>Those are all capital ships, they can hardly move anyway.
And dreadnoughts are in siege mode, so they can't move at all.When using subcapitals fighting requires maneuvering.</sentencetext>
	<parent>http://www.semanticweb.org/ontologies/ConversationInstances.owl#comment10_01_05_0357226.30652384</parent>
</comment>
<comment>
	<id>http://www.semanticweb.org/ontologies/ConversationInstances.owl#comment10_01_05_0357226.30653896</id>
	<title>Re:Why Am I Not Surprised</title>
	<author>Weezul</author>
	<datestamp>1262701380000</datestamp>
	<modclass>Interestin</modclass>
	<modscore>3</modscore>
	<htmltext><p>True, but CCP also has a long history of favoring the Band of Brothers.  People can quite reasonably accuse CCP of continuing to favor BoB's playing style here.</p><p>A fleetfight should simply not become unbalanced.  If players are lagging out, they should cull players evenly from each side, ideally offering non-culled players the option to give their slot to a culled player.</p></htmltext>
<tokenext>True , but CCP also has a long history of favoring the Band of Brothers .
People can quite reasonably accuse CCP of continuing to favor BoB 's playing style here.A fleetfight should simply not become unbalanced .
If players are lagging out , they should cull players evenly from each side , ideally offering non-culled players the option to give their slot to a culled player .</tokentext>
<sentencetext>True, but CCP also has a long history of favoring the Band of Brothers.
People can quite reasonably accuse CCP of continuing to favor BoB's playing style here.A fleetfight should simply not become unbalanced.
If players are lagging out, they should cull players evenly from each side, ideally offering non-culled players the option to give their slot to a culled player.</sentencetext>
	<parent>http://www.semanticweb.org/ontologies/ConversationInstances.owl#comment10_01_05_0357226.30652656</parent>
</comment>
<comment>
	<id>http://www.semanticweb.org/ontologies/ConversationInstances.owl#comment10_01_05_0357226.30653912</id>
	<title>Re:Why Am I Not Surprised</title>
	<author>jforr</author>
	<datestamp>1262701560000</datestamp>
	<modclass>None</modclass>
	<modscore>1</modscore>
	<htmltext><p>Eve handles large scale battles just fine.  The problem is, the term "large scale battle" gets redefined every time their network code gets updated.  Over the past few months there have been dozens of large scale battles with less players in this particular matchup, but still having hundreds more players than would be possible in years past.</p><p>As for only having 8 hours a week to play, eve is probably one of the most casual-friendly games out there.  Skills train whether you're online or not.  All ships, even the basic newbie ships which require virtually nil resources and training time play a role.</p></htmltext>
<tokenext>Eve handles large scale battles just fine .
The problem is , the term " large scale battle " gets redefined every time their network code gets updated .
Over the past few months there have been dozens of large scale battles with less players in this particular matchup , but still having hundreds more players than would be possible in years past.As for only having 8 hours a week to play , eve is probably one of the most casual-friendly games out there .
Skills train whether you 're online or not .
All ships , even the basic newbie ships which require virtually nil resources and training time play a role .</tokentext>
<sentencetext>Eve handles large scale battles just fine.
The problem is, the term "large scale battle" gets redefined every time their network code gets updated.
Over the past few months there have been dozens of large scale battles with less players in this particular matchup, but still having hundreds more players than would be possible in years past.As for only having 8 hours a week to play, eve is probably one of the most casual-friendly games out there.
Skills train whether you're online or not.
All ships, even the basic newbie ships which require virtually nil resources and training time play a role.</sentencetext>
	<parent>http://www.semanticweb.org/ontologies/ConversationInstances.owl#comment10_01_05_0357226.30653204</parent>
</comment>
<comment>
	<id>http://www.semanticweb.org/ontologies/ConversationInstances.owl#comment10_01_05_0357226.30653836</id>
	<title>Re:Why Am I Not Surprised</title>
	<author>Ephemeriis</author>
	<datestamp>1262700960000</datestamp>
	<modclass>Insightful</modclass>
	<modscore>2</modscore>
	<htmltext><p><div class="quote"><p>Only in EVE would the players decide that network failures are a factor they should take into consideration.</p></div><p>EVE is a fairly intense game.</p><p>It can take you literally years to train enough skills to fly certain ships.  It can take weeks to manufacture a piece of equipment.  It can take months to recover from a loss.</p><p>Yes, of course, it's only pixels...  But they're pixels that take a lot of time and effort to acquire.  Because of this, people take things fairly seriously.</p><p>In this case - everyone knows that CCP has some issues.  There are known problems that people just work around - like Jita on the weekends.  You know it'll be packed, you know there'll be travel advisories, so you work around it.</p><p>In the case of this battle, and the network failures...  Yes, it is something that they should have taken into consideration.  One side could have camped a jumpgate with overwhelming numbers <b>intending</b> for the other side to lose players to lag when they jumped in.  Or they could have flanked the system and come in through different jumpgates to avoid some of the lag.  Or they could have attacked other assets in nearby systems to draw players away from that one overwhelmed system and even the playing field.</p></div>
	</htmltext>
<tokenext>Only in EVE would the players decide that network failures are a factor they should take into consideration.EVE is a fairly intense game.It can take you literally years to train enough skills to fly certain ships .
It can take weeks to manufacture a piece of equipment .
It can take months to recover from a loss.Yes , of course , it 's only pixels... But they 're pixels that take a lot of time and effort to acquire .
Because of this , people take things fairly seriously.In this case - everyone knows that CCP has some issues .
There are known problems that people just work around - like Jita on the weekends .
You know it 'll be packed , you know there 'll be travel advisories , so you work around it.In the case of this battle , and the network failures... Yes , it is something that they should have taken into consideration .
One side could have camped a jumpgate with overwhelming numbers intending for the other side to lose players to lag when they jumped in .
Or they could have flanked the system and come in through different jumpgates to avoid some of the lag .
Or they could have attacked other assets in nearby systems to draw players away from that one overwhelmed system and even the playing field .</tokentext>
<sentencetext>Only in EVE would the players decide that network failures are a factor they should take into consideration.EVE is a fairly intense game.It can take you literally years to train enough skills to fly certain ships.
It can take weeks to manufacture a piece of equipment.
It can take months to recover from a loss.Yes, of course, it's only pixels...  But they're pixels that take a lot of time and effort to acquire.
Because of this, people take things fairly seriously.In this case - everyone knows that CCP has some issues.
There are known problems that people just work around - like Jita on the weekends.
You know it'll be packed, you know there'll be travel advisories, so you work around it.In the case of this battle, and the network failures...  Yes, it is something that they should have taken into consideration.
One side could have camped a jumpgate with overwhelming numbers intending for the other side to lose players to lag when they jumped in.
Or they could have flanked the system and come in through different jumpgates to avoid some of the lag.
Or they could have attacked other assets in nearby systems to draw players away from that one overwhelmed system and even the playing field.
	</sentencetext>
	<parent>http://www.semanticweb.org/ontologies/ConversationInstances.owl#comment10_01_05_0357226.30651788</parent>
</comment>
<comment>
	<id>http://www.semanticweb.org/ontologies/ConversationInstances.owl#comment10_01_05_0357226.30657276</id>
	<title>strikes me even more</title>
	<author>Atreide</author>
	<datestamp>1262716140000</datestamp>
	<modclass>None</modclass>
	<modscore>1</modscore>
	<htmltext><p>what strikes me even more is<br>"Despite the admitted network failure, leaders of the attacking force do not expect CCP to replace lost ships, claiming that it was their own fault for not accounting for server failures"</p><p>in most if not all other MMO<br>they would whine &amp; petition for compensation</p></htmltext>
<tokenext>what strikes me even more is " Despite the admitted network failure , leaders of the attacking force do not expect CCP to replace lost ships , claiming that it was their own fault for not accounting for server failures " in most if not all other MMOthey would whine &amp; petition for compensation</tokentext>
<sentencetext>what strikes me even more is"Despite the admitted network failure, leaders of the attacking force do not expect CCP to replace lost ships, claiming that it was their own fault for not accounting for server failures"in most if not all other MMOthey would whine &amp; petition for compensation</sentencetext>
	<parent>http://www.semanticweb.org/ontologies/ConversationInstances.owl#comment10_01_05_0357226.30651784</parent>
</comment>
<comment>
	<id>http://www.semanticweb.org/ontologies/ConversationInstances.owl#comment10_01_05_0357226.30653970</id>
	<title>This was my take as well.</title>
	<author>maillemaker</author>
	<datestamp>1262702220000</datestamp>
	<modclass>None</modclass>
	<modscore>1</modscore>
	<htmltext><p>I tried one of the 14-day trials.</p><p>It was obvious to me that in order to be a real player in this game you would have to invest a LOT of time and/or real money buying ISK.</p><p>I didn't have that kind of time or money.</p></htmltext>
<tokenext>I tried one of the 14-day trials.It was obvious to me that in order to be a real player in this game you would have to invest a LOT of time and/or real money buying ISK.I did n't have that kind of time or money .</tokentext>
<sentencetext>I tried one of the 14-day trials.It was obvious to me that in order to be a real player in this game you would have to invest a LOT of time and/or real money buying ISK.I didn't have that kind of time or money.</sentencetext>
	<parent>http://www.semanticweb.org/ontologies/ConversationInstances.owl#comment10_01_05_0357226.30651868</parent>
</comment>
<comment>
	<id>http://www.semanticweb.org/ontologies/ConversationInstances.owl#comment10_01_05_0357226.30652014</id>
	<title>Re:Here is video of the battle...</title>
	<author>Korbeau</author>
	<datestamp>1262635080000</datestamp>
	<modclass>Funny</modclass>
	<modscore>2</modscore>
	<htmltext><p>I have no clue about how this game work, but judging by the video the big vessels clearly should have gone into Ludicrous Speed mode!</p></htmltext>
<tokenext>I have no clue about how this game work , but judging by the video the big vessels clearly should have gone into Ludicrous Speed mode !</tokentext>
<sentencetext>I have no clue about how this game work, but judging by the video the big vessels clearly should have gone into Ludicrous Speed mode!</sentencetext>
	<parent>http://www.semanticweb.org/ontologies/ConversationInstances.owl#comment10_01_05_0357226.30651912</parent>
</comment>
<comment>
	<id>http://www.semanticweb.org/ontologies/ConversationInstances.owl#comment10_01_05_0357226.30654560</id>
	<title>Tried EVE...</title>
	<author>Anonymous</author>
	<datestamp>1262705940000</datestamp>
	<modclass>None</modclass>
	<modscore>0</modscore>
	<htmltext><p>Call me a carebare, but I tried EVE in December and the culture's so aggressive that it's simply not fun.</p><p>I liked the idea that a ship loss is a ship loss and you have to build a new one -- the old one could've been insured, but not everything's insured and you'll still have a significant rebuild-it time. It adds a gravity to the situation that games like WoW (or even less an FPS) don't have. At first, it also seems attractive that their's a range of security from "secure" 1.0 space to lawless 0.0 space.</p><p>Problem is, the game's culture, encouraged by CCP, glorifies griefing and there is no safe space. You can be ganked in 1.0 space, whether for grins or profit, and there's absolutely nothing you can do about it and you still have that significant death penalty. In games like WoW, there are at least some safe havens on a PvP server, and if you die and get camped or otherwise griefed, in the worst case you can simply logout and come back later. (Or choose a PvE server and only PvP when you choose to.) In EVE, literally the only safe place is docked in a station.</p><p>Case in point: if you had a paid account in the last two weeks of the year, you could claim a cool solar-sailing, explorer vessel. Problem is, you're only guaranteed to be able to undock in it. A significant portion of the population decided to compete to kill them. Your location and your skill level does absolutely nothing to prevent this.</p><p>Guess I'm not their demographic, since I like fighting, but I also just want to login and run a few missions to decompress sometimes, without running the risk of having someone who lives in the game force themselves on me. Just a word to those who become interested in EVE while reading this thread: the game is intriguing with its many skills, ships, and the apparent number of ways you can play the game (trader, pirate, etc, etc) but the bottom line is that it's a PvP game with no safe haven at all and you cannot feel safe in any region or doing any activity that takes you outside of a station.</p></htmltext>
<tokenext>Call me a carebare , but I tried EVE in December and the culture 's so aggressive that it 's simply not fun.I liked the idea that a ship loss is a ship loss and you have to build a new one -- the old one could 've been insured , but not everything 's insured and you 'll still have a significant rebuild-it time .
It adds a gravity to the situation that games like WoW ( or even less an FPS ) do n't have .
At first , it also seems attractive that their 's a range of security from " secure " 1.0 space to lawless 0.0 space.Problem is , the game 's culture , encouraged by CCP , glorifies griefing and there is no safe space .
You can be ganked in 1.0 space , whether for grins or profit , and there 's absolutely nothing you can do about it and you still have that significant death penalty .
In games like WoW , there are at least some safe havens on a PvP server , and if you die and get camped or otherwise griefed , in the worst case you can simply logout and come back later .
( Or choose a PvE server and only PvP when you choose to .
) In EVE , literally the only safe place is docked in a station.Case in point : if you had a paid account in the last two weeks of the year , you could claim a cool solar-sailing , explorer vessel .
Problem is , you 're only guaranteed to be able to undock in it .
A significant portion of the population decided to compete to kill them .
Your location and your skill level does absolutely nothing to prevent this.Guess I 'm not their demographic , since I like fighting , but I also just want to login and run a few missions to decompress sometimes , without running the risk of having someone who lives in the game force themselves on me .
Just a word to those who become interested in EVE while reading this thread : the game is intriguing with its many skills , ships , and the apparent number of ways you can play the game ( trader , pirate , etc , etc ) but the bottom line is that it 's a PvP game with no safe haven at all and you can not feel safe in any region or doing any activity that takes you outside of a station .</tokentext>
<sentencetext>Call me a carebare, but I tried EVE in December and the culture's so aggressive that it's simply not fun.I liked the idea that a ship loss is a ship loss and you have to build a new one -- the old one could've been insured, but not everything's insured and you'll still have a significant rebuild-it time.
It adds a gravity to the situation that games like WoW (or even less an FPS) don't have.
At first, it also seems attractive that their's a range of security from "secure" 1.0 space to lawless 0.0 space.Problem is, the game's culture, encouraged by CCP, glorifies griefing and there is no safe space.
You can be ganked in 1.0 space, whether for grins or profit, and there's absolutely nothing you can do about it and you still have that significant death penalty.
In games like WoW, there are at least some safe havens on a PvP server, and if you die and get camped or otherwise griefed, in the worst case you can simply logout and come back later.
(Or choose a PvE server and only PvP when you choose to.
) In EVE, literally the only safe place is docked in a station.Case in point: if you had a paid account in the last two weeks of the year, you could claim a cool solar-sailing, explorer vessel.
Problem is, you're only guaranteed to be able to undock in it.
A significant portion of the population decided to compete to kill them.
Your location and your skill level does absolutely nothing to prevent this.Guess I'm not their demographic, since I like fighting, but I also just want to login and run a few missions to decompress sometimes, without running the risk of having someone who lives in the game force themselves on me.
Just a word to those who become interested in EVE while reading this thread: the game is intriguing with its many skills, ships, and the apparent number of ways you can play the game (trader, pirate, etc, etc) but the bottom line is that it's a PvP game with no safe haven at all and you cannot feel safe in any region or doing any activity that takes you outside of a station.</sentencetext>
</comment>
<comment>
	<id>http://www.semanticweb.org/ontologies/ConversationInstances.owl#comment10_01_05_0357226.30653984</id>
	<title>Re:Here is video of the battle...</title>
	<author>Ephemeriis</author>
	<datestamp>1262702400000</datestamp>
	<modclass>None</modclass>
	<modscore>1</modscore>
	<htmltext><p><div class="quote"><p>That really looks terribly boring. After decades of big budget sci-fi movies, not to mention epic space battle video games like Homeworld, <i>this</i> is the best space combat system that EVE can offer? There didn't seem to be any maneuvering involved at all... might as well be a text based game.</p></div><p>You need to understand what you're looking at.</p><p>This is a massive fleet battle involving capital ships.  In order to fit everything on the screen the camera has been zoomed out quite a bit.  Any smaller ships are simply not going to be visible.</p><p>With smaller ships, speed matters.  You can move fast enough to make it hard for the enemy to hit you.  Smaller ships like frigates and cruisers will do this - but they wouldn't be visible in this movie.</p><p>The bigger ships can't get that kind of speed going.  They aren't going to dodge anyone's shots.  There isn't much point in them moving around a whole lot.</p><p>EVE also uses a combat system that's more similar to an RPG like EverQuest or WoW than a space flight sim like Wing Commander.  You don't use a flight stick...  You can't physically dodge a laser...  You click a button to fire at the enemy, and the game mechanics decide whether you hit or not.</p><p>Small-scale combat is a lot more interesting.  Gangs of frigates and destroyers do, indeed, maneuver around.  There'll be lots of motion as people try to control the distance between them and the enemy.  But that just does not happen with capital ships.</p></div>
	</htmltext>
<tokenext>That really looks terribly boring .
After decades of big budget sci-fi movies , not to mention epic space battle video games like Homeworld , this is the best space combat system that EVE can offer ?
There did n't seem to be any maneuvering involved at all... might as well be a text based game.You need to understand what you 're looking at.This is a massive fleet battle involving capital ships .
In order to fit everything on the screen the camera has been zoomed out quite a bit .
Any smaller ships are simply not going to be visible.With smaller ships , speed matters .
You can move fast enough to make it hard for the enemy to hit you .
Smaller ships like frigates and cruisers will do this - but they would n't be visible in this movie.The bigger ships ca n't get that kind of speed going .
They are n't going to dodge anyone 's shots .
There is n't much point in them moving around a whole lot.EVE also uses a combat system that 's more similar to an RPG like EverQuest or WoW than a space flight sim like Wing Commander .
You do n't use a flight stick... You ca n't physically dodge a laser... You click a button to fire at the enemy , and the game mechanics decide whether you hit or not.Small-scale combat is a lot more interesting .
Gangs of frigates and destroyers do , indeed , maneuver around .
There 'll be lots of motion as people try to control the distance between them and the enemy .
But that just does not happen with capital ships .</tokentext>
<sentencetext>That really looks terribly boring.
After decades of big budget sci-fi movies, not to mention epic space battle video games like Homeworld, this is the best space combat system that EVE can offer?
There didn't seem to be any maneuvering involved at all... might as well be a text based game.You need to understand what you're looking at.This is a massive fleet battle involving capital ships.
In order to fit everything on the screen the camera has been zoomed out quite a bit.
Any smaller ships are simply not going to be visible.With smaller ships, speed matters.
You can move fast enough to make it hard for the enemy to hit you.
Smaller ships like frigates and cruisers will do this - but they wouldn't be visible in this movie.The bigger ships can't get that kind of speed going.
They aren't going to dodge anyone's shots.
There isn't much point in them moving around a whole lot.EVE also uses a combat system that's more similar to an RPG like EverQuest or WoW than a space flight sim like Wing Commander.
You don't use a flight stick...  You can't physically dodge a laser...  You click a button to fire at the enemy, and the game mechanics decide whether you hit or not.Small-scale combat is a lot more interesting.
Gangs of frigates and destroyers do, indeed, maneuver around.
There'll be lots of motion as people try to control the distance between them and the enemy.
But that just does not happen with capital ships.
	</sentencetext>
	<parent>http://www.semanticweb.org/ontologies/ConversationInstances.owl#comment10_01_05_0357226.30652356</parent>
</comment>
<comment>
	<id>http://www.semanticweb.org/ontologies/ConversationInstances.owl#comment10_01_05_0357226.30652384</id>
	<title>Re:Here is video of the battle...</title>
	<author>seifried</author>
	<datestamp>1262682660000</datestamp>
	<modclass>Interestin</modclass>
	<modscore>2</modscore>
	<htmltext>I don't get it. Everyone just parks their ship and slugs it out? No maneuvering? Boring. Gratuitous Space Battles has way better game play.</htmltext>
<tokenext>I do n't get it .
Everyone just parks their ship and slugs it out ?
No maneuvering ?
Boring. Gratuitous Space Battles has way better game play .</tokentext>
<sentencetext>I don't get it.
Everyone just parks their ship and slugs it out?
No maneuvering?
Boring. Gratuitous Space Battles has way better game play.</sentencetext>
	<parent>http://www.semanticweb.org/ontologies/ConversationInstances.owl#comment10_01_05_0357226.30651912</parent>
</comment>
<comment>
	<id>http://www.semanticweb.org/ontologies/ConversationInstances.owl#comment10_01_05_0357226.30653320</id>
	<title>Re:I'm not sure about their policy...</title>
	<author>Anonymous</author>
	<datestamp>1262693880000</datestamp>
	<modclass>None</modclass>
	<modscore>0</modscore>
	<htmltext><p>so.... have ever you been to a casino, where you pay "real" money to get fiches, with whom you (hopely) win more of those fiches and then you resell whathever fiches you finish with to get back "real" money?<br>if somebody stole all your fiches, you wouldnt get angry becouse fiches are "fake" money, do you?<br>I dont really get the "its virtual money, it isnt worth anything" - if you can buy and sell the virtual money for a market value of real money, its as real as any other commodity.</p></htmltext>
<tokenext>so.... have ever you been to a casino , where you pay " real " money to get fiches , with whom you ( hopely ) win more of those fiches and then you resell whathever fiches you finish with to get back " real " money ? if somebody stole all your fiches , you wouldnt get angry becouse fiches are " fake " money , do you ? I dont really get the " its virtual money , it isnt worth anything " - if you can buy and sell the virtual money for a market value of real money , its as real as any other commodity .</tokentext>
<sentencetext>so.... have ever you been to a casino, where you pay "real" money to get fiches, with whom you (hopely) win more of those fiches and then you resell whathever fiches you finish with to get back "real" money?if somebody stole all your fiches, you wouldnt get angry becouse fiches are "fake" money, do you?I dont really get the "its virtual money, it isnt worth anything" - if you can buy and sell the virtual money for a market value of real money, its as real as any other commodity.</sentencetext>
	<parent>http://www.semanticweb.org/ontologies/ConversationInstances.owl#comment10_01_05_0357226.30651934</parent>
</comment>
<comment>
	<id>http://www.semanticweb.org/ontologies/ConversationInstances.owl#comment10_01_05_0357226.30652176</id>
	<title>Re:I'm not sure about their policy...</title>
	<author>Opportunist</author>
	<datestamp>1262723400000</datestamp>
	<modclass>None</modclass>
	<modscore>1</modscore>
	<htmltext><p>Well, especially in EvE, you might claim that indeed thousands of dollars were lost.</p><p>You see, it is possible in EvE through in-game means to sell game time card to other players for money. I.e. you buy a GTC for real money and can then sell that game time for in game money to other players. One could claim that it's not literally thousands of dollars but instead years of game time, but essentially, since it's a pay-to-play game, the effect is quite similar. Players could have used that money to buy game time instead. Or they might be forced to buy GTCs and sell them, since they're low on in-game money now (unlikely, considering who was involved, but still).</p></htmltext>
<tokenext>Well , especially in EvE , you might claim that indeed thousands of dollars were lost.You see , it is possible in EvE through in-game means to sell game time card to other players for money .
I.e. you buy a GTC for real money and can then sell that game time for in game money to other players .
One could claim that it 's not literally thousands of dollars but instead years of game time , but essentially , since it 's a pay-to-play game , the effect is quite similar .
Players could have used that money to buy game time instead .
Or they might be forced to buy GTCs and sell them , since they 're low on in-game money now ( unlikely , considering who was involved , but still ) .</tokentext>
<sentencetext>Well, especially in EvE, you might claim that indeed thousands of dollars were lost.You see, it is possible in EvE through in-game means to sell game time card to other players for money.
I.e. you buy a GTC for real money and can then sell that game time for in game money to other players.
One could claim that it's not literally thousands of dollars but instead years of game time, but essentially, since it's a pay-to-play game, the effect is quite similar.
Players could have used that money to buy game time instead.
Or they might be forced to buy GTCs and sell them, since they're low on in-game money now (unlikely, considering who was involved, but still).</sentencetext>
	<parent>http://www.semanticweb.org/ontologies/ConversationInstances.owl#comment10_01_05_0357226.30651934</parent>
</comment>
<comment>
	<id>http://www.semanticweb.org/ontologies/ConversationInstances.owl#comment10_01_05_0357226.30651974</id>
	<title>Re:EVE Online.</title>
	<author>DMUTPeregrine</author>
	<datestamp>1262634660000</datestamp>
	<modclass>Informativ</modclass>
	<modscore>4</modscore>
	<htmltext>1) It takes about a month to fly an interceptor. I'd far rather have a newbie in an interceptor than a battleship, they'll be worthless learning in the battleship. This is just plain wrong.
<br>
2) This has vastly improved with the creation of the internal affairs department. The problem with CCP is more incompetence (mostly on the part of the low-level GMs) than outright malice.<br>
3) The Reinforced node system helps, but is too limited. This is honestly the biggest issue with the game. The servers need to be able to support the player base.<br>
I play EVE because I enjoy small scale combat with meaningful risks. If I wanted to have epic battles with thousands of ships I'd probably be disappointed in it, but for 10-20 man roaming gangs it's very fun.</htmltext>
<tokenext>1 ) It takes about a month to fly an interceptor .
I 'd far rather have a newbie in an interceptor than a battleship , they 'll be worthless learning in the battleship .
This is just plain wrong .
2 ) This has vastly improved with the creation of the internal affairs department .
The problem with CCP is more incompetence ( mostly on the part of the low-level GMs ) than outright malice .
3 ) The Reinforced node system helps , but is too limited .
This is honestly the biggest issue with the game .
The servers need to be able to support the player base .
I play EVE because I enjoy small scale combat with meaningful risks .
If I wanted to have epic battles with thousands of ships I 'd probably be disappointed in it , but for 10-20 man roaming gangs it 's very fun .</tokentext>
<sentencetext>1) It takes about a month to fly an interceptor.
I'd far rather have a newbie in an interceptor than a battleship, they'll be worthless learning in the battleship.
This is just plain wrong.
2) This has vastly improved with the creation of the internal affairs department.
The problem with CCP is more incompetence (mostly on the part of the low-level GMs) than outright malice.
3) The Reinforced node system helps, but is too limited.
This is honestly the biggest issue with the game.
The servers need to be able to support the player base.
I play EVE because I enjoy small scale combat with meaningful risks.
If I wanted to have epic battles with thousands of ships I'd probably be disappointed in it, but for 10-20 man roaming gangs it's very fun.</sentencetext>
	<parent>http://www.semanticweb.org/ontologies/ConversationInstances.owl#comment10_01_05_0357226.30651868</parent>
</comment>
<comment>
	<id>http://www.semanticweb.org/ontologies/ConversationInstances.owl#comment10_01_05_0357226.30653600</id>
	<title>Re:Easy fix</title>
	<author>Anonymous</author>
	<datestamp>1262698140000</datestamp>
	<modclass>Funny</modclass>
	<modscore>3</modscore>
	<htmltext><p>Buy more servers, indeed!  I'm also told that nine women working together can have a baby in one month.</p></htmltext>
<tokenext>Buy more servers , indeed !
I 'm also told that nine women working together can have a baby in one month .</tokentext>
<sentencetext>Buy more servers, indeed!
I'm also told that nine women working together can have a baby in one month.</sentencetext>
	<parent>http://www.semanticweb.org/ontologies/ConversationInstances.owl#comment10_01_05_0357226.30651774</parent>
</comment>
<comment>
	<id>http://www.semanticweb.org/ontologies/ConversationInstances.owl#comment10_01_05_0357226.30653176</id>
	<title>Re:Kinda Cool</title>
	<author>Anonymous</author>
	<datestamp>1262692080000</datestamp>
	<modclass>None</modclass>
	<modscore>0</modscore>
	<htmltext><p><div class="quote"><p>but a game that lets you destroy THOUSANDS of dollars of stuff that other people value for the <strong>sheer malicious joy . . . well, that's perversely COOL!</strong></p> </div><p>And that's why I stopped playing....<br>EVE is a greifer's paradise.</p></div>
	</htmltext>
<tokenext>but a game that lets you destroy THOUSANDS of dollars of stuff that other people value for the sheer malicious joy .
. .
well , that 's perversely COOL !
And that 's why I stopped playing....EVE is a greifer 's paradise .</tokentext>
<sentencetext>but a game that lets you destroy THOUSANDS of dollars of stuff that other people value for the sheer malicious joy .
. .
well, that's perversely COOL!
And that's why I stopped playing....EVE is a greifer's paradise.
	</sentencetext>
	<parent>http://www.semanticweb.org/ontologies/ConversationInstances.owl#comment10_01_05_0357226.30651784</parent>
</comment>
<comment>
	<id>http://www.semanticweb.org/ontologies/ConversationInstances.owl#comment10_01_05_0357226.30652678</id>
	<title>Re:Here is video of the battle...</title>
	<author>Anonymous</author>
	<datestamp>1262685780000</datestamp>
	<modclass>None</modclass>
	<modscore>0</modscore>
	<htmltext><p>That's because you don't see any interceptors or for that matter any other small craft flying around. That might be a matter of scale or maybe their display is turned of to prevent the death of the graphics card. What you SEE is a big lump of imperial star destroyer sized ships and some death star sized ships which shouldnt move fast.</p><p>You might want to look at other videos if you want to see the small vessel action.</p></htmltext>
<tokenext>That 's because you do n't see any interceptors or for that matter any other small craft flying around .
That might be a matter of scale or maybe their display is turned of to prevent the death of the graphics card .
What you SEE is a big lump of imperial star destroyer sized ships and some death star sized ships which shouldnt move fast.You might want to look at other videos if you want to see the small vessel action .</tokentext>
<sentencetext>That's because you don't see any interceptors or for that matter any other small craft flying around.
That might be a matter of scale or maybe their display is turned of to prevent the death of the graphics card.
What you SEE is a big lump of imperial star destroyer sized ships and some death star sized ships which shouldnt move fast.You might want to look at other videos if you want to see the small vessel action.</sentencetext>
	<parent>http://www.semanticweb.org/ontologies/ConversationInstances.owl#comment10_01_05_0357226.30652384</parent>
</comment>
<comment>
	<id>http://www.semanticweb.org/ontologies/ConversationInstances.owl#comment10_01_05_0357226.30652092</id>
	<title>Re:I'm not sure about their policy...</title>
	<author>Jerrei</author>
	<datestamp>1262722320000</datestamp>
	<modclass>None</modclass>
	<modscore>1</modscore>
	<htmltext>Game time can be purchased with in-game currency.

One month of gametime goes for about 250mil ISK. 4 of the ships lost go for over 100bil. The "smaller" ships for anywhere from 1 to 2bil. &gt;600 ships lost.

Do the math.</htmltext>
<tokenext>Game time can be purchased with in-game currency .
One month of gametime goes for about 250mil ISK .
4 of the ships lost go for over 100bil .
The " smaller " ships for anywhere from 1 to 2bil .
&gt; 600 ships lost .
Do the math .</tokentext>
<sentencetext>Game time can be purchased with in-game currency.
One month of gametime goes for about 250mil ISK.
4 of the ships lost go for over 100bil.
The "smaller" ships for anywhere from 1 to 2bil.
&gt;600 ships lost.
Do the math.</sentencetext>
	<parent>http://www.semanticweb.org/ontologies/ConversationInstances.owl#comment10_01_05_0357226.30651934</parent>
</comment>
<comment>
	<id>http://www.semanticweb.org/ontologies/ConversationInstances.owl#comment10_01_05_0357226.30653204</id>
	<title>Re:Why Am I Not Surprised</title>
	<author>Anonymous</author>
	<datestamp>1262692560000</datestamp>
	<modclass>None</modclass>
	<modscore>1</modscore>
	<htmltext>No, it wasn't more than a WoW shard.  It is also a much simpler game.  And they continue to not be able to handle large scale battles when advertising the opposite.<br> <br>While the above is fact, my opinion is it is an extremely boring game except for the people who can dedicate a lot of time to it.  It is quite tedious to play as someone who only plays like 8 hours a week.  I have tried to get in to it a few times and just die of boredom after a week or two.</htmltext>
<tokenext>No , it was n't more than a WoW shard .
It is also a much simpler game .
And they continue to not be able to handle large scale battles when advertising the opposite .
While the above is fact , my opinion is it is an extremely boring game except for the people who can dedicate a lot of time to it .
It is quite tedious to play as someone who only plays like 8 hours a week .
I have tried to get in to it a few times and just die of boredom after a week or two .</tokentext>
<sentencetext>No, it wasn't more than a WoW shard.
It is also a much simpler game.
And they continue to not be able to handle large scale battles when advertising the opposite.
While the above is fact, my opinion is it is an extremely boring game except for the people who can dedicate a lot of time to it.
It is quite tedious to play as someone who only plays like 8 hours a week.
I have tried to get in to it a few times and just die of boredom after a week or two.</sentencetext>
	<parent>http://www.semanticweb.org/ontologies/ConversationInstances.owl#comment10_01_05_0357226.30652126</parent>
</comment>
<comment>
	<id>http://www.semanticweb.org/ontologies/ConversationInstances.owl#comment10_01_05_0357226.30654524</id>
	<title>Re:Kinda Cool</title>
	<author>rgviza</author>
	<datestamp>1262705700000</datestamp>
	<modclass>None</modclass>
	<modscore>1</modscore>
	<htmltext><p>haha you'd love eve then</p></htmltext>
<tokenext>haha you 'd love eve then</tokentext>
<sentencetext>haha you'd love eve then</sentencetext>
	<parent>http://www.semanticweb.org/ontologies/ConversationInstances.owl#comment10_01_05_0357226.30651784</parent>
</comment>
<comment>
	<id>http://www.semanticweb.org/ontologies/ConversationInstances.owl#comment10_01_05_0357226.30665752</id>
	<title>Re:Why Am I Not Surprised</title>
	<author>Weezul</author>
	<datestamp>1262714400000</datestamp>
	<modclass>None</modclass>
	<modscore>1</modscore>
	<htmltext><p>A simple random culling algorithm would be extremely close to fair the vast majority of the time.. no reason to favor players already in the system.</p><p>If you must favor players in the system, the only sane method is placing ships into the system only once the system can handle them.  So, if two many ships jump into a system, then additional ships jumping into the system either end up elsewhere or else their jump simply fails.</p><p>It's just downright lazy &amp; stupid to place ships into the system without granting their pilots control.</p></htmltext>
<tokenext>A simple random culling algorithm would be extremely close to fair the vast majority of the time.. no reason to favor players already in the system.If you must favor players in the system , the only sane method is placing ships into the system only once the system can handle them .
So , if two many ships jump into a system , then additional ships jumping into the system either end up elsewhere or else their jump simply fails.It 's just downright lazy &amp; stupid to place ships into the system without granting their pilots control .</tokentext>
<sentencetext>A simple random culling algorithm would be extremely close to fair the vast majority of the time.. no reason to favor players already in the system.If you must favor players in the system, the only sane method is placing ships into the system only once the system can handle them.
So, if two many ships jump into a system, then additional ships jumping into the system either end up elsewhere or else their jump simply fails.It's just downright lazy &amp; stupid to place ships into the system without granting their pilots control.</sentencetext>
	<parent>http://www.semanticweb.org/ontologies/ConversationInstances.owl#comment10_01_05_0357226.30654808</parent>
</comment>
<comment>
	<id>http://www.semanticweb.org/ontologies/ConversationInstances.owl#comment10_01_05_0357226.30653858</id>
	<title>No you can't</title>
	<author>SmallFurryCreature</author>
	<datestamp>1262701140000</datestamp>
	<modclass>Insightful</modclass>
	<modscore>2</modscore>
	<htmltext><p>The problem ain't like a webserver where you can seperate users, this about a LOT of users needing to interact with each other as they are in the same battle in the same area. You then run into the problem that for every person added you need 1+N more data being handled.
</p><p>Imagine a battle between a B17 bomber and a single fighter aircraft. The game needs to handle direction changes by both players AND their firing action BUT while the B17 can generate a LOT of fire data (10 or so guns) it won't actually be doing that since many of its guns will not be able to shoot at anything.
</p><p>But now add 1 more enemy fighter. Suddenly the B17 can often have two of its guns being able to see an enemy and fire at it. 1 more player added means not just that players flight and fire data but also additional data being generated by the original B17 player.
</p><p>And you now got extra as well with the fighters wanting to know each others status.
</p><p>That is why multiplayer games scale so badly and you can't just say, "oh my connection is 10x faster, now I can host 10 times the number of players. If that was true, we should be seeing home hosted 256 players game servers. We aren't.
</p><p>Personally I think that for the next move in massive player worlds (lots of people in the same area rather then just a massive world made up of different zones) you need to talk to IBM about mainframes and "super" computers. And that would involve more serious money then a small MMO company has available.
</p><p>MASSIVEmo's can't just be created by adding more servers, they have the difficult problem of needing a lot of CPU power to be applied to the SAME data, exactly what current super computers do NOT want to do. Parallel programming won't save your ass here. Neither will splitting up the load.</p></htmltext>
<tokenext>The problem ai n't like a webserver where you can seperate users , this about a LOT of users needing to interact with each other as they are in the same battle in the same area .
You then run into the problem that for every person added you need 1 + N more data being handled .
Imagine a battle between a B17 bomber and a single fighter aircraft .
The game needs to handle direction changes by both players AND their firing action BUT while the B17 can generate a LOT of fire data ( 10 or so guns ) it wo n't actually be doing that since many of its guns will not be able to shoot at anything .
But now add 1 more enemy fighter .
Suddenly the B17 can often have two of its guns being able to see an enemy and fire at it .
1 more player added means not just that players flight and fire data but also additional data being generated by the original B17 player .
And you now got extra as well with the fighters wanting to know each others status .
That is why multiplayer games scale so badly and you ca n't just say , " oh my connection is 10x faster , now I can host 10 times the number of players .
If that was true , we should be seeing home hosted 256 players game servers .
We are n't .
Personally I think that for the next move in massive player worlds ( lots of people in the same area rather then just a massive world made up of different zones ) you need to talk to IBM about mainframes and " super " computers .
And that would involve more serious money then a small MMO company has available .
MASSIVEmo 's ca n't just be created by adding more servers , they have the difficult problem of needing a lot of CPU power to be applied to the SAME data , exactly what current super computers do NOT want to do .
Parallel programming wo n't save your ass here .
Neither will splitting up the load .</tokentext>
<sentencetext>The problem ain't like a webserver where you can seperate users, this about a LOT of users needing to interact with each other as they are in the same battle in the same area.
You then run into the problem that for every person added you need 1+N more data being handled.
Imagine a battle between a B17 bomber and a single fighter aircraft.
The game needs to handle direction changes by both players AND their firing action BUT while the B17 can generate a LOT of fire data (10 or so guns) it won't actually be doing that since many of its guns will not be able to shoot at anything.
But now add 1 more enemy fighter.
Suddenly the B17 can often have two of its guns being able to see an enemy and fire at it.
1 more player added means not just that players flight and fire data but also additional data being generated by the original B17 player.
And you now got extra as well with the fighters wanting to know each others status.
That is why multiplayer games scale so badly and you can't just say, "oh my connection is 10x faster, now I can host 10 times the number of players.
If that was true, we should be seeing home hosted 256 players game servers.
We aren't.
Personally I think that for the next move in massive player worlds (lots of people in the same area rather then just a massive world made up of different zones) you need to talk to IBM about mainframes and "super" computers.
And that would involve more serious money then a small MMO company has available.
MASSIVEmo's can't just be created by adding more servers, they have the difficult problem of needing a lot of CPU power to be applied to the SAME data, exactly what current super computers do NOT want to do.
Parallel programming won't save your ass here.
Neither will splitting up the load.</sentencetext>
	<parent>http://www.semanticweb.org/ontologies/ConversationInstances.owl#comment10_01_05_0357226.30651774</parent>
</comment>
<comment>
	<id>http://www.semanticweb.org/ontologies/ConversationInstances.owl#comment10_01_05_0357226.30654794</id>
	<title>Re:Here is video of the battle...</title>
	<author>crossmr</author>
	<datestamp>1262706900000</datestamp>
	<modclass>None</modclass>
	<modscore>1</modscore>
	<htmltext><p>all set to some unnecessary and crappy music by someone who thinks they're a hot shot music video producer.</p></htmltext>
<tokenext>all set to some unnecessary and crappy music by someone who thinks they 're a hot shot music video producer .</tokentext>
<sentencetext>all set to some unnecessary and crappy music by someone who thinks they're a hot shot music video producer.</sentencetext>
	<parent>http://www.semanticweb.org/ontologies/ConversationInstances.owl#comment10_01_05_0357226.30651912</parent>
</comment>
<comment>
	<id>http://www.semanticweb.org/ontologies/ConversationInstances.owl#comment10_01_05_0357226.30655138</id>
	<title>Re:Offline alternatives ?</title>
	<author>Ephemeriis</author>
	<datestamp>1262708520000</datestamp>
	<modclass>None</modclass>
	<modscore>1</modscore>
	<htmltext><p><div class="quote"><p>Gamers with a tighter schedule (work, studies, family etc) or a lagging connection to online servers should really consider an offline alternative that goes with their own pace and allows <b>time speed adjustment</b>. Without time speed adjustment (which is by definition incompatible to large online games) space games can be extremely time consuming.</p><p>X3 Reunion + Xtended mod (I didn't like TC very much) is a good alternative but I'd be willing to know more.</p></div><p>One of the things that new players in EVE always complain about is how much of a timesink EVE is.  They complain that it takes literally weeks to train a single skill.  They lament who unfriendly EVE is to players who have real-life obligations.</p><p>Frankly, I think that's just plain wrong.</p><p>Most games require you to be sitting in front of them, playing, in order to advance.  WoW, for example, requires you to be logged in and killing monsters in order to gain XP and earn levels.</p><p>EVE, on the other hand, trains in real time.  If a skill indicates it will take a week to train, that's a week of real time.  Not in-game time.  So while I'm asleep, it's training.  While I'm at work, it's training.  While I'm mowing the lawn, or going out to dinner with my wife, or spending time with the kids - it's training.</p><p>And when I finally do have time in the evening to play EVE, I don't need to go kill monsters to get XP.  I can go mining instead, or run missions, or do some shopping, or PvP, or sit back and chat with people, or whatever...  And I'm still training my skills.</p><p>EVE, more than any other game out there, lets me play the game according to my schedule and my desires.  It never forces me to perform any specific in-game activities in order to progress...  Nor does it require any specific number of hours of gameplay to progress.</p><p>I play EVE specifically because it is so friendly to my casual play schedule.</p></div>
	</htmltext>
<tokenext>Gamers with a tighter schedule ( work , studies , family etc ) or a lagging connection to online servers should really consider an offline alternative that goes with their own pace and allows time speed adjustment .
Without time speed adjustment ( which is by definition incompatible to large online games ) space games can be extremely time consuming.X3 Reunion + Xtended mod ( I did n't like TC very much ) is a good alternative but I 'd be willing to know more.One of the things that new players in EVE always complain about is how much of a timesink EVE is .
They complain that it takes literally weeks to train a single skill .
They lament who unfriendly EVE is to players who have real-life obligations.Frankly , I think that 's just plain wrong.Most games require you to be sitting in front of them , playing , in order to advance .
WoW , for example , requires you to be logged in and killing monsters in order to gain XP and earn levels.EVE , on the other hand , trains in real time .
If a skill indicates it will take a week to train , that 's a week of real time .
Not in-game time .
So while I 'm asleep , it 's training .
While I 'm at work , it 's training .
While I 'm mowing the lawn , or going out to dinner with my wife , or spending time with the kids - it 's training.And when I finally do have time in the evening to play EVE , I do n't need to go kill monsters to get XP .
I can go mining instead , or run missions , or do some shopping , or PvP , or sit back and chat with people , or whatever... And I 'm still training my skills.EVE , more than any other game out there , lets me play the game according to my schedule and my desires .
It never forces me to perform any specific in-game activities in order to progress... Nor does it require any specific number of hours of gameplay to progress.I play EVE specifically because it is so friendly to my casual play schedule .</tokentext>
<sentencetext>Gamers with a tighter schedule (work, studies, family etc) or a lagging connection to online servers should really consider an offline alternative that goes with their own pace and allows time speed adjustment.
Without time speed adjustment (which is by definition incompatible to large online games) space games can be extremely time consuming.X3 Reunion + Xtended mod (I didn't like TC very much) is a good alternative but I'd be willing to know more.One of the things that new players in EVE always complain about is how much of a timesink EVE is.
They complain that it takes literally weeks to train a single skill.
They lament who unfriendly EVE is to players who have real-life obligations.Frankly, I think that's just plain wrong.Most games require you to be sitting in front of them, playing, in order to advance.
WoW, for example, requires you to be logged in and killing monsters in order to gain XP and earn levels.EVE, on the other hand, trains in real time.
If a skill indicates it will take a week to train, that's a week of real time.
Not in-game time.
So while I'm asleep, it's training.
While I'm at work, it's training.
While I'm mowing the lawn, or going out to dinner with my wife, or spending time with the kids - it's training.And when I finally do have time in the evening to play EVE, I don't need to go kill monsters to get XP.
I can go mining instead, or run missions, or do some shopping, or PvP, or sit back and chat with people, or whatever...  And I'm still training my skills.EVE, more than any other game out there, lets me play the game according to my schedule and my desires.
It never forces me to perform any specific in-game activities in order to progress...  Nor does it require any specific number of hours of gameplay to progress.I play EVE specifically because it is so friendly to my casual play schedule.
	</sentencetext>
	<parent>http://www.semanticweb.org/ontologies/ConversationInstances.owl#comment10_01_05_0357226.30652174</parent>
</comment>
<comment>
	<id>http://www.semanticweb.org/ontologies/ConversationInstances.owl#comment10_01_05_0357226.30652082</id>
	<title>Re:It was their own fault</title>
	<author>piggydoggy</author>
	<datestamp>1262722140000</datestamp>
	<modclass>Informativ</modclass>
	<modscore>2</modscore>
	<htmltext>Sadly the node couldn't be reinforced in time, as CCP's policy requires it to be done during the daily downtime. Yet thanks to a screwup by the original owners of the system, the attackers (in this battle) had only 12 hours to make their move and attack the system - not enough to wait for the next downtime and node reinforcement.</htmltext>
<tokenext>Sadly the node could n't be reinforced in time , as CCP 's policy requires it to be done during the daily downtime .
Yet thanks to a screwup by the original owners of the system , the attackers ( in this battle ) had only 12 hours to make their move and attack the system - not enough to wait for the next downtime and node reinforcement .</tokentext>
<sentencetext>Sadly the node couldn't be reinforced in time, as CCP's policy requires it to be done during the daily downtime.
Yet thanks to a screwup by the original owners of the system, the attackers (in this battle) had only 12 hours to make their move and attack the system - not enough to wait for the next downtime and node reinforcement.</sentencetext>
	<parent>http://www.semanticweb.org/ontologies/ConversationInstances.owl#comment10_01_05_0357226.30651812</parent>
</comment>
<comment>
	<id>http://www.semanticweb.org/ontologies/ConversationInstances.owl#comment10_01_05_0357226.30659802</id>
	<title>Re:Why Am I Not Surprised</title>
	<author>zerocool^</author>
	<datestamp>1262683200000</datestamp>
	<modclass>Interestin</modclass>
	<modscore>3</modscore>
	<htmltext><p>CCP's favoritism of BoB is something that gets trotted out every time they accomplish anything.  It's years in the past.</p><p>In this engagement, BoB (IT) won.  The people who jumped in were dumb.  They knew this might happen.</p><p>In a previous engagement (check the corporation alliance and org forum for post by SK Rooster), BoB/IT jumped in to someone else and lost 40 dreadnoughts.  Favoritism?  Not so much.  Whenever BoB loses, it's cause they suck, whenever they win, it's because they are getting help from the Developers and GM's.  Right?</p></htmltext>
<tokenext>CCP 's favoritism of BoB is something that gets trotted out every time they accomplish anything .
It 's years in the past.In this engagement , BoB ( IT ) won .
The people who jumped in were dumb .
They knew this might happen.In a previous engagement ( check the corporation alliance and org forum for post by SK Rooster ) , BoB/IT jumped in to someone else and lost 40 dreadnoughts .
Favoritism ? Not so much .
Whenever BoB loses , it 's cause they suck , whenever they win , it 's because they are getting help from the Developers and GM 's .
Right ?</tokentext>
<sentencetext>CCP's favoritism of BoB is something that gets trotted out every time they accomplish anything.
It's years in the past.In this engagement, BoB (IT) won.
The people who jumped in were dumb.
They knew this might happen.In a previous engagement (check the corporation alliance and org forum for post by SK Rooster), BoB/IT jumped in to someone else and lost 40 dreadnoughts.
Favoritism?  Not so much.
Whenever BoB loses, it's cause they suck, whenever they win, it's because they are getting help from the Developers and GM's.
Right?</sentencetext>
	<parent>http://www.semanticweb.org/ontologies/ConversationInstances.owl#comment10_01_05_0357226.30653896</parent>
</comment>
<comment>
	<id>http://www.semanticweb.org/ontologies/ConversationInstances.owl#comment10_01_05_0357226.30652126</id>
	<title>Re:Why Am I Not Surprised</title>
	<author>cbhacking</author>
	<datestamp>1262722800000</datestamp>
	<modclass>Informativ</modclass>
	<modscore>4</modscore>
	<htmltext><p>Only in EVE would you try and have thousands of players meet in a single location to fight.</p><p>From the sound of it, the number of people who were in that particular star system (or trying to get in) exceeds the number of players on many WOW instances. Yet, all in all, that was probably at most a few percent of the players online at the time, and they're all connected to the same game world.</p><p>That said, a single star system on EVE is hosted by a single physical server. Less-used systems can be grouped together to save on hardware, but for a big fight like this CCP fires up their most powerful hardware and puts the relevant system(s) on dedicated servers. While they're getting good at this - a few years ago 200 ships was a big fight, these days it's a common occurrence - it's still going to be an awful strain on the server to support that many players in combat. In a situation like that, the players need to take the limitations of computer hardware into account, and plan accordingly.</p></htmltext>
<tokenext>Only in EVE would you try and have thousands of players meet in a single location to fight.From the sound of it , the number of people who were in that particular star system ( or trying to get in ) exceeds the number of players on many WOW instances .
Yet , all in all , that was probably at most a few percent of the players online at the time , and they 're all connected to the same game world.That said , a single star system on EVE is hosted by a single physical server .
Less-used systems can be grouped together to save on hardware , but for a big fight like this CCP fires up their most powerful hardware and puts the relevant system ( s ) on dedicated servers .
While they 're getting good at this - a few years ago 200 ships was a big fight , these days it 's a common occurrence - it 's still going to be an awful strain on the server to support that many players in combat .
In a situation like that , the players need to take the limitations of computer hardware into account , and plan accordingly .</tokentext>
<sentencetext>Only in EVE would you try and have thousands of players meet in a single location to fight.From the sound of it, the number of people who were in that particular star system (or trying to get in) exceeds the number of players on many WOW instances.
Yet, all in all, that was probably at most a few percent of the players online at the time, and they're all connected to the same game world.That said, a single star system on EVE is hosted by a single physical server.
Less-used systems can be grouped together to save on hardware, but for a big fight like this CCP fires up their most powerful hardware and puts the relevant system(s) on dedicated servers.
While they're getting good at this - a few years ago 200 ships was a big fight, these days it's a common occurrence - it's still going to be an awful strain on the server to support that many players in combat.
In a situation like that, the players need to take the limitations of computer hardware into account, and plan accordingly.</sentencetext>
	<parent>http://www.semanticweb.org/ontologies/ConversationInstances.owl#comment10_01_05_0357226.30651788</parent>
</comment>
<comment>
	<id>http://www.semanticweb.org/ontologies/ConversationInstances.owl#comment10_01_05_0357226.30651944</id>
	<title>well... if you think about it</title>
	<author>Anonymous</author>
	<datestamp>1262634360000</datestamp>
	<modclass>Offtopic</modclass>
	<modscore>-1</modscore>
	<htmltext><p>Sarki was a huge mountain gorilla, and usually not very amicable. But he had seemed to take to Kate immediately, usually hanging over her shoulder or something whenever she was in his cage. Today was no exception, as she climbed up toward the ceiling to get at the lights. There was a large platform near the ceiling and she climbed up to that in order to inspect the lights better.</p><p>Sarki pulled his bulk right up next to her, but there was plenty of room up there. She stood up and craned her neck, trying to look straight up while keeping her balance. Suddenly, she felt a large hand on her ass, slowly stroking it, She turned around quickly, and found Sarki staring at her as his hand caressed her. She stood frozen, afraid that he might push her off the ledge or something. But what he actually did was bring his other hand up and began to feel her breasts through her t-shirt.</p><p>Standing very still, Kate slowly reached out, to push Sarki's hand away from her breast, she gripped his thumb, and twisted his hand back away from her. The animal became mad at this action, and shoved Kate roughly back, she fell over trying to stop her forward motion, not wanting to fall over the edge of the platform. Kate landed hard, on her stomach, and had the wind knocked out of her. She lay there for a moment struggling for breath, then to her shock she felt her shorts being ripped from her body. Sarki just tore the material apart like it was paper. Kate was frozen with fear by the beast's exhibition of shear strength. She wanted nothing more than to get out of this situation as fast as she could.</p><p>Kate knew that her life was in danger, she couldn't understand why Sarki was acting so aggressively toward her, but she knew that she was all alone at the zoo, and that she had better do something quickly. As Kate began to recover from the forceful push that she had received from the gorilla, she started to get up on hands and knees with the intention of climbing down as fast as she could. But this was not what happened.</p><p>With shocking roughness the beast took one of his fingers stabbed Kate from behind, right into her now exposed hole. His finger, though not as long as a man's penis, was just as wide and she began to squirm on it. His other hand fell from her breasts and curled around her ass, pulling her closer. He brought his face close to her and stared at her with great interest. His hand was working her over, the beast was becoming aroused by Kate's body.</p><p>She screamed, flailing at the apes chest, as she twisted and turned trying to escape from his grasp. But no matter what she did, she couldn't break his grip on her. He kept up his fingering of her pussy and she kept up her struggles to get away.</p><p>The ape finally grew tired of fighting with the human female, and smacked her across the face knocking Kate<br>into shocked submission. She was stunned and had temporarily lost her wits. The huge ape was totally aroused by now, and he flipped Kate back over on her stomach, and moved downward, further, until his now erect huge cock was staring right at her.</p><p>All thoughts of anything else quickly flew away with the sight of it, and she immediately knew what was going to happen to her, she couldn't believe it, she had never even thought that something like this could happen. But the great ape just started poking her face with his huge erect cock, trying to enter her mouth, finally after several attempts, and another smack to the head he shoved the tip of his cock between her lips and made Kate take it in her mouth, taking great pleasure from this, he began to force it in farther in obvious excitement.</p><p>His cock grew to an un-believable size that she could barely keep in her mouth. She could taste the few drops of his sexual fluids that were seeping out of his now rock hard cock.</p><p>After forcing her face against his crotch for a few minutes he pulled away, then pushed Kate down flat on the platform and spread her legs. With his finger he stabbed again into her pussy, which had become wet from the fear she felt,</p></htmltext>
<tokenext>Sarki was a huge mountain gorilla , and usually not very amicable .
But he had seemed to take to Kate immediately , usually hanging over her shoulder or something whenever she was in his cage .
Today was no exception , as she climbed up toward the ceiling to get at the lights .
There was a large platform near the ceiling and she climbed up to that in order to inspect the lights better.Sarki pulled his bulk right up next to her , but there was plenty of room up there .
She stood up and craned her neck , trying to look straight up while keeping her balance .
Suddenly , she felt a large hand on her ass , slowly stroking it , She turned around quickly , and found Sarki staring at her as his hand caressed her .
She stood frozen , afraid that he might push her off the ledge or something .
But what he actually did was bring his other hand up and began to feel her breasts through her t-shirt.Standing very still , Kate slowly reached out , to push Sarki 's hand away from her breast , she gripped his thumb , and twisted his hand back away from her .
The animal became mad at this action , and shoved Kate roughly back , she fell over trying to stop her forward motion , not wanting to fall over the edge of the platform .
Kate landed hard , on her stomach , and had the wind knocked out of her .
She lay there for a moment struggling for breath , then to her shock she felt her shorts being ripped from her body .
Sarki just tore the material apart like it was paper .
Kate was frozen with fear by the beast 's exhibition of shear strength .
She wanted nothing more than to get out of this situation as fast as she could.Kate knew that her life was in danger , she could n't understand why Sarki was acting so aggressively toward her , but she knew that she was all alone at the zoo , and that she had better do something quickly .
As Kate began to recover from the forceful push that she had received from the gorilla , she started to get up on hands and knees with the intention of climbing down as fast as she could .
But this was not what happened.With shocking roughness the beast took one of his fingers stabbed Kate from behind , right into her now exposed hole .
His finger , though not as long as a man 's penis , was just as wide and she began to squirm on it .
His other hand fell from her breasts and curled around her ass , pulling her closer .
He brought his face close to her and stared at her with great interest .
His hand was working her over , the beast was becoming aroused by Kate 's body.She screamed , flailing at the apes chest , as she twisted and turned trying to escape from his grasp .
But no matter what she did , she could n't break his grip on her .
He kept up his fingering of her pussy and she kept up her struggles to get away.The ape finally grew tired of fighting with the human female , and smacked her across the face knocking Kateinto shocked submission .
She was stunned and had temporarily lost her wits .
The huge ape was totally aroused by now , and he flipped Kate back over on her stomach , and moved downward , further , until his now erect huge cock was staring right at her.All thoughts of anything else quickly flew away with the sight of it , and she immediately knew what was going to happen to her , she could n't believe it , she had never even thought that something like this could happen .
But the great ape just started poking her face with his huge erect cock , trying to enter her mouth , finally after several attempts , and another smack to the head he shoved the tip of his cock between her lips and made Kate take it in her mouth , taking great pleasure from this , he began to force it in farther in obvious excitement.His cock grew to an un-believable size that she could barely keep in her mouth .
She could taste the few drops of his sexual fluids that were seeping out of his now rock hard cock.After forcing her face against his crotch for a few minutes he pulled away , then pushed Kate down flat on the platform and spread her legs .
With his finger he stabbed again into her pussy , which had become wet from the fear she felt,</tokentext>
<sentencetext>Sarki was a huge mountain gorilla, and usually not very amicable.
But he had seemed to take to Kate immediately, usually hanging over her shoulder or something whenever she was in his cage.
Today was no exception, as she climbed up toward the ceiling to get at the lights.
There was a large platform near the ceiling and she climbed up to that in order to inspect the lights better.Sarki pulled his bulk right up next to her, but there was plenty of room up there.
She stood up and craned her neck, trying to look straight up while keeping her balance.
Suddenly, she felt a large hand on her ass, slowly stroking it, She turned around quickly, and found Sarki staring at her as his hand caressed her.
She stood frozen, afraid that he might push her off the ledge or something.
But what he actually did was bring his other hand up and began to feel her breasts through her t-shirt.Standing very still, Kate slowly reached out, to push Sarki's hand away from her breast, she gripped his thumb, and twisted his hand back away from her.
The animal became mad at this action, and shoved Kate roughly back, she fell over trying to stop her forward motion, not wanting to fall over the edge of the platform.
Kate landed hard, on her stomach, and had the wind knocked out of her.
She lay there for a moment struggling for breath, then to her shock she felt her shorts being ripped from her body.
Sarki just tore the material apart like it was paper.
Kate was frozen with fear by the beast's exhibition of shear strength.
She wanted nothing more than to get out of this situation as fast as she could.Kate knew that her life was in danger, she couldn't understand why Sarki was acting so aggressively toward her, but she knew that she was all alone at the zoo, and that she had better do something quickly.
As Kate began to recover from the forceful push that she had received from the gorilla, she started to get up on hands and knees with the intention of climbing down as fast as she could.
But this was not what happened.With shocking roughness the beast took one of his fingers stabbed Kate from behind, right into her now exposed hole.
His finger, though not as long as a man's penis, was just as wide and she began to squirm on it.
His other hand fell from her breasts and curled around her ass, pulling her closer.
He brought his face close to her and stared at her with great interest.
His hand was working her over, the beast was becoming aroused by Kate's body.She screamed, flailing at the apes chest, as she twisted and turned trying to escape from his grasp.
But no matter what she did, she couldn't break his grip on her.
He kept up his fingering of her pussy and she kept up her struggles to get away.The ape finally grew tired of fighting with the human female, and smacked her across the face knocking Kateinto shocked submission.
She was stunned and had temporarily lost her wits.
The huge ape was totally aroused by now, and he flipped Kate back over on her stomach, and moved downward, further, until his now erect huge cock was staring right at her.All thoughts of anything else quickly flew away with the sight of it, and she immediately knew what was going to happen to her, she couldn't believe it, she had never even thought that something like this could happen.
But the great ape just started poking her face with his huge erect cock, trying to enter her mouth, finally after several attempts, and another smack to the head he shoved the tip of his cock between her lips and made Kate take it in her mouth, taking great pleasure from this, he began to force it in farther in obvious excitement.His cock grew to an un-believable size that she could barely keep in her mouth.
She could taste the few drops of his sexual fluids that were seeping out of his now rock hard cock.After forcing her face against his crotch for a few minutes he pulled away, then pushed Kate down flat on the platform and spread her legs.
With his finger he stabbed again into her pussy, which had become wet from the fear she felt,</sentencetext>
</comment>
<comment>
	<id>http://www.semanticweb.org/ontologies/ConversationInstances.owl#comment10_01_05_0357226.30654596</id>
	<title>Re:Here is video of the battle...</title>
	<author>Anonymous</author>
	<datestamp>1262706060000</datestamp>
	<modclass>None</modclass>
	<modscore>0</modscore>
	<htmltext><p>EVE is not a space combat flight simulator (which in itself is kinda dumb, to be honest... the flight and combat would have to all be computerized given the speeds at which things would happen). EVE takes that approach, you give general commands to your ship and it (the 'computer') does them for you... go over there, fire weapons at that target, etc. But EVE also does other things that break it from being a flight simulator as well, like ships moving at slow speeds... even at slow acceleration, you could eventually get a Titan to fly at near light speeds, if it were a simulator.</p></htmltext>
<tokenext>EVE is not a space combat flight simulator ( which in itself is kinda dumb , to be honest... the flight and combat would have to all be computerized given the speeds at which things would happen ) .
EVE takes that approach , you give general commands to your ship and it ( the 'computer ' ) does them for you... go over there , fire weapons at that target , etc .
But EVE also does other things that break it from being a flight simulator as well , like ships moving at slow speeds... even at slow acceleration , you could eventually get a Titan to fly at near light speeds , if it were a simulator .</tokentext>
<sentencetext>EVE is not a space combat flight simulator (which in itself is kinda dumb, to be honest... the flight and combat would have to all be computerized given the speeds at which things would happen).
EVE takes that approach, you give general commands to your ship and it (the 'computer') does them for you... go over there, fire weapons at that target, etc.
But EVE also does other things that break it from being a flight simulator as well, like ships moving at slow speeds... even at slow acceleration, you could eventually get a Titan to fly at near light speeds, if it were a simulator.</sentencetext>
	<parent>http://www.semanticweb.org/ontologies/ConversationInstances.owl#comment10_01_05_0357226.30652384</parent>
</comment>
<comment>
	<id>http://www.semanticweb.org/ontologies/ConversationInstances.owl#comment10_01_05_0357226.30653164</id>
	<title>Re:I'm not sure about their policy...</title>
	<author>osu-neko</author>
	<datestamp>1262691960000</datestamp>
	<modclass>None</modclass>
	<modscore>1</modscore>
	<htmltext><p><div class="quote"><p>I mean, its great that they won't give you a refund for your ships if you got them destroyed because of stupidity... but if the network code destroyed your fleet? Isn't that CCP's fault entirely?</p></div><p>The "network code" didn't destroy anything.  Network performance might have had something to do with it, but this is the EVE equivalent of space-weather.  Sometimes the divine wind comes by and wipes out the invading fleet (I'm talking real history now).  No fault of the invaders, and not due to the skill of the defenders, just bad weather.  Oh well, too bad, so sad.  Nature doesn't reimburse you for your lost invasion fleet.  CCP doesn't either.</p><p>It's also apparently the case that the invaders were intentionally trying to bring down the server in a plan that backfired on the badly.</p><p>You can argue until you're blue in the face that CCP should make such things impossible, but while they're possible, you live and die by the consequences of reality as it is rather than reality as you might want it to be, and crying to CCP for a refund will get you nowhere, whether it was skill, luck, or bad "space-weather" that ate your fleet.  Life isn't always fair, QQ.</p></div>
	</htmltext>
<tokenext>I mean , its great that they wo n't give you a refund for your ships if you got them destroyed because of stupidity... but if the network code destroyed your fleet ?
Is n't that CCP 's fault entirely ? The " network code " did n't destroy anything .
Network performance might have had something to do with it , but this is the EVE equivalent of space-weather .
Sometimes the divine wind comes by and wipes out the invading fleet ( I 'm talking real history now ) .
No fault of the invaders , and not due to the skill of the defenders , just bad weather .
Oh well , too bad , so sad .
Nature does n't reimburse you for your lost invasion fleet .
CCP does n't either.It 's also apparently the case that the invaders were intentionally trying to bring down the server in a plan that backfired on the badly.You can argue until you 're blue in the face that CCP should make such things impossible , but while they 're possible , you live and die by the consequences of reality as it is rather than reality as you might want it to be , and crying to CCP for a refund will get you nowhere , whether it was skill , luck , or bad " space-weather " that ate your fleet .
Life is n't always fair , QQ .</tokentext>
<sentencetext>I mean, its great that they won't give you a refund for your ships if you got them destroyed because of stupidity... but if the network code destroyed your fleet?
Isn't that CCP's fault entirely?The "network code" didn't destroy anything.
Network performance might have had something to do with it, but this is the EVE equivalent of space-weather.
Sometimes the divine wind comes by and wipes out the invading fleet (I'm talking real history now).
No fault of the invaders, and not due to the skill of the defenders, just bad weather.
Oh well, too bad, so sad.
Nature doesn't reimburse you for your lost invasion fleet.
CCP doesn't either.It's also apparently the case that the invaders were intentionally trying to bring down the server in a plan that backfired on the badly.You can argue until you're blue in the face that CCP should make such things impossible, but while they're possible, you live and die by the consequences of reality as it is rather than reality as you might want it to be, and crying to CCP for a refund will get you nowhere, whether it was skill, luck, or bad "space-weather" that ate your fleet.
Life isn't always fair, QQ.
	</sentencetext>
	<parent>http://www.semanticweb.org/ontologies/ConversationInstances.owl#comment10_01_05_0357226.30651772</parent>
</comment>
<comment>
	<id>http://www.semanticweb.org/ontologies/ConversationInstances.owl#comment10_01_05_0357226.30652958</id>
	<title>Re:EVE Online.</title>
	<author>Anonymous</author>
	<datestamp>1262689020000</datestamp>
	<modclass>None</modclass>
	<modscore>0</modscore>
	<htmltext><p>"One, why play a game that takes you at least a year to be able to do anything fun and useful? That's not a game at all, that's a job."</p><p>GoonFleet's MO is to take day old newbies and throw them into the fire of the end game where they can actually be useful. I'd say it's worked quite well. Beats playing WoW all day every day for months on end so you can grind out the end game over and over again...</p></htmltext>
<tokenext>" One , why play a game that takes you at least a year to be able to do anything fun and useful ?
That 's not a game at all , that 's a job .
" GoonFleet 's MO is to take day old newbies and throw them into the fire of the end game where they can actually be useful .
I 'd say it 's worked quite well .
Beats playing WoW all day every day for months on end so you can grind out the end game over and over again.. .</tokentext>
<sentencetext>"One, why play a game that takes you at least a year to be able to do anything fun and useful?
That's not a game at all, that's a job.
"GoonFleet's MO is to take day old newbies and throw them into the fire of the end game where they can actually be useful.
I'd say it's worked quite well.
Beats playing WoW all day every day for months on end so you can grind out the end game over and over again...</sentencetext>
	<parent>http://www.semanticweb.org/ontologies/ConversationInstances.owl#comment10_01_05_0357226.30651868</parent>
</comment>
<comment>
	<id>http://www.semanticweb.org/ontologies/ConversationInstances.owl#comment10_01_05_0357226.30652148</id>
	<title>Re:It was their own fault</title>
	<author>Anonymous</author>
	<datestamp>1262723100000</datestamp>
	<modclass>None</modclass>
	<modscore>0</modscore>
	<htmltext>CCP employees are already known to collude with player alliances that contain their own employees, and CCP itself seems unwilling to combat that problem.

So notifying CCP about a coming fleet fight is akin to giving it all away to the enemy.</htmltext>
<tokenext>CCP employees are already known to collude with player alliances that contain their own employees , and CCP itself seems unwilling to combat that problem .
So notifying CCP about a coming fleet fight is akin to giving it all away to the enemy .</tokentext>
<sentencetext>CCP employees are already known to collude with player alliances that contain their own employees, and CCP itself seems unwilling to combat that problem.
So notifying CCP about a coming fleet fight is akin to giving it all away to the enemy.</sentencetext>
	<parent>http://www.semanticweb.org/ontologies/ConversationInstances.owl#comment10_01_05_0357226.30651812</parent>
</comment>
<comment>
	<id>http://www.semanticweb.org/ontologies/ConversationInstances.owl#comment10_01_05_0357226.30652248</id>
	<title>Re:Thousands? Far from accurate...</title>
	<author>Opportunist</author>
	<datestamp>1262724120000</datestamp>
	<modclass>Informativ</modclass>
	<modscore>3</modscore>
	<htmltext><p>Hmm... last time I checked a PLEX was about 300m for 30 days. 15 USD=300m, so a Titan would "cost" about 3000 USD, the equivalent of 200 months of play time. So I guess the description could well be correct.</p></htmltext>
<tokenext>Hmm... last time I checked a PLEX was about 300m for 30 days .
15 USD = 300m , so a Titan would " cost " about 3000 USD , the equivalent of 200 months of play time .
So I guess the description could well be correct .</tokentext>
<sentencetext>Hmm... last time I checked a PLEX was about 300m for 30 days.
15 USD=300m, so a Titan would "cost" about 3000 USD, the equivalent of 200 months of play time.
So I guess the description could well be correct.</sentencetext>
	<parent>http://www.semanticweb.org/ontologies/ConversationInstances.owl#comment10_01_05_0357226.30651806</parent>
</comment>
<comment>
	<id>http://www.semanticweb.org/ontologies/ConversationInstances.owl#comment10_01_05_0357226.30657586</id>
	<title>Re:Here is video of the battle...</title>
	<author>IorDMUX</author>
	<datestamp>1262717220000</datestamp>
	<modclass>None</modclass>
	<modscore>1</modscore>
	<htmltext>Hmm.  Between the beaming lights and the background music, it appeared to be either an Animusic production or a Trans-Siberian Orchestra concert.</htmltext>
<tokenext>Hmm .
Between the beaming lights and the background music , it appeared to be either an Animusic production or a Trans-Siberian Orchestra concert .</tokentext>
<sentencetext>Hmm.
Between the beaming lights and the background music, it appeared to be either an Animusic production or a Trans-Siberian Orchestra concert.</sentencetext>
	<parent>http://www.semanticweb.org/ontologies/ConversationInstances.owl#comment10_01_05_0357226.30651912</parent>
</comment>
<comment>
	<id>http://www.semanticweb.org/ontologies/ConversationInstances.owl#comment10_01_05_0357226.30652170</id>
	<title>Re:EVE Online.</title>
	<author>Killeri</author>
	<datestamp>1262723340000</datestamp>
	<modclass>None</modclass>
	<modscore>1</modscore>
	<htmltext><p>You can fly a "tackler" in a couple of days (tackler is a ship that is designated to get in fast, hold an enemy ship for 10-20 seconds until the heavy ships get in, and then bail out). You can fly a decent mining ship in a couple of days. You can start doing effective trading in a few weeks. Production does take a bit longer to do effectively.</p></htmltext>
<tokenext>You can fly a " tackler " in a couple of days ( tackler is a ship that is designated to get in fast , hold an enemy ship for 10-20 seconds until the heavy ships get in , and then bail out ) .
You can fly a decent mining ship in a couple of days .
You can start doing effective trading in a few weeks .
Production does take a bit longer to do effectively .</tokentext>
<sentencetext>You can fly a "tackler" in a couple of days (tackler is a ship that is designated to get in fast, hold an enemy ship for 10-20 seconds until the heavy ships get in, and then bail out).
You can fly a decent mining ship in a couple of days.
You can start doing effective trading in a few weeks.
Production does take a bit longer to do effectively.</sentencetext>
	<parent>http://www.semanticweb.org/ontologies/ConversationInstances.owl#comment10_01_05_0357226.30651868</parent>
</comment>
<comment>
	<id>http://www.semanticweb.org/ontologies/ConversationInstances.owl#comment10_01_05_0357226.30653062</id>
	<title>Re:Here is video of the battle...</title>
	<author>theantipop</author>
	<datestamp>1262690460000</datestamp>
	<modclass>None</modclass>
	<modscore>1</modscore>
	<htmltext>Is that a laser Floyd show or a video game?</htmltext>
<tokenext>Is that a laser Floyd show or a video game ?</tokentext>
<sentencetext>Is that a laser Floyd show or a video game?</sentencetext>
	<parent>http://www.semanticweb.org/ontologies/ConversationInstances.owl#comment10_01_05_0357226.30651912</parent>
</comment>
<comment>
	<id>http://www.semanticweb.org/ontologies/ConversationInstances.owl#comment10_01_05_0357226.30652174</id>
	<title>Offline alternatives ?</title>
	<author>Anonymous</author>
	<datestamp>1262723400000</datestamp>
	<modclass>Informativ</modclass>
	<modscore>3</modscore>
	<htmltext><p>Gamers with a tighter schedule (work, studies, family etc) or a lagging connection to online servers should really consider an offline alternative that goes with their own pace and allows <b>time speed adjustment</b>. Without time speed adjustment (which is by definition incompatible to large online games) space games can be extremely time consuming.</p><p>X3 Reunion + Xtended mod (I didn't like TC very much) is a good alternative but I'd be willing to know more.</p></htmltext>
<tokenext>Gamers with a tighter schedule ( work , studies , family etc ) or a lagging connection to online servers should really consider an offline alternative that goes with their own pace and allows time speed adjustment .
Without time speed adjustment ( which is by definition incompatible to large online games ) space games can be extremely time consuming.X3 Reunion + Xtended mod ( I did n't like TC very much ) is a good alternative but I 'd be willing to know more .</tokentext>
<sentencetext>Gamers with a tighter schedule (work, studies, family etc) or a lagging connection to online servers should really consider an offline alternative that goes with their own pace and allows time speed adjustment.
Without time speed adjustment (which is by definition incompatible to large online games) space games can be extremely time consuming.X3 Reunion + Xtended mod (I didn't like TC very much) is a good alternative but I'd be willing to know more.</sentencetext>
</comment>
<comment>
	<id>http://www.semanticweb.org/ontologies/ConversationInstances.owl#comment10_01_05_0357226.30651850</id>
	<title>Blaming the servers?</title>
	<author>fake\_name</author>
	<datestamp>1262633280000</datestamp>
	<modclass>None</modclass>
	<modscore>1</modscore>
	<htmltext><p>"annihilated amidst controversy"?  When has there ever been any significant battle in Eve that didn't feature people blaming server issues for their loss?  (often correctly, I might add)</p></htmltext>
<tokenext>" annihilated amidst controversy " ?
When has there ever been any significant battle in Eve that did n't feature people blaming server issues for their loss ?
( often correctly , I might add )</tokentext>
<sentencetext>"annihilated amidst controversy"?
When has there ever been any significant battle in Eve that didn't feature people blaming server issues for their loss?
(often correctly, I might add)</sentencetext>
</comment>
<comment>
	<id>http://www.semanticweb.org/ontologies/ConversationInstances.owl#comment10_01_05_0357226.30654676</id>
	<title>Re:Why Am I Not Surprised</title>
	<author>drinkypoo</author>
	<datestamp>1262706480000</datestamp>
	<modclass>None</modclass>
	<modscore>1</modscore>
	<htmltext><p><div class="quote"><p>About a year ago, this number of people fighting in the same system would've been next to impossible.</p></div><p>It looks to <em>still</em> be impossible.</p><p>I notice you didn't bother to log in, probably because you know the single biggest problem with your argument, and don't want to put your name on such a flawed creation: EvE creates situations where it is necessary, if you want to accomplish certain reasonable goals, to attack with a fleet which the game cannot handle. EvE seeks to do something truly amazing, something of which the developers are apparently not capable. Yet they created a game which would create the necessity to do these things! This is a side effect of trying to make EvE too real without actually having the technical ability to back it up. It may well be that <em>no one</em> has figured out how to do what they're doing yet, but it doesn't change the fact that it makes EvE a lousy <em>game</em>. It may, however, be an acceptable second reality for some people.</p></div>
	</htmltext>
<tokenext>About a year ago , this number of people fighting in the same system would 've been next to impossible.It looks to still be impossible.I notice you did n't bother to log in , probably because you know the single biggest problem with your argument , and do n't want to put your name on such a flawed creation : EvE creates situations where it is necessary , if you want to accomplish certain reasonable goals , to attack with a fleet which the game can not handle .
EvE seeks to do something truly amazing , something of which the developers are apparently not capable .
Yet they created a game which would create the necessity to do these things !
This is a side effect of trying to make EvE too real without actually having the technical ability to back it up .
It may well be that no one has figured out how to do what they 're doing yet , but it does n't change the fact that it makes EvE a lousy game .
It may , however , be an acceptable second reality for some people .</tokentext>
<sentencetext>About a year ago, this number of people fighting in the same system would've been next to impossible.It looks to still be impossible.I notice you didn't bother to log in, probably because you know the single biggest problem with your argument, and don't want to put your name on such a flawed creation: EvE creates situations where it is necessary, if you want to accomplish certain reasonable goals, to attack with a fleet which the game cannot handle.
EvE seeks to do something truly amazing, something of which the developers are apparently not capable.
Yet they created a game which would create the necessity to do these things!
This is a side effect of trying to make EvE too real without actually having the technical ability to back it up.
It may well be that no one has figured out how to do what they're doing yet, but it doesn't change the fact that it makes EvE a lousy game.
It may, however, be an acceptable second reality for some people.
	</sentencetext>
	<parent>http://www.semanticweb.org/ontologies/ConversationInstances.owl#comment10_01_05_0357226.30652656</parent>
</comment>
<comment>
	<id>http://www.semanticweb.org/ontologies/ConversationInstances.owl#comment10_01_05_0357226.30653436</id>
	<title>Re:EVE Online.</title>
	<author>Anonymous</author>
	<datestamp>1262695260000</datestamp>
	<modclass>None</modclass>
	<modscore>0</modscore>
	<htmltext><p><i>Why play a game that takes you at least a year to be able to do anything fun and useful?</i><br>Only if you believe that in order to become a real world millionaire, a person would have to sweat at a 30k/year job for 33+ years.</p><p>There are thousands of ways to make ingame money in EVE's "anything goes" society besides combat and production... say trading, fraud, ingame and out of game services, detective work, prostitution, whatnot, and many of them don't even require your character to undock in his newbie ship. Once you have a sizable amount of ingame money, you can use it to *legally* buy some player's character that has your desirable, advanced, time-consuming skills trained. In most cases it's a lot more time-efficient.</p><p>Also, for all the game's shortcomings, its developers are in very good contact with the playerbase, and even host an annual fanfest to allow the players to meet the whole company in person.</p></htmltext>
<tokenext>Why play a game that takes you at least a year to be able to do anything fun and useful ? Only if you believe that in order to become a real world millionaire , a person would have to sweat at a 30k/year job for 33 + years.There are thousands of ways to make ingame money in EVE 's " anything goes " society besides combat and production... say trading , fraud , ingame and out of game services , detective work , prostitution , whatnot , and many of them do n't even require your character to undock in his newbie ship .
Once you have a sizable amount of ingame money , you can use it to * legally * buy some player 's character that has your desirable , advanced , time-consuming skills trained .
In most cases it 's a lot more time-efficient.Also , for all the game 's shortcomings , its developers are in very good contact with the playerbase , and even host an annual fanfest to allow the players to meet the whole company in person .</tokentext>
<sentencetext>Why play a game that takes you at least a year to be able to do anything fun and useful?Only if you believe that in order to become a real world millionaire, a person would have to sweat at a 30k/year job for 33+ years.There are thousands of ways to make ingame money in EVE's "anything goes" society besides combat and production... say trading, fraud, ingame and out of game services, detective work, prostitution, whatnot, and many of them don't even require your character to undock in his newbie ship.
Once you have a sizable amount of ingame money, you can use it to *legally* buy some player's character that has your desirable, advanced, time-consuming skills trained.
In most cases it's a lot more time-efficient.Also, for all the game's shortcomings, its developers are in very good contact with the playerbase, and even host an annual fanfest to allow the players to meet the whole company in person.</sentencetext>
	<parent>http://www.semanticweb.org/ontologies/ConversationInstances.owl#comment10_01_05_0357226.30651868</parent>
</comment>
<comment>
	<id>http://www.semanticweb.org/ontologies/ConversationInstances.owl#comment10_01_05_0357226.30657174</id>
	<title>Re:Tried EVE...</title>
	<author>gatkinso</author>
	<datestamp>1262715840000</datestamp>
	<modclass>None</modclass>
	<modscore>1</modscore>
	<htmltext><p>It isn't as bad as you say.  Stay in hi sec and you will have few problems.  You will be bored, but wont have too many issues.</p><p>However, just like in real life, people do get mugged in good neighborhoods.</p></htmltext>
<tokenext>It is n't as bad as you say .
Stay in hi sec and you will have few problems .
You will be bored , but wont have too many issues.However , just like in real life , people do get mugged in good neighborhoods .</tokentext>
<sentencetext>It isn't as bad as you say.
Stay in hi sec and you will have few problems.
You will be bored, but wont have too many issues.However, just like in real life, people do get mugged in good neighborhoods.</sentencetext>
	<parent>http://www.semanticweb.org/ontologies/ConversationInstances.owl#comment10_01_05_0357226.30654560</parent>
</comment>
<comment>
	<id>http://www.semanticweb.org/ontologies/ConversationInstances.owl#comment10_01_05_0357226.30652150</id>
	<title>Re:EVE Online.</title>
	<author>jeff4747</author>
	<datestamp>1262723160000</datestamp>
	<modclass>Interestin</modclass>
	<modscore>3</modscore>
	<htmltext><blockquote><div><p>Two, CCP has shown themselves in the past to be shady and unreliable, having developers specifically favor certain alliances and otherwise abuse their powers for their own in-game corporations.</p><p>Three, the amount of bugs and inability to cope for server stress for large battles (which is the meat and potatoes of this game--large space wars!) has apparently been evident for quite some time now.</p></div> </blockquote><p>IMO, these two issues are caused by CCP's location.  There's not a vast number of high-quality programming talent in Iceland.  (Simply because there isn't a vast number of people).  CCP has had a "Senior Programmer" open position on their web site for a couple of years now.</p><p>Frankly, the reason I left EvE is that the quality of the already mediocre code was heading downhill rapidly.  My personal tipping point was the bug where in-game browser bookmarks were not properly imported by their new in-game browser.  If the Devs can't even do that right, then how can anyone expect much from the rest of their code?</p></div>
	</htmltext>
<tokenext>Two , CCP has shown themselves in the past to be shady and unreliable , having developers specifically favor certain alliances and otherwise abuse their powers for their own in-game corporations.Three , the amount of bugs and inability to cope for server stress for large battles ( which is the meat and potatoes of this game--large space wars !
) has apparently been evident for quite some time now .
IMO , these two issues are caused by CCP 's location .
There 's not a vast number of high-quality programming talent in Iceland .
( Simply because there is n't a vast number of people ) .
CCP has had a " Senior Programmer " open position on their web site for a couple of years now.Frankly , the reason I left EvE is that the quality of the already mediocre code was heading downhill rapidly .
My personal tipping point was the bug where in-game browser bookmarks were not properly imported by their new in-game browser .
If the Devs ca n't even do that right , then how can anyone expect much from the rest of their code ?</tokentext>
<sentencetext>Two, CCP has shown themselves in the past to be shady and unreliable, having developers specifically favor certain alliances and otherwise abuse their powers for their own in-game corporations.Three, the amount of bugs and inability to cope for server stress for large battles (which is the meat and potatoes of this game--large space wars!
) has apparently been evident for quite some time now.
IMO, these two issues are caused by CCP's location.
There's not a vast number of high-quality programming talent in Iceland.
(Simply because there isn't a vast number of people).
CCP has had a "Senior Programmer" open position on their web site for a couple of years now.Frankly, the reason I left EvE is that the quality of the already mediocre code was heading downhill rapidly.
My personal tipping point was the bug where in-game browser bookmarks were not properly imported by their new in-game browser.
If the Devs can't even do that right, then how can anyone expect much from the rest of their code?
	</sentencetext>
	<parent>http://www.semanticweb.org/ontologies/ConversationInstances.owl#comment10_01_05_0357226.30651868</parent>
</comment>
<comment>
	<id>http://www.semanticweb.org/ontologies/ConversationInstances.owl#comment10_01_05_0357226.30663602</id>
	<title>Re:Here is video of the battle...</title>
	<author>inflame</author>
	<datestamp>1262699400000</datestamp>
	<modclass>None</modclass>
	<modscore>1</modscore>
	<htmltext>That's why it was called a massacre. One side basically lagged so much it was like shooting fish in a barrel.</htmltext>
<tokenext>That 's why it was called a massacre .
One side basically lagged so much it was like shooting fish in a barrel .</tokentext>
<sentencetext>That's why it was called a massacre.
One side basically lagged so much it was like shooting fish in a barrel.</sentencetext>
	<parent>http://www.semanticweb.org/ontologies/ConversationInstances.owl#comment10_01_05_0357226.30652356</parent>
</comment>
<comment>
	<id>http://www.semanticweb.org/ontologies/ConversationInstances.owl#comment10_01_05_0357226.30659992</id>
	<title>Re:Here is video of the battle...</title>
	<author>Anonymous</author>
	<datestamp>1262683980000</datestamp>
	<modclass>None</modclass>
	<modscore>0</modscore>
	<htmltext><p><div class="quote"><p>That really looks terribly boring. After decades of big budget sci-fi movies, not to mention epic space battle video games like Homeworld, <i>this</i> is the best space combat system that EVE can offer? There didn't seem to be any maneuvering involved at all... might as well be a text based game.</p></div><p>Actually, this isn't normally the case. The only reason you see all those ships not moving is because those are the attackers that jumped into the system and lagged out. From those ship pilot's point of view, they just saw a black screen and couldn't move their ships even if they wanted to.</p></div>
	</htmltext>
<tokenext>That really looks terribly boring .
After decades of big budget sci-fi movies , not to mention epic space battle video games like Homeworld , this is the best space combat system that EVE can offer ?
There did n't seem to be any maneuvering involved at all... might as well be a text based game.Actually , this is n't normally the case .
The only reason you see all those ships not moving is because those are the attackers that jumped into the system and lagged out .
From those ship pilot 's point of view , they just saw a black screen and could n't move their ships even if they wanted to .</tokentext>
<sentencetext>That really looks terribly boring.
After decades of big budget sci-fi movies, not to mention epic space battle video games like Homeworld, this is the best space combat system that EVE can offer?
There didn't seem to be any maneuvering involved at all... might as well be a text based game.Actually, this isn't normally the case.
The only reason you see all those ships not moving is because those are the attackers that jumped into the system and lagged out.
From those ship pilot's point of view, they just saw a black screen and couldn't move their ships even if they wanted to.
	</sentencetext>
	<parent>http://www.semanticweb.org/ontologies/ConversationInstances.owl#comment10_01_05_0357226.30652356</parent>
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