<article>
	<id>http://www.semanticweb.org/ontologies/ConversationInstances.owl#article09_12_19_1429252</id>
	<title>Verizon Defends Doubling of Early Termination Fee</title>
	<author>Soulskill</author>
	<datestamp>1261239060000</datestamp>
	<htmltext><a href="http://www.eff.org/support" rel="nofollow">I Don't Believe in Imaginary Property</a> writes <i>"Verizon is defending its decision to <a href="http://www.google.com/hostednews/ap/article/ALeqM5j2Q0Yxhbbj17xuV-NEk72qtDCEBgD9CM0AKG0">double its Early Termination Fee from $175 to $350</a> after being <a href="http://mobile.slashdot.org/story/09/12/05/0420217/FCC-Inquires-About-Controversial-Verizon-Fees?from=rss">called to account</a> by the FCC.  They claim it's because the higher fees <a href="http://fjallfoss.fcc.gov/ecfs/document/view?id=7020353621">allow them to offer more expensive phones with a lower up-front cost</a> (PDF), and they also say that because they pro-rate the fee depending on how much of your contract is left, they still lose money.  Apparently doing something about the <a href="http://xkcd.com/verizon/">Verizon customer service horror stories</a> isn't as good a way to retain customers as telling them that they have to pay several hundred dollars to leave."</i></htmltext>
<tokenext>I Do n't Believe in Imaginary Property writes " Verizon is defending its decision to double its Early Termination Fee from $ 175 to $ 350 after being called to account by the FCC .
They claim it 's because the higher fees allow them to offer more expensive phones with a lower up-front cost ( PDF ) , and they also say that because they pro-rate the fee depending on how much of your contract is left , they still lose money .
Apparently doing something about the Verizon customer service horror stories is n't as good a way to retain customers as telling them that they have to pay several hundred dollars to leave .
"</tokentext>
<sentencetext>I Don't Believe in Imaginary Property writes "Verizon is defending its decision to double its Early Termination Fee from $175 to $350 after being called to account by the FCC.
They claim it's because the higher fees allow them to offer more expensive phones with a lower up-front cost (PDF), and they also say that because they pro-rate the fee depending on how much of your contract is left, they still lose money.
Apparently doing something about the Verizon customer service horror stories isn't as good a way to retain customers as telling them that they have to pay several hundred dollars to leave.
"</sentencetext>
</article>
<comment>
	<id>http://www.semanticweb.org/ontologies/ConversationInstances.owl#comment09_12_19_1429252.30500212</id>
	<title>Re:Umm...</title>
	<author>KarmaMB84</author>
	<datestamp>1261255920000</datestamp>
	<modclass>None</modclass>
	<modscore>1</modscore>
	<htmltext>They lose money on the <b>phone</b>, not the contract.</htmltext>
<tokenext>They lose money on the phone , not the contract .</tokentext>
<sentencetext>They lose money on the phone, not the contract.</sentencetext>
	<parent>http://www.semanticweb.org/ontologies/ConversationInstances.owl#comment09_12_19_1429252.30498936</parent>
</comment>
<comment>
	<id>http://www.semanticweb.org/ontologies/ConversationInstances.owl#comment09_12_19_1429252.30499526</id>
	<title>Or, you could just pay full price for the hardware</title>
	<author>Anonymous</author>
	<datestamp>1261248180000</datestamp>
	<modclass>Flamebait</modclass>
	<modscore>0</modscore>
	<htmltext><p>I have never been prevented from paying full price for the hardware from any carrier.  This allows me to go month to month on the service.</p><p>I also do this with sattelite TV companies, and I've noticed they treat me better when I am not contractually bound to their service.</p><p>Telecom contracts are for suckers.</p><p>-Ted</p></htmltext>
<tokenext>I have never been prevented from paying full price for the hardware from any carrier .
This allows me to go month to month on the service.I also do this with sattelite TV companies , and I 've noticed they treat me better when I am not contractually bound to their service.Telecom contracts are for suckers.-Ted</tokentext>
<sentencetext>I have never been prevented from paying full price for the hardware from any carrier.
This allows me to go month to month on the service.I also do this with sattelite TV companies, and I've noticed they treat me better when I am not contractually bound to their service.Telecom contracts are for suckers.-Ted</sentencetext>
</comment>
<comment>
	<id>http://www.semanticweb.org/ontologies/ConversationInstances.owl#comment09_12_19_1429252.30499198</id>
	<title>Lower Cost Phones?</title>
	<author>eatblueshell</author>
	<datestamp>1261245660000</datestamp>
	<modclass>Insightful</modclass>
	<modscore>3</modscore>
	<htmltext>Absolute horse-crap. Phones are one of the most arbitrarily priced pieces of hardware on the market.

Take for example the 'free phone' it is 'retailed' at 200 plus dollars. It has not touch screen, no wifi, no app store, no legit mobile browser.

When in reality, you could buy, for that same 200 bucks, a iTouch, which gives you applications, wi-fi internet, Texting, and a significantly larger screen (touch screen even). Hell, with Wi-Fi, as long as you have access to a router, you can run Skype and Call anyone, FOR FREE!

Hell for 200 bucks you can get a netbook!

Cell-Phones are a huge, dare I say, price-fix bonanza. Friggen Rip-offs.</htmltext>
<tokenext>Absolute horse-crap .
Phones are one of the most arbitrarily priced pieces of hardware on the market .
Take for example the 'free phone ' it is 'retailed ' at 200 plus dollars .
It has not touch screen , no wifi , no app store , no legit mobile browser .
When in reality , you could buy , for that same 200 bucks , a iTouch , which gives you applications , wi-fi internet , Texting , and a significantly larger screen ( touch screen even ) .
Hell , with Wi-Fi , as long as you have access to a router , you can run Skype and Call anyone , FOR FREE !
Hell for 200 bucks you can get a netbook !
Cell-Phones are a huge , dare I say , price-fix bonanza .
Friggen Rip-offs .</tokentext>
<sentencetext>Absolute horse-crap.
Phones are one of the most arbitrarily priced pieces of hardware on the market.
Take for example the 'free phone' it is 'retailed' at 200 plus dollars.
It has not touch screen, no wifi, no app store, no legit mobile browser.
When in reality, you could buy, for that same 200 bucks, a iTouch, which gives you applications, wi-fi internet, Texting, and a significantly larger screen (touch screen even).
Hell, with Wi-Fi, as long as you have access to a router, you can run Skype and Call anyone, FOR FREE!
Hell for 200 bucks you can get a netbook!
Cell-Phones are a huge, dare I say, price-fix bonanza.
Friggen Rip-offs.</sentencetext>
</comment>
<comment>
	<id>http://www.semanticweb.org/ontologies/ConversationInstances.owl#comment09_12_19_1429252.30499496</id>
	<title>bye-bye, Verizon!</title>
	<author>david.emery</author>
	<datestamp>1261248000000</datestamp>
	<modclass>None</modclass>
	<modscore>1</modscore>
	<htmltext><p>I picked up his-and-her iPhones yesterday.  (Was scheduled for today, but we're getting all the snow they promised, 14" and coming down at 1"/hour).    Verizon coverage is very good, but ATT cannot be any worse than Verizon on customer service and in particular on corporate policies.  I got a call a couple of days ago from some Verizon sales rep trying to get me to replace/upgrade my phone.  I said "I don't want any of your new phones."</p><p>A friend has a Droid and is pretty happy.</p><p>Even if you're not an Apple fan, you have to give them credit for recasting the cellphone world and removing the chokehold the carriers had on costs, phones, customer service, etc, etc.</p></htmltext>
<tokenext>I picked up his-and-her iPhones yesterday .
( Was scheduled for today , but we 're getting all the snow they promised , 14 " and coming down at 1 " /hour ) .
Verizon coverage is very good , but ATT can not be any worse than Verizon on customer service and in particular on corporate policies .
I got a call a couple of days ago from some Verizon sales rep trying to get me to replace/upgrade my phone .
I said " I do n't want any of your new phones .
" A friend has a Droid and is pretty happy.Even if you 're not an Apple fan , you have to give them credit for recasting the cellphone world and removing the chokehold the carriers had on costs , phones , customer service , etc , etc .</tokentext>
<sentencetext>I picked up his-and-her iPhones yesterday.
(Was scheduled for today, but we're getting all the snow they promised, 14" and coming down at 1"/hour).
Verizon coverage is very good, but ATT cannot be any worse than Verizon on customer service and in particular on corporate policies.
I got a call a couple of days ago from some Verizon sales rep trying to get me to replace/upgrade my phone.
I said "I don't want any of your new phones.
"A friend has a Droid and is pretty happy.Even if you're not an Apple fan, you have to give them credit for recasting the cellphone world and removing the chokehold the carriers had on costs, phones, customer service, etc, etc.</sentencetext>
</comment>
<comment>
	<id>http://www.semanticweb.org/ontologies/ConversationInstances.owl#comment09_12_19_1429252.30499374</id>
	<title>Re:Don't pay the fee</title>
	<author>BrianRoach</author>
	<datestamp>1261246980000</datestamp>
	<modclass>None</modclass>
	<modscore>1</modscore>
	<htmltext><p><div class="quote"><p>Oh please .  Can I sign up, get service, and not sign and agreement?  NO.  Now exactly would I know how good their customer service, the network, or coverage is without signing up with them?</p>  </div><p>You're right, there is absolutely no way to research this information.</p><p>While I'm no fan of the telcos and know that their math is skewed, it's not like you can't do a little googling before making a two-year commitment to something. Or ask some friends / coworkers; more than likely at least a couple of them are going to have verizon.</p></div>
	</htmltext>
<tokenext>Oh please .
Can I sign up , get service , and not sign and agreement ?
NO. Now exactly would I know how good their customer service , the network , or coverage is without signing up with them ?
You 're right , there is absolutely no way to research this information.While I 'm no fan of the telcos and know that their math is skewed , it 's not like you ca n't do a little googling before making a two-year commitment to something .
Or ask some friends / coworkers ; more than likely at least a couple of them are going to have verizon .</tokentext>
<sentencetext>Oh please .
Can I sign up, get service, and not sign and agreement?
NO.  Now exactly would I know how good their customer service, the network, or coverage is without signing up with them?
You're right, there is absolutely no way to research this information.While I'm no fan of the telcos and know that their math is skewed, it's not like you can't do a little googling before making a two-year commitment to something.
Or ask some friends / coworkers; more than likely at least a couple of them are going to have verizon.
	</sentencetext>
	<parent>http://www.semanticweb.org/ontologies/ConversationInstances.owl#comment09_12_19_1429252.30499268</parent>
</comment>
<comment>
	<id>http://www.semanticweb.org/ontologies/ConversationInstances.owl#comment09_12_19_1429252.30499734</id>
	<title>Re:They can charge whatever they want</title>
	<author>timeOday</author>
	<datestamp>1261250220000</datestamp>
	<modclass>None</modclass>
	<modscore>1</modscore>
	<htmltext><blockquote><div><p>If they didn't get you on the back end, they could just charge you more up front to buy the phone, then amortize the up front cost through lower monthly bills, until in the end you pay the same amount. That way, they could even offer "no termination fee!" But I'm sure somebody would still get pissed at call it deceptive business practices.</p></div></blockquote><p>

You just made that up.  Why do you think it?  Obscure down-the-road fees are deceptive; up-front charges are not.  They're two different things.  That's the whole point.</p></div>
	</htmltext>
<tokenext>If they did n't get you on the back end , they could just charge you more up front to buy the phone , then amortize the up front cost through lower monthly bills , until in the end you pay the same amount .
That way , they could even offer " no termination fee !
" But I 'm sure somebody would still get pissed at call it deceptive business practices .
You just made that up .
Why do you think it ?
Obscure down-the-road fees are deceptive ; up-front charges are not .
They 're two different things .
That 's the whole point .</tokentext>
<sentencetext>If they didn't get you on the back end, they could just charge you more up front to buy the phone, then amortize the up front cost through lower monthly bills, until in the end you pay the same amount.
That way, they could even offer "no termination fee!
" But I'm sure somebody would still get pissed at call it deceptive business practices.
You just made that up.
Why do you think it?
Obscure down-the-road fees are deceptive; up-front charges are not.
They're two different things.
That's the whole point.
	</sentencetext>
	<parent>http://www.semanticweb.org/ontologies/ConversationInstances.owl#comment09_12_19_1429252.30498890</parent>
</comment>
<comment>
	<id>http://www.semanticweb.org/ontologies/ConversationInstances.owl#comment09_12_19_1429252.30501046</id>
	<title>Re:They can charge whatever they want</title>
	<author>noidentity</author>
	<datestamp>1261224960000</datestamp>
	<modclass>None</modclass>
	<modscore>1</modscore>
	<htmltext>It's ironic that someone who doesn't believe in IP (presumably because it conflicts with physical property) doesn't believe in physical property either. You signed a contract with the cell phone company. Deal with it. If you don't like such contracts, don't sign them! Nobody forced you.</htmltext>
<tokenext>It 's ironic that someone who does n't believe in IP ( presumably because it conflicts with physical property ) does n't believe in physical property either .
You signed a contract with the cell phone company .
Deal with it .
If you do n't like such contracts , do n't sign them !
Nobody forced you .</tokentext>
<sentencetext>It's ironic that someone who doesn't believe in IP (presumably because it conflicts with physical property) doesn't believe in physical property either.
You signed a contract with the cell phone company.
Deal with it.
If you don't like such contracts, don't sign them!
Nobody forced you.</sentencetext>
	<parent>http://www.semanticweb.org/ontologies/ConversationInstances.owl#comment09_12_19_1429252.30498890</parent>
</comment>
<comment>
	<id>http://www.semanticweb.org/ontologies/ConversationInstances.owl#comment09_12_19_1429252.30499418</id>
	<title>Re:They can charge whatever they want</title>
	<author>Anonymous</author>
	<datestamp>1261247280000</datestamp>
	<modclass>None</modclass>
	<modscore>0</modscore>
	<htmltext><p>Okay, here's what bugs me about this.  I'm inclined to purchase my phones outright, through ebay or any shop that sells used phones.  I often do this to avoid renewing my contract, because phone service from other carriers is starting to get better where I live.  If I upgrade my  plan to accomodate a yester-year smartphone that the company didn't subsidize at all, my ETF increases.  If I change my plan or upgrade a lower end phone, I'm still locked in for 2 years from the time I upgraded the new non-smartphone.</p><p>Verizon's policies suck, but it does have the fewest dropped calls where I live and on my commute.  It's only a free market when it's not the only player in the game, and I've been waiting a long time (7 years) for the competition to step up.</p></htmltext>
<tokenext>Okay , here 's what bugs me about this .
I 'm inclined to purchase my phones outright , through ebay or any shop that sells used phones .
I often do this to avoid renewing my contract , because phone service from other carriers is starting to get better where I live .
If I upgrade my plan to accomodate a yester-year smartphone that the company did n't subsidize at all , my ETF increases .
If I change my plan or upgrade a lower end phone , I 'm still locked in for 2 years from the time I upgraded the new non-smartphone.Verizon 's policies suck , but it does have the fewest dropped calls where I live and on my commute .
It 's only a free market when it 's not the only player in the game , and I 've been waiting a long time ( 7 years ) for the competition to step up .</tokentext>
<sentencetext>Okay, here's what bugs me about this.
I'm inclined to purchase my phones outright, through ebay or any shop that sells used phones.
I often do this to avoid renewing my contract, because phone service from other carriers is starting to get better where I live.
If I upgrade my  plan to accomodate a yester-year smartphone that the company didn't subsidize at all, my ETF increases.
If I change my plan or upgrade a lower end phone, I'm still locked in for 2 years from the time I upgraded the new non-smartphone.Verizon's policies suck, but it does have the fewest dropped calls where I live and on my commute.
It's only a free market when it's not the only player in the game, and I've been waiting a long time (7 years) for the competition to step up.</sentencetext>
	<parent>http://www.semanticweb.org/ontologies/ConversationInstances.owl#comment09_12_19_1429252.30498890</parent>
</comment>
<comment>
	<id>http://www.semanticweb.org/ontologies/ConversationInstances.owl#comment09_12_19_1429252.30499978</id>
	<title>Re:It's a problem with the whole industry</title>
	<author>phantomfive</author>
	<datestamp>1261252980000</datestamp>
	<modclass>None</modclass>
	<modscore>1</modscore>
	<htmltext>How much are you willing to pay for it?  The truth is, customer service in every industry in America is kind of lousy, because we'd rather do it ourselves and get a better deal. When most people are shopping for a cell phone plan, they aren't thinking, "how easy will it be for me to terminate this?" The primary thought in their mind is, "how much will this cost?"  As a cell phone company, if you can shave even a dollar off your monthly plan, that will give you a competitive advantage over the rest.<br> <br>
Also, Americans really are addicted to getting a good deal, which is why you can get free cell phones* all over the place.  In fact, my memory is that the cell phone never really became popular until the prices dropped down to around $30 for a phone. People just weren't willing to pay the true high cost.<br> <br>
*with a qualifying plan.</htmltext>
<tokenext>How much are you willing to pay for it ?
The truth is , customer service in every industry in America is kind of lousy , because we 'd rather do it ourselves and get a better deal .
When most people are shopping for a cell phone plan , they are n't thinking , " how easy will it be for me to terminate this ?
" The primary thought in their mind is , " how much will this cost ?
" As a cell phone company , if you can shave even a dollar off your monthly plan , that will give you a competitive advantage over the rest .
Also , Americans really are addicted to getting a good deal , which is why you can get free cell phones * all over the place .
In fact , my memory is that the cell phone never really became popular until the prices dropped down to around $ 30 for a phone .
People just were n't willing to pay the true high cost .
* with a qualifying plan .</tokentext>
<sentencetext>How much are you willing to pay for it?
The truth is, customer service in every industry in America is kind of lousy, because we'd rather do it ourselves and get a better deal.
When most people are shopping for a cell phone plan, they aren't thinking, "how easy will it be for me to terminate this?
" The primary thought in their mind is, "how much will this cost?
"  As a cell phone company, if you can shave even a dollar off your monthly plan, that will give you a competitive advantage over the rest.
Also, Americans really are addicted to getting a good deal, which is why you can get free cell phones* all over the place.
In fact, my memory is that the cell phone never really became popular until the prices dropped down to around $30 for a phone.
People just weren't willing to pay the true high cost.
*with a qualifying plan.</sentencetext>
	<parent>http://www.semanticweb.org/ontologies/ConversationInstances.owl#comment09_12_19_1429252.30498932</parent>
</comment>
<comment>
	<id>http://www.semanticweb.org/ontologies/ConversationInstances.owl#comment09_12_19_1429252.30499846</id>
	<title>Re:Oh boo, friggen, hoo...</title>
	<author>Anonymous</author>
	<datestamp>1261251240000</datestamp>
	<modclass>None</modclass>
	<modscore>1</modscore>
	<htmltext>I don't even understand why there should be early termination fees.  If they want to subsidize the cost of the phone, just give the person a loan and add its repayment costs to the monthly charge.  They already pull your credit report when you sign up for service anyway.  If the customer leaves early, the remaining balance of the loan becomes due.  Simple and keeps the numbers straight and legit.
<br> <br>
The only reason the cellular companies play this subsidized phone and early termination fee charade is to take advantage of people like me.  I've had the same phone for almost 4 years now.  I've long since paid back any subsidy which lowered my initial purchase price.  Yet I'm still paying the same monthly service fee (and hence subsidy repayment fee) as someone who got a brand spanking new smartphone last week.</htmltext>
<tokenext>I do n't even understand why there should be early termination fees .
If they want to subsidize the cost of the phone , just give the person a loan and add its repayment costs to the monthly charge .
They already pull your credit report when you sign up for service anyway .
If the customer leaves early , the remaining balance of the loan becomes due .
Simple and keeps the numbers straight and legit .
The only reason the cellular companies play this subsidized phone and early termination fee charade is to take advantage of people like me .
I 've had the same phone for almost 4 years now .
I 've long since paid back any subsidy which lowered my initial purchase price .
Yet I 'm still paying the same monthly service fee ( and hence subsidy repayment fee ) as someone who got a brand spanking new smartphone last week .</tokentext>
<sentencetext>I don't even understand why there should be early termination fees.
If they want to subsidize the cost of the phone, just give the person a loan and add its repayment costs to the monthly charge.
They already pull your credit report when you sign up for service anyway.
If the customer leaves early, the remaining balance of the loan becomes due.
Simple and keeps the numbers straight and legit.
The only reason the cellular companies play this subsidized phone and early termination fee charade is to take advantage of people like me.
I've had the same phone for almost 4 years now.
I've long since paid back any subsidy which lowered my initial purchase price.
Yet I'm still paying the same monthly service fee (and hence subsidy repayment fee) as someone who got a brand spanking new smartphone last week.</sentencetext>
	<parent>http://www.semanticweb.org/ontologies/ConversationInstances.owl#comment09_12_19_1429252.30498984</parent>
</comment>
<comment>
	<id>http://www.semanticweb.org/ontologies/ConversationInstances.owl#comment09_12_19_1429252.30500194</id>
	<title>Re:It's a problem with the whole industry</title>
	<author>Anonymous</author>
	<datestamp>1261255620000</datestamp>
	<modclass>None</modclass>
	<modscore>0</modscore>
	<htmltext><p>Having dealt with various three letter government agencies over the phone, I think that's about the only way the telecoms' customer service could be made worse than it already is.  I've gotten better help from Bangalore than from Lansing.</p></htmltext>
<tokenext>Having dealt with various three letter government agencies over the phone , I think that 's about the only way the telecoms ' customer service could be made worse than it already is .
I 've gotten better help from Bangalore than from Lansing .</tokentext>
<sentencetext>Having dealt with various three letter government agencies over the phone, I think that's about the only way the telecoms' customer service could be made worse than it already is.
I've gotten better help from Bangalore than from Lansing.</sentencetext>
	<parent>http://www.semanticweb.org/ontologies/ConversationInstances.owl#comment09_12_19_1429252.30498932</parent>
</comment>
<comment>
	<id>http://www.semanticweb.org/ontologies/ConversationInstances.owl#comment09_12_19_1429252.30499954</id>
	<title>Re:Don't pay the fee</title>
	<author>Sirusjr</author>
	<datestamp>1261252680000</datestamp>
	<modclass>None</modclass>
	<modscore>1</modscore>
	<htmltext>Everyone should know that you have to pay an early termination fee if you get a 2 year contract with your free phone.  That is how things work and if you don't want to pay it, put up with the phone you have for another 2 years (or less hopefully unless you JUST UPGRADED).  More than likely if you are able to get by with your phone for any length of time you can also get by just as well for another year and a half before splitting to another provider that will shaft you just as much with the same sorts of fees.</htmltext>
<tokenext>Everyone should know that you have to pay an early termination fee if you get a 2 year contract with your free phone .
That is how things work and if you do n't want to pay it , put up with the phone you have for another 2 years ( or less hopefully unless you JUST UPGRADED ) .
More than likely if you are able to get by with your phone for any length of time you can also get by just as well for another year and a half before splitting to another provider that will shaft you just as much with the same sorts of fees .</tokentext>
<sentencetext>Everyone should know that you have to pay an early termination fee if you get a 2 year contract with your free phone.
That is how things work and if you don't want to pay it, put up with the phone you have for another 2 years (or less hopefully unless you JUST UPGRADED).
More than likely if you are able to get by with your phone for any length of time you can also get by just as well for another year and a half before splitting to another provider that will shaft you just as much with the same sorts of fees.</sentencetext>
	<parent>http://www.semanticweb.org/ontologies/ConversationInstances.owl#comment09_12_19_1429252.30499278</parent>
</comment>
<comment>
	<id>http://www.semanticweb.org/ontologies/ConversationInstances.owl#comment09_12_19_1429252.30499208</id>
	<title>Re:Meh.</title>
	<author>Ogive17</author>
	<datestamp>1261245660000</datestamp>
	<modclass>None</modclass>
	<modscore>1</modscore>
	<htmltext>I only pay $65/month through Verizon for my blackberry storm.  I consider that a good deal since my co-worker has an iPhone 3G and pays $80/month for the same plan and the phones have very similar features.</htmltext>
<tokenext>I only pay $ 65/month through Verizon for my blackberry storm .
I consider that a good deal since my co-worker has an iPhone 3G and pays $ 80/month for the same plan and the phones have very similar features .</tokentext>
<sentencetext>I only pay $65/month through Verizon for my blackberry storm.
I consider that a good deal since my co-worker has an iPhone 3G and pays $80/month for the same plan and the phones have very similar features.</sentencetext>
	<parent>http://www.semanticweb.org/ontologies/ConversationInstances.owl#comment09_12_19_1429252.30498872</parent>
</comment>
<comment>
	<id>http://www.semanticweb.org/ontologies/ConversationInstances.owl#comment09_12_19_1429252.30503048</id>
	<title>What?</title>
	<author>clint999</author>
	<datestamp>1261308600000</datestamp>
	<modclass>None</modclass>
	<modscore>-1</modscore>
	<htmltext><i>Take a look at Wallyworld now. If you check the Verizon rack on the pre-paid phones and then look at the phones for contracts, you'll see that getting a basic phone locks you into a $350 ETF for a $45 phone. And yes, you can buy the $45 phone and then put it on a monthly account without an ETF.</i></htmltext>
<tokenext>Take a look at Wallyworld now .
If you check the Verizon rack on the pre-paid phones and then look at the phones for contracts , you 'll see that getting a basic phone locks you into a $ 350 ETF for a $ 45 phone .
And yes , you can buy the $ 45 phone and then put it on a monthly account without an ETF .</tokentext>
<sentencetext>Take a look at Wallyworld now.
If you check the Verizon rack on the pre-paid phones and then look at the phones for contracts, you'll see that getting a basic phone locks you into a $350 ETF for a $45 phone.
And yes, you can buy the $45 phone and then put it on a monthly account without an ETF.</sentencetext>
</comment>
<comment>
	<id>http://www.semanticweb.org/ontologies/ConversationInstances.owl#comment09_12_19_1429252.30500138</id>
	<title>That's nothin!</title>
	<author>Anonymous</author>
	<datestamp>1261255020000</datestamp>
	<modclass>None</modclass>
	<modscore>0</modscore>
	<htmltext><p>My T-mobile early termination fee was 500 dollars... That was \_years\_ ago.... WTF?<br>I'm never going to pay it... Fuck the credit system!</p></htmltext>
<tokenext>My T-mobile early termination fee was 500 dollars... That was \ _years \ _ ago.... WTF ? I 'm never going to pay it... Fuck the credit system !</tokentext>
<sentencetext>My T-mobile early termination fee was 500 dollars... That was \_years\_ ago.... WTF?I'm never going to pay it... Fuck the credit system!</sentencetext>
</comment>
<comment>
	<id>http://www.semanticweb.org/ontologies/ConversationInstances.owl#comment09_12_19_1429252.30498856</id>
	<title>Federal Trade Commission</title>
	<author>Anonymous</author>
	<datestamp>1261242840000</datestamp>
	<modclass>Insightful</modclass>
	<modscore>1</modscore>
	<htmltext><p>Maybe consumers would have a better chance at fairness if Verizon had to justify itself to the FTC.</p></htmltext>
<tokenext>Maybe consumers would have a better chance at fairness if Verizon had to justify itself to the FTC .</tokentext>
<sentencetext>Maybe consumers would have a better chance at fairness if Verizon had to justify itself to the FTC.</sentencetext>
</comment>
<comment>
	<id>http://www.semanticweb.org/ontologies/ConversationInstances.owl#comment09_12_19_1429252.30499850</id>
	<title>Did you notice...</title>
	<author>Hurricane78</author>
	<datestamp>1261251240000</datestamp>
	<modclass>None</modclass>
	<modscore>1</modscore>
	<htmltext><p>...that a totally &ldquo;free&rdquo; market, is the exact same thing as the law of the jungle?</p><p>Which is the opposite of democracy on the &ldquo;democracyness&rdquo; scale. (Beware, that I don&rsquo;t say that that scale can&rsquo;t have negative numbers too.<nobr> <wbr></nobr>:)</p><p>If you tell that to a fundamentalist &ldquo;free market&rdquo; republican, does his head explode? ^^</p><p>&ldquo;We must have a democracy.<br>But we must also have a completely free market.<br>But we must have a democracy.<br>But... aaaaahhhh *BANG*&rdquo;</p></htmltext>
<tokenext>...that a totally    free    market , is the exact same thing as the law of the jungle ? Which is the opposite of democracy on the    democracyness    scale .
( Beware , that I don    t say that that scale can    t have negative numbers too .
: ) If you tell that to a fundamentalist    free market    republican , does his head explode ?
^ ^    We must have a democracy.But we must also have a completely free market.But we must have a democracy.But... aaaaahhhh * BANG *   </tokentext>
<sentencetext>...that a totally “free” market, is the exact same thing as the law of the jungle?Which is the opposite of democracy on the “democracyness” scale.
(Beware, that I don’t say that that scale can’t have negative numbers too.
:)If you tell that to a fundamentalist “free market” republican, does his head explode?
^^“We must have a democracy.But we must also have a completely free market.But we must have a democracy.But... aaaaahhhh *BANG*”</sentencetext>
	<parent>http://www.semanticweb.org/ontologies/ConversationInstances.owl#comment09_12_19_1429252.30498890</parent>
</comment>
<comment>
	<id>http://www.semanticweb.org/ontologies/ConversationInstances.owl#comment09_12_19_1429252.30500698</id>
	<title>t-mobile</title>
	<author>luther349</author>
	<datestamp>1261219560000</datestamp>
	<modclass>None</modclass>
	<modscore>0</modscore>
	<htmltext>t-mobile has everything you guys ask for. they have a no contract option where you do pay full price for the hardware but of course you dont gotta worry abought termination fees. there rates are the lowest of all the company's. and there customer support doesn't make you to commit suscude after speaking with them, its kinda like dish network vs cable. cable companys got insanly high rates and crappy[y customer support. my dish had a issue the other day and they had a tech out hear the next day you herd my right the next day. and i pay abought half what i did for cable. yet cable companys are still a huge monnpooly.</htmltext>
<tokenext>t-mobile has everything you guys ask for .
they have a no contract option where you do pay full price for the hardware but of course you dont got ta worry abought termination fees .
there rates are the lowest of all the company 's .
and there customer support does n't make you to commit suscude after speaking with them , its kinda like dish network vs cable .
cable companys got insanly high rates and crappy [ y customer support .
my dish had a issue the other day and they had a tech out hear the next day you herd my right the next day .
and i pay abought half what i did for cable .
yet cable companys are still a huge monnpooly .</tokentext>
<sentencetext>t-mobile has everything you guys ask for.
they have a no contract option where you do pay full price for the hardware but of course you dont gotta worry abought termination fees.
there rates are the lowest of all the company's.
and there customer support doesn't make you to commit suscude after speaking with them, its kinda like dish network vs cable.
cable companys got insanly high rates and crappy[y customer support.
my dish had a issue the other day and they had a tech out hear the next day you herd my right the next day.
and i pay abought half what i did for cable.
yet cable companys are still a huge monnpooly.</sentencetext>
</comment>
<comment>
	<id>http://www.semanticweb.org/ontologies/ConversationInstances.owl#comment09_12_19_1429252.30500660</id>
	<title>Re:Crippling Early Termination Fee</title>
	<author>demonlapin</author>
	<datestamp>1261218960000</datestamp>
	<modclass>Informativ</modclass>
	<modscore>2</modscore>
	<htmltext>They can't do it in the US, either, although<nobr> <wbr></nobr>/. readers frequently  miss that.  Verizon has raised the ETF for <em>new subsidized smartphone purchases</em>.  I got my Droid on launch day, before the hike, and if I wanted to terminate service it would be $175.  My fee has not changed.</htmltext>
<tokenext>They ca n't do it in the US , either , although / .
readers frequently miss that .
Verizon has raised the ETF for new subsidized smartphone purchases .
I got my Droid on launch day , before the hike , and if I wanted to terminate service it would be $ 175 .
My fee has not changed .</tokentext>
<sentencetext>They can't do it in the US, either, although /.
readers frequently  miss that.
Verizon has raised the ETF for new subsidized smartphone purchases.
I got my Droid on launch day, before the hike, and if I wanted to terminate service it would be $175.
My fee has not changed.</sentencetext>
	<parent>http://www.semanticweb.org/ontologies/ConversationInstances.owl#comment09_12_19_1429252.30499876</parent>
</comment>
<comment>
	<id>http://www.semanticweb.org/ontologies/ConversationInstances.owl#comment09_12_19_1429252.30499940</id>
	<title>Not a 'Free Market'</title>
	<author>Anonymous</author>
	<datestamp>1261252440000</datestamp>
	<modclass>Insightful</modclass>
	<modscore>3</modscore>
	<htmltext>It's an oligopoly (with a high risk of collusion)...</htmltext>
<tokenext>It 's an oligopoly ( with a high risk of collusion ) .. .</tokentext>
<sentencetext>It's an oligopoly (with a high risk of collusion)...</sentencetext>
	<parent>http://www.semanticweb.org/ontologies/ConversationInstances.owl#comment09_12_19_1429252.30498890</parent>
</comment>
<comment>
	<id>http://www.semanticweb.org/ontologies/ConversationInstances.owl#comment09_12_19_1429252.30498936</id>
	<title>Umm...</title>
	<author>Timothy Brownawell</author>
	<datestamp>1261243560000</datestamp>
	<modclass>None</modclass>
	<modscore>1</modscore>
	<htmltext><p><div class="quote"><p>they also say that because they pro-rate the fee depending on how much of your contract is left, they still lose money.</p> </div><p>...So, they claim to be <em>losing money</em> on all the subscribers who <em>don't</em> cancel their contracts early?</p><p>That can't possibly be right, maybe I should go RTFA to see if it really says the same thing...</p></div>
	</htmltext>
<tokenext>they also say that because they pro-rate the fee depending on how much of your contract is left , they still lose money .
...So , they claim to be losing money on all the subscribers who do n't cancel their contracts early ? That ca n't possibly be right , maybe I should go RTFA to see if it really says the same thing.. .</tokentext>
<sentencetext>they also say that because they pro-rate the fee depending on how much of your contract is left, they still lose money.
...So, they claim to be losing money on all the subscribers who don't cancel their contracts early?That can't possibly be right, maybe I should go RTFA to see if it really says the same thing...
	</sentencetext>
</comment>
<comment>
	<id>http://www.semanticweb.org/ontologies/ConversationInstances.owl#comment09_12_19_1429252.30499098</id>
	<title>Just say it.</title>
	<author>MrCrassic</author>
	<datestamp>1261244940000</datestamp>
	<modclass>None</modclass>
	<modscore>1</modscore>
	<htmltext><p>Since this is the crux of it...</p><p><div class="quote"><p>Verizon Wireless said Friday that it doubled the fees for customers to break service contracts for smart phones because those devices cost much more.</p></div><p>and other companies have <b>not</b> raised their ETF incredibly (including AT&amp;T, who just so happens to have rights to the most smartphones, including iPhone), it basically comes down to maximizing profit with the added benefit of increasing retention rate. In other words, they want more money.</p><p>However, it's not completely bleak, since they do decrease the ETF like other carriers do:</p><p><div class="quote"><p>Verizon, like several other carriers, lowers the price of the early termination fee over the length of the contract. A Verizon customer who canceled a two-year contract after 23 months would still be charged $120, though.</p></div><p>It must suck if Verizon Wireless is one's only option. If it isn't, it makes <b>zero</b> sense to switch (except for network coverage, but AT&amp;T is practically right there with them).</p></div>
	</htmltext>
<tokenext>Since this is the crux of it...Verizon Wireless said Friday that it doubled the fees for customers to break service contracts for smart phones because those devices cost much more.and other companies have not raised their ETF incredibly ( including AT&amp;T , who just so happens to have rights to the most smartphones , including iPhone ) , it basically comes down to maximizing profit with the added benefit of increasing retention rate .
In other words , they want more money.However , it 's not completely bleak , since they do decrease the ETF like other carriers do : Verizon , like several other carriers , lowers the price of the early termination fee over the length of the contract .
A Verizon customer who canceled a two-year contract after 23 months would still be charged $ 120 , though.It must suck if Verizon Wireless is one 's only option .
If it is n't , it makes zero sense to switch ( except for network coverage , but AT&amp;T is practically right there with them ) .</tokentext>
<sentencetext>Since this is the crux of it...Verizon Wireless said Friday that it doubled the fees for customers to break service contracts for smart phones because those devices cost much more.and other companies have not raised their ETF incredibly (including AT&amp;T, who just so happens to have rights to the most smartphones, including iPhone), it basically comes down to maximizing profit with the added benefit of increasing retention rate.
In other words, they want more money.However, it's not completely bleak, since they do decrease the ETF like other carriers do:Verizon, like several other carriers, lowers the price of the early termination fee over the length of the contract.
A Verizon customer who canceled a two-year contract after 23 months would still be charged $120, though.It must suck if Verizon Wireless is one's only option.
If it isn't, it makes zero sense to switch (except for network coverage, but AT&amp;T is practically right there with them).
	</sentencetext>
</comment>
<comment>
	<id>http://www.semanticweb.org/ontologies/ConversationInstances.owl#comment09_12_19_1429252.30499238</id>
	<title>I'm with verizon because of the customer service</title>
	<author>Anonymous</author>
	<datestamp>1261246020000</datestamp>
	<modclass>None</modclass>
	<modscore>0</modscore>
	<htmltext><p>After having spent 12+ years in the wireless business building the non-wireline cellular network (A-side, was Cellular One, absorbed into Cingular, absorbed into AT&amp;T wireless) in several parts of the country, you'd think I'd stay with them. I have been with Verizon now for 8 of the last 10 years and the primary reasons are service almost anywhere I've been and their customer service. I've been mistreated and abused by Cingular, AT&amp;T, US West (in Minnesota), and Sprint. The difference between them and Verizon is night and day. I can usually get anything handled with Verizon in one phone call, usually talking to one person. If something happens that the problem isn't resolved on that phone call, they make arrangements to call me back. And, get this - they do!</p><p>The only thing that makes Verizon suck is their nickel and dime billing strategy* and their penchant for late, crippled phones that suck compared to the other carriers (droid is late, but it doesn't look crippled, I'm sorely tempted!). However, with all the places that abuse me as nothing more than a "consumer," I'll put up with Verizon's other practices to be treated like a human customer! [* just don't use vcast, vnavigator, or anything branded verizon, don't download stupid BREW apps, and get a plan with unlimited text and your bill won't vary due to nickels and dimes everywhere. If you get a smartphone, make sure you get one that can be hacked - HTC are especially good for this, but generally any full windows mobile phone has been hackable, just not the windows smartphone ones-the ones that don't have touch screen and are crackberry wannabes.]</p><p>[on an unrelated note, this javascript enabled reply box sucks! I wanted to edit a previous sentence and it kept disrupting the mouse's ability to place the cursor in the text. Eventually I had to click in the center of the box and use the cursor keys.]</p></htmltext>
<tokenext>After having spent 12 + years in the wireless business building the non-wireline cellular network ( A-side , was Cellular One , absorbed into Cingular , absorbed into AT&amp;T wireless ) in several parts of the country , you 'd think I 'd stay with them .
I have been with Verizon now for 8 of the last 10 years and the primary reasons are service almost anywhere I 've been and their customer service .
I 've been mistreated and abused by Cingular , AT&amp;T , US West ( in Minnesota ) , and Sprint .
The difference between them and Verizon is night and day .
I can usually get anything handled with Verizon in one phone call , usually talking to one person .
If something happens that the problem is n't resolved on that phone call , they make arrangements to call me back .
And , get this - they do ! The only thing that makes Verizon suck is their nickel and dime billing strategy * and their penchant for late , crippled phones that suck compared to the other carriers ( droid is late , but it does n't look crippled , I 'm sorely tempted ! ) .
However , with all the places that abuse me as nothing more than a " consumer , " I 'll put up with Verizon 's other practices to be treated like a human customer !
[ * just do n't use vcast , vnavigator , or anything branded verizon , do n't download stupid BREW apps , and get a plan with unlimited text and your bill wo n't vary due to nickels and dimes everywhere .
If you get a smartphone , make sure you get one that can be hacked - HTC are especially good for this , but generally any full windows mobile phone has been hackable , just not the windows smartphone ones-the ones that do n't have touch screen and are crackberry wannabes .
] [ on an unrelated note , this javascript enabled reply box sucks !
I wanted to edit a previous sentence and it kept disrupting the mouse 's ability to place the cursor in the text .
Eventually I had to click in the center of the box and use the cursor keys .
]</tokentext>
<sentencetext>After having spent 12+ years in the wireless business building the non-wireline cellular network (A-side, was Cellular One, absorbed into Cingular, absorbed into AT&amp;T wireless) in several parts of the country, you'd think I'd stay with them.
I have been with Verizon now for 8 of the last 10 years and the primary reasons are service almost anywhere I've been and their customer service.
I've been mistreated and abused by Cingular, AT&amp;T, US West (in Minnesota), and Sprint.
The difference between them and Verizon is night and day.
I can usually get anything handled with Verizon in one phone call, usually talking to one person.
If something happens that the problem isn't resolved on that phone call, they make arrangements to call me back.
And, get this - they do!The only thing that makes Verizon suck is their nickel and dime billing strategy* and their penchant for late, crippled phones that suck compared to the other carriers (droid is late, but it doesn't look crippled, I'm sorely tempted!).
However, with all the places that abuse me as nothing more than a "consumer," I'll put up with Verizon's other practices to be treated like a human customer!
[* just don't use vcast, vnavigator, or anything branded verizon, don't download stupid BREW apps, and get a plan with unlimited text and your bill won't vary due to nickels and dimes everywhere.
If you get a smartphone, make sure you get one that can be hacked - HTC are especially good for this, but generally any full windows mobile phone has been hackable, just not the windows smartphone ones-the ones that don't have touch screen and are crackberry wannabes.
][on an unrelated note, this javascript enabled reply box sucks!
I wanted to edit a previous sentence and it kept disrupting the mouse's ability to place the cursor in the text.
Eventually I had to click in the center of the box and use the cursor keys.
]</sentencetext>
</comment>
<comment>
	<id>http://www.semanticweb.org/ontologies/ConversationInstances.owl#comment09_12_19_1429252.30500252</id>
	<title>Re:Crippling Early Termination Fee</title>
	<author>Anonymous</author>
	<datestamp>1261213320000</datestamp>
	<modclass>None</modclass>
	<modscore>0</modscore>
	<htmltext><p>According to the paper work the higher termination fee isn't retroactive. It doesn't apply to my droid, which I purchased the day it came out (along with a plan). Essentially I have paper work that says I can quit right now, pay the old termination fee, and end up paying verizon less than the cost of the phone overall.</p></htmltext>
<tokenext>According to the paper work the higher termination fee is n't retroactive .
It does n't apply to my droid , which I purchased the day it came out ( along with a plan ) .
Essentially I have paper work that says I can quit right now , pay the old termination fee , and end up paying verizon less than the cost of the phone overall .</tokentext>
<sentencetext>According to the paper work the higher termination fee isn't retroactive.
It doesn't apply to my droid, which I purchased the day it came out (along with a plan).
Essentially I have paper work that says I can quit right now, pay the old termination fee, and end up paying verizon less than the cost of the phone overall.</sentencetext>
	<parent>http://www.semanticweb.org/ontologies/ConversationInstances.owl#comment09_12_19_1429252.30498908</parent>
</comment>
<comment>
	<id>http://www.semanticweb.org/ontologies/ConversationInstances.owl#comment09_12_19_1429252.30560218</id>
	<title>Re:bye-bye, Verizon!</title>
	<author>Ender\_Wiggin</author>
	<datestamp>1261841640000</datestamp>
	<modclass>None</modclass>
	<modscore>1</modscore>
	<htmltext><p>Apple removed the carriers' veto power over cell phone features. Verizon has disabled or crippled countless features on their phones. Apple made sure they had creative control over the device; no forced branding, no blocking of features, allowing the use of WiFi and some VoIP</p></htmltext>
<tokenext>Apple removed the carriers ' veto power over cell phone features .
Verizon has disabled or crippled countless features on their phones .
Apple made sure they had creative control over the device ; no forced branding , no blocking of features , allowing the use of WiFi and some VoIP</tokentext>
<sentencetext>Apple removed the carriers' veto power over cell phone features.
Verizon has disabled or crippled countless features on their phones.
Apple made sure they had creative control over the device; no forced branding, no blocking of features, allowing the use of WiFi and some VoIP</sentencetext>
	<parent>http://www.semanticweb.org/ontologies/ConversationInstances.owl#comment09_12_19_1429252.30499760</parent>
</comment>
<comment>
	<id>http://www.semanticweb.org/ontologies/ConversationInstances.owl#comment09_12_19_1429252.30502664</id>
	<title>cut the cord...</title>
	<author>twoHats</author>
	<datestamp>1261341600000</datestamp>
	<modclass>None</modclass>
	<modscore>1</modscore>
	<htmltext>...or some other anachronism that means dump the crooks.  I did a couple of years ago, and am about 2500 bucks richer - minus the 200 i have spent on wireless since then, and have only missed the endless time on the phone to customer service.</htmltext>
<tokenext>...or some other anachronism that means dump the crooks .
I did a couple of years ago , and am about 2500 bucks richer - minus the 200 i have spent on wireless since then , and have only missed the endless time on the phone to customer service .</tokentext>
<sentencetext>...or some other anachronism that means dump the crooks.
I did a couple of years ago, and am about 2500 bucks richer - minus the 200 i have spent on wireless since then, and have only missed the endless time on the phone to customer service.</sentencetext>
</comment>
<comment>
	<id>http://www.semanticweb.org/ontologies/ConversationInstances.owl#comment09_12_19_1429252.30499760</id>
	<title>Re:bye-bye, Verizon!</title>
	<author>Anonymous</author>
	<datestamp>1261250460000</datestamp>
	<modclass>Insightful</modclass>
	<modscore>2</modscore>
	<htmltext><p><div class="quote"><p>Even if you're not an Apple fan, you have to give them credit for recasting the cellphone world and removing the chokehold the carriers had on costs, phones, customer service, etc, etc.</p></div><p>Sorry, what? No I don't.</p><p>What, exactly, has Apple done to help that situation?</p></div>
	</htmltext>
<tokenext>Even if you 're not an Apple fan , you have to give them credit for recasting the cellphone world and removing the chokehold the carriers had on costs , phones , customer service , etc , etc.Sorry , what ?
No I do n't.What , exactly , has Apple done to help that situation ?</tokentext>
<sentencetext>Even if you're not an Apple fan, you have to give them credit for recasting the cellphone world and removing the chokehold the carriers had on costs, phones, customer service, etc, etc.Sorry, what?
No I don't.What, exactly, has Apple done to help that situation?
	</sentencetext>
	<parent>http://www.semanticweb.org/ontologies/ConversationInstances.owl#comment09_12_19_1429252.30499496</parent>
</comment>
<comment>
	<id>http://www.semanticweb.org/ontologies/ConversationInstances.owl#comment09_12_19_1429252.30502162</id>
	<title>Reminds me of my warranty dance</title>
	<author>pem</author>
	<datestamp>1261243800000</datestamp>
	<modclass>None</modclass>
	<modscore>1</modscore>
	<htmltext>Sometimes I go to (insert big office/computer store retailer here) to buy a new machine, when I'm too busy/lazy to put one together.
<p>
When I have the big, heavy, cardboard box up near the cash register and they start asking me if I want their warranty, I set it down as quickly as possible without any damage, back up like I just found out it's infected with ebola, and say in a very loud, incredulous, voice "It's going to BREAK!!?!  I don't want it if it's going to BREAK!!!"
</p><p>
Of course, they assure me that it's perfectly fine, so I ask why they even sell warranties, and then they go into some weaselly song and dance.  But the upshot is, I don't get the usual hard-sell on the warranty, because I've convinced them I'm ready to bolt without the hardware.</p></htmltext>
<tokenext>Sometimes I go to ( insert big office/computer store retailer here ) to buy a new machine , when I 'm too busy/lazy to put one together .
When I have the big , heavy , cardboard box up near the cash register and they start asking me if I want their warranty , I set it down as quickly as possible without any damage , back up like I just found out it 's infected with ebola , and say in a very loud , incredulous , voice " It 's going to BREAK ! ! ? !
I do n't want it if it 's going to BREAK ! ! !
" Of course , they assure me that it 's perfectly fine , so I ask why they even sell warranties , and then they go into some weaselly song and dance .
But the upshot is , I do n't get the usual hard-sell on the warranty , because I 've convinced them I 'm ready to bolt without the hardware .</tokentext>
<sentencetext>Sometimes I go to (insert big office/computer store retailer here) to buy a new machine, when I'm too busy/lazy to put one together.
When I have the big, heavy, cardboard box up near the cash register and they start asking me if I want their warranty, I set it down as quickly as possible without any damage, back up like I just found out it's infected with ebola, and say in a very loud, incredulous, voice "It's going to BREAK!!?!
I don't want it if it's going to BREAK!!!
"

Of course, they assure me that it's perfectly fine, so I ask why they even sell warranties, and then they go into some weaselly song and dance.
But the upshot is, I don't get the usual hard-sell on the warranty, because I've convinced them I'm ready to bolt without the hardware.</sentencetext>
	<parent>http://www.semanticweb.org/ontologies/ConversationInstances.owl#comment09_12_19_1429252.30499918</parent>
</comment>
<comment>
	<id>http://www.semanticweb.org/ontologies/ConversationInstances.owl#comment09_12_19_1429252.30500742</id>
	<title>Why stop at doubling?</title>
	<author>drwav</author>
	<datestamp>1261220280000</datestamp>
	<modclass>None</modclass>
	<modscore>1</modscore>
	<htmltext><p>Just make the early termination fee $1 billion and change the contract length from 2 years to 100 years. Then shut down all the towers and fire all employees so that the CEO and a few other high ups are the only ones collecting money. It isn't like they will need to worry about anyone ever leaving ever so who cares if they don't actually provide service since they have a "service not guaranteed" clause in the contract anyway.</p></htmltext>
<tokenext>Just make the early termination fee $ 1 billion and change the contract length from 2 years to 100 years .
Then shut down all the towers and fire all employees so that the CEO and a few other high ups are the only ones collecting money .
It is n't like they will need to worry about anyone ever leaving ever so who cares if they do n't actually provide service since they have a " service not guaranteed " clause in the contract anyway .</tokentext>
<sentencetext>Just make the early termination fee $1 billion and change the contract length from 2 years to 100 years.
Then shut down all the towers and fire all employees so that the CEO and a few other high ups are the only ones collecting money.
It isn't like they will need to worry about anyone ever leaving ever so who cares if they don't actually provide service since they have a "service not guaranteed" clause in the contract anyway.</sentencetext>
</comment>
<comment>
	<id>http://www.semanticweb.org/ontologies/ConversationInstances.owl#comment09_12_19_1429252.30499980</id>
	<title>Re:Lower Cost Phones?</title>
	<author>tixxit</author>
	<datestamp>1261252980000</datestamp>
	<modclass>None</modclass>
	<modscore>1</modscore>
	<htmltext>Hrmm... I got my phone for $70 CAD brand new from my carrier 1.5 years ago and have had no problems with it (it is my primary phone). When I was looking, all the carriers had basic phones (speaker phone, basic bluetooth, shitty camera, etc.) available for under $100 CAD.</htmltext>
<tokenext>Hrmm... I got my phone for $ 70 CAD brand new from my carrier 1.5 years ago and have had no problems with it ( it is my primary phone ) .
When I was looking , all the carriers had basic phones ( speaker phone , basic bluetooth , shitty camera , etc .
) available for under $ 100 CAD .</tokentext>
<sentencetext>Hrmm... I got my phone for $70 CAD brand new from my carrier 1.5 years ago and have had no problems with it (it is my primary phone).
When I was looking, all the carriers had basic phones (speaker phone, basic bluetooth, shitty camera, etc.
) available for under $100 CAD.</sentencetext>
	<parent>http://www.semanticweb.org/ontologies/ConversationInstances.owl#comment09_12_19_1429252.30499198</parent>
</comment>
<comment>
	<id>http://www.semanticweb.org/ontologies/ConversationInstances.owl#comment09_12_19_1429252.30499668</id>
	<title>In other News</title>
	<author>/dev/trash</author>
	<datestamp>1261249440000</datestamp>
	<modclass>None</modclass>
	<modscore>1</modscore>
	<htmltext><p>My pay as I go Virgin Mobile phone works just great.  See if I wanna visit a web page, I wait til I'm at a computer.  Call me old skool.</p></htmltext>
<tokenext>My pay as I go Virgin Mobile phone works just great .
See if I wan na visit a web page , I wait til I 'm at a computer .
Call me old skool .</tokentext>
<sentencetext>My pay as I go Virgin Mobile phone works just great.
See if I wanna visit a web page, I wait til I'm at a computer.
Call me old skool.</sentencetext>
</comment>
<comment>
	<id>http://www.semanticweb.org/ontologies/ConversationInstances.owl#comment09_12_19_1429252.30498908</id>
	<title>Crippling Early Termination Fee</title>
	<author>eldavojohn</author>
	<datestamp>1261243320000</datestamp>
	<modclass>Funny</modclass>
	<modscore>5</modscore>
	<htmltext><b>AT&amp;T CEO</b>: So, basically when the new iPhone 3GS++ comes out, people will be leaving other carriers in droves.<br>
<b>Verizon CEO</b>: No matter, every customer signed a contract with more words than the US Constitution which means they either didn't or are unable read it.  In that contract, we reserve the right to increase our crippling early termination fee.  So we'll juice that up to lock in size and by the time most customers can leave, we'll have an answer to your latest model.<br>
<b>Verizon Shareholder</b>: I approve.<br>
<b>Verizon Customer</b>: Why does my ass hurt?</htmltext>
<tokenext>AT&amp;T CEO : So , basically when the new iPhone 3GS + + comes out , people will be leaving other carriers in droves .
Verizon CEO : No matter , every customer signed a contract with more words than the US Constitution which means they either did n't or are unable read it .
In that contract , we reserve the right to increase our crippling early termination fee .
So we 'll juice that up to lock in size and by the time most customers can leave , we 'll have an answer to your latest model .
Verizon Shareholder : I approve .
Verizon Customer : Why does my ass hurt ?</tokentext>
<sentencetext>AT&amp;T CEO: So, basically when the new iPhone 3GS++ comes out, people will be leaving other carriers in droves.
Verizon CEO: No matter, every customer signed a contract with more words than the US Constitution which means they either didn't or are unable read it.
In that contract, we reserve the right to increase our crippling early termination fee.
So we'll juice that up to lock in size and by the time most customers can leave, we'll have an answer to your latest model.
Verizon Shareholder: I approve.
Verizon Customer: Why does my ass hurt?</sentencetext>
</comment>
<comment>
	<id>http://www.semanticweb.org/ontologies/ConversationInstances.owl#comment09_12_19_1429252.30499180</id>
	<title>Their service, their terms</title>
	<author>John Nowak</author>
	<datestamp>1261245600000</datestamp>
	<modclass>Troll</modclass>
	<modscore>0</modscore>
	<htmltext><p>If you don't like their terms, don't sign their contract. They're not your slaves and have no moral obligation to offer your favorite price structure. Use another service. I do.</p><p>The FCC is completely out of line here.</p></htmltext>
<tokenext>If you do n't like their terms , do n't sign their contract .
They 're not your slaves and have no moral obligation to offer your favorite price structure .
Use another service .
I do.The FCC is completely out of line here .</tokentext>
<sentencetext>If you don't like their terms, don't sign their contract.
They're not your slaves and have no moral obligation to offer your favorite price structure.
Use another service.
I do.The FCC is completely out of line here.</sentencetext>
</comment>
<comment>
	<id>http://www.semanticweb.org/ontologies/ConversationInstances.owl#comment09_12_19_1429252.30501052</id>
	<title>Re:Don't pay the fee</title>
	<author>Anonymous</author>
	<datestamp>1261225080000</datestamp>
	<modclass>None</modclass>
	<modscore>1</modscore>
	<htmltext><blockquote><div><p>Obviously, you missed the part about "the agreement" being intentionally and maliciously complex, to the point that it is indecipherable to the average customer.</p></div>
</blockquote><p>So don't sign anything that's maliciously complex to the point of being indecipherable.</p><blockquote><div><p>There are laws against trying to cheat customers. Hiding your draconian terms in an indecipherable "agreement" is anything but fair and honest. It should be illegal.</p></div></blockquote><p>Even though you can easily avoid this supposed fraud?</p></div>
	</htmltext>
<tokenext>Obviously , you missed the part about " the agreement " being intentionally and maliciously complex , to the point that it is indecipherable to the average customer .
So do n't sign anything that 's maliciously complex to the point of being indecipherable.There are laws against trying to cheat customers .
Hiding your draconian terms in an indecipherable " agreement " is anything but fair and honest .
It should be illegal.Even though you can easily avoid this supposed fraud ?</tokentext>
<sentencetext>Obviously, you missed the part about "the agreement" being intentionally and maliciously complex, to the point that it is indecipherable to the average customer.
So don't sign anything that's maliciously complex to the point of being indecipherable.There are laws against trying to cheat customers.
Hiding your draconian terms in an indecipherable "agreement" is anything but fair and honest.
It should be illegal.Even though you can easily avoid this supposed fraud?
	</sentencetext>
	<parent>http://www.semanticweb.org/ontologies/ConversationInstances.owl#comment09_12_19_1429252.30499278</parent>
</comment>
<comment>
	<id>http://www.semanticweb.org/ontologies/ConversationInstances.owl#comment09_12_19_1429252.30500494</id>
	<title>Double Double Fees</title>
	<author>Midnight Warrior</author>
	<datestamp>1261216680000</datestamp>
	<modclass>None</modclass>
	<modscore>1</modscore>
	<htmltext><p>These termination fees don't apply just to the whole contract.  If you add a family member in for the $9.99/mo, they get their own phone number (duh), which is effectively another contract.  If that family member leaves before the end of the contract, they own the remaining balance on the termination fee.  The primary holder on the account can also be hit for the remaining balance of the termination fee if they cancel early too.

</p><p>So, if you subscribe your wife and/or girlfriend on to the plan 18 months into a 24 month plan, they charge you $9.99 a month.  I don't remember if they charge a fee to set up the phone, but the cynical side of me says that they probably do.  If your significant other dumps you in the 23rd month of the contract, they can prorate the termination fee any way they want.  They may take their $175 prorated to remove (23-18=) 5 months and you owe the rest.  Then, when that is done making you mad and you decide to leave a month early, they'll hit your side of the contract with the prorated termination fee too.

</p><p>Oh.  Did I forget to mention this: when your significant other left you in month 23 and you canceled her phone, you automatically signed yourself up for a different plan.  So, if you go to leave at the end of month 24, they find a way to prorate the termination fee because you are leaving the new plan early.

</p><p>This is insane, you say?  Then go to a pay-as-you-go plan where the profits are <b>really</b> juicy.  Go ahead.  I dare you.

</p><p>I'm just glad none of these fuzzballs got bailout money.  Or at least I'm hoping they didn't.</p></htmltext>
<tokenext>These termination fees do n't apply just to the whole contract .
If you add a family member in for the $ 9.99/mo , they get their own phone number ( duh ) , which is effectively another contract .
If that family member leaves before the end of the contract , they own the remaining balance on the termination fee .
The primary holder on the account can also be hit for the remaining balance of the termination fee if they cancel early too .
So , if you subscribe your wife and/or girlfriend on to the plan 18 months into a 24 month plan , they charge you $ 9.99 a month .
I do n't remember if they charge a fee to set up the phone , but the cynical side of me says that they probably do .
If your significant other dumps you in the 23rd month of the contract , they can prorate the termination fee any way they want .
They may take their $ 175 prorated to remove ( 23-18 = ) 5 months and you owe the rest .
Then , when that is done making you mad and you decide to leave a month early , they 'll hit your side of the contract with the prorated termination fee too .
Oh. Did I forget to mention this : when your significant other left you in month 23 and you canceled her phone , you automatically signed yourself up for a different plan .
So , if you go to leave at the end of month 24 , they find a way to prorate the termination fee because you are leaving the new plan early .
This is insane , you say ?
Then go to a pay-as-you-go plan where the profits are really juicy .
Go ahead .
I dare you .
I 'm just glad none of these fuzzballs got bailout money .
Or at least I 'm hoping they did n't .</tokentext>
<sentencetext>These termination fees don't apply just to the whole contract.
If you add a family member in for the $9.99/mo, they get their own phone number (duh), which is effectively another contract.
If that family member leaves before the end of the contract, they own the remaining balance on the termination fee.
The primary holder on the account can also be hit for the remaining balance of the termination fee if they cancel early too.
So, if you subscribe your wife and/or girlfriend on to the plan 18 months into a 24 month plan, they charge you $9.99 a month.
I don't remember if they charge a fee to set up the phone, but the cynical side of me says that they probably do.
If your significant other dumps you in the 23rd month of the contract, they can prorate the termination fee any way they want.
They may take their $175 prorated to remove (23-18=) 5 months and you owe the rest.
Then, when that is done making you mad and you decide to leave a month early, they'll hit your side of the contract with the prorated termination fee too.
Oh.  Did I forget to mention this: when your significant other left you in month 23 and you canceled her phone, you automatically signed yourself up for a different plan.
So, if you go to leave at the end of month 24, they find a way to prorate the termination fee because you are leaving the new plan early.
This is insane, you say?
Then go to a pay-as-you-go plan where the profits are really juicy.
Go ahead.
I dare you.
I'm just glad none of these fuzzballs got bailout money.
Or at least I'm hoping they didn't.</sentencetext>
</comment>
<comment>
	<id>http://www.semanticweb.org/ontologies/ConversationInstances.owl#comment09_12_19_1429252.30499876</id>
	<title>Re:Crippling Early Termination Fee</title>
	<author>Hurricane78</author>
	<datestamp>1261251540000</datestamp>
	<modclass>None</modclass>
	<modscore>1</modscore>
	<htmltext><p>Uuum, one question: Here in Germany, no company can change a contract in &ldquo;mid air&rdquo;, without asking you for permission. They can send you a letter where they tell you about the changes. But you can then terminate the contract without having to pay anything, if they don&rsquo;t want to keep your original contract. They can&rsquo;t do anything about it. I&rsquo;ve done it some times.</p><p>Is&rsquo;t that the case in the USA too? If Verizon would send me a &ldquo;change in contract&rdquo;, with the new terms, that they could rape me, and that I would have to pay for it too, I could terminate on the spot... right? Oh god I hope I&rsquo;m right...</p></htmltext>
<tokenext>Uuum , one question : Here in Germany , no company can change a contract in    mid air    , without asking you for permission .
They can send you a letter where they tell you about the changes .
But you can then terminate the contract without having to pay anything , if they don    t want to keep your original contract .
They can    t do anything about it .
I    ve done it some times.Is    t that the case in the USA too ?
If Verizon would send me a    change in contract    , with the new terms , that they could rape me , and that I would have to pay for it too , I could terminate on the spot... right ? Oh god I hope I    m right.. .</tokentext>
<sentencetext>Uuum, one question: Here in Germany, no company can change a contract in “mid air”, without asking you for permission.
They can send you a letter where they tell you about the changes.
But you can then terminate the contract without having to pay anything, if they don’t want to keep your original contract.
They can’t do anything about it.
I’ve done it some times.Is’t that the case in the USA too?
If Verizon would send me a “change in contract”, with the new terms, that they could rape me, and that I would have to pay for it too, I could terminate on the spot... right? Oh god I hope I’m right...</sentencetext>
	<parent>http://www.semanticweb.org/ontologies/ConversationInstances.owl#comment09_12_19_1429252.30498908</parent>
</comment>
<comment>
	<id>http://www.semanticweb.org/ontologies/ConversationInstances.owl#comment09_12_19_1429252.30499448</id>
	<title>Re:Lower Cost Phones?</title>
	<author>webdog314</author>
	<datestamp>1261247640000</datestamp>
	<modclass>None</modclass>
	<modscore>1</modscore>
	<htmltext>Also remember that last year's cell phones are about as popular used gum, and just as hard to sell to the American cell market. It's for this reason that Verizon has it's "New Every Two" deal where they give you a big break on a new phone ever two years. They want you to be in the habit of thinking of phones as having a one or two-year shelf life, when most of us would be perfectly happy holding on to the phone we have for as long as five. But you BETTER buy a new phone every two years or they're going to be stuck with a whole bunch of useless hardware that they can't sell.  They charge you a ton to leave not to subsidize the phones they SELL, but rather to subsidize they phones they DON'T SELL. If you buy a phone use it for a while and cancel, they might break even on the deal (probably more than that) but they lose big time if they end up with branded hardware they can't sell at all.</htmltext>
<tokenext>Also remember that last year 's cell phones are about as popular used gum , and just as hard to sell to the American cell market .
It 's for this reason that Verizon has it 's " New Every Two " deal where they give you a big break on a new phone ever two years .
They want you to be in the habit of thinking of phones as having a one or two-year shelf life , when most of us would be perfectly happy holding on to the phone we have for as long as five .
But you BETTER buy a new phone every two years or they 're going to be stuck with a whole bunch of useless hardware that they ca n't sell .
They charge you a ton to leave not to subsidize the phones they SELL , but rather to subsidize they phones they DO N'T SELL .
If you buy a phone use it for a while and cancel , they might break even on the deal ( probably more than that ) but they lose big time if they end up with branded hardware they ca n't sell at all .</tokentext>
<sentencetext>Also remember that last year's cell phones are about as popular used gum, and just as hard to sell to the American cell market.
It's for this reason that Verizon has it's "New Every Two" deal where they give you a big break on a new phone ever two years.
They want you to be in the habit of thinking of phones as having a one or two-year shelf life, when most of us would be perfectly happy holding on to the phone we have for as long as five.
But you BETTER buy a new phone every two years or they're going to be stuck with a whole bunch of useless hardware that they can't sell.
They charge you a ton to leave not to subsidize the phones they SELL, but rather to subsidize they phones they DON'T SELL.
If you buy a phone use it for a while and cancel, they might break even on the deal (probably more than that) but they lose big time if they end up with branded hardware they can't sell at all.</sentencetext>
	<parent>http://www.semanticweb.org/ontologies/ConversationInstances.owl#comment09_12_19_1429252.30499198</parent>
</comment>
<comment>
	<id>http://www.semanticweb.org/ontologies/ConversationInstances.owl#comment09_12_19_1429252.30498994</id>
	<title>I can see why</title>
	<author>Anonymous</author>
	<datestamp>1261244040000</datestamp>
	<modclass>None</modclass>
	<modscore>0</modscore>
	<htmltext><p>Verzion has been running various deals where you get 2 of the newest generation phones for free/nominal fee with contract. A few people have doing the following: Sign up for 2 year contract, get the 2 phones (which retail for 200-300), pay the ~$300 cancellation fee, then sell the 2 phones on ebay for a profit. Though it can certainly be claimed to be their problem and some people may get screwed in the deal, this seems like a way to continue doing what they're doing without taking such a loss.</p></htmltext>
<tokenext>Verzion has been running various deals where you get 2 of the newest generation phones for free/nominal fee with contract .
A few people have doing the following : Sign up for 2 year contract , get the 2 phones ( which retail for 200-300 ) , pay the ~ $ 300 cancellation fee , then sell the 2 phones on ebay for a profit .
Though it can certainly be claimed to be their problem and some people may get screwed in the deal , this seems like a way to continue doing what they 're doing without taking such a loss .</tokentext>
<sentencetext>Verzion has been running various deals where you get 2 of the newest generation phones for free/nominal fee with contract.
A few people have doing the following: Sign up for 2 year contract, get the 2 phones (which retail for 200-300), pay the ~$300 cancellation fee, then sell the 2 phones on ebay for a profit.
Though it can certainly be claimed to be their problem and some people may get screwed in the deal, this seems like a way to continue doing what they're doing without taking such a loss.</sentencetext>
</comment>
<comment>
	<id>http://www.semanticweb.org/ontologies/ConversationInstances.owl#comment09_12_19_1429252.30499784</id>
	<title>Re:They can charge whatever they want</title>
	<author>ultranova</author>
	<datestamp>1261250640000</datestamp>
	<modclass>None</modclass>
	<modscore>1</modscore>
	<htmltext><blockquote><div><p>Please, Slashdot, can we have a way to filter out stories by submitter? I don't think I've ever seen a story from "I Don't Believe in Imaginary Property" that doesn't irritate me with its smug sanctimony and total irrelevance. Personally, I don't believe in imaginary news.</p></div> </blockquote><p>If they did, I'm sure somebody would still get pissed at call it deceptive news reporting. It's a free market, and Slashdot can filter its stories anyway they like. Your whining is a total non-story.</p><p>And personally, I've never seen a post saying "it's a free market" that didn't come down to defending some corporation from - usually well deserved - criticism. But then again, economical freedoms are more important than freedom of speech to right-wingers...</p></div>
	</htmltext>
<tokenext>Please , Slashdot , can we have a way to filter out stories by submitter ?
I do n't think I 've ever seen a story from " I Do n't Believe in Imaginary Property " that does n't irritate me with its smug sanctimony and total irrelevance .
Personally , I do n't believe in imaginary news .
If they did , I 'm sure somebody would still get pissed at call it deceptive news reporting .
It 's a free market , and Slashdot can filter its stories anyway they like .
Your whining is a total non-story.And personally , I 've never seen a post saying " it 's a free market " that did n't come down to defending some corporation from - usually well deserved - criticism .
But then again , economical freedoms are more important than freedom of speech to right-wingers.. .</tokentext>
<sentencetext>Please, Slashdot, can we have a way to filter out stories by submitter?
I don't think I've ever seen a story from "I Don't Believe in Imaginary Property" that doesn't irritate me with its smug sanctimony and total irrelevance.
Personally, I don't believe in imaginary news.
If they did, I'm sure somebody would still get pissed at call it deceptive news reporting.
It's a free market, and Slashdot can filter its stories anyway they like.
Your whining is a total non-story.And personally, I've never seen a post saying "it's a free market" that didn't come down to defending some corporation from - usually well deserved - criticism.
But then again, economical freedoms are more important than freedom of speech to right-wingers...
	</sentencetext>
	<parent>http://www.semanticweb.org/ontologies/ConversationInstances.owl#comment09_12_19_1429252.30498890</parent>
</comment>
<comment>
	<id>http://www.semanticweb.org/ontologies/ConversationInstances.owl#comment09_12_19_1429252.30500784</id>
	<title>Re:Crippling Early Termination Fee</title>
	<author>Anonymous</author>
	<datestamp>1261221000000</datestamp>
	<modclass>None</modclass>
	<modscore>0</modscore>
	<htmltext><p>Actually, not even the Verizon shareholder approves... they see little of the results.  The ones cleaning up are the executives on the top tier.  Its just the modern day equivalent of robber barons except that the executives win no matter how the company does in the profit zone.</p></htmltext>
<tokenext>Actually , not even the Verizon shareholder approves... they see little of the results .
The ones cleaning up are the executives on the top tier .
Its just the modern day equivalent of robber barons except that the executives win no matter how the company does in the profit zone .</tokentext>
<sentencetext>Actually, not even the Verizon shareholder approves... they see little of the results.
The ones cleaning up are the executives on the top tier.
Its just the modern day equivalent of robber barons except that the executives win no matter how the company does in the profit zone.</sentencetext>
	<parent>http://www.semanticweb.org/ontologies/ConversationInstances.owl#comment09_12_19_1429252.30498908</parent>
</comment>
<comment>
	<id>http://www.semanticweb.org/ontologies/ConversationInstances.owl#comment09_12_19_1429252.30499020</id>
	<title>Re:Umm...</title>
	<author>betterunixthanunix</author>
	<datestamp>1261244220000</datestamp>
	<modclass>None</modclass>
	<modscore>1</modscore>
	<htmltext>This is "loss" the same way that the RIAA "loses" money when you download your music.  In other words, they define the word differently than everyone else, but do not mention their different definition in an effort to confuse you.</htmltext>
<tokenext>This is " loss " the same way that the RIAA " loses " money when you download your music .
In other words , they define the word differently than everyone else , but do not mention their different definition in an effort to confuse you .</tokentext>
<sentencetext>This is "loss" the same way that the RIAA "loses" money when you download your music.
In other words, they define the word differently than everyone else, but do not mention their different definition in an effort to confuse you.</sentencetext>
	<parent>http://www.semanticweb.org/ontologies/ConversationInstances.owl#comment09_12_19_1429252.30498936</parent>
</comment>
<comment>
	<id>http://www.semanticweb.org/ontologies/ConversationInstances.owl#comment09_12_19_1429252.30499798</id>
	<title>Re:Their service, their terms</title>
	<author>TheRaven64</author>
	<datestamp>1261250820000</datestamp>
	<modclass>None</modclass>
	<modscore>1</modscore>
	<htmltext>They have been granted a license to use the public airwaves to operate their business on the assumption that it is beneficial to the public for them to do so.  If this is not the case, then the FCC, on behalf of the public, can revoke their license.</htmltext>
<tokenext>They have been granted a license to use the public airwaves to operate their business on the assumption that it is beneficial to the public for them to do so .
If this is not the case , then the FCC , on behalf of the public , can revoke their license .</tokentext>
<sentencetext>They have been granted a license to use the public airwaves to operate their business on the assumption that it is beneficial to the public for them to do so.
If this is not the case, then the FCC, on behalf of the public, can revoke their license.</sentencetext>
	<parent>http://www.semanticweb.org/ontologies/ConversationInstances.owl#comment09_12_19_1429252.30499180</parent>
</comment>
<comment>
	<id>http://www.semanticweb.org/ontologies/ConversationInstances.owl#comment09_12_19_1429252.30499138</id>
	<title>Pre-Pay is only way to go</title>
	<author>bwave</author>
	<datestamp>1261245240000</datestamp>
	<modclass>None</modclass>
	<modscore>1</modscore>
	<htmltext>I don't understand your non-poweruser who would sign a wireless contract.  Prepay is by far more cost effective, $1 a day to talk unlmited to any Verizon customer (and who isn't, even if they are evil), otherwise 10c per minute outbound, add $10 and you get unlimited text, otherwise 10c a text.  Best of all, no taxes or bogus FCC fees, etc.

Now if you live in NYC this might not work, as you probably have people on all the networks, so you'd be paying 10c per minute to talk outbound during the day  (unlimited nights and free inbound)   But here in Delaware/Maryland area, AT&amp;T's network quality is horrible, and Sprint/Nextel is nearly non-existant.</htmltext>
<tokenext>I do n't understand your non-poweruser who would sign a wireless contract .
Prepay is by far more cost effective , $ 1 a day to talk unlmited to any Verizon customer ( and who is n't , even if they are evil ) , otherwise 10c per minute outbound , add $ 10 and you get unlimited text , otherwise 10c a text .
Best of all , no taxes or bogus FCC fees , etc .
Now if you live in NYC this might not work , as you probably have people on all the networks , so you 'd be paying 10c per minute to talk outbound during the day ( unlimited nights and free inbound ) But here in Delaware/Maryland area , AT&amp;T 's network quality is horrible , and Sprint/Nextel is nearly non-existant .</tokentext>
<sentencetext>I don't understand your non-poweruser who would sign a wireless contract.
Prepay is by far more cost effective, $1 a day to talk unlmited to any Verizon customer (and who isn't, even if they are evil), otherwise 10c per minute outbound, add $10 and you get unlimited text, otherwise 10c a text.
Best of all, no taxes or bogus FCC fees, etc.
Now if you live in NYC this might not work, as you probably have people on all the networks, so you'd be paying 10c per minute to talk outbound during the day  (unlimited nights and free inbound)   But here in Delaware/Maryland area, AT&amp;T's network quality is horrible, and Sprint/Nextel is nearly non-existant.</sentencetext>
</comment>
<comment>
	<id>http://www.semanticweb.org/ontologies/ConversationInstances.owl#comment09_12_19_1429252.30498914</id>
	<title>Don't pay the fee</title>
	<author>Kohath</author>
	<datestamp>1261243320000</datestamp>
	<modclass>Insightful</modclass>
	<modscore>4</modscore>
	<htmltext><p>If you don't want to pay the fee, you should avoid it by not signing an agreement with Verizon.  If you don't like Verizon's customer service, you should avoid it by not signing an agreement with Verizon.  Or sign an agreement and live up to your obligations and avoid the fee that way.</p><p>Don't hire the government to force the people at Verizon to do things against their will -- unless the people at Verizon have truly defrauded you, personally, out of a significant amount of money.  Because forcing people to do things against their will is (almost always) morally wrong.</p></htmltext>
<tokenext>If you do n't want to pay the fee , you should avoid it by not signing an agreement with Verizon .
If you do n't like Verizon 's customer service , you should avoid it by not signing an agreement with Verizon .
Or sign an agreement and live up to your obligations and avoid the fee that way.Do n't hire the government to force the people at Verizon to do things against their will -- unless the people at Verizon have truly defrauded you , personally , out of a significant amount of money .
Because forcing people to do things against their will is ( almost always ) morally wrong .</tokentext>
<sentencetext>If you don't want to pay the fee, you should avoid it by not signing an agreement with Verizon.
If you don't like Verizon's customer service, you should avoid it by not signing an agreement with Verizon.
Or sign an agreement and live up to your obligations and avoid the fee that way.Don't hire the government to force the people at Verizon to do things against their will -- unless the people at Verizon have truly defrauded you, personally, out of a significant amount of money.
Because forcing people to do things against their will is (almost always) morally wrong.</sentencetext>
</comment>
<comment>
	<id>http://www.semanticweb.org/ontologies/ConversationInstances.owl#comment09_12_19_1429252.30501508</id>
	<title>Re:Any Jarhead can tell you....</title>
	<author>antdude</author>
	<datestamp>1261231500000</datestamp>
	<modclass>None</modclass>
	<modscore>1</modscore>
	<htmltext><p>What American phones have no contracts?</p></htmltext>
<tokenext>What American phones have no contracts ?</tokentext>
<sentencetext>What American phones have no contracts?</sentencetext>
	<parent>http://www.semanticweb.org/ontologies/ConversationInstances.owl#comment09_12_19_1429252.30500084</parent>
</comment>
<comment>
	<id>http://www.semanticweb.org/ontologies/ConversationInstances.owl#comment09_12_19_1429252.30499272</id>
	<title>Customers need to be informed</title>
	<author>Anonymous</author>
	<datestamp>1261246320000</datestamp>
	<modclass>None</modclass>
	<modscore>0</modscore>
	<htmltext><p>&gt; If you don't want to pay the fee, you should avoid it by not signing an agreement with Verizon. If you don't like Verizon's customer service, you should avoid it by not signing an agreement with Verizon.</p><p>That's a very good idea.  That's pretty much why I wrote this story:  to make sure that potential customers know what they're getting into.  If they sign the contract even after knowing, well, that's their fault.  But it might do them a lot of good to know that Verizon changed the contract on them (and they can, therefore, be made to drop it because Verizon isn't living up to what they originally agreed to).  Most people don't have time to read 800 page contracts every few days, just to see if they've changed.</p><p>In other words, even if Verizon is doing everything legally, people still have a very good reason to want to know about this fee hike.  One of the free market axioms is that customers are able to make informed decisions.  This story helps support that idea.</p><p>- <a href="http://www.eff.org/support" title="eff.org" rel="nofollow">I Don't Believe in Imaginary Property</a> [eff.org]</p></htmltext>
<tokenext>&gt; If you do n't want to pay the fee , you should avoid it by not signing an agreement with Verizon .
If you do n't like Verizon 's customer service , you should avoid it by not signing an agreement with Verizon.That 's a very good idea .
That 's pretty much why I wrote this story : to make sure that potential customers know what they 're getting into .
If they sign the contract even after knowing , well , that 's their fault .
But it might do them a lot of good to know that Verizon changed the contract on them ( and they can , therefore , be made to drop it because Verizon is n't living up to what they originally agreed to ) .
Most people do n't have time to read 800 page contracts every few days , just to see if they 've changed.In other words , even if Verizon is doing everything legally , people still have a very good reason to want to know about this fee hike .
One of the free market axioms is that customers are able to make informed decisions .
This story helps support that idea.- I Do n't Believe in Imaginary Property [ eff.org ]</tokentext>
<sentencetext>&gt; If you don't want to pay the fee, you should avoid it by not signing an agreement with Verizon.
If you don't like Verizon's customer service, you should avoid it by not signing an agreement with Verizon.That's a very good idea.
That's pretty much why I wrote this story:  to make sure that potential customers know what they're getting into.
If they sign the contract even after knowing, well, that's their fault.
But it might do them a lot of good to know that Verizon changed the contract on them (and they can, therefore, be made to drop it because Verizon isn't living up to what they originally agreed to).
Most people don't have time to read 800 page contracts every few days, just to see if they've changed.In other words, even if Verizon is doing everything legally, people still have a very good reason to want to know about this fee hike.
One of the free market axioms is that customers are able to make informed decisions.
This story helps support that idea.- I Don't Believe in Imaginary Property [eff.org]</sentencetext>
	<parent>http://www.semanticweb.org/ontologies/ConversationInstances.owl#comment09_12_19_1429252.30498914</parent>
</comment>
<comment>
	<id>http://www.semanticweb.org/ontologies/ConversationInstances.owl#comment09_12_19_1429252.30498984</id>
	<title>Oh boo, friggen, hoo...</title>
	<author>Anonymous</author>
	<datestamp>1261243980000</datestamp>
	<modclass>Insightful</modclass>
	<modscore>4</modscore>
	<htmltext><p>
"they also say that because they pro-rate the fee depending on how much of your contract is left, they still lose money"
</p><p>
Wow... that's the biggest load of BS I think I might have seen all week.
</p><p>
They don't lose money off of the pro-rated fee... at absolute worst they lose money because they lost a customer, and even that's unlikely unless the company is teetering on the edge of bankruptcy.  Heck, if a customer terminates early and the company collects that fee, they can actually earn interest on the whole termination fee sooner instead of collecting it over a period of several years.
</p><p>
I'm not sure in what sort of reality they think saying something like this would be likely to make anybody feel even slightly sorry for them.</p></htmltext>
<tokenext>" they also say that because they pro-rate the fee depending on how much of your contract is left , they still lose money " Wow... that 's the biggest load of BS I think I might have seen all week .
They do n't lose money off of the pro-rated fee... at absolute worst they lose money because they lost a customer , and even that 's unlikely unless the company is teetering on the edge of bankruptcy .
Heck , if a customer terminates early and the company collects that fee , they can actually earn interest on the whole termination fee sooner instead of collecting it over a period of several years .
I 'm not sure in what sort of reality they think saying something like this would be likely to make anybody feel even slightly sorry for them .</tokentext>
<sentencetext>
"they also say that because they pro-rate the fee depending on how much of your contract is left, they still lose money"

Wow... that's the biggest load of BS I think I might have seen all week.
They don't lose money off of the pro-rated fee... at absolute worst they lose money because they lost a customer, and even that's unlikely unless the company is teetering on the edge of bankruptcy.
Heck, if a customer terminates early and the company collects that fee, they can actually earn interest on the whole termination fee sooner instead of collecting it over a period of several years.
I'm not sure in what sort of reality they think saying something like this would be likely to make anybody feel even slightly sorry for them.</sentencetext>
</comment>
<comment>
	<id>http://www.semanticweb.org/ontologies/ConversationInstances.owl#comment09_12_19_1429252.30500100</id>
	<title>Re:Crippling Early Termination Fee</title>
	<author>Anonymous</author>
	<datestamp>1261254540000</datestamp>
	<modclass>None</modclass>
	<modscore>0</modscore>
	<htmltext><p>Sorry, that is a good assumption, but critically flawed.</p><p>Here in the US, A cellular provider can increase fees, cap bandwidth used for an Internet connection, change an ETF, and alter any terms of a contract with effectively zero notice.  There is no law against it, and legal cases have sided with the telcos on this one, just like how EULAs are enforced even though the other party never explicitly agreed.</p><p>Here in the US, the only way you would find that your contract changed in the way you mentioned is when you find the guys in the leather harnesses and gimp masks at your doorstep readying the leather cuffs.</p></htmltext>
<tokenext>Sorry , that is a good assumption , but critically flawed.Here in the US , A cellular provider can increase fees , cap bandwidth used for an Internet connection , change an ETF , and alter any terms of a contract with effectively zero notice .
There is no law against it , and legal cases have sided with the telcos on this one , just like how EULAs are enforced even though the other party never explicitly agreed.Here in the US , the only way you would find that your contract changed in the way you mentioned is when you find the guys in the leather harnesses and gimp masks at your doorstep readying the leather cuffs .</tokentext>
<sentencetext>Sorry, that is a good assumption, but critically flawed.Here in the US, A cellular provider can increase fees, cap bandwidth used for an Internet connection, change an ETF, and alter any terms of a contract with effectively zero notice.
There is no law against it, and legal cases have sided with the telcos on this one, just like how EULAs are enforced even though the other party never explicitly agreed.Here in the US, the only way you would find that your contract changed in the way you mentioned is when you find the guys in the leather harnesses and gimp masks at your doorstep readying the leather cuffs.</sentencetext>
	<parent>http://www.semanticweb.org/ontologies/ConversationInstances.owl#comment09_12_19_1429252.30499876</parent>
</comment>
<comment>
	<id>http://www.semanticweb.org/ontologies/ConversationInstances.owl#comment09_12_19_1429252.30500960</id>
	<title>Re:Crippling Early Termination Fee</title>
	<author>Tuoqui</author>
	<datestamp>1261223460000</datestamp>
	<modclass>None</modclass>
	<modscore>1</modscore>
	<htmltext><p>Except by jacking up their ETF they are effectively changing their contract which allows you to use a clause that if they change billing you can get out of the contract for free... That is unless they changed their contracts significantly since this video was posted.</p><p><a href="http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=nYUAnnCFscw" title="youtube.com">http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=nYUAnnCFscw</a> [youtube.com]</p></htmltext>
<tokenext>Except by jacking up their ETF they are effectively changing their contract which allows you to use a clause that if they change billing you can get out of the contract for free... That is unless they changed their contracts significantly since this video was posted.http : //www.youtube.com/watch ? v = nYUAnnCFscw [ youtube.com ]</tokentext>
<sentencetext>Except by jacking up their ETF they are effectively changing their contract which allows you to use a clause that if they change billing you can get out of the contract for free... That is unless they changed their contracts significantly since this video was posted.http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=nYUAnnCFscw [youtube.com]</sentencetext>
	<parent>http://www.semanticweb.org/ontologies/ConversationInstances.owl#comment09_12_19_1429252.30498908</parent>
</comment>
<comment>
	<id>http://www.semanticweb.org/ontologies/ConversationInstances.owl#comment09_12_19_1429252.30499918</id>
	<title>Re:Don't pay the fee</title>
	<author>Hurricane78</author>
	<datestamp>1261252200000</datestamp>
	<modclass>None</modclass>
	<modscore>1</modscore>
	<htmltext><p>I let salesmen really feel the pain, by sloowly reading the whole contract and terms... twice... asking for any and all the tiniest unclarities, until I perfectly and fully understand it. And if he loses his patience, I call the police and tell them some criminal want so pull a con job on me, and now started to threaten me.<br>Then when I&rsquo;m done, sometimes I simply say: Sorry, that thing is criminal, offensive and not acceptable. And drop it on the floor like it&rsquo;s a piece of cloth used for cleaning train station toilets.</p><p>Let them <em>feel</em> it.</p></htmltext>
<tokenext>I let salesmen really feel the pain , by sloowly reading the whole contract and terms... twice... asking for any and all the tiniest unclarities , until I perfectly and fully understand it .
And if he loses his patience , I call the police and tell them some criminal want so pull a con job on me , and now started to threaten me.Then when I    m done , sometimes I simply say : Sorry , that thing is criminal , offensive and not acceptable .
And drop it on the floor like it    s a piece of cloth used for cleaning train station toilets.Let them feel it .</tokentext>
<sentencetext>I let salesmen really feel the pain, by sloowly reading the whole contract and terms... twice... asking for any and all the tiniest unclarities, until I perfectly and fully understand it.
And if he loses his patience, I call the police and tell them some criminal want so pull a con job on me, and now started to threaten me.Then when I’m done, sometimes I simply say: Sorry, that thing is criminal, offensive and not acceptable.
And drop it on the floor like it’s a piece of cloth used for cleaning train station toilets.Let them feel it.</sentencetext>
	<parent>http://www.semanticweb.org/ontologies/ConversationInstances.owl#comment09_12_19_1429252.30499278</parent>
</comment>
<comment>
	<id>http://www.semanticweb.org/ontologies/ConversationInstances.owl#comment09_12_19_1429252.30499212</id>
	<title>Funny is a good mod...</title>
	<author>Anonymous</author>
	<datestamp>1261245720000</datestamp>
	<modclass>Flamebait</modclass>
	<modscore>-1</modscore>
	<htmltext><p>&gt; But I'm sure somebody would still get pissed at call it deceptive business practices. It's a free market, and they can charge anything they like. This is a total non-story.</p><p>One of the free market axioms is that consumers have full information about the goods they're buying.  You'll have to forgive me by trying to make it closer to true by making sure that people know about a gigantic fee buried under a huge pile of legalese before they find out about Verizon's customer service.</p><p>Also, you might know that there's <a href="http://www.facebook.com/group.php?gid=29820456570" title="facebook.com" rel="nofollow">more than one person who doesn't believe in imaginary property</a> [facebook.com] these days.</p><p>But wait!  My bad.  I guess I should have <a href="http://slashdot.org/~Guido+del+Confuso/tags/successfulltroll" title="slashdot.org" rel="nofollow">noticed the 'successfultroll' tag on your comment</a> [slashdot.org].  No cake for you.</p></htmltext>
<tokenext>&gt; But I 'm sure somebody would still get pissed at call it deceptive business practices .
It 's a free market , and they can charge anything they like .
This is a total non-story.One of the free market axioms is that consumers have full information about the goods they 're buying .
You 'll have to forgive me by trying to make it closer to true by making sure that people know about a gigantic fee buried under a huge pile of legalese before they find out about Verizon 's customer service.Also , you might know that there 's more than one person who does n't believe in imaginary property [ facebook.com ] these days.But wait !
My bad .
I guess I should have noticed the 'successfultroll ' tag on your comment [ slashdot.org ] .
No cake for you .</tokentext>
<sentencetext>&gt; But I'm sure somebody would still get pissed at call it deceptive business practices.
It's a free market, and they can charge anything they like.
This is a total non-story.One of the free market axioms is that consumers have full information about the goods they're buying.
You'll have to forgive me by trying to make it closer to true by making sure that people know about a gigantic fee buried under a huge pile of legalese before they find out about Verizon's customer service.Also, you might know that there's more than one person who doesn't believe in imaginary property [facebook.com] these days.But wait!
My bad.
I guess I should have noticed the 'successfultroll' tag on your comment [slashdot.org].
No cake for you.</sentencetext>
	<parent>http://www.semanticweb.org/ontologies/ConversationInstances.owl#comment09_12_19_1429252.30498890</parent>
</comment>
<comment>
	<id>http://www.semanticweb.org/ontologies/ConversationInstances.owl#comment09_12_19_1429252.30499086</id>
	<title>At $175, is it possible to make a profit</title>
	<author>Anonymous</author>
	<datestamp>1261244820000</datestamp>
	<modclass>None</modclass>
	<modscore>0</modscore>
	<htmltext><p>by purchasing an expensive smart phone, unlocking it, selling it on E-Bay and then paying the fee? If so, $175 is too low.</p></htmltext>
<tokenext>by purchasing an expensive smart phone , unlocking it , selling it on E-Bay and then paying the fee ?
If so , $ 175 is too low .</tokentext>
<sentencetext>by purchasing an expensive smart phone, unlocking it, selling it on E-Bay and then paying the fee?
If so, $175 is too low.</sentencetext>
</comment>
<comment>
	<id>http://www.semanticweb.org/ontologies/ConversationInstances.owl#comment09_12_19_1429252.30500316</id>
	<title>Seems like they should charge by phone</title>
	<author>SuperKendall</author>
	<datestamp>1261213920000</datestamp>
	<modclass>None</modclass>
	<modscore>1</modscore>
	<htmltext><p>I actually agree with Verizon that they shouldn't have to eat the cost of an expensive subsidized phone (like the Droid).   It seems fair to me that if you get a very expensive phone you are going to pay that back either through service usage or termination fees.</p><p>What seems wrong is that every person has to pay that termination fee, including people buying cheaper phones.  It makes no sense for those people to have to pay more when they don't even want a smartphone.</p></htmltext>
<tokenext>I actually agree with Verizon that they should n't have to eat the cost of an expensive subsidized phone ( like the Droid ) .
It seems fair to me that if you get a very expensive phone you are going to pay that back either through service usage or termination fees.What seems wrong is that every person has to pay that termination fee , including people buying cheaper phones .
It makes no sense for those people to have to pay more when they do n't even want a smartphone .</tokentext>
<sentencetext>I actually agree with Verizon that they shouldn't have to eat the cost of an expensive subsidized phone (like the Droid).
It seems fair to me that if you get a very expensive phone you are going to pay that back either through service usage or termination fees.What seems wrong is that every person has to pay that termination fee, including people buying cheaper phones.
It makes no sense for those people to have to pay more when they don't even want a smartphone.</sentencetext>
</comment>
<comment>
	<id>http://www.semanticweb.org/ontologies/ConversationInstances.owl#comment09_12_19_1429252.30499676</id>
	<title>So, sue me.</title>
	<author>Low Ranked Craig</author>
	<datestamp>1261249500000</datestamp>
	<modclass>None</modclass>
	<modscore>1</modscore>
	<htmltext>Basically, that's how I look at it.  Yes, they might ding your credit, but in my experience when purchasing a large ticket item like a car or a house, anything like a cell phone bill or a Dr's bill can generally be discounted as long as you mortgage, auto and credit card payments are current.  I've had the finance guys at car dealers and banks tell me that they don't even look at utility bills or dr bills.  tax liens, on the other hand...</htmltext>
<tokenext>Basically , that 's how I look at it .
Yes , they might ding your credit , but in my experience when purchasing a large ticket item like a car or a house , anything like a cell phone bill or a Dr 's bill can generally be discounted as long as you mortgage , auto and credit card payments are current .
I 've had the finance guys at car dealers and banks tell me that they do n't even look at utility bills or dr bills .
tax liens , on the other hand.. .</tokentext>
<sentencetext>Basically, that's how I look at it.
Yes, they might ding your credit, but in my experience when purchasing a large ticket item like a car or a house, anything like a cell phone bill or a Dr's bill can generally be discounted as long as you mortgage, auto and credit card payments are current.
I've had the finance guys at car dealers and banks tell me that they don't even look at utility bills or dr bills.
tax liens, on the other hand...</sentencetext>
</comment>
<comment>
	<id>http://www.semanticweb.org/ontologies/ConversationInstances.owl#comment09_12_19_1429252.30502064</id>
	<title>A strange game.</title>
	<author>PPH</author>
	<datestamp>1261241640000</datestamp>
	<modclass>None</modclass>
	<modscore>1</modscore>
	<htmltext><p>The only winning move is not to play.</p></htmltext>
<tokenext>The only winning move is not to play .</tokentext>
<sentencetext>The only winning move is not to play.</sentencetext>
</comment>
<comment>
	<id>http://www.semanticweb.org/ontologies/ConversationInstances.owl#comment09_12_19_1429252.30513082</id>
	<title>Re:Where is government now that we need them?</title>
	<author>Anonymous</author>
	<datestamp>1261416060000</datestamp>
	<modclass>None</modclass>
	<modscore>0</modscore>
	<htmltext><p>Well the GP never said chargers and SIM swapping were related, perhaps you're too stupid to notice.  Also, notice my correct use of you're (in case you're too stupid to notice this as well).</p></htmltext>
<tokenext>Well the GP never said chargers and SIM swapping were related , perhaps you 're too stupid to notice .
Also , notice my correct use of you 're ( in case you 're too stupid to notice this as well ) .</tokentext>
<sentencetext>Well the GP never said chargers and SIM swapping were related, perhaps you're too stupid to notice.
Also, notice my correct use of you're (in case you're too stupid to notice this as well).</sentencetext>
	<parent>http://www.semanticweb.org/ontologies/ConversationInstances.owl#comment09_12_19_1429252.30499132</parent>
</comment>
<comment>
	<id>http://www.semanticweb.org/ontologies/ConversationInstances.owl#comment09_12_19_1429252.30499478</id>
	<title>Er, "losing" money?  Bullshit.</title>
	<author>geekmux</author>
	<datestamp>1261247880000</datestamp>
	<modclass>None</modclass>
	<modscore>1</modscore>
	<htmltext><p><div class="quote"><p>"...they also say that because they pro-rate the fee depending on how much of your contract is left, they still lose money.</p></div><p>Er, somehow I seriously doubt that the<nobr> <wbr></nobr>.01\% of customers that terminate a contract early somehow equates to them "losing" money.  Their extortionist texting rates alone could probably keep the entire division afloat.  What a crock of shit.</p><p>Any company that is sitting back reaping the benefits of tens of millions of people calling in "every week to cast your vote for the next one-hit-wonder Idol" can STFU about "losing" money.  They're enjoying profit streams no one even imagined 10 years ago.</p></div>
	</htmltext>
<tokenext>" ...they also say that because they pro-rate the fee depending on how much of your contract is left , they still lose money.Er , somehow I seriously doubt that the .01 \ % of customers that terminate a contract early somehow equates to them " losing " money .
Their extortionist texting rates alone could probably keep the entire division afloat .
What a crock of shit.Any company that is sitting back reaping the benefits of tens of millions of people calling in " every week to cast your vote for the next one-hit-wonder Idol " can STFU about " losing " money .
They 're enjoying profit streams no one even imagined 10 years ago .</tokentext>
<sentencetext>"...they also say that because they pro-rate the fee depending on how much of your contract is left, they still lose money.Er, somehow I seriously doubt that the .01\% of customers that terminate a contract early somehow equates to them "losing" money.
Their extortionist texting rates alone could probably keep the entire division afloat.
What a crock of shit.Any company that is sitting back reaping the benefits of tens of millions of people calling in "every week to cast your vote for the next one-hit-wonder Idol" can STFU about "losing" money.
They're enjoying profit streams no one even imagined 10 years ago.
	</sentencetext>
</comment>
<comment>
	<id>http://www.semanticweb.org/ontologies/ConversationInstances.owl#comment09_12_19_1429252.30504536</id>
	<title>Re:Not a 'Free Market'</title>
	<author>Anonymous</author>
	<datestamp>1261330200000</datestamp>
	<modclass>None</modclass>
	<modscore>0</modscore>
	<htmltext><p>"it's not a car, it's an analogy!"</p></htmltext>
<tokenext>" it 's not a car , it 's an analogy !
"</tokentext>
<sentencetext>"it's not a car, it's an analogy!
"</sentencetext>
	<parent>http://www.semanticweb.org/ontologies/ConversationInstances.owl#comment09_12_19_1429252.30500086</parent>
</comment>
<comment>
	<id>http://www.semanticweb.org/ontologies/ConversationInstances.owl#comment09_12_19_1429252.30499446</id>
	<title>etf</title>
	<author>Anonymous</author>
	<datestamp>1261247580000</datestamp>
	<modclass>None</modclass>
	<modscore>0</modscore>
	<htmltext><p>As a Verizon Wireless Customer Service Representative in one of their call centers, let me just say this. That early termination fee pays my bills. And the 350 dollar early termination fee only applies to ADVANCED devices such as the Droid phones, the Windows phones, and other phones that we're selling to customers at a drastically discounted rate ($200 for a Droid whose MSRP is $600) so even with a 350 dollar early termination fee, Verizon is still losing money for those that cancel early after getting one of these phones. We don't even ask for the device back when they cancel, so THEY (the ones that cancel three months after getting such a device) are the ones that are ripping Verizon off, leaving Verizon to pay HTC and Motorola for the phones that we sold to them at 1/3 of the cost.</p></htmltext>
<tokenext>As a Verizon Wireless Customer Service Representative in one of their call centers , let me just say this .
That early termination fee pays my bills .
And the 350 dollar early termination fee only applies to ADVANCED devices such as the Droid phones , the Windows phones , and other phones that we 're selling to customers at a drastically discounted rate ( $ 200 for a Droid whose MSRP is $ 600 ) so even with a 350 dollar early termination fee , Verizon is still losing money for those that cancel early after getting one of these phones .
We do n't even ask for the device back when they cancel , so THEY ( the ones that cancel three months after getting such a device ) are the ones that are ripping Verizon off , leaving Verizon to pay HTC and Motorola for the phones that we sold to them at 1/3 of the cost .</tokentext>
<sentencetext>As a Verizon Wireless Customer Service Representative in one of their call centers, let me just say this.
That early termination fee pays my bills.
And the 350 dollar early termination fee only applies to ADVANCED devices such as the Droid phones, the Windows phones, and other phones that we're selling to customers at a drastically discounted rate ($200 for a Droid whose MSRP is $600) so even with a 350 dollar early termination fee, Verizon is still losing money for those that cancel early after getting one of these phones.
We don't even ask for the device back when they cancel, so THEY (the ones that cancel three months after getting such a device) are the ones that are ripping Verizon off, leaving Verizon to pay HTC and Motorola for the phones that we sold to them at 1/3 of the cost.</sentencetext>
</comment>
<comment>
	<id>http://www.semanticweb.org/ontologies/ConversationInstances.owl#comment09_12_19_1429252.30499490</id>
	<title>Re:They can charge whatever they want</title>
	<author>Anonymous</author>
	<datestamp>1261247940000</datestamp>
	<modclass>None</modclass>
	<modscore>0</modscore>
	<htmltext><p>The issue is the cheapest cell phones cost about $30 retail yet the cheapest Verizon sells is $179.99. They are not losing money anywhere.</p></htmltext>
<tokenext>The issue is the cheapest cell phones cost about $ 30 retail yet the cheapest Verizon sells is $ 179.99 .
They are not losing money anywhere .</tokentext>
<sentencetext>The issue is the cheapest cell phones cost about $30 retail yet the cheapest Verizon sells is $179.99.
They are not losing money anywhere.</sentencetext>
	<parent>http://www.semanticweb.org/ontologies/ConversationInstances.owl#comment09_12_19_1429252.30498890</parent>
</comment>
<comment>
	<id>http://www.semanticweb.org/ontologies/ConversationInstances.owl#comment09_12_19_1429252.30499122</id>
	<title>Verizon customer service is the worst</title>
	<author>Trip6</author>
	<datestamp>1261245180000</datestamp>
	<modclass>None</modclass>
	<modscore>1</modscore>
	<htmltext><p>I have NEVER had a good experience dealing with Verizon phone or store personnel.  I only feel better when I compare horror stories with AT&amp;T customers, who have similar complaints.</p><p>I am also amazed at the piss-poor quality of connection we collectively tolerate as cell phone consumers.  Remember when you could talk over a land line and actually hear somebody?  And now my wife and daughter want iPhones so it's about to get even worse.</p></htmltext>
<tokenext>I have NEVER had a good experience dealing with Verizon phone or store personnel .
I only feel better when I compare horror stories with AT&amp;T customers , who have similar complaints.I am also amazed at the piss-poor quality of connection we collectively tolerate as cell phone consumers .
Remember when you could talk over a land line and actually hear somebody ?
And now my wife and daughter want iPhones so it 's about to get even worse .</tokentext>
<sentencetext>I have NEVER had a good experience dealing with Verizon phone or store personnel.
I only feel better when I compare horror stories with AT&amp;T customers, who have similar complaints.I am also amazed at the piss-poor quality of connection we collectively tolerate as cell phone consumers.
Remember when you could talk over a land line and actually hear somebody?
And now my wife and daughter want iPhones so it's about to get even worse.</sentencetext>
</comment>
<comment>
	<id>http://www.semanticweb.org/ontologies/ConversationInstances.owl#comment09_12_19_1429252.30501040</id>
	<title>Re:Let em charge what they want!</title>
	<author>Anonymous</author>
	<datestamp>1261224780000</datestamp>
	<modclass>None</modclass>
	<modscore>0</modscore>
	<htmltext>No, but I'm forced to deal with a non-competitive market or live without.  You think that's fair or the way things should be?  You have no complaints with government created oligarchy running a significant part of communications in this country?  Does that make you a pro-government liberal?</htmltext>
<tokenext>No , but I 'm forced to deal with a non-competitive market or live without .
You think that 's fair or the way things should be ?
You have no complaints with government created oligarchy running a significant part of communications in this country ?
Does that make you a pro-government liberal ?</tokentext>
<sentencetext>No, but I'm forced to deal with a non-competitive market or live without.
You think that's fair or the way things should be?
You have no complaints with government created oligarchy running a significant part of communications in this country?
Does that make you a pro-government liberal?</sentencetext>
	<parent>http://www.semanticweb.org/ontologies/ConversationInstances.owl#comment09_12_19_1429252.30499524</parent>
</comment>
<comment>
	<id>http://www.semanticweb.org/ontologies/ConversationInstances.owl#comment09_12_19_1429252.30498932</id>
	<title>It's a problem with the whole industry</title>
	<author>BadAnalogyGuy</author>
	<datestamp>1261243500000</datestamp>
	<modclass>Interestin</modclass>
	<modscore>4</modscore>
	<htmltext><p>The total lack of customer service, the terrible coverage, and the relatively subpar implementation of cellular service in the US compared to other countries is not just a problem with Verizon. It is a problem industry-wide, and it is only getting worse.</p><p>With the economy in the toilet, these companies are losing customers like the Bucs lose football games. This means they don't have the financial wherewithal to build out the necessary networks. And due to this, customer service continues to decline.</p><p>Maybe it is time to nationalize the whole wireless carrier system and slowly parcel out contracts to private companies for the day-to-day operations. If we can punish these carriers by taking away their networks, we will see real change in customer service and subsequently real competition and improvements across the board.</p><p>As long as private companies run these networks, we're stuck with the worst possible system for cellular phone users. It may be a cultural thing because Asian and European companies don't seem to screw over their customers so badly, but it's our culture and we should (as a nation) take it back.</p></htmltext>
<tokenext>The total lack of customer service , the terrible coverage , and the relatively subpar implementation of cellular service in the US compared to other countries is not just a problem with Verizon .
It is a problem industry-wide , and it is only getting worse.With the economy in the toilet , these companies are losing customers like the Bucs lose football games .
This means they do n't have the financial wherewithal to build out the necessary networks .
And due to this , customer service continues to decline.Maybe it is time to nationalize the whole wireless carrier system and slowly parcel out contracts to private companies for the day-to-day operations .
If we can punish these carriers by taking away their networks , we will see real change in customer service and subsequently real competition and improvements across the board.As long as private companies run these networks , we 're stuck with the worst possible system for cellular phone users .
It may be a cultural thing because Asian and European companies do n't seem to screw over their customers so badly , but it 's our culture and we should ( as a nation ) take it back .</tokentext>
<sentencetext>The total lack of customer service, the terrible coverage, and the relatively subpar implementation of cellular service in the US compared to other countries is not just a problem with Verizon.
It is a problem industry-wide, and it is only getting worse.With the economy in the toilet, these companies are losing customers like the Bucs lose football games.
This means they don't have the financial wherewithal to build out the necessary networks.
And due to this, customer service continues to decline.Maybe it is time to nationalize the whole wireless carrier system and slowly parcel out contracts to private companies for the day-to-day operations.
If we can punish these carriers by taking away their networks, we will see real change in customer service and subsequently real competition and improvements across the board.As long as private companies run these networks, we're stuck with the worst possible system for cellular phone users.
It may be a cultural thing because Asian and European companies don't seem to screw over their customers so badly, but it's our culture and we should (as a nation) take it back.</sentencetext>
</comment>
<comment>
	<id>http://www.semanticweb.org/ontologies/ConversationInstances.owl#comment09_12_19_1429252.30500496</id>
	<title>When a free market isn't free</title>
	<author>rsborg</author>
	<datestamp>1261216680000</datestamp>
	<modclass>None</modclass>
	<modscore>1</modscore>
	<htmltext><blockquote><div><p>Oligopolies are perfectly capable of being formed in a free market economy. A free market refers to the lack of governmental intervention except in cases of force or fraud.</p></div></blockquote><p>As correct as you are, you forget what this means in reality: All the "goodness" (read: efficiency) of the ideal free-market goes out the window as soon as it becomes an Oligopoly or Monopoly... so in effect, this "free market variant" is so different in terms of apply basic pricing theory that it's not a free market at all.</p></div>
	</htmltext>
<tokenext>Oligopolies are perfectly capable of being formed in a free market economy .
A free market refers to the lack of governmental intervention except in cases of force or fraud.As correct as you are , you forget what this means in reality : All the " goodness " ( read : efficiency ) of the ideal free-market goes out the window as soon as it becomes an Oligopoly or Monopoly... so in effect , this " free market variant " is so different in terms of apply basic pricing theory that it 's not a free market at all .</tokentext>
<sentencetext>Oligopolies are perfectly capable of being formed in a free market economy.
A free market refers to the lack of governmental intervention except in cases of force or fraud.As correct as you are, you forget what this means in reality: All the "goodness" (read: efficiency) of the ideal free-market goes out the window as soon as it becomes an Oligopoly or Monopoly... so in effect, this "free market variant" is so different in terms of apply basic pricing theory that it's not a free market at all.
	</sentencetext>
	<parent>http://www.semanticweb.org/ontologies/ConversationInstances.owl#comment09_12_19_1429252.30500086</parent>
</comment>
<comment>
	<id>http://www.semanticweb.org/ontologies/ConversationInstances.owl#comment09_12_19_1429252.30499058</id>
	<title>These "free phone" deals . . .</title>
	<author>base3</author>
	<datestamp>1261244520000</datestamp>
	<modclass>Informativ</modclass>
	<modscore>2</modscore>
	<htmltext>. . . need to be regulated like the installment loan contracts they actually are, and subject to the Truth In Lending Act.</htmltext>
<tokenext>.
. .
need to be regulated like the installment loan contracts they actually are , and subject to the Truth In Lending Act .</tokentext>
<sentencetext>.
. .
need to be regulated like the installment loan contracts they actually are, and subject to the Truth In Lending Act.</sentencetext>
</comment>
<comment>
	<id>http://www.semanticweb.org/ontologies/ConversationInstances.owl#comment09_12_19_1429252.30502544</id>
	<title>Re:Lower Cost Phones?</title>
	<author>Anonymous</author>
	<datestamp>1261252680000</datestamp>
	<modclass>None</modclass>
	<modscore>0</modscore>
	<htmltext><blockquote><div><p>When in reality, you could buy, for that same 200 bucks, a iTouch, which gives you applications, wi-fi internet, Texting, and a significantly larger screen (touch screen even).</p></div></blockquote><p>
Horrible grammar aside, can we PLEASE stop colling the damned thing an "iTouch"? It makes you sound like a complete and utter tool.</p></div>
	</htmltext>
<tokenext>When in reality , you could buy , for that same 200 bucks , a iTouch , which gives you applications , wi-fi internet , Texting , and a significantly larger screen ( touch screen even ) .
Horrible grammar aside , can we PLEASE stop colling the damned thing an " iTouch " ?
It makes you sound like a complete and utter tool .</tokentext>
<sentencetext>When in reality, you could buy, for that same 200 bucks, a iTouch, which gives you applications, wi-fi internet, Texting, and a significantly larger screen (touch screen even).
Horrible grammar aside, can we PLEASE stop colling the damned thing an "iTouch"?
It makes you sound like a complete and utter tool.
	</sentencetext>
	<parent>http://www.semanticweb.org/ontologies/ConversationInstances.owl#comment09_12_19_1429252.30499198</parent>
</comment>
<comment>
	<id>http://www.semanticweb.org/ontologies/ConversationInstances.owl#comment09_12_19_1429252.30500086</id>
	<title>Re:Not a 'Free Market'</title>
	<author>Guido del Confuso</author>
	<datestamp>1261254360000</datestamp>
	<modclass>Insightful</modclass>
	<modscore>2</modscore>
	<htmltext><p>Oligopolies are perfectly capable of being formed in a free market economy.  A free market refers to the lack of governmental intervention except in cases of force or fraud.  An oligopoly is a market segment (whether in a free market, a socialist economy, or even anarchy) that is dominated by a small group of entities.  The two concepts are not incompatible, or even comparable.  Saying "it's not a free market, it's an oligopoly" is a non-sequitur.  It's kind of like saying "it's not a car, it's blue".</p></htmltext>
<tokenext>Oligopolies are perfectly capable of being formed in a free market economy .
A free market refers to the lack of governmental intervention except in cases of force or fraud .
An oligopoly is a market segment ( whether in a free market , a socialist economy , or even anarchy ) that is dominated by a small group of entities .
The two concepts are not incompatible , or even comparable .
Saying " it 's not a free market , it 's an oligopoly " is a non-sequitur .
It 's kind of like saying " it 's not a car , it 's blue " .</tokentext>
<sentencetext>Oligopolies are perfectly capable of being formed in a free market economy.
A free market refers to the lack of governmental intervention except in cases of force or fraud.
An oligopoly is a market segment (whether in a free market, a socialist economy, or even anarchy) that is dominated by a small group of entities.
The two concepts are not incompatible, or even comparable.
Saying "it's not a free market, it's an oligopoly" is a non-sequitur.
It's kind of like saying "it's not a car, it's blue".</sentencetext>
	<parent>http://www.semanticweb.org/ontologies/ConversationInstances.owl#comment09_12_19_1429252.30499940</parent>
</comment>
<comment>
	<id>http://www.semanticweb.org/ontologies/ConversationInstances.owl#comment09_12_19_1429252.30498926</id>
	<title>That's not all they do</title>
	<author>Anonymous</author>
	<datestamp>1261243440000</datestamp>
	<modclass>Informativ</modclass>
	<modscore>2</modscore>
	<htmltext><p>Verizon's guilty of a lot more than merely doubling their early termination fees.  They've also tried to pin about 300$ in botgus charges to a friend of mine's account when she tried to leave them.  I hope the FTC nails them to the nearest cross.</p></htmltext>
<tokenext>Verizon 's guilty of a lot more than merely doubling their early termination fees .
They 've also tried to pin about 300 $ in botgus charges to a friend of mine 's account when she tried to leave them .
I hope the FTC nails them to the nearest cross .</tokentext>
<sentencetext>Verizon's guilty of a lot more than merely doubling their early termination fees.
They've also tried to pin about 300$ in botgus charges to a friend of mine's account when she tried to leave them.
I hope the FTC nails them to the nearest cross.</sentencetext>
</comment>
<comment>
	<id>http://www.semanticweb.org/ontologies/ConversationInstances.owl#comment09_12_19_1429252.30499070</id>
	<title>How much is the fee</title>
	<author>Murdoch5</author>
	<datestamp>1261244700000</datestamp>
	<modclass>None</modclass>
	<modscore>1</modscore>
	<htmltext>I just had my contract cancelled because my phone broke and I needed a new one.   I had 33 months left and they charged me 400 and only picked up 190 of it.   When I told them thats retarted they said "We don't care just pay".  I'm confussed on what the fee should be.   <br> <br>
I want to call them back and agru this because first of all I shouldn't be charged for a broken phone because the phone should of broke in 3 months.  Second I shouldn't be charged a massive cancell fee becasue they sell phones which break easily.   <br> <br>
Does anyone have a story or tale about being charged a low rate for there contract.  Something around 33 months would be good because I'm really pissed about how they've been screwing me.   Out of the last 5 or so months I've had to call and get my bill corrected 4 times and on a second note I had to make a new call to just get my phone replaced.    This company is horrible and when my contract is up I'm never going back.</htmltext>
<tokenext>I just had my contract cancelled because my phone broke and I needed a new one .
I had 33 months left and they charged me 400 and only picked up 190 of it .
When I told them thats retarted they said " We do n't care just pay " .
I 'm confussed on what the fee should be .
I want to call them back and agru this because first of all I should n't be charged for a broken phone because the phone should of broke in 3 months .
Second I should n't be charged a massive cancell fee becasue they sell phones which break easily .
Does anyone have a story or tale about being charged a low rate for there contract .
Something around 33 months would be good because I 'm really pissed about how they 've been screwing me .
Out of the last 5 or so months I 've had to call and get my bill corrected 4 times and on a second note I had to make a new call to just get my phone replaced .
This company is horrible and when my contract is up I 'm never going back .</tokentext>
<sentencetext>I just had my contract cancelled because my phone broke and I needed a new one.
I had 33 months left and they charged me 400 and only picked up 190 of it.
When I told them thats retarted they said "We don't care just pay".
I'm confussed on what the fee should be.
I want to call them back and agru this because first of all I shouldn't be charged for a broken phone because the phone should of broke in 3 months.
Second I shouldn't be charged a massive cancell fee becasue they sell phones which break easily.
Does anyone have a story or tale about being charged a low rate for there contract.
Something around 33 months would be good because I'm really pissed about how they've been screwing me.
Out of the last 5 or so months I've had to call and get my bill corrected 4 times and on a second note I had to make a new call to just get my phone replaced.
This company is horrible and when my contract is up I'm never going back.</sentencetext>
</comment>
<comment>
	<id>http://www.semanticweb.org/ontologies/ConversationInstances.owl#comment09_12_19_1429252.30500594</id>
	<title>There's A Map for That!</title>
	<author>Trackster</author>
	<datestamp>1261218180000</datestamp>
	<modclass>None</modclass>
	<modscore>1</modscore>
	<htmltext>Want to find a way to avoid getting fuxed by the Verizon Wireless early termination fee to escape it's crappy service? *world map excluding United States pops up* There's a map for that!</htmltext>
<tokenext>Want to find a way to avoid getting fuxed by the Verizon Wireless early termination fee to escape it 's crappy service ?
* world map excluding United States pops up * There 's a map for that !</tokentext>
<sentencetext>Want to find a way to avoid getting fuxed by the Verizon Wireless early termination fee to escape it's crappy service?
*world map excluding United States pops up* There's a map for that!</sentencetext>
</comment>
<comment>
	<id>http://www.semanticweb.org/ontologies/ConversationInstances.owl#comment09_12_19_1429252.30499084</id>
	<title>Re:Meh.</title>
	<author>Anonymous</author>
	<datestamp>1261244760000</datestamp>
	<modclass>None</modclass>
	<modscore>1</modscore>
	<htmltext>I'm not even a potential Verizon customer, since they have no presence here in Australia, but pricing out any plan is largely an exercise in futility, given that just about all telcos are notorious for moving the goalposts as soon as you've signed on the dotted line. All you can do is run your costings on what they're offering at any given moment, in the hope that there isn't some buried clause in your contract that allows them to multiply the costs by x^n under whatever circumstances they hadn't seen fit to mention before. Or in the hope that the clause that says they can "vary the terms of your contract without bothering to tell you" won't come back to bite you on the bum.</htmltext>
<tokenext>I 'm not even a potential Verizon customer , since they have no presence here in Australia , but pricing out any plan is largely an exercise in futility , given that just about all telcos are notorious for moving the goalposts as soon as you 've signed on the dotted line .
All you can do is run your costings on what they 're offering at any given moment , in the hope that there is n't some buried clause in your contract that allows them to multiply the costs by x ^ n under whatever circumstances they had n't seen fit to mention before .
Or in the hope that the clause that says they can " vary the terms of your contract without bothering to tell you " wo n't come back to bite you on the bum .</tokentext>
<sentencetext>I'm not even a potential Verizon customer, since they have no presence here in Australia, but pricing out any plan is largely an exercise in futility, given that just about all telcos are notorious for moving the goalposts as soon as you've signed on the dotted line.
All you can do is run your costings on what they're offering at any given moment, in the hope that there isn't some buried clause in your contract that allows them to multiply the costs by x^n under whatever circumstances they hadn't seen fit to mention before.
Or in the hope that the clause that says they can "vary the terms of your contract without bothering to tell you" won't come back to bite you on the bum.</sentencetext>
	<parent>http://www.semanticweb.org/ontologies/ConversationInstances.owl#comment09_12_19_1429252.30498872</parent>
</comment>
<comment>
	<id>http://www.semanticweb.org/ontologies/ConversationInstances.owl#comment09_12_19_1429252.30499284</id>
	<title>Re:Don't pay the fee</title>
	<author>vvaduva</author>
	<datestamp>1261246380000</datestamp>
	<modclass>Insightful</modclass>
	<modscore>2</modscore>
	<htmltext><p>I couldn't say it better; the contract people sign with Verizon is voluntary...nobody is holding a gun to your head, so go to a competitor.  The market will sort things out in the end.</p></htmltext>
<tokenext>I could n't say it better ; the contract people sign with Verizon is voluntary...nobody is holding a gun to your head , so go to a competitor .
The market will sort things out in the end .</tokentext>
<sentencetext>I couldn't say it better; the contract people sign with Verizon is voluntary...nobody is holding a gun to your head, so go to a competitor.
The market will sort things out in the end.</sentencetext>
	<parent>http://www.semanticweb.org/ontologies/ConversationInstances.owl#comment09_12_19_1429252.30498914</parent>
</comment>
<comment>
	<id>http://www.semanticweb.org/ontologies/ConversationInstances.owl#comment09_12_19_1429252.30502122</id>
	<title>Re:Federal Trade Commission</title>
	<author>Zugok</author>
	<datestamp>1261242840000</datestamp>
	<modclass>None</modclass>
	<modscore>1</modscore>
	<htmltext><p>I too wondered why it was called to account to the FCC and not the FTC.  Seems it missed every over reply so far as well.</p></htmltext>
<tokenext>I too wondered why it was called to account to the FCC and not the FTC .
Seems it missed every over reply so far as well .</tokentext>
<sentencetext>I too wondered why it was called to account to the FCC and not the FTC.
Seems it missed every over reply so far as well.</sentencetext>
	<parent>http://www.semanticweb.org/ontologies/ConversationInstances.owl#comment09_12_19_1429252.30498856</parent>
</comment>
<comment>
	<id>http://www.semanticweb.org/ontologies/ConversationInstances.owl#comment09_12_19_1429252.30499748</id>
	<title>Termination fees should be depreciated</title>
	<author>davidwr</author>
	<datestamp>1261250340000</datestamp>
	<modclass>None</modclass>
	<modscore>1</modscore>
	<htmltext><p>If Verizon gives you a free phone for 24 month's service, they should credit you for 1/24th of the early termination fee every month should you terminate early.  Have a $240 termination fee and cancel after 23 months?  Cough up a 10-spot.</p></htmltext>
<tokenext>If Verizon gives you a free phone for 24 month 's service , they should credit you for 1/24th of the early termination fee every month should you terminate early .
Have a $ 240 termination fee and cancel after 23 months ?
Cough up a 10-spot .</tokentext>
<sentencetext>If Verizon gives you a free phone for 24 month's service, they should credit you for 1/24th of the early termination fee every month should you terminate early.
Have a $240 termination fee and cancel after 23 months?
Cough up a 10-spot.</sentencetext>
</comment>
<comment>
	<id>http://www.semanticweb.org/ontologies/ConversationInstances.owl#comment09_12_19_1429252.30498874</id>
	<title>Customer care</title>
	<author>Anonymous</author>
	<datestamp>1261242960000</datestamp>
	<modclass>None</modclass>
	<modscore>0</modscore>
	<htmltext><p>Verizon will go any lengths to protect their customers, even if it means killing them.</p></htmltext>
<tokenext>Verizon will go any lengths to protect their customers , even if it means killing them .</tokentext>
<sentencetext>Verizon will go any lengths to protect their customers, even if it means killing them.</sentencetext>
</comment>
<comment>
	<id>http://www.semanticweb.org/ontologies/ConversationInstances.owl#comment09_12_19_1429252.30498928</id>
	<title>So what if you have a basic phone?</title>
	<author>Anonymous</author>
	<datestamp>1261243500000</datestamp>
	<modclass>Interestin</modclass>
	<modscore>1</modscore>
	<htmltext><p>Is the fee prorated more aggressively because the phone doesn't cost as much or are you subsidizing the super phone users?</p></htmltext>
<tokenext>Is the fee prorated more aggressively because the phone does n't cost as much or are you subsidizing the super phone users ?</tokentext>
<sentencetext>Is the fee prorated more aggressively because the phone doesn't cost as much or are you subsidizing the super phone users?</sentencetext>
</comment>
<comment>
	<id>http://www.semanticweb.org/ontologies/ConversationInstances.owl#comment09_12_19_1429252.30501214</id>
	<title>Re:Don't pay the fee</title>
	<author>Nightspirit</author>
	<datestamp>1261227060000</datestamp>
	<modclass>None</modclass>
	<modscore>1</modscore>
	<htmltext><p>I agree. I don''t know about Verizon but the AT&amp;T stores clearly list the full price of phones without contract and with a contract. If you don't want to pay a termination fee then don't "finance" the $600 phone for $99, pay full price. Even my grandma knows this. I still have a 3 year old smartphone and while it doesn't have all the bells and whistles of the new smartphones, I'm not locked into a data plan and I can terminate my service anytime I want. The problem is entitlement, people want the latest and greatest for the cheapest and they don't care what they get into as long as they get it.</p></htmltext>
<tokenext>I agree .
I don''t know about Verizon but the AT&amp;T stores clearly list the full price of phones without contract and with a contract .
If you do n't want to pay a termination fee then do n't " finance " the $ 600 phone for $ 99 , pay full price .
Even my grandma knows this .
I still have a 3 year old smartphone and while it does n't have all the bells and whistles of the new smartphones , I 'm not locked into a data plan and I can terminate my service anytime I want .
The problem is entitlement , people want the latest and greatest for the cheapest and they do n't care what they get into as long as they get it .</tokentext>
<sentencetext>I agree.
I don''t know about Verizon but the AT&amp;T stores clearly list the full price of phones without contract and with a contract.
If you don't want to pay a termination fee then don't "finance" the $600 phone for $99, pay full price.
Even my grandma knows this.
I still have a 3 year old smartphone and while it doesn't have all the bells and whistles of the new smartphones, I'm not locked into a data plan and I can terminate my service anytime I want.
The problem is entitlement, people want the latest and greatest for the cheapest and they don't care what they get into as long as they get it.</sentencetext>
	<parent>http://www.semanticweb.org/ontologies/ConversationInstances.owl#comment09_12_19_1429252.30498914</parent>
</comment>
<comment>
	<id>http://www.semanticweb.org/ontologies/ConversationInstances.owl#comment09_12_19_1429252.30499700</id>
	<title>Re:They can charge whatever they want</title>
	<author>nurb432</author>
	<datestamp>1261249860000</datestamp>
	<modclass>None</modclass>
	<modscore>1</modscore>
	<htmltext><p>I agree that they have the right to run off business due to exorbitant fees/prices, but, if they change any terms DURING your current contract you should have the right to terminate with no fee or other repercussions. And yes, the that section of their TOS allowing them to do that should be struck down as deceptive.</p><p>Furthermore, if you don't like the posts from an individual, try this : DONT READ THEM.. geesh. You are whining as much as you claim others are..</p></htmltext>
<tokenext>I agree that they have the right to run off business due to exorbitant fees/prices , but , if they change any terms DURING your current contract you should have the right to terminate with no fee or other repercussions .
And yes , the that section of their TOS allowing them to do that should be struck down as deceptive.Furthermore , if you do n't like the posts from an individual , try this : DONT READ THEM.. geesh. You are whining as much as you claim others are. .</tokentext>
<sentencetext>I agree that they have the right to run off business due to exorbitant fees/prices, but, if they change any terms DURING your current contract you should have the right to terminate with no fee or other repercussions.
And yes, the that section of their TOS allowing them to do that should be struck down as deceptive.Furthermore, if you don't like the posts from an individual, try this : DONT READ THEM.. geesh. You are whining as much as you claim others are..</sentencetext>
	<parent>http://www.semanticweb.org/ontologies/ConversationInstances.owl#comment09_12_19_1429252.30498890</parent>
</comment>
<comment>
	<id>http://www.semanticweb.org/ontologies/ConversationInstances.owl#comment09_12_19_1429252.30502780</id>
	<title>Re:Lower Cost Phones?</title>
	<author>Anonymous</author>
	<datestamp>1261301160000</datestamp>
	<modclass>None</modclass>
	<modscore>0</modscore>
	<htmltext><p>It's because the cellular engine is covered by about a billion patents. 70\% of the cost of a cellphone goes directly to patent lawyers.</p></htmltext>
<tokenext>It 's because the cellular engine is covered by about a billion patents .
70 \ % of the cost of a cellphone goes directly to patent lawyers .</tokentext>
<sentencetext>It's because the cellular engine is covered by about a billion patents.
70\% of the cost of a cellphone goes directly to patent lawyers.</sentencetext>
	<parent>http://www.semanticweb.org/ontologies/ConversationInstances.owl#comment09_12_19_1429252.30499198</parent>
</comment>
<comment>
	<id>http://www.semanticweb.org/ontologies/ConversationInstances.owl#comment09_12_19_1429252.30499190</id>
	<title>Re:They can charge whatever they want</title>
	<author>Anonymous</author>
	<datestamp>1261245600000</datestamp>
	<modclass>None</modclass>
	<modscore>0</modscore>
	<htmltext><p>Actually, Koodo Mobile (in Canada) does something similar. You have the choice of buying the phone outright or amortizing the cost of the phone over a period of time. They call it running a tab: http://www.koodomobile.com/en/on/tab.shtml</p></htmltext>
<tokenext>Actually , Koodo Mobile ( in Canada ) does something similar .
You have the choice of buying the phone outright or amortizing the cost of the phone over a period of time .
They call it running a tab : http : //www.koodomobile.com/en/on/tab.shtml</tokentext>
<sentencetext>Actually, Koodo Mobile (in Canada) does something similar.
You have the choice of buying the phone outright or amortizing the cost of the phone over a period of time.
They call it running a tab: http://www.koodomobile.com/en/on/tab.shtml</sentencetext>
	<parent>http://www.semanticweb.org/ontologies/ConversationInstances.owl#comment09_12_19_1429252.30498890</parent>
</comment>
<comment>
	<id>http://www.semanticweb.org/ontologies/ConversationInstances.owl#comment09_12_19_1429252.30499958</id>
	<title>Re:Oh boo, friggen, hoo...</title>
	<author>farble1670</author>
	<datestamp>1261252680000</datestamp>
	<modclass>Informativ</modclass>
	<modscore>2</modscore>
	<htmltext><p>additionally, the idea that they pay $600 for a droid phone is BS. they are the single distribution channel for the droid in the US. that means that motorola is bending over to have them push their phone. they are getting droids at a massive discount over what a normal consumer would pay for the unlocked phone.</p></htmltext>
<tokenext>additionally , the idea that they pay $ 600 for a droid phone is BS .
they are the single distribution channel for the droid in the US .
that means that motorola is bending over to have them push their phone .
they are getting droids at a massive discount over what a normal consumer would pay for the unlocked phone .</tokentext>
<sentencetext>additionally, the idea that they pay $600 for a droid phone is BS.
they are the single distribution channel for the droid in the US.
that means that motorola is bending over to have them push their phone.
they are getting droids at a massive discount over what a normal consumer would pay for the unlocked phone.</sentencetext>
	<parent>http://www.semanticweb.org/ontologies/ConversationInstances.owl#comment09_12_19_1429252.30498984</parent>
</comment>
<comment>
	<id>http://www.semanticweb.org/ontologies/ConversationInstances.owl#comment09_12_19_1429252.30500558</id>
	<title>In Canada: Rogers charges for 'free' text messages</title>
	<author>Anonymous</author>
	<datestamp>1261217520000</datestamp>
	<modclass>None</modclass>
	<modscore>0</modscore>
	<htmltext><p>A Rogers Wireless customer signed a contract that said "All text messages received are free." But Rogers decided to start charging for those messages and when the customer got the large bill she decided to leave. That's when the fun started.</p><p>By the urging of the Canadian government, last year the wireless industry establishing a code of conduct which states that if customers contracts change they should not be forced to accept those changes and they can "terminate the contract without any additional fees for early termination"</p><p>But, Rogers told this customer that if she leaves she'll have to pay $20 a month for the remainder of the contract and Rogers "Rogers does not consider its cancellation fee to be a penalty"</p><p><a href="http://www.cbc.ca/canada/british-columbia/story/2009/12/14/bc-rogerstexting.html" title="www.cbc.ca" rel="nofollow">Watch the video on this page and Cringe.</a> [www.cbc.ca]</p></htmltext>
<tokenext>A Rogers Wireless customer signed a contract that said " All text messages received are free .
" But Rogers decided to start charging for those messages and when the customer got the large bill she decided to leave .
That 's when the fun started.By the urging of the Canadian government , last year the wireless industry establishing a code of conduct which states that if customers contracts change they should not be forced to accept those changes and they can " terminate the contract without any additional fees for early termination " But , Rogers told this customer that if she leaves she 'll have to pay $ 20 a month for the remainder of the contract and Rogers " Rogers does not consider its cancellation fee to be a penalty " Watch the video on this page and Cringe .
[ www.cbc.ca ]</tokentext>
<sentencetext>A Rogers Wireless customer signed a contract that said "All text messages received are free.
" But Rogers decided to start charging for those messages and when the customer got the large bill she decided to leave.
That's when the fun started.By the urging of the Canadian government, last year the wireless industry establishing a code of conduct which states that if customers contracts change they should not be forced to accept those changes and they can "terminate the contract without any additional fees for early termination"But, Rogers told this customer that if she leaves she'll have to pay $20 a month for the remainder of the contract and Rogers "Rogers does not consider its cancellation fee to be a penalty"Watch the video on this page and Cringe.
[www.cbc.ca]</sentencetext>
</comment>
<comment>
	<id>http://www.semanticweb.org/ontologies/ConversationInstances.owl#comment09_12_19_1429252.30498930</id>
	<title>Where is government now that we need them?</title>
	<author>Anonymous</author>
	<datestamp>1261243500000</datestamp>
	<modclass>Insightful</modclass>
	<modscore>5</modscore>
	<htmltext><p>The FCC and FTC definitely need to step in the the wireless market.  Policies like this promote stagnation and high prices.</p><p>Why should the customer be bound to a wireless contract when this doesn't apply to landlines?  I've said before that wireless contracts are keeping prices artifically high, allowing providers to charge quite similar rates for similar plans, because it is so difficult to switch.  If customers were not tied to contracts, the ensuing price war might bring wireless rates down closer to prices that I have seen outside the USA.</p><p>Speaking of other countries - Why is the USA one of few countries where I can't just pop the SIM or UICC card out of my handset and put it into a new one?  Why did it take intervention by the Chinese government to force device manufacturers to standardize chargers to minimize electronic waste?</p></htmltext>
<tokenext>The FCC and FTC definitely need to step in the the wireless market .
Policies like this promote stagnation and high prices.Why should the customer be bound to a wireless contract when this does n't apply to landlines ?
I 've said before that wireless contracts are keeping prices artifically high , allowing providers to charge quite similar rates for similar plans , because it is so difficult to switch .
If customers were not tied to contracts , the ensuing price war might bring wireless rates down closer to prices that I have seen outside the USA.Speaking of other countries - Why is the USA one of few countries where I ca n't just pop the SIM or UICC card out of my handset and put it into a new one ?
Why did it take intervention by the Chinese government to force device manufacturers to standardize chargers to minimize electronic waste ?</tokentext>
<sentencetext>The FCC and FTC definitely need to step in the the wireless market.
Policies like this promote stagnation and high prices.Why should the customer be bound to a wireless contract when this doesn't apply to landlines?
I've said before that wireless contracts are keeping prices artifically high, allowing providers to charge quite similar rates for similar plans, because it is so difficult to switch.
If customers were not tied to contracts, the ensuing price war might bring wireless rates down closer to prices that I have seen outside the USA.Speaking of other countries - Why is the USA one of few countries where I can't just pop the SIM or UICC card out of my handset and put it into a new one?
Why did it take intervention by the Chinese government to force device manufacturers to standardize chargers to minimize electronic waste?</sentencetext>
</comment>
<comment>
	<id>http://www.semanticweb.org/ontologies/ConversationInstances.owl#comment09_12_19_1429252.30502514</id>
	<title>Re:Don't pay the fee</title>
	<author>Blakey Rat</author>
	<datestamp>1261251960000</datestamp>
	<modclass>None</modclass>
	<modscore>1</modscore>
	<htmltext><p><i>Obviously, you missed the part about "the agreement" being intentionally and maliciously complex, to the point that it is indecipherable to the average customer.</i></p><p>Ok, so don't sign it for THAT reason.</p><p>It's not difficult. Don't sign a contract you don't understand. Don't sign a contract if you don't want to live up with the obligations spelled-out in it.</p><p>If Verizon loses customers because their contracts are too complex, then they'll either go out of business or they'll fix the problem. That's how the free market is *supposed* to work.</p><p>However, what usually ends up happening is that retards sign the contract, then get mad that they didn't read it, then petition the government to step-in to save them from themselves. Hello, nanny state!</p></htmltext>
<tokenext>Obviously , you missed the part about " the agreement " being intentionally and maliciously complex , to the point that it is indecipherable to the average customer.Ok , so do n't sign it for THAT reason.It 's not difficult .
Do n't sign a contract you do n't understand .
Do n't sign a contract if you do n't want to live up with the obligations spelled-out in it.If Verizon loses customers because their contracts are too complex , then they 'll either go out of business or they 'll fix the problem .
That 's how the free market is * supposed * to work.However , what usually ends up happening is that retards sign the contract , then get mad that they did n't read it , then petition the government to step-in to save them from themselves .
Hello , nanny state !</tokentext>
<sentencetext>Obviously, you missed the part about "the agreement" being intentionally and maliciously complex, to the point that it is indecipherable to the average customer.Ok, so don't sign it for THAT reason.It's not difficult.
Don't sign a contract you don't understand.
Don't sign a contract if you don't want to live up with the obligations spelled-out in it.If Verizon loses customers because their contracts are too complex, then they'll either go out of business or they'll fix the problem.
That's how the free market is *supposed* to work.However, what usually ends up happening is that retards sign the contract, then get mad that they didn't read it, then petition the government to step-in to save them from themselves.
Hello, nanny state!</sentencetext>
	<parent>http://www.semanticweb.org/ontologies/ConversationInstances.owl#comment09_12_19_1429252.30499278</parent>
</comment>
<comment>
	<id>http://www.semanticweb.org/ontologies/ConversationInstances.owl#comment09_12_19_1429252.30498924</id>
	<title>Careful, they're going to covertly sign you up</title>
	<author>Anonymous</author>
	<datestamp>1261243380000</datestamp>
	<modclass>Troll</modclass>
	<modscore>0</modscore>
	<htmltext><p>Somehow, Verizon has done the impossible, it has developed a way to sign people up for onerous contracts without their realizing it.</p><p>THAT is why this is so serious, it used to be you could just say "No, I'll use a different carrier" and go on about your business.  NO LONGER!</p><p>Ah, the good old days, when I was responsible for the contracts I signed and the agreements contained within...</p><p>GOD DAMN YOU VERIZON! WHY!!!</p></htmltext>
<tokenext>Somehow , Verizon has done the impossible , it has developed a way to sign people up for onerous contracts without their realizing it.THAT is why this is so serious , it used to be you could just say " No , I 'll use a different carrier " and go on about your business .
NO LONGER ! Ah , the good old days , when I was responsible for the contracts I signed and the agreements contained within...GOD DAMN YOU VERIZON !
WHY ! ! !</tokentext>
<sentencetext>Somehow, Verizon has done the impossible, it has developed a way to sign people up for onerous contracts without their realizing it.THAT is why this is so serious, it used to be you could just say "No, I'll use a different carrier" and go on about your business.
NO LONGER!Ah, the good old days, when I was responsible for the contracts I signed and the agreements contained within...GOD DAMN YOU VERIZON!
WHY!!!</sentencetext>
</comment>
<comment>
	<id>http://www.semanticweb.org/ontologies/ConversationInstances.owl#comment09_12_19_1429252.30500084</id>
	<title>Any Jarhead can tell you....</title>
	<author>Anonymous</author>
	<datestamp>1261254360000</datestamp>
	<modclass>Insightful</modclass>
	<modscore>3</modscore>
	<htmltext><p>USMC applies here too: U Signed the Muthafuckin' Contract.</p><p>Don't like it? Don't buy a Verizon phone. Or better still, don't buy a phone with a contract.</p></htmltext>
<tokenext>USMC applies here too : U Signed the Muthafuckin ' Contract.Do n't like it ?
Do n't buy a Verizon phone .
Or better still , do n't buy a phone with a contract .</tokentext>
<sentencetext>USMC applies here too: U Signed the Muthafuckin' Contract.Don't like it?
Don't buy a Verizon phone.
Or better still, don't buy a phone with a contract.</sentencetext>
</comment>
<comment>
	<id>http://www.semanticweb.org/ontologies/ConversationInstances.owl#comment09_12_19_1429252.30499524</id>
	<title>Let em charge what they want!</title>
	<author>Anonymous</author>
	<datestamp>1261248180000</datestamp>
	<modclass>Flamebait</modclass>
	<modscore>0</modscore>
	<htmltext>No one is FORCING you to purchase a wireless phone, no one is forcing you to purchase an expensive phone.  If you require a phone, get a cheap tracphone, or something similar.
If a company wants to charge more, then they better offer a better service, or they will lose market share.</htmltext>
<tokenext>No one is FORCING you to purchase a wireless phone , no one is forcing you to purchase an expensive phone .
If you require a phone , get a cheap tracphone , or something similar .
If a company wants to charge more , then they better offer a better service , or they will lose market share .</tokentext>
<sentencetext>No one is FORCING you to purchase a wireless phone, no one is forcing you to purchase an expensive phone.
If you require a phone, get a cheap tracphone, or something similar.
If a company wants to charge more, then they better offer a better service, or they will lose market share.</sentencetext>
	<parent>http://www.semanticweb.org/ontologies/ConversationInstances.owl#comment09_12_19_1429252.30498890</parent>
</comment>
<comment>
	<id>http://www.semanticweb.org/ontologies/ConversationInstances.owl#comment09_12_19_1429252.30500510</id>
	<title>Re:Where is government now that we need them?</title>
	<author>Anonymous</author>
	<datestamp>1261216800000</datestamp>
	<modclass>Interestin</modclass>
	<modscore>1</modscore>
	<htmltext><p>Unlike other markets of the world where people got used to modern cellular practices, the US was the first nation with a cellular network.  So a lot of Americans viewed cell service as ungainly expensive for a long time, and were happy with anything.  So for a long time, cellphone providers could get away with selling low end units with little functionality and charging a premium.  This is why Motorola raked in the cash with their RAZR line for so long.  American consumers for the most part only demanded phones that could call out, SMS, have a couple downloadable games for sale, and some stuff for download at a store.  So, cellphone companies provided just that.  Want new wallpaper?  $1.99.  Want the ringtone from whomever's latest album?  $4.99.</p><p>Fundamentally, these expectations didn't change until 2007 and the iPhone when Apple set the bar of what people should expect in a phone.</p><p>Even though these days, basic RAZR-like phones are relegated to the "free with two year subscription", or the rack of prepaid devices, US consumers are still used to throwing away a device at the end of the contract, then buying their new toy from another provider.  So, if someone has an iPhone and wants a Droid, they either wait until they are OOC with AT&amp;T or pay the ETF and jump providers.</p><p>The second reason is that the US has only two GSM providers.  The other two providers are CDMA, and this generation of technology does not allow for exchange of phones between carriers in an easy fashion.  For example, with T-Mobile, I can buy a phone, unlock it, drop in my SIM card and be online.  With Sprint or Verizon, the device has to be put on their CDMA network on their end so changing phones is more difficult.</p><p>Because of Americans being used (until recently) to low functioning cellular networks, and the incompatibility between providers (even the two GSM providers have different bands), consumers here tend not to bother with moving phones across networks, and instead will just switch providers when they switch phones.</p></htmltext>
<tokenext>Unlike other markets of the world where people got used to modern cellular practices , the US was the first nation with a cellular network .
So a lot of Americans viewed cell service as ungainly expensive for a long time , and were happy with anything .
So for a long time , cellphone providers could get away with selling low end units with little functionality and charging a premium .
This is why Motorola raked in the cash with their RAZR line for so long .
American consumers for the most part only demanded phones that could call out , SMS , have a couple downloadable games for sale , and some stuff for download at a store .
So , cellphone companies provided just that .
Want new wallpaper ?
$ 1.99. Want the ringtone from whomever 's latest album ?
$ 4.99.Fundamentally , these expectations did n't change until 2007 and the iPhone when Apple set the bar of what people should expect in a phone.Even though these days , basic RAZR-like phones are relegated to the " free with two year subscription " , or the rack of prepaid devices , US consumers are still used to throwing away a device at the end of the contract , then buying their new toy from another provider .
So , if someone has an iPhone and wants a Droid , they either wait until they are OOC with AT&amp;T or pay the ETF and jump providers.The second reason is that the US has only two GSM providers .
The other two providers are CDMA , and this generation of technology does not allow for exchange of phones between carriers in an easy fashion .
For example , with T-Mobile , I can buy a phone , unlock it , drop in my SIM card and be online .
With Sprint or Verizon , the device has to be put on their CDMA network on their end so changing phones is more difficult.Because of Americans being used ( until recently ) to low functioning cellular networks , and the incompatibility between providers ( even the two GSM providers have different bands ) , consumers here tend not to bother with moving phones across networks , and instead will just switch providers when they switch phones .</tokentext>
<sentencetext>Unlike other markets of the world where people got used to modern cellular practices, the US was the first nation with a cellular network.
So a lot of Americans viewed cell service as ungainly expensive for a long time, and were happy with anything.
So for a long time, cellphone providers could get away with selling low end units with little functionality and charging a premium.
This is why Motorola raked in the cash with their RAZR line for so long.
American consumers for the most part only demanded phones that could call out, SMS, have a couple downloadable games for sale, and some stuff for download at a store.
So, cellphone companies provided just that.
Want new wallpaper?
$1.99.  Want the ringtone from whomever's latest album?
$4.99.Fundamentally, these expectations didn't change until 2007 and the iPhone when Apple set the bar of what people should expect in a phone.Even though these days, basic RAZR-like phones are relegated to the "free with two year subscription", or the rack of prepaid devices, US consumers are still used to throwing away a device at the end of the contract, then buying their new toy from another provider.
So, if someone has an iPhone and wants a Droid, they either wait until they are OOC with AT&amp;T or pay the ETF and jump providers.The second reason is that the US has only two GSM providers.
The other two providers are CDMA, and this generation of technology does not allow for exchange of phones between carriers in an easy fashion.
For example, with T-Mobile, I can buy a phone, unlock it, drop in my SIM card and be online.
With Sprint or Verizon, the device has to be put on their CDMA network on their end so changing phones is more difficult.Because of Americans being used (until recently) to low functioning cellular networks, and the incompatibility between providers (even the two GSM providers have different bands), consumers here tend not to bother with moving phones across networks, and instead will just switch providers when they switch phones.</sentencetext>
	<parent>http://www.semanticweb.org/ontologies/ConversationInstances.owl#comment09_12_19_1429252.30498930</parent>
</comment>
<comment>
	<id>http://www.semanticweb.org/ontologies/ConversationInstances.owl#comment09_12_19_1429252.30499598</id>
	<title>Re:Don't pay the fee</title>
	<author>Anonymous</author>
	<datestamp>1261248840000</datestamp>
	<modclass>None</modclass>
	<modscore>0</modscore>
	<htmltext><p>I generally don't have a problem with dropped calls.  I know where the service is bad in my area and understand that there is not a tower there (despite Verizon's map having shown my area thoroughly covered for years.)</p><p>I DO have a serious problem with issues like having 3 bars on my phone at home and a) phone never rings yet missed calls show up (wife's phone does the same and is a different make/model), b) phone never rings, missed call never shows up, caller gets sent straight to voicemail, c) lots of trouble with conversations cutting out and being unintelligible.  It is so bad their service is hardly worth anything.  Why the hell should I have to pay an early termination fee when they have failed to provide the service they promised?  Period!</p><p>Further more, I doubt this move is a reaction to the FCC...it is a reaction to all the people that would rather have food on the table in this economy than mobile service that works half the time.  Screw you Verizon.</p></htmltext>
<tokenext>I generally do n't have a problem with dropped calls .
I know where the service is bad in my area and understand that there is not a tower there ( despite Verizon 's map having shown my area thoroughly covered for years .
) I DO have a serious problem with issues like having 3 bars on my phone at home and a ) phone never rings yet missed calls show up ( wife 's phone does the same and is a different make/model ) , b ) phone never rings , missed call never shows up , caller gets sent straight to voicemail , c ) lots of trouble with conversations cutting out and being unintelligible .
It is so bad their service is hardly worth anything .
Why the hell should I have to pay an early termination fee when they have failed to provide the service they promised ?
Period ! Further more , I doubt this move is a reaction to the FCC...it is a reaction to all the people that would rather have food on the table in this economy than mobile service that works half the time .
Screw you Verizon .</tokentext>
<sentencetext>I generally don't have a problem with dropped calls.
I know where the service is bad in my area and understand that there is not a tower there (despite Verizon's map having shown my area thoroughly covered for years.
)I DO have a serious problem with issues like having 3 bars on my phone at home and a) phone never rings yet missed calls show up (wife's phone does the same and is a different make/model), b) phone never rings, missed call never shows up, caller gets sent straight to voicemail, c) lots of trouble with conversations cutting out and being unintelligible.
It is so bad their service is hardly worth anything.
Why the hell should I have to pay an early termination fee when they have failed to provide the service they promised?
Period!Further more, I doubt this move is a reaction to the FCC...it is a reaction to all the people that would rather have food on the table in this economy than mobile service that works half the time.
Screw you Verizon.</sentencetext>
	<parent>http://www.semanticweb.org/ontologies/ConversationInstances.owl#comment09_12_19_1429252.30498914</parent>
</comment>
<comment>
	<id>http://www.semanticweb.org/ontologies/ConversationInstances.owl#comment09_12_19_1429252.30498890</id>
	<title>They can charge whatever they want</title>
	<author>Anonymous</author>
	<datestamp>1261243080000</datestamp>
	<modclass>Insightful</modclass>
	<modscore>2</modscore>
	<htmltext><p>If they didn't get you on the back end, they could just charge you more up front to buy the phone, then amortize the up front cost through lower monthly bills, until in the end you pay the same amount.  That way, they could even offer "no termination fee!"  But I'm sure somebody would still get pissed at call it deceptive business practices.  It's a free market, and they can charge anything they like.  This is a total non-story.</p><p>Please, Slashdot, can we have a way to filter out stories by submitter?  I don't think I've ever seen a story from "I Don't Believe in Imaginary Property" that doesn't irritate me with its smug sanctimony and total irrelevance.  Personally, I don't believe in imaginary news.</p></htmltext>
<tokenext>If they did n't get you on the back end , they could just charge you more up front to buy the phone , then amortize the up front cost through lower monthly bills , until in the end you pay the same amount .
That way , they could even offer " no termination fee !
" But I 'm sure somebody would still get pissed at call it deceptive business practices .
It 's a free market , and they can charge anything they like .
This is a total non-story.Please , Slashdot , can we have a way to filter out stories by submitter ?
I do n't think I 've ever seen a story from " I Do n't Believe in Imaginary Property " that does n't irritate me with its smug sanctimony and total irrelevance .
Personally , I do n't believe in imaginary news .</tokentext>
<sentencetext>If they didn't get you on the back end, they could just charge you more up front to buy the phone, then amortize the up front cost through lower monthly bills, until in the end you pay the same amount.
That way, they could even offer "no termination fee!
"  But I'm sure somebody would still get pissed at call it deceptive business practices.
It's a free market, and they can charge anything they like.
This is a total non-story.Please, Slashdot, can we have a way to filter out stories by submitter?
I don't think I've ever seen a story from "I Don't Believe in Imaginary Property" that doesn't irritate me with its smug sanctimony and total irrelevance.
Personally, I don't believe in imaginary news.</sentencetext>
</comment>
<comment>
	<id>http://www.semanticweb.org/ontologies/ConversationInstances.owl#comment09_12_19_1429252.30500140</id>
	<title>easy peasy fix</title>
	<author>Anonymous</author>
	<datestamp>1261255020000</datestamp>
	<modclass>None</modclass>
	<modscore>0</modscore>
	<htmltext><p>If enough people just refused to pay full stop they would soon have a change of mind  on the plus side this would also mean a lot less of the frikkin apple iPhone heaps around as well  because people will not pay the typical apple over inflated price for a stupid contraption</p></htmltext>
<tokenext>If enough people just refused to pay full stop they would soon have a change of mind on the plus side this would also mean a lot less of the frikkin apple iPhone heaps around as well because people will not pay the typical apple over inflated price for a stupid contraption</tokentext>
<sentencetext>If enough people just refused to pay full stop they would soon have a change of mind  on the plus side this would also mean a lot less of the frikkin apple iPhone heaps around as well  because people will not pay the typical apple over inflated price for a stupid contraption</sentencetext>
</comment>
<comment>
	<id>http://www.semanticweb.org/ontologies/ConversationInstances.owl#comment09_12_19_1429252.30500500</id>
	<title>Re:Crippling Early Termination Fee</title>
	<author>PopeRatzo</author>
	<datestamp>1261216740000</datestamp>
	<modclass>None</modclass>
	<modscore>0</modscore>
	<htmltext><blockquote><div><p>.Here in Germany, no company can change a contract in &ldquo;mid air&rdquo;</p></div></blockquote><p>See, that's proof that you don't have a free market economy.</p><p>A "free market economy" means that corporations are "free" to screw over consumers and workers.</p></div>
	</htmltext>
<tokenext>.Here in Germany , no company can change a contract in    mid air    See , that 's proof that you do n't have a free market economy.A " free market economy " means that corporations are " free " to screw over consumers and workers .</tokentext>
<sentencetext>.Here in Germany, no company can change a contract in “mid air”See, that's proof that you don't have a free market economy.A "free market economy" means that corporations are "free" to screw over consumers and workers.
	</sentencetext>
	<parent>http://www.semanticweb.org/ontologies/ConversationInstances.owl#comment09_12_19_1429252.30499876</parent>
</comment>
<comment>
	<id>http://www.semanticweb.org/ontologies/ConversationInstances.owl#comment09_12_19_1429252.30498872</id>
	<title>Meh.</title>
	<author>RightSaidFred99</author>
	<datestamp>1261242960000</datestamp>
	<modclass>Insightful</modclass>
	<modscore>3</modscore>
	<htmltext><p>Verizon sucks anyway.  Their plans are laughable.  Try pricing out a smartphone plan with them.  Oh, and don't forget the (lol) extra $24 for the data plan.  For an average family plan with smartphones they come out to like $40+ more than Verizon for just two lines, and it goes up as you get more lines.</p><p>Verizon can rot in hell.  Can you hear me now?  Yes?  Well, what I said was "fuck you, Verizon".</p></htmltext>
<tokenext>Verizon sucks anyway .
Their plans are laughable .
Try pricing out a smartphone plan with them .
Oh , and do n't forget the ( lol ) extra $ 24 for the data plan .
For an average family plan with smartphones they come out to like $ 40 + more than Verizon for just two lines , and it goes up as you get more lines.Verizon can rot in hell .
Can you hear me now ?
Yes ? Well , what I said was " fuck you , Verizon " .</tokentext>
<sentencetext>Verizon sucks anyway.
Their plans are laughable.
Try pricing out a smartphone plan with them.
Oh, and don't forget the (lol) extra $24 for the data plan.
For an average family plan with smartphones they come out to like $40+ more than Verizon for just two lines, and it goes up as you get more lines.Verizon can rot in hell.
Can you hear me now?
Yes?  Well, what I said was "fuck you, Verizon".</sentencetext>
</comment>
<comment>
	<id>http://www.semanticweb.org/ontologies/ConversationInstances.owl#comment09_12_19_1429252.30500582</id>
	<title>Re:Not a 'Free Market'</title>
	<author>Anonymous</author>
	<datestamp>1261218000000</datestamp>
	<modclass>None</modclass>
	<modscore>0</modscore>
	<htmltext><p><div class="quote"><p>A free market refers to the lack of governmental intervention except in cases of force or fraud.</p></div><p>Set up a cell tower in your back yard... see how quickly the government uses force.</p><p>Also, check out the number of tax-payer gifts the phone companies have landed for "expanding coverage" and "creating jobs".</p></div>
	</htmltext>
<tokenext>A free market refers to the lack of governmental intervention except in cases of force or fraud.Set up a cell tower in your back yard... see how quickly the government uses force.Also , check out the number of tax-payer gifts the phone companies have landed for " expanding coverage " and " creating jobs " .</tokentext>
<sentencetext>A free market refers to the lack of governmental intervention except in cases of force or fraud.Set up a cell tower in your back yard... see how quickly the government uses force.Also, check out the number of tax-payer gifts the phone companies have landed for "expanding coverage" and "creating jobs".
	</sentencetext>
	<parent>http://www.semanticweb.org/ontologies/ConversationInstances.owl#comment09_12_19_1429252.30500086</parent>
</comment>
<comment>
	<id>http://www.semanticweb.org/ontologies/ConversationInstances.owl#comment09_12_19_1429252.30500804</id>
	<title>Re:Not a 'Free Market'</title>
	<author>Rich0</author>
	<datestamp>1261221300000</datestamp>
	<modclass>None</modclass>
	<modscore>1</modscore>
	<htmltext><p>It is only a free market if anybody is free to enter the market.  That is certainly not the case with a phone company.  How much capital do you think it would take to actually create a credible cell-phone provider?</p></htmltext>
<tokenext>It is only a free market if anybody is free to enter the market .
That is certainly not the case with a phone company .
How much capital do you think it would take to actually create a credible cell-phone provider ?</tokentext>
<sentencetext>It is only a free market if anybody is free to enter the market.
That is certainly not the case with a phone company.
How much capital do you think it would take to actually create a credible cell-phone provider?</sentencetext>
	<parent>http://www.semanticweb.org/ontologies/ConversationInstances.owl#comment09_12_19_1429252.30500086</parent>
</comment>
<comment>
	<id>http://www.semanticweb.org/ontologies/ConversationInstances.owl#comment09_12_19_1429252.30501026</id>
	<title>Re:Not a 'Free Market'</title>
	<author>10101001 10101001</author>
	<datestamp>1261224480000</datestamp>
	<modclass>None</modclass>
	<modscore>1</modscore>
	<htmltext><blockquote><div><p>Oligopolies are perfectly capable of being formed in a free market economy. A free market refers to the lack of governmental intervention except in cases of force or fraud.</p></div></blockquote><p>Generally true.  However, in the Adam Smith free market, monopolies and oligopolies should be fought, removed, etc.  Meanwhile, in the Laissez-Faire free market, monopolies and oligopolies are good, wholesome constructions of inherent rights.</p><p>Many people who champion a free market don't realize that monopolies and oligopolies could be constructed in a free market because many Laissez-Faire supporting individuals are quick to downplay their inevitable existence with speak of competition and the invisible hand.  The end result is people like the GP who are misinformed about what a real free market (as opposed to an idealized free market) entails.</p></div>
	</htmltext>
<tokenext>Oligopolies are perfectly capable of being formed in a free market economy .
A free market refers to the lack of governmental intervention except in cases of force or fraud.Generally true .
However , in the Adam Smith free market , monopolies and oligopolies should be fought , removed , etc .
Meanwhile , in the Laissez-Faire free market , monopolies and oligopolies are good , wholesome constructions of inherent rights.Many people who champion a free market do n't realize that monopolies and oligopolies could be constructed in a free market because many Laissez-Faire supporting individuals are quick to downplay their inevitable existence with speak of competition and the invisible hand .
The end result is people like the GP who are misinformed about what a real free market ( as opposed to an idealized free market ) entails .</tokentext>
<sentencetext>Oligopolies are perfectly capable of being formed in a free market economy.
A free market refers to the lack of governmental intervention except in cases of force or fraud.Generally true.
However, in the Adam Smith free market, monopolies and oligopolies should be fought, removed, etc.
Meanwhile, in the Laissez-Faire free market, monopolies and oligopolies are good, wholesome constructions of inherent rights.Many people who champion a free market don't realize that monopolies and oligopolies could be constructed in a free market because many Laissez-Faire supporting individuals are quick to downplay their inevitable existence with speak of competition and the invisible hand.
The end result is people like the GP who are misinformed about what a real free market (as opposed to an idealized free market) entails.
	</sentencetext>
	<parent>http://www.semanticweb.org/ontologies/ConversationInstances.owl#comment09_12_19_1429252.30500086</parent>
</comment>
<comment>
	<id>http://www.semanticweb.org/ontologies/ConversationInstances.owl#comment09_12_19_1429252.30500280</id>
	<title>There is another way</title>
	<author>whistlingtony</author>
	<datestamp>1261213500000</datestamp>
	<modclass>None</modclass>
	<modscore>1</modscore>
	<htmltext><p>I have a nasty habit of washing my phones. Or losing them when camping....</p><p>I can't afford to get a fancy phone three times a year. I can't afford to be in a contract. So I just buy my phones.</p><p>I get them off ebay. They cost $10, including shipping. They have no bells and whistles, but who cares? I don't contribute to shitty Ta mining practices in Africa. I don't sign a contract for the length of my service. It's cheaper for me.</p><p>I'm free. I can leave whenever I want to. Hear that Sprint? Yup... whenever I want to.</p><p>Other people could be free too. We're all whining about how Evil Verizon is, but people PUT UP WITH THIS SH!T. It's outrageous, considering that NOT putting up with it is cheaper, easier, better for the environment, etc...</p><p>Now, even though I think most poeple are morons who "need" the latest Shiny... The phone ocmpanies are still evil bastards. Go FCC! Extend network neutrality to phones!</p></htmltext>
<tokenext>I have a nasty habit of washing my phones .
Or losing them when camping....I ca n't afford to get a fancy phone three times a year .
I ca n't afford to be in a contract .
So I just buy my phones.I get them off ebay .
They cost $ 10 , including shipping .
They have no bells and whistles , but who cares ?
I do n't contribute to shitty Ta mining practices in Africa .
I do n't sign a contract for the length of my service .
It 's cheaper for me.I 'm free .
I can leave whenever I want to .
Hear that Sprint ?
Yup... whenever I want to.Other people could be free too .
We 're all whining about how Evil Verizon is , but people PUT UP WITH THIS SH ! T .
It 's outrageous , considering that NOT putting up with it is cheaper , easier , better for the environment , etc...Now , even though I think most poeple are morons who " need " the latest Shiny... The phone ocmpanies are still evil bastards .
Go FCC !
Extend network neutrality to phones !</tokentext>
<sentencetext>I have a nasty habit of washing my phones.
Or losing them when camping....I can't afford to get a fancy phone three times a year.
I can't afford to be in a contract.
So I just buy my phones.I get them off ebay.
They cost $10, including shipping.
They have no bells and whistles, but who cares?
I don't contribute to shitty Ta mining practices in Africa.
I don't sign a contract for the length of my service.
It's cheaper for me.I'm free.
I can leave whenever I want to.
Hear that Sprint?
Yup... whenever I want to.Other people could be free too.
We're all whining about how Evil Verizon is, but people PUT UP WITH THIS SH!T.
It's outrageous, considering that NOT putting up with it is cheaper, easier, better for the environment, etc...Now, even though I think most poeple are morons who "need" the latest Shiny... The phone ocmpanies are still evil bastards.
Go FCC!
Extend network neutrality to phones!</sentencetext>
</comment>
<comment>
	<id>http://www.semanticweb.org/ontologies/ConversationInstances.owl#comment09_12_19_1429252.30504936</id>
	<title>Re:Don't pay the fee</title>
	<author>Myopic</author>
	<datestamp>1261333140000</datestamp>
	<modclass>None</modclass>
	<modscore>1</modscore>
	<htmltext><p>We use legislation to make markets more free.</p><p>In this case, the naturally occurring cell phone market is unfree because the power delta between provider and consumer is so gigantic that providers can collude and use tricks to get consumers to buy their products. We can use legislation to make that unfree market more free, by having laws to increase consumers' understanding of contracts, and so on.</p><p>There is no such thing as a free market (just as there is no such thing as a perfect circle), and insofar as we prefer freer markets to unfreer ones, we can use legislation to increase freeness.</p></htmltext>
<tokenext>We use legislation to make markets more free.In this case , the naturally occurring cell phone market is unfree because the power delta between provider and consumer is so gigantic that providers can collude and use tricks to get consumers to buy their products .
We can use legislation to make that unfree market more free , by having laws to increase consumers ' understanding of contracts , and so on.There is no such thing as a free market ( just as there is no such thing as a perfect circle ) , and insofar as we prefer freer markets to unfreer ones , we can use legislation to increase freeness .</tokentext>
<sentencetext>We use legislation to make markets more free.In this case, the naturally occurring cell phone market is unfree because the power delta between provider and consumer is so gigantic that providers can collude and use tricks to get consumers to buy their products.
We can use legislation to make that unfree market more free, by having laws to increase consumers' understanding of contracts, and so on.There is no such thing as a free market (just as there is no such thing as a perfect circle), and insofar as we prefer freer markets to unfreer ones, we can use legislation to increase freeness.</sentencetext>
	<parent>http://www.semanticweb.org/ontologies/ConversationInstances.owl#comment09_12_19_1429252.30498914</parent>
</comment>
<comment>
	<id>http://www.semanticweb.org/ontologies/ConversationInstances.owl#comment09_12_19_1429252.30500690</id>
	<title>Stop buying subsidized phones</title>
	<author>Stan92057</author>
	<datestamp>1261219380000</datestamp>
	<modclass>None</modclass>
	<modscore>0</modscore>
	<htmltext>What do you expect them to do when you get a subsidized phone?? There should be little penalty for switching if you own the phone outright,whatever it costs to do the switching. But as far as subsidized phones ya got to pay for the phone and switching. Its only fair i think</htmltext>
<tokenext>What do you expect them to do when you get a subsidized phone ? ?
There should be little penalty for switching if you own the phone outright,whatever it costs to do the switching .
But as far as subsidized phones ya got to pay for the phone and switching .
Its only fair i think</tokentext>
<sentencetext>What do you expect them to do when you get a subsidized phone??
There should be little penalty for switching if you own the phone outright,whatever it costs to do the switching.
But as far as subsidized phones ya got to pay for the phone and switching.
Its only fair i think</sentencetext>
</comment>
<comment>
	<id>http://www.semanticweb.org/ontologies/ConversationInstances.owl#comment09_12_19_1429252.30499934</id>
	<title>Re:Don't pay the fee</title>
	<author>Lord Kano</author>
	<datestamp>1261252380000</datestamp>
	<modclass>None</modclass>
	<modscore>1</modscore>
	<htmltext><p>Basically, you have to be willing to walk. I was willing to leave the Verizon store if I didn't get the phone I wanted, a plan that I wanted and a 1 year contract. I got the phone for free, a discount on my calling plan and a one year contract. The phone turned out to be a piece of shit, I didn't know at the time that Verizon crippled the RAZR. I finished my year and left. I went to another carrier and left Verizon behind. I'll never go back to them.</p><p>LK</p></htmltext>
<tokenext>Basically , you have to be willing to walk .
I was willing to leave the Verizon store if I did n't get the phone I wanted , a plan that I wanted and a 1 year contract .
I got the phone for free , a discount on my calling plan and a one year contract .
The phone turned out to be a piece of shit , I did n't know at the time that Verizon crippled the RAZR .
I finished my year and left .
I went to another carrier and left Verizon behind .
I 'll never go back to them.LK</tokentext>
<sentencetext>Basically, you have to be willing to walk.
I was willing to leave the Verizon store if I didn't get the phone I wanted, a plan that I wanted and a 1 year contract.
I got the phone for free, a discount on my calling plan and a one year contract.
The phone turned out to be a piece of shit, I didn't know at the time that Verizon crippled the RAZR.
I finished my year and left.
I went to another carrier and left Verizon behind.
I'll never go back to them.LK</sentencetext>
	<parent>http://www.semanticweb.org/ontologies/ConversationInstances.owl#comment09_12_19_1429252.30498914</parent>
</comment>
<comment>
	<id>http://www.semanticweb.org/ontologies/ConversationInstances.owl#comment09_12_19_1429252.30499002</id>
	<title>$350?</title>
	<author>Anonymous</author>
	<datestamp>1261244100000</datestamp>
	<modclass>None</modclass>
	<modscore>1</modscore>
	<htmltext><p>Wow.  My early cancellation fee is $500.  And contracts are three years, not two.</p></htmltext>
<tokenext>Wow .
My early cancellation fee is $ 500 .
And contracts are three years , not two .</tokentext>
<sentencetext>Wow.
My early cancellation fee is $500.
And contracts are three years, not two.</sentencetext>
</comment>
<comment>
	<id>http://www.semanticweb.org/ontologies/ConversationInstances.owl#comment09_12_19_1429252.30500766</id>
	<title>I think the government should step in...</title>
	<author>okmijnuhb</author>
	<datestamp>1261220760000</datestamp>
	<modclass>None</modclass>
	<modscore>1</modscore>
	<htmltext>...and require carriers to offer service plans without a contract. That would force them to shape up service to retain customers.</htmltext>
<tokenext>...and require carriers to offer service plans without a contract .
That would force them to shape up service to retain customers .</tokentext>
<sentencetext>...and require carriers to offer service plans without a contract.
That would force them to shape up service to retain customers.</sentencetext>
</comment>
<comment>
	<id>http://www.semanticweb.org/ontologies/ConversationInstances.owl#comment09_12_19_1429252.30499278</id>
	<title>Re:Don't pay the fee</title>
	<author>Jawn98685</author>
	<datestamp>1261246380000</datestamp>
	<modclass>Insightful</modclass>
	<modscore>5</modscore>
	<htmltext><p><div class="quote"><p>Don't hire the government to force the people at Verizon to do things against their will -- unless the people at Verizon have truly defrauded you, personally, out of a significant amount of money.  Because forcing people to do things against their will is (almost always) morally wrong.</p></div><p>Obviously, you missed the part about "the agreement" being intentionally and maliciously complex, to the point that it is indecipherable to the average customer. Said customer, having been assured by the friendly sales rep, "It just says [insert standard salesman bullshit rap here]", signs anyway, in the mistaken belief that he's dealing with a fair and honorable business.
<br>There are laws against trying to cheat customers. Hiding your draconian terms in an indecipherable "agreement" is anything but fair and honest. It should be illegal.</p></div>
	</htmltext>
<tokenext>Do n't hire the government to force the people at Verizon to do things against their will -- unless the people at Verizon have truly defrauded you , personally , out of a significant amount of money .
Because forcing people to do things against their will is ( almost always ) morally wrong.Obviously , you missed the part about " the agreement " being intentionally and maliciously complex , to the point that it is indecipherable to the average customer .
Said customer , having been assured by the friendly sales rep , " It just says [ insert standard salesman bullshit rap here ] " , signs anyway , in the mistaken belief that he 's dealing with a fair and honorable business .
There are laws against trying to cheat customers .
Hiding your draconian terms in an indecipherable " agreement " is anything but fair and honest .
It should be illegal .</tokentext>
<sentencetext>Don't hire the government to force the people at Verizon to do things against their will -- unless the people at Verizon have truly defrauded you, personally, out of a significant amount of money.
Because forcing people to do things against their will is (almost always) morally wrong.Obviously, you missed the part about "the agreement" being intentionally and maliciously complex, to the point that it is indecipherable to the average customer.
Said customer, having been assured by the friendly sales rep, "It just says [insert standard salesman bullshit rap here]", signs anyway, in the mistaken belief that he's dealing with a fair and honorable business.
There are laws against trying to cheat customers.
Hiding your draconian terms in an indecipherable "agreement" is anything but fair and honest.
It should be illegal.
	</sentencetext>
	<parent>http://www.semanticweb.org/ontologies/ConversationInstances.owl#comment09_12_19_1429252.30498914</parent>
</comment>
<comment>
	<id>http://www.semanticweb.org/ontologies/ConversationInstances.owl#comment09_12_19_1429252.30499910</id>
	<title>Re:Don't pay the fee</title>
	<author>farble1670</author>
	<datestamp>1261252080000</datestamp>
	<modclass>None</modclass>
	<modscore>1</modscore>
	<htmltext><p>the problem in the US market anyway is that *all* of the providers are pirates. you can go to a competitor, but you get screwed there as well, albeit in a different manner probably. i guarantee that at&amp;t is just waiting to see what the FTC does with verizon's ETF. if it stands, they'll bump their own shortly.</p><p>the fact of the matter is that lower ETF's aren't something that providers can effectively use for marketing against their competitor. consequently all the providers will have similar ETFs in the long run. you can't sell someone a phone / plan by talking about how easy it is to *leave* the plan early. it's a confusing message. why would the user want to leave? because the service is poor? it implies there is a reason the user would want to leave in the first place. not a good message.</p></htmltext>
<tokenext>the problem in the US market anyway is that * all * of the providers are pirates .
you can go to a competitor , but you get screwed there as well , albeit in a different manner probably .
i guarantee that at&amp;t is just waiting to see what the FTC does with verizon 's ETF .
if it stands , they 'll bump their own shortly.the fact of the matter is that lower ETF 's are n't something that providers can effectively use for marketing against their competitor .
consequently all the providers will have similar ETFs in the long run .
you ca n't sell someone a phone / plan by talking about how easy it is to * leave * the plan early .
it 's a confusing message .
why would the user want to leave ?
because the service is poor ?
it implies there is a reason the user would want to leave in the first place .
not a good message .</tokentext>
<sentencetext>the problem in the US market anyway is that *all* of the providers are pirates.
you can go to a competitor, but you get screwed there as well, albeit in a different manner probably.
i guarantee that at&amp;t is just waiting to see what the FTC does with verizon's ETF.
if it stands, they'll bump their own shortly.the fact of the matter is that lower ETF's aren't something that providers can effectively use for marketing against their competitor.
consequently all the providers will have similar ETFs in the long run.
you can't sell someone a phone / plan by talking about how easy it is to *leave* the plan early.
it's a confusing message.
why would the user want to leave?
because the service is poor?
it implies there is a reason the user would want to leave in the first place.
not a good message.</sentencetext>
	<parent>http://www.semanticweb.org/ontologies/ConversationInstances.owl#comment09_12_19_1429252.30499284</parent>
</comment>
<comment>
	<id>http://www.semanticweb.org/ontologies/ConversationInstances.owl#comment09_12_19_1429252.30499054</id>
	<title>Alternative services</title>
	<author>Anonymous</author>
	<datestamp>1261244460000</datestamp>
	<modclass>None</modclass>
	<modscore>1</modscore>
	<htmltext>Go Prepaid!  Cheaper rates and no contract!  Boost Mobile - $50/month for unlimited data usage.  Metro PCS - $45/month for unlimited data usage.
<br> <br>
Except if you want to get a new phone, there is no discount.  The Samsung Finesse, for example, costs $300.  Out of pocket.</htmltext>
<tokenext>Go Prepaid !
Cheaper rates and no contract !
Boost Mobile - $ 50/month for unlimited data usage .
Metro PCS - $ 45/month for unlimited data usage .
Except if you want to get a new phone , there is no discount .
The Samsung Finesse , for example , costs $ 300 .
Out of pocket .</tokentext>
<sentencetext>Go Prepaid!
Cheaper rates and no contract!
Boost Mobile - $50/month for unlimited data usage.
Metro PCS - $45/month for unlimited data usage.
Except if you want to get a new phone, there is no discount.
The Samsung Finesse, for example, costs $300.
Out of pocket.</sentencetext>
</comment>
<comment>
	<id>http://www.semanticweb.org/ontologies/ConversationInstances.owl#comment09_12_19_1429252.30499132</id>
	<title>Re:Where is government now that we need them?</title>
	<author>Anonymous</author>
	<datestamp>1261245240000</datestamp>
	<modclass>None</modclass>
	<modscore>2</modscore>
	<htmltext><p>well to start with we don't have just GSM networking.  Verizon uses CDMA, and sprint uses a different type of CDMA. So gsm only work with AT&amp;T and tmobile.  So you can SIM swap however swapping to other carriers is useless as tmobile has shitty coverage in the USA.</p><p>Good news as it stands now both Verizon and AT&amp;T are going to support LTE for their 4G cell phone tech so in about 10 years sim swapping will be semi practical.  sprint is going the wi-max route.</p><p>Chargers are a different problem and your too stupid to notice.  Chargers are laid out by the manufacture of which the majority sub contract out to china anyways.  Sim swapping has nothing to do with charger plugs.</p></htmltext>
<tokenext>well to start with we do n't have just GSM networking .
Verizon uses CDMA , and sprint uses a different type of CDMA .
So gsm only work with AT&amp;T and tmobile .
So you can SIM swap however swapping to other carriers is useless as tmobile has shitty coverage in the USA.Good news as it stands now both Verizon and AT&amp;T are going to support LTE for their 4G cell phone tech so in about 10 years sim swapping will be semi practical .
sprint is going the wi-max route.Chargers are a different problem and your too stupid to notice .
Chargers are laid out by the manufacture of which the majority sub contract out to china anyways .
Sim swapping has nothing to do with charger plugs .</tokentext>
<sentencetext>well to start with we don't have just GSM networking.
Verizon uses CDMA, and sprint uses a different type of CDMA.
So gsm only work with AT&amp;T and tmobile.
So you can SIM swap however swapping to other carriers is useless as tmobile has shitty coverage in the USA.Good news as it stands now both Verizon and AT&amp;T are going to support LTE for their 4G cell phone tech so in about 10 years sim swapping will be semi practical.
sprint is going the wi-max route.Chargers are a different problem and your too stupid to notice.
Chargers are laid out by the manufacture of which the majority sub contract out to china anyways.
Sim swapping has nothing to do with charger plugs.</sentencetext>
	<parent>http://www.semanticweb.org/ontologies/ConversationInstances.owl#comment09_12_19_1429252.30498930</parent>
</comment>
<comment>
	<id>http://www.semanticweb.org/ontologies/ConversationInstances.owl#comment09_12_19_1429252.30499268</id>
	<title>Re:Don't pay the fee</title>
	<author>DebianDog</author>
	<datestamp>1261246320000</datestamp>
	<modclass>None</modclass>
	<modscore>1</modscore>
	<htmltext>Oh please .  Can I sign up, get service, and not sign and agreement?  NO.  Now exactly would I know how good their customer service, the network, or coverage is without signing up with them?  Then once I find out how crappy the service for -my- needs  I am stuck?  Then they can charge -ANY- amount of $$$ to release me from crappy service? Sorry buddy there should be some level of oversight.

Luckily Verizon is awesome -here- and I have been a customer for 8 years!</htmltext>
<tokenext>Oh please .
Can I sign up , get service , and not sign and agreement ?
NO. Now exactly would I know how good their customer service , the network , or coverage is without signing up with them ?
Then once I find out how crappy the service for -my- needs I am stuck ?
Then they can charge -ANY- amount of $ $ $ to release me from crappy service ?
Sorry buddy there should be some level of oversight .
Luckily Verizon is awesome -here- and I have been a customer for 8 years !</tokentext>
<sentencetext>Oh please .
Can I sign up, get service, and not sign and agreement?
NO.  Now exactly would I know how good their customer service, the network, or coverage is without signing up with them?
Then once I find out how crappy the service for -my- needs  I am stuck?
Then they can charge -ANY- amount of $$$ to release me from crappy service?
Sorry buddy there should be some level of oversight.
Luckily Verizon is awesome -here- and I have been a customer for 8 years!</sentencetext>
	<parent>http://www.semanticweb.org/ontologies/ConversationInstances.owl#comment09_12_19_1429252.30498914</parent>
</comment>
<comment>
	<id>http://www.semanticweb.org/ontologies/ConversationInstances.owl#comment09_12_19_1429252.30499326</id>
	<title>Re:Don't pay the fee</title>
	<author>db32</author>
	<datestamp>1261246680000</datestamp>
	<modclass>Insightful</modclass>
	<modscore>4</modscore>
	<htmltext><p>Forcing kids to do homework or eat vegetables or stopping drunk drivers, rapists, murders, thieves, genocidal dictators, slave owners/traders, and so on is all morally wrong?  To say "almost always" is a little overboard, not that I disagree with the notion you are trying to get across. I just think the situations in which it is not morally wrong to stop someone happen a lot more often than you imply. </p><p>In this case...the trouble is that the government is giving verizon special permission in order for them to operate their service (frequency usage, tower locations, etc).  Additionally, the whole notion of contracts that one side can unilaterally change at any given time is pretty stupid too.</p><p>That said, fraud is one of those things that should be stopped.  There are plenty of conmen that tell "the truth" but do it with so much smoke and mirror tapdancing that people still sign up.  What you are attempting to do is blame the victim by letting verizon totally of the hook.  So...they say it is to help subsidize the phone.  Why is it that I would get subjected to the termination fee if I brought my own phone?  This also adds to the issue that they claim they recoup the cost of the phone through their rates and the ETF makes up for the people who leave early.  Well...why don't I get a lower rate for bringing my own phone?  Or why don't I get my rate reduced after I have paid back the subsidized portion of the phone?  I am guessing you haven't seen the leaked meetings where they talk about how many billions they make using various fraudulent billing tactics.  They force people to burn minutes as they sit through the ever growing "welcome to your verizon voice mail and blah blah blah and blah and blah blah blah pres blah blah blah" messages.</p><p>I agree that we shouldn't hire the government to force Verizon to do things against their will.  However, calling them out for deceptive and fraudulent bullshit is not the same.  (Their argument for why they hide the ETF is that it is 'not important' and they got busted on that when it was decided that big ETFs qualify as materially important pieces of a contract).  I think the best solution would actually to slap "users of any service provided using these frequencies cannot be subject to early termination fees or have their service terminated for excessive roaming" in the fine print of the agreements they have with the FCC to even operate.  I bet they would scream bloody murder at such a one sided contract change...and then we can tell them "Well you shouldn't have signed anything with the FCC, you could have started your service in the Sahara where there is no FCC."</p></htmltext>
<tokenext>Forcing kids to do homework or eat vegetables or stopping drunk drivers , rapists , murders , thieves , genocidal dictators , slave owners/traders , and so on is all morally wrong ?
To say " almost always " is a little overboard , not that I disagree with the notion you are trying to get across .
I just think the situations in which it is not morally wrong to stop someone happen a lot more often than you imply .
In this case...the trouble is that the government is giving verizon special permission in order for them to operate their service ( frequency usage , tower locations , etc ) .
Additionally , the whole notion of contracts that one side can unilaterally change at any given time is pretty stupid too.That said , fraud is one of those things that should be stopped .
There are plenty of conmen that tell " the truth " but do it with so much smoke and mirror tapdancing that people still sign up .
What you are attempting to do is blame the victim by letting verizon totally of the hook .
So...they say it is to help subsidize the phone .
Why is it that I would get subjected to the termination fee if I brought my own phone ?
This also adds to the issue that they claim they recoup the cost of the phone through their rates and the ETF makes up for the people who leave early .
Well...why do n't I get a lower rate for bringing my own phone ?
Or why do n't I get my rate reduced after I have paid back the subsidized portion of the phone ?
I am guessing you have n't seen the leaked meetings where they talk about how many billions they make using various fraudulent billing tactics .
They force people to burn minutes as they sit through the ever growing " welcome to your verizon voice mail and blah blah blah and blah and blah blah blah pres blah blah blah " messages.I agree that we should n't hire the government to force Verizon to do things against their will .
However , calling them out for deceptive and fraudulent bullshit is not the same .
( Their argument for why they hide the ETF is that it is 'not important ' and they got busted on that when it was decided that big ETFs qualify as materially important pieces of a contract ) .
I think the best solution would actually to slap " users of any service provided using these frequencies can not be subject to early termination fees or have their service terminated for excessive roaming " in the fine print of the agreements they have with the FCC to even operate .
I bet they would scream bloody murder at such a one sided contract change...and then we can tell them " Well you should n't have signed anything with the FCC , you could have started your service in the Sahara where there is no FCC .
"</tokentext>
<sentencetext>Forcing kids to do homework or eat vegetables or stopping drunk drivers, rapists, murders, thieves, genocidal dictators, slave owners/traders, and so on is all morally wrong?
To say "almost always" is a little overboard, not that I disagree with the notion you are trying to get across.
I just think the situations in which it is not morally wrong to stop someone happen a lot more often than you imply.
In this case...the trouble is that the government is giving verizon special permission in order for them to operate their service (frequency usage, tower locations, etc).
Additionally, the whole notion of contracts that one side can unilaterally change at any given time is pretty stupid too.That said, fraud is one of those things that should be stopped.
There are plenty of conmen that tell "the truth" but do it with so much smoke and mirror tapdancing that people still sign up.
What you are attempting to do is blame the victim by letting verizon totally of the hook.
So...they say it is to help subsidize the phone.
Why is it that I would get subjected to the termination fee if I brought my own phone?
This also adds to the issue that they claim they recoup the cost of the phone through their rates and the ETF makes up for the people who leave early.
Well...why don't I get a lower rate for bringing my own phone?
Or why don't I get my rate reduced after I have paid back the subsidized portion of the phone?
I am guessing you haven't seen the leaked meetings where they talk about how many billions they make using various fraudulent billing tactics.
They force people to burn minutes as they sit through the ever growing "welcome to your verizon voice mail and blah blah blah and blah and blah blah blah pres blah blah blah" messages.I agree that we shouldn't hire the government to force Verizon to do things against their will.
However, calling them out for deceptive and fraudulent bullshit is not the same.
(Their argument for why they hide the ETF is that it is 'not important' and they got busted on that when it was decided that big ETFs qualify as materially important pieces of a contract).
I think the best solution would actually to slap "users of any service provided using these frequencies cannot be subject to early termination fees or have their service terminated for excessive roaming" in the fine print of the agreements they have with the FCC to even operate.
I bet they would scream bloody murder at such a one sided contract change...and then we can tell them "Well you shouldn't have signed anything with the FCC, you could have started your service in the Sahara where there is no FCC.
"</sentencetext>
	<parent>http://www.semanticweb.org/ontologies/ConversationInstances.owl#comment09_12_19_1429252.30498914</parent>
</comment>
<comment>
	<id>http://www.semanticweb.org/ontologies/ConversationInstances.owl#comment09_12_19_1429252.30498922</id>
	<title>Here is a solution to cell phone madness</title>
	<author>Anonymous</author>
	<datestamp>1261243380000</datestamp>
	<modclass>None</modclass>
	<modscore>0</modscore>
	<htmltext><p>Let us interested Americans pool resources and start a nation wide non-profit cellphone company where we can all do as we please or where we can all utilize resources according to predetermined policies.</p><p>It would not be that hard.</p><p>Or, we could take over an existing company like <a href="http://www.metropcs.com/" title="metropcs.com"> Metro </a> [metropcs.com] then do as we please. We surely can raise a few billion dollars, can't we?</p></htmltext>
<tokenext>Let us interested Americans pool resources and start a nation wide non-profit cellphone company where we can all do as we please or where we can all utilize resources according to predetermined policies.It would not be that hard.Or , we could take over an existing company like Metro [ metropcs.com ] then do as we please .
We surely can raise a few billion dollars , ca n't we ?</tokentext>
<sentencetext>Let us interested Americans pool resources and start a nation wide non-profit cellphone company where we can all do as we please or where we can all utilize resources according to predetermined policies.It would not be that hard.Or, we could take over an existing company like  Metro  [metropcs.com] then do as we please.
We surely can raise a few billion dollars, can't we?</sentencetext>
</comment>
<comment>
	<id>http://www.semanticweb.org/ontologies/ConversationInstances.owl#comment09_12_19_1429252.30499596</id>
	<title>Re:Don't pay the fee</title>
	<author>sglewis100</author>
	<datestamp>1261248840000</datestamp>
	<modclass>None</modclass>
	<modscore>1</modscore>
	<htmltext><p><div class="quote"><p> Oh please . Can I sign up, get service, and not sign and agreement? NO. Now exactly would I know how good their customer service, the network, or coverage is without signing up with them? Then once I find out how crappy the service for -my- needs I am stuck? Then they can charge -ANY- amount of $$$ to release me from crappy service?</p>  </div><p>If only there was some sort of <a href="http://www.verizonwireless.com/b2c/globalText?textName=RETURN\_POLICY&amp;jspName=footer/returnPolicy.jsp" title="verizonwireless.com">short term period</a> [verizonwireless.com] wherein you could return the phone for a small "restock" fee (ie: the non return of the activation charge and pay only for your actual usage and have the contract null and void. SIGH!</p></div>
	</htmltext>
<tokenext>Oh please .
Can I sign up , get service , and not sign and agreement ?
NO. Now exactly would I know how good their customer service , the network , or coverage is without signing up with them ?
Then once I find out how crappy the service for -my- needs I am stuck ?
Then they can charge -ANY- amount of $ $ $ to release me from crappy service ?
If only there was some sort of short term period [ verizonwireless.com ] wherein you could return the phone for a small " restock " fee ( ie : the non return of the activation charge and pay only for your actual usage and have the contract null and void .
SIGH !</tokentext>
<sentencetext> Oh please .
Can I sign up, get service, and not sign and agreement?
NO. Now exactly would I know how good their customer service, the network, or coverage is without signing up with them?
Then once I find out how crappy the service for -my- needs I am stuck?
Then they can charge -ANY- amount of $$$ to release me from crappy service?
If only there was some sort of short term period [verizonwireless.com] wherein you could return the phone for a small "restock" fee (ie: the non return of the activation charge and pay only for your actual usage and have the contract null and void.
SIGH!
	</sentencetext>
	<parent>http://www.semanticweb.org/ontologies/ConversationInstances.owl#comment09_12_19_1429252.30499268</parent>
</comment>
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	<id>http://www.semanticweb.org/ontologies/ConversationInstances.owl#thread_09_12_19_1429252_15</id>
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