<article>
	<id>http://www.semanticweb.org/ontologies/ConversationInstances.owl#article09_12_29_2129221</id>
	<title>Uniforms For the Help Desk?</title>
	<author>timothy</author>
	<datestamp>1262080140000</datestamp>
	<htmltext>An anonymous reader writes <i>"I am an IT worker in a mid sized company with approximately 500 employees.  There are 30 people on the IT staff, 6 of whom are on the help desk. Our help desk does have significant visibility in the company, and most people know us by face (some by name). Recently the idea has been floated up the management chain to have these help desk workers wear IT department branded shirts. The idea is to promote visibility and unity. Wearing of these shirts would be mandatory Monday through Thursday. The shirts would not be identical (there would be several styles offered). We would be the only department with specific garments outside of the normal business casual dress code. Is management out of line with the industry in promoting this sort of policy change? Is the singling out of 6 employees as 'the IT guys' a step in the right direction, or does it detract from the professionalism that we are trying to display as a department?"</i></htmltext>
<tokenext>An anonymous reader writes " I am an IT worker in a mid sized company with approximately 500 employees .
There are 30 people on the IT staff , 6 of whom are on the help desk .
Our help desk does have significant visibility in the company , and most people know us by face ( some by name ) .
Recently the idea has been floated up the management chain to have these help desk workers wear IT department branded shirts .
The idea is to promote visibility and unity .
Wearing of these shirts would be mandatory Monday through Thursday .
The shirts would not be identical ( there would be several styles offered ) .
We would be the only department with specific garments outside of the normal business casual dress code .
Is management out of line with the industry in promoting this sort of policy change ?
Is the singling out of 6 employees as 'the IT guys ' a step in the right direction , or does it detract from the professionalism that we are trying to display as a department ?
"</tokentext>
<sentencetext>An anonymous reader writes "I am an IT worker in a mid sized company with approximately 500 employees.
There are 30 people on the IT staff, 6 of whom are on the help desk.
Our help desk does have significant visibility in the company, and most people know us by face (some by name).
Recently the idea has been floated up the management chain to have these help desk workers wear IT department branded shirts.
The idea is to promote visibility and unity.
Wearing of these shirts would be mandatory Monday through Thursday.
The shirts would not be identical (there would be several styles offered).
We would be the only department with specific garments outside of the normal business casual dress code.
Is management out of line with the industry in promoting this sort of policy change?
Is the singling out of 6 employees as 'the IT guys' a step in the right direction, or does it detract from the professionalism that we are trying to display as a department?
"</sentencetext>
</article>
<comment>
	<id>http://www.semanticweb.org/ontologies/ConversationInstances.owl#comment09_12_29_2129221.30590136</id>
	<title>Re:Professionalism</title>
	<author>fermion</author>
	<datestamp>1262103000000</datestamp>
	<modclass>None</modclass>
	<modscore>1</modscore>
	<htmltext>It seems to me that this is issue right there.  If the company has a dress code, and the test of question implied it does, and the IT department is responsible to that dress code, then it would seem a waste to mandate a separate dress code for six people.
<p>
Furthermore I think the hostility on this topic in other threads is extremely immature and does not speak to the issue at hand.  Employees are to some extent at the whim of their employers, and have the option to leave if the employer is too whimish.  OTOH, a rational employer is not going to want to overstress the employees.  In this case, perhaps the company buys a set of uniforms for these workers if the company believe that it adds value.  Certainly I think some of the hostility comes from the fact that the employees are going to have buy specific work clothes, as opposed to finding clothes that fits a budget.
</p><p>
I see some this in my current position, where an increase level of dress has recently been discussed.  Suit and the like are really inappropriate for most of us, as it just gets torn up way too easily.  Spending a couple hundred dollars for outfits that are going to have to be replaced every 6 months is really out of line for all but the highest paid employees.  Some people do wear such clothes, and it is their choice to spend that money to promote their career.  When all is said and done, if one is playing the appropriate part in an organization, then everything else is just inefficiency.  Of course, it is the prerogative of the owner of the company to be inefficient, but if I was told I was going to have to spend hundreds of dollars of my own money to meet some arbitrary PHB mandate, I might look for another job.  Or perhaps I am making so much money that the amount is not significant.</p></htmltext>
<tokenext>It seems to me that this is issue right there .
If the company has a dress code , and the test of question implied it does , and the IT department is responsible to that dress code , then it would seem a waste to mandate a separate dress code for six people .
Furthermore I think the hostility on this topic in other threads is extremely immature and does not speak to the issue at hand .
Employees are to some extent at the whim of their employers , and have the option to leave if the employer is too whimish .
OTOH , a rational employer is not going to want to overstress the employees .
In this case , perhaps the company buys a set of uniforms for these workers if the company believe that it adds value .
Certainly I think some of the hostility comes from the fact that the employees are going to have buy specific work clothes , as opposed to finding clothes that fits a budget .
I see some this in my current position , where an increase level of dress has recently been discussed .
Suit and the like are really inappropriate for most of us , as it just gets torn up way too easily .
Spending a couple hundred dollars for outfits that are going to have to be replaced every 6 months is really out of line for all but the highest paid employees .
Some people do wear such clothes , and it is their choice to spend that money to promote their career .
When all is said and done , if one is playing the appropriate part in an organization , then everything else is just inefficiency .
Of course , it is the prerogative of the owner of the company to be inefficient , but if I was told I was going to have to spend hundreds of dollars of my own money to meet some arbitrary PHB mandate , I might look for another job .
Or perhaps I am making so much money that the amount is not significant .</tokentext>
<sentencetext>It seems to me that this is issue right there.
If the company has a dress code, and the test of question implied it does, and the IT department is responsible to that dress code, then it would seem a waste to mandate a separate dress code for six people.
Furthermore I think the hostility on this topic in other threads is extremely immature and does not speak to the issue at hand.
Employees are to some extent at the whim of their employers, and have the option to leave if the employer is too whimish.
OTOH, a rational employer is not going to want to overstress the employees.
In this case, perhaps the company buys a set of uniforms for these workers if the company believe that it adds value.
Certainly I think some of the hostility comes from the fact that the employees are going to have buy specific work clothes, as opposed to finding clothes that fits a budget.
I see some this in my current position, where an increase level of dress has recently been discussed.
Suit and the like are really inappropriate for most of us, as it just gets torn up way too easily.
Spending a couple hundred dollars for outfits that are going to have to be replaced every 6 months is really out of line for all but the highest paid employees.
Some people do wear such clothes, and it is their choice to spend that money to promote their career.
When all is said and done, if one is playing the appropriate part in an organization, then everything else is just inefficiency.
Of course, it is the prerogative of the owner of the company to be inefficient, but if I was told I was going to have to spend hundreds of dollars of my own money to meet some arbitrary PHB mandate, I might look for another job.
Or perhaps I am making so much money that the amount is not significant.</sentencetext>
	<parent>http://www.semanticweb.org/ontologies/ConversationInstances.owl#comment09_12_29_2129221.30587096</parent>
</comment>
<comment>
	<id>http://www.semanticweb.org/ontologies/ConversationInstances.owl#comment09_12_29_2129221.30587486</id>
	<title>Re:Nothing wrong with the idea</title>
	<author>Anonymous</author>
	<datestamp>1262085300000</datestamp>
	<modclass>None</modclass>
	<modscore>0</modscore>
	<htmltext><p><div class="quote"><p>I don't see why the idea couldn't be extended to wearing branded shirts.</p></div><p><div class="quote"><p>If you wouldn't bring up Nazis, don't bring up Kool-Aid. Nothing in IT is Jonestown-Equivalent.</p></div><p>I read your sig and thought "you know who else had to wear branded shirts?"</p></div>
	</htmltext>
<tokenext>I do n't see why the idea could n't be extended to wearing branded shirts.If you would n't bring up Nazis , do n't bring up Kool-Aid .
Nothing in IT is Jonestown-Equivalent.I read your sig and thought " you know who else had to wear branded shirts ?
"</tokentext>
<sentencetext>I don't see why the idea couldn't be extended to wearing branded shirts.If you wouldn't bring up Nazis, don't bring up Kool-Aid.
Nothing in IT is Jonestown-Equivalent.I read your sig and thought "you know who else had to wear branded shirts?
"
	</sentencetext>
	<parent>http://www.semanticweb.org/ontologies/ConversationInstances.owl#comment09_12_29_2129221.30587138</parent>
</comment>
<comment>
	<id>http://www.semanticweb.org/ontologies/ConversationInstances.owl#comment09_12_29_2129221.30588508</id>
	<title>Cool shirts are cool</title>
	<author>Galen Wolffit</author>
	<datestamp>1262089800000</datestamp>
	<modclass>None</modclass>
	<modscore>1</modscore>
	<htmltext><p>IMHO, cool shirts are cool; lame shirts are lame.  My company gives every new employee a blue and/or white polo shirt with the company logo on it.  These shirts are NOT mandatory attire at any time, but are still frequently seen around the office, and occasionally seen outside the office.</p><p>If it's a shirt you would wear by choice, then it's not a problem.</p></htmltext>
<tokenext>IMHO , cool shirts are cool ; lame shirts are lame .
My company gives every new employee a blue and/or white polo shirt with the company logo on it .
These shirts are NOT mandatory attire at any time , but are still frequently seen around the office , and occasionally seen outside the office.If it 's a shirt you would wear by choice , then it 's not a problem .</tokentext>
<sentencetext>IMHO, cool shirts are cool; lame shirts are lame.
My company gives every new employee a blue and/or white polo shirt with the company logo on it.
These shirts are NOT mandatory attire at any time, but are still frequently seen around the office, and occasionally seen outside the office.If it's a shirt you would wear by choice, then it's not a problem.</sentencetext>
</comment>
<comment>
	<id>http://www.semanticweb.org/ontologies/ConversationInstances.owl#comment09_12_29_2129221.30591774</id>
	<title>I suggest</title>
	<author>rebtun</author>
	<datestamp>1259839200000</datestamp>
	<modclass>None</modclass>
	<modscore>1</modscore>
	<htmltext>If you go this route I would suggest you go with a dress shirt.

I know I would like the opportunity to hide all the tattoes on my arms when I am at work.
And also just as important I can wear my ties with a dress shirt.</htmltext>
<tokenext>If you go this route I would suggest you go with a dress shirt .
I know I would like the opportunity to hide all the tattoes on my arms when I am at work .
And also just as important I can wear my ties with a dress shirt .</tokentext>
<sentencetext>If you go this route I would suggest you go with a dress shirt.
I know I would like the opportunity to hide all the tattoes on my arms when I am at work.
And also just as important I can wear my ties with a dress shirt.</sentencetext>
</comment>
<comment>
	<id>http://www.semanticweb.org/ontologies/ConversationInstances.owl#comment09_12_29_2129221.30587940</id>
	<title>Serious people dress seriously.</title>
	<author>grahamlord86</author>
	<datestamp>1262086920000</datestamp>
	<modclass>None</modclass>
	<modscore>0</modscore>
	<htmltext><p>I was at a meeting with my boss a year ago for a presentation from Cerco. There was about a dozen IT professionals in the room, and three guys from Cerco who were pitching an offer to us to be over-flow tech support if they ran out of their own guys.</p><p>Me and my boss were only half interested in the presentation (which turned out to be a farce), we were also interested in seeing what other IT competitors were in our area. The thing that stuck out to me, was that all the Serious Looking Professionals wore not a full suit, but smart looking clothes, well presented, and were armed with a leather-bound notepad or something similar.</p><p>The other types there were a young married looking couple, or middle aged man, with polo-shirts bearing their company name in machined stitching. They looked like amateurs.</p><p>The company that now owns the local repair shop I run offered me company shirts, and I refused, saying that our customers wanted to see a smartly dressed engineer behind the counter, not a guy who's been given some shirts to make him look smart.</p><p>If your company wants you to wear shirts and good trousers, that's a good idea, I'm impressed when I see smartly dressed IT pros, but uniforms are not impressive IMHO...</p></htmltext>
<tokenext>I was at a meeting with my boss a year ago for a presentation from Cerco .
There was about a dozen IT professionals in the room , and three guys from Cerco who were pitching an offer to us to be over-flow tech support if they ran out of their own guys.Me and my boss were only half interested in the presentation ( which turned out to be a farce ) , we were also interested in seeing what other IT competitors were in our area .
The thing that stuck out to me , was that all the Serious Looking Professionals wore not a full suit , but smart looking clothes , well presented , and were armed with a leather-bound notepad or something similar.The other types there were a young married looking couple , or middle aged man , with polo-shirts bearing their company name in machined stitching .
They looked like amateurs.The company that now owns the local repair shop I run offered me company shirts , and I refused , saying that our customers wanted to see a smartly dressed engineer behind the counter , not a guy who 's been given some shirts to make him look smart.If your company wants you to wear shirts and good trousers , that 's a good idea , I 'm impressed when I see smartly dressed IT pros , but uniforms are not impressive IMHO.. .</tokentext>
<sentencetext>I was at a meeting with my boss a year ago for a presentation from Cerco.
There was about a dozen IT professionals in the room, and three guys from Cerco who were pitching an offer to us to be over-flow tech support if they ran out of their own guys.Me and my boss were only half interested in the presentation (which turned out to be a farce), we were also interested in seeing what other IT competitors were in our area.
The thing that stuck out to me, was that all the Serious Looking Professionals wore not a full suit, but smart looking clothes, well presented, and were armed with a leather-bound notepad or something similar.The other types there were a young married looking couple, or middle aged man, with polo-shirts bearing their company name in machined stitching.
They looked like amateurs.The company that now owns the local repair shop I run offered me company shirts, and I refused, saying that our customers wanted to see a smartly dressed engineer behind the counter, not a guy who's been given some shirts to make him look smart.If your company wants you to wear shirts and good trousers, that's a good idea, I'm impressed when I see smartly dressed IT pros, but uniforms are not impressive IMHO...</sentencetext>
</comment>
<comment>
	<id>http://www.semanticweb.org/ontologies/ConversationInstances.owl#comment09_12_29_2129221.30587444</id>
	<title>Lab coats instead?</title>
	<author>Anonymous</author>
	<datestamp>1262085120000</datestamp>
	<modclass>Interestin</modclass>
	<modscore>2</modscore>
	<htmltext><p>See if you can get management to go for lab coats with a logo or some sort of jacket.  That way, you could take it off easily for that lunch break they are probably timing to the second.</p></htmltext>
<tokenext>See if you can get management to go for lab coats with a logo or some sort of jacket .
That way , you could take it off easily for that lunch break they are probably timing to the second .</tokentext>
<sentencetext>See if you can get management to go for lab coats with a logo or some sort of jacket.
That way, you could take it off easily for that lunch break they are probably timing to the second.</sentencetext>
</comment>
<comment>
	<id>http://www.semanticweb.org/ontologies/ConversationInstances.owl#comment09_12_29_2129221.30588048</id>
	<title>How is a uniform unprofessional?</title>
	<author>Trailer Trash</author>
	<datestamp>1262087400000</datestamp>
	<modclass>Insightful</modclass>
	<modscore>3</modscore>
	<htmltext><p>Seriously - doctors, nurses, mechanics, police officers, firemen, geeze, a *bunch* of legitimate professionals wear uniforms, many with pride.  Now, you're thinking "I'm an office worker, I'm above that".  I don't know.  Being in a service industry (and that's what IT is within your company - an inward-facing service division) I think a uniform can actually make some sense in this case.  I'd like to know more about their reasoning, though.  As others have said, maybe it's just a way to get you to dress somewhat normally.</p><p>How about a trade-off - you wear the uniform but you also get a company car?</p></htmltext>
<tokenext>Seriously - doctors , nurses , mechanics , police officers , firemen , geeze , a * bunch * of legitimate professionals wear uniforms , many with pride .
Now , you 're thinking " I 'm an office worker , I 'm above that " .
I do n't know .
Being in a service industry ( and that 's what IT is within your company - an inward-facing service division ) I think a uniform can actually make some sense in this case .
I 'd like to know more about their reasoning , though .
As others have said , maybe it 's just a way to get you to dress somewhat normally.How about a trade-off - you wear the uniform but you also get a company car ?</tokentext>
<sentencetext>Seriously - doctors, nurses, mechanics, police officers, firemen, geeze, a *bunch* of legitimate professionals wear uniforms, many with pride.
Now, you're thinking "I'm an office worker, I'm above that".
I don't know.
Being in a service industry (and that's what IT is within your company - an inward-facing service division) I think a uniform can actually make some sense in this case.
I'd like to know more about their reasoning, though.
As others have said, maybe it's just a way to get you to dress somewhat normally.How about a trade-off - you wear the uniform but you also get a company car?</sentencetext>
</comment>
<comment>
	<id>http://www.semanticweb.org/ontologies/ConversationInstances.owl#comment09_12_29_2129221.30589804</id>
	<title>Re:UNIFORMS SUCK. want respect from CEO? wear ties</title>
	<author>bickerdyke</author>
	<datestamp>1262099760000</datestamp>
	<modclass>None</modclass>
	<modscore>1</modscore>
	<htmltext><p>ever told that your local firefighters?</p><p>Or did you ever consider that a tie is just a *different* uniform?</p></htmltext>
<tokenext>ever told that your local firefighters ? Or did you ever consider that a tie is just a * different * uniform ?</tokentext>
<sentencetext>ever told that your local firefighters?Or did you ever consider that a tie is just a *different* uniform?</sentencetext>
	<parent>http://www.semanticweb.org/ontologies/ConversationInstances.owl#comment09_12_29_2129221.30588004</parent>
</comment>
<comment>
	<id>http://www.semanticweb.org/ontologies/ConversationInstances.owl#comment09_12_29_2129221.30589662</id>
	<title>FBI windbreakers</title>
	<author>pclminion</author>
	<datestamp>1262098440000</datestamp>
	<modclass>None</modclass>
	<modscore>1</modscore>
	<htmltext>I'm not IT, but if I was, I'd happily wear a uniform as long as it looked reasonably like an FBI windbreaker ("IT" in bold white sans-serif letters on the back). And I'd also carry a gun. An inventory gun. But in a holster. Yeah.</htmltext>
<tokenext>I 'm not IT , but if I was , I 'd happily wear a uniform as long as it looked reasonably like an FBI windbreaker ( " IT " in bold white sans-serif letters on the back ) .
And I 'd also carry a gun .
An inventory gun .
But in a holster .
Yeah .</tokentext>
<sentencetext>I'm not IT, but if I was, I'd happily wear a uniform as long as it looked reasonably like an FBI windbreaker ("IT" in bold white sans-serif letters on the back).
And I'd also carry a gun.
An inventory gun.
But in a holster.
Yeah.</sentencetext>
</comment>
<comment>
	<id>http://www.semanticweb.org/ontologies/ConversationInstances.owl#comment09_12_29_2129221.30590128</id>
	<title>Re:Well...</title>
	<author>Anonymous</author>
	<datestamp>1262102940000</datestamp>
	<modclass>None</modclass>
	<modscore>0</modscore>
	<htmltext><p>Wear ALL the clothes simultaneously.</p><p>Take loads home and customise them.</p></htmltext>
<tokenext>Wear ALL the clothes simultaneously.Take loads home and customise them .</tokentext>
<sentencetext>Wear ALL the clothes simultaneously.Take loads home and customise them.</sentencetext>
	<parent>http://www.semanticweb.org/ontologies/ConversationInstances.owl#comment09_12_29_2129221.30587462</parent>
</comment>
<comment>
	<id>http://www.semanticweb.org/ontologies/ConversationInstances.owl#comment09_12_29_2129221.30603150</id>
	<title>Let them wear Droids</title>
	<author>Anonymous</author>
	<datestamp>1259865300000</datestamp>
	<modclass>None</modclass>
	<modscore>0</modscore>
	<htmltext><p>How about issuing them all Droids with brightly-colored belt pouches (maybe logoed)?  That would set them apart without a demeaning uniform.</p></htmltext>
<tokenext>How about issuing them all Droids with brightly-colored belt pouches ( maybe logoed ) ?
That would set them apart without a demeaning uniform .</tokentext>
<sentencetext>How about issuing them all Droids with brightly-colored belt pouches (maybe logoed)?
That would set them apart without a demeaning uniform.</sentencetext>
</comment>
<comment>
	<id>http://www.semanticweb.org/ontologies/ConversationInstances.owl#comment09_12_29_2129221.30587698</id>
	<title>Re:Professionalism</title>
	<author>LandDolphin</author>
	<datestamp>1262086080000</datestamp>
	<modclass>None</modclass>
	<modscore>1</modscore>
	<htmltext>Probably because IT provides a direct service for all of the other employees.  (Payroll does not come to your desk)</htmltext>
<tokenext>Probably because IT provides a direct service for all of the other employees .
( Payroll does not come to your desk )</tokentext>
<sentencetext>Probably because IT provides a direct service for all of the other employees.
(Payroll does not come to your desk)</sentencetext>
	<parent>http://www.semanticweb.org/ontologies/ConversationInstances.owl#comment09_12_29_2129221.30587250</parent>
</comment>
<comment>
	<id>http://www.semanticweb.org/ontologies/ConversationInstances.owl#comment09_12_29_2129221.30591146</id>
	<title>Re:How is a uniform unprofessional?</title>
	<author>tokul</author>
	<datestamp>1259870460000</datestamp>
	<modclass>None</modclass>
	<modscore>1</modscore>
	<htmltext><blockquote><div><p>I think a uniform can actually make some sense in this case.</p></div>
</blockquote><p>
All employees (including C*Os) wear uniforms - fine. Only selected group does - Nazis called, they want their people management methods back.</p></div>
	</htmltext>
<tokenext>I think a uniform can actually make some sense in this case .
All employees ( including C * Os ) wear uniforms - fine .
Only selected group does - Nazis called , they want their people management methods back .</tokentext>
<sentencetext>I think a uniform can actually make some sense in this case.
All employees (including C*Os) wear uniforms - fine.
Only selected group does - Nazis called, they want their people management methods back.
	</sentencetext>
	<parent>http://www.semanticweb.org/ontologies/ConversationInstances.owl#comment09_12_29_2129221.30588048</parent>
</comment>
<comment>
	<id>http://www.semanticweb.org/ontologies/ConversationInstances.owl#comment09_12_29_2129221.30588476</id>
	<title>Re:lovely</title>
	<author>servognome</author>
	<datestamp>1262089560000</datestamp>
	<modclass>None</modclass>
	<modscore>1</modscore>
	<htmltext>In most of your examples the employee wearing the uniform is the first line interface with the customer.  It's identifying to the customer "talk to me," not necessarily pointing out the lowest person on the totem pole.  I'd argue people washing dishes, stocking shelves, doing inventory, are the lowest in terms of pay and responsibility but are not usually forced to wear uniforms because they are behind the scenes.</htmltext>
<tokenext>In most of your examples the employee wearing the uniform is the first line interface with the customer .
It 's identifying to the customer " talk to me , " not necessarily pointing out the lowest person on the totem pole .
I 'd argue people washing dishes , stocking shelves , doing inventory , are the lowest in terms of pay and responsibility but are not usually forced to wear uniforms because they are behind the scenes .</tokentext>
<sentencetext>In most of your examples the employee wearing the uniform is the first line interface with the customer.
It's identifying to the customer "talk to me," not necessarily pointing out the lowest person on the totem pole.
I'd argue people washing dishes, stocking shelves, doing inventory, are the lowest in terms of pay and responsibility but are not usually forced to wear uniforms because they are behind the scenes.</sentencetext>
	<parent>http://www.semanticweb.org/ontologies/ConversationInstances.owl#comment09_12_29_2129221.30587278</parent>
</comment>
<comment>
	<id>http://www.semanticweb.org/ontologies/ConversationInstances.owl#comment09_12_29_2129221.30589810</id>
	<title>Re:Nothing wrong with the idea</title>
	<author>Petersko</author>
	<datestamp>1262099820000</datestamp>
	<modclass>None</modclass>
	<modscore>1</modscore>
	<htmltext><i>"The problem with this thinking is that a good tech should NEVER outgrow help desk. A good tech constantly updates his skills and should be paid and respected for that expertise, not made to wear uniforms and perform ridiculous dances on command....The idea of "help desk" as "entry level" employment is really stupid. Relying on your worst paid and most-stressed employees to keep the company running is a fantastic example of horrible management.</i> <br> <br>

It's not stupid at all. Why would a company want to pay an employee based on a whole bunch of skills that he doesn't use? If I want a house painted, I want to pay house painting wages. I don't care that the painter is a $400/hr lawyer. If the guy is very skilled, put him to work doing things that challenge him. You won't find those things on the help desk.<br> <br>

The idea that a good tech should never outgrow the help desk only works if you artificially restrict his growth by refusing training, or if the role of the help desk expands with him - and either way he's still not going to be answering the general phone.<br> <br>

<i>"Your type of thinking is why good techs don't stay in help desk and is, furthermore, one of the many reasons help desk can't help you 75\% of the time. All the good techs have "advanced" (IE: run the hell out)."</i> <br> <br>

No, they advance because the job doesn't challenge a good tech for long.</htmltext>
<tokenext>" The problem with this thinking is that a good tech should NEVER outgrow help desk .
A good tech constantly updates his skills and should be paid and respected for that expertise , not made to wear uniforms and perform ridiculous dances on command....The idea of " help desk " as " entry level " employment is really stupid .
Relying on your worst paid and most-stressed employees to keep the company running is a fantastic example of horrible management .
It 's not stupid at all .
Why would a company want to pay an employee based on a whole bunch of skills that he does n't use ?
If I want a house painted , I want to pay house painting wages .
I do n't care that the painter is a $ 400/hr lawyer .
If the guy is very skilled , put him to work doing things that challenge him .
You wo n't find those things on the help desk .
The idea that a good tech should never outgrow the help desk only works if you artificially restrict his growth by refusing training , or if the role of the help desk expands with him - and either way he 's still not going to be answering the general phone .
" Your type of thinking is why good techs do n't stay in help desk and is , furthermore , one of the many reasons help desk ca n't help you 75 \ % of the time .
All the good techs have " advanced " ( IE : run the hell out ) .
" No , they advance because the job does n't challenge a good tech for long .</tokentext>
<sentencetext>"The problem with this thinking is that a good tech should NEVER outgrow help desk.
A good tech constantly updates his skills and should be paid and respected for that expertise, not made to wear uniforms and perform ridiculous dances on command....The idea of "help desk" as "entry level" employment is really stupid.
Relying on your worst paid and most-stressed employees to keep the company running is a fantastic example of horrible management.
It's not stupid at all.
Why would a company want to pay an employee based on a whole bunch of skills that he doesn't use?
If I want a house painted, I want to pay house painting wages.
I don't care that the painter is a $400/hr lawyer.
If the guy is very skilled, put him to work doing things that challenge him.
You won't find those things on the help desk.
The idea that a good tech should never outgrow the help desk only works if you artificially restrict his growth by refusing training, or if the role of the help desk expands with him - and either way he's still not going to be answering the general phone.
"Your type of thinking is why good techs don't stay in help desk and is, furthermore, one of the many reasons help desk can't help you 75\% of the time.
All the good techs have "advanced" (IE: run the hell out).
"  

No, they advance because the job doesn't challenge a good tech for long.</sentencetext>
	<parent>http://www.semanticweb.org/ontologies/ConversationInstances.owl#comment09_12_29_2129221.30587718</parent>
</comment>
<comment>
	<id>http://www.semanticweb.org/ontologies/ConversationInstances.owl#comment09_12_29_2129221.30590382</id>
	<title>Uniform != Janitor</title>
	<author>RandomUsername99</author>
	<datestamp>1262105760000</datestamp>
	<modclass>None</modclass>
	<modscore>1</modscore>
	<htmltext><p>Uniform != Janitor</p><p>There are lots of highly paid, well educated, well qualified people who must wear uniforms. Though with many of these professions there are physical needs for these uniforms, they're quite often most valuable because they allow people to be identified by their jobs so they can be found in a crowd in case of an emergency without even exchanging words. It's quite important for people to be able to tell a doctor from a nurse from an orderly from a security guard in the hallway in a hospital. As a chef, I know that it's important for everyone from new waitstaff to health inspectors to vendors to be able to come into the kitchen and see who's the chef, who the line cooks are and who the dishwasher is without having to interrupt the workflow and start asking questions. To all of the people who would say associating cooks with IT guys is degrading for IT guys, most cooks that I've worked with were on average just as smart, just as well educated and/or more experienced in their field as your average guy that I worked with as a 3rd level support engineer for a large Solaris based software package for IBM. I would be much more likely to hire cooks into an IT organization than hire IT guys into a kitchen.</p><p>And though the word janitor has a definite 'cleaner' context to it, (and being a cleaner in most environments is not highly skilled labor) I'd certainly call most IT positions essentially custodial positions, especially in the help desk. Many facilities type custodial positions require them to perform basic electrical work, repair appliances, furniture, doors, windows, etc. These types of jobs certainly require more specialized knowledge than any of the helpdesk jobs I've hired for. When you're talking about someone who is generally only required to know how to check basic network connectivity, run malware and virus scanners, perform basic setup and configuration, and call someone the second they're in over there head, it's absurd that there's so much disdain for people in a position where they have to know how to replace a broken window pane, replace a broken faucet, snake a drain, fix a broken toilet, replace cracked tiles, tend to plants, safely replace light switches, strip and buff a floor, etc. etc. etc. You can go to Cornell and get a Masters degree in facilities management. Last I checked you couldn't get one in "helpdesk arts". I was in IT or closely related fields for over a decade and it certainly is an honorable profession. This thread perfectly highlights how condescending IT guys can be towards people in other fields, and more often than not, it's to people who have more difficult, more complicated, more stressful and often more important jobs. It's one of the primary reasons that so many end users are immediately defensive and confrontational when dealing with IT guys. They aren't born that way.</p><p>There are certainly tons of great IT guys out there... the overwhelming majority... but those guys that have the classic IT god/martyr complex is one of the primary reasons that I left the field to get into something where you're judged exclusively based on your merit as a worker and not how much noise you make about it. Keep convincing yourself that <i>you</i> are an invaluable IT <i>artiste</i>, certainly within the top 5 most important people in the company. You should even throw your arms up in the air and passionately shout<nobr> <wbr></nobr>::cue French accent:: "I cannot work under zees circumstances!" when management makes demands like this of you. It'll be a hilarious story to tell the guy in Bangalore who is going to replace you and 3 other people armed only with a remote desktop connection and a telephone.</p></htmltext>
<tokenext>Uniform ! = JanitorThere are lots of highly paid , well educated , well qualified people who must wear uniforms .
Though with many of these professions there are physical needs for these uniforms , they 're quite often most valuable because they allow people to be identified by their jobs so they can be found in a crowd in case of an emergency without even exchanging words .
It 's quite important for people to be able to tell a doctor from a nurse from an orderly from a security guard in the hallway in a hospital .
As a chef , I know that it 's important for everyone from new waitstaff to health inspectors to vendors to be able to come into the kitchen and see who 's the chef , who the line cooks are and who the dishwasher is without having to interrupt the workflow and start asking questions .
To all of the people who would say associating cooks with IT guys is degrading for IT guys , most cooks that I 've worked with were on average just as smart , just as well educated and/or more experienced in their field as your average guy that I worked with as a 3rd level support engineer for a large Solaris based software package for IBM .
I would be much more likely to hire cooks into an IT organization than hire IT guys into a kitchen.And though the word janitor has a definite 'cleaner ' context to it , ( and being a cleaner in most environments is not highly skilled labor ) I 'd certainly call most IT positions essentially custodial positions , especially in the help desk .
Many facilities type custodial positions require them to perform basic electrical work , repair appliances , furniture , doors , windows , etc .
These types of jobs certainly require more specialized knowledge than any of the helpdesk jobs I 've hired for .
When you 're talking about someone who is generally only required to know how to check basic network connectivity , run malware and virus scanners , perform basic setup and configuration , and call someone the second they 're in over there head , it 's absurd that there 's so much disdain for people in a position where they have to know how to replace a broken window pane , replace a broken faucet , snake a drain , fix a broken toilet , replace cracked tiles , tend to plants , safely replace light switches , strip and buff a floor , etc .
etc. etc .
You can go to Cornell and get a Masters degree in facilities management .
Last I checked you could n't get one in " helpdesk arts " .
I was in IT or closely related fields for over a decade and it certainly is an honorable profession .
This thread perfectly highlights how condescending IT guys can be towards people in other fields , and more often than not , it 's to people who have more difficult , more complicated , more stressful and often more important jobs .
It 's one of the primary reasons that so many end users are immediately defensive and confrontational when dealing with IT guys .
They are n't born that way.There are certainly tons of great IT guys out there... the overwhelming majority... but those guys that have the classic IT god/martyr complex is one of the primary reasons that I left the field to get into something where you 're judged exclusively based on your merit as a worker and not how much noise you make about it .
Keep convincing yourself that you are an invaluable IT artiste , certainly within the top 5 most important people in the company .
You should even throw your arms up in the air and passionately shout : : cue French accent : : " I can not work under zees circumstances !
" when management makes demands like this of you .
It 'll be a hilarious story to tell the guy in Bangalore who is going to replace you and 3 other people armed only with a remote desktop connection and a telephone .</tokentext>
<sentencetext>Uniform != JanitorThere are lots of highly paid, well educated, well qualified people who must wear uniforms.
Though with many of these professions there are physical needs for these uniforms, they're quite often most valuable because they allow people to be identified by their jobs so they can be found in a crowd in case of an emergency without even exchanging words.
It's quite important for people to be able to tell a doctor from a nurse from an orderly from a security guard in the hallway in a hospital.
As a chef, I know that it's important for everyone from new waitstaff to health inspectors to vendors to be able to come into the kitchen and see who's the chef, who the line cooks are and who the dishwasher is without having to interrupt the workflow and start asking questions.
To all of the people who would say associating cooks with IT guys is degrading for IT guys, most cooks that I've worked with were on average just as smart, just as well educated and/or more experienced in their field as your average guy that I worked with as a 3rd level support engineer for a large Solaris based software package for IBM.
I would be much more likely to hire cooks into an IT organization than hire IT guys into a kitchen.And though the word janitor has a definite 'cleaner' context to it, (and being a cleaner in most environments is not highly skilled labor) I'd certainly call most IT positions essentially custodial positions, especially in the help desk.
Many facilities type custodial positions require them to perform basic electrical work, repair appliances, furniture, doors, windows, etc.
These types of jobs certainly require more specialized knowledge than any of the helpdesk jobs I've hired for.
When you're talking about someone who is generally only required to know how to check basic network connectivity, run malware and virus scanners, perform basic setup and configuration, and call someone the second they're in over there head, it's absurd that there's so much disdain for people in a position where they have to know how to replace a broken window pane, replace a broken faucet, snake a drain, fix a broken toilet, replace cracked tiles, tend to plants, safely replace light switches, strip and buff a floor, etc.
etc. etc.
You can go to Cornell and get a Masters degree in facilities management.
Last I checked you couldn't get one in "helpdesk arts".
I was in IT or closely related fields for over a decade and it certainly is an honorable profession.
This thread perfectly highlights how condescending IT guys can be towards people in other fields, and more often than not, it's to people who have more difficult, more complicated, more stressful and often more important jobs.
It's one of the primary reasons that so many end users are immediately defensive and confrontational when dealing with IT guys.
They aren't born that way.There are certainly tons of great IT guys out there... the overwhelming majority... but those guys that have the classic IT god/martyr complex is one of the primary reasons that I left the field to get into something where you're judged exclusively based on your merit as a worker and not how much noise you make about it.
Keep convincing yourself that you are an invaluable IT artiste, certainly within the top 5 most important people in the company.
You should even throw your arms up in the air and passionately shout ::cue French accent:: "I cannot work under zees circumstances!
" when management makes demands like this of you.
It'll be a hilarious story to tell the guy in Bangalore who is going to replace you and 3 other people armed only with a remote desktop connection and a telephone.</sentencetext>
</comment>
<comment>
	<id>http://www.semanticweb.org/ontologies/ConversationInstances.owl#comment09_12_29_2129221.30587534</id>
	<title>Uniforms?</title>
	<author>Anonymous</author>
	<datestamp>1262085420000</datestamp>
	<modclass>None</modclass>
	<modscore>0</modscore>
	<htmltext><p>Help-desk is an entry level IT position. Generally it is staffed by recent University grads. If you would like to see the dead-sea effect in affect then by all means, make them wear uniforms. Soon you'll find that any with skill have moved on.</p><p>Uniforms are demeaning and it's bad enough those of us in IT have to swallow your upper/mid-level management BS.</p></htmltext>
<tokenext>Help-desk is an entry level IT position .
Generally it is staffed by recent University grads .
If you would like to see the dead-sea effect in affect then by all means , make them wear uniforms .
Soon you 'll find that any with skill have moved on.Uniforms are demeaning and it 's bad enough those of us in IT have to swallow your upper/mid-level management BS .</tokentext>
<sentencetext>Help-desk is an entry level IT position.
Generally it is staffed by recent University grads.
If you would like to see the dead-sea effect in affect then by all means, make them wear uniforms.
Soon you'll find that any with skill have moved on.Uniforms are demeaning and it's bad enough those of us in IT have to swallow your upper/mid-level management BS.</sentencetext>
</comment>
<comment>
	<id>http://www.semanticweb.org/ontologies/ConversationInstances.owl#comment09_12_29_2129221.30591350</id>
	<title>I Think it would be a great idea UNTIL</title>
	<author>Anonymous</author>
	<datestamp>1259831940000</datestamp>
	<modclass>None</modclass>
	<modscore>0</modscore>
	<htmltext><p>I Think it would be a great idea UNTIL the economy comes back and all of your humiliated help desk people leave in a mass exodus leaving you scrambling to replace them at a higher cost.  The unfortunate truth is a lot of the outsourced jobs are coming back to the USA and it is getting more and more difficult to fill them because so many people have left the marketplace.  Of course the cloud is going to change all of that and put us all out of work eventually (snotty developers included) so it will be interesting to see how the future evolves.</p></htmltext>
<tokenext>I Think it would be a great idea UNTIL the economy comes back and all of your humiliated help desk people leave in a mass exodus leaving you scrambling to replace them at a higher cost .
The unfortunate truth is a lot of the outsourced jobs are coming back to the USA and it is getting more and more difficult to fill them because so many people have left the marketplace .
Of course the cloud is going to change all of that and put us all out of work eventually ( snotty developers included ) so it will be interesting to see how the future evolves .</tokentext>
<sentencetext>I Think it would be a great idea UNTIL the economy comes back and all of your humiliated help desk people leave in a mass exodus leaving you scrambling to replace them at a higher cost.
The unfortunate truth is a lot of the outsourced jobs are coming back to the USA and it is getting more and more difficult to fill them because so many people have left the marketplace.
Of course the cloud is going to change all of that and put us all out of work eventually (snotty developers included) so it will be interesting to see how the future evolves.</sentencetext>
</comment>
<comment>
	<id>http://www.semanticweb.org/ontologies/ConversationInstances.owl#comment09_12_29_2129221.30589062</id>
	<title>Out of ideas...</title>
	<author>Anonymous</author>
	<datestamp>1262093040000</datestamp>
	<modclass>Interestin</modclass>
	<modscore>1</modscore>
	<htmltext><p>Getting hall-jacked is never fun and uniforms only make it worse.  With all best business practices pointing all IT service requests to a central authority for routing and accounting it actually flies in the face of sensibility.</p><p>Just because someone manages to tackle you in the hall with their iTunes problem doesn't mean they are the highest priority IT issue your group has to deal with.</p><p>In fact they are very likely derailing you from issues that have been properly submitted and documented.</p><p>If the IT folks in uniform can only answer "I can't help you until you call the help desk and put in a ticket." the new shirts certainly won't improve your "image" with the non-IT herd.</p><p>If your ability to get IT support at your job is governed by your prowess at playing hide and seek your organization is fatally flawed - work on your resume.</p><p>It's a bad idea.  If it's the best idea your managers can come up with to improve your contribution to the organization then they are out of ideas.  Now might be a great time to bring some real IT-related ideas to the table to really cut costs and save energy in your organization.  Pick up a copy of CIO magazine or whatever, drop a couple buzz words you find there around your bosses-bosses and who knows - in a couple years maybe you'll be the one sitting around coming up with half-assed ideas for twice the pay.</p></htmltext>
<tokenext>Getting hall-jacked is never fun and uniforms only make it worse .
With all best business practices pointing all IT service requests to a central authority for routing and accounting it actually flies in the face of sensibility.Just because someone manages to tackle you in the hall with their iTunes problem does n't mean they are the highest priority IT issue your group has to deal with.In fact they are very likely derailing you from issues that have been properly submitted and documented.If the IT folks in uniform can only answer " I ca n't help you until you call the help desk and put in a ticket .
" the new shirts certainly wo n't improve your " image " with the non-IT herd.If your ability to get IT support at your job is governed by your prowess at playing hide and seek your organization is fatally flawed - work on your resume.It 's a bad idea .
If it 's the best idea your managers can come up with to improve your contribution to the organization then they are out of ideas .
Now might be a great time to bring some real IT-related ideas to the table to really cut costs and save energy in your organization .
Pick up a copy of CIO magazine or whatever , drop a couple buzz words you find there around your bosses-bosses and who knows - in a couple years maybe you 'll be the one sitting around coming up with half-assed ideas for twice the pay .</tokentext>
<sentencetext>Getting hall-jacked is never fun and uniforms only make it worse.
With all best business practices pointing all IT service requests to a central authority for routing and accounting it actually flies in the face of sensibility.Just because someone manages to tackle you in the hall with their iTunes problem doesn't mean they are the highest priority IT issue your group has to deal with.In fact they are very likely derailing you from issues that have been properly submitted and documented.If the IT folks in uniform can only answer "I can't help you until you call the help desk and put in a ticket.
" the new shirts certainly won't improve your "image" with the non-IT herd.If your ability to get IT support at your job is governed by your prowess at playing hide and seek your organization is fatally flawed - work on your resume.It's a bad idea.
If it's the best idea your managers can come up with to improve your contribution to the organization then they are out of ideas.
Now might be a great time to bring some real IT-related ideas to the table to really cut costs and save energy in your organization.
Pick up a copy of CIO magazine or whatever, drop a couple buzz words you find there around your bosses-bosses and who knows - in a couple years maybe you'll be the one sitting around coming up with half-assed ideas for twice the pay.</sentencetext>
</comment>
<comment>
	<id>http://www.semanticweb.org/ontologies/ConversationInstances.owl#comment09_12_29_2129221.30587942</id>
	<title>Re:Professionalism</title>
	<author>ELitwin</author>
	<datestamp>1262086920000</datestamp>
	<modclass>None</modclass>
	<modscore>1</modscore>
	<htmltext>If they posted a picture of what they normally dress like, I could tell them very quickly whether or not uniforms are a good idea.</htmltext>
<tokenext>If they posted a picture of what they normally dress like , I could tell them very quickly whether or not uniforms are a good idea .</tokentext>
<sentencetext>If they posted a picture of what they normally dress like, I could tell them very quickly whether or not uniforms are a good idea.</sentencetext>
	<parent>http://www.semanticweb.org/ontologies/ConversationInstances.owl#comment09_12_29_2129221.30587096</parent>
</comment>
<comment>
	<id>http://www.semanticweb.org/ontologies/ConversationInstances.owl#comment09_12_29_2129221.30590340</id>
	<title>Re:Well...</title>
	<author>Anonymous</author>
	<datestamp>1262105280000</datestamp>
	<modclass>None</modclass>
	<modscore>0</modscore>
	<htmltext><p>Or you could go pantsless.<br>Make them buy your entire working wardrobe.</p></htmltext>
<tokenext>Or you could go pantsless.Make them buy your entire working wardrobe .</tokentext>
<sentencetext>Or you could go pantsless.Make them buy your entire working wardrobe.</sentencetext>
	<parent>http://www.semanticweb.org/ontologies/ConversationInstances.owl#comment09_12_29_2129221.30587462</parent>
</comment>
<comment>
	<id>http://www.semanticweb.org/ontologies/ConversationInstances.owl#comment09_12_29_2129221.30590048</id>
	<title>Doing uniforms right</title>
	<author>Animats</author>
	<datestamp>1262102160000</datestamp>
	<modclass>Informativ</modclass>
	<modscore>2</modscore>
	<htmltext><p>
If you're going to do it, do it right.  Check out <a href="https://www.vfimagewear.com/vfweb/redkap/coms/index.jsp" title="vfimagewear.com">VF Imagewear</a> [vfimagewear.com], the leading supplier of business uniforms.  They even have a downloadable design tool.
</p><p>
There are several ways to go.  One is <a href="http://www.vfimagewear.com/vfweb/redkap/mojo/controller?actionID=npg/catalog/ProductDisplay&amp;\_siteID=1&amp;txtSeqNo=1840&amp;indexNo=56&amp;hHomeFlag=1&amp;levelid=2&amp;hMarketId=ALL&amp;hValid=Y&amp;txtUserIDPV=PUBLICVIEW" title="vfimagewear.com">a lab coat,</a> [vfimagewear.com] like the ones doctors wear. Aerospace companies have used those for decades.
Another is <a href="http://www.vfimagewear.com/vfweb/redkap/mojo/controller?actionID=npg/catalog/GarmentDisplay&amp;\_siteID=1&amp;txtSeqNo=534&amp;indexNo=29&amp;hHomeFlag=1&amp;levelid=1&amp;hMarketId=ALL&amp;hValid=Y&amp;txtUserIDPV=PUBLICVIEW&amp;hOutside=Y&amp;hSvrNameInside=www.vfimagewear.com&amp;txtNewLogin=N" title="vfimagewear.com">auto-company style uniforms.</a> [vfimagewear.com] Avoid ball caps unless you get the entire SWAT-team ensemble, which they offer.</p></htmltext>
<tokenext>If you 're going to do it , do it right .
Check out VF Imagewear [ vfimagewear.com ] , the leading supplier of business uniforms .
They even have a downloadable design tool .
There are several ways to go .
One is a lab coat , [ vfimagewear.com ] like the ones doctors wear .
Aerospace companies have used those for decades .
Another is auto-company style uniforms .
[ vfimagewear.com ] Avoid ball caps unless you get the entire SWAT-team ensemble , which they offer .</tokentext>
<sentencetext>
If you're going to do it, do it right.
Check out VF Imagewear [vfimagewear.com], the leading supplier of business uniforms.
They even have a downloadable design tool.
There are several ways to go.
One is a lab coat, [vfimagewear.com] like the ones doctors wear.
Aerospace companies have used those for decades.
Another is auto-company style uniforms.
[vfimagewear.com] Avoid ball caps unless you get the entire SWAT-team ensemble, which they offer.</sentencetext>
</comment>
<comment>
	<id>http://www.semanticweb.org/ontologies/ConversationInstances.owl#comment09_12_29_2129221.30591052</id>
	<title>Re:30 IT people in a 500 employee company?!</title>
	<author>Anonymous</author>
	<datestamp>1262115000000</datestamp>
	<modclass>None</modclass>
	<modscore>0</modscore>
	<htmltext><p><div class="quote"><p>What are most of you DOING?  I work for a company with over 800 employees, approximately 600 or so who directly use computers, that has 16 locations in the Eastern USA and we make do with TWO.</p></div><p>Ha!  That is EXACTLY what I was thinking.  We've got around 600 employees, all of whom use computers and we also have just two IT folks.</p><p>You should put your uniform on and be quietly thankful for an incredibly cushy job.</p></div>
	</htmltext>
<tokenext>What are most of you DOING ?
I work for a company with over 800 employees , approximately 600 or so who directly use computers , that has 16 locations in the Eastern USA and we make do with TWO.Ha !
That is EXACTLY what I was thinking .
We 've got around 600 employees , all of whom use computers and we also have just two IT folks.You should put your uniform on and be quietly thankful for an incredibly cushy job .</tokentext>
<sentencetext>What are most of you DOING?
I work for a company with over 800 employees, approximately 600 or so who directly use computers, that has 16 locations in the Eastern USA and we make do with TWO.Ha!
That is EXACTLY what I was thinking.
We've got around 600 employees, all of whom use computers and we also have just two IT folks.You should put your uniform on and be quietly thankful for an incredibly cushy job.
	</sentencetext>
	<parent>http://www.semanticweb.org/ontologies/ConversationInstances.owl#comment09_12_29_2129221.30587272</parent>
</comment>
<comment>
	<id>http://www.semanticweb.org/ontologies/ConversationInstances.owl#comment09_12_29_2129221.30587494</id>
	<title>Re:I like uniforms</title>
	<author>Jeff DeMaagd</author>
	<datestamp>1262085360000</datestamp>
	<modclass>None</modclass>
	<modscore>1</modscore>
	<htmltext><p>If it's just a matter of sloppiness, then just having some minimum dress code would be a better way to go about it.</p><p>A uniform can be comfortable, but cost saving measures make that an unlikely prospect.  Uniform services tend to push a terrible synthetic fabric, having slightly better breathing capability of Saran Wrap.  Some services seem to have an expectation that the uniform is worn year-round, so you might be stuck with short sleeves in winter or long sleeves in summer.  With terrible fabric.</p></htmltext>
<tokenext>If it 's just a matter of sloppiness , then just having some minimum dress code would be a better way to go about it.A uniform can be comfortable , but cost saving measures make that an unlikely prospect .
Uniform services tend to push a terrible synthetic fabric , having slightly better breathing capability of Saran Wrap .
Some services seem to have an expectation that the uniform is worn year-round , so you might be stuck with short sleeves in winter or long sleeves in summer .
With terrible fabric .</tokentext>
<sentencetext>If it's just a matter of sloppiness, then just having some minimum dress code would be a better way to go about it.A uniform can be comfortable, but cost saving measures make that an unlikely prospect.
Uniform services tend to push a terrible synthetic fabric, having slightly better breathing capability of Saran Wrap.
Some services seem to have an expectation that the uniform is worn year-round, so you might be stuck with short sleeves in winter or long sleeves in summer.
With terrible fabric.</sentencetext>
	<parent>http://www.semanticweb.org/ontologies/ConversationInstances.owl#comment09_12_29_2129221.30587120</parent>
</comment>
<comment>
	<id>http://www.semanticweb.org/ontologies/ConversationInstances.owl#comment09_12_29_2129221.30588300</id>
	<title>Sad but true</title>
	<author>noz</author>
	<datestamp>1262088720000</datestamp>
	<modclass>None</modclass>
	<modscore>1</modscore>
	<htmltext><p>Management view: you are not a person; you are a number. Get used to it.</p></htmltext>
<tokenext>Management view : you are not a person ; you are a number .
Get used to it .</tokentext>
<sentencetext>Management view: you are not a person; you are a number.
Get used to it.</sentencetext>
</comment>
<comment>
	<id>http://www.semanticweb.org/ontologies/ConversationInstances.owl#comment09_12_29_2129221.30588442</id>
	<title>Re:I like uniforms</title>
	<author>SuperKendall</author>
	<datestamp>1262089440000</datestamp>
	<modclass>Insightful</modclass>
	<modscore>3</modscore>
	<htmltext><p><i>Oh, and the reason I prefer not to wear a uniform is so I can express myself.</i></p><p>If your natural expressiveness does not come through regardless of what you are wearing, you are doing it wrong.</p><p>I wore uniforms for one or two jobs,  I was plenty expressive regardless.  What you really don't want are the jobs where you have to wear a uniform AND exhibit no expressiveness.</p></htmltext>
<tokenext>Oh , and the reason I prefer not to wear a uniform is so I can express myself.If your natural expressiveness does not come through regardless of what you are wearing , you are doing it wrong.I wore uniforms for one or two jobs , I was plenty expressive regardless .
What you really do n't want are the jobs where you have to wear a uniform AND exhibit no expressiveness .</tokentext>
<sentencetext>Oh, and the reason I prefer not to wear a uniform is so I can express myself.If your natural expressiveness does not come through regardless of what you are wearing, you are doing it wrong.I wore uniforms for one or two jobs,  I was plenty expressive regardless.
What you really don't want are the jobs where you have to wear a uniform AND exhibit no expressiveness.</sentencetext>
	<parent>http://www.semanticweb.org/ontologies/ConversationInstances.owl#comment09_12_29_2129221.30587390</parent>
</comment>
<comment>
	<id>http://www.semanticweb.org/ontologies/ConversationInstances.owl#comment09_12_29_2129221.30588468</id>
	<title>Visibility</title>
	<author>tgrigsby</author>
	<datestamp>1262089560000</datestamp>
	<modclass>None</modclass>
	<modscore>1</modscore>
	<htmltext><p>If you're visible to external customers and serve their needs, then it makes sense.  If you're only visible internally, then it's a stupid idea designed to make a manager look like he's busy and somehow contributing.  It's also a waste of company funds.  Tell them that if they really want to put that money to good use, implement a dress code and purchase a decent vending machine instead.</p></htmltext>
<tokenext>If you 're visible to external customers and serve their needs , then it makes sense .
If you 're only visible internally , then it 's a stupid idea designed to make a manager look like he 's busy and somehow contributing .
It 's also a waste of company funds .
Tell them that if they really want to put that money to good use , implement a dress code and purchase a decent vending machine instead .</tokentext>
<sentencetext>If you're visible to external customers and serve their needs, then it makes sense.
If you're only visible internally, then it's a stupid idea designed to make a manager look like he's busy and somehow contributing.
It's also a waste of company funds.
Tell them that if they really want to put that money to good use, implement a dress code and purchase a decent vending machine instead.</sentencetext>
</comment>
<comment>
	<id>http://www.semanticweb.org/ontologies/ConversationInstances.owl#comment09_12_29_2129221.30589022</id>
	<title>Re:I like uniforms</title>
	<author>couchslug</author>
	<datestamp>1262092740000</datestamp>
	<modclass>None</modclass>
	<modscore>1</modscore>
	<htmltext><p>My duty to my employer ended when I became a civilian.</p><p>Unlike the military, civilian employment is merely a matter of tolerable mutual exploitation.</p><p>I don't care about the company I work for and don't care if upper management fucks it up. I don't care about how well anything other than my department and payroll function.</p><p>Business is business and the fundamental principles of being a peon boil down to "get paid", "do it even if it's wrong so long as you don't break the law", and "I don't get paid to defy the stupid". If buy the uniforms I could care less. If I am asked to buy them I'll take the money back by wasting their time and amusing myself instead of working. If things become too annoying I'll leave.</p></htmltext>
<tokenext>My duty to my employer ended when I became a civilian.Unlike the military , civilian employment is merely a matter of tolerable mutual exploitation.I do n't care about the company I work for and do n't care if upper management fucks it up .
I do n't care about how well anything other than my department and payroll function.Business is business and the fundamental principles of being a peon boil down to " get paid " , " do it even if it 's wrong so long as you do n't break the law " , and " I do n't get paid to defy the stupid " .
If buy the uniforms I could care less .
If I am asked to buy them I 'll take the money back by wasting their time and amusing myself instead of working .
If things become too annoying I 'll leave .</tokentext>
<sentencetext>My duty to my employer ended when I became a civilian.Unlike the military, civilian employment is merely a matter of tolerable mutual exploitation.I don't care about the company I work for and don't care if upper management fucks it up.
I don't care about how well anything other than my department and payroll function.Business is business and the fundamental principles of being a peon boil down to "get paid", "do it even if it's wrong so long as you don't break the law", and "I don't get paid to defy the stupid".
If buy the uniforms I could care less.
If I am asked to buy them I'll take the money back by wasting their time and amusing myself instead of working.
If things become too annoying I'll leave.</sentencetext>
	<parent>http://www.semanticweb.org/ontologies/ConversationInstances.owl#comment09_12_29_2129221.30588366</parent>
</comment>
<comment>
	<id>http://www.semanticweb.org/ontologies/ConversationInstances.owl#comment09_12_29_2129221.30588656</id>
	<title>Re:Are you colleagues or janitors?</title>
	<author>zoloto</author>
	<datestamp>1262090520000</datestamp>
	<modclass>None</modclass>
	<modscore>1</modscore>
	<htmltext>Individuality has no business in an organization (re: team) that provide the same essential services. I don't want my "unique" apache install to suddenly decide to switch ports on me because it "feels" the need to be unique-er than the previous week.

You provide a service, much like those in sales or the executives. They have a dress code. Why shouldn't you?</htmltext>
<tokenext>Individuality has no business in an organization ( re : team ) that provide the same essential services .
I do n't want my " unique " apache install to suddenly decide to switch ports on me because it " feels " the need to be unique-er than the previous week .
You provide a service , much like those in sales or the executives .
They have a dress code .
Why should n't you ?</tokentext>
<sentencetext>Individuality has no business in an organization (re: team) that provide the same essential services.
I don't want my "unique" apache install to suddenly decide to switch ports on me because it "feels" the need to be unique-er than the previous week.
You provide a service, much like those in sales or the executives.
They have a dress code.
Why shouldn't you?</sentencetext>
	<parent>http://www.semanticweb.org/ontologies/ConversationInstances.owl#comment09_12_29_2129221.30587244</parent>
</comment>
<comment>
	<id>http://www.semanticweb.org/ontologies/ConversationInstances.owl#comment09_12_29_2129221.30587452</id>
	<title>How many are FSO (desktop support) beyond the hd?</title>
	<author>nightsweat</author>
	<datestamp>1262085240000</datestamp>
	<modclass>None</modclass>
	<modscore>1</modscore>
	<htmltext>Because by my lights (and I run It for 1/3 of a big big company), you're hella overstaffed unless a lot of those people are developers.<br> <br>

And say hell no to the uniform shirts.  You shouldn't be cohesive with your IT team (well, you should, but)- you should be cohesive with the business unit.  Anything that separates you from the biz makes you appear more severable from the core of the company.</htmltext>
<tokenext>Because by my lights ( and I run It for 1/3 of a big big company ) , you 're hella overstaffed unless a lot of those people are developers .
And say hell no to the uniform shirts .
You should n't be cohesive with your IT team ( well , you should , but ) - you should be cohesive with the business unit .
Anything that separates you from the biz makes you appear more severable from the core of the company .</tokentext>
<sentencetext>Because by my lights (and I run It for 1/3 of a big big company), you're hella overstaffed unless a lot of those people are developers.
And say hell no to the uniform shirts.
You shouldn't be cohesive with your IT team (well, you should, but)- you should be cohesive with the business unit.
Anything that separates you from the biz makes you appear more severable from the core of the company.</sentencetext>
</comment>
<comment>
	<id>http://www.semanticweb.org/ontologies/ConversationInstances.owl#comment09_12_29_2129221.30587550</id>
	<title>Does 3 Things</title>
	<author>Anonymous</author>
	<datestamp>1262085480000</datestamp>
	<modclass>None</modclass>
	<modscore>0</modscore>
	<htmltext><p>I think making you wear matching uniforms does three things:</p><p>1.  Makes you so visible that when you are on breaks or company meetings, various employees come up and start asking you for computer advice and help.  This intrudes on your personal space and will no longer get a free moment within the company.<br>2.  The skills you worked at and honed to get this position will now look as valuable as those of fast food attendant and they will try to pay you as such.<br>3.  You will likely be ostracized by other departments as you are now set apart from everyone else because you are wearing a uniform.  You will likely have to hang out with the cleaning crew and maintenance workers as they are the only ones that relate to you now.</p><p>IT workers should be treated like professionals and not disposable workers that can be easily interchanged.</p></htmltext>
<tokenext>I think making you wear matching uniforms does three things : 1 .
Makes you so visible that when you are on breaks or company meetings , various employees come up and start asking you for computer advice and help .
This intrudes on your personal space and will no longer get a free moment within the company.2 .
The skills you worked at and honed to get this position will now look as valuable as those of fast food attendant and they will try to pay you as such.3 .
You will likely be ostracized by other departments as you are now set apart from everyone else because you are wearing a uniform .
You will likely have to hang out with the cleaning crew and maintenance workers as they are the only ones that relate to you now.IT workers should be treated like professionals and not disposable workers that can be easily interchanged .</tokentext>
<sentencetext>I think making you wear matching uniforms does three things:1.
Makes you so visible that when you are on breaks or company meetings, various employees come up and start asking you for computer advice and help.
This intrudes on your personal space and will no longer get a free moment within the company.2.
The skills you worked at and honed to get this position will now look as valuable as those of fast food attendant and they will try to pay you as such.3.
You will likely be ostracized by other departments as you are now set apart from everyone else because you are wearing a uniform.
You will likely have to hang out with the cleaning crew and maintenance workers as they are the only ones that relate to you now.IT workers should be treated like professionals and not disposable workers that can be easily interchanged.</sentencetext>
</comment>
<comment>
	<id>http://www.semanticweb.org/ontologies/ConversationInstances.owl#comment09_12_29_2129221.30589054</id>
	<title>I'm from the Vietnam era...</title>
	<author>Anonymous</author>
	<datestamp>1262092980000</datestamp>
	<modclass>None</modclass>
	<modscore>0</modscore>
	<htmltext><p>There's a reason that most of the 2nd looies removed their bars - the ones that came back anyway</p></htmltext>
<tokenext>There 's a reason that most of the 2nd looies removed their bars - the ones that came back anyway</tokentext>
<sentencetext>There's a reason that most of the 2nd looies removed their bars - the ones that came back anyway</sentencetext>
</comment>
<comment>
	<id>http://www.semanticweb.org/ontologies/ConversationInstances.owl#comment09_12_29_2129221.30590668</id>
	<title>Re:30 IT people in a 500 employee company?!</title>
	<author>Anonymous</author>
	<datestamp>1262108880000</datestamp>
	<modclass>None</modclass>
	<modscore>0</modscore>
	<htmltext><p>It does depend on the applications and all, but I worked for a spook house (government/military/cryptography).  We had a lot of GIS applications I can't talk about, digital signal processing apps I can't talk about, radar, communication etc. (none of which I can talk about).  There were at least 200 people in the area our group was responsible for.  There were 7 in the summer, and regularly 4.  It also (of course) included about 20 servers, many with multiple applications and real-time data processing.  It could be regarded as a bit thin, but work got done, and everyone was productive.  Mind you, we were senior IT staff, there were about an equal number of junior people handling PEBKAC issues.</p></htmltext>
<tokenext>It does depend on the applications and all , but I worked for a spook house ( government/military/cryptography ) .
We had a lot of GIS applications I ca n't talk about , digital signal processing apps I ca n't talk about , radar , communication etc .
( none of which I can talk about ) .
There were at least 200 people in the area our group was responsible for .
There were 7 in the summer , and regularly 4 .
It also ( of course ) included about 20 servers , many with multiple applications and real-time data processing .
It could be regarded as a bit thin , but work got done , and everyone was productive .
Mind you , we were senior IT staff , there were about an equal number of junior people handling PEBKAC issues .</tokentext>
<sentencetext>It does depend on the applications and all, but I worked for a spook house (government/military/cryptography).
We had a lot of GIS applications I can't talk about, digital signal processing apps I can't talk about, radar, communication etc.
(none of which I can talk about).
There were at least 200 people in the area our group was responsible for.
There were 7 in the summer, and regularly 4.
It also (of course) included about 20 servers, many with multiple applications and real-time data processing.
It could be regarded as a bit thin, but work got done, and everyone was productive.
Mind you, we were senior IT staff, there were about an equal number of junior people handling PEBKAC issues.</sentencetext>
	<parent>http://www.semanticweb.org/ontologies/ConversationInstances.owl#comment09_12_29_2129221.30587272</parent>
</comment>
<comment>
	<id>http://www.semanticweb.org/ontologies/ConversationInstances.owl#comment09_12_29_2129221.30587394</id>
	<title>I, for one, welcome our costumed overlords.</title>
	<author>wardomon</author>
	<datestamp>1262085000000</datestamp>
	<modclass>None</modclass>
	<modscore>-1</modscore>
	<htmltext><p>Seriously, are you frying burgers there?  Uniforms just barely make sense in retail and none in an office setting.  In the early 90's I sold computer parts over the phone.  The office manager thought it would be a good idea for everyone to wear nice shirts and ties to impress the customers over the phone.  I wore a loud Hawaiian shirt and the shortest, widest tie I could find.  The policy lasted 3 days.</p></htmltext>
<tokenext>Seriously , are you frying burgers there ?
Uniforms just barely make sense in retail and none in an office setting .
In the early 90 's I sold computer parts over the phone .
The office manager thought it would be a good idea for everyone to wear nice shirts and ties to impress the customers over the phone .
I wore a loud Hawaiian shirt and the shortest , widest tie I could find .
The policy lasted 3 days .</tokentext>
<sentencetext>Seriously, are you frying burgers there?
Uniforms just barely make sense in retail and none in an office setting.
In the early 90's I sold computer parts over the phone.
The office manager thought it would be a good idea for everyone to wear nice shirts and ties to impress the customers over the phone.
I wore a loud Hawaiian shirt and the shortest, widest tie I could find.
The policy lasted 3 days.</sentencetext>
</comment>
<comment>
	<id>http://www.semanticweb.org/ontologies/ConversationInstances.owl#comment09_12_29_2129221.30587630</id>
	<title>A fine idea.</title>
	<author>PopeRatzo</author>
	<datestamp>1262085780000</datestamp>
	<modclass>None</modclass>
	<modscore>1</modscore>
	<htmltext><p>I don't know if any of you saw Inglorious Basterds, but I seem to recall the Brad Pitt character having an issue with any enemy who might like to remove their uniform after the war.</p><p>I thought of that when I read story, and after some consideration, I've come to the conclusion that uniforms for the IT staff at my workplace, an institution of higher learning, might not be such a bad idea.</p><p>At least then I'd be able to see them coming.</p></htmltext>
<tokenext>I do n't know if any of you saw Inglorious Basterds , but I seem to recall the Brad Pitt character having an issue with any enemy who might like to remove their uniform after the war.I thought of that when I read story , and after some consideration , I 've come to the conclusion that uniforms for the IT staff at my workplace , an institution of higher learning , might not be such a bad idea.At least then I 'd be able to see them coming .</tokentext>
<sentencetext>I don't know if any of you saw Inglorious Basterds, but I seem to recall the Brad Pitt character having an issue with any enemy who might like to remove their uniform after the war.I thought of that when I read story, and after some consideration, I've come to the conclusion that uniforms for the IT staff at my workplace, an institution of higher learning, might not be such a bad idea.At least then I'd be able to see them coming.</sentencetext>
</comment>
<comment>
	<id>http://www.semanticweb.org/ontologies/ConversationInstances.owl#comment09_12_29_2129221.30590186</id>
	<title>Corporate Swag?</title>
	<author>Anonymous</author>
	<datestamp>1262103600000</datestamp>
	<modclass>None</modclass>
	<modscore>0</modscore>
	<htmltext><p>I wouldn't mind wearing some of those Cutter &amp; Buck polos with the two tone collars and nice embroidered logos, you know - the ones they hand out for free to everyone except the IT staff?</p></htmltext>
<tokenext>I would n't mind wearing some of those Cutter &amp; Buck polos with the two tone collars and nice embroidered logos , you know - the ones they hand out for free to everyone except the IT staff ?</tokentext>
<sentencetext>I wouldn't mind wearing some of those Cutter &amp; Buck polos with the two tone collars and nice embroidered logos, you know - the ones they hand out for free to everyone except the IT staff?</sentencetext>
</comment>
<comment>
	<id>http://www.semanticweb.org/ontologies/ConversationInstances.owl#comment09_12_29_2129221.30587264</id>
	<title>Polyester and boobies</title>
	<author>Anonymous</author>
	<datestamp>1262084580000</datestamp>
	<modclass>None</modclass>
	<modscore>0</modscore>
	<htmltext><p>We tried that at my company for our engineering team. Learn from our mistakes and use the following formula.</p><p>Add each employee's weight and divide by number of employees. If result is greater than 230lbs, do not order polyester blend polo/golf shirts. Go with the 100\% cotton ones. Aging men, nipples, and polyester do not blend. Unless your into that kind of thing.</p></htmltext>
<tokenext>We tried that at my company for our engineering team .
Learn from our mistakes and use the following formula.Add each employee 's weight and divide by number of employees .
If result is greater than 230lbs , do not order polyester blend polo/golf shirts .
Go with the 100 \ % cotton ones .
Aging men , nipples , and polyester do not blend .
Unless your into that kind of thing .</tokentext>
<sentencetext>We tried that at my company for our engineering team.
Learn from our mistakes and use the following formula.Add each employee's weight and divide by number of employees.
If result is greater than 230lbs, do not order polyester blend polo/golf shirts.
Go with the 100\% cotton ones.
Aging men, nipples, and polyester do not blend.
Unless your into that kind of thing.</sentencetext>
</comment>
<comment>
	<id>http://www.semanticweb.org/ontologies/ConversationInstances.owl#comment09_12_29_2129221.30588342</id>
	<title>1 real reason for helpdesk to wear a uniform</title>
	<author>Anonymous</author>
	<datestamp>1262088900000</datestamp>
	<modclass>None</modclass>
	<modscore>0</modscore>
	<htmltext><p>What a load of bollocks.</p><p>I've worked in the IT industry for over 10 years now working both sides of the fence both in IT Maintenance/Comms and in Software Engineering.  It pretty much boils down to 1 real factor as to why they would want you to wear a uniform while on a helpdesk.  Helpdesk personelle are generally socially ostrecised in most organisations, after all they will be one of the most lowly paid employee, and almost anyone can do their job or be trained to do their job.  By wearing uniforms it can make everyone in helpdesk feel that they are socially part of the company rather than just "phone jockeys" who are just there for a pay cheque.  The other reason may be that your manager will be guiding investors through the place, if they see sloppy helpdesk staff (the front line to their customers) then it makes a good impression on them if they are wearing uniforms.</p><p>Grow a pair and wear the uniform.</p></htmltext>
<tokenext>What a load of bollocks.I 've worked in the IT industry for over 10 years now working both sides of the fence both in IT Maintenance/Comms and in Software Engineering .
It pretty much boils down to 1 real factor as to why they would want you to wear a uniform while on a helpdesk .
Helpdesk personelle are generally socially ostrecised in most organisations , after all they will be one of the most lowly paid employee , and almost anyone can do their job or be trained to do their job .
By wearing uniforms it can make everyone in helpdesk feel that they are socially part of the company rather than just " phone jockeys " who are just there for a pay cheque .
The other reason may be that your manager will be guiding investors through the place , if they see sloppy helpdesk staff ( the front line to their customers ) then it makes a good impression on them if they are wearing uniforms.Grow a pair and wear the uniform .</tokentext>
<sentencetext>What a load of bollocks.I've worked in the IT industry for over 10 years now working both sides of the fence both in IT Maintenance/Comms and in Software Engineering.
It pretty much boils down to 1 real factor as to why they would want you to wear a uniform while on a helpdesk.
Helpdesk personelle are generally socially ostrecised in most organisations, after all they will be one of the most lowly paid employee, and almost anyone can do their job or be trained to do their job.
By wearing uniforms it can make everyone in helpdesk feel that they are socially part of the company rather than just "phone jockeys" who are just there for a pay cheque.
The other reason may be that your manager will be guiding investors through the place, if they see sloppy helpdesk staff (the front line to their customers) then it makes a good impression on them if they are wearing uniforms.Grow a pair and wear the uniform.</sentencetext>
</comment>
<comment>
	<id>http://www.semanticweb.org/ontologies/ConversationInstances.owl#comment09_12_29_2129221.30588484</id>
	<title>quit</title>
	<author>Anonymous</author>
	<datestamp>1262089620000</datestamp>
	<modclass>None</modclass>
	<modscore>0</modscore>
	<htmltext><p>I was on an IT team about 6 years ago and then uniforms got ordered... I quit, because I only wear jeans and a t-shirt.  Well I now wear jeans and a t-shirt making triple the salary.</p></htmltext>
<tokenext>I was on an IT team about 6 years ago and then uniforms got ordered... I quit , because I only wear jeans and a t-shirt .
Well I now wear jeans and a t-shirt making triple the salary .</tokentext>
<sentencetext>I was on an IT team about 6 years ago and then uniforms got ordered... I quit, because I only wear jeans and a t-shirt.
Well I now wear jeans and a t-shirt making triple the salary.</sentencetext>
</comment>
<comment>
	<id>http://www.semanticweb.org/ontologies/ConversationInstances.owl#comment09_12_29_2129221.30590872</id>
	<title>Who foots the bill?</title>
	<author>ajlisows</author>
	<datestamp>1262112120000</datestamp>
	<modclass>None</modclass>
	<modscore>1</modscore>
	<htmltext><p>Honestly, that is my first thought.  If they are going to provide work appropriate clothing for you to wear at no cost to yourself, heck yeah.  If they are going to make you pay for 5 shirts at $30 each and 5 pairs of pants at $50 each that display the company logo (making them useless to you at your next gig) I would be annoyed by it.</p></htmltext>
<tokenext>Honestly , that is my first thought .
If they are going to provide work appropriate clothing for you to wear at no cost to yourself , heck yeah .
If they are going to make you pay for 5 shirts at $ 30 each and 5 pairs of pants at $ 50 each that display the company logo ( making them useless to you at your next gig ) I would be annoyed by it .</tokentext>
<sentencetext>Honestly, that is my first thought.
If they are going to provide work appropriate clothing for you to wear at no cost to yourself, heck yeah.
If they are going to make you pay for 5 shirts at $30 each and 5 pairs of pants at $50 each that display the company logo (making them useless to you at your next gig) I would be annoyed by it.</sentencetext>
</comment>
<comment>
	<id>http://www.semanticweb.org/ontologies/ConversationInstances.owl#comment09_12_29_2129221.30592078</id>
	<title>Stupid but not unheard of</title>
	<author>Rysc</author>
	<datestamp>1259845200000</datestamp>
	<modclass>None</modclass>
	<modscore>1</modscore>
	<htmltext><p>I worked at a place where they had us do this. Basically, it's an idea that the management like but nobody else cares for. After 6 months the "mandatory" thing had stopped being enforced and after a year almost nobody wore the department shirt. Deal with it, at least they aren't telling you how to do you job.</p></htmltext>
<tokenext>I worked at a place where they had us do this .
Basically , it 's an idea that the management like but nobody else cares for .
After 6 months the " mandatory " thing had stopped being enforced and after a year almost nobody wore the department shirt .
Deal with it , at least they are n't telling you how to do you job .</tokentext>
<sentencetext>I worked at a place where they had us do this.
Basically, it's an idea that the management like but nobody else cares for.
After 6 months the "mandatory" thing had stopped being enforced and after a year almost nobody wore the department shirt.
Deal with it, at least they aren't telling you how to do you job.</sentencetext>
</comment>
<comment>
	<id>http://www.semanticweb.org/ontologies/ConversationInstances.owl#comment09_12_29_2129221.30591768</id>
	<title>They're getting lost</title>
	<author>El Loro Narcotizado</author>
	<datestamp>1259839080000</datestamp>
	<modclass>None</modclass>
	<modscore>1</modscore>
	<htmltext>From what I have seen on the last decade and from what I can predict, the problem with our current economic, financial and political models is that they are failing. This happens mainly not because of workers' competence, but rather because of incompetent leadership. This condition gets worse from day to day and they (our bosses) know it. In some cases, our competence is grater than theirs and they know it. They have no capacity to solve financial, strategic or even human problem inhouse, so they panic and ultimately take bad decisions such as the one reported in this article.</htmltext>
<tokenext>From what I have seen on the last decade and from what I can predict , the problem with our current economic , financial and political models is that they are failing .
This happens mainly not because of workers ' competence , but rather because of incompetent leadership .
This condition gets worse from day to day and they ( our bosses ) know it .
In some cases , our competence is grater than theirs and they know it .
They have no capacity to solve financial , strategic or even human problem inhouse , so they panic and ultimately take bad decisions such as the one reported in this article .</tokentext>
<sentencetext>From what I have seen on the last decade and from what I can predict, the problem with our current economic, financial and political models is that they are failing.
This happens mainly not because of workers' competence, but rather because of incompetent leadership.
This condition gets worse from day to day and they (our bosses) know it.
In some cases, our competence is grater than theirs and they know it.
They have no capacity to solve financial, strategic or even human problem inhouse, so they panic and ultimately take bad decisions such as the one reported in this article.</sentencetext>
</comment>
<comment>
	<id>http://www.semanticweb.org/ontologies/ConversationInstances.owl#comment09_12_29_2129221.30588270</id>
	<title>Re:Professionalism</title>
	<author>Anonymous</author>
	<datestamp>1262088480000</datestamp>
	<modclass>None</modclass>
	<modscore>0</modscore>
	<htmltext><p>Why would they want to lose money paying for your clothes?  They'll just automatically deduct a "uniform fee" out of each and every one of your paychecks.  Been there.</p></htmltext>
<tokenext>Why would they want to lose money paying for your clothes ?
They 'll just automatically deduct a " uniform fee " out of each and every one of your paychecks .
Been there .</tokentext>
<sentencetext>Why would they want to lose money paying for your clothes?
They'll just automatically deduct a "uniform fee" out of each and every one of your paychecks.
Been there.</sentencetext>
	<parent>http://www.semanticweb.org/ontologies/ConversationInstances.owl#comment09_12_29_2129221.30587480</parent>
</comment>
<comment>
	<id>http://www.semanticweb.org/ontologies/ConversationInstances.owl#comment09_12_29_2129221.30590830</id>
	<title>Re:Uniforms can have value to the employee too!</title>
	<author>Anonymous</author>
	<datestamp>1262111220000</datestamp>
	<modclass>None</modclass>
	<modscore>0</modscore>
	<htmltext><p>the concept of a dress code sounds like a classic case of micromanagement to me. Those who need to wear specific clothes (or require others to) just to keep a certain frame of mind are weak and insecure individuals.  Why should the culture shore them up?</p></htmltext>
<tokenext>the concept of a dress code sounds like a classic case of micromanagement to me .
Those who need to wear specific clothes ( or require others to ) just to keep a certain frame of mind are weak and insecure individuals .
Why should the culture shore them up ?</tokentext>
<sentencetext>the concept of a dress code sounds like a classic case of micromanagement to me.
Those who need to wear specific clothes (or require others to) just to keep a certain frame of mind are weak and insecure individuals.
Why should the culture shore them up?</sentencetext>
	<parent>http://www.semanticweb.org/ontologies/ConversationInstances.owl#comment09_12_29_2129221.30589276</parent>
</comment>
<comment>
	<id>http://www.semanticweb.org/ontologies/ConversationInstances.owl#comment09_12_29_2129221.30587304</id>
	<title>Optional?</title>
	<author>MrKaos</author>
	<datestamp>1262084760000</datestamp>
	<modclass>None</modclass>
	<modscore>1</modscore>
	<htmltext>think about it, free T-Shirts, no ironing. Sounds pretty good to me, why would I want to wear out my clothes.</htmltext>
<tokenext>think about it , free T-Shirts , no ironing .
Sounds pretty good to me , why would I want to wear out my clothes .</tokentext>
<sentencetext>think about it, free T-Shirts, no ironing.
Sounds pretty good to me, why would I want to wear out my clothes.</sentencetext>
</comment>
<comment>
	<id>http://www.semanticweb.org/ontologies/ConversationInstances.owl#comment09_12_29_2129221.30590056</id>
	<title>Re:30 IT people in a 500 employee company?!</title>
	<author>Anonymous</author>
	<datestamp>1262102220000</datestamp>
	<modclass>None</modclass>
	<modscore>0</modscore>
	<htmltext><p>A) Your users aren't idiots</p><p>B) You're being overworked and don't realize it</p><p>C) Some of the above</p><p>D) All of the Above</p><p>E) CowboyNeal</p></htmltext>
<tokenext>A ) Your users are n't idiotsB ) You 're being overworked and do n't realize itC ) Some of the aboveD ) All of the AboveE ) CowboyNeal</tokentext>
<sentencetext>A) Your users aren't idiotsB) You're being overworked and don't realize itC) Some of the aboveD) All of the AboveE) CowboyNeal</sentencetext>
	<parent>http://www.semanticweb.org/ontologies/ConversationInstances.owl#comment09_12_29_2129221.30587272</parent>
</comment>
<comment>
	<id>http://www.semanticweb.org/ontologies/ConversationInstances.owl#comment09_12_29_2129221.30587500</id>
	<title>It's Wrong</title>
	<author>b4upoo</author>
	<datestamp>1262085360000</datestamp>
	<modclass>None</modclass>
	<modscore>1</modscore>
	<htmltext><p>      Quite a few workers hate uniforms and if it is in a situation where creative thinking is involved you can bet that many, good, potential employees will refuse to work there.</p></htmltext>
<tokenext>Quite a few workers hate uniforms and if it is in a situation where creative thinking is involved you can bet that many , good , potential employees will refuse to work there .</tokentext>
<sentencetext>      Quite a few workers hate uniforms and if it is in a situation where creative thinking is involved you can bet that many, good, potential employees will refuse to work there.</sentencetext>
</comment>
<comment>
	<id>http://www.semanticweb.org/ontologies/ConversationInstances.owl#comment09_12_29_2129221.30588794</id>
	<title>Re:Well...</title>
	<author>brian.stinar</author>
	<datestamp>1262091240000</datestamp>
	<modclass>None</modclass>
	<modscore>1</modscore>
	<htmltext><p>Are you kidding? 40k USD per year for that job in *AFRICAN COUNTRY RUN BY A DICTATOR* is amazing! He has three cars, two drivers, six maids, two chefs, a butler, a 15,000 square foot mansion, a private army AND parties out with *DICTATOR* on the weekends. Don't you remember the scene from Eurotrip in Eastern Europe?</p><p>Movie Name: EuroTrip (2004)<br>Quote:</p><p>Waiter: [Scottie tosses the waiter a nickel] Ah! A nickel! [waiter<br>
&nbsp; &nbsp; shows his manager] You see this? [slaps the manager] I quit. I open<br>
&nbsp; &nbsp; my own hotel.</p><p>When I went to Costa Rica, I bought three bananas for 1.25 cents (1 + 1/4 cents, not dollars). Costa Rica is rich for Central America, and is an agricultural power house, but that's still REALLY cheap. It all depends on the location, and possibly in this case, the exaggeration.</p><p>
&nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; -Brian J. Stinar-</p><p>*This post has been edited for content to avoid offending any specific Africans living in countries run by dictators, general offense is fine for humor purposes.*</p></div>
	</htmltext>
<tokenext>Are you kidding ?
40k USD per year for that job in * AFRICAN COUNTRY RUN BY A DICTATOR * is amazing !
He has three cars , two drivers , six maids , two chefs , a butler , a 15,000 square foot mansion , a private army AND parties out with * DICTATOR * on the weekends .
Do n't you remember the scene from Eurotrip in Eastern Europe ? Movie Name : EuroTrip ( 2004 ) Quote : Waiter : [ Scottie tosses the waiter a nickel ] Ah !
A nickel !
[ waiter     shows his manager ] You see this ?
[ slaps the manager ] I quit .
I open     my own hotel.When I went to Costa Rica , I bought three bananas for 1.25 cents ( 1 + 1/4 cents , not dollars ) .
Costa Rica is rich for Central America , and is an agricultural power house , but that 's still REALLY cheap .
It all depends on the location , and possibly in this case , the exaggeration .
        -Brian J. Stinar- * This post has been edited for content to avoid offending any specific Africans living in countries run by dictators , general offense is fine for humor purposes .
*</tokentext>
<sentencetext>Are you kidding?
40k USD per year for that job in *AFRICAN COUNTRY RUN BY A DICTATOR* is amazing!
He has three cars, two drivers, six maids, two chefs, a butler, a 15,000 square foot mansion, a private army AND parties out with *DICTATOR* on the weekends.
Don't you remember the scene from Eurotrip in Eastern Europe?Movie Name: EuroTrip (2004)Quote:Waiter: [Scottie tosses the waiter a nickel] Ah!
A nickel!
[waiter
    shows his manager] You see this?
[slaps the manager] I quit.
I open
    my own hotel.When I went to Costa Rica, I bought three bananas for 1.25 cents (1 + 1/4 cents, not dollars).
Costa Rica is rich for Central America, and is an agricultural power house, but that's still REALLY cheap.
It all depends on the location, and possibly in this case, the exaggeration.
        -Brian J. Stinar-*This post has been edited for content to avoid offending any specific Africans living in countries run by dictators, general offense is fine for humor purposes.
*
	</sentencetext>
	<parent>http://www.semanticweb.org/ontologies/ConversationInstances.owl#comment09_12_29_2129221.30588546</parent>
</comment>
<comment>
	<id>http://www.semanticweb.org/ontologies/ConversationInstances.owl#comment09_12_29_2129221.30587888</id>
	<title>Weapons</title>
	<author>vlm</author>
	<datestamp>1262086740000</datestamp>
	<modclass>None</modclass>
	<modscore>1</modscore>
	<htmltext><p>Most military uniforms come with either a modern pistol/rifle or a ceremonial sword.</p><p>So, do you get the BOFH shotgun or the ninja katana sword?</p></htmltext>
<tokenext>Most military uniforms come with either a modern pistol/rifle or a ceremonial sword.So , do you get the BOFH shotgun or the ninja katana sword ?</tokentext>
<sentencetext>Most military uniforms come with either a modern pistol/rifle or a ceremonial sword.So, do you get the BOFH shotgun or the ninja katana sword?</sentencetext>
</comment>
<comment>
	<id>http://www.semanticweb.org/ontologies/ConversationInstances.owl#comment09_12_29_2129221.30588664</id>
	<title>Could be worse, you could be required to wear ties</title>
	<author>fuzzylollipop</author>
	<datestamp>1262090580000</datestamp>
	<modclass>None</modclass>
	<modscore>1</modscore>
	<htmltext>It could be much much worse, as in having to wear dress shirts and ties and shiny shoes and dress pants. I think you are getting off easy.</htmltext>
<tokenext>It could be much much worse , as in having to wear dress shirts and ties and shiny shoes and dress pants .
I think you are getting off easy .</tokentext>
<sentencetext>It could be much much worse, as in having to wear dress shirts and ties and shiny shoes and dress pants.
I think you are getting off easy.</sentencetext>
</comment>
<comment>
	<id>http://www.semanticweb.org/ontologies/ConversationInstances.owl#comment09_12_29_2129221.30592188</id>
	<title>Douche bags</title>
	<author>pyster</author>
	<datestamp>1259846760000</datestamp>
	<modclass>None</modclass>
	<modscore>1</modscore>
	<htmltext>This is the kinda douche bag move companies do that piss of their underpaid employees. Want them to dress nicer? Pay them more. Want them to do a good job? Implement training. Want them to 'wear a uniform'? Just pass out free shirts with the logo. Polo, t shits, and button downs. And dont be afraid of the colour black. Dont make i mandatory to wear them... but they were free... Chances are they will wear them without feeling shit upon.</htmltext>
<tokenext>This is the kinda douche bag move companies do that piss of their underpaid employees .
Want them to dress nicer ?
Pay them more .
Want them to do a good job ?
Implement training .
Want them to 'wear a uniform ' ?
Just pass out free shirts with the logo .
Polo , t shits , and button downs .
And dont be afraid of the colour black .
Dont make i mandatory to wear them... but they were free... Chances are they will wear them without feeling shit upon .</tokentext>
<sentencetext>This is the kinda douche bag move companies do that piss of their underpaid employees.
Want them to dress nicer?
Pay them more.
Want them to do a good job?
Implement training.
Want them to 'wear a uniform'?
Just pass out free shirts with the logo.
Polo, t shits, and button downs.
And dont be afraid of the colour black.
Dont make i mandatory to wear them... but they were free... Chances are they will wear them without feeling shit upon.</sentencetext>
</comment>
<comment>
	<id>http://www.semanticweb.org/ontologies/ConversationInstances.owl#comment09_12_29_2129221.30590290</id>
	<title>Re:Other Roles Would Be Good Too</title>
	<author>Genda</author>
	<datestamp>1262104740000</datestamp>
	<modclass>None</modclass>
	<modscore>1</modscore>
	<htmltext><p>Ooooo... Oooooo... I wanna be the first to carve an "L" into a lawyer!!!</p></htmltext>
<tokenext>Ooooo... Oooooo... I wan na be the first to carve an " L " into a lawyer ! !
!</tokentext>
<sentencetext>Ooooo... Oooooo... I wanna be the first to carve an "L" into a lawyer!!
!</sentencetext>
	<parent>http://www.semanticweb.org/ontologies/ConversationInstances.owl#comment09_12_29_2129221.30587132</parent>
</comment>
<comment>
	<id>http://www.semanticweb.org/ontologies/ConversationInstances.owl#comment09_12_29_2129221.30588632</id>
	<title>Re:Nothing wrong with the idea</title>
	<author>WidescreenFreak</author>
	<datestamp>1262090400000</datestamp>
	<modclass>None</modclass>
	<modscore>1</modscore>
	<htmltext>And how exactly do those shirt even matter if almost all of the communication is over e-mail or the phone where no one is going to even SEE the damned shirt?
<br> <br>
Uniforms for IT is a ludicrous requirement, held in high standards only by those who think that we need to be back in the 1980s working for IBM.</htmltext>
<tokenext>And how exactly do those shirt even matter if almost all of the communication is over e-mail or the phone where no one is going to even SEE the damned shirt ?
Uniforms for IT is a ludicrous requirement , held in high standards only by those who think that we need to be back in the 1980s working for IBM .</tokentext>
<sentencetext>And how exactly do those shirt even matter if almost all of the communication is over e-mail or the phone where no one is going to even SEE the damned shirt?
Uniforms for IT is a ludicrous requirement, held in high standards only by those who think that we need to be back in the 1980s working for IBM.</sentencetext>
	<parent>http://www.semanticweb.org/ontologies/ConversationInstances.owl#comment09_12_29_2129221.30587138</parent>
</comment>
<comment>
	<id>http://www.semanticweb.org/ontologies/ConversationInstances.owl#comment09_12_29_2129221.30590968</id>
	<title>Re:I like uniforms</title>
	<author>kilodelta</author>
	<datestamp>1262113680000</datestamp>
	<modclass>None</modclass>
	<modscore>1</modscore>
	<htmltext>When I worked in the IT support unit for the Alumni &amp; Development unit of Brown University we pushed the non-existent dress code. A t-shirt and shorts worked.</htmltext>
<tokenext>When I worked in the IT support unit for the Alumni &amp; Development unit of Brown University we pushed the non-existent dress code .
A t-shirt and shorts worked .</tokentext>
<sentencetext>When I worked in the IT support unit for the Alumni &amp; Development unit of Brown University we pushed the non-existent dress code.
A t-shirt and shorts worked.</sentencetext>
	<parent>http://www.semanticweb.org/ontologies/ConversationInstances.owl#comment09_12_29_2129221.30587120</parent>
</comment>
<comment>
	<id>http://www.semanticweb.org/ontologies/ConversationInstances.owl#comment09_12_29_2129221.30590376</id>
	<title>Depends on your situation</title>
	<author>ccktech</author>
	<datestamp>1262105700000</datestamp>
	<modclass>None</modclass>
	<modscore>1</modscore>
	<htmltext>My helpdesk decided on their own to wear flourescent vents that highway workers wear.  They wanted to as part of a rollout of a new knowledge  base system for the employees and as a way to let people know who they are.  Results seem to be pretty good so far as when they go somewhere we get more of the hallway conversations that are really useful rather than just being some random unknown person in the building.</htmltext>
<tokenext>My helpdesk decided on their own to wear flourescent vents that highway workers wear .
They wanted to as part of a rollout of a new knowledge base system for the employees and as a way to let people know who they are .
Results seem to be pretty good so far as when they go somewhere we get more of the hallway conversations that are really useful rather than just being some random unknown person in the building .</tokentext>
<sentencetext>My helpdesk decided on their own to wear flourescent vents that highway workers wear.
They wanted to as part of a rollout of a new knowledge  base system for the employees and as a way to let people know who they are.
Results seem to be pretty good so far as when they go somewhere we get more of the hallway conversations that are really useful rather than just being some random unknown person in the building.</sentencetext>
</comment>
<comment>
	<id>http://www.semanticweb.org/ontologies/ConversationInstances.owl#comment09_12_29_2129221.30600486</id>
	<title>Firefighters, police and ambulance workers do</title>
	<author>RonMcMahon</author>
	<datestamp>1259840520000</datestamp>
	<modclass>None</modclass>
	<modscore>1</modscore>
	<htmltext>IT is a critical part of our society and the Help Desk is like first responders (fire, police, ambulance) for other emergencies.  I work for the City of Calgary and have wondered if an IT crest-emblazoned collared shirt similar to police or fire would be helpful.  I'm not sure, but a crest with a logo / coat of arms that isn't tacky that is put together in a pseudo-military style shirt could look nice, however, given the general tendency towards pear-shaped employees in IT, this may not come off too well...and I can hear it now 'Here come the muffin-tops!'</htmltext>
<tokenext>IT is a critical part of our society and the Help Desk is like first responders ( fire , police , ambulance ) for other emergencies .
I work for the City of Calgary and have wondered if an IT crest-emblazoned collared shirt similar to police or fire would be helpful .
I 'm not sure , but a crest with a logo / coat of arms that is n't tacky that is put together in a pseudo-military style shirt could look nice , however , given the general tendency towards pear-shaped employees in IT , this may not come off too well...and I can hear it now 'Here come the muffin-tops !
'</tokentext>
<sentencetext>IT is a critical part of our society and the Help Desk is like first responders (fire, police, ambulance) for other emergencies.
I work for the City of Calgary and have wondered if an IT crest-emblazoned collared shirt similar to police or fire would be helpful.
I'm not sure, but a crest with a logo / coat of arms that isn't tacky that is put together in a pseudo-military style shirt could look nice, however, given the general tendency towards pear-shaped employees in IT, this may not come off too well...and I can hear it now 'Here come the muffin-tops!
'</sentencetext>
</comment>
<comment>
	<id>http://www.semanticweb.org/ontologies/ConversationInstances.owl#comment09_12_29_2129221.30590072</id>
	<title>Don't forget...</title>
	<author>Anonymous</author>
	<datestamp>1262102400000</datestamp>
	<modclass>None</modclass>
	<modscore>0</modscore>
	<htmltext><p>Be sure that your company gives you a uniform allowance to take care of your "uniforms". I get about $10/month to launder my uniform shirts. That's $120/year extra!</p></htmltext>
<tokenext>Be sure that your company gives you a uniform allowance to take care of your " uniforms " .
I get about $ 10/month to launder my uniform shirts .
That 's $ 120/year extra !</tokentext>
<sentencetext>Be sure that your company gives you a uniform allowance to take care of your "uniforms".
I get about $10/month to launder my uniform shirts.
That's $120/year extra!</sentencetext>
</comment>
<comment>
	<id>http://www.semanticweb.org/ontologies/ConversationInstances.owl#comment09_12_29_2129221.30588058</id>
	<title>Professional Identification is a plus</title>
	<author>Anonymous</author>
	<datestamp>1262087400000</datestamp>
	<modclass>None</modclass>
	<modscore>0</modscore>
	<htmltext><p>This could be a good thing, if everyone can agree to wear the "uniform" with pride.  If you do this, try something like lab coats, not shirts.<br>It is subtle, but think what respect Doctors command by simply marking themselves out with a white coat.  What they wear is functional,<br>but also is a signal as to who is in charge.  Likewise, the hat the drill sergeant wears is unique, and many Boy Scout leaders adopt wearing<br>a red jacket to signal who is in charge.<br>Perhaps you have noticed that private security personell will wear a distinctive blazer.</p><p>Choose a professional looking coat or jacket for your on-duty "consultants" and exhibit friendly pride in your distinct appearance.  You may<br>be pleasantly surprised at the almost instinctive respect that your uniform can cause.<br>
&nbsp;</p></htmltext>
<tokenext>This could be a good thing , if everyone can agree to wear the " uniform " with pride .
If you do this , try something like lab coats , not shirts.It is subtle , but think what respect Doctors command by simply marking themselves out with a white coat .
What they wear is functional,but also is a signal as to who is in charge .
Likewise , the hat the drill sergeant wears is unique , and many Boy Scout leaders adopt wearinga red jacket to signal who is in charge.Perhaps you have noticed that private security personell will wear a distinctive blazer.Choose a professional looking coat or jacket for your on-duty " consultants " and exhibit friendly pride in your distinct appearance .
You maybe pleasantly surprised at the almost instinctive respect that your uniform can cause .
 </tokentext>
<sentencetext>This could be a good thing, if everyone can agree to wear the "uniform" with pride.
If you do this, try something like lab coats, not shirts.It is subtle, but think what respect Doctors command by simply marking themselves out with a white coat.
What they wear is functional,but also is a signal as to who is in charge.
Likewise, the hat the drill sergeant wears is unique, and many Boy Scout leaders adopt wearinga red jacket to signal who is in charge.Perhaps you have noticed that private security personell will wear a distinctive blazer.Choose a professional looking coat or jacket for your on-duty "consultants" and exhibit friendly pride in your distinct appearance.
You maybe pleasantly surprised at the almost instinctive respect that your uniform can cause.
 </sentencetext>
</comment>
<comment>
	<id>http://www.semanticweb.org/ontologies/ConversationInstances.owl#comment09_12_29_2129221.30588618</id>
	<title>wa?</title>
	<author>Anonymous</author>
	<datestamp>1262090340000</datestamp>
	<modclass>None</modclass>
	<modscore>0</modscore>
	<htmltext><p>30 IT people for 500 staff???</p></htmltext>
<tokenext>30 IT people for 500 staff ? ?
?</tokentext>
<sentencetext>30 IT people for 500 staff??
?</sentencetext>
</comment>
<comment>
	<id>http://www.semanticweb.org/ontologies/ConversationInstances.owl#comment09_12_29_2129221.30587272</id>
	<title>30 IT people in a 500 employee company?!</title>
	<author>Anonymous</author>
	<datestamp>1262084580000</datestamp>
	<modclass>Interestin</modclass>
	<modscore>3</modscore>
	<htmltext><p>What are most of you DOING?  I work for a company with over 800 employees, approximately 600 or so who directly use computers, that has 16 locations in the Eastern USA and we make do with TWO.</p></htmltext>
<tokenext>What are most of you DOING ?
I work for a company with over 800 employees , approximately 600 or so who directly use computers , that has 16 locations in the Eastern USA and we make do with TWO .</tokentext>
<sentencetext>What are most of you DOING?
I work for a company with over 800 employees, approximately 600 or so who directly use computers, that has 16 locations in the Eastern USA and we make do with TWO.</sentencetext>
</comment>
<comment>
	<id>http://www.semanticweb.org/ontologies/ConversationInstances.owl#comment09_12_29_2129221.30588350</id>
	<title>well said</title>
	<author>Anonymous</author>
	<datestamp>1262088960000</datestamp>
	<modclass>Insightful</modclass>
	<modscore>2</modscore>
	<htmltext><p>Having a uniform takes the usage out of my own clothes. Christ the number of ruined shirts I had when I worked for EMC because of the times I ended up crawling in some crappy floor space to pull a cable through.</p><p>However we had to go onsite in suit and bloody tie. I'd have loved some 'free t shirts' - hell, give me half a dozen and that's my dad sorted for Christmas<nobr> <wbr></nobr>;)</p><p>Hell i loved School Uniform when i was a kid because I didn't have to care that I wasn't following the latest fashion.</p></htmltext>
<tokenext>Having a uniform takes the usage out of my own clothes .
Christ the number of ruined shirts I had when I worked for EMC because of the times I ended up crawling in some crappy floor space to pull a cable through.However we had to go onsite in suit and bloody tie .
I 'd have loved some 'free t shirts ' - hell , give me half a dozen and that 's my dad sorted for Christmas ; ) Hell i loved School Uniform when i was a kid because I did n't have to care that I was n't following the latest fashion .</tokentext>
<sentencetext>Having a uniform takes the usage out of my own clothes.
Christ the number of ruined shirts I had when I worked for EMC because of the times I ended up crawling in some crappy floor space to pull a cable through.However we had to go onsite in suit and bloody tie.
I'd have loved some 'free t shirts' - hell, give me half a dozen and that's my dad sorted for Christmas ;)Hell i loved School Uniform when i was a kid because I didn't have to care that I wasn't following the latest fashion.</sentencetext>
	<parent>http://www.semanticweb.org/ontologies/ConversationInstances.owl#comment09_12_29_2129221.30587480</parent>
</comment>
<comment>
	<id>http://www.semanticweb.org/ontologies/ConversationInstances.owl#comment09_12_29_2129221.30590268</id>
	<title>Re:Other Roles Would Be Good Too</title>
	<author>Anonymous</author>
	<datestamp>1262104500000</datestamp>
	<modclass>None</modclass>
	<modscore>0</modscore>
	<htmltext><p>Don't you mean BS ?</p></htmltext>
<tokenext>Do n't you mean BS ?</tokentext>
<sentencetext>Don't you mean BS ?</sentencetext>
	<parent>http://www.semanticweb.org/ontologies/ConversationInstances.owl#comment09_12_29_2129221.30587132</parent>
</comment>
<comment>
	<id>http://www.semanticweb.org/ontologies/ConversationInstances.owl#comment09_12_29_2129221.30587598</id>
	<title>Red Shirts -- Federation Engineering Color</title>
	<author>TwineLogic</author>
	<datestamp>1262085660000</datestamp>
	<modclass>None</modclass>
	<modscore>1</modscore>
	<htmltext>Per the Star Trek uniforms, you should all wear red shirts, as your function is primarily engineering.  The manager who floated this up the management chain, however, should wear a gold, V-neck, shirt.<br><br>Black pants are mandatory.  Skip the minis.<br><br>(j/k: It sounds like such a terrible idea I had to entertain the Star Trek analogy.)</htmltext>
<tokenext>Per the Star Trek uniforms , you should all wear red shirts , as your function is primarily engineering .
The manager who floated this up the management chain , however , should wear a gold , V-neck , shirt.Black pants are mandatory .
Skip the minis .
( j/k : It sounds like such a terrible idea I had to entertain the Star Trek analogy .
)</tokentext>
<sentencetext>Per the Star Trek uniforms, you should all wear red shirts, as your function is primarily engineering.
The manager who floated this up the management chain, however, should wear a gold, V-neck, shirt.Black pants are mandatory.
Skip the minis.
(j/k: It sounds like such a terrible idea I had to entertain the Star Trek analogy.
)</sentencetext>
</comment>
<comment>
	<id>http://www.semanticweb.org/ontologies/ConversationInstances.owl#comment09_12_29_2129221.30587854</id>
	<title>That's the whole reason I voted for Obama!</title>
	<author>mujadaddy</author>
	<datestamp>1262086620000</datestamp>
	<modclass>None</modclass>
	<modscore>1</modscore>
	<htmltext>These Help Desk people should feel privileged that they're amongst the first to receive the long-awaited and apparently over-promised beasts of legend! Think how majestic they'll appear as they make their way from tech emergency to tech emergency, astride the most resplendent beast in all of history!<br> <br>
Wait, what?</htmltext>
<tokenext>These Help Desk people should feel privileged that they 're amongst the first to receive the long-awaited and apparently over-promised beasts of legend !
Think how majestic they 'll appear as they make their way from tech emergency to tech emergency , astride the most resplendent beast in all of history !
Wait , what ?</tokentext>
<sentencetext>These Help Desk people should feel privileged that they're amongst the first to receive the long-awaited and apparently over-promised beasts of legend!
Think how majestic they'll appear as they make their way from tech emergency to tech emergency, astride the most resplendent beast in all of history!
Wait, what?</sentencetext>
</comment>
<comment>
	<id>http://www.semanticweb.org/ontologies/ConversationInstances.owl#comment09_12_29_2129221.30587164</id>
	<title>Depends on the current atmosphere</title>
	<author>alanmusician</author>
	<datestamp>1262084220000</datestamp>
	<modclass>None</modclass>
	<modscore>1</modscore>
	<htmltext>Our IT staff has the option of wearing a uniform, which is provided by the company for off-site work, and they have taken to wearing it Monday-Friday even though it's not required. They do this for the reasons that you mentioned. I don't think your IT staff is going to mind unless they're already harassed by bureaucracy. If that is the case, they'll probably take it as a fascist move. It probably won't do anything to change the atmosphere unless you've got problems with the atmosphere already.</htmltext>
<tokenext>Our IT staff has the option of wearing a uniform , which is provided by the company for off-site work , and they have taken to wearing it Monday-Friday even though it 's not required .
They do this for the reasons that you mentioned .
I do n't think your IT staff is going to mind unless they 're already harassed by bureaucracy .
If that is the case , they 'll probably take it as a fascist move .
It probably wo n't do anything to change the atmosphere unless you 've got problems with the atmosphere already .</tokentext>
<sentencetext>Our IT staff has the option of wearing a uniform, which is provided by the company for off-site work, and they have taken to wearing it Monday-Friday even though it's not required.
They do this for the reasons that you mentioned.
I don't think your IT staff is going to mind unless they're already harassed by bureaucracy.
If that is the case, they'll probably take it as a fascist move.
It probably won't do anything to change the atmosphere unless you've got problems with the atmosphere already.</sentencetext>
</comment>
<comment>
	<id>http://www.semanticweb.org/ontologies/ConversationInstances.owl#comment09_12_29_2129221.30587746</id>
	<title>What's the difference....</title>
	<author>Jim Robinson Jr.</author>
	<datestamp>1262086200000</datestamp>
	<modclass>None</modclass>
	<modscore>1</modscore>
	<htmltext><p>Like most people who work in or around IT I've got a closet full of give-away shirts. T-shits, polo's, and yes... dress-shirts.... all emblazoned with some company's pitch and all screaming "hey everyone... I work in IT". Don't laugh before you check your own wardrobe.</p><p>Have you ever worn one of these to work? Even once? If so, what's the difference? If you are willing to advertise another company's brand why shouldn't you be willing to wear your company's logo?</p><p>Of course, this is predicated on the idea that the "uniforms" in question are tasteful, button-down, collared shirts in a non-neon color and intended to be worn with your existing dress slacks. If you would wear it in public, then it shouldn't matter. As someone else has already pointed out it can be liberating to have a limited wardrobe to select from and financially beneficial to have someone else pay for it. If, however, you would NOT wear this in public, you have a very different decision to make.</p></htmltext>
<tokenext>Like most people who work in or around IT I 've got a closet full of give-away shirts .
T-shits , polo 's , and yes... dress-shirts.... all emblazoned with some company 's pitch and all screaming " hey everyone... I work in IT " .
Do n't laugh before you check your own wardrobe.Have you ever worn one of these to work ?
Even once ?
If so , what 's the difference ?
If you are willing to advertise another company 's brand why should n't you be willing to wear your company 's logo ? Of course , this is predicated on the idea that the " uniforms " in question are tasteful , button-down , collared shirts in a non-neon color and intended to be worn with your existing dress slacks .
If you would wear it in public , then it should n't matter .
As someone else has already pointed out it can be liberating to have a limited wardrobe to select from and financially beneficial to have someone else pay for it .
If , however , you would NOT wear this in public , you have a very different decision to make .</tokentext>
<sentencetext>Like most people who work in or around IT I've got a closet full of give-away shirts.
T-shits, polo's, and yes... dress-shirts.... all emblazoned with some company's pitch and all screaming "hey everyone... I work in IT".
Don't laugh before you check your own wardrobe.Have you ever worn one of these to work?
Even once?
If so, what's the difference?
If you are willing to advertise another company's brand why shouldn't you be willing to wear your company's logo?Of course, this is predicated on the idea that the "uniforms" in question are tasteful, button-down, collared shirts in a non-neon color and intended to be worn with your existing dress slacks.
If you would wear it in public, then it shouldn't matter.
As someone else has already pointed out it can be liberating to have a limited wardrobe to select from and financially beneficial to have someone else pay for it.
If, however, you would NOT wear this in public, you have a very different decision to make.</sentencetext>
</comment>
<comment>
	<id>http://www.semanticweb.org/ontologies/ConversationInstances.owl#comment09_12_29_2129221.30587446</id>
	<title>Will the shirts say</title>
	<author>Anonymous</author>
	<datestamp>1262085180000</datestamp>
	<modclass>None</modclass>
	<modscore>0</modscore>
	<htmltext><p>Geek Squad?</p></htmltext>
<tokenext>Geek Squad ?</tokentext>
<sentencetext>Geek Squad?</sentencetext>
</comment>
<comment>
	<id>http://www.semanticweb.org/ontologies/ConversationInstances.owl#comment09_12_29_2129221.30596504</id>
	<title>British Maid Outfit preferred by IT professionals</title>
	<author>strangeattraction</author>
	<datestamp>1259865540000</datestamp>
	<modclass>Funny</modclass>
	<modscore>2</modscore>
	<htmltext>Most IT professionals have adopted the British Maid outfit for the help desk, Norge repairman butt crack pants for the techs and Bondage Mistress for the CIO.</htmltext>
<tokenext>Most IT professionals have adopted the British Maid outfit for the help desk , Norge repairman butt crack pants for the techs and Bondage Mistress for the CIO .</tokentext>
<sentencetext>Most IT professionals have adopted the British Maid outfit for the help desk, Norge repairman butt crack pants for the techs and Bondage Mistress for the CIO.</sentencetext>
</comment>
<comment>
	<id>http://www.semanticweb.org/ontologies/ConversationInstances.owl#comment09_12_29_2129221.30587666</id>
	<title>Why bother asking?</title>
	<author>spoggle</author>
	<datestamp>1262085900000</datestamp>
	<modclass>None</modclass>
	<modscore>1</modscore>
	<htmltext><p>Just the tone of the way you asked this question seems to indicate that you've already made up your mind that it's a bad thing and you're just for fuel for your own feelings.</p><p>I think it helps promote the feeling of being a team provided the majority on board with the idea.  I once worked for a company that made it clear that they wanted to close my group down.  We got summoned to the headquarters, but before we went I offered to have some polo shirts made up for my team - we all wore them to the meetings as a symbol of unity and my boss freaked. That's long in the past now, but we all still remember those shirts.</p></htmltext>
<tokenext>Just the tone of the way you asked this question seems to indicate that you 've already made up your mind that it 's a bad thing and you 're just for fuel for your own feelings.I think it helps promote the feeling of being a team provided the majority on board with the idea .
I once worked for a company that made it clear that they wanted to close my group down .
We got summoned to the headquarters , but before we went I offered to have some polo shirts made up for my team - we all wore them to the meetings as a symbol of unity and my boss freaked .
That 's long in the past now , but we all still remember those shirts .</tokentext>
<sentencetext>Just the tone of the way you asked this question seems to indicate that you've already made up your mind that it's a bad thing and you're just for fuel for your own feelings.I think it helps promote the feeling of being a team provided the majority on board with the idea.
I once worked for a company that made it clear that they wanted to close my group down.
We got summoned to the headquarters, but before we went I offered to have some polo shirts made up for my team - we all wore them to the meetings as a symbol of unity and my boss freaked.
That's long in the past now, but we all still remember those shirts.</sentencetext>
</comment>
<comment>
	<id>http://www.semanticweb.org/ontologies/ConversationInstances.owl#comment09_12_29_2129221.30590562</id>
	<title>Re:How is a uniform unprofessional?</title>
	<author>pclminion</author>
	<datestamp>1262107800000</datestamp>
	<modclass>None</modclass>
	<modscore>1</modscore>
	<htmltext>In every single one of those examples, the uniform serves a utilitarian FUNCTION. A doctor wears clothing which is easy to clean and makes it easy to see when it's contaminated with something (e.g. blood). A mechanic wears something that he doesn't mind getting covered in grease. A police officer wears something that makes him instantly recognizable as a legal authority figure, and it also gives him a place to hang or attach all of the equipment he carries. And do I really need to explain why a fireman needs a uniform?</htmltext>
<tokenext>In every single one of those examples , the uniform serves a utilitarian FUNCTION .
A doctor wears clothing which is easy to clean and makes it easy to see when it 's contaminated with something ( e.g .
blood ) . A mechanic wears something that he does n't mind getting covered in grease .
A police officer wears something that makes him instantly recognizable as a legal authority figure , and it also gives him a place to hang or attach all of the equipment he carries .
And do I really need to explain why a fireman needs a uniform ?</tokentext>
<sentencetext>In every single one of those examples, the uniform serves a utilitarian FUNCTION.
A doctor wears clothing which is easy to clean and makes it easy to see when it's contaminated with something (e.g.
blood). A mechanic wears something that he doesn't mind getting covered in grease.
A police officer wears something that makes him instantly recognizable as a legal authority figure, and it also gives him a place to hang or attach all of the equipment he carries.
And do I really need to explain why a fireman needs a uniform?</sentencetext>
	<parent>http://www.semanticweb.org/ontologies/ConversationInstances.owl#comment09_12_29_2129221.30588048</parent>
</comment>
<comment>
	<id>http://www.semanticweb.org/ontologies/ConversationInstances.owl#comment09_12_29_2129221.30590154</id>
	<title>Re:30 IT people in a 500 employee company?!</title>
	<author>Anonymous</author>
	<datestamp>1262103180000</datestamp>
	<modclass>None</modclass>
	<modscore>0</modscore>
	<htmltext><p>That's a pretty high risk way to run a business. What happens to your business if the network goes down in 2 locations while one IT employee is away on leave or if one gets ill? Better yet, what happens when both decide to leave due to the amount of pressure upon their shoulders?<br>Also, 30 + IT staff isn't a large number if the business itself is IT based. I guess it comes down to what is more profitable for your business.. sending 800 staff home for a day (or longer) or employing more staff to look after the veins of your business?</p></htmltext>
<tokenext>That 's a pretty high risk way to run a business .
What happens to your business if the network goes down in 2 locations while one IT employee is away on leave or if one gets ill ?
Better yet , what happens when both decide to leave due to the amount of pressure upon their shoulders ? Also , 30 + IT staff is n't a large number if the business itself is IT based .
I guess it comes down to what is more profitable for your business.. sending 800 staff home for a day ( or longer ) or employing more staff to look after the veins of your business ?</tokentext>
<sentencetext>That's a pretty high risk way to run a business.
What happens to your business if the network goes down in 2 locations while one IT employee is away on leave or if one gets ill?
Better yet, what happens when both decide to leave due to the amount of pressure upon their shoulders?Also, 30 + IT staff isn't a large number if the business itself is IT based.
I guess it comes down to what is more profitable for your business.. sending 800 staff home for a day (or longer) or employing more staff to look after the veins of your business?</sentencetext>
	<parent>http://www.semanticweb.org/ontologies/ConversationInstances.owl#comment09_12_29_2129221.30587272</parent>
</comment>
<comment>
	<id>http://www.semanticweb.org/ontologies/ConversationInstances.owl#comment09_12_29_2129221.30590350</id>
	<title>The IT Dept should be able to choose its uniforms</title>
	<author>Anonymous</author>
	<datestamp>1262105400000</datestamp>
	<modclass>Funny</modclass>
	<modscore>3</modscore>
	<htmltext>Original Series, NextGen, DSN or Voyager.

Seems reasonable to me.</htmltext>
<tokenext>Original Series , NextGen , DSN or Voyager .
Seems reasonable to me .</tokentext>
<sentencetext>Original Series, NextGen, DSN or Voyager.
Seems reasonable to me.</sentencetext>
</comment>
<comment>
	<id>http://www.semanticweb.org/ontologies/ConversationInstances.owl#comment09_12_29_2129221.30587896</id>
	<title>beat them at their game</title>
	<author>frovingslosh</author>
	<datestamp>1262086740000</datestamp>
	<modclass>None</modclass>
	<modscore>1</modscore>
	<htmltext>I certainly wouldn't like being in the position of having to wear on of the red shirts. Does a real number on your choice of wardrobe too. Here is my suggestion: before the pronouncement comes down, get the help desk (and maybe even everyone in the IT department) an inexpensive lab coat. These can be purchased cheaply from most uniform supply companies. Add a company logo if you wish and there is a budget for it. People can continue to dress as they see fit, and wear their lab coat over their choice of clothing when doing help desk stuff. It can even be very handy if help desk stuff includes crawling around under desks looking for that lost cable and such or working on a computer with a fresh litter of dust bunnies. But your staff can still take the lab coats off and go to lunch without looking like some geek squad rejects.</htmltext>
<tokenext>I certainly would n't like being in the position of having to wear on of the red shirts .
Does a real number on your choice of wardrobe too .
Here is my suggestion : before the pronouncement comes down , get the help desk ( and maybe even everyone in the IT department ) an inexpensive lab coat .
These can be purchased cheaply from most uniform supply companies .
Add a company logo if you wish and there is a budget for it .
People can continue to dress as they see fit , and wear their lab coat over their choice of clothing when doing help desk stuff .
It can even be very handy if help desk stuff includes crawling around under desks looking for that lost cable and such or working on a computer with a fresh litter of dust bunnies .
But your staff can still take the lab coats off and go to lunch without looking like some geek squad rejects .</tokentext>
<sentencetext>I certainly wouldn't like being in the position of having to wear on of the red shirts.
Does a real number on your choice of wardrobe too.
Here is my suggestion: before the pronouncement comes down, get the help desk (and maybe even everyone in the IT department) an inexpensive lab coat.
These can be purchased cheaply from most uniform supply companies.
Add a company logo if you wish and there is a budget for it.
People can continue to dress as they see fit, and wear their lab coat over their choice of clothing when doing help desk stuff.
It can even be very handy if help desk stuff includes crawling around under desks looking for that lost cable and such or working on a computer with a fresh litter of dust bunnies.
But your staff can still take the lab coats off and go to lunch without looking like some geek squad rejects.</sentencetext>
</comment>
<comment>
	<id>http://www.semanticweb.org/ontologies/ConversationInstances.owl#comment09_12_29_2129221.30602072</id>
	<title>Hoodies as an option</title>
	<author>monk01</author>
	<datestamp>1259852880000</datestamp>
	<modclass>None</modclass>
	<modscore>1</modscore>
	<htmltext>How about allowing hoodies or hooded sweatshirts as one choice for helpdesk uniform. These hoodies can have the company name and job title silkscreened on them.


Hoodies are popular with with college students and when I was in college, I liked wearing my college hoodie. Even after graduation, I still like wearing them.


Of course if the weather gets warm, regular or polo shirts can be one of the choices.</htmltext>
<tokenext>How about allowing hoodies or hooded sweatshirts as one choice for helpdesk uniform .
These hoodies can have the company name and job title silkscreened on them .
Hoodies are popular with with college students and when I was in college , I liked wearing my college hoodie .
Even after graduation , I still like wearing them .
Of course if the weather gets warm , regular or polo shirts can be one of the choices .</tokentext>
<sentencetext>How about allowing hoodies or hooded sweatshirts as one choice for helpdesk uniform.
These hoodies can have the company name and job title silkscreened on them.
Hoodies are popular with with college students and when I was in college, I liked wearing my college hoodie.
Even after graduation, I still like wearing them.
Of course if the weather gets warm, regular or polo shirts can be one of the choices.</sentencetext>
</comment>
<comment>
	<id>http://www.semanticweb.org/ontologies/ConversationInstances.owl#comment09_12_29_2129221.30589332</id>
	<title>Uniforms in IT??</title>
	<author>Anonymous</author>
	<datestamp>1262095440000</datestamp>
	<modclass>Funny</modclass>
	<modscore>1</modscore>
	<htmltext><p>Ive worn uniforms in many IT Jobs as System Integrator as even as Senior Network Analyst, it is good for support staff who have to get under desks and get dirty around comms cabinets, it gave me a feeling of pride and also its a good excuse to increase what little power IT departments usuall have in an organization, now im working for a Government body its uniforms all the way....</p><p>You could always buy your staff the "No I will not fix your computer t-shirts.."</p></htmltext>
<tokenext>Ive worn uniforms in many IT Jobs as System Integrator as even as Senior Network Analyst , it is good for support staff who have to get under desks and get dirty around comms cabinets , it gave me a feeling of pride and also its a good excuse to increase what little power IT departments usuall have in an organization , now im working for a Government body its uniforms all the way....You could always buy your staff the " No I will not fix your computer t-shirts.. "</tokentext>
<sentencetext>Ive worn uniforms in many IT Jobs as System Integrator as even as Senior Network Analyst, it is good for support staff who have to get under desks and get dirty around comms cabinets, it gave me a feeling of pride and also its a good excuse to increase what little power IT departments usuall have in an organization, now im working for a Government body its uniforms all the way....You could always buy your staff the "No I will not fix your computer t-shirts.."</sentencetext>
</comment>
<comment>
	<id>http://www.semanticweb.org/ontologies/ConversationInstances.owl#comment09_12_29_2129221.30587462</id>
	<title>Re:Well...</title>
	<author>Anonymous</author>
	<datestamp>1262085240000</datestamp>
	<modclass>Insightful</modclass>
	<modscore>5</modscore>
	<htmltext>Funny, but my company did just mandate blaze orange shirts for all front line IT staff.  I can't for the life of me figure out who thought that was a good idea.

Mine comes in Monday.

We can also wear Navy.  I think I'm going to get an equal number of pairs of blaze orange and navy pants and alternate them daily.

Personally, I find it extremely condescending.  I'm required to design and maintain hundreds of databases, several servers, write apps, troubleshoot network problems, manage million dollar projects, AND do desktop support for 2000 devices with 3 other IT people for $40K/year.  And now this.  No wonder I've thrown my hands up today and am now posting on slashdot.

Yes, I'm looking for a way out.</htmltext>
<tokenext>Funny , but my company did just mandate blaze orange shirts for all front line IT staff .
I ca n't for the life of me figure out who thought that was a good idea .
Mine comes in Monday .
We can also wear Navy .
I think I 'm going to get an equal number of pairs of blaze orange and navy pants and alternate them daily .
Personally , I find it extremely condescending .
I 'm required to design and maintain hundreds of databases , several servers , write apps , troubleshoot network problems , manage million dollar projects , AND do desktop support for 2000 devices with 3 other IT people for $ 40K/year .
And now this .
No wonder I 've thrown my hands up today and am now posting on slashdot .
Yes , I 'm looking for a way out .</tokentext>
<sentencetext>Funny, but my company did just mandate blaze orange shirts for all front line IT staff.
I can't for the life of me figure out who thought that was a good idea.
Mine comes in Monday.
We can also wear Navy.
I think I'm going to get an equal number of pairs of blaze orange and navy pants and alternate them daily.
Personally, I find it extremely condescending.
I'm required to design and maintain hundreds of databases, several servers, write apps, troubleshoot network problems, manage million dollar projects, AND do desktop support for 2000 devices with 3 other IT people for $40K/year.
And now this.
No wonder I've thrown my hands up today and am now posting on slashdot.
Yes, I'm looking for a way out.</sentencetext>
	<parent>http://www.semanticweb.org/ontologies/ConversationInstances.owl#comment09_12_29_2129221.30587090</parent>
</comment>
<comment>
	<id>http://www.semanticweb.org/ontologies/ConversationInstances.owl#comment09_12_29_2129221.30587788</id>
	<title>Are the shirts for -</title>
	<author>DontScotty</author>
	<datestamp>1262086320000</datestamp>
	<modclass>None</modclass>
	<modscore>0</modscore>
	<htmltext><p>Desk side techs?  Or Helpdesk (aka Phone and E-mail Support) techs?</p><p>As long as management provides 1 shirt for each day of the week, plus a backup - then it shouldn't be a problem.</p><p>Usually - techs that provide desk side support and are not direct employees of the company receiving services wear shirts with their company name.  This makes sure they aren't stealing soda's or ink pens and paper.</p><p>VERY IMPORTANT, ya know...</p></htmltext>
<tokenext>Desk side techs ?
Or Helpdesk ( aka Phone and E-mail Support ) techs ? As long as management provides 1 shirt for each day of the week , plus a backup - then it should n't be a problem.Usually - techs that provide desk side support and are not direct employees of the company receiving services wear shirts with their company name .
This makes sure they are n't stealing soda 's or ink pens and paper.VERY IMPORTANT , ya know.. .</tokentext>
<sentencetext>Desk side techs?
Or Helpdesk (aka Phone and E-mail Support) techs?As long as management provides 1 shirt for each day of the week, plus a backup - then it shouldn't be a problem.Usually - techs that provide desk side support and are not direct employees of the company receiving services wear shirts with their company name.
This makes sure they aren't stealing soda's or ink pens and paper.VERY IMPORTANT, ya know...</sentencetext>
</comment>
<comment>
	<id>http://www.semanticweb.org/ontologies/ConversationInstances.owl#comment09_12_29_2129221.30587658</id>
	<title>A variety of (polo?) shirts, not uniforms!</title>
	<author>Anonymous</author>
	<datestamp>1262085840000</datestamp>
	<modclass>None</modclass>
	<modscore>0</modscore>
	<htmltext>Couple of things... They're SHIRTS (I assume Polo Shirts), not coveralls or uniforms... and the OP said a variety of colors...

If the help desk staff actually makes house calls (cube calls?), then I'd say definitely YES, wear em! Create a sense of team, identifiable to others. These are not military uniforms.

Even if phone based, free shirts don't suck.</htmltext>
<tokenext>Couple of things... They 're SHIRTS ( I assume Polo Shirts ) , not coveralls or uniforms... and the OP said a variety of colors.. . If the help desk staff actually makes house calls ( cube calls ?
) , then I 'd say definitely YES , wear em !
Create a sense of team , identifiable to others .
These are not military uniforms .
Even if phone based , free shirts do n't suck .</tokentext>
<sentencetext>Couple of things... They're SHIRTS (I assume Polo Shirts), not coveralls or uniforms... and the OP said a variety of colors...

If the help desk staff actually makes house calls (cube calls?
), then I'd say definitely YES, wear em!
Create a sense of team, identifiable to others.
These are not military uniforms.
Even if phone based, free shirts don't suck.</sentencetext>
</comment>
<comment>
	<id>http://www.semanticweb.org/ontologies/ConversationInstances.owl#comment09_12_29_2129221.30588196</id>
	<title>Re:Nothing wrong with the idea</title>
	<author>oatworm</author>
	<datestamp>1262088120000</datestamp>
	<modclass>None</modclass>
	<modscore>1</modscore>
	<htmltext>It depends on what kind of problems you're running into.  If you're letting your best people spend their day answering questions like, "Where did the blue W go on my desktop?!", they're probably not putting their skills to the best use possible.  Having some entry-level drones at the bottom of the org chart that can answer simple questions like that does have value, both for the organization and for the rest of the IT department.  That said, you need to make sure those drones are competent <em>enough</em> to actually answer those simple questions and, just as importantly, when to throw it above their pay grade.</htmltext>
<tokenext>It depends on what kind of problems you 're running into .
If you 're letting your best people spend their day answering questions like , " Where did the blue W go on my desktop ? !
" , they 're probably not putting their skills to the best use possible .
Having some entry-level drones at the bottom of the org chart that can answer simple questions like that does have value , both for the organization and for the rest of the IT department .
That said , you need to make sure those drones are competent enough to actually answer those simple questions and , just as importantly , when to throw it above their pay grade .</tokentext>
<sentencetext>It depends on what kind of problems you're running into.
If you're letting your best people spend their day answering questions like, "Where did the blue W go on my desktop?!
", they're probably not putting their skills to the best use possible.
Having some entry-level drones at the bottom of the org chart that can answer simple questions like that does have value, both for the organization and for the rest of the IT department.
That said, you need to make sure those drones are competent enough to actually answer those simple questions and, just as importantly, when to throw it above their pay grade.</sentencetext>
	<parent>http://www.semanticweb.org/ontologies/ConversationInstances.owl#comment09_12_29_2129221.30587718</parent>
</comment>
<comment>
	<id>http://www.semanticweb.org/ontologies/ConversationInstances.owl#comment09_12_29_2129221.30587406</id>
	<title>Silly management</title>
	<author>Anonymous</author>
	<datestamp>1262085000000</datestamp>
	<modclass>Interestin</modclass>
	<modscore>3</modscore>
	<htmltext>This is what happens as the company grows<br>It goes Dilbert on itself.<br>This is what happens when people too stupid to do any real work and who've been replaced by a bash script gets promoted to middle management because you can't get rid of them due to union rules and stuff.<br>You know how they got the management position? A: The parkinson law : Upper management doesn't want their job threatened by a younger, smarter, more active, more educated middle manager, so they promote somebody dumber then themselves and the guy under hires some1 dumber then himself and so on<nobr> <wbr></nobr>.....<br> <br>Uniforms is lack a respect for you tech support guys, uniform is a school's tool to reduce violence and bullying by unifying every1 thus eliminating gangs and groups. It's not for a job place, it's a joke to think about it, if they had respect, they would ask you to wear a suit and a tie, but then you would be in par with ur middle management guy, he is not gonna put you on that level, he is also prolly afraid that you'll write another bash script to replace the middle management positions.<br> <br> <br>Hey while I think of it, a script that creates and assigns random useless task and complains a lot could replace my boss.</htmltext>
<tokenext>This is what happens as the company growsIt goes Dilbert on itself.This is what happens when people too stupid to do any real work and who 've been replaced by a bash script gets promoted to middle management because you ca n't get rid of them due to union rules and stuff.You know how they got the management position ?
A : The parkinson law : Upper management does n't want their job threatened by a younger , smarter , more active , more educated middle manager , so they promote somebody dumber then themselves and the guy under hires some1 dumber then himself and so on ..... Uniforms is lack a respect for you tech support guys , uniform is a school 's tool to reduce violence and bullying by unifying every1 thus eliminating gangs and groups .
It 's not for a job place , it 's a joke to think about it , if they had respect , they would ask you to wear a suit and a tie , but then you would be in par with ur middle management guy , he is not gon na put you on that level , he is also prolly afraid that you 'll write another bash script to replace the middle management positions .
Hey while I think of it , a script that creates and assigns random useless task and complains a lot could replace my boss .</tokentext>
<sentencetext>This is what happens as the company growsIt goes Dilbert on itself.This is what happens when people too stupid to do any real work and who've been replaced by a bash script gets promoted to middle management because you can't get rid of them due to union rules and stuff.You know how they got the management position?
A: The parkinson law : Upper management doesn't want their job threatened by a younger, smarter, more active, more educated middle manager, so they promote somebody dumber then themselves and the guy under hires some1 dumber then himself and so on ..... Uniforms is lack a respect for you tech support guys, uniform is a school's tool to reduce violence and bullying by unifying every1 thus eliminating gangs and groups.
It's not for a job place, it's a joke to think about it, if they had respect, they would ask you to wear a suit and a tie, but then you would be in par with ur middle management guy, he is not gonna put you on that level, he is also prolly afraid that you'll write another bash script to replace the middle management positions.
Hey while I think of it, a script that creates and assigns random useless task and complains a lot could replace my boss.</sentencetext>
</comment>
<comment>
	<id>http://www.semanticweb.org/ontologies/ConversationInstances.owl#comment09_12_29_2129221.30589144</id>
	<title>Re:Well...</title>
	<author>Anonymous</author>
	<datestamp>1262093700000</datestamp>
	<modclass>None</modclass>
	<modscore>0</modscore>
	<htmltext><p><div class="quote"><p>I'm required to design and maintain hundreds of databases, several servers, write apps, troubleshoot network problems, manage million dollar projects, AND do desktop support for 2000 devices with 3 other IT people for $40K/year.</p></div><p>Okay, Superman, so what did your boss say when you told him that?  You did say it exactly like that, right?  Sorry to troll like this but something smells fishy here.</p></div>
	</htmltext>
<tokenext>I 'm required to design and maintain hundreds of databases , several servers , write apps , troubleshoot network problems , manage million dollar projects , AND do desktop support for 2000 devices with 3 other IT people for $ 40K/year.Okay , Superman , so what did your boss say when you told him that ?
You did say it exactly like that , right ?
Sorry to troll like this but something smells fishy here .</tokentext>
<sentencetext>I'm required to design and maintain hundreds of databases, several servers, write apps, troubleshoot network problems, manage million dollar projects, AND do desktop support for 2000 devices with 3 other IT people for $40K/year.Okay, Superman, so what did your boss say when you told him that?
You did say it exactly like that, right?
Sorry to troll like this but something smells fishy here.
	</sentencetext>
	<parent>http://www.semanticweb.org/ontologies/ConversationInstances.owl#comment09_12_29_2129221.30587462</parent>
</comment>
<comment>
	<id>http://www.semanticweb.org/ontologies/ConversationInstances.owl#comment09_12_29_2129221.30587036</id>
	<title>Tell it to the plastic clown</title>
	<author>Anonymous</author>
	<datestamp>1262083800000</datestamp>
	<modclass>Insightful</modclass>
	<modscore>5</modscore>
	<htmltext><p>To me, it's a little close to wearing a fast food uniform.  It would bug me.</p></htmltext>
<tokenext>To me , it 's a little close to wearing a fast food uniform .
It would bug me .</tokentext>
<sentencetext>To me, it's a little close to wearing a fast food uniform.
It would bug me.</sentencetext>
</comment>
<comment>
	<id>http://www.semanticweb.org/ontologies/ConversationInstances.owl#comment09_12_29_2129221.30587496</id>
	<title>Who do you think you are kidding?</title>
	<author>Anonymous</author>
	<datestamp>1262085360000</datestamp>
	<modclass>None</modclass>
	<modscore>0</modscore>
	<htmltext>Seriously, when did the cleaning crew get so uppity? Shut the hell up and do what you're told.<br>
If you don't want to wear the uniform there are plenty of others who will. You aren't being paid to think.<br>
<br>
Remember kids: You can't spell "janitor" without "IT"!</htmltext>
<tokenext>Seriously , when did the cleaning crew get so uppity ?
Shut the hell up and do what you 're told .
If you do n't want to wear the uniform there are plenty of others who will .
You are n't being paid to think .
Remember kids : You ca n't spell " janitor " without " IT " !</tokentext>
<sentencetext>Seriously, when did the cleaning crew get so uppity?
Shut the hell up and do what you're told.
If you don't want to wear the uniform there are plenty of others who will.
You aren't being paid to think.
Remember kids: You can't spell "janitor" without "IT"!</sentencetext>
</comment>
<comment>
	<id>http://www.semanticweb.org/ontologies/ConversationInstances.owl#comment09_12_29_2129221.30588302</id>
	<title>I could never take this seriously</title>
	<author>InterStellaArtois</author>
	<datestamp>1262088720000</datestamp>
	<modclass>None</modclass>
	<modscore>1</modscore>
	<htmltext>One reaction to this would be to accept, but then play the "casual labourer" role to the hilt.  So insist on playing the radio full-blast wherever you're working.  Whistle and sing loudly and obnoxiously.  Holler at your colleagues on the far end of the office and refer to everybody by disparaging nicknames.  Wear low-slung stonewashed jeans which force everybody to stare at the floor whenever you bend over.  After all, if they don't treat you like professionals, why should you act that way?</htmltext>
<tokenext>One reaction to this would be to accept , but then play the " casual labourer " role to the hilt .
So insist on playing the radio full-blast wherever you 're working .
Whistle and sing loudly and obnoxiously .
Holler at your colleagues on the far end of the office and refer to everybody by disparaging nicknames .
Wear low-slung stonewashed jeans which force everybody to stare at the floor whenever you bend over .
After all , if they do n't treat you like professionals , why should you act that way ?</tokentext>
<sentencetext>One reaction to this would be to accept, but then play the "casual labourer" role to the hilt.
So insist on playing the radio full-blast wherever you're working.
Whistle and sing loudly and obnoxiously.
Holler at your colleagues on the far end of the office and refer to everybody by disparaging nicknames.
Wear low-slung stonewashed jeans which force everybody to stare at the floor whenever you bend over.
After all, if they don't treat you like professionals, why should you act that way?</sentencetext>
</comment>
<comment>
	<id>http://www.semanticweb.org/ontologies/ConversationInstances.owl#comment09_12_29_2129221.30587770</id>
	<title>New shirts</title>
	<author>Anonymous</author>
	<datestamp>1262086260000</datestamp>
	<modclass>None</modclass>
	<modscore>0</modscore>
	<htmltext><p>I'd work there for the free shirt</p></htmltext>
<tokenext>I 'd work there for the free shirt</tokentext>
<sentencetext>I'd work there for the free shirt</sentencetext>
</comment>
<comment>
	<id>http://www.semanticweb.org/ontologies/ConversationInstances.owl#comment09_12_29_2129221.30589024</id>
	<title>Re:Are you colleagues or janitors?</title>
	<author>Anonymous</author>
	<datestamp>1262092740000</datestamp>
	<modclass>None</modclass>
	<modscore>0</modscore>
	<htmltext><p>Sounds like your beef is with IT staff getting shoved down a rung or two on the status ladder, not with social stratification itself. There aren't too many groups as keen on the perks of social ranking and stratification, or as indebted to its myriad benefits, as professionals.</p></htmltext>
<tokenext>Sounds like your beef is with IT staff getting shoved down a rung or two on the status ladder , not with social stratification itself .
There are n't too many groups as keen on the perks of social ranking and stratification , or as indebted to its myriad benefits , as professionals .</tokentext>
<sentencetext>Sounds like your beef is with IT staff getting shoved down a rung or two on the status ladder, not with social stratification itself.
There aren't too many groups as keen on the perks of social ranking and stratification, or as indebted to its myriad benefits, as professionals.</sentencetext>
	<parent>http://www.semanticweb.org/ontologies/ConversationInstances.owl#comment09_12_29_2129221.30587244</parent>
</comment>
<comment>
	<id>http://www.semanticweb.org/ontologies/ConversationInstances.owl#comment09_12_29_2129221.30597048</id>
	<title>Re:Nothing wrong with the idea</title>
	<author>Anonymous</author>
	<datestamp>1259867640000</datestamp>
	<modclass>None</modclass>
	<modscore>0</modscore>
	<htmltext><p>My company (about 400 people in one building) experimented with a number of help desk models before settling in with uniforms for the floor team.  The floor team being a small group of IT/help desk types who rotated on some internal schedule to be free from normal trouble tickets and just walk around looking for problems.  They carry small backpacks with just the minimal laptop, software, cables, etc. to be functional, and if it is something more to it than what they carry, they file a trouble ticket.  They wear tan dockers and white shirts with the company logo and "Floor Team" on the arms, and the IT/help desk has been very firm about how it is ok to ask the floor team for help if you see one free, but otherwise just file a ticket.</p><p>It works well, and really makes the IT/help desk "feel" more responsive to our problems (even if it might have been faster for me to file a normal trouble ticket).  In turn, we respect them and their other work if they aren't on the floor that day so there's no competition.</p><p>Win/win.</p></htmltext>
<tokenext>My company ( about 400 people in one building ) experimented with a number of help desk models before settling in with uniforms for the floor team .
The floor team being a small group of IT/help desk types who rotated on some internal schedule to be free from normal trouble tickets and just walk around looking for problems .
They carry small backpacks with just the minimal laptop , software , cables , etc .
to be functional , and if it is something more to it than what they carry , they file a trouble ticket .
They wear tan dockers and white shirts with the company logo and " Floor Team " on the arms , and the IT/help desk has been very firm about how it is ok to ask the floor team for help if you see one free , but otherwise just file a ticket.It works well , and really makes the IT/help desk " feel " more responsive to our problems ( even if it might have been faster for me to file a normal trouble ticket ) .
In turn , we respect them and their other work if they are n't on the floor that day so there 's no competition.Win/win .</tokentext>
<sentencetext>My company (about 400 people in one building) experimented with a number of help desk models before settling in with uniforms for the floor team.
The floor team being a small group of IT/help desk types who rotated on some internal schedule to be free from normal trouble tickets and just walk around looking for problems.
They carry small backpacks with just the minimal laptop, software, cables, etc.
to be functional, and if it is something more to it than what they carry, they file a trouble ticket.
They wear tan dockers and white shirts with the company logo and "Floor Team" on the arms, and the IT/help desk has been very firm about how it is ok to ask the floor team for help if you see one free, but otherwise just file a ticket.It works well, and really makes the IT/help desk "feel" more responsive to our problems (even if it might have been faster for me to file a normal trouble ticket).
In turn, we respect them and their other work if they aren't on the floor that day so there's no competition.Win/win.</sentencetext>
	<parent>http://www.semanticweb.org/ontologies/ConversationInstances.owl#comment09_12_29_2129221.30587138</parent>
</comment>
<comment>
	<id>http://www.semanticweb.org/ontologies/ConversationInstances.owl#comment09_12_29_2129221.30594166</id>
	<title>Professionalism</title>
	<author>Anonymous</author>
	<datestamp>1259858400000</datestamp>
	<modclass>Flamebait</modclass>
	<modscore>-1</modscore>
	<htmltext><blockquote><div><p>does it detract from the professionalism</p></div></blockquote><p>That word refers to people being paid, nothing more.  If anything, seeing someone wearing demeaning clothing is a sign that they <em>are</em> being paid, since someone who wasn't receiving something (paychecks) in return, would just say "fuck this" and walk away.  So no, it doesn't detract from professionalism; it only detracts from dignity.  That's why doctors have to wear their white coats, suits wear their suits (to the point of being named after their clothing), soldiers wear their dresses, etc: it's so they don't get too uppity.  Someone's afraid of the hell desk; you guys probably shouldn't have been such assholes (in their eyes) so they're going to try to put you in your place.</p><p><a href="http://ask.slashdot.org/comments.pl?sid=1492772&amp;cid=30587282" title="slashdot.org" rel="nofollow">This guy's first comment</a> [slashdot.org] rings true too.  Maybe you guys had a slob on the team, so you're all gonna pay.</p></div>
	</htmltext>
<tokenext>does it detract from the professionalismThat word refers to people being paid , nothing more .
If anything , seeing someone wearing demeaning clothing is a sign that they are being paid , since someone who was n't receiving something ( paychecks ) in return , would just say " fuck this " and walk away .
So no , it does n't detract from professionalism ; it only detracts from dignity .
That 's why doctors have to wear their white coats , suits wear their suits ( to the point of being named after their clothing ) , soldiers wear their dresses , etc : it 's so they do n't get too uppity .
Someone 's afraid of the hell desk ; you guys probably should n't have been such assholes ( in their eyes ) so they 're going to try to put you in your place.This guy 's first comment [ slashdot.org ] rings true too .
Maybe you guys had a slob on the team , so you 're all gon na pay .</tokentext>
<sentencetext>does it detract from the professionalismThat word refers to people being paid, nothing more.
If anything, seeing someone wearing demeaning clothing is a sign that they are being paid, since someone who wasn't receiving something (paychecks) in return, would just say "fuck this" and walk away.
So no, it doesn't detract from professionalism; it only detracts from dignity.
That's why doctors have to wear their white coats, suits wear their suits (to the point of being named after their clothing), soldiers wear their dresses, etc: it's so they don't get too uppity.
Someone's afraid of the hell desk; you guys probably shouldn't have been such assholes (in their eyes) so they're going to try to put you in your place.This guy's first comment [slashdot.org] rings true too.
Maybe you guys had a slob on the team, so you're all gonna pay.
	</sentencetext>
</comment>
<comment>
	<id>http://www.semanticweb.org/ontologies/ConversationInstances.owl#comment09_12_29_2129221.30587312</id>
	<title>Sounds like BS to me</title>
	<author>pileated</author>
	<datestamp>1262084760000</datestamp>
	<modclass>None</modclass>
	<modscore>1</modscore>
	<htmltext><p>I'd ask yourselves this question: do you think you need to 'promote visibility and unity'? It sounds like most people already know who you are. Do you need 'unity' then? Is this how you'd prefer to 'promote unity'?</p><p>My guess it that the answer is no. In that case I'd ask management to have enough guts to tell you what they really want. If they think you dress like slobs they should tell you so. I have no sympathy at all with gutless management and you shouldn't either.</p></htmltext>
<tokenext>I 'd ask yourselves this question : do you think you need to 'promote visibility and unity ' ?
It sounds like most people already know who you are .
Do you need 'unity ' then ?
Is this how you 'd prefer to 'promote unity ' ? My guess it that the answer is no .
In that case I 'd ask management to have enough guts to tell you what they really want .
If they think you dress like slobs they should tell you so .
I have no sympathy at all with gutless management and you should n't either .</tokentext>
<sentencetext>I'd ask yourselves this question: do you think you need to 'promote visibility and unity'?
It sounds like most people already know who you are.
Do you need 'unity' then?
Is this how you'd prefer to 'promote unity'?My guess it that the answer is no.
In that case I'd ask management to have enough guts to tell you what they really want.
If they think you dress like slobs they should tell you so.
I have no sympathy at all with gutless management and you shouldn't either.</sentencetext>
</comment>
<comment>
	<id>http://www.semanticweb.org/ontologies/ConversationInstances.owl#comment09_12_29_2129221.30587388</id>
	<title>Look on the bright side...</title>
	<author>roc97007</author>
	<datestamp>1262084940000</datestamp>
	<modclass>None</modclass>
	<modscore>1</modscore>
	<htmltext><p>
Free shirts!</p></htmltext>
<tokenext>Free shirts !</tokentext>
<sentencetext>
Free shirts!</sentencetext>
</comment>
<comment>
	<id>http://www.semanticweb.org/ontologies/ConversationInstances.owl#comment09_12_29_2129221.30590816</id>
	<title>Re:How is a uniform unprofessional?</title>
	<author>CAIMLAS</author>
	<datestamp>1262111040000</datestamp>
	<modclass>None</modclass>
	<modscore>1</modscore>
	<htmltext><p>What you call an 'authoritative swagger', I (and most cops, I'm sure) call "damn my back and feet are killing me from carrying this 30lb gear belt". Wear one long enough, spend enough time standing or walking on hard even surfaces (ie not hiking up or down a mountain), and you, too, can have an 'authoritative' swagger!</p></htmltext>
<tokenext>What you call an 'authoritative swagger ' , I ( and most cops , I 'm sure ) call " damn my back and feet are killing me from carrying this 30lb gear belt " .
Wear one long enough , spend enough time standing or walking on hard even surfaces ( ie not hiking up or down a mountain ) , and you , too , can have an 'authoritative ' swagger !</tokentext>
<sentencetext>What you call an 'authoritative swagger', I (and most cops, I'm sure) call "damn my back and feet are killing me from carrying this 30lb gear belt".
Wear one long enough, spend enough time standing or walking on hard even surfaces (ie not hiking up or down a mountain), and you, too, can have an 'authoritative' swagger!</sentencetext>
	<parent>http://www.semanticweb.org/ontologies/ConversationInstances.owl#comment09_12_29_2129221.30589686</parent>
</comment>
<comment>
	<id>http://www.semanticweb.org/ontologies/ConversationInstances.owl#comment09_12_29_2129221.30587674</id>
	<title>Re:30 IT people in a 500 employee company?!</title>
	<author>Anonymous</author>
	<datestamp>1262085960000</datestamp>
	<modclass>None</modclass>
	<modscore>0</modscore>
	<htmltext><p>So true.</p><p>Call center here, with something like 20,000 PC's and our entire IT / Systems team is maybe 100 strong (including IT managers / directors).</p></htmltext>
<tokenext>So true.Call center here , with something like 20,000 PC 's and our entire IT / Systems team is maybe 100 strong ( including IT managers / directors ) .</tokentext>
<sentencetext>So true.Call center here, with something like 20,000 PC's and our entire IT / Systems team is maybe 100 strong (including IT managers / directors).</sentencetext>
	<parent>http://www.semanticweb.org/ontologies/ConversationInstances.owl#comment09_12_29_2129221.30587272</parent>
</comment>
<comment>
	<id>http://www.semanticweb.org/ontologies/ConversationInstances.owl#comment09_12_29_2129221.30592566</id>
	<title>Do you own the company?</title>
	<author>hiTechToy</author>
	<datestamp>1259851380000</datestamp>
	<modclass>None</modclass>
	<modscore>1</modscore>
	<htmltext>If you own the company and don't like the uniforms, then strike it down. If you don't own the company and don't like the uniforms, find another job. It is your right to find employment elsewhere should the conditions under which you work change to your dissatisfaction...just as it is the owners right to run their company as they see fit.</htmltext>
<tokenext>If you own the company and do n't like the uniforms , then strike it down .
If you do n't own the company and do n't like the uniforms , find another job .
It is your right to find employment elsewhere should the conditions under which you work change to your dissatisfaction...just as it is the owners right to run their company as they see fit .</tokentext>
<sentencetext>If you own the company and don't like the uniforms, then strike it down.
If you don't own the company and don't like the uniforms, find another job.
It is your right to find employment elsewhere should the conditions under which you work change to your dissatisfaction...just as it is the owners right to run their company as they see fit.</sentencetext>
</comment>
<comment>
	<id>http://www.semanticweb.org/ontologies/ConversationInstances.owl#comment09_12_29_2129221.30589672</id>
	<title>Dress for success at outsourcing</title>
	<author>Anonymous</author>
	<datestamp>1262098560000</datestamp>
	<modclass>None</modclass>
	<modscore>0</modscore>
	<htmltext><p>What do the janitors, security guards, and kitchen staff help? Where are they on the corporate food chain? And is there some idiot in IT who keeps coming in wearing "Free Kevin Mitnick" shirts?</p><p>It sounds like you're being set up to be faceless, replaceable drones, training your replacements and having marks against you dreamed up by cost-cutting managers who want to let you go, "with cause", just before you get stock options or get medical benefits or before they'd have to pay you unemployment for firing you.</p></htmltext>
<tokenext>What do the janitors , security guards , and kitchen staff help ?
Where are they on the corporate food chain ?
And is there some idiot in IT who keeps coming in wearing " Free Kevin Mitnick " shirts ? It sounds like you 're being set up to be faceless , replaceable drones , training your replacements and having marks against you dreamed up by cost-cutting managers who want to let you go , " with cause " , just before you get stock options or get medical benefits or before they 'd have to pay you unemployment for firing you .</tokentext>
<sentencetext>What do the janitors, security guards, and kitchen staff help?
Where are they on the corporate food chain?
And is there some idiot in IT who keeps coming in wearing "Free Kevin Mitnick" shirts?It sounds like you're being set up to be faceless, replaceable drones, training your replacements and having marks against you dreamed up by cost-cutting managers who want to let you go, "with cause", just before you get stock options or get medical benefits or before they'd have to pay you unemployment for firing you.</sentencetext>
</comment>
<comment>
	<id>http://www.semanticweb.org/ontologies/ConversationInstances.owl#comment09_12_29_2129221.30596092</id>
	<title>Anonymous Coward</title>
	<author>Anonymous</author>
	<datestamp>1259864280000</datestamp>
	<modclass>None</modclass>
	<modscore>0</modscore>
	<htmltext><p>I don't like the idea of uniforms for IT staff. The issue came up at a previous job, my suggestion was to provide some type of lab coat. You can wear your own cloths and take it off when not on the floor. A nice lab coat doesn't say hamburger flipper or janitor. It could however promote the nerd factor which isn't always a good idea.</p></htmltext>
<tokenext>I do n't like the idea of uniforms for IT staff .
The issue came up at a previous job , my suggestion was to provide some type of lab coat .
You can wear your own cloths and take it off when not on the floor .
A nice lab coat does n't say hamburger flipper or janitor .
It could however promote the nerd factor which is n't always a good idea .</tokentext>
<sentencetext>I don't like the idea of uniforms for IT staff.
The issue came up at a previous job, my suggestion was to provide some type of lab coat.
You can wear your own cloths and take it off when not on the floor.
A nice lab coat doesn't say hamburger flipper or janitor.
It could however promote the nerd factor which isn't always a good idea.</sentencetext>
</comment>
<comment>
	<id>http://www.semanticweb.org/ontologies/ConversationInstances.owl#comment09_12_29_2129221.30587910</id>
	<title>My manager has this idea from time to time as well</title>
	<author>laron</author>
	<datestamp>1262086800000</datestamp>
	<modclass>None</modclass>
	<modscore>1</modscore>
	<htmltext><p>Usually I tell him that I want to go the whole mile then. Rank insignia, DOS (6.2-ME) and Windows NT campaign (NT4.0-Vista) ribbon, MVP and MCSE medals...<br>Anyone got a good idea for a cap badge design?</p></htmltext>
<tokenext>Usually I tell him that I want to go the whole mile then .
Rank insignia , DOS ( 6.2-ME ) and Windows NT campaign ( NT4.0-Vista ) ribbon , MVP and MCSE medals...Anyone got a good idea for a cap badge design ?</tokentext>
<sentencetext>Usually I tell him that I want to go the whole mile then.
Rank insignia, DOS (6.2-ME) and Windows NT campaign (NT4.0-Vista) ribbon, MVP and MCSE medals...Anyone got a good idea for a cap badge design?</sentencetext>
</comment>
<comment>
	<id>http://www.semanticweb.org/ontologies/ConversationInstances.owl#comment09_12_29_2129221.30587396</id>
	<title>In reality, will you have any say?</title>
	<author>Anonymous</author>
	<datestamp>1262085000000</datestamp>
	<modclass>None</modclass>
	<modscore>1</modscore>
	<htmltext>Apart from packing your bags, will you have any say in the decision? If not, it's either get on the train, or prepare to be run over.<br> <br>I can see pro- and con- for uniforms or a dress code.  Yes, it can portray a common front for a department that is often "unseen" by others in positions of power.  The users you serve likely know you and your team members well.  It could be a move by management to help other senior staff recognize your presence in their departments, too.<br> <br>I would be interested in finding out the real motivation for the change.  Does anyone on your team tend to dress inappropriately or stretch the boundaries of the casual environment too far? If so, talk to your manager to make sure the entire team is not getting punnished for the actions of one. Others have raised the concept of the employer buying the uniforms. That's been done in many places, but don't hold your breath.  If anything, it would be reasonable to expect at least one free shirt (I'm assuming pants will still be up to you, but might need to be a certain color or type--excluding jeans, for example).  There certainly will be tax rules regarding required uniforms.  My employer reimburses for 'x' uniforms a year (I don't remember how many because my department does not use uniforms), and for 50\% of required safety shoes for those who need them. Be sure to get all expectations or details of the new policy in writing, especially as it pertains to costs, reimbursements, and expectations.<br> <br>My personal guess is that one of your corporate officers spent a lot of time in line at Best Buy (or a similar location) before Christmas.  He probably noticed all of the associates in their blue polo shirts and tan pants, except for the Geek Squad which was wearing it's black and white motiff.  "Management by standing in line" may well be the new "management by magazine". Either that, or someone who can make the decisions has a laid off sister-in-law who just happened to start an embroidery business...</htmltext>
<tokenext>Apart from packing your bags , will you have any say in the decision ?
If not , it 's either get on the train , or prepare to be run over .
I can see pro- and con- for uniforms or a dress code .
Yes , it can portray a common front for a department that is often " unseen " by others in positions of power .
The users you serve likely know you and your team members well .
It could be a move by management to help other senior staff recognize your presence in their departments , too .
I would be interested in finding out the real motivation for the change .
Does anyone on your team tend to dress inappropriately or stretch the boundaries of the casual environment too far ?
If so , talk to your manager to make sure the entire team is not getting punnished for the actions of one .
Others have raised the concept of the employer buying the uniforms .
That 's been done in many places , but do n't hold your breath .
If anything , it would be reasonable to expect at least one free shirt ( I 'm assuming pants will still be up to you , but might need to be a certain color or type--excluding jeans , for example ) .
There certainly will be tax rules regarding required uniforms .
My employer reimburses for 'x ' uniforms a year ( I do n't remember how many because my department does not use uniforms ) , and for 50 \ % of required safety shoes for those who need them .
Be sure to get all expectations or details of the new policy in writing , especially as it pertains to costs , reimbursements , and expectations .
My personal guess is that one of your corporate officers spent a lot of time in line at Best Buy ( or a similar location ) before Christmas .
He probably noticed all of the associates in their blue polo shirts and tan pants , except for the Geek Squad which was wearing it 's black and white motiff .
" Management by standing in line " may well be the new " management by magazine " .
Either that , or someone who can make the decisions has a laid off sister-in-law who just happened to start an embroidery business.. .</tokentext>
<sentencetext>Apart from packing your bags, will you have any say in the decision?
If not, it's either get on the train, or prepare to be run over.
I can see pro- and con- for uniforms or a dress code.
Yes, it can portray a common front for a department that is often "unseen" by others in positions of power.
The users you serve likely know you and your team members well.
It could be a move by management to help other senior staff recognize your presence in their departments, too.
I would be interested in finding out the real motivation for the change.
Does anyone on your team tend to dress inappropriately or stretch the boundaries of the casual environment too far?
If so, talk to your manager to make sure the entire team is not getting punnished for the actions of one.
Others have raised the concept of the employer buying the uniforms.
That's been done in many places, but don't hold your breath.
If anything, it would be reasonable to expect at least one free shirt (I'm assuming pants will still be up to you, but might need to be a certain color or type--excluding jeans, for example).
There certainly will be tax rules regarding required uniforms.
My employer reimburses for 'x' uniforms a year (I don't remember how many because my department does not use uniforms), and for 50\% of required safety shoes for those who need them.
Be sure to get all expectations or details of the new policy in writing, especially as it pertains to costs, reimbursements, and expectations.
My personal guess is that one of your corporate officers spent a lot of time in line at Best Buy (or a similar location) before Christmas.
He probably noticed all of the associates in their blue polo shirts and tan pants, except for the Geek Squad which was wearing it's black and white motiff.
"Management by standing in line" may well be the new "management by magazine".
Either that, or someone who can make the decisions has a laid off sister-in-law who just happened to start an embroidery business...</sentencetext>
</comment>
<comment>
	<id>http://www.semanticweb.org/ontologies/ConversationInstances.owl#comment09_12_29_2129221.30593654</id>
	<title>Re:30 IT people in a 500 employee company?!</title>
	<author>GeckoAddict</author>
	<datestamp>1259856720000</datestamp>
	<modclass>None</modclass>
	<modscore>1</modscore>
	<htmltext>Its varying definitions of IT.  To some, IT includes software development (which I typically think of as more of engineering, not IT).  It also includes help desk, as well as standard IT (supporting applications/networking/servers/backups, etc)</htmltext>
<tokenext>Its varying definitions of IT .
To some , IT includes software development ( which I typically think of as more of engineering , not IT ) .
It also includes help desk , as well as standard IT ( supporting applications/networking/servers/backups , etc )</tokentext>
<sentencetext>Its varying definitions of IT.
To some, IT includes software development (which I typically think of as more of engineering, not IT).
It also includes help desk, as well as standard IT (supporting applications/networking/servers/backups, etc)</sentencetext>
	<parent>http://www.semanticweb.org/ontologies/ConversationInstances.owl#comment09_12_29_2129221.30587272</parent>
</comment>
<comment>
	<id>http://www.semanticweb.org/ontologies/ConversationInstances.owl#comment09_12_29_2129221.30590744</id>
	<title>Re:30 IT people in a 500 employee company?!</title>
	<author>Anonymous</author>
	<datestamp>1262109840000</datestamp>
	<modclass>None</modclass>
	<modscore>0</modscore>
	<htmltext><p>800 people, 16 locations =&gt; 50 people per location. 1 IT person per 300 computerized employees...</p><p>Sure you can do that - but it means your business has to be very simple. No, let me say that better - very, very simple.</p><p>On the other hand yes, 30 IT persons for 500 employees looks indeed unusually dense.</p><p>(Said by someone working for a Very Large database company, visiting an average of 30 different customers per year over the last 14 years, ranging from 100ish to tens of thousands employees).</p></htmltext>
<tokenext>800 people , 16 locations = &gt; 50 people per location .
1 IT person per 300 computerized employees...Sure you can do that - but it means your business has to be very simple .
No , let me say that better - very , very simple.On the other hand yes , 30 IT persons for 500 employees looks indeed unusually dense .
( Said by someone working for a Very Large database company , visiting an average of 30 different customers per year over the last 14 years , ranging from 100ish to tens of thousands employees ) .</tokentext>
<sentencetext>800 people, 16 locations =&gt; 50 people per location.
1 IT person per 300 computerized employees...Sure you can do that - but it means your business has to be very simple.
No, let me say that better - very, very simple.On the other hand yes, 30 IT persons for 500 employees looks indeed unusually dense.
(Said by someone working for a Very Large database company, visiting an average of 30 different customers per year over the last 14 years, ranging from 100ish to tens of thousands employees).</sentencetext>
	<parent>http://www.semanticweb.org/ontologies/ConversationInstances.owl#comment09_12_29_2129221.30587272</parent>
</comment>
<comment>
	<id>http://www.semanticweb.org/ontologies/ConversationInstances.owl#comment09_12_29_2129221.30588674</id>
	<title>NO!</title>
	<author>gbutler69</author>
	<datestamp>1262090700000</datestamp>
	<modclass>None</modclass>
	<modscore>1</modscore>
	<htmltext>Every department in the company in there to serve other departments and/or customers in some capacity or another. Why should the "IT Guys" have special uniforms? It's insulting!</htmltext>
<tokenext>Every department in the company in there to serve other departments and/or customers in some capacity or another .
Why should the " IT Guys " have special uniforms ?
It 's insulting !</tokentext>
<sentencetext>Every department in the company in there to serve other departments and/or customers in some capacity or another.
Why should the "IT Guys" have special uniforms?
It's insulting!</sentencetext>
</comment>
<comment>
	<id>http://www.semanticweb.org/ontologies/ConversationInstances.owl#comment09_12_29_2129221.30591618</id>
	<title>Re:Professionalism</title>
	<author>Anonymous</author>
	<datestamp>1259836020000</datestamp>
	<modclass>None</modclass>
	<modscore>0</modscore>
	<htmltext><p>I am not sloppy I just wear my crocs slippers, so I can move about without making noise.</p></htmltext>
<tokenext>I am not sloppy I just wear my crocs slippers , so I can move about without making noise .</tokentext>
<sentencetext>I am not sloppy I just wear my crocs slippers, so I can move about without making noise.</sentencetext>
	<parent>http://www.semanticweb.org/ontologies/ConversationInstances.owl#comment09_12_29_2129221.30587096</parent>
</comment>
<comment>
	<id>http://www.semanticweb.org/ontologies/ConversationInstances.owl#comment09_12_29_2129221.30587748</id>
	<title>For the past 28 years ...</title>
	<author>jeepmeister</author>
	<datestamp>1262086200000</datestamp>
	<modclass>None</modclass>
	<modscore>1</modscore>
	<htmltext><p>For the past 28 years I've been an Information Technology Professional. During that time I've watched corporate America transform IT from a profession staffed and managed by technologists into an outsourceable commodity managed by MBA's. The uniform suggestion is an idea worthy only of ridicule. Why not suggest to the MBA who floated that idea that it be mandated all MBA's working in IT departments wear big floppy shoes and a bright red shirt to work Monday thru Thursday so they can more easily identify each other as clowns? The rest of us already know who the clowns are.</p></htmltext>
<tokenext>For the past 28 years I 've been an Information Technology Professional .
During that time I 've watched corporate America transform IT from a profession staffed and managed by technologists into an outsourceable commodity managed by MBA 's .
The uniform suggestion is an idea worthy only of ridicule .
Why not suggest to the MBA who floated that idea that it be mandated all MBA 's working in IT departments wear big floppy shoes and a bright red shirt to work Monday thru Thursday so they can more easily identify each other as clowns ?
The rest of us already know who the clowns are .</tokentext>
<sentencetext>For the past 28 years I've been an Information Technology Professional.
During that time I've watched corporate America transform IT from a profession staffed and managed by technologists into an outsourceable commodity managed by MBA's.
The uniform suggestion is an idea worthy only of ridicule.
Why not suggest to the MBA who floated that idea that it be mandated all MBA's working in IT departments wear big floppy shoes and a bright red shirt to work Monday thru Thursday so they can more easily identify each other as clowns?
The rest of us already know who the clowns are.</sentencetext>
</comment>
<comment>
	<id>http://www.semanticweb.org/ontologies/ConversationInstances.owl#comment09_12_29_2129221.30590200</id>
	<title>Be glad you have a job</title>
	<author>Anonymous</author>
	<datestamp>1262103840000</datestamp>
	<modclass>None</modclass>
	<modscore>0</modscore>
	<htmltext><p>Be glad you have a job and stop whining.</p></htmltext>
<tokenext>Be glad you have a job and stop whining .</tokentext>
<sentencetext>Be glad you have a job and stop whining.</sentencetext>
</comment>
<comment>
	<id>http://www.semanticweb.org/ontologies/ConversationInstances.owl#comment09_12_29_2129221.30588748</id>
	<title>Re:Well...</title>
	<author>valid902</author>
	<datestamp>1262091060000</datestamp>
	<modclass>None</modclass>
	<modscore>1</modscore>
	<htmltext>... if you are willing you come to my place of work and take a pay cut for the same thing........<nobr> <wbr></nobr>....don't forget, you will get no further support, personnel, equipment or budget....</htmltext>
<tokenext>... if you are willing you come to my place of work and take a pay cut for the same thing........ ....do n't forget , you will get no further support , personnel , equipment or budget... .</tokentext>
<sentencetext>... if you are willing you come to my place of work and take a pay cut for the same thing........ ....don't forget, you will get no further support, personnel, equipment or budget....</sentencetext>
	<parent>http://www.semanticweb.org/ontologies/ConversationInstances.owl#comment09_12_29_2129221.30587462</parent>
</comment>
<comment>
	<id>http://www.semanticweb.org/ontologies/ConversationInstances.owl#comment09_12_29_2129221.30587158</id>
	<title>Are they offering propeller beanies as well?</title>
	<author>John Hasler</author>
	<datestamp>1262084220000</datestamp>
	<modclass>Funny</modclass>
	<modscore>2</modscore>
	<htmltext><p>n/t</p></htmltext>
<tokenext>n/t</tokentext>
<sentencetext>n/t</sentencetext>
</comment>
<comment>
	<id>http://www.semanticweb.org/ontologies/ConversationInstances.owl#comment09_12_29_2129221.30588106</id>
	<title>How much does this really matter?</title>
	<author>Angst Badger</author>
	<datestamp>1262087640000</datestamp>
	<modclass>None</modclass>
	<modscore>1</modscore>
	<htmltext><p>It's a dumb idea. That said, it's also not worth getting worked up about if management is going to pay for the shirts and give you enough of them to get through the week with clean shirts without having to do extra laundry. Is it demeaning? Well, sure, but no matter what you wear, non-technical personnel are going to think of you -- as they think of all of us -- as some kind of mutant idiot-savants. Until someone writes software to replace non-technical managers, it's something we unfortunately have to live with.</p></htmltext>
<tokenext>It 's a dumb idea .
That said , it 's also not worth getting worked up about if management is going to pay for the shirts and give you enough of them to get through the week with clean shirts without having to do extra laundry .
Is it demeaning ?
Well , sure , but no matter what you wear , non-technical personnel are going to think of you -- as they think of all of us -- as some kind of mutant idiot-savants .
Until someone writes software to replace non-technical managers , it 's something we unfortunately have to live with .</tokentext>
<sentencetext>It's a dumb idea.
That said, it's also not worth getting worked up about if management is going to pay for the shirts and give you enough of them to get through the week with clean shirts without having to do extra laundry.
Is it demeaning?
Well, sure, but no matter what you wear, non-technical personnel are going to think of you -- as they think of all of us -- as some kind of mutant idiot-savants.
Until someone writes software to replace non-technical managers, it's something we unfortunately have to live with.</sentencetext>
</comment>
<comment>
	<id>http://www.semanticweb.org/ontologies/ConversationInstances.owl#comment09_12_29_2129221.30592582</id>
	<title>IT Uniforms</title>
	<author>CreatureComfort</author>
	<datestamp>1259851440000</datestamp>
	<modclass>None</modclass>
	<modscore>1</modscore>
	<htmltext>Hey, the way I look at it, if they provide them... Free Shirts!</htmltext>
<tokenext>Hey , the way I look at it , if they provide them... Free Shirts !</tokentext>
<sentencetext>Hey, the way I look at it, if they provide them... Free Shirts!</sentencetext>
</comment>
<comment>
	<id>http://www.semanticweb.org/ontologies/ConversationInstances.owl#comment09_12_29_2129221.30593144</id>
	<title>Re:How is a uniform unprofessional?</title>
	<author>Anonymous</author>
	<datestamp>1259854560000</datestamp>
	<modclass>None</modclass>
	<modscore>0</modscore>
	<htmltext><p>How the heck is that a trade-off?  $150 in shirts vs. $400/month car?  Let me know how that works.</p></htmltext>
<tokenext>How the heck is that a trade-off ?
$ 150 in shirts vs. $ 400/month car ?
Let me know how that works .</tokentext>
<sentencetext>How the heck is that a trade-off?
$150 in shirts vs. $400/month car?
Let me know how that works.</sentencetext>
	<parent>http://www.semanticweb.org/ontologies/ConversationInstances.owl#comment09_12_29_2129221.30588048</parent>
</comment>
<comment>
	<id>http://www.semanticweb.org/ontologies/ConversationInstances.owl#comment09_12_29_2129221.30588904</id>
	<title>Re:30 IT people in a 500 employee company?!</title>
	<author>Anonymous</author>
	<datestamp>1262092020000</datestamp>
	<modclass>Insightful</modclass>
	<modscore>1</modscore>
	<htmltext><p>It's kind of silly to look at numbers and make calls like that. As he said, the vast majority of the IT staff are not help desk staff. Perhaps he should have called them technology staff, instead of IT staff.</p><p>It is very possible that the company he works for is just extremely technology focused.</p></htmltext>
<tokenext>It 's kind of silly to look at numbers and make calls like that .
As he said , the vast majority of the IT staff are not help desk staff .
Perhaps he should have called them technology staff , instead of IT staff.It is very possible that the company he works for is just extremely technology focused .</tokentext>
<sentencetext>It's kind of silly to look at numbers and make calls like that.
As he said, the vast majority of the IT staff are not help desk staff.
Perhaps he should have called them technology staff, instead of IT staff.It is very possible that the company he works for is just extremely technology focused.</sentencetext>
	<parent>http://www.semanticweb.org/ontologies/ConversationInstances.owl#comment09_12_29_2129221.30587272</parent>
</comment>
<comment>
	<id>http://www.semanticweb.org/ontologies/ConversationInstances.owl#comment09_12_29_2129221.30587282</id>
	<title>my guesses</title>
	<author>tempest69</author>
	<datestamp>1262084640000</datestamp>
	<modclass>None</modclass>
	<modscore>1</modscore>
	<htmltext>First guess, someone in the help desk is coming in a little to dirty or smelly. And as the saying goes, if everyone else smells fine...<br>
Second guess, mental laziness.  They want to be able to do a hey you, without remembering who you are.  it's like being able to locate the janitor because of their attire.  To most people your a service, not a person.  But then again so are cops, paramedics, and ER doctors.<p>
Storm</p></htmltext>
<tokenext>First guess , someone in the help desk is coming in a little to dirty or smelly .
And as the saying goes , if everyone else smells fine.. . Second guess , mental laziness .
They want to be able to do a hey you , without remembering who you are .
it 's like being able to locate the janitor because of their attire .
To most people your a service , not a person .
But then again so are cops , paramedics , and ER doctors .
Storm</tokentext>
<sentencetext>First guess, someone in the help desk is coming in a little to dirty or smelly.
And as the saying goes, if everyone else smells fine...
Second guess, mental laziness.
They want to be able to do a hey you, without remembering who you are.
it's like being able to locate the janitor because of their attire.
To most people your a service, not a person.
But then again so are cops, paramedics, and ER doctors.
Storm</sentencetext>
</comment>
<comment>
	<id>http://www.semanticweb.org/ontologies/ConversationInstances.owl#comment09_12_29_2129221.30597734</id>
	<title>I'll wear a uniform...</title>
	<author>SirBigSpur</author>
	<datestamp>1259870340000</datestamp>
	<modclass>None</modclass>
	<modscore>1</modscore>
	<htmltext>but it better come with a night stick.

'What, you forgot your password agian?" *Whack!</htmltext>
<tokenext>but it better come with a night stick .
'What , you forgot your password agian ?
" * Whack !</tokentext>
<sentencetext>but it better come with a night stick.
'What, you forgot your password agian?
" *Whack!</sentencetext>
</comment>
<comment>
	<id>http://www.semanticweb.org/ontologies/ConversationInstances.owl#comment09_12_29_2129221.30591564</id>
	<title>Re:Well...</title>
	<author>Anonymous</author>
	<datestamp>1259835060000</datestamp>
	<modclass>None</modclass>
	<modscore>0</modscore>
	<htmltext><p>This ties into your comment well:</p><p>30 IT staff for 500 employee?  Really?</p><p>We had 4 people for 350 people.  Which eventually was trimmed to 2 people.  But in all seriousness 30?  Sounds like something the government would do.</p></htmltext>
<tokenext>This ties into your comment well : 30 IT staff for 500 employee ?
Really ? We had 4 people for 350 people .
Which eventually was trimmed to 2 people .
But in all seriousness 30 ?
Sounds like something the government would do .</tokentext>
<sentencetext>This ties into your comment well:30 IT staff for 500 employee?
Really?We had 4 people for 350 people.
Which eventually was trimmed to 2 people.
But in all seriousness 30?
Sounds like something the government would do.</sentencetext>
	<parent>http://www.semanticweb.org/ontologies/ConversationInstances.owl#comment09_12_29_2129221.30587462</parent>
</comment>
<comment>
	<id>http://www.semanticweb.org/ontologies/ConversationInstances.owl#comment09_12_29_2129221.30587094</id>
	<title>Economy</title>
	<author>Anonymous</author>
	<datestamp>1262084040000</datestamp>
	<modclass>None</modclass>
	<modscore>0</modscore>
	<htmltext><p>That's alot IT staff for only 500 employees.   Our organization is 13,000 employees with 10 IT Staff.</p></htmltext>
<tokenext>That 's alot IT staff for only 500 employees .
Our organization is 13,000 employees with 10 IT Staff .</tokentext>
<sentencetext>That's alot IT staff for only 500 employees.
Our organization is 13,000 employees with 10 IT Staff.</sentencetext>
</comment>
<comment>
	<id>http://www.semanticweb.org/ontologies/ConversationInstances.owl#comment09_12_29_2129221.30588394</id>
	<title>distinction doesn't require clothing</title>
	<author>noric</author>
	<datestamp>1262089200000</datestamp>
	<modclass>None</modclass>
	<modscore>1</modscore>
	<htmltext>A uniform in an IT company, where business casual is the norm, is insulting. If they want you to appear distinct, issue badges, or neon lanyards, etc.</htmltext>
<tokenext>A uniform in an IT company , where business casual is the norm , is insulting .
If they want you to appear distinct , issue badges , or neon lanyards , etc .</tokentext>
<sentencetext>A uniform in an IT company, where business casual is the norm, is insulting.
If they want you to appear distinct, issue badges, or neon lanyards, etc.</sentencetext>
</comment>
<comment>
	<id>http://www.semanticweb.org/ontologies/ConversationInstances.owl#comment09_12_29_2129221.30587430</id>
	<title>I use uniforms</title>
	<author>Saija</author>
	<datestamp>1262085060000</datestamp>
	<modclass>None</modclass>
	<modscore>1</modscore>
	<htmltext>every single day, as the one and only developer-IT guy in a manufacturing plant, and not only uniform i also had to use security boots and hear protectors and in some cases dust mask.Everyone hear wear uniforms: the manteinance guys, the operators of the machines and the administrative guys: engineers, production planners &amp; programmers, etc.<br>
i see the wearing of the uniform as a bonus because i don't have to buy new clothes and my shoes are less used because they're left alone in my locker<br>
ps: we also get our lunch in the company restaurant, free of charge of course, so for my is no more buying clothes and free food<nobr> <wbr></nobr>:)</htmltext>
<tokenext>every single day , as the one and only developer-IT guy in a manufacturing plant , and not only uniform i also had to use security boots and hear protectors and in some cases dust mask.Everyone hear wear uniforms : the manteinance guys , the operators of the machines and the administrative guys : engineers , production planners &amp; programmers , etc .
i see the wearing of the uniform as a bonus because i do n't have to buy new clothes and my shoes are less used because they 're left alone in my locker ps : we also get our lunch in the company restaurant , free of charge of course , so for my is no more buying clothes and free food : )</tokentext>
<sentencetext>every single day, as the one and only developer-IT guy in a manufacturing plant, and not only uniform i also had to use security boots and hear protectors and in some cases dust mask.Everyone hear wear uniforms: the manteinance guys, the operators of the machines and the administrative guys: engineers, production planners &amp; programmers, etc.
i see the wearing of the uniform as a bonus because i don't have to buy new clothes and my shoes are less used because they're left alone in my locker
ps: we also get our lunch in the company restaurant, free of charge of course, so for my is no more buying clothes and free food :)</sentencetext>
</comment>
<comment>
	<id>http://www.semanticweb.org/ontologies/ConversationInstances.owl#comment09_12_29_2129221.30588122</id>
	<title>What a perfect(ly biased) place to argue this...</title>
	<author>billsayswow</author>
	<datestamp>1262087760000</datestamp>
	<modclass>None</modclass>
	<modscore>0</modscore>
	<htmltext>You might as well go to Yahoo Answers and ask if there should be a minimum intelligence level to use the internet.</htmltext>
<tokenext>You might as well go to Yahoo Answers and ask if there should be a minimum intelligence level to use the internet .</tokentext>
<sentencetext>You might as well go to Yahoo Answers and ask if there should be a minimum intelligence level to use the internet.</sentencetext>
</comment>
<comment>
	<id>http://www.semanticweb.org/ontologies/ConversationInstances.owl#comment09_12_29_2129221.30589468</id>
	<title>Not such a great idea</title>
	<author>sleepdepzombie</author>
	<datestamp>1262096760000</datestamp>
	<modclass>None</modclass>
	<modscore>1</modscore>
	<htmltext><p>Unless you are dealing with customers outside of your company's staff don't do it.</p><p>Problems with Mandatory Uniforms:<br>1. They make you look like an external vendor.  You may soon be come one.<br>2. Unless other teams have some uniform requirement your staff will resent it.<br>3. Your team is already among the the lowest paid in the company.  Don't make them feel like the janitors.<br>4. Mandatory is something that really rubs people the wrong way.</p><p>Presumably, you already have some sort of dress code. If IT looks like slobs enforce what you already have.</p><p>An alternate suggestion: If you already have a dress code of button-down shirts or ties, just give your help desk guys some company/IT logo shirts polo, button-down, t-shirt, or whatever and say these are also acceptable as part of the dress code.  You'll see them fairly regularly if they aren't horrible without going the route of making them mandatory. Hell, going this route the team may see getting the shirts as a good thing.</p></htmltext>
<tokenext>Unless you are dealing with customers outside of your company 's staff do n't do it.Problems with Mandatory Uniforms : 1 .
They make you look like an external vendor .
You may soon be come one.2 .
Unless other teams have some uniform requirement your staff will resent it.3 .
Your team is already among the the lowest paid in the company .
Do n't make them feel like the janitors.4 .
Mandatory is something that really rubs people the wrong way.Presumably , you already have some sort of dress code .
If IT looks like slobs enforce what you already have.An alternate suggestion : If you already have a dress code of button-down shirts or ties , just give your help desk guys some company/IT logo shirts polo , button-down , t-shirt , or whatever and say these are also acceptable as part of the dress code .
You 'll see them fairly regularly if they are n't horrible without going the route of making them mandatory .
Hell , going this route the team may see getting the shirts as a good thing .</tokentext>
<sentencetext>Unless you are dealing with customers outside of your company's staff don't do it.Problems with Mandatory Uniforms:1.
They make you look like an external vendor.
You may soon be come one.2.
Unless other teams have some uniform requirement your staff will resent it.3.
Your team is already among the the lowest paid in the company.
Don't make them feel like the janitors.4.
Mandatory is something that really rubs people the wrong way.Presumably, you already have some sort of dress code.
If IT looks like slobs enforce what you already have.An alternate suggestion: If you already have a dress code of button-down shirts or ties, just give your help desk guys some company/IT logo shirts polo, button-down, t-shirt, or whatever and say these are also acceptable as part of the dress code.
You'll see them fairly regularly if they aren't horrible without going the route of making them mandatory.
Hell, going this route the team may see getting the shirts as a good thing.</sentencetext>
</comment>
<comment>
	<id>http://www.semanticweb.org/ontologies/ConversationInstances.owl#comment09_12_29_2129221.30588264</id>
	<title>Make them look good and optional...</title>
	<author>VoxMagis</author>
	<datestamp>1262088480000</datestamp>
	<modclass>None</modclass>
	<modscore>1</modscore>
	<htmltext><p>We have 'uniform' shirts where I work.  We travel to many customers, so I actually like them as an identifier.  This is not the case you're in as your question states, but it's really not far off with a company location that size.</p><p>In our case, they are optional - We are expected to wear something professional or wear one of our work shirts.  The boss came in with a catalogue with many different types and styles of shirts that get our logo sewn on, and that's it.  It took a bit, but nearly all of us wear the work shirts.  They are a style WE have chosen and WE can choose not to wear them, so, being a bunch of geeks, of course we do.</p><p>Besides, we barely have to dress ourselves that way!  It keeps the bizarre color choices we come in with to a minimum.</p></htmltext>
<tokenext>We have 'uniform ' shirts where I work .
We travel to many customers , so I actually like them as an identifier .
This is not the case you 're in as your question states , but it 's really not far off with a company location that size.In our case , they are optional - We are expected to wear something professional or wear one of our work shirts .
The boss came in with a catalogue with many different types and styles of shirts that get our logo sewn on , and that 's it .
It took a bit , but nearly all of us wear the work shirts .
They are a style WE have chosen and WE can choose not to wear them , so , being a bunch of geeks , of course we do.Besides , we barely have to dress ourselves that way !
It keeps the bizarre color choices we come in with to a minimum .</tokentext>
<sentencetext>We have 'uniform' shirts where I work.
We travel to many customers, so I actually like them as an identifier.
This is not the case you're in as your question states, but it's really not far off with a company location that size.In our case, they are optional - We are expected to wear something professional or wear one of our work shirts.
The boss came in with a catalogue with many different types and styles of shirts that get our logo sewn on, and that's it.
It took a bit, but nearly all of us wear the work shirts.
They are a style WE have chosen and WE can choose not to wear them, so, being a bunch of geeks, of course we do.Besides, we barely have to dress ourselves that way!
It keeps the bizarre color choices we come in with to a minimum.</sentencetext>
</comment>
<comment>
	<id>http://www.semanticweb.org/ontologies/ConversationInstances.owl#comment09_12_29_2129221.30589138</id>
	<title>Think of this however ...</title>
	<author>sho-gun</author>
	<datestamp>1262093640000</datestamp>
	<modclass>None</modclass>
	<modscore>1</modscore>
	<htmltext><p>I tend to think that if management is pushing this down, then there's probably been an issue with the IT team dressing appropriately.<br>I've been in large companies over the years and some of the IT people really pushed the bottom end of "business casual".</p><p>You have to think about this though:<br>The outsourced company they could hire to replace your department will almost definately wear some sort of team shirt when they are in the office.<br>In fact, I bet they'd be happy to.</p><p>In my current job, the entire network engineering team was given a full set of various style company logo shirts. We are to wear these<br>when visiting customer and vendor sites, or perhaps on days when there are meetings with various in-house departments.<br>I don't have a problem with it. It isn't a hard rule to follow. There's nothing wrong with projecting a consistent professional company image<br>when interfacing with the public or other companies.</p><p>The shirts are also good to wear on days when visiting head-end buildings working on racks or running wiring or fibers along the rails where<br>all the nasty dust bunnies are. No sense in dirtying up personal clothes<nobr> <wbr></nobr>:)</p></htmltext>
<tokenext>I tend to think that if management is pushing this down , then there 's probably been an issue with the IT team dressing appropriately.I 've been in large companies over the years and some of the IT people really pushed the bottom end of " business casual " .You have to think about this though : The outsourced company they could hire to replace your department will almost definately wear some sort of team shirt when they are in the office.In fact , I bet they 'd be happy to.In my current job , the entire network engineering team was given a full set of various style company logo shirts .
We are to wear thesewhen visiting customer and vendor sites , or perhaps on days when there are meetings with various in-house departments.I do n't have a problem with it .
It is n't a hard rule to follow .
There 's nothing wrong with projecting a consistent professional company imagewhen interfacing with the public or other companies.The shirts are also good to wear on days when visiting head-end buildings working on racks or running wiring or fibers along the rails whereall the nasty dust bunnies are .
No sense in dirtying up personal clothes : )</tokentext>
<sentencetext>I tend to think that if management is pushing this down, then there's probably been an issue with the IT team dressing appropriately.I've been in large companies over the years and some of the IT people really pushed the bottom end of "business casual".You have to think about this though:The outsourced company they could hire to replace your department will almost definately wear some sort of team shirt when they are in the office.In fact, I bet they'd be happy to.In my current job, the entire network engineering team was given a full set of various style company logo shirts.
We are to wear thesewhen visiting customer and vendor sites, or perhaps on days when there are meetings with various in-house departments.I don't have a problem with it.
It isn't a hard rule to follow.
There's nothing wrong with projecting a consistent professional company imagewhen interfacing with the public or other companies.The shirts are also good to wear on days when visiting head-end buildings working on racks or running wiring or fibers along the rails whereall the nasty dust bunnies are.
No sense in dirtying up personal clothes :)</sentencetext>
</comment>
<comment>
	<id>http://www.semanticweb.org/ontologies/ConversationInstances.owl#comment09_12_29_2129221.30587132</id>
	<title>Other Roles Would Be Good Too</title>
	<author>Anonymous</author>
	<datestamp>1262084160000</datestamp>
	<modclass>Funny</modclass>
	<modscore>3</modscore>
	<htmltext>While we're on the subject, I'd like sales people to be readily recognizable as well. Perhaps a red S emblazoned on their forehead with a red-hot branding iron.</htmltext>
<tokenext>While we 're on the subject , I 'd like sales people to be readily recognizable as well .
Perhaps a red S emblazoned on their forehead with a red-hot branding iron .</tokentext>
<sentencetext>While we're on the subject, I'd like sales people to be readily recognizable as well.
Perhaps a red S emblazoned on their forehead with a red-hot branding iron.</sentencetext>
</comment>
<comment>
	<id>http://www.semanticweb.org/ontologies/ConversationInstances.owl#comment09_12_29_2129221.30587180</id>
	<title>Idea has been floated up the management chain</title>
	<author>Anonymous</author>
	<datestamp>1262084280000</datestamp>
	<modclass>None</modclass>
	<modscore>0</modscore>
	<htmltext><p>In most companies, the shit flows in the opposite direction.</p></htmltext>
<tokenext>In most companies , the shit flows in the opposite direction .</tokentext>
<sentencetext>In most companies, the shit flows in the opposite direction.</sentencetext>
</comment>
<comment>
	<id>http://www.semanticweb.org/ontologies/ConversationInstances.owl#comment09_12_29_2129221.30590834</id>
	<title>Re:How is a uniform unprofessional?</title>
	<author>Anonymous</author>
	<datestamp>1262111220000</datestamp>
	<modclass>None</modclass>
	<modscore>0</modscore>
	<htmltext><p>Doctors, nurses, and mechanics wear uniforms to keep blood and oil off of their clothes.  Police officers and firemen wear a uniform so we can flag them down, as well as some parts being functional for their jobs.</p><p>A dress shirt for an IT worker doesn't fill any obvious functional role like the rest of your examples do.</p></htmltext>
<tokenext>Doctors , nurses , and mechanics wear uniforms to keep blood and oil off of their clothes .
Police officers and firemen wear a uniform so we can flag them down , as well as some parts being functional for their jobs.A dress shirt for an IT worker does n't fill any obvious functional role like the rest of your examples do .</tokentext>
<sentencetext>Doctors, nurses, and mechanics wear uniforms to keep blood and oil off of their clothes.
Police officers and firemen wear a uniform so we can flag them down, as well as some parts being functional for their jobs.A dress shirt for an IT worker doesn't fill any obvious functional role like the rest of your examples do.</sentencetext>
	<parent>http://www.semanticweb.org/ontologies/ConversationInstances.owl#comment09_12_29_2129221.30588048</parent>
</comment>
<comment>
	<id>http://www.semanticweb.org/ontologies/ConversationInstances.owl#comment09_12_29_2129221.30587938</id>
	<title>Re:30 IT people in a 500 employee company?!</title>
	<author>Anonymous</author>
	<datestamp>1262086920000</datestamp>
	<modclass>None</modclass>
	<modscore>0</modscore>
	<htmltext><p><div class="quote"><p>What are most of you DOING?  I work for a company with over 800 employees, approximately 600 or so who directly use computers, that has 16 locations in the Eastern USA and we make do with TWO.</p></div><p>I hear that.  I cover a region from Mississippi to Oklahoma and the company as a whole has 6 "Help Desk" guys who play every role in the IT spectrum.  on the flip side of the argument, I once worked for a hospital that employeed roughly 30 techs just to keep the nurses in line.  Those crazy women could bring down a citrix thinclient with the flick of a wrist.</p></div>
	</htmltext>
<tokenext>What are most of you DOING ?
I work for a company with over 800 employees , approximately 600 or so who directly use computers , that has 16 locations in the Eastern USA and we make do with TWO.I hear that .
I cover a region from Mississippi to Oklahoma and the company as a whole has 6 " Help Desk " guys who play every role in the IT spectrum .
on the flip side of the argument , I once worked for a hospital that employeed roughly 30 techs just to keep the nurses in line .
Those crazy women could bring down a citrix thinclient with the flick of a wrist .</tokentext>
<sentencetext>What are most of you DOING?
I work for a company with over 800 employees, approximately 600 or so who directly use computers, that has 16 locations in the Eastern USA and we make do with TWO.I hear that.
I cover a region from Mississippi to Oklahoma and the company as a whole has 6 "Help Desk" guys who play every role in the IT spectrum.
on the flip side of the argument, I once worked for a hospital that employeed roughly 30 techs just to keep the nurses in line.
Those crazy women could bring down a citrix thinclient with the flick of a wrist.
	</sentencetext>
	<parent>http://www.semanticweb.org/ontologies/ConversationInstances.owl#comment09_12_29_2129221.30587272</parent>
</comment>
<comment>
	<id>http://www.semanticweb.org/ontologies/ConversationInstances.owl#comment09_12_29_2129221.30587986</id>
	<title>An Idea:</title>
	<author>TheAngryMob</author>
	<datestamp>1262087100000</datestamp>
	<modclass>None</modclass>
	<modscore>1</modscore>
	<htmltext><p>White sleeveless dress shirt and black tie.</p><p>Classy and sexy all at once!</p></htmltext>
<tokenext>White sleeveless dress shirt and black tie.Classy and sexy all at once !</tokentext>
<sentencetext>White sleeveless dress shirt and black tie.Classy and sexy all at once!</sentencetext>
</comment>
<comment>
	<id>http://www.semanticweb.org/ontologies/ConversationInstances.owl#comment09_12_29_2129221.30587808</id>
	<title>Free Clothes?</title>
	<author>stewbacca</author>
	<datestamp>1262086440000</datestamp>
	<modclass>None</modclass>
	<modscore>1</modscore>
	<htmltext><p>If they give them to you and you don't have to go out and buy work clothes, then I'd wear one!</p></htmltext>
<tokenext>If they give them to you and you do n't have to go out and buy work clothes , then I 'd wear one !</tokentext>
<sentencetext>If they give them to you and you don't have to go out and buy work clothes, then I'd wear one!</sentencetext>
</comment>
<comment>
	<id>http://www.semanticweb.org/ontologies/ConversationInstances.owl#comment09_12_29_2129221.30592772</id>
	<title>Re:30 IT people in a 500 employee company?!</title>
	<author>Anonymous</author>
	<datestamp>1259852760000</datestamp>
	<modclass>Informativ</modclass>
	<modscore>1</modscore>
	<htmltext><p>500 users here, in a Public Company. Large infrastructure. Multiple locals spanning from Idaho to Indiana. We've got three staff members. Me for severs, network, and comps. Another for ERP, and finally a director.... So srsly.... what do you guys do all day?</p><p>Beyond that, the "IT Guys" do get away with alot here. I daily wear jeans, sneakers and polo shirts, and have been known to wear jeans with holes and t-shirts with random IT sayings on them. (My favorite is the "No I will not fix your computer" shirt.)</p><p>We get that slack from management because we know our job and do it well. No help desk, I run over 35 Servers, hundreds of computers, Cisco VOIP, Time Clocks, Wireless, Switches, Routers, Edge, etc. etc. etc.</p><p>If they told me "uniform or bust." I'd say, "Uptime or Uniforms?" IT people don't "make" money for most companies, but what we need to do as a whole is realize where our place actually is in an organization. I've been playing this game too long for someone to make me look like a drive thru attendant. Here's the deal, you have to earn respect, and then you can say no to things. If you haven't earned that respect yet, then you will just have to go along with it or quit. That's always been my rule.</p></htmltext>
<tokenext>500 users here , in a Public Company .
Large infrastructure .
Multiple locals spanning from Idaho to Indiana .
We 've got three staff members .
Me for severs , network , and comps .
Another for ERP , and finally a director.... So srsly.... what do you guys do all day ? Beyond that , the " IT Guys " do get away with alot here .
I daily wear jeans , sneakers and polo shirts , and have been known to wear jeans with holes and t-shirts with random IT sayings on them .
( My favorite is the " No I will not fix your computer " shirt .
) We get that slack from management because we know our job and do it well .
No help desk , I run over 35 Servers , hundreds of computers , Cisco VOIP , Time Clocks , Wireless , Switches , Routers , Edge , etc .
etc. etc.If they told me " uniform or bust .
" I 'd say , " Uptime or Uniforms ?
" IT people do n't " make " money for most companies , but what we need to do as a whole is realize where our place actually is in an organization .
I 've been playing this game too long for someone to make me look like a drive thru attendant .
Here 's the deal , you have to earn respect , and then you can say no to things .
If you have n't earned that respect yet , then you will just have to go along with it or quit .
That 's always been my rule .</tokentext>
<sentencetext>500 users here, in a Public Company.
Large infrastructure.
Multiple locals spanning from Idaho to Indiana.
We've got three staff members.
Me for severs, network, and comps.
Another for ERP, and finally a director.... So srsly.... what do you guys do all day?Beyond that, the "IT Guys" do get away with alot here.
I daily wear jeans, sneakers and polo shirts, and have been known to wear jeans with holes and t-shirts with random IT sayings on them.
(My favorite is the "No I will not fix your computer" shirt.
)We get that slack from management because we know our job and do it well.
No help desk, I run over 35 Servers, hundreds of computers, Cisco VOIP, Time Clocks, Wireless, Switches, Routers, Edge, etc.
etc. etc.If they told me "uniform or bust.
" I'd say, "Uptime or Uniforms?
" IT people don't "make" money for most companies, but what we need to do as a whole is realize where our place actually is in an organization.
I've been playing this game too long for someone to make me look like a drive thru attendant.
Here's the deal, you have to earn respect, and then you can say no to things.
If you haven't earned that respect yet, then you will just have to go along with it or quit.
That's always been my rule.</sentencetext>
	<parent>http://www.semanticweb.org/ontologies/ConversationInstances.owl#comment09_12_29_2129221.30587272</parent>
</comment>
<comment>
	<id>http://www.semanticweb.org/ontologies/ConversationInstances.owl#comment09_12_29_2129221.30588756</id>
	<title>Uni what</title>
	<author>Anonymous</author>
	<datestamp>1262091060000</datestamp>
	<modclass>None</modclass>
	<modscore>0</modscore>
	<htmltext><p>What a stupid FUCKING IDEA, some dipshit in HR came up with this huh? So are the execs suppossed to dress like used car salesman to represent themselves as the scum bags they are? Or the Accounting folks suppossed to dress with pocket protectors and glasses to look like bean counters?</p><p>Fucking ass tards</p></htmltext>
<tokenext>What a stupid FUCKING IDEA , some dipshit in HR came up with this huh ?
So are the execs suppossed to dress like used car salesman to represent themselves as the scum bags they are ?
Or the Accounting folks suppossed to dress with pocket protectors and glasses to look like bean counters ? Fucking ass tards</tokentext>
<sentencetext>What a stupid FUCKING IDEA, some dipshit in HR came up with this huh?
So are the execs suppossed to dress like used car salesman to represent themselves as the scum bags they are?
Or the Accounting folks suppossed to dress with pocket protectors and glasses to look like bean counters?Fucking ass tards</sentencetext>
</comment>
<comment>
	<id>http://www.semanticweb.org/ontologies/ConversationInstances.owl#comment09_12_29_2129221.30587448</id>
	<title>Keep it clean!</title>
	<author>SoundGuyNoise</author>
	<datestamp>1262085180000</datestamp>
	<modclass>None</modclass>
	<modscore>1</modscore>
	<htmltext>Will the company pay for the additional cost of laundry as well?</htmltext>
<tokenext>Will the company pay for the additional cost of laundry as well ?</tokentext>
<sentencetext>Will the company pay for the additional cost of laundry as well?</sentencetext>
</comment>
<comment>
	<id>http://www.semanticweb.org/ontologies/ConversationInstances.owl#comment09_12_29_2129221.30588912</id>
	<title>Re:Economy</title>
	<author>jschrod</author>
	<datestamp>1262092080000</datestamp>
	<modclass>None</modclass>
	<modscore>1</modscore>
	<htmltext>Hey, our IT staff is 5 out of 6 people. The 6th also has a M.Sc. in Computer Science, as we all have at least, and is just most of the time too busy with business management contracts to handle technical contracts.
<p>
Why do we do our IT ourselves? This is sometimes called "eating your own dog food", if we recommend stuff to our customers, we need to know it.
</p><p>
And don't tell me we're mismanaged, I'm the CEO.<nobr> <wbr></nobr>;-)
</p><p>
Or, in other words: Don't judge other businesses where you have no idea what they're doing.</p></htmltext>
<tokenext>Hey , our IT staff is 5 out of 6 people .
The 6th also has a M.Sc .
in Computer Science , as we all have at least , and is just most of the time too busy with business management contracts to handle technical contracts .
Why do we do our IT ourselves ?
This is sometimes called " eating your own dog food " , if we recommend stuff to our customers , we need to know it .
And do n't tell me we 're mismanaged , I 'm the CEO .
; - ) Or , in other words : Do n't judge other businesses where you have no idea what they 're doing .</tokentext>
<sentencetext>Hey, our IT staff is 5 out of 6 people.
The 6th also has a M.Sc.
in Computer Science, as we all have at least, and is just most of the time too busy with business management contracts to handle technical contracts.
Why do we do our IT ourselves?
This is sometimes called "eating your own dog food", if we recommend stuff to our customers, we need to know it.
And don't tell me we're mismanaged, I'm the CEO.
;-)

Or, in other words: Don't judge other businesses where you have no idea what they're doing.</sentencetext>
	<parent>http://www.semanticweb.org/ontologies/ConversationInstances.owl#comment09_12_29_2129221.30587094</parent>
</comment>
<comment>
	<id>http://www.semanticweb.org/ontologies/ConversationInstances.owl#comment09_12_29_2129221.30587668</id>
	<title>alternatives</title>
	<author>Anonymous</author>
	<datestamp>1262085900000</datestamp>
	<modclass>None</modclass>
	<modscore>0</modscore>
	<htmltext><p>I would suggest that if you want to avoid this you should suggest some less onerous alternatives.  For example, a big ID badge or something similar that is visible enough to distinguish the help desk folk but still allow you to wear your own clothes.  Or maybe fancy hats.  Or balloons; everyone likes balloons.</p></htmltext>
<tokenext>I would suggest that if you want to avoid this you should suggest some less onerous alternatives .
For example , a big ID badge or something similar that is visible enough to distinguish the help desk folk but still allow you to wear your own clothes .
Or maybe fancy hats .
Or balloons ; everyone likes balloons .</tokentext>
<sentencetext>I would suggest that if you want to avoid this you should suggest some less onerous alternatives.
For example, a big ID badge or something similar that is visible enough to distinguish the help desk folk but still allow you to wear your own clothes.
Or maybe fancy hats.
Or balloons; everyone likes balloons.</sentencetext>
</comment>
<comment>
	<id>http://www.semanticweb.org/ontologies/ConversationInstances.owl#comment09_12_29_2129221.30591388</id>
	<title>Re:30 IT people in a 500 employee company?!</title>
	<author>BlueBoxSW.com</author>
	<datestamp>1259832420000</datestamp>
	<modclass>None</modclass>
	<modscore>1</modscore>
	<htmltext><p>Yes, but not everyone has Macs.</p></htmltext>
<tokenext>Yes , but not everyone has Macs .</tokentext>
<sentencetext>Yes, but not everyone has Macs.</sentencetext>
	<parent>http://www.semanticweb.org/ontologies/ConversationInstances.owl#comment09_12_29_2129221.30587272</parent>
</comment>
<comment>
	<id>http://www.semanticweb.org/ontologies/ConversationInstances.owl#comment09_12_29_2129221.30587096</id>
	<title>Professionalism</title>
	<author>Anonymous</author>
	<datestamp>1262084040000</datestamp>
	<modclass>Interestin</modclass>
	<modscore>4</modscore>
	<htmltext><p>Does the company have an existing dress code? Do the IT guys follow that dress code well?</p><p>Let's be honest: IT guys have a reputation for being a bit sloppy. If that's the case here, perhaps the right approach would be for the team to do a better job of looking professional.</p><p>But if the team is already meeting the same expectations as the other employees, this just sounds like a giant waste of time. Money, energy and resources wasted on this would probably be better spent on something worthwhile that would actually have an impact on the team's ability to provide quality service.</p></htmltext>
<tokenext>Does the company have an existing dress code ?
Do the IT guys follow that dress code well ? Let 's be honest : IT guys have a reputation for being a bit sloppy .
If that 's the case here , perhaps the right approach would be for the team to do a better job of looking professional.But if the team is already meeting the same expectations as the other employees , this just sounds like a giant waste of time .
Money , energy and resources wasted on this would probably be better spent on something worthwhile that would actually have an impact on the team 's ability to provide quality service .</tokentext>
<sentencetext>Does the company have an existing dress code?
Do the IT guys follow that dress code well?Let's be honest: IT guys have a reputation for being a bit sloppy.
If that's the case here, perhaps the right approach would be for the team to do a better job of looking professional.But if the team is already meeting the same expectations as the other employees, this just sounds like a giant waste of time.
Money, energy and resources wasted on this would probably be better spent on something worthwhile that would actually have an impact on the team's ability to provide quality service.</sentencetext>
</comment>
<comment>
	<id>http://www.semanticweb.org/ontologies/ConversationInstances.owl#comment09_12_29_2129221.30588714</id>
	<title>Appropriate Wear</title>
	<author>AtrN</author>
	<datestamp>1262090880000</datestamp>
	<modclass>None</modclass>
	<modscore>1</modscore>
	<htmltext>Dress like fire fighters.</htmltext>
<tokenext>Dress like fire fighters .</tokentext>
<sentencetext>Dress like fire fighters.</sentencetext>
</comment>
<comment>
	<id>http://www.semanticweb.org/ontologies/ConversationInstances.owl#comment09_12_29_2129221.30587290</id>
	<title>Uniforms are communication</title>
	<author>Primitive Pete</author>
	<datestamp>1262084640000</datestamp>
	<modclass>None</modclass>
	<modscore>1</modscore>
	<htmltext>The real issue of concern for me would be that many uniforms are associated with either semi-skilled jobs (fast food) or positions that require special garments to perform work (soldiers, firefighters). Most help-desk people that I've known (and the one I used to be) think of  themselves as office professionals.

What message does the uniform send to the non-IT staff with whom the help desk has contact. Clearly, you don't want to send messages that amount to either "semi-skilled" or "willing to move filing cabinets."</htmltext>
<tokenext>The real issue of concern for me would be that many uniforms are associated with either semi-skilled jobs ( fast food ) or positions that require special garments to perform work ( soldiers , firefighters ) .
Most help-desk people that I 've known ( and the one I used to be ) think of themselves as office professionals .
What message does the uniform send to the non-IT staff with whom the help desk has contact .
Clearly , you do n't want to send messages that amount to either " semi-skilled " or " willing to move filing cabinets .
"</tokentext>
<sentencetext>The real issue of concern for me would be that many uniforms are associated with either semi-skilled jobs (fast food) or positions that require special garments to perform work (soldiers, firefighters).
Most help-desk people that I've known (and the one I used to be) think of  themselves as office professionals.
What message does the uniform send to the non-IT staff with whom the help desk has contact.
Clearly, you don't want to send messages that amount to either "semi-skilled" or "willing to move filing cabinets.
"</sentencetext>
</comment>
<comment>
	<id>http://www.semanticweb.org/ontologies/ConversationInstances.owl#comment09_12_29_2129221.30589418</id>
	<title>Re:Say goodbye to your lunchbreak</title>
	<author>bickerdyke</author>
	<datestamp>1262096280000</datestamp>
	<modclass>None</modclass>
	<modscore>1</modscore>
	<htmltext><p>That would even be an advantage to, say, orange jackets or vests. Don't wear them during lunch break. Vest of = off duty.</p></htmltext>
<tokenext>That would even be an advantage to , say , orange jackets or vests .
Do n't wear them during lunch break .
Vest of = off duty .</tokentext>
<sentencetext>That would even be an advantage to, say, orange jackets or vests.
Don't wear them during lunch break.
Vest of = off duty.</sentencetext>
	<parent>http://www.semanticweb.org/ontologies/ConversationInstances.owl#comment09_12_29_2129221.30587186</parent>
</comment>
<comment>
	<id>http://www.semanticweb.org/ontologies/ConversationInstances.owl#comment09_12_29_2129221.30590482</id>
	<title>You wear...</title>
	<author>Deadstick</author>
	<datestamp>1262106900000</datestamp>
	<modclass>None</modclass>
	<modscore>1</modscore>
	<htmltext><p>...an expensive, delicate suit to show that you don't have to do any physical work. You wear a uniform to show that your identity is a three-ring binder.</p><p>rj</p></htmltext>
<tokenext>...an expensive , delicate suit to show that you do n't have to do any physical work .
You wear a uniform to show that your identity is a three-ring binder.rj</tokentext>
<sentencetext>...an expensive, delicate suit to show that you don't have to do any physical work.
You wear a uniform to show that your identity is a three-ring binder.rj</sentencetext>
</comment>
<comment>
	<id>http://www.semanticweb.org/ontologies/ConversationInstances.owl#comment09_12_29_2129221.30587730</id>
	<title>Re:I like uniforms</title>
	<author>Anonymous</author>
	<datestamp>1262086140000</datestamp>
	<modclass>Flamebait</modclass>
	<modscore>-1</modscore>
	<htmltext><blockquote><div><p>Oh, and the reason I prefer not to wear a uniform is so I can express myself. My employer can't take away my individuality!</p></div> </blockquote><p>Let me guess, you're Gen-Y.</p><p>You have no right to self-expression on the job, and yeah, they can take away your individuality. Do the damned job you're paid to do, wear your uniform, and STFU.</p><p>Seriously.</p></div>
	</htmltext>
<tokenext>Oh , and the reason I prefer not to wear a uniform is so I can express myself .
My employer ca n't take away my individuality !
Let me guess , you 're Gen-Y.You have no right to self-expression on the job , and yeah , they can take away your individuality .
Do the damned job you 're paid to do , wear your uniform , and STFU.Seriously .</tokentext>
<sentencetext>Oh, and the reason I prefer not to wear a uniform is so I can express myself.
My employer can't take away my individuality!
Let me guess, you're Gen-Y.You have no right to self-expression on the job, and yeah, they can take away your individuality.
Do the damned job you're paid to do, wear your uniform, and STFU.Seriously.
	</sentencetext>
	<parent>http://www.semanticweb.org/ontologies/ConversationInstances.owl#comment09_12_29_2129221.30587390</parent>
</comment>
<comment>
	<id>http://www.semanticweb.org/ontologies/ConversationInstances.owl#comment09_12_29_2129221.30587600</id>
	<title>Social Status</title>
	<author>Anonymous</author>
	<datestamp>1262085660000</datestamp>
	<modclass>None</modclass>
	<modscore>0</modscore>
	<htmltext><p>Just think of it as management's little way of knocking you down a peg or two by making you look like blue collar technicians thereby making their ignorant selves gain a little bit of social status.</p><p>Don't be surprised to be asked to change their oil as well</p></htmltext>
<tokenext>Just think of it as management 's little way of knocking you down a peg or two by making you look like blue collar technicians thereby making their ignorant selves gain a little bit of social status.Do n't be surprised to be asked to change their oil as well</tokentext>
<sentencetext>Just think of it as management's little way of knocking you down a peg or two by making you look like blue collar technicians thereby making their ignorant selves gain a little bit of social status.Don't be surprised to be asked to change their oil as well</sentencetext>
</comment>
<comment>
	<id>http://www.semanticweb.org/ontologies/ConversationInstances.owl#comment09_12_29_2129221.30590352</id>
	<title>The Geek Uniform?</title>
	<author>bromoseltzer</author>
	<datestamp>1262105400000</datestamp>
	<modclass>None</modclass>
	<modscore>1</modscore>
	<htmltext><p>True geeks wear white lab coats.  That's what I'd want!</p><p>Think <a href="http://muppet.wikia.com/wiki/Beaker" title="wikia.com">Beaker</a> [wikia.com].</p></htmltext>
<tokenext>True geeks wear white lab coats .
That 's what I 'd want ! Think Beaker [ wikia.com ] .</tokentext>
<sentencetext>True geeks wear white lab coats.
That's what I'd want!Think Beaker [wikia.com].</sentencetext>
</comment>
<comment>
	<id>http://www.semanticweb.org/ontologies/ConversationInstances.owl#comment09_12_29_2129221.30587872</id>
	<title>Re:I like uniforms</title>
	<author>Anonymous</author>
	<datestamp>1262086620000</datestamp>
	<modclass>None</modclass>
	<modscore>1</modscore>
	<htmltext><p>I own 5 shirts. The time it takes me decide which one to wear is not long. Maybe you have too many clothes. Maybe you are a girl?</p><p>But I agree, let the support staff standout.</p></htmltext>
<tokenext>I own 5 shirts .
The time it takes me decide which one to wear is not long .
Maybe you have too many clothes .
Maybe you are a girl ? But I agree , let the support staff standout .</tokentext>
<sentencetext>I own 5 shirts.
The time it takes me decide which one to wear is not long.
Maybe you have too many clothes.
Maybe you are a girl?But I agree, let the support staff standout.</sentencetext>
	<parent>http://www.semanticweb.org/ontologies/ConversationInstances.owl#comment09_12_29_2129221.30587120</parent>
</comment>
<comment>
	<id>http://www.semanticweb.org/ontologies/ConversationInstances.owl#comment09_12_29_2129221.30587898</id>
	<title>Terms and Conditions</title>
	<author>Anonymous</author>
	<datestamp>1262086800000</datestamp>
	<modclass>None</modclass>
	<modscore>0</modscore>
	<htmltext><p>Making you wear a uniform is effectively a change in the terms and conditions of your contract. Therefore you have to agree to them before they can make the change. If you don't agree, they can't make you wear a uniform.</p><p>Or at least that is how it is in the UK.</p></htmltext>
<tokenext>Making you wear a uniform is effectively a change in the terms and conditions of your contract .
Therefore you have to agree to them before they can make the change .
If you do n't agree , they ca n't make you wear a uniform.Or at least that is how it is in the UK .</tokentext>
<sentencetext>Making you wear a uniform is effectively a change in the terms and conditions of your contract.
Therefore you have to agree to them before they can make the change.
If you don't agree, they can't make you wear a uniform.Or at least that is how it is in the UK.</sentencetext>
</comment>
<comment>
	<id>http://www.semanticweb.org/ontologies/ConversationInstances.owl#comment09_12_29_2129221.30589384</id>
	<title>Re:Well...</title>
	<author>Anonymous</author>
	<datestamp>1262095980000</datestamp>
	<modclass>None</modclass>
	<modscore>0</modscore>
	<htmltext><p>If you are, indeed, doing all of this work, you are grossly underpaid @ $40K a year. It is surely time to get out.</p></htmltext>
<tokenext>If you are , indeed , doing all of this work , you are grossly underpaid @ $ 40K a year .
It is surely time to get out .</tokentext>
<sentencetext>If you are, indeed, doing all of this work, you are grossly underpaid @ $40K a year.
It is surely time to get out.</sentencetext>
	<parent>http://www.semanticweb.org/ontologies/ConversationInstances.owl#comment09_12_29_2129221.30587462</parent>
</comment>
<comment>
	<id>http://www.semanticweb.org/ontologies/ConversationInstances.owl#comment09_12_29_2129221.30592362</id>
	<title>I have a uniform already.</title>
	<author>kklein</author>
	<datestamp>1259849100000</datestamp>
	<modclass>None</modclass>
	<modscore>1</modscore>
	<htmltext><p>I have a uniform already. It's called "collared shirt, no jeans, and a tie." Because, you know, I'm a grownup.

</p><p>Most people have uniforms of some kind. Have you considered that maybe the IT department looks like crap? Too many stained anime t-shirts?

</p><p>Also, to all the people asking, "what, do they think that we are blue-collar workers?": The answer is "yes," because that is what you are. You do not need a degree to do your job (my best-paid IT-industry friend dropped out of HIGH SCHOOL--no GED). You have a list of licenses and test qualifications. You <i>are</i> peons. Get used to it or get out.

</p><p>And yes, I've done that job as well. I'm not saying it's <i>fair</i> to be viewed as peons, but that is indeed what they are. They are basically on the same level as janitors and food service. In the company but not of it.

</p><p>Finally, how about this: It might not be so bad. Honestly, I'm thinking of changing careers, and if I do, the company I'll be at will require me to wear a polo shirt with a logo on it. There are a lot of styles available, and I'm stoked. I can go back to spending most of my clothes budget on clothes for playing instead of clothes for working! It's not all bad.</p></htmltext>
<tokenext>I have a uniform already .
It 's called " collared shirt , no jeans , and a tie .
" Because , you know , I 'm a grownup .
Most people have uniforms of some kind .
Have you considered that maybe the IT department looks like crap ?
Too many stained anime t-shirts ?
Also , to all the people asking , " what , do they think that we are blue-collar workers ?
" : The answer is " yes , " because that is what you are .
You do not need a degree to do your job ( my best-paid IT-industry friend dropped out of HIGH SCHOOL--no GED ) .
You have a list of licenses and test qualifications .
You are peons .
Get used to it or get out .
And yes , I 've done that job as well .
I 'm not saying it 's fair to be viewed as peons , but that is indeed what they are .
They are basically on the same level as janitors and food service .
In the company but not of it .
Finally , how about this : It might not be so bad .
Honestly , I 'm thinking of changing careers , and if I do , the company I 'll be at will require me to wear a polo shirt with a logo on it .
There are a lot of styles available , and I 'm stoked .
I can go back to spending most of my clothes budget on clothes for playing instead of clothes for working !
It 's not all bad .</tokentext>
<sentencetext>I have a uniform already.
It's called "collared shirt, no jeans, and a tie.
" Because, you know, I'm a grownup.
Most people have uniforms of some kind.
Have you considered that maybe the IT department looks like crap?
Too many stained anime t-shirts?
Also, to all the people asking, "what, do they think that we are blue-collar workers?
": The answer is "yes," because that is what you are.
You do not need a degree to do your job (my best-paid IT-industry friend dropped out of HIGH SCHOOL--no GED).
You have a list of licenses and test qualifications.
You are peons.
Get used to it or get out.
And yes, I've done that job as well.
I'm not saying it's fair to be viewed as peons, but that is indeed what they are.
They are basically on the same level as janitors and food service.
In the company but not of it.
Finally, how about this: It might not be so bad.
Honestly, I'm thinking of changing careers, and if I do, the company I'll be at will require me to wear a polo shirt with a logo on it.
There are a lot of styles available, and I'm stoked.
I can go back to spending most of my clothes budget on clothes for playing instead of clothes for working!
It's not all bad.</sentencetext>
</comment>
<comment>
	<id>http://www.semanticweb.org/ontologies/ConversationInstances.owl#comment09_12_29_2129221.30587716</id>
	<title>Re:I like uniforms</title>
	<author>ArsonSmith</author>
	<datestamp>1262086140000</datestamp>
	<modclass>Insightful</modclass>
	<modscore>4</modscore>
	<htmltext><p>"Oh, and the reason I prefer not to wear a uniform is so I can express myself."</p><p>What are you, 13?</p></htmltext>
<tokenext>" Oh , and the reason I prefer not to wear a uniform is so I can express myself .
" What are you , 13 ?</tokentext>
<sentencetext>"Oh, and the reason I prefer not to wear a uniform is so I can express myself.
"What are you, 13?</sentencetext>
	<parent>http://www.semanticweb.org/ontologies/ConversationInstances.owl#comment09_12_29_2129221.30587390</parent>
</comment>
<comment>
	<id>http://www.semanticweb.org/ontologies/ConversationInstances.owl#comment09_12_29_2129221.30712488</id>
	<title>degrading</title>
	<author>Teriblows</author>
	<datestamp>1231521600000</datestamp>
	<modclass>None</modclass>
	<modscore>1</modscore>
	<htmltext>unless its a place where everyone else is already in uniform it only screams that the it staff are of low social position within the company and are basically on the level of janitorial staff or the cable guy:P  its a visual separation from the "normal" workers which is simply unnecessary.  unless its a specific service business like a store or restaurant uniforms only are there to differentiate the help from everyone else. lunch ladies and janitors wear uniforms, not the teachers.</htmltext>
<tokenext>unless its a place where everyone else is already in uniform it only screams that the it staff are of low social position within the company and are basically on the level of janitorial staff or the cable guy : P its a visual separation from the " normal " workers which is simply unnecessary .
unless its a specific service business like a store or restaurant uniforms only are there to differentiate the help from everyone else .
lunch ladies and janitors wear uniforms , not the teachers .</tokentext>
<sentencetext>unless its a place where everyone else is already in uniform it only screams that the it staff are of low social position within the company and are basically on the level of janitorial staff or the cable guy:P  its a visual separation from the "normal" workers which is simply unnecessary.
unless its a specific service business like a store or restaurant uniforms only are there to differentiate the help from everyone else.
lunch ladies and janitors wear uniforms, not the teachers.</sentencetext>
</comment>
<comment>
	<id>http://www.semanticweb.org/ontologies/ConversationInstances.owl#comment09_12_29_2129221.30591610</id>
	<title>Why the unhealthy stratification?</title>
	<author>d3athp3nguin</author>
	<datestamp>1259835780000</datestamp>
	<modclass>None</modclass>
	<modscore>1</modscore>
	<htmltext><p>I second other opinions that the special outfits idea is a band-aid for another issue, or a misconception of how IT staff should be viewed.</p><p>I understand the notion of mandatory uniforms for a franchise or company, like BestBuy or GeekSquad- you are encouraging a consistent user experience across the <i>entire</i> company, and that image is also part of the product or service you are selling.</p><p>However, why the need to make an internal IT department look like an outsourced support franchise?  Is the CIO trying a little too hard to "sell" the IT department to the rest of the company?  All you are doing is further alienating the support staff and making it harder for other employees to see them as coworkers.</p><p>In this context I would feel like I had just been demoted to "IT Janitor" with such a targeted uniform mandate.  I can hear the sales staff now: "Hey blue shirt, somehow a virus got on my machine and I need you to fix this pronto..."</p></htmltext>
<tokenext>I second other opinions that the special outfits idea is a band-aid for another issue , or a misconception of how IT staff should be viewed.I understand the notion of mandatory uniforms for a franchise or company , like BestBuy or GeekSquad- you are encouraging a consistent user experience across the entire company , and that image is also part of the product or service you are selling.However , why the need to make an internal IT department look like an outsourced support franchise ?
Is the CIO trying a little too hard to " sell " the IT department to the rest of the company ?
All you are doing is further alienating the support staff and making it harder for other employees to see them as coworkers.In this context I would feel like I had just been demoted to " IT Janitor " with such a targeted uniform mandate .
I can hear the sales staff now : " Hey blue shirt , somehow a virus got on my machine and I need you to fix this pronto... "</tokentext>
<sentencetext>I second other opinions that the special outfits idea is a band-aid for another issue, or a misconception of how IT staff should be viewed.I understand the notion of mandatory uniforms for a franchise or company, like BestBuy or GeekSquad- you are encouraging a consistent user experience across the entire company, and that image is also part of the product or service you are selling.However, why the need to make an internal IT department look like an outsourced support franchise?
Is the CIO trying a little too hard to "sell" the IT department to the rest of the company?
All you are doing is further alienating the support staff and making it harder for other employees to see them as coworkers.In this context I would feel like I had just been demoted to "IT Janitor" with such a targeted uniform mandate.
I can hear the sales staff now: "Hey blue shirt, somehow a virus got on my machine and I need you to fix this pronto..."</sentencetext>
</comment>
<comment>
	<id>http://www.semanticweb.org/ontologies/ConversationInstances.owl#comment09_12_29_2129221.30588068</id>
	<title>Solution</title>
	<author>fishbowl</author>
	<datestamp>1262087460000</datestamp>
	<modclass>None</modclass>
	<modscore>1</modscore>
	<htmltext><p>Wear a collared shirt and tie, pressed slacks, and dress shoes every day.<br>Get fired for this, and then let a jury hear about it.</p><p>Retire with your millions.</p></htmltext>
<tokenext>Wear a collared shirt and tie , pressed slacks , and dress shoes every day.Get fired for this , and then let a jury hear about it.Retire with your millions .</tokentext>
<sentencetext>Wear a collared shirt and tie, pressed slacks, and dress shoes every day.Get fired for this, and then let a jury hear about it.Retire with your millions.</sentencetext>
</comment>
<comment>
	<id>http://www.semanticweb.org/ontologies/ConversationInstances.owl#comment09_12_29_2129221.30592450</id>
	<title>Individuality Matters</title>
	<author>Mutatis Mutandis</author>
	<datestamp>1259850240000</datestamp>
	<modclass>None</modclass>
	<modscore>1</modscore>
	<htmltext><p>My experience is from the user side, and I would strongly discourage uniforms for the IT helpdesk, in fact for any helpdesk.</p><p>The reality of life is that individuality matters, especially in a person from which one seeks help: People need to establish personal contact. And when it comes to essential tools such as computers, which can make our workday hell if they don't work properly, trust matters a lot. Putting your helpdesk people in uniform is the first step to make them uniformized drones. It will have a bad effect on employee morale, not just of the people who wear the uniforms, but also the people who call on them.</p><p>My advice is to fight it, tooth and claw. Instead promote rapprochement between the helpdesk people and the business by making sure that when people call, they get the same helpdesk person whenever possible. Don't over-emphasize central helpdesk lines and by all means avoid trouble ticket systems -- I've never seen one that didn't succeed in infuriating the end users.</p></htmltext>
<tokenext>My experience is from the user side , and I would strongly discourage uniforms for the IT helpdesk , in fact for any helpdesk.The reality of life is that individuality matters , especially in a person from which one seeks help : People need to establish personal contact .
And when it comes to essential tools such as computers , which can make our workday hell if they do n't work properly , trust matters a lot .
Putting your helpdesk people in uniform is the first step to make them uniformized drones .
It will have a bad effect on employee morale , not just of the people who wear the uniforms , but also the people who call on them.My advice is to fight it , tooth and claw .
Instead promote rapprochement between the helpdesk people and the business by making sure that when people call , they get the same helpdesk person whenever possible .
Do n't over-emphasize central helpdesk lines and by all means avoid trouble ticket systems -- I 've never seen one that did n't succeed in infuriating the end users .</tokentext>
<sentencetext>My experience is from the user side, and I would strongly discourage uniforms for the IT helpdesk, in fact for any helpdesk.The reality of life is that individuality matters, especially in a person from which one seeks help: People need to establish personal contact.
And when it comes to essential tools such as computers, which can make our workday hell if they don't work properly, trust matters a lot.
Putting your helpdesk people in uniform is the first step to make them uniformized drones.
It will have a bad effect on employee morale, not just of the people who wear the uniforms, but also the people who call on them.My advice is to fight it, tooth and claw.
Instead promote rapprochement between the helpdesk people and the business by making sure that when people call, they get the same helpdesk person whenever possible.
Don't over-emphasize central helpdesk lines and by all means avoid trouble ticket systems -- I've never seen one that didn't succeed in infuriating the end users.</sentencetext>
</comment>
<comment>
	<id>http://www.semanticweb.org/ontologies/ConversationInstances.owl#comment09_12_29_2129221.30587140</id>
	<title>Perfect opportunity</title>
	<author>Anonymous</author>
	<datestamp>1262084220000</datestamp>
	<modclass>None</modclass>
	<modscore>1</modscore>
	<htmltext>I recommend something in <a href="http://bastardlogic.wordpress.com/2008/01/" title="wordpress.com">this style</a> [wordpress.com].</htmltext>
<tokenext>I recommend something in this style [ wordpress.com ] .</tokentext>
<sentencetext>I recommend something in this style [wordpress.com].</sentencetext>
</comment>
<comment>
	<id>http://www.semanticweb.org/ontologies/ConversationInstances.owl#comment09_12_29_2129221.30591442</id>
	<title>T-shirts could be fun...</title>
	<author>Anonymous</author>
	<datestamp>1259833200000</datestamp>
	<modclass>None</modclass>
	<modscore>0</modscore>
	<htmltext><p>... as long as the correct I.T. related slogan is used:</p><p>"Giving I.T. to you"</p><p>"Doing I.T. on your desktop"</p><p>or - to emphasise the caring nature of helpdesk work</p><p>"Tell someone who cares"</p></htmltext>
<tokenext>... as long as the correct I.T .
related slogan is used : " Giving I.T .
to you " " Doing I.T .
on your desktop " or - to emphasise the caring nature of helpdesk work " Tell someone who cares "</tokentext>
<sentencetext>... as long as the correct I.T.
related slogan is used:"Giving I.T.
to you""Doing I.T.
on your desktop"or - to emphasise the caring nature of helpdesk work"Tell someone who cares"</sentencetext>
</comment>
<comment>
	<id>http://www.semanticweb.org/ontologies/ConversationInstances.owl#comment09_12_29_2129221.30589720</id>
	<title>Only If I could pick the verbage</title>
	<author>teknosapien</author>
	<datestamp>1262099100000</datestamp>
	<modclass>None</modclass>
	<modscore>1</modscore>
	<htmltext>,<br>Like the old Think geek shirts 
<br> No I will not fix your computer  
<br> I read your email 
<br> you can be replaced by a small shell script 

<br> seriously though, a good IT department is basically unseen 
<br> if they are highly visible then are they not doing their jobs 
<br> The company I work for thought their IT department (think billions of revenue fortune 500 type)was over paid and not visible enough 
<br> that was until we lost corporate HQ and the IT department DR/BC plan kicked in. 
<br> Then they saw us but only briefly while we set them up at the DR sight then we were gone 
<br> The fact that we lost the building at 10 PM and business continued the very next day with out skipping a beat spoke volumes.

<br> so you may want to ask yourself(short of having a disaster) is this being done so management has an idea as to the worth of the help desk 
<br> and make them more visible to the general populace of the company you work for or is it a dumbing down of the IT department, in particular the help desk (think out sourcing)
<br> If it is the prior then it may be a good thing</htmltext>
<tokenext>,Like the old Think geek shirts No I will not fix your computer I read your email you can be replaced by a small shell script seriously though , a good IT department is basically unseen if they are highly visible then are they not doing their jobs The company I work for thought their IT department ( think billions of revenue fortune 500 type ) was over paid and not visible enough that was until we lost corporate HQ and the IT department DR/BC plan kicked in .
Then they saw us but only briefly while we set them up at the DR sight then we were gone The fact that we lost the building at 10 PM and business continued the very next day with out skipping a beat spoke volumes .
so you may want to ask yourself ( short of having a disaster ) is this being done so management has an idea as to the worth of the help desk and make them more visible to the general populace of the company you work for or is it a dumbing down of the IT department , in particular the help desk ( think out sourcing ) If it is the prior then it may be a good thing</tokentext>
<sentencetext>,Like the old Think geek shirts 
 No I will not fix your computer  
 I read your email 
 you can be replaced by a small shell script 

 seriously though, a good IT department is basically unseen 
 if they are highly visible then are they not doing their jobs 
 The company I work for thought their IT department (think billions of revenue fortune 500 type)was over paid and not visible enough 
 that was until we lost corporate HQ and the IT department DR/BC plan kicked in.
Then they saw us but only briefly while we set them up at the DR sight then we were gone 
 The fact that we lost the building at 10 PM and business continued the very next day with out skipping a beat spoke volumes.
so you may want to ask yourself(short of having a disaster) is this being done so management has an idea as to the worth of the help desk 
 and make them more visible to the general populace of the company you work for or is it a dumbing down of the IT department, in particular the help desk (think out sourcing)
 If it is the prior then it may be a good thing</sentencetext>
</comment>
<comment>
	<id>http://www.semanticweb.org/ontologies/ConversationInstances.owl#comment09_12_29_2129221.30591166</id>
	<title>Re:30 IT people in a 500 employee company?!</title>
	<author>Anonymous</author>
	<datestamp>1259870880000</datestamp>
	<modclass>None</modclass>
	<modscore>0</modscore>
	<htmltext><p>Then you must not handle much ever. Many larger companies deal with imaging machines, maintaining a running inventory of which machines are checked out, assisting people with phone calls over a variety of OS' (as some may have actual business needs for Win7 over WinXP/WinVista, or similarly for Mac OS X), ordering new machines as necessary, and keeping business desktops up-to-date and relevant.</p><p>So the real question is <i>what are <b>YOU</b> doing?</i></p></htmltext>
<tokenext>Then you must not handle much ever .
Many larger companies deal with imaging machines , maintaining a running inventory of which machines are checked out , assisting people with phone calls over a variety of OS ' ( as some may have actual business needs for Win7 over WinXP/WinVista , or similarly for Mac OS X ) , ordering new machines as necessary , and keeping business desktops up-to-date and relevant.So the real question is what are YOU doing ?</tokentext>
<sentencetext>Then you must not handle much ever.
Many larger companies deal with imaging machines, maintaining a running inventory of which machines are checked out, assisting people with phone calls over a variety of OS' (as some may have actual business needs for Win7 over WinXP/WinVista, or similarly for Mac OS X), ordering new machines as necessary, and keeping business desktops up-to-date and relevant.So the real question is what are YOU doing?</sentencetext>
	<parent>http://www.semanticweb.org/ontologies/ConversationInstances.owl#comment09_12_29_2129221.30587272</parent>
</comment>
<comment>
	<id>http://www.semanticweb.org/ontologies/ConversationInstances.owl#comment09_12_29_2129221.30588496</id>
	<title>Re:lovely</title>
	<author>Anonymous</author>
	<datestamp>1262089680000</datestamp>
	<modclass>Insightful</modclass>
	<modscore>3</modscore>
	<htmltext><i>I'm trying to think of other businesses that have that kind of uniform/plainclothes distinction. Delivery drivers, pest control people, UPS, the people who go out in the field wear the uniform. They're also the lowest paid of the bunch.</i> <br>
<br>
Those people aren't wearing a uniform because they're viewed as less important employees, but rather, for the other reason you mentioned -- they're the ones out in the field.  Having them wear a uniform does a few things: It keeps the company image visible to the public, and it also provides customers with at least some insurance that the random doofus knocking on their door or asking to be let into the office is, in fact, there for a legitimate reason.<br>
<br>
In some cases the "uniform" is less to maintain a uniform appearance among employees and more of a practical consideration.  You offered mechanics at dealerships as an example.  They're wearing coveralls because that's the only practical garment for someone who will be tinkering with grease and oil-covered engines all day.  What would you suggest they wear, a suit?  Besides, any dealership worth a damn appreciates skilled mechanics.
<br> <br>
Similarly, a chef's clothes are practical as well, at least to an extent.  The crisp white looks clean and hygenic and that's important for people to see from a chef.  The pockets along the sleeves and shirtfront are useful for carrying thermometers and other tools, and the double-breasted construction can be reversed to hide any accidental stains.  And you'd better believe that in any fine restaurant, the chef is highly valued.
<br> <br>
Another notable counterexample to your list is an airline pilot, who, particularly the more senior ones, can command an impressive salary with all kinds of perks and benefits, and is obviously nowhere near the bottom of the totem pole. <br>
<br>
<i>Pretty much anyone in uniform is on the lower end of the totem pole. </i> <br>
<br>
Perhaps, but at least in our culture, people expect service personnel to be in uniform.  Your examples are all service personnel.  And the truth is, helpdesk <b>is</b> the lowest end of the totem pole in IT.   <br>
<br>
Having worked helpdesk before I naturally balk at the idea, but in most places, I don't see how helpdesk is fundamentally any different from the waiters, cashiers, bus drivers, skycaps, security guards, and so forth, all of whom we expect to be in uniform.</htmltext>
<tokenext>I 'm trying to think of other businesses that have that kind of uniform/plainclothes distinction .
Delivery drivers , pest control people , UPS , the people who go out in the field wear the uniform .
They 're also the lowest paid of the bunch .
Those people are n't wearing a uniform because they 're viewed as less important employees , but rather , for the other reason you mentioned -- they 're the ones out in the field .
Having them wear a uniform does a few things : It keeps the company image visible to the public , and it also provides customers with at least some insurance that the random doofus knocking on their door or asking to be let into the office is , in fact , there for a legitimate reason .
In some cases the " uniform " is less to maintain a uniform appearance among employees and more of a practical consideration .
You offered mechanics at dealerships as an example .
They 're wearing coveralls because that 's the only practical garment for someone who will be tinkering with grease and oil-covered engines all day .
What would you suggest they wear , a suit ?
Besides , any dealership worth a damn appreciates skilled mechanics .
Similarly , a chef 's clothes are practical as well , at least to an extent .
The crisp white looks clean and hygenic and that 's important for people to see from a chef .
The pockets along the sleeves and shirtfront are useful for carrying thermometers and other tools , and the double-breasted construction can be reversed to hide any accidental stains .
And you 'd better believe that in any fine restaurant , the chef is highly valued .
Another notable counterexample to your list is an airline pilot , who , particularly the more senior ones , can command an impressive salary with all kinds of perks and benefits , and is obviously nowhere near the bottom of the totem pole .
Pretty much anyone in uniform is on the lower end of the totem pole .
Perhaps , but at least in our culture , people expect service personnel to be in uniform .
Your examples are all service personnel .
And the truth is , helpdesk is the lowest end of the totem pole in IT .
Having worked helpdesk before I naturally balk at the idea , but in most places , I do n't see how helpdesk is fundamentally any different from the waiters , cashiers , bus drivers , skycaps , security guards , and so forth , all of whom we expect to be in uniform .</tokentext>
<sentencetext>I'm trying to think of other businesses that have that kind of uniform/plainclothes distinction.
Delivery drivers, pest control people, UPS, the people who go out in the field wear the uniform.
They're also the lowest paid of the bunch.
Those people aren't wearing a uniform because they're viewed as less important employees, but rather, for the other reason you mentioned -- they're the ones out in the field.
Having them wear a uniform does a few things: It keeps the company image visible to the public, and it also provides customers with at least some insurance that the random doofus knocking on their door or asking to be let into the office is, in fact, there for a legitimate reason.
In some cases the "uniform" is less to maintain a uniform appearance among employees and more of a practical consideration.
You offered mechanics at dealerships as an example.
They're wearing coveralls because that's the only practical garment for someone who will be tinkering with grease and oil-covered engines all day.
What would you suggest they wear, a suit?
Besides, any dealership worth a damn appreciates skilled mechanics.
Similarly, a chef's clothes are practical as well, at least to an extent.
The crisp white looks clean and hygenic and that's important for people to see from a chef.
The pockets along the sleeves and shirtfront are useful for carrying thermometers and other tools, and the double-breasted construction can be reversed to hide any accidental stains.
And you'd better believe that in any fine restaurant, the chef is highly valued.
Another notable counterexample to your list is an airline pilot, who, particularly the more senior ones, can command an impressive salary with all kinds of perks and benefits, and is obviously nowhere near the bottom of the totem pole.
Pretty much anyone in uniform is on the lower end of the totem pole.
Perhaps, but at least in our culture, people expect service personnel to be in uniform.
Your examples are all service personnel.
And the truth is, helpdesk is the lowest end of the totem pole in IT.
Having worked helpdesk before I naturally balk at the idea, but in most places, I don't see how helpdesk is fundamentally any different from the waiters, cashiers, bus drivers, skycaps, security guards, and so forth, all of whom we expect to be in uniform.</sentencetext>
	<parent>http://www.semanticweb.org/ontologies/ConversationInstances.owl#comment09_12_29_2129221.30587278</parent>
</comment>
<comment>
	<id>http://www.semanticweb.org/ontologies/ConversationInstances.owl#comment09_12_29_2129221.30587590</id>
	<title>Who else?</title>
	<author>techno-vampire</author>
	<datestamp>1262085660000</datestamp>
	<modclass>None</modclass>
	<modscore>1</modscore>
	<htmltext>Who else at your company has to wear a uniform?  Probably just the cleaning staff, right?  Making the help desk wear a distinctive uniform is telling everybody who works there exactly how low on the pecking order it is.  If it were me, I'd point that out to whoever came up with the idea, but do so respectfully.  Then, if the idea goes through, start sending out my resume.</htmltext>
<tokenext>Who else at your company has to wear a uniform ?
Probably just the cleaning staff , right ?
Making the help desk wear a distinctive uniform is telling everybody who works there exactly how low on the pecking order it is .
If it were me , I 'd point that out to whoever came up with the idea , but do so respectfully .
Then , if the idea goes through , start sending out my resume .</tokentext>
<sentencetext>Who else at your company has to wear a uniform?
Probably just the cleaning staff, right?
Making the help desk wear a distinctive uniform is telling everybody who works there exactly how low on the pecking order it is.
If it were me, I'd point that out to whoever came up with the idea, but do so respectfully.
Then, if the idea goes through, start sending out my resume.</sentencetext>
</comment>
<comment>
	<id>http://www.semanticweb.org/ontologies/ConversationInstances.owl#comment09_12_29_2129221.30587118</id>
	<title>Identification</title>
	<author>iso-cop</author>
	<datestamp>1262084100000</datestamp>
	<modclass>None</modclass>
	<modscore>1</modscore>
	<htmltext>Other than to identify you as someone who should be touching their computer, I see no value. How about a special badge (if people at your company wear badges) or a jester's hat?<nobr> <wbr></nobr>;-&gt;</htmltext>
<tokenext>Other than to identify you as someone who should be touching their computer , I see no value .
How about a special badge ( if people at your company wear badges ) or a jester 's hat ?
; - &gt;</tokentext>
<sentencetext>Other than to identify you as someone who should be touching their computer, I see no value.
How about a special badge (if people at your company wear badges) or a jester's hat?
;-&gt;</sentencetext>
</comment>
<comment>
	<id>http://www.semanticweb.org/ontologies/ConversationInstances.owl#comment09_12_29_2129221.30590106</id>
	<title>Good Secuirty Move</title>
	<author>roguebfl</author>
	<datestamp>1262102820000</datestamp>
	<modclass>None</modclass>
	<modscore>1</modscore>
	<htmltext><p>Actually this makes a lot of since from a security point a view. If Help desk is also response for maintain the machines be able to identify the person removed a computer or hard drive the a workspace, is a very good idea</p></htmltext>
<tokenext>Actually this makes a lot of since from a security point a view .
If Help desk is also response for maintain the machines be able to identify the person removed a computer or hard drive the a workspace , is a very good idea</tokentext>
<sentencetext>Actually this makes a lot of since from a security point a view.
If Help desk is also response for maintain the machines be able to identify the person removed a computer or hard drive the a workspace, is a very good idea</sentencetext>
</comment>
<comment>
	<id>http://www.semanticweb.org/ontologies/ConversationInstances.owl#comment09_12_29_2129221.30587480</id>
	<title>Re:Professionalism</title>
	<author>couchslug</author>
	<datestamp>1262085300000</datestamp>
	<modclass>Insightful</modclass>
	<modscore>4</modscore>
	<htmltext><p>Don't argue, take advantage!</p><p>T-shirts scream "peon". Suggest shirts from a uniform service (so you dont have to buy replacements or wash them yourself) and come up with a professional logo. Dark colors don't show sweat and stains as much. Dark blue or black would stand out. Brown is depressing.</p><p>"Money, energy and resources wasted on this would probably be better spent on something worthwhile that would actually have an impact on the team's ability to provide quality service."</p><p>I wouldn't give a shit. Pay me and pay for my clothes if ya don't like what I buy myself.</p></htmltext>
<tokenext>Do n't argue , take advantage ! T-shirts scream " peon " .
Suggest shirts from a uniform service ( so you dont have to buy replacements or wash them yourself ) and come up with a professional logo .
Dark colors do n't show sweat and stains as much .
Dark blue or black would stand out .
Brown is depressing .
" Money , energy and resources wasted on this would probably be better spent on something worthwhile that would actually have an impact on the team 's ability to provide quality service .
" I would n't give a shit .
Pay me and pay for my clothes if ya do n't like what I buy myself .</tokentext>
<sentencetext>Don't argue, take advantage!T-shirts scream "peon".
Suggest shirts from a uniform service (so you dont have to buy replacements or wash them yourself) and come up with a professional logo.
Dark colors don't show sweat and stains as much.
Dark blue or black would stand out.
Brown is depressing.
"Money, energy and resources wasted on this would probably be better spent on something worthwhile that would actually have an impact on the team's ability to provide quality service.
"I wouldn't give a shit.
Pay me and pay for my clothes if ya don't like what I buy myself.</sentencetext>
	<parent>http://www.semanticweb.org/ontologies/ConversationInstances.owl#comment09_12_29_2129221.30587096</parent>
</comment>
<comment>
	<id>http://www.semanticweb.org/ontologies/ConversationInstances.owl#comment09_12_29_2129221.30587424</id>
	<title>Re:Superhero costumes to hide true identities</title>
	<author>tempest69</author>
	<datestamp>1262085060000</datestamp>
	<modclass>Funny</modclass>
	<modscore>3</modscore>
	<htmltext>Yea, and when<nobr> <wbr></nobr>/insert supervillan here/ attacks. The extra time spent killing the POD's would provide time for the others to escape.<br>
brilliant<p>
Storm</p></htmltext>
<tokenext>Yea , and when /insert supervillan here/ attacks .
The extra time spent killing the POD 's would provide time for the others to escape .
brilliant Storm</tokentext>
<sentencetext>Yea, and when /insert supervillan here/ attacks.
The extra time spent killing the POD's would provide time for the others to escape.
brilliant
Storm</sentencetext>
	<parent>http://www.semanticweb.org/ontologies/ConversationInstances.owl#comment09_12_29_2129221.30587168</parent>
</comment>
<comment>
	<id>http://www.semanticweb.org/ontologies/ConversationInstances.owl#comment09_12_29_2129221.30590310</id>
	<title>who pays</title>
	<author>nothermark</author>
	<datestamp>1262105040000</datestamp>
	<modclass>None</modclass>
	<modscore>1</modscore>
	<htmltext>If the uniforms are free and reasonable I would go for it.  I've never seen an IT person get very far from their desk without getting accosted about some problem.  You might as well cash in on somebodies dumb idea.</htmltext>
<tokenext>If the uniforms are free and reasonable I would go for it .
I 've never seen an IT person get very far from their desk without getting accosted about some problem .
You might as well cash in on somebodies dumb idea .</tokentext>
<sentencetext>If the uniforms are free and reasonable I would go for it.
I've never seen an IT person get very far from their desk without getting accosted about some problem.
You might as well cash in on somebodies dumb idea.</sentencetext>
</comment>
<comment>
	<id>http://www.semanticweb.org/ontologies/ConversationInstances.owl#comment09_12_29_2129221.30593526</id>
	<title>Uniforms</title>
	<author>ATLHivemind</author>
	<datestamp>1259856180000</datestamp>
	<modclass>Interestin</modclass>
	<modscore>2</modscore>
	<htmltext>I work at a MSP, so we're a help desk for 30+ companies.
The uniform for technical folks is a logo'ed button-down shirt (dark green, either short or long-sleeved) and slacks (technically kakhi, navy or black, but the predominant color is kakhi) and 'dress' shoes (anything not sport shoes is fair game). Even for those stuck in the office all day and not in the field interacting with customers the policy applies (the logic being that if you have to run out to a site you're already dressed).

We have a strict "no help without a trouble ticket" policy and most of our customers are now smart enough to not harass the local greenshirt directly... mostly.

If we're talking about a megacorp helpdesk, it only makes sense if the rest of the company has required uniforms or anything beyond "business casual".
In an office without uniforms the breakdown seems to be this:
Boss + boss's cronies/assistants: Business formal or high-end business casual (suit and tie)
Non-customer-facing folks: business casual
customer-facing: business casual with a tighter dress code or a uniform.

If IT must have a uniform, make sure it is comfortable. Full-cotton is great, and darker color don't show dirt and sweat (though the usual gray computer-dust sticks out a bit). Also find a dry cleaner that will do pickup/delivery. Professionally cleaned and pressed uniforms do wonders for the image (bonus: the IT grunts only have to keep track of where the dirty bag and pile of clean shirts are, not the mechanics of washing.).
If you do have a mandate for uniforms, make sure to keep a stash of cleaned and pressed uniform shirts in a closet or cabinet somewhere at the office, someone WILL need it someday.</htmltext>
<tokenext>I work at a MSP , so we 're a help desk for 30 + companies .
The uniform for technical folks is a logo'ed button-down shirt ( dark green , either short or long-sleeved ) and slacks ( technically kakhi , navy or black , but the predominant color is kakhi ) and 'dress ' shoes ( anything not sport shoes is fair game ) .
Even for those stuck in the office all day and not in the field interacting with customers the policy applies ( the logic being that if you have to run out to a site you 're already dressed ) .
We have a strict " no help without a trouble ticket " policy and most of our customers are now smart enough to not harass the local greenshirt directly... mostly . If we 're talking about a megacorp helpdesk , it only makes sense if the rest of the company has required uniforms or anything beyond " business casual " .
In an office without uniforms the breakdown seems to be this : Boss + boss 's cronies/assistants : Business formal or high-end business casual ( suit and tie ) Non-customer-facing folks : business casual customer-facing : business casual with a tighter dress code or a uniform .
If IT must have a uniform , make sure it is comfortable .
Full-cotton is great , and darker color do n't show dirt and sweat ( though the usual gray computer-dust sticks out a bit ) .
Also find a dry cleaner that will do pickup/delivery .
Professionally cleaned and pressed uniforms do wonders for the image ( bonus : the IT grunts only have to keep track of where the dirty bag and pile of clean shirts are , not the mechanics of washing. ) .
If you do have a mandate for uniforms , make sure to keep a stash of cleaned and pressed uniform shirts in a closet or cabinet somewhere at the office , someone WILL need it someday .</tokentext>
<sentencetext>I work at a MSP, so we're a help desk for 30+ companies.
The uniform for technical folks is a logo'ed button-down shirt (dark green, either short or long-sleeved) and slacks (technically kakhi, navy or black, but the predominant color is kakhi) and 'dress' shoes (anything not sport shoes is fair game).
Even for those stuck in the office all day and not in the field interacting with customers the policy applies (the logic being that if you have to run out to a site you're already dressed).
We have a strict "no help without a trouble ticket" policy and most of our customers are now smart enough to not harass the local greenshirt directly... mostly.

If we're talking about a megacorp helpdesk, it only makes sense if the rest of the company has required uniforms or anything beyond "business casual".
In an office without uniforms the breakdown seems to be this:
Boss + boss's cronies/assistants: Business formal or high-end business casual (suit and tie)
Non-customer-facing folks: business casual
customer-facing: business casual with a tighter dress code or a uniform.
If IT must have a uniform, make sure it is comfortable.
Full-cotton is great, and darker color don't show dirt and sweat (though the usual gray computer-dust sticks out a bit).
Also find a dry cleaner that will do pickup/delivery.
Professionally cleaned and pressed uniforms do wonders for the image (bonus: the IT grunts only have to keep track of where the dirty bag and pile of clean shirts are, not the mechanics of washing.).
If you do have a mandate for uniforms, make sure to keep a stash of cleaned and pressed uniform shirts in a closet or cabinet somewhere at the office, someone WILL need it someday.</sentencetext>
</comment>
<comment>
	<id>http://www.semanticweb.org/ontologies/ConversationInstances.owl#comment09_12_29_2129221.30588042</id>
	<title>They have a good reason</title>
	<author>Anonymous</author>
	<datestamp>1262087340000</datestamp>
	<modclass>None</modclass>
	<modscore>0</modscore>
	<htmltext><p>I see the point.<br>I worked for a large Insurance company as part of the facilities management department.<br>it was my job to help the employees with any issues they had with furniture, set up new workstations, set up/take down conference rooms and the like.<br>As part of my duties, I was wandering throughout the entire building. My shirt that had Facilities Management embroidered on it let people in the building know who this person was, that was walking through their work area.<br>And, yes, most people knew me by sight, if not by name. But, there were always new people working, or someone who doesn't interact much.<br>So, I don't think it's too far out of line.<br>It just lets the other employees know you belong where you are, and are allowed to be on someones computer.</p></htmltext>
<tokenext>I see the point.I worked for a large Insurance company as part of the facilities management department.it was my job to help the employees with any issues they had with furniture , set up new workstations , set up/take down conference rooms and the like.As part of my duties , I was wandering throughout the entire building .
My shirt that had Facilities Management embroidered on it let people in the building know who this person was , that was walking through their work area.And , yes , most people knew me by sight , if not by name .
But , there were always new people working , or someone who does n't interact much.So , I do n't think it 's too far out of line.It just lets the other employees know you belong where you are , and are allowed to be on someones computer .</tokentext>
<sentencetext>I see the point.I worked for a large Insurance company as part of the facilities management department.it was my job to help the employees with any issues they had with furniture, set up new workstations, set up/take down conference rooms and the like.As part of my duties, I was wandering throughout the entire building.
My shirt that had Facilities Management embroidered on it let people in the building know who this person was, that was walking through their work area.And, yes, most people knew me by sight, if not by name.
But, there were always new people working, or someone who doesn't interact much.So, I don't think it's too far out of line.It just lets the other employees know you belong where you are, and are allowed to be on someones computer.</sentencetext>
</comment>
<comment>
	<id>http://www.semanticweb.org/ontologies/ConversationInstances.owl#comment09_12_29_2129221.30589566</id>
	<title>Re:Other Roles Would Be Good Too</title>
	<author>GrumblyStuff</author>
	<datestamp>1262097600000</datestamp>
	<modclass>None</modclass>
	<modscore>1</modscore>
	<htmltext><p>I dunno.  It might grow back.  Might I suggest all the way through?</p></htmltext>
<tokenext>I dunno .
It might grow back .
Might I suggest all the way through ?</tokentext>
<sentencetext>I dunno.
It might grow back.
Might I suggest all the way through?</sentencetext>
	<parent>http://www.semanticweb.org/ontologies/ConversationInstances.owl#comment09_12_29_2129221.30587132</parent>
</comment>
<comment>
	<id>http://www.semanticweb.org/ontologies/ConversationInstances.owl#comment09_12_29_2129221.30588920</id>
	<title>Re:Well...</title>
	<author>couchslug</author>
	<datestamp>1262092140000</datestamp>
	<modclass>None</modclass>
	<modscore>1</modscore>
	<htmltext><p>"I'm required to design and maintain hundreds of databases, several servers, write apps, troubleshoot network problems, manage million dollar projects, AND do desktop support for 2000 devices with 3 other IT people for $40K/year."</p><p>You have a job, so look before you leap over trivia. Leaping to better money OTOH would be a Wise Choice.</p></htmltext>
<tokenext>" I 'm required to design and maintain hundreds of databases , several servers , write apps , troubleshoot network problems , manage million dollar projects , AND do desktop support for 2000 devices with 3 other IT people for $ 40K/year .
" You have a job , so look before you leap over trivia .
Leaping to better money OTOH would be a Wise Choice .</tokentext>
<sentencetext>"I'm required to design and maintain hundreds of databases, several servers, write apps, troubleshoot network problems, manage million dollar projects, AND do desktop support for 2000 devices with 3 other IT people for $40K/year.
"You have a job, so look before you leap over trivia.
Leaping to better money OTOH would be a Wise Choice.</sentencetext>
	<parent>http://www.semanticweb.org/ontologies/ConversationInstances.owl#comment09_12_29_2129221.30587462</parent>
</comment>
<comment>
	<id>http://www.semanticweb.org/ontologies/ConversationInstances.owl#comment09_12_29_2129221.30593986</id>
	<title>Re:</title>
	<author>clint999</author>
	<datestamp>1259857800000</datestamp>
	<modclass>None</modclass>
	<modscore>-1</modscore>
	<htmltext><blockquote><div><p>I would have to see the uniforms before passing judgment.<nobr> <wbr></nobr>...</p></div></blockquote></div>
	</htmltext>
<tokenext>I would have to see the uniforms before passing judgment .
.. .</tokentext>
<sentencetext>I would have to see the uniforms before passing judgment.
...
	</sentencetext>
</comment>
<comment>
	<id>http://www.semanticweb.org/ontologies/ConversationInstances.owl#comment09_12_29_2129221.30588108</id>
	<title>I run a helpdesk</title>
	<author>Anonymous</author>
	<datestamp>1262087700000</datestamp>
	<modclass>None</modclass>
	<modscore>0</modscore>
	<htmltext><p>There's no way in hell I would make my team where uniforms. It's insulting and demeaning. We already have enough trouble with disrespectful customers who think that just because they are some VPs secretary someone who makes three times what they do keeping millions of dollars in equipment running properly should come fix their broken cupholder immediately. The key to running an effective helpdesk is building relationships, in a professional environment being uniformed is an impediment to that. We aren't a bunch of mindless grunts just following orders.</p></htmltext>
<tokenext>There 's no way in hell I would make my team where uniforms .
It 's insulting and demeaning .
We already have enough trouble with disrespectful customers who think that just because they are some VPs secretary someone who makes three times what they do keeping millions of dollars in equipment running properly should come fix their broken cupholder immediately .
The key to running an effective helpdesk is building relationships , in a professional environment being uniformed is an impediment to that .
We are n't a bunch of mindless grunts just following orders .</tokentext>
<sentencetext>There's no way in hell I would make my team where uniforms.
It's insulting and demeaning.
We already have enough trouble with disrespectful customers who think that just because they are some VPs secretary someone who makes three times what they do keeping millions of dollars in equipment running properly should come fix their broken cupholder immediately.
The key to running an effective helpdesk is building relationships, in a professional environment being uniformed is an impediment to that.
We aren't a bunch of mindless grunts just following orders.</sentencetext>
</comment>
<comment>
	<id>http://www.semanticweb.org/ontologies/ConversationInstances.owl#comment09_12_29_2129221.30589000</id>
	<title>Re:30 IT people in a 500 employee company?!</title>
	<author>Anonymous</author>
	<datestamp>1262092560000</datestamp>
	<modclass>None</modclass>
	<modscore>0</modscore>
	<htmltext><p>Lots of windows, probably in different versions and not locked down.    That will keep 30 people busy very easily.</p></htmltext>
<tokenext>Lots of windows , probably in different versions and not locked down .
That will keep 30 people busy very easily .</tokentext>
<sentencetext>Lots of windows, probably in different versions and not locked down.
That will keep 30 people busy very easily.</sentencetext>
	<parent>http://www.semanticweb.org/ontologies/ConversationInstances.owl#comment09_12_29_2129221.30587272</parent>
</comment>
<comment>
	<id>http://www.semanticweb.org/ontologies/ConversationInstances.owl#comment09_12_29_2129221.30592402</id>
	<title>Obligatory</title>
	<author>Anonymous</author>
	<datestamp>1259849580000</datestamp>
	<modclass>None</modclass>
	<modscore>0</modscore>
	<htmltext><p>In soviet Russia, uniforms wear YOU!</p><p>*hides*</p></htmltext>
<tokenext>In soviet Russia , uniforms wear YOU !
* hides *</tokentext>
<sentencetext>In soviet Russia, uniforms wear YOU!
*hides*</sentencetext>
</comment>
<comment>
	<id>http://www.semanticweb.org/ontologies/ConversationInstances.owl#comment09_12_29_2129221.30592158</id>
	<title>Re:30 IT people in a 500 employee company?!</title>
	<author>Anonymous</author>
	<datestamp>1259846340000</datestamp>
	<modclass>None</modclass>
	<modscore>0</modscore>
	<htmltext><p>Perhaps their IT staff are doing more than fix the random lotus notes crash or lost password...</p><p>I work at a location where process control systems for oil and gas plants/rigs are made and while I am not technically in a support role I do help the support staff with problems on a weekly basis. This is due to the huge amount of variation in software used by different projects. If you limit your on-site support to operating system and office productivity apps you get a whole lot less work.. but we cant do that<nobr> <wbr></nobr>;)</p><p>Oh.. and we have an IBM support deal for trivial problems. Only the annoying bastard problems that wont go away land on our laps<nobr> <wbr></nobr>:-p</p><p>Like running DECNet on vmware or dealing with localization issues with software developed in the late 70s. This is called "tech support" where I work. So I suspect our definitions differ quite a bit.</p><p>Thankfully here in Norway the dress code is fairly free. If we get work done the management rarely bother us<nobr> <wbr></nobr>:-p</p></htmltext>
<tokenext>Perhaps their IT staff are doing more than fix the random lotus notes crash or lost password...I work at a location where process control systems for oil and gas plants/rigs are made and while I am not technically in a support role I do help the support staff with problems on a weekly basis .
This is due to the huge amount of variation in software used by different projects .
If you limit your on-site support to operating system and office productivity apps you get a whole lot less work.. but we cant do that ; ) Oh.. and we have an IBM support deal for trivial problems .
Only the annoying bastard problems that wont go away land on our laps : -pLike running DECNet on vmware or dealing with localization issues with software developed in the late 70s .
This is called " tech support " where I work .
So I suspect our definitions differ quite a bit.Thankfully here in Norway the dress code is fairly free .
If we get work done the management rarely bother us : -p</tokentext>
<sentencetext>Perhaps their IT staff are doing more than fix the random lotus notes crash or lost password...I work at a location where process control systems for oil and gas plants/rigs are made and while I am not technically in a support role I do help the support staff with problems on a weekly basis.
This is due to the huge amount of variation in software used by different projects.
If you limit your on-site support to operating system and office productivity apps you get a whole lot less work.. but we cant do that ;)Oh.. and we have an IBM support deal for trivial problems.
Only the annoying bastard problems that wont go away land on our laps :-pLike running DECNet on vmware or dealing with localization issues with software developed in the late 70s.
This is called "tech support" where I work.
So I suspect our definitions differ quite a bit.Thankfully here in Norway the dress code is fairly free.
If we get work done the management rarely bother us :-p</sentencetext>
	<parent>http://www.semanticweb.org/ontologies/ConversationInstances.owl#comment09_12_29_2129221.30587272</parent>
</comment>
<comment>
	<id>http://www.semanticweb.org/ontologies/ConversationInstances.owl#comment09_12_29_2129221.30587308</id>
	<title>I'd personally take it as a sign of dissonance</title>
	<author>BobMcD</author>
	<datestamp>1262084760000</datestamp>
	<modclass>Interestin</modclass>
	<modscore>3</modscore>
	<htmltext><p><div class="quote"><p>Recently the idea has been floated up the management chain to have these help desk workers wear IT department branded shirts. The idea is to promote visibility and unity.</p><p><nobr> <wbr></nobr>...</p><p>Is the singling out of 6 employees as 'the IT guys' a step in the right direction, or does it detract from the professionalism that we are trying to display as a department?</p></div><p>Better question:  Is your Help Desk projecting an image of service or are they too focused as being seen as "professionals"?</p><p>It seems to me that your management wants to label your Help Desk staff so that people will be more comfortable in approaching them with issues.  This, if it were true, is a HUGE RED FLAG to everyone in your department.  If your Help Desk isn't helpful, its just a desk, and it is likely way, way, way too expensive in that light.  If the shirts thing doesn't work, expect workforce changes.</p><p>Someone needs to recon what your management thinks of the team as a whole, without focusing too much on the dress code issue, before you decide to respond in any particular way.  Changes need to be made.  Preferably changes to your liking rather than the more heavy-handed flavor.</p></div>
	</htmltext>
<tokenext>Recently the idea has been floated up the management chain to have these help desk workers wear IT department branded shirts .
The idea is to promote visibility and unity .
...Is the singling out of 6 employees as 'the IT guys ' a step in the right direction , or does it detract from the professionalism that we are trying to display as a department ? Better question : Is your Help Desk projecting an image of service or are they too focused as being seen as " professionals " ? It seems to me that your management wants to label your Help Desk staff so that people will be more comfortable in approaching them with issues .
This , if it were true , is a HUGE RED FLAG to everyone in your department .
If your Help Desk is n't helpful , its just a desk , and it is likely way , way , way too expensive in that light .
If the shirts thing does n't work , expect workforce changes.Someone needs to recon what your management thinks of the team as a whole , without focusing too much on the dress code issue , before you decide to respond in any particular way .
Changes need to be made .
Preferably changes to your liking rather than the more heavy-handed flavor .</tokentext>
<sentencetext>Recently the idea has been floated up the management chain to have these help desk workers wear IT department branded shirts.
The idea is to promote visibility and unity.
...Is the singling out of 6 employees as 'the IT guys' a step in the right direction, or does it detract from the professionalism that we are trying to display as a department?Better question:  Is your Help Desk projecting an image of service or are they too focused as being seen as "professionals"?It seems to me that your management wants to label your Help Desk staff so that people will be more comfortable in approaching them with issues.
This, if it were true, is a HUGE RED FLAG to everyone in your department.
If your Help Desk isn't helpful, its just a desk, and it is likely way, way, way too expensive in that light.
If the shirts thing doesn't work, expect workforce changes.Someone needs to recon what your management thinks of the team as a whole, without focusing too much on the dress code issue, before you decide to respond in any particular way.
Changes need to be made.
Preferably changes to your liking rather than the more heavy-handed flavor.
	</sentencetext>
</comment>
<comment>
	<id>http://www.semanticweb.org/ontologies/ConversationInstances.owl#comment09_12_29_2129221.30587780</id>
	<title>Seems Like Visibility Would Cause Problems</title>
	<author>Slashdot Parent</author>
	<datestamp>1262086320000</datestamp>
	<modclass>Insightful</modclass>
	<modscore>3</modscore>
	<htmltext><p>If I were the IT manager, I wouldn't want extra visibility for the IT guys, because it seems to me it would encourage users to circumvent the proper helpdesk channels.  Whenever a uniformed IT guy walks by, I can just hear the one-off requests/questions, that would be completely untrackable.</p><p>Besides, I always thought in the best-run shops, you never knew that IT existed.<nobr> <wbr></nobr>:)</p></htmltext>
<tokenext>If I were the IT manager , I would n't want extra visibility for the IT guys , because it seems to me it would encourage users to circumvent the proper helpdesk channels .
Whenever a uniformed IT guy walks by , I can just hear the one-off requests/questions , that would be completely untrackable.Besides , I always thought in the best-run shops , you never knew that IT existed .
: )</tokentext>
<sentencetext>If I were the IT manager, I wouldn't want extra visibility for the IT guys, because it seems to me it would encourage users to circumvent the proper helpdesk channels.
Whenever a uniformed IT guy walks by, I can just hear the one-off requests/questions, that would be completely untrackable.Besides, I always thought in the best-run shops, you never knew that IT existed.
:)</sentencetext>
</comment>
<comment>
	<id>http://www.semanticweb.org/ontologies/ConversationInstances.owl#comment09_12_29_2129221.30587190</id>
	<title>The company's paying...</title>
	<author>ATestR</author>
	<datestamp>1262084340000</datestamp>
	<modclass>None</modclass>
	<modscore>1</modscore>
	<htmltext>They pay my wage... if they are willing to buy four company shirts of my choice... sure I'd wear them.</htmltext>
<tokenext>They pay my wage... if they are willing to buy four company shirts of my choice... sure I 'd wear them .</tokentext>
<sentencetext>They pay my wage... if they are willing to buy four company shirts of my choice... sure I'd wear them.</sentencetext>
</comment>
<comment>
	<id>http://www.semanticweb.org/ontologies/ConversationInstances.owl#comment09_12_29_2129221.30587650</id>
	<title>Uniforms are bad for worker morale and don't look</title>
	<author>Joe The Dragon</author>
	<datestamp>1262085840000</datestamp>
	<modclass>None</modclass>
	<modscore>1</modscore>
	<htmltext><p>Uniforms are bad for worker morale and don't look good if you need work on systems / get them dirty.</p><p>And they better be free as well having a pay boost to pay to keep them clean.</p></htmltext>
<tokenext>Uniforms are bad for worker morale and do n't look good if you need work on systems / get them dirty.And they better be free as well having a pay boost to pay to keep them clean .</tokentext>
<sentencetext>Uniforms are bad for worker morale and don't look good if you need work on systems / get them dirty.And they better be free as well having a pay boost to pay to keep them clean.</sentencetext>
</comment>
<comment>
	<id>http://www.semanticweb.org/ontologies/ConversationInstances.owl#comment09_12_29_2129221.30588280</id>
	<title>Re:Professionalism</title>
	<author>bradm</author>
	<datestamp>1262088600000</datestamp>
	<modclass>None</modclass>
	<modscore>1</modscore>
	<htmltext><p>Right direction, but not far enough.  I'm thinking that custom made tuxedos are the way to go here, with company paid dry cleaning.  Of course, each employee is going to need a closet full, ala Men in Black.</p><p>As a bonus, on bad days you can pretend you're in the Matrix.</p></htmltext>
<tokenext>Right direction , but not far enough .
I 'm thinking that custom made tuxedos are the way to go here , with company paid dry cleaning .
Of course , each employee is going to need a closet full , ala Men in Black.As a bonus , on bad days you can pretend you 're in the Matrix .</tokentext>
<sentencetext>Right direction, but not far enough.
I'm thinking that custom made tuxedos are the way to go here, with company paid dry cleaning.
Of course, each employee is going to need a closet full, ala Men in Black.As a bonus, on bad days you can pretend you're in the Matrix.</sentencetext>
	<parent>http://www.semanticweb.org/ontologies/ConversationInstances.owl#comment09_12_29_2129221.30587480</parent>
</comment>
<comment>
	<id>http://www.semanticweb.org/ontologies/ConversationInstances.owl#comment09_12_29_2129221.30587322</id>
	<title>500:30 = Lucky</title>
	<author>Anonymous</author>
	<datestamp>1262084760000</datestamp>
	<modclass>None</modclass>
	<modscore>0</modscore>
	<htmltext>Sheesh, where I come from we have 500 employees and only 8 IT workers with 2 of them running the helpdesk.  We have a very well equipped datacenter but our IT department runs on a very lean payroll, too lean if you ask me.<br> <br>This makes me wonder what the average everyone-to-IT ratio is at other companies our size.</htmltext>
<tokenext>Sheesh , where I come from we have 500 employees and only 8 IT workers with 2 of them running the helpdesk .
We have a very well equipped datacenter but our IT department runs on a very lean payroll , too lean if you ask me .
This makes me wonder what the average everyone-to-IT ratio is at other companies our size .</tokentext>
<sentencetext>Sheesh, where I come from we have 500 employees and only 8 IT workers with 2 of them running the helpdesk.
We have a very well equipped datacenter but our IT department runs on a very lean payroll, too lean if you ask me.
This makes me wonder what the average everyone-to-IT ratio is at other companies our size.</sentencetext>
</comment>
<comment>
	<id>http://www.semanticweb.org/ontologies/ConversationInstances.owl#comment09_12_29_2129221.30587562</id>
	<title>bonus!</title>
	<author>lophophore</author>
	<datestamp>1262085540000</datestamp>
	<modclass>None</modclass>
	<modscore>1</modscore>
	<htmltext><p>free clothing!  bonus!</p></htmltext>
<tokenext>free clothing !
bonus !</tokentext>
<sentencetext>free clothing!
bonus!</sentencetext>
</comment>
<comment>
	<id>http://www.semanticweb.org/ontologies/ConversationInstances.owl#comment09_12_29_2129221.30588832</id>
	<title>Anonymous Coward</title>
	<author>Anonymous</author>
	<datestamp>1262091540000</datestamp>
	<modclass>None</modclass>
	<modscore>0</modscore>
	<htmltext><p>Do you like your job? If not look for another job (assuming any are out there). If you do want to protest it while appearing professiona, wear a suit or a sport jacket and slacks M-Th and see if it generates complaints. Now that would be ironic.</p></htmltext>
<tokenext>Do you like your job ?
If not look for another job ( assuming any are out there ) .
If you do want to protest it while appearing professiona , wear a suit or a sport jacket and slacks M-Th and see if it generates complaints .
Now that would be ironic .</tokentext>
<sentencetext>Do you like your job?
If not look for another job (assuming any are out there).
If you do want to protest it while appearing professiona, wear a suit or a sport jacket and slacks M-Th and see if it generates complaints.
Now that would be ironic.</sentencetext>
</comment>
<comment>
	<id>http://www.semanticweb.org/ontologies/ConversationInstances.owl#comment09_12_29_2129221.30591132</id>
	<title>Ties</title>
	<author>bytesex</author>
	<datestamp>1262116380000</datestamp>
	<modclass>None</modclass>
	<modscore>1</modscore>
	<htmltext><p>Get a company tie with a little bit of print, saying 'IT Support' or some such.  Yes go on, make your guys wear shirt and ties.</p></htmltext>
<tokenext>Get a company tie with a little bit of print , saying 'IT Support ' or some such .
Yes go on , make your guys wear shirt and ties .</tokentext>
<sentencetext>Get a company tie with a little bit of print, saying 'IT Support' or some such.
Yes go on, make your guys wear shirt and ties.</sentencetext>
</comment>
<comment>
	<id>http://www.semanticweb.org/ontologies/ConversationInstances.owl#comment09_12_29_2129221.30596564</id>
	<title>Shirts with logos might not be so bad....</title>
	<author>ender1598</author>
	<datestamp>1259865720000</datestamp>
	<modclass>Interestin</modclass>
	<modscore>2</modscore>
	<htmltext><p>I work at helpdesk for a smallish technical college. We have about 15-20 total in the IT office and our CIO buys us these nice dress shirts with the college logo and "Information Technology" above the pocket. His dress code for us is no jeans and look professional. We can choose to wear a tie or even our own shirts. But we also regularly get comments from other people about how nice our shirts look and how professional it makes our office look when we show up to a meeting in similar styled dress shirts. On days when there's a lot of dirty work involved we can come in with what's appropriate but overall I think the shirts add to the job instead of being an annoyance.</p></htmltext>
<tokenext>I work at helpdesk for a smallish technical college .
We have about 15-20 total in the IT office and our CIO buys us these nice dress shirts with the college logo and " Information Technology " above the pocket .
His dress code for us is no jeans and look professional .
We can choose to wear a tie or even our own shirts .
But we also regularly get comments from other people about how nice our shirts look and how professional it makes our office look when we show up to a meeting in similar styled dress shirts .
On days when there 's a lot of dirty work involved we can come in with what 's appropriate but overall I think the shirts add to the job instead of being an annoyance .</tokentext>
<sentencetext>I work at helpdesk for a smallish technical college.
We have about 15-20 total in the IT office and our CIO buys us these nice dress shirts with the college logo and "Information Technology" above the pocket.
His dress code for us is no jeans and look professional.
We can choose to wear a tie or even our own shirts.
But we also regularly get comments from other people about how nice our shirts look and how professional it makes our office look when we show up to a meeting in similar styled dress shirts.
On days when there's a lot of dirty work involved we can come in with what's appropriate but overall I think the shirts add to the job instead of being an annoyance.</sentencetext>
</comment>
<comment>
	<id>http://www.semanticweb.org/ontologies/ConversationInstances.owl#comment09_12_29_2129221.30588650</id>
	<title>Missing the point</title>
	<author>Barny</author>
	<datestamp>1262090520000</datestamp>
	<modclass>None</modclass>
	<modscore>1</modscore>
	<htmltext><p>A uniform isn't always a strict mandated set of clothing provided by the employer though, in a lot of cases its a level of dress, since management feels they need to enforce a uniform restriction on you (the original poster) I am guessing you (or one of your colleagues, or all of you) have not been living up to the the expected dress code for your position. The mandated uniform will of course give you some idea where you (or your co-workers) went wrong.</p></htmltext>
<tokenext>A uniform is n't always a strict mandated set of clothing provided by the employer though , in a lot of cases its a level of dress , since management feels they need to enforce a uniform restriction on you ( the original poster ) I am guessing you ( or one of your colleagues , or all of you ) have not been living up to the the expected dress code for your position .
The mandated uniform will of course give you some idea where you ( or your co-workers ) went wrong .</tokentext>
<sentencetext>A uniform isn't always a strict mandated set of clothing provided by the employer though, in a lot of cases its a level of dress, since management feels they need to enforce a uniform restriction on you (the original poster) I am guessing you (or one of your colleagues, or all of you) have not been living up to the the expected dress code for your position.
The mandated uniform will of course give you some idea where you (or your co-workers) went wrong.</sentencetext>
</comment>
<comment>
	<id>http://www.semanticweb.org/ontologies/ConversationInstances.owl#comment09_12_29_2129221.30587250</id>
	<title>Re:Professionalism</title>
	<author>Anonymous</author>
	<datestamp>1262084520000</datestamp>
	<modclass>None</modclass>
	<modscore>1</modscore>
	<htmltext><p>"IT guys are stereotyped as being a bit sloppy."</p><p>Fixed that for you.</p><p>It's worth wondering why IT is being singled out for uniforms.  How about the folks in payroll?  Or accounting?  Just what is being said about IT here that can't be said about any other department in the company?</p><p>If IT needs a uniform, it's nothing more complex that a plumber's set of overalls.  We spend all our time in the field crouched under desks and showing our ass cracks anyway, right?  Now hand me that left-handed feeblegruber and get out of the way.</p></htmltext>
<tokenext>" IT guys are stereotyped as being a bit sloppy .
" Fixed that for you.It 's worth wondering why IT is being singled out for uniforms .
How about the folks in payroll ?
Or accounting ?
Just what is being said about IT here that ca n't be said about any other department in the company ? If IT needs a uniform , it 's nothing more complex that a plumber 's set of overalls .
We spend all our time in the field crouched under desks and showing our ass cracks anyway , right ?
Now hand me that left-handed feeblegruber and get out of the way .</tokentext>
<sentencetext>"IT guys are stereotyped as being a bit sloppy.
"Fixed that for you.It's worth wondering why IT is being singled out for uniforms.
How about the folks in payroll?
Or accounting?
Just what is being said about IT here that can't be said about any other department in the company?If IT needs a uniform, it's nothing more complex that a plumber's set of overalls.
We spend all our time in the field crouched under desks and showing our ass cracks anyway, right?
Now hand me that left-handed feeblegruber and get out of the way.</sentencetext>
	<parent>http://www.semanticweb.org/ontologies/ConversationInstances.owl#comment09_12_29_2129221.30587096</parent>
</comment>
<comment>
	<id>http://www.semanticweb.org/ontologies/ConversationInstances.owl#comment09_12_29_2129221.30592118</id>
	<title>Re:Say goodbye to your lunchbreak</title>
	<author>babybird</author>
	<datestamp>1259845680000</datestamp>
	<modclass>None</modclass>
	<modscore>1</modscore>
	<htmltext><p>Taping a bullseye to your back on a battlefield shouldn't be a problem at all actually.</p><p>If it's a problem, it's either because you're screwing up so badly that your own guys want to kill you, or you're a coward and you're retreating, presenting the enemy with something nice to aim at. Either way, problem solved.<nobr> <wbr></nobr>;)</p></htmltext>
<tokenext>Taping a bullseye to your back on a battlefield should n't be a problem at all actually.If it 's a problem , it 's either because you 're screwing up so badly that your own guys want to kill you , or you 're a coward and you 're retreating , presenting the enemy with something nice to aim at .
Either way , problem solved .
; )</tokentext>
<sentencetext>Taping a bullseye to your back on a battlefield shouldn't be a problem at all actually.If it's a problem, it's either because you're screwing up so badly that your own guys want to kill you, or you're a coward and you're retreating, presenting the enemy with something nice to aim at.
Either way, problem solved.
;)</sentencetext>
	<parent>http://www.semanticweb.org/ontologies/ConversationInstances.owl#comment09_12_29_2129221.30587186</parent>
</comment>
<comment>
	<id>http://www.semanticweb.org/ontologies/ConversationInstances.owl#comment09_12_29_2129221.30588542</id>
	<title>Re:Well...</title>
	<author>Anonymous</author>
	<datestamp>1262089920000</datestamp>
	<modclass>None</modclass>
	<modscore>0</modscore>
	<htmltext><p>I'm sure you can do it better, it's only a question of organization.</p></htmltext>
<tokenext>I 'm sure you can do it better , it 's only a question of organization .</tokentext>
<sentencetext>I'm sure you can do it better, it's only a question of organization.</sentencetext>
	<parent>http://www.semanticweb.org/ontologies/ConversationInstances.owl#comment09_12_29_2129221.30587462</parent>
</comment>
<comment>
	<id>http://www.semanticweb.org/ontologies/ConversationInstances.owl#comment09_12_29_2129221.30604378</id>
	<title>Re:30 for 500?</title>
	<author>Killjoy\_NL</author>
	<datestamp>1262267700000</datestamp>
	<modclass>None</modclass>
	<modscore>1</modscore>
	<htmltext><p>We are working with 1 manager and 2 sysadmins for an organisation of almost a thousand people.<br>I am not happy about that<nobr> <wbr></nobr>:(</p></htmltext>
<tokenext>We are working with 1 manager and 2 sysadmins for an organisation of almost a thousand people.I am not happy about that : (</tokentext>
<sentencetext>We are working with 1 manager and 2 sysadmins for an organisation of almost a thousand people.I am not happy about that :(</sentencetext>
	<parent>http://www.semanticweb.org/ontologies/ConversationInstances.owl#comment09_12_29_2129221.30588594</parent>
</comment>
<comment>
	<id>http://www.semanticweb.org/ontologies/ConversationInstances.owl#comment09_12_29_2129221.30590532</id>
	<title>Re:Other Roles Would Be Good Too</title>
	<author>Anonymous</author>
	<datestamp>1262107440000</datestamp>
	<modclass>None</modclass>
	<modscore>0</modscore>
	<htmltext><p><div class="quote"><p>While we're on the subject, I'd like sales people to be readily recognizable as well. Perhaps a red S emblazoned on their forehead with a red-hot branding iron.</p></div><p>If this is the case, then the IT Help Desk can wear a large H on their forehead.  Priority service goes to any user who addresses them as "Smeghead".</p></div>
	</htmltext>
<tokenext>While we 're on the subject , I 'd like sales people to be readily recognizable as well .
Perhaps a red S emblazoned on their forehead with a red-hot branding iron.If this is the case , then the IT Help Desk can wear a large H on their forehead .
Priority service goes to any user who addresses them as " Smeghead " .</tokentext>
<sentencetext>While we're on the subject, I'd like sales people to be readily recognizable as well.
Perhaps a red S emblazoned on their forehead with a red-hot branding iron.If this is the case, then the IT Help Desk can wear a large H on their forehead.
Priority service goes to any user who addresses them as "Smeghead".
	</sentencetext>
	<parent>http://www.semanticweb.org/ontologies/ConversationInstances.owl#comment09_12_29_2129221.30587132</parent>
</comment>
<comment>
	<id>http://www.semanticweb.org/ontologies/ConversationInstances.owl#comment09_12_29_2129221.30588954</id>
	<title>Who's paying for the shirts?</title>
	<author>Russ Nelson</author>
	<datestamp>1262092320000</datestamp>
	<modclass>None</modclass>
	<modscore>1</modscore>
	<htmltext><p>Who's paying for the shirts?  I hope that the boss is.  But if she isn't, then ANY clothing which is required for continued employment is tax deductible as an unreimbursed employer expense.</p></htmltext>
<tokenext>Who 's paying for the shirts ?
I hope that the boss is .
But if she is n't , then ANY clothing which is required for continued employment is tax deductible as an unreimbursed employer expense .</tokentext>
<sentencetext>Who's paying for the shirts?
I hope that the boss is.
But if she isn't, then ANY clothing which is required for continued employment is tax deductible as an unreimbursed employer expense.</sentencetext>
</comment>
<comment>
	<id>http://www.semanticweb.org/ontologies/ConversationInstances.owl#comment09_12_29_2129221.30587168</id>
	<title>Superhero costumes to hide true identities</title>
	<author>Rene S. Hollan</author>
	<datestamp>1262084280000</datestamp>
	<modclass>Funny</modclass>
	<modscore>4</modscore>
	<htmltext><p>Given how IT staff get harassed to fix everything, and blamed for everything broken, I would suggest an idea floated during my days as a university student.</p><p>See, we had these "Programmers On Duty", or PODs, many of whom were volunteers, who would look at your program, and attempt to help you find what was wrong. This was pretty much a thankless job, and anything you broke, and they couldn't fix, was considered their fault. (This was the late 70s era of punched cards, and computer printouts, with actual terminals a rare and coveted tool -- the POD had an office with, you guessed it, a terminal -- a CRT to boot, so one would not have to keep trying to use the back of discarded printouts in the DECwriters. The attraction of POD duty was access to that terminal, in hopes it would be a slow day.)</p><p>A bunch of us thought that PODs should be issued distinctive uniforms as well: superhero-style costumes actually. Ostensibly this was to distinguish them as members of a rare breed: people who could debug programs quickly. In fact, the intent was to shield their identity lest the be pestered to provide help while off duty.</p></htmltext>
<tokenext>Given how IT staff get harassed to fix everything , and blamed for everything broken , I would suggest an idea floated during my days as a university student.See , we had these " Programmers On Duty " , or PODs , many of whom were volunteers , who would look at your program , and attempt to help you find what was wrong .
This was pretty much a thankless job , and anything you broke , and they could n't fix , was considered their fault .
( This was the late 70s era of punched cards , and computer printouts , with actual terminals a rare and coveted tool -- the POD had an office with , you guessed it , a terminal -- a CRT to boot , so one would not have to keep trying to use the back of discarded printouts in the DECwriters .
The attraction of POD duty was access to that terminal , in hopes it would be a slow day .
) A bunch of us thought that PODs should be issued distinctive uniforms as well : superhero-style costumes actually .
Ostensibly this was to distinguish them as members of a rare breed : people who could debug programs quickly .
In fact , the intent was to shield their identity lest the be pestered to provide help while off duty .</tokentext>
<sentencetext>Given how IT staff get harassed to fix everything, and blamed for everything broken, I would suggest an idea floated during my days as a university student.See, we had these "Programmers On Duty", or PODs, many of whom were volunteers, who would look at your program, and attempt to help you find what was wrong.
This was pretty much a thankless job, and anything you broke, and they couldn't fix, was considered their fault.
(This was the late 70s era of punched cards, and computer printouts, with actual terminals a rare and coveted tool -- the POD had an office with, you guessed it, a terminal -- a CRT to boot, so one would not have to keep trying to use the back of discarded printouts in the DECwriters.
The attraction of POD duty was access to that terminal, in hopes it would be a slow day.
)A bunch of us thought that PODs should be issued distinctive uniforms as well: superhero-style costumes actually.
Ostensibly this was to distinguish them as members of a rare breed: people who could debug programs quickly.
In fact, the intent was to shield their identity lest the be pestered to provide help while off duty.</sentencetext>
</comment>
<comment>
	<id>http://www.semanticweb.org/ontologies/ConversationInstances.owl#comment09_12_29_2129221.30592348</id>
	<title>I disagree</title>
	<author>maple\_shaft</author>
	<datestamp>1259848920000</datestamp>
	<modclass>None</modclass>
	<modscore>1</modscore>
	<htmltext>I disagree that uniforms are a bad idea and yes I work in IT.  I was also a member of the armed forces for a time in my life and as a service member I wore a uniform as well.

Would you compare a soldier to a fast-food worker because they both wear a uniform?

When you and your group that you work with everyday wear uniforms it can sometimes reinforce that you feel a member of something, a part of something bigger than yourself all working towards a common goal.  If you have pride in yourself and your workplace and what you and your peers do for a living then a uniform should not bother you, in fact it would bring you all closer together.

On the other hand if the company has consistently treated you with disrespect and you aren't particularly happy with what you are doing and where you are at then I can understand how it can be construed as demeaning.</htmltext>
<tokenext>I disagree that uniforms are a bad idea and yes I work in IT .
I was also a member of the armed forces for a time in my life and as a service member I wore a uniform as well .
Would you compare a soldier to a fast-food worker because they both wear a uniform ?
When you and your group that you work with everyday wear uniforms it can sometimes reinforce that you feel a member of something , a part of something bigger than yourself all working towards a common goal .
If you have pride in yourself and your workplace and what you and your peers do for a living then a uniform should not bother you , in fact it would bring you all closer together .
On the other hand if the company has consistently treated you with disrespect and you are n't particularly happy with what you are doing and where you are at then I can understand how it can be construed as demeaning .</tokentext>
<sentencetext>I disagree that uniforms are a bad idea and yes I work in IT.
I was also a member of the armed forces for a time in my life and as a service member I wore a uniform as well.
Would you compare a soldier to a fast-food worker because they both wear a uniform?
When you and your group that you work with everyday wear uniforms it can sometimes reinforce that you feel a member of something, a part of something bigger than yourself all working towards a common goal.
If you have pride in yourself and your workplace and what you and your peers do for a living then a uniform should not bother you, in fact it would bring you all closer together.
On the other hand if the company has consistently treated you with disrespect and you aren't particularly happy with what you are doing and where you are at then I can understand how it can be construed as demeaning.</sentencetext>
</comment>
<comment>
	<id>http://www.semanticweb.org/ontologies/ConversationInstances.owl#comment09_12_29_2129221.30588628</id>
	<title>Re:lovely</title>
	<author>benjamindees</author>
	<datestamp>1262090400000</datestamp>
	<modclass>None</modclass>
	<modscore>1</modscore>
	<htmltext><p><div class="quote"><p>Delivery drivers, pest control people, UPS, the people who go out in the field wear the uniform.  They're also the lowest paid of the bunch.</p></div><p>Actually, for UPS at least, the people who go out in the field make much more than the people who work in the distribution centers, because their jobs are more demanding and they are entrusted with several hundred thousand dollars worth of goods at a time.  And the major purpose of a uniform for field workers is to display a consistent brand image to the public at large.</p><p>I agree though, that in an office environment, and at McDonalds, the real purpose of uniforms is to differentiate workers by class.</p></div>
	</htmltext>
<tokenext>Delivery drivers , pest control people , UPS , the people who go out in the field wear the uniform .
They 're also the lowest paid of the bunch.Actually , for UPS at least , the people who go out in the field make much more than the people who work in the distribution centers , because their jobs are more demanding and they are entrusted with several hundred thousand dollars worth of goods at a time .
And the major purpose of a uniform for field workers is to display a consistent brand image to the public at large.I agree though , that in an office environment , and at McDonalds , the real purpose of uniforms is to differentiate workers by class .</tokentext>
<sentencetext>Delivery drivers, pest control people, UPS, the people who go out in the field wear the uniform.
They're also the lowest paid of the bunch.Actually, for UPS at least, the people who go out in the field make much more than the people who work in the distribution centers, because their jobs are more demanding and they are entrusted with several hundred thousand dollars worth of goods at a time.
And the major purpose of a uniform for field workers is to display a consistent brand image to the public at large.I agree though, that in an office environment, and at McDonalds, the real purpose of uniforms is to differentiate workers by class.
	</sentencetext>
	<parent>http://www.semanticweb.org/ontologies/ConversationInstances.owl#comment09_12_29_2129221.30587278</parent>
</comment>
<comment>
	<id>http://www.semanticweb.org/ontologies/ConversationInstances.owl#comment09_12_29_2129221.30589196</id>
	<title>Re:Nothing wrong with the idea</title>
	<author>Culture20</author>
	<datestamp>1262094120000</datestamp>
	<modclass>None</modclass>
	<modscore>1</modscore>
	<htmltext><p><div class="quote"><p>When your skills outgrow the help desk - and they should - consider losing the uniform as a perk of advancement.</p></div><p>If you wear an unprofessional looking uniform (read: branded for your department), you reinforce the idea that you belong there.  There will be no advancement into other groups even within IT at that company.  If you want the helpdesk to start dressing nicer, tell them to start dressing nicer.  Business casual is the dress code for workstation flunkies in about half of the places out there.</p></div>
	</htmltext>
<tokenext>When your skills outgrow the help desk - and they should - consider losing the uniform as a perk of advancement.If you wear an unprofessional looking uniform ( read : branded for your department ) , you reinforce the idea that you belong there .
There will be no advancement into other groups even within IT at that company .
If you want the helpdesk to start dressing nicer , tell them to start dressing nicer .
Business casual is the dress code for workstation flunkies in about half of the places out there .</tokentext>
<sentencetext>When your skills outgrow the help desk - and they should - consider losing the uniform as a perk of advancement.If you wear an unprofessional looking uniform (read: branded for your department), you reinforce the idea that you belong there.
There will be no advancement into other groups even within IT at that company.
If you want the helpdesk to start dressing nicer, tell them to start dressing nicer.
Business casual is the dress code for workstation flunkies in about half of the places out there.
	</sentencetext>
	<parent>http://www.semanticweb.org/ontologies/ConversationInstances.owl#comment09_12_29_2129221.30587138</parent>
</comment>
<comment>
	<id>http://www.semanticweb.org/ontologies/ConversationInstances.owl#comment09_12_29_2129221.30587868</id>
	<title>pre-empt them</title>
	<author>spongman</author>
	<datestamp>1262086620000</datestamp>
	<modclass>None</modclass>
	<modscore>1</modscore>
	<htmltext><p>buy (or rent) your team a set of matching <a href="http://www.surplusandoutdoors.com/shop/outdoor-workwear/boilersuits-overalls/white-zipped-front-poly-cotton-437860.html" title="surplusandoutdoors.com">white, one-piece overalls</a> [surplusandoutdoors.com].</p><p>make a point of walking around the office, as a team, near the management's offices carrying some tools. if you can align that with 'bring your favorite industrial power tool to work' day, all the better. hard hats, goggles &amp; walkie-talkes make nice accessories.</p></htmltext>
<tokenext>buy ( or rent ) your team a set of matching white , one-piece overalls [ surplusandoutdoors.com ] .make a point of walking around the office , as a team , near the management 's offices carrying some tools .
if you can align that with 'bring your favorite industrial power tool to work ' day , all the better .
hard hats , goggles &amp; walkie-talkes make nice accessories .</tokentext>
<sentencetext>buy (or rent) your team a set of matching white, one-piece overalls [surplusandoutdoors.com].make a point of walking around the office, as a team, near the management's offices carrying some tools.
if you can align that with 'bring your favorite industrial power tool to work' day, all the better.
hard hats, goggles &amp; walkie-talkes make nice accessories.</sentencetext>
</comment>
<comment>
	<id>http://www.semanticweb.org/ontologies/ConversationInstances.owl#comment09_12_29_2129221.30590590</id>
	<title>Re:Well...</title>
	<author>wisty</author>
	<datestamp>1262107980000</datestamp>
	<modclass>Interestin</modclass>
	<modscore>2</modscore>
	<htmltext><p><div class="quote"><p>Funny, but my company did just mandate blaze orange shirts for all front line IT staff.  I can't for the life of me figure out who thought that was a good idea.</p><p>Mine comes in Monday.</p><p>We can also wear Navy.  I think I'm going to get an equal number of pairs of blaze orange and navy pants and alternate them daily.</p><p>Personally, I find it extremely condescending.  I'm required to design and maintain hundreds of databases, several servers, write apps, troubleshoot network problems, manage million dollar projects, AND do desktop support for 2000 devices with 3 other IT people for $40K/year.  And now this.  No wonder I've thrown my hands up today and am now posting on slashdot.</p><p>Yes, I'm looking for a way out.</p></div><p> <a href="http://jobs.stackoverflow.com/" title="stackoverflow.com">http://jobs.stackoverflow.com/</a> [stackoverflow.com]</p><p><a href="http://jobs.serverfault.com/" title="serverfault.com">http://jobs.serverfault.com/</a> [serverfault.com]</p><p>Your resume should look like this:</p><p>Designed and maintained over 200 databases, including:<br>* Customer whatsit thinghy, with 8,000 records, 30 fields, and 30 current users<br>* three<br>* other<br>* highlights</p><p>Designed, set-up and maintained 7 servers, including:<br>* Main NAS with 1.5T of data (including back-up to, network connections,<nobr> <wbr></nobr>...)<br>* more<br>* highlights</p><p>Produced a number of web applications, including<br>* Some<br>* highlights</p><p>Managed projects worth in excess of $2 million, including<br>* Rollover to Windows 7<br>* Server upgrade program.<br>* whatever</p><p>Supported over 2000 devices in a small team of 4 staff.</p><p>*Don't* go out of your way to mention your salary (unless asked), and if you do mention it, make sure they know that you consider your current salary inadequate.</p></div>
	</htmltext>
<tokenext>Funny , but my company did just mandate blaze orange shirts for all front line IT staff .
I ca n't for the life of me figure out who thought that was a good idea.Mine comes in Monday.We can also wear Navy .
I think I 'm going to get an equal number of pairs of blaze orange and navy pants and alternate them daily.Personally , I find it extremely condescending .
I 'm required to design and maintain hundreds of databases , several servers , write apps , troubleshoot network problems , manage million dollar projects , AND do desktop support for 2000 devices with 3 other IT people for $ 40K/year .
And now this .
No wonder I 've thrown my hands up today and am now posting on slashdot.Yes , I 'm looking for a way out .
http : //jobs.stackoverflow.com/ [ stackoverflow.com ] http : //jobs.serverfault.com/ [ serverfault.com ] Your resume should look like this : Designed and maintained over 200 databases , including : * Customer whatsit thinghy , with 8,000 records , 30 fields , and 30 current users * three * other * highlightsDesigned , set-up and maintained 7 servers , including : * Main NAS with 1.5T of data ( including back-up to , network connections , ... ) * more * highlightsProduced a number of web applications , including * Some * highlightsManaged projects worth in excess of $ 2 million , including * Rollover to Windows 7 * Server upgrade program .
* whateverSupported over 2000 devices in a small team of 4 staff .
* Do n't * go out of your way to mention your salary ( unless asked ) , and if you do mention it , make sure they know that you consider your current salary inadequate .</tokentext>
<sentencetext>Funny, but my company did just mandate blaze orange shirts for all front line IT staff.
I can't for the life of me figure out who thought that was a good idea.Mine comes in Monday.We can also wear Navy.
I think I'm going to get an equal number of pairs of blaze orange and navy pants and alternate them daily.Personally, I find it extremely condescending.
I'm required to design and maintain hundreds of databases, several servers, write apps, troubleshoot network problems, manage million dollar projects, AND do desktop support for 2000 devices with 3 other IT people for $40K/year.
And now this.
No wonder I've thrown my hands up today and am now posting on slashdot.Yes, I'm looking for a way out.
http://jobs.stackoverflow.com/ [stackoverflow.com]http://jobs.serverfault.com/ [serverfault.com]Your resume should look like this:Designed and maintained over 200 databases, including:* Customer whatsit thinghy, with 8,000 records, 30 fields, and 30 current users* three* other* highlightsDesigned, set-up and maintained 7 servers, including:* Main NAS with 1.5T of data (including back-up to, network connections, ...)* more* highlightsProduced a number of web applications, including* Some* highlightsManaged projects worth in excess of $2 million, including* Rollover to Windows 7* Server upgrade program.
* whateverSupported over 2000 devices in a small team of 4 staff.
*Don't* go out of your way to mention your salary (unless asked), and if you do mention it, make sure they know that you consider your current salary inadequate.
	</sentencetext>
	<parent>http://www.semanticweb.org/ontologies/ConversationInstances.owl#comment09_12_29_2129221.30587462</parent>
</comment>
<comment>
	<id>http://www.semanticweb.org/ontologies/ConversationInstances.owl#comment09_12_29_2129221.30587100</id>
	<title>n0x0n</title>
	<author>Anonymous</author>
	<datestamp>1262084040000</datestamp>
	<modclass>None</modclass>
	<modscore>0</modscore>
	<htmltext><p>Why not - I once had the same idea... All my co-workers agreed but management declined...</p></htmltext>
<tokenext>Why not - I once had the same idea... All my co-workers agreed but management declined.. .</tokentext>
<sentencetext>Why not - I once had the same idea... All my co-workers agreed but management declined...</sentencetext>
</comment>
<comment>
	<id>http://www.semanticweb.org/ontologies/ConversationInstances.owl#comment09_12_29_2129221.30587098</id>
	<title>News for nerds...</title>
	<author>trickyrickb</author>
	<datestamp>1262084040000</datestamp>
	<modclass>None</modclass>
	<modscore>0</modscore>
	<htmltext>Stuff that matters.</htmltext>
<tokenext>Stuff that matters .</tokentext>
<sentencetext>Stuff that matters.</sentencetext>
</comment>
<comment>
	<id>http://www.semanticweb.org/ontologies/ConversationInstances.owl#comment09_12_29_2129221.30589642</id>
	<title>re: Uniforms For the Help Desk?</title>
	<author>brianc</author>
	<datestamp>1262098320000</datestamp>
	<modclass>None</modclass>
	<modscore>1</modscore>
	<htmltext><p><div class="quote"><p>Uniforms For the Help Desk?</p></div><p> <a href="http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Nehru\_jacket" title="wikipedia.org" rel="nofollow">Nehru Jackets</a> [wikipedia.org], maybe?</p></div>
	</htmltext>
<tokenext>Uniforms For the Help Desk ?
Nehru Jackets [ wikipedia.org ] , maybe ?</tokentext>
<sentencetext>Uniforms For the Help Desk?
Nehru Jackets [wikipedia.org], maybe?
	</sentencetext>
</comment>
<comment>
	<id>http://www.semanticweb.org/ontologies/ConversationInstances.owl#comment09_12_29_2129221.30603600</id>
	<title>depends..</title>
	<author>Anonymous</author>
	<datestamp>1262291400000</datestamp>
	<modclass>None</modclass>
	<modscore>0</modscore>
	<htmltext><p>if the uniforms are  white lab coats it has to be OK.</p></htmltext>
<tokenext>if the uniforms are white lab coats it has to be OK .</tokentext>
<sentencetext>if the uniforms are  white lab coats it has to be OK.</sentencetext>
</comment>
<comment>
	<id>http://www.semanticweb.org/ontologies/ConversationInstances.owl#comment09_12_29_2129221.30588610</id>
	<title>If it's about recognition</title>
	<author>Jerry Smith</author>
	<datestamp>1262090340000</datestamp>
	<modclass>None</modclass>
	<modscore>1</modscore>
	<htmltext>I used to walk around (from task to task, that is) with a cd-rom (drivegenius or other toollike cd-rom) in my hand, some cat5 dangling from a pocket and nearly ALWAYS whistling in the hallways the theme of Goofy (from Disney). People knew I was there without me needing to show up only at trouble and they didn't even need to see me. But I can understand the distiction needed from hoi polloi: isn't there a cool thing to get recognised by? A Bat-belt or something?</htmltext>
<tokenext>I used to walk around ( from task to task , that is ) with a cd-rom ( drivegenius or other toollike cd-rom ) in my hand , some cat5 dangling from a pocket and nearly ALWAYS whistling in the hallways the theme of Goofy ( from Disney ) .
People knew I was there without me needing to show up only at trouble and they did n't even need to see me .
But I can understand the distiction needed from hoi polloi : is n't there a cool thing to get recognised by ?
A Bat-belt or something ?</tokentext>
<sentencetext>I used to walk around (from task to task, that is) with a cd-rom (drivegenius or other toollike cd-rom) in my hand, some cat5 dangling from a pocket and nearly ALWAYS whistling in the hallways the theme of Goofy (from Disney).
People knew I was there without me needing to show up only at trouble and they didn't even need to see me.
But I can understand the distiction needed from hoi polloi: isn't there a cool thing to get recognised by?
A Bat-belt or something?</sentencetext>
</comment>
<comment>
	<id>http://www.semanticweb.org/ontologies/ConversationInstances.owl#comment09_12_29_2129221.30593680</id>
	<title>Visibility for job security</title>
	<author>UrgentUnguent</author>
	<datestamp>1259856780000</datestamp>
	<modclass>None</modclass>
	<modscore>1</modscore>
	<htmltext>As the original post put it, this is an attempt to Brand the help desk staff. I suspect the IT management is looking to build \_internal\_ market share and have more leverage to protect their assets during the next round of cuts. Unfortunately, it's more likely they're a bunch of self-aggrandising dunderheads, sigh.</htmltext>
<tokenext>As the original post put it , this is an attempt to Brand the help desk staff .
I suspect the IT management is looking to build \ _internal \ _ market share and have more leverage to protect their assets during the next round of cuts .
Unfortunately , it 's more likely they 're a bunch of self-aggrandising dunderheads , sigh .</tokentext>
<sentencetext>As the original post put it, this is an attempt to Brand the help desk staff.
I suspect the IT management is looking to build \_internal\_ market share and have more leverage to protect their assets during the next round of cuts.
Unfortunately, it's more likely they're a bunch of self-aggrandising dunderheads, sigh.</sentencetext>
</comment>
<comment>
	<id>http://www.semanticweb.org/ontologies/ConversationInstances.owl#comment09_12_29_2129221.30589668</id>
	<title>Thank goodness ...</title>
	<author>PPH</author>
	<datestamp>1262098500000</datestamp>
	<modclass>Funny</modclass>
	<modscore>2</modscore>
	<htmltext><nobr> <wbr></nobr>... they've said nothing about pants. Making me wear pants to work would just be too much, IMO.</htmltext>
<tokenext>... they 've said nothing about pants .
Making me wear pants to work would just be too much , IMO .</tokentext>
<sentencetext> ... they've said nothing about pants.
Making me wear pants to work would just be too much, IMO.</sentencetext>
</comment>
<comment>
	<id>http://www.semanticweb.org/ontologies/ConversationInstances.owl#comment09_12_29_2129221.30598632</id>
	<title>This is like</title>
	<author>hey!</author>
	<datestamp>1259873580000</datestamp>
	<modclass>None</modclass>
	<modscore>1</modscore>
	<htmltext><p>when a woman asks her friend whether her husband is cheating on her.  The fact she has to ask tells the friend everything she needs to know.</p><p>These shirts are symbols.  Basic semiotics here: symbols in themselves are meaningless. They require context to interpret.  If your reaction is, "Gee, what an intriguing idea," then you can take management assurances at face value.  If your immediate reaction is, "This sounds like yet another indignity being heaped upon us," it probably is.</p></htmltext>
<tokenext>when a woman asks her friend whether her husband is cheating on her .
The fact she has to ask tells the friend everything she needs to know.These shirts are symbols .
Basic semiotics here : symbols in themselves are meaningless .
They require context to interpret .
If your reaction is , " Gee , what an intriguing idea , " then you can take management assurances at face value .
If your immediate reaction is , " This sounds like yet another indignity being heaped upon us , " it probably is .</tokentext>
<sentencetext>when a woman asks her friend whether her husband is cheating on her.
The fact she has to ask tells the friend everything she needs to know.These shirts are symbols.
Basic semiotics here: symbols in themselves are meaningless.
They require context to interpret.
If your reaction is, "Gee, what an intriguing idea," then you can take management assurances at face value.
If your immediate reaction is, "This sounds like yet another indignity being heaped upon us," it probably is.</sentencetext>
</comment>
<comment>
	<id>http://www.semanticweb.org/ontologies/ConversationInstances.owl#comment09_12_29_2129221.30587956</id>
	<title>Don't insult the Help Desk with uniforms</title>
	<author>Anonymous</author>
	<datestamp>1262086980000</datestamp>
	<modclass>None</modclass>
	<modscore>0</modscore>
	<htmltext><p>Why don't you just make them all wear the letter L on their foreheads too? Whoever thought of the uniform idea should be shot dead in front of their children. "See kids. Here is what happens when you are stupid. BANG!" That is an insult of monumental proportions. Selecting a single group to be outcasts. Bravo.</p></htmltext>
<tokenext>Why do n't you just make them all wear the letter L on their foreheads too ?
Whoever thought of the uniform idea should be shot dead in front of their children .
" See kids .
Here is what happens when you are stupid .
BANG ! " That is an insult of monumental proportions .
Selecting a single group to be outcasts .
Bravo .</tokentext>
<sentencetext>Why don't you just make them all wear the letter L on their foreheads too?
Whoever thought of the uniform idea should be shot dead in front of their children.
"See kids.
Here is what happens when you are stupid.
BANG!" That is an insult of monumental proportions.
Selecting a single group to be outcasts.
Bravo.</sentencetext>
</comment>
<comment>
	<id>http://www.semanticweb.org/ontologies/ConversationInstances.owl#comment09_12_29_2129221.30587758</id>
	<title>Re:30 IT people in a 500 employee company?!</title>
	<author>Blakey Rat</author>
	<datestamp>1262086260000</datestamp>
	<modclass>None</modclass>
	<modscore>1</modscore>
	<htmltext><p>They could be very heavy computer users, like a CAD company. Or have very high turnaround, and so require more manpower to image computer and do training.</p><p>Or, hell, in this economy you're critical at a company hiring *too many* employees? Man, let just get a paycheck and feel good about it.</p></htmltext>
<tokenext>They could be very heavy computer users , like a CAD company .
Or have very high turnaround , and so require more manpower to image computer and do training.Or , hell , in this economy you 're critical at a company hiring * too many * employees ?
Man , let just get a paycheck and feel good about it .</tokentext>
<sentencetext>They could be very heavy computer users, like a CAD company.
Or have very high turnaround, and so require more manpower to image computer and do training.Or, hell, in this economy you're critical at a company hiring *too many* employees?
Man, let just get a paycheck and feel good about it.</sentencetext>
	<parent>http://www.semanticweb.org/ontologies/ConversationInstances.owl#comment09_12_29_2129221.30587272</parent>
</comment>
<comment>
	<id>http://www.semanticweb.org/ontologies/ConversationInstances.owl#comment09_12_29_2129221.30590354</id>
	<title>Everybody's so negative</title>
	<author>smchris</author>
	<datestamp>1262105400000</datestamp>
	<modclass>None</modclass>
	<modscore>1</modscore>
	<htmltext><p>As long as they're black and silky with mirror shades, bluetooth and a logo that strikes cowering respect in the client.</p></htmltext>
<tokenext>As long as they 're black and silky with mirror shades , bluetooth and a logo that strikes cowering respect in the client .</tokentext>
<sentencetext>As long as they're black and silky with mirror shades, bluetooth and a logo that strikes cowering respect in the client.</sentencetext>
</comment>
<comment>
	<id>http://www.semanticweb.org/ontologies/ConversationInstances.owl#comment09_12_29_2129221.30587826</id>
	<title>Re:30 IT people in a 500 employee company?!</title>
	<author>Anonymous</author>
	<datestamp>1262086500000</datestamp>
	<modclass>None</modclass>
	<modscore>0</modscore>
	<htmltext><p>29 to handle "i forgot my password" requests and 1 to do actual work.</p></htmltext>
<tokenext>29 to handle " i forgot my password " requests and 1 to do actual work .</tokentext>
<sentencetext>29 to handle "i forgot my password" requests and 1 to do actual work.</sentencetext>
	<parent>http://www.semanticweb.org/ontologies/ConversationInstances.owl#comment09_12_29_2129221.30587272</parent>
</comment>
<comment>
	<id>http://www.semanticweb.org/ontologies/ConversationInstances.owl#comment09_12_29_2129221.30587874</id>
	<title>Service business, dirt cheap!</title>
	<author>Anonymous</author>
	<datestamp>1262086620000</datestamp>
	<modclass>None</modclass>
	<modscore>0</modscore>
	<htmltext><p>Uniforms are used as part of the external face of a service business. I wonder if this isn't an indication that they've started to think of your group like an outsourced service business. You know, the kind where everybody that comes in is a replaceable cog and is required to meet your every need, while all you have to provide in return is the cash: no benefits or respect required. I can't see any other reason they'd think uniforms for an internal group would have any purpose or meaning. I wouldn't be surprised if the next step is that they start firing the highest paid people and replacing them with interns whose resumes include lines like, "Set up grandparents new Dell Computer and DVD player."</p></htmltext>
<tokenext>Uniforms are used as part of the external face of a service business .
I wonder if this is n't an indication that they 've started to think of your group like an outsourced service business .
You know , the kind where everybody that comes in is a replaceable cog and is required to meet your every need , while all you have to provide in return is the cash : no benefits or respect required .
I ca n't see any other reason they 'd think uniforms for an internal group would have any purpose or meaning .
I would n't be surprised if the next step is that they start firing the highest paid people and replacing them with interns whose resumes include lines like , " Set up grandparents new Dell Computer and DVD player .
"</tokentext>
<sentencetext>Uniforms are used as part of the external face of a service business.
I wonder if this isn't an indication that they've started to think of your group like an outsourced service business.
You know, the kind where everybody that comes in is a replaceable cog and is required to meet your every need, while all you have to provide in return is the cash: no benefits or respect required.
I can't see any other reason they'd think uniforms for an internal group would have any purpose or meaning.
I wouldn't be surprised if the next step is that they start firing the highest paid people and replacing them with interns whose resumes include lines like, "Set up grandparents new Dell Computer and DVD player.
"</sentencetext>
</comment>
<comment>
	<id>http://www.semanticweb.org/ontologies/ConversationInstances.owl#comment09_12_29_2129221.30592790</id>
	<title>Re:30 IT people in a 500 employee company?!</title>
	<author>Mutatis Mutandis</author>
	<datestamp>1259852880000</datestamp>
	<modclass>None</modclass>
	<modscore>1</modscore>
	<htmltext><p>That number of IT people sounds like about our own rate, around 30 people in a company with 600 employees. Of which about half a dozen are helpdesk people. In practice that is not enough for us.</p><p>Yes, it all depends on what you do. If your company only needs an off-the-shelf accounting system and MS Office, these 2 people should do fine. But we have half a dozen transactional database systems, a number of servers that are running heavyweight scientific data analysis, a commercial web interface which we need to keep running 24/7, very strong legal requirements to maintain privacy and data integrity, and almost daily requests to make changes to applications.</p><p>Our IT departement therefore includes programmers, database analysts, testers and validation staff, and of course various managers. These 24 extra people in practice boil down to only 1 or 2 skilled people to support every business-critical system, which means that there are serious gaps every time when people are on holiday or leave the company... We have to cover part of the gaps by allocating time from IT-skilled people in the business unit.</p><p>As for the helpdesk, simply giving everybody the same PC and the same image isn't a viable solution, although sadly our CIO is incompetent enough to think it would be. There is a rather wide gap in requirements between addressing the needs of a manager or his secretary, meeting the more demanding requirements or bio-informatician wrestling with gigabytes of sequencing data, and setting up a controller for a robot that could easily crack somebody's skull. Not to mention all the internal development of software tools.</p><p>However, in fairness, it also depends on how people are organized. Our management has discovered outsourcing, specialization, and centralization: In practice that leads to a bureaucratic merry-go-round in which a simple problem passes through a dozen different mailboxes before somebody does something about it. I've seen trouble tickets that bounced back and forth for two weeks before they landed on the desk of some IT manager, who honestly had to admit that he too couldn't figure out who was responsible for actually solving the problem.</p></htmltext>
<tokenext>That number of IT people sounds like about our own rate , around 30 people in a company with 600 employees .
Of which about half a dozen are helpdesk people .
In practice that is not enough for us.Yes , it all depends on what you do .
If your company only needs an off-the-shelf accounting system and MS Office , these 2 people should do fine .
But we have half a dozen transactional database systems , a number of servers that are running heavyweight scientific data analysis , a commercial web interface which we need to keep running 24/7 , very strong legal requirements to maintain privacy and data integrity , and almost daily requests to make changes to applications.Our IT departement therefore includes programmers , database analysts , testers and validation staff , and of course various managers .
These 24 extra people in practice boil down to only 1 or 2 skilled people to support every business-critical system , which means that there are serious gaps every time when people are on holiday or leave the company... We have to cover part of the gaps by allocating time from IT-skilled people in the business unit.As for the helpdesk , simply giving everybody the same PC and the same image is n't a viable solution , although sadly our CIO is incompetent enough to think it would be .
There is a rather wide gap in requirements between addressing the needs of a manager or his secretary , meeting the more demanding requirements or bio-informatician wrestling with gigabytes of sequencing data , and setting up a controller for a robot that could easily crack somebody 's skull .
Not to mention all the internal development of software tools.However , in fairness , it also depends on how people are organized .
Our management has discovered outsourcing , specialization , and centralization : In practice that leads to a bureaucratic merry-go-round in which a simple problem passes through a dozen different mailboxes before somebody does something about it .
I 've seen trouble tickets that bounced back and forth for two weeks before they landed on the desk of some IT manager , who honestly had to admit that he too could n't figure out who was responsible for actually solving the problem .</tokentext>
<sentencetext>That number of IT people sounds like about our own rate, around 30 people in a company with 600 employees.
Of which about half a dozen are helpdesk people.
In practice that is not enough for us.Yes, it all depends on what you do.
If your company only needs an off-the-shelf accounting system and MS Office, these 2 people should do fine.
But we have half a dozen transactional database systems, a number of servers that are running heavyweight scientific data analysis, a commercial web interface which we need to keep running 24/7, very strong legal requirements to maintain privacy and data integrity, and almost daily requests to make changes to applications.Our IT departement therefore includes programmers, database analysts, testers and validation staff, and of course various managers.
These 24 extra people in practice boil down to only 1 or 2 skilled people to support every business-critical system, which means that there are serious gaps every time when people are on holiday or leave the company... We have to cover part of the gaps by allocating time from IT-skilled people in the business unit.As for the helpdesk, simply giving everybody the same PC and the same image isn't a viable solution, although sadly our CIO is incompetent enough to think it would be.
There is a rather wide gap in requirements between addressing the needs of a manager or his secretary, meeting the more demanding requirements or bio-informatician wrestling with gigabytes of sequencing data, and setting up a controller for a robot that could easily crack somebody's skull.
Not to mention all the internal development of software tools.However, in fairness, it also depends on how people are organized.
Our management has discovered outsourcing, specialization, and centralization: In practice that leads to a bureaucratic merry-go-round in which a simple problem passes through a dozen different mailboxes before somebody does something about it.
I've seen trouble tickets that bounced back and forth for two weeks before they landed on the desk of some IT manager, who honestly had to admit that he too couldn't figure out who was responsible for actually solving the problem.</sentencetext>
	<parent>http://www.semanticweb.org/ontologies/ConversationInstances.owl#comment09_12_29_2129221.30587272</parent>
</comment>
<comment>
	<id>http://www.semanticweb.org/ontologies/ConversationInstances.owl#comment09_12_29_2129221.30588534</id>
	<title>At least they are not French Maid Uniforms</title>
	<author>Anonymous</author>
	<datestamp>1262089860000</datestamp>
	<modclass>None</modclass>
	<modscore>0</modscore>
	<htmltext><p>It could always be worse.</p></htmltext>
<tokenext>It could always be worse .</tokentext>
<sentencetext>It could always be worse.</sentencetext>
</comment>
<comment>
	<id>http://www.semanticweb.org/ontologies/ConversationInstances.owl#comment09_12_29_2129221.30587184</id>
	<title>star trek uniforms</title>
	<author>Anonymous</author>
	<datestamp>1262084340000</datestamp>
	<modclass>None</modclass>
	<modscore>1</modscore>
	<htmltext><p>what about star trek uniforms?</p></htmltext>
<tokenext>what about star trek uniforms ?</tokentext>
<sentencetext>what about star trek uniforms?</sentencetext>
</comment>
<comment>
	<id>http://www.semanticweb.org/ontologies/ConversationInstances.owl#comment09_12_29_2129221.30595120</id>
	<title>Hockey Jersey's</title>
	<author>DarthVain</author>
	<datestamp>1259861520000</datestamp>
	<modclass>Insightful</modclass>
	<modscore>2</modscore>
	<htmltext><p>As many have mentioned, it depends on the uniform.</p><p>If it was something like a golf shirt with a small monogrammed IT logo, it wouldn't bother me, as that's pretty much what I wear to work anyway (and pants).</p><p>If it was something really distinctive and cool, like custom Hockey Jersey's with teams names and logos, and my name on the back with a number, I think that would also be fun!</p><p>If however it was something I felt was lame or stupid, when then I guess I wouldn't like it very much.</p></htmltext>
<tokenext>As many have mentioned , it depends on the uniform.If it was something like a golf shirt with a small monogrammed IT logo , it would n't bother me , as that 's pretty much what I wear to work anyway ( and pants ) .If it was something really distinctive and cool , like custom Hockey Jersey 's with teams names and logos , and my name on the back with a number , I think that would also be fun ! If however it was something I felt was lame or stupid , when then I guess I would n't like it very much .</tokentext>
<sentencetext>As many have mentioned, it depends on the uniform.If it was something like a golf shirt with a small monogrammed IT logo, it wouldn't bother me, as that's pretty much what I wear to work anyway (and pants).If it was something really distinctive and cool, like custom Hockey Jersey's with teams names and logos, and my name on the back with a number, I think that would also be fun!If however it was something I felt was lame or stupid, when then I guess I wouldn't like it very much.</sentencetext>
</comment>
<comment>
	<id>http://www.semanticweb.org/ontologies/ConversationInstances.owl#comment09_12_29_2129221.30587718</id>
	<title>Re:Nothing wrong with the idea</title>
	<author>Anonymous</author>
	<datestamp>1262086140000</datestamp>
	<modclass>Interestin</modclass>
	<modscore>1</modscore>
	<htmltext><p>The problem with this thinking is that a good tech should NEVER outgrow help desk.  A good tech constantly updates his skills and should be paid and respected for that expertise, not made to wear uniforms and perform ridiculous dances on command.</p><p>Your type of thinking is why good techs don't stay in help desk and is, furthermore, one of the many reasons help desk can't help you 75\% of the time.  All the good techs have "advanced" (IE: run the hell out).</p><p>The idea of "help desk" as "entry level" employment is really stupid.  Relying on your worst paid and most-stressed employees to keep the company running is a fantastic example of horrible management.</p></htmltext>
<tokenext>The problem with this thinking is that a good tech should NEVER outgrow help desk .
A good tech constantly updates his skills and should be paid and respected for that expertise , not made to wear uniforms and perform ridiculous dances on command.Your type of thinking is why good techs do n't stay in help desk and is , furthermore , one of the many reasons help desk ca n't help you 75 \ % of the time .
All the good techs have " advanced " ( IE : run the hell out ) .The idea of " help desk " as " entry level " employment is really stupid .
Relying on your worst paid and most-stressed employees to keep the company running is a fantastic example of horrible management .</tokentext>
<sentencetext>The problem with this thinking is that a good tech should NEVER outgrow help desk.
A good tech constantly updates his skills and should be paid and respected for that expertise, not made to wear uniforms and perform ridiculous dances on command.Your type of thinking is why good techs don't stay in help desk and is, furthermore, one of the many reasons help desk can't help you 75\% of the time.
All the good techs have "advanced" (IE: run the hell out).The idea of "help desk" as "entry level" employment is really stupid.
Relying on your worst paid and most-stressed employees to keep the company running is a fantastic example of horrible management.</sentencetext>
	<parent>http://www.semanticweb.org/ontologies/ConversationInstances.owl#comment09_12_29_2129221.30587138</parent>
</comment>
<comment>
	<id>http://www.semanticweb.org/ontologies/ConversationInstances.owl#comment09_12_29_2129221.30592528</id>
	<title>Have fun with it!</title>
	<author>CudaFS</author>
	<datestamp>1259850900000</datestamp>
	<modclass>Funny</modclass>
	<modscore>2</modscore>
	<htmltext>I work in a IT dept of two people for a small town. The IT head wanted us to come up with a logo to "Brand" our dept. So we worked on the style and substance and came up with a nice 3 color logo.

I tossed in some binary because it looked good in red and stands out in the logo. 01010010 01010100 010000110 01001101.(yes, the boss knows what it means)

When any user or "Tie Wearer" asks what it means we just tell them its some random binary numbers.</htmltext>
<tokenext>I work in a IT dept of two people for a small town .
The IT head wanted us to come up with a logo to " Brand " our dept .
So we worked on the style and substance and came up with a nice 3 color logo .
I tossed in some binary because it looked good in red and stands out in the logo .
01010010 01010100 010000110 01001101 .
( yes , the boss knows what it means ) When any user or " Tie Wearer " asks what it means we just tell them its some random binary numbers .</tokentext>
<sentencetext>I work in a IT dept of two people for a small town.
The IT head wanted us to come up with a logo to "Brand" our dept.
So we worked on the style and substance and came up with a nice 3 color logo.
I tossed in some binary because it looked good in red and stands out in the logo.
01010010 01010100 010000110 01001101.
(yes, the boss knows what it means)

When any user or "Tie Wearer" asks what it means we just tell them its some random binary numbers.</sentencetext>
</comment>
<comment>
	<id>http://www.semanticweb.org/ontologies/ConversationInstances.owl#comment09_12_29_2129221.30589634</id>
	<title>Are you joking?</title>
	<author>RandomPsychology</author>
	<datestamp>1262098140000</datestamp>
	<modclass>Insightful</modclass>
	<modscore>2</modscore>
	<htmltext>What's your problem?? Are you *really* going to turn down the opportunity to make one less decision each day?</htmltext>
<tokenext>What 's your problem ? ?
Are you * really * going to turn down the opportunity to make one less decision each day ?</tokentext>
<sentencetext>What's your problem??
Are you *really* going to turn down the opportunity to make one less decision each day?</sentencetext>
</comment>
<comment>
	<id>http://www.semanticweb.org/ontologies/ConversationInstances.owl#comment09_12_29_2129221.30589148</id>
	<title>Re:Well...</title>
	<author>rosaliepizza</author>
	<datestamp>1262093700000</datestamp>
	<modclass>None</modclass>
	<modscore>1</modscore>
	<htmltext>My daughter attends Auburn University and everything she wears is Orange and Blue...do not think she wants anything else</htmltext>
<tokenext>My daughter attends Auburn University and everything she wears is Orange and Blue...do not think she wants anything else</tokentext>
<sentencetext>My daughter attends Auburn University and everything she wears is Orange and Blue...do not think she wants anything else</sentencetext>
	<parent>http://www.semanticweb.org/ontologies/ConversationInstances.owl#comment09_12_29_2129221.30587462</parent>
</comment>
<comment>
	<id>http://www.semanticweb.org/ontologies/ConversationInstances.owl#comment09_12_29_2129221.30588306</id>
	<title>Solution</title>
	<author>Midnight Thunder</author>
	<datestamp>1262088720000</datestamp>
	<modclass>None</modclass>
	<modscore>1</modscore>
	<htmltext><p>There is a solution, join together and buy these T-shirts:</p><p><a href="http://www.thinkgeek.com/tshirts-apparel/unisex/itdepartment/388b/" title="thinkgeek.com">http://www.thinkgeek.com/tshirts-apparel/unisex/itdepartment/388b/</a> [thinkgeek.com]</p><p>go into work and then indicate you were happy with the uniform idea.</p><p>There will probably be multiple reasons for not being asked to wear a uniform the next day.</p></htmltext>
<tokenext>There is a solution , join together and buy these T-shirts : http : //www.thinkgeek.com/tshirts-apparel/unisex/itdepartment/388b/ [ thinkgeek.com ] go into work and then indicate you were happy with the uniform idea.There will probably be multiple reasons for not being asked to wear a uniform the next day .</tokentext>
<sentencetext>There is a solution, join together and buy these T-shirts:http://www.thinkgeek.com/tshirts-apparel/unisex/itdepartment/388b/ [thinkgeek.com]go into work and then indicate you were happy with the uniform idea.There will probably be multiple reasons for not being asked to wear a uniform the next day.</sentencetext>
</comment>
<comment>
	<id>http://www.semanticweb.org/ontologies/ConversationInstances.owl#comment09_12_29_2129221.30589576</id>
	<title>Re:30 IT people in a 500 employee company?!</title>
	<author>Anonymous</author>
	<datestamp>1262097660000</datestamp>
	<modclass>None</modclass>
	<modscore>0</modscore>
	<htmltext><p>"What are most of you DOING? "</p><p>
&nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; Using Windows.<br>
&nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; And I'm not trolling.  It seems to me that wide-scale normal Windows deployments need TONS AND TONS of hand-holding, firefighting, etc., VERY labor intensive.   Widescale deployments with the software microsoft provides to automate patcihng etc., still has lots of firefighting, AND the software tends to be very difficult to deal with to the point that there'll be one guy (at least!) JUST fighting with the automation software (AD, patch management, etc. etc.)  Virus and anti-spyware software and cleanup; imaging; if someone gets a new computer, they probably can't do an automated install due to Windows's poor driver support out of the box.   Licensing.  Etc.  Windows is no Linux after all.</p></htmltext>
<tokenext>" What are most of you DOING ?
"             Using Windows .
            And I 'm not trolling .
It seems to me that wide-scale normal Windows deployments need TONS AND TONS of hand-holding , firefighting , etc. , VERY labor intensive .
Widescale deployments with the software microsoft provides to automate patcihng etc. , still has lots of firefighting , AND the software tends to be very difficult to deal with to the point that there 'll be one guy ( at least !
) JUST fighting with the automation software ( AD , patch management , etc .
etc. ) Virus and anti-spyware software and cleanup ; imaging ; if someone gets a new computer , they probably ca n't do an automated install due to Windows 's poor driver support out of the box .
Licensing. Etc .
Windows is no Linux after all .</tokentext>
<sentencetext>"What are most of you DOING?
"
            Using Windows.
            And I'm not trolling.
It seems to me that wide-scale normal Windows deployments need TONS AND TONS of hand-holding, firefighting, etc., VERY labor intensive.
Widescale deployments with the software microsoft provides to automate patcihng etc., still has lots of firefighting, AND the software tends to be very difficult to deal with to the point that there'll be one guy (at least!
) JUST fighting with the automation software (AD, patch management, etc.
etc.)  Virus and anti-spyware software and cleanup; imaging; if someone gets a new computer, they probably can't do an automated install due to Windows's poor driver support out of the box.
Licensing.  Etc.
Windows is no Linux after all.</sentencetext>
	<parent>http://www.semanticweb.org/ontologies/ConversationInstances.owl#comment09_12_29_2129221.30587272</parent>
</comment>
<comment>
	<id>http://www.semanticweb.org/ontologies/ConversationInstances.owl#comment09_12_29_2129221.30589914</id>
	<title>Should be ok</title>
	<author>tombeard</author>
	<datestamp>1262100720000</datestamp>
	<modclass>None</modclass>
	<modscore>1</modscore>
	<htmltext><p>NP, as long as it has a superman cape.</p></htmltext>
<tokenext>NP , as long as it has a superman cape .</tokentext>
<sentencetext>NP, as long as it has a superman cape.</sentencetext>
</comment>
<comment>
	<id>http://www.semanticweb.org/ontologies/ConversationInstances.owl#comment09_12_29_2129221.30589130</id>
	<title>Re:Professionalism</title>
	<author>Nimey</author>
	<datestamp>1262093520000</datestamp>
	<modclass>None</modclass>
	<modscore>1</modscore>
	<htmltext><p>Black with silver trim, and black boots.  Cultivate a really <i>intense</i> workplace persona.</p></htmltext>
<tokenext>Black with silver trim , and black boots .
Cultivate a really intense workplace persona .</tokentext>
<sentencetext>Black with silver trim, and black boots.
Cultivate a really intense workplace persona.</sentencetext>
	<parent>http://www.semanticweb.org/ontologies/ConversationInstances.owl#comment09_12_29_2129221.30587480</parent>
</comment>
<comment>
	<id>http://www.semanticweb.org/ontologies/ConversationInstances.owl#comment09_12_29_2129221.30589832</id>
	<title>Re:30 IT people in a 500 employee company?!</title>
	<author>straponego</author>
	<datestamp>1262100000000</datestamp>
	<modclass>None</modclass>
	<modscore>1</modscore>
	<htmltext>Windows.</htmltext>
<tokenext>Windows .</tokentext>
<sentencetext>Windows.</sentencetext>
	<parent>http://www.semanticweb.org/ontologies/ConversationInstances.owl#comment09_12_29_2129221.30587272</parent>
</comment>
<comment>
	<id>http://www.semanticweb.org/ontologies/ConversationInstances.owl#comment09_12_29_2129221.30587458</id>
	<title>How about a different kind of badge</title>
	<author>Microsift</author>
	<datestamp>1262085240000</datestamp>
	<modclass>None</modclass>
	<modscore>1</modscore>
	<htmltext><p>It seems like this could be best handled by some sort of indication on your badge (if you have one).</p></htmltext>
<tokenext>It seems like this could be best handled by some sort of indication on your badge ( if you have one ) .</tokentext>
<sentencetext>It seems like this could be best handled by some sort of indication on your badge (if you have one).</sentencetext>
</comment>
<comment>
	<id>http://www.semanticweb.org/ontologies/ConversationInstances.owl#comment09_12_29_2129221.30587556</id>
	<title>Nazis...</title>
	<author>Anonymous</author>
	<datestamp>1262085480000</datestamp>
	<modclass>None</modclass>
	<modscore>0</modscore>
	<htmltext>did something similar to Jews.  We all know how that worked out.</htmltext>
<tokenext>did something similar to Jews .
We all know how that worked out .</tokentext>
<sentencetext>did something similar to Jews.
We all know how that worked out.</sentencetext>
</comment>
<comment>
	<id>http://www.semanticweb.org/ontologies/ConversationInstances.owl#comment09_12_29_2129221.30588504</id>
	<title>Colored IDs</title>
	<author>Anonymous</author>
	<datestamp>1262089740000</datestamp>
	<modclass>None</modclass>
	<modscore>0</modscore>
	<htmltext><p>Why wear a uniform when you could just require everyone toss on a colored nametag/id? It would make them stand out just as much, and not be nearly as annoying. Bonus points if you give them color coded neck band holder things.</p></htmltext>
<tokenext>Why wear a uniform when you could just require everyone toss on a colored nametag/id ?
It would make them stand out just as much , and not be nearly as annoying .
Bonus points if you give them color coded neck band holder things .</tokentext>
<sentencetext>Why wear a uniform when you could just require everyone toss on a colored nametag/id?
It would make them stand out just as much, and not be nearly as annoying.
Bonus points if you give them color coded neck band holder things.</sentencetext>
</comment>
<comment>
	<id>http://www.semanticweb.org/ontologies/ConversationInstances.owl#comment09_12_29_2129221.30588430</id>
	<title>unity?</title>
	<author>ikegami</author>
	<datestamp>1262089320000</datestamp>
	<modclass>None</modclass>
	<modscore>1</modscore>
	<htmltext><blockquote><div><p> <i>The idea is to promote visibility and unity.</i></p></div> </blockquote><p>How does something that separates them from the rest of the company promote unity?

</p><p>Either way, wouldn't something like a different style for the id badge do the same thing more cheaply and without resentment?</p></div>
	</htmltext>
<tokenext>The idea is to promote visibility and unity .
How does something that separates them from the rest of the company promote unity ?
Either way , would n't something like a different style for the id badge do the same thing more cheaply and without resentment ?</tokentext>
<sentencetext> The idea is to promote visibility and unity.
How does something that separates them from the rest of the company promote unity?
Either way, wouldn't something like a different style for the id badge do the same thing more cheaply and without resentment?
	</sentencetext>
</comment>
<comment>
	<id>http://www.semanticweb.org/ontologies/ConversationInstances.owl#comment09_12_29_2129221.30593766</id>
	<title>Mike</title>
	<author>Redstorm\_mpasaa</author>
	<datestamp>1259857080000</datestamp>
	<modclass>Insightful</modclass>
	<modscore>2</modscore>
	<htmltext><p>Do you want fries with that<nobr> <wbr></nobr>;-)  Typical, treating IT staff as service workers as usual...no offense to those who wear uniforms for their jobs but it's appropriate in some jobs...not in others.  Working in corporate and office environments means showing certain kinds of professionalism and making IT staff wear some sort of uniform, in my opinion, detracts from this image.  We aren't plumbers or electricians or copier repair guys visiting your sites from outside companies...we are employees too (I count contractors in this pool too especially whe under long term contracts).  I agree with some others...make management wear badges that say "President", "CIO", CFO" etc...you think that would go over well...why should IT wear a uniform....frankly, IT staff are often the ones who know and speak with everyone in the company  and anyone who doesn't live under a rock in their company knows them...that's more than I can say for some employees in places I've worked.  There have been employees who literally sit next to each but never speak or even know each other's names...maybe they should wear a uniform letting others know which departments they work in...maybe that would foster more teamwork from average employees...leave IT staff alone...we've got enough fires and issues to deal with...Peace and happy New Year to all...</p></htmltext>
<tokenext>Do you want fries with that ; - ) Typical , treating IT staff as service workers as usual...no offense to those who wear uniforms for their jobs but it 's appropriate in some jobs...not in others .
Working in corporate and office environments means showing certain kinds of professionalism and making IT staff wear some sort of uniform , in my opinion , detracts from this image .
We are n't plumbers or electricians or copier repair guys visiting your sites from outside companies...we are employees too ( I count contractors in this pool too especially whe under long term contracts ) .
I agree with some others...make management wear badges that say " President " , " CIO " , CFO " etc...you think that would go over well...why should IT wear a uniform....frankly , IT staff are often the ones who know and speak with everyone in the company and anyone who does n't live under a rock in their company knows them...that 's more than I can say for some employees in places I 've worked .
There have been employees who literally sit next to each but never speak or even know each other 's names...maybe they should wear a uniform letting others know which departments they work in...maybe that would foster more teamwork from average employees...leave IT staff alone...we 've got enough fires and issues to deal with...Peace and happy New Year to all.. .</tokentext>
<sentencetext>Do you want fries with that ;-)  Typical, treating IT staff as service workers as usual...no offense to those who wear uniforms for their jobs but it's appropriate in some jobs...not in others.
Working in corporate and office environments means showing certain kinds of professionalism and making IT staff wear some sort of uniform, in my opinion, detracts from this image.
We aren't plumbers or electricians or copier repair guys visiting your sites from outside companies...we are employees too (I count contractors in this pool too especially whe under long term contracts).
I agree with some others...make management wear badges that say "President", "CIO", CFO" etc...you think that would go over well...why should IT wear a uniform....frankly, IT staff are often the ones who know and speak with everyone in the company  and anyone who doesn't live under a rock in their company knows them...that's more than I can say for some employees in places I've worked.
There have been employees who literally sit next to each but never speak or even know each other's names...maybe they should wear a uniform letting others know which departments they work in...maybe that would foster more teamwork from average employees...leave IT staff alone...we've got enough fires and issues to deal with...Peace and happy New Year to all...</sentencetext>
</comment>
<comment>
	<id>http://www.semanticweb.org/ontologies/ConversationInstances.owl#comment09_12_29_2129221.30589310</id>
	<title>Re:30 for 500?</title>
	<author>Rytr23</author>
	<datestamp>1262095200000</datestamp>
	<modclass>None</modclass>
	<modscore>1</modscore>
	<htmltext>No.  It depends on the business. I work for a financial services company and our LOB is about 130 bodies with ~50 dedicated to IT. That includes DBAs/INF/Devs/Arch/PMs. We don't even provide help desk services.  And we are drinking through a fire hose with the workload from the business.  The LOB,  of course,  is a web based financial management service with a lot of demanding clients. But our parent company (a bank) has about 25K employees with 4K that are considered IT which isn't nearly the ratio we are but is much higher than 60/1.</htmltext>
<tokenext>No .
It depends on the business .
I work for a financial services company and our LOB is about 130 bodies with ~ 50 dedicated to IT .
That includes DBAs/INF/Devs/Arch/PMs .
We do n't even provide help desk services .
And we are drinking through a fire hose with the workload from the business .
The LOB , of course , is a web based financial management service with a lot of demanding clients .
But our parent company ( a bank ) has about 25K employees with 4K that are considered IT which is n't nearly the ratio we are but is much higher than 60/1 .</tokentext>
<sentencetext>No.
It depends on the business.
I work for a financial services company and our LOB is about 130 bodies with ~50 dedicated to IT.
That includes DBAs/INF/Devs/Arch/PMs.
We don't even provide help desk services.
And we are drinking through a fire hose with the workload from the business.
The LOB,  of course,  is a web based financial management service with a lot of demanding clients.
But our parent company (a bank) has about 25K employees with 4K that are considered IT which isn't nearly the ratio we are but is much higher than 60/1.</sentencetext>
	<parent>http://www.semanticweb.org/ontologies/ConversationInstances.owl#comment09_12_29_2129221.30588594</parent>
</comment>
<comment>
	<id>http://www.semanticweb.org/ontologies/ConversationInstances.owl#comment09_12_29_2129221.30587244</id>
	<title>Are you colleagues or janitors?</title>
	<author>Anonymous</author>
	<datestamp>1262084520000</datestamp>
	<modclass>Insightful</modclass>
	<modscore>4</modscore>
	<htmltext><blockquote><div><p>The idea is to promote visibility and unity.</p></div></blockquote><p>As opposed to interchangeability and lack of individuality?</p><p>Why on earth should your help desk boys be forced to wear uniforms by policy when the rest of the office get to dress like professionals? From my viewpoint, the whole question just oozes social stratification.</p></div>
	</htmltext>
<tokenext>The idea is to promote visibility and unity.As opposed to interchangeability and lack of individuality ? Why on earth should your help desk boys be forced to wear uniforms by policy when the rest of the office get to dress like professionals ?
From my viewpoint , the whole question just oozes social stratification .</tokentext>
<sentencetext>The idea is to promote visibility and unity.As opposed to interchangeability and lack of individuality?Why on earth should your help desk boys be forced to wear uniforms by policy when the rest of the office get to dress like professionals?
From my viewpoint, the whole question just oozes social stratification.
	</sentencetext>
</comment>
<comment>
	<id>http://www.semanticweb.org/ontologies/ConversationInstances.owl#comment09_12_29_2129221.30587766</id>
	<title>Geek squad</title>
	<author>Anonymous</author>
	<datestamp>1262086260000</datestamp>
	<modclass>None</modclass>
	<modscore>0</modscore>
	<htmltext><p>Sounds like many Management teams that consider their Help Desk staff to be no different from The Geek Squad.  I think it's insulting.</p><p>Just because someone works the Help Desk doesn't mean they have a lack of talent.  It's an entry-level position where you often have to "pay your dues" (even if you have the knowledge or skill) to move to positions of higher responsibility.</p><p>I'd suggest that the Management team all wear uniforms with the phrase "Management" emblazoned across them "to convey a message of unity" that the Management is all one team.  Doubtful, but it may change their tune.</p></htmltext>
<tokenext>Sounds like many Management teams that consider their Help Desk staff to be no different from The Geek Squad .
I think it 's insulting.Just because someone works the Help Desk does n't mean they have a lack of talent .
It 's an entry-level position where you often have to " pay your dues " ( even if you have the knowledge or skill ) to move to positions of higher responsibility.I 'd suggest that the Management team all wear uniforms with the phrase " Management " emblazoned across them " to convey a message of unity " that the Management is all one team .
Doubtful , but it may change their tune .</tokentext>
<sentencetext>Sounds like many Management teams that consider their Help Desk staff to be no different from The Geek Squad.
I think it's insulting.Just because someone works the Help Desk doesn't mean they have a lack of talent.
It's an entry-level position where you often have to "pay your dues" (even if you have the knowledge or skill) to move to positions of higher responsibility.I'd suggest that the Management team all wear uniforms with the phrase "Management" emblazoned across them "to convey a message of unity" that the Management is all one team.
Doubtful, but it may change their tune.</sentencetext>
</comment>
<comment>
	<id>http://www.semanticweb.org/ontologies/ConversationInstances.owl#comment09_12_29_2129221.30587610</id>
	<title>Seriously don't...</title>
	<author>lysacor</author>
	<datestamp>1262085720000</datestamp>
	<modclass>None</modclass>
	<modscore>1</modscore>
	<htmltext>Simply put, Help Desk staff assigned to wear retail style "uniforms" will make the users think less of the staff.

Doing this you are comparing your Help Desk, to the local staff at the Best Buy/Geek Squad, what have you.

This may not be a flattering image you want to portray... especially to your "internal customers"...</htmltext>
<tokenext>Simply put , Help Desk staff assigned to wear retail style " uniforms " will make the users think less of the staff .
Doing this you are comparing your Help Desk , to the local staff at the Best Buy/Geek Squad , what have you .
This may not be a flattering image you want to portray... especially to your " internal customers " .. .</tokentext>
<sentencetext>Simply put, Help Desk staff assigned to wear retail style "uniforms" will make the users think less of the staff.
Doing this you are comparing your Help Desk, to the local staff at the Best Buy/Geek Squad, what have you.
This may not be a flattering image you want to portray... especially to your "internal customers"...</sentencetext>
</comment>
<comment>
	<id>http://www.semanticweb.org/ontologies/ConversationInstances.owl#comment09_12_29_2129221.30587440</id>
	<title>Who are you trying to impress?</title>
	<author>shameless</author>
	<datestamp>1262085120000</datestamp>
	<modclass>None</modclass>
	<modscore>1</modscore>
	<htmltext><p>It's not clear from the original article... is this an internal helpdesk or a customer-facing helpdesk?  If you're in a customer-facing position I agree that a look that reinforces your "brand" is good business.  If your "customers" are all internal, though, then I have to wonder about management's motivations.  Either they're trying to send a subtle message about your current mode of dress, or else they're scheming to get more attention (and resources) from upper management ("We want to make sure they KNOW who helped them out come budget time!")</p><p>A more-flexible and less-costly alternative to shirts, though, might be special "help-desk" *badges* that you wear when you're on the clock.  These serve the same branding function, but you only have to buy one per employee (if they expect you to wear the shirts four days a week, they damned well better issue at least four shirts per employee!)</p></htmltext>
<tokenext>It 's not clear from the original article... is this an internal helpdesk or a customer-facing helpdesk ?
If you 're in a customer-facing position I agree that a look that reinforces your " brand " is good business .
If your " customers " are all internal , though , then I have to wonder about management 's motivations .
Either they 're trying to send a subtle message about your current mode of dress , or else they 're scheming to get more attention ( and resources ) from upper management ( " We want to make sure they KNOW who helped them out come budget time !
" ) A more-flexible and less-costly alternative to shirts , though , might be special " help-desk " * badges * that you wear when you 're on the clock .
These serve the same branding function , but you only have to buy one per employee ( if they expect you to wear the shirts four days a week , they damned well better issue at least four shirts per employee !
)</tokentext>
<sentencetext>It's not clear from the original article... is this an internal helpdesk or a customer-facing helpdesk?
If you're in a customer-facing position I agree that a look that reinforces your "brand" is good business.
If your "customers" are all internal, though, then I have to wonder about management's motivations.
Either they're trying to send a subtle message about your current mode of dress, or else they're scheming to get more attention (and resources) from upper management ("We want to make sure they KNOW who helped them out come budget time!
")A more-flexible and less-costly alternative to shirts, though, might be special "help-desk" *badges* that you wear when you're on the clock.
These serve the same branding function, but you only have to buy one per employee (if they expect you to wear the shirts four days a week, they damned well better issue at least four shirts per employee!
)</sentencetext>
</comment>
<comment>
	<id>http://www.semanticweb.org/ontologies/ConversationInstances.owl#comment09_12_29_2129221.30587660</id>
	<title>Re:30 IT people in a 500 employee company?!</title>
	<author>Anonymous</author>
	<datestamp>1262085840000</datestamp>
	<modclass>None</modclass>
	<modscore>0</modscore>
	<htmltext><p>Yeah no shit. I work for a company with about 550 people and I manage with only two helpdesk people. We also have 14 office spread over about a 300 mile radius.</p></htmltext>
<tokenext>Yeah no shit .
I work for a company with about 550 people and I manage with only two helpdesk people .
We also have 14 office spread over about a 300 mile radius .</tokentext>
<sentencetext>Yeah no shit.
I work for a company with about 550 people and I manage with only two helpdesk people.
We also have 14 office spread over about a 300 mile radius.</sentencetext>
	<parent>http://www.semanticweb.org/ontologies/ConversationInstances.owl#comment09_12_29_2129221.30587272</parent>
</comment>
<comment>
	<id>http://www.semanticweb.org/ontologies/ConversationInstances.owl#comment09_12_29_2129221.30587584</id>
	<title>Depends on why you're doing it</title>
	<author>reaper</author>
	<datestamp>1262085660000</datestamp>
	<modclass>None</modclass>
	<modscore>1</modscore>
	<htmltext><p>If you're doing it to get department unity, or to get better visibility for your people so you can get the recognition for a good job, it's not a terrible idea. The trick is that you don't want the IT guys to dislike it, or so that users don't start pulling guys away from higher priority tasks due to the new visibility.</p><p>I know, I prefer wearing the uniform when I go out on calls (saves me from having to think about my outfit), but our shirts are actually comfortable and appropriate for the weather and clients we're servicing. That and as a small company, we really need to have a professional, unified image.</p><p>Having an internal team wear them just to be easier to stick out, or for reasons that don't help your team directly, will brew internal tension.</p></htmltext>
<tokenext>If you 're doing it to get department unity , or to get better visibility for your people so you can get the recognition for a good job , it 's not a terrible idea .
The trick is that you do n't want the IT guys to dislike it , or so that users do n't start pulling guys away from higher priority tasks due to the new visibility.I know , I prefer wearing the uniform when I go out on calls ( saves me from having to think about my outfit ) , but our shirts are actually comfortable and appropriate for the weather and clients we 're servicing .
That and as a small company , we really need to have a professional , unified image.Having an internal team wear them just to be easier to stick out , or for reasons that do n't help your team directly , will brew internal tension .</tokentext>
<sentencetext>If you're doing it to get department unity, or to get better visibility for your people so you can get the recognition for a good job, it's not a terrible idea.
The trick is that you don't want the IT guys to dislike it, or so that users don't start pulling guys away from higher priority tasks due to the new visibility.I know, I prefer wearing the uniform when I go out on calls (saves me from having to think about my outfit), but our shirts are actually comfortable and appropriate for the weather and clients we're servicing.
That and as a small company, we really need to have a professional, unified image.Having an internal team wear them just to be easier to stick out, or for reasons that don't help your team directly, will brew internal tension.</sentencetext>
</comment>
<comment>
	<id>http://www.semanticweb.org/ontologies/ConversationInstances.owl#comment09_12_29_2129221.30587332</id>
	<title>Of course it's a step in the right direction.</title>
	<author>Anonymous</author>
	<datestamp>1262084820000</datestamp>
	<modclass>None</modclass>
	<modscore>0</modscore>
	<htmltext><p>
Of course, it doesn't go nearly far enough.  Aren't they going to make you all get the same haircut and talk with the same accent as well?  I assume one of the 6 is female?  After all, the rest of you already seem to have had your balls taken away for conformity.
</p></htmltext>
<tokenext>Of course , it does n't go nearly far enough .
Are n't they going to make you all get the same haircut and talk with the same accent as well ?
I assume one of the 6 is female ?
After all , the rest of you already seem to have had your balls taken away for conformity .</tokentext>
<sentencetext>
Of course, it doesn't go nearly far enough.
Aren't they going to make you all get the same haircut and talk with the same accent as well?
I assume one of the 6 is female?
After all, the rest of you already seem to have had your balls taken away for conformity.
</sentencetext>
</comment>
<comment>
	<id>http://www.semanticweb.org/ontologies/ConversationInstances.owl#comment09_12_29_2129221.30591222</id>
	<title>Just for girls</title>
	<author>Fotograf</author>
	<datestamp>1259872140000</datestamp>
	<modclass>None</modclass>
	<modscore>1</modscore>
	<htmltext>dress code just for girls, design with care for fun, unity, motivation and comfort in overheated offices</htmltext>
<tokenext>dress code just for girls , design with care for fun , unity , motivation and comfort in overheated offices</tokentext>
<sentencetext>dress code just for girls, design with care for fun, unity, motivation and comfort in overheated offices</sentencetext>
</comment>
<comment>
	<id>http://www.semanticweb.org/ontologies/ConversationInstances.owl#comment09_12_29_2129221.30587474</id>
	<title>Anonymous Coward</title>
	<author>Anonymous</author>
	<datestamp>1262085300000</datestamp>
	<modclass>None</modclass>
	<modscore>0</modscore>
	<htmltext><p>I see this as a security opportunity. A local company had a hacker us social engineering to acquire laptops by posing as a help desk employee. The shirts would make a help desk employee more easily identifiable, especially a new hire.</p></htmltext>
<tokenext>I see this as a security opportunity .
A local company had a hacker us social engineering to acquire laptops by posing as a help desk employee .
The shirts would make a help desk employee more easily identifiable , especially a new hire .</tokentext>
<sentencetext>I see this as a security opportunity.
A local company had a hacker us social engineering to acquire laptops by posing as a help desk employee.
The shirts would make a help desk employee more easily identifiable, especially a new hire.</sentencetext>
</comment>
<comment>
	<id>http://www.semanticweb.org/ontologies/ConversationInstances.owl#comment09_12_29_2129221.30592586</id>
	<title>Re:Well...</title>
	<author>Vindicator9000</author>
	<datestamp>1259851500000</datestamp>
	<modclass>Informativ</modclass>
	<modscore>2</modscore>
	<htmltext>Healthcare.  I work desktop support in healthcare.<p>
I've talked to other people who work desktop in this industry, and it seems to be the same all over the place.  Most of the managers of IT are clinical people rather than IT people.  They regard IT as an unnecessary evil, and would rather it be gone completely.  The organization is setup so that no one can tell anyone no, least of all us.  They don't care about job descriptions; here Desktop Support is a catchall, but they tell us that we're being paid the industry standard for Desktop, so we should be happy.</p><p>
So, when someone puts in a helpdesk ticket asking me to write them an access database, or fix one that they broke I have to do it.  When someone puts in a helpdesk ticket ordering 100 computers, I have to do that.  When someone wants an app written, I have to do that.  When someone picks out some damned vendor package against our objections, I have to install it on the desktops, install it on the servers, and maintain both.</p><p>
Yes, it is in a flyover state, but my pay is still low for the area if they would pay me based on what I do rather than my job description.</p></htmltext>
<tokenext>Healthcare .
I work desktop support in healthcare .
I 've talked to other people who work desktop in this industry , and it seems to be the same all over the place .
Most of the managers of IT are clinical people rather than IT people .
They regard IT as an unnecessary evil , and would rather it be gone completely .
The organization is setup so that no one can tell anyone no , least of all us .
They do n't care about job descriptions ; here Desktop Support is a catchall , but they tell us that we 're being paid the industry standard for Desktop , so we should be happy .
So , when someone puts in a helpdesk ticket asking me to write them an access database , or fix one that they broke I have to do it .
When someone puts in a helpdesk ticket ordering 100 computers , I have to do that .
When someone wants an app written , I have to do that .
When someone picks out some damned vendor package against our objections , I have to install it on the desktops , install it on the servers , and maintain both .
Yes , it is in a flyover state , but my pay is still low for the area if they would pay me based on what I do rather than my job description .</tokentext>
<sentencetext>Healthcare.
I work desktop support in healthcare.
I've talked to other people who work desktop in this industry, and it seems to be the same all over the place.
Most of the managers of IT are clinical people rather than IT people.
They regard IT as an unnecessary evil, and would rather it be gone completely.
The organization is setup so that no one can tell anyone no, least of all us.
They don't care about job descriptions; here Desktop Support is a catchall, but they tell us that we're being paid the industry standard for Desktop, so we should be happy.
So, when someone puts in a helpdesk ticket asking me to write them an access database, or fix one that they broke I have to do it.
When someone puts in a helpdesk ticket ordering 100 computers, I have to do that.
When someone wants an app written, I have to do that.
When someone picks out some damned vendor package against our objections, I have to install it on the desktops, install it on the servers, and maintain both.
Yes, it is in a flyover state, but my pay is still low for the area if they would pay me based on what I do rather than my job description.</sentencetext>
	<parent>http://www.semanticweb.org/ontologies/ConversationInstances.owl#comment09_12_29_2129221.30588546</parent>
</comment>
<comment>
	<id>http://www.semanticweb.org/ontologies/ConversationInstances.owl#comment09_12_29_2129221.30588908</id>
	<title>Re:Well...</title>
	<author>DigiShaman</author>
	<datestamp>1262092080000</datestamp>
	<modclass>None</modclass>
	<modscore>1</modscore>
	<htmltext><p>I have to agree. With that level of skillset, he should be running his *own* company as an active consultant!</p><p>Vindicator9000, 40k a year isn't worth jack if you die young from a heart attack.</p></htmltext>
<tokenext>I have to agree .
With that level of skillset , he should be running his * own * company as an active consultant ! Vindicator9000 , 40k a year is n't worth jack if you die young from a heart attack .</tokentext>
<sentencetext>I have to agree.
With that level of skillset, he should be running his *own* company as an active consultant!Vindicator9000, 40k a year isn't worth jack if you die young from a heart attack.</sentencetext>
	<parent>http://www.semanticweb.org/ontologies/ConversationInstances.owl#comment09_12_29_2129221.30588546</parent>
</comment>
<comment>
	<id>http://www.semanticweb.org/ontologies/ConversationInstances.owl#comment09_12_29_2129221.30589986</id>
	<title>Re:Professionalism</title>
	<author>Anonymous</author>
	<datestamp>1262101440000</datestamp>
	<modclass>None</modclass>
	<modscore>0</modscore>
	<htmltext><p>When I was in IT I was an Electronic Point Of Sale installer-configurationneer-(alcohol line flow meter installer) and I loved my deep blue shirt. They could take a lot of sweat and crap and still look good.<br>A good memory... I am now a dev with a grad school degree, work suck more but I have more money...</p></htmltext>
<tokenext>When I was in IT I was an Electronic Point Of Sale installer-configurationneer- ( alcohol line flow meter installer ) and I loved my deep blue shirt .
They could take a lot of sweat and crap and still look good.A good memory... I am now a dev with a grad school degree , work suck more but I have more money.. .</tokentext>
<sentencetext>When I was in IT I was an Electronic Point Of Sale installer-configurationneer-(alcohol line flow meter installer) and I loved my deep blue shirt.
They could take a lot of sweat and crap and still look good.A good memory... I am now a dev with a grad school degree, work suck more but I have more money...</sentencetext>
	<parent>http://www.semanticweb.org/ontologies/ConversationInstances.owl#comment09_12_29_2129221.30587480</parent>
</comment>
<comment>
	<id>http://www.semanticweb.org/ontologies/ConversationInstances.owl#comment09_12_29_2129221.30593820</id>
	<title>Re:Are you colleagues or janitors?</title>
	<author>Avatar8</author>
	<datestamp>1259857260000</datestamp>
	<modclass>None</modclass>
	<modscore>1</modscore>
	<htmltext>Despite the original poster stating "...know us by name," the managers cannot actually tell one IT person apart from another. Wearing similar shirts help management to think less... if that is possible.</htmltext>
<tokenext>Despite the original poster stating " ...know us by name , " the managers can not actually tell one IT person apart from another .
Wearing similar shirts help management to think less... if that is possible .</tokentext>
<sentencetext>Despite the original poster stating "...know us by name," the managers cannot actually tell one IT person apart from another.
Wearing similar shirts help management to think less... if that is possible.</sentencetext>
	<parent>http://www.semanticweb.org/ontologies/ConversationInstances.owl#comment09_12_29_2129221.30587244</parent>
</comment>
<comment>
	<id>http://www.semanticweb.org/ontologies/ConversationInstances.owl#comment09_12_29_2129221.30587236</id>
	<title>The First Step</title>
	<author>Anonymous</author>
	<datestamp>1262084460000</datestamp>
	<modclass>None</modclass>
	<modscore>1</modscore>
	<htmltext>This is the first step in making you blue collar workers.</htmltext>
<tokenext>This is the first step in making you blue collar workers .</tokentext>
<sentencetext>This is the first step in making you blue collar workers.</sentencetext>
</comment>
<comment>
	<id>http://www.semanticweb.org/ontologies/ConversationInstances.owl#comment09_12_29_2129221.30589488</id>
	<title>Re:The First Step</title>
	<author>thePowerOfGrayskull</author>
	<datestamp>1262096880000</datestamp>
	<modclass>None</modclass>
	<modscore>1</modscore>
	<htmltext>Is that incorrect? I know this won't be popular here of all places but<nobr> <wbr></nobr>... computers have advanced in the last 30 years.  Most problems can be resolved by following simple decision trees.  True, in-depth understanding of how they do what they do is no longer a requirement in order to maintain them.  This means that the level of intelligence required is not as high as it once was (case in point: geek squad)
<p>
Given this, it really seems to me that IT/support is headed in this direction... and that this isn't necessarily incorrect.</p></htmltext>
<tokenext>Is that incorrect ?
I know this wo n't be popular here of all places but ... computers have advanced in the last 30 years .
Most problems can be resolved by following simple decision trees .
True , in-depth understanding of how they do what they do is no longer a requirement in order to maintain them .
This means that the level of intelligence required is not as high as it once was ( case in point : geek squad ) Given this , it really seems to me that IT/support is headed in this direction... and that this is n't necessarily incorrect .</tokentext>
<sentencetext>Is that incorrect?
I know this won't be popular here of all places but ... computers have advanced in the last 30 years.
Most problems can be resolved by following simple decision trees.
True, in-depth understanding of how they do what they do is no longer a requirement in order to maintain them.
This means that the level of intelligence required is not as high as it once was (case in point: geek squad)

Given this, it really seems to me that IT/support is headed in this direction... and that this isn't necessarily incorrect.</sentencetext>
	<parent>http://www.semanticweb.org/ontologies/ConversationInstances.owl#comment09_12_29_2129221.30587236</parent>
</comment>
<comment>
	<id>http://www.semanticweb.org/ontologies/ConversationInstances.owl#comment09_12_29_2129221.30595498</id>
	<title>Re:Well...</title>
	<author>Anonymous</author>
	<datestamp>1259862480000</datestamp>
	<modclass>None</modclass>
	<modscore>0</modscore>
	<htmltext><p>With a blaze orange shirt and pants, you'll look like you just broke out of Guantanamo.  You might as well wear the black and white stripes of a chain gang!</p></htmltext>
<tokenext>With a blaze orange shirt and pants , you 'll look like you just broke out of Guantanamo .
You might as well wear the black and white stripes of a chain gang !</tokentext>
<sentencetext>With a blaze orange shirt and pants, you'll look like you just broke out of Guantanamo.
You might as well wear the black and white stripes of a chain gang!</sentencetext>
	<parent>http://www.semanticweb.org/ontologies/ConversationInstances.owl#comment09_12_29_2129221.30587462</parent>
</comment>
<comment>
	<id>http://www.semanticweb.org/ontologies/ConversationInstances.owl#comment09_12_29_2129221.30596706</id>
	<title>Re:Well...</title>
	<author>Anonymous</author>
	<datestamp>1259866320000</datestamp>
	<modclass>None</modclass>
	<modscore>0</modscore>
	<htmltext><p>Post a link to your resume. The best thing about a down economy and closing shops is the impending upsurge of pissed off ex-employees taking the reins and starting new companies. crappy policies like these are a way to keep folks in their place.</p></htmltext>
<tokenext>Post a link to your resume .
The best thing about a down economy and closing shops is the impending upsurge of pissed off ex-employees taking the reins and starting new companies .
crappy policies like these are a way to keep folks in their place .</tokentext>
<sentencetext>Post a link to your resume.
The best thing about a down economy and closing shops is the impending upsurge of pissed off ex-employees taking the reins and starting new companies.
crappy policies like these are a way to keep folks in their place.</sentencetext>
	<parent>http://www.semanticweb.org/ontologies/ConversationInstances.owl#comment09_12_29_2129221.30587462</parent>
</comment>
<comment>
	<id>http://www.semanticweb.org/ontologies/ConversationInstances.owl#comment09_12_29_2129221.30587564</id>
	<title>Not too bad</title>
	<author>bondog</author>
	<datestamp>1262085540000</datestamp>
	<modclass>None</modclass>
	<modscore>1</modscore>
	<htmltext>I worked for an organization that did this, and I preferred this to the other option. The other option was that we were to wear a suit and tie. Screw that. I wanted the uniform that was provided and cleaned by the company. It is not too bad</htmltext>
<tokenext>I worked for an organization that did this , and I preferred this to the other option .
The other option was that we were to wear a suit and tie .
Screw that .
I wanted the uniform that was provided and cleaned by the company .
It is not too bad</tokentext>
<sentencetext>I worked for an organization that did this, and I preferred this to the other option.
The other option was that we were to wear a suit and tie.
Screw that.
I wanted the uniform that was provided and cleaned by the company.
It is not too bad</sentencetext>
</comment>
<comment>
	<id>http://www.semanticweb.org/ontologies/ConversationInstances.owl#comment09_12_29_2129221.30587128</id>
	<title>Better areas for Company $$$</title>
	<author>bagboy</author>
	<datestamp>1262084100000</datestamp>
	<modclass>None</modclass>
	<modscore>1</modscore>
	<htmltext>Assuming the company would be springing for the $$ for these "Uniforms" point out better ways for the company to be utilizing their resources/cash.   Ultimately, corporate policy (even dress codes) is driven by management and if they see this affecting their bonuses (via EBITDA), well then???</htmltext>
<tokenext>Assuming the company would be springing for the $ $ for these " Uniforms " point out better ways for the company to be utilizing their resources/cash .
Ultimately , corporate policy ( even dress codes ) is driven by management and if they see this affecting their bonuses ( via EBITDA ) , well then ? ?
?</tokentext>
<sentencetext>Assuming the company would be springing for the $$ for these "Uniforms" point out better ways for the company to be utilizing their resources/cash.
Ultimately, corporate policy (even dress codes) is driven by management and if they see this affecting their bonuses (via EBITDA), well then??
?</sentencetext>
</comment>
<comment>
	<id>http://www.semanticweb.org/ontologies/ConversationInstances.owl#comment09_12_29_2129221.30587324</id>
	<title>Professional is as professional does...</title>
	<author>Anonymous</author>
	<datestamp>1262084760000</datestamp>
	<modclass>None</modclass>
	<modscore>0</modscore>
	<htmltext><p>having to wear a costume- er, excuse me, uniform- is demeaning, conformist, and totally out of line with the professional attitude i've strived to cultivate as an IT worker.</p><p>unless the uniform consists of ripped, sleeveless "megadeth" t-shirts, in which case it's all the same.</p></htmltext>
<tokenext>having to wear a costume- er , excuse me , uniform- is demeaning , conformist , and totally out of line with the professional attitude i 've strived to cultivate as an IT worker.unless the uniform consists of ripped , sleeveless " megadeth " t-shirts , in which case it 's all the same .</tokentext>
<sentencetext>having to wear a costume- er, excuse me, uniform- is demeaning, conformist, and totally out of line with the professional attitude i've strived to cultivate as an IT worker.unless the uniform consists of ripped, sleeveless "megadeth" t-shirts, in which case it's all the same.</sentencetext>
</comment>
<comment>
	<id>http://www.semanticweb.org/ontologies/ConversationInstances.owl#comment09_12_29_2129221.30587178</id>
	<title>Kind of stupid</title>
	<author>linuxgurugamer</author>
	<datestamp>1262084280000</datestamp>
	<modclass>Interestin</modclass>
	<modscore>2</modscore>
	<htmltext><p>Hopefully the IT helpdesk are professionals.  Who else in the company provides support for anything?  Are they going to have uniforms as well?</p><p>Who is going to pay for these uniforms?  The company?</p><p>Now lets do a little analysis.  There are 6 employees who this will affect.  There will be several styles.  The word "several" is defined as:  "being more than two but fewer than many in number or kind:" (dictionary.com).<br>So lets assume that there will be 4 different styles.  This means that there will not be a "common" uniform, which is the only thing that would "unify" the department and promote it's visibility.</p><p>This is different from technicians who go out and support customers in the field.  This sounds like a really stupid idea.</p></htmltext>
<tokenext>Hopefully the IT helpdesk are professionals .
Who else in the company provides support for anything ?
Are they going to have uniforms as well ? Who is going to pay for these uniforms ?
The company ? Now lets do a little analysis .
There are 6 employees who this will affect .
There will be several styles .
The word " several " is defined as : " being more than two but fewer than many in number or kind : " ( dictionary.com ) .So lets assume that there will be 4 different styles .
This means that there will not be a " common " uniform , which is the only thing that would " unify " the department and promote it 's visibility.This is different from technicians who go out and support customers in the field .
This sounds like a really stupid idea .</tokentext>
<sentencetext>Hopefully the IT helpdesk are professionals.
Who else in the company provides support for anything?
Are they going to have uniforms as well?Who is going to pay for these uniforms?
The company?Now lets do a little analysis.
There are 6 employees who this will affect.
There will be several styles.
The word "several" is defined as:  "being more than two but fewer than many in number or kind:" (dictionary.com).So lets assume that there will be 4 different styles.
This means that there will not be a "common" uniform, which is the only thing that would "unify" the department and promote it's visibility.This is different from technicians who go out and support customers in the field.
This sounds like a really stupid idea.</sentencetext>
</comment>
<comment>
	<id>http://www.semanticweb.org/ontologies/ConversationInstances.owl#comment09_12_29_2129221.30605704</id>
	<title>create unity by doing unifying things</title>
	<author>Anonymous</author>
	<datestamp>1262277960000</datestamp>
	<modclass>None</modclass>
	<modscore>0</modscore>
	<htmltext><p>create an internal tech blog and everyone put a 'windows tip of the day' or 'iTips for Leopard Users' kind of thing. have the profiles include pictures.</p></htmltext>
<tokenext>create an internal tech blog and everyone put a 'windows tip of the day ' or 'iTips for Leopard Users ' kind of thing .
have the profiles include pictures .</tokentext>
<sentencetext>create an internal tech blog and everyone put a 'windows tip of the day' or 'iTips for Leopard Users' kind of thing.
have the profiles include pictures.</sentencetext>
</comment>
<comment>
	<id>http://www.semanticweb.org/ontologies/ConversationInstances.owl#comment09_12_29_2129221.30588694</id>
	<title>Anonymous Coward</title>
	<author>Anonymous</author>
	<datestamp>1262090760000</datestamp>
	<modclass>None</modclass>
	<modscore>0</modscore>
	<htmltext><p>Wow!! talk about a boneheaded management decision -- this is the first call for "unioninizing" of IT -- initiated by management!!! -- there are some serious "pro labor" bills in the works -- many companies are scared silly to the point of holding anti-union mtgs &amp; trying to stay union-free -- tell your mgt that you are doing them a huge favor by discarding this idea -- and if they do push you folks into "uni"forms, then you get pretty close to being able to "negotiate" a higher pay as a "group"</p></htmltext>
<tokenext>Wow ! !
talk about a boneheaded management decision -- this is the first call for " unioninizing " of IT -- initiated by management ! ! !
-- there are some serious " pro labor " bills in the works -- many companies are scared silly to the point of holding anti-union mtgs &amp; trying to stay union-free -- tell your mgt that you are doing them a huge favor by discarding this idea -- and if they do push you folks into " uni " forms , then you get pretty close to being able to " negotiate " a higher pay as a " group "</tokentext>
<sentencetext>Wow!!
talk about a boneheaded management decision -- this is the first call for "unioninizing" of IT -- initiated by management!!!
-- there are some serious "pro labor" bills in the works -- many companies are scared silly to the point of holding anti-union mtgs &amp; trying to stay union-free -- tell your mgt that you are doing them a huge favor by discarding this idea -- and if they do push you folks into "uni"forms, then you get pretty close to being able to "negotiate" a higher pay as a "group"</sentencetext>
</comment>
<comment>
	<id>http://www.semanticweb.org/ontologies/ConversationInstances.owl#comment09_12_29_2129221.30592190</id>
	<title>Re:Nothing wrong with the idea</title>
	<author>moderators\_are\_w*nke</author>
	<datestamp>1259846820000</datestamp>
	<modclass>None</modclass>
	<modscore>1</modscore>
	<htmltext><p>You're an idiot.</p></htmltext>
<tokenext>You 're an idiot .</tokentext>
<sentencetext>You're an idiot.</sentencetext>
	<parent>http://www.semanticweb.org/ontologies/ConversationInstances.owl#comment09_12_29_2129221.30587138</parent>
</comment>
<comment>
	<id>http://www.semanticweb.org/ontologies/ConversationInstances.owl#comment09_12_29_2129221.30591264</id>
	<title>Re:How is a uniform unprofessional?</title>
	<author>Anonymous</author>
	<datestamp>1259873040000</datestamp>
	<modclass>None</modclass>
	<modscore>0</modscore>
	<htmltext><p>So do the guys at mcdonalds.</p></htmltext>
<tokenext>So do the guys at mcdonalds .</tokentext>
<sentencetext>So do the guys at mcdonalds.</sentencetext>
	<parent>http://www.semanticweb.org/ontologies/ConversationInstances.owl#comment09_12_29_2129221.30588048</parent>
</comment>
<comment>
	<id>http://www.semanticweb.org/ontologies/ConversationInstances.owl#comment09_12_29_2129221.30593070</id>
	<title>Welcome the shirts, wear it like a badge of honor!</title>
	<author>Anonymous</author>
	<datestamp>1259854260000</datestamp>
	<modclass>Interestin</modclass>
	<modscore>1</modscore>
	<htmltext><p>Wear it like a badge of honor. A similar thing happen in our company, but with engineers. Although wearing the uniformed shirts is a on a volunteer basis in our department, there was a negative reaction at first, but when we all started to wear the shirts we all sensed a greater feeling of belonging to a team &ndash; at least I felt it myself. The shirts issued to engineers were of various styles and colors, all with a company logo. These shirts were not like those of the service department, or of the utility type worn by shop personnel, but of dress quality. Every winter we now get great looking jackets and long sleeved shirts, and at the beginning of summer we get sporty net shirts.  I say welcome the shirts, but have your department take the active role in choosing the styles and accessories.</p></htmltext>
<tokenext>Wear it like a badge of honor .
A similar thing happen in our company , but with engineers .
Although wearing the uniformed shirts is a on a volunteer basis in our department , there was a negative reaction at first , but when we all started to wear the shirts we all sensed a greater feeling of belonging to a team    at least I felt it myself .
The shirts issued to engineers were of various styles and colors , all with a company logo .
These shirts were not like those of the service department , or of the utility type worn by shop personnel , but of dress quality .
Every winter we now get great looking jackets and long sleeved shirts , and at the beginning of summer we get sporty net shirts .
I say welcome the shirts , but have your department take the active role in choosing the styles and accessories .</tokentext>
<sentencetext>Wear it like a badge of honor.
A similar thing happen in our company, but with engineers.
Although wearing the uniformed shirts is a on a volunteer basis in our department, there was a negative reaction at first, but when we all started to wear the shirts we all sensed a greater feeling of belonging to a team – at least I felt it myself.
The shirts issued to engineers were of various styles and colors, all with a company logo.
These shirts were not like those of the service department, or of the utility type worn by shop personnel, but of dress quality.
Every winter we now get great looking jackets and long sleeved shirts, and at the beginning of summer we get sporty net shirts.
I say welcome the shirts, but have your department take the active role in choosing the styles and accessories.</sentencetext>
</comment>
<comment>
	<id>http://www.semanticweb.org/ontologies/ConversationInstances.owl#comment09_12_29_2129221.30593962</id>
	<title>Re:lovely</title>
	<author>Avatar8</author>
	<datestamp>1259857680000</datestamp>
	<modclass>None</modclass>
	<modscore>1</modscore>
	<htmltext>You forgot two important points that uniforms provide:  social engineering and cost savings.<p>
With the ease of getting the right color polo shirt, hackers can easily pass for a company employee to other employees or customers and acquire information useful to steal information, equipment or money. Get a blue vest and a clipboard and you can walk out of Wal-mart with a cart full of LCD TVs as you "transfer them" to another store. Remember the chaos caused by a group of people with blue polo shirts and khaki pants at Best Buy?</p><p>
The only benefit uniforms provide in my opinion are employer paid clothing that doesn't have to come out of your pocket when it gets torn by your every day work. I worked in a computer rental shop that required dress pants and ties. Not only was my tie getting caught in PC fans constantly, but I went through 4 pair of pants in one year and I had to pay to replace them.</p></htmltext>
<tokenext>You forgot two important points that uniforms provide : social engineering and cost savings .
With the ease of getting the right color polo shirt , hackers can easily pass for a company employee to other employees or customers and acquire information useful to steal information , equipment or money .
Get a blue vest and a clipboard and you can walk out of Wal-mart with a cart full of LCD TVs as you " transfer them " to another store .
Remember the chaos caused by a group of people with blue polo shirts and khaki pants at Best Buy ?
The only benefit uniforms provide in my opinion are employer paid clothing that does n't have to come out of your pocket when it gets torn by your every day work .
I worked in a computer rental shop that required dress pants and ties .
Not only was my tie getting caught in PC fans constantly , but I went through 4 pair of pants in one year and I had to pay to replace them .</tokentext>
<sentencetext>You forgot two important points that uniforms provide:  social engineering and cost savings.
With the ease of getting the right color polo shirt, hackers can easily pass for a company employee to other employees or customers and acquire information useful to steal information, equipment or money.
Get a blue vest and a clipboard and you can walk out of Wal-mart with a cart full of LCD TVs as you "transfer them" to another store.
Remember the chaos caused by a group of people with blue polo shirts and khaki pants at Best Buy?
The only benefit uniforms provide in my opinion are employer paid clothing that doesn't have to come out of your pocket when it gets torn by your every day work.
I worked in a computer rental shop that required dress pants and ties.
Not only was my tie getting caught in PC fans constantly, but I went through 4 pair of pants in one year and I had to pay to replace them.</sentencetext>
	<parent>http://www.semanticweb.org/ontologies/ConversationInstances.owl#comment09_12_29_2129221.30588496</parent>
</comment>
<comment>
	<id>http://www.semanticweb.org/ontologies/ConversationInstances.owl#comment09_12_29_2129221.30591748</id>
	<title>body spirit</title>
	<author>Anonymous</author>
	<datestamp>1259838600000</datestamp>
	<modclass>None</modclass>
	<modscore>0</modscore>
	<htmltext><p>Why people at army, police and others  use uniforms ? To give what they call "body spirit", thats is, to give a feeling that they are part of something bigger than themselves and are united by a common sense.<br>So, uniforms must be used by  everyone or nobody, but not by some.</p></htmltext>
<tokenext>Why people at army , police and others use uniforms ?
To give what they call " body spirit " , thats is , to give a feeling that they are part of something bigger than themselves and are united by a common sense.So , uniforms must be used by everyone or nobody , but not by some .</tokentext>
<sentencetext>Why people at army, police and others  use uniforms ?
To give what they call "body spirit", thats is, to give a feeling that they are part of something bigger than themselves and are united by a common sense.So, uniforms must be used by  everyone or nobody, but not by some.</sentencetext>
</comment>
<comment>
	<id>http://www.semanticweb.org/ontologies/ConversationInstances.owl#comment09_12_29_2129221.30588586</id>
	<title>Walker Helpdesk Ranger</title>
	<author>sexybomber</author>
	<datestamp>1262090160000</datestamp>
	<modclass>None</modclass>
	<modscore>1</modscore>
	<htmltext>I think having special shirts would tend to alienate y'all from the rest of the company if they were sufficiently different from what everyone else wears on an everyday basis.  Not to mention that they would be like a target on your backs, as several other people have suggested above.<br>
<br>
Badges, on the other hand... those might work.  They're 1) less obvious; 2) removeable (in a way that a company-logo uniform is not); 3) quite stylish <a href="http://www.pimall.com/nais/images/705.jpg" title="pimall.com">if</a> [pimall.com] <a href="http://www.wildwestbadges.com/images/uploads/PH-24.jpg" title="wildwestbadges.com">done</a> [wildwestbadges.com] <a href="http://patricebadges.com.au/img/gallery/pins-badges/peace-progress-badge.jpg" title="patricebadges.com.au">right</a> [patricebadges.com.au].  Plus, have you heard the phrase "badge of honor"?  They might give your department some swagger!</htmltext>
<tokenext>I think having special shirts would tend to alienate y'all from the rest of the company if they were sufficiently different from what everyone else wears on an everyday basis .
Not to mention that they would be like a target on your backs , as several other people have suggested above .
Badges , on the other hand... those might work .
They 're 1 ) less obvious ; 2 ) removeable ( in a way that a company-logo uniform is not ) ; 3 ) quite stylish if [ pimall.com ] done [ wildwestbadges.com ] right [ patricebadges.com.au ] .
Plus , have you heard the phrase " badge of honor " ?
They might give your department some swagger !</tokentext>
<sentencetext>I think having special shirts would tend to alienate y'all from the rest of the company if they were sufficiently different from what everyone else wears on an everyday basis.
Not to mention that they would be like a target on your backs, as several other people have suggested above.
Badges, on the other hand... those might work.
They're 1) less obvious; 2) removeable (in a way that a company-logo uniform is not); 3) quite stylish if [pimall.com] done [wildwestbadges.com] right [patricebadges.com.au].
Plus, have you heard the phrase "badge of honor"?
They might give your department some swagger!</sentencetext>
</comment>
<comment>
	<id>http://www.semanticweb.org/ontologies/ConversationInstances.owl#comment09_12_29_2129221.30587110</id>
	<title>Hygiene</title>
	<author>Anonymous</author>
	<datestamp>1262084040000</datestamp>
	<modclass>None</modclass>
	<modscore>0</modscore>
	<htmltext><p>See what happens when you have good hygiene?</p></htmltext>
<tokenext>See what happens when you have good hygiene ?</tokentext>
<sentencetext>See what happens when you have good hygiene?</sentencetext>
</comment>
<comment>
	<id>http://www.semanticweb.org/ontologies/ConversationInstances.owl#comment09_12_29_2129221.30587522</id>
	<title>Could be worse</title>
	<author>richardkelleher</author>
	<datestamp>1262085420000</datestamp>
	<modclass>None</modclass>
	<modscore>1</modscore>
	<htmltext>If they don't buy polyester crap shirts (cotton is nice), they look half-way decent, only have a little embroidery on them, not some big corporate logo on the back, pay for the damn things and provide either a laundry service or a laundry allowance to cover care of the uniform, it wouldn't completely suck.  Saves you from having to shop for clothes to wear.  If they are talking about buying little electric black and white VW beetles for you to ride from cubicle to cubicle, scream bloody murder!</htmltext>
<tokenext>If they do n't buy polyester crap shirts ( cotton is nice ) , they look half-way decent , only have a little embroidery on them , not some big corporate logo on the back , pay for the damn things and provide either a laundry service or a laundry allowance to cover care of the uniform , it would n't completely suck .
Saves you from having to shop for clothes to wear .
If they are talking about buying little electric black and white VW beetles for you to ride from cubicle to cubicle , scream bloody murder !</tokentext>
<sentencetext>If they don't buy polyester crap shirts (cotton is nice), they look half-way decent, only have a little embroidery on them, not some big corporate logo on the back, pay for the damn things and provide either a laundry service or a laundry allowance to cover care of the uniform, it wouldn't completely suck.
Saves you from having to shop for clothes to wear.
If they are talking about buying little electric black and white VW beetles for you to ride from cubicle to cubicle, scream bloody murder!</sentencetext>
</comment>
<comment>
	<id>http://www.semanticweb.org/ontologies/ConversationInstances.owl#comment09_12_29_2129221.30587252</id>
	<title>Army Attire</title>
	<author>Anonymous</author>
	<datestamp>1262084520000</datestamp>
	<modclass>None</modclass>
	<modscore>0</modscore>
	<htmltext><p>If I had an IT department I'd make them wear uniforms, most IT guys I've dealt with look like they can't afford to shop at the salvation army.</p></htmltext>
<tokenext>If I had an IT department I 'd make them wear uniforms , most IT guys I 've dealt with look like they ca n't afford to shop at the salvation army .</tokentext>
<sentencetext>If I had an IT department I'd make them wear uniforms, most IT guys I've dealt with look like they can't afford to shop at the salvation army.</sentencetext>
</comment>
<comment>
	<id>http://www.semanticweb.org/ontologies/ConversationInstances.owl#comment09_12_29_2129221.30587278</id>
	<title>lovely</title>
	<author>jollyreaper</author>
	<datestamp>1262084640000</datestamp>
	<modclass>Insightful</modclass>
	<modscore>2</modscore>
	<htmltext><p>First reaction is that this is nothing more than flair and you know who else made people wear flair? TGI Fridays! AndHitler.</p><p>Second more reasonable reaction: which other departments are required to wear uniforms? If IT is being made to stand out like a redheaded stepchild, that's not cool. I'm trying to think of other businesses that have that kind of uniform/plainclothes distinction. Delivery drivers, pest control people, UPS, the people who go out in the field wear the uniform. They're also the lowest paid of the bunch. McDonalds lets the managers wear a dress shirt and tie. Dealerships have the mechanics wearing uniforms but not the sales people and office staff. Pretty much anyone in uniform is on the lower end of the totem pole. IT is supposed to be a co-equal department, right?</p><p>It might seem like I'm making a bit much of it but I think this is really an outward sign of holding IT in lower regard than the other departments. Let me know when Accounting gets assigned jumpsuits.</p></htmltext>
<tokenext>First reaction is that this is nothing more than flair and you know who else made people wear flair ?
TGI Fridays !
AndHitler.Second more reasonable reaction : which other departments are required to wear uniforms ?
If IT is being made to stand out like a redheaded stepchild , that 's not cool .
I 'm trying to think of other businesses that have that kind of uniform/plainclothes distinction .
Delivery drivers , pest control people , UPS , the people who go out in the field wear the uniform .
They 're also the lowest paid of the bunch .
McDonalds lets the managers wear a dress shirt and tie .
Dealerships have the mechanics wearing uniforms but not the sales people and office staff .
Pretty much anyone in uniform is on the lower end of the totem pole .
IT is supposed to be a co-equal department , right ? It might seem like I 'm making a bit much of it but I think this is really an outward sign of holding IT in lower regard than the other departments .
Let me know when Accounting gets assigned jumpsuits .</tokentext>
<sentencetext>First reaction is that this is nothing more than flair and you know who else made people wear flair?
TGI Fridays!
AndHitler.Second more reasonable reaction: which other departments are required to wear uniforms?
If IT is being made to stand out like a redheaded stepchild, that's not cool.
I'm trying to think of other businesses that have that kind of uniform/plainclothes distinction.
Delivery drivers, pest control people, UPS, the people who go out in the field wear the uniform.
They're also the lowest paid of the bunch.
McDonalds lets the managers wear a dress shirt and tie.
Dealerships have the mechanics wearing uniforms but not the sales people and office staff.
Pretty much anyone in uniform is on the lower end of the totem pole.
IT is supposed to be a co-equal department, right?It might seem like I'm making a bit much of it but I think this is really an outward sign of holding IT in lower regard than the other departments.
Let me know when Accounting gets assigned jumpsuits.</sentencetext>
</comment>
<comment>
	<id>http://www.semanticweb.org/ontologies/ConversationInstances.owl#comment09_12_29_2129221.30588380</id>
	<title>Re:30 IT people in a 500 employee company?!</title>
	<author>Anonymous</author>
	<datestamp>1262089080000</datestamp>
	<modclass>None</modclass>
	<modscore>0</modscore>
	<htmltext><p>6 man helpdesk, a couple of sysadmins, some DBAs, and a small in-house dev-team. The rest uses computers, but saying everyone that "directly use computers" is in IT is like saying that anyone that directly uses cars is a mechanic...</p></htmltext>
<tokenext>6 man helpdesk , a couple of sysadmins , some DBAs , and a small in-house dev-team .
The rest uses computers , but saying everyone that " directly use computers " is in IT is like saying that anyone that directly uses cars is a mechanic.. .</tokentext>
<sentencetext>6 man helpdesk, a couple of sysadmins, some DBAs, and a small in-house dev-team.
The rest uses computers, but saying everyone that "directly use computers" is in IT is like saying that anyone that directly uses cars is a mechanic...</sentencetext>
	<parent>http://www.semanticweb.org/ontologies/ConversationInstances.owl#comment09_12_29_2129221.30587272</parent>
</comment>
<comment>
	<id>http://www.semanticweb.org/ontologies/ConversationInstances.owl#comment09_12_29_2129221.30588250</id>
	<title>Social Engineering</title>
	<author>Quazion</author>
	<datestamp>1262088360000</datestamp>
	<modclass>None</modclass>
	<modscore>1</modscore>
	<htmltext><p>Guess its harder to pretend your the new Helpdesk personal if you don't have a t-shirt.<br>So maybe its not great but it enhances security a bit<nobr> <wbr></nobr>;-)</p></htmltext>
<tokenext>Guess its harder to pretend your the new Helpdesk personal if you do n't have a t-shirt.So maybe its not great but it enhances security a bit ; - )</tokentext>
<sentencetext>Guess its harder to pretend your the new Helpdesk personal if you don't have a t-shirt.So maybe its not great but it enhances security a bit ;-)</sentencetext>
</comment>
<comment>
	<id>http://www.semanticweb.org/ontologies/ConversationInstances.owl#comment09_12_29_2129221.30589716</id>
	<title>The Collective</title>
	<author>Quiet\_Desperation</author>
	<datestamp>1262099040000</datestamp>
	<modclass>None</modclass>
	<modscore>1</modscore>
	<htmltext><p>You can still express your individuality. For example, make your hair like <a href="http://images.huffingtonpost.com/2008-05-18-images-mohawk.jpg" title="huffingtonpost.com">this</a> [huffingtonpost.com].</p><p>They were considering IT uniforms where I work and solicited ideas. I submitted <a href="http://www.creativestem.com/uploads\_user/gallery\_full/sirprimate1202762975-domina.jpg" title="creativestem.com">this</a> [creativestem.com], but I never heard back from anyone. I guess they were afraid it would discourage people from asking for help. Or overload the help line. One or the other. Maybe both.</p></htmltext>
<tokenext>You can still express your individuality .
For example , make your hair like this [ huffingtonpost.com ] .They were considering IT uniforms where I work and solicited ideas .
I submitted this [ creativestem.com ] , but I never heard back from anyone .
I guess they were afraid it would discourage people from asking for help .
Or overload the help line .
One or the other .
Maybe both .</tokentext>
<sentencetext>You can still express your individuality.
For example, make your hair like this [huffingtonpost.com].They were considering IT uniforms where I work and solicited ideas.
I submitted this [creativestem.com], but I never heard back from anyone.
I guess they were afraid it would discourage people from asking for help.
Or overload the help line.
One or the other.
Maybe both.</sentencetext>
</comment>
<comment>
	<id>http://www.semanticweb.org/ontologies/ConversationInstances.owl#comment09_12_29_2129221.30592264</id>
	<title>Bad idea, don't buy in...</title>
	<author>kenh</author>
	<datestamp>1259847840000</datestamp>
	<modclass>None</modclass>
	<modscore>1</modscore>
	<htmltext><p>Your employer wants to treat it's professional, trained support staff as if they were members of Best Buy's Geek Squad, and the assumption is that by being easily spotted, you would now bw available for direct, in-person support questions while walking down the halls, on break, or at lunch.</p><p>If the support team wanted to do this and they came up with the idea, I'd have no problem with it, but until then, resist it.</p><p>There's a saying in business that you don't dress for the job you have, you dress for the job you want - and I can't believe your help desk folks want to dress "down" and be treated like unprofessional "computer guys", akin to the maint. staff or delivery boys.</p></htmltext>
<tokenext>Your employer wants to treat it 's professional , trained support staff as if they were members of Best Buy 's Geek Squad , and the assumption is that by being easily spotted , you would now bw available for direct , in-person support questions while walking down the halls , on break , or at lunch.If the support team wanted to do this and they came up with the idea , I 'd have no problem with it , but until then , resist it.There 's a saying in business that you do n't dress for the job you have , you dress for the job you want - and I ca n't believe your help desk folks want to dress " down " and be treated like unprofessional " computer guys " , akin to the maint .
staff or delivery boys .</tokentext>
<sentencetext>Your employer wants to treat it's professional, trained support staff as if they were members of Best Buy's Geek Squad, and the assumption is that by being easily spotted, you would now bw available for direct, in-person support questions while walking down the halls, on break, or at lunch.If the support team wanted to do this and they came up with the idea, I'd have no problem with it, but until then, resist it.There's a saying in business that you don't dress for the job you have, you dress for the job you want - and I can't believe your help desk folks want to dress "down" and be treated like unprofessional "computer guys", akin to the maint.
staff or delivery boys.</sentencetext>
</comment>
<comment>
	<id>http://www.semanticweb.org/ontologies/ConversationInstances.owl#comment09_12_29_2129221.30587340</id>
	<title>there are always dresscodes</title>
	<author>Anonymous</author>
	<datestamp>1262084820000</datestamp>
	<modclass>None</modclass>
	<modscore>0</modscore>
	<htmltext><p>Where i work (A utility company in Brussels, Belgium) the helpdesk and lower IT personel are the only who don't have to wear a suit, just a clean neutral clothing, a long non baggy trouser, a neutral shirt or decent t-shirt and/or pullover (no hoods) and leather shoes  (no sneakers, sandals or boots) but for the rest we are free. For the few ladies in our department similar dresscode are made.</p><p>All the rest are dressed in suit or for the cleaning/technical upkeep staff, a uniform fitted to their job with company logo's on it.</p></htmltext>
<tokenext>Where i work ( A utility company in Brussels , Belgium ) the helpdesk and lower IT personel are the only who do n't have to wear a suit , just a clean neutral clothing , a long non baggy trouser , a neutral shirt or decent t-shirt and/or pullover ( no hoods ) and leather shoes ( no sneakers , sandals or boots ) but for the rest we are free .
For the few ladies in our department similar dresscode are made.All the rest are dressed in suit or for the cleaning/technical upkeep staff , a uniform fitted to their job with company logo 's on it .</tokentext>
<sentencetext>Where i work (A utility company in Brussels, Belgium) the helpdesk and lower IT personel are the only who don't have to wear a suit, just a clean neutral clothing, a long non baggy trouser, a neutral shirt or decent t-shirt and/or pullover (no hoods) and leather shoes  (no sneakers, sandals or boots) but for the rest we are free.
For the few ladies in our department similar dresscode are made.All the rest are dressed in suit or for the cleaning/technical upkeep staff, a uniform fitted to their job with company logo's on it.</sentencetext>
</comment>
<comment>
	<id>http://www.semanticweb.org/ontologies/ConversationInstances.owl#comment09_12_29_2129221.30592134</id>
	<title>Dont worry about it.</title>
	<author>tanker27</author>
	<datestamp>1259845860000</datestamp>
	<modclass>None</modclass>
	<modscore>1</modscore>
	<htmltext>As someone who started on the "Help Desk" I remember what I used to wear to work, tattered jeans, t-shirts, etc. Now that I have progressed in my IT career which is to the point where Business casual and the suit are the norm. I also happen to work for a Fortune 500 company that has a healthy work hard to play hard mentality.

Anyways, Our Help Desk is also visible but as I look at some of those people I tend to be judgemental by what they are wearing. I Shouldnt be I was once like them. But I guess at some point I succumbed to the corporate culture.<nobr> <wbr></nobr>/shrug

I wouldnt be upset too much of the change. Remember you want to dress for the job you want not the one you have.<nobr> <wbr></nobr>:)</htmltext>
<tokenext>As someone who started on the " Help Desk " I remember what I used to wear to work , tattered jeans , t-shirts , etc .
Now that I have progressed in my IT career which is to the point where Business casual and the suit are the norm .
I also happen to work for a Fortune 500 company that has a healthy work hard to play hard mentality .
Anyways , Our Help Desk is also visible but as I look at some of those people I tend to be judgemental by what they are wearing .
I Shouldnt be I was once like them .
But I guess at some point I succumbed to the corporate culture .
/shrug I wouldnt be upset too much of the change .
Remember you want to dress for the job you want not the one you have .
: )</tokentext>
<sentencetext>As someone who started on the "Help Desk" I remember what I used to wear to work, tattered jeans, t-shirts, etc.
Now that I have progressed in my IT career which is to the point where Business casual and the suit are the norm.
I also happen to work for a Fortune 500 company that has a healthy work hard to play hard mentality.
Anyways, Our Help Desk is also visible but as I look at some of those people I tend to be judgemental by what they are wearing.
I Shouldnt be I was once like them.
But I guess at some point I succumbed to the corporate culture.
/shrug

I wouldnt be upset too much of the change.
Remember you want to dress for the job you want not the one you have.
:)</sentencetext>
</comment>
<comment>
	<id>http://www.semanticweb.org/ontologies/ConversationInstances.owl#comment09_12_29_2129221.30588980</id>
	<title>No to uniforms...</title>
	<author>Codifex Maximus</author>
	<datestamp>1262092440000</datestamp>
	<modclass>None</modclass>
	<modscore>1</modscore>
	<htmltext><p>I think IT and Help Desk people should:<br>
&nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; work in the basement.<br>
&nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; all have personalized coffee mugs.<br>
&nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; and have english accents.</p></htmltext>
<tokenext>I think IT and Help Desk people should :       work in the basement .
      all have personalized coffee mugs .
      and have english accents .</tokentext>
<sentencetext>I think IT and Help Desk people should:
      work in the basement.
      all have personalized coffee mugs.
      and have english accents.</sentencetext>
</comment>
<comment>
	<id>http://www.semanticweb.org/ontologies/ConversationInstances.owl#comment09_12_29_2129221.30590060</id>
	<title>Utility belt with Taser, Asp and Handcuffs?</title>
	<author>Anonymous</author>
	<datestamp>1262102280000</datestamp>
	<modclass>None</modclass>
	<modscore>0</modscore>
	<htmltext><p>"What, you turned your computer off with the switch \_again\_ in the middle of an update?"</p><p>(ZZZAP!)</p><p>Smell the sizzle as you brand their forehead with the PEBCAK tattoo...</p></htmltext>
<tokenext>" What , you turned your computer off with the switch \ _again \ _ in the middle of an update ? " ( ZZZAP !
) Smell the sizzle as you brand their forehead with the PEBCAK tattoo.. .</tokentext>
<sentencetext>"What, you turned your computer off with the switch \_again\_ in the middle of an update?"(ZZZAP!
)Smell the sizzle as you brand their forehead with the PEBCAK tattoo...</sentencetext>
</comment>
<comment>
	<id>http://www.semanticweb.org/ontologies/ConversationInstances.owl#comment09_12_29_2129221.30587390</id>
	<title>Re:I like uniforms</title>
	<author>Anonymous</author>
	<datestamp>1262084940000</datestamp>
	<modclass>None</modclass>
	<modscore>1</modscore>
	<htmltext>I wore one for 6 years and couldn't disagree more. I don't know how much time you spend thinking about what you're going to wear to work, but for me, it's a process that doesn't take any longer than putting my clothes on. Grab a pair of pants, while I'm putting them on spot a shirt that doesn't clash, then reach left or right for shoes that "go."

<br> <br>Oh, and the reason I prefer not to wear a uniform is so I can express myself. My employer can't take away my individuality!

<br> <br>That's right. No one will ever mistake me for a metrosexual.</htmltext>
<tokenext>I wore one for 6 years and could n't disagree more .
I do n't know how much time you spend thinking about what you 're going to wear to work , but for me , it 's a process that does n't take any longer than putting my clothes on .
Grab a pair of pants , while I 'm putting them on spot a shirt that does n't clash , then reach left or right for shoes that " go .
" Oh , and the reason I prefer not to wear a uniform is so I can express myself .
My employer ca n't take away my individuality !
That 's right .
No one will ever mistake me for a metrosexual .</tokentext>
<sentencetext>I wore one for 6 years and couldn't disagree more.
I don't know how much time you spend thinking about what you're going to wear to work, but for me, it's a process that doesn't take any longer than putting my clothes on.
Grab a pair of pants, while I'm putting them on spot a shirt that doesn't clash, then reach left or right for shoes that "go.
"

 Oh, and the reason I prefer not to wear a uniform is so I can express myself.
My employer can't take away my individuality!
That's right.
No one will ever mistake me for a metrosexual.</sentencetext>
	<parent>http://www.semanticweb.org/ontologies/ConversationInstances.owl#comment09_12_29_2129221.30587120</parent>
</comment>
<comment>
	<id>http://www.semanticweb.org/ontologies/ConversationInstances.owl#comment09_12_29_2129221.30589198</id>
	<title>Re:Professionalism</title>
	<author>dangitman</author>
	<datestamp>1262094180000</datestamp>
	<modclass>None</modclass>
	<modscore>1</modscore>
	<htmltext><p><div class="quote"><p>We spend all our time in the field crouched under desks and showing our ass cracks anyway, right?</p></div><p>I think you might be doing it wrong.</p></div>
	</htmltext>
<tokenext>We spend all our time in the field crouched under desks and showing our ass cracks anyway , right ? I think you might be doing it wrong .</tokentext>
<sentencetext>We spend all our time in the field crouched under desks and showing our ass cracks anyway, right?I think you might be doing it wrong.
	</sentencetext>
	<parent>http://www.semanticweb.org/ontologies/ConversationInstances.owl#comment09_12_29_2129221.30587250</parent>
</comment>
<comment>
	<id>http://www.semanticweb.org/ontologies/ConversationInstances.owl#comment09_12_29_2129221.30588142</id>
	<title>Re:lovely</title>
	<author>istigmata</author>
	<datestamp>1262087820000</datestamp>
	<modclass>Interestin</modclass>
	<modscore>2</modscore>
	<htmltext><p><div class="quote"><p> IT is supposed to be a co-equal department, right?</p></div><p>No. In IT the closer you are to the user the lower your status. Helpdesk is naturally at the bottom and the guy who fiddles with DNS entries and router tables is at the top. From the helpdesk you can graduate to desktop support, then to servers and eventually networks -  each step having refreshingly less user interaction. I say this with only a bit of tongue in cheek.</p></div>
	</htmltext>
<tokenext>IT is supposed to be a co-equal department , right ? No .
In IT the closer you are to the user the lower your status .
Helpdesk is naturally at the bottom and the guy who fiddles with DNS entries and router tables is at the top .
From the helpdesk you can graduate to desktop support , then to servers and eventually networks - each step having refreshingly less user interaction .
I say this with only a bit of tongue in cheek .</tokentext>
<sentencetext> IT is supposed to be a co-equal department, right?No.
In IT the closer you are to the user the lower your status.
Helpdesk is naturally at the bottom and the guy who fiddles with DNS entries and router tables is at the top.
From the helpdesk you can graduate to desktop support, then to servers and eventually networks -  each step having refreshingly less user interaction.
I say this with only a bit of tongue in cheek.
	</sentencetext>
	<parent>http://www.semanticweb.org/ontologies/ConversationInstances.owl#comment09_12_29_2129221.30587278</parent>
</comment>
<comment>
	<id>http://www.semanticweb.org/ontologies/ConversationInstances.owl#comment09_12_29_2129221.30589010</id>
	<title>Re:Well...</title>
	<author>Anonymous</author>
	<datestamp>1262092680000</datestamp>
	<modclass>None</modclass>
	<modscore>0</modscore>
	<htmltext><p>So you're a sysadmin, DBA, programmer, network engineer, project manager and tech support and you only make $40K\year? I don't care if they let you wear you pajamas - get a new job! Any one of those titles on it's own could get you $60K\year.</p></htmltext>
<tokenext>So you 're a sysadmin , DBA , programmer , network engineer , project manager and tech support and you only make $ 40K \ year ?
I do n't care if they let you wear you pajamas - get a new job !
Any one of those titles on it 's own could get you $ 60K \ year .</tokentext>
<sentencetext>So you're a sysadmin, DBA, programmer, network engineer, project manager and tech support and you only make $40K\year?
I don't care if they let you wear you pajamas - get a new job!
Any one of those titles on it's own could get you $60K\year.</sentencetext>
	<parent>http://www.semanticweb.org/ontologies/ConversationInstances.owl#comment09_12_29_2129221.30587462</parent>
</comment>
<comment>
	<id>http://www.semanticweb.org/ontologies/ConversationInstances.owl#comment09_12_29_2129221.30588480</id>
	<title>Might want to start floating resumes.</title>
	<author>Reeses</author>
	<datestamp>1262089560000</datestamp>
	<modclass>None</modclass>
	<modscore>1</modscore>
	<htmltext><p>It could also be the precursor to outsourcing your services.</p><p>Make you guys wear uniforms until people are used to looking for the uniform, then when they replace the workers, people no longer have to look for you, just the shirt.</p></htmltext>
<tokenext>It could also be the precursor to outsourcing your services.Make you guys wear uniforms until people are used to looking for the uniform , then when they replace the workers , people no longer have to look for you , just the shirt .</tokentext>
<sentencetext>It could also be the precursor to outsourcing your services.Make you guys wear uniforms until people are used to looking for the uniform, then when they replace the workers, people no longer have to look for you, just the shirt.</sentencetext>
</comment>
<comment>
	<id>http://www.semanticweb.org/ontologies/ConversationInstances.owl#comment09_12_29_2129221.30590398</id>
	<title>Re:30 IT people in a 500 employee company?!</title>
	<author>Anonymous</author>
	<datestamp>1262105940000</datestamp>
	<modclass>None</modclass>
	<modscore>0</modscore>
	<htmltext><p><div class="quote"><p>...and we make do with TWO.</p></div><p>...1...0.</p></div>
	</htmltext>
<tokenext>...and we make do with TWO....1...0 .</tokentext>
<sentencetext>...and we make do with TWO....1...0.
	</sentencetext>
	<parent>http://www.semanticweb.org/ontologies/ConversationInstances.owl#comment09_12_29_2129221.30587272</parent>
</comment>
<comment>
	<id>http://www.semanticweb.org/ontologies/ConversationInstances.owl#comment09_12_29_2129221.30592298</id>
	<title>Simply Follow Dilbert's Rules Of Order</title>
	<author>Anonymous</author>
	<datestamp>1259848200000</datestamp>
	<modclass>None</modclass>
	<modscore>0</modscore>
	<htmltext><p>I think it's a superb idea!</p><p>1) Uniform must follow Dilbertian Rules<br>
&nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; a) Tie, with slight curl at the bottom<br>
&nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; b) white, short-sleeved shirt<br>
&nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; c) pocket protector in shirt pocket with company logo on the pocket protector<br>
&nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; d) horn-rimmed glasses with tape in center of glasses.</p><p>2) When you introduce yourself to your clients (perhaps as some catchy name like "The Man with no Communication Skills"), let them know you got a work order from the pointy-haired boss.  Proceed to berate them for bringing such a stupid work order - make them grovel to get the work done.</p></htmltext>
<tokenext>I think it 's a superb idea ! 1 ) Uniform must follow Dilbertian Rules             a ) Tie , with slight curl at the bottom             b ) white , short-sleeved shirt             c ) pocket protector in shirt pocket with company logo on the pocket protector             d ) horn-rimmed glasses with tape in center of glasses.2 ) When you introduce yourself to your clients ( perhaps as some catchy name like " The Man with no Communication Skills " ) , let them know you got a work order from the pointy-haired boss .
Proceed to berate them for bringing such a stupid work order - make them grovel to get the work done .</tokentext>
<sentencetext>I think it's a superb idea!1) Uniform must follow Dilbertian Rules
            a) Tie, with slight curl at the bottom
            b) white, short-sleeved shirt
            c) pocket protector in shirt pocket with company logo on the pocket protector
            d) horn-rimmed glasses with tape in center of glasses.2) When you introduce yourself to your clients (perhaps as some catchy name like "The Man with no Communication Skills"), let them know you got a work order from the pointy-haired boss.
Proceed to berate them for bringing such a stupid work order - make them grovel to get the work done.</sentencetext>
</comment>
<comment>
	<id>http://www.semanticweb.org/ontologies/ConversationInstances.owl#comment09_12_29_2129221.30589840</id>
	<title>Re:Well...</title>
	<author>bill\_mcgonigle</author>
	<datestamp>1262100000000</datestamp>
	<modclass>None</modclass>
	<modscore>1</modscore>
	<htmltext><p>Once nice thing about your poor salary is that you can probably go on your own for about the same even if you're not very good at running the business.</p><p>If you're already pulling down $95 it's much harder to jump.</p></htmltext>
<tokenext>Once nice thing about your poor salary is that you can probably go on your own for about the same even if you 're not very good at running the business.If you 're already pulling down $ 95 it 's much harder to jump .</tokentext>
<sentencetext>Once nice thing about your poor salary is that you can probably go on your own for about the same even if you're not very good at running the business.If you're already pulling down $95 it's much harder to jump.</sentencetext>
	<parent>http://www.semanticweb.org/ontologies/ConversationInstances.owl#comment09_12_29_2129221.30587462</parent>
</comment>
<comment>
	<id>http://www.semanticweb.org/ontologies/ConversationInstances.owl#comment09_12_29_2129221.30589496</id>
	<title>Re:Are you colleagues or janitors?</title>
	<author>thePowerOfGrayskull</author>
	<datestamp>1262097000000</datestamp>
	<modclass>None</modclass>
	<modscore>1</modscore>
	<htmltext>That goes to the point raised by the previous poster (directly above); but - to paraphrase my reply to that<nobr> <wbr></nobr>... given the declining level of expertise required to do this kind of work (at least by current standards), "janitors" may be closer to the truth than "professionals" in many cases.</htmltext>
<tokenext>That goes to the point raised by the previous poster ( directly above ) ; but - to paraphrase my reply to that ... given the declining level of expertise required to do this kind of work ( at least by current standards ) , " janitors " may be closer to the truth than " professionals " in many cases .</tokentext>
<sentencetext>That goes to the point raised by the previous poster (directly above); but - to paraphrase my reply to that ... given the declining level of expertise required to do this kind of work (at least by current standards), "janitors" may be closer to the truth than "professionals" in many cases.</sentencetext>
	<parent>http://www.semanticweb.org/ontologies/ConversationInstances.owl#comment09_12_29_2129221.30587244</parent>
</comment>
<comment>
	<id>http://www.semanticweb.org/ontologies/ConversationInstances.owl#comment09_12_29_2129221.30591324</id>
	<title>ThinkGeek sells these uniforms, I kid you not.</title>
	<author>Shag</author>
	<datestamp>1259830980000</datestamp>
	<modclass>None</modclass>
	<modscore>1</modscore>
	<htmltext><p><a href="http://www.thinkgeek.com/5cb5/" title="thinkgeek.com">Network Security Staff</a> [thinkgeek.com] t-shirts.</p><p>(And honestly, if they want anything more than a t-shirt, you need to have a talk with them about the difference between "looking the part" and "getting the job done.")</p></htmltext>
<tokenext>Network Security Staff [ thinkgeek.com ] t-shirts .
( And honestly , if they want anything more than a t-shirt , you need to have a talk with them about the difference between " looking the part " and " getting the job done .
" )</tokentext>
<sentencetext>Network Security Staff [thinkgeek.com] t-shirts.
(And honestly, if they want anything more than a t-shirt, you need to have a talk with them about the difference between "looking the part" and "getting the job done.
")</sentencetext>
</comment>
<comment>
	<id>http://www.semanticweb.org/ontologies/ConversationInstances.owl#comment09_12_29_2129221.30591656</id>
	<title>Re:lovely</title>
	<author>Anonymous</author>
	<datestamp>1259836860000</datestamp>
	<modclass>None</modclass>
	<modscore>0</modscore>
	<htmltext><p>You think the whole help desk will be called to sing in choir happy birthday, everytime there is cake, TGIF style?</p></htmltext>
<tokenext>You think the whole help desk will be called to sing in choir happy birthday , everytime there is cake , TGIF style ?</tokentext>
<sentencetext>You think the whole help desk will be called to sing in choir happy birthday, everytime there is cake, TGIF style?</sentencetext>
	<parent>http://www.semanticweb.org/ontologies/ConversationInstances.owl#comment09_12_29_2129221.30587278</parent>
</comment>
<comment>
	<id>http://www.semanticweb.org/ontologies/ConversationInstances.owl#comment09_12_29_2129221.30592792</id>
	<title>Best Buy Geek Squad.</title>
	<author>tbgreve</author>
	<datestamp>1259852880000</datestamp>
	<modclass>None</modclass>
	<modscore>0</modscore>
	<htmltext>Make them give you a souped up VW too.
I don't know about you but I did not go to collage and rack up 60k in student loans to land a gig that I would have to work a shift, wear a name tag or a uniform. Make the Been Counters wear one and see how long that last. Or you could be a BOFH and intercept all emails and memos and make them read Executive staff instead of IT.</htmltext>
<tokenext>Make them give you a souped up VW too .
I do n't know about you but I did not go to collage and rack up 60k in student loans to land a gig that I would have to work a shift , wear a name tag or a uniform .
Make the Been Counters wear one and see how long that last .
Or you could be a BOFH and intercept all emails and memos and make them read Executive staff instead of IT .</tokentext>
<sentencetext>Make them give you a souped up VW too.
I don't know about you but I did not go to collage and rack up 60k in student loans to land a gig that I would have to work a shift, wear a name tag or a uniform.
Make the Been Counters wear one and see how long that last.
Or you could be a BOFH and intercept all emails and memos and make them read Executive staff instead of IT.</sentencetext>
</comment>
<comment>
	<id>http://www.semanticweb.org/ontologies/ConversationInstances.owl#comment09_12_29_2129221.30592082</id>
	<title>Re:Well...</title>
	<author>babybird</author>
	<datestamp>1259845260000</datestamp>
	<modclass>None</modclass>
	<modscore>1</modscore>
	<htmltext><p>I've said for several years now that IT people are looked upon as basically labor workers akin to fast food workers. I *HAD* argued about them being similar to plumbers or auto mechanics, but nobody seems to balk over their car needing expensive maintenance every 15,000 miles, whereas if you tell someone that they need to pay you $75 once every year or so to clean off the garbage adware/spyware/viruses they get in their computers <b>while preserving their files no less</b>, it's considered highway robbery.</p></htmltext>
<tokenext>I 've said for several years now that IT people are looked upon as basically labor workers akin to fast food workers .
I * HAD * argued about them being similar to plumbers or auto mechanics , but nobody seems to balk over their car needing expensive maintenance every 15,000 miles , whereas if you tell someone that they need to pay you $ 75 once every year or so to clean off the garbage adware/spyware/viruses they get in their computers while preserving their files no less , it 's considered highway robbery .</tokentext>
<sentencetext>I've said for several years now that IT people are looked upon as basically labor workers akin to fast food workers.
I *HAD* argued about them being similar to plumbers or auto mechanics, but nobody seems to balk over their car needing expensive maintenance every 15,000 miles, whereas if you tell someone that they need to pay you $75 once every year or so to clean off the garbage adware/spyware/viruses they get in their computers while preserving their files no less, it's considered highway robbery.</sentencetext>
	<parent>http://www.semanticweb.org/ontologies/ConversationInstances.owl#comment09_12_29_2129221.30587462</parent>
</comment>
<comment>
	<id>http://www.semanticweb.org/ontologies/ConversationInstances.owl#comment09_12_29_2129221.30596824</id>
	<title>Re:Well...</title>
	<author>Anonymous</author>
	<datestamp>1259866740000</datestamp>
	<modclass>None</modclass>
	<modscore>0</modscore>
	<htmltext><p>Wow.</p><p>If this is how much you inflate your job on slashdot, I am interested in reading your resume:</p><p>* "routinely walk on water, healing the sick and lame servers by touch, co-workers and visiting luminaries by appointment"</p></htmltext>
<tokenext>Wow.If this is how much you inflate your job on slashdot , I am interested in reading your resume : * " routinely walk on water , healing the sick and lame servers by touch , co-workers and visiting luminaries by appointment "</tokentext>
<sentencetext>Wow.If this is how much you inflate your job on slashdot, I am interested in reading your resume:* "routinely walk on water, healing the sick and lame servers by touch, co-workers and visiting luminaries by appointment"</sentencetext>
	<parent>http://www.semanticweb.org/ontologies/ConversationInstances.owl#comment09_12_29_2129221.30587462</parent>
</comment>
<comment>
	<id>http://www.semanticweb.org/ontologies/ConversationInstances.owl#comment09_12_29_2129221.30587186</id>
	<title>Say goodbye to your lunchbreak</title>
	<author>L3370</author>
	<datestamp>1262084340000</datestamp>
	<modclass>Insightful</modclass>
	<modscore>5</modscore>
	<htmltext>With conspicious uniforms mandated for your help desk and NO ONE ELSE, I'd imagine it equivalent to taping a bulls-eye to your back on a battlefield. <br> <br>
This may be the desired effect from management but the HD will probably despise it. Every time a coworker passes by you and your neat little t-shirt, it will remind them about that computer problem that just cant wait untill you are done eating...or smoking that cigarette, or taking a leak in the public restroom.<br> <br>
I know that this feeling is already experienced by those of us in IT, but I think this would worsen the problem.</htmltext>
<tokenext>With conspicious uniforms mandated for your help desk and NO ONE ELSE , I 'd imagine it equivalent to taping a bulls-eye to your back on a battlefield .
This may be the desired effect from management but the HD will probably despise it .
Every time a coworker passes by you and your neat little t-shirt , it will remind them about that computer problem that just cant wait untill you are done eating...or smoking that cigarette , or taking a leak in the public restroom .
I know that this feeling is already experienced by those of us in IT , but I think this would worsen the problem .</tokentext>
<sentencetext>With conspicious uniforms mandated for your help desk and NO ONE ELSE, I'd imagine it equivalent to taping a bulls-eye to your back on a battlefield.
This may be the desired effect from management but the HD will probably despise it.
Every time a coworker passes by you and your neat little t-shirt, it will remind them about that computer problem that just cant wait untill you are done eating...or smoking that cigarette, or taking a leak in the public restroom.
I know that this feeling is already experienced by those of us in IT, but I think this would worsen the problem.</sentencetext>
</comment>
<comment>
	<id>http://www.semanticweb.org/ontologies/ConversationInstances.owl#comment09_12_29_2129221.30591412</id>
	<title>Re:</title>
	<author>clint999</author>
	<datestamp>1259832600000</datestamp>
	<modclass>None</modclass>
	<modscore>-1</modscore>
	<htmltext><p><div class="quote"><p>There are two other groups in his office wearing uniforms. a) the cleaners b) the security guards.</p></div></div>
	</htmltext>
<tokenext>There are two other groups in his office wearing uniforms .
a ) the cleaners b ) the security guards .</tokentext>
<sentencetext>There are two other groups in his office wearing uniforms.
a) the cleaners b) the security guards.
	</sentencetext>
</comment>
<comment>
	<id>http://www.semanticweb.org/ontologies/ConversationInstances.owl#comment09_12_29_2129221.30598076</id>
	<title>i think you need a balanced solution</title>
	<author>Anonymous</author>
	<datestamp>1259871600000</datestamp>
	<modclass>None</modclass>
	<modscore>0</modscore>
	<htmltext><p>if they were think geek shirts it might be alright<nobr> <wbr></nobr>:). I am one of 2 IT guys at a small (100) company and i enjoy wearing jeans and a polo or sometimes my Geek shirts/ etc. I think uniforms could be a good step if its handled right and there are a lot of options and choices, im not a fan of looking like the geek squad at best buy though....</p></htmltext>
<tokenext>if they were think geek shirts it might be alright : ) .
I am one of 2 IT guys at a small ( 100 ) company and i enjoy wearing jeans and a polo or sometimes my Geek shirts/ etc .
I think uniforms could be a good step if its handled right and there are a lot of options and choices , im not a fan of looking like the geek squad at best buy though... .</tokentext>
<sentencetext>if they were think geek shirts it might be alright :).
I am one of 2 IT guys at a small (100) company and i enjoy wearing jeans and a polo or sometimes my Geek shirts/ etc.
I think uniforms could be a good step if its handled right and there are a lot of options and choices, im not a fan of looking like the geek squad at best buy though....</sentencetext>
</comment>
<comment>
	<id>http://www.semanticweb.org/ontologies/ConversationInstances.owl#comment09_12_29_2129221.30588790</id>
	<title>Re:Well...</title>
	<author>SharpFang</author>
	<datestamp>1262091180000</datestamp>
	<modclass>None</modclass>
	<modscore>1</modscore>
	<htmltext><p>Worse yet, he is creating unhealthy price negotiation environment for all of us. It creates impression in the management that this is the standard salary.</p><p>Anyway, high time to request all the benefits that come with an uniform service.<br>You are becoming a soldier. Be one, not a cannon fodder.</p></htmltext>
<tokenext>Worse yet , he is creating unhealthy price negotiation environment for all of us .
It creates impression in the management that this is the standard salary.Anyway , high time to request all the benefits that come with an uniform service.You are becoming a soldier .
Be one , not a cannon fodder .</tokentext>
<sentencetext>Worse yet, he is creating unhealthy price negotiation environment for all of us.
It creates impression in the management that this is the standard salary.Anyway, high time to request all the benefits that come with an uniform service.You are becoming a soldier.
Be one, not a cannon fodder.</sentencetext>
	<parent>http://www.semanticweb.org/ontologies/ConversationInstances.owl#comment09_12_29_2129221.30588546</parent>
</comment>
<comment>
	<id>http://www.semanticweb.org/ontologies/ConversationInstances.owl#comment09_12_29_2129221.30588958</id>
	<title>I would like to suggest</title>
	<author>BlindRobin</author>
	<datestamp>1262092320000</datestamp>
	<modclass>None</modclass>
	<modscore>1</modscore>
	<htmltext>I would like to suggest that, rather than having only a few IT personnel be singled out for facile identification, all IT staff and management wear mediaeval style monks habits with appropriate tonsure according to station. This would make them readily identifiable by the laity in order that they be afforded due respect and deference without focusing undue attention on a minority of the sect.</htmltext>
<tokenext>I would like to suggest that , rather than having only a few IT personnel be singled out for facile identification , all IT staff and management wear mediaeval style monks habits with appropriate tonsure according to station .
This would make them readily identifiable by the laity in order that they be afforded due respect and deference without focusing undue attention on a minority of the sect .</tokentext>
<sentencetext>I would like to suggest that, rather than having only a few IT personnel be singled out for facile identification, all IT staff and management wear mediaeval style monks habits with appropriate tonsure according to station.
This would make them readily identifiable by the laity in order that they be afforded due respect and deference without focusing undue attention on a minority of the sect.</sentencetext>
</comment>
<comment>
	<id>http://www.semanticweb.org/ontologies/ConversationInstances.owl#comment09_12_29_2129221.30588292</id>
	<title>k3wl</title>
	<author>DynaSoar</author>
	<datestamp>1262088660000</datestamp>
	<modclass>None</modclass>
	<modscore>1</modscore>
	<htmltext><p>Getting matching shirts with the department mark on them is awesome. You get singled out as being special, and everybody will know all of them by name, by face, and by reputation. It's not just a shirt, it'a freaking badge, of the professional ism you mention. If one department gets them, I bet some others will want to also.</p><p>FREE CLOTHES d00d. So what if they match. They don't come out of your paycheck.</p></htmltext>
<tokenext>Getting matching shirts with the department mark on them is awesome .
You get singled out as being special , and everybody will know all of them by name , by face , and by reputation .
It 's not just a shirt , it'a freaking badge , of the professional ism you mention .
If one department gets them , I bet some others will want to also.FREE CLOTHES d00d .
So what if they match .
They do n't come out of your paycheck .</tokentext>
<sentencetext>Getting matching shirts with the department mark on them is awesome.
You get singled out as being special, and everybody will know all of them by name, by face, and by reputation.
It's not just a shirt, it'a freaking badge, of the professional ism you mention.
If one department gets them, I bet some others will want to also.FREE CLOTHES d00d.
So what if they match.
They don't come out of your paycheck.</sentencetext>
</comment>
<comment>
	<id>http://www.semanticweb.org/ontologies/ConversationInstances.owl#comment09_12_29_2129221.30588660</id>
	<title>Re:I like uniforms</title>
	<author>broggyr</author>
	<datestamp>1262090580000</datestamp>
	<modclass>None</modclass>
	<modscore>1</modscore>
	<htmltext><blockquote><div><p>My employer can't take away my individuality!</p></div> </blockquote><p>Room 101!</p></div>
	</htmltext>
<tokenext>My employer ca n't take away my individuality !
Room 101 !</tokentext>
<sentencetext>My employer can't take away my individuality!
Room 101!
	</sentencetext>
	<parent>http://www.semanticweb.org/ontologies/ConversationInstances.owl#comment09_12_29_2129221.30587390</parent>
</comment>
<comment>
	<id>http://www.semanticweb.org/ontologies/ConversationInstances.owl#comment09_12_29_2129221.30589686</id>
	<title>Re:How is a uniform unprofessional?</title>
	<author>Anonymous</author>
	<datestamp>1262098740000</datestamp>
	<modclass>None</modclass>
	<modscore>0</modscore>
	<htmltext><p>Police officers wear their uniform with an authoritative swagger and demands that you give up all your rights.</p></htmltext>
<tokenext>Police officers wear their uniform with an authoritative swagger and demands that you give up all your rights .</tokentext>
<sentencetext>Police officers wear their uniform with an authoritative swagger and demands that you give up all your rights.</sentencetext>
	<parent>http://www.semanticweb.org/ontologies/ConversationInstances.owl#comment09_12_29_2129221.30588048</parent>
</comment>
<comment>
	<id>http://www.semanticweb.org/ontologies/ConversationInstances.owl#comment09_12_29_2129221.30588604</id>
	<title>Could be taken too far</title>
	<author>kabdib</author>
	<datestamp>1262090280000</datestamp>
	<modclass>None</modclass>
	<modscore>1</modscore>
	<htmltext><p>The red shirts, okay.  The fake nose and clown shoes, no way.</p></htmltext>
<tokenext>The red shirts , okay .
The fake nose and clown shoes , no way .</tokentext>
<sentencetext>The red shirts, okay.
The fake nose and clown shoes, no way.</sentencetext>
</comment>
<comment>
	<id>http://www.semanticweb.org/ontologies/ConversationInstances.owl#comment09_12_29_2129221.30589240</id>
	<title>Re:Well...</title>
	<author>Anonymous</author>
	<datestamp>1262094600000</datestamp>
	<modclass>None</modclass>
	<modscore>0</modscore>
	<htmltext><p>Ahhhh I say have fun with it on purpose... get the blaze orange shirts and get a matching pair of pants!  And do it on a day that everyone will notice.</p><p>I think after that you'll be asked not to wear the uniform and just do your job.</p></htmltext>
<tokenext>Ahhhh I say have fun with it on purpose... get the blaze orange shirts and get a matching pair of pants !
And do it on a day that everyone will notice.I think after that you 'll be asked not to wear the uniform and just do your job .</tokentext>
<sentencetext>Ahhhh I say have fun with it on purpose... get the blaze orange shirts and get a matching pair of pants!
And do it on a day that everyone will notice.I think after that you'll be asked not to wear the uniform and just do your job.</sentencetext>
	<parent>http://www.semanticweb.org/ontologies/ConversationInstances.owl#comment09_12_29_2129221.30587462</parent>
</comment>
<comment>
	<id>http://www.semanticweb.org/ontologies/ConversationInstances.owl#comment09_12_29_2129221.30587776</id>
	<title>Simple</title>
	<author>Purity Of Essence</author>
	<datestamp>1262086320000</datestamp>
	<modclass>None</modclass>
	<modscore>1</modscore>
	<htmltext><p>"I'm with Stupid" T-shirt</p></htmltext>
<tokenext>" I 'm with Stupid " T-shirt</tokentext>
<sentencetext>"I'm with Stupid" T-shirt</sentencetext>
</comment>
<comment>
	<id>http://www.semanticweb.org/ontologies/ConversationInstances.owl#comment09_12_29_2129221.30593252</id>
	<title>Obligatory Cheech &amp; Chong Reference:</title>
	<author>KendyForTheState</author>
	<datestamp>1259855100000</datestamp>
	<modclass>None</modclass>
	<modscore>1</modscore>
	<htmltext>"If we're going to wear uniforms, man, let's everybody wear something different".</htmltext>
<tokenext>" If we 're going to wear uniforms , man , let 's everybody wear something different " .</tokentext>
<sentencetext>"If we're going to wear uniforms, man, let's everybody wear something different".</sentencetext>
</comment>
<comment>
	<id>http://www.semanticweb.org/ontologies/ConversationInstances.owl#comment09_12_29_2129221.30589724</id>
	<title>Re:30 IT people in a 500 employee company?!</title>
	<author>Anonymous</author>
	<datestamp>1262099100000</datestamp>
	<modclass>None</modclass>
	<modscore>0</modscore>
	<htmltext><p>That's a slightly unfair comment. You have no idea what they do. Are the programmers &amp; DBAs considered IT? Helpdesk &amp; 2nd level support? Managers?</p><p>I support 700 users &amp; desktop PCs with 3, including myself, in a generally homogeneous mix of hardware/software. If not for the complex and needy 5\%, I could probably do with less too.</p></htmltext>
<tokenext>That 's a slightly unfair comment .
You have no idea what they do .
Are the programmers &amp; DBAs considered IT ?
Helpdesk &amp; 2nd level support ?
Managers ? I support 700 users &amp; desktop PCs with 3 , including myself , in a generally homogeneous mix of hardware/software .
If not for the complex and needy 5 \ % , I could probably do with less too .</tokentext>
<sentencetext>That's a slightly unfair comment.
You have no idea what they do.
Are the programmers &amp; DBAs considered IT?
Helpdesk &amp; 2nd level support?
Managers?I support 700 users &amp; desktop PCs with 3, including myself, in a generally homogeneous mix of hardware/software.
If not for the complex and needy 5\%, I could probably do with less too.</sentencetext>
	<parent>http://www.semanticweb.org/ontologies/ConversationInstances.owl#comment09_12_29_2129221.30587272</parent>
</comment>
<comment>
	<id>http://www.semanticweb.org/ontologies/ConversationInstances.owl#comment09_12_29_2129221.30651122</id>
	<title>Re:Say goodbye to your lunchbreak</title>
	<author>Geminii</author>
	<datestamp>1231089660000</datestamp>
	<modclass>None</modclass>
	<modscore>1</modscore>
	<htmltext>"We appreciate the concept of being forced to wear clothing we did not choose or design ourselves, and look forward to the Management team leading the way in this brave revolution. To assist with implementing this new policy, we have stepped up to the plate and proactively designed the uniforms for the Management team. They are distinct, highly visible from across a floor, and come with a wide range of accessories, from red wigs to squirting flowers, and shoes in Executive Board Member sizes."</htmltext>
<tokenext>" We appreciate the concept of being forced to wear clothing we did not choose or design ourselves , and look forward to the Management team leading the way in this brave revolution .
To assist with implementing this new policy , we have stepped up to the plate and proactively designed the uniforms for the Management team .
They are distinct , highly visible from across a floor , and come with a wide range of accessories , from red wigs to squirting flowers , and shoes in Executive Board Member sizes .
"</tokentext>
<sentencetext>"We appreciate the concept of being forced to wear clothing we did not choose or design ourselves, and look forward to the Management team leading the way in this brave revolution.
To assist with implementing this new policy, we have stepped up to the plate and proactively designed the uniforms for the Management team.
They are distinct, highly visible from across a floor, and come with a wide range of accessories, from red wigs to squirting flowers, and shoes in Executive Board Member sizes.
"</sentencetext>
	<parent>http://www.semanticweb.org/ontologies/ConversationInstances.owl#comment09_12_29_2129221.30587186</parent>
</comment>
<comment>
	<id>http://www.semanticweb.org/ontologies/ConversationInstances.owl#comment09_12_29_2129221.30619998</id>
	<title>Justify your very high IT to staff ratio</title>
	<author>maxbash</author>
	<datestamp>1230837480000</datestamp>
	<modclass>None</modclass>
	<modscore>1</modscore>
	<htmltext>I would go for it, if you think it will help make management happy about your very large IT dept. What the heck you doing with so many personnel? Do you maintain your own software? I thought we had to do regular horse and pony shows to management to justify our large IT dept, 10 people, 3 helpdesk for 450. We would need less personnel if wasn't one or two unique quirky apps for each of our 10 departments on top of the usual IT stuff, that you have to do ritual dances and prayers to the Vendor gods to keep operational.</htmltext>
<tokenext>I would go for it , if you think it will help make management happy about your very large IT dept .
What the heck you doing with so many personnel ?
Do you maintain your own software ?
I thought we had to do regular horse and pony shows to management to justify our large IT dept , 10 people , 3 helpdesk for 450 .
We would need less personnel if was n't one or two unique quirky apps for each of our 10 departments on top of the usual IT stuff , that you have to do ritual dances and prayers to the Vendor gods to keep operational .</tokentext>
<sentencetext>I would go for it, if you think it will help make management happy about your very large IT dept.
What the heck you doing with so many personnel?
Do you maintain your own software?
I thought we had to do regular horse and pony shows to management to justify our large IT dept, 10 people, 3 helpdesk for 450.
We would need less personnel if wasn't one or two unique quirky apps for each of our 10 departments on top of the usual IT stuff, that you have to do ritual dances and prayers to the Vendor gods to keep operational.</sentencetext>
</comment>
<comment>
	<id>http://www.semanticweb.org/ontologies/ConversationInstances.owl#comment09_12_29_2129221.30595244</id>
	<title>uniforms - is there a social engineering issue?</title>
	<author>Anonymous</author>
	<datestamp>1259861820000</datestamp>
	<modclass>None</modclass>
	<modscore>0</modscore>
	<htmltext><p>Unless you carry no id badges or other identifying info and also have a problem with social enineering attacks on your systems I'd be opposed.<br>If management has an issue with the business casual they should say so.<br>Singling out 6 professionals from the rest sets a bad trned and unless the companys paying will leave a real distaste for the it staff.</p></htmltext>
<tokenext>Unless you carry no id badges or other identifying info and also have a problem with social enineering attacks on your systems I 'd be opposed.If management has an issue with the business casual they should say so.Singling out 6 professionals from the rest sets a bad trned and unless the companys paying will leave a real distaste for the it staff .</tokentext>
<sentencetext>Unless you carry no id badges or other identifying info and also have a problem with social enineering attacks on your systems I'd be opposed.If management has an issue with the business casual they should say so.Singling out 6 professionals from the rest sets a bad trned and unless the companys paying will leave a real distaste for the it staff.</sentencetext>
</comment>
<comment>
	<id>http://www.semanticweb.org/ontologies/ConversationInstances.owl#comment09_12_29_2129221.30587318</id>
	<title>Departmental shirts  Professionalism</title>
	<author>Anonymous</author>
	<datestamp>1262084760000</datestamp>
	<modclass>None</modclass>
	<modscore>0</modscore>
	<htmltext><p>Whether you wear department shirts won't affect the professionalism.</p><p>The right answer depends on:</p><p>1) the culture of the company at large, and of the IT group in particular.  Heck, if you "have fun" with it, it could be a big plus<br>2) whether there is some other lurking problem you have not mentioned the shirts attempt to address</p></htmltext>
<tokenext>Whether you wear department shirts wo n't affect the professionalism.The right answer depends on : 1 ) the culture of the company at large , and of the IT group in particular .
Heck , if you " have fun " with it , it could be a big plus2 ) whether there is some other lurking problem you have not mentioned the shirts attempt to address</tokentext>
<sentencetext>Whether you wear department shirts won't affect the professionalism.The right answer depends on:1) the culture of the company at large, and of the IT group in particular.
Heck, if you "have fun" with it, it could be a big plus2) whether there is some other lurking problem you have not mentioned the shirts attempt to address</sentencetext>
</comment>
<comment>
	<id>http://www.semanticweb.org/ontologies/ConversationInstances.owl#comment09_12_29_2129221.30592676</id>
	<title>Re:lovely</title>
	<author>Enyk</author>
	<datestamp>1259852040000</datestamp>
	<modclass>None</modclass>
	<modscore>1</modscore>
	<htmltext><p><div class="quote"><p>Let me know when Accounting gets assigned jumpsuits.</p></div><p>They're usually orange, and only assigned once the embezzling has been found.</p></div>
	</htmltext>
<tokenext>Let me know when Accounting gets assigned jumpsuits.They 're usually orange , and only assigned once the embezzling has been found .</tokentext>
<sentencetext>Let me know when Accounting gets assigned jumpsuits.They're usually orange, and only assigned once the embezzling has been found.
	</sentencetext>
	<parent>http://www.semanticweb.org/ontologies/ConversationInstances.owl#comment09_12_29_2129221.30587278</parent>
</comment>
<comment>
	<id>http://www.semanticweb.org/ontologies/ConversationInstances.owl#comment09_12_29_2129221.30587606</id>
	<title>Wait...</title>
	<author>Anonymous</author>
	<datestamp>1262085720000</datestamp>
	<modclass>None</modclass>
	<modscore>0</modscore>
	<htmltext><p>Your call center is located AT your actual company? In the same COUNTRY? seriously? Well they should all be happy to have a job and wear whatever they're told.</p></htmltext>
<tokenext>Your call center is located AT your actual company ?
In the same COUNTRY ?
seriously ? Well they should all be happy to have a job and wear whatever they 're told .</tokentext>
<sentencetext>Your call center is located AT your actual company?
In the same COUNTRY?
seriously? Well they should all be happy to have a job and wear whatever they're told.</sentencetext>
</comment>
<comment>
	<id>http://www.semanticweb.org/ontologies/ConversationInstances.owl#comment09_12_29_2129221.30591090</id>
	<title>Re:Well...</title>
	<author>Anonymous</author>
	<datestamp>1262115780000</datestamp>
	<modclass>None</modclass>
	<modscore>0</modscore>
	<htmltext><p>$40K?  Are you serious?  Walk, walk now.</p><p>That's $100K work.</p></htmltext>
<tokenext>$ 40K ?
Are you serious ?
Walk , walk now.That 's $ 100K work .</tokentext>
<sentencetext>$40K?
Are you serious?
Walk, walk now.That's $100K work.</sentencetext>
	<parent>http://www.semanticweb.org/ontologies/ConversationInstances.owl#comment09_12_29_2129221.30587462</parent>
</comment>
<comment>
	<id>http://www.semanticweb.org/ontologies/ConversationInstances.owl#comment09_12_29_2129221.30588432</id>
	<title>Lab Coats?</title>
	<author>chewedtoothpick</author>
	<datestamp>1262089380000</datestamp>
	<modclass>None</modclass>
	<modscore>1</modscore>
	<htmltext><p>Why would anyone balk at a chance to wear lab coats in a 'professional' office?</p></htmltext>
<tokenext>Why would anyone balk at a chance to wear lab coats in a 'professional ' office ?</tokentext>
<sentencetext>Why would anyone balk at a chance to wear lab coats in a 'professional' office?</sentencetext>
</comment>
<comment>
	<id>http://www.semanticweb.org/ontologies/ConversationInstances.owl#comment09_12_29_2129221.30587792</id>
	<title>Hollywood Video once had the real bad uniforms and</title>
	<author>Joe The Dragon</author>
	<datestamp>1262086380000</datestamp>
	<modclass>None</modclass>
	<modscore>1</modscore>
	<htmltext><p>Hollywood Video once had the real bad uniforms and even the customers did not like them and now they don't.</p><p>And the less IT looks like the geek squad the better.</p></htmltext>
<tokenext>Hollywood Video once had the real bad uniforms and even the customers did not like them and now they do n't.And the less IT looks like the geek squad the better .</tokentext>
<sentencetext>Hollywood Video once had the real bad uniforms and even the customers did not like them and now they don't.And the less IT looks like the geek squad the better.</sentencetext>
</comment>
<comment>
	<id>http://www.semanticweb.org/ontologies/ConversationInstances.owl#comment09_12_29_2129221.30587612</id>
	<title>Re:I like uniforms</title>
	<author>couchslug</author>
	<datestamp>1262085720000</datestamp>
	<modclass>None</modclass>
	<modscore>1</modscore>
	<htmltext><p>"I haven't had to wear one in almost 20 years, but when I did, I liked it, because then I didn't have to think about what I was going to wear to work."</p><p>Worked for me, and I still wear what is essentially a "uniform" (jeans, plain black T-shirt, blue work jacket) where I work now. It's cheap, it doesn't show dirt (I work in a welding shop) and I don't have to think about it.</p><p>I don't give a shit about self-expression by dressing differently at work, I'm there for the money and because I enjoy working on machines.</p></htmltext>
<tokenext>" I have n't had to wear one in almost 20 years , but when I did , I liked it , because then I did n't have to think about what I was going to wear to work .
" Worked for me , and I still wear what is essentially a " uniform " ( jeans , plain black T-shirt , blue work jacket ) where I work now .
It 's cheap , it does n't show dirt ( I work in a welding shop ) and I do n't have to think about it.I do n't give a shit about self-expression by dressing differently at work , I 'm there for the money and because I enjoy working on machines .</tokentext>
<sentencetext>"I haven't had to wear one in almost 20 years, but when I did, I liked it, because then I didn't have to think about what I was going to wear to work.
"Worked for me, and I still wear what is essentially a "uniform" (jeans, plain black T-shirt, blue work jacket) where I work now.
It's cheap, it doesn't show dirt (I work in a welding shop) and I don't have to think about it.I don't give a shit about self-expression by dressing differently at work, I'm there for the money and because I enjoy working on machines.</sentencetext>
	<parent>http://www.semanticweb.org/ontologies/ConversationInstances.owl#comment09_12_29_2129221.30587120</parent>
</comment>
<comment>
	<id>http://www.semanticweb.org/ontologies/ConversationInstances.owl#comment09_12_29_2129221.30587836</id>
	<title>The shirts would need a slogan like..</title>
	<author>ljwest</author>
	<datestamp>1262086560000</datestamp>
	<modclass>None</modclass>
	<modscore>1</modscore>
	<htmltext>" I'm Lovin' IT "</htmltext>
<tokenext>" I 'm Lovin ' IT "</tokentext>
<sentencetext>" I'm Lovin' IT "</sentencetext>
</comment>
<comment>
	<id>http://www.semanticweb.org/ontologies/ConversationInstances.owl#comment09_12_29_2129221.30587442</id>
	<title>Good Idea</title>
	<author>Itninja</author>
	<datestamp>1262085120000</datestamp>
	<modclass>None</modclass>
	<modscore>1</modscore>
	<htmltext>Since the IT folks are often the most powerful employees of any company (in terms of how quickly a few people could essentially shut down an entire organization), I would support an idea like this. Of course, I would want something simple like (like <a href="http://www.thinkgeek.com/tshirts-apparel/unisex/itdepartment/5cb5/" title="thinkgeek.com">this</a> [thinkgeek.com]). <br> <br>
In large organizations, anyone with elevated, potentially damaging powers should be distinguishable on sight. The CIO should have to wear a gorilla suit just so it's fair.</htmltext>
<tokenext>Since the IT folks are often the most powerful employees of any company ( in terms of how quickly a few people could essentially shut down an entire organization ) , I would support an idea like this .
Of course , I would want something simple like ( like this [ thinkgeek.com ] ) .
In large organizations , anyone with elevated , potentially damaging powers should be distinguishable on sight .
The CIO should have to wear a gorilla suit just so it 's fair .</tokentext>
<sentencetext>Since the IT folks are often the most powerful employees of any company (in terms of how quickly a few people could essentially shut down an entire organization), I would support an idea like this.
Of course, I would want something simple like (like this [thinkgeek.com]).
In large organizations, anyone with elevated, potentially damaging powers should be distinguishable on sight.
The CIO should have to wear a gorilla suit just so it's fair.</sentencetext>
</comment>
<comment>
	<id>http://www.semanticweb.org/ontologies/ConversationInstances.owl#comment09_12_29_2129221.30588324</id>
	<title>Re:Are you colleagues or janitors?</title>
	<author>Anonymous</author>
	<datestamp>1262088840000</datestamp>
	<modclass>None</modclass>
	<modscore>0</modscore>
	<htmltext>Typically you want your help desk employees to be interchangable.  In large corporate settings, you want employees to "find somebody in a blue shirt" rather than "find Steve, or if he's not around try Morgan."<br>Uniforms are a tool.  When implemented correctly they can quickly identify people with skillsets and/or decision making authority.  It's useful in time critical applications such as large scale manufacturing or retail customer service, where you don't want people wasting time looking for the right person to help.<br>That said, given the company size and working environment, uniforms are probably not the best tools in this case.  There are better ways to identify help desk employees which wouldn't have the negative consequences of having 6 "special" employees.</htmltext>
<tokenext>Typically you want your help desk employees to be interchangable .
In large corporate settings , you want employees to " find somebody in a blue shirt " rather than " find Steve , or if he 's not around try Morgan .
" Uniforms are a tool .
When implemented correctly they can quickly identify people with skillsets and/or decision making authority .
It 's useful in time critical applications such as large scale manufacturing or retail customer service , where you do n't want people wasting time looking for the right person to help.That said , given the company size and working environment , uniforms are probably not the best tools in this case .
There are better ways to identify help desk employees which would n't have the negative consequences of having 6 " special " employees .</tokentext>
<sentencetext>Typically you want your help desk employees to be interchangable.
In large corporate settings, you want employees to "find somebody in a blue shirt" rather than "find Steve, or if he's not around try Morgan.
"Uniforms are a tool.
When implemented correctly they can quickly identify people with skillsets and/or decision making authority.
It's useful in time critical applications such as large scale manufacturing or retail customer service, where you don't want people wasting time looking for the right person to help.That said, given the company size and working environment, uniforms are probably not the best tools in this case.
There are better ways to identify help desk employees which wouldn't have the negative consequences of having 6 "special" employees.</sentencetext>
	<parent>http://www.semanticweb.org/ontologies/ConversationInstances.owl#comment09_12_29_2129221.30587244</parent>
</comment>
<comment>
	<id>http://www.semanticweb.org/ontologies/ConversationInstances.owl#comment09_12_29_2129221.30587662</id>
	<title>We should ALL have uniforms...</title>
	<author>Anonymous</author>
	<datestamp>1262085900000</datestamp>
	<modclass>None</modclass>
	<modscore>1</modscore>
	<htmltext><p>I've been fascinated how, in the medieval world, everyone seemed to have some sort of dress appropriate to their function. We should have different uniforms we should wear, depending on what do.  If we are single, that would make for good ice breakers.. "so, I see you are a botanist, level 2", is a lot better of an opener, then, "hey baby, what's your sign."</p></htmltext>
<tokenext>I 've been fascinated how , in the medieval world , everyone seemed to have some sort of dress appropriate to their function .
We should have different uniforms we should wear , depending on what do .
If we are single , that would make for good ice breakers.. " so , I see you are a botanist , level 2 " , is a lot better of an opener , then , " hey baby , what 's your sign .
"</tokentext>
<sentencetext>I've been fascinated how, in the medieval world, everyone seemed to have some sort of dress appropriate to their function.
We should have different uniforms we should wear, depending on what do.
If we are single, that would make for good ice breakers.. "so, I see you are a botanist, level 2", is a lot better of an opener, then, "hey baby, what's your sign.
"</sentencetext>
</comment>
<comment>
	<id>http://www.semanticweb.org/ontologies/ConversationInstances.owl#comment09_12_29_2129221.30593098</id>
	<title>Yes!</title>
	<author>Anonymous</author>
	<datestamp>1259854320000</datestamp>
	<modclass>None</modclass>
	<modscore>0</modscore>
	<htmltext><p>I made this suggestion to the boss, while I was a lowly IT "help desk" employee (they call them technical support analysts now).</p><p>Actually, I told him:  "We should be wearing jumpsuits and always be running between appointments."</p></htmltext>
<tokenext>I made this suggestion to the boss , while I was a lowly IT " help desk " employee ( they call them technical support analysts now ) .Actually , I told him : " We should be wearing jumpsuits and always be running between appointments .
"</tokentext>
<sentencetext>I made this suggestion to the boss, while I was a lowly IT "help desk" employee (they call them technical support analysts now).Actually, I told him:  "We should be wearing jumpsuits and always be running between appointments.
"</sentencetext>
</comment>
<comment>
	<id>http://www.semanticweb.org/ontologies/ConversationInstances.owl#comment09_12_29_2129221.30588594</id>
	<title>30 for 500?</title>
	<author>mjensen</author>
	<datestamp>1262090220000</datestamp>
	<modclass>None</modclass>
	<modscore>1</modscore>
	<htmltext><p>....."approximately 500 employees. There are 30 people on the IT staff".....<br>That's a LOT of IT people, from what I've been told.  For 120 employees, we did well with 2 IT staff (1.5 on help desk and 0.5 on development).<br>By that ratio, you'd need a total of 12.</p><p>Anyone else think this number is a bit high?</p></htmltext>
<tokenext>..... " approximately 500 employees .
There are 30 people on the IT staff " .....That 's a LOT of IT people , from what I 've been told .
For 120 employees , we did well with 2 IT staff ( 1.5 on help desk and 0.5 on development ) .By that ratio , you 'd need a total of 12.Anyone else think this number is a bit high ?</tokentext>
<sentencetext>....."approximately 500 employees.
There are 30 people on the IT staff".....That's a LOT of IT people, from what I've been told.
For 120 employees, we did well with 2 IT staff (1.5 on help desk and 0.5 on development).By that ratio, you'd need a total of 12.Anyone else think this number is a bit high?</sentencetext>
</comment>
<comment>
	<id>http://www.semanticweb.org/ontologies/ConversationInstances.owl#comment09_12_29_2129221.30589660</id>
	<title>It is demeaning...</title>
	<author>jotaeleemeese</author>
	<datestamp>1262098440000</datestamp>
	<modclass>None</modclass>
	<modscore>1</modscore>
	<htmltext><p>Singling out help desk people is telling you that they consider your services janitorial in quality.</p><p>I just can't imagine working in a company requiring this. This is the 21st century, somebody should pass the memo to some companies out there.</p></htmltext>
<tokenext>Singling out help desk people is telling you that they consider your services janitorial in quality.I just ca n't imagine working in a company requiring this .
This is the 21st century , somebody should pass the memo to some companies out there .</tokentext>
<sentencetext>Singling out help desk people is telling you that they consider your services janitorial in quality.I just can't imagine working in a company requiring this.
This is the 21st century, somebody should pass the memo to some companies out there.</sentencetext>
</comment>
<comment>
	<id>http://www.semanticweb.org/ontologies/ConversationInstances.owl#comment09_12_29_2129221.30611076</id>
	<title>Re:30 IT people in a 500 employee company?!</title>
	<author>Anonymous</author>
	<datestamp>1262264040000</datestamp>
	<modclass>None</modclass>
	<modscore>0</modscore>
	<htmltext><p>What sort of business are you supporting?<br>Helpdesk headcount ratios can vary anywhere from 1:10 to 1:1000 depending on the nature of the business, the trading hours, the criticality of response times, the skill level of the support staff etc etc.<br>I've worked at an investment bank where the IT staff were 25\% of the company, an ISP where they were over 50\%, a Finance firm where we were less than 1\%.<br>I'm currently working it retail and our helpdesk team is 5 to support 300 PCs over 80 locations that trade for approx 80 hours per week. It's horses for courses.</p></htmltext>
<tokenext>What sort of business are you supporting ? Helpdesk headcount ratios can vary anywhere from 1 : 10 to 1 : 1000 depending on the nature of the business , the trading hours , the criticality of response times , the skill level of the support staff etc etc.I 've worked at an investment bank where the IT staff were 25 \ % of the company , an ISP where they were over 50 \ % , a Finance firm where we were less than 1 \ % .I 'm currently working it retail and our helpdesk team is 5 to support 300 PCs over 80 locations that trade for approx 80 hours per week .
It 's horses for courses .</tokentext>
<sentencetext>What sort of business are you supporting?Helpdesk headcount ratios can vary anywhere from 1:10 to 1:1000 depending on the nature of the business, the trading hours, the criticality of response times, the skill level of the support staff etc etc.I've worked at an investment bank where the IT staff were 25\% of the company, an ISP where they were over 50\%, a Finance firm where we were less than 1\%.I'm currently working it retail and our helpdesk team is 5 to support 300 PCs over 80 locations that trade for approx 80 hours per week.
It's horses for courses.</sentencetext>
	<parent>http://www.semanticweb.org/ontologies/ConversationInstances.owl#comment09_12_29_2129221.30587272</parent>
</comment>
<comment>
	<id>http://www.semanticweb.org/ontologies/ConversationInstances.owl#comment09_12_29_2129221.30590774</id>
	<title>Re:Nothing wrong with the idea</title>
	<author>Anonymous</author>
	<datestamp>1262110380000</datestamp>
	<modclass>None</modclass>
	<modscore>0</modscore>
	<htmltext><p>..or maybe we shouldn't support a culture that reenforces the reenforcement of insecure suit types who only see the superficial.  Dressing a slacker in a uniform does not unslack him.</p></htmltext>
<tokenext>..or maybe we should n't support a culture that reenforces the reenforcement of insecure suit types who only see the superficial .
Dressing a slacker in a uniform does not unslack him .</tokentext>
<sentencetext>..or maybe we shouldn't support a culture that reenforces the reenforcement of insecure suit types who only see the superficial.
Dressing a slacker in a uniform does not unslack him.</sentencetext>
	<parent>http://www.semanticweb.org/ontologies/ConversationInstances.owl#comment09_12_29_2129221.30587138</parent>
</comment>
<comment>
	<id>http://www.semanticweb.org/ontologies/ConversationInstances.owl#comment09_12_29_2129221.30587728</id>
	<title>If it's about identification...</title>
	<author>Anonymous</author>
	<datestamp>1262086140000</datestamp>
	<modclass>None</modclass>
	<modscore>0</modscore>
	<htmltext><p>then why not just issue ID tags and lanyards?</p><p>http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Lanyard#Other\_uses</p></htmltext>
<tokenext>then why not just issue ID tags and lanyards ? http : //en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Lanyard # Other \ _uses</tokentext>
<sentencetext>then why not just issue ID tags and lanyards?http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Lanyard#Other\_uses</sentencetext>
</comment>
<comment>
	<id>http://www.semanticweb.org/ontologies/ConversationInstances.owl#comment09_12_29_2129221.30587334</id>
	<title>Oh, I see</title>
	<author>WindBourne</author>
	<datestamp>1262084820000</datestamp>
	<modclass>None</modclass>
	<modscore>1</modscore>
	<htmltext>They will be just like Janitors.<br> <br>
Time to find a new job.</htmltext>
<tokenext>They will be just like Janitors .
Time to find a new job .</tokentext>
<sentencetext>They will be just like Janitors.
Time to find a new job.</sentencetext>
</comment>
<comment>
	<id>http://www.semanticweb.org/ontologies/ConversationInstances.owl#comment09_12_29_2129221.30590402</id>
	<title>Re:I like uniforms</title>
	<author>Anonymous</author>
	<datestamp>1262106060000</datestamp>
	<modclass>None</modclass>
	<modscore>0</modscore>
	<htmltext><p>I like pie.</p></htmltext>
<tokenext>I like pie .</tokentext>
<sentencetext>I like pie.</sentencetext>
	<parent>http://www.semanticweb.org/ontologies/ConversationInstances.owl#comment09_12_29_2129221.30587120</parent>
</comment>
<comment>
	<id>http://www.semanticweb.org/ontologies/ConversationInstances.owl#comment09_12_29_2129221.30587696</id>
	<title>Re:lovely</title>
	<author>value\_added</author>
	<datestamp>1262086080000</datestamp>
	<modclass>Interestin</modclass>
	<modscore>2</modscore>
	<htmltext><p><i>Delivery drivers, pest control people, UPS, the people who go out in the field wear the uniform. They're also the lowest paid of the bunch. McDonalds lets the managers wear a dress shirt and tie. Dealerships have the mechanics wearing uniforms but not the sales people and office staff. Pretty much anyone in uniform is on the lower end of the totem pole. IT is supposed to be a co-equal department, right?</i></p><p>That pretty much sums up the inconsistencies, doesn't it?</p><p>Uniforms can be perfectly fine, but their use is typically reserved for workers who don't work in the office (read "you don't belong here").</p><p>The only example I can think of where someone would be uniformed and allowed free access in an office environment is the case where internal services have been outsourced to a company that provides on-site employees.  This is a fairly common setup in larger companies that have huge volumes of internal mail delivery, or require messengering and/or print/duplication work be done in-house.</p><p>If I was the office manager and had a need to uniform certain employees, I'd segregate them to their own area, possibly giving each their own red stapler to ease the transition.</p></htmltext>
<tokenext>Delivery drivers , pest control people , UPS , the people who go out in the field wear the uniform .
They 're also the lowest paid of the bunch .
McDonalds lets the managers wear a dress shirt and tie .
Dealerships have the mechanics wearing uniforms but not the sales people and office staff .
Pretty much anyone in uniform is on the lower end of the totem pole .
IT is supposed to be a co-equal department , right ? That pretty much sums up the inconsistencies , does n't it ? Uniforms can be perfectly fine , but their use is typically reserved for workers who do n't work in the office ( read " you do n't belong here " ) .The only example I can think of where someone would be uniformed and allowed free access in an office environment is the case where internal services have been outsourced to a company that provides on-site employees .
This is a fairly common setup in larger companies that have huge volumes of internal mail delivery , or require messengering and/or print/duplication work be done in-house.If I was the office manager and had a need to uniform certain employees , I 'd segregate them to their own area , possibly giving each their own red stapler to ease the transition .</tokentext>
<sentencetext>Delivery drivers, pest control people, UPS, the people who go out in the field wear the uniform.
They're also the lowest paid of the bunch.
McDonalds lets the managers wear a dress shirt and tie.
Dealerships have the mechanics wearing uniforms but not the sales people and office staff.
Pretty much anyone in uniform is on the lower end of the totem pole.
IT is supposed to be a co-equal department, right?That pretty much sums up the inconsistencies, doesn't it?Uniforms can be perfectly fine, but their use is typically reserved for workers who don't work in the office (read "you don't belong here").The only example I can think of where someone would be uniformed and allowed free access in an office environment is the case where internal services have been outsourced to a company that provides on-site employees.
This is a fairly common setup in larger companies that have huge volumes of internal mail delivery, or require messengering and/or print/duplication work be done in-house.If I was the office manager and had a need to uniform certain employees, I'd segregate them to their own area, possibly giving each their own red stapler to ease the transition.</sentencetext>
	<parent>http://www.semanticweb.org/ontologies/ConversationInstances.owl#comment09_12_29_2129221.30587278</parent>
</comment>
<comment>
	<id>http://www.semanticweb.org/ontologies/ConversationInstances.owl#comment09_12_29_2129221.30587892</id>
	<title>Shirts as a gift to employees</title>
	<author>jemc</author>
	<datestamp>1262086740000</datestamp>
	<modclass>None</modclass>
	<modscore>1</modscore>
	<htmltext>Ever so often, in my company, one department or another makes a purchase of shirts (or mugs, or other) and "gives" them to the group.
They include appropriate logos of the department or the project they are working on.

People just wear them because they are good quality, look good, and show that they got the gift at some point.
It is more of a reward.</htmltext>
<tokenext>Ever so often , in my company , one department or another makes a purchase of shirts ( or mugs , or other ) and " gives " them to the group .
They include appropriate logos of the department or the project they are working on .
People just wear them because they are good quality , look good , and show that they got the gift at some point .
It is more of a reward .</tokentext>
<sentencetext>Ever so often, in my company, one department or another makes a purchase of shirts (or mugs, or other) and "gives" them to the group.
They include appropriate logos of the department or the project they are working on.
People just wear them because they are good quality, look good, and show that they got the gift at some point.
It is more of a reward.</sentencetext>
</comment>
<comment>
	<id>http://www.semanticweb.org/ontologies/ConversationInstances.owl#comment09_12_29_2129221.30599822</id>
	<title>This is a good thing.</title>
	<author>geekoid</author>
	<datestamp>1259836260000</datestamp>
	<modclass>None</modclass>
	<modscore>1</modscore>
	<htmltext><p>First of all, if they dont' ahve to be the same they are NOT UNIFORMS because they won't be uniform.</p><p>Second of all this is a GOOD thing. If you are smart and good at your job you want this.</p><p>Having a polo it It's symbol is a great way for people to see you adding value. You may do your job better then anyone in the world and work for the most compentant IT dept. in the world, but of you don't make your slef known you will experience budget cuts. Yes, I know a good system is one where you don't see the IT people; however that's doesn't fit in with the realities of human nature.<br>I ahve seen similiar policyies put in place, and they have almost always benefited the IT dept in the long run. The onlly time I saw it ahve a negative impact is the one time where it was an actual gray uniform shirt. Like the old schookl mechanis wore. That made everyone feel like drones.</p><p>A polo shirt with a little emblem over the left breast, or a comfortable printed Tee- Shirt are the way to go.</p><p>I am goint o say this again becasue it really can't be stressed enough in the crowd:<br>Being visible when you do a good job is a good thing. It shows your value and a good manager can use that to get a bigger budget to get YOU the TOOLS and education you need. Maybe even a bonus structure for IT workers.</p><p>You should be happy someone is trying to get you recognized for the good work you do.</p></htmltext>
<tokenext>First of all , if they dont ' ahve to be the same they are NOT UNIFORMS because they wo n't be uniform.Second of all this is a GOOD thing .
If you are smart and good at your job you want this.Having a polo it It 's symbol is a great way for people to see you adding value .
You may do your job better then anyone in the world and work for the most compentant IT dept .
in the world , but of you do n't make your slef known you will experience budget cuts .
Yes , I know a good system is one where you do n't see the IT people ; however that 's does n't fit in with the realities of human nature.I ahve seen similiar policyies put in place , and they have almost always benefited the IT dept in the long run .
The onlly time I saw it ahve a negative impact is the one time where it was an actual gray uniform shirt .
Like the old schookl mechanis wore .
That made everyone feel like drones.A polo shirt with a little emblem over the left breast , or a comfortable printed Tee- Shirt are the way to go.I am goint o say this again becasue it really ca n't be stressed enough in the crowd : Being visible when you do a good job is a good thing .
It shows your value and a good manager can use that to get a bigger budget to get YOU the TOOLS and education you need .
Maybe even a bonus structure for IT workers.You should be happy someone is trying to get you recognized for the good work you do .</tokentext>
<sentencetext>First of all, if they dont' ahve to be the same they are NOT UNIFORMS because they won't be uniform.Second of all this is a GOOD thing.
If you are smart and good at your job you want this.Having a polo it It's symbol is a great way for people to see you adding value.
You may do your job better then anyone in the world and work for the most compentant IT dept.
in the world, but of you don't make your slef known you will experience budget cuts.
Yes, I know a good system is one where you don't see the IT people; however that's doesn't fit in with the realities of human nature.I ahve seen similiar policyies put in place, and they have almost always benefited the IT dept in the long run.
The onlly time I saw it ahve a negative impact is the one time where it was an actual gray uniform shirt.
Like the old schookl mechanis wore.
That made everyone feel like drones.A polo shirt with a little emblem over the left breast, or a comfortable printed Tee- Shirt are the way to go.I am goint o say this again becasue it really can't be stressed enough in the crowd:Being visible when you do a good job is a good thing.
It shows your value and a good manager can use that to get a bigger budget to get YOU the TOOLS and education you need.
Maybe even a bonus structure for IT workers.You should be happy someone is trying to get you recognized for the good work you do.</sentencetext>
</comment>
<comment>
	<id>http://www.semanticweb.org/ontologies/ConversationInstances.owl#comment09_12_29_2129221.30589304</id>
	<title>Re:30 IT people in a 500 employee company?!</title>
	<author>Anonymous</author>
	<datestamp>1262095200000</datestamp>
	<modclass>None</modclass>
	<modscore>0</modscore>
	<htmltext><p>They have servers running Windows 2000</p></htmltext>
<tokenext>They have servers running Windows 2000</tokentext>
<sentencetext>They have servers running Windows 2000</sentencetext>
	<parent>http://www.semanticweb.org/ontologies/ConversationInstances.owl#comment09_12_29_2129221.30587272</parent>
</comment>
<comment>
	<id>http://www.semanticweb.org/ontologies/ConversationInstances.owl#comment09_12_29_2129221.30590926</id>
	<title>30 IT guys for a 500 employee company?</title>
	<author>fluffy99</author>
	<datestamp>1262112900000</datestamp>
	<modclass>None</modclass>
	<modscore>1</modscore>
	<htmltext><p>Do you really need an IT guy for every 16 employees?  Unless you are an IT company or suport a heavy web presence, I'd say you either have very incompetent employees or you're grossly overstaffed in the IT department.</p></htmltext>
<tokenext>Do you really need an IT guy for every 16 employees ?
Unless you are an IT company or suport a heavy web presence , I 'd say you either have very incompetent employees or you 're grossly overstaffed in the IT department .</tokentext>
<sentencetext>Do you really need an IT guy for every 16 employees?
Unless you are an IT company or suport a heavy web presence, I'd say you either have very incompetent employees or you're grossly overstaffed in the IT department.</sentencetext>
</comment>
<comment>
	<id>http://www.semanticweb.org/ontologies/ConversationInstances.owl#comment09_12_29_2129221.30587368</id>
	<title>Lucky you</title>
	<author>Anonymous</author>
	<datestamp>1262084940000</datestamp>
	<modclass>None</modclass>
	<modscore>1</modscore>
	<htmltext><p>When I worked front-line IT support for UPS back in the 90s, I had to wear dress slacks and a tie. If I was visiting customers I had to wear a suit. This would not be a big deal if the customers worked in offices, but for the most part they worked in the shipping department which was usually in the warehouse which was usually the hottest and dustiest place in the building.  Even for internal customers it was a pain. A UPS shipping facility is filthy. There's dust, dirt, grime and it's not air-conditioned. A lot times I was crawling under carts, going up in ceilings to trace cabling,  Wearing dress clothes in this environment sucked. Not only did I get filthy almost every day, but my clothes didn't last very long at all.</p><p>And I had to walk uphill across conveyor belts to and from school.</p></htmltext>
<tokenext>When I worked front-line IT support for UPS back in the 90s , I had to wear dress slacks and a tie .
If I was visiting customers I had to wear a suit .
This would not be a big deal if the customers worked in offices , but for the most part they worked in the shipping department which was usually in the warehouse which was usually the hottest and dustiest place in the building .
Even for internal customers it was a pain .
A UPS shipping facility is filthy .
There 's dust , dirt , grime and it 's not air-conditioned .
A lot times I was crawling under carts , going up in ceilings to trace cabling , Wearing dress clothes in this environment sucked .
Not only did I get filthy almost every day , but my clothes did n't last very long at all.And I had to walk uphill across conveyor belts to and from school .</tokentext>
<sentencetext>When I worked front-line IT support for UPS back in the 90s, I had to wear dress slacks and a tie.
If I was visiting customers I had to wear a suit.
This would not be a big deal if the customers worked in offices, but for the most part they worked in the shipping department which was usually in the warehouse which was usually the hottest and dustiest place in the building.
Even for internal customers it was a pain.
A UPS shipping facility is filthy.
There's dust, dirt, grime and it's not air-conditioned.
A lot times I was crawling under carts, going up in ceilings to trace cabling,  Wearing dress clothes in this environment sucked.
Not only did I get filthy almost every day, but my clothes didn't last very long at all.And I had to walk uphill across conveyor belts to and from school.</sentencetext>
</comment>
<comment>
	<id>http://www.semanticweb.org/ontologies/ConversationInstances.owl#comment09_12_29_2129221.30592650</id>
	<title>Car mechanics? Low?</title>
	<author>SmallFurryCreature</author>
	<datestamp>1259851860000</datestamp>
	<modclass>None</modclass>
	<modscore>1</modscore>
	<htmltext><p>Don't know where you get your car serviced but it is the sales people with a base salary who work on commission. The mechanics simply get a regular decent pay based on experience and skill and it ain't low because skilled mechanics are hard to find, while sale clerks are a dime a dozen.
</p><p>Surgeons also wear uniforms, are they low paid as well? So do airline pilots.
</p><p>And the higher you are in a bank, the more you are required to wear the uniform of a 3 piece suit in the appropriate colors/style. While the IT flunky can come to work at the same bank in whatever he wants as long as it contains the blubber.
</p><p>On a construction site, the ones in the company colors are the regulars, the ones who got a job the whole year, everyone in their own clothes will be temps, hired hands, with no job security.
</p><p>Sorry mate, but you need some more experience with real life.
</p><p>Bad jobs are bad jobs, the uniform or not has nothing to do with it.
</p><p>I would insist that the uniforms are paid for by the company, completely and cleaned on their expense. Then just consider it a saving and deal with it.</p></htmltext>
<tokenext>Do n't know where you get your car serviced but it is the sales people with a base salary who work on commission .
The mechanics simply get a regular decent pay based on experience and skill and it ai n't low because skilled mechanics are hard to find , while sale clerks are a dime a dozen .
Surgeons also wear uniforms , are they low paid as well ?
So do airline pilots .
And the higher you are in a bank , the more you are required to wear the uniform of a 3 piece suit in the appropriate colors/style .
While the IT flunky can come to work at the same bank in whatever he wants as long as it contains the blubber .
On a construction site , the ones in the company colors are the regulars , the ones who got a job the whole year , everyone in their own clothes will be temps , hired hands , with no job security .
Sorry mate , but you need some more experience with real life .
Bad jobs are bad jobs , the uniform or not has nothing to do with it .
I would insist that the uniforms are paid for by the company , completely and cleaned on their expense .
Then just consider it a saving and deal with it .</tokentext>
<sentencetext>Don't know where you get your car serviced but it is the sales people with a base salary who work on commission.
The mechanics simply get a regular decent pay based on experience and skill and it ain't low because skilled mechanics are hard to find, while sale clerks are a dime a dozen.
Surgeons also wear uniforms, are they low paid as well?
So do airline pilots.
And the higher you are in a bank, the more you are required to wear the uniform of a 3 piece suit in the appropriate colors/style.
While the IT flunky can come to work at the same bank in whatever he wants as long as it contains the blubber.
On a construction site, the ones in the company colors are the regulars, the ones who got a job the whole year, everyone in their own clothes will be temps, hired hands, with no job security.
Sorry mate, but you need some more experience with real life.
Bad jobs are bad jobs, the uniform or not has nothing to do with it.
I would insist that the uniforms are paid for by the company, completely and cleaned on their expense.
Then just consider it a saving and deal with it.</sentencetext>
	<parent>http://www.semanticweb.org/ontologies/ConversationInstances.owl#comment09_12_29_2129221.30587278</parent>
</comment>
<comment>
	<id>http://www.semanticweb.org/ontologies/ConversationInstances.owl#comment09_12_29_2129221.30587784</id>
	<title>Might not be fun to wear them but...</title>
	<author>nicolas.kassis</author>
	<datestamp>1262086320000</datestamp>
	<modclass>None</modclass>
	<modscore>1</modscore>
	<htmltext>they would give you guys a more credible look. Dunno if that's a win or loose but uniforms do have psychological effects on people.</htmltext>
<tokenext>they would give you guys a more credible look .
Dunno if that 's a win or loose but uniforms do have psychological effects on people .</tokentext>
<sentencetext>they would give you guys a more credible look.
Dunno if that's a win or loose but uniforms do have psychological effects on people.</sentencetext>
</comment>
<comment>
	<id>http://www.semanticweb.org/ontologies/ConversationInstances.owl#comment09_12_29_2129221.30588366</id>
	<title>Re:I like uniforms</title>
	<author>Anonymous</author>
	<datestamp>1262089020000</datestamp>
	<modclass>Insightful</modclass>
	<modscore>1</modscore>
	<htmltext><p><i>Maybe they're trying to send you guys a not-so-subtle message that maybe your business casual is a bit too casual?</i></p><p>You are forgetting the asshat factor.  There are just asshats out there who look to 'fix things'.  They see an opportunity to make someone *ELSE* do something and they get to look good suggesting it.  From the description I would bet MONEY that this is the case.  Make *THEM* personally wear the same uniform and pay for it out of pocket like the IT guys and suddenly it will not be such a good idea.</p><p>Someone should stand up and say 'ok maybe our atire is a bit out of line(?) we will clean it up.  However, I think mandating uniforms is a bit far unless you are willing to institute this across the compnay.  You would be discriminating against us.'  Bring up the D word and suddenly HR is involved and it becomes an 'ugly' thing.</p><p>It is amazing the number of 'old outdated' ideas I have seen re-rise to the top of the pile now that the 'economy is bad'.  Everyone seems to be listening to the worst of the stupidest ideas from old management ideas and calling them new again.</p></htmltext>
<tokenext>Maybe they 're trying to send you guys a not-so-subtle message that maybe your business casual is a bit too casual ? You are forgetting the asshat factor .
There are just asshats out there who look to 'fix things' .
They see an opportunity to make someone * ELSE * do something and they get to look good suggesting it .
From the description I would bet MONEY that this is the case .
Make * THEM * personally wear the same uniform and pay for it out of pocket like the IT guys and suddenly it will not be such a good idea.Someone should stand up and say 'ok maybe our atire is a bit out of line ( ?
) we will clean it up .
However , I think mandating uniforms is a bit far unless you are willing to institute this across the compnay .
You would be discriminating against us .
' Bring up the D word and suddenly HR is involved and it becomes an 'ugly ' thing.It is amazing the number of 'old outdated ' ideas I have seen re-rise to the top of the pile now that the 'economy is bad' .
Everyone seems to be listening to the worst of the stupidest ideas from old management ideas and calling them new again .</tokentext>
<sentencetext>Maybe they're trying to send you guys a not-so-subtle message that maybe your business casual is a bit too casual?You are forgetting the asshat factor.
There are just asshats out there who look to 'fix things'.
They see an opportunity to make someone *ELSE* do something and they get to look good suggesting it.
From the description I would bet MONEY that this is the case.
Make *THEM* personally wear the same uniform and pay for it out of pocket like the IT guys and suddenly it will not be such a good idea.Someone should stand up and say 'ok maybe our atire is a bit out of line(?
) we will clean it up.
However, I think mandating uniforms is a bit far unless you are willing to institute this across the compnay.
You would be discriminating against us.
'  Bring up the D word and suddenly HR is involved and it becomes an 'ugly' thing.It is amazing the number of 'old outdated' ideas I have seen re-rise to the top of the pile now that the 'economy is bad'.
Everyone seems to be listening to the worst of the stupidest ideas from old management ideas and calling them new again.</sentencetext>
	<parent>http://www.semanticweb.org/ontologies/ConversationInstances.owl#comment09_12_29_2129221.30587120</parent>
</comment>
<comment>
	<id>http://www.semanticweb.org/ontologies/ConversationInstances.owl#comment09_12_29_2129221.30588696</id>
	<title>Re:I like uniforms</title>
	<author>countertrolling</author>
	<datestamp>1262090760000</datestamp>
	<modclass>None</modclass>
	<modscore>1</modscore>
	<htmltext><p><i>...maybe your business casual is a bit too casual?</i></p><p>What do you have against boxers and tank top? Personally, at the right price, I wear whatever they tell me. It's all acting. If the uniform is provided, that much better.</p></htmltext>
<tokenext>...maybe your business casual is a bit too casual ? What do you have against boxers and tank top ?
Personally , at the right price , I wear whatever they tell me .
It 's all acting .
If the uniform is provided , that much better .</tokentext>
<sentencetext>...maybe your business casual is a bit too casual?What do you have against boxers and tank top?
Personally, at the right price, I wear whatever they tell me.
It's all acting.
If the uniform is provided, that much better.</sentencetext>
	<parent>http://www.semanticweb.org/ontologies/ConversationInstances.owl#comment09_12_29_2129221.30587120</parent>
</comment>
<comment>
	<id>http://www.semanticweb.org/ontologies/ConversationInstances.owl#comment09_12_29_2129221.30590168</id>
	<title>armbands?</title>
	<author>Aurisor</author>
	<datestamp>1262103420000</datestamp>
	<modclass>Funny</modclass>
	<modscore>3</modscore>
	<htmltext><p>You might want to float the idea of having armbands.  They're unobtrusive, sharp, and have been shown in the past to foster a sense of shared identity.</p><p>Might want to give a little thought to putting a logo of some sort on it too...maybe one of those Indian good luck symbols...you know, something simple that looks good in black and white.</p></htmltext>
<tokenext>You might want to float the idea of having armbands .
They 're unobtrusive , sharp , and have been shown in the past to foster a sense of shared identity.Might want to give a little thought to putting a logo of some sort on it too...maybe one of those Indian good luck symbols...you know , something simple that looks good in black and white .</tokentext>
<sentencetext>You might want to float the idea of having armbands.
They're unobtrusive, sharp, and have been shown in the past to foster a sense of shared identity.Might want to give a little thought to putting a logo of some sort on it too...maybe one of those Indian good luck symbols...you know, something simple that looks good in black and white.</sentencetext>
</comment>
<comment>
	<id>http://www.semanticweb.org/ontologies/ConversationInstances.owl#comment09_12_29_2129221.30588440</id>
	<title>Its akin to a Wizard robe.</title>
	<author>unity100</author>
	<datestamp>1262089440000</datestamp>
	<modclass>None</modclass>
	<modscore>1</modscore>
	<htmltext><p>with all the advantages and disadvantages. people will see you like a wizard and respect you for that, but they will also think you are from some secluded, hard to understand, even sometimes scary group of people.</p></htmltext>
<tokenext>with all the advantages and disadvantages .
people will see you like a wizard and respect you for that , but they will also think you are from some secluded , hard to understand , even sometimes scary group of people .</tokentext>
<sentencetext>with all the advantages and disadvantages.
people will see you like a wizard and respect you for that, but they will also think you are from some secluded, hard to understand, even sometimes scary group of people.</sentencetext>
</comment>
<comment>
	<id>http://www.semanticweb.org/ontologies/ConversationInstances.owl#comment09_12_29_2129221.30589046</id>
	<title>Your lucky we have to wear uncomfortable tie's</title>
	<author>Anonymous</author>
	<datestamp>1262092920000</datestamp>
	<modclass>None</modclass>
	<modscore>0</modscore>
	<htmltext><p>Your lucky I wouldn't mind having a branded IT shirt for all to wear.  We have to wear a tie and its a pain working on things with a tie around your next and so uncomfortable.  But they won't budge from this!!</p></htmltext>
<tokenext>Your lucky I would n't mind having a branded IT shirt for all to wear .
We have to wear a tie and its a pain working on things with a tie around your next and so uncomfortable .
But they wo n't budge from this !
!</tokentext>
<sentencetext>Your lucky I wouldn't mind having a branded IT shirt for all to wear.
We have to wear a tie and its a pain working on things with a tie around your next and so uncomfortable.
But they won't budge from this!
!</sentencetext>
</comment>
<comment>
	<id>http://www.semanticweb.org/ontologies/ConversationInstances.owl#comment09_12_29_2129221.30611050</id>
	<title>Re:lovely</title>
	<author>Icarium</author>
	<datestamp>1262263860000</datestamp>
	<modclass>None</modclass>
	<modscore>1</modscore>
	<htmltext><p>What are these "users" you refer to?</p><p>I don't know about status, but being in a position where none of your 10000 users are allowed to contact you is good. When the 20 odd first line support staff that they report issues to aren't allowed to contact you either, it's great. When even your direct co workers have to go through your line manager (who quite understands if you're too busy to assist mere mortals) to speak to you, it's heaven. Having a praise wall dedicated to you is a bit creepy though.</p></htmltext>
<tokenext>What are these " users " you refer to ? I do n't know about status , but being in a position where none of your 10000 users are allowed to contact you is good .
When the 20 odd first line support staff that they report issues to are n't allowed to contact you either , it 's great .
When even your direct co workers have to go through your line manager ( who quite understands if you 're too busy to assist mere mortals ) to speak to you , it 's heaven .
Having a praise wall dedicated to you is a bit creepy though .</tokentext>
<sentencetext>What are these "users" you refer to?I don't know about status, but being in a position where none of your 10000 users are allowed to contact you is good.
When the 20 odd first line support staff that they report issues to aren't allowed to contact you either, it's great.
When even your direct co workers have to go through your line manager (who quite understands if you're too busy to assist mere mortals) to speak to you, it's heaven.
Having a praise wall dedicated to you is a bit creepy though.</sentencetext>
	<parent>http://www.semanticweb.org/ontologies/ConversationInstances.owl#comment09_12_29_2129221.30588142</parent>
</comment>
<comment>
	<id>http://www.semanticweb.org/ontologies/ConversationInstances.owl#comment09_12_29_2129221.30587138</id>
	<title>Nothing wrong with the idea</title>
	<author>Petersko</author>
	<datestamp>1262084160000</datestamp>
	<modclass>Insightful</modclass>
	<modscore>5</modscore>
	<htmltext>If you're like most companies that are trying to keep a "helpdesk-centric" model going, your group is the forward face of IT, and the contact point. Help desks aren't about strong individuality - they're about consistency/uniformity of service. I don't see why the idea couldn't be extended to wearing branded shirts.<br> <br>

When your skills outgrow the help desk - and they should - consider losing the uniform as a perk of advancement.</htmltext>
<tokenext>If you 're like most companies that are trying to keep a " helpdesk-centric " model going , your group is the forward face of IT , and the contact point .
Help desks are n't about strong individuality - they 're about consistency/uniformity of service .
I do n't see why the idea could n't be extended to wearing branded shirts .
When your skills outgrow the help desk - and they should - consider losing the uniform as a perk of advancement .</tokentext>
<sentencetext>If you're like most companies that are trying to keep a "helpdesk-centric" model going, your group is the forward face of IT, and the contact point.
Help desks aren't about strong individuality - they're about consistency/uniformity of service.
I don't see why the idea couldn't be extended to wearing branded shirts.
When your skills outgrow the help desk - and they should - consider losing the uniform as a perk of advancement.</sentencetext>
</comment>
<comment>
	<id>http://www.semanticweb.org/ontologies/ConversationInstances.owl#comment09_12_29_2129221.30587524</id>
	<title>sounds like an opportunity...</title>
	<author>almondo</author>
	<datestamp>1262085420000</datestamp>
	<modclass>None</modclass>
	<modscore>1</modscore>
	<htmltext><p>Heh, I would view it as an opportunity to fail to comply with management.   Historically I have always been on the lookout for such opportunities.  I still remember the cool bit of code some joker wrote...first it displayed "Press any key to begin formatting C:", then it waited about 5 seconds, after which it displayed  "Just kidding...Formatting...n/n/n" and it cycled through some fake head numbers while making a nice ominous clicking sound through the speaker.  I think it would make a comeback if somebody ordered me to wear an IT droid shirt.</p></htmltext>
<tokenext>Heh , I would view it as an opportunity to fail to comply with management .
Historically I have always been on the lookout for such opportunities .
I still remember the cool bit of code some joker wrote...first it displayed " Press any key to begin formatting C : " , then it waited about 5 seconds , after which it displayed " Just kidding...Formatting...n/n/n " and it cycled through some fake head numbers while making a nice ominous clicking sound through the speaker .
I think it would make a comeback if somebody ordered me to wear an IT droid shirt .</tokentext>
<sentencetext>Heh, I would view it as an opportunity to fail to comply with management.
Historically I have always been on the lookout for such opportunities.
I still remember the cool bit of code some joker wrote...first it displayed "Press any key to begin formatting C:", then it waited about 5 seconds, after which it displayed  "Just kidding...Formatting...n/n/n" and it cycled through some fake head numbers while making a nice ominous clicking sound through the speaker.
I think it would make a comeback if somebody ordered me to wear an IT droid shirt.</sentencetext>
</comment>
<comment>
	<id>http://www.semanticweb.org/ontologies/ConversationInstances.owl#comment09_12_29_2129221.30591994</id>
	<title>Why is everyone against it?</title>
	<author>djjockey</author>
	<datestamp>1259843700000</datestamp>
	<modclass>None</modclass>
	<modscore>1</modscore>
	<htmltext><p>It seems that nearly every reply is against this idea. I'm not really sure why. It seems that the business rules are "business casual", and either it is too broad and people interpret how they want, or the manager might just be genuinely trying to build a feeling of team. Yep, good managers do exist.</p><p>I manage a small customer service team in a large (500+) business. We rarely see external customers face to face. But recently, they asked for one small thing.... yep... a uniform. To be accurate, it was business clothes, shirts, vests etc with the company logo, but they were all matching. Sure it's optional, and they don't wear it all the time, but that one small thing did make them feel more like a team and they took pride in wearing the company's logo.</p><p>Interestingly, there is one other team that has the closest thing to the uniform - the IT team. Typically they wear business attire, but often it includes an embroidered shirt proclaiming that they are in the IT team. We all know who they are and what they do, but that doesn't stop them.</p><p>Maybe the difference is that these examples are optional. But even if it was compulsory it might not be all that bad.</p></htmltext>
<tokenext>It seems that nearly every reply is against this idea .
I 'm not really sure why .
It seems that the business rules are " business casual " , and either it is too broad and people interpret how they want , or the manager might just be genuinely trying to build a feeling of team .
Yep , good managers do exist.I manage a small customer service team in a large ( 500 + ) business .
We rarely see external customers face to face .
But recently , they asked for one small thing.... yep... a uniform .
To be accurate , it was business clothes , shirts , vests etc with the company logo , but they were all matching .
Sure it 's optional , and they do n't wear it all the time , but that one small thing did make them feel more like a team and they took pride in wearing the company 's logo.Interestingly , there is one other team that has the closest thing to the uniform - the IT team .
Typically they wear business attire , but often it includes an embroidered shirt proclaiming that they are in the IT team .
We all know who they are and what they do , but that does n't stop them.Maybe the difference is that these examples are optional .
But even if it was compulsory it might not be all that bad .</tokentext>
<sentencetext>It seems that nearly every reply is against this idea.
I'm not really sure why.
It seems that the business rules are "business casual", and either it is too broad and people interpret how they want, or the manager might just be genuinely trying to build a feeling of team.
Yep, good managers do exist.I manage a small customer service team in a large (500+) business.
We rarely see external customers face to face.
But recently, they asked for one small thing.... yep... a uniform.
To be accurate, it was business clothes, shirts, vests etc with the company logo, but they were all matching.
Sure it's optional, and they don't wear it all the time, but that one small thing did make them feel more like a team and they took pride in wearing the company's logo.Interestingly, there is one other team that has the closest thing to the uniform - the IT team.
Typically they wear business attire, but often it includes an embroidered shirt proclaiming that they are in the IT team.
We all know who they are and what they do, but that doesn't stop them.Maybe the difference is that these examples are optional.
But even if it was compulsory it might not be all that bad.</sentencetext>
</comment>
<comment>
	<id>http://www.semanticweb.org/ontologies/ConversationInstances.owl#comment09_12_29_2129221.30590452</id>
	<title>Re:I like uniforms</title>
	<author>Anonymous</author>
	<datestamp>1262106660000</datestamp>
	<modclass>None</modclass>
	<modscore>0</modscore>
	<htmltext><p><div class="quote"><p>"Oh, and the reason I prefer not to wear a uniform is so I can express myself."</p><p>What are you, 13?</p></div><p>wasn't that obvious?</p></div>
	</htmltext>
<tokenext>" Oh , and the reason I prefer not to wear a uniform is so I can express myself .
" What are you , 13 ? was n't that obvious ?</tokentext>
<sentencetext>"Oh, and the reason I prefer not to wear a uniform is so I can express myself.
"What are you, 13?wasn't that obvious?
	</sentencetext>
	<parent>http://www.semanticweb.org/ontologies/ConversationInstances.owl#comment09_12_29_2129221.30587716</parent>
</comment>
<comment>
	<id>http://www.semanticweb.org/ontologies/ConversationInstances.owl#comment09_12_29_2129221.30587254</id>
	<title>Not surprising, but kinda unusual</title>
	<author>MobyDisk</author>
	<datestamp>1262084580000</datestamp>
	<modclass>None</modclass>
	<modscore>1</modscore>
	<htmltext><p>Branded uniforms are usually only applied to externally-facing positions.  It is unusual to wear a uniform if you only provide helpdesk services within the company.  But when I have had to do that, I didn't find it that stifling.  Especially if you have some say in the design.  But... it does seem like overkill.</p><p>Perhaps you can suggest an alternative - like a special pin or badge or pocket protector (jk about that last one).  That might make management happy without forcing entire uniforms.  With uniforms comes the usual complaints about who replaces them if they get torn or worn-out, and having to create a policy for it.  It is usually a headache for the company.</p></htmltext>
<tokenext>Branded uniforms are usually only applied to externally-facing positions .
It is unusual to wear a uniform if you only provide helpdesk services within the company .
But when I have had to do that , I did n't find it that stifling .
Especially if you have some say in the design .
But... it does seem like overkill.Perhaps you can suggest an alternative - like a special pin or badge or pocket protector ( jk about that last one ) .
That might make management happy without forcing entire uniforms .
With uniforms comes the usual complaints about who replaces them if they get torn or worn-out , and having to create a policy for it .
It is usually a headache for the company .</tokentext>
<sentencetext>Branded uniforms are usually only applied to externally-facing positions.
It is unusual to wear a uniform if you only provide helpdesk services within the company.
But when I have had to do that, I didn't find it that stifling.
Especially if you have some say in the design.
But... it does seem like overkill.Perhaps you can suggest an alternative - like a special pin or badge or pocket protector (jk about that last one).
That might make management happy without forcing entire uniforms.
With uniforms comes the usual complaints about who replaces them if they get torn or worn-out, and having to create a policy for it.
It is usually a headache for the company.</sentencetext>
</comment>
<comment>
	<id>http://www.semanticweb.org/ontologies/ConversationInstances.owl#comment09_12_29_2129221.30587450</id>
	<title>This is a Big Deal???</title>
	<author>rueger</author>
	<datestamp>1262085180000</datestamp>
	<modclass>Insightful</modclass>
	<modscore>2</modscore>
	<htmltext>My God. If your employer wants a uniform (or uniform appearance) you wear the shirt.  Who cares? They're paying your salary, so they call the shots.<br> <br>

In the grand scheme of workplace complaints this is so low on the list as to be not worth mentioning.</htmltext>
<tokenext>My God .
If your employer wants a uniform ( or uniform appearance ) you wear the shirt .
Who cares ?
They 're paying your salary , so they call the shots .
In the grand scheme of workplace complaints this is so low on the list as to be not worth mentioning .</tokentext>
<sentencetext>My God.
If your employer wants a uniform (or uniform appearance) you wear the shirt.
Who cares?
They're paying your salary, so they call the shots.
In the grand scheme of workplace complaints this is so low on the list as to be not worth mentioning.</sentencetext>
</comment>
<comment>
	<id>http://www.semanticweb.org/ontologies/ConversationInstances.owl#comment09_12_29_2129221.30591390</id>
	<title>Re:Uniforms can have value to the employee too!</title>
	<author>Mr. Lwanga</author>
	<datestamp>1259832420000</datestamp>
	<modclass>None</modclass>
	<modscore>1</modscore>
	<htmltext><p>"This can allow you the freedom to act in the ways the job requires, which may include being subservient to your customers", surely you must be trolling or have never worked in the lower levels of IT.</p><p>Meaningless management seminar psychobabble doesn't apply to the real world.</p></htmltext>
<tokenext>" This can allow you the freedom to act in the ways the job requires , which may include being subservient to your customers " , surely you must be trolling or have never worked in the lower levels of IT.Meaningless management seminar psychobabble does n't apply to the real world .</tokentext>
<sentencetext>"This can allow you the freedom to act in the ways the job requires, which may include being subservient to your customers", surely you must be trolling or have never worked in the lower levels of IT.Meaningless management seminar psychobabble doesn't apply to the real world.</sentencetext>
	<parent>http://www.semanticweb.org/ontologies/ConversationInstances.owl#comment09_12_29_2129221.30589276</parent>
</comment>
<comment>
	<id>http://www.semanticweb.org/ontologies/ConversationInstances.owl#comment09_12_29_2129221.30599824</id>
	<title>Re:I like uniforms</title>
	<author>qoncept</author>
	<datestamp>1259836260000</datestamp>
	<modclass>None</modclass>
	<modscore>1</modscore>
	<htmltext><p><div class="quote"><p>Grab a pair of pants, while I'm putting them on spot a shirt that doesn't clash, then reach left or right for shoes that "go."</p> </div><p><div class="quote"><p>Oh, and the reason I prefer not to wear a uniform is so I can express myself. My employer can't take away my individuality!</p> </div><p>Oh the irony! Or sarcasm.</p><p><div class="quote"><p>What are you, 13?</p></div><p>No.</p></div>
	</htmltext>
<tokenext>Grab a pair of pants , while I 'm putting them on spot a shirt that does n't clash , then reach left or right for shoes that " go .
" Oh , and the reason I prefer not to wear a uniform is so I can express myself .
My employer ca n't take away my individuality !
Oh the irony !
Or sarcasm.What are you , 13 ? No .</tokentext>
<sentencetext>Grab a pair of pants, while I'm putting them on spot a shirt that doesn't clash, then reach left or right for shoes that "go.
" Oh, and the reason I prefer not to wear a uniform is so I can express myself.
My employer can't take away my individuality!
Oh the irony!
Or sarcasm.What are you, 13?No.
	</sentencetext>
	<parent>http://www.semanticweb.org/ontologies/ConversationInstances.owl#comment09_12_29_2129221.30587716</parent>
</comment>
<comment>
	<id>http://www.semanticweb.org/ontologies/ConversationInstances.owl#comment09_12_29_2129221.30588004</id>
	<title>UNIFORMS SUCK. want respect from CEO? wear ties</title>
	<author>jsepeta</author>
	<datestamp>1262087220000</datestamp>
	<modclass>None</modclass>
	<modscore>1</modscore>
	<htmltext><p>wearing a uniform = no respect and lower paid jobs<br>wearing a tie = respect (deserved or not) and higher paid jobs</p></htmltext>
<tokenext>wearing a uniform = no respect and lower paid jobswearing a tie = respect ( deserved or not ) and higher paid jobs</tokentext>
<sentencetext>wearing a uniform = no respect and lower paid jobswearing a tie = respect (deserved or not) and higher paid jobs</sentencetext>
</comment>
<comment>
	<id>http://www.semanticweb.org/ontologies/ConversationInstances.owl#comment09_12_29_2129221.30594148</id>
	<title>I wore a uniform</title>
	<author>ccc31807</author>
	<datestamp>1259858340000</datestamp>
	<modclass>Insightful</modclass>
	<modscore>2</modscore>
	<htmltext>I wore a uniform for two years, consisting of a white shirt with the company logo and khaki trousers, and thought it was a good idea. My department was held in high regard as a result of the services it performed, and I gained instant credibility as a result of my visual identification with the department. Wasn't a help desk, but as an instructor in a technical college. Still, if the department is respected, the members will be as well.</htmltext>
<tokenext>I wore a uniform for two years , consisting of a white shirt with the company logo and khaki trousers , and thought it was a good idea .
My department was held in high regard as a result of the services it performed , and I gained instant credibility as a result of my visual identification with the department .
Was n't a help desk , but as an instructor in a technical college .
Still , if the department is respected , the members will be as well .</tokentext>
<sentencetext>I wore a uniform for two years, consisting of a white shirt with the company logo and khaki trousers, and thought it was a good idea.
My department was held in high regard as a result of the services it performed, and I gained instant credibility as a result of my visual identification with the department.
Wasn't a help desk, but as an instructor in a technical college.
Still, if the department is respected, the members will be as well.</sentencetext>
</comment>
<comment>
	<id>http://www.semanticweb.org/ontologies/ConversationInstances.owl#comment09_12_29_2129221.30590510</id>
	<title>2 words: mandatory neckbeards</title>
	<author>gig</author>
	<datestamp>1262107140000</datestamp>
	<modclass>None</modclass>
	<modscore>1</modscore>
	<htmltext><p>If you are deploying Windows then you made so many problems for your users that you deserve whatever they do to make your life miserable.</p><p>If not deploying Windows, then being available by phone, email, and physical help desk should be plenty. I manage to find the Genius Bar once every 3 years when I need I-T help. I know the Apple employees are wearing colorful T-shirts but the way I tell who I'm meeting with is who is behind the big bar at the time of my appointment.</p><p>Apple just open sourced "Concierge", their app for users to make appointments for I-T help. Maybe that kind of thing on your Intranet would be helpful. If a user can make an appointment in a Web browser (on their phone if their PC is down and vice versa) then they feel like they're in control, they know someone is coming at 11:00 or they have to go to the help desk at 11:00 and someone will be there to meet them. If you tell them "soon" then they feel like they're not in control and you'll never get there and they have to go looking for you.</p></htmltext>
<tokenext>If you are deploying Windows then you made so many problems for your users that you deserve whatever they do to make your life miserable.If not deploying Windows , then being available by phone , email , and physical help desk should be plenty .
I manage to find the Genius Bar once every 3 years when I need I-T help .
I know the Apple employees are wearing colorful T-shirts but the way I tell who I 'm meeting with is who is behind the big bar at the time of my appointment.Apple just open sourced " Concierge " , their app for users to make appointments for I-T help .
Maybe that kind of thing on your Intranet would be helpful .
If a user can make an appointment in a Web browser ( on their phone if their PC is down and vice versa ) then they feel like they 're in control , they know someone is coming at 11 : 00 or they have to go to the help desk at 11 : 00 and someone will be there to meet them .
If you tell them " soon " then they feel like they 're not in control and you 'll never get there and they have to go looking for you .</tokentext>
<sentencetext>If you are deploying Windows then you made so many problems for your users that you deserve whatever they do to make your life miserable.If not deploying Windows, then being available by phone, email, and physical help desk should be plenty.
I manage to find the Genius Bar once every 3 years when I need I-T help.
I know the Apple employees are wearing colorful T-shirts but the way I tell who I'm meeting with is who is behind the big bar at the time of my appointment.Apple just open sourced "Concierge", their app for users to make appointments for I-T help.
Maybe that kind of thing on your Intranet would be helpful.
If a user can make an appointment in a Web browser (on their phone if their PC is down and vice versa) then they feel like they're in control, they know someone is coming at 11:00 or they have to go to the help desk at 11:00 and someone will be there to meet them.
If you tell them "soon" then they feel like they're not in control and you'll never get there and they have to go looking for you.</sentencetext>
</comment>
<comment>
	<id>http://www.semanticweb.org/ontologies/ConversationInstances.owl#comment09_12_29_2129221.30588546</id>
	<title>Re:Well...</title>
	<author>tgrigsby</author>
	<datestamp>1262089920000</datestamp>
	<modclass>Insightful</modclass>
	<modscore>2</modscore>
	<htmltext><p>Time out...</p><p>You design and maintain hundreds of databases, write apps, manage projects, maintain servers and hardware devices... and you only charge $40k a year.</p><p>Dude.  You're SO doing it wrong.  Your paycheck is an epic fail.  What country are you living in?</p></htmltext>
<tokenext>Time out...You design and maintain hundreds of databases , write apps , manage projects , maintain servers and hardware devices... and you only charge $ 40k a year.Dude .
You 're SO doing it wrong .
Your paycheck is an epic fail .
What country are you living in ?</tokentext>
<sentencetext>Time out...You design and maintain hundreds of databases, write apps, manage projects, maintain servers and hardware devices... and you only charge $40k a year.Dude.
You're SO doing it wrong.
Your paycheck is an epic fail.
What country are you living in?</sentencetext>
	<parent>http://www.semanticweb.org/ontologies/ConversationInstances.owl#comment09_12_29_2129221.30587462</parent>
</comment>
<comment>
	<id>http://www.semanticweb.org/ontologies/ConversationInstances.owl#comment09_12_29_2129221.30587342</id>
	<title>Re:Professionalism</title>
	<author>Anonymous</author>
	<datestamp>1262084820000</datestamp>
	<modclass>None</modclass>
	<modscore>1</modscore>
	<htmltext>The right image will enhance your treatment by others. I remember working with casually dressed telecom workers while my employer required a dress shirt and tie. It was interesting to see how much I was respected. The telecom workers were not treated with the same level of respect. Ever since that time, I always make sure my image represents my value as a business asset.</htmltext>
<tokenext>The right image will enhance your treatment by others .
I remember working with casually dressed telecom workers while my employer required a dress shirt and tie .
It was interesting to see how much I was respected .
The telecom workers were not treated with the same level of respect .
Ever since that time , I always make sure my image represents my value as a business asset .</tokentext>
<sentencetext>The right image will enhance your treatment by others.
I remember working with casually dressed telecom workers while my employer required a dress shirt and tie.
It was interesting to see how much I was respected.
The telecom workers were not treated with the same level of respect.
Ever since that time, I always make sure my image represents my value as a business asset.</sentencetext>
	<parent>http://www.semanticweb.org/ontologies/ConversationInstances.owl#comment09_12_29_2129221.30587096</parent>
</comment>
<comment>
	<id>http://www.semanticweb.org/ontologies/ConversationInstances.owl#comment09_12_29_2129221.30588688</id>
	<title>Re:Well...</title>
	<author>Anonymous</author>
	<datestamp>1262090760000</datestamp>
	<modclass>None</modclass>
	<modscore>0</modscore>
	<htmltext><p>You may give me your job. Problem solved.</p></htmltext>
<tokenext>You may give me your job .
Problem solved .</tokentext>
<sentencetext>You may give me your job.
Problem solved.</sentencetext>
	<parent>http://www.semanticweb.org/ontologies/ConversationInstances.owl#comment09_12_29_2129221.30587462</parent>
</comment>
<comment>
	<id>http://www.semanticweb.org/ontologies/ConversationInstances.owl#comment09_12_29_2129221.30593402</id>
	<title>Get your boss to wear them too</title>
	<author>samspock</author>
	<datestamp>1259855760000</datestamp>
	<modclass>Insightful</modclass>
	<modscore>2</modscore>
	<htmltext>I worked for a Mortgage company that had five front line IT people including my boss. He suggested that we get navy blue polo shirts for us with the company logo. They were nice ones (should have been dry cleaned but I am cheap) and even he wore one 4 days a week (he was the junior partner in the company.) I did not mind them since it also meant I did not have to figure out what to wear or buy work shirts. Even the sales types wanted them. The only complaint I had about them was that they did not get long sleeve ones for the winter.

If it is done right it can work. Suggest that the head of the department get them as well.</htmltext>
<tokenext>I worked for a Mortgage company that had five front line IT people including my boss .
He suggested that we get navy blue polo shirts for us with the company logo .
They were nice ones ( should have been dry cleaned but I am cheap ) and even he wore one 4 days a week ( he was the junior partner in the company .
) I did not mind them since it also meant I did not have to figure out what to wear or buy work shirts .
Even the sales types wanted them .
The only complaint I had about them was that they did not get long sleeve ones for the winter .
If it is done right it can work .
Suggest that the head of the department get them as well .</tokentext>
<sentencetext>I worked for a Mortgage company that had five front line IT people including my boss.
He suggested that we get navy blue polo shirts for us with the company logo.
They were nice ones (should have been dry cleaned but I am cheap) and even he wore one 4 days a week (he was the junior partner in the company.
) I did not mind them since it also meant I did not have to figure out what to wear or buy work shirts.
Even the sales types wanted them.
The only complaint I had about them was that they did not get long sleeve ones for the winter.
If it is done right it can work.
Suggest that the head of the department get them as well.</sentencetext>
</comment>
<comment>
	<id>http://www.semanticweb.org/ontologies/ConversationInstances.owl#comment09_12_29_2129221.30590740</id>
	<title>Uniforms are great and Business Casual needs to be</title>
	<author>Anonymous</author>
	<datestamp>1262109840000</datestamp>
	<modclass>None</modclass>
	<modscore>1</modscore>
	<htmltext><p>better outlined and enforced.</p><p>My idea of business casual is NOT EVEN CLOSE to what is permitted.</p><p>AND NO "casual Fridays."</p><p>The NO list:</p><p>NO THONGS (These are shoes for you whippersnappers!)/Sandals/Flip Flops! ! ! This is NOT THE !$@!Y$\%!@^$!\% BEACH!<br>NO DEMIM EVER PERIOD!</p><p>Women: NO PANTS, EVER! Skirts and Dresses ONLY!<br>
&nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; NO BARE LEGS! You need to learn the words: TIGHTS, STOCKINGS, PANTYHOSE.</p><p>I work in a field which for 90\% of the employees a UNIFORM is required. I have the option, to wear the uniform or PROPER BUSINESS APPAREL. 95\% of the time I wear the uniform, The remaining 5\% is dress shirt, dress pants, tie, dress shoes. I keep a co-ordinating suit jacket at the ready if I need it. This is FAR ABOVE "PROPER BUSINESS APPAREL" for my agency. As management I need to set the bar, others need to live up to. What is "acceptable" to the agency is far more generous. I make it clear when new hires start what is considered acceptable in the department and what the agency "lax'ly permits."</p><p>Why? The uniform is provided to me, free, no cost,none. This includes dry cleaning. Its simple, closet of shirts, closet of pants, all the same. Pick one of each. DONE!</p><p>Embrace the uniform! Make getting ready for work easier.</p></htmltext>
<tokenext>better outlined and enforced.My idea of business casual is NOT EVEN CLOSE to what is permitted.AND NO " casual Fridays .
" The NO list : NO THONGS ( These are shoes for you whippersnappers !
) /Sandals/Flip Flops !
! !
This is NOT THE ! $ @ ! Y $ \ % !
@ ^ $ ! \ % BEACH ! NO DEMIM EVER PERIOD ! Women : NO PANTS , EVER !
Skirts and Dresses ONLY !
              NO BARE LEGS !
You need to learn the words : TIGHTS , STOCKINGS , PANTYHOSE.I work in a field which for 90 \ % of the employees a UNIFORM is required .
I have the option , to wear the uniform or PROPER BUSINESS APPAREL .
95 \ % of the time I wear the uniform , The remaining 5 \ % is dress shirt , dress pants , tie , dress shoes .
I keep a co-ordinating suit jacket at the ready if I need it .
This is FAR ABOVE " PROPER BUSINESS APPAREL " for my agency .
As management I need to set the bar , others need to live up to .
What is " acceptable " to the agency is far more generous .
I make it clear when new hires start what is considered acceptable in the department and what the agency " lax'ly permits. " Why ?
The uniform is provided to me , free , no cost,none .
This includes dry cleaning .
Its simple , closet of shirts , closet of pants , all the same .
Pick one of each .
DONE ! Embrace the uniform !
Make getting ready for work easier .</tokentext>
<sentencetext>better outlined and enforced.My idea of business casual is NOT EVEN CLOSE to what is permitted.AND NO "casual Fridays.
"The NO list:NO THONGS (These are shoes for you whippersnappers!
)/Sandals/Flip Flops!
! !
This is NOT THE !$@!Y$\%!
@^$!\% BEACH!NO DEMIM EVER PERIOD!Women: NO PANTS, EVER!
Skirts and Dresses ONLY!
              NO BARE LEGS!
You need to learn the words: TIGHTS, STOCKINGS, PANTYHOSE.I work in a field which for 90\% of the employees a UNIFORM is required.
I have the option, to wear the uniform or PROPER BUSINESS APPAREL.
95\% of the time I wear the uniform, The remaining 5\% is dress shirt, dress pants, tie, dress shoes.
I keep a co-ordinating suit jacket at the ready if I need it.
This is FAR ABOVE "PROPER BUSINESS APPAREL" for my agency.
As management I need to set the bar, others need to live up to.
What is "acceptable" to the agency is far more generous.
I make it clear when new hires start what is considered acceptable in the department and what the agency "lax'ly permits."Why?
The uniform is provided to me, free, no cost,none.
This includes dry cleaning.
Its simple, closet of shirts, closet of pants, all the same.
Pick one of each.
DONE!Embrace the uniform!
Make getting ready for work easier.</sentencetext>
</comment>
<comment>
	<id>http://www.semanticweb.org/ontologies/ConversationInstances.owl#comment09_12_29_2129221.30588776</id>
	<title>Re:Are you colleagues or janitors?</title>
	<author>countertrolling</author>
	<datestamp>1262091120000</datestamp>
	<modclass>None</modclass>
	<modscore>1</modscore>
	<htmltext><p><i>...colleagues or janitors?</i></p><p>I am a robot. The content of my job means nothing. It's the quality that counts. Ultimately I always set the conditions. So does everybody else. We all do what we consider "acceptable".</p></htmltext>
<tokenext>...colleagues or janitors ? I am a robot .
The content of my job means nothing .
It 's the quality that counts .
Ultimately I always set the conditions .
So does everybody else .
We all do what we consider " acceptable " .</tokentext>
<sentencetext>...colleagues or janitors?I am a robot.
The content of my job means nothing.
It's the quality that counts.
Ultimately I always set the conditions.
So does everybody else.
We all do what we consider "acceptable".</sentencetext>
	<parent>http://www.semanticweb.org/ontologies/ConversationInstances.owl#comment09_12_29_2129221.30587244</parent>
</comment>
<comment>
	<id>http://www.semanticweb.org/ontologies/ConversationInstances.owl#comment09_12_29_2129221.30587104</id>
	<title>YMCA!</title>
	<author>John Utah</author>
	<datestamp>1262084040000</datestamp>
	<modclass>None</modclass>
	<modscore>1</modscore>
	<htmltext>I would be upset.</htmltext>
<tokenext>I would be upset .</tokentext>
<sentencetext>I would be upset.</sentencetext>
</comment>
<comment>
	<id>http://www.semanticweb.org/ontologies/ConversationInstances.owl#comment09_12_29_2129221.30590096</id>
	<title>Re:30 IT people in a 500 employee company?!</title>
	<author>Anonymous</author>
	<datestamp>1262102640000</datestamp>
	<modclass>None</modclass>
	<modscore>0</modscore>
	<htmltext><p>Your company must have a decent SSO with an automated password reset system, then.  It would take at least 2 dedicated people just to reset all the passwords daily in a company of 500.</p><p>If your helpdesk guys aren't getting paid very well, they'd probably love the idea, *if* the shirts are free, and there are different styles and colors.  Don't make everyone where the same style shirt.  Some people love polo shirts, others hate them.  Some people love button-ups, others do not.</p><p>If you want it to be even more popular, pay for their dry cleaning.</p></htmltext>
<tokenext>Your company must have a decent SSO with an automated password reset system , then .
It would take at least 2 dedicated people just to reset all the passwords daily in a company of 500.If your helpdesk guys are n't getting paid very well , they 'd probably love the idea , * if * the shirts are free , and there are different styles and colors .
Do n't make everyone where the same style shirt .
Some people love polo shirts , others hate them .
Some people love button-ups , others do not.If you want it to be even more popular , pay for their dry cleaning .</tokentext>
<sentencetext>Your company must have a decent SSO with an automated password reset system, then.
It would take at least 2 dedicated people just to reset all the passwords daily in a company of 500.If your helpdesk guys aren't getting paid very well, they'd probably love the idea, *if* the shirts are free, and there are different styles and colors.
Don't make everyone where the same style shirt.
Some people love polo shirts, others hate them.
Some people love button-ups, others do not.If you want it to be even more popular, pay for their dry cleaning.</sentencetext>
	<parent>http://www.semanticweb.org/ontologies/ConversationInstances.owl#comment09_12_29_2129221.30587272</parent>
</comment>
<comment>
	<id>http://www.semanticweb.org/ontologies/ConversationInstances.owl#comment09_12_29_2129221.30587154</id>
	<title>I don't know</title>
	<author>Anonymous</author>
	<datestamp>1262084220000</datestamp>
	<modclass>None</modclass>
	<modscore>0</modscore>
	<htmltext><p>It seems a bit odd for doing it with "Just 6 guys", but it doesn't strike me as an outright bad idea. These are the dispatch folks, I assume, who get sent on the floor to deal with customers?</p><p>There are a lot of pro, feel-good type reasons why this could be a good idea, but if you're convinced its a step from asking "do you want fries with that?", you're not likely to be persuaded the benefits.</p><p>Is the company paying for the shirts?</p></htmltext>
<tokenext>It seems a bit odd for doing it with " Just 6 guys " , but it does n't strike me as an outright bad idea .
These are the dispatch folks , I assume , who get sent on the floor to deal with customers ? There are a lot of pro , feel-good type reasons why this could be a good idea , but if you 're convinced its a step from asking " do you want fries with that ?
" , you 're not likely to be persuaded the benefits.Is the company paying for the shirts ?</tokentext>
<sentencetext>It seems a bit odd for doing it with "Just 6 guys", but it doesn't strike me as an outright bad idea.
These are the dispatch folks, I assume, who get sent on the floor to deal with customers?There are a lot of pro, feel-good type reasons why this could be a good idea, but if you're convinced its a step from asking "do you want fries with that?
", you're not likely to be persuaded the benefits.Is the company paying for the shirts?</sentencetext>
</comment>
<comment>
	<id>http://www.semanticweb.org/ontologies/ConversationInstances.owl#comment09_12_29_2129221.30589842</id>
	<title>another example of "IT guy" contempt</title>
	<author>CAIMLAS</author>
	<datestamp>1262100060000</datestamp>
	<modclass>None</modclass>
	<modscore>1</modscore>
	<htmltext><p>To me, this just smacks of general disdain for "computer people". It's a subtle insult and an effort at class differentiation.</p><p>Do your building maintenance or janitorial workers have to wear such things?</p><p>The only way I'd say this is even remotely acceptable is if:</p><p>a) you work in a hospital environment where many of the other workers are wearing smocks or similar over their clothes.<br>b) the shirts are partially subsidized by the company and/or inexpensive<br>c) There is an actual reason for the uniforms aside from some managerial BS. IE, you do a lot of crawling around on the ground and get dirty throughout the day, and having a clean shirt bin to clean into to keep you presentable is necessary.</p><p>As a whole, it's a stupid idea. It decreases morale, especially in a decidedly 'independent' field like IT (even if it's just helpdesk).</p><p>Now, if the uniforms are being pushed down your throats because your 'independently minded' help desk has a repeated reputation for not dressing to 'business casual' (as i'm sure is the case with many IT types), that's another story. But then, that's also the issue which needs to be addressed - not making another, special-case rule for a certain segment of people.</p></htmltext>
<tokenext>To me , this just smacks of general disdain for " computer people " .
It 's a subtle insult and an effort at class differentiation.Do your building maintenance or janitorial workers have to wear such things ? The only way I 'd say this is even remotely acceptable is if : a ) you work in a hospital environment where many of the other workers are wearing smocks or similar over their clothes.b ) the shirts are partially subsidized by the company and/or inexpensivec ) There is an actual reason for the uniforms aside from some managerial BS .
IE , you do a lot of crawling around on the ground and get dirty throughout the day , and having a clean shirt bin to clean into to keep you presentable is necessary.As a whole , it 's a stupid idea .
It decreases morale , especially in a decidedly 'independent ' field like IT ( even if it 's just helpdesk ) .Now , if the uniforms are being pushed down your throats because your 'independently minded ' help desk has a repeated reputation for not dressing to 'business casual ' ( as i 'm sure is the case with many IT types ) , that 's another story .
But then , that 's also the issue which needs to be addressed - not making another , special-case rule for a certain segment of people .</tokentext>
<sentencetext>To me, this just smacks of general disdain for "computer people".
It's a subtle insult and an effort at class differentiation.Do your building maintenance or janitorial workers have to wear such things?The only way I'd say this is even remotely acceptable is if:a) you work in a hospital environment where many of the other workers are wearing smocks or similar over their clothes.b) the shirts are partially subsidized by the company and/or inexpensivec) There is an actual reason for the uniforms aside from some managerial BS.
IE, you do a lot of crawling around on the ground and get dirty throughout the day, and having a clean shirt bin to clean into to keep you presentable is necessary.As a whole, it's a stupid idea.
It decreases morale, especially in a decidedly 'independent' field like IT (even if it's just helpdesk).Now, if the uniforms are being pushed down your throats because your 'independently minded' help desk has a repeated reputation for not dressing to 'business casual' (as i'm sure is the case with many IT types), that's another story.
But then, that's also the issue which needs to be addressed - not making another, special-case rule for a certain segment of people.</sentencetext>
</comment>
<comment>
	<id>http://www.semanticweb.org/ontologies/ConversationInstances.owl#comment09_12_29_2129221.30587540</id>
	<title>Not just fast food</title>
	<author>roc97007</author>
	<datestamp>1262085480000</datestamp>
	<modclass>Informativ</modclass>
	<modscore>2</modscore>
	<htmltext><p>
When I worked in technical marketing, making low six figures, we wore polo shirts provided by the company that had the product names for which one was responsible stitched above the pocket.  If your area of responsibility included several products, you could end up with a closet full of free polo shirts.  I wouldn't consider that "fast food-ish".  Of course, they were nice, cotton shirts that fit well.  I would perhaps feel different if they were 100\% polyester or vinyl one-size-fits-all monstrosities like I had to wear as a busboy in college.</p></htmltext>
<tokenext>When I worked in technical marketing , making low six figures , we wore polo shirts provided by the company that had the product names for which one was responsible stitched above the pocket .
If your area of responsibility included several products , you could end up with a closet full of free polo shirts .
I would n't consider that " fast food-ish " .
Of course , they were nice , cotton shirts that fit well .
I would perhaps feel different if they were 100 \ % polyester or vinyl one-size-fits-all monstrosities like I had to wear as a busboy in college .</tokentext>
<sentencetext>
When I worked in technical marketing, making low six figures, we wore polo shirts provided by the company that had the product names for which one was responsible stitched above the pocket.
If your area of responsibility included several products, you could end up with a closet full of free polo shirts.
I wouldn't consider that "fast food-ish".
Of course, they were nice, cotton shirts that fit well.
I would perhaps feel different if they were 100\% polyester or vinyl one-size-fits-all monstrosities like I had to wear as a busboy in college.</sentencetext>
</comment>
<comment>
	<id>http://www.semanticweb.org/ontologies/ConversationInstances.owl#comment09_12_29_2129221.30588838</id>
	<title>Re:Well...</title>
	<author>Anonymous</author>
	<datestamp>1262091600000</datestamp>
	<modclass>None</modclass>
	<modscore>0</modscore>
	<htmltext><p>Man you are seriously getting raped. I just got a job at a defense contractor as a Software Engineer with a starting salary of $65k/year.<nobr> <wbr></nobr>:s</p></htmltext>
<tokenext>Man you are seriously getting raped .
I just got a job at a defense contractor as a Software Engineer with a starting salary of $ 65k/year .
: s</tokentext>
<sentencetext>Man you are seriously getting raped.
I just got a job at a defense contractor as a Software Engineer with a starting salary of $65k/year.
:s</sentencetext>
	<parent>http://www.semanticweb.org/ontologies/ConversationInstances.owl#comment09_12_29_2129221.30587462</parent>
</comment>
<comment>
	<id>http://www.semanticweb.org/ontologies/ConversationInstances.owl#comment09_12_29_2129221.30588102</id>
	<title>Re:Nothing wrong with the idea</title>
	<author>pileated</author>
	<datestamp>1262087640000</datestamp>
	<modclass>None</modclass>
	<modscore>1</modscore>
	<htmltext><p>Sounds like management-speak. Confusing show and substance. If the Help Desk does its job no one cares about forward face or point of contact. They know the job gets done. That's substance. Uniforms are show, and degrading show at that. But maybe if you have really stupid clients they'll confuse the show of uniforms with the substance of solving the problem. I doubt it though. Clients do know when they're getting show not substance.</p><p>This is one of the most pitiful things I've yet seen in IT.</p></htmltext>
<tokenext>Sounds like management-speak .
Confusing show and substance .
If the Help Desk does its job no one cares about forward face or point of contact .
They know the job gets done .
That 's substance .
Uniforms are show , and degrading show at that .
But maybe if you have really stupid clients they 'll confuse the show of uniforms with the substance of solving the problem .
I doubt it though .
Clients do know when they 're getting show not substance.This is one of the most pitiful things I 've yet seen in IT .</tokentext>
<sentencetext>Sounds like management-speak.
Confusing show and substance.
If the Help Desk does its job no one cares about forward face or point of contact.
They know the job gets done.
That's substance.
Uniforms are show, and degrading show at that.
But maybe if you have really stupid clients they'll confuse the show of uniforms with the substance of solving the problem.
I doubt it though.
Clients do know when they're getting show not substance.This is one of the most pitiful things I've yet seen in IT.</sentencetext>
	<parent>http://www.semanticweb.org/ontologies/ConversationInstances.owl#comment09_12_29_2129221.30587138</parent>
</comment>
<comment>
	<id>http://www.semanticweb.org/ontologies/ConversationInstances.owl#comment09_12_29_2129221.30595574</id>
	<title>pointy haired thinking</title>
	<author>Anonymous</author>
	<datestamp>1259862720000</datestamp>
	<modclass>Insightful</modclass>
	<modscore>1</modscore>
	<htmltext><p>You have to understand management to understand the genesis of the uniforms idea. See, some pointy hair was buying a computer for his nephew and asked for help from the nearest Geek Squad drone and was impressed by the professionalism of the help. (Your nephew probably likes games so buy the more expensive one, dude).</p><p>The comments about team unity and visibility and all that other stuff are mere rationalizations. The real reason is because the PHB liked that he could find the computer geek when he wanted one And face it, PHBs need to ask computer geeks questions like, "How do I log on?" and "How do I open the cup holder?" a lot.</p></htmltext>
<tokenext>You have to understand management to understand the genesis of the uniforms idea .
See , some pointy hair was buying a computer for his nephew and asked for help from the nearest Geek Squad drone and was impressed by the professionalism of the help .
( Your nephew probably likes games so buy the more expensive one , dude ) .The comments about team unity and visibility and all that other stuff are mere rationalizations .
The real reason is because the PHB liked that he could find the computer geek when he wanted one And face it , PHBs need to ask computer geeks questions like , " How do I log on ?
" and " How do I open the cup holder ?
" a lot .</tokentext>
<sentencetext>You have to understand management to understand the genesis of the uniforms idea.
See, some pointy hair was buying a computer for his nephew and asked for help from the nearest Geek Squad drone and was impressed by the professionalism of the help.
(Your nephew probably likes games so buy the more expensive one, dude).The comments about team unity and visibility and all that other stuff are mere rationalizations.
The real reason is because the PHB liked that he could find the computer geek when he wanted one And face it, PHBs need to ask computer geeks questions like, "How do I log on?
" and "How do I open the cup holder?
" a lot.</sentencetext>
</comment>
<comment>
	<id>http://www.semanticweb.org/ontologies/ConversationInstances.owl#comment09_12_29_2129221.30588900</id>
	<title>we were given shirts and a jacket</title>
	<author>Anonymous</author>
	<datestamp>1262092020000</datestamp>
	<modclass>None</modclass>
	<modscore>0</modscore>
	<htmltext><p>we were given shirts and a jacket but there wasn't any hint of a suggestion that we had to wear them.<br>when I started they said they'd give me four or five polo shirts with the MIT IS&amp;T logo on them and a fleece jacket with the same.<br>Sometimes I wore them sometimes I didn't. I liked the fleece and still wear it sometimes and I left my job at MIT several years ago.</p><p>In a meeting someone fairly high up asked the group how they could get the physical plant guys to wear uniforms. I told them to give them jackets that they would want to wear every day and I think they ended up doing just that.</p></htmltext>
<tokenext>we were given shirts and a jacket but there was n't any hint of a suggestion that we had to wear them.when I started they said they 'd give me four or five polo shirts with the MIT IS&amp;T logo on them and a fleece jacket with the same.Sometimes I wore them sometimes I did n't .
I liked the fleece and still wear it sometimes and I left my job at MIT several years ago.In a meeting someone fairly high up asked the group how they could get the physical plant guys to wear uniforms .
I told them to give them jackets that they would want to wear every day and I think they ended up doing just that .</tokentext>
<sentencetext>we were given shirts and a jacket but there wasn't any hint of a suggestion that we had to wear them.when I started they said they'd give me four or five polo shirts with the MIT IS&amp;T logo on them and a fleece jacket with the same.Sometimes I wore them sometimes I didn't.
I liked the fleece and still wear it sometimes and I left my job at MIT several years ago.In a meeting someone fairly high up asked the group how they could get the physical plant guys to wear uniforms.
I told them to give them jackets that they would want to wear every day and I think they ended up doing just that.</sentencetext>
</comment>
<comment>
	<id>http://www.semanticweb.org/ontologies/ConversationInstances.owl#comment09_12_29_2129221.30602004</id>
	<title>Re:I like uniforms</title>
	<author>GWBasic</author>
	<datestamp>1259852280000</datestamp>
	<modclass>None</modclass>
	<modscore>1</modscore>
	<htmltext><p><div class="quote"><p>"Oh, and the reason I prefer not to wear a uniform is so I can express myself."

What are you, 13?</p></div><p>I wore a tie as part of my uniform every day to high school.  I hated it so much that I chose the ugliest ties possible to "express myself.". Once I entered the corporate world, it took me about a year to figure out how to express myself with the context of business casual.  Even in restrictive dress environments, it's still possible to express one's self.</p></div>
	</htmltext>
<tokenext>" Oh , and the reason I prefer not to wear a uniform is so I can express myself .
" What are you , 13 ? I wore a tie as part of my uniform every day to high school .
I hated it so much that I chose the ugliest ties possible to " express myself. " .
Once I entered the corporate world , it took me about a year to figure out how to express myself with the context of business casual .
Even in restrictive dress environments , it 's still possible to express one 's self .</tokentext>
<sentencetext>"Oh, and the reason I prefer not to wear a uniform is so I can express myself.
"

What are you, 13?I wore a tie as part of my uniform every day to high school.
I hated it so much that I chose the ugliest ties possible to "express myself.".
Once I entered the corporate world, it took me about a year to figure out how to express myself with the context of business casual.
Even in restrictive dress environments, it's still possible to express one's self.
	</sentencetext>
	<parent>http://www.semanticweb.org/ontologies/ConversationInstances.owl#comment09_12_29_2129221.30587716</parent>
</comment>
<comment>
	<id>http://www.semanticweb.org/ontologies/ConversationInstances.owl#comment09_12_29_2129221.30588974</id>
	<title>Why so negative</title>
	<author>Anonymous</author>
	<datestamp>1262092380000</datestamp>
	<modclass>Interestin</modclass>
	<modscore>1</modscore>
	<htmltext><p>hey all,</p><p>We did something similar to this at my work this was done as a team effort and an slogan and logo was designed by the IT team now the whole IT department wears these shirts and this seems to help foster a good team spirt and make IT more visable to the business as a whole. no bad thing in my opinion<nobr> <wbr></nobr>:P</p><p>cheer</p><p>daniel</p></htmltext>
<tokenext>hey all,We did something similar to this at my work this was done as a team effort and an slogan and logo was designed by the IT team now the whole IT department wears these shirts and this seems to help foster a good team spirt and make IT more visable to the business as a whole .
no bad thing in my opinion : Pcheerdaniel</tokentext>
<sentencetext>hey all,We did something similar to this at my work this was done as a team effort and an slogan and logo was designed by the IT team now the whole IT department wears these shirts and this seems to help foster a good team spirt and make IT more visable to the business as a whole.
no bad thing in my opinion :Pcheerdaniel</sentencetext>
</comment>
<comment>
	<id>http://www.semanticweb.org/ontologies/ConversationInstances.owl#comment09_12_29_2129221.30592152</id>
	<title>Re:Professionalism</title>
	<author>awol</author>
	<datestamp>1259846220000</datestamp>
	<modclass>None</modclass>
	<modscore>1</modscore>
	<htmltext><p>I worked for a software house of 10 people. We wore what the hell we wanted unless we were facing clients, then we wore what the hell the client needed to see in order to believe we were professionals. Once the client "knew" us, we wore what the hell we wanted. We grew, we merged with a company of equivalent size to make about 200 people. We kept our "dress code". The merged company exploded in size, technology group represented less than 10\% of the 10,000 staff globally a big group of that 10\% wore some company branded hooey we stayed with what the hell we wanted. Someone tried to introduce the idea that we should conform to a uniform policy.</p><p>I find the requirement for "uniforms" for non customer facing resources to be offensive. I have enough trouble with the idea of "uniforms" for people that do face customers. What I understand is that some customers come at things with a view to what a professional looks like and in order to make the connection you have to conform until you can prove that your suit isnot what makes you worth paying to do your job.</p><p>I probably would have walked from my job over this issue because it really sits at the heart of my relationship with my employer. My expertise, commitment and professionalism are measured in what I do and not the clothes I wear. If my boss thinks otherwise then he or she is a tool. If I cannot persuade them or their boss of this issue then the company is not worth working for. Period.</p><p>We all have to make compromises and by the time this issue came up for me I was senior enought that I could have pulled weight and just ignored it but I was holding out for all the guys in our group who didn't have that ability. I cannot overstate how much this kind of thing shits me. I don't know about your Helldesk folk but the ones I work with fall into two categories, the good who treat most problems like puzzles and do what has to be done to solve them, for them I would go into bat to get 'em the right to wear what the hell they like. The others, you know the kind I mean, I wouldn't piss on if they were on fire and I have bollocked them and their managers over their work, I would be happy if their uniform was a grey smock and a dunces hat, just so we know what to expect...</p><p>If you cannot leave your job then suck it up and wait until you can because this kind of thing is a baaaad deal.</p></htmltext>
<tokenext>I worked for a software house of 10 people .
We wore what the hell we wanted unless we were facing clients , then we wore what the hell the client needed to see in order to believe we were professionals .
Once the client " knew " us , we wore what the hell we wanted .
We grew , we merged with a company of equivalent size to make about 200 people .
We kept our " dress code " .
The merged company exploded in size , technology group represented less than 10 \ % of the 10,000 staff globally a big group of that 10 \ % wore some company branded hooey we stayed with what the hell we wanted .
Someone tried to introduce the idea that we should conform to a uniform policy.I find the requirement for " uniforms " for non customer facing resources to be offensive .
I have enough trouble with the idea of " uniforms " for people that do face customers .
What I understand is that some customers come at things with a view to what a professional looks like and in order to make the connection you have to conform until you can prove that your suit isnot what makes you worth paying to do your job.I probably would have walked from my job over this issue because it really sits at the heart of my relationship with my employer .
My expertise , commitment and professionalism are measured in what I do and not the clothes I wear .
If my boss thinks otherwise then he or she is a tool .
If I can not persuade them or their boss of this issue then the company is not worth working for .
Period.We all have to make compromises and by the time this issue came up for me I was senior enought that I could have pulled weight and just ignored it but I was holding out for all the guys in our group who did n't have that ability .
I can not overstate how much this kind of thing shits me .
I do n't know about your Helldesk folk but the ones I work with fall into two categories , the good who treat most problems like puzzles and do what has to be done to solve them , for them I would go into bat to get 'em the right to wear what the hell they like .
The others , you know the kind I mean , I would n't piss on if they were on fire and I have bollocked them and their managers over their work , I would be happy if their uniform was a grey smock and a dunces hat , just so we know what to expect...If you can not leave your job then suck it up and wait until you can because this kind of thing is a baaaad deal .</tokentext>
<sentencetext>I worked for a software house of 10 people.
We wore what the hell we wanted unless we were facing clients, then we wore what the hell the client needed to see in order to believe we were professionals.
Once the client "knew" us, we wore what the hell we wanted.
We grew, we merged with a company of equivalent size to make about 200 people.
We kept our "dress code".
The merged company exploded in size, technology group represented less than 10\% of the 10,000 staff globally a big group of that 10\% wore some company branded hooey we stayed with what the hell we wanted.
Someone tried to introduce the idea that we should conform to a uniform policy.I find the requirement for "uniforms" for non customer facing resources to be offensive.
I have enough trouble with the idea of "uniforms" for people that do face customers.
What I understand is that some customers come at things with a view to what a professional looks like and in order to make the connection you have to conform until you can prove that your suit isnot what makes you worth paying to do your job.I probably would have walked from my job over this issue because it really sits at the heart of my relationship with my employer.
My expertise, commitment and professionalism are measured in what I do and not the clothes I wear.
If my boss thinks otherwise then he or she is a tool.
If I cannot persuade them or their boss of this issue then the company is not worth working for.
Period.We all have to make compromises and by the time this issue came up for me I was senior enought that I could have pulled weight and just ignored it but I was holding out for all the guys in our group who didn't have that ability.
I cannot overstate how much this kind of thing shits me.
I don't know about your Helldesk folk but the ones I work with fall into two categories, the good who treat most problems like puzzles and do what has to be done to solve them, for them I would go into bat to get 'em the right to wear what the hell they like.
The others, you know the kind I mean, I wouldn't piss on if they were on fire and I have bollocked them and their managers over their work, I would be happy if their uniform was a grey smock and a dunces hat, just so we know what to expect...If you cannot leave your job then suck it up and wait until you can because this kind of thing is a baaaad deal.</sentencetext>
	<parent>http://www.semanticweb.org/ontologies/ConversationInstances.owl#comment09_12_29_2129221.30587096</parent>
</comment>
<comment>
	<id>http://www.semanticweb.org/ontologies/ConversationInstances.owl#comment09_12_29_2129221.30588844</id>
	<title>Depends so much on culture</title>
	<author>jd.schmidt</author>
	<datestamp>1262091720000</datestamp>
	<modclass>Insightful</modclass>
	<modscore>2</modscore>
	<htmltext><p>There are plenty of times and places where uniforms gain respect.  In many civilizations, wearing a military uniform was very much a sign of respect, certainly a high ranking one anyway.  Lots of people still respect firefighters and police officers today.  At one time government officals all wore uniforms as a mark of position.  Also as noted, suit and tie are definitely a uniform of a kind.</p><p>Uniforms gain you respect IF the institution they represent is respected.  So it can be a benefit (IT, those guys are great) or a problem (geez, another IT goon).  In all cases it sets you apart and puts you in a class.</p><p>Also the surrounding culture matters.  If you are surrounded by suits, wearing a uniform will likely pull you down the totem pole.  If the standards of dress are very lax, then it might make you stand out and appear to have your act together.  Management will still view themselves as above you, but you might gain over all organizational respect.</p><p>So a risky move that might pay off if you understand your culture well.</p></htmltext>
<tokenext>There are plenty of times and places where uniforms gain respect .
In many civilizations , wearing a military uniform was very much a sign of respect , certainly a high ranking one anyway .
Lots of people still respect firefighters and police officers today .
At one time government officals all wore uniforms as a mark of position .
Also as noted , suit and tie are definitely a uniform of a kind.Uniforms gain you respect IF the institution they represent is respected .
So it can be a benefit ( IT , those guys are great ) or a problem ( geez , another IT goon ) .
In all cases it sets you apart and puts you in a class.Also the surrounding culture matters .
If you are surrounded by suits , wearing a uniform will likely pull you down the totem pole .
If the standards of dress are very lax , then it might make you stand out and appear to have your act together .
Management will still view themselves as above you , but you might gain over all organizational respect.So a risky move that might pay off if you understand your culture well .</tokentext>
<sentencetext>There are plenty of times and places where uniforms gain respect.
In many civilizations, wearing a military uniform was very much a sign of respect, certainly a high ranking one anyway.
Lots of people still respect firefighters and police officers today.
At one time government officals all wore uniforms as a mark of position.
Also as noted, suit and tie are definitely a uniform of a kind.Uniforms gain you respect IF the institution they represent is respected.
So it can be a benefit (IT, those guys are great) or a problem (geez, another IT goon).
In all cases it sets you apart and puts you in a class.Also the surrounding culture matters.
If you are surrounded by suits, wearing a uniform will likely pull you down the totem pole.
If the standards of dress are very lax, then it might make you stand out and appear to have your act together.
Management will still view themselves as above you, but you might gain over all organizational respect.So a risky move that might pay off if you understand your culture well.</sentencetext>
</comment>
<comment>
	<id>http://www.semanticweb.org/ontologies/ConversationInstances.owl#comment09_12_29_2129221.30595986</id>
	<title>depends on the shirt</title>
	<author>josepha48</author>
	<datestamp>1259863980000</datestamp>
	<modclass>Insightful</modclass>
	<modscore>2</modscore>
	<htmltext>and person.  If it is a short sleeve shirt and you get cold in the office can you wear a sweater or jacket?  If it is a long sleeve shirt can yo roll up you're sleeves?  Who would clean these uniforms and how many of them would you have?
<p>I can see doing this so people know who the IT guys are, but I think badges would be better. Tell them you want cotten cause you are allergic to polyester<nobr> <wbr></nobr>:))
</p><p>Welcome to Kmart, how may I help you<nobr> <wbr></nobr>;)</p></htmltext>
<tokenext>and person .
If it is a short sleeve shirt and you get cold in the office can you wear a sweater or jacket ?
If it is a long sleeve shirt can yo roll up you 're sleeves ?
Who would clean these uniforms and how many of them would you have ?
I can see doing this so people know who the IT guys are , but I think badges would be better .
Tell them you want cotten cause you are allergic to polyester : ) ) Welcome to Kmart , how may I help you ; )</tokentext>
<sentencetext>and person.
If it is a short sleeve shirt and you get cold in the office can you wear a sweater or jacket?
If it is a long sleeve shirt can yo roll up you're sleeves?
Who would clean these uniforms and how many of them would you have?
I can see doing this so people know who the IT guys are, but I think badges would be better.
Tell them you want cotten cause you are allergic to polyester :))
Welcome to Kmart, how may I help you ;)</sentencetext>
</comment>
<comment>
	<id>http://www.semanticweb.org/ontologies/ConversationInstances.owl#comment09_12_29_2129221.30588202</id>
	<title>An alternate suggestion</title>
	<author>st1ckybit</author>
	<datestamp>1262088180000</datestamp>
	<modclass>None</modclass>
	<modscore>1</modscore>
	<htmltext>Instead, perhaps you could suggest beanies with attached propellers.  People could choose a particular beanie style (rainbow, striped, solid or camo) that fits them best.  I'm guessing that this is the way your management would like IT to "stand out".</htmltext>
<tokenext>Instead , perhaps you could suggest beanies with attached propellers .
People could choose a particular beanie style ( rainbow , striped , solid or camo ) that fits them best .
I 'm guessing that this is the way your management would like IT to " stand out " .</tokentext>
<sentencetext>Instead, perhaps you could suggest beanies with attached propellers.
People could choose a particular beanie style (rainbow, striped, solid or camo) that fits them best.
I'm guessing that this is the way your management would like IT to "stand out".</sentencetext>
</comment>
<comment>
	<id>http://www.semanticweb.org/ontologies/ConversationInstances.owl#comment09_12_29_2129221.30587990</id>
	<title>It's a fantastic idea!</title>
	<author>SpacePunk</author>
	<datestamp>1262087160000</datestamp>
	<modclass>None</modclass>
	<modscore>1</modscore>
	<htmltext><p>If...  you don't mind being seen as a peon.  I'd only agree to it if other departments had to wear some sort of uniform outfit also.  Perhaps management could wear something with an embroidered bib since, evidently, they are drooling idiots.  Tell em to fuck off.</p></htmltext>
<tokenext>If... you do n't mind being seen as a peon .
I 'd only agree to it if other departments had to wear some sort of uniform outfit also .
Perhaps management could wear something with an embroidered bib since , evidently , they are drooling idiots .
Tell em to fuck off .</tokentext>
<sentencetext>If...  you don't mind being seen as a peon.
I'd only agree to it if other departments had to wear some sort of uniform outfit also.
Perhaps management could wear something with an embroidered bib since, evidently, they are drooling idiots.
Tell em to fuck off.</sentencetext>
</comment>
<comment>
	<id>http://www.semanticweb.org/ontologies/ConversationInstances.owl#comment09_12_29_2129221.30588792</id>
	<title>Re:Nothing wrong with the idea</title>
	<author>Anonymous</author>
	<datestamp>1262091180000</datestamp>
	<modclass>None</modclass>
	<modscore>0</modscore>
	<htmltext><p>McITjob...</p><p>and people wonder why more young students are not interested in computer science or drop out of the field later...</p><p>Thanks for making my skills feel more and more like I am on the same level as a burger flipper.</p><p>Excuse me why I change careers and head into nursing, at least they get paid what they are worth, and more as years go by, esp if you specialize in certain fields.</p><p>And their uniforms are better...</p><p>(Or you can read this another way. FUCK MANAGEMENT and their stupid ideas and making my skills feel like they are less then theirs. Gonna burn this place down one day....)</p></htmltext>
<tokenext>McITjob...and people wonder why more young students are not interested in computer science or drop out of the field later...Thanks for making my skills feel more and more like I am on the same level as a burger flipper.Excuse me why I change careers and head into nursing , at least they get paid what they are worth , and more as years go by , esp if you specialize in certain fields.And their uniforms are better... ( Or you can read this another way .
FUCK MANAGEMENT and their stupid ideas and making my skills feel like they are less then theirs .
Gon na burn this place down one day.... )</tokentext>
<sentencetext>McITjob...and people wonder why more young students are not interested in computer science or drop out of the field later...Thanks for making my skills feel more and more like I am on the same level as a burger flipper.Excuse me why I change careers and head into nursing, at least they get paid what they are worth, and more as years go by, esp if you specialize in certain fields.And their uniforms are better...(Or you can read this another way.
FUCK MANAGEMENT and their stupid ideas and making my skills feel like they are less then theirs.
Gonna burn this place down one day....)</sentencetext>
	<parent>http://www.semanticweb.org/ontologies/ConversationInstances.owl#comment09_12_29_2129221.30587138</parent>
</comment>
<comment>
	<id>http://www.semanticweb.org/ontologies/ConversationInstances.owl#comment09_12_29_2129221.30590586</id>
	<title>Re:I like uniforms</title>
	<author>Anonymous</author>
	<datestamp>1262107920000</datestamp>
	<modclass>None</modclass>
	<modscore>0</modscore>
	<htmltext><p>Exactly!  Now let me get back to ironing my Black Flag t-shirt for tomorrow.</p></htmltext>
<tokenext>Exactly !
Now let me get back to ironing my Black Flag t-shirt for tomorrow .</tokentext>
<sentencetext>Exactly!
Now let me get back to ironing my Black Flag t-shirt for tomorrow.</sentencetext>
	<parent>http://www.semanticweb.org/ontologies/ConversationInstances.owl#comment09_12_29_2129221.30587716</parent>
</comment>
<comment>
	<id>http://www.semanticweb.org/ontologies/ConversationInstances.owl#comment09_12_29_2129221.30588418</id>
	<title>Terrible idea</title>
	<author>jr76</author>
	<datestamp>1262089260000</datestamp>
	<modclass>None</modclass>
	<modscore>1</modscore>
	<htmltext>Want to make yourself look less valued and more like a McDonald's worker?  Wear a uniform.  Look, not only for yourself and your career, but for the entire IT industry, do not accept this, at all, EVER.</htmltext>
<tokenext>Want to make yourself look less valued and more like a McDonald 's worker ?
Wear a uniform .
Look , not only for yourself and your career , but for the entire IT industry , do not accept this , at all , EVER .</tokentext>
<sentencetext>Want to make yourself look less valued and more like a McDonald's worker?
Wear a uniform.
Look, not only for yourself and your career, but for the entire IT industry, do not accept this, at all, EVER.</sentencetext>
</comment>
<comment>
	<id>http://www.semanticweb.org/ontologies/ConversationInstances.owl#comment09_12_29_2129221.30587120</id>
	<title>I like uniforms</title>
	<author>Mike Buddha</author>
	<datestamp>1262084100000</datestamp>
	<modclass>Insightful</modclass>
	<modscore>5</modscore>
	<htmltext><p>I haven't had to wear one in almost 20 years, but when I did, I liked it, because then I didn't have to think about what I was going to wear to work.</p><p>Maybe they're trying to send you guys a not-so-subtle message that maybe your business casual is a bit too casual?</p></htmltext>
<tokenext>I have n't had to wear one in almost 20 years , but when I did , I liked it , because then I did n't have to think about what I was going to wear to work.Maybe they 're trying to send you guys a not-so-subtle message that maybe your business casual is a bit too casual ?</tokentext>
<sentencetext>I haven't had to wear one in almost 20 years, but when I did, I liked it, because then I didn't have to think about what I was going to wear to work.Maybe they're trying to send you guys a not-so-subtle message that maybe your business casual is a bit too casual?</sentencetext>
</comment>
<comment>
	<id>http://www.semanticweb.org/ontologies/ConversationInstances.owl#comment09_12_29_2129221.30587090</id>
	<title>Well...</title>
	<author>Guil Rarey</author>
	<datestamp>1262083980000</datestamp>
	<modclass>Funny</modclass>
	<modscore>4</modscore>
	<htmltext><p>is the color blaze orange with concentric circles on the back?</p></htmltext>
<tokenext>is the color blaze orange with concentric circles on the back ?</tokentext>
<sentencetext>is the color blaze orange with concentric circles on the back?</sentencetext>
</comment>
<comment>
	<id>http://www.semanticweb.org/ontologies/ConversationInstances.owl#comment09_12_29_2129221.30589932</id>
	<title>Re:Well...</title>
	<author>Anonymous</author>
	<datestamp>1262100900000</datestamp>
	<modclass>None</modclass>
	<modscore>0</modscore>
	<htmltext><p><div class="quote"><p>Funny, but my company did just mandate blaze orange shirts for all front line IT staff.  I can't for the life of me figure out who thought that was a good idea.</p><p>Mine comes in Monday.</p><p>We can also wear Navy.  I think I'm going to get an equal number of pairs of blaze orange and navy pants and alternate them daily.</p><p>Personally, I find it extremely condescending.  I'm required to design and maintain hundreds of databases, several servers, write apps, troubleshoot network problems, manage million dollar projects, AND do desktop support for 2000 devices with 3 other IT people for $40K/year.  And now this.  No wonder I've thrown my hands up today and am now posting on slashdot.</p><p>Yes, I'm looking for a way out.</p></div><p>if all you are making is 40k, you need to find another job.</p></div>
	</htmltext>
<tokenext>Funny , but my company did just mandate blaze orange shirts for all front line IT staff .
I ca n't for the life of me figure out who thought that was a good idea.Mine comes in Monday.We can also wear Navy .
I think I 'm going to get an equal number of pairs of blaze orange and navy pants and alternate them daily.Personally , I find it extremely condescending .
I 'm required to design and maintain hundreds of databases , several servers , write apps , troubleshoot network problems , manage million dollar projects , AND do desktop support for 2000 devices with 3 other IT people for $ 40K/year .
And now this .
No wonder I 've thrown my hands up today and am now posting on slashdot.Yes , I 'm looking for a way out.if all you are making is 40k , you need to find another job .</tokentext>
<sentencetext>Funny, but my company did just mandate blaze orange shirts for all front line IT staff.
I can't for the life of me figure out who thought that was a good idea.Mine comes in Monday.We can also wear Navy.
I think I'm going to get an equal number of pairs of blaze orange and navy pants and alternate them daily.Personally, I find it extremely condescending.
I'm required to design and maintain hundreds of databases, several servers, write apps, troubleshoot network problems, manage million dollar projects, AND do desktop support for 2000 devices with 3 other IT people for $40K/year.
And now this.
No wonder I've thrown my hands up today and am now posting on slashdot.Yes, I'm looking for a way out.if all you are making is 40k, you need to find another job.
	</sentencetext>
	<parent>http://www.semanticweb.org/ontologies/ConversationInstances.owl#comment09_12_29_2129221.30587462</parent>
</comment>
<comment>
	<id>http://www.semanticweb.org/ontologies/ConversationInstances.owl#comment09_12_29_2129221.30592350</id>
	<title>Not So New Paradigm</title>
	<author>Teufelhunden25</author>
	<datestamp>1259848980000</datestamp>
	<modclass>None</modclass>
	<modscore>1</modscore>
	<htmltext>We have a way of thinking where I work (as long as safety is not violated):


1.  Are they paying you?  If so, shut up and wear the uniform.  Stay focused.
2.  The best way for a bad plan to fail is to implement it.  If it's a bad plan, it will fail.  Do not try to stand it up on your own.  A plan should succeed or fail on its own merit.
3.  Management changes.  Even though you're in a relatively small company (I work in a company w/ 25k+ employees), management will come and go.  Your current management will move on to screw with someone else just because they can.
4.  The "Golden Rule."  He who has the gold, makes the rules.  You work for "them."  If you do not like a policy, try and fight it.  In this economy, shut up and wear the uniform.


All that being said, I did recently "draw the line in the sand."  I was asked to provide my SSN to my company to get access to a room I've had access to w/o a SSN for the past 12 years.  Apparently, once I "sign" the form, they have carte blanche to check my credit w/o letting me know they are doing so.  Sorry, I don't give out my SSN for anything other than payroll.  I spent 14 years in the military and had clearances.  Even the military requests permission to check my credit each time they do so.</htmltext>
<tokenext>We have a way of thinking where I work ( as long as safety is not violated ) : 1 .
Are they paying you ?
If so , shut up and wear the uniform .
Stay focused .
2. The best way for a bad plan to fail is to implement it .
If it 's a bad plan , it will fail .
Do not try to stand it up on your own .
A plan should succeed or fail on its own merit .
3. Management changes .
Even though you 're in a relatively small company ( I work in a company w/ 25k + employees ) , management will come and go .
Your current management will move on to screw with someone else just because they can .
4. The " Golden Rule .
" He who has the gold , makes the rules .
You work for " them .
" If you do not like a policy , try and fight it .
In this economy , shut up and wear the uniform .
All that being said , I did recently " draw the line in the sand .
" I was asked to provide my SSN to my company to get access to a room I 've had access to w/o a SSN for the past 12 years .
Apparently , once I " sign " the form , they have carte blanche to check my credit w/o letting me know they are doing so .
Sorry , I do n't give out my SSN for anything other than payroll .
I spent 14 years in the military and had clearances .
Even the military requests permission to check my credit each time they do so .</tokentext>
<sentencetext>We have a way of thinking where I work (as long as safety is not violated):


1.
Are they paying you?
If so, shut up and wear the uniform.
Stay focused.
2.  The best way for a bad plan to fail is to implement it.
If it's a bad plan, it will fail.
Do not try to stand it up on your own.
A plan should succeed or fail on its own merit.
3.  Management changes.
Even though you're in a relatively small company (I work in a company w/ 25k+ employees), management will come and go.
Your current management will move on to screw with someone else just because they can.
4.  The "Golden Rule.
"  He who has the gold, makes the rules.
You work for "them.
"  If you do not like a policy, try and fight it.
In this economy, shut up and wear the uniform.
All that being said, I did recently "draw the line in the sand.
"  I was asked to provide my SSN to my company to get access to a room I've had access to w/o a SSN for the past 12 years.
Apparently, once I "sign" the form, they have carte blanche to check my credit w/o letting me know they are doing so.
Sorry, I don't give out my SSN for anything other than payroll.
I spent 14 years in the military and had clearances.
Even the military requests permission to check my credit each time they do so.</sentencetext>
</comment>
<comment>
	<id>http://www.semanticweb.org/ontologies/ConversationInstances.owl#comment09_12_29_2129221.30589276</id>
	<title>Uniforms can have value to the employee too!</title>
	<author>Anonymous</author>
	<datestamp>1262094900000</datestamp>
	<modclass>None</modclass>
	<modscore>2</modscore>
	<htmltext><p>I've been thinking about this issue recently in the context of highly intelligent, customer facing, problem solving employees, and I've come to the conclusion that uniforms, or at least the idea of a "virtual uniform" is one that has value both for the company *and* the employee.</p><p>The uniform is a means toward conformity, and as such both attempts to mold the individual into some standard and also serves as an indicator to others that this individual has certain abilities and responsibilities which set their expectations before an encounter has begun.</p><p>If you're not wearing a uniform, then you're on your own as an individual to impress your customer. You will take any comments they make personally, and you may feel compelled to act "cool" in a "Yo, what's happening, I'm so awesome" kind of way to try to protect your own ego. This is all really bad from the customer's point of view.</p><p>When wearing a uniform, you're taking on the persona of that uniform and what it stands for (your company) and to a great degree you *are* the company when you wear it. This means that if someone whines or complains at you, they're not really attacking you but the company. This can allow you the freedom to act in the ways the job requires, which may include being subservient to your customers (oddly enough we usually work for them rather than the other way round, no matter how much we like to think otherwise). You can leave your own ego and attitude at home and feel ok doing things, and behaving in ways, that you as an individual would not be comfortable with. If you make a mistake, the uniform even takes some of the blame off of you the individual.</p><p>Smart techies encountering a new customer often expect to immediately be treated with respect and reverence, when in reality such respect has to be earned each time. Wearing a uniform helps with this too, as respect you build will apply to everyone wearing that same uniform and so the next person who has to deal with that customer will get more benefit from the relationship you've already created with them.</p><p>So I think there are definite advantages to being able to hide your self/ego behind a uniform at times. The uniform doesn't even have to be an actual physical thing. Just understanding the concept that when you're working you're not just Joe The Individual, but Joe of YourCompany, can help you deal with a lot of the ego/respect issues that arise when you're serving whoever your customers are.</p><p>G.</p></htmltext>
<tokenext>I 've been thinking about this issue recently in the context of highly intelligent , customer facing , problem solving employees , and I 've come to the conclusion that uniforms , or at least the idea of a " virtual uniform " is one that has value both for the company * and * the employee.The uniform is a means toward conformity , and as such both attempts to mold the individual into some standard and also serves as an indicator to others that this individual has certain abilities and responsibilities which set their expectations before an encounter has begun.If you 're not wearing a uniform , then you 're on your own as an individual to impress your customer .
You will take any comments they make personally , and you may feel compelled to act " cool " in a " Yo , what 's happening , I 'm so awesome " kind of way to try to protect your own ego .
This is all really bad from the customer 's point of view.When wearing a uniform , you 're taking on the persona of that uniform and what it stands for ( your company ) and to a great degree you * are * the company when you wear it .
This means that if someone whines or complains at you , they 're not really attacking you but the company .
This can allow you the freedom to act in the ways the job requires , which may include being subservient to your customers ( oddly enough we usually work for them rather than the other way round , no matter how much we like to think otherwise ) .
You can leave your own ego and attitude at home and feel ok doing things , and behaving in ways , that you as an individual would not be comfortable with .
If you make a mistake , the uniform even takes some of the blame off of you the individual.Smart techies encountering a new customer often expect to immediately be treated with respect and reverence , when in reality such respect has to be earned each time .
Wearing a uniform helps with this too , as respect you build will apply to everyone wearing that same uniform and so the next person who has to deal with that customer will get more benefit from the relationship you 've already created with them.So I think there are definite advantages to being able to hide your self/ego behind a uniform at times .
The uniform does n't even have to be an actual physical thing .
Just understanding the concept that when you 're working you 're not just Joe The Individual , but Joe of YourCompany , can help you deal with a lot of the ego/respect issues that arise when you 're serving whoever your customers are.G .</tokentext>
<sentencetext>I've been thinking about this issue recently in the context of highly intelligent, customer facing, problem solving employees, and I've come to the conclusion that uniforms, or at least the idea of a "virtual uniform" is one that has value both for the company *and* the employee.The uniform is a means toward conformity, and as such both attempts to mold the individual into some standard and also serves as an indicator to others that this individual has certain abilities and responsibilities which set their expectations before an encounter has begun.If you're not wearing a uniform, then you're on your own as an individual to impress your customer.
You will take any comments they make personally, and you may feel compelled to act "cool" in a "Yo, what's happening, I'm so awesome" kind of way to try to protect your own ego.
This is all really bad from the customer's point of view.When wearing a uniform, you're taking on the persona of that uniform and what it stands for (your company) and to a great degree you *are* the company when you wear it.
This means that if someone whines or complains at you, they're not really attacking you but the company.
This can allow you the freedom to act in the ways the job requires, which may include being subservient to your customers (oddly enough we usually work for them rather than the other way round, no matter how much we like to think otherwise).
You can leave your own ego and attitude at home and feel ok doing things, and behaving in ways, that you as an individual would not be comfortable with.
If you make a mistake, the uniform even takes some of the blame off of you the individual.Smart techies encountering a new customer often expect to immediately be treated with respect and reverence, when in reality such respect has to be earned each time.
Wearing a uniform helps with this too, as respect you build will apply to everyone wearing that same uniform and so the next person who has to deal with that customer will get more benefit from the relationship you've already created with them.So I think there are definite advantages to being able to hide your self/ego behind a uniform at times.
The uniform doesn't even have to be an actual physical thing.
Just understanding the concept that when you're working you're not just Joe The Individual, but Joe of YourCompany, can help you deal with a lot of the ego/respect issues that arise when you're serving whoever your customers are.G.</sentencetext>
</comment>
<comment>
	<id>http://www.semanticweb.org/ontologies/ConversationInstances.owl#comment09_12_29_2129221.30645750</id>
	<title>Re:lovely</title>
	<author>Anonymous</author>
	<datestamp>1231061880000</datestamp>
	<modclass>None</modclass>
	<modscore>0</modscore>
	<htmltext><p>Unfortunately, those of us who wear uniforms on a regular basis are the lowest paid in the bunch, but, there again, a lot of us also do a hell of a lot of demanding work.</p><p>Work often cited as being too critical for such mediocre pay.</p><p>Most uniformed police officers don't bring home a staggering pay, and for the large portion of officers who I've met, who do their jobs well and don't harass the general public, who typically take huge risks in unknown situations where any lunatic could easily have any kind of weapon trained on them, deserve to draw a larger check.</p><p>Most fire fighters, volunteer or paid (but for the sake of argument, this refers to paid), also typically bring home a "meh" quality paycheck. To become certified as a firefighter usually requires just a few months in an academy, but to become truly proficient at the job, requires years of experience wrought from dangerous situations.</p><p>Most EMS, the guys who bring the sick people (and often, the not so sick who just don't feel like waiting till Monday to go see their family Doc.) to the doctors and nurses, and typically those individuals need to work 2 or more jobs, on average 80+ hours a week, to bring home enough money to afford to pay for their families.</p><p>The handful of lunatics that do these jobs, who deal with chaotic, uncontrolled environments and typically the absolute low point of most people's years or lives, don't bring home the same level of cash that most mid-level commercial employees do. I'm not arguing that members of these professions could run a multi-million dollar business, but I'm also willing to put money down that a lot of these business-types couldn't handle the stresses of what we do on the streets.</p><p>Ultimately, my argument leads to this: Why do people ever have a problem with wearing a uniform? If you don't have the pride in what you do to display it, go do something else. A uniform is more than just providing what should be unity and consistent service (provided adequate training and experience for the position), a uniform, at least in my field, is a symbol of PRIDE.</p><p>However, saying that, I know how much a uniform serves as a big red flag, as I've been waved down countless times. Service from IT makes sense, at least to me, based upon the priority of the received complaint. Trade off for uniforms with your bosses by implementing some form of system to discover the priority of these people's problems. Technical triage. Yay.</p></htmltext>
<tokenext>Unfortunately , those of us who wear uniforms on a regular basis are the lowest paid in the bunch , but , there again , a lot of us also do a hell of a lot of demanding work.Work often cited as being too critical for such mediocre pay.Most uniformed police officers do n't bring home a staggering pay , and for the large portion of officers who I 've met , who do their jobs well and do n't harass the general public , who typically take huge risks in unknown situations where any lunatic could easily have any kind of weapon trained on them , deserve to draw a larger check.Most fire fighters , volunteer or paid ( but for the sake of argument , this refers to paid ) , also typically bring home a " meh " quality paycheck .
To become certified as a firefighter usually requires just a few months in an academy , but to become truly proficient at the job , requires years of experience wrought from dangerous situations.Most EMS , the guys who bring the sick people ( and often , the not so sick who just do n't feel like waiting till Monday to go see their family Doc .
) to the doctors and nurses , and typically those individuals need to work 2 or more jobs , on average 80 + hours a week , to bring home enough money to afford to pay for their families.The handful of lunatics that do these jobs , who deal with chaotic , uncontrolled environments and typically the absolute low point of most people 's years or lives , do n't bring home the same level of cash that most mid-level commercial employees do .
I 'm not arguing that members of these professions could run a multi-million dollar business , but I 'm also willing to put money down that a lot of these business-types could n't handle the stresses of what we do on the streets.Ultimately , my argument leads to this : Why do people ever have a problem with wearing a uniform ?
If you do n't have the pride in what you do to display it , go do something else .
A uniform is more than just providing what should be unity and consistent service ( provided adequate training and experience for the position ) , a uniform , at least in my field , is a symbol of PRIDE.However , saying that , I know how much a uniform serves as a big red flag , as I 've been waved down countless times .
Service from IT makes sense , at least to me , based upon the priority of the received complaint .
Trade off for uniforms with your bosses by implementing some form of system to discover the priority of these people 's problems .
Technical triage .
Yay .</tokentext>
<sentencetext>Unfortunately, those of us who wear uniforms on a regular basis are the lowest paid in the bunch, but, there again, a lot of us also do a hell of a lot of demanding work.Work often cited as being too critical for such mediocre pay.Most uniformed police officers don't bring home a staggering pay, and for the large portion of officers who I've met, who do their jobs well and don't harass the general public, who typically take huge risks in unknown situations where any lunatic could easily have any kind of weapon trained on them, deserve to draw a larger check.Most fire fighters, volunteer or paid (but for the sake of argument, this refers to paid), also typically bring home a "meh" quality paycheck.
To become certified as a firefighter usually requires just a few months in an academy, but to become truly proficient at the job, requires years of experience wrought from dangerous situations.Most EMS, the guys who bring the sick people (and often, the not so sick who just don't feel like waiting till Monday to go see their family Doc.
) to the doctors and nurses, and typically those individuals need to work 2 or more jobs, on average 80+ hours a week, to bring home enough money to afford to pay for their families.The handful of lunatics that do these jobs, who deal with chaotic, uncontrolled environments and typically the absolute low point of most people's years or lives, don't bring home the same level of cash that most mid-level commercial employees do.
I'm not arguing that members of these professions could run a multi-million dollar business, but I'm also willing to put money down that a lot of these business-types couldn't handle the stresses of what we do on the streets.Ultimately, my argument leads to this: Why do people ever have a problem with wearing a uniform?
If you don't have the pride in what you do to display it, go do something else.
A uniform is more than just providing what should be unity and consistent service (provided adequate training and experience for the position), a uniform, at least in my field, is a symbol of PRIDE.However, saying that, I know how much a uniform serves as a big red flag, as I've been waved down countless times.
Service from IT makes sense, at least to me, based upon the priority of the received complaint.
Trade off for uniforms with your bosses by implementing some form of system to discover the priority of these people's problems.
Technical triage.
Yay.</sentencetext>
	<parent>http://www.semanticweb.org/ontologies/ConversationInstances.owl#comment09_12_29_2129221.30588496</parent>
</comment>
<comment>
	<id>http://www.semanticweb.org/ontologies/ConversationInstances.owl#comment09_12_29_2129221.30587596</id>
	<title>Good Idea!</title>
	<author>Anonymous</author>
	<datestamp>1262085660000</datestamp>
	<modclass>None</modclass>
	<modscore>1</modscore>
	<htmltext>If I have to wear a uniform to work at a help desk, I want it to be a Level 4 haz-mat suit with the biohazard symbol all over it. I'm sure that would make me very approachable to all the people who infect their computers with spyware or fuck it up in some other moronic menial way and expect me to fix it.<p>
Seriously though, a company that requires me to wear any sort of 'uniform' to answer moronic questions about computers for internal staff, is a company I no longer work for.</p></htmltext>
<tokenext>If I have to wear a uniform to work at a help desk , I want it to be a Level 4 haz-mat suit with the biohazard symbol all over it .
I 'm sure that would make me very approachable to all the people who infect their computers with spyware or fuck it up in some other moronic menial way and expect me to fix it .
Seriously though , a company that requires me to wear any sort of 'uniform ' to answer moronic questions about computers for internal staff , is a company I no longer work for .</tokentext>
<sentencetext>If I have to wear a uniform to work at a help desk, I want it to be a Level 4 haz-mat suit with the biohazard symbol all over it.
I'm sure that would make me very approachable to all the people who infect their computers with spyware or fuck it up in some other moronic menial way and expect me to fix it.
Seriously though, a company that requires me to wear any sort of 'uniform' to answer moronic questions about computers for internal staff, is a company I no longer work for.</sentencetext>
</comment>
<comment>
	<id>http://www.semanticweb.org/ontologies/ConversationInstances.owl#comment09_12_29_2129221.30587608</id>
	<title>If you want to be professional, it's dress shirts.</title>
	<author>Maxo-Texas</author>
	<datestamp>1262085720000</datestamp>
	<modclass>Interestin</modclass>
	<modscore>4</modscore>
	<htmltext><p>One of the companies i worked at had a standard,<br>Tan pants and<br>dress shirt or company logo'd shirt.</p><p>But it applied to everyone, even the president.</p><p>I'd find it a bit demeaning if it was limited to the help desk only.</p></htmltext>
<tokenext>One of the companies i worked at had a standard,Tan pants anddress shirt or company logo 'd shirt.But it applied to everyone , even the president.I 'd find it a bit demeaning if it was limited to the help desk only .</tokentext>
<sentencetext>One of the companies i worked at had a standard,Tan pants anddress shirt or company logo'd shirt.But it applied to everyone, even the president.I'd find it a bit demeaning if it was limited to the help desk only.</sentencetext>
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