<article>
	<id>http://www.semanticweb.org/ontologies/ConversationInstances.owl#article10_01_04_1548235</id>
	<title>Monty Wants To Save MySQL</title>
	<author>CmdrTaco</author>
	<datestamp>1262620560000</datestamp>
	<htmltext>An anonymous reader writes <i>"It seems as if the MySQL author is trying hard to win back control over MySQL. In his <a href="http://monty-says.blogspot.com/2009/12/help-keep-internet-free.html">blog</a> he calls upon the MySQL users to 'Help keep the Internet free' by <a href="http://www.helpmysql.org/">signing his petition</a>. He fears that if Oracle buys Sun they automatically get MySQL which would spell doom for the project. But I have have mixed feelings with this call for help, because after all &mdash; who sold MySQL in the first place?"</i></htmltext>
<tokenext>An anonymous reader writes " It seems as if the MySQL author is trying hard to win back control over MySQL .
In his blog he calls upon the MySQL users to 'Help keep the Internet free ' by signing his petition .
He fears that if Oracle buys Sun they automatically get MySQL which would spell doom for the project .
But I have have mixed feelings with this call for help , because after all    who sold MySQL in the first place ?
"</tokentext>
<sentencetext>An anonymous reader writes "It seems as if the MySQL author is trying hard to win back control over MySQL.
In his blog he calls upon the MySQL users to 'Help keep the Internet free' by signing his petition.
He fears that if Oracle buys Sun they automatically get MySQL which would spell doom for the project.
But I have have mixed feelings with this call for help, because after all — who sold MySQL in the first place?
"</sentencetext>
</article>
<comment>
	<id>http://www.semanticweb.org/ontologies/ConversationInstances.owl#comment10_01_04_1548235.30641562</id>
	<title>well...</title>
	<author>buanzo</author>
	<datestamp>1262624280000</datestamp>
	<modclass>Insightful</modclass>
	<modscore>3</modscore>
	<htmltext>we still have pgsql, right? yeah, migration, but still free/libre, right?

first post? nah...</htmltext>
<tokenext>we still have pgsql , right ?
yeah , migration , but still free/libre , right ?
first post ?
nah.. .</tokentext>
<sentencetext>we still have pgsql, right?
yeah, migration, but still free/libre, right?
first post?
nah...</sentencetext>
</comment>
<comment>
	<id>http://www.semanticweb.org/ontologies/ConversationInstances.owl#comment10_01_04_1548235.30667258</id>
	<title>Re:well...</title>
	<author>Anonymous</author>
	<datestamp>1262775180000</datestamp>
	<modclass>None</modclass>
	<modscore>1</modscore>
	<htmltext><p>WTF are *you* talking about?</p><p>What part of "<a href="http://monty-says.blogspot.com/2009/09/codeplex-foundation-why-is-microsoft.html" title="blogspot.com" rel="nofollow">I will try to explain why I think that the CodePlex Foundation is a good idea, and why I agreed to be an advisor for the Foundation.</a> [blogspot.com]" did you happen to miss?</p></htmltext>
<tokenext>WTF are * you * talking about ? What part of " I will try to explain why I think that the CodePlex Foundation is a good idea , and why I agreed to be an advisor for the Foundation .
[ blogspot.com ] " did you happen to miss ?</tokentext>
<sentencetext>WTF are *you* talking about?What part of "I will try to explain why I think that the CodePlex Foundation is a good idea, and why I agreed to be an advisor for the Foundation.
[blogspot.com]" did you happen to miss?</sentencetext>
	<parent>http://www.semanticweb.org/ontologies/ConversationInstances.owl#comment10_01_04_1548235.30642802</parent>
</comment>
<comment>
	<id>http://www.semanticweb.org/ontologies/ConversationInstances.owl#comment10_01_04_1548235.30641758</id>
	<title>Baloney!  He doesn't want to save MySQL</title>
	<author>Anonymous</author>
	<datestamp>1262624940000</datestamp>
	<modclass>Insightful</modclass>
	<modscore>4</modscore>
	<htmltext><p>He wants to build another business on MySQL and force Oracle into letting him do it.</p><p>This is greed masquerading as virtue.</p></htmltext>
<tokenext>He wants to build another business on MySQL and force Oracle into letting him do it.This is greed masquerading as virtue .</tokentext>
<sentencetext>He wants to build another business on MySQL and force Oracle into letting him do it.This is greed masquerading as virtue.</sentencetext>
</comment>
<comment>
	<id>http://www.semanticweb.org/ontologies/ConversationInstances.owl#comment10_01_04_1548235.30641732</id>
	<title>Re:Own fault</title>
	<author>Anonymous</author>
	<datestamp>1262624820000</datestamp>
	<modclass>None</modclass>
	<modscore>0</modscore>
	<htmltext><p>Let me rephrase that for the audience...</p><p>Hypothetically, it's like when your girlfriends brakes up with you, and you spam her with emails to get her back when she's found a new guy and you're not getting any.</p><p>
&nbsp;</p></htmltext>
<tokenext>Let me rephrase that for the audience...Hypothetically , it 's like when your girlfriends brakes up with you , and you spam her with emails to get her back when she 's found a new guy and you 're not getting any .
 </tokentext>
<sentencetext>Let me rephrase that for the audience...Hypothetically, it's like when your girlfriends brakes up with you, and you spam her with emails to get her back when she's found a new guy and you're not getting any.
 </sentencetext>
	<parent>http://www.semanticweb.org/ontologies/ConversationInstances.owl#comment10_01_04_1548235.30641574</parent>
</comment>
<comment>
	<id>http://www.semanticweb.org/ontologies/ConversationInstances.owl#comment10_01_04_1548235.30641586</id>
	<title>Me too!</title>
	<author>TheRaven64</author>
	<datestamp>1262624340000</datestamp>
	<modclass>Insightful</modclass>
	<modscore>5</modscore>
	<htmltext>I, too, would love to sell something for a billion dollars and then have it given back.</htmltext>
<tokenext>I , too , would love to sell something for a billion dollars and then have it given back .</tokentext>
<sentencetext>I, too, would love to sell something for a billion dollars and then have it given back.</sentencetext>
</comment>
<comment>
	<id>http://www.semanticweb.org/ontologies/ConversationInstances.owl#comment10_01_04_1548235.30641662</id>
	<title>Ob</title>
	<author>Anonymous</author>
	<datestamp>1262624640000</datestamp>
	<modclass>None</modclass>
	<modscore>1</modscore>
	<htmltext><p>Vot about Rommel?</p></htmltext>
<tokenext>Vot about Rommel ?</tokentext>
<sentencetext>Vot about Rommel?</sentencetext>
</comment>
<comment>
	<id>http://www.semanticweb.org/ontologies/ConversationInstances.owl#comment10_01_04_1548235.30642580</id>
	<title>The best part of this...</title>
	<author>Anonymous</author>
	<datestamp>1262627880000</datestamp>
	<modclass>Funny</modclass>
	<modscore>2</modscore>
	<htmltext><p>.... is the preposterous idea that Sun and/or Oracle care a whit about online petitions or email campaigns.</p><p>Unless Monty is just indulging in a popularity survey.  In which case he forgot to ask us how we 'felt' about this.</p><p>I, BTW, feel like you've gotten your money and want your cake back as well.  Good luck.  Fork it and compete with your previous employer, ok?</p><p>sheesh.</p></htmltext>
<tokenext>.... is the preposterous idea that Sun and/or Oracle care a whit about online petitions or email campaigns.Unless Monty is just indulging in a popularity survey .
In which case he forgot to ask us how we 'felt ' about this.I , BTW , feel like you 've gotten your money and want your cake back as well .
Good luck .
Fork it and compete with your previous employer , ok ? sheesh .</tokentext>
<sentencetext>.... is the preposterous idea that Sun and/or Oracle care a whit about online petitions or email campaigns.Unless Monty is just indulging in a popularity survey.
In which case he forgot to ask us how we 'felt' about this.I, BTW, feel like you've gotten your money and want your cake back as well.
Good luck.
Fork it and compete with your previous employer, ok?sheesh.</sentencetext>
</comment>
<comment>
	<id>http://www.semanticweb.org/ontologies/ConversationInstances.owl#comment10_01_04_1548235.30641972</id>
	<title>No no no!</title>
	<author>geminidomino</author>
	<datestamp>1262625720000</datestamp>
	<modclass>None</modclass>
	<modscore>1</modscore>
	<htmltext><p>Having seen the date 1969-12-31 one time too many, I say let the fucker die.</p><p>DIE DIE DIE!</p><p>I hate HATE HATE HATE mysql.</p><p>(why yes, I have recently been replaying FF VI. Why do you ask?)</p></htmltext>
<tokenext>Having seen the date 1969-12-31 one time too many , I say let the fucker die.DIE DIE DIE ! I hate HATE HATE HATE mysql .
( why yes , I have recently been replaying FF VI .
Why do you ask ?
)</tokentext>
<sentencetext>Having seen the date 1969-12-31 one time too many, I say let the fucker die.DIE DIE DIE!I hate HATE HATE HATE mysql.
(why yes, I have recently been replaying FF VI.
Why do you ask?
)</sentencetext>
</comment>
<comment>
	<id>http://www.semanticweb.org/ontologies/ConversationInstances.owl#comment10_01_04_1548235.30643514</id>
	<title>Re:Own fault</title>
	<author>Anonymous</author>
	<datestamp>1262631960000</datestamp>
	<modclass>None</modclass>
	<modscore>0</modscore>
	<htmltext><p>It's not clear to me that the American legal system really allows you to do that sort of thing; the structure of corporations is governed by some fairly specific laws, and you can't just set up whatever kind of corporate entity with whatever kind of binding agreements you want. But IANAL - one of those should weigh in.</p></htmltext>
<tokenext>It 's not clear to me that the American legal system really allows you to do that sort of thing ; the structure of corporations is governed by some fairly specific laws , and you ca n't just set up whatever kind of corporate entity with whatever kind of binding agreements you want .
But IANAL - one of those should weigh in .</tokentext>
<sentencetext>It's not clear to me that the American legal system really allows you to do that sort of thing; the structure of corporations is governed by some fairly specific laws, and you can't just set up whatever kind of corporate entity with whatever kind of binding agreements you want.
But IANAL - one of those should weigh in.</sentencetext>
	<parent>http://www.semanticweb.org/ontologies/ConversationInstances.owl#comment10_01_04_1548235.30642492</parent>
</comment>
<comment>
	<id>http://www.semanticweb.org/ontologies/ConversationInstances.owl#comment10_01_04_1548235.30641672</id>
	<title>Hypocrite</title>
	<author>Anonymous</author>
	<datestamp>1262624640000</datestamp>
	<modclass>Insightful</modclass>
	<modscore>1</modscore>
	<htmltext><p>Hypocrite Monty.<br>Give back the billion dollars and we may talk.</p></htmltext>
<tokenext>Hypocrite Monty.Give back the billion dollars and we may talk .</tokentext>
<sentencetext>Hypocrite Monty.Give back the billion dollars and we may talk.</sentencetext>
</comment>
<comment>
	<id>http://www.semanticweb.org/ontologies/ConversationInstances.owl#comment10_01_04_1548235.30645888</id>
	<title>Re:No he doesn't</title>
	<author>montywi</author>
	<datestamp>1262598360000</datestamp>
	<modclass>None</modclass>
	<modscore>2</modscore>
	<htmltext><p>I haven't asked Sun to give up anything</p><p>I have however pointed out the reasons why one can't assume that a fork will suddenly spring up and be able to resurrect MySQL if Oracle would decide to kill it (as others seam to think). The manual is one reason, the GPL license is another.</p><p>And MariaDB is not commercial;  It's only available under Open Source.</p><p>What we are asking for in the petition is that MySQL users should be heard in the process.<br>By asking MySQL to be divested to another entity, there is no money for me to make (actually less, as you should know if you have read my blog)</p></htmltext>
<tokenext>I have n't asked Sun to give up anythingI have however pointed out the reasons why one ca n't assume that a fork will suddenly spring up and be able to resurrect MySQL if Oracle would decide to kill it ( as others seam to think ) .
The manual is one reason , the GPL license is another.And MariaDB is not commercial ; It 's only available under Open Source.What we are asking for in the petition is that MySQL users should be heard in the process.By asking MySQL to be divested to another entity , there is no money for me to make ( actually less , as you should know if you have read my blog )</tokentext>
<sentencetext>I haven't asked Sun to give up anythingI have however pointed out the reasons why one can't assume that a fork will suddenly spring up and be able to resurrect MySQL if Oracle would decide to kill it (as others seam to think).
The manual is one reason, the GPL license is another.And MariaDB is not commercial;  It's only available under Open Source.What we are asking for in the petition is that MySQL users should be heard in the process.By asking MySQL to be divested to another entity, there is no money for me to make (actually less, as you should know if you have read my blog)</sentencetext>
	<parent>http://www.semanticweb.org/ontologies/ConversationInstances.owl#comment10_01_04_1548235.30641618</parent>
</comment>
<comment>
	<id>http://www.semanticweb.org/ontologies/ConversationInstances.owl#comment10_01_04_1548235.30642044</id>
	<title>Re:Own fault</title>
	<author>sean\_nestor</author>
	<datestamp>1262626020000</datestamp>
	<modclass>Informativ</modclass>
	<modscore>4</modscore>
	<htmltext><p>FTA:</p><p> <i>Q: Didn't you sell MySQL to Sun? Do you want to have the cake and eat it too?</i> </p><p>First a little background:</p><p>I started to work on a code that would later become MySQL in 1982. MySQL was released in 1995 under a dual licensing scheme that allowed David Axmark and me to very quickly work full time on developing MySQL.</p><p>I lost the rights to the MySQL copyright in 2001 when MySQL AB was created and we allowed investors to come in. We needed to bring in investors to be able to create a full-scale working company to satisfy big customers and to be able to hire more developers and take MySQL to the next stage. To ensure that MySQL would continue to be free, David and I stated in the shareholder agreement that MySQL AB would have to keep MySQL under an open source license. The problem with a shareholder agreement is that it is terminated when the company is sold. This is just how things works.</p><p>David and I however thought that this would not be a problem, as we would help ensure that MySQL would be bought by a good owner.</p><p>I continued to lead the MySQL project and have been one of the leaders and top contributors for the project since then.</p><p>When the sales process to Sun started, I was at the time not anymore in the MySQL Board (just a MySQL shareholder). I was just informed about the deal, after it was agreed to. I did get money for my shares, that is true, but it did not change in any way my dedication or involvement in the MySQL project.</p></htmltext>
<tokenext>FTA : Q : Did n't you sell MySQL to Sun ?
Do you want to have the cake and eat it too ?
First a little background : I started to work on a code that would later become MySQL in 1982 .
MySQL was released in 1995 under a dual licensing scheme that allowed David Axmark and me to very quickly work full time on developing MySQL.I lost the rights to the MySQL copyright in 2001 when MySQL AB was created and we allowed investors to come in .
We needed to bring in investors to be able to create a full-scale working company to satisfy big customers and to be able to hire more developers and take MySQL to the next stage .
To ensure that MySQL would continue to be free , David and I stated in the shareholder agreement that MySQL AB would have to keep MySQL under an open source license .
The problem with a shareholder agreement is that it is terminated when the company is sold .
This is just how things works.David and I however thought that this would not be a problem , as we would help ensure that MySQL would be bought by a good owner.I continued to lead the MySQL project and have been one of the leaders and top contributors for the project since then.When the sales process to Sun started , I was at the time not anymore in the MySQL Board ( just a MySQL shareholder ) .
I was just informed about the deal , after it was agreed to .
I did get money for my shares , that is true , but it did not change in any way my dedication or involvement in the MySQL project .</tokentext>
<sentencetext>FTA: Q: Didn't you sell MySQL to Sun?
Do you want to have the cake and eat it too?
First a little background:I started to work on a code that would later become MySQL in 1982.
MySQL was released in 1995 under a dual licensing scheme that allowed David Axmark and me to very quickly work full time on developing MySQL.I lost the rights to the MySQL copyright in 2001 when MySQL AB was created and we allowed investors to come in.
We needed to bring in investors to be able to create a full-scale working company to satisfy big customers and to be able to hire more developers and take MySQL to the next stage.
To ensure that MySQL would continue to be free, David and I stated in the shareholder agreement that MySQL AB would have to keep MySQL under an open source license.
The problem with a shareholder agreement is that it is terminated when the company is sold.
This is just how things works.David and I however thought that this would not be a problem, as we would help ensure that MySQL would be bought by a good owner.I continued to lead the MySQL project and have been one of the leaders and top contributors for the project since then.When the sales process to Sun started, I was at the time not anymore in the MySQL Board (just a MySQL shareholder).
I was just informed about the deal, after it was agreed to.
I did get money for my shares, that is true, but it did not change in any way my dedication or involvement in the MySQL project.</sentencetext>
	<parent>http://www.semanticweb.org/ontologies/ConversationInstances.owl#comment10_01_04_1548235.30641574</parent>
</comment>
<comment>
	<id>http://www.semanticweb.org/ontologies/ConversationInstances.owl#comment10_01_04_1548235.30643980</id>
	<title>Re:Own fault</title>
	<author>Kagato</author>
	<datestamp>1262633820000</datestamp>
	<modclass>Interestin</modclass>
	<modscore>2</modscore>
	<htmltext><p>Basically Monty fell into the classic pitfall technical people with great ideas fall into.  In order to have the successful project they need money.  Money in these situations typically comes from venture capital firms (investors).  The stated strategy of many firms is to remove the founders (in particular when they come from a technical background) from the business side of the organization.  Once a VC and their slate of investors is on the board with a significant share of the equity the downfall of the founders is assured.  Sometimes they allow the technical folks to be in charge of R&amp;D, more often than not they are shown the door (with a large chunk of money and stock in-hand).</p><p>Products based on Open Source encourages VC firms to play nicer with company founders, but make no mistake, most VC firms want to make as much money as they can off a deal, and that usually involves selling it to a larger fish.  Once a sale has occurred the stock a company founder would have is seriously diluted where at most they are a mid-tier shareholder.</p></htmltext>
<tokenext>Basically Monty fell into the classic pitfall technical people with great ideas fall into .
In order to have the successful project they need money .
Money in these situations typically comes from venture capital firms ( investors ) .
The stated strategy of many firms is to remove the founders ( in particular when they come from a technical background ) from the business side of the organization .
Once a VC and their slate of investors is on the board with a significant share of the equity the downfall of the founders is assured .
Sometimes they allow the technical folks to be in charge of R&amp;D , more often than not they are shown the door ( with a large chunk of money and stock in-hand ) .Products based on Open Source encourages VC firms to play nicer with company founders , but make no mistake , most VC firms want to make as much money as they can off a deal , and that usually involves selling it to a larger fish .
Once a sale has occurred the stock a company founder would have is seriously diluted where at most they are a mid-tier shareholder .</tokentext>
<sentencetext>Basically Monty fell into the classic pitfall technical people with great ideas fall into.
In order to have the successful project they need money.
Money in these situations typically comes from venture capital firms (investors).
The stated strategy of many firms is to remove the founders (in particular when they come from a technical background) from the business side of the organization.
Once a VC and their slate of investors is on the board with a significant share of the equity the downfall of the founders is assured.
Sometimes they allow the technical folks to be in charge of R&amp;D, more often than not they are shown the door (with a large chunk of money and stock in-hand).Products based on Open Source encourages VC firms to play nicer with company founders, but make no mistake, most VC firms want to make as much money as they can off a deal, and that usually involves selling it to a larger fish.
Once a sale has occurred the stock a company founder would have is seriously diluted where at most they are a mid-tier shareholder.</sentencetext>
	<parent>http://www.semanticweb.org/ontologies/ConversationInstances.owl#comment10_01_04_1548235.30642044</parent>
</comment>
<comment>
	<id>http://www.semanticweb.org/ontologies/ConversationInstances.owl#comment10_01_04_1548235.30642702</id>
	<title>Didn't he get a billion dollars?</title>
	<author>tjstork</author>
	<datestamp>1262628300000</datestamp>
	<modclass>Insightful</modclass>
	<modscore>2</modscore>
	<htmltext><p>I'm sorry, but Monty sold his baby, and got well paid for it.  If I could sell any program I wrote for a fraction of what he sold MySQL for, and they kicked me out of working on it, I could do any number of any other things I wanted to work on in life.  Come on Monty, attack P=NP.  It's not like you need a job.</p></htmltext>
<tokenext>I 'm sorry , but Monty sold his baby , and got well paid for it .
If I could sell any program I wrote for a fraction of what he sold MySQL for , and they kicked me out of working on it , I could do any number of any other things I wanted to work on in life .
Come on Monty , attack P = NP .
It 's not like you need a job .</tokentext>
<sentencetext>I'm sorry, but Monty sold his baby, and got well paid for it.
If I could sell any program I wrote for a fraction of what he sold MySQL for, and they kicked me out of working on it, I could do any number of any other things I wanted to work on in life.
Come on Monty, attack P=NP.
It's not like you need a job.</sentencetext>
</comment>
<comment>
	<id>http://www.semanticweb.org/ontologies/ConversationInstances.owl#comment10_01_04_1548235.30641948</id>
	<title>Re:Own fault</title>
	<author>Antique Geekmeister</author>
	<datestamp>1262625600000</datestamp>
	<modclass>Interestin</modclass>
	<modscore>2</modscore>
	<htmltext><p>More like breaking up with his wife, signing the divorce papers and custody agreements, but now she wants to move to another state where access to his kids will be far more difficult. Because Monty went with the dual licensing model, he thought he could retain his business model as well.</p><p>This is \_exactly\_ the sort of wanting to have your cake and eat it, too, model that the GPL helps \_avoid\_. The situation is in fact mislabeled as a GPL issue. It was the dual model, GPL for the core and BSD for business ventures model that Sun used and that Monty's later business ventures are based on, and that is now at risk.</p></htmltext>
<tokenext>More like breaking up with his wife , signing the divorce papers and custody agreements , but now she wants to move to another state where access to his kids will be far more difficult .
Because Monty went with the dual licensing model , he thought he could retain his business model as well.This is \ _exactly \ _ the sort of wanting to have your cake and eat it , too , model that the GPL helps \ _avoid \ _ .
The situation is in fact mislabeled as a GPL issue .
It was the dual model , GPL for the core and BSD for business ventures model that Sun used and that Monty 's later business ventures are based on , and that is now at risk .</tokentext>
<sentencetext>More like breaking up with his wife, signing the divorce papers and custody agreements, but now she wants to move to another state where access to his kids will be far more difficult.
Because Monty went with the dual licensing model, he thought he could retain his business model as well.This is \_exactly\_ the sort of wanting to have your cake and eat it, too, model that the GPL helps \_avoid\_.
The situation is in fact mislabeled as a GPL issue.
It was the dual model, GPL for the core and BSD for business ventures model that Sun used and that Monty's later business ventures are based on, and that is now at risk.</sentencetext>
	<parent>http://www.semanticweb.org/ontologies/ConversationInstances.owl#comment10_01_04_1548235.30641574</parent>
</comment>
<comment>
	<id>http://www.semanticweb.org/ontologies/ConversationInstances.owl#comment10_01_04_1548235.30651740</id>
	<title>Re:Own fault</title>
	<author>Anonymous</author>
	<datestamp>1262632140000</datestamp>
	<modclass>None</modclass>
	<modscore>0</modscore>
	<htmltext><p>My first impression was more like divorcing your wife to find out she's on her way to kill your child.</p></htmltext>
<tokenext>My first impression was more like divorcing your wife to find out she 's on her way to kill your child .</tokentext>
<sentencetext>My first impression was more like divorcing your wife to find out she's on her way to kill your child.</sentencetext>
	<parent>http://www.semanticweb.org/ontologies/ConversationInstances.owl#comment10_01_04_1548235.30641712</parent>
</comment>
<comment>
	<id>http://www.semanticweb.org/ontologies/ConversationInstances.owl#comment10_01_04_1548235.30642530</id>
	<title>Re:It seems to be GPL so . . . so what?</title>
	<author>vlm</author>
	<datestamp>1262627760000</datestamp>
	<modclass>Informativ</modclass>
	<modscore>2</modscore>
	<htmltext><p><div class="quote"><p>I also don't entirely understand why one would buy a proprietary license for a GPL product?</p></div><p>Read the GPL.  It specifically prevents a variety of antisocial activities like not releasing the source code, not releasing it as a part of a non GPL program, etc.</p><p>If you can buy the same code under another license that basically has no obligations other than "send us the money", then you have<nobr> <wbr></nobr>... no obligations, which can be convenient primarily for anti-social folks.  Dual licensing is basically the equivalent of the catholic church selling indulgences, its OK to sin, if you send us some cold hard cash.</p></div>
	</htmltext>
<tokenext>I also do n't entirely understand why one would buy a proprietary license for a GPL product ? Read the GPL .
It specifically prevents a variety of antisocial activities like not releasing the source code , not releasing it as a part of a non GPL program , etc.If you can buy the same code under another license that basically has no obligations other than " send us the money " , then you have ... no obligations , which can be convenient primarily for anti-social folks .
Dual licensing is basically the equivalent of the catholic church selling indulgences , its OK to sin , if you send us some cold hard cash .</tokentext>
<sentencetext>I also don't entirely understand why one would buy a proprietary license for a GPL product?Read the GPL.
It specifically prevents a variety of antisocial activities like not releasing the source code, not releasing it as a part of a non GPL program, etc.If you can buy the same code under another license that basically has no obligations other than "send us the money", then you have ... no obligations, which can be convenient primarily for anti-social folks.
Dual licensing is basically the equivalent of the catholic church selling indulgences, its OK to sin, if you send us some cold hard cash.
	</sentencetext>
	<parent>http://www.semanticweb.org/ontologies/ConversationInstances.owl#comment10_01_04_1548235.30642328</parent>
</comment>
<comment>
	<id>http://www.semanticweb.org/ontologies/ConversationInstances.owl#comment10_01_04_1548235.30641702</id>
	<title>C'mon man...</title>
	<author>raftpeople</author>
	<datestamp>1262624760000</datestamp>
	<modclass>Funny</modclass>
	<modscore>3</modscore>
	<htmltext>don't Monty me on this deal!</htmltext>
<tokenext>do n't Monty me on this deal !</tokentext>
<sentencetext>don't Monty me on this deal!</sentencetext>
</comment>
<comment>
	<id>http://www.semanticweb.org/ontologies/ConversationInstances.owl#comment10_01_04_1548235.30642778</id>
	<title>Re:Own fault</title>
	<author>Anonymous</author>
	<datestamp>1262628660000</datestamp>
	<modclass>None</modclass>
	<modscore>0</modscore>
	<htmltext><p>Monty is a big hypocrite. If he is sincere with MySQL. he should not have sold it in the first place. Now if he wants it saved, let him buy back MySQL from Sun with the tons of money he raked in. I seriously doubt he would do this.</p></htmltext>
<tokenext>Monty is a big hypocrite .
If he is sincere with MySQL .
he should not have sold it in the first place .
Now if he wants it saved , let him buy back MySQL from Sun with the tons of money he raked in .
I seriously doubt he would do this .</tokentext>
<sentencetext>Monty is a big hypocrite.
If he is sincere with MySQL.
he should not have sold it in the first place.
Now if he wants it saved, let him buy back MySQL from Sun with the tons of money he raked in.
I seriously doubt he would do this.</sentencetext>
	<parent>http://www.semanticweb.org/ontologies/ConversationInstances.owl#comment10_01_04_1548235.30641574</parent>
</comment>
<comment>
	<id>http://www.semanticweb.org/ontologies/ConversationInstances.owl#comment10_01_04_1548235.30642314</id>
	<title>It was sold</title>
	<author>Anonymous</author>
	<datestamp>1262627040000</datestamp>
	<modclass>None</modclass>
	<modscore>0</modscore>
	<htmltext><p>He made his choice: he took the cash.  If he wants to change his mind, he can buy it back.</p><p>Perhaps Monty has never seen the show <a href="http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Let's\_Make\_a\_Deal" title="wikipedia.org" rel="nofollow">"Let's Make a Deal"</a> [wikipedia.org]?  If the curtains open on your choice of door #1 and you've discovered you won the goat, it's too late to bargain.</p><p>Or, if it was the host that opened the door on the goat, he could switch his choice and pick door #2 (postgresql), which might be a better deal.</p></htmltext>
<tokenext>He made his choice : he took the cash .
If he wants to change his mind , he can buy it back.Perhaps Monty has never seen the show " Let 's Make a Deal " [ wikipedia.org ] ?
If the curtains open on your choice of door # 1 and you 've discovered you won the goat , it 's too late to bargain.Or , if it was the host that opened the door on the goat , he could switch his choice and pick door # 2 ( postgresql ) , which might be a better deal .</tokentext>
<sentencetext>He made his choice: he took the cash.
If he wants to change his mind, he can buy it back.Perhaps Monty has never seen the show "Let's Make a Deal" [wikipedia.org]?
If the curtains open on your choice of door #1 and you've discovered you won the goat, it's too late to bargain.Or, if it was the host that opened the door on the goat, he could switch his choice and pick door #2 (postgresql), which might be a better deal.</sentencetext>
</comment>
<comment>
	<id>http://www.semanticweb.org/ontologies/ConversationInstances.owl#comment10_01_04_1548235.30642076</id>
	<title>Re:He got paid. It's GPL.</title>
	<author>corbettw</author>
	<datestamp>1262626140000</datestamp>
	<modclass>None</modclass>
	<modscore>1</modscore>
	<htmltext><p>Given the way this guy is whining and begging rather than just doing something about it, I'd say MySQL is already forked.</p></htmltext>
<tokenext>Given the way this guy is whining and begging rather than just doing something about it , I 'd say MySQL is already forked .</tokentext>
<sentencetext>Given the way this guy is whining and begging rather than just doing something about it, I'd say MySQL is already forked.</sentencetext>
	<parent>http://www.semanticweb.org/ontologies/ConversationInstances.owl#comment10_01_04_1548235.30641664</parent>
</comment>
<comment>
	<id>http://www.semanticweb.org/ontologies/ConversationInstances.owl#comment10_01_04_1548235.30645048</id>
	<title>Re:Not a valid argument...</title>
	<author>VGPowerlord</author>
	<datestamp>1262638740000</datestamp>
	<modclass>None</modclass>
	<modscore>1</modscore>
	<htmltext><blockquote><div><blockquote><div><p>I understand the concern - that MySQL will be an in-house "competitor" for resources to Oracle's database. However, why wouldn't they be complimentary?</p></div></blockquote><p>That's the big mystery.</p><p>Microsoft seems to be doing ok with both SQL Server and SQL Server Express. It helps that the migration between the two is mind-numbingly simple.</p><p>If Oracle set up an easy way to migrate from MySQL to Oracle, and they renamed MySQL into "Oracle Express", there you go.</p></div></blockquote><p>Rather than, say, <a href="http://www.oracle.com/technology/products/database/xe/index.html" title="oracle.com">Oracle Database Express Edition</a> [oracle.com] (XE)?</p></div>
	</htmltext>
<tokenext>I understand the concern - that MySQL will be an in-house " competitor " for resources to Oracle 's database .
However , why would n't they be complimentary ? That 's the big mystery.Microsoft seems to be doing ok with both SQL Server and SQL Server Express .
It helps that the migration between the two is mind-numbingly simple.If Oracle set up an easy way to migrate from MySQL to Oracle , and they renamed MySQL into " Oracle Express " , there you go.Rather than , say , Oracle Database Express Edition [ oracle.com ] ( XE ) ?</tokentext>
<sentencetext>I understand the concern - that MySQL will be an in-house "competitor" for resources to Oracle's database.
However, why wouldn't they be complimentary?That's the big mystery.Microsoft seems to be doing ok with both SQL Server and SQL Server Express.
It helps that the migration between the two is mind-numbingly simple.If Oracle set up an easy way to migrate from MySQL to Oracle, and they renamed MySQL into "Oracle Express", there you go.Rather than, say, Oracle Database Express Edition [oracle.com] (XE)?
	</sentencetext>
	<parent>http://www.semanticweb.org/ontologies/ConversationInstances.owl#comment10_01_04_1548235.30643850</parent>
</comment>
<comment>
	<id>http://www.semanticweb.org/ontologies/ConversationInstances.owl#comment10_01_04_1548235.30643568</id>
	<title>If you wanted it saved ...</title>
	<author>Anonymous</author>
	<datestamp>1262632140000</datestamp>
	<modclass>None</modclass>
	<modscore>0</modscore>
	<htmltext><p>then you shouldn't have sold it to Sun in the first place, dumb-ass. This sets a bad precedent - get some company to buy you open source product for a tidy sum of money, and then back-pedal and start a petition to have it return to open-source.</p></htmltext>
<tokenext>then you should n't have sold it to Sun in the first place , dumb-ass .
This sets a bad precedent - get some company to buy you open source product for a tidy sum of money , and then back-pedal and start a petition to have it return to open-source .</tokentext>
<sentencetext>then you shouldn't have sold it to Sun in the first place, dumb-ass.
This sets a bad precedent - get some company to buy you open source product for a tidy sum of money, and then back-pedal and start a petition to have it return to open-source.</sentencetext>
</comment>
<comment>
	<id>http://www.semanticweb.org/ontologies/ConversationInstances.owl#comment10_01_04_1548235.30644686</id>
	<title>Re:pgsql is NOT FREE!</title>
	<author>Unequivocal</author>
	<datestamp>1262637120000</datestamp>
	<modclass>None</modclass>
	<modscore>1</modscore>
	<htmltext><p>Oh shit! Apache's not free either. And crap, Ruby on Rails is MIT licensed. The sky is falling.</p></htmltext>
<tokenext>Oh shit !
Apache 's not free either .
And crap , Ruby on Rails is MIT licensed .
The sky is falling .</tokentext>
<sentencetext>Oh shit!
Apache's not free either.
And crap, Ruby on Rails is MIT licensed.
The sky is falling.</sentencetext>
	<parent>http://www.semanticweb.org/ontologies/ConversationInstances.owl#comment10_01_04_1548235.30642162</parent>
</comment>
<comment>
	<id>http://www.semanticweb.org/ontologies/ConversationInstances.owl#comment10_01_04_1548235.30642852</id>
	<title>It doesn't matter.  Fork it.</title>
	<author>mmell</author>
	<datestamp>1262628960000</datestamp>
	<modclass>Informativ</modclass>
	<modscore>2</modscore>
	<htmltext>I mean, it's (still) just another open source project, isn't it?  Fork it.<p>
And fork you too, Monty/Sun/Oracle.</p></htmltext>
<tokenext>I mean , it 's ( still ) just another open source project , is n't it ?
Fork it .
And fork you too , Monty/Sun/Oracle .</tokentext>
<sentencetext>I mean, it's (still) just another open source project, isn't it?
Fork it.
And fork you too, Monty/Sun/Oracle.</sentencetext>
</comment>
<comment>
	<id>http://www.semanticweb.org/ontologies/ConversationInstances.owl#comment10_01_04_1548235.30643044</id>
	<title>Why keep being abused?</title>
	<author>Anonymous</author>
	<datestamp>1262629740000</datestamp>
	<modclass>None</modclass>
	<modscore>0</modscore>
	<htmltext><p><i>In his blog he calls upon the MySQL users to "Help keep the Internet free" by signing his petition.</i></p><p>Internet Freedom has nothing to do with MySQL.</p><p>And really, given the past treatment - why bother with MySQL?   Other choices exist.</p></htmltext>
<tokenext>In his blog he calls upon the MySQL users to " Help keep the Internet free " by signing his petition.Internet Freedom has nothing to do with MySQL.And really , given the past treatment - why bother with MySQL ?
Other choices exist .</tokentext>
<sentencetext>In his blog he calls upon the MySQL users to "Help keep the Internet free" by signing his petition.Internet Freedom has nothing to do with MySQL.And really, given the past treatment - why bother with MySQL?
Other choices exist.</sentencetext>
</comment>
<comment>
	<id>http://www.semanticweb.org/ontologies/ConversationInstances.owl#comment10_01_04_1548235.30641906</id>
	<title>Monty NoLastName</title>
	<author>Anonymous</author>
	<datestamp>1262625480000</datestamp>
	<modclass>None</modclass>
	<modscore>1</modscore>
	<htmltext><p>Wow, must be nice to be as famous as Madonna and no longer need a last name.</p></htmltext>
<tokenext>Wow , must be nice to be as famous as Madonna and no longer need a last name .</tokentext>
<sentencetext>Wow, must be nice to be as famous as Madonna and no longer need a last name.</sentencetext>
</comment>
<comment>
	<id>http://www.semanticweb.org/ontologies/ConversationInstances.owl#comment10_01_04_1548235.30642796</id>
	<title>Re:And how much money did he make from it?</title>
	<author>Anonymous</author>
	<datestamp>1262628720000</datestamp>
	<modclass>None</modclass>
	<modscore>0</modscore>
	<htmltext><p>Hey, it worked for the guys who built Skype. Why not take a page out of their play book.</p></htmltext>
<tokenext>Hey , it worked for the guys who built Skype .
Why not take a page out of their play book .</tokentext>
<sentencetext>Hey, it worked for the guys who built Skype.
Why not take a page out of their play book.</sentencetext>
	<parent>http://www.semanticweb.org/ontologies/ConversationInstances.owl#comment10_01_04_1548235.30641884</parent>
</comment>
<comment>
	<id>http://www.semanticweb.org/ontologies/ConversationInstances.owl#comment10_01_04_1548235.30643712</id>
	<title>Re:Me too!</title>
	<author>Blakey Rat</author>
	<datestamp>1262632680000</datestamp>
	<modclass>None</modclass>
	<modscore>1</modscore>
	<htmltext><p>Yah. Like... this empty Coke can. Or a box of Cheerios.</p><p>Any offers?</p></htmltext>
<tokenext>Yah .
Like... this empty Coke can .
Or a box of Cheerios.Any offers ?</tokentext>
<sentencetext>Yah.
Like... this empty Coke can.
Or a box of Cheerios.Any offers?</sentencetext>
	<parent>http://www.semanticweb.org/ontologies/ConversationInstances.owl#comment10_01_04_1548235.30641586</parent>
</comment>
<comment>
	<id>http://www.semanticweb.org/ontologies/ConversationInstances.owl#comment10_01_04_1548235.30642882</id>
	<title>No, try some REAL slashdot terms</title>
	<author>A nonymous Coward</author>
	<datestamp>1262629020000</datestamp>
	<modclass>Funny</modclass>
	<modscore>2</modscore>
	<htmltext><p><div class="quote"><p>It's like you broke up with your car and then go crying it back when it has found a new owner, while you're having no luck finding another car.</p></div><p>It's like you broke up with your parents and then go crying back when they have found a new tenant, while you're having no luck finding another basement.</p></div>
	</htmltext>
<tokenext>It 's like you broke up with your car and then go crying it back when it has found a new owner , while you 're having no luck finding another car.It 's like you broke up with your parents and then go crying back when they have found a new tenant , while you 're having no luck finding another basement .</tokentext>
<sentencetext>It's like you broke up with your car and then go crying it back when it has found a new owner, while you're having no luck finding another car.It's like you broke up with your parents and then go crying back when they have found a new tenant, while you're having no luck finding another basement.
	</sentencetext>
	<parent>http://www.semanticweb.org/ontologies/ConversationInstances.owl#comment10_01_04_1548235.30641712</parent>
</comment>
<comment>
	<id>http://www.semanticweb.org/ontologies/ConversationInstances.owl#comment10_01_04_1548235.30642490</id>
	<title>OMG tehy r killin my BABY</title>
	<author>Just!nVix</author>
	<datestamp>1262627640000</datestamp>
	<modclass>Insightful</modclass>
	<modscore>2</modscore>
	<htmltext>Sooo, To understand the basics here...<br>
Monty wants to keep the internet free, and that is somehow connected to his old, crappy product being "freed" from the rightful owner. Uhuh, riiiiight.<br>
<br>
I read the tripe of a blog-entry, and I am disgusted. This man seems to write as bad as he codes. Aside from quite healthy competition, PostgreSQL comes to mind. Especially the feature of stored procedures (don't bitch, I am sure they included that after Monty sold it.)<br>
<br>
First and foremost, I need to point out the painfully obvious:<br>
<b>The Infrastructure of the Internet is NOT free.</b> The pipes are owned by companies, and they can rightfully charge for the usage. No second-rate celebunerd can change that. You have to be be BONO to be recognized beyond a casual<nobr> <wbr></nobr>/. entry, and even the glorious Number 2 (southpark reference) has problems with his logic on property rights (when it suits his coffers).<br>
<br>
To add to that, Oracle, in all their evil splendor, has the complete right, if it owns SUN, to modify, improve, abolish any and all property that came with the purchase. Who knows, maybe they will turn MySQL into something usable by serious programmers! Oh, wait, they HAVE a product, closed source, that has been established to work for decades, and that profitable companies pay good money for when it comes to managing data... I am shocked and awed!<br>
<br>
I know this is a very difficult thing to understand for you young freetards out there: Stuff costs money. Things and services. Like iPods, cleaning cars, using the turnpike, going to the pool, beer, hookers, and other fun stuff.<br>
<br>
And again, why is there no concerted effort to produce a GOOD product? MySQL can go away tomorrow and no one will give a flying rat's ass. Your SQL statements will still work, and all those young PHP coders will flock to competitors that suits their freetard mentality.<br>
<br>
Maybe someone can explain to me that whole FREE mentality. Somehow, everything has to be free if you WANT it. And then what? The pattern keeps emerging that those pining for the FREE fjords fail to differentiate other people's work from theirs. Others should provide free tools, free software, free this free that. But somehow, they want to charge for the result of using said tools.<br>
That, Gentlemen (and those high regarded few Ladies), is the problem here.<br>
<br>
I call Monty in reference to a Family Guy episode: HE IS A BIG FAT PHONY<br>
\_\_\_\_\_\_\_\_\_\_\_\_\_\_\_\_\_\_\_\_\_\_\_\_\_\_\_\_\_\_\_<br><nobr> <wbr></nobr>... Now, keep sending those letters.</htmltext>
<tokenext>Sooo , To understand the basics here.. . Monty wants to keep the internet free , and that is somehow connected to his old , crappy product being " freed " from the rightful owner .
Uhuh , riiiiight .
I read the tripe of a blog-entry , and I am disgusted .
This man seems to write as bad as he codes .
Aside from quite healthy competition , PostgreSQL comes to mind .
Especially the feature of stored procedures ( do n't bitch , I am sure they included that after Monty sold it .
) First and foremost , I need to point out the painfully obvious : The Infrastructure of the Internet is NOT free .
The pipes are owned by companies , and they can rightfully charge for the usage .
No second-rate celebunerd can change that .
You have to be be BONO to be recognized beyond a casual / .
entry , and even the glorious Number 2 ( southpark reference ) has problems with his logic on property rights ( when it suits his coffers ) .
To add to that , Oracle , in all their evil splendor , has the complete right , if it owns SUN , to modify , improve , abolish any and all property that came with the purchase .
Who knows , maybe they will turn MySQL into something usable by serious programmers !
Oh , wait , they HAVE a product , closed source , that has been established to work for decades , and that profitable companies pay good money for when it comes to managing data... I am shocked and awed !
I know this is a very difficult thing to understand for you young freetards out there : Stuff costs money .
Things and services .
Like iPods , cleaning cars , using the turnpike , going to the pool , beer , hookers , and other fun stuff .
And again , why is there no concerted effort to produce a GOOD product ?
MySQL can go away tomorrow and no one will give a flying rat 's ass .
Your SQL statements will still work , and all those young PHP coders will flock to competitors that suits their freetard mentality .
Maybe someone can explain to me that whole FREE mentality .
Somehow , everything has to be free if you WANT it .
And then what ?
The pattern keeps emerging that those pining for the FREE fjords fail to differentiate other people 's work from theirs .
Others should provide free tools , free software , free this free that .
But somehow , they want to charge for the result of using said tools .
That , Gentlemen ( and those high regarded few Ladies ) , is the problem here .
I call Monty in reference to a Family Guy episode : HE IS A BIG FAT PHONY \ _ \ _ \ _ \ _ \ _ \ _ \ _ \ _ \ _ \ _ \ _ \ _ \ _ \ _ \ _ \ _ \ _ \ _ \ _ \ _ \ _ \ _ \ _ \ _ \ _ \ _ \ _ \ _ \ _ \ _ \ _ ... Now , keep sending those letters .</tokentext>
<sentencetext>Sooo, To understand the basics here...
Monty wants to keep the internet free, and that is somehow connected to his old, crappy product being "freed" from the rightful owner.
Uhuh, riiiiight.
I read the tripe of a blog-entry, and I am disgusted.
This man seems to write as bad as he codes.
Aside from quite healthy competition, PostgreSQL comes to mind.
Especially the feature of stored procedures (don't bitch, I am sure they included that after Monty sold it.
)

First and foremost, I need to point out the painfully obvious:
The Infrastructure of the Internet is NOT free.
The pipes are owned by companies, and they can rightfully charge for the usage.
No second-rate celebunerd can change that.
You have to be be BONO to be recognized beyond a casual /.
entry, and even the glorious Number 2 (southpark reference) has problems with his logic on property rights (when it suits his coffers).
To add to that, Oracle, in all their evil splendor, has the complete right, if it owns SUN, to modify, improve, abolish any and all property that came with the purchase.
Who knows, maybe they will turn MySQL into something usable by serious programmers!
Oh, wait, they HAVE a product, closed source, that has been established to work for decades, and that profitable companies pay good money for when it comes to managing data... I am shocked and awed!
I know this is a very difficult thing to understand for you young freetards out there: Stuff costs money.
Things and services.
Like iPods, cleaning cars, using the turnpike, going to the pool, beer, hookers, and other fun stuff.
And again, why is there no concerted effort to produce a GOOD product?
MySQL can go away tomorrow and no one will give a flying rat's ass.
Your SQL statements will still work, and all those young PHP coders will flock to competitors that suits their freetard mentality.
Maybe someone can explain to me that whole FREE mentality.
Somehow, everything has to be free if you WANT it.
And then what?
The pattern keeps emerging that those pining for the FREE fjords fail to differentiate other people's work from theirs.
Others should provide free tools, free software, free this free that.
But somehow, they want to charge for the result of using said tools.
That, Gentlemen (and those high regarded few Ladies), is the problem here.
I call Monty in reference to a Family Guy episode: HE IS A BIG FAT PHONY
\_\_\_\_\_\_\_\_\_\_\_\_\_\_\_\_\_\_\_\_\_\_\_\_\_\_\_\_\_\_\_ ... Now, keep sending those letters.</sentencetext>
</comment>
<comment>
	<id>http://www.semanticweb.org/ontologies/ConversationInstances.owl#comment10_01_04_1548235.30642802</id>
	<title>Re:well...</title>
	<author>Anonymous</author>
	<datestamp>1262628780000</datestamp>
	<modclass>Insightful</modclass>
	<modscore>1</modscore>
	<htmltext><p>What the fuck are you talking about? Monty isn't involved with Microsoft or their Codeplex site.</p><p>Also, Python has never traditionally been part of the "LAMP" stack. The "P" stands for PHP.</p><p>Finally, the LAMP stack has been on its way out for some time now. These days, most new sites developed by sensible developers are built on FLPP (FreeBSD/Lighttpd/PostgreSQL/Python) or FNPP (FreeBSD/Nginx/PostgreSQL/Python) stacks.</p></htmltext>
<tokenext>What the fuck are you talking about ?
Monty is n't involved with Microsoft or their Codeplex site.Also , Python has never traditionally been part of the " LAMP " stack .
The " P " stands for PHP.Finally , the LAMP stack has been on its way out for some time now .
These days , most new sites developed by sensible developers are built on FLPP ( FreeBSD/Lighttpd/PostgreSQL/Python ) or FNPP ( FreeBSD/Nginx/PostgreSQL/Python ) stacks .</tokentext>
<sentencetext>What the fuck are you talking about?
Monty isn't involved with Microsoft or their Codeplex site.Also, Python has never traditionally been part of the "LAMP" stack.
The "P" stands for PHP.Finally, the LAMP stack has been on its way out for some time now.
These days, most new sites developed by sensible developers are built on FLPP (FreeBSD/Lighttpd/PostgreSQL/Python) or FNPP (FreeBSD/Nginx/PostgreSQL/Python) stacks.</sentencetext>
	<parent>http://www.semanticweb.org/ontologies/ConversationInstances.owl#comment10_01_04_1548235.30642158</parent>
</comment>
<comment>
	<id>http://www.semanticweb.org/ontologies/ConversationInstances.owl#comment10_01_04_1548235.30643926</id>
	<title>Maybe he realized money isn't everything...</title>
	<author>Anonymous</author>
	<datestamp>1262633580000</datestamp>
	<modclass>None</modclass>
	<modscore>0</modscore>
	<htmltext><p>Say what you want about his potential greed, MariaDB and looking for a business angle, etc. IMO, it is possible that the $1,000,000,000 (or whatever he actually pocketed) isn't as satisfying to him now that he sees his life's work being flushed down the toilet by Sun's sale to Oracle. You have to consider that maybe, just maybe, this isn't all about money to him.</p></htmltext>
<tokenext>Say what you want about his potential greed , MariaDB and looking for a business angle , etc .
IMO , it is possible that the $ 1,000,000,000 ( or whatever he actually pocketed ) is n't as satisfying to him now that he sees his life 's work being flushed down the toilet by Sun 's sale to Oracle .
You have to consider that maybe , just maybe , this is n't all about money to him .</tokentext>
<sentencetext>Say what you want about his potential greed, MariaDB and looking for a business angle, etc.
IMO, it is possible that the $1,000,000,000 (or whatever he actually pocketed) isn't as satisfying to him now that he sees his life's work being flushed down the toilet by Sun's sale to Oracle.
You have to consider that maybe, just maybe, this isn't all about money to him.</sentencetext>
</comment>
<comment>
	<id>http://www.semanticweb.org/ontologies/ConversationInstances.owl#comment10_01_04_1548235.30642826</id>
	<title>Question</title>
	<author>rudy\_wayne</author>
	<datestamp>1262628840000</datestamp>
	<modclass>Funny</modclass>
	<modscore>2</modscore>
	<htmltext><p>If Oracle cuts MySQL loose, does Monty have to give back the billion dollars?</p></htmltext>
<tokenext>If Oracle cuts MySQL loose , does Monty have to give back the billion dollars ?</tokentext>
<sentencetext>If Oracle cuts MySQL loose, does Monty have to give back the billion dollars?</sentencetext>
</comment>
<comment>
	<id>http://www.semanticweb.org/ontologies/ConversationInstances.owl#comment10_01_04_1548235.30656786</id>
	<title>Re:He got paid. It's GPL.</title>
	<author>Anonymous</author>
	<datestamp>1262714640000</datestamp>
	<modclass>None</modclass>
	<modscore>0</modscore>
	<htmltext><p>Don't forget there is always PostgreSQL!</p></htmltext>
<tokenext>Do n't forget there is always PostgreSQL !</tokentext>
<sentencetext>Don't forget there is always PostgreSQL!</sentencetext>
	<parent>http://www.semanticweb.org/ontologies/ConversationInstances.owl#comment10_01_04_1548235.30641664</parent>
</comment>
<comment>
	<id>http://www.semanticweb.org/ontologies/ConversationInstances.owl#comment10_01_04_1548235.30642058</id>
	<title>Who has shared hosting with PostgreSQL?</title>
	<author>tepples</author>
	<datestamp>1262626080000</datestamp>
	<modclass>None</modclass>
	<modscore>1</modscore>
	<htmltext><p><div class="quote"><p>It's called PostgreSQL.</p></div><p>MySQL has plenty of affordable shared hosting providers. What company do you recommend for hosting web sites based on PostgreSQL?</p></div>
	</htmltext>
<tokenext>It 's called PostgreSQL.MySQL has plenty of affordable shared hosting providers .
What company do you recommend for hosting web sites based on PostgreSQL ?</tokentext>
<sentencetext>It's called PostgreSQL.MySQL has plenty of affordable shared hosting providers.
What company do you recommend for hosting web sites based on PostgreSQL?
	</sentencetext>
	<parent>http://www.semanticweb.org/ontologies/ConversationInstances.owl#comment10_01_04_1548235.30641750</parent>
</comment>
<comment>
	<id>http://www.semanticweb.org/ontologies/ConversationInstances.owl#comment10_01_04_1548235.30645620</id>
	<title>Re:its all in the name.</title>
	<author>Dare nMc</author>
	<datestamp>1262597460000</datestamp>
	<modclass>None</modclass>
	<modscore>1</modscore>
	<htmltext><p>I still agree with the GP, The only thing that this sell could take away, is the right to use the name "MySQL." And possibly any updates that the new owners add to MySQL.  IE we have the code in a GPL license, we can always build from that, we just have to choose a different name if oracle declares their branch of MySQL is no longer open-source.  And also Oracle would become the only one capable of creating new MySQL  pre-priority licenses of MySQL.</p></htmltext>
<tokenext>I still agree with the GP , The only thing that this sell could take away , is the right to use the name " MySQL .
" And possibly any updates that the new owners add to MySQL .
IE we have the code in a GPL license , we can always build from that , we just have to choose a different name if oracle declares their branch of MySQL is no longer open-source .
And also Oracle would become the only one capable of creating new MySQL pre-priority licenses of MySQL .</tokentext>
<sentencetext>I still agree with the GP, The only thing that this sell could take away, is the right to use the name "MySQL.
" And possibly any updates that the new owners add to MySQL.
IE we have the code in a GPL license, we can always build from that, we just have to choose a different name if oracle declares their branch of MySQL is no longer open-source.
And also Oracle would become the only one capable of creating new MySQL  pre-priority licenses of MySQL.</sentencetext>
	<parent>http://www.semanticweb.org/ontologies/ConversationInstances.owl#comment10_01_04_1548235.30642044</parent>
</comment>
<comment>
	<id>http://www.semanticweb.org/ontologies/ConversationInstances.owl#comment10_01_04_1548235.30645318</id>
	<title>Anti-petition</title>
	<author>Lulu of the Lotus-Ea</author>
	<datestamp>1262596440000</datestamp>
	<modclass>None</modclass>
	<modscore>1</modscore>
	<htmltext><p>Is anyone conducting something to counter Monty's money-grabbing schemes.  A counter-petition (in particular, one that got more signatures) that said "We FOSS developers oppose efforts (by Monty) to weaken or violate the protections of the GPL, and insist that MySQL code base remain free, and not be proprietarized by its former developers".  Wording could be better, but something to that effect.</p><p>I would sign in a second, and I suspect thousands of<nobr> <wbr></nobr>/. readers would too.</p></htmltext>
<tokenext>Is anyone conducting something to counter Monty 's money-grabbing schemes .
A counter-petition ( in particular , one that got more signatures ) that said " We FOSS developers oppose efforts ( by Monty ) to weaken or violate the protections of the GPL , and insist that MySQL code base remain free , and not be proprietarized by its former developers " .
Wording could be better , but something to that effect.I would sign in a second , and I suspect thousands of / .
readers would too .</tokentext>
<sentencetext>Is anyone conducting something to counter Monty's money-grabbing schemes.
A counter-petition (in particular, one that got more signatures) that said "We FOSS developers oppose efforts (by Monty) to weaken or violate the protections of the GPL, and insist that MySQL code base remain free, and not be proprietarized by its former developers".
Wording could be better, but something to that effect.I would sign in a second, and I suspect thousands of /.
readers would too.</sentencetext>
</comment>
<comment>
	<id>http://www.semanticweb.org/ontologies/ConversationInstances.owl#comment10_01_04_1548235.30646084</id>
	<title>Re:well...</title>
	<author>Anonymous</author>
	<datestamp>1262599200000</datestamp>
	<modclass>None</modclass>
	<modscore>0</modscore>
	<htmltext><p>What nonsense. Sensible developers build new sites on LNSR (Linux/Nginx/SQLite3/Ruby) these days.</p></htmltext>
<tokenext>What nonsense .
Sensible developers build new sites on LNSR ( Linux/Nginx/SQLite3/Ruby ) these days .</tokentext>
<sentencetext>What nonsense.
Sensible developers build new sites on LNSR (Linux/Nginx/SQLite3/Ruby) these days.</sentencetext>
	<parent>http://www.semanticweb.org/ontologies/ConversationInstances.owl#comment10_01_04_1548235.30642802</parent>
</comment>
<comment>
	<id>http://www.semanticweb.org/ontologies/ConversationInstances.owl#comment10_01_04_1548235.30642912</id>
	<title>Re:He got paid. It's GPL.</title>
	<author>greg1104</author>
	<datestamp>1262629140000</datestamp>
	<modclass>None</modclass>
	<modscore>1</modscore>
	<htmltext><p>The documentation is not GPL, a move defended <a href="http://blogs.sun.com/mysqlf/entry/mysql\_documentation\_no\_license\_change" title="sun.com">quite weakly</a> [sun.com] by Sun.  That article does address one of the real reasons for what Monty is doing though:  "MySQL forks should have their own, specific, documentation".  Monty doesn't want to recreate all that from scratch, so forcing that into more open licensing would make his life easier.</p></htmltext>
<tokenext>The documentation is not GPL , a move defended quite weakly [ sun.com ] by Sun .
That article does address one of the real reasons for what Monty is doing though : " MySQL forks should have their own , specific , documentation " .
Monty does n't want to recreate all that from scratch , so forcing that into more open licensing would make his life easier .</tokentext>
<sentencetext>The documentation is not GPL, a move defended quite weakly [sun.com] by Sun.
That article does address one of the real reasons for what Monty is doing though:  "MySQL forks should have their own, specific, documentation".
Monty doesn't want to recreate all that from scratch, so forcing that into more open licensing would make his life easier.</sentencetext>
	<parent>http://www.semanticweb.org/ontologies/ConversationInstances.owl#comment10_01_04_1548235.30641664</parent>
</comment>
<comment>
	<id>http://www.semanticweb.org/ontologies/ConversationInstances.owl#comment10_01_04_1548235.30642624</id>
	<title>given that he sold it, and for mucho money</title>
	<author>obarthelemy</author>
	<datestamp>1262628060000</datestamp>
	<modclass>None</modclass>
	<modscore>1</modscore>
	<htmltext><p>i find his political bid to try and get it back rather greedy.</p></htmltext>
<tokenext>i find his political bid to try and get it back rather greedy .</tokentext>
<sentencetext>i find his political bid to try and get it back rather greedy.</sentencetext>
</comment>
<comment>
	<id>http://www.semanticweb.org/ontologies/ConversationInstances.owl#comment10_01_04_1548235.30642362</id>
	<title>Postgres is a superior alternative</title>
	<author>Anonymous</author>
	<datestamp>1262627220000</datestamp>
	<modclass>None</modclass>
	<modscore>0</modscore>
	<htmltext><p>Anyone who is worried about MySQL should try postgres. If you've written your app correctly you can probably switch over seamlessly.</p></htmltext>
<tokenext>Anyone who is worried about MySQL should try postgres .
If you 've written your app correctly you can probably switch over seamlessly .</tokentext>
<sentencetext>Anyone who is worried about MySQL should try postgres.
If you've written your app correctly you can probably switch over seamlessly.</sentencetext>
</comment>
<comment>
	<id>http://www.semanticweb.org/ontologies/ConversationInstances.owl#comment10_01_04_1548235.30642648</id>
	<title>He's also spamming by e-mail (IMO)...</title>
	<author>Anonymous</author>
	<datestamp>1262628180000</datestamp>
	<modclass>Informativ</modclass>
	<modscore>1</modscore>
	<htmltext><p>He definitely learned some new tricks so it seems. On my company e-mail address I got the following e-mail, and I can assure you that I did <b>not</b> apply to be kept informed about MySQL on their website. Maybe a post on a mailinglist or two, but thats it. Nevertheless, I received the following e-mail:</p><p>Hi!</p><p>I am contacting you because you have in the past shown interest in<br>MySQL and from that I assume you are interested in the future<br>well-being of MySQL.</p><p>Now you have a unique opportunity to make a difference.  By signing<br>the petition at <a href="http://www.helpmysql.org/" title="helpmysql.org" rel="nofollow">http://www.helpmysql.org/</a> [helpmysql.org] you can help affect the<br>future of MySQL as an Open Source database.</p><p>You can find more information of this on my latest blog post at:<br><a href="http://monty-says.blogspot.com/2009/12/help-keep-internet-free.html" title="blogspot.com" rel="nofollow">http://monty-says.blogspot.com/2009/12/help-keep-internet-free.html</a> [blogspot.com]</p><p>Help us spread the world about this petition!<br><a href="http://www.helpmysql.org/" title="helpmysql.org" rel="nofollow">http://www.helpmysql.org/</a> [helpmysql.org] is available in 18 languages and every vote<br>is important, independent of from where in the world it comes!<br>If you know people that are using MySQL, please contact them and<br>ensure they also sign the petition!</p><p>Regards,<br>Monty<br>Creator of MySQL</p><p>PS: If you already have signed the petition or know about it, sorry for<br>
&nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; reminding you about this! Because of the importance of this issue,<br>
&nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; I am trying to contact every person that I have ever communicated<br>
&nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; with regarding MySQL.</p><p>One has to wonder...</p><p>Because I do care about MySQL but don't care for this petition I visited the website, read his blog (the least you can do is hear someone out) and wrote a somewhat cynical but polite comment how I felt about this action. Surprise; surprise; it never appeared on the (moderated) blog responses. And thats where I have to wonder if he's doing his best for a decent and honest attempt to help MySQL or if he's working out an hidden agenda...</p><p>I for one don't think this is doing the good reputation of MySQL any good.</p></htmltext>
<tokenext>He definitely learned some new tricks so it seems .
On my company e-mail address I got the following e-mail , and I can assure you that I did not apply to be kept informed about MySQL on their website .
Maybe a post on a mailinglist or two , but thats it .
Nevertheless , I received the following e-mail : Hi ! I am contacting you because you have in the past shown interest inMySQL and from that I assume you are interested in the futurewell-being of MySQL.Now you have a unique opportunity to make a difference .
By signingthe petition at http : //www.helpmysql.org/ [ helpmysql.org ] you can help affect thefuture of MySQL as an Open Source database.You can find more information of this on my latest blog post at : http : //monty-says.blogspot.com/2009/12/help-keep-internet-free.html [ blogspot.com ] Help us spread the world about this petition ! http : //www.helpmysql.org/ [ helpmysql.org ] is available in 18 languages and every voteis important , independent of from where in the world it comes ! If you know people that are using MySQL , please contact them andensure they also sign the petition ! Regards,MontyCreator of MySQLPS : If you already have signed the petition or know about it , sorry for         reminding you about this !
Because of the importance of this issue ,         I am trying to contact every person that I have ever communicated         with regarding MySQL.One has to wonder...Because I do care about MySQL but do n't care for this petition I visited the website , read his blog ( the least you can do is hear someone out ) and wrote a somewhat cynical but polite comment how I felt about this action .
Surprise ; surprise ; it never appeared on the ( moderated ) blog responses .
And thats where I have to wonder if he 's doing his best for a decent and honest attempt to help MySQL or if he 's working out an hidden agenda...I for one do n't think this is doing the good reputation of MySQL any good .</tokentext>
<sentencetext>He definitely learned some new tricks so it seems.
On my company e-mail address I got the following e-mail, and I can assure you that I did not apply to be kept informed about MySQL on their website.
Maybe a post on a mailinglist or two, but thats it.
Nevertheless, I received the following e-mail:Hi!I am contacting you because you have in the past shown interest inMySQL and from that I assume you are interested in the futurewell-being of MySQL.Now you have a unique opportunity to make a difference.
By signingthe petition at http://www.helpmysql.org/ [helpmysql.org] you can help affect thefuture of MySQL as an Open Source database.You can find more information of this on my latest blog post at:http://monty-says.blogspot.com/2009/12/help-keep-internet-free.html [blogspot.com]Help us spread the world about this petition!http://www.helpmysql.org/ [helpmysql.org] is available in 18 languages and every voteis important, independent of from where in the world it comes!If you know people that are using MySQL, please contact them andensure they also sign the petition!Regards,MontyCreator of MySQLPS: If you already have signed the petition or know about it, sorry for
        reminding you about this!
Because of the importance of this issue,
        I am trying to contact every person that I have ever communicated
        with regarding MySQL.One has to wonder...Because I do care about MySQL but don't care for this petition I visited the website, read his blog (the least you can do is hear someone out) and wrote a somewhat cynical but polite comment how I felt about this action.
Surprise; surprise; it never appeared on the (moderated) blog responses.
And thats where I have to wonder if he's doing his best for a decent and honest attempt to help MySQL or if he's working out an hidden agenda...I for one don't think this is doing the good reputation of MySQL any good.</sentencetext>
</comment>
<comment>
	<id>http://www.semanticweb.org/ontologies/ConversationInstances.owl#comment10_01_04_1548235.30643600</id>
	<title>Re:Own fault</title>
	<author>Anonymous</author>
	<datestamp>1262632320000</datestamp>
	<modclass>None</modclass>
	<modscore>0</modscore>
	<htmltext><p>I would say it's more like he broke up with his girlfriend, but her new boyfriend is beating her, so although he had broken up with her, he cares enough about her to try and help her out of an abusive relationship.</p><p>I'm not suggesting the new boyfriend has a rap sheet, but the new boyfriend is already pimping his favorite girl, and the newcomer is likely to get snuffed.</p></htmltext>
<tokenext>I would say it 's more like he broke up with his girlfriend , but her new boyfriend is beating her , so although he had broken up with her , he cares enough about her to try and help her out of an abusive relationship.I 'm not suggesting the new boyfriend has a rap sheet , but the new boyfriend is already pimping his favorite girl , and the newcomer is likely to get snuffed .</tokentext>
<sentencetext>I would say it's more like he broke up with his girlfriend, but her new boyfriend is beating her, so although he had broken up with her, he cares enough about her to try and help her out of an abusive relationship.I'm not suggesting the new boyfriend has a rap sheet, but the new boyfriend is already pimping his favorite girl, and the newcomer is likely to get snuffed.</sentencetext>
	<parent>http://www.semanticweb.org/ontologies/ConversationInstances.owl#comment10_01_04_1548235.30641574</parent>
</comment>
<comment>
	<id>http://www.semanticweb.org/ontologies/ConversationInstances.owl#comment10_01_04_1548235.30641692</id>
	<title>I'll think about it</title>
	<author>Anonymous</author>
	<datestamp>1262624700000</datestamp>
	<modclass>None</modclass>
	<modscore>-1</modscore>
	<htmltext>I'll think about signing his petition if he gives back the money</htmltext>
<tokenext>I 'll think about signing his petition if he gives back the money</tokentext>
<sentencetext>I'll think about signing his petition if he gives back the money</sentencetext>
</comment>
<comment>
	<id>http://www.semanticweb.org/ontologies/ConversationInstances.owl#comment10_01_04_1548235.30643852</id>
	<title>Re:Own fault</title>
	<author>EnglishTim</author>
	<datestamp>1262633220000</datestamp>
	<modclass>Insightful</modclass>
	<modscore>2</modscore>
	<htmltext><p>Do you think they would have been able to get the investment if they had stipulated that the company couldn't be sold? I'm sure they realised that there were risks in taking the path they took; but that was the cost of being able to afford enough developers to keep MySQL competitive.</p></htmltext>
<tokenext>Do you think they would have been able to get the investment if they had stipulated that the company could n't be sold ?
I 'm sure they realised that there were risks in taking the path they took ; but that was the cost of being able to afford enough developers to keep MySQL competitive .</tokentext>
<sentencetext>Do you think they would have been able to get the investment if they had stipulated that the company couldn't be sold?
I'm sure they realised that there were risks in taking the path they took; but that was the cost of being able to afford enough developers to keep MySQL competitive.</sentencetext>
	<parent>http://www.semanticweb.org/ontologies/ConversationInstances.owl#comment10_01_04_1548235.30642492</parent>
</comment>
<comment>
	<id>http://www.semanticweb.org/ontologies/ConversationInstances.owl#comment10_01_04_1548235.30641944</id>
	<title>Re:Stick a fork in it!</title>
	<author>Anonymous</author>
	<datestamp>1262625600000</datestamp>
	<modclass>Informativ</modclass>
	<modscore>3</modscore>
	<htmltext><p><div class="quote"><p>Why doesn't he just fork the whole project?</p> </div><p>He has, it's called something like mariadb.  Two problems: No one has ever heard of his fork, and what he really wants is the proprietary parts that were developed when mysql (the corp) was under his control.</p></div>
	</htmltext>
<tokenext>Why does n't he just fork the whole project ?
He has , it 's called something like mariadb .
Two problems : No one has ever heard of his fork , and what he really wants is the proprietary parts that were developed when mysql ( the corp ) was under his control .</tokentext>
<sentencetext>Why doesn't he just fork the whole project?
He has, it's called something like mariadb.
Two problems: No one has ever heard of his fork, and what he really wants is the proprietary parts that were developed when mysql (the corp) was under his control.
	</sentencetext>
	<parent>http://www.semanticweb.org/ontologies/ConversationInstances.owl#comment10_01_04_1548235.30641624</parent>
</comment>
<comment>
	<id>http://www.semanticweb.org/ontologies/ConversationInstances.owl#comment10_01_04_1548235.30643160</id>
	<title>Berkley DB</title>
	<author>theManInTheYellowHat</author>
	<datestamp>1262630220000</datestamp>
	<modclass>None</modclass>
	<modscore>1</modscore>
	<htmltext><p>Oracle has owned Berkley DB and Sleepycat since February 2006 and it is still in fine shape.  Still open source and still used the same as it ever was.  I suspect that MySQL will be the same.</p></htmltext>
<tokenext>Oracle has owned Berkley DB and Sleepycat since February 2006 and it is still in fine shape .
Still open source and still used the same as it ever was .
I suspect that MySQL will be the same .</tokentext>
<sentencetext>Oracle has owned Berkley DB and Sleepycat since February 2006 and it is still in fine shape.
Still open source and still used the same as it ever was.
I suspect that MySQL will be the same.</sentencetext>
</comment>
<comment>
	<id>http://www.semanticweb.org/ontologies/ConversationInstances.owl#comment10_01_04_1548235.30641712</id>
	<title>Re:Own fault</title>
	<author>Anonymous</author>
	<datestamp>1262624760000</datestamp>
	<modclass>Funny</modclass>
	<modscore>5</modscore>
	<htmltext><p><div class="quote"><p>It's like you broke up with your girlfriend and then go crying her back when she has found a new guy, while you're having no luck.</p></div><p>Or, to put it in Slashdot terms:</p><p>It's like you broke up with your car and then go crying it back when it has found a new owner, while you're having no luck finding another car.</p></div>
	</htmltext>
<tokenext>It 's like you broke up with your girlfriend and then go crying her back when she has found a new guy , while you 're having no luck.Or , to put it in Slashdot terms : It 's like you broke up with your car and then go crying it back when it has found a new owner , while you 're having no luck finding another car .</tokentext>
<sentencetext>It's like you broke up with your girlfriend and then go crying her back when she has found a new guy, while you're having no luck.Or, to put it in Slashdot terms:It's like you broke up with your car and then go crying it back when it has found a new owner, while you're having no luck finding another car.
	</sentencetext>
	<parent>http://www.semanticweb.org/ontologies/ConversationInstances.owl#comment10_01_04_1548235.30641574</parent>
</comment>
<comment>
	<id>http://www.semanticweb.org/ontologies/ConversationInstances.owl#comment10_01_04_1548235.30643114</id>
	<title>Re:Who has shared hosting with PostgreSQL?</title>
	<author>the\_womble</author>
	<datestamp>1262629980000</datestamp>
	<modclass>None</modclass>
	<modscore>1</modscore>
	<htmltext><p><div class="quote"><p>MySQL has plenty of affordable shared hosting providers. What company do you recommend for hosting web sites based on PostgreSQL?</p></div><p>Nearly Free Speech, Webfaction, Django hosting (they do PHP too) or Mythic Beasts. Virtual servers are also affordable these days.</p><p>Between the above they cover everything from very cheap to as expensive as a dedicated server but worth it.</p></div>
	</htmltext>
<tokenext>MySQL has plenty of affordable shared hosting providers .
What company do you recommend for hosting web sites based on PostgreSQL ? Nearly Free Speech , Webfaction , Django hosting ( they do PHP too ) or Mythic Beasts .
Virtual servers are also affordable these days.Between the above they cover everything from very cheap to as expensive as a dedicated server but worth it .</tokentext>
<sentencetext>MySQL has plenty of affordable shared hosting providers.
What company do you recommend for hosting web sites based on PostgreSQL?Nearly Free Speech, Webfaction, Django hosting (they do PHP too) or Mythic Beasts.
Virtual servers are also affordable these days.Between the above they cover everything from very cheap to as expensive as a dedicated server but worth it.
	</sentencetext>
	<parent>http://www.semanticweb.org/ontologies/ConversationInstances.owl#comment10_01_04_1548235.30642058</parent>
</comment>
<comment>
	<id>http://www.semanticweb.org/ontologies/ConversationInstances.owl#comment10_01_04_1548235.30643260</id>
	<title>Fuck Monty and the whore he rode to Sun...</title>
	<author>FlyingGuy</author>
	<datestamp>1262630820000</datestamp>
	<modclass>Troll</modclass>
	<modscore>0</modscore>
	<htmltext><p>to collect his filthy lucre.  I mean it, I really I do.  I as as much a fan of FOOS as anyone and I cheer those who work their asses off to make it possible, but this guy is nothing but a greedy schmuck.</p><p>CmdrTaco this is nothing but a blatant <b>RGA</b> &copy; 2010 (<b>R</b>evenue <b>G</b>enerating <b>A</b>rticle)  and <b>you</b> are an asshat for even posting it.  Yes you may have started<nobr> <wbr></nobr>/. but now you are abusing it.</p><p>Monty, take your money and go have a great big mug of <b>shut the fuck up</b> you disingenuous little weasel.</p></htmltext>
<tokenext>to collect his filthy lucre .
I mean it , I really I do .
I as as much a fan of FOOS as anyone and I cheer those who work their asses off to make it possible , but this guy is nothing but a greedy schmuck.CmdrTaco this is nothing but a blatant RGA   2010 ( Revenue Generating Article ) and you are an asshat for even posting it .
Yes you may have started / .
but now you are abusing it.Monty , take your money and go have a great big mug of shut the fuck up you disingenuous little weasel .</tokentext>
<sentencetext>to collect his filthy lucre.
I mean it, I really I do.
I as as much a fan of FOOS as anyone and I cheer those who work their asses off to make it possible, but this guy is nothing but a greedy schmuck.CmdrTaco this is nothing but a blatant RGA © 2010 (Revenue Generating Article)  and you are an asshat for even posting it.
Yes you may have started /.
but now you are abusing it.Monty, take your money and go have a great big mug of shut the fuck up you disingenuous little weasel.</sentencetext>
</comment>
<comment>
	<id>http://www.semanticweb.org/ontologies/ConversationInstances.owl#comment10_01_04_1548235.30641876</id>
	<title>Buy it back</title>
	<author>linuxgurugamer</author>
	<datestamp>1262625360000</datestamp>
	<modclass>None</modclass>
	<modscore>1</modscore>
	<htmltext><p>So rather than  ask for it back, why doesn't he offer to buy it back for the same amount that he was paid for it?</p><p>This sounds too much like like greed to me.</p><p>The choices on the petition are laughable as well.  MySQL is already GPL.  If Oracle does try to kill it, there is nothing to stop another company from forking it (aren't there several forks already) and providing commercial support &amp; development.  Asking Oracle to do work on it, and then release that work for free, is also stupid.  Oracle is a company which wants to make money.  Why should they develop competition to their main product and then release it for free?</p></htmltext>
<tokenext>So rather than ask for it back , why does n't he offer to buy it back for the same amount that he was paid for it ? This sounds too much like like greed to me.The choices on the petition are laughable as well .
MySQL is already GPL .
If Oracle does try to kill it , there is nothing to stop another company from forking it ( are n't there several forks already ) and providing commercial support &amp; development .
Asking Oracle to do work on it , and then release that work for free , is also stupid .
Oracle is a company which wants to make money .
Why should they develop competition to their main product and then release it for free ?</tokentext>
<sentencetext>So rather than  ask for it back, why doesn't he offer to buy it back for the same amount that he was paid for it?This sounds too much like like greed to me.The choices on the petition are laughable as well.
MySQL is already GPL.
If Oracle does try to kill it, there is nothing to stop another company from forking it (aren't there several forks already) and providing commercial support &amp; development.
Asking Oracle to do work on it, and then release that work for free, is also stupid.
Oracle is a company which wants to make money.
Why should they develop competition to their main product and then release it for free?</sentencetext>
</comment>
<comment>
	<id>http://www.semanticweb.org/ontologies/ConversationInstances.owl#comment10_01_04_1548235.30642310</id>
	<title>I wonder</title>
	<author>Dunbal</author>
	<datestamp>1262627040000</datestamp>
	<modclass>None</modclass>
	<modscore>1</modscore>
	<htmltext><p>So exactly how many times are we going to have to read this same story again?</p><p>I have no sympathy for Mr. Widenius - after all he sold MySQL to Sun for a nice chunk of change. If you don't like it, FORK IT. But shut the hell up already.</p></htmltext>
<tokenext>So exactly how many times are we going to have to read this same story again ? I have no sympathy for Mr. Widenius - after all he sold MySQL to Sun for a nice chunk of change .
If you do n't like it , FORK IT .
But shut the hell up already .</tokentext>
<sentencetext>So exactly how many times are we going to have to read this same story again?I have no sympathy for Mr. Widenius - after all he sold MySQL to Sun for a nice chunk of change.
If you don't like it, FORK IT.
But shut the hell up already.</sentencetext>
</comment>
<comment>
	<id>http://www.semanticweb.org/ontologies/ConversationInstances.owl#comment10_01_04_1548235.30641644</id>
	<title>Not a valid argument...</title>
	<author>filesiteguy</author>
	<datestamp>1262624520000</datestamp>
	<modclass>None</modclass>
	<modscore>1</modscore>
	<htmltext>I read the blog/petition last week. (What else is there to do at work between Christmas and New Year's?)<br><br>I understand the concern - that MySQL will be an in-house "competitor" for resources to Oracle's database.  However, why wouldn't they be complimentary?<br><br>Also, since a large portion of the original MySQL is OSS, then I see no reason an entity couldn't take it and create a forked product to compete in that space. This would be like Websphere and Apache co-existing. IBM goes after the corporate market and Apache goes after the rest.</htmltext>
<tokenext>I read the blog/petition last week .
( What else is there to do at work between Christmas and New Year 's ?
) I understand the concern - that MySQL will be an in-house " competitor " for resources to Oracle 's database .
However , why would n't they be complimentary ? Also , since a large portion of the original MySQL is OSS , then I see no reason an entity could n't take it and create a forked product to compete in that space .
This would be like Websphere and Apache co-existing .
IBM goes after the corporate market and Apache goes after the rest .</tokentext>
<sentencetext>I read the blog/petition last week.
(What else is there to do at work between Christmas and New Year's?
)I understand the concern - that MySQL will be an in-house "competitor" for resources to Oracle's database.
However, why wouldn't they be complimentary?Also, since a large portion of the original MySQL is OSS, then I see no reason an entity couldn't take it and create a forked product to compete in that space.
This would be like Websphere and Apache co-existing.
IBM goes after the corporate market and Apache goes after the rest.</sentencetext>
</comment>
<comment>
	<id>http://www.semanticweb.org/ontologies/ConversationInstances.owl#comment10_01_04_1548235.30644356</id>
	<title>Monty needs to put a sock in it...</title>
	<author>TemporalBeing</author>
	<datestamp>1262635560000</datestamp>
	<modclass>None</modclass>
	<modscore>1</modscore>
	<htmltext>See <a href="http://slashdot.org/comments.pl?sid=1476830&amp;cid=30427742" title="slashdot.org">here</a> [slashdot.org] and <a href="http://www.groklaw.net/comment.php?mode=display&amp;sid=20091208104422384&amp;title=Funny\%20thing\%20is...&amp;type=article&amp;order=&amp;hideanonymous=0&amp;pid=0#c806354" title="groklaw.net">here</a> [groklaw.net] for the reasons why. To summarize:

<ul>
    <li>Monty made MySQL; licensed it under a dual license (GPL + MySQL Commercial License)</li><li>dual license structure worked well for MySQL AB - prevented commercial competitors, fostered community around GPL version</li><li>Monty sold MySQL AB to Sun for $1B without changing the license. No compliants; he worked for Sun.</li><li>Sun seems to be under the gun and going to get sold off - Monty quits, tries to fork MySQL as MariaDB. Wants to build a new "MySQL AB" under another name; but the dual license prevents it.</li><li>See opportunity to force Sun to change the license so he can keep his money from the sale, while still getting all the code, possibly also the commercial code, and redo MySQL AB</li><li>Monty's looking to do a "rinse-repeat".</li></ul></htmltext>
<tokenext>See here [ slashdot.org ] and here [ groklaw.net ] for the reasons why .
To summarize : Monty made MySQL ; licensed it under a dual license ( GPL + MySQL Commercial License ) dual license structure worked well for MySQL AB - prevented commercial competitors , fostered community around GPL versionMonty sold MySQL AB to Sun for $ 1B without changing the license .
No compliants ; he worked for Sun.Sun seems to be under the gun and going to get sold off - Monty quits , tries to fork MySQL as MariaDB .
Wants to build a new " MySQL AB " under another name ; but the dual license prevents it.See opportunity to force Sun to change the license so he can keep his money from the sale , while still getting all the code , possibly also the commercial code , and redo MySQL ABMonty 's looking to do a " rinse-repeat " .</tokentext>
<sentencetext>See here [slashdot.org] and here [groklaw.net] for the reasons why.
To summarize:


    Monty made MySQL; licensed it under a dual license (GPL + MySQL Commercial License)dual license structure worked well for MySQL AB - prevented commercial competitors, fostered community around GPL versionMonty sold MySQL AB to Sun for $1B without changing the license.
No compliants; he worked for Sun.Sun seems to be under the gun and going to get sold off - Monty quits, tries to fork MySQL as MariaDB.
Wants to build a new "MySQL AB" under another name; but the dual license prevents it.See opportunity to force Sun to change the license so he can keep his money from the sale, while still getting all the code, possibly also the commercial code, and redo MySQL ABMonty's looking to do a "rinse-repeat".</sentencetext>
</comment>
<comment>
	<id>http://www.semanticweb.org/ontologies/ConversationInstances.owl#comment10_01_04_1548235.30643200</id>
	<title>Re:There is already a perfectly good free DBMS</title>
	<author>Carewolf</author>
	<datestamp>1262630460000</datestamp>
	<modclass>None</modclass>
	<modscore>1</modscore>
	<htmltext><p>PostgreSQL have been designed to be a correct database from the ground up. MySQL is only a strict database if you use the later fused-in InnoDB. The point is that MySQL was designed to be a fast storage engine, but not a true database. It is excelent for its original purpose but it makes a lousy database.</p></htmltext>
<tokenext>PostgreSQL have been designed to be a correct database from the ground up .
MySQL is only a strict database if you use the later fused-in InnoDB .
The point is that MySQL was designed to be a fast storage engine , but not a true database .
It is excelent for its original purpose but it makes a lousy database .</tokentext>
<sentencetext>PostgreSQL have been designed to be a correct database from the ground up.
MySQL is only a strict database if you use the later fused-in InnoDB.
The point is that MySQL was designed to be a fast storage engine, but not a true database.
It is excelent for its original purpose but it makes a lousy database.</sentencetext>
	<parent>http://www.semanticweb.org/ontologies/ConversationInstances.owl#comment10_01_04_1548235.30642168</parent>
</comment>
<comment>
	<id>http://www.semanticweb.org/ontologies/ConversationInstances.owl#comment10_01_04_1548235.30642688</id>
	<title>Re:Who has shared hosting with PostgreSQL?</title>
	<author>Anonymous</author>
	<datestamp>1262628240000</datestamp>
	<modclass>None</modclass>
	<modscore>0</modscore>
	<htmltext>I use a2hosting (as in Ann Arbor).</htmltext>
<tokenext>I use a2hosting ( as in Ann Arbor ) .</tokentext>
<sentencetext>I use a2hosting (as in Ann Arbor).</sentencetext>
	<parent>http://www.semanticweb.org/ontologies/ConversationInstances.owl#comment10_01_04_1548235.30642058</parent>
</comment>
<comment>
	<id>http://www.semanticweb.org/ontologies/ConversationInstances.owl#comment10_01_04_1548235.30641564</id>
	<title>so which is it?</title>
	<author>madddddddddd</author>
	<datestamp>1262624280000</datestamp>
	<modclass>None</modclass>
	<modscore>0</modscore>
	<htmltext>is the web going to be unrecognizable in 2020 or will monty still keep it free?</htmltext>
<tokenext>is the web going to be unrecognizable in 2020 or will monty still keep it free ?</tokentext>
<sentencetext>is the web going to be unrecognizable in 2020 or will monty still keep it free?</sentencetext>
</comment>
<comment>
	<id>http://www.semanticweb.org/ontologies/ConversationInstances.owl#comment10_01_04_1548235.30653766</id>
	<title>Re:Time to switch...</title>
	<author>Issarlk</author>
	<datestamp>1262700240000</datestamp>
	<modclass>None</modclass>
	<modscore>1</modscore>
	<htmltext>It certainly runs faster than a crashed MySQL.</htmltext>
<tokenext>It certainly runs faster than a crashed MySQL .</tokentext>
<sentencetext>It certainly runs faster than a crashed MySQL.</sentencetext>
	<parent>http://www.semanticweb.org/ontologies/ConversationInstances.owl#comment10_01_04_1548235.30642878</parent>
</comment>
<comment>
	<id>http://www.semanticweb.org/ontologies/ConversationInstances.owl#comment10_01_04_1548235.30642420</id>
	<title>Re:Baloney! He doesn't want to save MySQL</title>
	<author>gabereiser</author>
	<datestamp>1262627400000</datestamp>
	<modclass>None</modclass>
	<modscore>0</modscore>
	<htmltext><p><div class="quote"><p>He wants to build another business on MySQL and force Oracle into letting him do it.</p><p>This is greed masquerading as virtue.</p></div><p>took the words right out of my mouth...</p></div>
	</htmltext>
<tokenext>He wants to build another business on MySQL and force Oracle into letting him do it.This is greed masquerading as virtue.took the words right out of my mouth.. .</tokentext>
<sentencetext>He wants to build another business on MySQL and force Oracle into letting him do it.This is greed masquerading as virtue.took the words right out of my mouth...
	</sentencetext>
	<parent>http://www.semanticweb.org/ontologies/ConversationInstances.owl#comment10_01_04_1548235.30641758</parent>
</comment>
<comment>
	<id>http://www.semanticweb.org/ontologies/ConversationInstances.owl#comment10_01_04_1548235.30643502</id>
	<title>Re:There is already a perfectly good free DBMS</title>
	<author>Just Some Guy</author>
	<datestamp>1262631960000</datestamp>
	<modclass>None</modclass>
	<modscore>1</modscore>
	<htmltext><p><div class="quote"><p>3 years after I started offering hosting I got one request for it, and when I explained that there wasn't much demand I got this little speech.</p></div><p>On behalf of competent hosts everywhere, I say this sincerely: thanks for the customers!</p></div>
	</htmltext>
<tokenext>3 years after I started offering hosting I got one request for it , and when I explained that there was n't much demand I got this little speech.On behalf of competent hosts everywhere , I say this sincerely : thanks for the customers !</tokentext>
<sentencetext>3 years after I started offering hosting I got one request for it, and when I explained that there wasn't much demand I got this little speech.On behalf of competent hosts everywhere, I say this sincerely: thanks for the customers!
	</sentencetext>
	<parent>http://www.semanticweb.org/ontologies/ConversationInstances.owl#comment10_01_04_1548235.30642346</parent>
</comment>
<comment>
	<id>http://www.semanticweb.org/ontologies/ConversationInstances.owl#comment10_01_04_1548235.30642046</id>
	<title>Re:Stick a fork in it!</title>
	<author>jvillain</author>
	<datestamp>1262626020000</datestamp>
	<modclass>Insightful</modclass>
	<modscore>3</modscore>
	<htmltext><p>There is a third problem. No one is going to risk their business on Monty's fork or sign over their patches because the risk is so great that he will sell every one out again. The fact that he is fully in bed with Microsoft on this makes it even more likely. Fool us once shame on you, fool us twice shame on us.</p></htmltext>
<tokenext>There is a third problem .
No one is going to risk their business on Monty 's fork or sign over their patches because the risk is so great that he will sell every one out again .
The fact that he is fully in bed with Microsoft on this makes it even more likely .
Fool us once shame on you , fool us twice shame on us .</tokentext>
<sentencetext>There is a third problem.
No one is going to risk their business on Monty's fork or sign over their patches because the risk is so great that he will sell every one out again.
The fact that he is fully in bed with Microsoft on this makes it even more likely.
Fool us once shame on you, fool us twice shame on us.</sentencetext>
	<parent>http://www.semanticweb.org/ontologies/ConversationInstances.owl#comment10_01_04_1548235.30641624</parent>
</comment>
<comment>
	<id>http://www.semanticweb.org/ontologies/ConversationInstances.owl#comment10_01_04_1548235.30642592</id>
	<title>Re:Who has shared hosting with PostgreSQL?</title>
	<author>uncledrax</author>
	<datestamp>1262627940000</datestamp>
	<modclass>None</modclass>
	<modscore>1</modscore>
	<htmltext><p>Also, since it's been brought up before, there are 2 reasons my MySQL is as popular as it is in the webhosting world:<br>1- it's free<br>2- it worked easily/well enough when the whole Virtual-Server thing started taking off (I mean in Apache terms: 1 IP, 1+ web sites, not VMware terms<nobr> <wbr></nobr>:] )</p><p>If MySQL dies, then web hosts will (slowly I'm sure) start migrating to using something else like PostgreSQL. Issues with either MySQL/Pgsql will be developed around, new management tools will emerge to fill the needs, and/or a new alternative will show it's head (someone mentioned a n existing fork of MySQL already).</p><p>Dear Monty; Perhaps you overstate your usefulness. Pray I do no alter the deal any further.<nobr> <wbr></nobr>.. or something.</p><p>If MySQL dies, it won't be the end of the Internet (I could only pray for so much to happen!).. I'm sure someone like Google would step in and offer consolidate database solutions.. does Gears or whatever already do that?</p></htmltext>
<tokenext>Also , since it 's been brought up before , there are 2 reasons my MySQL is as popular as it is in the webhosting world : 1- it 's free2- it worked easily/well enough when the whole Virtual-Server thing started taking off ( I mean in Apache terms : 1 IP , 1 + web sites , not VMware terms : ] ) If MySQL dies , then web hosts will ( slowly I 'm sure ) start migrating to using something else like PostgreSQL .
Issues with either MySQL/Pgsql will be developed around , new management tools will emerge to fill the needs , and/or a new alternative will show it 's head ( someone mentioned a n existing fork of MySQL already ) .Dear Monty ; Perhaps you overstate your usefulness .
Pray I do no alter the deal any further .
.. or something.If MySQL dies , it wo n't be the end of the Internet ( I could only pray for so much to happen ! ) . .
I 'm sure someone like Google would step in and offer consolidate database solutions.. does Gears or whatever already do that ?</tokentext>
<sentencetext>Also, since it's been brought up before, there are 2 reasons my MySQL is as popular as it is in the webhosting world:1- it's free2- it worked easily/well enough when the whole Virtual-Server thing started taking off (I mean in Apache terms: 1 IP, 1+ web sites, not VMware terms :] )If MySQL dies, then web hosts will (slowly I'm sure) start migrating to using something else like PostgreSQL.
Issues with either MySQL/Pgsql will be developed around, new management tools will emerge to fill the needs, and/or a new alternative will show it's head (someone mentioned a n existing fork of MySQL already).Dear Monty; Perhaps you overstate your usefulness.
Pray I do no alter the deal any further.
.. or something.If MySQL dies, it won't be the end of the Internet (I could only pray for so much to happen!)..
I'm sure someone like Google would step in and offer consolidate database solutions.. does Gears or whatever already do that?</sentencetext>
	<parent>http://www.semanticweb.org/ontologies/ConversationInstances.owl#comment10_01_04_1548235.30642058</parent>
</comment>
<comment>
	<id>http://www.semanticweb.org/ontologies/ConversationInstances.owl#comment10_01_04_1548235.30645558</id>
	<title>Let it die</title>
	<author>asamad</author>
	<datestamp>1262597280000</datestamp>
	<modclass>None</modclass>
	<modscore>1</modscore>
	<htmltext><p>Just let it die. then we can all move to pgsql</p></htmltext>
<tokenext>Just let it die .
then we can all move to pgsql</tokentext>
<sentencetext>Just let it die.
then we can all move to pgsql</sentencetext>
</comment>
<comment>
	<id>http://www.semanticweb.org/ontologies/ConversationInstances.owl#comment10_01_04_1548235.30643756</id>
	<title>Y2.01k slashdot timewarp bug</title>
	<author>Anonymous</author>
	<datestamp>1262632860000</datestamp>
	<modclass>None</modclass>
	<modscore>0</modscore>
	<htmltext><p>IPv4 exhaustion, various university pet projects seeking disruptive replacement of the Internet in a bid to hoard attention and  I sold out MySQL please shed copious tears for me.</p><p>Is this the matrix did the same cat just run by twice?</p></htmltext>
<tokenext>IPv4 exhaustion , various university pet projects seeking disruptive replacement of the Internet in a bid to hoard attention and I sold out MySQL please shed copious tears for me.Is this the matrix did the same cat just run by twice ?</tokentext>
<sentencetext>IPv4 exhaustion, various university pet projects seeking disruptive replacement of the Internet in a bid to hoard attention and  I sold out MySQL please shed copious tears for me.Is this the matrix did the same cat just run by twice?</sentencetext>
</comment>
<comment>
	<id>http://www.semanticweb.org/ontologies/ConversationInstances.owl#comment10_01_04_1548235.30643050</id>
	<title>We Don't Need No Stinking Petition</title>
	<author>mpapet</author>
	<datestamp>1262629740000</datestamp>
	<modclass>Informativ</modclass>
	<modscore>3</modscore>
	<htmltext><p>1. MySQL would need to be a sufficiently revenue-producing entity in order for it to sustain internal development at Oracle.  What those revenue producing metrics are is impossible to know from the outside.  I'm a pessimist though and would estimate whatever MySQL dev is done in-house will probably get chopped by 2/3 in order to make the revenue fit into their financing targets.  That's assuming Oracle doesn't abandon it right away.</p><p>2. This $1 Billion number being thrown around is a PR number.  I'd guess Monty's gotten 10's of thousands of dollars for closing the deal.  Other than that his payout won't come.  He won't get paid because the value of the deal is typically based on payouts based on future earnings.  We know Sun couldn't turn it into a bigger revenue producer.  With the change in ownership, I'm sure Oracle will renege on whatever deal he had with Sun and tell Monty to "Go pound sand.  Your issue is with the Sun Officers who signed the deal, not Oracle."</p><p>3. I bet he's got a non-compete that prevents him from directly starting something.  Which, Oracle would enforce while pretending about other parts of the agreement.  That's why he's got this petition thing.</p><p>Monty pretended those future payouts would work, got screwed by Sun, and now he's trying to get back in the game.</p><p>Today's entrepreneurial lesson:  get paid today, not tomorrow.</p></htmltext>
<tokenext>1 .
MySQL would need to be a sufficiently revenue-producing entity in order for it to sustain internal development at Oracle .
What those revenue producing metrics are is impossible to know from the outside .
I 'm a pessimist though and would estimate whatever MySQL dev is done in-house will probably get chopped by 2/3 in order to make the revenue fit into their financing targets .
That 's assuming Oracle does n't abandon it right away.2 .
This $ 1 Billion number being thrown around is a PR number .
I 'd guess Monty 's gotten 10 's of thousands of dollars for closing the deal .
Other than that his payout wo n't come .
He wo n't get paid because the value of the deal is typically based on payouts based on future earnings .
We know Sun could n't turn it into a bigger revenue producer .
With the change in ownership , I 'm sure Oracle will renege on whatever deal he had with Sun and tell Monty to " Go pound sand .
Your issue is with the Sun Officers who signed the deal , not Oracle. " 3 .
I bet he 's got a non-compete that prevents him from directly starting something .
Which , Oracle would enforce while pretending about other parts of the agreement .
That 's why he 's got this petition thing.Monty pretended those future payouts would work , got screwed by Sun , and now he 's trying to get back in the game.Today 's entrepreneurial lesson : get paid today , not tomorrow .</tokentext>
<sentencetext>1.
MySQL would need to be a sufficiently revenue-producing entity in order for it to sustain internal development at Oracle.
What those revenue producing metrics are is impossible to know from the outside.
I'm a pessimist though and would estimate whatever MySQL dev is done in-house will probably get chopped by 2/3 in order to make the revenue fit into their financing targets.
That's assuming Oracle doesn't abandon it right away.2.
This $1 Billion number being thrown around is a PR number.
I'd guess Monty's gotten 10's of thousands of dollars for closing the deal.
Other than that his payout won't come.
He won't get paid because the value of the deal is typically based on payouts based on future earnings.
We know Sun couldn't turn it into a bigger revenue producer.
With the change in ownership, I'm sure Oracle will renege on whatever deal he had with Sun and tell Monty to "Go pound sand.
Your issue is with the Sun Officers who signed the deal, not Oracle."3.
I bet he's got a non-compete that prevents him from directly starting something.
Which, Oracle would enforce while pretending about other parts of the agreement.
That's why he's got this petition thing.Monty pretended those future payouts would work, got screwed by Sun, and now he's trying to get back in the game.Today's entrepreneurial lesson:  get paid today, not tomorrow.</sentencetext>
</comment>
<comment>
	<id>http://www.semanticweb.org/ontologies/ConversationInstances.owl#comment10_01_04_1548235.30643358</id>
	<title>Re:Not just his blog</title>
	<author>Anonymous</author>
	<datestamp>1262631240000</datestamp>
	<modclass>Informativ</modclass>
	<modscore>2</modscore>
	<htmltext><p>I can confirm this. I have merely helped post some bugs from Debian to MySQL dev's bug tracker and now I was spammed by "save my MySQL project".</p><p>The entire request is dumb and goes against the merits of what MySQL AB did under his apparent leadership. Remember when they have changed LGPL libmysqlclient library to GPL only and told commercial or other non-free devs to pay up? Now, he wants EU to force Sun/Oracle to release MySQL again under BSD or something? WTF? Now that's hypocrisy!</p><p>Monty, you *SOLD* MySQL AB. That means you *chose* to move on from controlling the project, or have any future say on how it works. Period. Now, walk away. It is not your project anymore.</p><p>PS. I've moved to PostgreSQL after MySQL changed licenses in 4.0.x time and I couldn't be happier. Finally, a database that works and is free.</p></htmltext>
<tokenext>I can confirm this .
I have merely helped post some bugs from Debian to MySQL dev 's bug tracker and now I was spammed by " save my MySQL project " .The entire request is dumb and goes against the merits of what MySQL AB did under his apparent leadership .
Remember when they have changed LGPL libmysqlclient library to GPL only and told commercial or other non-free devs to pay up ?
Now , he wants EU to force Sun/Oracle to release MySQL again under BSD or something ?
WTF ? Now that 's hypocrisy ! Monty , you * SOLD * MySQL AB .
That means you * chose * to move on from controlling the project , or have any future say on how it works .
Period. Now , walk away .
It is not your project anymore.PS .
I 've moved to PostgreSQL after MySQL changed licenses in 4.0.x time and I could n't be happier .
Finally , a database that works and is free .</tokentext>
<sentencetext>I can confirm this.
I have merely helped post some bugs from Debian to MySQL dev's bug tracker and now I was spammed by "save my MySQL project".The entire request is dumb and goes against the merits of what MySQL AB did under his apparent leadership.
Remember when they have changed LGPL libmysqlclient library to GPL only and told commercial or other non-free devs to pay up?
Now, he wants EU to force Sun/Oracle to release MySQL again under BSD or something?
WTF? Now that's hypocrisy!Monty, you *SOLD* MySQL AB.
That means you *chose* to move on from controlling the project, or have any future say on how it works.
Period. Now, walk away.
It is not your project anymore.PS.
I've moved to PostgreSQL after MySQL changed licenses in 4.0.x time and I couldn't be happier.
Finally, a database that works and is free.</sentencetext>
	<parent>http://www.semanticweb.org/ontologies/ConversationInstances.owl#comment10_01_04_1548235.30641604</parent>
</comment>
<comment>
	<id>http://www.semanticweb.org/ontologies/ConversationInstances.owl#comment10_01_04_1548235.30641618</id>
	<title>No he doesn't</title>
	<author>wiredlogic</author>
	<datestamp>1262624400000</datestamp>
	<modclass>Informativ</modclass>
	<modscore>5</modscore>
	<htmltext><p>This has been hashed out before. Monty wants to force the legitimate owner of MySQL to give up its rights to the documentation and proprietary parts of the source code so he can deploy his own commercial product using MariaDB. It's that simple. He got a big payoff when he cashed out and now he wants to double dip by getting back for free what he has already been compensated for.</p></htmltext>
<tokenext>This has been hashed out before .
Monty wants to force the legitimate owner of MySQL to give up its rights to the documentation and proprietary parts of the source code so he can deploy his own commercial product using MariaDB .
It 's that simple .
He got a big payoff when he cashed out and now he wants to double dip by getting back for free what he has already been compensated for .</tokentext>
<sentencetext>This has been hashed out before.
Monty wants to force the legitimate owner of MySQL to give up its rights to the documentation and proprietary parts of the source code so he can deploy his own commercial product using MariaDB.
It's that simple.
He got a big payoff when he cashed out and now he wants to double dip by getting back for free what he has already been compensated for.</sentencetext>
</comment>
<comment>
	<id>http://www.semanticweb.org/ontologies/ConversationInstances.owl#comment10_01_04_1548235.30643166</id>
	<title>Re:Fuck Monty and the horse he rode in on</title>
	<author>Anonymous</author>
	<datestamp>1262630280000</datestamp>
	<modclass>None</modclass>
	<modscore>0</modscore>
	<htmltext><p><div class="quote"><p>If he'd wanted to retain control then why did he sell mySQL to Sun?</p></div><p>He didn't. He had already lost control before that deal went through. He had no say in it, and was only informed of it afterwards.</p><p><div class="quote"><p>He certainly didn't have a problem with a corporation owning it in exchange for a cool billion earlier.</p></div><p>As a shareholder, he got a piece of that billion &mdash; probably a pretty healthy piece. But it wasn't all his money, or even most of it.</p><p><div class="quote"><p>Monty's rights to do anything more than complain vocally were terminated by his own hand the instant he signed the contract</p></div><p>He didn't sign anything.</p><p><div class="quote"><p>Meanwhile, if mySQL really is and has remained open source, then it's still open, so Monty should STFU and fork it already.</p></div><p>He did. But there's more to it than that. As he says in his blog, "(y)ou can fork a GPL infrastructure project, but not the economic ecosystem around it."</p><p><div class="quote"><p>The comment moderation on his blog is just icing on that cake -- only comments supporting poor, ickle widdle Monty's untenable position are allowed through.</p></div><p>Uh, did you stop reading at the first comment? Monty has had to post many comments defending his position against the doubters.</p><p> <i>Read</i> his blog post. He addresses <i>everything</i> you've brought up.</p></div>
	</htmltext>
<tokenext>If he 'd wanted to retain control then why did he sell mySQL to Sun ? He did n't .
He had already lost control before that deal went through .
He had no say in it , and was only informed of it afterwards.He certainly did n't have a problem with a corporation owning it in exchange for a cool billion earlier.As a shareholder , he got a piece of that billion    probably a pretty healthy piece .
But it was n't all his money , or even most of it.Monty 's rights to do anything more than complain vocally were terminated by his own hand the instant he signed the contractHe did n't sign anything.Meanwhile , if mySQL really is and has remained open source , then it 's still open , so Monty should STFU and fork it already.He did .
But there 's more to it than that .
As he says in his blog , " ( y ) ou can fork a GPL infrastructure project , but not the economic ecosystem around it .
" The comment moderation on his blog is just icing on that cake -- only comments supporting poor , ickle widdle Monty 's untenable position are allowed through.Uh , did you stop reading at the first comment ?
Monty has had to post many comments defending his position against the doubters .
Read his blog post .
He addresses everything you 've brought up .</tokentext>
<sentencetext>If he'd wanted to retain control then why did he sell mySQL to Sun?He didn't.
He had already lost control before that deal went through.
He had no say in it, and was only informed of it afterwards.He certainly didn't have a problem with a corporation owning it in exchange for a cool billion earlier.As a shareholder, he got a piece of that billion — probably a pretty healthy piece.
But it wasn't all his money, or even most of it.Monty's rights to do anything more than complain vocally were terminated by his own hand the instant he signed the contractHe didn't sign anything.Meanwhile, if mySQL really is and has remained open source, then it's still open, so Monty should STFU and fork it already.He did.
But there's more to it than that.
As he says in his blog, "(y)ou can fork a GPL infrastructure project, but not the economic ecosystem around it.
"The comment moderation on his blog is just icing on that cake -- only comments supporting poor, ickle widdle Monty's untenable position are allowed through.Uh, did you stop reading at the first comment?
Monty has had to post many comments defending his position against the doubters.
Read his blog post.
He addresses everything you've brought up.
	</sentencetext>
	<parent>http://www.semanticweb.org/ontologies/ConversationInstances.owl#comment10_01_04_1548235.30641874</parent>
</comment>
<comment>
	<id>http://www.semanticweb.org/ontologies/ConversationInstances.owl#comment10_01_04_1548235.30642756</id>
	<title>sorry but I don't get it - just fork it</title>
	<author>OrangeTide</author>
	<datestamp>1262628540000</datestamp>
	<modclass>None</modclass>
	<modscore>1</modscore>
	<htmltext><p>In the event of Oracle funny business. What stops anyone from starting a new project, let's pretend it is called "FreeSQL" to avoid trademark issues. Which continues to enhance and releases the current version of MySQL, which is already open source. You can't undo open source of versions already released, the license has no provisions to do so.<br>If there are patent issues then I guess that teaches all a lesson about bothering to file "defensive patents", unless they are assigned to some organization that cannot be easily sold or liquidated(FSF perhaps?). And simply publishing the patent information without filing is sufficient to block the creation of patent in that specific event, but not useful in a "defensive" patent trade. Of course defense of patents can be handled through copyright strong arming, for example an open source license that has a poison pill for patent litigation. Such a license might be worth considering for future projects, <a href="http://www.microsoft.com/opensource/licenses.mspx#Ms-RL" title="microsoft.com">Ms-RL</a> [microsoft.com] comes to mind as an example.</p></htmltext>
<tokenext>In the event of Oracle funny business .
What stops anyone from starting a new project , let 's pretend it is called " FreeSQL " to avoid trademark issues .
Which continues to enhance and releases the current version of MySQL , which is already open source .
You ca n't undo open source of versions already released , the license has no provisions to do so.If there are patent issues then I guess that teaches all a lesson about bothering to file " defensive patents " , unless they are assigned to some organization that can not be easily sold or liquidated ( FSF perhaps ? ) .
And simply publishing the patent information without filing is sufficient to block the creation of patent in that specific event , but not useful in a " defensive " patent trade .
Of course defense of patents can be handled through copyright strong arming , for example an open source license that has a poison pill for patent litigation .
Such a license might be worth considering for future projects , Ms-RL [ microsoft.com ] comes to mind as an example .</tokentext>
<sentencetext>In the event of Oracle funny business.
What stops anyone from starting a new project, let's pretend it is called "FreeSQL" to avoid trademark issues.
Which continues to enhance and releases the current version of MySQL, which is already open source.
You can't undo open source of versions already released, the license has no provisions to do so.If there are patent issues then I guess that teaches all a lesson about bothering to file "defensive patents", unless they are assigned to some organization that cannot be easily sold or liquidated(FSF perhaps?).
And simply publishing the patent information without filing is sufficient to block the creation of patent in that specific event, but not useful in a "defensive" patent trade.
Of course defense of patents can be handled through copyright strong arming, for example an open source license that has a poison pill for patent litigation.
Such a license might be worth considering for future projects, Ms-RL [microsoft.com] comes to mind as an example.</sentencetext>
</comment>
<comment>
	<id>http://www.semanticweb.org/ontologies/ConversationInstances.owl#comment10_01_04_1548235.30644088</id>
	<title>It's pure love</title>
	<author>ClosedSource</author>
	<datestamp>1262634360000</datestamp>
	<modclass>None</modclass>
	<modscore>1</modscore>
	<htmltext><p>Isn't more like you sold your girlfriend to another guy and he sold her to another guy and you want people to sign a petition to free here from guy #2?</p></htmltext>
<tokenext>Is n't more like you sold your girlfriend to another guy and he sold her to another guy and you want people to sign a petition to free here from guy # 2 ?</tokentext>
<sentencetext>Isn't more like you sold your girlfriend to another guy and he sold her to another guy and you want people to sign a petition to free here from guy #2?</sentencetext>
	<parent>http://www.semanticweb.org/ontologies/ConversationInstances.owl#comment10_01_04_1548235.30641574</parent>
</comment>
<comment>
	<id>http://www.semanticweb.org/ontologies/ConversationInstances.owl#comment10_01_04_1548235.30642054</id>
	<title>MySQL bad? Oracle worse.</title>
	<author>Anonymous</author>
	<datestamp>1262626080000</datestamp>
	<modclass>None</modclass>
	<modscore>0</modscore>
	<htmltext><p>All of you who are mindful that MySQL is Sun's stuff, bought and paid for, and who are impugning the author of MySQL with ulterior motives, do not seem to realize that, however dark and dank the MySQL author's motives might be, Oracle's motives can only be worse and it has high-powered lawyers on retainer to back them up.  If Oracle chooses to lock up the code of MySQL, a lot of database users may find themselves up the creek with no recourse whatever.</p></htmltext>
<tokenext>All of you who are mindful that MySQL is Sun 's stuff , bought and paid for , and who are impugning the author of MySQL with ulterior motives , do not seem to realize that , however dark and dank the MySQL author 's motives might be , Oracle 's motives can only be worse and it has high-powered lawyers on retainer to back them up .
If Oracle chooses to lock up the code of MySQL , a lot of database users may find themselves up the creek with no recourse whatever .</tokentext>
<sentencetext>All of you who are mindful that MySQL is Sun's stuff, bought and paid for, and who are impugning the author of MySQL with ulterior motives, do not seem to realize that, however dark and dank the MySQL author's motives might be, Oracle's motives can only be worse and it has high-powered lawyers on retainer to back them up.
If Oracle chooses to lock up the code of MySQL, a lot of database users may find themselves up the creek with no recourse whatever.</sentencetext>
</comment>
<comment>
	<id>http://www.semanticweb.org/ontologies/ConversationInstances.owl#comment10_01_04_1548235.30641592</id>
	<title>Go on,</title>
	<author>Anonymous</author>
	<datestamp>1262624340000</datestamp>
	<modclass>None</modclass>
	<modscore>0</modscore>
	<htmltext>take the money and run...</htmltext>
<tokenext>take the money and run.. .</tokentext>
<sentencetext>take the money and run...</sentencetext>
</comment>
<comment>
	<id>http://www.semanticweb.org/ontologies/ConversationInstances.owl#comment10_01_04_1548235.30652164</id>
	<title>Problems with MySQL</title>
	<author>yuhong</author>
	<datestamp>1262723280000</datestamp>
	<modclass>None</modclass>
	<modscore>1</modscore>
	<htmltext>Did you read this comment:
<a href="http://monty-says.blogspot.com/2009/02/time-to-move-on.html?showComment=1233908220000#c6913688673838779641" title="blogspot.com" rel="nofollow">http://monty-says.blogspot.com/2009/02/time-to-move-on.html?showComment=1233908220000#c6913688673838779641</a> [blogspot.com]
I think the biggest problem was the business model of MySQL, which was based on support.
And companies like Red Hat was supporting MySQL in it's RHEL, and they as a result did not use MySQL's support services.
Thus MySQL had to make some features non-free.
What is even worse, it looks like it was funded with VC, which means that either it had to IPO or sold to another company, according to this article:
<a href="http://monty-says.blogspot.com/2008/01/sun-buys-mysql-ab.html" title="blogspot.com" rel="nofollow">http://monty-says.blogspot.com/2008/01/sun-buys-mysql-ab.html</a> [blogspot.com]
I wonder what if Monty had chosen an IPO instead of selling it to another company?
Seems that Monty was the CTO of MySQL AB, BTW.</htmltext>
<tokenext>Did you read this comment : http : //monty-says.blogspot.com/2009/02/time-to-move-on.html ? showComment = 1233908220000 # c6913688673838779641 [ blogspot.com ] I think the biggest problem was the business model of MySQL , which was based on support .
And companies like Red Hat was supporting MySQL in it 's RHEL , and they as a result did not use MySQL 's support services .
Thus MySQL had to make some features non-free .
What is even worse , it looks like it was funded with VC , which means that either it had to IPO or sold to another company , according to this article : http : //monty-says.blogspot.com/2008/01/sun-buys-mysql-ab.html [ blogspot.com ] I wonder what if Monty had chosen an IPO instead of selling it to another company ?
Seems that Monty was the CTO of MySQL AB , BTW .</tokentext>
<sentencetext>Did you read this comment:
http://monty-says.blogspot.com/2009/02/time-to-move-on.html?showComment=1233908220000#c6913688673838779641 [blogspot.com]
I think the biggest problem was the business model of MySQL, which was based on support.
And companies like Red Hat was supporting MySQL in it's RHEL, and they as a result did not use MySQL's support services.
Thus MySQL had to make some features non-free.
What is even worse, it looks like it was funded with VC, which means that either it had to IPO or sold to another company, according to this article:
http://monty-says.blogspot.com/2008/01/sun-buys-mysql-ab.html [blogspot.com]
I wonder what if Monty had chosen an IPO instead of selling it to another company?
Seems that Monty was the CTO of MySQL AB, BTW.</sentencetext>
</comment>
<comment>
	<id>http://www.semanticweb.org/ontologies/ConversationInstances.owl#comment10_01_04_1548235.30641728</id>
	<title>Re:Me too!</title>
	<author>Anonymous</author>
	<datestamp>1262624760000</datestamp>
	<modclass>None</modclass>
	<modscore>0</modscore>
	<htmltext><p>If he wants to use the money he got from selling it to buy it back, why shouldn't he?</p><p>It's not as if he was unaware of the danger of the death of free software.</p></htmltext>
<tokenext>If he wants to use the money he got from selling it to buy it back , why should n't he ? It 's not as if he was unaware of the danger of the death of free software .</tokentext>
<sentencetext>If he wants to use the money he got from selling it to buy it back, why shouldn't he?It's not as if he was unaware of the danger of the death of free software.</sentencetext>
	<parent>http://www.semanticweb.org/ontologies/ConversationInstances.owl#comment10_01_04_1548235.30641586</parent>
</comment>
<comment>
	<id>http://www.semanticweb.org/ontologies/ConversationInstances.owl#comment10_01_04_1548235.30644310</id>
	<title>Re:Own fault</title>
	<author>yttrstein</author>
	<datestamp>1262635380000</datestamp>
	<modclass>Insightful</modclass>
	<modscore>3</modscore>
	<htmltext>I have to step in and say something here.  If at any point in the 90s or early oughts... even up to 2004, you'd considered dropping in the ability to do hot DB dumps without table locking, you would have very likely gotten bigger than Oracle.  (Much as Linux has gotten bigger than Solaris). It was idiocy of you not to do so, in favor of... god only knows what.<br><br>And now frankly its too little, too late.  MYSQL is pretty ok for a light-to-medium duty database, but you guys have had a couple of decades to really, *really* get it right, and you didn't.<br><br>If Oracle kills MySQL, the biggest pain in the arse will be moving things over to postgresql, which everyone should have done ten years ago in the first place.</htmltext>
<tokenext>I have to step in and say something here .
If at any point in the 90s or early oughts... even up to 2004 , you 'd considered dropping in the ability to do hot DB dumps without table locking , you would have very likely gotten bigger than Oracle .
( Much as Linux has gotten bigger than Solaris ) .
It was idiocy of you not to do so , in favor of... god only knows what.And now frankly its too little , too late .
MYSQL is pretty ok for a light-to-medium duty database , but you guys have had a couple of decades to really , * really * get it right , and you did n't.If Oracle kills MySQL , the biggest pain in the arse will be moving things over to postgresql , which everyone should have done ten years ago in the first place .</tokentext>
<sentencetext>I have to step in and say something here.
If at any point in the 90s or early oughts... even up to 2004, you'd considered dropping in the ability to do hot DB dumps without table locking, you would have very likely gotten bigger than Oracle.
(Much as Linux has gotten bigger than Solaris).
It was idiocy of you not to do so, in favor of... god only knows what.And now frankly its too little, too late.
MYSQL is pretty ok for a light-to-medium duty database, but you guys have had a couple of decades to really, *really* get it right, and you didn't.If Oracle kills MySQL, the biggest pain in the arse will be moving things over to postgresql, which everyone should have done ten years ago in the first place.</sentencetext>
	<parent>http://www.semanticweb.org/ontologies/ConversationInstances.owl#comment10_01_04_1548235.30642044</parent>
</comment>
<comment>
	<id>http://www.semanticweb.org/ontologies/ConversationInstances.owl#comment10_01_04_1548235.30643868</id>
	<title>Re:Me too!</title>
	<author>al3</author>
	<datestamp>1262633220000</datestamp>
	<modclass>None</modclass>
	<modscore>1</modscore>
	<htmltext>If I had a billion dollars I'd try to think of ways to make the world better too. Undoing what got you the $1B is a little strange, but whatev.</htmltext>
<tokenext>If I had a billion dollars I 'd try to think of ways to make the world better too .
Undoing what got you the $ 1B is a little strange , but whatev .</tokentext>
<sentencetext>If I had a billion dollars I'd try to think of ways to make the world better too.
Undoing what got you the $1B is a little strange, but whatev.</sentencetext>
	<parent>http://www.semanticweb.org/ontologies/ConversationInstances.owl#comment10_01_04_1548235.30641586</parent>
</comment>
<comment>
	<id>http://www.semanticweb.org/ontologies/ConversationInstances.owl#comment10_01_04_1548235.30642764</id>
	<title>Re:Own fault</title>
	<author>davester666</author>
	<datestamp>1262628600000</datestamp>
	<modclass>None</modclass>
	<modscore>1</modscore>
	<htmltext><p>More like breaking up with his wife, signing the divorce papers and custody agreements, getting a large cash settlement,...</p><p>It sounds like he wants to 'buy' back MySQL so he can go back to doing the dual-license thing [get people to do bug fixes/enhancements for free, and only he can sell the result].  Because if he just wants to make sure MySQL continues, he's free to do so as the current code base is GPL and available...</p></htmltext>
<tokenext>More like breaking up with his wife , signing the divorce papers and custody agreements , getting a large cash settlement,...It sounds like he wants to 'buy ' back MySQL so he can go back to doing the dual-license thing [ get people to do bug fixes/enhancements for free , and only he can sell the result ] .
Because if he just wants to make sure MySQL continues , he 's free to do so as the current code base is GPL and available.. .</tokentext>
<sentencetext>More like breaking up with his wife, signing the divorce papers and custody agreements, getting a large cash settlement,...It sounds like he wants to 'buy' back MySQL so he can go back to doing the dual-license thing [get people to do bug fixes/enhancements for free, and only he can sell the result].
Because if he just wants to make sure MySQL continues, he's free to do so as the current code base is GPL and available...</sentencetext>
	<parent>http://www.semanticweb.org/ontologies/ConversationInstances.owl#comment10_01_04_1548235.30641948</parent>
</comment>
<comment>
	<id>http://www.semanticweb.org/ontologies/ConversationInstances.owl#comment10_01_04_1548235.30646526</id>
	<title>Re:Fuck Monty and the horse he rode in on</title>
	<author>Anonymous</author>
	<datestamp>1262600880000</datestamp>
	<modclass>None</modclass>
	<modscore>0</modscore>
	<htmltext><p><i>The fact of the matter is that Oracle doesn't give more than about a shit-and-a-half about mySQL</i></p><p>
&nbsp; <br>i disagree. if oracle can turn even a small percentage of the MySQL install base into paying oracle customers, it's a huge win for them.</p></htmltext>
<tokenext>The fact of the matter is that Oracle does n't give more than about a shit-and-a-half about mySQL   i disagree .
if oracle can turn even a small percentage of the MySQL install base into paying oracle customers , it 's a huge win for them .</tokentext>
<sentencetext>The fact of the matter is that Oracle doesn't give more than about a shit-and-a-half about mySQL
  i disagree.
if oracle can turn even a small percentage of the MySQL install base into paying oracle customers, it's a huge win for them.</sentencetext>
	<parent>http://www.semanticweb.org/ontologies/ConversationInstances.owl#comment10_01_04_1548235.30641874</parent>
</comment>
<comment>
	<id>http://www.semanticweb.org/ontologies/ConversationInstances.owl#comment10_01_04_1548235.30642932</id>
	<title>Re:There is already a perfectly good free DBMS</title>
	<author>TheSunborn</author>
	<datestamp>1262629200000</datestamp>
	<modclass>Insightful</modclass>
	<modscore>2</modscore>
	<htmltext><p>Correct as in<br>If you insert "Hello world" as a date, it will not accept it, and convert it into "god known what". (This problem exists with all datatypes).<br>If you use transactions on table that don't support it, it will not just ignore commit/rollback commands.<br>If part of a transaction fails, a commit will not commit the rest of the transaction.</p><p>And PostgreSQL got a much better query optimizer. I still can't use views in our MySQL database because mysql keep using the wrong index. (MySQL is really bad when optimizing queries where the select that created the view uses a key)</p></htmltext>
<tokenext>Correct as inIf you insert " Hello world " as a date , it will not accept it , and convert it into " god known what " .
( This problem exists with all datatypes ) .If you use transactions on table that do n't support it , it will not just ignore commit/rollback commands.If part of a transaction fails , a commit will not commit the rest of the transaction.And PostgreSQL got a much better query optimizer .
I still ca n't use views in our MySQL database because mysql keep using the wrong index .
( MySQL is really bad when optimizing queries where the select that created the view uses a key )</tokentext>
<sentencetext>Correct as inIf you insert "Hello world" as a date, it will not accept it, and convert it into "god known what".
(This problem exists with all datatypes).If you use transactions on table that don't support it, it will not just ignore commit/rollback commands.If part of a transaction fails, a commit will not commit the rest of the transaction.And PostgreSQL got a much better query optimizer.
I still can't use views in our MySQL database because mysql keep using the wrong index.
(MySQL is really bad when optimizing queries where the select that created the view uses a key)</sentencetext>
	<parent>http://www.semanticweb.org/ontologies/ConversationInstances.owl#comment10_01_04_1548235.30642168</parent>
</comment>
<comment>
	<id>http://www.semanticweb.org/ontologies/ConversationInstances.owl#comment10_01_04_1548235.30642004</id>
	<title>Save?</title>
	<author>mseeger</author>
	<datestamp>1262625900000</datestamp>
	<modclass>None</modclass>
	<modscore>1</modscore>
	<htmltext>It looks to me more like "I had to destroy MySQL in order to save it". He is (IMHO) not doing anyone a favor.....</htmltext>
<tokenext>It looks to me more like " I had to destroy MySQL in order to save it " .
He is ( IMHO ) not doing anyone a favor.... .</tokentext>
<sentencetext>It looks to me more like "I had to destroy MySQL in order to save it".
He is (IMHO) not doing anyone a favor.....</sentencetext>
</comment>
<comment>
	<id>http://www.semanticweb.org/ontologies/ConversationInstances.owl#comment10_01_04_1548235.30642166</id>
	<title>Re:Own fault</title>
	<author>tushar.tyagi</author>
	<datestamp>1262626500000</datestamp>
	<modclass>Insightful</modclass>
	<modscore>3</modscore>
	<htmltext><p><div class="quote"><p>It's like you broke up with your girlfriend and then go crying her back when she has found a new guy, while you're having no luck.</p></div><p>If Oracle does whatever MySQL guy thinks it'll do then that means the new guy is trying to kill your girl. In that case it's all right trying to save her.</p></div>
	</htmltext>
<tokenext>It 's like you broke up with your girlfriend and then go crying her back when she has found a new guy , while you 're having no luck.If Oracle does whatever MySQL guy thinks it 'll do then that means the new guy is trying to kill your girl .
In that case it 's all right trying to save her .</tokentext>
<sentencetext>It's like you broke up with your girlfriend and then go crying her back when she has found a new guy, while you're having no luck.If Oracle does whatever MySQL guy thinks it'll do then that means the new guy is trying to kill your girl.
In that case it's all right trying to save her.
	</sentencetext>
	<parent>http://www.semanticweb.org/ontologies/ConversationInstances.owl#comment10_01_04_1548235.30641574</parent>
</comment>
<comment>
	<id>http://www.semanticweb.org/ontologies/ConversationInstances.owl#comment10_01_04_1548235.30641874</id>
	<title>Fuck Monty and the horse he rode in on</title>
	<author>ReallyEvilCanine</author>
	<datestamp>1262625360000</datestamp>
	<modclass>Insightful</modclass>
	<modscore>4</modscore>
	<htmltext>This three-week-old story hasn't changed a bit and neither has Monty's disingenuous hypocrisy.
<p>
If he'd wanted to retain control then why did he sell mySQL to Sun? Once that sale was completed he gave up his rights and claims. He certainly didn't have a problem with a corporation owning it in exchange for a cool <i>billion</i> earlier.
</p><p>
What Sun said they wanted to do with it is immaterial; Monty's rights to do anything more than complain vocally were terminated by his own hand the instant he signed the contract, and were made irreversible when he deposited that check.
</p><p>
The fact of the matter is that Oracle doesn't give more than about a shit-and-a-half about mySQL. Oracle cares about Enterprise installations and mySQL not only ain't there now, it never will be. Even Foxbase^W^H MS SQL Server spanks it 37 ways to next Tuesday in Enterprise and Data Warehousing environments.
</p><p>
Meanwhile, if mySQL really is and has remained open source, then it's <i>still</i> open, so Monty should STFU and fork it already. If not, then he himself killed it and there's no one else to blame.
</p><p>
Once you sell your 2CV to someone, you have no more say in what's done with the car, even if it turns out to have been bought by Top Gear and they want to blow it up. Once you take the money, you don't get to complain anymore. If it had meant that much to Monty then why did he sell?
</p><p>
<i>Cake: have vs. eat.</i>
</p><p>
The comment moderation on his blog is just icing on that cake -- only comments supporting poor, ickle widdle Monty's untenable position are allowed through.
</p><p>
And for those who still refuse to change the "evil Oracle" record, The <a href="http://www.oracle.com/corporate/pricing/technology-price-list.pdf" title="oracle.com">base Oracle DB charge</a> [oracle.com] is $350 (Std) / $950 (Ent) per user or $17,500 (Std) / $47,500 (Ent) per processor -- annually, not including required support and other charges -- Oracle doesn't give a shit about mySQL and the paltry few thousand that supporting it might bring in.
</p><p>
If it's really still Open Sauce and the community doesn't like what happens with it then mySQL will fork. Again. Except that it will need a new core team since the current core team has bills to pay and enjoys employment during an economic mess.</p></htmltext>
<tokenext>This three-week-old story has n't changed a bit and neither has Monty 's disingenuous hypocrisy .
If he 'd wanted to retain control then why did he sell mySQL to Sun ?
Once that sale was completed he gave up his rights and claims .
He certainly did n't have a problem with a corporation owning it in exchange for a cool billion earlier .
What Sun said they wanted to do with it is immaterial ; Monty 's rights to do anything more than complain vocally were terminated by his own hand the instant he signed the contract , and were made irreversible when he deposited that check .
The fact of the matter is that Oracle does n't give more than about a shit-and-a-half about mySQL .
Oracle cares about Enterprise installations and mySQL not only ai n't there now , it never will be .
Even Foxbase ^ W ^ H MS SQL Server spanks it 37 ways to next Tuesday in Enterprise and Data Warehousing environments .
Meanwhile , if mySQL really is and has remained open source , then it 's still open , so Monty should STFU and fork it already .
If not , then he himself killed it and there 's no one else to blame .
Once you sell your 2CV to someone , you have no more say in what 's done with the car , even if it turns out to have been bought by Top Gear and they want to blow it up .
Once you take the money , you do n't get to complain anymore .
If it had meant that much to Monty then why did he sell ?
Cake : have vs. eat . The comment moderation on his blog is just icing on that cake -- only comments supporting poor , ickle widdle Monty 's untenable position are allowed through .
And for those who still refuse to change the " evil Oracle " record , The base Oracle DB charge [ oracle.com ] is $ 350 ( Std ) / $ 950 ( Ent ) per user or $ 17,500 ( Std ) / $ 47,500 ( Ent ) per processor -- annually , not including required support and other charges -- Oracle does n't give a shit about mySQL and the paltry few thousand that supporting it might bring in .
If it 's really still Open Sauce and the community does n't like what happens with it then mySQL will fork .
Again. Except that it will need a new core team since the current core team has bills to pay and enjoys employment during an economic mess .</tokentext>
<sentencetext>This three-week-old story hasn't changed a bit and neither has Monty's disingenuous hypocrisy.
If he'd wanted to retain control then why did he sell mySQL to Sun?
Once that sale was completed he gave up his rights and claims.
He certainly didn't have a problem with a corporation owning it in exchange for a cool billion earlier.
What Sun said they wanted to do with it is immaterial; Monty's rights to do anything more than complain vocally were terminated by his own hand the instant he signed the contract, and were made irreversible when he deposited that check.
The fact of the matter is that Oracle doesn't give more than about a shit-and-a-half about mySQL.
Oracle cares about Enterprise installations and mySQL not only ain't there now, it never will be.
Even Foxbase^W^H MS SQL Server spanks it 37 ways to next Tuesday in Enterprise and Data Warehousing environments.
Meanwhile, if mySQL really is and has remained open source, then it's still open, so Monty should STFU and fork it already.
If not, then he himself killed it and there's no one else to blame.
Once you sell your 2CV to someone, you have no more say in what's done with the car, even if it turns out to have been bought by Top Gear and they want to blow it up.
Once you take the money, you don't get to complain anymore.
If it had meant that much to Monty then why did he sell?
Cake: have vs. eat.

The comment moderation on his blog is just icing on that cake -- only comments supporting poor, ickle widdle Monty's untenable position are allowed through.
And for those who still refuse to change the "evil Oracle" record, The base Oracle DB charge [oracle.com] is $350 (Std) / $950 (Ent) per user or $17,500 (Std) / $47,500 (Ent) per processor -- annually, not including required support and other charges -- Oracle doesn't give a shit about mySQL and the paltry few thousand that supporting it might bring in.
If it's really still Open Sauce and the community doesn't like what happens with it then mySQL will fork.
Again. Except that it will need a new core team since the current core team has bills to pay and enjoys employment during an economic mess.</sentencetext>
</comment>
<comment>
	<id>http://www.semanticweb.org/ontologies/ConversationInstances.owl#comment10_01_04_1548235.30643194</id>
	<title>Re:There is already a perfectly good free DBMS</title>
	<author>sco08y</author>
	<datestamp>1262630400000</datestamp>
	<modclass>Informativ</modclass>
	<modscore>4</modscore>
	<htmltext><p><div class="quote"><p>Can you elaborate on the 'correct' with emphasis?</p><p>Google says that both postgresql and mysql get hits from 'incorrect results'.  Are you stating that mysql's bugs have gone unfixed while postgre's have not?  Or what?</p></div><p>For fairness, I'm going by MySQL version 5.5, the development version.</p><p>The default storage engine will quietly ignore foreign key constraints and transactions. <a href="http://dev.mysql.com/doc/refman/5.5/en/myisam-storage-engine.html" title="mysql.com">source for default engine</a> [mysql.com], <a href="http://dev.mysql.com/doc/refman/5.5/en/ansi-diff-foreign-keys.html" title="mysql.com">claim that MySQL parses and ignores for non-InnoDB</a> [mysql.com]</p><p>There are multiple "SQL Modes" that can alter correctness, <a href="http://dev.mysql.com/doc/refman/5.5/en/server-sql-mode.html" title="mysql.com">source</a> [mysql.com], but by default the DBMS doesn't try to validate input. It's pretty confusing what mode does what, and I don't care enough to figure it out, but MySQL's approach has always been Do What I Think You Mean, and if they set the new version to be ANSI compliant by default it'd break all the existing sites built on it.</p><p>(I'm claiming this qualifies as "not being correct" by virtue of the Information Principle. Granted, SQL itself violates it in many ways, but MySQL proved that you can do worse than SQL.)</p><p>PostgreSQL has a far more correct transaction model. In some ways, they're actually better than Oracle. (In Oracle, a DDL statement will start a new transaction, whereas PostgreSQL wraps DDL into a transaction.) For starters, there aren't multiple "storage engines" per table with different transactional behaviors. <a href="http://www.postgresql.org/docs/8.4/interactive/storage-file-layout.html" title="postgresql.org">source, sort of.</a> [postgresql.org]</p><p>Also, PostgreSQL, to my knowledge, correctly validates input. It's kind of hard to cite a source for this since there's just no FAQ entry "Q. How do I configure PostgreSQL to silently corrupt my data? A. You can't." But by the same token, they don't have any long-standing terrible design decisions that they have to maintain compatibility with.</p></div>
	</htmltext>
<tokenext>Can you elaborate on the 'correct ' with emphasis ? Google says that both postgresql and mysql get hits from 'incorrect results' .
Are you stating that mysql 's bugs have gone unfixed while postgre 's have not ?
Or what ? For fairness , I 'm going by MySQL version 5.5 , the development version.The default storage engine will quietly ignore foreign key constraints and transactions .
source for default engine [ mysql.com ] , claim that MySQL parses and ignores for non-InnoDB [ mysql.com ] There are multiple " SQL Modes " that can alter correctness , source [ mysql.com ] , but by default the DBMS does n't try to validate input .
It 's pretty confusing what mode does what , and I do n't care enough to figure it out , but MySQL 's approach has always been Do What I Think You Mean , and if they set the new version to be ANSI compliant by default it 'd break all the existing sites built on it .
( I 'm claiming this qualifies as " not being correct " by virtue of the Information Principle .
Granted , SQL itself violates it in many ways , but MySQL proved that you can do worse than SQL .
) PostgreSQL has a far more correct transaction model .
In some ways , they 're actually better than Oracle .
( In Oracle , a DDL statement will start a new transaction , whereas PostgreSQL wraps DDL into a transaction .
) For starters , there are n't multiple " storage engines " per table with different transactional behaviors .
source , sort of .
[ postgresql.org ] Also , PostgreSQL , to my knowledge , correctly validates input .
It 's kind of hard to cite a source for this since there 's just no FAQ entry " Q. How do I configure PostgreSQL to silently corrupt my data ?
A. You ca n't .
" But by the same token , they do n't have any long-standing terrible design decisions that they have to maintain compatibility with .</tokentext>
<sentencetext>Can you elaborate on the 'correct' with emphasis?Google says that both postgresql and mysql get hits from 'incorrect results'.
Are you stating that mysql's bugs have gone unfixed while postgre's have not?
Or what?For fairness, I'm going by MySQL version 5.5, the development version.The default storage engine will quietly ignore foreign key constraints and transactions.
source for default engine [mysql.com], claim that MySQL parses and ignores for non-InnoDB [mysql.com]There are multiple "SQL Modes" that can alter correctness, source [mysql.com], but by default the DBMS doesn't try to validate input.
It's pretty confusing what mode does what, and I don't care enough to figure it out, but MySQL's approach has always been Do What I Think You Mean, and if they set the new version to be ANSI compliant by default it'd break all the existing sites built on it.
(I'm claiming this qualifies as "not being correct" by virtue of the Information Principle.
Granted, SQL itself violates it in many ways, but MySQL proved that you can do worse than SQL.
)PostgreSQL has a far more correct transaction model.
In some ways, they're actually better than Oracle.
(In Oracle, a DDL statement will start a new transaction, whereas PostgreSQL wraps DDL into a transaction.
) For starters, there aren't multiple "storage engines" per table with different transactional behaviors.
source, sort of.
[postgresql.org]Also, PostgreSQL, to my knowledge, correctly validates input.
It's kind of hard to cite a source for this since there's just no FAQ entry "Q. How do I configure PostgreSQL to silently corrupt my data?
A. You can't.
" But by the same token, they don't have any long-standing terrible design decisions that they have to maintain compatibility with.
	</sentencetext>
	<parent>http://www.semanticweb.org/ontologies/ConversationInstances.owl#comment10_01_04_1548235.30642168</parent>
</comment>
<comment>
	<id>http://www.semanticweb.org/ontologies/ConversationInstances.owl#comment10_01_04_1548235.30651898</id>
	<title>Re:Own fault</title>
	<author>blai</author>
	<datestamp>1262633940000</datestamp>
	<modclass>None</modclass>
	<modscore>1</modscore>
	<htmltext>oooh right I get it now!</htmltext>
<tokenext>oooh right I get it now !</tokentext>
<sentencetext>oooh right I get it now!</sentencetext>
	<parent>http://www.semanticweb.org/ontologies/ConversationInstances.owl#comment10_01_04_1548235.30641712</parent>
</comment>
<comment>
	<id>http://www.semanticweb.org/ontologies/ConversationInstances.owl#comment10_01_04_1548235.30642492</id>
	<title>Re:Own fault</title>
	<author>sopssa</author>
	<datestamp>1262627640000</datestamp>
	<modclass>Insightful</modclass>
	<modscore>4</modscore>
	<htmltext><p><div class="quote"><p>David and I however thought that this would not be a problem, as we would help ensure that MySQL would be bought by a good owner.</p></div><p>So it was really short-sighted thinking. They should had have some clause that limits how MySQL project would be possibly resold, or not sell the company at all, because its pretty clear that the project could be resold or go along with larger corporate overtakes. It's happened hundreds of times. They got to have known this.</p></div>
	</htmltext>
<tokenext>David and I however thought that this would not be a problem , as we would help ensure that MySQL would be bought by a good owner.So it was really short-sighted thinking .
They should had have some clause that limits how MySQL project would be possibly resold , or not sell the company at all , because its pretty clear that the project could be resold or go along with larger corporate overtakes .
It 's happened hundreds of times .
They got to have known this .</tokentext>
<sentencetext>David and I however thought that this would not be a problem, as we would help ensure that MySQL would be bought by a good owner.So it was really short-sighted thinking.
They should had have some clause that limits how MySQL project would be possibly resold, or not sell the company at all, because its pretty clear that the project could be resold or go along with larger corporate overtakes.
It's happened hundreds of times.
They got to have known this.
	</sentencetext>
	<parent>http://www.semanticweb.org/ontologies/ConversationInstances.owl#comment10_01_04_1548235.30642044</parent>
</comment>
<comment>
	<id>http://www.semanticweb.org/ontologies/ConversationInstances.owl#comment10_01_04_1548235.30643428</id>
	<title>Re:well...</title>
	<author>tuxgeek</author>
	<datestamp>1262631600000</datestamp>
	<modclass>None</modclass>
	<modscore>1</modscore>
	<htmltext>Choice is always good<br>It's just the right time to fork mysql to keep it free and going</htmltext>
<tokenext>Choice is always goodIt 's just the right time to fork mysql to keep it free and going</tokentext>
<sentencetext>Choice is always goodIt's just the right time to fork mysql to keep it free and going</sentencetext>
	<parent>http://www.semanticweb.org/ontologies/ConversationInstances.owl#comment10_01_04_1548235.30641562</parent>
</comment>
<comment>
	<id>http://www.semanticweb.org/ontologies/ConversationInstances.owl#comment10_01_04_1548235.30646646</id>
	<title>Re:Fuck Monty and the horse he rode in on</title>
	<author>Anonymous</author>
	<datestamp>1262601420000</datestamp>
	<modclass>None</modclass>
	<modscore>0</modscore>
	<htmltext><p><div class="quote"><p>And for those who still refuse to change the "evil Oracle" record, The base Oracle DB charge is $350 (Std) / $950 (Ent) per user or $17,500 (Std) / $47,500 (Ent) per processor -- annually, not including required support and other charges -- Oracle doesn't give a shit about mySQL and the paltry few thousand that supporting it might bring in.</p></div><p>Oracle used to offer Oracle 10g XE for free, even for production use, but I don't know if that now applies to Oracle 11g.  10 XE had limitations like 1 CPU &amp; 4GB per DB IIRC, but that would hardly bother most people who might balk at Oracle's entry-level pricing.  Most of those who wouldn't consider switching from MySQL would never pay up for Oracle anyway, and Ellison isn't subject to the peculiar stupidity afflicting the RIAA.  And Oracle would be foolish to strangle MySQL - it's a good way to upsell some people into becoming paying Oracle customers.  Oracle could enhance MySQL with Oracle DB interfaces to ease mixed installations and data migration (in the profitable direction, of course) to discourage use of PostgreSQL/Firebird/whatever, and they'd probably still break even on continuing MySQL commercial licenses.<br>
<br>
- T</p></div>
	</htmltext>
<tokenext>And for those who still refuse to change the " evil Oracle " record , The base Oracle DB charge is $ 350 ( Std ) / $ 950 ( Ent ) per user or $ 17,500 ( Std ) / $ 47,500 ( Ent ) per processor -- annually , not including required support and other charges -- Oracle does n't give a shit about mySQL and the paltry few thousand that supporting it might bring in.Oracle used to offer Oracle 10g XE for free , even for production use , but I do n't know if that now applies to Oracle 11g .
10 XE had limitations like 1 CPU &amp; 4GB per DB IIRC , but that would hardly bother most people who might balk at Oracle 's entry-level pricing .
Most of those who would n't consider switching from MySQL would never pay up for Oracle anyway , and Ellison is n't subject to the peculiar stupidity afflicting the RIAA .
And Oracle would be foolish to strangle MySQL - it 's a good way to upsell some people into becoming paying Oracle customers .
Oracle could enhance MySQL with Oracle DB interfaces to ease mixed installations and data migration ( in the profitable direction , of course ) to discourage use of PostgreSQL/Firebird/whatever , and they 'd probably still break even on continuing MySQL commercial licenses .
- T</tokentext>
<sentencetext>And for those who still refuse to change the "evil Oracle" record, The base Oracle DB charge is $350 (Std) / $950 (Ent) per user or $17,500 (Std) / $47,500 (Ent) per processor -- annually, not including required support and other charges -- Oracle doesn't give a shit about mySQL and the paltry few thousand that supporting it might bring in.Oracle used to offer Oracle 10g XE for free, even for production use, but I don't know if that now applies to Oracle 11g.
10 XE had limitations like 1 CPU &amp; 4GB per DB IIRC, but that would hardly bother most people who might balk at Oracle's entry-level pricing.
Most of those who wouldn't consider switching from MySQL would never pay up for Oracle anyway, and Ellison isn't subject to the peculiar stupidity afflicting the RIAA.
And Oracle would be foolish to strangle MySQL - it's a good way to upsell some people into becoming paying Oracle customers.
Oracle could enhance MySQL with Oracle DB interfaces to ease mixed installations and data migration (in the profitable direction, of course) to discourage use of PostgreSQL/Firebird/whatever, and they'd probably still break even on continuing MySQL commercial licenses.
- T
	</sentencetext>
	<parent>http://www.semanticweb.org/ontologies/ConversationInstances.owl#comment10_01_04_1548235.30641874</parent>
</comment>
<comment>
	<id>http://www.semanticweb.org/ontologies/ConversationInstances.owl#comment10_01_04_1548235.30641574</id>
	<title>Own fault</title>
	<author>Anonymous</author>
	<datestamp>1262624340000</datestamp>
	<modclass>Insightful</modclass>
	<modscore>5</modscore>
	<htmltext><p>Maybe he shouldn't had sold it in the first time, so he wouldn't be crying it back now?</p><p>It's like you broke up with your girlfriend and then go crying her back when she has found a new guy, while you're having no luck.</p></htmltext>
<tokenext>Maybe he should n't had sold it in the first time , so he would n't be crying it back now ? It 's like you broke up with your girlfriend and then go crying her back when she has found a new guy , while you 're having no luck .</tokentext>
<sentencetext>Maybe he shouldn't had sold it in the first time, so he wouldn't be crying it back now?It's like you broke up with your girlfriend and then go crying her back when she has found a new guy, while you're having no luck.</sentencetext>
</comment>
<comment>
	<id>http://www.semanticweb.org/ontologies/ConversationInstances.owl#comment10_01_04_1548235.30642804</id>
	<title>Re:There is already a perfectly good free DBMS</title>
	<author>jedidiah</author>
	<datestamp>1262628780000</datestamp>
	<modclass>Informativ</modclass>
	<modscore>2</modscore>
	<htmltext><p>Sorry but all of your ranting reads more like a reason to dump mysql than postgres.</p><p>SQL is that 'standard' environment. The fact that mysql now has yet another reason<br>why discriminating users might shun it doesn't make all of those other reasons<br>suddenly disappear.</p><p>Fork mysql.<br>Use postgres.<br>Use a more embedded 'free' solution.<br>Use a serious 'non-free' solution.</p><p>There are genuine industry standards here. Where's the tragedy?</p></htmltext>
<tokenext>Sorry but all of your ranting reads more like a reason to dump mysql than postgres.SQL is that 'standard ' environment .
The fact that mysql now has yet another reasonwhy discriminating users might shun it does n't make all of those other reasonssuddenly disappear.Fork mysql.Use postgres.Use a more embedded 'free ' solution.Use a serious 'non-free ' solution.There are genuine industry standards here .
Where 's the tragedy ?</tokentext>
<sentencetext>Sorry but all of your ranting reads more like a reason to dump mysql than postgres.SQL is that 'standard' environment.
The fact that mysql now has yet another reasonwhy discriminating users might shun it doesn't make all of those other reasonssuddenly disappear.Fork mysql.Use postgres.Use a more embedded 'free' solution.Use a serious 'non-free' solution.There are genuine industry standards here.
Where's the tragedy?</sentencetext>
	<parent>http://www.semanticweb.org/ontologies/ConversationInstances.owl#comment10_01_04_1548235.30642346</parent>
</comment>
<comment>
	<id>http://www.semanticweb.org/ontologies/ConversationInstances.owl#comment10_01_04_1548235.30641560</id>
	<title>yay</title>
	<author>Anonymous</author>
	<datestamp>1262624280000</datestamp>
	<modclass>Funny</modclass>
	<modscore>4</modscore>
	<htmltext><p>...First at last</p><p>For the sake of topic titles, I'd rather if Monty saved Python.</p></htmltext>
<tokenext>...First at lastFor the sake of topic titles , I 'd rather if Monty saved Python .</tokentext>
<sentencetext>...First at lastFor the sake of topic titles, I'd rather if Monty saved Python.</sentencetext>
</comment>
<comment>
	<id>http://www.semanticweb.org/ontologies/ConversationInstances.owl#comment10_01_04_1548235.30643574</id>
	<title>What an idiot!</title>
	<author>AlexLibman</author>
	<datestamp>1262632200000</datestamp>
	<modclass>None</modclass>
	<modscore>0</modscore>
	<htmltext><p>He sells his joke of a database product to Sun, and now he wants Mommy Government to hurt two large companies and millions of their customers, employees, and investors just to push for some socialist political agenda!  Hasn't he ever heard of forking?!  Viral license or not, Oracle and Sun are not Monty's slaves!</p><p>Them GNU idiots are a cult, and rational people are right to stay as far away from them as possible.  Good thing even before I knew anything about software licenses I was smart enough to specialize in PostgreSQL and SQLite based on their technological merits, which make MySQL look like a toy for retarded toddlers!  Why anyone would use MySQL over PostgreSQL is beyond me - must be further evidence of the socialist bias in the open source community...</p><p>If the Sun-Oracle deal goes through, I swear, I will rewrite every piece of software myself from scratch rather than resort to using anything with a copyleft license ever again!</p></htmltext>
<tokenext>He sells his joke of a database product to Sun , and now he wants Mommy Government to hurt two large companies and millions of their customers , employees , and investors just to push for some socialist political agenda !
Has n't he ever heard of forking ? !
Viral license or not , Oracle and Sun are not Monty 's slaves ! Them GNU idiots are a cult , and rational people are right to stay as far away from them as possible .
Good thing even before I knew anything about software licenses I was smart enough to specialize in PostgreSQL and SQLite based on their technological merits , which make MySQL look like a toy for retarded toddlers !
Why anyone would use MySQL over PostgreSQL is beyond me - must be further evidence of the socialist bias in the open source community...If the Sun-Oracle deal goes through , I swear , I will rewrite every piece of software myself from scratch rather than resort to using anything with a copyleft license ever again !</tokentext>
<sentencetext>He sells his joke of a database product to Sun, and now he wants Mommy Government to hurt two large companies and millions of their customers, employees, and investors just to push for some socialist political agenda!
Hasn't he ever heard of forking?!
Viral license or not, Oracle and Sun are not Monty's slaves!Them GNU idiots are a cult, and rational people are right to stay as far away from them as possible.
Good thing even before I knew anything about software licenses I was smart enough to specialize in PostgreSQL and SQLite based on their technological merits, which make MySQL look like a toy for retarded toddlers!
Why anyone would use MySQL over PostgreSQL is beyond me - must be further evidence of the socialist bias in the open source community...If the Sun-Oracle deal goes through, I swear, I will rewrite every piece of software myself from scratch rather than resort to using anything with a copyleft license ever again!</sentencetext>
</comment>
<comment>
	<id>http://www.semanticweb.org/ontologies/ConversationInstances.owl#comment10_01_04_1548235.30641664</id>
	<title>He got paid. It's GPL.</title>
	<author>bcrowell</author>
	<datestamp>1262624640000</datestamp>
	<modclass>Insightful</modclass>
	<modscore>3</modscore>
	<htmltext>He got paid a large amount of money for MySQL, and now he's not satisfied. MySQL is under GPL v. 2, so there isn't a problem. If Sun takes it in a bad direction, it can be forked.</htmltext>
<tokenext>He got paid a large amount of money for MySQL , and now he 's not satisfied .
MySQL is under GPL v. 2 , so there is n't a problem .
If Sun takes it in a bad direction , it can be forked .</tokentext>
<sentencetext>He got paid a large amount of money for MySQL, and now he's not satisfied.
MySQL is under GPL v. 2, so there isn't a problem.
If Sun takes it in a bad direction, it can be forked.</sentencetext>
</comment>
<comment>
	<id>http://www.semanticweb.org/ontologies/ConversationInstances.owl#comment10_01_04_1548235.30645272</id>
	<title>Re:Time to switch...</title>
	<author>Just Some Guy</author>
	<datestamp>1262596320000</datestamp>
	<modclass>None</modclass>
	<modscore>1</modscore>
	<htmltext><p><div class="quote"><p>It may not be as fast as MySQL</p></div><p>...but it'll probably be a lot faster, especially if you're running more than one query in parallel. Seriously, PostgreSQL scales <em>much</em> better than MySQL, and that's pretty crucial when almost no one makes single-core server hardware anymore.</p></div>
	</htmltext>
<tokenext>It may not be as fast as MySQL...but it 'll probably be a lot faster , especially if you 're running more than one query in parallel .
Seriously , PostgreSQL scales much better than MySQL , and that 's pretty crucial when almost no one makes single-core server hardware anymore .</tokentext>
<sentencetext>It may not be as fast as MySQL...but it'll probably be a lot faster, especially if you're running more than one query in parallel.
Seriously, PostgreSQL scales much better than MySQL, and that's pretty crucial when almost no one makes single-core server hardware anymore.
	</sentencetext>
	<parent>http://www.semanticweb.org/ontologies/ConversationInstances.owl#comment10_01_04_1548235.30642878</parent>
</comment>
<comment>
	<id>http://www.semanticweb.org/ontologies/ConversationInstances.owl#comment10_01_04_1548235.30641660</id>
	<title>Econ 101: if a niche needs filled, it will be</title>
	<author>SlappyBastard</author>
	<datestamp>1262624580000</datestamp>
	<modclass>None</modclass>
	<modscore>1</modscore>
	<htmltext><p>How intellectually lazy is it to say there won't be a free DB?  Do I want to migrate from MySQL to PG?  No.  But, if the economics of MySQL become prohibitive, it's not like I'm going to kill myself over it.  I'm going to move on.</p><p>If the existing solutions aren't good enough, then a new solution will emerge.  That's economics.  The niche is already proven by MySQL.  If MySQL ceases to fill that niche, it won't be long before something else fills it.</p></htmltext>
<tokenext>How intellectually lazy is it to say there wo n't be a free DB ?
Do I want to migrate from MySQL to PG ?
No. But , if the economics of MySQL become prohibitive , it 's not like I 'm going to kill myself over it .
I 'm going to move on.If the existing solutions are n't good enough , then a new solution will emerge .
That 's economics .
The niche is already proven by MySQL .
If MySQL ceases to fill that niche , it wo n't be long before something else fills it .</tokentext>
<sentencetext>How intellectually lazy is it to say there won't be a free DB?
Do I want to migrate from MySQL to PG?
No.  But, if the economics of MySQL become prohibitive, it's not like I'm going to kill myself over it.
I'm going to move on.If the existing solutions aren't good enough, then a new solution will emerge.
That's economics.
The niche is already proven by MySQL.
If MySQL ceases to fill that niche, it won't be long before something else fills it.</sentencetext>
</comment>
<comment>
	<id>http://www.semanticweb.org/ontologies/ConversationInstances.owl#comment10_01_04_1548235.30641604</id>
	<title>Not just his blog</title>
	<author>Anonymous</author>
	<datestamp>1262624400000</datestamp>
	<modclass>Informativ</modclass>
	<modscore>5</modscore>
	<htmltext>He also spammed everybody who's ever been dumb enough to let him get anywhere near their e-mail address with the same self-serving, hypocritical screed...</htmltext>
<tokenext>He also spammed everybody who 's ever been dumb enough to let him get anywhere near their e-mail address with the same self-serving , hypocritical screed.. .</tokentext>
<sentencetext>He also spammed everybody who's ever been dumb enough to let him get anywhere near their e-mail address with the same self-serving, hypocritical screed...</sentencetext>
</comment>
<comment>
	<id>http://www.semanticweb.org/ontologies/ConversationInstances.owl#comment10_01_04_1548235.30641764</id>
	<title>Monty is a douche</title>
	<author>thetoadwarrior</author>
	<datestamp>1262624940000</datestamp>
	<modclass>Interestin</modclass>
	<modscore>3</modscore>
	<htmltext>He got his money and now he sees an opportunity to get his code back that he sold and the shyster is doing what he can to get it back.
<br> <br>
He has his own db, MariaDB and if it's any good then he shouldn't care since its whole purpose is that it's a replacement to MySQL.
<br> <br>
I've also noticed he's not allowing comments on his blog that counter his points no matter how mature and well presented they are.
<br> <br>
I really hope Oracle gets the ok, if for any reason to shit in this guy's Cheerios. I won't have anything to do anything he's working on.</htmltext>
<tokenext>He got his money and now he sees an opportunity to get his code back that he sold and the shyster is doing what he can to get it back .
He has his own db , MariaDB and if it 's any good then he should n't care since its whole purpose is that it 's a replacement to MySQL .
I 've also noticed he 's not allowing comments on his blog that counter his points no matter how mature and well presented they are .
I really hope Oracle gets the ok , if for any reason to shit in this guy 's Cheerios .
I wo n't have anything to do anything he 's working on .</tokentext>
<sentencetext>He got his money and now he sees an opportunity to get his code back that he sold and the shyster is doing what he can to get it back.
He has his own db, MariaDB and if it's any good then he shouldn't care since its whole purpose is that it's a replacement to MySQL.
I've also noticed he's not allowing comments on his blog that counter his points no matter how mature and well presented they are.
I really hope Oracle gets the ok, if for any reason to shit in this guy's Cheerios.
I won't have anything to do anything he's working on.</sentencetext>
</comment>
<comment>
	<id>http://www.semanticweb.org/ontologies/ConversationInstances.owl#comment10_01_04_1548235.30644416</id>
	<title>Re:well...</title>
	<author>Anonymous</author>
	<datestamp>1262635860000</datestamp>
	<modclass>None</modclass>
	<modscore>0</modscore>
	<htmltext><p>No but we do have <a href="http://www.firebirdsql.org/" title="firebirdsql.org" rel="nofollow">Firebird</a> [firebirdsql.org] which is similar in features to pg but performs way better.  In fact, Firebird is a like combination of MySQL (performance) and PostgreSQL (features).</p></htmltext>
<tokenext>No but we do have Firebird [ firebirdsql.org ] which is similar in features to pg but performs way better .
In fact , Firebird is a like combination of MySQL ( performance ) and PostgreSQL ( features ) .</tokentext>
<sentencetext>No but we do have Firebird [firebirdsql.org] which is similar in features to pg but performs way better.
In fact, Firebird is a like combination of MySQL (performance) and PostgreSQL (features).</sentencetext>
	<parent>http://www.semanticweb.org/ontologies/ConversationInstances.owl#comment10_01_04_1548235.30641562</parent>
</comment>
<comment>
	<id>http://www.semanticweb.org/ontologies/ConversationInstances.owl#comment10_01_04_1548235.30642158</id>
	<title>Re:well...</title>
	<author>poetmatt</author>
	<datestamp>1262626500000</datestamp>
	<modclass>Flamebait</modclass>
	<modscore>-1</modscore>
	<htmltext><p>I guess it didn't take long for Monty to show his true colors when he joined Microsoft (codeplex), huh.</p><p>Man, all that's left of LAMP is linux and python at this point if MySQL fails. Talk about Microsoft attacks on open source.</p></htmltext>
<tokenext>I guess it did n't take long for Monty to show his true colors when he joined Microsoft ( codeplex ) , huh.Man , all that 's left of LAMP is linux and python at this point if MySQL fails .
Talk about Microsoft attacks on open source .</tokentext>
<sentencetext>I guess it didn't take long for Monty to show his true colors when he joined Microsoft (codeplex), huh.Man, all that's left of LAMP is linux and python at this point if MySQL fails.
Talk about Microsoft attacks on open source.</sentencetext>
	<parent>http://www.semanticweb.org/ontologies/ConversationInstances.owl#comment10_01_04_1548235.30641562</parent>
</comment>
<comment>
	<id>http://www.semanticweb.org/ontologies/ConversationInstances.owl#comment10_01_04_1548235.30641844</id>
	<title>Let's just use PostgreSQL</title>
	<author>bogaboga</author>
	<datestamp>1262625240000</datestamp>
	<modclass>None</modclass>
	<modscore>1</modscore>
	<htmltext><p>Why? Because the alleged shortcommings of PostgreSQL can be solved and it is far more superior to MySQL when it comes to supporting partial indexes. MySQL would not know how to handle this.</p></htmltext>
<tokenext>Why ?
Because the alleged shortcommings of PostgreSQL can be solved and it is far more superior to MySQL when it comes to supporting partial indexes .
MySQL would not know how to handle this .</tokentext>
<sentencetext>Why?
Because the alleged shortcommings of PostgreSQL can be solved and it is far more superior to MySQL when it comes to supporting partial indexes.
MySQL would not know how to handle this.</sentencetext>
</comment>
<comment>
	<id>http://www.semanticweb.org/ontologies/ConversationInstances.owl#comment10_01_04_1548235.30642328</id>
	<title>It seems to be GPL so . . . so what?</title>
	<author>pugugly</author>
	<datestamp>1262627100000</datestamp>
	<modclass>None</modclass>
	<modscore>1</modscore>
	<htmltext><p>For all the crying about Monty's disingenuousness, <a href="http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Mysql#Support\_and\_licensing" title="wikipedia.org">Wikipedia</a> [wikipedia.org] shows the main license is still GPL, with a proprietary license available but not the only license. Presuming this is accurate (And I concede, I don't know exactly why anyone would pay a giga-buck for a GPL'd application given the inherent limitations on monetizing it in any way anyone else with access to the source could. I also don't entirely understand why one would buy a proprietary license for a GPL product? So finding out I misunderstand the situation would hardly be a shock.), um - so what. Phoenix the name, keep the code, fork the project - Oracle seems to be buying the mark, the code is open.</p><p>So, uh, who cares. The GPL is a valid license, in order to actually grab the code itself Oracle would have to file a lawsuit and retroactively 'un-GPL' it, and given the (intermittently tested, but consistent) record of the GPL as a perfectly valid license, I don't see that happening.</p><p>So . . . What am I missing that this sale is a major issue from the open-source pov?</p><p>Pug</p></htmltext>
<tokenext>For all the crying about Monty 's disingenuousness , Wikipedia [ wikipedia.org ] shows the main license is still GPL , with a proprietary license available but not the only license .
Presuming this is accurate ( And I concede , I do n't know exactly why anyone would pay a giga-buck for a GPL 'd application given the inherent limitations on monetizing it in any way anyone else with access to the source could .
I also do n't entirely understand why one would buy a proprietary license for a GPL product ?
So finding out I misunderstand the situation would hardly be a shock .
) , um - so what .
Phoenix the name , keep the code , fork the project - Oracle seems to be buying the mark , the code is open.So , uh , who cares .
The GPL is a valid license , in order to actually grab the code itself Oracle would have to file a lawsuit and retroactively 'un-GPL ' it , and given the ( intermittently tested , but consistent ) record of the GPL as a perfectly valid license , I do n't see that happening.So .
. .
What am I missing that this sale is a major issue from the open-source pov ? Pug</tokentext>
<sentencetext>For all the crying about Monty's disingenuousness, Wikipedia [wikipedia.org] shows the main license is still GPL, with a proprietary license available but not the only license.
Presuming this is accurate (And I concede, I don't know exactly why anyone would pay a giga-buck for a GPL'd application given the inherent limitations on monetizing it in any way anyone else with access to the source could.
I also don't entirely understand why one would buy a proprietary license for a GPL product?
So finding out I misunderstand the situation would hardly be a shock.
), um - so what.
Phoenix the name, keep the code, fork the project - Oracle seems to be buying the mark, the code is open.So, uh, who cares.
The GPL is a valid license, in order to actually grab the code itself Oracle would have to file a lawsuit and retroactively 'un-GPL' it, and given the (intermittently tested, but consistent) record of the GPL as a perfectly valid license, I don't see that happening.So .
. .
What am I missing that this sale is a major issue from the open-source pov?Pug</sentencetext>
</comment>
<comment>
	<id>http://www.semanticweb.org/ontologies/ConversationInstances.owl#comment10_01_04_1548235.30643762</id>
	<title>Re:Own fault</title>
	<author>Grishnakh</author>
	<datestamp>1262632860000</datestamp>
	<modclass>None</modclass>
	<modscore>1</modscore>
	<htmltext><p>Maybe I'm missing something here, but isn't MySQL still under an open-source license?  Or at least the version that was sold to Sun?  Why not just fork the code, as was done with XFree86/X.org?  So he might not be able to keep the same name, but who cares?  Call it "NewMySQL" or "RealMySQL".</p></htmltext>
<tokenext>Maybe I 'm missing something here , but is n't MySQL still under an open-source license ?
Or at least the version that was sold to Sun ?
Why not just fork the code , as was done with XFree86/X.org ?
So he might not be able to keep the same name , but who cares ?
Call it " NewMySQL " or " RealMySQL " .</tokentext>
<sentencetext>Maybe I'm missing something here, but isn't MySQL still under an open-source license?
Or at least the version that was sold to Sun?
Why not just fork the code, as was done with XFree86/X.org?
So he might not be able to keep the same name, but who cares?
Call it "NewMySQL" or "RealMySQL".</sentencetext>
	<parent>http://www.semanticweb.org/ontologies/ConversationInstances.owl#comment10_01_04_1548235.30642044</parent>
</comment>
<comment>
	<id>http://www.semanticweb.org/ontologies/ConversationInstances.owl#comment10_01_04_1548235.30642290</id>
	<title>There are *many* open source RDBMS</title>
	<author>toby</author>
	<datestamp>1262626980000</datestamp>
	<modclass>None</modclass>
	<modscore>1</modscore>
	<htmltext><p>Others include</p><ul><li> <a href="http://firebirdsql.org/" title="firebirdsql.org">Firebird</a> [firebirdsql.org]</li><li> <a href="http://www.ingres.com/products/ingres-database.php" title="ingres.com">Ingres</a> [ingres.com]</li></ul><p>And there are many more, <a href="http://internetmindmap.com/database\_software" title="internetmindmap.com">relational and non-relational,</a> [internetmindmap.com] out there.</p></htmltext>
<tokenext>Others include Firebird [ firebirdsql.org ] Ingres [ ingres.com ] And there are many more , relational and non-relational , [ internetmindmap.com ] out there .</tokentext>
<sentencetext>Others include Firebird [firebirdsql.org] Ingres [ingres.com]And there are many more, relational and non-relational, [internetmindmap.com] out there.</sentencetext>
	<parent>http://www.semanticweb.org/ontologies/ConversationInstances.owl#comment10_01_04_1548235.30641750</parent>
</comment>
<comment>
	<id>http://www.semanticweb.org/ontologies/ConversationInstances.owl#comment10_01_04_1548235.30643866</id>
	<title>Simple Solution</title>
	<author>Stregano</author>
	<datestamp>1262633220000</datestamp>
	<modclass>None</modclass>
	<modscore>1</modscore>
	<htmltext>If he wants it back, why can't he just give the money back that he sold it for?  That seems simple enough.</htmltext>
<tokenext>If he wants it back , why ca n't he just give the money back that he sold it for ?
That seems simple enough .</tokentext>
<sentencetext>If he wants it back, why can't he just give the money back that he sold it for?
That seems simple enough.</sentencetext>
</comment>
<comment>
	<id>http://www.semanticweb.org/ontologies/ConversationInstances.owl#comment10_01_04_1548235.30643272</id>
	<title>Re:Own fault</title>
	<author>xaxa</author>
	<datestamp>1262630820000</datestamp>
	<modclass>None</modclass>
	<modscore>1</modscore>
	<htmltext><p>No... it's like you sold your car to the dealer, then leased it back from them. This was fine, the dealer kept  maintaining and improving the car. But now, the dealer is being bought out by a bigger dealer. The bigger dealer only leases luxury cars, so while they'll maintain yours they'll no longer improve it, and new customers won't be able to lease the model you have.</p><p>(I.e. MySQL will continue as an open source project, but, since it's a low-cost competitor to Oracle's main product, Oracle aren't going to improve it, and will likely make it more difficult/expensive for people to buy commercial licenses to use MySQL.)</p></htmltext>
<tokenext>No... it 's like you sold your car to the dealer , then leased it back from them .
This was fine , the dealer kept maintaining and improving the car .
But now , the dealer is being bought out by a bigger dealer .
The bigger dealer only leases luxury cars , so while they 'll maintain yours they 'll no longer improve it , and new customers wo n't be able to lease the model you have. ( I.e .
MySQL will continue as an open source project , but , since it 's a low-cost competitor to Oracle 's main product , Oracle are n't going to improve it , and will likely make it more difficult/expensive for people to buy commercial licenses to use MySQL .
)</tokentext>
<sentencetext>No... it's like you sold your car to the dealer, then leased it back from them.
This was fine, the dealer kept  maintaining and improving the car.
But now, the dealer is being bought out by a bigger dealer.
The bigger dealer only leases luxury cars, so while they'll maintain yours they'll no longer improve it, and new customers won't be able to lease the model you have.(I.e.
MySQL will continue as an open source project, but, since it's a low-cost competitor to Oracle's main product, Oracle aren't going to improve it, and will likely make it more difficult/expensive for people to buy commercial licenses to use MySQL.
)</sentencetext>
	<parent>http://www.semanticweb.org/ontologies/ConversationInstances.owl#comment10_01_04_1548235.30641712</parent>
</comment>
<comment>
	<id>http://www.semanticweb.org/ontologies/ConversationInstances.owl#comment10_01_04_1548235.30646580</id>
	<title>no thanks</title>
	<author>Anonymous</author>
	<datestamp>1262601060000</datestamp>
	<modclass>None</modclass>
	<modscore>0</modscore>
	<htmltext><p>I might give a damn if the product was worth a damn.</p></htmltext>
<tokenext>I might give a damn if the product was worth a damn .</tokentext>
<sentencetext>I might give a damn if the product was worth a damn.</sentencetext>
</comment>
<comment>
	<id>http://www.semanticweb.org/ontologies/ConversationInstances.owl#comment10_01_04_1548235.30645744</id>
	<title>Want a free popular opensource project?</title>
	<author>Nelson</author>
	<datestamp>1262597820000</datestamp>
	<modclass>None</modclass>
	<modscore>1</modscore>
	<htmltext><p>I've suggested this before.    Build PostgreSQL and package it with some tweaked configurations,   enable all local connections by default,  beef up the buffers and some of the memory usage by default,  write some install scripts to make accounts for local users,  add PLSQL out of the box...   I can't help but think that that's like 80\% of the problem the Postgresql holdouts have,  you do have to do more lifting to get it running.   Maybe start writing a Postgresql configuration GUI that will help you tune the config stuff some.</p><p>If you want to be fancy include one of the replication packages out of the box too.</p><p>Call it "MyPgSQL..."</p></htmltext>
<tokenext>I 've suggested this before .
Build PostgreSQL and package it with some tweaked configurations , enable all local connections by default , beef up the buffers and some of the memory usage by default , write some install scripts to make accounts for local users , add PLSQL out of the box... I ca n't help but think that that 's like 80 \ % of the problem the Postgresql holdouts have , you do have to do more lifting to get it running .
Maybe start writing a Postgresql configuration GUI that will help you tune the config stuff some.If you want to be fancy include one of the replication packages out of the box too.Call it " MyPgSQL... "</tokentext>
<sentencetext>I've suggested this before.
Build PostgreSQL and package it with some tweaked configurations,   enable all local connections by default,  beef up the buffers and some of the memory usage by default,  write some install scripts to make accounts for local users,  add PLSQL out of the box...   I can't help but think that that's like 80\% of the problem the Postgresql holdouts have,  you do have to do more lifting to get it running.
Maybe start writing a Postgresql configuration GUI that will help you tune the config stuff some.If you want to be fancy include one of the replication packages out of the box too.Call it "MyPgSQL..."</sentencetext>
</comment>
<comment>
	<id>http://www.semanticweb.org/ontologies/ConversationInstances.owl#comment10_01_04_1548235.30641796</id>
	<title>A sentence is missing from the beginning...</title>
	<author>mark-t</author>
	<datestamp>1262625060000</datestamp>
	<modclass>Insightful</modclass>
	<modscore>4</modscore>
	<htmltext>"In January, 2008, Sun legally acquired MySQL for $1 billion."</htmltext>
<tokenext>" In January , 2008 , Sun legally acquired MySQL for $ 1 billion .
"</tokentext>
<sentencetext>"In January, 2008, Sun legally acquired MySQL for $1 billion.
"</sentencetext>
</comment>
<comment>
	<id>http://www.semanticweb.org/ontologies/ConversationInstances.owl#comment10_01_04_1548235.30645674</id>
	<title>Re:Own fault</title>
	<author>Antique Geekmeister</author>
	<datestamp>1262597580000</datestamp>
	<modclass>None</modclass>
	<modscore>1</modscore>
	<htmltext><p>Because that license allows me, as a developer, access to the public's and my GPL peers' work to give me a base to sell my own work to people who want changes, or support. It's paying my salaries, and RedHat is profitable, so it's clearly a functional business model. And my clients pay me to help them avoid the traps of the business models you're espousing.</p></htmltext>
<tokenext>Because that license allows me , as a developer , access to the public 's and my GPL peers ' work to give me a base to sell my own work to people who want changes , or support .
It 's paying my salaries , and RedHat is profitable , so it 's clearly a functional business model .
And my clients pay me to help them avoid the traps of the business models you 're espousing .</tokentext>
<sentencetext>Because that license allows me, as a developer, access to the public's and my GPL peers' work to give me a base to sell my own work to people who want changes, or support.
It's paying my salaries, and RedHat is profitable, so it's clearly a functional business model.
And my clients pay me to help them avoid the traps of the business models you're espousing.</sentencetext>
	<parent>http://www.semanticweb.org/ontologies/ConversationInstances.owl#comment10_01_04_1548235.30642948</parent>
</comment>
<comment>
	<id>http://www.semanticweb.org/ontologies/ConversationInstances.owl#comment10_01_04_1548235.30641566</id>
	<title>How many times...</title>
	<author>Anonymous</author>
	<datestamp>1262624280000</datestamp>
	<modclass>Insightful</modclass>
	<modscore>2</modscore>
	<htmltext><p>Will this show up every 2 weeks on<nobr> <wbr></nobr>/.</p></htmltext>
<tokenext>Will this show up every 2 weeks on / .</tokentext>
<sentencetext>Will this show up every 2 weeks on /.</sentencetext>
</comment>
<comment>
	<id>http://www.semanticweb.org/ontologies/ConversationInstances.owl#comment10_01_04_1548235.30646548</id>
	<title>The real problem with this was the GPL switch.</title>
	<author>Spy der Mann</author>
	<datestamp>1262600940000</datestamp>
	<modclass>None</modclass>
	<modscore>1</modscore>
	<htmltext><p>is the GPL and dual-license. When MySQL was LGPL, nobody had a problem with it. But then came greediness, the switch to GPL and the MySQL-AB demands for people to pay for just linking to the MySQL client (to date there's still no concensus on whether linking to the client is a GPL violation or not, but scaring small businesses into paying is really profitable).</p><p>Frankly, I don't give a dime if Monty goes to jail, loses all his money or what not. What's really important is the ability for small businesses to use MySQL. With the Oracle-Sun deal, I really don't know what will happen.</p><p>If we wanted to fork we'd have to use the 4.0 base which was LGPL. Any volunteers to re-fix who-knows-how-many bugs?</p></htmltext>
<tokenext>is the GPL and dual-license .
When MySQL was LGPL , nobody had a problem with it .
But then came greediness , the switch to GPL and the MySQL-AB demands for people to pay for just linking to the MySQL client ( to date there 's still no concensus on whether linking to the client is a GPL violation or not , but scaring small businesses into paying is really profitable ) .Frankly , I do n't give a dime if Monty goes to jail , loses all his money or what not .
What 's really important is the ability for small businesses to use MySQL .
With the Oracle-Sun deal , I really do n't know what will happen.If we wanted to fork we 'd have to use the 4.0 base which was LGPL .
Any volunteers to re-fix who-knows-how-many bugs ?</tokentext>
<sentencetext>is the GPL and dual-license.
When MySQL was LGPL, nobody had a problem with it.
But then came greediness, the switch to GPL and the MySQL-AB demands for people to pay for just linking to the MySQL client (to date there's still no concensus on whether linking to the client is a GPL violation or not, but scaring small businesses into paying is really profitable).Frankly, I don't give a dime if Monty goes to jail, loses all his money or what not.
What's really important is the ability for small businesses to use MySQL.
With the Oracle-Sun deal, I really don't know what will happen.If we wanted to fork we'd have to use the 4.0 base which was LGPL.
Any volunteers to re-fix who-knows-how-many bugs?</sentencetext>
</comment>
<comment>
	<id>http://www.semanticweb.org/ontologies/ConversationInstances.owl#comment10_01_04_1548235.30641964</id>
	<title>Ah, so that's why he spammed me this weekend</title>
	<author>paulhoffman</author>
	<datestamp>1262625660000</datestamp>
	<modclass>Informativ</modclass>
	<modscore>2</modscore>
	<htmltext><p>He apparently went through the database of everyone who had ever submitted a bug report and vacuumed up email addresses, because that's the only way he would have known me to send me his appeal. That's not stooping low: that's slithering.</p></htmltext>
<tokenext>He apparently went through the database of everyone who had ever submitted a bug report and vacuumed up email addresses , because that 's the only way he would have known me to send me his appeal .
That 's not stooping low : that 's slithering .</tokentext>
<sentencetext>He apparently went through the database of everyone who had ever submitted a bug report and vacuumed up email addresses, because that's the only way he would have known me to send me his appeal.
That's not stooping low: that's slithering.</sentencetext>
</comment>
<comment>
	<id>http://www.semanticweb.org/ontologies/ConversationInstances.owl#comment10_01_04_1548235.30642014</id>
	<title>Monty Wants To Save MySQL</title>
	<author>omar.sahal</author>
	<datestamp>1262625900000</datestamp>
	<modclass>None</modclass>
	<modscore>1</modscore>
	<htmltext>Taking Monty at face value he seems to be saying Mysql was such a dynamic open source poject because of the way it was funded (a GPL codebase with a propriety licence for any one willing to pay), giving it lots of cash to develop (enabling full-time developers to work on the code base). Mysql (in Montys view) was not like Linux that had a distributed development effort behind it. <br>
Taking him at face value this seems to be a weekness in Mysql development model, the Oracle buy out is a case in point.<br> Not taking him at face value however is <a href="http://www.groklaw.net/articlebasic.php?story=20091208104422384" title="groklaw.net">Groklaw</a> [groklaw.net] I think her assessment is a little harsh (not because I know Monty personally, I dont) as there is a reasonable explanation for his actions outlined in the Groklaw artical. He's trying to stop Oracle from Buying Sun and therefore mysql, as he can not see Oracle supporting mysql. Why would a company buy out a competitor, whose product makes less profit  than theirs, and support it, even though it will take customers from their more lucrative products. <br>I say this because with the accusations against Monty are strong and need to be proven in non contradictory ways.</htmltext>
<tokenext>Taking Monty at face value he seems to be saying Mysql was such a dynamic open source poject because of the way it was funded ( a GPL codebase with a propriety licence for any one willing to pay ) , giving it lots of cash to develop ( enabling full-time developers to work on the code base ) .
Mysql ( in Montys view ) was not like Linux that had a distributed development effort behind it .
Taking him at face value this seems to be a weekness in Mysql development model , the Oracle buy out is a case in point .
Not taking him at face value however is Groklaw [ groklaw.net ] I think her assessment is a little harsh ( not because I know Monty personally , I dont ) as there is a reasonable explanation for his actions outlined in the Groklaw artical .
He 's trying to stop Oracle from Buying Sun and therefore mysql , as he can not see Oracle supporting mysql .
Why would a company buy out a competitor , whose product makes less profit than theirs , and support it , even though it will take customers from their more lucrative products .
I say this because with the accusations against Monty are strong and need to be proven in non contradictory ways .</tokentext>
<sentencetext>Taking Monty at face value he seems to be saying Mysql was such a dynamic open source poject because of the way it was funded (a GPL codebase with a propriety licence for any one willing to pay), giving it lots of cash to develop (enabling full-time developers to work on the code base).
Mysql (in Montys view) was not like Linux that had a distributed development effort behind it.
Taking him at face value this seems to be a weekness in Mysql development model, the Oracle buy out is a case in point.
Not taking him at face value however is Groklaw [groklaw.net] I think her assessment is a little harsh (not because I know Monty personally, I dont) as there is a reasonable explanation for his actions outlined in the Groklaw artical.
He's trying to stop Oracle from Buying Sun and therefore mysql, as he can not see Oracle supporting mysql.
Why would a company buy out a competitor, whose product makes less profit  than theirs, and support it, even though it will take customers from their more lucrative products.
I say this because with the accusations against Monty are strong and need to be proven in non contradictory ways.</sentencetext>
</comment>
<comment>
	<id>http://www.semanticweb.org/ontologies/ConversationInstances.owl#comment10_01_04_1548235.30642770</id>
	<title>Re:There is already a perfectly good free DBMS</title>
	<author>Anonymous</author>
	<datestamp>1262628660000</datestamp>
	<modclass>None</modclass>
	<modscore>0</modscore>
	<htmltext><p>Well, for example, PostgreSQL is fully SQL compliant and MySQL is not.</p><p>Also, please see this:<br>http://monty-says.blogspot.com/2008/11/oops-we-did-it-again-mysql-51-released.html</p><p>written by none other that Mynty himself.</p></htmltext>
<tokenext>Well , for example , PostgreSQL is fully SQL compliant and MySQL is not.Also , please see this : http : //monty-says.blogspot.com/2008/11/oops-we-did-it-again-mysql-51-released.htmlwritten by none other that Mynty himself .</tokentext>
<sentencetext>Well, for example, PostgreSQL is fully SQL compliant and MySQL is not.Also, please see this:http://monty-says.blogspot.com/2008/11/oops-we-did-it-again-mysql-51-released.htmlwritten by none other that Mynty himself.</sentencetext>
	<parent>http://www.semanticweb.org/ontologies/ConversationInstances.owl#comment10_01_04_1548235.30642168</parent>
</comment>
<comment>
	<id>http://www.semanticweb.org/ontologies/ConversationInstances.owl#comment10_01_04_1548235.30642162</id>
	<title>pgsql is NOT FREE!</title>
	<author>Anonymous</author>
	<datestamp>1262626500000</datestamp>
	<modclass>Funny</modclass>
	<modscore>0</modscore>
	<htmltext>pgsql is NOT Free Open Source! It is not GPL, so it is not truly Free. mysql is the only true community database and we must save it from corporate plunder at all costs!</htmltext>
<tokenext>pgsql is NOT Free Open Source !
It is not GPL , so it is not truly Free .
mysql is the only true community database and we must save it from corporate plunder at all costs !</tokentext>
<sentencetext>pgsql is NOT Free Open Source!
It is not GPL, so it is not truly Free.
mysql is the only true community database and we must save it from corporate plunder at all costs!</sentencetext>
	<parent>http://www.semanticweb.org/ontologies/ConversationInstances.owl#comment10_01_04_1548235.30641562</parent>
</comment>
<comment>
	<id>http://www.semanticweb.org/ontologies/ConversationInstances.owl#comment10_01_04_1548235.30642978</id>
	<title>Re:Who has shared hosting with PostgreSQL?</title>
	<author>Anonymous</author>
	<datestamp>1262629440000</datestamp>
	<modclass>None</modclass>
	<modscore>0</modscore>
	<htmltext><p><a href="http://lmgtfy.com/?q=web+hosting+offering+postgresql" title="lmgtfy.com" rel="nofollow">Let me Google that for you...</a> [lmgtfy.com]</p></htmltext>
<tokenext>Let me Google that for you... [ lmgtfy.com ]</tokentext>
<sentencetext>Let me Google that for you... [lmgtfy.com]</sentencetext>
	<parent>http://www.semanticweb.org/ontologies/ConversationInstances.owl#comment10_01_04_1548235.30642058</parent>
</comment>
<comment>
	<id>http://www.semanticweb.org/ontologies/ConversationInstances.owl#comment10_01_04_1548235.30647286</id>
	<title>Re:Want a free popular opensource project?</title>
	<author>larry bagina</author>
	<datestamp>1262604180000</datestamp>
	<modclass>None</modclass>
	<modscore>1</modscore>
	<htmltext>There are scripts to do schema conversion and stored procedures (functions) to emulate mysql functions but mysql has other non-standard functionality (like SELECTing columns which aren't GROUPed BY, DELETE<nobr> <wbr></nobr>... LIMIT, INSERT<nobr> <wbr></nobr>... ON DUPLICATE KEY UPDATE<nobr> <wbr></nobr>..., silently truncating data, 2009-2-31, etc).  Now, every sql db can be considered an extended superset of the SQL standard, but MySQL seems to be full of workarounds -- like a new column type for an updating timestamp vs using a trigger.</htmltext>
<tokenext>There are scripts to do schema conversion and stored procedures ( functions ) to emulate mysql functions but mysql has other non-standard functionality ( like SELECTing columns which are n't GROUPed BY , DELETE ... LIMIT , INSERT ... ON DUPLICATE KEY UPDATE ... , silently truncating data , 2009-2-31 , etc ) .
Now , every sql db can be considered an extended superset of the SQL standard , but MySQL seems to be full of workarounds -- like a new column type for an updating timestamp vs using a trigger .</tokentext>
<sentencetext>There are scripts to do schema conversion and stored procedures (functions) to emulate mysql functions but mysql has other non-standard functionality (like SELECTing columns which aren't GROUPed BY, DELETE ... LIMIT, INSERT ... ON DUPLICATE KEY UPDATE ..., silently truncating data, 2009-2-31, etc).
Now, every sql db can be considered an extended superset of the SQL standard, but MySQL seems to be full of workarounds -- like a new column type for an updating timestamp vs using a trigger.</sentencetext>
	<parent>http://www.semanticweb.org/ontologies/ConversationInstances.owl#comment10_01_04_1548235.30645744</parent>
</comment>
<comment>
	<id>http://www.semanticweb.org/ontologies/ConversationInstances.owl#comment10_01_04_1548235.30641918</id>
	<title>Feel free OS</title>
	<author>francodane</author>
	<datestamp>1262625480000</datestamp>
	<modclass>None</modclass>
	<modscore>1</modscore>
	<htmltext>I think that this database must be free,but also more and more software,i'm going to the petition page</htmltext>
<tokenext>I think that this database must be free,but also more and more software,i 'm going to the petition page</tokentext>
<sentencetext>I think that this database must be free,but also more and more software,i'm going to the petition page</sentencetext>
</comment>
<comment>
	<id>http://www.semanticweb.org/ontologies/ConversationInstances.owl#comment10_01_04_1548235.30681292</id>
	<title>Re:well...</title>
	<author>Anonymous</author>
	<datestamp>1262873280000</datestamp>
	<modclass>None</modclass>
	<modscore>0</modscore>
	<htmltext><p><div class="quote"><p>What the fuck are you talking about? Monty isn't involved with Microsoft or their Codeplex site.</p></div><p>What the fuck are YOU talking about, Holmes?</p><p>Perhaps you missed the part where he said, "<a href="http://monty-says.blogspot.com/2009/09/codeplex-foundation-why-is-microsoft.html" title="blogspot.com" rel="nofollow">I will try to explain why I think that the CodePlex Foundation is a good idea, and why I agreed to be an advisor for the Foundation</a> [blogspot.com]"...?</p></div>
	</htmltext>
<tokenext>What the fuck are you talking about ?
Monty is n't involved with Microsoft or their Codeplex site.What the fuck are YOU talking about , Holmes ? Perhaps you missed the part where he said , " I will try to explain why I think that the CodePlex Foundation is a good idea , and why I agreed to be an advisor for the Foundation [ blogspot.com ] " ... ?</tokentext>
<sentencetext>What the fuck are you talking about?
Monty isn't involved with Microsoft or their Codeplex site.What the fuck are YOU talking about, Holmes?Perhaps you missed the part where he said, "I will try to explain why I think that the CodePlex Foundation is a good idea, and why I agreed to be an advisor for the Foundation [blogspot.com]"...?
	</sentencetext>
	<parent>http://www.semanticweb.org/ontologies/ConversationInstances.owl#comment10_01_04_1548235.30642802</parent>
</comment>
<comment>
	<id>http://www.semanticweb.org/ontologies/ConversationInstances.owl#comment10_01_04_1548235.30643382</id>
	<title>Oracle keeping MySQL might be worse</title>
	<author>rednival</author>
	<datestamp>1262631300000</datestamp>
	<modclass>Insightful</modclass>
	<modscore>2</modscore>
	<htmltext>Killing MySQL is not what we should be concerned about.  Oracle taking control of MySQL's direction is a far greater danger.  It will be harder to build a new community around a fork if MySQL still exists.  If Oracle kills MySQL, a new fork will appear overnight and people will flock to it.  If they keep MySQL around and do everything in their power to control it, Oracle can virtually ensure that MySQL never becomes a real threat to its proprietary database.

My guess is that Oracle will keep MySQL but they will position it as a lightweight database server for small to mid-size databases.  They'll push people toward their proprietary database for a "REAL" enterprise database.</htmltext>
<tokenext>Killing MySQL is not what we should be concerned about .
Oracle taking control of MySQL 's direction is a far greater danger .
It will be harder to build a new community around a fork if MySQL still exists .
If Oracle kills MySQL , a new fork will appear overnight and people will flock to it .
If they keep MySQL around and do everything in their power to control it , Oracle can virtually ensure that MySQL never becomes a real threat to its proprietary database .
My guess is that Oracle will keep MySQL but they will position it as a lightweight database server for small to mid-size databases .
They 'll push people toward their proprietary database for a " REAL " enterprise database .</tokentext>
<sentencetext>Killing MySQL is not what we should be concerned about.
Oracle taking control of MySQL's direction is a far greater danger.
It will be harder to build a new community around a fork if MySQL still exists.
If Oracle kills MySQL, a new fork will appear overnight and people will flock to it.
If they keep MySQL around and do everything in their power to control it, Oracle can virtually ensure that MySQL never becomes a real threat to its proprietary database.
My guess is that Oracle will keep MySQL but they will position it as a lightweight database server for small to mid-size databases.
They'll push people toward their proprietary database for a "REAL" enterprise database.</sentencetext>
</comment>
<comment>
	<id>http://www.semanticweb.org/ontologies/ConversationInstances.owl#comment10_01_04_1548235.30643974</id>
	<title>Hey, Monty!</title>
	<author>dwiget001</author>
	<datestamp>1262633820000</datestamp>
	<modclass>None</modclass>
	<modscore>1</modscore>
	<htmltext><p>Stop your whining.</p><p>That is all.</p></htmltext>
<tokenext>Stop your whining.That is all .</tokentext>
<sentencetext>Stop your whining.That is all.</sentencetext>
</comment>
<comment>
	<id>http://www.semanticweb.org/ontologies/ConversationInstances.owl#comment10_01_04_1548235.30641884</id>
	<title>And how much money did he make from it?</title>
	<author>frinkacheese</author>
	<datestamp>1262625360000</datestamp>
	<modclass>Insightful</modclass>
	<modscore>4</modscore>
	<htmltext>
So MySQL sold for a cool $1 billion in whatever it was, and now he wants to get it back for free?

This is so funny it may just work.</htmltext>
<tokenext>So MySQL sold for a cool $ 1 billion in whatever it was , and now he wants to get it back for free ?
This is so funny it may just work .</tokentext>
<sentencetext>
So MySQL sold for a cool $1 billion in whatever it was, and now he wants to get it back for free?
This is so funny it may just work.</sentencetext>
</comment>
<comment>
	<id>http://www.semanticweb.org/ontologies/ConversationInstances.owl#comment10_01_04_1548235.30642670</id>
	<title>Re:Baloney! He doesn't want to save MySQL</title>
	<author>TooMuchToDo</author>
	<datestamp>1262628180000</datestamp>
	<modclass>None</modclass>
	<modscore>1</modscore>
	<htmltext>Yeah, but when you hate Orcale, you can't really blame him<p><nobr> <wbr></nobr>/hates Oracle</p></htmltext>
<tokenext>Yeah , but when you hate Orcale , you ca n't really blame him /hates Oracle</tokentext>
<sentencetext>Yeah, but when you hate Orcale, you can't really blame him /hates Oracle</sentencetext>
	<parent>http://www.semanticweb.org/ontologies/ConversationInstances.owl#comment10_01_04_1548235.30641758</parent>
</comment>
<comment>
	<id>http://www.semanticweb.org/ontologies/ConversationInstances.owl#comment10_01_04_1548235.30642950</id>
	<title>Re:Fuck Monty and the horse he rode in on</title>
	<author>icepick72</author>
	<datestamp>1262629260000</datestamp>
	<modclass>None</modclass>
	<modscore>1</modscore>
	<htmltext>A cool billion the first time?! Obviously he wants it back to sell again! Simple math.</htmltext>
<tokenext>A cool billion the first time ? !
Obviously he wants it back to sell again !
Simple math .</tokentext>
<sentencetext>A cool billion the first time?!
Obviously he wants it back to sell again!
Simple math.</sentencetext>
	<parent>http://www.semanticweb.org/ontologies/ConversationInstances.owl#comment10_01_04_1548235.30641874</parent>
</comment>
<comment>
	<id>http://www.semanticweb.org/ontologies/ConversationInstances.owl#comment10_01_04_1548235.30642800</id>
	<title>Re:Who has shared hosting with PostgreSQL?</title>
	<author>greg1104</author>
	<datestamp>1262628780000</datestamp>
	<modclass>None</modclass>
	<modscore>1</modscore>
	<htmltext><p>There's a <a href="http://www.postgresql.org/support/professional\_hosting" title="postgresql.org">list of PostgreSQL hosting companies</a> [postgresql.org] available.  Last time I was picking one <a href="http://www.a2hosting.com/" title="a2hosting.com">A2</a> [a2hosting.com] and <a href="http://www.hub.org/" title="hub.org">hub.org</a> [hub.org] made my short list; there are plenty of others too.</p></htmltext>
<tokenext>There 's a list of PostgreSQL hosting companies [ postgresql.org ] available .
Last time I was picking one A2 [ a2hosting.com ] and hub.org [ hub.org ] made my short list ; there are plenty of others too .</tokentext>
<sentencetext>There's a list of PostgreSQL hosting companies [postgresql.org] available.
Last time I was picking one A2 [a2hosting.com] and hub.org [hub.org] made my short list; there are plenty of others too.</sentencetext>
	<parent>http://www.semanticweb.org/ontologies/ConversationInstances.owl#comment10_01_04_1548235.30642058</parent>
</comment>
<comment>
	<id>http://www.semanticweb.org/ontologies/ConversationInstances.owl#comment10_01_04_1548235.30642282</id>
	<title>He's just a greedy hypocritical troll</title>
	<author>Anonymous</author>
	<datestamp>1262626920000</datestamp>
	<modclass>Informativ</modclass>
	<modscore>5</modscore>
	<htmltext><a href="http://trolltalk.com/blog/blog/article.php?story=troll\_of\_the\_day\_20091213\_monty\_widenius" title="trolltalk.com">Original source</a> [trolltalk.com]
<p>
Background: MySQL is an open-source database used by millions. Originally developed by closely-held Swedish company MySQL AB, it was sold to Sun Microsystems Inc in January 2008. Sun is now in the process of being acquired Oracle Corporation. The deal is still awaiting European regulatory approval.
</p><p>
Not happy with selling MySQL AB to Sun for a cool billion, Monty Widenius is now trolling regulators, the media, and anyone who will listen in his efforts to get back control of "his" database (without having to give back the money).
</p><p>
<b>European regulators still don't "get" the open-source software model </b>
</p><p>
The Europeans are holding up their approval of the Sun-Oracle deal because of concerns that the acquisition will reduce competition in the database industry. Oracle Corp, which is already the dominant player in large-scale corporate databases, already "controls" several open-source database products such as Oracle Berkeley DB and the InnoDB transactional storage engine for MysQL
</p><p>
The reason I put "controls" in quotes is because it's very difficult to actually exert full control an open-source project, especially one that is licensed under the GPL or similar open-source license. It would probably be more accurate to say that Oracle "sponsors" both BerkeleyDB and InnoDB.
</p><p>
<b>It's all about being an unabashed hypocrite </b>
</p><p>
Widenius was originally able to control MySQL by insisting that the copyright for all code contributed by outsiders be assigned to MySQL AB. By doing this, Widenius was able to "dual-license" MySQL, with both a free GPL version and a paid commercial version.
</p><p>
This licensing scheme was good enough when Widenius was in control of MySQL AB, but now that Oracle is buying Sun, suddenly Widenius wants both the licensing scheme changed to something that would allow his new company to sell modified copies without having to release the source code for their changes, and to have Oracle turn over control of MySQL to someone other than Oracle - perhaps the EU should consider (nudge nudge, wink wink) his new company, Monty Program AB?
</p><p>
<b>Calls the GPL licensing scheme an "infection", wants the EU to violate international treaties </b>
</p><p>
You can <a href="http://www.groklaw.net/article.php?story=20091208104422384" title="groklaw.net">read more</a> [groklaw.net] about the attempt to get the Europeans to retroactively change the licensing scheme from the GPL to something more "Monty Widenius-friendly":</p><blockquote><div><p>We would like to draw attention to the fact that some major concerns about the effects of the proposed transaction could be somewhat alleviated by requiring that all versions of MySQL source code previously released under the GPLv2 license (whether in a General Availability, Release Candidate, Beta, Alpha release, or as public bazaar or bitkeeper revision control trees) must be released under a more liberal open source license that is usable also by the OEM users and would also create an opportuity for other service vendors to compete with offerings comparable to MySQL Enterprise.</p></div>
</blockquote><p>
In other words, he wants the European Union to violate Articles 9 and 12 of the Bern Convention on Copyrights and retroactively change the license from the GPL, which requires him to share any changes he makes to source code covered by the GPL, to a license that would let him take from the original authors, but not give back anything in return.</p><blockquote><div><p>The "copyleft/infection" principle of the GPL license represents a particular obstacle not only to revenue generation by the fork vendor but also to the overall adoption and market penetration of MySQL, MySQL forks and MySQL storage engines....</p></div>
</blockquote><p>
When we were kids, our parents told us "share and share alike." The authors who contributed source code under the GPL adhered to this principle. If you don't want to share your changes, simply don't "borrow" their code.
</p><p>
The GPL might not be the most "business-friendly" to someone like Monty Widenius, who wants European regulators do the dirty work of filing off the licensing terms of the software in violation of international treaties, but that's only because right now his new business can't compete with the business he sold. Other companies such as IBM, Microsoft, Oracle, Sun, Novell and Linksys manage to make a profit using GPL-licensed code. Why should Widenius and his company, Monty Program AB, get special treatment?
</p><p>
<b>Some would call it extortion </b>
</p><p>
Widenius is hoping that Oracle will cave in because the delay of the Sun acquisition are costing Sun an estimated $100 million a month, and the uncertainty is damaging to both companies. This is a classic example of "gaming the system" by Widenius, same as people who bring groundless lawsuits in the hope of getting a payoff to just shut up and go away. Widenius apparently hasn't noticed that companies no longer play that game because they know it just encourages more frivolous actions. Oracle is using the same game book that IBM and Novell used when SCO brought their groundless "you need a SCO unix license to run linux because linux contains our unix code" lawsuits, hoping for a big payday to "just go away."
</p><p>
Widenius has already done the "take the money and run" thing<nobr> <wbr></nobr>... now he's trying to have his cake and eat it too. Oracle should just do the merger and deal with the EU later. If they handle MySQL the same way they've handled InnoDB and Berkeley, they would be able to prove that the fears that trolls like Widenius have been pushing were groundless.
</p><p>
Like Darl McBride of SCO, Monty Widenius is a troll - and a bad one at that<nobr> <wbr></nobr>...
</p><p>
Afternote:  The only reason Widenius doesn't get the Troll of the Year (Technology) for 2009 is because <a href="http://trolltalk.com/blog/blog/article.php?story=20100102190353137" title="trolltalk.com">Eric (you have no privacy, you ignorant clod!) Schmidt</a> [trolltalk.com] of Google beat him out.</p></div>
	</htmltext>
<tokenext>Original source [ trolltalk.com ] Background : MySQL is an open-source database used by millions .
Originally developed by closely-held Swedish company MySQL AB , it was sold to Sun Microsystems Inc in January 2008 .
Sun is now in the process of being acquired Oracle Corporation .
The deal is still awaiting European regulatory approval .
Not happy with selling MySQL AB to Sun for a cool billion , Monty Widenius is now trolling regulators , the media , and anyone who will listen in his efforts to get back control of " his " database ( without having to give back the money ) .
European regulators still do n't " get " the open-source software model The Europeans are holding up their approval of the Sun-Oracle deal because of concerns that the acquisition will reduce competition in the database industry .
Oracle Corp , which is already the dominant player in large-scale corporate databases , already " controls " several open-source database products such as Oracle Berkeley DB and the InnoDB transactional storage engine for MysQL The reason I put " controls " in quotes is because it 's very difficult to actually exert full control an open-source project , especially one that is licensed under the GPL or similar open-source license .
It would probably be more accurate to say that Oracle " sponsors " both BerkeleyDB and InnoDB .
It 's all about being an unabashed hypocrite Widenius was originally able to control MySQL by insisting that the copyright for all code contributed by outsiders be assigned to MySQL AB .
By doing this , Widenius was able to " dual-license " MySQL , with both a free GPL version and a paid commercial version .
This licensing scheme was good enough when Widenius was in control of MySQL AB , but now that Oracle is buying Sun , suddenly Widenius wants both the licensing scheme changed to something that would allow his new company to sell modified copies without having to release the source code for their changes , and to have Oracle turn over control of MySQL to someone other than Oracle - perhaps the EU should consider ( nudge nudge , wink wink ) his new company , Monty Program AB ?
Calls the GPL licensing scheme an " infection " , wants the EU to violate international treaties You can read more [ groklaw.net ] about the attempt to get the Europeans to retroactively change the licensing scheme from the GPL to something more " Monty Widenius-friendly " : We would like to draw attention to the fact that some major concerns about the effects of the proposed transaction could be somewhat alleviated by requiring that all versions of MySQL source code previously released under the GPLv2 license ( whether in a General Availability , Release Candidate , Beta , Alpha release , or as public bazaar or bitkeeper revision control trees ) must be released under a more liberal open source license that is usable also by the OEM users and would also create an opportuity for other service vendors to compete with offerings comparable to MySQL Enterprise .
In other words , he wants the European Union to violate Articles 9 and 12 of the Bern Convention on Copyrights and retroactively change the license from the GPL , which requires him to share any changes he makes to source code covered by the GPL , to a license that would let him take from the original authors , but not give back anything in return.The " copyleft/infection " principle of the GPL license represents a particular obstacle not only to revenue generation by the fork vendor but also to the overall adoption and market penetration of MySQL , MySQL forks and MySQL storage engines... . When we were kids , our parents told us " share and share alike .
" The authors who contributed source code under the GPL adhered to this principle .
If you do n't want to share your changes , simply do n't " borrow " their code .
The GPL might not be the most " business-friendly " to someone like Monty Widenius , who wants European regulators do the dirty work of filing off the licensing terms of the software in violation of international treaties , but that 's only because right now his new business ca n't compete with the business he sold .
Other companies such as IBM , Microsoft , Oracle , Sun , Novell and Linksys manage to make a profit using GPL-licensed code .
Why should Widenius and his company , Monty Program AB , get special treatment ?
Some would call it extortion Widenius is hoping that Oracle will cave in because the delay of the Sun acquisition are costing Sun an estimated $ 100 million a month , and the uncertainty is damaging to both companies .
This is a classic example of " gaming the system " by Widenius , same as people who bring groundless lawsuits in the hope of getting a payoff to just shut up and go away .
Widenius apparently has n't noticed that companies no longer play that game because they know it just encourages more frivolous actions .
Oracle is using the same game book that IBM and Novell used when SCO brought their groundless " you need a SCO unix license to run linux because linux contains our unix code " lawsuits , hoping for a big payday to " just go away .
" Widenius has already done the " take the money and run " thing ... now he 's trying to have his cake and eat it too .
Oracle should just do the merger and deal with the EU later .
If they handle MySQL the same way they 've handled InnoDB and Berkeley , they would be able to prove that the fears that trolls like Widenius have been pushing were groundless .
Like Darl McBride of SCO , Monty Widenius is a troll - and a bad one at that .. . Afternote : The only reason Widenius does n't get the Troll of the Year ( Technology ) for 2009 is because Eric ( you have no privacy , you ignorant clod !
) Schmidt [ trolltalk.com ] of Google beat him out .</tokentext>
<sentencetext>Original source [trolltalk.com]

Background: MySQL is an open-source database used by millions.
Originally developed by closely-held Swedish company MySQL AB, it was sold to Sun Microsystems Inc in January 2008.
Sun is now in the process of being acquired Oracle Corporation.
The deal is still awaiting European regulatory approval.
Not happy with selling MySQL AB to Sun for a cool billion, Monty Widenius is now trolling regulators, the media, and anyone who will listen in his efforts to get back control of "his" database (without having to give back the money).
European regulators still don't "get" the open-source software model 

The Europeans are holding up their approval of the Sun-Oracle deal because of concerns that the acquisition will reduce competition in the database industry.
Oracle Corp, which is already the dominant player in large-scale corporate databases, already "controls" several open-source database products such as Oracle Berkeley DB and the InnoDB transactional storage engine for MysQL

The reason I put "controls" in quotes is because it's very difficult to actually exert full control an open-source project, especially one that is licensed under the GPL or similar open-source license.
It would probably be more accurate to say that Oracle "sponsors" both BerkeleyDB and InnoDB.
It's all about being an unabashed hypocrite 

Widenius was originally able to control MySQL by insisting that the copyright for all code contributed by outsiders be assigned to MySQL AB.
By doing this, Widenius was able to "dual-license" MySQL, with both a free GPL version and a paid commercial version.
This licensing scheme was good enough when Widenius was in control of MySQL AB, but now that Oracle is buying Sun, suddenly Widenius wants both the licensing scheme changed to something that would allow his new company to sell modified copies without having to release the source code for their changes, and to have Oracle turn over control of MySQL to someone other than Oracle - perhaps the EU should consider (nudge nudge, wink wink) his new company, Monty Program AB?
Calls the GPL licensing scheme an "infection", wants the EU to violate international treaties 

You can read more [groklaw.net] about the attempt to get the Europeans to retroactively change the licensing scheme from the GPL to something more "Monty Widenius-friendly":We would like to draw attention to the fact that some major concerns about the effects of the proposed transaction could be somewhat alleviated by requiring that all versions of MySQL source code previously released under the GPLv2 license (whether in a General Availability, Release Candidate, Beta, Alpha release, or as public bazaar or bitkeeper revision control trees) must be released under a more liberal open source license that is usable also by the OEM users and would also create an opportuity for other service vendors to compete with offerings comparable to MySQL Enterprise.
In other words, he wants the European Union to violate Articles 9 and 12 of the Bern Convention on Copyrights and retroactively change the license from the GPL, which requires him to share any changes he makes to source code covered by the GPL, to a license that would let him take from the original authors, but not give back anything in return.The "copyleft/infection" principle of the GPL license represents a particular obstacle not only to revenue generation by the fork vendor but also to the overall adoption and market penetration of MySQL, MySQL forks and MySQL storage engines....

When we were kids, our parents told us "share and share alike.
" The authors who contributed source code under the GPL adhered to this principle.
If you don't want to share your changes, simply don't "borrow" their code.
The GPL might not be the most "business-friendly" to someone like Monty Widenius, who wants European regulators do the dirty work of filing off the licensing terms of the software in violation of international treaties, but that's only because right now his new business can't compete with the business he sold.
Other companies such as IBM, Microsoft, Oracle, Sun, Novell and Linksys manage to make a profit using GPL-licensed code.
Why should Widenius and his company, Monty Program AB, get special treatment?
Some would call it extortion 

Widenius is hoping that Oracle will cave in because the delay of the Sun acquisition are costing Sun an estimated $100 million a month, and the uncertainty is damaging to both companies.
This is a classic example of "gaming the system" by Widenius, same as people who bring groundless lawsuits in the hope of getting a payoff to just shut up and go away.
Widenius apparently hasn't noticed that companies no longer play that game because they know it just encourages more frivolous actions.
Oracle is using the same game book that IBM and Novell used when SCO brought their groundless "you need a SCO unix license to run linux because linux contains our unix code" lawsuits, hoping for a big payday to "just go away.
"

Widenius has already done the "take the money and run" thing ... now he's trying to have his cake and eat it too.
Oracle should just do the merger and deal with the EU later.
If they handle MySQL the same way they've handled InnoDB and Berkeley, they would be able to prove that the fears that trolls like Widenius have been pushing were groundless.
Like Darl McBride of SCO, Monty Widenius is a troll - and a bad one at that ...

Afternote:  The only reason Widenius doesn't get the Troll of the Year (Technology) for 2009 is because Eric (you have no privacy, you ignorant clod!
) Schmidt [trolltalk.com] of Google beat him out.
	</sentencetext>
	<parent>http://www.semanticweb.org/ontologies/ConversationInstances.owl#comment10_01_04_1548235.30641574</parent>
</comment>
<comment>
	<id>http://www.semanticweb.org/ontologies/ConversationInstances.owl#comment10_01_04_1548235.30641706</id>
	<title>Dear Monty...</title>
	<author>Richard\_at\_work</author>
	<datestamp>1262624760000</datestamp>
	<modclass>Insightful</modclass>
	<modscore>3</modscore>
	<htmltext>If you had never sold MySQL to Sun in the first place, it wouldn't be in the position it is now in.  I hope the money was worth it.<br> <br>

Why are you so concerned now?  Your chance to do something came and went, and so did you.<br> <br>

Also, I rather think you overrate MySQL in that petition post, but thats just mho.</htmltext>
<tokenext>If you had never sold MySQL to Sun in the first place , it would n't be in the position it is now in .
I hope the money was worth it .
Why are you so concerned now ?
Your chance to do something came and went , and so did you .
Also , I rather think you overrate MySQL in that petition post , but thats just mho .</tokentext>
<sentencetext>If you had never sold MySQL to Sun in the first place, it wouldn't be in the position it is now in.
I hope the money was worth it.
Why are you so concerned now?
Your chance to do something came and went, and so did you.
Also, I rather think you overrate MySQL in that petition post, but thats just mho.</sentencetext>
</comment>
<comment>
	<id>http://www.semanticweb.org/ontologies/ConversationInstances.owl#comment10_01_04_1548235.30646562</id>
	<title>Re:We Don't Need No Stinking Petition</title>
	<author>toby</author>
	<datestamp>1262601000000</datestamp>
	<modclass>None</modclass>
	<modscore>1</modscore>
	<htmltext><p> <i> MySQL would need to be a sufficiently revenue-producing entity in order for it to sustain internal development at Oracle</i></p><p>A MySQL owned and developed by Oracle would make for some decent competition for SQL Server, wouldn't you think? It's probably easier to position MySQL like that than their traditional product (which tends to be associated with high costs, at least in minds).</p></htmltext>
<tokenext>MySQL would need to be a sufficiently revenue-producing entity in order for it to sustain internal development at OracleA MySQL owned and developed by Oracle would make for some decent competition for SQL Server , would n't you think ?
It 's probably easier to position MySQL like that than their traditional product ( which tends to be associated with high costs , at least in minds ) .</tokentext>
<sentencetext>  MySQL would need to be a sufficiently revenue-producing entity in order for it to sustain internal development at OracleA MySQL owned and developed by Oracle would make for some decent competition for SQL Server, wouldn't you think?
It's probably easier to position MySQL like that than their traditional product (which tends to be associated with high costs, at least in minds).</sentencetext>
	<parent>http://www.semanticweb.org/ontologies/ConversationInstances.owl#comment10_01_04_1548235.30643050</parent>
</comment>
<comment>
	<id>http://www.semanticweb.org/ontologies/ConversationInstances.owl#comment10_01_04_1548235.30658194</id>
	<title>Re:Own fault</title>
	<author>Anonymous</author>
	<datestamp>1262719320000</datestamp>
	<modclass>None</modclass>
	<modscore>0</modscore>
	<htmltext><p>The beauty of Open Source is that anyone can take the source and modify it, and re-release it for free.  If Oracle goes on to change the license on future MySQL versions, it won't change the fact that previous versions were open-source and can be forked into new open source projects.  There is no need for a petition an appeal to keep MySQL free.  Just fork it.  (E.g. Joomla/Mambo).</p></htmltext>
<tokenext>The beauty of Open Source is that anyone can take the source and modify it , and re-release it for free .
If Oracle goes on to change the license on future MySQL versions , it wo n't change the fact that previous versions were open-source and can be forked into new open source projects .
There is no need for a petition an appeal to keep MySQL free .
Just fork it .
( E.g. Joomla/Mambo ) .</tokentext>
<sentencetext>The beauty of Open Source is that anyone can take the source and modify it, and re-release it for free.
If Oracle goes on to change the license on future MySQL versions, it won't change the fact that previous versions were open-source and can be forked into new open source projects.
There is no need for a petition an appeal to keep MySQL free.
Just fork it.
(E.g. Joomla/Mambo).</sentencetext>
	<parent>http://www.semanticweb.org/ontologies/ConversationInstances.owl#comment10_01_04_1548235.30642044</parent>
</comment>
<comment>
	<id>http://www.semanticweb.org/ontologies/ConversationInstances.owl#comment10_01_04_1548235.30645384</id>
	<title>Re:There is already a perfectly good free DBMS</title>
	<author>dissy</author>
	<datestamp>1262596740000</datestamp>
	<modclass>Interestin</modclass>
	<modscore>2</modscore>
	<htmltext><p><div class="quote"><p>There is already a perfectly good free DBMS<br>It's called PostgreSQL. It's fast, what's even more important, it's correct and it's tried and tested. Get it here [postgresql.org].</p></div><p>I'm confused on your suggestion.  You want Monty to take PostgreSQL, change it's license to closed source, and sell it as a product?</p><p>If not, I don't see why you would suggest it over MySQL, which is what he is trying to do that with currently.</p></div>
	</htmltext>
<tokenext>There is already a perfectly good free DBMSIt 's called PostgreSQL .
It 's fast , what 's even more important , it 's correct and it 's tried and tested .
Get it here [ postgresql.org ] .I 'm confused on your suggestion .
You want Monty to take PostgreSQL , change it 's license to closed source , and sell it as a product ? If not , I do n't see why you would suggest it over MySQL , which is what he is trying to do that with currently .</tokentext>
<sentencetext>There is already a perfectly good free DBMSIt's called PostgreSQL.
It's fast, what's even more important, it's correct and it's tried and tested.
Get it here [postgresql.org].I'm confused on your suggestion.
You want Monty to take PostgreSQL, change it's license to closed source, and sell it as a product?If not, I don't see why you would suggest it over MySQL, which is what he is trying to do that with currently.
	</sentencetext>
	<parent>http://www.semanticweb.org/ontologies/ConversationInstances.owl#comment10_01_04_1548235.30641750</parent>
</comment>
<comment>
	<id>http://www.semanticweb.org/ontologies/ConversationInstances.owl#comment10_01_04_1548235.30641750</id>
	<title>There is already a perfectly good free DBMS</title>
	<author>A beautiful mind</author>
	<datestamp>1262624880000</datestamp>
	<modclass>Insightful</modclass>
	<modscore>4</modscore>
	<htmltext>It's called PostgreSQL. It's fast, what's even more important, it's <b>correct</b> and it's tried and tested. Get  it <a href="http://www.postgresql.org/" title="postgresql.org">here</a> [postgresql.org].</htmltext>
<tokenext>It 's called PostgreSQL .
It 's fast , what 's even more important , it 's correct and it 's tried and tested .
Get it here [ postgresql.org ] .</tokentext>
<sentencetext>It's called PostgreSQL.
It's fast, what's even more important, it's correct and it's tried and tested.
Get  it here [postgresql.org].</sentencetext>
</comment>
<comment>
	<id>http://www.semanticweb.org/ontologies/ConversationInstances.owl#comment10_01_04_1548235.30642066</id>
	<title>Re:How many times...</title>
	<author>LizardKing</author>
	<datestamp>1262626080000</datestamp>
	<modclass>None</modclass>
	<modscore>1</modscore>
	<htmltext><p> <i>Will this show up every 2 weeks on<nobr> <wbr></nobr>/.</i> </p><p>It will probably show up regularly until Slashdot doesn't run on MySQL anymore. If they'd used a real RDBMS from the start then that <a href="http://slashdot.org/articles/06/11/09/1534204.shtml" title="slashdot.org">clusterfuck with indexes not updating on a datatype change</a> [slashdot.org] from a few years back wouldn't have happened.</p></htmltext>
<tokenext>Will this show up every 2 weeks on / .
It will probably show up regularly until Slashdot does n't run on MySQL anymore .
If they 'd used a real RDBMS from the start then that clusterfuck with indexes not updating on a datatype change [ slashdot.org ] from a few years back would n't have happened .</tokentext>
<sentencetext> Will this show up every 2 weeks on /.
It will probably show up regularly until Slashdot doesn't run on MySQL anymore.
If they'd used a real RDBMS from the start then that clusterfuck with indexes not updating on a datatype change [slashdot.org] from a few years back wouldn't have happened.</sentencetext>
	<parent>http://www.semanticweb.org/ontologies/ConversationInstances.owl#comment10_01_04_1548235.30641566</parent>
</comment>
<comment>
	<id>http://www.semanticweb.org/ontologies/ConversationInstances.owl#comment10_01_04_1548235.30642752</id>
	<title>Re:Not a valid argument...</title>
	<author>itsdapead</author>
	<datestamp>1262628540000</datestamp>
	<modclass>None</modclass>
	<modscore>1</modscore>
	<htmltext><p><div class="quote"><p>I see no reason an entity couldn't take it and create a forked product to compete in that space</p></div><p>No, but there is a built in inequity: anybody developing a fork from the GPL code base is obliged to release their products under the GPL. Even if they're happy to contribute their own work to the community, that makes it harder to develop products that are interoperable with other proprietary systems and/or which might have patent issues.

</p><p>Oracle, on the other hand, will own the copyrights and therefore <i>are not bound at all by the GPL</i>.  They would be free to distribute MySQL-based products or MySQL clients with, for example, better integration with Oracle, Windows,<nobr> <wbr></nobr>.NET or IIS. They could even bolt on a proprietary DB engine...

</p><p>Now, if you are a GPL purist this won't worry you, since you'd rather shave your own head with a cheesegrater than use proprietary code (and you're probably using PostgreSQL anyway), but if you're more pragmatic and interested in commercializing MySQL-based products then it means Oracle have a potential competetive edge.

</p><p>Of course, in the past you could always approach Monty or, later, Sun and ask for a license to distribute MySQL or its libraries outside the GPL. Now you'll have to ask Oracle - and its their position as a dominant player in the database industry that is the real cause for concern. That's also the anti-competition justification that may give the EU the right to intervene.</p><p><div class="quote"><p>However, why wouldn't they be complimentary?</p></div><p>Depends whether you see MySQL in its traditional role as a "lite" DBMS which perfectly nails the sweet spot as a backend for blogs and web shops, or as a potential Oracle/MSSQL-killer dealing reliably with complex transactions and squillions of tables. I'm sure its creators see it as the latter, but I've always felt that  adding transactions and referential integrity was a bit like putting airbags on a pushbike...</p></div>
	</htmltext>
<tokenext>I see no reason an entity could n't take it and create a forked product to compete in that spaceNo , but there is a built in inequity : anybody developing a fork from the GPL code base is obliged to release their products under the GPL .
Even if they 're happy to contribute their own work to the community , that makes it harder to develop products that are interoperable with other proprietary systems and/or which might have patent issues .
Oracle , on the other hand , will own the copyrights and therefore are not bound at all by the GPL .
They would be free to distribute MySQL-based products or MySQL clients with , for example , better integration with Oracle , Windows , .NET or IIS .
They could even bolt on a proprietary DB engine.. . Now , if you are a GPL purist this wo n't worry you , since you 'd rather shave your own head with a cheesegrater than use proprietary code ( and you 're probably using PostgreSQL anyway ) , but if you 're more pragmatic and interested in commercializing MySQL-based products then it means Oracle have a potential competetive edge .
Of course , in the past you could always approach Monty or , later , Sun and ask for a license to distribute MySQL or its libraries outside the GPL .
Now you 'll have to ask Oracle - and its their position as a dominant player in the database industry that is the real cause for concern .
That 's also the anti-competition justification that may give the EU the right to intervene.However , why would n't they be complimentary ? Depends whether you see MySQL in its traditional role as a " lite " DBMS which perfectly nails the sweet spot as a backend for blogs and web shops , or as a potential Oracle/MSSQL-killer dealing reliably with complex transactions and squillions of tables .
I 'm sure its creators see it as the latter , but I 've always felt that adding transactions and referential integrity was a bit like putting airbags on a pushbike.. .</tokentext>
<sentencetext>I see no reason an entity couldn't take it and create a forked product to compete in that spaceNo, but there is a built in inequity: anybody developing a fork from the GPL code base is obliged to release their products under the GPL.
Even if they're happy to contribute their own work to the community, that makes it harder to develop products that are interoperable with other proprietary systems and/or which might have patent issues.
Oracle, on the other hand, will own the copyrights and therefore are not bound at all by the GPL.
They would be free to distribute MySQL-based products or MySQL clients with, for example, better integration with Oracle, Windows, .NET or IIS.
They could even bolt on a proprietary DB engine...

Now, if you are a GPL purist this won't worry you, since you'd rather shave your own head with a cheesegrater than use proprietary code (and you're probably using PostgreSQL anyway), but if you're more pragmatic and interested in commercializing MySQL-based products then it means Oracle have a potential competetive edge.
Of course, in the past you could always approach Monty or, later, Sun and ask for a license to distribute MySQL or its libraries outside the GPL.
Now you'll have to ask Oracle - and its their position as a dominant player in the database industry that is the real cause for concern.
That's also the anti-competition justification that may give the EU the right to intervene.However, why wouldn't they be complimentary?Depends whether you see MySQL in its traditional role as a "lite" DBMS which perfectly nails the sweet spot as a backend for blogs and web shops, or as a potential Oracle/MSSQL-killer dealing reliably with complex transactions and squillions of tables.
I'm sure its creators see it as the latter, but I've always felt that  adding transactions and referential integrity was a bit like putting airbags on a pushbike...
	</sentencetext>
	<parent>http://www.semanticweb.org/ontologies/ConversationInstances.owl#comment10_01_04_1548235.30641644</parent>
</comment>
<comment>
	<id>http://www.semanticweb.org/ontologies/ConversationInstances.owl#comment10_01_04_1548235.30642144</id>
	<title>Re:He got paid. It's GPL.</title>
	<author>gomek-ramek</author>
	<datestamp>1262626380000</datestamp>
	<modclass>None</modclass>
	<modscore>1</modscore>
	<htmltext>He *has* forked it.  Regardless of Monty's intentions, I'm growing tired of seeing this argument stated over and over.</htmltext>
<tokenext>He * has * forked it .
Regardless of Monty 's intentions , I 'm growing tired of seeing this argument stated over and over .</tokentext>
<sentencetext>He *has* forked it.
Regardless of Monty's intentions, I'm growing tired of seeing this argument stated over and over.</sentencetext>
	<parent>http://www.semanticweb.org/ontologies/ConversationInstances.owl#comment10_01_04_1548235.30641664</parent>
</comment>
<comment>
	<id>http://www.semanticweb.org/ontologies/ConversationInstances.owl#comment10_01_04_1548235.30642948</id>
	<title>Re:Own fault</title>
	<author>smbarbour</author>
	<datestamp>1262629260000</datestamp>
	<modclass>None</modclass>
	<modscore>1</modscore>
	<htmltext><p>Actually, the issue is not one of licensing.  The issue is that a minor product of one company is at risk of being abandoned due to the purchase of the company by another whose major product is a competitor.  That said, the GPL has it's place.  It is good for making the world a better place, but it is bad for business.  If one could feed a family on sunshine and rainbows, the GPL would be good in most cases.</p><p>To put in plainly, if Microsoft released Windows under the GPL, anyone who legally acquired a copy of Windows could then take the source code, make trivial modifications, and redistribute it, and Microsoft would not see a dime from any of that.  Why would anyone in their right mind use a license that undermines their business?  (disregarding any argument that Windows would be made better as a result)</p><p><i>Note:  This post was made from a computer running Ubuntu</i></p></htmltext>
<tokenext>Actually , the issue is not one of licensing .
The issue is that a minor product of one company is at risk of being abandoned due to the purchase of the company by another whose major product is a competitor .
That said , the GPL has it 's place .
It is good for making the world a better place , but it is bad for business .
If one could feed a family on sunshine and rainbows , the GPL would be good in most cases.To put in plainly , if Microsoft released Windows under the GPL , anyone who legally acquired a copy of Windows could then take the source code , make trivial modifications , and redistribute it , and Microsoft would not see a dime from any of that .
Why would anyone in their right mind use a license that undermines their business ?
( disregarding any argument that Windows would be made better as a result ) Note : This post was made from a computer running Ubuntu</tokentext>
<sentencetext>Actually, the issue is not one of licensing.
The issue is that a minor product of one company is at risk of being abandoned due to the purchase of the company by another whose major product is a competitor.
That said, the GPL has it's place.
It is good for making the world a better place, but it is bad for business.
If one could feed a family on sunshine and rainbows, the GPL would be good in most cases.To put in plainly, if Microsoft released Windows under the GPL, anyone who legally acquired a copy of Windows could then take the source code, make trivial modifications, and redistribute it, and Microsoft would not see a dime from any of that.
Why would anyone in their right mind use a license that undermines their business?
(disregarding any argument that Windows would be made better as a result)Note:  This post was made from a computer running Ubuntu</sentencetext>
	<parent>http://www.semanticweb.org/ontologies/ConversationInstances.owl#comment10_01_04_1548235.30641948</parent>
</comment>
<comment>
	<id>http://www.semanticweb.org/ontologies/ConversationInstances.owl#comment10_01_04_1548235.30643850</id>
	<title>Re:Not a valid argument...</title>
	<author>Blakey Rat</author>
	<datestamp>1262633160000</datestamp>
	<modclass>None</modclass>
	<modscore>1</modscore>
	<htmltext><p><i>I understand the concern - that MySQL will be an in-house "competitor" for resources to Oracle's database. However, why wouldn't they be complimentary?</i></p><p>That's the big mystery.</p><p>Microsoft seems to be doing ok with both SQL Server and SQL Server Express. It helps that the migration between the two is mind-numbingly simple.</p><p>If Oracle set up an easy way to migrate from MySQL to Oracle, and they renamed MySQL into "Oracle Express", there you go.</p></htmltext>
<tokenext>I understand the concern - that MySQL will be an in-house " competitor " for resources to Oracle 's database .
However , why would n't they be complimentary ? That 's the big mystery.Microsoft seems to be doing ok with both SQL Server and SQL Server Express .
It helps that the migration between the two is mind-numbingly simple.If Oracle set up an easy way to migrate from MySQL to Oracle , and they renamed MySQL into " Oracle Express " , there you go .</tokentext>
<sentencetext>I understand the concern - that MySQL will be an in-house "competitor" for resources to Oracle's database.
However, why wouldn't they be complimentary?That's the big mystery.Microsoft seems to be doing ok with both SQL Server and SQL Server Express.
It helps that the migration between the two is mind-numbingly simple.If Oracle set up an easy way to migrate from MySQL to Oracle, and they renamed MySQL into "Oracle Express", there you go.</sentencetext>
	<parent>http://www.semanticweb.org/ontologies/ConversationInstances.owl#comment10_01_04_1548235.30641644</parent>
</comment>
<comment>
	<id>http://www.semanticweb.org/ontologies/ConversationInstances.owl#comment10_01_04_1548235.30642168</id>
	<title>Re:There is already a perfectly good free DBMS</title>
	<author>Anonymous</author>
	<datestamp>1262626500000</datestamp>
	<modclass>None</modclass>
	<modscore>1</modscore>
	<htmltext><p><div class="quote"><p>It's called PostgreSQL. It's fast, what's even more important, it's <b>correct</b> and it's tried and tested.</p></div><p>Can you elaborate on the 'correct' with emphasis?</p><p>Google says that both postgresql and mysql get hits from 'incorrect results'.  Are you stating that mysql's bugs have gone unfixed while postgre's have not?  Or what?</p></div>
	</htmltext>
<tokenext>It 's called PostgreSQL .
It 's fast , what 's even more important , it 's correct and it 's tried and tested.Can you elaborate on the 'correct ' with emphasis ? Google says that both postgresql and mysql get hits from 'incorrect results' .
Are you stating that mysql 's bugs have gone unfixed while postgre 's have not ?
Or what ?</tokentext>
<sentencetext>It's called PostgreSQL.
It's fast, what's even more important, it's correct and it's tried and tested.Can you elaborate on the 'correct' with emphasis?Google says that both postgresql and mysql get hits from 'incorrect results'.
Are you stating that mysql's bugs have gone unfixed while postgre's have not?
Or what?
	</sentencetext>
	<parent>http://www.semanticweb.org/ontologies/ConversationInstances.owl#comment10_01_04_1548235.30641750</parent>
</comment>
<comment>
	<id>http://www.semanticweb.org/ontologies/ConversationInstances.owl#comment10_01_04_1548235.30641624</id>
	<title>Stick a fork in it!</title>
	<author>Anonymous</author>
	<datestamp>1262624460000</datestamp>
	<modclass>None</modclass>
	<modscore>0</modscore>
	<htmltext><p>Why doesn't he just fork the whole project?  He is the original author so many contributors would likely follow him.  That would be a much easier way to maintain some control IMHO.</p></htmltext>
<tokenext>Why does n't he just fork the whole project ?
He is the original author so many contributors would likely follow him .
That would be a much easier way to maintain some control IMHO .</tokentext>
<sentencetext>Why doesn't he just fork the whole project?
He is the original author so many contributors would likely follow him.
That would be a much easier way to maintain some control IMHO.</sentencetext>
</comment>
<comment>
	<id>http://www.semanticweb.org/ontologies/ConversationInstances.owl#comment10_01_04_1548235.30642154</id>
	<title>What can SUN do?</title>
	<author>gsgriffin</author>
	<datestamp>1262626440000</datestamp>
	<modclass>None</modclass>
	<modscore>1</modscore>
	<htmltext>I'm not claiming to be an expert in this field, but have a simple question...<br> <br>If this is GPL, can SUN stop it from continuing to be GPL?  Even if they purchase SUN, doesn't the GPL have to be maintained on software once placed in the public domain?  Even if Oracle took it and if they stopped development of it, it wouldn't mean that the public would have to stop developing and using it, would it?  Couldn't separate efforts, much like Linux, continue this on as if nothing happened, OR is this what can happen to any GPL in the future?</htmltext>
<tokenext>I 'm not claiming to be an expert in this field , but have a simple question... If this is GPL , can SUN stop it from continuing to be GPL ?
Even if they purchase SUN , does n't the GPL have to be maintained on software once placed in the public domain ?
Even if Oracle took it and if they stopped development of it , it would n't mean that the public would have to stop developing and using it , would it ?
Could n't separate efforts , much like Linux , continue this on as if nothing happened , OR is this what can happen to any GPL in the future ?</tokentext>
<sentencetext>I'm not claiming to be an expert in this field, but have a simple question... If this is GPL, can SUN stop it from continuing to be GPL?
Even if they purchase SUN, doesn't the GPL have to be maintained on software once placed in the public domain?
Even if Oracle took it and if they stopped development of it, it wouldn't mean that the public would have to stop developing and using it, would it?
Couldn't separate efforts, much like Linux, continue this on as if nothing happened, OR is this what can happen to any GPL in the future?</sentencetext>
</comment>
<comment>
	<id>http://www.semanticweb.org/ontologies/ConversationInstances.owl#comment10_01_04_1548235.30645598</id>
	<title>Re:Own fault</title>
	<author>montywi</author>
	<datestamp>1262597400000</datestamp>
	<modclass>Interestin</modclass>
	<modscore>4</modscore>
	<htmltext><p>When you take in investors, it's impossible to get such a clause. (Don't think that we didn't try).</p><p>So, in 2001, David and I had the choice to continue like before and grow slowly or take a risk and grow<br>rapidly.</p><p>Growing meant more resources for development and a better Open Source database overall. The price to pay was less control.</p></htmltext>
<tokenext>When you take in investors , it 's impossible to get such a clause .
( Do n't think that we did n't try ) .So , in 2001 , David and I had the choice to continue like before and grow slowly or take a risk and growrapidly.Growing meant more resources for development and a better Open Source database overall .
The price to pay was less control .</tokentext>
<sentencetext>When you take in investors, it's impossible to get such a clause.
(Don't think that we didn't try).So, in 2001, David and I had the choice to continue like before and grow slowly or take a risk and growrapidly.Growing meant more resources for development and a better Open Source database overall.
The price to pay was less control.</sentencetext>
	<parent>http://www.semanticweb.org/ontologies/ConversationInstances.owl#comment10_01_04_1548235.30642492</parent>
</comment>
<comment>
	<id>http://www.semanticweb.org/ontologies/ConversationInstances.owl#comment10_01_04_1548235.30642878</id>
	<title>Time to switch...</title>
	<author>XB-70</author>
	<datestamp>1262629020000</datestamp>
	<modclass>Insightful</modclass>
	<modscore>4</modscore>
	<htmltext>Instead of whining, it's time to make the switch to a 'real' database: PostgreSQL - <a href="http://www.postgresql.org/" title="postgresql.org" rel="nofollow">http://www.postgresql.org/</a> [postgresql.org]
<p>It may not be as fast as MySQL, but it's certainly more robust and capable. If you look at the core of ORACLE's design (which is pretty damned good), you'll find that Postgresql has similar design principals.
</p><p>When it comes to data loss, I'd rather the more robust database than the fastest one.</p></htmltext>
<tokenext>Instead of whining , it 's time to make the switch to a 'real ' database : PostgreSQL - http : //www.postgresql.org/ [ postgresql.org ] It may not be as fast as MySQL , but it 's certainly more robust and capable .
If you look at the core of ORACLE 's design ( which is pretty damned good ) , you 'll find that Postgresql has similar design principals .
When it comes to data loss , I 'd rather the more robust database than the fastest one .</tokentext>
<sentencetext>Instead of whining, it's time to make the switch to a 'real' database: PostgreSQL - http://www.postgresql.org/ [postgresql.org]
It may not be as fast as MySQL, but it's certainly more robust and capable.
If you look at the core of ORACLE's design (which is pretty damned good), you'll find that Postgresql has similar design principals.
When it comes to data loss, I'd rather the more robust database than the fastest one.</sentencetext>
</comment>
<comment>
	<id>http://www.semanticweb.org/ontologies/ConversationInstances.owl#comment10_01_04_1548235.30642322</id>
	<title>Re:Who has shared hosting with PostgreSQL?</title>
	<author>Anonymous</author>
	<datestamp>1262627040000</datestamp>
	<modclass>None</modclass>
	<modscore>0</modscore>
	<htmltext><p>I've seen a few small ones.  They run Plesk and often offer Postgres aside MySQL.</p></htmltext>
<tokenext>I 've seen a few small ones .
They run Plesk and often offer Postgres aside MySQL .</tokentext>
<sentencetext>I've seen a few small ones.
They run Plesk and often offer Postgres aside MySQL.</sentencetext>
	<parent>http://www.semanticweb.org/ontologies/ConversationInstances.owl#comment10_01_04_1548235.30642058</parent>
</comment>
<comment>
	<id>http://www.semanticweb.org/ontologies/ConversationInstances.owl#comment10_01_04_1548235.30642278</id>
	<title>Unclean Hands</title>
	<author>Blackeagle\_Falcon</author>
	<datestamp>1262626920000</datestamp>
	<modclass>Insightful</modclass>
	<modscore>2</modscore>
	<htmltext>So, Monty uses dual licensing to turn his open source software into a profitable company, sells that company for a billion dollars, and now he's suddenly concerned with freedom.  Oracle buying MySQL may be bad, but I don't think Monty has much credibility in opposing it.</htmltext>
<tokenext>So , Monty uses dual licensing to turn his open source software into a profitable company , sells that company for a billion dollars , and now he 's suddenly concerned with freedom .
Oracle buying MySQL may be bad , but I do n't think Monty has much credibility in opposing it .</tokentext>
<sentencetext>So, Monty uses dual licensing to turn his open source software into a profitable company, sells that company for a billion dollars, and now he's suddenly concerned with freedom.
Oracle buying MySQL may be bad, but I don't think Monty has much credibility in opposing it.</sentencetext>
</comment>
<comment>
	<id>http://www.semanticweb.org/ontologies/ConversationInstances.owl#comment10_01_04_1548235.30642346</id>
	<title>Re:There is already a perfectly good free DBMS</title>
	<author>Anonymous</author>
	<datestamp>1262627100000</datestamp>
	<modclass>None</modclass>
	<modscore>0</modscore>
	<htmltext><p>to quote austin powers, why won't PostGres die already?</p><p>10 years ago when I got into Linux it was a neglected project. 3 years after I started offering hosting I got one request for it, and when I explained that there wasn't much demand I got this little speech.</p><p>Give up already. Use a standardized environment. Learn a new skill. Stop lecturing people. Drop your fetish for things that are unpopular.</p></div>
	</htmltext>
<tokenext>to quote austin powers , why wo n't PostGres die already ? 10 years ago when I got into Linux it was a neglected project .
3 years after I started offering hosting I got one request for it , and when I explained that there was n't much demand I got this little speech.Give up already .
Use a standardized environment .
Learn a new skill .
Stop lecturing people .
Drop your fetish for things that are unpopular .</tokentext>
<sentencetext>to quote austin powers, why won't PostGres die already?10 years ago when I got into Linux it was a neglected project.
3 years after I started offering hosting I got one request for it, and when I explained that there wasn't much demand I got this little speech.Give up already.
Use a standardized environment.
Learn a new skill.
Stop lecturing people.
Drop your fetish for things that are unpopular.
	</sentencetext>
	<parent>http://www.semanticweb.org/ontologies/ConversationInstances.owl#comment10_01_04_1548235.30641750</parent>
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