<article>
	<id>http://www.semanticweb.org/ontologies/ConversationInstances.owl#article09_10_26_164226</id>
	<title>What is the Current State of Home Automation?</title>
	<author>ScuttleMonkey</author>
	<datestamp>1256586060000</datestamp>
	<htmltext>StonyCreekBare writes <i>"What do people have to say about the current state of Home Automation software?  Preferably Linux based, but mainly the field in general, and principally the DIY flavors as opposed to the upscale turnkey systems.  I am familiar with Misterhouse, HomeSeer and Automated Living's HAL2000, all of which have serious flaws and weaknesses, but which sometimes succeed well in specific areas.  But in all cases, the state of the art seems to have moved little in the last decade. Is any interesting work being done in this space?  Or should I just grab one of the three and try to mold it to fit my vision of what it should be?  Misterhouse at least is open source so I can add new features, but it has not had an update in a long long time and seems to be missing some modern stuff.  The other two are expensive and closed source, and from all I can see, quite flawed, not the least by their dependence on intimate ties to Microsoft.  Yet they seem to offer a lot more than Misterhouse despite their weaknesses.  Is the Home Automation field as bleak as it appears?  Or have I missed the forest for the trees?"</i>  What home automation projects have people tackled?  Any examples of wild success or failure?</htmltext>
<tokenext>StonyCreekBare writes " What do people have to say about the current state of Home Automation software ?
Preferably Linux based , but mainly the field in general , and principally the DIY flavors as opposed to the upscale turnkey systems .
I am familiar with Misterhouse , HomeSeer and Automated Living 's HAL2000 , all of which have serious flaws and weaknesses , but which sometimes succeed well in specific areas .
But in all cases , the state of the art seems to have moved little in the last decade .
Is any interesting work being done in this space ?
Or should I just grab one of the three and try to mold it to fit my vision of what it should be ?
Misterhouse at least is open source so I can add new features , but it has not had an update in a long long time and seems to be missing some modern stuff .
The other two are expensive and closed source , and from all I can see , quite flawed , not the least by their dependence on intimate ties to Microsoft .
Yet they seem to offer a lot more than Misterhouse despite their weaknesses .
Is the Home Automation field as bleak as it appears ?
Or have I missed the forest for the trees ?
" What home automation projects have people tackled ?
Any examples of wild success or failure ?</tokentext>
<sentencetext>StonyCreekBare writes "What do people have to say about the current state of Home Automation software?
Preferably Linux based, but mainly the field in general, and principally the DIY flavors as opposed to the upscale turnkey systems.
I am familiar with Misterhouse, HomeSeer and Automated Living's HAL2000, all of which have serious flaws and weaknesses, but which sometimes succeed well in specific areas.
But in all cases, the state of the art seems to have moved little in the last decade.
Is any interesting work being done in this space?
Or should I just grab one of the three and try to mold it to fit my vision of what it should be?
Misterhouse at least is open source so I can add new features, but it has not had an update in a long long time and seems to be missing some modern stuff.
The other two are expensive and closed source, and from all I can see, quite flawed, not the least by their dependence on intimate ties to Microsoft.
Yet they seem to offer a lot more than Misterhouse despite their weaknesses.
Is the Home Automation field as bleak as it appears?
Or have I missed the forest for the trees?
"  What home automation projects have people tackled?
Any examples of wild success or failure?</sentencetext>
</article>
<comment>
	<id>http://www.semanticweb.org/ontologies/ConversationInstances.owl#comment09_10_26_164226.29876647</id>
	<title>Re:X10 makes cool stuff for automation</title>
	<author>nullchar</author>
	<datestamp>1256548740000</datestamp>
	<modclass>None</modclass>
	<modscore>1</modscore>
	<htmltext><p>X10 has had 3rd party open-source / linux support for years.  The main problem with the tech is the combination of weak RF wireless and powerline communication.  Modern circuit breakers (at least mine does) filter out the powerline communication between circuits.  So when you're trying to control the lights across the house from your PC, the RF is too weak to make it there and powerline comm doesn't make it either.</p><p>X10 is nice in that the modules can replace wall sockets, light switches, light sockets, etc. so you can add to your house over time and you don't need much special wiring.</p></htmltext>
<tokenext>X10 has had 3rd party open-source / linux support for years .
The main problem with the tech is the combination of weak RF wireless and powerline communication .
Modern circuit breakers ( at least mine does ) filter out the powerline communication between circuits .
So when you 're trying to control the lights across the house from your PC , the RF is too weak to make it there and powerline comm does n't make it either.X10 is nice in that the modules can replace wall sockets , light switches , light sockets , etc .
so you can add to your house over time and you do n't need much special wiring .</tokentext>
<sentencetext>X10 has had 3rd party open-source / linux support for years.
The main problem with the tech is the combination of weak RF wireless and powerline communication.
Modern circuit breakers (at least mine does) filter out the powerline communication between circuits.
So when you're trying to control the lights across the house from your PC, the RF is too weak to make it there and powerline comm doesn't make it either.X10 is nice in that the modules can replace wall sockets, light switches, light sockets, etc.
so you can add to your house over time and you don't need much special wiring.</sentencetext>
	<parent>http://www.semanticweb.org/ontologies/ConversationInstances.owl#comment09_10_26_164226.29876329</parent>
</comment>
<comment>
	<id>http://www.semanticweb.org/ontologies/ConversationInstances.owl#comment09_10_26_164226.29897623</id>
	<title>Re:Good luck</title>
	<author>afidel</author>
	<datestamp>1256746020000</datestamp>
	<modclass>None</modclass>
	<modscore>1</modscore>
	<htmltext>At 10x more the ROI vs CFL's is going to be looooong so consumers would either have to have altruistic intentions in the purchase or you are going to have to show significant improvements AND likely offer a 3rd party warranty on them (further increasing costs).</htmltext>
<tokenext>At 10x more the ROI vs CFL 's is going to be looooong so consumers would either have to have altruistic intentions in the purchase or you are going to have to show significant improvements AND likely offer a 3rd party warranty on them ( further increasing costs ) .</tokentext>
<sentencetext>At 10x more the ROI vs CFL's is going to be looooong so consumers would either have to have altruistic intentions in the purchase or you are going to have to show significant improvements AND likely offer a 3rd party warranty on them (further increasing costs).</sentencetext>
	<parent>http://www.semanticweb.org/ontologies/ConversationInstances.owl#comment09_10_26_164226.29876773</parent>
</comment>
<comment>
	<id>http://www.semanticweb.org/ontologies/ConversationInstances.owl#comment09_10_26_164226.29877415</id>
	<title>Re:Good luck</title>
	<author>Grishnakh</author>
	<datestamp>1256551620000</datestamp>
	<modclass>None</modclass>
	<modscore>1</modscore>
	<htmltext><p><i>In reference to the "serious flaws" and weaknesses...ever wondered why none of the home automation tech we've been promised since 1950 has come to be common in homes?</i></p><p>The answer is simple: it's because houses are not consumer products, like computers, TVs, or cars.  If you want to make a car with a lot of complex controls, it's easy; lots of higher-end cars have sophisticated in-vehicle data buses and controllers for everything.  It's easy because cars are sold as a complete product, made in a factory on an assembly line by a single company.  That company designs everything into that model it wants, tests it, manufactures it, and ships it.</p><p>Houses are different.  Except for widely-derided manufactured homes, houses are built on-site.  Unlike cars, they're not designed by engineers, but rather by "builders", who are just people with high school educations at best who worked their way up from hammering nails for a living.  They're made by a bunch of skilled trades people, organized by this "builder", and made with the same techniques that houses have been built with for decades, with little change.  Adding ethernet wiring is a serious problem for many of them since they don't understand it.</p><p>Some houses are different; they're designed by architects, and cost millions of dollars and are built by rich people.  Bill Gates has a pretty serious home automation system I've heard.  But regular houses owned by middle-class people don't have this.  And worse, most houses aren't purchased new, they're sold over and over again, since they easily last many decades.  Just like retrofitting airbags onto a 50s car is impractical, retrofitting HA stuff into an older house isn't easy either.</p></htmltext>
<tokenext>In reference to the " serious flaws " and weaknesses...ever wondered why none of the home automation tech we 've been promised since 1950 has come to be common in homes ? The answer is simple : it 's because houses are not consumer products , like computers , TVs , or cars .
If you want to make a car with a lot of complex controls , it 's easy ; lots of higher-end cars have sophisticated in-vehicle data buses and controllers for everything .
It 's easy because cars are sold as a complete product , made in a factory on an assembly line by a single company .
That company designs everything into that model it wants , tests it , manufactures it , and ships it.Houses are different .
Except for widely-derided manufactured homes , houses are built on-site .
Unlike cars , they 're not designed by engineers , but rather by " builders " , who are just people with high school educations at best who worked their way up from hammering nails for a living .
They 're made by a bunch of skilled trades people , organized by this " builder " , and made with the same techniques that houses have been built with for decades , with little change .
Adding ethernet wiring is a serious problem for many of them since they do n't understand it.Some houses are different ; they 're designed by architects , and cost millions of dollars and are built by rich people .
Bill Gates has a pretty serious home automation system I 've heard .
But regular houses owned by middle-class people do n't have this .
And worse , most houses are n't purchased new , they 're sold over and over again , since they easily last many decades .
Just like retrofitting airbags onto a 50s car is impractical , retrofitting HA stuff into an older house is n't easy either .</tokentext>
<sentencetext>In reference to the "serious flaws" and weaknesses...ever wondered why none of the home automation tech we've been promised since 1950 has come to be common in homes?The answer is simple: it's because houses are not consumer products, like computers, TVs, or cars.
If you want to make a car with a lot of complex controls, it's easy; lots of higher-end cars have sophisticated in-vehicle data buses and controllers for everything.
It's easy because cars are sold as a complete product, made in a factory on an assembly line by a single company.
That company designs everything into that model it wants, tests it, manufactures it, and ships it.Houses are different.
Except for widely-derided manufactured homes, houses are built on-site.
Unlike cars, they're not designed by engineers, but rather by "builders", who are just people with high school educations at best who worked their way up from hammering nails for a living.
They're made by a bunch of skilled trades people, organized by this "builder", and made with the same techniques that houses have been built with for decades, with little change.
Adding ethernet wiring is a serious problem for many of them since they don't understand it.Some houses are different; they're designed by architects, and cost millions of dollars and are built by rich people.
Bill Gates has a pretty serious home automation system I've heard.
But regular houses owned by middle-class people don't have this.
And worse, most houses aren't purchased new, they're sold over and over again, since they easily last many decades.
Just like retrofitting airbags onto a 50s car is impractical, retrofitting HA stuff into an older house isn't easy either.</sentencetext>
	<parent>http://www.semanticweb.org/ontologies/ConversationInstances.owl#comment09_10_26_164226.29876267</parent>
</comment>
<comment>
	<id>http://www.semanticweb.org/ontologies/ConversationInstances.owl#comment09_10_26_164226.29884339</id>
	<title>Re:What about INSTEON?</title>
	<author>senor\_burt</author>
	<datestamp>1256660760000</datestamp>
	<modclass>None</modclass>
	<modscore>1</modscore>
	<htmltext><p>I had a good experience with Insteon. Plus I tied their SDK into a speech recognition system, so I can tell the room to adjust lighting as I want.<br>In addition to the SDK they had a web server - which took HTTP triggered commands quite nicely, to device or class of devices.</p><p>I found their SDK was sufficient to let me do the basics that I wanted - though their documentation was a pain to work with.</p><p>Very nice project. And not very expensive (at least for one room - you needed X10/Insteon devices everywhere you wanted it).</p><p>Insteon was nicer because it did dual transmissions - wireless and powerline - so I didn't have to worry about the house's wiring.</p></htmltext>
<tokenext>I had a good experience with Insteon .
Plus I tied their SDK into a speech recognition system , so I can tell the room to adjust lighting as I want.In addition to the SDK they had a web server - which took HTTP triggered commands quite nicely , to device or class of devices.I found their SDK was sufficient to let me do the basics that I wanted - though their documentation was a pain to work with.Very nice project .
And not very expensive ( at least for one room - you needed X10/Insteon devices everywhere you wanted it ) .Insteon was nicer because it did dual transmissions - wireless and powerline - so I did n't have to worry about the house 's wiring .</tokentext>
<sentencetext>I had a good experience with Insteon.
Plus I tied their SDK into a speech recognition system, so I can tell the room to adjust lighting as I want.In addition to the SDK they had a web server - which took HTTP triggered commands quite nicely, to device or class of devices.I found their SDK was sufficient to let me do the basics that I wanted - though their documentation was a pain to work with.Very nice project.
And not very expensive (at least for one room - you needed X10/Insteon devices everywhere you wanted it).Insteon was nicer because it did dual transmissions - wireless and powerline - so I didn't have to worry about the house's wiring.</sentencetext>
	<parent>http://www.semanticweb.org/ontologies/ConversationInstances.owl#comment09_10_26_164226.29876455</parent>
</comment>
<comment>
	<id>http://www.semanticweb.org/ontologies/ConversationInstances.owl#comment09_10_26_164226.29877439</id>
	<title>One "smart" thermostat....</title>
	<author>Hasai</author>
	<datestamp>1256551680000</datestamp>
	<modclass>None</modclass>
	<modscore>1</modscore>
	<htmltext><p>....Which my wife insists be set to the exact same temperature for every time period of every day, and during the summer my wife switches to "AC Only" and during the winter she switches to "Heat Only".</p><p><i>(Shuffles off into a corner to cry....)</i></p></htmltext>
<tokenext>....Which my wife insists be set to the exact same temperature for every time period of every day , and during the summer my wife switches to " AC Only " and during the winter she switches to " Heat Only " .
( Shuffles off into a corner to cry.... )</tokentext>
<sentencetext>....Which my wife insists be set to the exact same temperature for every time period of every day, and during the summer my wife switches to "AC Only" and during the winter she switches to "Heat Only".
(Shuffles off into a corner to cry....)</sentencetext>
</comment>
<comment>
	<id>http://www.semanticweb.org/ontologies/ConversationInstances.owl#comment09_10_26_164226.29876393</id>
	<title>linux ha</title>
	<author>Anonymous</author>
	<datestamp>1256547600000</datestamp>
	<modclass>Informativ</modclass>
	<modscore>5</modscore>
	<htmltext><p><a href="http://www.linuxha.com/" title="linuxha.com">http://www.linuxha.com/</a> [linuxha.com]</p></htmltext>
<tokenext>http : //www.linuxha.com/ [ linuxha.com ]</tokentext>
<sentencetext>http://www.linuxha.com/ [linuxha.com]</sentencetext>
</comment>
<comment>
	<id>http://www.semanticweb.org/ontologies/ConversationInstances.owl#comment09_10_26_164226.29876157</id>
	<title>Home automation</title>
	<author>sopssa</author>
	<datestamp>1256589660000</datestamp>
	<modclass>Insightful</modclass>
	<modscore>3</modscore>
	<htmltext><p>Since you bought up the open source / closed source fight, if you want customization that Misterhouse might be good. You can then submit patches and updates for the project (it seems it's still sometimes updated, last time in 2008)</p><p>But because the other ones are closed source, it doesn't mean you cant add features in to them. HomeSeer supports 3rd party plug-in development and these kind of systems tend to be really configurable always.</p></htmltext>
<tokenext>Since you bought up the open source / closed source fight , if you want customization that Misterhouse might be good .
You can then submit patches and updates for the project ( it seems it 's still sometimes updated , last time in 2008 ) But because the other ones are closed source , it does n't mean you cant add features in to them .
HomeSeer supports 3rd party plug-in development and these kind of systems tend to be really configurable always .</tokentext>
<sentencetext>Since you bought up the open source / closed source fight, if you want customization that Misterhouse might be good.
You can then submit patches and updates for the project (it seems it's still sometimes updated, last time in 2008)But because the other ones are closed source, it doesn't mean you cant add features in to them.
HomeSeer supports 3rd party plug-in development and these kind of systems tend to be really configurable always.</sentencetext>
</comment>
<comment>
	<id>http://www.semanticweb.org/ontologies/ConversationInstances.owl#comment09_10_26_164226.29877425</id>
	<title>Welcome to my money pit!</title>
	<author>Sacarino</author>
	<datestamp>1256551680000</datestamp>
	<modclass>Informativ</modclass>
	<modscore>4</modscore>
	<htmltext>The problem with "home automation" systems is that it is VERY loosely defined. Some say it's the ability to control your lights, others say it's HVAC, still others say it's distributed audio/video. Since it's such a generic term, somewhat consequentially there are a variety of vendors and products that claim to be home automation. If you want to bridge technologies, you have to find a product that'll do that natively or allow you to expand it yourself.<br>
<br>
I happen to have a pretty robust system that uses Homeseer as the backend engine. This allows me to leverage strengths from various hardware providers due to the extensibility of their software, plus I have the ability to roll my own<nobr> <wbr></nobr>.NET code and have it integrate into the system. I currently utilize some very specific X-10 devices for a narrow niche (wireless door and window sensors) and a thermostat (if it ain't broke!), but the great majority of my stuff has been converted to Z-wave. The beauty of Z-wave over X-10 is the signal confirmation... with X-10, I'd send a signal into the ether and hope it'd get there, but with Z-wave, I get delivery confirmation so the system knows that a desired action hasn't been completed. There are additional technologies out there like Insteon, ZigBee, and UPB, but they have issues I don't like or the squeeze isn't worth the juice. Some of this crap is exceedingly pricey and I just can't justify spending it. <br>
<br>
I use Cinemar's MainLobby for integration with my theater gear, which also provides the sexy touchscreen frontend that everyone looks for in a system. Homeseer has also deployed a software with similar capabilities called HSTouch, but it isn't as powerful for my A/V setup just yet.<br>
<br>
Just a quick rundown of <i>some</i> things that I've got my system setup to do:<ul>
<li>Occupancy detection - if vacant, it goes into an energy savings mode and shuts off lights and adjusts thermostat setpoints.</li><li>Exterior lighting is automatic based on sunset/sunrise, plus only brightens to 100\% when motion detected or doors are opened.</li><li>Certain actions at certain times trigger sequences: when I open my bedroom door in the morning, the kitchen light kicks on and the TV flips on and tunes to the news channel I like.</li><li>Caller ID is screened and/or announced for me, in addition to displaying on television screens.</li><li>Freezer and fridge doors trip alarms if they're left open for too long.</li><li>Exhaust fans in the bathrooms are based on humidity conditions.</li><li>Yard irrigation is controlled both by wind conditions and zoned soil wetness conditions.</li><li>When the doorbell is rung, the touchscreens all show a live camera feed for that door from my ZoneMinder server.</li></ul><p>
There's tons more that I currently do, I've got a list as long as my arm of things I plan to do, and there's a lot of options out there for things I could do. If you're interested in HA, you really need to figure out what it is for you by detailing out what you want and how you want to get there. My route is a lot of DIY because I'm happy hacking my way through a problem... If you've got more money than brains, you can certainly take the vendor lock-in approach of something like Crestron.</p></htmltext>
<tokenext>The problem with " home automation " systems is that it is VERY loosely defined .
Some say it 's the ability to control your lights , others say it 's HVAC , still others say it 's distributed audio/video .
Since it 's such a generic term , somewhat consequentially there are a variety of vendors and products that claim to be home automation .
If you want to bridge technologies , you have to find a product that 'll do that natively or allow you to expand it yourself .
I happen to have a pretty robust system that uses Homeseer as the backend engine .
This allows me to leverage strengths from various hardware providers due to the extensibility of their software , plus I have the ability to roll my own .NET code and have it integrate into the system .
I currently utilize some very specific X-10 devices for a narrow niche ( wireless door and window sensors ) and a thermostat ( if it ai n't broke !
) , but the great majority of my stuff has been converted to Z-wave .
The beauty of Z-wave over X-10 is the signal confirmation... with X-10 , I 'd send a signal into the ether and hope it 'd get there , but with Z-wave , I get delivery confirmation so the system knows that a desired action has n't been completed .
There are additional technologies out there like Insteon , ZigBee , and UPB , but they have issues I do n't like or the squeeze is n't worth the juice .
Some of this crap is exceedingly pricey and I just ca n't justify spending it .
I use Cinemar 's MainLobby for integration with my theater gear , which also provides the sexy touchscreen frontend that everyone looks for in a system .
Homeseer has also deployed a software with similar capabilities called HSTouch , but it is n't as powerful for my A/V setup just yet .
Just a quick rundown of some things that I 've got my system setup to do : Occupancy detection - if vacant , it goes into an energy savings mode and shuts off lights and adjusts thermostat setpoints.Exterior lighting is automatic based on sunset/sunrise , plus only brightens to 100 \ % when motion detected or doors are opened.Certain actions at certain times trigger sequences : when I open my bedroom door in the morning , the kitchen light kicks on and the TV flips on and tunes to the news channel I like.Caller ID is screened and/or announced for me , in addition to displaying on television screens.Freezer and fridge doors trip alarms if they 're left open for too long.Exhaust fans in the bathrooms are based on humidity conditions.Yard irrigation is controlled both by wind conditions and zoned soil wetness conditions.When the doorbell is rung , the touchscreens all show a live camera feed for that door from my ZoneMinder server .
There 's tons more that I currently do , I 've got a list as long as my arm of things I plan to do , and there 's a lot of options out there for things I could do .
If you 're interested in HA , you really need to figure out what it is for you by detailing out what you want and how you want to get there .
My route is a lot of DIY because I 'm happy hacking my way through a problem... If you 've got more money than brains , you can certainly take the vendor lock-in approach of something like Crestron .</tokentext>
<sentencetext>The problem with "home automation" systems is that it is VERY loosely defined.
Some say it's the ability to control your lights, others say it's HVAC, still others say it's distributed audio/video.
Since it's such a generic term, somewhat consequentially there are a variety of vendors and products that claim to be home automation.
If you want to bridge technologies, you have to find a product that'll do that natively or allow you to expand it yourself.
I happen to have a pretty robust system that uses Homeseer as the backend engine.
This allows me to leverage strengths from various hardware providers due to the extensibility of their software, plus I have the ability to roll my own .NET code and have it integrate into the system.
I currently utilize some very specific X-10 devices for a narrow niche (wireless door and window sensors) and a thermostat (if it ain't broke!
), but the great majority of my stuff has been converted to Z-wave.
The beauty of Z-wave over X-10 is the signal confirmation... with X-10, I'd send a signal into the ether and hope it'd get there, but with Z-wave, I get delivery confirmation so the system knows that a desired action hasn't been completed.
There are additional technologies out there like Insteon, ZigBee, and UPB, but they have issues I don't like or the squeeze isn't worth the juice.
Some of this crap is exceedingly pricey and I just can't justify spending it.
I use Cinemar's MainLobby for integration with my theater gear, which also provides the sexy touchscreen frontend that everyone looks for in a system.
Homeseer has also deployed a software with similar capabilities called HSTouch, but it isn't as powerful for my A/V setup just yet.
Just a quick rundown of some things that I've got my system setup to do:
Occupancy detection - if vacant, it goes into an energy savings mode and shuts off lights and adjusts thermostat setpoints.Exterior lighting is automatic based on sunset/sunrise, plus only brightens to 100\% when motion detected or doors are opened.Certain actions at certain times trigger sequences: when I open my bedroom door in the morning, the kitchen light kicks on and the TV flips on and tunes to the news channel I like.Caller ID is screened and/or announced for me, in addition to displaying on television screens.Freezer and fridge doors trip alarms if they're left open for too long.Exhaust fans in the bathrooms are based on humidity conditions.Yard irrigation is controlled both by wind conditions and zoned soil wetness conditions.When the doorbell is rung, the touchscreens all show a live camera feed for that door from my ZoneMinder server.
There's tons more that I currently do, I've got a list as long as my arm of things I plan to do, and there's a lot of options out there for things I could do.
If you're interested in HA, you really need to figure out what it is for you by detailing out what you want and how you want to get there.
My route is a lot of DIY because I'm happy hacking my way through a problem... If you've got more money than brains, you can certainly take the vendor lock-in approach of something like Crestron.</sentencetext>
</comment>
<comment>
	<id>http://www.semanticweb.org/ontologies/ConversationInstances.owl#comment09_10_26_164226.29879567</id>
	<title>Re:What do you want home automation for?</title>
	<author>jonwil</author>
	<datestamp>1256564220000</datestamp>
	<modclass>None</modclass>
	<modscore>1</modscore>
	<htmltext><p>Actually, an automated shopping list system is something I wish someone WOULD invent. If you use up some food and want to remember to buy more next time, you swipe the bar code on a bar code scanner in the kitchen. If you want food that doesn't have a bar code such as fresh produce you just pick it from a list. Same as if you want food that you dont have the package for (thrown out by mistake without scanning it, whatever else)</p><p>Then when you are going shopping, you just print the list and take it with you.</p><p>Such a system would be great for me, I could instantly make a note anytime I think of food (or non-food items like cleaning products or toilet paper) that I need to buy next time I go shopping. I could make a note anytime I use up the last of some product. And I wouldn't have the problem where I can never remember if I need more of something or not.</p><p>The hardest part would be comming up with the database that matches all the bar codes to products and keeping that database up to date.</p></htmltext>
<tokenext>Actually , an automated shopping list system is something I wish someone WOULD invent .
If you use up some food and want to remember to buy more next time , you swipe the bar code on a bar code scanner in the kitchen .
If you want food that does n't have a bar code such as fresh produce you just pick it from a list .
Same as if you want food that you dont have the package for ( thrown out by mistake without scanning it , whatever else ) Then when you are going shopping , you just print the list and take it with you.Such a system would be great for me , I could instantly make a note anytime I think of food ( or non-food items like cleaning products or toilet paper ) that I need to buy next time I go shopping .
I could make a note anytime I use up the last of some product .
And I would n't have the problem where I can never remember if I need more of something or not.The hardest part would be comming up with the database that matches all the bar codes to products and keeping that database up to date .</tokentext>
<sentencetext>Actually, an automated shopping list system is something I wish someone WOULD invent.
If you use up some food and want to remember to buy more next time, you swipe the bar code on a bar code scanner in the kitchen.
If you want food that doesn't have a bar code such as fresh produce you just pick it from a list.
Same as if you want food that you dont have the package for (thrown out by mistake without scanning it, whatever else)Then when you are going shopping, you just print the list and take it with you.Such a system would be great for me, I could instantly make a note anytime I think of food (or non-food items like cleaning products or toilet paper) that I need to buy next time I go shopping.
I could make a note anytime I use up the last of some product.
And I wouldn't have the problem where I can never remember if I need more of something or not.The hardest part would be comming up with the database that matches all the bar codes to products and keeping that database up to date.</sentencetext>
	<parent>http://www.semanticweb.org/ontologies/ConversationInstances.owl#comment09_10_26_164226.29876453</parent>
</comment>
<comment>
	<id>http://www.semanticweb.org/ontologies/ConversationInstances.owl#comment09_10_26_164226.29880459</id>
	<title>Re:What about INSTEON?</title>
	<author>Ricochet</author>
	<datestamp>1256573700000</datestamp>
	<modclass>None</modclass>
	<modscore>1</modscore>
	<htmltext><p>Oh yeah, free software, take a look at <a href="http://www.linuxha.com/common/iplcd/" title="linuxha.com" rel="nofollow">Insteon software here</a> [linuxha.com] (sorry I forgot). Yes it's my site and yes I really need to update it but I'm working on Insteon software.</p></htmltext>
<tokenext>Oh yeah , free software , take a look at Insteon software here [ linuxha.com ] ( sorry I forgot ) .
Yes it 's my site and yes I really need to update it but I 'm working on Insteon software .</tokentext>
<sentencetext>Oh yeah, free software, take a look at Insteon software here [linuxha.com] (sorry I forgot).
Yes it's my site and yes I really need to update it but I'm working on Insteon software.</sentencetext>
	<parent>http://www.semanticweb.org/ontologies/ConversationInstances.owl#comment09_10_26_164226.29877627</parent>
</comment>
<comment>
	<id>http://www.semanticweb.org/ontologies/ConversationInstances.owl#comment09_10_26_164226.29883491</id>
	<title>Re:Doing it wrong</title>
	<author>Anonymous</author>
	<datestamp>1256656740000</datestamp>
	<modclass>None</modclass>
	<modscore>0</modscore>
	<htmltext><p><div class="quote"><p>Why in hell would you want to access your kitchen appliances from a telephone or a videogame?</p></div><p>While I'll agree that many appliances don't need connectivity, I'm still dreaming of a RFID enabled pantry/refrigerator/freezer.  No more looking to find out what we have, if something is past the expiration date, or even how long those leftovers have been in there.</p><p>Mr. Pantry logs it all and can even tell you if it is behind the milk.</p></div>
	</htmltext>
<tokenext>Why in hell would you want to access your kitchen appliances from a telephone or a videogame ? While I 'll agree that many appliances do n't need connectivity , I 'm still dreaming of a RFID enabled pantry/refrigerator/freezer .
No more looking to find out what we have , if something is past the expiration date , or even how long those leftovers have been in there.Mr .
Pantry logs it all and can even tell you if it is behind the milk .</tokentext>
<sentencetext>Why in hell would you want to access your kitchen appliances from a telephone or a videogame?While I'll agree that many appliances don't need connectivity, I'm still dreaming of a RFID enabled pantry/refrigerator/freezer.
No more looking to find out what we have, if something is past the expiration date, or even how long those leftovers have been in there.Mr.
Pantry logs it all and can even tell you if it is behind the milk.
	</sentencetext>
	<parent>http://www.semanticweb.org/ontologies/ConversationInstances.owl#comment09_10_26_164226.29876757</parent>
</comment>
<comment>
	<id>http://www.semanticweb.org/ontologies/ConversationInstances.owl#comment09_10_26_164226.29881459</id>
	<title>Re:What about INSTEON?</title>
	<author>Anonymous</author>
	<datestamp>1256676720000</datestamp>
	<modclass>None</modclass>
	<modscore>0</modscore>
	<htmltext>I think the x10 kit was free and you paid like $5 shipping. Of course that deal ended years ago, pretty much went to $50 for that deal. X10 works great for some things. My parents place have some outdoor lights controlled by a light sensor. Rather than trying to put a light sensor on every light there's just the one which sends x10 commands to the lights. If the signal doesn't get through no big deal. If you want more than a few devices or better reliability x10 starts to suffer. You can find the starter kits equivalent to that old x10 starter kit on sale occasionally for about $130 and there's a few free softwares to control it - including one through smarthome (though it sucks.)</htmltext>
<tokenext>I think the x10 kit was free and you paid like $ 5 shipping .
Of course that deal ended years ago , pretty much went to $ 50 for that deal .
X10 works great for some things .
My parents place have some outdoor lights controlled by a light sensor .
Rather than trying to put a light sensor on every light there 's just the one which sends x10 commands to the lights .
If the signal does n't get through no big deal .
If you want more than a few devices or better reliability x10 starts to suffer .
You can find the starter kits equivalent to that old x10 starter kit on sale occasionally for about $ 130 and there 's a few free softwares to control it - including one through smarthome ( though it sucks .
)</tokentext>
<sentencetext>I think the x10 kit was free and you paid like $5 shipping.
Of course that deal ended years ago, pretty much went to $50 for that deal.
X10 works great for some things.
My parents place have some outdoor lights controlled by a light sensor.
Rather than trying to put a light sensor on every light there's just the one which sends x10 commands to the lights.
If the signal doesn't get through no big deal.
If you want more than a few devices or better reliability x10 starts to suffer.
You can find the starter kits equivalent to that old x10 starter kit on sale occasionally for about $130 and there's a few free softwares to control it - including one through smarthome (though it sucks.
)</sentencetext>
	<parent>http://www.semanticweb.org/ontologies/ConversationInstances.owl#comment09_10_26_164226.29877627</parent>
</comment>
<comment>
	<id>http://www.semanticweb.org/ontologies/ConversationInstances.owl#comment09_10_26_164226.29880229</id>
	<title>Re:$2000 in and counting</title>
	<author>Anonymous</author>
	<datestamp>1256571000000</datestamp>
	<modclass>None</modclass>
	<modscore>0</modscore>
	<htmltext><p>I'll have to agree with the Insteon system.  I started a bit into X-10 a few years back, and all I had was problems with phase coupling, signal levels, and no real good way to program it.</p><p>Fast forward to Insteon, and I have excellent light control, especially scenes, where I tap "night time" and the lights come on in the kitchen, just bright enough to get a water.  Tap "party" and different lights come on to their prescribed intensities.  In my opinion, worth it just to not have 6 dimmer switches side by side to control the recessed lights, under cabinet lights, pendants, etc.</p><p>I've been impressed with Insteon and products developed by Universal Controls.  They have an ISY-26 (not ISY-99) which handles all the programming, timers, macros, etc.  It takes some tenacity to figure it all out, but once you do, it's real easy to keep going.  Next up is a wall-mounted touch screen to control the HVAC and audio throughout the house.</p><p>HA is what you make of it.  Where I don't foresee every light and electronic device ever being controlled by HA (when was the last time you cared what temperature your fridge was), a reasonably small investment can pay off in terms of convenience and lifestyle.  Oh yeah... and the coolness factor</p></htmltext>
<tokenext>I 'll have to agree with the Insteon system .
I started a bit into X-10 a few years back , and all I had was problems with phase coupling , signal levels , and no real good way to program it.Fast forward to Insteon , and I have excellent light control , especially scenes , where I tap " night time " and the lights come on in the kitchen , just bright enough to get a water .
Tap " party " and different lights come on to their prescribed intensities .
In my opinion , worth it just to not have 6 dimmer switches side by side to control the recessed lights , under cabinet lights , pendants , etc.I 've been impressed with Insteon and products developed by Universal Controls .
They have an ISY-26 ( not ISY-99 ) which handles all the programming , timers , macros , etc .
It takes some tenacity to figure it all out , but once you do , it 's real easy to keep going .
Next up is a wall-mounted touch screen to control the HVAC and audio throughout the house.HA is what you make of it .
Where I do n't foresee every light and electronic device ever being controlled by HA ( when was the last time you cared what temperature your fridge was ) , a reasonably small investment can pay off in terms of convenience and lifestyle .
Oh yeah... and the coolness factor</tokentext>
<sentencetext>I'll have to agree with the Insteon system.
I started a bit into X-10 a few years back, and all I had was problems with phase coupling, signal levels, and no real good way to program it.Fast forward to Insteon, and I have excellent light control, especially scenes, where I tap "night time" and the lights come on in the kitchen, just bright enough to get a water.
Tap "party" and different lights come on to their prescribed intensities.
In my opinion, worth it just to not have 6 dimmer switches side by side to control the recessed lights, under cabinet lights, pendants, etc.I've been impressed with Insteon and products developed by Universal Controls.
They have an ISY-26 (not ISY-99) which handles all the programming, timers, macros, etc.
It takes some tenacity to figure it all out, but once you do, it's real easy to keep going.
Next up is a wall-mounted touch screen to control the HVAC and audio throughout the house.HA is what you make of it.
Where I don't foresee every light and electronic device ever being controlled by HA (when was the last time you cared what temperature your fridge was), a reasonably small investment can pay off in terms of convenience and lifestyle.
Oh yeah... and the coolness factor</sentencetext>
	<parent>http://www.semanticweb.org/ontologies/ConversationInstances.owl#comment09_10_26_164226.29877071</parent>
</comment>
<comment>
	<id>http://www.semanticweb.org/ontologies/ConversationInstances.owl#comment09_10_26_164226.29878643</id>
	<title>Re:Avoid Open Source!</title>
	<author>sbjornda</author>
	<datestamp>1256557800000</datestamp>
	<modclass>Offtopic</modclass>
	<modscore>1</modscore>
	<htmltext><blockquote><div><p> <i>He spent all night hacking away at his own source code</i></p></div> </blockquote><p>Dude. Self-modifying code. It always ends in tears. You should know better.</p><p>--<br>.nosig</p></div>
	</htmltext>
<tokenext>He spent all night hacking away at his own source code Dude .
Self-modifying code .
It always ends in tears .
You should know better.--.nosig</tokentext>
<sentencetext> He spent all night hacking away at his own source code Dude.
Self-modifying code.
It always ends in tears.
You should know better.--.nosig
	</sentencetext>
	<parent>http://www.semanticweb.org/ontologies/ConversationInstances.owl#comment09_10_26_164226.29876799</parent>
</comment>
<comment>
	<id>http://www.semanticweb.org/ontologies/ConversationInstances.owl#comment09_10_26_164226.29876917</id>
	<title>HA is a solution in search of a problem.</title>
	<author>johnthorensen</author>
	<datestamp>1256549640000</datestamp>
	<modclass>Insightful</modclass>
	<modscore>3</modscore>
	<htmltext>The reason there's no 'good' home automation products is because there's not enough demand, pure and simple.  At the end of the day, HA is 99\% bling and maybe 1\% utility.

There's really only one 'problem' out there that HA-type technologies are suited to solving:  energy.  There are of course measureable ways to reduce a building's energy consumption through electronic controls.  That said, there are plenty of ways that people have achieved this without delving into the realm of what's typically thought of as 'home automation'.  Want to handle lighting based on occupancy?  Buy a lightswitch with integrated PID for maybe $50.  Want to handle climate control based on occupancy?  Get a thermostat with a timer for $20 that will handle 98\% of all circumstances.  In the remaining 2\%, walk your butt over and adjust the thermostat.
<br> <br>
The primary difference between "Home Automation" systems and the sort of one-off solutions like thermostats and PID lightswitches is the network.  Really, the advantages of having these devices know about one another in a practical environment are few-to-none.
<br> <br>
Now, if you're the type that wants to have a girl over and impress her by pressing one button to dim the lights, close the curtains, and turn on the stereo, great.  On the other hand, if you're the<nobr> <wbr></nobr>/. type who's taken the time to set up a system, you're probably paying her anyway so I doubt that's going to affect your chances of getting layed.</htmltext>
<tokenext>The reason there 's no 'good ' home automation products is because there 's not enough demand , pure and simple .
At the end of the day , HA is 99 \ % bling and maybe 1 \ % utility .
There 's really only one 'problem ' out there that HA-type technologies are suited to solving : energy .
There are of course measureable ways to reduce a building 's energy consumption through electronic controls .
That said , there are plenty of ways that people have achieved this without delving into the realm of what 's typically thought of as 'home automation' .
Want to handle lighting based on occupancy ?
Buy a lightswitch with integrated PID for maybe $ 50 .
Want to handle climate control based on occupancy ?
Get a thermostat with a timer for $ 20 that will handle 98 \ % of all circumstances .
In the remaining 2 \ % , walk your butt over and adjust the thermostat .
The primary difference between " Home Automation " systems and the sort of one-off solutions like thermostats and PID lightswitches is the network .
Really , the advantages of having these devices know about one another in a practical environment are few-to-none .
Now , if you 're the type that wants to have a girl over and impress her by pressing one button to dim the lights , close the curtains , and turn on the stereo , great .
On the other hand , if you 're the / .
type who 's taken the time to set up a system , you 're probably paying her anyway so I doubt that 's going to affect your chances of getting layed .</tokentext>
<sentencetext>The reason there's no 'good' home automation products is because there's not enough demand, pure and simple.
At the end of the day, HA is 99\% bling and maybe 1\% utility.
There's really only one 'problem' out there that HA-type technologies are suited to solving:  energy.
There are of course measureable ways to reduce a building's energy consumption through electronic controls.
That said, there are plenty of ways that people have achieved this without delving into the realm of what's typically thought of as 'home automation'.
Want to handle lighting based on occupancy?
Buy a lightswitch with integrated PID for maybe $50.
Want to handle climate control based on occupancy?
Get a thermostat with a timer for $20 that will handle 98\% of all circumstances.
In the remaining 2\%, walk your butt over and adjust the thermostat.
The primary difference between "Home Automation" systems and the sort of one-off solutions like thermostats and PID lightswitches is the network.
Really, the advantages of having these devices know about one another in a practical environment are few-to-none.
Now, if you're the type that wants to have a girl over and impress her by pressing one button to dim the lights, close the curtains, and turn on the stereo, great.
On the other hand, if you're the /.
type who's taken the time to set up a system, you're probably paying her anyway so I doubt that's going to affect your chances of getting layed.</sentencetext>
</comment>
<comment>
	<id>http://www.semanticweb.org/ontologies/ConversationInstances.owl#comment09_10_26_164226.29879759</id>
	<title>Re:Doing it wrong</title>
	<author>Anonymous</author>
	<datestamp>1256565900000</datestamp>
	<modclass>None</modclass>
	<modscore>0</modscore>
	<htmltext><p>I don't know about that... I like my coffee ready when I wake up in the morning. It's automation, even if it's not on the network.</p></htmltext>
<tokenext>I do n't know about that... I like my coffee ready when I wake up in the morning .
It 's automation , even if it 's not on the network .</tokentext>
<sentencetext>I don't know about that... I like my coffee ready when I wake up in the morning.
It's automation, even if it's not on the network.</sentencetext>
	<parent>http://www.semanticweb.org/ontologies/ConversationInstances.owl#comment09_10_26_164226.29876757</parent>
</comment>
<comment>
	<id>http://www.semanticweb.org/ontologies/ConversationInstances.owl#comment09_10_26_164226.29876609</id>
	<title>fatal exception</title>
	<author>Jbain</author>
	<datestamp>1256548560000</datestamp>
	<modclass>Funny</modclass>
	<modscore>2</modscore>
	<htmltext><p>Wife 1.0 seems to crash with Fatal Exception: Divorce. Any idea when a patch for this will be released?</p></htmltext>
<tokenext>Wife 1.0 seems to crash with Fatal Exception : Divorce .
Any idea when a patch for this will be released ?</tokentext>
<sentencetext>Wife 1.0 seems to crash with Fatal Exception: Divorce.
Any idea when a patch for this will be released?</sentencetext>
	<parent>http://www.semanticweb.org/ontologies/ConversationInstances.owl#comment09_10_26_164226.29876185</parent>
</comment>
<comment>
	<id>http://www.semanticweb.org/ontologies/ConversationInstances.owl#comment09_10_26_164226.29878265</id>
	<title>Re:Doing it wrong</title>
	<author>babyrat</author>
	<datestamp>1256555220000</datestamp>
	<modclass>None</modclass>
	<modscore>1</modscore>
	<htmltext><p><i>Right now, without having any self configured computer in my house:</i></p><p>It sounds to me like you have at least 3 computers in your house.  The one that controls the thermostat, the one that controls the driveway lights and the PVR.</p><p><i> I can access this from the web if needed to check usage and adjust the temperature... I see no reason to have these networked</i></p><p>Apparently you see at least one need to have those networked...</p></htmltext>
<tokenext>Right now , without having any self configured computer in my house : It sounds to me like you have at least 3 computers in your house .
The one that controls the thermostat , the one that controls the driveway lights and the PVR .
I can access this from the web if needed to check usage and adjust the temperature... I see no reason to have these networkedApparently you see at least one need to have those networked.. .</tokentext>
<sentencetext>Right now, without having any self configured computer in my house:It sounds to me like you have at least 3 computers in your house.
The one that controls the thermostat, the one that controls the driveway lights and the PVR.
I can access this from the web if needed to check usage and adjust the temperature... I see no reason to have these networkedApparently you see at least one need to have those networked...</sentencetext>
	<parent>http://www.semanticweb.org/ontologies/ConversationInstances.owl#comment09_10_26_164226.29877107</parent>
</comment>
<comment>
	<id>http://www.semanticweb.org/ontologies/ConversationInstances.owl#comment09_10_26_164226.29876937</id>
	<title>Re:Doing it wrong</title>
	<author>profplump</author>
	<datestamp>1256549700000</datestamp>
	<modclass>None</modclass>
	<modscore>1</modscore>
	<htmltext><p>Because there's never any long-running process that I might want to monitor remotely -- it's obvious that anyone who cooks has nothing better to do than stand in the kitchen and watch their thermometers and timers until the food is ready; there's absolutely no use for a popup on your DVR that tells you when your roast hits the desired temperature, or when your 40 minute timer has expired.</p></htmltext>
<tokenext>Because there 's never any long-running process that I might want to monitor remotely -- it 's obvious that anyone who cooks has nothing better to do than stand in the kitchen and watch their thermometers and timers until the food is ready ; there 's absolutely no use for a popup on your DVR that tells you when your roast hits the desired temperature , or when your 40 minute timer has expired .</tokentext>
<sentencetext>Because there's never any long-running process that I might want to monitor remotely -- it's obvious that anyone who cooks has nothing better to do than stand in the kitchen and watch their thermometers and timers until the food is ready; there's absolutely no use for a popup on your DVR that tells you when your roast hits the desired temperature, or when your 40 minute timer has expired.</sentencetext>
	<parent>http://www.semanticweb.org/ontologies/ConversationInstances.owl#comment09_10_26_164226.29876757</parent>
</comment>
<comment>
	<id>http://www.semanticweb.org/ontologies/ConversationInstances.owl#comment09_10_26_164226.29876831</id>
	<title>Re:X10 makes cool stuff for automation</title>
	<author>Hijacked Public</author>
	<datestamp>1256549340000</datestamp>
	<modclass>None</modclass>
	<modscore>1</modscore>
	<htmltext><p>If you own your house (or the bank does but lets you live there) and know electrical wiring then, yes, there are much better solutions.</p><p>I know industrial automation, so I bought a SLC5/05 in a chassis full of IO off of ebay for less than $200. That, some relatively cheap electrical hardware, and a few years of designing control systems nets me what is probably the most reliable way to automate a house that can be had.</p><p>But that isn't remotely within the reach of the average home occupant. I think X10 and their peers are offering a turnkey approximation of what I have, but that is very difficult to do.</p></htmltext>
<tokenext>If you own your house ( or the bank does but lets you live there ) and know electrical wiring then , yes , there are much better solutions.I know industrial automation , so I bought a SLC5/05 in a chassis full of IO off of ebay for less than $ 200 .
That , some relatively cheap electrical hardware , and a few years of designing control systems nets me what is probably the most reliable way to automate a house that can be had.But that is n't remotely within the reach of the average home occupant .
I think X10 and their peers are offering a turnkey approximation of what I have , but that is very difficult to do .</tokentext>
<sentencetext>If you own your house (or the bank does but lets you live there) and know electrical wiring then, yes, there are much better solutions.I know industrial automation, so I bought a SLC5/05 in a chassis full of IO off of ebay for less than $200.
That, some relatively cheap electrical hardware, and a few years of designing control systems nets me what is probably the most reliable way to automate a house that can be had.But that isn't remotely within the reach of the average home occupant.
I think X10 and their peers are offering a turnkey approximation of what I have, but that is very difficult to do.</sentencetext>
	<parent>http://www.semanticweb.org/ontologies/ConversationInstances.owl#comment09_10_26_164226.29876531</parent>
</comment>
<comment>
	<id>http://www.semanticweb.org/ontologies/ConversationInstances.owl#comment09_10_26_164226.29876619</id>
	<title>DDC Systems</title>
	<author>Anonymous</author>
	<datestamp>1256548620000</datestamp>
	<modclass>None</modclass>
	<modscore>0</modscore>
	<htmltext><p>These are designed specifically for building automation, and would work just as well in a home as they do in an office tower.  They can control pretty much anything everyone in this thread has mentioned.</p><p>The largest cost is the wiring of sensors &amp; devices around the house.  Retrofits to an existing house, even more $$$</p></htmltext>
<tokenext>These are designed specifically for building automation , and would work just as well in a home as they do in an office tower .
They can control pretty much anything everyone in this thread has mentioned.The largest cost is the wiring of sensors &amp; devices around the house .
Retrofits to an existing house , even more $ $ $</tokentext>
<sentencetext>These are designed specifically for building automation, and would work just as well in a home as they do in an office tower.
They can control pretty much anything everyone in this thread has mentioned.The largest cost is the wiring of sensors &amp; devices around the house.
Retrofits to an existing house, even more $$$</sentencetext>
</comment>
<comment>
	<id>http://www.semanticweb.org/ontologies/ConversationInstances.owl#comment09_10_26_164226.29883715</id>
	<title>Re:What do you want home automation for?</title>
	<author>Anonymous</author>
	<datestamp>1256657880000</datestamp>
	<modclass>None</modclass>
	<modscore>0</modscore>
	<htmltext><p><div class="quote"><p>What purpose are you accomplishing with this home automation? I have seen these predictions and calls for home automation for years, but I have never seen a compelling reason for doing so.</p><p>I could go on, but I just don't see what I get out of investing in these gadgets for home automation.</p></div><p>You've got a good point, but there are a couple of environments you're not considering: Hospitals and Nursing Homes.</p><p>Providing a patient with control over their environment is a Good Thing. It reduces feelings of helplessness, and that leads to happier patients. Happier patients are (usually) healthier patients. The little things, like being able to open/close the window shades, make a big difference. Not to mention the ability to adjust the temperature as the next poster says. (Do you have any idea how difficult it is to adjust a thermostat after you've had a <a href="http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Knee\_replacement" title="wikipedia.org" rel="nofollow">total knee replacement</a> [wikipedia.org]? It's a total PITA!)</p><p>As for remotely controlling stoves and ovens and such, well, if your grandma lives in an <a href="http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Assisted\_living" title="wikipedia.org" rel="nofollow">assisted living facility</a> [wikipedia.org] it would be good if the staff could turn off the stove in case grandma forgets to. (Hell, <em>I've</em> forgotten to turn off the stove, and I'm not in assisted living!) And there's no reason the same technology couldn't be applied to your grandma's house so she can stay there longer. Combine the tech with something like Brain Age or a chatbot to keep her brain stimulated too.</p><p>With those environments in mind, I think you'll probably see consumer grade HA equipment that's the result of work done for hospital automation and home automation for the elderly and special needs markets.</p></div>
	</htmltext>
<tokenext>What purpose are you accomplishing with this home automation ?
I have seen these predictions and calls for home automation for years , but I have never seen a compelling reason for doing so.I could go on , but I just do n't see what I get out of investing in these gadgets for home automation.You 've got a good point , but there are a couple of environments you 're not considering : Hospitals and Nursing Homes.Providing a patient with control over their environment is a Good Thing .
It reduces feelings of helplessness , and that leads to happier patients .
Happier patients are ( usually ) healthier patients .
The little things , like being able to open/close the window shades , make a big difference .
Not to mention the ability to adjust the temperature as the next poster says .
( Do you have any idea how difficult it is to adjust a thermostat after you 've had a total knee replacement [ wikipedia.org ] ?
It 's a total PITA !
) As for remotely controlling stoves and ovens and such , well , if your grandma lives in an assisted living facility [ wikipedia.org ] it would be good if the staff could turn off the stove in case grandma forgets to .
( Hell , I 've forgotten to turn off the stove , and I 'm not in assisted living !
) And there 's no reason the same technology could n't be applied to your grandma 's house so she can stay there longer .
Combine the tech with something like Brain Age or a chatbot to keep her brain stimulated too.With those environments in mind , I think you 'll probably see consumer grade HA equipment that 's the result of work done for hospital automation and home automation for the elderly and special needs markets .</tokentext>
<sentencetext>What purpose are you accomplishing with this home automation?
I have seen these predictions and calls for home automation for years, but I have never seen a compelling reason for doing so.I could go on, but I just don't see what I get out of investing in these gadgets for home automation.You've got a good point, but there are a couple of environments you're not considering: Hospitals and Nursing Homes.Providing a patient with control over their environment is a Good Thing.
It reduces feelings of helplessness, and that leads to happier patients.
Happier patients are (usually) healthier patients.
The little things, like being able to open/close the window shades, make a big difference.
Not to mention the ability to adjust the temperature as the next poster says.
(Do you have any idea how difficult it is to adjust a thermostat after you've had a total knee replacement [wikipedia.org]?
It's a total PITA!
)As for remotely controlling stoves and ovens and such, well, if your grandma lives in an assisted living facility [wikipedia.org] it would be good if the staff could turn off the stove in case grandma forgets to.
(Hell, I've forgotten to turn off the stove, and I'm not in assisted living!
) And there's no reason the same technology couldn't be applied to your grandma's house so she can stay there longer.
Combine the tech with something like Brain Age or a chatbot to keep her brain stimulated too.With those environments in mind, I think you'll probably see consumer grade HA equipment that's the result of work done for hospital automation and home automation for the elderly and special needs markets.
	</sentencetext>
	<parent>http://www.semanticweb.org/ontologies/ConversationInstances.owl#comment09_10_26_164226.29876453</parent>
</comment>
<comment>
	<id>http://www.semanticweb.org/ontologies/ConversationInstances.owl#comment09_10_26_164226.29879985</id>
	<title>Re:What do you want home automation for?</title>
	<author>Killeryugi</author>
	<datestamp>1256568180000</datestamp>
	<modclass>Interestin</modclass>
	<modscore>2</modscore>
	<htmltext>The town where I go to school, McKeesport PA has a unique situation in that 20\% of its population are senior citizens, and that number is rising. Eventually the nation will mirror this number, so it is being used as a testbed for autonomous retirement homes by a company called BlueRoof Technologies. They aim to be able to control all aspects of the home to the point that the resident does not need a permanent caregiver. Knowing how many times the fridge/shower/sink have been used can clue the computer or operator in on the quality of life of the patient. Situations like turning off the stove then become a bigger deal, if the stove is on with no rise in temperature.</htmltext>
<tokenext>The town where I go to school , McKeesport PA has a unique situation in that 20 \ % of its population are senior citizens , and that number is rising .
Eventually the nation will mirror this number , so it is being used as a testbed for autonomous retirement homes by a company called BlueRoof Technologies .
They aim to be able to control all aspects of the home to the point that the resident does not need a permanent caregiver .
Knowing how many times the fridge/shower/sink have been used can clue the computer or operator in on the quality of life of the patient .
Situations like turning off the stove then become a bigger deal , if the stove is on with no rise in temperature .</tokentext>
<sentencetext>The town where I go to school, McKeesport PA has a unique situation in that 20\% of its population are senior citizens, and that number is rising.
Eventually the nation will mirror this number, so it is being used as a testbed for autonomous retirement homes by a company called BlueRoof Technologies.
They aim to be able to control all aspects of the home to the point that the resident does not need a permanent caregiver.
Knowing how many times the fridge/shower/sink have been used can clue the computer or operator in on the quality of life of the patient.
Situations like turning off the stove then become a bigger deal, if the stove is on with no rise in temperature.</sentencetext>
	<parent>http://www.semanticweb.org/ontologies/ConversationInstances.owl#comment09_10_26_164226.29876453</parent>
</comment>
<comment>
	<id>http://www.semanticweb.org/ontologies/ConversationInstances.owl#comment09_10_26_164226.29876445</id>
	<title>Re:Wife 1.0</title>
	<author>Anonymous</author>
	<datestamp>1256547900000</datestamp>
	<modclass>Funny</modclass>
	<modscore>4</modscore>
	<htmltext>Unfortunately, when you install Girlfriend 1.0, there's always conflicts. Also, Wife 1.0 is always trying to download a beta version of iBaby, and the nag screens saying "Do you want to install iBaby?" keep popping up.</htmltext>
<tokenext>Unfortunately , when you install Girlfriend 1.0 , there 's always conflicts .
Also , Wife 1.0 is always trying to download a beta version of iBaby , and the nag screens saying " Do you want to install iBaby ?
" keep popping up .</tokentext>
<sentencetext>Unfortunately, when you install Girlfriend 1.0, there's always conflicts.
Also, Wife 1.0 is always trying to download a beta version of iBaby, and the nag screens saying "Do you want to install iBaby?
" keep popping up.</sentencetext>
	<parent>http://www.semanticweb.org/ontologies/ConversationInstances.owl#comment09_10_26_164226.29876185</parent>
</comment>
<comment>
	<id>http://www.semanticweb.org/ontologies/ConversationInstances.owl#comment09_10_26_164226.29876661</id>
	<title>Re:Too expensive</title>
	<author>0100010001010011</author>
	<datestamp>1256548800000</datestamp>
	<modclass>Interestin</modclass>
	<modscore>3</modscore>
	<htmltext><p>If you can solder: <a href="http://www.maxim-ic.com/products/1-wire/" title="maxim-ic.com">http://www.maxim-ic.com/products/1-wire/</a> [maxim-ic.com]</p><p>Or if you can't: <a href="http://www.hobby-boards.com/catalog/index.php?cPath=24" title="hobby-boards.com">http://www.hobby-boards.com/catalog/index.php?cPath=24</a> [hobby-boards.com]</p><p>Or if you sign up on Maxim's website they'll send you 1-2 samples of some of their products. Very awesome indeed.</p></htmltext>
<tokenext>If you can solder : http : //www.maxim-ic.com/products/1-wire/ [ maxim-ic.com ] Or if you ca n't : http : //www.hobby-boards.com/catalog/index.php ? cPath = 24 [ hobby-boards.com ] Or if you sign up on Maxim 's website they 'll send you 1-2 samples of some of their products .
Very awesome indeed .</tokentext>
<sentencetext>If you can solder: http://www.maxim-ic.com/products/1-wire/ [maxim-ic.com]Or if you can't: http://www.hobby-boards.com/catalog/index.php?cPath=24 [hobby-boards.com]Or if you sign up on Maxim's website they'll send you 1-2 samples of some of their products.
Very awesome indeed.</sentencetext>
	<parent>http://www.semanticweb.org/ontologies/ConversationInstances.owl#comment09_10_26_164226.29876389</parent>
</comment>
<comment>
	<id>http://www.semanticweb.org/ontologies/ConversationInstances.owl#comment09_10_26_164226.29879831</id>
	<title>Re:$2000 in and counting</title>
	<author>Anonymous</author>
	<datestamp>1256566500000</datestamp>
	<modclass>None</modclass>
	<modscore>0</modscore>
	<htmltext><p>Insteon and the ISY-99 standalone controller have worked very well for us.  I looked at much more expensive options such as Control4.</p><p>I tried a few other software packages to control the Insteon devices, but ran in to limitations with all of them.  The ISY-99 is a dedicated, standalone controller that does not require a PC, can be easily controlled over WiFi by any device with a browser (iPhone, Blackberry, etc) and can be easily configured for Internet access.  The ISY-99 and associated software are from Universal Devices.  The UI for the software is not beautiful, but it is robust and in my experience very reliable.  I've yet to come across anything I can't achieve in our home automation setup using this setup.  Check out the Universal-Devices user forum.  It's very active with excellent contribution from the user community and the developer.</p></htmltext>
<tokenext>Insteon and the ISY-99 standalone controller have worked very well for us .
I looked at much more expensive options such as Control4.I tried a few other software packages to control the Insteon devices , but ran in to limitations with all of them .
The ISY-99 is a dedicated , standalone controller that does not require a PC , can be easily controlled over WiFi by any device with a browser ( iPhone , Blackberry , etc ) and can be easily configured for Internet access .
The ISY-99 and associated software are from Universal Devices .
The UI for the software is not beautiful , but it is robust and in my experience very reliable .
I 've yet to come across anything I ca n't achieve in our home automation setup using this setup .
Check out the Universal-Devices user forum .
It 's very active with excellent contribution from the user community and the developer .</tokentext>
<sentencetext>Insteon and the ISY-99 standalone controller have worked very well for us.
I looked at much more expensive options such as Control4.I tried a few other software packages to control the Insteon devices, but ran in to limitations with all of them.
The ISY-99 is a dedicated, standalone controller that does not require a PC, can be easily controlled over WiFi by any device with a browser (iPhone, Blackberry, etc) and can be easily configured for Internet access.
The ISY-99 and associated software are from Universal Devices.
The UI for the software is not beautiful, but it is robust and in my experience very reliable.
I've yet to come across anything I can't achieve in our home automation setup using this setup.
Check out the Universal-Devices user forum.
It's very active with excellent contribution from the user community and the developer.</sentencetext>
	<parent>http://www.semanticweb.org/ontologies/ConversationInstances.owl#comment09_10_26_164226.29877071</parent>
</comment>
<comment>
	<id>http://www.semanticweb.org/ontologies/ConversationInstances.owl#comment09_10_26_164226.29882759</id>
	<title>I'm looking forward for digitalSTROM availability</title>
	<author>rapidmax</author>
	<datestamp>1256652600000</datestamp>
	<modclass>Informativ</modclass>
	<modscore>2</modscore>
	<htmltext><p>If they where really available next year, this seems to be the perfect solution to control my home. The components works without programming at all out of the box, you'll just need a button and a few <a href="http://developer.digitalstrom.org/" title="digitalstrom.org" rel="nofollow">digitalSTROM</a> [digitalstrom.org] enabled bulb or luster terminal to start. There is no wiring needed, only a simple component right after the fuse or each circuit.</p><p>I'll add the server component of course, as this part is released as OpenSource (GPL, as this was said at LinuxTag '09). Using this server I'm able to program and control the house exactly as I like.</p><p>I'll use <a href="http://openremote.org/" title="openremote.org" rel="nofollow">OpenRemote</a> [openremote.org] to control the server part. This project finally connects all kind of home equippment together (KNX, UPnP, etc). This project should also provide an easy panel interface.</p></htmltext>
<tokenext>If they where really available next year , this seems to be the perfect solution to control my home .
The components works without programming at all out of the box , you 'll just need a button and a few digitalSTROM [ digitalstrom.org ] enabled bulb or luster terminal to start .
There is no wiring needed , only a simple component right after the fuse or each circuit.I 'll add the server component of course , as this part is released as OpenSource ( GPL , as this was said at LinuxTag '09 ) .
Using this server I 'm able to program and control the house exactly as I like.I 'll use OpenRemote [ openremote.org ] to control the server part .
This project finally connects all kind of home equippment together ( KNX , UPnP , etc ) .
This project should also provide an easy panel interface .</tokentext>
<sentencetext>If they where really available next year, this seems to be the perfect solution to control my home.
The components works without programming at all out of the box, you'll just need a button and a few digitalSTROM [digitalstrom.org] enabled bulb or luster terminal to start.
There is no wiring needed, only a simple component right after the fuse or each circuit.I'll add the server component of course, as this part is released as OpenSource (GPL, as this was said at LinuxTag '09).
Using this server I'm able to program and control the house exactly as I like.I'll use OpenRemote [openremote.org] to control the server part.
This project finally connects all kind of home equippment together (KNX, UPnP, etc).
This project should also provide an easy panel interface.</sentencetext>
</comment>
<comment>
	<id>http://www.semanticweb.org/ontologies/ConversationInstances.owl#comment09_10_26_164226.29892097</id>
	<title>Re:HA is a solution in search of a problem.</title>
	<author>Anonymous</author>
	<datestamp>1256652960000</datestamp>
	<modclass>None</modclass>
	<modscore>0</modscore>
	<htmltext><p>Other motivations:<br>
&nbsp; - safety<br>
&nbsp; - security<br>
&nbsp; - ease of use<br>Added to the one you listed : efficiency (because energy is not a problem you solve, unless you're in a Physics class)</p><p>Also, I think you meant "laid".</p></htmltext>
<tokenext>Other motivations :   - safety   - security   - ease of useAdded to the one you listed : efficiency ( because energy is not a problem you solve , unless you 're in a Physics class ) Also , I think you meant " laid " .</tokentext>
<sentencetext>Other motivations:
  - safety
  - security
  - ease of useAdded to the one you listed : efficiency (because energy is not a problem you solve, unless you're in a Physics class)Also, I think you meant "laid".</sentencetext>
	<parent>http://www.semanticweb.org/ontologies/ConversationInstances.owl#comment09_10_26_164226.29876917</parent>
</comment>
<comment>
	<id>http://www.semanticweb.org/ontologies/ConversationInstances.owl#comment09_10_26_164226.29876341</id>
	<title>Re:Wife 1.0</title>
	<author>Anonymous</author>
	<datestamp>1256590560000</datestamp>
	<modclass>Funny</modclass>
	<modscore>5</modscore>
	<htmltext><p>uummm<nobr> <wbr></nobr>... tHis is<nobr> <wbr></nobr>/.<nobr> <wbr></nobr>... Mom 1.0</p></htmltext>
<tokenext>uummm ... tHis is / .
... Mom 1.0</tokentext>
<sentencetext>uummm ... tHis is /.
... Mom 1.0</sentencetext>
	<parent>http://www.semanticweb.org/ontologies/ConversationInstances.owl#comment09_10_26_164226.29876185</parent>
</comment>
<comment>
	<id>http://www.semanticweb.org/ontologies/ConversationInstances.owl#comment09_10_26_164226.29876455</id>
	<title>Re:What about INSTEON?</title>
	<author>Anonymous</author>
	<datestamp>1256547960000</datestamp>
	<modclass>Interestin</modclass>
	<modscore>2</modscore>
	<htmltext><p>I talked to a Control4 dealer and I got a few interesting tidbits:</p><p>-The *Dealer* installs, configures the system into your house using special dealer-only software (PWD protect the system, too)<br>-You get a turnkey system, not the pwd.<br>-You can get something like an SDK for it but it is a *subset* (read: down version) of what the dealer used.</p></htmltext>
<tokenext>I talked to a Control4 dealer and I got a few interesting tidbits : -The * Dealer * installs , configures the system into your house using special dealer-only software ( PWD protect the system , too ) -You get a turnkey system , not the pwd.-You can get something like an SDK for it but it is a * subset * ( read : down version ) of what the dealer used .</tokentext>
<sentencetext>I talked to a Control4 dealer and I got a few interesting tidbits:-The *Dealer* installs, configures the system into your house using special dealer-only software (PWD protect the system, too)-You get a turnkey system, not the pwd.-You can get something like an SDK for it but it is a *subset* (read: down version) of what the dealer used.</sentencetext>
	<parent>http://www.semanticweb.org/ontologies/ConversationInstances.owl#comment09_10_26_164226.29876335</parent>
</comment>
<comment>
	<id>http://www.semanticweb.org/ontologies/ConversationInstances.owl#comment09_10_26_164226.29876945</id>
	<title>The biggest problem with HAL2000...</title>
	<author>brennanw</author>
	<datestamp>1256549760000</datestamp>
	<modclass>None</modclass>
	<modscore>1</modscore>
	<htmltext><p>... is that the company named the application after a computer that <strong>went berserk and started killing people in order to preserve the mission objective</strong>.</p><p>I'm not sure I want to listen to my house singing "Daisy, Daisy" in an ever-decreasing key as the corpses of friends &amp; family float listlessly in space. I think people would probably stop coming to my parties after that.</p><p>Suggested company motto: "We're 7000 releases away from full-blown psychosis!"</p></htmltext>
<tokenext>... is that the company named the application after a computer that went berserk and started killing people in order to preserve the mission objective.I 'm not sure I want to listen to my house singing " Daisy , Daisy " in an ever-decreasing key as the corpses of friends &amp; family float listlessly in space .
I think people would probably stop coming to my parties after that.Suggested company motto : " We 're 7000 releases away from full-blown psychosis !
"</tokentext>
<sentencetext>... is that the company named the application after a computer that went berserk and started killing people in order to preserve the mission objective.I'm not sure I want to listen to my house singing "Daisy, Daisy" in an ever-decreasing key as the corpses of friends &amp; family float listlessly in space.
I think people would probably stop coming to my parties after that.Suggested company motto: "We're 7000 releases away from full-blown psychosis!
"</sentencetext>
</comment>
<comment>
	<id>http://www.semanticweb.org/ontologies/ConversationInstances.owl#comment09_10_26_164226.29881101</id>
	<title>Re:Home automation</title>
	<author>thynk</author>
	<datestamp>1256584020000</datestamp>
	<modclass>Interestin</modclass>
	<modscore>2</modscore>
	<htmltext><p>As a misterhouse user, I can attest that it's updated far more frequently than 2008.  New code and patches are added the SVN on an as needed basis. New release comes out every so often, but users are encouraged to keep updated with the SVN.  Also has a very responsive mailing list with a number of folks willing to help even the greenest n00b.  Runs FAR better on linux than it does on Windows, at least in my experience.  YMMV.  I can't speak for the other bits of software, I dumped homeseer years ago, tho I understand it's quite popular.</p></htmltext>
<tokenext>As a misterhouse user , I can attest that it 's updated far more frequently than 2008 .
New code and patches are added the SVN on an as needed basis .
New release comes out every so often , but users are encouraged to keep updated with the SVN .
Also has a very responsive mailing list with a number of folks willing to help even the greenest n00b .
Runs FAR better on linux than it does on Windows , at least in my experience .
YMMV. I ca n't speak for the other bits of software , I dumped homeseer years ago , tho I understand it 's quite popular .</tokentext>
<sentencetext>As a misterhouse user, I can attest that it's updated far more frequently than 2008.
New code and patches are added the SVN on an as needed basis.
New release comes out every so often, but users are encouraged to keep updated with the SVN.
Also has a very responsive mailing list with a number of folks willing to help even the greenest n00b.
Runs FAR better on linux than it does on Windows, at least in my experience.
YMMV.  I can't speak for the other bits of software, I dumped homeseer years ago, tho I understand it's quite popular.</sentencetext>
	<parent>http://www.semanticweb.org/ontologies/ConversationInstances.owl#comment09_10_26_164226.29876157</parent>
</comment>
<comment>
	<id>http://www.semanticweb.org/ontologies/ConversationInstances.owl#comment09_10_26_164226.29877709</id>
	<title>Re:Doing it wrong</title>
	<author>QuantumRiff</author>
	<datestamp>1256552820000</datestamp>
	<modclass>None</modclass>
	<modscore>1</modscore>
	<htmltext><p>I thought that was the idea behind Zigbee, the low cost, low power, mesh networking standard.  Not to mention, there is a home powerline networking standard, HomePlug alliance, that has been out for quite awhile.  Unfortunately, neither of them is popular enough to get the economies of scale.  (now if that fancy little linux powered wall wart <a href="http://www.marvell.com/products/embedded\_processors/kirkwood/plugcomputer.jsp" title="marvell.com">http://www.marvell.com/products/embedded\_processors/kirkwood/plugcomputer.jsp</a> [marvell.com] would support either of the other two standards, we might be able to do some very, very cool stuff!)</p></htmltext>
<tokenext>I thought that was the idea behind Zigbee , the low cost , low power , mesh networking standard .
Not to mention , there is a home powerline networking standard , HomePlug alliance , that has been out for quite awhile .
Unfortunately , neither of them is popular enough to get the economies of scale .
( now if that fancy little linux powered wall wart http : //www.marvell.com/products/embedded \ _processors/kirkwood/plugcomputer.jsp [ marvell.com ] would support either of the other two standards , we might be able to do some very , very cool stuff !
)</tokentext>
<sentencetext>I thought that was the idea behind Zigbee, the low cost, low power, mesh networking standard.
Not to mention, there is a home powerline networking standard, HomePlug alliance, that has been out for quite awhile.
Unfortunately, neither of them is popular enough to get the economies of scale.
(now if that fancy little linux powered wall wart http://www.marvell.com/products/embedded\_processors/kirkwood/plugcomputer.jsp [marvell.com] would support either of the other two standards, we might be able to do some very, very cool stuff!
)</sentencetext>
	<parent>http://www.semanticweb.org/ontologies/ConversationInstances.owl#comment09_10_26_164226.29876223</parent>
</comment>
<comment>
	<id>http://www.semanticweb.org/ontologies/ConversationInstances.owl#comment09_10_26_164226.29877147</id>
	<title>Re:Doing it wrong</title>
	<author>Bodhammer</author>
	<datestamp>1256550540000</datestamp>
	<modclass>None</modclass>
	<modscore>1</modscore>
	<htmltext>The WiFi Direct spec was just released.  Hopefully it will address this exactly and get this off of Top Dead Center...

<a href="http://www.wi-fi.org/news\_articles.php?f=media\_news&amp;news\_id=909" title="wi-fi.org">http://www.wi-fi.org/news\_articles.php?f=media\_news&amp;news\_id=909</a> [wi-fi.org]</htmltext>
<tokenext>The WiFi Direct spec was just released .
Hopefully it will address this exactly and get this off of Top Dead Center.. . http : //www.wi-fi.org/news \ _articles.php ? f = media \ _news&amp;news \ _id = 909 [ wi-fi.org ]</tokentext>
<sentencetext>The WiFi Direct spec was just released.
Hopefully it will address this exactly and get this off of Top Dead Center...

http://www.wi-fi.org/news\_articles.php?f=media\_news&amp;news\_id=909 [wi-fi.org]</sentencetext>
	<parent>http://www.semanticweb.org/ontologies/ConversationInstances.owl#comment09_10_26_164226.29876223</parent>
</comment>
<comment>
	<id>http://www.semanticweb.org/ontologies/ConversationInstances.owl#comment09_10_26_164226.29879469</id>
	<title>Re:X10 makes cool stuff for automation</title>
	<author>BitZtream</author>
	<datestamp>1256563440000</datestamp>
	<modclass>None</modclass>
	<modscore>1</modscore>
	<htmltext><p>The problems you are complaining about are because of the crappy equipment sold by X10.com.  The X10 protocol (which is not 'owned' by X10.com) does not prevent status responses from being sent, but when you buy bargin basement crap from a website designed to leech your money, you get crappy hardware.</p><p>Do you complain when you get a e-machine and it doesn't have a PCI-E slot as well?  Pay for quality and get quality (sometimes<nobr> <wbr></nobr>:), don't pay for quality and you probably won't get quality, unless they haven't yet figured out how they can make it cheaper and maximize their profits.  You really do get what you pay for.</p></htmltext>
<tokenext>The problems you are complaining about are because of the crappy equipment sold by X10.com .
The X10 protocol ( which is not 'owned ' by X10.com ) does not prevent status responses from being sent , but when you buy bargin basement crap from a website designed to leech your money , you get crappy hardware.Do you complain when you get a e-machine and it does n't have a PCI-E slot as well ?
Pay for quality and get quality ( sometimes : ) , do n't pay for quality and you probably wo n't get quality , unless they have n't yet figured out how they can make it cheaper and maximize their profits .
You really do get what you pay for .</tokentext>
<sentencetext>The problems you are complaining about are because of the crappy equipment sold by X10.com.
The X10 protocol (which is not 'owned' by X10.com) does not prevent status responses from being sent, but when you buy bargin basement crap from a website designed to leech your money, you get crappy hardware.Do you complain when you get a e-machine and it doesn't have a PCI-E slot as well?
Pay for quality and get quality (sometimes :), don't pay for quality and you probably won't get quality, unless they haven't yet figured out how they can make it cheaper and maximize their profits.
You really do get what you pay for.</sentencetext>
	<parent>http://www.semanticweb.org/ontologies/ConversationInstances.owl#comment09_10_26_164226.29876531</parent>
</comment>
<comment>
	<id>http://www.semanticweb.org/ontologies/ConversationInstances.owl#comment09_10_26_164226.29876695</id>
	<title>Re:Wife 1.0</title>
	<author>tsstahl</author>
	<datestamp>1256548860000</datestamp>
	<modclass>Funny</modclass>
	<modscore>5</modscore>
	<htmltext>Pure vaporware.</htmltext>
<tokenext>Pure vaporware .</tokentext>
<sentencetext>Pure vaporware.</sentencetext>
	<parent>http://www.semanticweb.org/ontologies/ConversationInstances.owl#comment09_10_26_164226.29876373</parent>
</comment>
<comment>
	<id>http://www.semanticweb.org/ontologies/ConversationInstances.owl#comment09_10_26_164226.29880163</id>
	<title>Re:Home automation</title>
	<author>Ricochet</author>
	<datestamp>1256570160000</datestamp>
	<modclass>None</modclass>
	<modscore>1</modscore>
	<htmltext><p>Actually Misterhouse is updated almost on a daily basis. The SVN version is the one being update. At some point in the year a point release is decided and then the over all number get incremented. I use Misterhouse on a daily basis.</p></htmltext>
<tokenext>Actually Misterhouse is updated almost on a daily basis .
The SVN version is the one being update .
At some point in the year a point release is decided and then the over all number get incremented .
I use Misterhouse on a daily basis .</tokentext>
<sentencetext>Actually Misterhouse is updated almost on a daily basis.
The SVN version is the one being update.
At some point in the year a point release is decided and then the over all number get incremented.
I use Misterhouse on a daily basis.</sentencetext>
	<parent>http://www.semanticweb.org/ontologies/ConversationInstances.owl#comment09_10_26_164226.29876157</parent>
</comment>
<comment>
	<id>http://www.semanticweb.org/ontologies/ConversationInstances.owl#comment09_10_26_164226.29885869</id>
	<title>Re:Doing it wrong</title>
	<author>2obvious4u</author>
	<datestamp>1256667480000</datestamp>
	<modclass>None</modclass>
	<modscore>1</modscore>
	<htmltext><p><div class="quote"><p>Never has a subject line been so accurate... Look, it's pretty obvious that you have NEVER cooked anything. If you're cooking YOU'RE IN THE DAMNED KITCHEN! Why in hell would you want to access your kitchen appliances from a telephone or a videogame?</p></div><p>
Look its pretty obvious that you've never cooked anything that has to sit in the oven or on the stove for longer than 20 min.  You do the prep work, set the food in the oven, and then clean the mess.  Then you go sit down at your x-box or ps3 and start playing a game.  Next thing you know you totally forgot the timer and your food burned.  Wouldn't it be nice if the oven timer notified you in game so you didn't burn your food.  Or even paused the game automatically for you to go check the food.<br>
<br>
I almost burned down the kitchen one time trying to make boiled p-nuts.  I got engrossed in a game of Age of Empires and burned a hole in the bottom of the pan.  Some kitchen automation is very useful.<br>
<br>
Then there is the refrigerator.  This is probably the most useful kitchen appliance to have on the network.  You could scan bar codes of your condiments or even have webcams in the fridge to check and see what you have available.  You could even store expiration dates of the food in the fridge and it could warn you when food expires.  It could even suggest recipes for what you have available.  So before you leave the office to go home you could look up what you need to pick up for supper that night.<br>
<br>
Then there is slow cooking!  You could set up a crock pot or dutch oven in the oven before you leave for work, then you could set it to start at some later time.  Then you get held up in traffic and set the oven to warm instead of low, medium or high.  Or even turn it up if you know you're going to be early.<br>
<br>
Just saying, kitchen automation isn't useless.</p></div>
	</htmltext>
<tokenext>Never has a subject line been so accurate... Look , it 's pretty obvious that you have NEVER cooked anything .
If you 're cooking YOU 'RE IN THE DAMNED KITCHEN !
Why in hell would you want to access your kitchen appliances from a telephone or a videogame ?
Look its pretty obvious that you 've never cooked anything that has to sit in the oven or on the stove for longer than 20 min .
You do the prep work , set the food in the oven , and then clean the mess .
Then you go sit down at your x-box or ps3 and start playing a game .
Next thing you know you totally forgot the timer and your food burned .
Would n't it be nice if the oven timer notified you in game so you did n't burn your food .
Or even paused the game automatically for you to go check the food .
I almost burned down the kitchen one time trying to make boiled p-nuts .
I got engrossed in a game of Age of Empires and burned a hole in the bottom of the pan .
Some kitchen automation is very useful .
Then there is the refrigerator .
This is probably the most useful kitchen appliance to have on the network .
You could scan bar codes of your condiments or even have webcams in the fridge to check and see what you have available .
You could even store expiration dates of the food in the fridge and it could warn you when food expires .
It could even suggest recipes for what you have available .
So before you leave the office to go home you could look up what you need to pick up for supper that night .
Then there is slow cooking !
You could set up a crock pot or dutch oven in the oven before you leave for work , then you could set it to start at some later time .
Then you get held up in traffic and set the oven to warm instead of low , medium or high .
Or even turn it up if you know you 're going to be early .
Just saying , kitchen automation is n't useless .</tokentext>
<sentencetext>Never has a subject line been so accurate... Look, it's pretty obvious that you have NEVER cooked anything.
If you're cooking YOU'RE IN THE DAMNED KITCHEN!
Why in hell would you want to access your kitchen appliances from a telephone or a videogame?
Look its pretty obvious that you've never cooked anything that has to sit in the oven or on the stove for longer than 20 min.
You do the prep work, set the food in the oven, and then clean the mess.
Then you go sit down at your x-box or ps3 and start playing a game.
Next thing you know you totally forgot the timer and your food burned.
Wouldn't it be nice if the oven timer notified you in game so you didn't burn your food.
Or even paused the game automatically for you to go check the food.
I almost burned down the kitchen one time trying to make boiled p-nuts.
I got engrossed in a game of Age of Empires and burned a hole in the bottom of the pan.
Some kitchen automation is very useful.
Then there is the refrigerator.
This is probably the most useful kitchen appliance to have on the network.
You could scan bar codes of your condiments or even have webcams in the fridge to check and see what you have available.
You could even store expiration dates of the food in the fridge and it could warn you when food expires.
It could even suggest recipes for what you have available.
So before you leave the office to go home you could look up what you need to pick up for supper that night.
Then there is slow cooking!
You could set up a crock pot or dutch oven in the oven before you leave for work, then you could set it to start at some later time.
Then you get held up in traffic and set the oven to warm instead of low, medium or high.
Or even turn it up if you know you're going to be early.
Just saying, kitchen automation isn't useless.
	</sentencetext>
	<parent>http://www.semanticweb.org/ontologies/ConversationInstances.owl#comment09_10_26_164226.29876757</parent>
</comment>
<comment>
	<id>http://www.semanticweb.org/ontologies/ConversationInstances.owl#comment09_10_26_164226.29877463</id>
	<title>Re:Too expensive</title>
	<author>Anonymous</author>
	<datestamp>1256551800000</datestamp>
	<modclass>None</modclass>
	<modscore>0</modscore>
	<htmltext><p>Crestron (http://www.crestron.com/)<br>AMX (http://www.amx.com/)<br>
&nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; - Expensive, top of the line general purpose control</p><p>Lutron (http://www.lutron.com/)<br>
&nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; - Mostly geared to lighting products but branched out</p><p>Extron (http://www.extron.com/)<br>
&nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; - Mostly geared to video products but branched out</p><p>Aurora Multimedia (http://auroramultimedia.com/)<br>
&nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; - offers WACI interfaces, that is worth it for the name...</p><p>Yes, there are many bits to buy to control each and every thing.</p></htmltext>
<tokenext>Crestron ( http : //www.crestron.com/ ) AMX ( http : //www.amx.com/ )         - Expensive , top of the line general purpose controlLutron ( http : //www.lutron.com/ )         - Mostly geared to lighting products but branched outExtron ( http : //www.extron.com/ )         - Mostly geared to video products but branched outAurora Multimedia ( http : //auroramultimedia.com/ )         - offers WACI interfaces , that is worth it for the name...Yes , there are many bits to buy to control each and every thing .</tokentext>
<sentencetext>Crestron (http://www.crestron.com/)AMX (http://www.amx.com/)
        - Expensive, top of the line general purpose controlLutron (http://www.lutron.com/)
        - Mostly geared to lighting products but branched outExtron (http://www.extron.com/)
        - Mostly geared to video products but branched outAurora Multimedia (http://auroramultimedia.com/)
        - offers WACI interfaces, that is worth it for the name...Yes, there are many bits to buy to control each and every thing.</sentencetext>
	<parent>http://www.semanticweb.org/ontologies/ConversationInstances.owl#comment09_10_26_164226.29876389</parent>
</comment>
<comment>
	<id>http://www.semanticweb.org/ontologies/ConversationInstances.owl#comment09_10_26_164226.29881747</id>
	<title>Re:Doing it wrong</title>
	<author>wpiman</author>
	<datestamp>1256638860000</datestamp>
	<modclass>None</modclass>
	<modscore>1</modscore>
	<htmltext>The product I use is called Homeseer (in OP) and it does much of what you say.  It uses a 900 Mhz wireless protocol mesh network called Zwave which communicates to various devices.  It is supported by multiple manufacturers.  I have light switches, thermostats, motion sensor, light sensors, temp sensors, appliance modules, door locks, and door sensors that all run Zwave.  Big names like Trane and Schlage support it.  In addition there are other sensors (water sensors, humidity sensors) you can get.  Zigbee sort of hasn't caught much traction.  You can buy zwave products at lowes.
<p>It runs on Windows; which some say is a minus-- but doesn't bother me.  </p><p>There is a slick iphone interface cause HSTouch which allows you to create your own screens for control (works on Windows/Linux/CE and Mac too I believe).  </p><p>When I get home- I pull out my iPhone and unlock my doors; turn on the light and the heat.
</p><p>Zwave is still growing; and I imagine integration into these products is forthcoming.  The beauty of zwave over wifi is that it comes little power; so battery operated devices are plausible.  Throughput it 9600 -&gt; 40 kbps.
</p><p>To add devices; I just bring my zwave usb stick to a device; click a button on each; and it adds.  The network self optimizes.
</p><p>Again; long way to go but the community is pretty strong.</p></htmltext>
<tokenext>The product I use is called Homeseer ( in OP ) and it does much of what you say .
It uses a 900 Mhz wireless protocol mesh network called Zwave which communicates to various devices .
It is supported by multiple manufacturers .
I have light switches , thermostats , motion sensor , light sensors , temp sensors , appliance modules , door locks , and door sensors that all run Zwave .
Big names like Trane and Schlage support it .
In addition there are other sensors ( water sensors , humidity sensors ) you can get .
Zigbee sort of has n't caught much traction .
You can buy zwave products at lowes .
It runs on Windows ; which some say is a minus-- but does n't bother me .
There is a slick iphone interface cause HSTouch which allows you to create your own screens for control ( works on Windows/Linux/CE and Mac too I believe ) .
When I get home- I pull out my iPhone and unlock my doors ; turn on the light and the heat .
Zwave is still growing ; and I imagine integration into these products is forthcoming .
The beauty of zwave over wifi is that it comes little power ; so battery operated devices are plausible .
Throughput it 9600 - &gt; 40 kbps .
To add devices ; I just bring my zwave usb stick to a device ; click a button on each ; and it adds .
The network self optimizes .
Again ; long way to go but the community is pretty strong .</tokentext>
<sentencetext>The product I use is called Homeseer (in OP) and it does much of what you say.
It uses a 900 Mhz wireless protocol mesh network called Zwave which communicates to various devices.
It is supported by multiple manufacturers.
I have light switches, thermostats, motion sensor, light sensors, temp sensors, appliance modules, door locks, and door sensors that all run Zwave.
Big names like Trane and Schlage support it.
In addition there are other sensors (water sensors, humidity sensors) you can get.
Zigbee sort of hasn't caught much traction.
You can buy zwave products at lowes.
It runs on Windows; which some say is a minus-- but doesn't bother me.
There is a slick iphone interface cause HSTouch which allows you to create your own screens for control (works on Windows/Linux/CE and Mac too I believe).
When I get home- I pull out my iPhone and unlock my doors; turn on the light and the heat.
Zwave is still growing; and I imagine integration into these products is forthcoming.
The beauty of zwave over wifi is that it comes little power; so battery operated devices are plausible.
Throughput it 9600 -&gt; 40 kbps.
To add devices; I just bring my zwave usb stick to a device; click a button on each; and it adds.
The network self optimizes.
Again; long way to go but the community is pretty strong.</sentencetext>
	<parent>http://www.semanticweb.org/ontologies/ConversationInstances.owl#comment09_10_26_164226.29876223</parent>
</comment>
<comment>
	<id>http://www.semanticweb.org/ontologies/ConversationInstances.owl#comment09_10_26_164226.29876389</id>
	<title>Too expensive</title>
	<author>Orange Crush</author>
	<datestamp>1256547600000</datestamp>
	<modclass>Interestin</modclass>
	<modscore>2</modscore>
	<htmltext><p>The main reason I haven't bothered looking in to home automation more seriously is the expense of all the "bits" (switches, outlets, thermostats, etc.).</p><p>What <b>are</b> the cheapest options out there right now?</p><p>I'd be most interested in controlling HVAC, ceiling fans and lighting.</p></htmltext>
<tokenext>The main reason I have n't bothered looking in to home automation more seriously is the expense of all the " bits " ( switches , outlets , thermostats , etc .
) .What are the cheapest options out there right now ? I 'd be most interested in controlling HVAC , ceiling fans and lighting .</tokentext>
<sentencetext>The main reason I haven't bothered looking in to home automation more seriously is the expense of all the "bits" (switches, outlets, thermostats, etc.
).What are the cheapest options out there right now?I'd be most interested in controlling HVAC, ceiling fans and lighting.</sentencetext>
</comment>
<comment>
	<id>http://www.semanticweb.org/ontologies/ConversationInstances.owl#comment09_10_26_164226.29881035</id>
	<title>OpenRemote</title>
	<author>Anonymous</author>
	<datestamp>1256582280000</datestamp>
	<modclass>None</modclass>
	<modscore>0</modscore>
	<htmltext><p>There is a new GPL platform in development called OpenRemote. It is based on open standards and supports popular protocols like x10, KNX and Insteon. They already have software that runs the backend called the "Boss" and remote platform working on the iPhone/Touch. The project was started by Marc Fleury, founder and former CEO of JBoss If you are just getting started, this definitely worth looking at.</p><p>http://www.openremote.org/</p><p>David</p></htmltext>
<tokenext>There is a new GPL platform in development called OpenRemote .
It is based on open standards and supports popular protocols like x10 , KNX and Insteon .
They already have software that runs the backend called the " Boss " and remote platform working on the iPhone/Touch .
The project was started by Marc Fleury , founder and former CEO of JBoss If you are just getting started , this definitely worth looking at.http : //www.openremote.org/David</tokentext>
<sentencetext>There is a new GPL platform in development called OpenRemote.
It is based on open standards and supports popular protocols like x10, KNX and Insteon.
They already have software that runs the backend called the "Boss" and remote platform working on the iPhone/Touch.
The project was started by Marc Fleury, founder and former CEO of JBoss If you are just getting started, this definitely worth looking at.http://www.openremote.org/David</sentencetext>
</comment>
<comment>
	<id>http://www.semanticweb.org/ontologies/ConversationInstances.owl#comment09_10_26_164226.29878147</id>
	<title>Go for open standards and build on top</title>
	<author>Anonymous</author>
	<datestamp>1256554620000</datestamp>
	<modclass>None</modclass>
	<modscore>0</modscore>
	<htmltext><p>If you want to go for something sustainable that doesn't depend on a single manufacturer, go for open standards like KNX (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/KNX\_\%28standard\%29).</p><p>Then there are pretty cool projects like Linknx (http://sourceforge.net/projects/linknx/) that will allow you to add loads of features to your home automation system with little effort.</p></htmltext>
<tokenext>If you want to go for something sustainable that does n't depend on a single manufacturer , go for open standards like KNX ( http : //en.wikipedia.org/wiki/KNX \ _ \ % 28standard \ % 29 ) .Then there are pretty cool projects like Linknx ( http : //sourceforge.net/projects/linknx/ ) that will allow you to add loads of features to your home automation system with little effort .</tokentext>
<sentencetext>If you want to go for something sustainable that doesn't depend on a single manufacturer, go for open standards like KNX (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/KNX\_\%28standard\%29).Then there are pretty cool projects like Linknx (http://sourceforge.net/projects/linknx/) that will allow you to add loads of features to your home automation system with little effort.</sentencetext>
</comment>
<comment>
	<id>http://www.semanticweb.org/ontologies/ConversationInstances.owl#comment09_10_26_164226.29886939</id>
	<title>Setting up an HA system</title>
	<author>Anonymous</author>
	<datestamp>1256672160000</datestamp>
	<modclass>None</modclass>
	<modscore>0</modscore>
	<htmltext><p>I'm actually using a hardware alarm/automation panel ELK M1 Gold, and have been using a software based automation program called CQC</p></htmltext>
<tokenext>I 'm actually using a hardware alarm/automation panel ELK M1 Gold , and have been using a software based automation program called CQC</tokentext>
<sentencetext>I'm actually using a hardware alarm/automation panel ELK M1 Gold, and have been using a software based automation program called CQC</sentencetext>
</comment>
<comment>
	<id>http://www.semanticweb.org/ontologies/ConversationInstances.owl#comment09_10_26_164226.29888487</id>
	<title>Jane, get me off this crazy thing!</title>
	<author>professorguy</author>
	<datestamp>1256635320000</datestamp>
	<modclass>None</modclass>
	<modscore>1</modscore>
	<htmltext>Hey, I have home automation: My heat is automatically turned down when no one is home because there's no one there to put more logs into the woodstove.  This has worked great since 1979.
<br> <br>
On a serious note, I think most automation projects are designed beautifully but are not used as designed because it turns out they weren't really needed.  This is fine for a hobby but it don't make a market.
<br> <br>
If you're thinking "I need some automation." maybe you should instead be thinking "I have way too much shit to take care of." If you're thinking "I need to protect my crap." maybe you should instead be thinking "Why do I have this crap?"  Buying "crap babysitters" is always going to be more expensive than not owning crap that needs babysitting.
<br> <br>
If you are seriously considering having to call your oven to tell it you're going to be late from work, you have all the disadvantages of a wife without the advantages.  WTF?</htmltext>
<tokenext>Hey , I have home automation : My heat is automatically turned down when no one is home because there 's no one there to put more logs into the woodstove .
This has worked great since 1979 .
On a serious note , I think most automation projects are designed beautifully but are not used as designed because it turns out they were n't really needed .
This is fine for a hobby but it do n't make a market .
If you 're thinking " I need some automation .
" maybe you should instead be thinking " I have way too much shit to take care of .
" If you 're thinking " I need to protect my crap .
" maybe you should instead be thinking " Why do I have this crap ?
" Buying " crap babysitters " is always going to be more expensive than not owning crap that needs babysitting .
If you are seriously considering having to call your oven to tell it you 're going to be late from work , you have all the disadvantages of a wife without the advantages .
WTF ?</tokentext>
<sentencetext>Hey, I have home automation: My heat is automatically turned down when no one is home because there's no one there to put more logs into the woodstove.
This has worked great since 1979.
On a serious note, I think most automation projects are designed beautifully but are not used as designed because it turns out they weren't really needed.
This is fine for a hobby but it don't make a market.
If you're thinking "I need some automation.
" maybe you should instead be thinking "I have way too much shit to take care of.
" If you're thinking "I need to protect my crap.
" maybe you should instead be thinking "Why do I have this crap?
"  Buying "crap babysitters" is always going to be more expensive than not owning crap that needs babysitting.
If you are seriously considering having to call your oven to tell it you're going to be late from work, you have all the disadvantages of a wife without the advantages.
WTF?</sentencetext>
</comment>
<comment>
	<id>http://www.semanticweb.org/ontologies/ConversationInstances.owl#comment09_10_26_164226.29879355</id>
	<title>Re:Doing it wrong</title>
	<author>markov23</author>
	<datestamp>1256562600000</datestamp>
	<modclass>Informativ</modclass>
	<modscore>2</modscore>
	<htmltext>its not pointless -- its just not for you.

We put these systems in lots of houses and when they are done right they make complicated systems very simple to use.    Most of our projects have 8-16 rooms with digital music, video networks that can put any source on any TV and simple remote controls that make the whole thing work.  It aint cheap, but done correctly you can make these systems work for competing viewpoints of husbands and wives.

Typically husbands love tech -- dont mind seeing a stack of equipment in a room and see it as a normal part of everyday life that they need 3 remotes to watch a movie.   Wives want to see the stuff disappear -- which is why you put speakers in the ceiling and have touchpads control music instead of having a stereo stack in each room you might want to listen to music in.  These systems also let you have a nice clean look in media rooms.  Most of our projects we put every piece of equipment in a server rack and control it all via RF remotes.   This lets you just put a TV over the fireplace -- or just have a plasma and in wall speakers in the family room without having to cram a bunch of stuff into a piece of furniture you didnt want in the room.

This is not for everybody -- but to our customers ease of use and aesthetics are important and they are willing to pay for them.

Now there is a DIY crowd out there trying to use home depot quality stuff and x-10 tech.   If this is all you look at, you will think the field hasnt moved in decades.  The enthusiast market is filled with incomplete solutions and hacker tech.  It may be fun to play with, but it aint wife friendly and it wont be reliable.   This group tends to get overly focused on the cost of the gear and has very high expectations of performance ( this is from my viewpoint as a professional in the space )  As a company weve stayed away from projects where people want to use x-10 level of gear.

Lastly -- and way off topic -- but there is some chatter about wifi growing up to handle these tasks.   I'd put that at not likely with the current state of that spec.    Its fine for laptops roaming around the house, but its too unreliable for home automation where it needs to work 100\% of the time.   We try to have anything that needs that kind of connectivity have a dedicated ethernet or we never really trust it.   Its not all wifi's fault -- the embedded device code for wifi that is in most touch panels and equipment in the automation space has no clue how to handle a multi channel wifi network where it might roam -- this makes it pretty bad for what most people expect of it.</htmltext>
<tokenext>its not pointless -- its just not for you .
We put these systems in lots of houses and when they are done right they make complicated systems very simple to use .
Most of our projects have 8-16 rooms with digital music , video networks that can put any source on any TV and simple remote controls that make the whole thing work .
It aint cheap , but done correctly you can make these systems work for competing viewpoints of husbands and wives .
Typically husbands love tech -- dont mind seeing a stack of equipment in a room and see it as a normal part of everyday life that they need 3 remotes to watch a movie .
Wives want to see the stuff disappear -- which is why you put speakers in the ceiling and have touchpads control music instead of having a stereo stack in each room you might want to listen to music in .
These systems also let you have a nice clean look in media rooms .
Most of our projects we put every piece of equipment in a server rack and control it all via RF remotes .
This lets you just put a TV over the fireplace -- or just have a plasma and in wall speakers in the family room without having to cram a bunch of stuff into a piece of furniture you didnt want in the room .
This is not for everybody -- but to our customers ease of use and aesthetics are important and they are willing to pay for them .
Now there is a DIY crowd out there trying to use home depot quality stuff and x-10 tech .
If this is all you look at , you will think the field hasnt moved in decades .
The enthusiast market is filled with incomplete solutions and hacker tech .
It may be fun to play with , but it aint wife friendly and it wont be reliable .
This group tends to get overly focused on the cost of the gear and has very high expectations of performance ( this is from my viewpoint as a professional in the space ) As a company weve stayed away from projects where people want to use x-10 level of gear .
Lastly -- and way off topic -- but there is some chatter about wifi growing up to handle these tasks .
I 'd put that at not likely with the current state of that spec .
Its fine for laptops roaming around the house , but its too unreliable for home automation where it needs to work 100 \ % of the time .
We try to have anything that needs that kind of connectivity have a dedicated ethernet or we never really trust it .
Its not all wifi 's fault -- the embedded device code for wifi that is in most touch panels and equipment in the automation space has no clue how to handle a multi channel wifi network where it might roam -- this makes it pretty bad for what most people expect of it .</tokentext>
<sentencetext>its not pointless -- its just not for you.
We put these systems in lots of houses and when they are done right they make complicated systems very simple to use.
Most of our projects have 8-16 rooms with digital music, video networks that can put any source on any TV and simple remote controls that make the whole thing work.
It aint cheap, but done correctly you can make these systems work for competing viewpoints of husbands and wives.
Typically husbands love tech -- dont mind seeing a stack of equipment in a room and see it as a normal part of everyday life that they need 3 remotes to watch a movie.
Wives want to see the stuff disappear -- which is why you put speakers in the ceiling and have touchpads control music instead of having a stereo stack in each room you might want to listen to music in.
These systems also let you have a nice clean look in media rooms.
Most of our projects we put every piece of equipment in a server rack and control it all via RF remotes.
This lets you just put a TV over the fireplace -- or just have a plasma and in wall speakers in the family room without having to cram a bunch of stuff into a piece of furniture you didnt want in the room.
This is not for everybody -- but to our customers ease of use and aesthetics are important and they are willing to pay for them.
Now there is a DIY crowd out there trying to use home depot quality stuff and x-10 tech.
If this is all you look at, you will think the field hasnt moved in decades.
The enthusiast market is filled with incomplete solutions and hacker tech.
It may be fun to play with, but it aint wife friendly and it wont be reliable.
This group tends to get overly focused on the cost of the gear and has very high expectations of performance ( this is from my viewpoint as a professional in the space )  As a company weve stayed away from projects where people want to use x-10 level of gear.
Lastly -- and way off topic -- but there is some chatter about wifi growing up to handle these tasks.
I'd put that at not likely with the current state of that spec.
Its fine for laptops roaming around the house, but its too unreliable for home automation where it needs to work 100\% of the time.
We try to have anything that needs that kind of connectivity have a dedicated ethernet or we never really trust it.
Its not all wifi's fault -- the embedded device code for wifi that is in most touch panels and equipment in the automation space has no clue how to handle a multi channel wifi network where it might roam -- this makes it pretty bad for what most people expect of it.</sentencetext>
	<parent>http://www.semanticweb.org/ontologies/ConversationInstances.owl#comment09_10_26_164226.29877107</parent>
</comment>
<comment>
	<id>http://www.semanticweb.org/ontologies/ConversationInstances.owl#comment09_10_26_164226.29876533</id>
	<title>Re:Wife 1.0</title>
	<author>mcgrew</author>
	<datestamp>1256548200000</datestamp>
	<modclass>None</modclass>
	<modscore>1</modscore>
	<htmltext><p>I had one of those, it was a pain in the ass. I finally got rid of it. maybe I'll get a different model one of these years.</p></htmltext>
<tokenext>I had one of those , it was a pain in the ass .
I finally got rid of it .
maybe I 'll get a different model one of these years .</tokentext>
<sentencetext>I had one of those, it was a pain in the ass.
I finally got rid of it.
maybe I'll get a different model one of these years.</sentencetext>
	<parent>http://www.semanticweb.org/ontologies/ConversationInstances.owl#comment09_10_26_164226.29876185</parent>
</comment>
<comment>
	<id>http://www.semanticweb.org/ontologies/ConversationInstances.owl#comment09_10_26_164226.29876635</id>
	<title>Re:Too expensive</title>
	<author>Zerth</author>
	<datestamp>1256548680000</datestamp>
	<modclass>None</modclass>
	<modscore>1</modscore>
	<htmltext><p>Cheapest?</p><p>Cheapest I'd go is to take an old spring/mercury switch thermostat and replace the switch with a USB controlled switch, get a cheap USB thermometer, plug both of those into a hub, then plug the hub into a Sheevaplug.</p><p>You can get cheaper by replacing the Sheevaplug with something embedded, like an Arduino, but I'm too lazy.</p></htmltext>
<tokenext>Cheapest ? Cheapest I 'd go is to take an old spring/mercury switch thermostat and replace the switch with a USB controlled switch , get a cheap USB thermometer , plug both of those into a hub , then plug the hub into a Sheevaplug.You can get cheaper by replacing the Sheevaplug with something embedded , like an Arduino , but I 'm too lazy .</tokentext>
<sentencetext>Cheapest?Cheapest I'd go is to take an old spring/mercury switch thermostat and replace the switch with a USB controlled switch, get a cheap USB thermometer, plug both of those into a hub, then plug the hub into a Sheevaplug.You can get cheaper by replacing the Sheevaplug with something embedded, like an Arduino, but I'm too lazy.</sentencetext>
	<parent>http://www.semanticweb.org/ontologies/ConversationInstances.owl#comment09_10_26_164226.29876389</parent>
</comment>
<comment>
	<id>http://www.semanticweb.org/ontologies/ConversationInstances.owl#comment09_10_26_164226.29876303</id>
	<title>Internet toaster 20 years ago</title>
	<author>Anonymous</author>
	<datestamp>1256590440000</datestamp>
	<modclass>None</modclass>
	<modscore>0</modscore>
	<htmltext><p>Interop in 1990: a TCP/IP controlled toaster was demonstrated:</p><p><a href="http://www.livinginternet.com/i/ia\_myths\_toast.htm" title="livinginternet.com" rel="nofollow">http://www.livinginternet.com/i/ia\_myths\_toast.htm</a> [livinginternet.com]</p><p>And in 1991, a robotic arm was built to insert the toast, again using TCP/IP commands.</p></htmltext>
<tokenext>Interop in 1990 : a TCP/IP controlled toaster was demonstrated : http : //www.livinginternet.com/i/ia \ _myths \ _toast.htm [ livinginternet.com ] And in 1991 , a robotic arm was built to insert the toast , again using TCP/IP commands .</tokentext>
<sentencetext>Interop in 1990: a TCP/IP controlled toaster was demonstrated:http://www.livinginternet.com/i/ia\_myths\_toast.htm [livinginternet.com]And in 1991, a robotic arm was built to insert the toast, again using TCP/IP commands.</sentencetext>
</comment>
<comment>
	<id>http://www.semanticweb.org/ontologies/ConversationInstances.owl#comment09_10_26_164226.29880517</id>
	<title>Re:Welcome to my money pit!</title>
	<author>Anonymous</author>
	<datestamp>1256574420000</datestamp>
	<modclass>None</modclass>
	<modscore>0</modscore>
	<htmltext><p>I own a automated home. My home setup isn't the most advanced setup in the world.... but it isn't that far behind ether.</p><p>I fail to see any use for (linux or any other) open source software for this use. The investment required for automation (or even a house) is far greater than the cost of a used XP Box. Don't get me wrong... it's fine if you like to write code... but this hobbie really won't give you the chance to write the code you think it might.</p><p>I use an old XP, P3 dust collector of a computer to run X10 (ActiveHomePro, from X10.com) software and a small user created software (Bill's Voice Commander http://www.wgjohns.com/bvc.htm) to voice control my system. I've created a Fan Site to help spread the word about BVC (http://www.davesdomainonline.com/bvc/bvc.htm). I've also created some YouTube Videos about Home Automation (http://www.youtube.com/suitmanIM).</p><p>You can read my posts at the automation forums also.</p></htmltext>
<tokenext>I own a automated home .
My home setup is n't the most advanced setup in the world.... but it is n't that far behind ether.I fail to see any use for ( linux or any other ) open source software for this use .
The investment required for automation ( or even a house ) is far greater than the cost of a used XP Box .
Do n't get me wrong... it 's fine if you like to write code... but this hobbie really wo n't give you the chance to write the code you think it might.I use an old XP , P3 dust collector of a computer to run X10 ( ActiveHomePro , from X10.com ) software and a small user created software ( Bill 's Voice Commander http : //www.wgjohns.com/bvc.htm ) to voice control my system .
I 've created a Fan Site to help spread the word about BVC ( http : //www.davesdomainonline.com/bvc/bvc.htm ) .
I 've also created some YouTube Videos about Home Automation ( http : //www.youtube.com/suitmanIM ) .You can read my posts at the automation forums also .</tokentext>
<sentencetext>I own a automated home.
My home setup isn't the most advanced setup in the world.... but it isn't that far behind ether.I fail to see any use for (linux or any other) open source software for this use.
The investment required for automation (or even a house) is far greater than the cost of a used XP Box.
Don't get me wrong... it's fine if you like to write code... but this hobbie really won't give you the chance to write the code you think it might.I use an old XP, P3 dust collector of a computer to run X10 (ActiveHomePro, from X10.com) software and a small user created software (Bill's Voice Commander http://www.wgjohns.com/bvc.htm) to voice control my system.
I've created a Fan Site to help spread the word about BVC (http://www.davesdomainonline.com/bvc/bvc.htm).
I've also created some YouTube Videos about Home Automation (http://www.youtube.com/suitmanIM).You can read my posts at the automation forums also.</sentencetext>
	<parent>http://www.semanticweb.org/ontologies/ConversationInstances.owl#comment09_10_26_164226.29877425</parent>
</comment>
<comment>
	<id>http://www.semanticweb.org/ontologies/ConversationInstances.owl#comment09_10_26_164226.29878317</id>
	<title>Mawson Lakes (South Australia)</title>
	<author>Anonymous</author>
	<datestamp>1256555460000</datestamp>
	<modclass>None</modclass>
	<modscore>0</modscore>
	<htmltext><p>I attended a talk by the (then) president of a residents' association at the Subj residential development (developer: Delfin) - squeezed between Uni SA's Mawson Lakes (formerly: Levels) Campus &amp; the (then floundering attempt to encourage a) Technology Park.</p><p>The word was that Home Automation over Internet (HAoI - my name for it, not his) was REQUIRED by an encumberance - on each land-parcel owner's deed.</p><p>In practice, this requirement translated into an INCREASE of the construction cost of the house ( $20,000 ), eg, arising from the installation of sensors, control unit &amp; Internet interface.</p><p>As it was a technical group, that had organised the talk, we were shown lots of system diagrams, as well as some of the control devices' &amp; remote control software's screens. To be honest, these were hardly impressive.</p><p>The suggestion that there was (then) a SOLE SOURCE for the installed HAoI gear made me guess that - just maybe - some insider had to be making a killing on the required extras.</p><p>We were given to understand that most residents objected VIGOROUSLY to the extra costs - for the required installation &amp; (for any who wished to actually use the system) costly Internet service, needed to remotely control the few functions that could (then) be controlled.</p><p>Many owners (then and/or later) bought &amp; built HUGE homes (so, one might think that a remote control heating/cooling system might help them to reduce energy costs), that are now used as cheap boarding houses, for the many overseas students who attend Uni SA's Mawson campus.</p><p>In fact, some homes have modified [unlawfully &amp; even without finishing the carpentry work, ie, beyond the point at which rooms are rented by students (particularly, newcomers, before they have a chance to find more suitable housing at about the same cost, elsewhere) from Bangladesh, China, India, Sri Lanka, etc.] by DIY owners or their carpenters, to enable them to squeeze, eg, 3 boarding rooms into what were to be family rooms, kitchens and/or master bedrooms; single bedrooms are similarly modified into multiple rooms, and these might be provided with bunk-beds, to increase the rental income.</p><p>One is reminded of housing provided by Chinese sweat-shop dormitories, with several workers squeezed into tiny spaces, with this overcrowding leading to smoke (from cooking fires) being breathed by the occupants, just as it would be by those students living beside beside the kitchens, in the crowded boarding houses at Mawson Lakes.</p><p>Dodgy landlords, who run such boarding houses tend not to have computers or Internet, let alone the interest in learning how to use dimly designed remote control systems (even though we might see some energy-saving advantage to their doing so, over time); instead, they may simply claim - a priori - that their tenants have used "too much" water, for example, and impose fees for the purported excess usage, just as they with hold bond money, reportedly for "carpet cleaning" without actually doing any carpet cleaning for years.</p><p>Of course, some of these houses may have been purchased from disenchanted original owners (eg, after interest rises made that extra $20,000 house cost impact their family budgets even harder) and have no great reason to look into their houses' remote control systems.</p><p>In sum, when developers of such residential developments IMPOSE a "one-size fits all" Home Automation system on uninterested &amp; unwilling buyers, on a take-it-or-leave-it basis, nobody wins but the single-source HA system supplier (and, presumably the developers).</p><p>I got the impression that - in the case of Mawson Lakes - lawyers might also have won a bit, ie, as land owners tried to workaround the encumberance's consequential $20,000 higher house costs, especially, after they saw &amp; heard back from earlier waves of home owners there. Most (reportedly) gave up, as had that resident's organisation.</p><p>As I recall, our speaker wasn't aware of any greater energy savings - ie, beyond what might be expected from</p></htmltext>
<tokenext>I attended a talk by the ( then ) president of a residents ' association at the Subj residential development ( developer : Delfin ) - squeezed between Uni SA 's Mawson Lakes ( formerly : Levels ) Campus &amp; the ( then floundering attempt to encourage a ) Technology Park.The word was that Home Automation over Internet ( HAoI - my name for it , not his ) was REQUIRED by an encumberance - on each land-parcel owner 's deed.In practice , this requirement translated into an INCREASE of the construction cost of the house ( $ 20,000 ) , eg , arising from the installation of sensors , control unit &amp; Internet interface.As it was a technical group , that had organised the talk , we were shown lots of system diagrams , as well as some of the control devices ' &amp; remote control software 's screens .
To be honest , these were hardly impressive.The suggestion that there was ( then ) a SOLE SOURCE for the installed HAoI gear made me guess that - just maybe - some insider had to be making a killing on the required extras.We were given to understand that most residents objected VIGOROUSLY to the extra costs - for the required installation &amp; ( for any who wished to actually use the system ) costly Internet service , needed to remotely control the few functions that could ( then ) be controlled.Many owners ( then and/or later ) bought &amp; built HUGE homes ( so , one might think that a remote control heating/cooling system might help them to reduce energy costs ) , that are now used as cheap boarding houses , for the many overseas students who attend Uni SA 's Mawson campus.In fact , some homes have modified [ unlawfully &amp; even without finishing the carpentry work , ie , beyond the point at which rooms are rented by students ( particularly , newcomers , before they have a chance to find more suitable housing at about the same cost , elsewhere ) from Bangladesh , China , India , Sri Lanka , etc .
] by DIY owners or their carpenters , to enable them to squeeze , eg , 3 boarding rooms into what were to be family rooms , kitchens and/or master bedrooms ; single bedrooms are similarly modified into multiple rooms , and these might be provided with bunk-beds , to increase the rental income.One is reminded of housing provided by Chinese sweat-shop dormitories , with several workers squeezed into tiny spaces , with this overcrowding leading to smoke ( from cooking fires ) being breathed by the occupants , just as it would be by those students living beside beside the kitchens , in the crowded boarding houses at Mawson Lakes.Dodgy landlords , who run such boarding houses tend not to have computers or Internet , let alone the interest in learning how to use dimly designed remote control systems ( even though we might see some energy-saving advantage to their doing so , over time ) ; instead , they may simply claim - a priori - that their tenants have used " too much " water , for example , and impose fees for the purported excess usage , just as they with hold bond money , reportedly for " carpet cleaning " without actually doing any carpet cleaning for years.Of course , some of these houses may have been purchased from disenchanted original owners ( eg , after interest rises made that extra $ 20,000 house cost impact their family budgets even harder ) and have no great reason to look into their houses ' remote control systems.In sum , when developers of such residential developments IMPOSE a " one-size fits all " Home Automation system on uninterested &amp; unwilling buyers , on a take-it-or-leave-it basis , nobody wins but the single-source HA system supplier ( and , presumably the developers ) .I got the impression that - in the case of Mawson Lakes - lawyers might also have won a bit , ie , as land owners tried to workaround the encumberance 's consequential $ 20,000 higher house costs , especially , after they saw &amp; heard back from earlier waves of home owners there .
Most ( reportedly ) gave up , as had that resident 's organisation.As I recall , our speaker was n't aware of any greater energy savings - ie , beyond what might be expected from</tokentext>
<sentencetext>I attended a talk by the (then) president of a residents' association at the Subj residential development (developer: Delfin) - squeezed between Uni SA's Mawson Lakes (formerly: Levels) Campus &amp; the (then floundering attempt to encourage a) Technology Park.The word was that Home Automation over Internet (HAoI - my name for it, not his) was REQUIRED by an encumberance - on each land-parcel owner's deed.In practice, this requirement translated into an INCREASE of the construction cost of the house ( $20,000 ), eg, arising from the installation of sensors, control unit &amp; Internet interface.As it was a technical group, that had organised the talk, we were shown lots of system diagrams, as well as some of the control devices' &amp; remote control software's screens.
To be honest, these were hardly impressive.The suggestion that there was (then) a SOLE SOURCE for the installed HAoI gear made me guess that - just maybe - some insider had to be making a killing on the required extras.We were given to understand that most residents objected VIGOROUSLY to the extra costs - for the required installation &amp; (for any who wished to actually use the system) costly Internet service, needed to remotely control the few functions that could (then) be controlled.Many owners (then and/or later) bought &amp; built HUGE homes (so, one might think that a remote control heating/cooling system might help them to reduce energy costs), that are now used as cheap boarding houses, for the many overseas students who attend Uni SA's Mawson campus.In fact, some homes have modified [unlawfully &amp; even without finishing the carpentry work, ie, beyond the point at which rooms are rented by students (particularly, newcomers, before they have a chance to find more suitable housing at about the same cost, elsewhere) from Bangladesh, China, India, Sri Lanka, etc.
] by DIY owners or their carpenters, to enable them to squeeze, eg, 3 boarding rooms into what were to be family rooms, kitchens and/or master bedrooms; single bedrooms are similarly modified into multiple rooms, and these might be provided with bunk-beds, to increase the rental income.One is reminded of housing provided by Chinese sweat-shop dormitories, with several workers squeezed into tiny spaces, with this overcrowding leading to smoke (from cooking fires) being breathed by the occupants, just as it would be by those students living beside beside the kitchens, in the crowded boarding houses at Mawson Lakes.Dodgy landlords, who run such boarding houses tend not to have computers or Internet, let alone the interest in learning how to use dimly designed remote control systems (even though we might see some energy-saving advantage to their doing so, over time); instead, they may simply claim - a priori - that their tenants have used "too much" water, for example, and impose fees for the purported excess usage, just as they with hold bond money, reportedly for "carpet cleaning" without actually doing any carpet cleaning for years.Of course, some of these houses may have been purchased from disenchanted original owners (eg, after interest rises made that extra $20,000 house cost impact their family budgets even harder) and have no great reason to look into their houses' remote control systems.In sum, when developers of such residential developments IMPOSE a "one-size fits all" Home Automation system on uninterested &amp; unwilling buyers, on a take-it-or-leave-it basis, nobody wins but the single-source HA system supplier (and, presumably the developers).I got the impression that - in the case of Mawson Lakes - lawyers might also have won a bit, ie, as land owners tried to workaround the encumberance's consequential $20,000 higher house costs, especially, after they saw &amp; heard back from earlier waves of home owners there.
Most (reportedly) gave up, as had that resident's organisation.As I recall, our speaker wasn't aware of any greater energy savings - ie, beyond what might be expected from</sentencetext>
</comment>
<comment>
	<id>http://www.semanticweb.org/ontologies/ConversationInstances.owl#comment09_10_26_164226.29880599</id>
	<title>Re:What do you want home automation for?</title>
	<author>Dare nMc</author>
	<datestamp>1256575800000</datestamp>
	<modclass>None</modclass>
	<modscore>1</modscore>
	<htmltext><p>power, and water would be my desired benefits.  Some data acquisition to know quickly if time of use electric is working (cheaper power at night, more cost during day).  I now have a solar water heater, if it's sunny I would like the dishwasher, and clothes washer to run, but with daytime power at a higher rate, the solar heater better be at temperature first.  Ability to analyze if small habit changes reduce the bill (best shower time)<br>Also I am 100\% electric, with a heat pump for heat/cool in a dry climate.  I would like a system that knows inside temperature, outside temperature/humidty, electric rate, habitation status, and weather forecast.  Run a fan to bring in cool air, turn on mister next to AC unit outside cooler if running in low humidity, wait 10 minutes to turn on if electric rate is about to change, but not 90 minutes if temperatures rising...  My old water heater works, but is also the solar storage tank, with a on-demand after.  It would be nice to easily be able to set some plans entered easily.  IE if a shower is planned for 8am (after electric rates increase) it would be good to turn on the old water heater, if solar water is spent, but that would be wasted if no shower, and solar heat becomes available.  Also to know if a extra solar tank would be a bigger return, or a bigger panel is needed.<br>I can setup and buy the loggers from Omega for a few hundred.  Water valves are within my ability.  Using relays for the washer/ dryer is not too bad, water heater rely is pricey (220v 25A), the software, and a decent touch screen interface is a bit more of a commitment than I want at this time.</p></htmltext>
<tokenext>power , and water would be my desired benefits .
Some data acquisition to know quickly if time of use electric is working ( cheaper power at night , more cost during day ) .
I now have a solar water heater , if it 's sunny I would like the dishwasher , and clothes washer to run , but with daytime power at a higher rate , the solar heater better be at temperature first .
Ability to analyze if small habit changes reduce the bill ( best shower time ) Also I am 100 \ % electric , with a heat pump for heat/cool in a dry climate .
I would like a system that knows inside temperature , outside temperature/humidty , electric rate , habitation status , and weather forecast .
Run a fan to bring in cool air , turn on mister next to AC unit outside cooler if running in low humidity , wait 10 minutes to turn on if electric rate is about to change , but not 90 minutes if temperatures rising... My old water heater works , but is also the solar storage tank , with a on-demand after .
It would be nice to easily be able to set some plans entered easily .
IE if a shower is planned for 8am ( after electric rates increase ) it would be good to turn on the old water heater , if solar water is spent , but that would be wasted if no shower , and solar heat becomes available .
Also to know if a extra solar tank would be a bigger return , or a bigger panel is needed.I can setup and buy the loggers from Omega for a few hundred .
Water valves are within my ability .
Using relays for the washer/ dryer is not too bad , water heater rely is pricey ( 220v 25A ) , the software , and a decent touch screen interface is a bit more of a commitment than I want at this time .</tokentext>
<sentencetext>power, and water would be my desired benefits.
Some data acquisition to know quickly if time of use electric is working (cheaper power at night, more cost during day).
I now have a solar water heater, if it's sunny I would like the dishwasher, and clothes washer to run, but with daytime power at a higher rate, the solar heater better be at temperature first.
Ability to analyze if small habit changes reduce the bill (best shower time)Also I am 100\% electric, with a heat pump for heat/cool in a dry climate.
I would like a system that knows inside temperature, outside temperature/humidty, electric rate, habitation status, and weather forecast.
Run a fan to bring in cool air, turn on mister next to AC unit outside cooler if running in low humidity, wait 10 minutes to turn on if electric rate is about to change, but not 90 minutes if temperatures rising...  My old water heater works, but is also the solar storage tank, with a on-demand after.
It would be nice to easily be able to set some plans entered easily.
IE if a shower is planned for 8am (after electric rates increase) it would be good to turn on the old water heater, if solar water is spent, but that would be wasted if no shower, and solar heat becomes available.
Also to know if a extra solar tank would be a bigger return, or a bigger panel is needed.I can setup and buy the loggers from Omega for a few hundred.
Water valves are within my ability.
Using relays for the washer/ dryer is not too bad, water heater rely is pricey (220v 25A), the software, and a decent touch screen interface is a bit more of a commitment than I want at this time.</sentencetext>
	<parent>http://www.semanticweb.org/ontologies/ConversationInstances.owl#comment09_10_26_164226.29876453</parent>
</comment>
<comment>
	<id>http://www.semanticweb.org/ontologies/ConversationInstances.owl#comment09_10_26_164226.29876557</id>
	<title>it's not great</title>
	<author>digitalsushi</author>
	<datestamp>1256548380000</datestamp>
	<modclass>None</modclass>
	<modscore>1</modscore>
	<htmltext><p>i use an x10 wireless control module, an rs232 firecracker, and a few lamp modules to control my non-drug-related plant lights to extend their photoperiod (keeps them from going dormant through the long-night new england winters).  ubuntu packages the bottlerocket kit as the 'br' binary, and it works pretty well.  10 bucks per outlet to control something like 256 devices.  the latency is crap.  if i could control two outlets simultaneously, i could make my cool traffic light work.  instead, i must suffer through learning how to program my little pic 16f690 to do this.  it's way too much overhead to do something so stupid/useless.</p><p>so basically i think it's junk right now.</p></htmltext>
<tokenext>i use an x10 wireless control module , an rs232 firecracker , and a few lamp modules to control my non-drug-related plant lights to extend their photoperiod ( keeps them from going dormant through the long-night new england winters ) .
ubuntu packages the bottlerocket kit as the 'br ' binary , and it works pretty well .
10 bucks per outlet to control something like 256 devices .
the latency is crap .
if i could control two outlets simultaneously , i could make my cool traffic light work .
instead , i must suffer through learning how to program my little pic 16f690 to do this .
it 's way too much overhead to do something so stupid/useless.so basically i think it 's junk right now .</tokentext>
<sentencetext>i use an x10 wireless control module, an rs232 firecracker, and a few lamp modules to control my non-drug-related plant lights to extend their photoperiod (keeps them from going dormant through the long-night new england winters).
ubuntu packages the bottlerocket kit as the 'br' binary, and it works pretty well.
10 bucks per outlet to control something like 256 devices.
the latency is crap.
if i could control two outlets simultaneously, i could make my cool traffic light work.
instead, i must suffer through learning how to program my little pic 16f690 to do this.
it's way too much overhead to do something so stupid/useless.so basically i think it's junk right now.</sentencetext>
</comment>
<comment>
	<id>http://www.semanticweb.org/ontologies/ConversationInstances.owl#comment09_10_26_164226.29881159</id>
	<title>Re:Doing it wrong</title>
	<author>Anonymous</author>
	<datestamp>1256585040000</datestamp>
	<modclass>None</modclass>
	<modscore>0</modscore>
	<htmltext><blockquote><div><p>Look, it's pretty obvious that you have NEVER cooked anything. If you're cooking YOU'RE IN THE DAMNED KITCHEN! Why in hell would you want to access your kitchen appliances from a telephone or a videogame?</p></div></blockquote><p>It's pretty obvious you've got a limited imagination.  If you're heating some bread (toaster oven), some vegetables or rice or such (microwave or stove), and broiling or baking (oven) at the same time, you want to be able to coordinate the timers on them, and check their temperatures (especially if pre-heating the oven, etc.) to make stuff come out at the same time.  Or if you're sitting down eating for a formal meal (eg, Thanksgiving) and want coffee and desert after, you can wait and start the coffee toward the end of the meal from your phone, or microwave the chocolate sauce for the dessert.</p><p>I'm the AC that posted, and I really didn't think this needed explanation, but judging from the multitude of replies to you I was wrong.  There are plenty of other coordination uses too: updating grocery lists, checking expirations against recipes... the possibilities are pretty limitless.</p></div>
	</htmltext>
<tokenext>Look , it 's pretty obvious that you have NEVER cooked anything .
If you 're cooking YOU 'RE IN THE DAMNED KITCHEN !
Why in hell would you want to access your kitchen appliances from a telephone or a videogame ? It 's pretty obvious you 've got a limited imagination .
If you 're heating some bread ( toaster oven ) , some vegetables or rice or such ( microwave or stove ) , and broiling or baking ( oven ) at the same time , you want to be able to coordinate the timers on them , and check their temperatures ( especially if pre-heating the oven , etc .
) to make stuff come out at the same time .
Or if you 're sitting down eating for a formal meal ( eg , Thanksgiving ) and want coffee and desert after , you can wait and start the coffee toward the end of the meal from your phone , or microwave the chocolate sauce for the dessert.I 'm the AC that posted , and I really did n't think this needed explanation , but judging from the multitude of replies to you I was wrong .
There are plenty of other coordination uses too : updating grocery lists , checking expirations against recipes... the possibilities are pretty limitless .</tokentext>
<sentencetext>Look, it's pretty obvious that you have NEVER cooked anything.
If you're cooking YOU'RE IN THE DAMNED KITCHEN!
Why in hell would you want to access your kitchen appliances from a telephone or a videogame?It's pretty obvious you've got a limited imagination.
If you're heating some bread (toaster oven), some vegetables or rice or such (microwave or stove), and broiling or baking (oven) at the same time, you want to be able to coordinate the timers on them, and check their temperatures (especially if pre-heating the oven, etc.
) to make stuff come out at the same time.
Or if you're sitting down eating for a formal meal (eg, Thanksgiving) and want coffee and desert after, you can wait and start the coffee toward the end of the meal from your phone, or microwave the chocolate sauce for the dessert.I'm the AC that posted, and I really didn't think this needed explanation, but judging from the multitude of replies to you I was wrong.
There are plenty of other coordination uses too: updating grocery lists, checking expirations against recipes... the possibilities are pretty limitless.
	</sentencetext>
	<parent>http://www.semanticweb.org/ontologies/ConversationInstances.owl#comment09_10_26_164226.29876757</parent>
</comment>
<comment>
	<id>http://www.semanticweb.org/ontologies/ConversationInstances.owl#comment09_10_26_164226.29876403</id>
	<title>Either you get one of two things...</title>
	<author>HerculesMO</author>
	<datestamp>1256547660000</datestamp>
	<modclass>Interestin</modclass>
	<modscore>2</modscore>
	<htmltext><p>You can either automate your home the way you want to and use the best tool for the job, or you can bash your head against the wall and try to use open source stuff that pales in comparison.</p><p>I use my computer as a tool, it's not a religion, so I'll use what works best.</p><p>If you're trying to make a case study about how Linux can automate your home -- have at it.</p><p>I prefer actually getting the job done.</p></htmltext>
<tokenext>You can either automate your home the way you want to and use the best tool for the job , or you can bash your head against the wall and try to use open source stuff that pales in comparison.I use my computer as a tool , it 's not a religion , so I 'll use what works best.If you 're trying to make a case study about how Linux can automate your home -- have at it.I prefer actually getting the job done .</tokentext>
<sentencetext>You can either automate your home the way you want to and use the best tool for the job, or you can bash your head against the wall and try to use open source stuff that pales in comparison.I use my computer as a tool, it's not a religion, so I'll use what works best.If you're trying to make a case study about how Linux can automate your home -- have at it.I prefer actually getting the job done.</sentencetext>
</comment>
<comment>
	<id>http://www.semanticweb.org/ontologies/ConversationInstances.owl#comment09_10_26_164226.29876509</id>
	<title>HA is actually easy as DIY</title>
	<author>Anonymous</author>
	<datestamp>1256548140000</datestamp>
	<modclass>None</modclass>
	<modscore>0</modscore>
	<htmltext><p>There are two home automation discussions on my forum that will have a ton of info for you, assuming you want to do it yourself:</p><p>http://www.societyofrobots.com/robotforum/index.php?topic=4668.0</p><p>http://www.societyofrobots.com/robotforum/index.php?topic=5511.msg42433#msg42433</p></htmltext>
<tokenext>There are two home automation discussions on my forum that will have a ton of info for you , assuming you want to do it yourself : http : //www.societyofrobots.com/robotforum/index.php ? topic = 4668.0http : //www.societyofrobots.com/robotforum/index.php ? topic = 5511.msg42433 # msg42433</tokentext>
<sentencetext>There are two home automation discussions on my forum that will have a ton of info for you, assuming you want to do it yourself:http://www.societyofrobots.com/robotforum/index.php?topic=4668.0http://www.societyofrobots.com/robotforum/index.php?topic=5511.msg42433#msg42433</sentencetext>
</comment>
<comment>
	<id>http://www.semanticweb.org/ontologies/ConversationInstances.owl#comment09_10_26_164226.29876567</id>
	<title>green meters for electric</title>
	<author>Dan667</author>
	<datestamp>1256548440000</datestamp>
	<modclass>None</modclass>
	<modscore>1</modscore>
	<htmltext>I see this as a gating technology.  As more get installed and you can see your electricity usage from the web, etc I bet there are more projects that take advantage of it or expand it to other areas of the house.</htmltext>
<tokenext>I see this as a gating technology .
As more get installed and you can see your electricity usage from the web , etc I bet there are more projects that take advantage of it or expand it to other areas of the house .</tokentext>
<sentencetext>I see this as a gating technology.
As more get installed and you can see your electricity usage from the web, etc I bet there are more projects that take advantage of it or expand it to other areas of the house.</sentencetext>
</comment>
<comment>
	<id>http://www.semanticweb.org/ontologies/ConversationInstances.owl#comment09_10_26_164226.29877349</id>
	<title>Smart Grid and home automation - have your say</title>
	<author>Nefarious Wheel</author>
	<datestamp>1256551260000</datestamp>
	<modclass>Interestin</modclass>
	<modscore>4</modscore>
	<htmltext><p><div class="quote"></div><p>I just completed work on a major study around Smart Grids and there's a window of opportunity for home automation coming up from that direction.  One of the initiatives the power companies are discussing will involve tools to let you not only see your house's power consumption on a circuit-by-circuit basis, but are meant to allow you to more directly control the electrical appliances in the home, remotely via the Internet.  (It gives them better usage information too, which cuts the cost of power - they typically oversupply by 100\% to handle peaks).</p><p>The way to influence what capabilities these things will have (and to voice any concerns you have over security etc.) is to find the email address of your local power company and send them your <i>questions</i>. Questions get a lot more air play than suggested solutions, but if you're careful about how you couch the questions you can steer them in the direction you want.  I'd suggest a few like:</p><p>Q: What does "smart grid" mean and how will it relate to me?" - you'll get boilerplate response on this one, but it will flag your letter to the C-levels who are currently tracking this stuff hard. </p><p>Q: What sort of control over my usage will this give me? Can I control my house this way?</p><p>Q: How secure will it be?  Would others be able to hack into my house and turn off my fridge?</p><p>Et very cetra.  Make up your own.  They won't really have any answers yet, because they're all very early on in the investment / infrastructure refresh cycle,  but if you ask the questions you want them to answer and consider your needs and interests in them, you will get heard - this is that part of the build cycle where they're actually listening.  Use your voice now while it counts.  You might even get some nifty gear for effectively free, and it might be the stuff you want.  And if enough of you ask for it, yes, it will run Linux.</p></div>
	</htmltext>
<tokenext>I just completed work on a major study around Smart Grids and there 's a window of opportunity for home automation coming up from that direction .
One of the initiatives the power companies are discussing will involve tools to let you not only see your house 's power consumption on a circuit-by-circuit basis , but are meant to allow you to more directly control the electrical appliances in the home , remotely via the Internet .
( It gives them better usage information too , which cuts the cost of power - they typically oversupply by 100 \ % to handle peaks ) .The way to influence what capabilities these things will have ( and to voice any concerns you have over security etc .
) is to find the email address of your local power company and send them your questions .
Questions get a lot more air play than suggested solutions , but if you 're careful about how you couch the questions you can steer them in the direction you want .
I 'd suggest a few like : Q : What does " smart grid " mean and how will it relate to me ?
" - you 'll get boilerplate response on this one , but it will flag your letter to the C-levels who are currently tracking this stuff hard .
Q : What sort of control over my usage will this give me ?
Can I control my house this way ? Q : How secure will it be ?
Would others be able to hack into my house and turn off my fridge ? Et very cetra .
Make up your own .
They wo n't really have any answers yet , because they 're all very early on in the investment / infrastructure refresh cycle , but if you ask the questions you want them to answer and consider your needs and interests in them , you will get heard - this is that part of the build cycle where they 're actually listening .
Use your voice now while it counts .
You might even get some nifty gear for effectively free , and it might be the stuff you want .
And if enough of you ask for it , yes , it will run Linux .</tokentext>
<sentencetext>I just completed work on a major study around Smart Grids and there's a window of opportunity for home automation coming up from that direction.
One of the initiatives the power companies are discussing will involve tools to let you not only see your house's power consumption on a circuit-by-circuit basis, but are meant to allow you to more directly control the electrical appliances in the home, remotely via the Internet.
(It gives them better usage information too, which cuts the cost of power - they typically oversupply by 100\% to handle peaks).The way to influence what capabilities these things will have (and to voice any concerns you have over security etc.
) is to find the email address of your local power company and send them your questions.
Questions get a lot more air play than suggested solutions, but if you're careful about how you couch the questions you can steer them in the direction you want.
I'd suggest a few like:Q: What does "smart grid" mean and how will it relate to me?
" - you'll get boilerplate response on this one, but it will flag your letter to the C-levels who are currently tracking this stuff hard.
Q: What sort of control over my usage will this give me?
Can I control my house this way?Q: How secure will it be?
Would others be able to hack into my house and turn off my fridge?Et very cetra.
Make up your own.
They won't really have any answers yet, because they're all very early on in the investment / infrastructure refresh cycle,  but if you ask the questions you want them to answer and consider your needs and interests in them, you will get heard - this is that part of the build cycle where they're actually listening.
Use your voice now while it counts.
You might even get some nifty gear for effectively free, and it might be the stuff you want.
And if enough of you ask for it, yes, it will run Linux.
	</sentencetext>
	<parent>http://www.semanticweb.org/ontologies/ConversationInstances.owl#comment09_10_26_164226.29876157</parent>
</comment>
<comment>
	<id>http://www.semanticweb.org/ontologies/ConversationInstances.owl#comment09_10_26_164226.29876413</id>
	<title>Re:Good luck</title>
	<author>Anonymous</author>
	<datestamp>1256547720000</datestamp>
	<modclass>None</modclass>
	<modscore>1</modscore>
	<htmltext>Sounds like you're describing Crestron since all the functionality you mention you can find in a Crestron home or office. The owner of the company I work for is all about it even though it's overpriced crap. I think you're right about why it hasn't taken off though, that licensing has kept it all prohibitively expensive but more importantly if the power goes out living in your house is miserable and the robotics break a lot. When the quality and logistics get worked out better you'll find it in more homes.</htmltext>
<tokenext>Sounds like you 're describing Crestron since all the functionality you mention you can find in a Crestron home or office .
The owner of the company I work for is all about it even though it 's overpriced crap .
I think you 're right about why it has n't taken off though , that licensing has kept it all prohibitively expensive but more importantly if the power goes out living in your house is miserable and the robotics break a lot .
When the quality and logistics get worked out better you 'll find it in more homes .</tokentext>
<sentencetext>Sounds like you're describing Crestron since all the functionality you mention you can find in a Crestron home or office.
The owner of the company I work for is all about it even though it's overpriced crap.
I think you're right about why it hasn't taken off though, that licensing has kept it all prohibitively expensive but more importantly if the power goes out living in your house is miserable and the robotics break a lot.
When the quality and logistics get worked out better you'll find it in more homes.</sentencetext>
	<parent>http://www.semanticweb.org/ontologies/ConversationInstances.owl#comment09_10_26_164226.29876267</parent>
</comment>
<comment>
	<id>http://www.semanticweb.org/ontologies/ConversationInstances.owl#comment09_10_26_164226.29877071</id>
	<title>$2000 in and counting</title>
	<author>CompressedAir</author>
	<datestamp>1256550240000</datestamp>
	<modclass>Informativ</modclass>
	<modscore>4</modscore>
	<htmltext><p>I have been automating my home for some time now, and I hope I can give you some perspective on the process.</p><p>Modern (as in, not X10) home automation hardware comes with a steep cost of entry. For my chosen flavor  (Insteon), you have to buy $60 worth of phase couplers / wireless receivers and a $80 powerline - computer interface before you can even start adding wall switches. So, unless you are just wildly flush with cash, there usually has to be a need as well as the want to get started.</p><p>For me, my house is wired to that the driveway light switch are out in the detached garage. This was very irritating. By replacing the switch in the garage and the switch by the back door of the house with Insteon switches, I can now turn on the driveway lights from within the house. Cheaper than hiring an electrician to re-wire the switches.</p><p>Once the initial hurdle is passed, you can do all sorts of things quickly and easily. Such as:</p><p>1. I added a wireless switch at knee level so my 2-year old can turn on the light in her room. She LOVES this. A motion sensor turns the light off 15 minutes after she leaves. When she's older I'll set it up so she turns the light off, but I didn't want her flashing the lights on/off/on/off for an hour.<br>2. The wall switch in the living room can also start/stop music playing, as well as control the volume and change songs.<br>3. Using some ir-controlled home made window blind controllers I built, the blinds on the first floor of the house are controlled by the computer. Most notably, it shuts them when the sun goes down, so I don't have to worry about people seeing into the house after dark. I got real used to that real fast, let me tell ya.<br>4. I've put together a "Baby Monitor of the Gods" that sends video (with sound) from an old DV camcorder to any screen in the house (mostly old laptops running Damn Small Linux loaded into RAM, but also either of the TVs). In the workout room the video comes up on the picture-in-picture, so my wife can see the baby sleeping while she exercises. Very popular feature, that.<br>5. The library did not have a wall switch. Now it does. (It turns on the lamps.)<br>6. I'm leaving out the basic stuff, such as being able to control a light across the house from the bedroom. Very nice when you are getting ready for bed.<br>7. Everything is also controllable from our iPhones.<br>8. Next up is door locks, and after that probably HVAC. Part of me really wants to do computer controlled zoned HVAC, but the other part hates working in the attic. Choices, choices.</p><p>All of this runs from a Mac Cube running Indigo. I cannot say enough good things about Indigo, it is one truly great piece of home automation software.</p><p>So to sum up, the state of home automation is fantastic. With the relay control modules, you can control just about anything. Add IR control to that and there's not much left beyond your reach. Blind and drapes control is very expensive to buy off the shelf for some reason, but building your own is easy enough.</p><p>Good luck (and keep count of how many times you mix up the load and line wires)!</p><p>Brian</p></htmltext>
<tokenext>I have been automating my home for some time now , and I hope I can give you some perspective on the process.Modern ( as in , not X10 ) home automation hardware comes with a steep cost of entry .
For my chosen flavor ( Insteon ) , you have to buy $ 60 worth of phase couplers / wireless receivers and a $ 80 powerline - computer interface before you can even start adding wall switches .
So , unless you are just wildly flush with cash , there usually has to be a need as well as the want to get started.For me , my house is wired to that the driveway light switch are out in the detached garage .
This was very irritating .
By replacing the switch in the garage and the switch by the back door of the house with Insteon switches , I can now turn on the driveway lights from within the house .
Cheaper than hiring an electrician to re-wire the switches.Once the initial hurdle is passed , you can do all sorts of things quickly and easily .
Such as : 1 .
I added a wireless switch at knee level so my 2-year old can turn on the light in her room .
She LOVES this .
A motion sensor turns the light off 15 minutes after she leaves .
When she 's older I 'll set it up so she turns the light off , but I did n't want her flashing the lights on/off/on/off for an hour.2 .
The wall switch in the living room can also start/stop music playing , as well as control the volume and change songs.3 .
Using some ir-controlled home made window blind controllers I built , the blinds on the first floor of the house are controlled by the computer .
Most notably , it shuts them when the sun goes down , so I do n't have to worry about people seeing into the house after dark .
I got real used to that real fast , let me tell ya.4 .
I 've put together a " Baby Monitor of the Gods " that sends video ( with sound ) from an old DV camcorder to any screen in the house ( mostly old laptops running Damn Small Linux loaded into RAM , but also either of the TVs ) .
In the workout room the video comes up on the picture-in-picture , so my wife can see the baby sleeping while she exercises .
Very popular feature , that.5 .
The library did not have a wall switch .
Now it does .
( It turns on the lamps. ) 6 .
I 'm leaving out the basic stuff , such as being able to control a light across the house from the bedroom .
Very nice when you are getting ready for bed.7 .
Everything is also controllable from our iPhones.8 .
Next up is door locks , and after that probably HVAC .
Part of me really wants to do computer controlled zoned HVAC , but the other part hates working in the attic .
Choices , choices.All of this runs from a Mac Cube running Indigo .
I can not say enough good things about Indigo , it is one truly great piece of home automation software.So to sum up , the state of home automation is fantastic .
With the relay control modules , you can control just about anything .
Add IR control to that and there 's not much left beyond your reach .
Blind and drapes control is very expensive to buy off the shelf for some reason , but building your own is easy enough.Good luck ( and keep count of how many times you mix up the load and line wires ) ! Brian</tokentext>
<sentencetext>I have been automating my home for some time now, and I hope I can give you some perspective on the process.Modern (as in, not X10) home automation hardware comes with a steep cost of entry.
For my chosen flavor  (Insteon), you have to buy $60 worth of phase couplers / wireless receivers and a $80 powerline - computer interface before you can even start adding wall switches.
So, unless you are just wildly flush with cash, there usually has to be a need as well as the want to get started.For me, my house is wired to that the driveway light switch are out in the detached garage.
This was very irritating.
By replacing the switch in the garage and the switch by the back door of the house with Insteon switches, I can now turn on the driveway lights from within the house.
Cheaper than hiring an electrician to re-wire the switches.Once the initial hurdle is passed, you can do all sorts of things quickly and easily.
Such as:1.
I added a wireless switch at knee level so my 2-year old can turn on the light in her room.
She LOVES this.
A motion sensor turns the light off 15 minutes after she leaves.
When she's older I'll set it up so she turns the light off, but I didn't want her flashing the lights on/off/on/off for an hour.2.
The wall switch in the living room can also start/stop music playing, as well as control the volume and change songs.3.
Using some ir-controlled home made window blind controllers I built, the blinds on the first floor of the house are controlled by the computer.
Most notably, it shuts them when the sun goes down, so I don't have to worry about people seeing into the house after dark.
I got real used to that real fast, let me tell ya.4.
I've put together a "Baby Monitor of the Gods" that sends video (with sound) from an old DV camcorder to any screen in the house (mostly old laptops running Damn Small Linux loaded into RAM, but also either of the TVs).
In the workout room the video comes up on the picture-in-picture, so my wife can see the baby sleeping while she exercises.
Very popular feature, that.5.
The library did not have a wall switch.
Now it does.
(It turns on the lamps.)6.
I'm leaving out the basic stuff, such as being able to control a light across the house from the bedroom.
Very nice when you are getting ready for bed.7.
Everything is also controllable from our iPhones.8.
Next up is door locks, and after that probably HVAC.
Part of me really wants to do computer controlled zoned HVAC, but the other part hates working in the attic.
Choices, choices.All of this runs from a Mac Cube running Indigo.
I cannot say enough good things about Indigo, it is one truly great piece of home automation software.So to sum up, the state of home automation is fantastic.
With the relay control modules, you can control just about anything.
Add IR control to that and there's not much left beyond your reach.
Blind and drapes control is very expensive to buy off the shelf for some reason, but building your own is easy enough.Good luck (and keep count of how many times you mix up the load and line wires)!Brian</sentencetext>
</comment>
<comment>
	<id>http://www.semanticweb.org/ontologies/ConversationInstances.owl#comment09_10_26_164226.29884231</id>
	<title>LinuxMCE.org</title>
	<author>Anonymous</author>
	<datestamp>1256660220000</datestamp>
	<modclass>None</modclass>
	<modscore>0</modscore>
	<htmltext><p>Check out linuxmce.org.  The Kubuntu system features gaming, climate control, lighting, telecom, media, security and can control X-10, KNX/EIB, Z-Wave, EnOcean, Insteon, and PLC devices. You can control the system from many number of devices.</p></htmltext>
<tokenext>Check out linuxmce.org .
The Kubuntu system features gaming , climate control , lighting , telecom , media , security and can control X-10 , KNX/EIB , Z-Wave , EnOcean , Insteon , and PLC devices .
You can control the system from many number of devices .</tokentext>
<sentencetext>Check out linuxmce.org.
The Kubuntu system features gaming, climate control, lighting, telecom, media, security and can control X-10, KNX/EIB, Z-Wave, EnOcean, Insteon, and PLC devices.
You can control the system from many number of devices.</sentencetext>
</comment>
<comment>
	<id>http://www.semanticweb.org/ontologies/ConversationInstances.owl#comment09_10_26_164226.29877161</id>
	<title>There's more to automation than information</title>
	<author>PowerVegetable</author>
	<datestamp>1256550540000</datestamp>
	<modclass>None</modclass>
	<modscore>1</modscore>
	<htmltext>I've thought about this repeatedly and I agree with some of the above posters: there's no good reason to use the current systems (other than geek factor) and here's why:<br> <br>

The sort of 'automation' that is available today is almost entirely information handling.  It is simply the modification of manually-operated devices to let them take information from and give information to the other devices in your home.  But moving information around isn't the only thing your house chores require; you also have to load the dishwasher, move clothes from the washer to the dryer, get the mail, cook the dinner, water the plants, mow the yard, and feed the dog.<br> <br>

Yes, it's neat to be able to set the temperature on your hot water heater from your iphone.  But these sorts of flag-setting and value-editing and stream-routing tasks don't actually remove the more burdensome aspects of home operation.  Just the easiest-to-automate.<br> <br>

Setting your DVR from your phone isn't effective automation.  The Roomba is.</htmltext>
<tokenext>I 've thought about this repeatedly and I agree with some of the above posters : there 's no good reason to use the current systems ( other than geek factor ) and here 's why : The sort of 'automation ' that is available today is almost entirely information handling .
It is simply the modification of manually-operated devices to let them take information from and give information to the other devices in your home .
But moving information around is n't the only thing your house chores require ; you also have to load the dishwasher , move clothes from the washer to the dryer , get the mail , cook the dinner , water the plants , mow the yard , and feed the dog .
Yes , it 's neat to be able to set the temperature on your hot water heater from your iphone .
But these sorts of flag-setting and value-editing and stream-routing tasks do n't actually remove the more burdensome aspects of home operation .
Just the easiest-to-automate .
Setting your DVR from your phone is n't effective automation .
The Roomba is .</tokentext>
<sentencetext>I've thought about this repeatedly and I agree with some of the above posters: there's no good reason to use the current systems (other than geek factor) and here's why: 

The sort of 'automation' that is available today is almost entirely information handling.
It is simply the modification of manually-operated devices to let them take information from and give information to the other devices in your home.
But moving information around isn't the only thing your house chores require; you also have to load the dishwasher, move clothes from the washer to the dryer, get the mail, cook the dinner, water the plants, mow the yard, and feed the dog.
Yes, it's neat to be able to set the temperature on your hot water heater from your iphone.
But these sorts of flag-setting and value-editing and stream-routing tasks don't actually remove the more burdensome aspects of home operation.
Just the easiest-to-automate.
Setting your DVR from your phone isn't effective automation.
The Roomba is.</sentencetext>
</comment>
<comment>
	<id>http://www.semanticweb.org/ontologies/ConversationInstances.owl#comment09_10_26_164226.29878587</id>
	<title>Re:What do you want home automation for?</title>
	<author>RicktheBrick</author>
	<datestamp>1256557380000</datestamp>
	<modclass>None</modclass>
	<modscore>1</modscore>
	<htmltext>I want a speaker and a microphone in every room of my house.  I want the computer to communicate with me using them.  I want the computer to be able to recognize noise as well as voice.  For instance if there is a water or gas leak in your house the computer would hear it and shut the water or gas off.  When I leave the house the computer would ask me how long it would be before I returned.  The computer than could reduce energy use while I was not there.  It would also know that no one should be in the house and notify someone if there were.  I want the computer to keep track of me by the noise I make and ask me if something is wrong if I stop making any noises.  I would tell the computer when I went to bed.  If it determined if there was a problem with me(I had fallen and knocked myself out) it would contact someone to investigate.  There are plenty of single people who are growing old and it would be nice if the computer could provide some help in every day life.  For instance if I put something on the stove and leave the kitchen the computer could notify me after a few minutes to check it.  When the clothes dryer shuts off the computer would tell me such.</htmltext>
<tokenext>I want a speaker and a microphone in every room of my house .
I want the computer to communicate with me using them .
I want the computer to be able to recognize noise as well as voice .
For instance if there is a water or gas leak in your house the computer would hear it and shut the water or gas off .
When I leave the house the computer would ask me how long it would be before I returned .
The computer than could reduce energy use while I was not there .
It would also know that no one should be in the house and notify someone if there were .
I want the computer to keep track of me by the noise I make and ask me if something is wrong if I stop making any noises .
I would tell the computer when I went to bed .
If it determined if there was a problem with me ( I had fallen and knocked myself out ) it would contact someone to investigate .
There are plenty of single people who are growing old and it would be nice if the computer could provide some help in every day life .
For instance if I put something on the stove and leave the kitchen the computer could notify me after a few minutes to check it .
When the clothes dryer shuts off the computer would tell me such .</tokentext>
<sentencetext>I want a speaker and a microphone in every room of my house.
I want the computer to communicate with me using them.
I want the computer to be able to recognize noise as well as voice.
For instance if there is a water or gas leak in your house the computer would hear it and shut the water or gas off.
When I leave the house the computer would ask me how long it would be before I returned.
The computer than could reduce energy use while I was not there.
It would also know that no one should be in the house and notify someone if there were.
I want the computer to keep track of me by the noise I make and ask me if something is wrong if I stop making any noises.
I would tell the computer when I went to bed.
If it determined if there was a problem with me(I had fallen and knocked myself out) it would contact someone to investigate.
There are plenty of single people who are growing old and it would be nice if the computer could provide some help in every day life.
For instance if I put something on the stove and leave the kitchen the computer could notify me after a few minutes to check it.
When the clothes dryer shuts off the computer would tell me such.</sentencetext>
	<parent>http://www.semanticweb.org/ontologies/ConversationInstances.owl#comment09_10_26_164226.29876453</parent>
</comment>
<comment>
	<id>http://www.semanticweb.org/ontologies/ConversationInstances.owl#comment09_10_26_164226.29880239</id>
	<title>Re:X10 makes cool stuff for automation</title>
	<author>Anonymous</author>
	<datestamp>1256571120000</datestamp>
	<modclass>None</modclass>
	<modscore>0</modscore>
	<htmltext><p>I've given up on X10 - it works randomly, my kids think it's a joke and I agree</p></htmltext>
<tokenext>I 've given up on X10 - it works randomly , my kids think it 's a joke and I agree</tokentext>
<sentencetext>I've given up on X10 - it works randomly, my kids think it's a joke and I agree</sentencetext>
	<parent>http://www.semanticweb.org/ontologies/ConversationInstances.owl#comment09_10_26_164226.29876329</parent>
</comment>
<comment>
	<id>http://www.semanticweb.org/ontologies/ConversationInstances.owl#comment09_10_26_164226.29878821</id>
	<title>Re:Good luck</title>
	<author>captainryan1</author>
	<datestamp>1256559000000</datestamp>
	<modclass>None</modclass>
	<modscore>1</modscore>
	<htmltext><p><div class="quote"><p>I'm an open source fan personally, so I'd do Misterhouse.  My father had a setup a few years back that he home-built with a linux distro that was made for a little headless machine that he stuck in the basement.  He got really complex with it and did all the programming himself in Assembly (he's a masochist) instead of making use of the built-in tools.  He wanted to do it HIS way.  It worked great though.  My dad's HA setup was dialed into all of the lighting and thermostat controls for the house and it did some cool stuff.  He had a temperature probe on the outside of the house, and the system would decide (based on outside temperature, time of day, and whether anyone was in the house) whether or not to run the A/C to keep the house cool, but first it would spin up all the ceiling fans.




In reference to the "serious flaws" and weaknesses...ever wondered why none of the home automation tech we've been promised since 1950 has come to be common in homes?  Things like auto-opening drapes, autoadjusting lighting, stuff like that.  Ever wished someone would just sell something like that?  The reason we don't have all of this cool stuff is that there is a company (can't remember the name off the top of my head) that holds a bunch of over-broad patents on most of what we think of as "duh" innovations in home automation.  They don't license or sell their tech.  They just sue people who try to make stuff.</p></div><p>Patent Trolls suck! They need to stopped. And, the government needs to step in and stop them. They are killing technology in more areas then just home automation.</p></div>
	</htmltext>
<tokenext>I 'm an open source fan personally , so I 'd do Misterhouse .
My father had a setup a few years back that he home-built with a linux distro that was made for a little headless machine that he stuck in the basement .
He got really complex with it and did all the programming himself in Assembly ( he 's a masochist ) instead of making use of the built-in tools .
He wanted to do it HIS way .
It worked great though .
My dad 's HA setup was dialed into all of the lighting and thermostat controls for the house and it did some cool stuff .
He had a temperature probe on the outside of the house , and the system would decide ( based on outside temperature , time of day , and whether anyone was in the house ) whether or not to run the A/C to keep the house cool , but first it would spin up all the ceiling fans .
In reference to the " serious flaws " and weaknesses...ever wondered why none of the home automation tech we 've been promised since 1950 has come to be common in homes ?
Things like auto-opening drapes , autoadjusting lighting , stuff like that .
Ever wished someone would just sell something like that ?
The reason we do n't have all of this cool stuff is that there is a company ( ca n't remember the name off the top of my head ) that holds a bunch of over-broad patents on most of what we think of as " duh " innovations in home automation .
They do n't license or sell their tech .
They just sue people who try to make stuff.Patent Trolls suck !
They need to stopped .
And , the government needs to step in and stop them .
They are killing technology in more areas then just home automation .</tokentext>
<sentencetext>I'm an open source fan personally, so I'd do Misterhouse.
My father had a setup a few years back that he home-built with a linux distro that was made for a little headless machine that he stuck in the basement.
He got really complex with it and did all the programming himself in Assembly (he's a masochist) instead of making use of the built-in tools.
He wanted to do it HIS way.
It worked great though.
My dad's HA setup was dialed into all of the lighting and thermostat controls for the house and it did some cool stuff.
He had a temperature probe on the outside of the house, and the system would decide (based on outside temperature, time of day, and whether anyone was in the house) whether or not to run the A/C to keep the house cool, but first it would spin up all the ceiling fans.
In reference to the "serious flaws" and weaknesses...ever wondered why none of the home automation tech we've been promised since 1950 has come to be common in homes?
Things like auto-opening drapes, autoadjusting lighting, stuff like that.
Ever wished someone would just sell something like that?
The reason we don't have all of this cool stuff is that there is a company (can't remember the name off the top of my head) that holds a bunch of over-broad patents on most of what we think of as "duh" innovations in home automation.
They don't license or sell their tech.
They just sue people who try to make stuff.Patent Trolls suck!
They need to stopped.
And, the government needs to step in and stop them.
They are killing technology in more areas then just home automation.
	</sentencetext>
	<parent>http://www.semanticweb.org/ontologies/ConversationInstances.owl#comment09_10_26_164226.29876267</parent>
</comment>
<comment>
	<id>http://www.semanticweb.org/ontologies/ConversationInstances.owl#comment09_10_26_164226.29876677</id>
	<title>Problem: no good commodity products</title>
	<author>Overzeetop</author>
	<datestamp>1256548800000</datestamp>
	<modclass>None</modclass>
	<modscore>1</modscore>
	<htmltext><p>Admittedly, I haven't looked into home automation in a couple of years, but the biggest problem is the total cost of systems - both in components and manpower to properly install them.  There are no real commodity parts for all the little pieces, so every system is effectively proprietary - and priced as such.  Even a simple, full home automation set will set you back several thousand dollars.  There is no value in the manufacturers creating a commodity market for this stuff - the volume is too low and the development costs too high. That will keep it all as niche products.</p><p>The second problem is setup and programming. Until we get to plug-and-play with these systems that your typical grandmother can do, it's going to take manpower to setup. Guess what - the guys who do this professionally have a vested interest in keeping the lay public from being able to install it themselves. Since the manufacturers depend on the custom installers to sell product, they make it hard for the lay public to (a) get the hardware and (b) get the documentation. The same problem exists in the home theater market. Anything that requires local human hands to set anything up is going to drive the cost up dramatically, and that has to be factored in. Huge margins on the hardware makes the installation seem less expensive. If you sold this stuff at a 300\% markup over manufacturing, there'd be no allowance for installers - or you'd find out that the "free" install you just got on your $1000 controller was really a $400 controller and $600 installation fee.</p></htmltext>
<tokenext>Admittedly , I have n't looked into home automation in a couple of years , but the biggest problem is the total cost of systems - both in components and manpower to properly install them .
There are no real commodity parts for all the little pieces , so every system is effectively proprietary - and priced as such .
Even a simple , full home automation set will set you back several thousand dollars .
There is no value in the manufacturers creating a commodity market for this stuff - the volume is too low and the development costs too high .
That will keep it all as niche products.The second problem is setup and programming .
Until we get to plug-and-play with these systems that your typical grandmother can do , it 's going to take manpower to setup .
Guess what - the guys who do this professionally have a vested interest in keeping the lay public from being able to install it themselves .
Since the manufacturers depend on the custom installers to sell product , they make it hard for the lay public to ( a ) get the hardware and ( b ) get the documentation .
The same problem exists in the home theater market .
Anything that requires local human hands to set anything up is going to drive the cost up dramatically , and that has to be factored in .
Huge margins on the hardware makes the installation seem less expensive .
If you sold this stuff at a 300 \ % markup over manufacturing , there 'd be no allowance for installers - or you 'd find out that the " free " install you just got on your $ 1000 controller was really a $ 400 controller and $ 600 installation fee .</tokentext>
<sentencetext>Admittedly, I haven't looked into home automation in a couple of years, but the biggest problem is the total cost of systems - both in components and manpower to properly install them.
There are no real commodity parts for all the little pieces, so every system is effectively proprietary - and priced as such.
Even a simple, full home automation set will set you back several thousand dollars.
There is no value in the manufacturers creating a commodity market for this stuff - the volume is too low and the development costs too high.
That will keep it all as niche products.The second problem is setup and programming.
Until we get to plug-and-play with these systems that your typical grandmother can do, it's going to take manpower to setup.
Guess what - the guys who do this professionally have a vested interest in keeping the lay public from being able to install it themselves.
Since the manufacturers depend on the custom installers to sell product, they make it hard for the lay public to (a) get the hardware and (b) get the documentation.
The same problem exists in the home theater market.
Anything that requires local human hands to set anything up is going to drive the cost up dramatically, and that has to be factored in.
Huge margins on the hardware makes the installation seem less expensive.
If you sold this stuff at a 300\% markup over manufacturing, there'd be no allowance for installers - or you'd find out that the "free" install you just got on your $1000 controller was really a $400 controller and $600 installation fee.</sentencetext>
</comment>
<comment>
	<id>http://www.semanticweb.org/ontologies/ConversationInstances.owl#comment09_10_26_164226.29882007</id>
	<title>Re:Wife 1.0</title>
	<author>TheLink</author>
	<datestamp>1256643660000</datestamp>
	<modclass>None</modclass>
	<modscore>1</modscore>
	<htmltext>Speaking of problems, I know someone who was planning to install iBaby 1.0 first, and convert his Acquaintance 0.1 to Wife 1.0 all without checking system requirements or even compatibility.<br><br>All while his Acquaintance 0.1 was trying to abort the iBaby installation...</htmltext>
<tokenext>Speaking of problems , I know someone who was planning to install iBaby 1.0 first , and convert his Acquaintance 0.1 to Wife 1.0 all without checking system requirements or even compatibility.All while his Acquaintance 0.1 was trying to abort the iBaby installation.. .</tokentext>
<sentencetext>Speaking of problems, I know someone who was planning to install iBaby 1.0 first, and convert his Acquaintance 0.1 to Wife 1.0 all without checking system requirements or even compatibility.All while his Acquaintance 0.1 was trying to abort the iBaby installation...</sentencetext>
	<parent>http://www.semanticweb.org/ontologies/ConversationInstances.owl#comment09_10_26_164226.29877489</parent>
</comment>
<comment>
	<id>http://www.semanticweb.org/ontologies/ConversationInstances.owl#comment09_10_26_164226.29881321</id>
	<title>Re:Smart Grid and home automation - have your say</title>
	<author>Michael Neuffer</author>
	<datestamp>1256674080000</datestamp>
	<modclass>None</modclass>
	<modscore>1</modscore>
	<htmltext><p>Have a look at DigitalStrom <a href="http://www.digitalstrom.de/index.php?id=115&amp;L=2" title="digitalstrom.de" rel="nofollow">http://www.digitalstrom.de/index.php?id=115&amp;L=2</a> [digitalstrom.de] (in English)<br>At ETH Z&#252;rich (Swiss Federal Institute of Technology) they developed a microcontroller that can be directly attached to 220/110V power lines.<br>At first they will put the chip into insulating screw joints but they are also talking to makers of household appliances to incorporate them directly.<br><a href="http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=viXnOxeX6Uk" title="youtube.com" rel="nofollow">http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=viXnOxeX6Uk</a> [youtube.com]</p><p>They will publish the management software as GPL</p><p>I believe that they have a very good chance to take off in the market.</p></htmltext>
<tokenext>Have a look at DigitalStrom http : //www.digitalstrom.de/index.php ? id = 115&amp;L = 2 [ digitalstrom.de ] ( in English ) At ETH Z   rich ( Swiss Federal Institute of Technology ) they developed a microcontroller that can be directly attached to 220/110V power lines.At first they will put the chip into insulating screw joints but they are also talking to makers of household appliances to incorporate them directly.http : //www.youtube.com/watch ? v = viXnOxeX6Uk [ youtube.com ] They will publish the management software as GPLI believe that they have a very good chance to take off in the market .</tokentext>
<sentencetext>Have a look at DigitalStrom http://www.digitalstrom.de/index.php?id=115&amp;L=2 [digitalstrom.de] (in English)At ETH Zürich (Swiss Federal Institute of Technology) they developed a microcontroller that can be directly attached to 220/110V power lines.At first they will put the chip into insulating screw joints but they are also talking to makers of household appliances to incorporate them directly.http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=viXnOxeX6Uk [youtube.com]They will publish the management software as GPLI believe that they have a very good chance to take off in the market.</sentencetext>
	<parent>http://www.semanticweb.org/ontologies/ConversationInstances.owl#comment09_10_26_164226.29877349</parent>
</comment>
<comment>
	<id>http://www.semanticweb.org/ontologies/ConversationInstances.owl#comment09_10_26_164226.29878037</id>
	<title>Control4 has really nice stuff, at a price</title>
	<author>Anonymous</author>
	<datestamp>1256554140000</datestamp>
	<modclass>None</modclass>
	<modscore>0</modscore>
	<htmltext><p>We install Control4 stuff where I work. Their stuff is nice, and can be interfaced via ZigBee, WiFi, wired networking, etc. It uses basically an object oriented setup kinda like Alice (free to download 3d world/animator made by Carnegie Mellon University).</p><p>I also recall seeing in the past on their website it runs Linux as the main control OS, but I'm not positive about this and I don't see any GPL info or download sections on their website.</p></htmltext>
<tokenext>We install Control4 stuff where I work .
Their stuff is nice , and can be interfaced via ZigBee , WiFi , wired networking , etc .
It uses basically an object oriented setup kinda like Alice ( free to download 3d world/animator made by Carnegie Mellon University ) .I also recall seeing in the past on their website it runs Linux as the main control OS , but I 'm not positive about this and I do n't see any GPL info or download sections on their website .</tokentext>
<sentencetext>We install Control4 stuff where I work.
Their stuff is nice, and can be interfaced via ZigBee, WiFi, wired networking, etc.
It uses basically an object oriented setup kinda like Alice (free to download 3d world/animator made by Carnegie Mellon University).I also recall seeing in the past on their website it runs Linux as the main control OS, but I'm not positive about this and I don't see any GPL info or download sections on their website.</sentencetext>
</comment>
<comment>
	<id>http://www.semanticweb.org/ontologies/ConversationInstances.owl#comment09_10_26_164226.29877917</id>
	<title>Re:What do you want home automation for?</title>
	<author>Locke2005</author>
	<datestamp>1256553660000</datestamp>
	<modclass>None</modclass>
	<modscore>1</modscore>
	<htmltext>I could use a dryer that will remind me to take the permanent press clothes out and hang them up, and a audio system that will mute itself when the phone rings. While you're at it, how about a shower that automatically adjusts to my temperature and spray pattern settings so I don't have to fiddle with knobs when I'm half asleep. You are correct, keeping a running inventory of all the food in the house is a patently stupid idea. However, automatically feeding and watering the dog might make sense -- they have a much more limited diet. Like many of you, I already have a "home automation" system in place -- it turns the sprinklers on and off at preset times. Now I need to add a rain sensor; I get tired of it turning the sprinklers on when it is raining.</htmltext>
<tokenext>I could use a dryer that will remind me to take the permanent press clothes out and hang them up , and a audio system that will mute itself when the phone rings .
While you 're at it , how about a shower that automatically adjusts to my temperature and spray pattern settings so I do n't have to fiddle with knobs when I 'm half asleep .
You are correct , keeping a running inventory of all the food in the house is a patently stupid idea .
However , automatically feeding and watering the dog might make sense -- they have a much more limited diet .
Like many of you , I already have a " home automation " system in place -- it turns the sprinklers on and off at preset times .
Now I need to add a rain sensor ; I get tired of it turning the sprinklers on when it is raining .</tokentext>
<sentencetext>I could use a dryer that will remind me to take the permanent press clothes out and hang them up, and a audio system that will mute itself when the phone rings.
While you're at it, how about a shower that automatically adjusts to my temperature and spray pattern settings so I don't have to fiddle with knobs when I'm half asleep.
You are correct, keeping a running inventory of all the food in the house is a patently stupid idea.
However, automatically feeding and watering the dog might make sense -- they have a much more limited diet.
Like many of you, I already have a "home automation" system in place -- it turns the sprinklers on and off at preset times.
Now I need to add a rain sensor; I get tired of it turning the sprinklers on when it is raining.</sentencetext>
	<parent>http://www.semanticweb.org/ontologies/ConversationInstances.owl#comment09_10_26_164226.29876453</parent>
</comment>
<comment>
	<id>http://www.semanticweb.org/ontologies/ConversationInstances.owl#comment09_10_26_164226.29876741</id>
	<title>Re:X10 makes cool stuff for automation</title>
	<author>Anonymous Codger</author>
	<datestamp>1256549040000</datestamp>
	<modclass>None</modclass>
	<modscore>1</modscore>
	<htmltext><p>X-10 works great when it works. But their build quality is just about the worst of any product I have ever seen. It's rare for a timer or module to last more than a few months past warranty expiration. It also doesn't play well with compact fluorescent bulbs. Don't waste your money.</p></htmltext>
<tokenext>X-10 works great when it works .
But their build quality is just about the worst of any product I have ever seen .
It 's rare for a timer or module to last more than a few months past warranty expiration .
It also does n't play well with compact fluorescent bulbs .
Do n't waste your money .</tokentext>
<sentencetext>X-10 works great when it works.
But their build quality is just about the worst of any product I have ever seen.
It's rare for a timer or module to last more than a few months past warranty expiration.
It also doesn't play well with compact fluorescent bulbs.
Don't waste your money.</sentencetext>
	<parent>http://www.semanticweb.org/ontologies/ConversationInstances.owl#comment09_10_26_164226.29876329</parent>
</comment>
<comment>
	<id>http://www.semanticweb.org/ontologies/ConversationInstances.owl#comment09_10_26_164226.29880739</id>
	<title>Re:Doing it wrong</title>
	<author>TheModelEskimo</author>
	<datestamp>1256577780000</datestamp>
	<modclass>None</modclass>
	<modscore>1</modscore>
	<htmltext>&gt; If you're cooking YOU'RE IN THE DAMNED KITCHEN!<br> <br>
Hey, that's true for now. But as home automation grows more and more popular, let's say somebody decides to build a FSU (food storage unit)-to-Cooking Unit interface with an open communication standard. Pretty soon you've got trucks rolling down your street every week, dropping off FSUs left and right. Sure, your menu will be generally pre-determined, but your grocery bill just got a LOT cheaper. Or if cheap isn't important, you can now eat like a king if you order premium FSUs.<br> <br>And then there's the reduced need for multitasking...you subscribe to a gourmet menu selection by your favorite chef, and you just walk to the Cooking Unit at mealtime and pick up your food, eat.<br> <br>Sure, there will always be people who love to cook by hand, the old way...just like there will always be people who read paper books, play old-style board games, etc.<br> <br>The new &amp; improved Mayan calendar gives us <i>just</i> enough time to accomplish all this, too...<nobr> <wbr></nobr>:-)</htmltext>
<tokenext>&gt; If you 're cooking YOU 'RE IN THE DAMNED KITCHEN !
Hey , that 's true for now .
But as home automation grows more and more popular , let 's say somebody decides to build a FSU ( food storage unit ) -to-Cooking Unit interface with an open communication standard .
Pretty soon you 've got trucks rolling down your street every week , dropping off FSUs left and right .
Sure , your menu will be generally pre-determined , but your grocery bill just got a LOT cheaper .
Or if cheap is n't important , you can now eat like a king if you order premium FSUs .
And then there 's the reduced need for multitasking...you subscribe to a gourmet menu selection by your favorite chef , and you just walk to the Cooking Unit at mealtime and pick up your food , eat .
Sure , there will always be people who love to cook by hand , the old way...just like there will always be people who read paper books , play old-style board games , etc .
The new &amp; improved Mayan calendar gives us just enough time to accomplish all this , too... : - )</tokentext>
<sentencetext>&gt; If you're cooking YOU'RE IN THE DAMNED KITCHEN!
Hey, that's true for now.
But as home automation grows more and more popular, let's say somebody decides to build a FSU (food storage unit)-to-Cooking Unit interface with an open communication standard.
Pretty soon you've got trucks rolling down your street every week, dropping off FSUs left and right.
Sure, your menu will be generally pre-determined, but your grocery bill just got a LOT cheaper.
Or if cheap isn't important, you can now eat like a king if you order premium FSUs.
And then there's the reduced need for multitasking...you subscribe to a gourmet menu selection by your favorite chef, and you just walk to the Cooking Unit at mealtime and pick up your food, eat.
Sure, there will always be people who love to cook by hand, the old way...just like there will always be people who read paper books, play old-style board games, etc.
The new &amp; improved Mayan calendar gives us just enough time to accomplish all this, too... :-)</sentencetext>
	<parent>http://www.semanticweb.org/ontologies/ConversationInstances.owl#comment09_10_26_164226.29876757</parent>
</comment>
<comment>
	<id>http://www.semanticweb.org/ontologies/ConversationInstances.owl#comment09_10_26_164226.29877469</id>
	<title>Re:What do you want home automation for?</title>
	<author>Eil</author>
	<datestamp>1256551860000</datestamp>
	<modclass>None</modclass>
	<modscore>1</modscore>
	<htmltext><p>It's easy to think of "useless" home automation features. Here are some that aren't so useless.</p><p>* automatic energy monitoring/control<br>
&nbsp; &nbsp; - have your washer/dryer/whatever run during non-peak hours<br>
&nbsp; &nbsp; - automate the opening/closing of heading/AC vents around the house depending on time of day, who's home, etc<br>
&nbsp; &nbsp; - activate a solar water heater on days that it's worthwhile<br>* phone system, media integration<br>
&nbsp; &nbsp; - have your media collection available no matter which room you're in<br>
&nbsp; &nbsp; - have your playing music/show follow you around the house<br>
&nbsp; &nbsp; - show caller ID or take a call on whichever terminal or phone you happen to be near<br>* security<br>
&nbsp; &nbsp; - control video cameras and configure the system to react when something "interesting" happens<br>
&nbsp; &nbsp; - get a live view of your house anywhere you have an Internet connection</p></htmltext>
<tokenext>It 's easy to think of " useless " home automation features .
Here are some that are n't so useless .
* automatic energy monitoring/control     - have your washer/dryer/whatever run during non-peak hours     - automate the opening/closing of heading/AC vents around the house depending on time of day , who 's home , etc     - activate a solar water heater on days that it 's worthwhile * phone system , media integration     - have your media collection available no matter which room you 're in     - have your playing music/show follow you around the house     - show caller ID or take a call on whichever terminal or phone you happen to be near * security     - control video cameras and configure the system to react when something " interesting " happens     - get a live view of your house anywhere you have an Internet connection</tokentext>
<sentencetext>It's easy to think of "useless" home automation features.
Here are some that aren't so useless.
* automatic energy monitoring/control
    - have your washer/dryer/whatever run during non-peak hours
    - automate the opening/closing of heading/AC vents around the house depending on time of day, who's home, etc
    - activate a solar water heater on days that it's worthwhile* phone system, media integration
    - have your media collection available no matter which room you're in
    - have your playing music/show follow you around the house
    - show caller ID or take a call on whichever terminal or phone you happen to be near* security
    - control video cameras and configure the system to react when something "interesting" happens
    - get a live view of your house anywhere you have an Internet connection</sentencetext>
	<parent>http://www.semanticweb.org/ontologies/ConversationInstances.owl#comment09_10_26_164226.29876453</parent>
</comment>
<comment>
	<id>http://www.semanticweb.org/ontologies/ConversationInstances.owl#comment09_10_26_164226.29877961</id>
	<title>Re:Wife 1.0</title>
	<author>Anonymous</author>
	<datestamp>1256553840000</datestamp>
	<modclass>Funny</modclass>
	<modscore>4</modscore>
	<htmltext><p>On the other hand, the UI for the setup program for iBaby is a [u]lot[/ul] more fun than the iBaby app itself.<br>Just click cancel before installation completes, or make sure that Wife 1.0 has a firewall.</p></htmltext>
<tokenext>On the other hand , the UI for the setup program for iBaby is a [ u ] lot [ /ul ] more fun than the iBaby app itself.Just click cancel before installation completes , or make sure that Wife 1.0 has a firewall .</tokentext>
<sentencetext>On the other hand, the UI for the setup program for iBaby is a [u]lot[/ul] more fun than the iBaby app itself.Just click cancel before installation completes, or make sure that Wife 1.0 has a firewall.</sentencetext>
	<parent>http://www.semanticweb.org/ontologies/ConversationInstances.owl#comment09_10_26_164226.29876445</parent>
</comment>
<comment>
	<id>http://www.semanticweb.org/ontologies/ConversationInstances.owl#comment09_10_26_164226.29879401</id>
	<title>Re:$2000 in and counting</title>
	<author>Coward Anonymous</author>
	<datestamp>1256562960000</datestamp>
	<modclass>Interestin</modclass>
	<modscore>3</modscore>
	<htmltext><p><i>"1. I added a wireless switch at knee level so my 2-year old can turn on the light in her room. She LOVES this. A motion sensor turns the light off 15 minutes after she leaves. When she's older I'll set it up so she turns the light off, but I didn't want her flashing the lights on/off/on/off for an hour"</i></p><p>You must be kidding me. I have a much cheaper and more robust automation system. My two year old stretches on his tippy toes to reach the lights or drags over a chair if he still can't reach. He'll occasionally mess with the lights when he shouldn't but that's what being a kid is about. As for automation, if I need a light switched and I'm too lazy to get up I have an eager two year old who will switch it for me - voice recognition built in.</p><p>Seriously, you are control freak - let you daughter frickin' mess with the lights!</p></htmltext>
<tokenext>" 1 .
I added a wireless switch at knee level so my 2-year old can turn on the light in her room .
She LOVES this .
A motion sensor turns the light off 15 minutes after she leaves .
When she 's older I 'll set it up so she turns the light off , but I did n't want her flashing the lights on/off/on/off for an hour " You must be kidding me .
I have a much cheaper and more robust automation system .
My two year old stretches on his tippy toes to reach the lights or drags over a chair if he still ca n't reach .
He 'll occasionally mess with the lights when he should n't but that 's what being a kid is about .
As for automation , if I need a light switched and I 'm too lazy to get up I have an eager two year old who will switch it for me - voice recognition built in.Seriously , you are control freak - let you daughter frickin ' mess with the lights !</tokentext>
<sentencetext>"1.
I added a wireless switch at knee level so my 2-year old can turn on the light in her room.
She LOVES this.
A motion sensor turns the light off 15 minutes after she leaves.
When she's older I'll set it up so she turns the light off, but I didn't want her flashing the lights on/off/on/off for an hour"You must be kidding me.
I have a much cheaper and more robust automation system.
My two year old stretches on his tippy toes to reach the lights or drags over a chair if he still can't reach.
He'll occasionally mess with the lights when he shouldn't but that's what being a kid is about.
As for automation, if I need a light switched and I'm too lazy to get up I have an eager two year old who will switch it for me - voice recognition built in.Seriously, you are control freak - let you daughter frickin' mess with the lights!</sentencetext>
	<parent>http://www.semanticweb.org/ontologies/ConversationInstances.owl#comment09_10_26_164226.29877071</parent>
</comment>
<comment>
	<id>http://www.semanticweb.org/ontologies/ConversationInstances.owl#comment09_10_26_164226.29880555</id>
	<title>LinuxMCE</title>
	<author>zehnra</author>
	<datestamp>1256575020000</datestamp>
	<modclass>None</modclass>
	<modscore>1</modscore>
	<htmltext>Since I don't have any mod points and none of the other MCE posts are getting any attention...

LinuxMCE is much, much more than just a media center.  It was originally PlutoHome, which was designed as a home automation suite.  I'm guessing the name changed due to the primary use of the product, but the automation features are still there.  Since I currently don't have it in my budget to do any automation I can't speak to how well it works, but I have read that it supports most automation hardware out there.  The hard part becomes finding the right hardware solution for you.  From what I've read, X10 is fairly outdated and a bit frustrating, but none of the newer technologies/specifications have really taken a lead.  I'd say read up on a number of the more modern specs and see what fits your need.  A quick Google for home automation turns up a lot of useful information.  I'd start with <a href="http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Home\_automation" title="wikipedia.org" rel="nofollow">Wikipedia's</a> [wikipedia.org] article on home automation.  It has a lot of basic information on the various protocols, specifications, brands, etc.</htmltext>
<tokenext>Since I do n't have any mod points and none of the other MCE posts are getting any attention.. . LinuxMCE is much , much more than just a media center .
It was originally PlutoHome , which was designed as a home automation suite .
I 'm guessing the name changed due to the primary use of the product , but the automation features are still there .
Since I currently do n't have it in my budget to do any automation I ca n't speak to how well it works , but I have read that it supports most automation hardware out there .
The hard part becomes finding the right hardware solution for you .
From what I 've read , X10 is fairly outdated and a bit frustrating , but none of the newer technologies/specifications have really taken a lead .
I 'd say read up on a number of the more modern specs and see what fits your need .
A quick Google for home automation turns up a lot of useful information .
I 'd start with Wikipedia 's [ wikipedia.org ] article on home automation .
It has a lot of basic information on the various protocols , specifications , brands , etc .</tokentext>
<sentencetext>Since I don't have any mod points and none of the other MCE posts are getting any attention...

LinuxMCE is much, much more than just a media center.
It was originally PlutoHome, which was designed as a home automation suite.
I'm guessing the name changed due to the primary use of the product, but the automation features are still there.
Since I currently don't have it in my budget to do any automation I can't speak to how well it works, but I have read that it supports most automation hardware out there.
The hard part becomes finding the right hardware solution for you.
From what I've read, X10 is fairly outdated and a bit frustrating, but none of the newer technologies/specifications have really taken a lead.
I'd say read up on a number of the more modern specs and see what fits your need.
A quick Google for home automation turns up a lot of useful information.
I'd start with Wikipedia's [wikipedia.org] article on home automation.
It has a lot of basic information on the various protocols, specifications, brands, etc.</sentencetext>
</comment>
<comment>
	<id>http://www.semanticweb.org/ontologies/ConversationInstances.owl#comment09_10_26_164226.29885493</id>
	<title>Re:What do you want home automation for?</title>
	<author>ResidentSourcerer</author>
	<datestamp>1256665980000</datestamp>
	<modclass>None</modclass>
	<modscore>1</modscore>
	<htmltext><p>For me the large obstacle is the cost of the peripheral stuff.</p><p>What would I use it for:</p><p>1.  Solar hot water panel control.  When the water in the<br>top of the collector is warmer than the water in the storage<br>tank, turn on the pump.  If the water temp is less than 4<br>degrees C, drain the system.</p><p>2.  Solar/+storage.<br>The above, but if the storage tank is above 50C,<br>and the outside temp is above 20C then divert surplus hot water to deep burried crawlspace heating pipe.  If outside<br>temp is below 20C divert to shallow buried crawlspace heating<br>pipe.</p><p>4.  If water level in the sump is mroe than 2 inches abvoe the normal turn on point, raise hell.</p><p>5.  I have to blow snow tommorow.   At midnight turn on the<br>plug that the tractor is plugged into, so it has a chance<br>of starting in the morning.</p><p>6.  Someone has driven through the gate to the tree yard.<br>Wait.  Oh, they went on to the gas well lease.  Ignore it.</p><p>7.  Someone has driven through the gate to the tree yard.<br>They didn't go to the gas lease.  Send me a message.</p><p>8.  Green house temp is above 30.  Spray mist between the<br>two poly layers.  Collect hot water in stratified storage tank.</p><p>9.  Green house temp is above 33 degrees, open vents, start<br>fans.</p><p>10.  Green house temp is above 35 degrees.  Send me a message.<br>12 Greenhouse temp is below 4 degrees.  Raise hell.<br>11.  Green house temp is below X  and time of day is Y.<br>Circulate hot water from storage tank through heater coils.<br>13. Greenhouse temp is below 4 degrees.  Raise hell.</p><p>14.  It's after sunset and the outside temp is below 10 C.  Close the curtains.</p><p>15.  It daytime, and the outside temp is -20C.  Open curtains<br>only if the light intensity is greater than XX</p><p>AND I want to do this and not have to run huge amounts of wire.</p><p>And I want devices to tell me that they will need a new<br>battery soon, or that they are off line.  (Ok the system has<br>to tell me that.)</p></htmltext>
<tokenext>For me the large obstacle is the cost of the peripheral stuff.What would I use it for : 1 .
Solar hot water panel control .
When the water in thetop of the collector is warmer than the water in the storagetank , turn on the pump .
If the water temp is less than 4degrees C , drain the system.2 .
Solar/ + storage.The above , but if the storage tank is above 50C,and the outside temp is above 20C then divert surplus hot water to deep burried crawlspace heating pipe .
If outsidetemp is below 20C divert to shallow buried crawlspace heatingpipe.4 .
If water level in the sump is mroe than 2 inches abvoe the normal turn on point , raise hell.5 .
I have to blow snow tommorow .
At midnight turn on theplug that the tractor is plugged into , so it has a chanceof starting in the morning.6 .
Someone has driven through the gate to the tree yard.Wait .
Oh , they went on to the gas well lease .
Ignore it.7 .
Someone has driven through the gate to the tree yard.They did n't go to the gas lease .
Send me a message.8 .
Green house temp is above 30 .
Spray mist between thetwo poly layers .
Collect hot water in stratified storage tank.9 .
Green house temp is above 33 degrees , open vents , startfans.10 .
Green house temp is above 35 degrees .
Send me a message.12 Greenhouse temp is below 4 degrees .
Raise hell.11 .
Green house temp is below X and time of day is Y.Circulate hot water from storage tank through heater coils.13 .
Greenhouse temp is below 4 degrees .
Raise hell.14 .
It 's after sunset and the outside temp is below 10 C. Close the curtains.15 .
It daytime , and the outside temp is -20C .
Open curtainsonly if the light intensity is greater than XXAND I want to do this and not have to run huge amounts of wire.And I want devices to tell me that they will need a newbattery soon , or that they are off line .
( Ok the system hasto tell me that .
)</tokentext>
<sentencetext>For me the large obstacle is the cost of the peripheral stuff.What would I use it for:1.
Solar hot water panel control.
When the water in thetop of the collector is warmer than the water in the storagetank, turn on the pump.
If the water temp is less than 4degrees C, drain the system.2.
Solar/+storage.The above, but if the storage tank is above 50C,and the outside temp is above 20C then divert surplus hot water to deep burried crawlspace heating pipe.
If outsidetemp is below 20C divert to shallow buried crawlspace heatingpipe.4.
If water level in the sump is mroe than 2 inches abvoe the normal turn on point, raise hell.5.
I have to blow snow tommorow.
At midnight turn on theplug that the tractor is plugged into, so it has a chanceof starting in the morning.6.
Someone has driven through the gate to the tree yard.Wait.
Oh, they went on to the gas well lease.
Ignore it.7.
Someone has driven through the gate to the tree yard.They didn't go to the gas lease.
Send me a message.8.
Green house temp is above 30.
Spray mist between thetwo poly layers.
Collect hot water in stratified storage tank.9.
Green house temp is above 33 degrees, open vents, startfans.10.
Green house temp is above 35 degrees.
Send me a message.12 Greenhouse temp is below 4 degrees.
Raise hell.11.
Green house temp is below X  and time of day is Y.Circulate hot water from storage tank through heater coils.13.
Greenhouse temp is below 4 degrees.
Raise hell.14.
It's after sunset and the outside temp is below 10 C.  Close the curtains.15.
It daytime, and the outside temp is -20C.
Open curtainsonly if the light intensity is greater than XXAND I want to do this and not have to run huge amounts of wire.And I want devices to tell me that they will need a newbattery soon, or that they are off line.
(Ok the system hasto tell me that.
)</sentencetext>
	<parent>http://www.semanticweb.org/ontologies/ConversationInstances.owl#comment09_10_26_164226.29876453</parent>
</comment>
<comment>
	<id>http://www.semanticweb.org/ontologies/ConversationInstances.owl#comment09_10_26_164226.29877663</id>
	<title>Re:Wife 1.0</title>
	<author>sbeckstead</author>
	<datestamp>1256552640000</datestamp>
	<modclass>None</modclass>
	<modscore>1</modscore>
	<htmltext>Yeah in wife 1.0 the sex module seem to be the first to go.  Thank god the Sit-On-Couch-and-eat-Bon-bons module costs more than I can afford right now.</htmltext>
<tokenext>Yeah in wife 1.0 the sex module seem to be the first to go .
Thank god the Sit-On-Couch-and-eat-Bon-bons module costs more than I can afford right now .</tokentext>
<sentencetext>Yeah in wife 1.0 the sex module seem to be the first to go.
Thank god the Sit-On-Couch-and-eat-Bon-bons module costs more than I can afford right now.</sentencetext>
	<parent>http://www.semanticweb.org/ontologies/ConversationInstances.owl#comment09_10_26_164226.29876373</parent>
</comment>
<comment>
	<id>http://www.semanticweb.org/ontologies/ConversationInstances.owl#comment09_10_26_164226.29876581</id>
	<title>Re:Good luck</title>
	<author>MobyDisk</author>
	<datestamp>1256548440000</datestamp>
	<modclass>None</modclass>
	<modscore>1</modscore>
	<htmltext><p><div class="quote"><p>t there is a company (can't remember the name off the top of my head) that holds a bunch of over-broad patents on most of what we think of as "duh" innovations in home automation. They don't license or sell their tech. They just sue people who try to make stuff.</p></div><p>[citation needed]</p></div>
	</htmltext>
<tokenext>t there is a company ( ca n't remember the name off the top of my head ) that holds a bunch of over-broad patents on most of what we think of as " duh " innovations in home automation .
They do n't license or sell their tech .
They just sue people who try to make stuff .
[ citation needed ]</tokentext>
<sentencetext>t there is a company (can't remember the name off the top of my head) that holds a bunch of over-broad patents on most of what we think of as "duh" innovations in home automation.
They don't license or sell their tech.
They just sue people who try to make stuff.
[citation needed]
	</sentencetext>
	<parent>http://www.semanticweb.org/ontologies/ConversationInstances.owl#comment09_10_26_164226.29876267</parent>
</comment>
<comment>
	<id>http://www.semanticweb.org/ontologies/ConversationInstances.owl#comment09_10_26_164226.29876931</id>
	<title>Re:What do you want home automation for?</title>
	<author>smellsofbikes</author>
	<datestamp>1256549700000</datestamp>
	<modclass>Interestin</modclass>
	<modscore>3</modscore>
	<htmltext>I think having a network-enabled microwave is lame.  However, I think there are some places where it *could* make sense to invest in home automation: intelligent control of heat and lighting.  If you have sensors that tell the computer where people are (and some adaptive software so it learns where they generally tend to be and go at different times) and have zone heating/AC, it's possible you could save a lot of money.  At my old house we quite rarely used the downstairs and one room, so we closed them off and closed the heater vents to them, and reduced our heating costs by about 20\%.  Likewise, intelligent lighting control would mean if nobody's in the room the light automatically turns off, or for areas that are often used, dims to 10\% with a rapid-on if a person walks through.  Since this is the field in which I work, I might as well add a few numbers: we're trying to do this for parking lot and street lighting, specifically using dimming to a fraction of full lighting, and somewhat intelligent prediction of where people are heading so we can just crank up the relevant lights, and are claiming municipalities can reduce their power costs by 30\% based on studies we've had done.  We hope it'll be even higher than that, but we feel pretty confident in the 30\% claim, given that 80\% of the lights will be using 80\% less power about 65\% of the time.</htmltext>
<tokenext>I think having a network-enabled microwave is lame .
However , I think there are some places where it * could * make sense to invest in home automation : intelligent control of heat and lighting .
If you have sensors that tell the computer where people are ( and some adaptive software so it learns where they generally tend to be and go at different times ) and have zone heating/AC , it 's possible you could save a lot of money .
At my old house we quite rarely used the downstairs and one room , so we closed them off and closed the heater vents to them , and reduced our heating costs by about 20 \ % .
Likewise , intelligent lighting control would mean if nobody 's in the room the light automatically turns off , or for areas that are often used , dims to 10 \ % with a rapid-on if a person walks through .
Since this is the field in which I work , I might as well add a few numbers : we 're trying to do this for parking lot and street lighting , specifically using dimming to a fraction of full lighting , and somewhat intelligent prediction of where people are heading so we can just crank up the relevant lights , and are claiming municipalities can reduce their power costs by 30 \ % based on studies we 've had done .
We hope it 'll be even higher than that , but we feel pretty confident in the 30 \ % claim , given that 80 \ % of the lights will be using 80 \ % less power about 65 \ % of the time .</tokentext>
<sentencetext>I think having a network-enabled microwave is lame.
However, I think there are some places where it *could* make sense to invest in home automation: intelligent control of heat and lighting.
If you have sensors that tell the computer where people are (and some adaptive software so it learns where they generally tend to be and go at different times) and have zone heating/AC, it's possible you could save a lot of money.
At my old house we quite rarely used the downstairs and one room, so we closed them off and closed the heater vents to them, and reduced our heating costs by about 20\%.
Likewise, intelligent lighting control would mean if nobody's in the room the light automatically turns off, or for areas that are often used, dims to 10\% with a rapid-on if a person walks through.
Since this is the field in which I work, I might as well add a few numbers: we're trying to do this for parking lot and street lighting, specifically using dimming to a fraction of full lighting, and somewhat intelligent prediction of where people are heading so we can just crank up the relevant lights, and are claiming municipalities can reduce their power costs by 30\% based on studies we've had done.
We hope it'll be even higher than that, but we feel pretty confident in the 30\% claim, given that 80\% of the lights will be using 80\% less power about 65\% of the time.</sentencetext>
	<parent>http://www.semanticweb.org/ontologies/ConversationInstances.owl#comment09_10_26_164226.29876453</parent>
</comment>
<comment>
	<id>http://www.semanticweb.org/ontologies/ConversationInstances.owl#comment09_10_26_164226.29876549</id>
	<title>All automated</title>
	<author>SnarfQuest</author>
	<datestamp>1256548380000</datestamp>
	<modclass>None</modclass>
	<modscore>1</modscore>
	<htmltext><p>I've been using automation since I've gotten my house. It's stuffed to the gills with everything, and I'm constantly adding to it. However, I now have to live in the shed behind the house as there isn't any room left for me.</p></htmltext>
<tokenext>I 've been using automation since I 've gotten my house .
It 's stuffed to the gills with everything , and I 'm constantly adding to it .
However , I now have to live in the shed behind the house as there is n't any room left for me .</tokentext>
<sentencetext>I've been using automation since I've gotten my house.
It's stuffed to the gills with everything, and I'm constantly adding to it.
However, I now have to live in the shed behind the house as there isn't any room left for me.</sentencetext>
</comment>
<comment>
	<id>http://www.semanticweb.org/ontologies/ConversationInstances.owl#comment09_10_26_164226.29876227</id>
	<title>Re: What is the Current State of Home Automation?</title>
	<author>Anonymous</author>
	<datestamp>1256590080000</datestamp>
	<modclass>Redundant</modclass>
	<modscore>-1</modscore>
	<htmltext><p>Still waiting for Linux to hit the desktop</p></htmltext>
<tokenext>Still waiting for Linux to hit the desktop</tokentext>
<sentencetext>Still waiting for Linux to hit the desktop</sentencetext>
</comment>
<comment>
	<id>http://www.semanticweb.org/ontologies/ConversationInstances.owl#comment09_10_26_164226.29876773</id>
	<title>Re:Good luck</title>
	<author>smellsofbikes</author>
	<datestamp>1256549160000</datestamp>
	<modclass>Interestin</modclass>
	<modscore>2</modscore>
	<htmltext><p><div class="quote"><p>Things like auto-opening drapes, autoadjusting lighting, stuff like that.  Ever wished someone would just sell something like that?</p> </div><p>I can't speak with any authority on your other topics, but the auto-adjusting lights, at least, will be in your friendly local hardware store within 2 years (or I'll be out of a job.)  The question is: will you want to pay for it?  Contemporary LED lighting (my field) is moving strongly into ambient light detection and (semi) intelligent lighting, and there are bulbs going on the market right now that even offer closed-loop color quality correction, so they not only turn on and off based on room lighting, but guarantee a lighting color throughout their lifetimes by using multiple colored LED's that vary based on measurement.  (They're weird to work with because the color output from the bulb changes drastically if you hold a white sheet of paper up to the light, as compared to a piece of dark fabric, although the reflected color looks just about the same... which is the whole point.)</p><p>
However, they cost about 10x what current lightbulbs cost, and it's an open question whether customers are going to actually spend more money for their lights.  As brought up elsewhere in this thread, it's not that home automation is expensive <i>per se</i>, but that in order to apply it throughout a house, you could be changing 50-200 fixtures, outlets, and bulbs, and then it becomes cripplingly expensive.</p></div>
	</htmltext>
<tokenext>Things like auto-opening drapes , autoadjusting lighting , stuff like that .
Ever wished someone would just sell something like that ?
I ca n't speak with any authority on your other topics , but the auto-adjusting lights , at least , will be in your friendly local hardware store within 2 years ( or I 'll be out of a job .
) The question is : will you want to pay for it ?
Contemporary LED lighting ( my field ) is moving strongly into ambient light detection and ( semi ) intelligent lighting , and there are bulbs going on the market right now that even offer closed-loop color quality correction , so they not only turn on and off based on room lighting , but guarantee a lighting color throughout their lifetimes by using multiple colored LED 's that vary based on measurement .
( They 're weird to work with because the color output from the bulb changes drastically if you hold a white sheet of paper up to the light , as compared to a piece of dark fabric , although the reflected color looks just about the same... which is the whole point .
) However , they cost about 10x what current lightbulbs cost , and it 's an open question whether customers are going to actually spend more money for their lights .
As brought up elsewhere in this thread , it 's not that home automation is expensive per se , but that in order to apply it throughout a house , you could be changing 50-200 fixtures , outlets , and bulbs , and then it becomes cripplingly expensive .</tokentext>
<sentencetext>Things like auto-opening drapes, autoadjusting lighting, stuff like that.
Ever wished someone would just sell something like that?
I can't speak with any authority on your other topics, but the auto-adjusting lights, at least, will be in your friendly local hardware store within 2 years (or I'll be out of a job.
)  The question is: will you want to pay for it?
Contemporary LED lighting (my field) is moving strongly into ambient light detection and (semi) intelligent lighting, and there are bulbs going on the market right now that even offer closed-loop color quality correction, so they not only turn on and off based on room lighting, but guarantee a lighting color throughout their lifetimes by using multiple colored LED's that vary based on measurement.
(They're weird to work with because the color output from the bulb changes drastically if you hold a white sheet of paper up to the light, as compared to a piece of dark fabric, although the reflected color looks just about the same... which is the whole point.
)
However, they cost about 10x what current lightbulbs cost, and it's an open question whether customers are going to actually spend more money for their lights.
As brought up elsewhere in this thread, it's not that home automation is expensive per se, but that in order to apply it throughout a house, you could be changing 50-200 fixtures, outlets, and bulbs, and then it becomes cripplingly expensive.
	</sentencetext>
	<parent>http://www.semanticweb.org/ontologies/ConversationInstances.owl#comment09_10_26_164226.29876267</parent>
</comment>
<comment>
	<id>http://www.semanticweb.org/ontologies/ConversationInstances.owl#comment09_10_26_164226.29889783</id>
	<title>Pretty good is good enough</title>
	<author>asteinmetz</author>
	<datestamp>1256640180000</datestamp>
	<modclass>None</modclass>
	<modscore>1</modscore>
	<htmltext>The term "automation" can be vague.  It can mean stuff happens without human intervention or it can mean stuff happens under my control without me leaving the couch.  I have a mix of DIY stuff centered around these building blocks:

- Homeseer

- Elk home security system

- Z-Wave light switches (Leviton)

- Aprilaire Thermostats

-Panasonic IP Cameras

-Logitech Squeezeboxes

- Denon AV receiver with built-in web server

- Universal brand IR/RF remotes

Homeseer does the programmatic stuff and talks to the Elk, light switches and thermostats.  The Elk has many, many motion sensors wired into it so I throw in a bunch of rules at Homeseer around motion control of lights.

The IP cameras are super baby monitors for the nursery and common areas, and cover entrances.  Zoneminder (running on an old box with Ubuntu server) is an open source DVR for the cameras.

The AV chores are handled by the Denon receiver and the Universal remotes.  The Receiver, cable boxes and squeezebox are in the basement and an RFtoIR blaster delivers the remote commands.

The key thing to note about all this is that it is not all tied together with a unified interface on a touch panel, or suchlike.  The interfaces for AV, security cameras and lighting/climate are separate.  BUT, virtually all of it is IP-based.  No legacy X-10 stuff or proprietary wiring.  This means everything has a web interface because all of the hardware ganglia<nobr> <wbr></nobr>:) have web servers built in.  So rather than get up from the kitchen table to change from radioIO to Radio Paradise, we can do it from our iPhones.  The wife isn't 100\% fluent in all this geekery but she can get to the Tivo stuff, and listen to music, and bring up the nursery cams on the netbook, so she's pretty happy.</htmltext>
<tokenext>The term " automation " can be vague .
It can mean stuff happens without human intervention or it can mean stuff happens under my control without me leaving the couch .
I have a mix of DIY stuff centered around these building blocks : - Homeseer - Elk home security system - Z-Wave light switches ( Leviton ) - Aprilaire Thermostats -Panasonic IP Cameras -Logitech Squeezeboxes - Denon AV receiver with built-in web server - Universal brand IR/RF remotes Homeseer does the programmatic stuff and talks to the Elk , light switches and thermostats .
The Elk has many , many motion sensors wired into it so I throw in a bunch of rules at Homeseer around motion control of lights .
The IP cameras are super baby monitors for the nursery and common areas , and cover entrances .
Zoneminder ( running on an old box with Ubuntu server ) is an open source DVR for the cameras .
The AV chores are handled by the Denon receiver and the Universal remotes .
The Receiver , cable boxes and squeezebox are in the basement and an RFtoIR blaster delivers the remote commands .
The key thing to note about all this is that it is not all tied together with a unified interface on a touch panel , or suchlike .
The interfaces for AV , security cameras and lighting/climate are separate .
BUT , virtually all of it is IP-based .
No legacy X-10 stuff or proprietary wiring .
This means everything has a web interface because all of the hardware ganglia : ) have web servers built in .
So rather than get up from the kitchen table to change from radioIO to Radio Paradise , we can do it from our iPhones .
The wife is n't 100 \ % fluent in all this geekery but she can get to the Tivo stuff , and listen to music , and bring up the nursery cams on the netbook , so she 's pretty happy .</tokentext>
<sentencetext>The term "automation" can be vague.
It can mean stuff happens without human intervention or it can mean stuff happens under my control without me leaving the couch.
I have a mix of DIY stuff centered around these building blocks:

- Homeseer

- Elk home security system

- Z-Wave light switches (Leviton)

- Aprilaire Thermostats

-Panasonic IP Cameras

-Logitech Squeezeboxes

- Denon AV receiver with built-in web server

- Universal brand IR/RF remotes

Homeseer does the programmatic stuff and talks to the Elk, light switches and thermostats.
The Elk has many, many motion sensors wired into it so I throw in a bunch of rules at Homeseer around motion control of lights.
The IP cameras are super baby monitors for the nursery and common areas, and cover entrances.
Zoneminder (running on an old box with Ubuntu server) is an open source DVR for the cameras.
The AV chores are handled by the Denon receiver and the Universal remotes.
The Receiver, cable boxes and squeezebox are in the basement and an RFtoIR blaster delivers the remote commands.
The key thing to note about all this is that it is not all tied together with a unified interface on a touch panel, or suchlike.
The interfaces for AV, security cameras and lighting/climate are separate.
BUT, virtually all of it is IP-based.
No legacy X-10 stuff or proprietary wiring.
This means everything has a web interface because all of the hardware ganglia :) have web servers built in.
So rather than get up from the kitchen table to change from radioIO to Radio Paradise, we can do it from our iPhones.
The wife isn't 100\% fluent in all this geekery but she can get to the Tivo stuff, and listen to music, and bring up the nursery cams on the netbook, so she's pretty happy.</sentencetext>
</comment>
<comment>
	<id>http://www.semanticweb.org/ontologies/ConversationInstances.owl#comment09_10_26_164226.29876649</id>
	<title>LinuxMCE</title>
	<author>Anonymous</author>
	<datestamp>1256548740000</datestamp>
	<modclass>None</modclass>
	<modscore>0</modscore>
	<htmltext><p>One word - linuxmce.org.  Very cool - covers the home automation as well as security and media controls.</p></htmltext>
<tokenext>One word - linuxmce.org .
Very cool - covers the home automation as well as security and media controls .</tokentext>
<sentencetext>One word - linuxmce.org.
Very cool - covers the home automation as well as security and media controls.</sentencetext>
</comment>
<comment>
	<id>http://www.semanticweb.org/ontologies/ConversationInstances.owl#comment09_10_26_164226.29877487</id>
	<title>Re:Wife 1.0</title>
	<author>Abreu</author>
	<datestamp>1256551860000</datestamp>
	<modclass>None</modclass>
	<modscore>1</modscore>
	<htmltext><p><div class="quote"><p>Wife 1.0 continues to work quite well, thank you.</p></div><p>As a happy user of Wife 1.0, I must say this system is not for everybody...</p><p>The subscription plan is a bit pricey, imho</p></div>
	</htmltext>
<tokenext>Wife 1.0 continues to work quite well , thank you.As a happy user of Wife 1.0 , I must say this system is not for everybody...The subscription plan is a bit pricey , imho</tokentext>
<sentencetext>Wife 1.0 continues to work quite well, thank you.As a happy user of Wife 1.0, I must say this system is not for everybody...The subscription plan is a bit pricey, imho
	</sentencetext>
	<parent>http://www.semanticweb.org/ontologies/ConversationInstances.owl#comment09_10_26_164226.29876185</parent>
</comment>
<comment>
	<id>http://www.semanticweb.org/ontologies/ConversationInstances.owl#comment09_10_26_164226.29879959</id>
	<title>Re:What do you want home automation for?</title>
	<author>Macgrrl</author>
	<datestamp>1256567940000</datestamp>
	<modclass>None</modclass>
	<modscore>1</modscore>
	<htmltext><p>My washer and dryer have time delay options on them already. Home automation won't move clothes between units or fold the clean laundry when it's done. Page me when it will.</p></htmltext>
<tokenext>My washer and dryer have time delay options on them already .
Home automation wo n't move clothes between units or fold the clean laundry when it 's done .
Page me when it will .</tokentext>
<sentencetext>My washer and dryer have time delay options on them already.
Home automation won't move clothes between units or fold the clean laundry when it's done.
Page me when it will.</sentencetext>
	<parent>http://www.semanticweb.org/ontologies/ConversationInstances.owl#comment09_10_26_164226.29877469</parent>
</comment>
<comment>
	<id>http://www.semanticweb.org/ontologies/ConversationInstances.owl#comment09_10_26_164226.29877417</id>
	<title>Re:Wife 1.0</title>
	<author>ewenix</author>
	<datestamp>1256551620000</datestamp>
	<modclass>None</modclass>
	<modscore>1</modscore>
	<htmltext>Easy fix my friend, you just have to chroot Girlfriend 1.0.<br>
Just beware that you do this properly as this is very dangerous and can cause insufficient resource errors.<br>
Also if Wife 1.0 encounters any girlfriend 1.0 files, your GnuCash files will be deleted and then Wife 1.0 will uninstall, but not cleanly.<p>
Regarding the iBaby popup... Check carefully next time... there should be a "don't remind me again" checkbox.</p><p>
Remember to always keep your anti-virus and anti-spyware up to date.</p></htmltext>
<tokenext>Easy fix my friend , you just have to chroot Girlfriend 1.0 .
Just beware that you do this properly as this is very dangerous and can cause insufficient resource errors .
Also if Wife 1.0 encounters any girlfriend 1.0 files , your GnuCash files will be deleted and then Wife 1.0 will uninstall , but not cleanly .
Regarding the iBaby popup... Check carefully next time... there should be a " do n't remind me again " checkbox .
Remember to always keep your anti-virus and anti-spyware up to date .</tokentext>
<sentencetext>Easy fix my friend, you just have to chroot Girlfriend 1.0.
Just beware that you do this properly as this is very dangerous and can cause insufficient resource errors.
Also if Wife 1.0 encounters any girlfriend 1.0 files, your GnuCash files will be deleted and then Wife 1.0 will uninstall, but not cleanly.
Regarding the iBaby popup... Check carefully next time... there should be a "don't remind me again" checkbox.
Remember to always keep your anti-virus and anti-spyware up to date.</sentencetext>
	<parent>http://www.semanticweb.org/ontologies/ConversationInstances.owl#comment09_10_26_164226.29876445</parent>
</comment>
<comment>
	<id>http://www.semanticweb.org/ontologies/ConversationInstances.owl#comment09_10_26_164226.29885559</id>
	<title>thought of ever selling your house?</title>
	<author>formfeed</author>
	<datestamp>1256666220000</datestamp>
	<modclass>None</modclass>
	<modscore>1</modscore>
	<htmltext>Europeans usually stay in the same place for two to three thousand years, but Americans move every couple years and sell their houses.
<p>
So if you happen to live in the Westindies, i suggest for home automation : 1.look for useful rather than for unique, and  2. make it movable or make it compatible.
</p><p>
1. I'd rather add zoning, so the upstairs bedroom has it's on thermostat, before I'd build a system that turns on the lights 10 minutes before I get up.
</p><p>
2. If you're planning on leaving the system in the house, make it so it works with "standard" components. You can build your own, but make the interfaces follow some commercial standard, so someone without much knowledge could just buy a part and pop it in.</p></htmltext>
<tokenext>Europeans usually stay in the same place for two to three thousand years , but Americans move every couple years and sell their houses .
So if you happen to live in the Westindies , i suggest for home automation : 1.look for useful rather than for unique , and 2. make it movable or make it compatible .
1. I 'd rather add zoning , so the upstairs bedroom has it 's on thermostat , before I 'd build a system that turns on the lights 10 minutes before I get up .
2. If you 're planning on leaving the system in the house , make it so it works with " standard " components .
You can build your own , but make the interfaces follow some commercial standard , so someone without much knowledge could just buy a part and pop it in .</tokentext>
<sentencetext>Europeans usually stay in the same place for two to three thousand years, but Americans move every couple years and sell their houses.
So if you happen to live in the Westindies, i suggest for home automation : 1.look for useful rather than for unique, and  2. make it movable or make it compatible.
1. I'd rather add zoning, so the upstairs bedroom has it's on thermostat, before I'd build a system that turns on the lights 10 minutes before I get up.
2. If you're planning on leaving the system in the house, make it so it works with "standard" components.
You can build your own, but make the interfaces follow some commercial standard, so someone without much knowledge could just buy a part and pop it in.</sentencetext>
</comment>
<comment>
	<id>http://www.semanticweb.org/ontologies/ConversationInstances.owl#comment09_10_26_164226.29877143</id>
	<title>Re:Doing it wrong</title>
	<author>Grizzley9</author>
	<datestamp>1256550480000</datestamp>
	<modclass>None</modclass>
	<modscore>1</modscore>
	<htmltext>You can, it's called Viper SmartStart.  There's a free iPhone app but the service costs money.</htmltext>
<tokenext>You can , it 's called Viper SmartStart .
There 's a free iPhone app but the service costs money .</tokentext>
<sentencetext>You can, it's called Viper SmartStart.
There's a free iPhone app but the service costs money.</sentencetext>
	<parent>http://www.semanticweb.org/ontologies/ConversationInstances.owl#comment09_10_26_164226.29876757</parent>
</comment>
<comment>
	<id>http://www.semanticweb.org/ontologies/ConversationInstances.owl#comment09_10_26_164226.29876237</id>
	<title>Links?</title>
	<author>Anonymous</author>
	<datestamp>1256590140000</datestamp>
	<modclass>Insightful</modclass>
	<modscore>2</modscore>
	<htmltext><p>A few links might have helped. I haven't heard of "Misterhouse" or any of the other stuff you mentioned. Don't assume lack of ignorance on anybody's part -- everybody is ignorant about something.</p></htmltext>
<tokenext>A few links might have helped .
I have n't heard of " Misterhouse " or any of the other stuff you mentioned .
Do n't assume lack of ignorance on anybody 's part -- everybody is ignorant about something .</tokentext>
<sentencetext>A few links might have helped.
I haven't heard of "Misterhouse" or any of the other stuff you mentioned.
Don't assume lack of ignorance on anybody's part -- everybody is ignorant about something.</sentencetext>
</comment>
<comment>
	<id>http://www.semanticweb.org/ontologies/ConversationInstances.owl#comment09_10_26_164226.29876713</id>
	<title>UPB expensive but really nice</title>
	<author>bmwm3nut</author>
	<datestamp>1256548920000</datestamp>
	<modclass>Informativ</modclass>
	<modscore>2</modscore>
	<htmltext>UPB (Universal Powerline Bus) is the same idea at X10 and unfortunately much more expensive because of licensing issues, but the reliability of the communications is really good.  It comes with a (poorly written) windows program that allows you to setup commands and stuff, but because of the ease of the UPB protocol I've just written my own C++ code to monitor the Bus and send commands to do things.  I send an email to my house when I leave work, then the software reads the UPB temperature sensors inside and outside to determine when and if the heat should be turned on.  When the light sensor notices that it's dark outside, the porch lights go on.  When my car comes in the driveway (induction sensors) and I'm not hope the first floor lights go on.  I unlock the front door with a key fob.  And lots more.  Blinds open and close depending on sun levels, inside, and outside temperature.  Lots of really cool logic!  I'm working right now on artificial intelligence to guess when I'm coming home, when I'm going to bed, all of that stuff, it's just hard because my schedule isn't very regular.  Anyway, to get back on topic.  I had to write all of this myself because the offerings out there are no good, if you want anything beyond the basics you won't get it.  If you're a good hacker, it's worth it just to write a service that can read and write UPB commands and you can do anything you want (there's also a UPB-X10 bridge if you want to use X10 hardware).</htmltext>
<tokenext>UPB ( Universal Powerline Bus ) is the same idea at X10 and unfortunately much more expensive because of licensing issues , but the reliability of the communications is really good .
It comes with a ( poorly written ) windows program that allows you to setup commands and stuff , but because of the ease of the UPB protocol I 've just written my own C + + code to monitor the Bus and send commands to do things .
I send an email to my house when I leave work , then the software reads the UPB temperature sensors inside and outside to determine when and if the heat should be turned on .
When the light sensor notices that it 's dark outside , the porch lights go on .
When my car comes in the driveway ( induction sensors ) and I 'm not hope the first floor lights go on .
I unlock the front door with a key fob .
And lots more .
Blinds open and close depending on sun levels , inside , and outside temperature .
Lots of really cool logic !
I 'm working right now on artificial intelligence to guess when I 'm coming home , when I 'm going to bed , all of that stuff , it 's just hard because my schedule is n't very regular .
Anyway , to get back on topic .
I had to write all of this myself because the offerings out there are no good , if you want anything beyond the basics you wo n't get it .
If you 're a good hacker , it 's worth it just to write a service that can read and write UPB commands and you can do anything you want ( there 's also a UPB-X10 bridge if you want to use X10 hardware ) .</tokentext>
<sentencetext>UPB (Universal Powerline Bus) is the same idea at X10 and unfortunately much more expensive because of licensing issues, but the reliability of the communications is really good.
It comes with a (poorly written) windows program that allows you to setup commands and stuff, but because of the ease of the UPB protocol I've just written my own C++ code to monitor the Bus and send commands to do things.
I send an email to my house when I leave work, then the software reads the UPB temperature sensors inside and outside to determine when and if the heat should be turned on.
When the light sensor notices that it's dark outside, the porch lights go on.
When my car comes in the driveway (induction sensors) and I'm not hope the first floor lights go on.
I unlock the front door with a key fob.
And lots more.
Blinds open and close depending on sun levels, inside, and outside temperature.
Lots of really cool logic!
I'm working right now on artificial intelligence to guess when I'm coming home, when I'm going to bed, all of that stuff, it's just hard because my schedule isn't very regular.
Anyway, to get back on topic.
I had to write all of this myself because the offerings out there are no good, if you want anything beyond the basics you won't get it.
If you're a good hacker, it's worth it just to write a service that can read and write UPB commands and you can do anything you want (there's also a UPB-X10 bridge if you want to use X10 hardware).</sentencetext>
</comment>
<comment>
	<id>http://www.semanticweb.org/ontologies/ConversationInstances.owl#comment09_10_26_164226.29880207</id>
	<title>State of home automation</title>
	<author>Ricochet</author>
	<datestamp>1256570760000</datestamp>
	<modclass>Informativ</modclass>
	<modscore>2</modscore>
	<htmltext><p>Well we're on the verge of a great many changes. The push for the smart grid has begun and no one knows which direction it will go in. There are a great many technologies that can be used in automating your home but a great many players have a vested interest in not playing nice. As such the <a href="http://www.openremote.org/" title="openremote.org" rel="nofollow">OpenRemote</a> [openremote.org] was started to be the glue that pulls everything together. We currently working on great many things including Insteon, X10, KNX, IP and many of the other standard interfaces.</p></htmltext>
<tokenext>Well we 're on the verge of a great many changes .
The push for the smart grid has begun and no one knows which direction it will go in .
There are a great many technologies that can be used in automating your home but a great many players have a vested interest in not playing nice .
As such the OpenRemote [ openremote.org ] was started to be the glue that pulls everything together .
We currently working on great many things including Insteon , X10 , KNX , IP and many of the other standard interfaces .</tokentext>
<sentencetext>Well we're on the verge of a great many changes.
The push for the smart grid has begun and no one knows which direction it will go in.
There are a great many technologies that can be used in automating your home but a great many players have a vested interest in not playing nice.
As such the OpenRemote [openremote.org] was started to be the glue that pulls everything together.
We currently working on great many things including Insteon, X10, KNX, IP and many of the other standard interfaces.</sentencetext>
</comment>
<comment>
	<id>http://www.semanticweb.org/ontologies/ConversationInstances.owl#comment09_10_26_164226.29888843</id>
	<title>PowerHome</title>
	<author>Anonymous</author>
	<datestamp>1256636520000</datestamp>
	<modclass>None</modclass>
	<modscore>0</modscore>
	<htmltext><p>If you haven't heard of it, look into PowerHome. While not particularly user friendly, if you are a DIYer and have tech background, you will likely find this to be far and away the best of the software lot when it comes to taking on home automation. (Disclaimer: I am a home user of PowerHome and have purchased the application, but beyond that have no affiliation with the developer other than offering him my profound respect.)</p><p>It supports X10 and Insteon, but offers programmatic capabilities well beyond that.</p></htmltext>
<tokenext>If you have n't heard of it , look into PowerHome .
While not particularly user friendly , if you are a DIYer and have tech background , you will likely find this to be far and away the best of the software lot when it comes to taking on home automation .
( Disclaimer : I am a home user of PowerHome and have purchased the application , but beyond that have no affiliation with the developer other than offering him my profound respect .
) It supports X10 and Insteon , but offers programmatic capabilities well beyond that .</tokentext>
<sentencetext>If you haven't heard of it, look into PowerHome.
While not particularly user friendly, if you are a DIYer and have tech background, you will likely find this to be far and away the best of the software lot when it comes to taking on home automation.
(Disclaimer: I am a home user of PowerHome and have purchased the application, but beyond that have no affiliation with the developer other than offering him my profound respect.
)It supports X10 and Insteon, but offers programmatic capabilities well beyond that.</sentencetext>
</comment>
<comment>
	<id>http://www.semanticweb.org/ontologies/ConversationInstances.owl#comment09_10_26_164226.29883741</id>
	<title>Another Open Source Alternative</title>
	<author>Anonymous</author>
	<datestamp>1256658000000</datestamp>
	<modclass>None</modclass>
	<modscore>0</modscore>
	<htmltext><p>Last year I worked on a project where I explored knowledge representation, language parsing, and voice interfaces, which resulted in:</p><p>http://www.platoai.com/</p><p>The code is available on SourceForge and is written in C#.</p></htmltext>
<tokenext>Last year I worked on a project where I explored knowledge representation , language parsing , and voice interfaces , which resulted in : http : //www.platoai.com/The code is available on SourceForge and is written in C # .</tokentext>
<sentencetext>Last year I worked on a project where I explored knowledge representation, language parsing, and voice interfaces, which resulted in:http://www.platoai.com/The code is available on SourceForge and is written in C#.</sentencetext>
</comment>
<comment>
	<id>http://www.semanticweb.org/ontologies/ConversationInstances.owl#comment09_10_26_164226.29877787</id>
	<title>Re:What about INSTEON?</title>
	<author>Anonymous</author>
	<datestamp>1256553120000</datestamp>
	<modclass>Interestin</modclass>
	<modscore>1</modscore>
	<htmltext><p>You mean the following root password? username=root password=t0talc0ntr0l4!<br>The project is XML and if talk to the controller on port 5205 (the zserver) you can issue it any commands. Not hard to figure it out if you what the output coming in from devices.</p></htmltext>
<tokenext>You mean the following root password ?
username = root password = t0talc0ntr0l4 ! The project is XML and if talk to the controller on port 5205 ( the zserver ) you can issue it any commands .
Not hard to figure it out if you what the output coming in from devices .</tokentext>
<sentencetext>You mean the following root password?
username=root password=t0talc0ntr0l4!The project is XML and if talk to the controller on port 5205 (the zserver) you can issue it any commands.
Not hard to figure it out if you what the output coming in from devices.</sentencetext>
	<parent>http://www.semanticweb.org/ontologies/ConversationInstances.owl#comment09_10_26_164226.29876455</parent>
</comment>
<comment>
	<id>http://www.semanticweb.org/ontologies/ConversationInstances.owl#comment09_10_26_164226.29878143</id>
	<title>Re:Doing it wrong</title>
	<author>stabiesoft</author>
	<datestamp>1256554620000</datestamp>
	<modclass>None</modclass>
	<modscore>1</modscore>
	<htmltext><p>A number of cars do allow remote start with the heat or A/C coming on as needed. My caddi has it and I know other brands do too. I think there are aftermarket devices as well. Its a nice feature when its way hot/cold. I'm not sure I see the point of calling the car. The remote has been good enough for me.</p></htmltext>
<tokenext>A number of cars do allow remote start with the heat or A/C coming on as needed .
My caddi has it and I know other brands do too .
I think there are aftermarket devices as well .
Its a nice feature when its way hot/cold .
I 'm not sure I see the point of calling the car .
The remote has been good enough for me .</tokentext>
<sentencetext>A number of cars do allow remote start with the heat or A/C coming on as needed.
My caddi has it and I know other brands do too.
I think there are aftermarket devices as well.
Its a nice feature when its way hot/cold.
I'm not sure I see the point of calling the car.
The remote has been good enough for me.</sentencetext>
	<parent>http://www.semanticweb.org/ontologies/ConversationInstances.owl#comment09_10_26_164226.29876757</parent>
</comment>
<comment>
	<id>http://www.semanticweb.org/ontologies/ConversationInstances.owl#comment09_10_26_164226.29876737</id>
	<title>Re:Good luck</title>
	<author>joib</author>
	<datestamp>1256549040000</datestamp>
	<modclass>None</modclass>
	<modscore>1</modscore>
	<htmltext><p>My father also made a temperature controller for his house, controlling the hot/cold mixer before the water is pumped through the radiators. Inputs were inside temp, outside temp, and boiler temp. But this was all done with analog electronics, recycled from all kinds of crap that fills up his garage.</p><p>Personally, I'd have done it with an AVR or maybe even a small embedded Linux system (a suitable excuse to tinker, if nothing else). But hey, it works, so who am I to complain. Took a lot of tweaking before it worked properly though.</p></htmltext>
<tokenext>My father also made a temperature controller for his house , controlling the hot/cold mixer before the water is pumped through the radiators .
Inputs were inside temp , outside temp , and boiler temp .
But this was all done with analog electronics , recycled from all kinds of crap that fills up his garage.Personally , I 'd have done it with an AVR or maybe even a small embedded Linux system ( a suitable excuse to tinker , if nothing else ) .
But hey , it works , so who am I to complain .
Took a lot of tweaking before it worked properly though .</tokentext>
<sentencetext>My father also made a temperature controller for his house, controlling the hot/cold mixer before the water is pumped through the radiators.
Inputs were inside temp, outside temp, and boiler temp.
But this was all done with analog electronics, recycled from all kinds of crap that fills up his garage.Personally, I'd have done it with an AVR or maybe even a small embedded Linux system (a suitable excuse to tinker, if nothing else).
But hey, it works, so who am I to complain.
Took a lot of tweaking before it worked properly though.</sentencetext>
	<parent>http://www.semanticweb.org/ontologies/ConversationInstances.owl#comment09_10_26_164226.29876267</parent>
</comment>
<comment>
	<id>http://www.semanticweb.org/ontologies/ConversationInstances.owl#comment09_10_26_164226.29878935</id>
	<title>Re:Wife 1.0</title>
	<author>Anonymous</author>
	<datestamp>1256559660000</datestamp>
	<modclass>None</modclass>
	<modscore>0</modscore>
	<htmltext><p>The way this stacked on my screen I thought that was a response to Mom 1.0!  *cringe*</p></htmltext>
<tokenext>The way this stacked on my screen I thought that was a response to Mom 1.0 !
* cringe *</tokentext>
<sentencetext>The way this stacked on my screen I thought that was a response to Mom 1.0!
*cringe*</sentencetext>
	<parent>http://www.semanticweb.org/ontologies/ConversationInstances.owl#comment09_10_26_164226.29876373</parent>
</comment>
<comment>
	<id>http://www.semanticweb.org/ontologies/ConversationInstances.owl#comment09_10_26_164226.29878813</id>
	<title>What works and what doesn't</title>
	<author>mstrebe</author>
	<datestamp>1256558880000</datestamp>
	<modclass>None</modclass>
	<modscore>1</modscore>
	<htmltext><p>Disclaimer: I am the author of INSTEON: Smarthomes for everyone.</p><p>There are basically only three "Do it yourself" home automation systems on the market that are advertised as such:</p><p>X10, which is basically obsolete due to its lack of reliability features and speed<br>INSTEON, which is essentially X10 except faster and with reliability features like retry and confirmation built in<br>Z-Wave, which is wireless</p><p>Other systems like Lutron and UPB require custom installers and are not appropriate for DIY.</p><p>I went with INSTEON in my home. I have every light in the house automated, and because we were building we were able to save some money on the electrical wiring by not including any three-way or outdoor switches--those functions are all handled by the smarthome system. Our total cost for a 6000 sq.ft. home was about $5000 including an optional central controller called an ISY-99 that provides programmability beyond just linking lights to switches.</p><p>What we got for the money boils down basically to convenient path lighting and remote control. Everything can be controlled by a native iPhone app, I can shut off all lights in the house with a wall switch in the bedroom, and we have the kids lights programmed to dim and then shut off with their bedtimes, and prevent them from coming back on unless we "unlock" the lights with a keypad in the livingroom. at 1:00 a.m. a script shuts off every light in the house ensuring that nothing is ever left on. Motion sensors turn on lights automatically as people move throughout the house if it's after dark.</p><p>For lighting, the savings from before I had the system programmed in electrical costs is about $100/mo, but I have a $400 month electrical bill and pay<nobr> <wbr></nobr>.31 cents per kW beyond 2kW, so unless you live in a high-rate electricity area you won't save this much on lights alone.</p><p>We also save about $250 per month during the summer months by not using the A/C when the temp is below 85 outside with automated windows that open and close on their own based on the inside and outside temperature. This is all handled by the home automation protocol. When we use the AC, our power bill is between $600..$700 per month. By automating with the windows, we've been able to cut AC use to about three weeks per year total without sacrificing comfort.</p><p>Anyway, just my specific use case. I wouldn't expect to see these kinds of savings unless you live somewhere like Southern California. I went with INSTEON because it was reliable in my tests and cost less than anything but X10. I looked into Z-Wave, but it didn't seem as flexible, there were not nearly as many types of devices available, and it cost about double what INSTEON cost.</p></htmltext>
<tokenext>Disclaimer : I am the author of INSTEON : Smarthomes for everyone.There are basically only three " Do it yourself " home automation systems on the market that are advertised as such : X10 , which is basically obsolete due to its lack of reliability features and speedINSTEON , which is essentially X10 except faster and with reliability features like retry and confirmation built inZ-Wave , which is wirelessOther systems like Lutron and UPB require custom installers and are not appropriate for DIY.I went with INSTEON in my home .
I have every light in the house automated , and because we were building we were able to save some money on the electrical wiring by not including any three-way or outdoor switches--those functions are all handled by the smarthome system .
Our total cost for a 6000 sq.ft .
home was about $ 5000 including an optional central controller called an ISY-99 that provides programmability beyond just linking lights to switches.What we got for the money boils down basically to convenient path lighting and remote control .
Everything can be controlled by a native iPhone app , I can shut off all lights in the house with a wall switch in the bedroom , and we have the kids lights programmed to dim and then shut off with their bedtimes , and prevent them from coming back on unless we " unlock " the lights with a keypad in the livingroom .
at 1 : 00 a.m. a script shuts off every light in the house ensuring that nothing is ever left on .
Motion sensors turn on lights automatically as people move throughout the house if it 's after dark.For lighting , the savings from before I had the system programmed in electrical costs is about $ 100/mo , but I have a $ 400 month electrical bill and pay .31 cents per kW beyond 2kW , so unless you live in a high-rate electricity area you wo n't save this much on lights alone.We also save about $ 250 per month during the summer months by not using the A/C when the temp is below 85 outside with automated windows that open and close on their own based on the inside and outside temperature .
This is all handled by the home automation protocol .
When we use the AC , our power bill is between $ 600.. $ 700 per month .
By automating with the windows , we 've been able to cut AC use to about three weeks per year total without sacrificing comfort.Anyway , just my specific use case .
I would n't expect to see these kinds of savings unless you live somewhere like Southern California .
I went with INSTEON because it was reliable in my tests and cost less than anything but X10 .
I looked into Z-Wave , but it did n't seem as flexible , there were not nearly as many types of devices available , and it cost about double what INSTEON cost .</tokentext>
<sentencetext>Disclaimer: I am the author of INSTEON: Smarthomes for everyone.There are basically only three "Do it yourself" home automation systems on the market that are advertised as such:X10, which is basically obsolete due to its lack of reliability features and speedINSTEON, which is essentially X10 except faster and with reliability features like retry and confirmation built inZ-Wave, which is wirelessOther systems like Lutron and UPB require custom installers and are not appropriate for DIY.I went with INSTEON in my home.
I have every light in the house automated, and because we were building we were able to save some money on the electrical wiring by not including any three-way or outdoor switches--those functions are all handled by the smarthome system.
Our total cost for a 6000 sq.ft.
home was about $5000 including an optional central controller called an ISY-99 that provides programmability beyond just linking lights to switches.What we got for the money boils down basically to convenient path lighting and remote control.
Everything can be controlled by a native iPhone app, I can shut off all lights in the house with a wall switch in the bedroom, and we have the kids lights programmed to dim and then shut off with their bedtimes, and prevent them from coming back on unless we "unlock" the lights with a keypad in the livingroom.
at 1:00 a.m. a script shuts off every light in the house ensuring that nothing is ever left on.
Motion sensors turn on lights automatically as people move throughout the house if it's after dark.For lighting, the savings from before I had the system programmed in electrical costs is about $100/mo, but I have a $400 month electrical bill and pay .31 cents per kW beyond 2kW, so unless you live in a high-rate electricity area you won't save this much on lights alone.We also save about $250 per month during the summer months by not using the A/C when the temp is below 85 outside with automated windows that open and close on their own based on the inside and outside temperature.
This is all handled by the home automation protocol.
When we use the AC, our power bill is between $600..$700 per month.
By automating with the windows, we've been able to cut AC use to about three weeks per year total without sacrificing comfort.Anyway, just my specific use case.
I wouldn't expect to see these kinds of savings unless you live somewhere like Southern California.
I went with INSTEON because it was reliable in my tests and cost less than anything but X10.
I looked into Z-Wave, but it didn't seem as flexible, there were not nearly as many types of devices available, and it cost about double what INSTEON cost.</sentencetext>
</comment>
<comment>
	<id>http://www.semanticweb.org/ontologies/ConversationInstances.owl#comment09_10_26_164226.29876485</id>
	<title>HomeSeer, mControl, and iLinc</title>
	<author>Anonymous</author>
	<datestamp>1256548020000</datestamp>
	<modclass>None</modclass>
	<modscore>0</modscore>
	<htmltext><p>I've used HomeSeer and mControl's home automation software, and I wasn't really happy with either of them.  My main beef with HomeSeer was with its interface, which just seemed cumbersome to me.  Still, I've done some interesting things with both pieces of software, whether it's hooking up a webcam that turns on all the lights and sends me a picture when it detects motion, or diming the lights automatically whenever I watch a movie on my media center.  My trials of mControl and HomeSeer have since expired and I don't plan on buying the full version because I wasn't really happy with them.</p><p>Kinda off topic, but I do use iLinc on the iPhone to turn on and off my lights.  It's not home automation, but it links well into Home Automation setups that use Insteon switches.</p></htmltext>
<tokenext>I 've used HomeSeer and mControl 's home automation software , and I was n't really happy with either of them .
My main beef with HomeSeer was with its interface , which just seemed cumbersome to me .
Still , I 've done some interesting things with both pieces of software , whether it 's hooking up a webcam that turns on all the lights and sends me a picture when it detects motion , or diming the lights automatically whenever I watch a movie on my media center .
My trials of mControl and HomeSeer have since expired and I do n't plan on buying the full version because I was n't really happy with them.Kinda off topic , but I do use iLinc on the iPhone to turn on and off my lights .
It 's not home automation , but it links well into Home Automation setups that use Insteon switches .</tokentext>
<sentencetext>I've used HomeSeer and mControl's home automation software, and I wasn't really happy with either of them.
My main beef with HomeSeer was with its interface, which just seemed cumbersome to me.
Still, I've done some interesting things with both pieces of software, whether it's hooking up a webcam that turns on all the lights and sends me a picture when it detects motion, or diming the lights automatically whenever I watch a movie on my media center.
My trials of mControl and HomeSeer have since expired and I don't plan on buying the full version because I wasn't really happy with them.Kinda off topic, but I do use iLinc on the iPhone to turn on and off my lights.
It's not home automation, but it links well into Home Automation setups that use Insteon switches.</sentencetext>
</comment>
<comment>
	<id>http://www.semanticweb.org/ontologies/ConversationInstances.owl#comment09_10_26_164226.29876495</id>
	<title>Re:Good luck</title>
	<author>0100010001010011</author>
	<datestamp>1256548080000</datestamp>
	<modclass>Informativ</modclass>
	<modscore>3</modscore>
	<htmltext><p><a href="http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/1-Wire" title="wikipedia.org">1-Wire</a> [wikipedia.org] is awesome. I'm currently using it in my house. While it doesn't do everything, there are <a href="http://www.hobby-boards.com/catalog/index.php?cPath=24" title="hobby-boards.com">quite a few modules for different things.</a> [hobby-boards.com]</p><p>Those are just the pre-built options. <a href="http://www.maxim-ic.com/products/1-wire/index.cfm?CMP=WP-7" title="maxim-ic.com">Maxim</a> [maxim-ic.com] has quite a few chips that do different things. People have also used things in very creative ways. The wind direction gauge is just a position feedback sensor on a mechanical device to point towards the wind.</p><p>And no 1-wire home setup would be complete without <a href="http://owfs.org/" title="owfs.org">OWFS</a> [owfs.org] (One Wire File System). Works quite a bit like<nobr> <wbr></nobr>/proc. You can query your temp sensors with 'cat' and turn on relays with 'echo'. Also has libs for php, perl and other languages so you can use scripts. Caching so you don't hammer the bus.</p><p>Since I installed my HVAC controller before the temp sensors (Open Loop!) I went with a <a href="http://www.emx.net.au/Page426.htm" title="emx.net.au">super4 relay board</a> [emx.net.au]. They have linux code, but uses the proprietary FTDI drivers, I used libftdi and write my own. I wired it up in parallel to my thermostat, which I set to 50F. When I was driving home I'd kick it on and when I got home I'd kick it off. If I was hot, I turned it off. Etc. Also kicked on (via cron) at 7 am. (I grew up in an old farm house, so 60F ambient is fine for my single life).</p><p>I also have it on the 'web' checking an e-mail address that I can text from my phone. "heat" kicks things on "off" kicks things off. Nothing fancy yet.</p></htmltext>
<tokenext>1-Wire [ wikipedia.org ] is awesome .
I 'm currently using it in my house .
While it does n't do everything , there are quite a few modules for different things .
[ hobby-boards.com ] Those are just the pre-built options .
Maxim [ maxim-ic.com ] has quite a few chips that do different things .
People have also used things in very creative ways .
The wind direction gauge is just a position feedback sensor on a mechanical device to point towards the wind.And no 1-wire home setup would be complete without OWFS [ owfs.org ] ( One Wire File System ) .
Works quite a bit like /proc .
You can query your temp sensors with 'cat ' and turn on relays with 'echo' .
Also has libs for php , perl and other languages so you can use scripts .
Caching so you do n't hammer the bus.Since I installed my HVAC controller before the temp sensors ( Open Loop !
) I went with a super4 relay board [ emx.net.au ] .
They have linux code , but uses the proprietary FTDI drivers , I used libftdi and write my own .
I wired it up in parallel to my thermostat , which I set to 50F .
When I was driving home I 'd kick it on and when I got home I 'd kick it off .
If I was hot , I turned it off .
Etc. Also kicked on ( via cron ) at 7 am .
( I grew up in an old farm house , so 60F ambient is fine for my single life ) .I also have it on the 'web ' checking an e-mail address that I can text from my phone .
" heat " kicks things on " off " kicks things off .
Nothing fancy yet .</tokentext>
<sentencetext>1-Wire [wikipedia.org] is awesome.
I'm currently using it in my house.
While it doesn't do everything, there are quite a few modules for different things.
[hobby-boards.com]Those are just the pre-built options.
Maxim [maxim-ic.com] has quite a few chips that do different things.
People have also used things in very creative ways.
The wind direction gauge is just a position feedback sensor on a mechanical device to point towards the wind.And no 1-wire home setup would be complete without OWFS [owfs.org] (One Wire File System).
Works quite a bit like /proc.
You can query your temp sensors with 'cat' and turn on relays with 'echo'.
Also has libs for php, perl and other languages so you can use scripts.
Caching so you don't hammer the bus.Since I installed my HVAC controller before the temp sensors (Open Loop!
) I went with a super4 relay board [emx.net.au].
They have linux code, but uses the proprietary FTDI drivers, I used libftdi and write my own.
I wired it up in parallel to my thermostat, which I set to 50F.
When I was driving home I'd kick it on and when I got home I'd kick it off.
If I was hot, I turned it off.
Etc. Also kicked on (via cron) at 7 am.
(I grew up in an old farm house, so 60F ambient is fine for my single life).I also have it on the 'web' checking an e-mail address that I can text from my phone.
"heat" kicks things on "off" kicks things off.
Nothing fancy yet.</sentencetext>
	<parent>http://www.semanticweb.org/ontologies/ConversationInstances.owl#comment09_10_26_164226.29876267</parent>
</comment>
<comment>
	<id>http://www.semanticweb.org/ontologies/ConversationInstances.owl#comment09_10_26_164226.29877359</id>
	<title>Re:What do you want home automation for?</title>
	<author>vlm</author>
	<datestamp>1256551320000</datestamp>
	<modclass>None</modclass>
	<modscore>1</modscore>
	<htmltext><p><div class="quote"><p>What purpose are you accomplishing with this home automation? I have seen these predictions and calls for home automation for years, but I have never seen a compelling reason for doing so.</p></div><p>Probably the simplest way is to break it down by location.</p><p>NTP plus misterhouse's built in functions means my security lights outside turn on shortly after sunset and off at bedtime.  They also turn on in the morning, on days that I go to work, if its before sunrise (I live at a pretty high latitude...)  Also certain outside lights turn on for awhile when the garage door is opened.</p><p>The soundcard is wired into an octopus of speakers in many rooms of my house.  Atomic clock accurate grandfather clock chimes.  A considerable length of perl code mutes or unmutes based on various bedtimes, etc.  It also makes a weird alarm clock.</p><p>Text to speech makes various announcements thru above speakers.  Long story there.</p><p>misterhouse is set up as an AIM bot, I can command it and see what its up to remotely.</p><p>misterhouse also has a nice, or at least usable web interface to control it.</p><p>I have several remote controlled switches that are essentially using misterhouse as an extremely complicated timer.</p><p>Long term plans:</p><p>reconfigure my hvac system with motion detectors and a permanent schedule to basically shut off unused parts of the house to save energy and turn them back on predictably in advance of when they'd be needed.</p><p>sync my google calendar with misterhouse and utilize the text to speech</p><p>Get my weather station connected, and use misterhouse text to speech to announce the temperature each hour, etc.</p><p>Work extensively on modes.  Put lights, speakers, even HVAC, into "movie watching mode" vs "work mode" vs "sleep mode" etc.</p><p>In house motion sensors trigger my lights, timers, and HVAC intelligently.</p><p>Its the kind of thing that you add one little thing at a time.  The goal, is to notice things I manually do "all the time" and automate them away...</p></div>
	</htmltext>
<tokenext>What purpose are you accomplishing with this home automation ?
I have seen these predictions and calls for home automation for years , but I have never seen a compelling reason for doing so.Probably the simplest way is to break it down by location.NTP plus misterhouse 's built in functions means my security lights outside turn on shortly after sunset and off at bedtime .
They also turn on in the morning , on days that I go to work , if its before sunrise ( I live at a pretty high latitude... ) Also certain outside lights turn on for awhile when the garage door is opened.The soundcard is wired into an octopus of speakers in many rooms of my house .
Atomic clock accurate grandfather clock chimes .
A considerable length of perl code mutes or unmutes based on various bedtimes , etc .
It also makes a weird alarm clock.Text to speech makes various announcements thru above speakers .
Long story there.misterhouse is set up as an AIM bot , I can command it and see what its up to remotely.misterhouse also has a nice , or at least usable web interface to control it.I have several remote controlled switches that are essentially using misterhouse as an extremely complicated timer.Long term plans : reconfigure my hvac system with motion detectors and a permanent schedule to basically shut off unused parts of the house to save energy and turn them back on predictably in advance of when they 'd be needed.sync my google calendar with misterhouse and utilize the text to speechGet my weather station connected , and use misterhouse text to speech to announce the temperature each hour , etc.Work extensively on modes .
Put lights , speakers , even HVAC , into " movie watching mode " vs " work mode " vs " sleep mode " etc.In house motion sensors trigger my lights , timers , and HVAC intelligently.Its the kind of thing that you add one little thing at a time .
The goal , is to notice things I manually do " all the time " and automate them away.. .</tokentext>
<sentencetext>What purpose are you accomplishing with this home automation?
I have seen these predictions and calls for home automation for years, but I have never seen a compelling reason for doing so.Probably the simplest way is to break it down by location.NTP plus misterhouse's built in functions means my security lights outside turn on shortly after sunset and off at bedtime.
They also turn on in the morning, on days that I go to work, if its before sunrise (I live at a pretty high latitude...)  Also certain outside lights turn on for awhile when the garage door is opened.The soundcard is wired into an octopus of speakers in many rooms of my house.
Atomic clock accurate grandfather clock chimes.
A considerable length of perl code mutes or unmutes based on various bedtimes, etc.
It also makes a weird alarm clock.Text to speech makes various announcements thru above speakers.
Long story there.misterhouse is set up as an AIM bot, I can command it and see what its up to remotely.misterhouse also has a nice, or at least usable web interface to control it.I have several remote controlled switches that are essentially using misterhouse as an extremely complicated timer.Long term plans:reconfigure my hvac system with motion detectors and a permanent schedule to basically shut off unused parts of the house to save energy and turn them back on predictably in advance of when they'd be needed.sync my google calendar with misterhouse and utilize the text to speechGet my weather station connected, and use misterhouse text to speech to announce the temperature each hour, etc.Work extensively on modes.
Put lights, speakers, even HVAC, into "movie watching mode" vs "work mode" vs "sleep mode" etc.In house motion sensors trigger my lights, timers, and HVAC intelligently.Its the kind of thing that you add one little thing at a time.
The goal, is to notice things I manually do "all the time" and automate them away...
	</sentencetext>
	<parent>http://www.semanticweb.org/ontologies/ConversationInstances.owl#comment09_10_26_164226.29876453</parent>
</comment>
<comment>
	<id>http://www.semanticweb.org/ontologies/ConversationInstances.owl#comment09_10_26_164226.29881761</id>
	<title>Re:Good luck</title>
	<author>Anonymous</author>
	<datestamp>1256639040000</datestamp>
	<modclass>None</modclass>
	<modscore>0</modscore>
	<htmltext><p>Finally someone, who actually knows something about home automation.  If the subby thinks theirs been no progress it's because he's ignoring anything not linux (first mistake).  A pc is good for a lot of things, but stable reliable control it is not.  So unless you feel like tracking random bugs 5 years down the track, just get a decent control system (AMX or Creston are both acceptable), and keep it simple.   I've seen a lot of AV projects go pear shape because someone want to redesign the wheel.</p></htmltext>
<tokenext>Finally someone , who actually knows something about home automation .
If the subby thinks theirs been no progress it 's because he 's ignoring anything not linux ( first mistake ) .
A pc is good for a lot of things , but stable reliable control it is not .
So unless you feel like tracking random bugs 5 years down the track , just get a decent control system ( AMX or Creston are both acceptable ) , and keep it simple .
I 've seen a lot of AV projects go pear shape because someone want to redesign the wheel .</tokentext>
<sentencetext>Finally someone, who actually knows something about home automation.
If the subby thinks theirs been no progress it's because he's ignoring anything not linux (first mistake).
A pc is good for a lot of things, but stable reliable control it is not.
So unless you feel like tracking random bugs 5 years down the track, just get a decent control system (AMX or Creston are both acceptable), and keep it simple.
I've seen a lot of AV projects go pear shape because someone want to redesign the wheel.</sentencetext>
	<parent>http://www.semanticweb.org/ontologies/ConversationInstances.owl#comment09_10_26_164226.29876413</parent>
</comment>
<comment>
	<id>http://www.semanticweb.org/ontologies/ConversationInstances.owl#comment09_10_26_164226.29879407</id>
	<title>Vera from Micasaverde</title>
	<author>tisboyo</author>
	<datestamp>1256562960000</datestamp>
	<modclass>None</modclass>
	<modscore>1</modscore>
	<htmltext>You should check out Vera from Micasaverde. <a href="http://www.micasaverde.com/" title="micasaverde.com" rel="nofollow">http://www.micasaverde.com/</a> [micasaverde.com]
It uses ZWave, works with the new Schlage locks and while it isn't 100\% open source it uses an open platform.</htmltext>
<tokenext>You should check out Vera from Micasaverde .
http : //www.micasaverde.com/ [ micasaverde.com ] It uses ZWave , works with the new Schlage locks and while it is n't 100 \ % open source it uses an open platform .</tokentext>
<sentencetext>You should check out Vera from Micasaverde.
http://www.micasaverde.com/ [micasaverde.com]
It uses ZWave, works with the new Schlage locks and while it isn't 100\% open source it uses an open platform.</sentencetext>
</comment>
<comment>
	<id>http://www.semanticweb.org/ontologies/ConversationInstances.owl#comment09_10_26_164226.29876913</id>
	<title>Alarm Panel Integration</title>
	<author>Anonymous</author>
	<datestamp>1256549640000</datestamp>
	<modclass>Informativ</modclass>
	<modscore>1</modscore>
	<htmltext><p>There are some neat products out there to integrate into your alarm panel.  Utilizing Misterhouse or HomeSeer, products like this:  http://www.nutech.com/nu-tech-shop/12.html  (AD2USB Adapter) to hook your alarm system to your PC.  Or the Vista ICM Module (which, imo is way inferior to the cheaper AD2USB Device provided by Nu Tech).  People have made plugins for HomeSeer for these devices, and make it quite easy to integrate, monitor, and control your security system from the comfort of your PC.</p></htmltext>
<tokenext>There are some neat products out there to integrate into your alarm panel .
Utilizing Misterhouse or HomeSeer , products like this : http : //www.nutech.com/nu-tech-shop/12.html ( AD2USB Adapter ) to hook your alarm system to your PC .
Or the Vista ICM Module ( which , imo is way inferior to the cheaper AD2USB Device provided by Nu Tech ) .
People have made plugins for HomeSeer for these devices , and make it quite easy to integrate , monitor , and control your security system from the comfort of your PC .</tokentext>
<sentencetext>There are some neat products out there to integrate into your alarm panel.
Utilizing Misterhouse or HomeSeer, products like this:  http://www.nutech.com/nu-tech-shop/12.html  (AD2USB Adapter) to hook your alarm system to your PC.
Or the Vista ICM Module (which, imo is way inferior to the cheaper AD2USB Device provided by Nu Tech).
People have made plugins for HomeSeer for these devices, and make it quite easy to integrate, monitor, and control your security system from the comfort of your PC.</sentencetext>
</comment>
<comment>
	<id>http://www.semanticweb.org/ontologies/ConversationInstances.owl#comment09_10_26_164226.29877105</id>
	<title>Re:fatal exception</title>
	<author>Anonymous</author>
	<datestamp>1256550360000</datestamp>
	<modclass>None</modclass>
	<modscore>0</modscore>
	<htmltext><p>Generally, that is because of installing Girlfriend 1.0 or later.  If you uninstall GF1.0 prior to upgrading GF4.0 to Wife 1.0, Wife 1.0 is less likely to crash.  If you rename the executable as "Office Trip.exe", you can avoid detection if it isnt run too often.</p><p>The real conflict occurs with Assets.dll, as it is a share resource between all installations of Girlfriend and Wife.  Having a separate copy of Assets.dll in each run directory, instead of a path or root directory, also increases the success of running both programs.</p><p>In summary, the best suggestion is to not run them together.  I would even recommend not upgrading to Wife 1.0, as there is a patch out that lets two instances of Girlfriend 2.1 run at the same time, often on the same processor.  Sadly, I have upgraded to Wife 1.0, but have been lucky enough to avoid most of the errors viewed on various forums.</p></htmltext>
<tokenext>Generally , that is because of installing Girlfriend 1.0 or later .
If you uninstall GF1.0 prior to upgrading GF4.0 to Wife 1.0 , Wife 1.0 is less likely to crash .
If you rename the executable as " Office Trip.exe " , you can avoid detection if it isnt run too often.The real conflict occurs with Assets.dll , as it is a share resource between all installations of Girlfriend and Wife .
Having a separate copy of Assets.dll in each run directory , instead of a path or root directory , also increases the success of running both programs.In summary , the best suggestion is to not run them together .
I would even recommend not upgrading to Wife 1.0 , as there is a patch out that lets two instances of Girlfriend 2.1 run at the same time , often on the same processor .
Sadly , I have upgraded to Wife 1.0 , but have been lucky enough to avoid most of the errors viewed on various forums .</tokentext>
<sentencetext>Generally, that is because of installing Girlfriend 1.0 or later.
If you uninstall GF1.0 prior to upgrading GF4.0 to Wife 1.0, Wife 1.0 is less likely to crash.
If you rename the executable as "Office Trip.exe", you can avoid detection if it isnt run too often.The real conflict occurs with Assets.dll, as it is a share resource between all installations of Girlfriend and Wife.
Having a separate copy of Assets.dll in each run directory, instead of a path or root directory, also increases the success of running both programs.In summary, the best suggestion is to not run them together.
I would even recommend not upgrading to Wife 1.0, as there is a patch out that lets two instances of Girlfriend 2.1 run at the same time, often on the same processor.
Sadly, I have upgraded to Wife 1.0, but have been lucky enough to avoid most of the errors viewed on various forums.</sentencetext>
	<parent>http://www.semanticweb.org/ontologies/ConversationInstances.owl#comment09_10_26_164226.29876609</parent>
</comment>
<comment>
	<id>http://www.semanticweb.org/ontologies/ConversationInstances.owl#comment09_10_26_164226.29878277</id>
	<title>Re:$2000 in and counting</title>
	<author>Sacarino</author>
	<datestamp>1256555280000</datestamp>
	<modclass>None</modclass>
	<modscore>1</modscore>
	<htmltext><i>Using some ir-controlled home made window blind controllers I built, the blinds on the first floor of the house are controlled by the computer. Most notably, it shuts them when the sun goes down, so I don't have to worry about people seeing into the house after dark. I got real used to that real fast, let me tell ya.</i> <br>
<br>
Don't suppose you'd like to share some technical details about that, would you? I would love to tie my blinds into the system but there's no way I'm paying Somfy-esq prices for the capability.</htmltext>
<tokenext>Using some ir-controlled home made window blind controllers I built , the blinds on the first floor of the house are controlled by the computer .
Most notably , it shuts them when the sun goes down , so I do n't have to worry about people seeing into the house after dark .
I got real used to that real fast , let me tell ya .
Do n't suppose you 'd like to share some technical details about that , would you ?
I would love to tie my blinds into the system but there 's no way I 'm paying Somfy-esq prices for the capability .</tokentext>
<sentencetext>Using some ir-controlled home made window blind controllers I built, the blinds on the first floor of the house are controlled by the computer.
Most notably, it shuts them when the sun goes down, so I don't have to worry about people seeing into the house after dark.
I got real used to that real fast, let me tell ya.
Don't suppose you'd like to share some technical details about that, would you?
I would love to tie my blinds into the system but there's no way I'm paying Somfy-esq prices for the capability.</sentencetext>
	<parent>http://www.semanticweb.org/ontologies/ConversationInstances.owl#comment09_10_26_164226.29877071</parent>
</comment>
<comment>
	<id>http://www.semanticweb.org/ontologies/ConversationInstances.owl#comment09_10_26_164226.29877431</id>
	<title>Re:HA is a solution in search of a problem.</title>
	<author>PhantomHarlock</author>
	<datestamp>1256551680000</datestamp>
	<modclass>None</modclass>
	<modscore>1</modscore>
	<htmltext><p>Agreed on most points.   But it's only energy saving if you're controlling enough lights to offset the cost of the controller PC running 24/7, unless you have baked everything into the little Insteon or other plug-in PLC unit.   The fancy dimmers with the LEDs and what not also take up a not-insignificant amount of power compared to the old light switch.</p></htmltext>
<tokenext>Agreed on most points .
But it 's only energy saving if you 're controlling enough lights to offset the cost of the controller PC running 24/7 , unless you have baked everything into the little Insteon or other plug-in PLC unit .
The fancy dimmers with the LEDs and what not also take up a not-insignificant amount of power compared to the old light switch .</tokentext>
<sentencetext>Agreed on most points.
But it's only energy saving if you're controlling enough lights to offset the cost of the controller PC running 24/7, unless you have baked everything into the little Insteon or other plug-in PLC unit.
The fancy dimmers with the LEDs and what not also take up a not-insignificant amount of power compared to the old light switch.</sentencetext>
	<parent>http://www.semanticweb.org/ontologies/ConversationInstances.owl#comment09_10_26_164226.29876917</parent>
</comment>
<comment>
	<id>http://www.semanticweb.org/ontologies/ConversationInstances.owl#comment09_10_26_164226.29876957</id>
	<title>Charmed Quark</title>
	<author>Anonymous</author>
	<datestamp>1256549760000</datestamp>
	<modclass>Informativ</modclass>
	<modscore>1</modscore>
	<htmltext><p>You might want to glaze your eyes over the Charmed Quark Controller (or CQC) at http://www.charmedquark.com<br>So it doesn't run on Linux, and its not open source. But as a testament to the product, its one of the most stable pieces of software I have ever used. It comes boxed with a number of hardware device drivers, an a comprehensive scripting and macro language to extend out its connectivity and functionality.</p><p>On the "cons" side, there's a pretty steep learning curve (which shouldn't be a problem for a<nobr> <wbr></nobr>/.er).  And its not cheap, at around $600 plus $90 annual subscription fee. But again, that pretty much pales into insignificance when you consider all the hardware and wiring costs for a decent HA installation.</p></htmltext>
<tokenext>You might want to glaze your eyes over the Charmed Quark Controller ( or CQC ) at http : //www.charmedquark.comSo it does n't run on Linux , and its not open source .
But as a testament to the product , its one of the most stable pieces of software I have ever used .
It comes boxed with a number of hardware device drivers , an a comprehensive scripting and macro language to extend out its connectivity and functionality.On the " cons " side , there 's a pretty steep learning curve ( which should n't be a problem for a /.er ) .
And its not cheap , at around $ 600 plus $ 90 annual subscription fee .
But again , that pretty much pales into insignificance when you consider all the hardware and wiring costs for a decent HA installation .</tokentext>
<sentencetext>You might want to glaze your eyes over the Charmed Quark Controller (or CQC) at http://www.charmedquark.comSo it doesn't run on Linux, and its not open source.
But as a testament to the product, its one of the most stable pieces of software I have ever used.
It comes boxed with a number of hardware device drivers, an a comprehensive scripting and macro language to extend out its connectivity and functionality.On the "cons" side, there's a pretty steep learning curve (which shouldn't be a problem for a /.er).
And its not cheap, at around $600 plus $90 annual subscription fee.
But again, that pretty much pales into insignificance when you consider all the hardware and wiring costs for a decent HA installation.</sentencetext>
</comment>
<comment>
	<id>http://www.semanticweb.org/ontologies/ConversationInstances.owl#comment09_10_26_164226.29878503</id>
	<title>Re:Wife 1.0</title>
	<author>soundguy</author>
	<datestamp>1256556780000</datestamp>
	<modclass>None</modclass>
	<modscore>1</modscore>
	<htmltext><p>The problem here is that you went for the installed version of Girlfriend 1.0. Try Girlfriend-as-a-service instead. It can seem pricey at first (usually $100-$200 an hour) but there are no permanent resource allocations. There is a significant chance of virus infection though, so be sure to use LaTex with all access ports. Whatever you do, NEVER call customer service.</p></htmltext>
<tokenext>The problem here is that you went for the installed version of Girlfriend 1.0 .
Try Girlfriend-as-a-service instead .
It can seem pricey at first ( usually $ 100- $ 200 an hour ) but there are no permanent resource allocations .
There is a significant chance of virus infection though , so be sure to use LaTex with all access ports .
Whatever you do , NEVER call customer service .</tokentext>
<sentencetext>The problem here is that you went for the installed version of Girlfriend 1.0.
Try Girlfriend-as-a-service instead.
It can seem pricey at first (usually $100-$200 an hour) but there are no permanent resource allocations.
There is a significant chance of virus infection though, so be sure to use LaTex with all access ports.
Whatever you do, NEVER call customer service.</sentencetext>
	<parent>http://www.semanticweb.org/ontologies/ConversationInstances.owl#comment09_10_26_164226.29876445</parent>
</comment>
<comment>
	<id>http://www.semanticweb.org/ontologies/ConversationInstances.owl#comment09_10_26_164226.29876687</id>
	<title>Bleak, No</title>
	<author>MountainLogic</author>
	<datestamp>1256548860000</datestamp>
	<modclass>None</modclass>
	<modscore>1</modscore>
	<htmltext>I would not describe it as bleak, but as ripe with opportunity for innovation.  The biggest barrier is that manufacturers have little interest in playing nice with each other.</htmltext>
<tokenext>I would not describe it as bleak , but as ripe with opportunity for innovation .
The biggest barrier is that manufacturers have little interest in playing nice with each other .</tokentext>
<sentencetext>I would not describe it as bleak, but as ripe with opportunity for innovation.
The biggest barrier is that manufacturers have little interest in playing nice with each other.</sentencetext>
</comment>
<comment>
	<id>http://www.semanticweb.org/ontologies/ConversationInstances.owl#comment09_10_26_164226.29887675</id>
	<title>Re:UPB expensive but really nice</title>
	<author>I'm not really here</author>
	<datestamp>1256675100000</datestamp>
	<modclass>None</modclass>
	<modscore>1</modscore>
	<htmltext>I'd be interested to see some of this integrated with Ubiquity so that your home automation system actually knows where you are and can adjust accordingly.  If you leave work, it knows, and based on previous experiences, predicts when you will be home, kicks in the heat at the right moment, etc., all without you manually doing anything.</htmltext>
<tokenext>I 'd be interested to see some of this integrated with Ubiquity so that your home automation system actually knows where you are and can adjust accordingly .
If you leave work , it knows , and based on previous experiences , predicts when you will be home , kicks in the heat at the right moment , etc. , all without you manually doing anything .</tokentext>
<sentencetext>I'd be interested to see some of this integrated with Ubiquity so that your home automation system actually knows where you are and can adjust accordingly.
If you leave work, it knows, and based on previous experiences, predicts when you will be home, kicks in the heat at the right moment, etc., all without you manually doing anything.</sentencetext>
	<parent>http://www.semanticweb.org/ontologies/ConversationInstances.owl#comment09_10_26_164226.29876713</parent>
</comment>
<comment>
	<id>http://www.semanticweb.org/ontologies/ConversationInstances.owl#comment09_10_26_164226.29881451</id>
	<title>Re:Avoid Open Source!</title>
	<author>Anonymous</author>
	<datestamp>1256676540000</datestamp>
	<modclass>None</modclass>
	<modscore>1</modscore>
	<htmltext>I think i saw that movie last summer..</htmltext>
<tokenext>I think i saw that movie last summer. .</tokentext>
<sentencetext>I think i saw that movie last summer..</sentencetext>
	<parent>http://www.semanticweb.org/ontologies/ConversationInstances.owl#comment09_10_26_164226.29876799</parent>
</comment>
<comment>
	<id>http://www.semanticweb.org/ontologies/ConversationInstances.owl#comment09_10_26_164226.29876707</id>
	<title>Konnex Home Automation</title>
	<author>Anonymous</author>
	<datestamp>1256548920000</datestamp>
	<modclass>Informativ</modclass>
	<modscore>1</modscore>
	<htmltext><p>If you're in Europe, check out Konnex (www.knx.org) which is an open standard that defines HA standards that are implemented by all the major European electrical manufacturing companies. You can mix and match various components from different manufacturors. Eg. use GIRA/Berker switches (sensors) that control the lighting managed by a switching actuator made by Siemens or Hager.</p><p>And yes the specs of this standards are completely open, and Marc Fleury (founder of JBoss) has now launched an open source initiative for Home Automation. See his website: http://www.openremote.org. They also developed an iPhone control module. Quite cool actually!</p></htmltext>
<tokenext>If you 're in Europe , check out Konnex ( www.knx.org ) which is an open standard that defines HA standards that are implemented by all the major European electrical manufacturing companies .
You can mix and match various components from different manufacturors .
Eg. use GIRA/Berker switches ( sensors ) that control the lighting managed by a switching actuator made by Siemens or Hager.And yes the specs of this standards are completely open , and Marc Fleury ( founder of JBoss ) has now launched an open source initiative for Home Automation .
See his website : http : //www.openremote.org .
They also developed an iPhone control module .
Quite cool actually !</tokentext>
<sentencetext>If you're in Europe, check out Konnex (www.knx.org) which is an open standard that defines HA standards that are implemented by all the major European electrical manufacturing companies.
You can mix and match various components from different manufacturors.
Eg. use GIRA/Berker switches (sensors) that control the lighting managed by a switching actuator made by Siemens or Hager.And yes the specs of this standards are completely open, and Marc Fleury (founder of JBoss) has now launched an open source initiative for Home Automation.
See his website: http://www.openremote.org.
They also developed an iPhone control module.
Quite cool actually!</sentencetext>
</comment>
<comment>
	<id>http://www.semanticweb.org/ontologies/ConversationInstances.owl#comment09_10_26_164226.29882485</id>
	<title>Re:Wife 1.0</title>
	<author>linux\_0x740x750x78</author>
	<datestamp>1256650860000</datestamp>
	<modclass>None</modclass>
	<modscore>1</modscore>
	<htmltext>When trying to prevent iBaby from getting installed on Wife 1.0 you MUST take a layered security approach.

1. Install invisible filtering bridge in front of Wife 1.0's gateway.
2. Install Squid proxy on filtering bridge so you can track Wife 1.0's surfing habits.
3. Configure Wife 1.0's firewall to drop ALL PACKETS INCOMING, OUTGOING, AND FORWARDING!
4. Only allow Your IP address INCOMING access to machine running Wife 1.0.

Dropping FORWARDING packets is important, otherwise iBaby might get installed on another machine.</htmltext>
<tokenext>When trying to prevent iBaby from getting installed on Wife 1.0 you MUST take a layered security approach .
1. Install invisible filtering bridge in front of Wife 1.0 's gateway .
2. Install Squid proxy on filtering bridge so you can track Wife 1.0 's surfing habits .
3. Configure Wife 1.0 's firewall to drop ALL PACKETS INCOMING , OUTGOING , AND FORWARDING !
4. Only allow Your IP address INCOMING access to machine running Wife 1.0 .
Dropping FORWARDING packets is important , otherwise iBaby might get installed on another machine .</tokentext>
<sentencetext>When trying to prevent iBaby from getting installed on Wife 1.0 you MUST take a layered security approach.
1. Install invisible filtering bridge in front of Wife 1.0's gateway.
2. Install Squid proxy on filtering bridge so you can track Wife 1.0's surfing habits.
3. Configure Wife 1.0's firewall to drop ALL PACKETS INCOMING, OUTGOING, AND FORWARDING!
4. Only allow Your IP address INCOMING access to machine running Wife 1.0.
Dropping FORWARDING packets is important, otherwise iBaby might get installed on another machine.</sentencetext>
	<parent>http://www.semanticweb.org/ontologies/ConversationInstances.owl#comment09_10_26_164226.29877961</parent>
</comment>
<comment>
	<id>http://www.semanticweb.org/ontologies/ConversationInstances.owl#comment09_10_26_164226.29876751</id>
	<title>Re:X10 makes cool stuff for automation</title>
	<author>Andy Dodd</author>
	<datestamp>1256549100000</datestamp>
	<modclass>Informativ</modclass>
	<modscore>2</modscore>
	<htmltext><p>X10 is CRAP.  It supports only 16 device codes and 16 house codes, and the majority of their controllers are only able to control one housecode at a time.</p><p>In short, there's a total address space of only 256 devices, and it's partitioned into 16 chunks of 16.</p><p>Also, it's heavily unreliable.  The modulation scheme hasn't been revamped in decades to take advantage of modern ECC schemes (which are no longer computationally expensive).</p><p>They could have had great success with an "X10 version 2" with a more robust ECC scheme and larger address space, the closest thing is Insteon which has its own set of problems (namely a history of unfriendliness to open-source efforts.)</p></htmltext>
<tokenext>X10 is CRAP .
It supports only 16 device codes and 16 house codes , and the majority of their controllers are only able to control one housecode at a time.In short , there 's a total address space of only 256 devices , and it 's partitioned into 16 chunks of 16.Also , it 's heavily unreliable .
The modulation scheme has n't been revamped in decades to take advantage of modern ECC schemes ( which are no longer computationally expensive ) .They could have had great success with an " X10 version 2 " with a more robust ECC scheme and larger address space , the closest thing is Insteon which has its own set of problems ( namely a history of unfriendliness to open-source efforts .
)</tokentext>
<sentencetext>X10 is CRAP.
It supports only 16 device codes and 16 house codes, and the majority of their controllers are only able to control one housecode at a time.In short, there's a total address space of only 256 devices, and it's partitioned into 16 chunks of 16.Also, it's heavily unreliable.
The modulation scheme hasn't been revamped in decades to take advantage of modern ECC schemes (which are no longer computationally expensive).They could have had great success with an "X10 version 2" with a more robust ECC scheme and larger address space, the closest thing is Insteon which has its own set of problems (namely a history of unfriendliness to open-source efforts.
)</sentencetext>
	<parent>http://www.semanticweb.org/ontologies/ConversationInstances.owl#comment09_10_26_164226.29876329</parent>
</comment>
<comment>
	<id>http://www.semanticweb.org/ontologies/ConversationInstances.owl#comment09_10_26_164226.29879347</id>
	<title>Re:Doing it wrong</title>
	<author>BitZtream</author>
	<datestamp>1256562540000</datestamp>
	<modclass>None</modclass>
	<modscore>1</modscore>
	<htmltext><blockquote><div><p>Why can't I call my car and tell it to start and run the heater or air?</p></div></blockquote><p>Because you didn't get the remote start package for your car?  Mine does it just fine,  just push the button on the key fob while drinking my morning Mt Dew.  (Or coffee for you masochists.)</p><blockquote><div><p>Why can't I look outside, see that it's starting to rain, and call my car and have it roll the windows up?</p></div> </blockquote><p>Proper automation would alert you and if no response, roll them up on its own.</p><blockquote><div><p>For that matter why can't I roll up the windows without the key in the "run" position?</p></div></blockquote><p>I can, until I get out, in which case having a way to roll the windows down without the key in would make one hell of an easy way to get into the car.  No need to slimjim the door, just get a cloths hanger, push the button on the power windows now just reach in and open the door.  Perhaps you bought the wrong car/package.</p></div>
	</htmltext>
<tokenext>Why ca n't I call my car and tell it to start and run the heater or air ? Because you did n't get the remote start package for your car ?
Mine does it just fine , just push the button on the key fob while drinking my morning Mt Dew .
( Or coffee for you masochists .
) Why ca n't I look outside , see that it 's starting to rain , and call my car and have it roll the windows up ?
Proper automation would alert you and if no response , roll them up on its own.For that matter why ca n't I roll up the windows without the key in the " run " position ? I can , until I get out , in which case having a way to roll the windows down without the key in would make one hell of an easy way to get into the car .
No need to slimjim the door , just get a cloths hanger , push the button on the power windows now just reach in and open the door .
Perhaps you bought the wrong car/package .</tokentext>
<sentencetext>Why can't I call my car and tell it to start and run the heater or air?Because you didn't get the remote start package for your car?
Mine does it just fine,  just push the button on the key fob while drinking my morning Mt Dew.
(Or coffee for you masochists.
)Why can't I look outside, see that it's starting to rain, and call my car and have it roll the windows up?
Proper automation would alert you and if no response, roll them up on its own.For that matter why can't I roll up the windows without the key in the "run" position?I can, until I get out, in which case having a way to roll the windows down without the key in would make one hell of an easy way to get into the car.
No need to slimjim the door, just get a cloths hanger, push the button on the power windows now just reach in and open the door.
Perhaps you bought the wrong car/package.
	</sentencetext>
	<parent>http://www.semanticweb.org/ontologies/ConversationInstances.owl#comment09_10_26_164226.29876757</parent>
</comment>
<comment>
	<id>http://www.semanticweb.org/ontologies/ConversationInstances.owl#comment09_10_26_164226.29877479</id>
	<title>Currently setting up MisterHouse to talk to my poo</title>
	<author>Anonymous</author>
	<datestamp>1256551860000</datestamp>
	<modclass>Informativ</modclass>
	<modscore>2</modscore>
	<htmltext><p>
I recently discovered MisterHouse because it has a module to talk to my Pentair Compool pool controller. I'm documenting my experience here: <a href="http://carlstrom.com/pool/" title="carlstrom.com" rel="nofollow">http://carlstrom.com/pool/</a> [carlstrom.com]
</p><p>
I've found MisterHouse documentation to be frustrating but I've gotten it to do what I need so far for my pool project (allow remote control and to log temperature information over time). I will say that it could use some serious rearchitecture to go along with some better documentation. If I were going to do some more serious HA I would consider trying to improve things, but its good enough for my needs, so I'll just be submitting some minor bug fix / corrections...
</p></htmltext>
<tokenext>I recently discovered MisterHouse because it has a module to talk to my Pentair Compool pool controller .
I 'm documenting my experience here : http : //carlstrom.com/pool/ [ carlstrom.com ] I 've found MisterHouse documentation to be frustrating but I 've gotten it to do what I need so far for my pool project ( allow remote control and to log temperature information over time ) .
I will say that it could use some serious rearchitecture to go along with some better documentation .
If I were going to do some more serious HA I would consider trying to improve things , but its good enough for my needs , so I 'll just be submitting some minor bug fix / corrections.. .</tokentext>
<sentencetext>
I recently discovered MisterHouse because it has a module to talk to my Pentair Compool pool controller.
I'm documenting my experience here: http://carlstrom.com/pool/ [carlstrom.com]

I've found MisterHouse documentation to be frustrating but I've gotten it to do what I need so far for my pool project (allow remote control and to log temperature information over time).
I will say that it could use some serious rearchitecture to go along with some better documentation.
If I were going to do some more serious HA I would consider trying to improve things, but its good enough for my needs, so I'll just be submitting some minor bug fix / corrections...
</sentencetext>
</comment>
<comment>
	<id>http://www.semanticweb.org/ontologies/ConversationInstances.owl#comment09_10_26_164226.29881979</id>
	<title>AMX</title>
	<author>hyperviper66</author>
	<datestamp>1256643240000</datestamp>
	<modclass>None</modclass>
	<modscore>1</modscore>
	<htmltext>I am a builder from Australia and use a system called AMX. It is the most advanced (and most expensive) system available. It does from memory run on a custom unix or linux platform. It can pretty much control anything as long as you have the money to spend on the system. The system in my house was aproximately AUD $230,000 including the Clipsal C-bus lighting system, plasma screens, cinema system, multi-room audio system and lots of other bits &amp; pieces. This might seem expensive but its actually quite a cheap installation for this type of system. AMX is used in the United States Military, the white house, homes such as that of Bill Gates, etc. I highly recommend it if you can afford it. See <a href="http://www.amx.com/" title="amx.com" rel="nofollow">http://www.amx.com/</a> [amx.com]</htmltext>
<tokenext>I am a builder from Australia and use a system called AMX .
It is the most advanced ( and most expensive ) system available .
It does from memory run on a custom unix or linux platform .
It can pretty much control anything as long as you have the money to spend on the system .
The system in my house was aproximately AUD $ 230,000 including the Clipsal C-bus lighting system , plasma screens , cinema system , multi-room audio system and lots of other bits &amp; pieces .
This might seem expensive but its actually quite a cheap installation for this type of system .
AMX is used in the United States Military , the white house , homes such as that of Bill Gates , etc .
I highly recommend it if you can afford it .
See http : //www.amx.com/ [ amx.com ]</tokentext>
<sentencetext>I am a builder from Australia and use a system called AMX.
It is the most advanced (and most expensive) system available.
It does from memory run on a custom unix or linux platform.
It can pretty much control anything as long as you have the money to spend on the system.
The system in my house was aproximately AUD $230,000 including the Clipsal C-bus lighting system, plasma screens, cinema system, multi-room audio system and lots of other bits &amp; pieces.
This might seem expensive but its actually quite a cheap installation for this type of system.
AMX is used in the United States Military, the white house, homes such as that of Bill Gates, etc.
I highly recommend it if you can afford it.
See http://www.amx.com/ [amx.com]</sentencetext>
</comment>
<comment>
	<id>http://www.semanticweb.org/ontologies/ConversationInstances.owl#comment09_10_26_164226.29879241</id>
	<title>Big reason for automation</title>
	<author>cdrguru</author>
	<datestamp>1256561700000</datestamp>
	<modclass>None</modclass>
	<modscore>1</modscore>
	<htmltext><p>We are going to start seeing more and more automation being supplied to us via the power company and/or government regulation.  I know in Florida it is basically a requirement to have your air conditioner on a remote control switch - so the power company can turn it off.  We are going to see this on more and more equipment in the future as electric power demand continues to increase without building any new power plants.</p><p>You might try solar, but it is actually doubtful you are going to put up enough solar panels to run the air conditioner in the early evening.  Noon?  Maybe.  I'd be expecting the refrigerator and big-screen TV to be next on the power company remote control list.</p><p>Maybe having a suitably robust automation system might let you get a jump on things and avoid having your house filled with switches you cannot control.</p></htmltext>
<tokenext>We are going to start seeing more and more automation being supplied to us via the power company and/or government regulation .
I know in Florida it is basically a requirement to have your air conditioner on a remote control switch - so the power company can turn it off .
We are going to see this on more and more equipment in the future as electric power demand continues to increase without building any new power plants.You might try solar , but it is actually doubtful you are going to put up enough solar panels to run the air conditioner in the early evening .
Noon ? Maybe .
I 'd be expecting the refrigerator and big-screen TV to be next on the power company remote control list.Maybe having a suitably robust automation system might let you get a jump on things and avoid having your house filled with switches you can not control .</tokentext>
<sentencetext>We are going to start seeing more and more automation being supplied to us via the power company and/or government regulation.
I know in Florida it is basically a requirement to have your air conditioner on a remote control switch - so the power company can turn it off.
We are going to see this on more and more equipment in the future as electric power demand continues to increase without building any new power plants.You might try solar, but it is actually doubtful you are going to put up enough solar panels to run the air conditioner in the early evening.
Noon?  Maybe.
I'd be expecting the refrigerator and big-screen TV to be next on the power company remote control list.Maybe having a suitably robust automation system might let you get a jump on things and avoid having your house filled with switches you cannot control.</sentencetext>
</comment>
<comment>
	<id>http://www.semanticweb.org/ontologies/ConversationInstances.owl#comment09_10_26_164226.29877587</id>
	<title>Re:HA is a solution in search of a problem.</title>
	<author>Animats</author>
	<datestamp>1256552280000</datestamp>
	<modclass>None</modclass>
	<modscore>1</modscore>
	<htmltext><p>
<i>
The reason there's no 'good' home automation products is because there's not enough demand, pure and simple. At the end of the day, HA is 99\% bling and maybe 1\% utility.</i>
</p><p>
Agreed.  The place where building automation is underused, though, is in places that have meeting rooms - schools, universities, churches, offices, and hotels.  Meeting rooms need the <a href="http://www.trane.com/Commercial/DNA/View.aspx?i=962" title="trane.com">full set of sensors</a> [trane.com] for HVAC control - movement, heat, C02, CO, temperature, and humidity.  These are in place in many buildings today, but not in enough of them.
</p><p>
Meeting rooms have the property that the people load changes suddenly.   A completely empty room can have its lights turned out, or at least very low, and the air change rate can be cut very low.  When people enter a room, the lights come up, dampers open, and blower speeds increase.  The CO2 measurement is an indicator of people load; when CO2 goes up, blower speeds have to go up to increase the air change rate.  CO content indicates smokers, which means more air has to be drawn from the outside.  And, of course, the system is measuring these parameters for outside air, so outside air can be used to heat, cool, humidify, or dehumidify, as required.
</p><p>
This alone makes meeting rooms much more pleasant, while cutting energy use.   But there's no "bling factor" to this.  It's invisible to almost everyone.
</p><p>
The next time you enter a conference room with a group in a modern building, listen for blowers winding up to speed and the whir of motors moving dampers.   Somewhere, a microcontroller and network are quietly doing their job.</p></htmltext>
<tokenext>The reason there 's no 'good ' home automation products is because there 's not enough demand , pure and simple .
At the end of the day , HA is 99 \ % bling and maybe 1 \ % utility .
Agreed. The place where building automation is underused , though , is in places that have meeting rooms - schools , universities , churches , offices , and hotels .
Meeting rooms need the full set of sensors [ trane.com ] for HVAC control - movement , heat , C02 , CO , temperature , and humidity .
These are in place in many buildings today , but not in enough of them .
Meeting rooms have the property that the people load changes suddenly .
A completely empty room can have its lights turned out , or at least very low , and the air change rate can be cut very low .
When people enter a room , the lights come up , dampers open , and blower speeds increase .
The CO2 measurement is an indicator of people load ; when CO2 goes up , blower speeds have to go up to increase the air change rate .
CO content indicates smokers , which means more air has to be drawn from the outside .
And , of course , the system is measuring these parameters for outside air , so outside air can be used to heat , cool , humidify , or dehumidify , as required .
This alone makes meeting rooms much more pleasant , while cutting energy use .
But there 's no " bling factor " to this .
It 's invisible to almost everyone .
The next time you enter a conference room with a group in a modern building , listen for blowers winding up to speed and the whir of motors moving dampers .
Somewhere , a microcontroller and network are quietly doing their job .</tokentext>
<sentencetext>

The reason there's no 'good' home automation products is because there's not enough demand, pure and simple.
At the end of the day, HA is 99\% bling and maybe 1\% utility.
Agreed.  The place where building automation is underused, though, is in places that have meeting rooms - schools, universities, churches, offices, and hotels.
Meeting rooms need the full set of sensors [trane.com] for HVAC control - movement, heat, C02, CO, temperature, and humidity.
These are in place in many buildings today, but not in enough of them.
Meeting rooms have the property that the people load changes suddenly.
A completely empty room can have its lights turned out, or at least very low, and the air change rate can be cut very low.
When people enter a room, the lights come up, dampers open, and blower speeds increase.
The CO2 measurement is an indicator of people load; when CO2 goes up, blower speeds have to go up to increase the air change rate.
CO content indicates smokers, which means more air has to be drawn from the outside.
And, of course, the system is measuring these parameters for outside air, so outside air can be used to heat, cool, humidify, or dehumidify, as required.
This alone makes meeting rooms much more pleasant, while cutting energy use.
But there's no "bling factor" to this.
It's invisible to almost everyone.
The next time you enter a conference room with a group in a modern building, listen for blowers winding up to speed and the whir of motors moving dampers.
Somewhere, a microcontroller and network are quietly doing their job.</sentencetext>
	<parent>http://www.semanticweb.org/ontologies/ConversationInstances.owl#comment09_10_26_164226.29876917</parent>
</comment>
<comment>
	<id>http://www.semanticweb.org/ontologies/ConversationInstances.owl#comment09_10_26_164226.29883551</id>
	<title>Re:Doing it wrong</title>
	<author>Anonymous</author>
	<datestamp>1256657100000</datestamp>
	<modclass>None</modclass>
	<modscore>0</modscore>
	<htmltext><p><div class="quote"><p>The reason that the field hasn't developed or matured is that the approach being taken for most products is wrong.  There needs to be a domicile wireless standard that either uses the wifi or separate from it.  They need key-based access control, so that your Android or iPhone or whatever can interface with them.  New devices can be autodetected.</p><p>The problem is that no one has taken the lead and made this happen.  It can though.  For example, cooking supper your toaster, oven, microwave, and stovetop could all supply timing and temperature information to the network, and you could make changes to each from your phone/console/ps3/etc.</p><p>This isn't going to happen if every device has to have a driver for every other device.  It won't happen if you have to add each device manually (ie, configure, not just adding your key).  But it should instead be made a self-organizing system.</p></div><p>There is actually a proposal for exactly what you want: <a href="http://www.exceptionalinnovation.com/products/dpws.php" title="exceptiona...vation.com" rel="nofollow">Devices Profile for Web Services (DPWS)</a> [exceptiona...vation.com]. Anyone could use it.</p><p>From the page:</p><p><div class="quote"><p> <b>Plug &amp; Play for Ethernet</b> </p><p>DPWS delivers true plug-n-play functionality in an Ethernet device-connected environment. The vision is of disparate devices made by a variety of vendors communicating seamlessly over a network in which new devices are automatically discovered and made available to applications for use.</p><p>For example, DPWS-enabled networked peripherals such as printers or scanners can be detected and put into service by remote users as soon as they are added to the network. With DPWS, the same discovery and configuration process that PC users have embraced when adding a peripheral device locally via USB is now available over a network.</p><p>For this reason, many refer to DPWS as "USB for Ethernet." It provides an important and simple new extension of device functionality into the networked environment. What's more, the vast majority of today's existing IT professionals already possess Microsoft-based networking experience to allow them to quickly and easily implement and administer a DPWS solution on their networks.</p></div><p>Granted, it's targeted at Windows, but since it's a web service surely a smart Linux/Open Source programmer could write equivalent software.</p></div>
	</htmltext>
<tokenext>The reason that the field has n't developed or matured is that the approach being taken for most products is wrong .
There needs to be a domicile wireless standard that either uses the wifi or separate from it .
They need key-based access control , so that your Android or iPhone or whatever can interface with them .
New devices can be autodetected.The problem is that no one has taken the lead and made this happen .
It can though .
For example , cooking supper your toaster , oven , microwave , and stovetop could all supply timing and temperature information to the network , and you could make changes to each from your phone/console/ps3/etc.This is n't going to happen if every device has to have a driver for every other device .
It wo n't happen if you have to add each device manually ( ie , configure , not just adding your key ) .
But it should instead be made a self-organizing system.There is actually a proposal for exactly what you want : Devices Profile for Web Services ( DPWS ) [ exceptiona...vation.com ] .
Anyone could use it.From the page : Plug &amp; Play for Ethernet DPWS delivers true plug-n-play functionality in an Ethernet device-connected environment .
The vision is of disparate devices made by a variety of vendors communicating seamlessly over a network in which new devices are automatically discovered and made available to applications for use.For example , DPWS-enabled networked peripherals such as printers or scanners can be detected and put into service by remote users as soon as they are added to the network .
With DPWS , the same discovery and configuration process that PC users have embraced when adding a peripheral device locally via USB is now available over a network.For this reason , many refer to DPWS as " USB for Ethernet .
" It provides an important and simple new extension of device functionality into the networked environment .
What 's more , the vast majority of today 's existing IT professionals already possess Microsoft-based networking experience to allow them to quickly and easily implement and administer a DPWS solution on their networks.Granted , it 's targeted at Windows , but since it 's a web service surely a smart Linux/Open Source programmer could write equivalent software .</tokentext>
<sentencetext>The reason that the field hasn't developed or matured is that the approach being taken for most products is wrong.
There needs to be a domicile wireless standard that either uses the wifi or separate from it.
They need key-based access control, so that your Android or iPhone or whatever can interface with them.
New devices can be autodetected.The problem is that no one has taken the lead and made this happen.
It can though.
For example, cooking supper your toaster, oven, microwave, and stovetop could all supply timing and temperature information to the network, and you could make changes to each from your phone/console/ps3/etc.This isn't going to happen if every device has to have a driver for every other device.
It won't happen if you have to add each device manually (ie, configure, not just adding your key).
But it should instead be made a self-organizing system.There is actually a proposal for exactly what you want: Devices Profile for Web Services (DPWS) [exceptiona...vation.com].
Anyone could use it.From the page: Plug &amp; Play for Ethernet DPWS delivers true plug-n-play functionality in an Ethernet device-connected environment.
The vision is of disparate devices made by a variety of vendors communicating seamlessly over a network in which new devices are automatically discovered and made available to applications for use.For example, DPWS-enabled networked peripherals such as printers or scanners can be detected and put into service by remote users as soon as they are added to the network.
With DPWS, the same discovery and configuration process that PC users have embraced when adding a peripheral device locally via USB is now available over a network.For this reason, many refer to DPWS as "USB for Ethernet.
" It provides an important and simple new extension of device functionality into the networked environment.
What's more, the vast majority of today's existing IT professionals already possess Microsoft-based networking experience to allow them to quickly and easily implement and administer a DPWS solution on their networks.Granted, it's targeted at Windows, but since it's a web service surely a smart Linux/Open Source programmer could write equivalent software.
	</sentencetext>
	<parent>http://www.semanticweb.org/ontologies/ConversationInstances.owl#comment09_10_26_164226.29876223</parent>
</comment>
<comment>
	<id>http://www.semanticweb.org/ontologies/ConversationInstances.owl#comment09_10_26_164226.29876761</id>
	<title>Re:Same as linux on the desktop</title>
	<author>sco\_robinso</author>
	<datestamp>1256549160000</datestamp>
	<modclass>None</modclass>
	<modscore>1</modscore>
	<htmltext>Agreed. The home automation field seems to have many of the same issues as Linux and many FOSS projects - too many small players and not enough industry-wide standardization and focus. As the OP points out, there's tons of options out there, all with their own major issues and problems. Crestron and AMX are the two big players out there, but they're not cheap, and far from open.</htmltext>
<tokenext>Agreed .
The home automation field seems to have many of the same issues as Linux and many FOSS projects - too many small players and not enough industry-wide standardization and focus .
As the OP points out , there 's tons of options out there , all with their own major issues and problems .
Crestron and AMX are the two big players out there , but they 're not cheap , and far from open .</tokentext>
<sentencetext>Agreed.
The home automation field seems to have many of the same issues as Linux and many FOSS projects - too many small players and not enough industry-wide standardization and focus.
As the OP points out, there's tons of options out there, all with their own major issues and problems.
Crestron and AMX are the two big players out there, but they're not cheap, and far from open.</sentencetext>
	<parent>http://www.semanticweb.org/ontologies/ConversationInstances.owl#comment09_10_26_164226.29876345</parent>
</comment>
<comment>
	<id>http://www.semanticweb.org/ontologies/ConversationInstances.owl#comment09_10_26_164226.29878851</id>
	<title>Re:Doing it wrong</title>
	<author>uiucgrad</author>
	<datestamp>1256559240000</datestamp>
	<modclass>None</modclass>
	<modscore>1</modscore>
	<htmltext><p>I think I remember Jini being touted for this kind of stuff as well.  Not much mention of it on the Wikipedia page though.</p><p>http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Jini<br>https://home-automation.dev.java.net/</p></htmltext>
<tokenext>I think I remember Jini being touted for this kind of stuff as well .
Not much mention of it on the Wikipedia page though.http : //en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Jinihttps : //home-automation.dev.java.net/</tokentext>
<sentencetext>I think I remember Jini being touted for this kind of stuff as well.
Not much mention of it on the Wikipedia page though.http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Jinihttps://home-automation.dev.java.net/</sentencetext>
	<parent>http://www.semanticweb.org/ontologies/ConversationInstances.owl#comment09_10_26_164226.29876223</parent>
</comment>
<comment>
	<id>http://www.semanticweb.org/ontologies/ConversationInstances.owl#comment09_10_26_164226.29883397</id>
	<title>Re:Doing it wrong</title>
	<author>pbhj</author>
	<datestamp>1256656260000</datestamp>
	<modclass>None</modclass>
	<modscore>1</modscore>
	<htmltext><p><div class="quote"><p>Look, it's pretty obvious that you have NEVER cooked anything. If you're cooking YOU'RE IN THE DAMNED KITCHEN!</p> </div><p>Cookers have had simple timers for a long time. Sometimes when you've set the timer to cook the food and you're out of the house you get delayed<nobr> <wbr></nobr>... why not login to the home network and bump back the cooking start-time a little so it's still hot when you get in?</p></div>
	</htmltext>
<tokenext>Look , it 's pretty obvious that you have NEVER cooked anything .
If you 're cooking YOU 'RE IN THE DAMNED KITCHEN !
Cookers have had simple timers for a long time .
Sometimes when you 've set the timer to cook the food and you 're out of the house you get delayed ... why not login to the home network and bump back the cooking start-time a little so it 's still hot when you get in ?</tokentext>
<sentencetext>Look, it's pretty obvious that you have NEVER cooked anything.
If you're cooking YOU'RE IN THE DAMNED KITCHEN!
Cookers have had simple timers for a long time.
Sometimes when you've set the timer to cook the food and you're out of the house you get delayed ... why not login to the home network and bump back the cooking start-time a little so it's still hot when you get in?
	</sentencetext>
	<parent>http://www.semanticweb.org/ontologies/ConversationInstances.owl#comment09_10_26_164226.29876757</parent>
</comment>
<comment>
	<id>http://www.semanticweb.org/ontologies/ConversationInstances.owl#comment09_10_26_164226.29878761</id>
	<title>Re:Home automation</title>
	<author>sootman</author>
	<datestamp>1256558520000</datestamp>
	<modclass>Funny</modclass>
	<modscore>2</modscore>
	<htmltext><p>I don't want to start a holy war here, but what is the deal with you Open Source House fanatics? I've been sitting here at my freelance gig on an Open Source House elevator for about 20 minutes now while it attempts to climb 17 floors. 20 minutes. At home, on my <a href="http://www.microsoft.com/windowsembedded/en-us/about/devices/agm/home-auto-gate.mspx" title="microsoft.com">Microsoft Home Automation Gateways</a> [microsoft.com] MagicStair, running Escalator 1.0, which by all standards should be a lot slower than this Elevator, the same operation would take about 2 minutes. If that.</p><p>In addition, while on this elevator, my microwave will not work. And everything else has ground to a halt. Even the parking garage is straining to keep up as I type this...</p></htmltext>
<tokenext>I do n't want to start a holy war here , but what is the deal with you Open Source House fanatics ?
I 've been sitting here at my freelance gig on an Open Source House elevator for about 20 minutes now while it attempts to climb 17 floors .
20 minutes .
At home , on my Microsoft Home Automation Gateways [ microsoft.com ] MagicStair , running Escalator 1.0 , which by all standards should be a lot slower than this Elevator , the same operation would take about 2 minutes .
If that.In addition , while on this elevator , my microwave will not work .
And everything else has ground to a halt .
Even the parking garage is straining to keep up as I type this.. .</tokentext>
<sentencetext>I don't want to start a holy war here, but what is the deal with you Open Source House fanatics?
I've been sitting here at my freelance gig on an Open Source House elevator for about 20 minutes now while it attempts to climb 17 floors.
20 minutes.
At home, on my Microsoft Home Automation Gateways [microsoft.com] MagicStair, running Escalator 1.0, which by all standards should be a lot slower than this Elevator, the same operation would take about 2 minutes.
If that.In addition, while on this elevator, my microwave will not work.
And everything else has ground to a halt.
Even the parking garage is straining to keep up as I type this...</sentencetext>
	<parent>http://www.semanticweb.org/ontologies/ConversationInstances.owl#comment09_10_26_164226.29876157</parent>
</comment>
<comment>
	<id>http://www.semanticweb.org/ontologies/ConversationInstances.owl#comment09_10_26_164226.29880029</id>
	<title>Re:Welcome to my money pit!</title>
	<author>Anonymous</author>
	<datestamp>1256568780000</datestamp>
	<modclass>None</modclass>
	<modscore>0</modscore>
	<htmltext><p>Another possible feature could include a Vacation setting that simulates people are home while you're away</p></htmltext>
<tokenext>Another possible feature could include a Vacation setting that simulates people are home while you 're away</tokentext>
<sentencetext>Another possible feature could include a Vacation setting that simulates people are home while you're away</sentencetext>
	<parent>http://www.semanticweb.org/ontologies/ConversationInstances.owl#comment09_10_26_164226.29877425</parent>
</comment>
<comment>
	<id>http://www.semanticweb.org/ontologies/ConversationInstances.owl#comment09_10_26_164226.29876477</id>
	<title>Re:Wife 1.0</title>
	<author>Anonymous</author>
	<datestamp>1256548020000</datestamp>
	<modclass>Insightful</modclass>
	<modscore>0</modscore>
	<htmltext><p><div class="quote"><p>I found that v3.0 to be much better then the previous versions, the 3.0 version includes such a vast feature sets like "cooking, cleaning, sex, full time work and mute button"</p></div><p>If you treated them like people, you wouldn't be on your third one, loser.</p></div>
	</htmltext>
<tokenext>I found that v3.0 to be much better then the previous versions , the 3.0 version includes such a vast feature sets like " cooking , cleaning , sex , full time work and mute button " If you treated them like people , you would n't be on your third one , loser .</tokentext>
<sentencetext>I found that v3.0 to be much better then the previous versions, the 3.0 version includes such a vast feature sets like "cooking, cleaning, sex, full time work and mute button"If you treated them like people, you wouldn't be on your third one, loser.
	</sentencetext>
	<parent>http://www.semanticweb.org/ontologies/ConversationInstances.owl#comment09_10_26_164226.29876373</parent>
</comment>
<comment>
	<id>http://www.semanticweb.org/ontologies/ConversationInstances.owl#comment09_10_26_164226.29878637</id>
	<title>Why PC Based?</title>
	<author>Anonymous</author>
	<datestamp>1256557680000</datestamp>
	<modclass>None</modclass>
	<modscore>0</modscore>
	<htmltext><p>I dont see why you need a system to be PC Based and tied to a Desktop OS. What little I've done in college utilizing PLC's and PIC based circuitry has allowed me to lay alot of theory groundwork (being a poor student implementation is more than I can afford) on setting up automation systems not connected to any PC. Probably if I would look around I could obtain most of the core infrastructure quite cheap as scrap Industrial controls.</p><p>Point of statement &gt; Look beyond the desktop computer for your needs, and you will find all the tools are there and they just need the right mind to put them together.</p></htmltext>
<tokenext>I dont see why you need a system to be PC Based and tied to a Desktop OS .
What little I 've done in college utilizing PLC 's and PIC based circuitry has allowed me to lay alot of theory groundwork ( being a poor student implementation is more than I can afford ) on setting up automation systems not connected to any PC .
Probably if I would look around I could obtain most of the core infrastructure quite cheap as scrap Industrial controls.Point of statement &gt; Look beyond the desktop computer for your needs , and you will find all the tools are there and they just need the right mind to put them together .</tokentext>
<sentencetext>I dont see why you need a system to be PC Based and tied to a Desktop OS.
What little I've done in college utilizing PLC's and PIC based circuitry has allowed me to lay alot of theory groundwork (being a poor student implementation is more than I can afford) on setting up automation systems not connected to any PC.
Probably if I would look around I could obtain most of the core infrastructure quite cheap as scrap Industrial controls.Point of statement &gt; Look beyond the desktop computer for your needs, and you will find all the tools are there and they just need the right mind to put them together.</sentencetext>
</comment>
<comment>
	<id>http://www.semanticweb.org/ontologies/ConversationInstances.owl#comment09_10_26_164226.29883429</id>
	<title>Re:Wife 1.0</title>
	<author>cadience</author>
	<datestamp>1256656440000</datestamp>
	<modclass>None</modclass>
	<modscore>1</modscore>
	<htmltext>Wife 1.0 is much less advanced than mom. 1.0 in terms of hose "automation". Wife 1.0 is alot like vista.  Are you sure you want to do X, it's not really a good idea.<nobr> <wbr></nobr>...or "you didn't DO Y"  or "Do Z", but no mater what, wife 1.0 doesn't just take care of it...sigh.</htmltext>
<tokenext>Wife 1.0 is much less advanced than mom .
1.0 in terms of hose " automation " .
Wife 1.0 is alot like vista .
Are you sure you want to do X , it 's not really a good idea .
...or " you did n't DO Y " or " Do Z " , but no mater what , wife 1.0 does n't just take care of it...sigh .</tokentext>
<sentencetext>Wife 1.0 is much less advanced than mom.
1.0 in terms of hose "automation".
Wife 1.0 is alot like vista.
Are you sure you want to do X, it's not really a good idea.
...or "you didn't DO Y"  or "Do Z", but no mater what, wife 1.0 doesn't just take care of it...sigh.</sentencetext>
	<parent>http://www.semanticweb.org/ontologies/ConversationInstances.owl#comment09_10_26_164226.29876341</parent>
</comment>
<comment>
	<id>http://www.semanticweb.org/ontologies/ConversationInstances.owl#comment09_10_26_164226.29879435</id>
	<title>Re:Good luck</title>
	<author>BitZtream</author>
	<datestamp>1256563200000</datestamp>
	<modclass>None</modclass>
	<modscore>1</modscore>
	<htmltext><p>Not really sure what the outside temperature matters.  If its 2 degrees outside, and my house is at a comfortable temp, theres no reason to turn on anything because of the outside temp.</p><p>It could be 62f outside, and 90f in my office due to the PCs in it, I expect the system to deal with that regardless of outside temp.</p><p>Time of day is not real useful as well.  I have a thermostat that supports scheduling and what I've found is that I set the schedule to be the same all the time anyway, its cheaper to keep the house cool then to have the AC or heater run like hell to fix the problem before I get home, or to have a home thats uncomfortable because I came home early.</p><p>By the sound of it, your father over engineered the problem and wasted time and money.  Its okay, as a geek, its an unwritten law, unless he worked for NASA, in which case he shouldn't work for NASA.</p><p>The real reason people don't do it?  They don't see the need for it.</p><p>If you want your lights on as a security precaution, buy an alarm, its far more effective.  Temps should generally remain consistent to provide comfort.  I've considered setting up automation on several occasions and every time I've come to the conclusion that the additional complexity and lowered reliability and chance for it to screw up are far worse than any benefits, perceived or otherwise that would result from doing so.  There just ISN'T that much stuff that needs automated.  Even with things like your coffee in the morning.  You've got to set the machine up with water and coffee the day before anyway, at which point you can push the button to turn it on automatically, and if you forget to add water, you don't burn your house down.  A 5 minute wait for coffee is far better than a trip to the hospital burn unit or funeral home.</p></htmltext>
<tokenext>Not really sure what the outside temperature matters .
If its 2 degrees outside , and my house is at a comfortable temp , theres no reason to turn on anything because of the outside temp.It could be 62f outside , and 90f in my office due to the PCs in it , I expect the system to deal with that regardless of outside temp.Time of day is not real useful as well .
I have a thermostat that supports scheduling and what I 've found is that I set the schedule to be the same all the time anyway , its cheaper to keep the house cool then to have the AC or heater run like hell to fix the problem before I get home , or to have a home thats uncomfortable because I came home early.By the sound of it , your father over engineered the problem and wasted time and money .
Its okay , as a geek , its an unwritten law , unless he worked for NASA , in which case he should n't work for NASA.The real reason people do n't do it ?
They do n't see the need for it.If you want your lights on as a security precaution , buy an alarm , its far more effective .
Temps should generally remain consistent to provide comfort .
I 've considered setting up automation on several occasions and every time I 've come to the conclusion that the additional complexity and lowered reliability and chance for it to screw up are far worse than any benefits , perceived or otherwise that would result from doing so .
There just IS N'T that much stuff that needs automated .
Even with things like your coffee in the morning .
You 've got to set the machine up with water and coffee the day before anyway , at which point you can push the button to turn it on automatically , and if you forget to add water , you do n't burn your house down .
A 5 minute wait for coffee is far better than a trip to the hospital burn unit or funeral home .</tokentext>
<sentencetext>Not really sure what the outside temperature matters.
If its 2 degrees outside, and my house is at a comfortable temp, theres no reason to turn on anything because of the outside temp.It could be 62f outside, and 90f in my office due to the PCs in it, I expect the system to deal with that regardless of outside temp.Time of day is not real useful as well.
I have a thermostat that supports scheduling and what I've found is that I set the schedule to be the same all the time anyway, its cheaper to keep the house cool then to have the AC or heater run like hell to fix the problem before I get home, or to have a home thats uncomfortable because I came home early.By the sound of it, your father over engineered the problem and wasted time and money.
Its okay, as a geek, its an unwritten law, unless he worked for NASA, in which case he shouldn't work for NASA.The real reason people don't do it?
They don't see the need for it.If you want your lights on as a security precaution, buy an alarm, its far more effective.
Temps should generally remain consistent to provide comfort.
I've considered setting up automation on several occasions and every time I've come to the conclusion that the additional complexity and lowered reliability and chance for it to screw up are far worse than any benefits, perceived or otherwise that would result from doing so.
There just ISN'T that much stuff that needs automated.
Even with things like your coffee in the morning.
You've got to set the machine up with water and coffee the day before anyway, at which point you can push the button to turn it on automatically, and if you forget to add water, you don't burn your house down.
A 5 minute wait for coffee is far better than a trip to the hospital burn unit or funeral home.</sentencetext>
	<parent>http://www.semanticweb.org/ontologies/ConversationInstances.owl#comment09_10_26_164226.29876267</parent>
</comment>
<comment>
	<id>http://www.semanticweb.org/ontologies/ConversationInstances.owl#comment09_10_26_164226.29876329</id>
	<title>X10 makes cool stuff for automation</title>
	<author>Anonymous</author>
	<datestamp>1256590500000</datestamp>
	<modclass>Interestin</modclass>
	<modscore>2</modscore>
	<htmltext>You know, that annoying company that bombarded the late 90's with ads about their X10 "Spy Camera" system?<br><br>Well, the same company now makes all sorts of neat wireless and wired gadgets for automating your house. You can get replacement switches and outlets, or add-on ones (that plug into existing outlets) and can be controlled by their own wireless panels or by a computer interface. I know they have software for Windows but something might be available on Linux.<br><br>Basically with the X10 system you could potentially control every outlet, switch, and light with a single interface, as well as any low-voltage system (garage doors, etc) you want. You can also wire up sensors to windows and doors in order to trigger events such as turning on a light, sounding an alarm, or via the computer sending an e-mail or making a phone call.<br><br>Cool stuff, and when I buy a house I'm going to run the full gamut with these things. The nice thing is that the individual outlets and such aren't overly expensive so you could start with just a few and expand your system over time.</htmltext>
<tokenext>You know , that annoying company that bombarded the late 90 's with ads about their X10 " Spy Camera " system ? Well , the same company now makes all sorts of neat wireless and wired gadgets for automating your house .
You can get replacement switches and outlets , or add-on ones ( that plug into existing outlets ) and can be controlled by their own wireless panels or by a computer interface .
I know they have software for Windows but something might be available on Linux.Basically with the X10 system you could potentially control every outlet , switch , and light with a single interface , as well as any low-voltage system ( garage doors , etc ) you want .
You can also wire up sensors to windows and doors in order to trigger events such as turning on a light , sounding an alarm , or via the computer sending an e-mail or making a phone call.Cool stuff , and when I buy a house I 'm going to run the full gamut with these things .
The nice thing is that the individual outlets and such are n't overly expensive so you could start with just a few and expand your system over time .</tokentext>
<sentencetext>You know, that annoying company that bombarded the late 90's with ads about their X10 "Spy Camera" system?Well, the same company now makes all sorts of neat wireless and wired gadgets for automating your house.
You can get replacement switches and outlets, or add-on ones (that plug into existing outlets) and can be controlled by their own wireless panels or by a computer interface.
I know they have software for Windows but something might be available on Linux.Basically with the X10 system you could potentially control every outlet, switch, and light with a single interface, as well as any low-voltage system (garage doors, etc) you want.
You can also wire up sensors to windows and doors in order to trigger events such as turning on a light, sounding an alarm, or via the computer sending an e-mail or making a phone call.Cool stuff, and when I buy a house I'm going to run the full gamut with these things.
The nice thing is that the individual outlets and such aren't overly expensive so you could start with just a few and expand your system over time.</sentencetext>
</comment>
<comment>
	<id>http://www.semanticweb.org/ontologies/ConversationInstances.owl#comment09_10_26_164226.29881203</id>
	<title>Pachube</title>
	<author>Anonymous</author>
	<datestamp>1256585640000</datestamp>
	<modclass>None</modclass>
	<modscore>0</modscore>
	<htmltext><p>You might try the Pachube community for ideas:  <a href="http://www.pachube.com/" title="pachube.com" rel="nofollow">http://www.pachube.com/</a> [pachube.com] and  <a href="http://community.pachube.com/" title="pachube.com" rel="nofollow">http://community.pachube.com/</a> [pachube.com].</p></htmltext>
<tokenext>You might try the Pachube community for ideas : http : //www.pachube.com/ [ pachube.com ] and http : //community.pachube.com/ [ pachube.com ] .</tokentext>
<sentencetext>You might try the Pachube community for ideas:  http://www.pachube.com/ [pachube.com] and  http://community.pachube.com/ [pachube.com].</sentencetext>
</comment>
<comment>
	<id>http://www.semanticweb.org/ontologies/ConversationInstances.owl#comment09_10_26_164226.29879197</id>
	<title>Re:Good luck</title>
	<author>uvsc\_wolverine</author>
	<datestamp>1256561400000</datestamp>
	<modclass>None</modclass>
	<modscore>1</modscore>
	<htmltext>That's part of why my dad was able to do so much with his.  They custom built the house and he went over on weekends and ran several miles of cable through the walls before the drywall went up.  There were multiple coax, POTS, and cat5 runs to each room, with a few extra things thrown in for future availability.  Once the house was up it was a simple matter of plugging everything in.
<br>
<br>
I agree with you totally.  Retrofitting sucks.</htmltext>
<tokenext>That 's part of why my dad was able to do so much with his .
They custom built the house and he went over on weekends and ran several miles of cable through the walls before the drywall went up .
There were multiple coax , POTS , and cat5 runs to each room , with a few extra things thrown in for future availability .
Once the house was up it was a simple matter of plugging everything in .
I agree with you totally .
Retrofitting sucks .</tokentext>
<sentencetext>That's part of why my dad was able to do so much with his.
They custom built the house and he went over on weekends and ran several miles of cable through the walls before the drywall went up.
There were multiple coax, POTS, and cat5 runs to each room, with a few extra things thrown in for future availability.
Once the house was up it was a simple matter of plugging everything in.
I agree with you totally.
Retrofitting sucks.</sentencetext>
	<parent>http://www.semanticweb.org/ontologies/ConversationInstances.owl#comment09_10_26_164226.29876773</parent>
</comment>
<comment>
	<id>http://www.semanticweb.org/ontologies/ConversationInstances.owl#comment09_10_26_164226.29876223</id>
	<title>Doing it wrong</title>
	<author>Anonymous</author>
	<datestamp>1256590080000</datestamp>
	<modclass>Interestin</modclass>
	<modscore>4</modscore>
	<htmltext><p>The reason that the field hasn't developed or matured is that the approach being taken for most products is wrong.  There needs to be a domicile wireless standard that either uses the wifi or separate from it.  They need key-based access control, so that your Android or iPhone or whatever can interface with them.  New devices can be autodetected.</p><p>The problem is that no one has taken the lead and made this happen.  It can though.  For example, cooking supper your toaster, oven, microwave, and stovetop could all supply timing and temperature information to the network, and you could make changes to each from your phone/console/ps3/etc.</p><p>This isn't going to happen if every device has to have a driver for every other device.  It won't happen if you have to add each device manually (ie, configure, not just adding your key).  But it should instead be made a self-organizing system.</p></htmltext>
<tokenext>The reason that the field has n't developed or matured is that the approach being taken for most products is wrong .
There needs to be a domicile wireless standard that either uses the wifi or separate from it .
They need key-based access control , so that your Android or iPhone or whatever can interface with them .
New devices can be autodetected.The problem is that no one has taken the lead and made this happen .
It can though .
For example , cooking supper your toaster , oven , microwave , and stovetop could all supply timing and temperature information to the network , and you could make changes to each from your phone/console/ps3/etc.This is n't going to happen if every device has to have a driver for every other device .
It wo n't happen if you have to add each device manually ( ie , configure , not just adding your key ) .
But it should instead be made a self-organizing system .</tokentext>
<sentencetext>The reason that the field hasn't developed or matured is that the approach being taken for most products is wrong.
There needs to be a domicile wireless standard that either uses the wifi or separate from it.
They need key-based access control, so that your Android or iPhone or whatever can interface with them.
New devices can be autodetected.The problem is that no one has taken the lead and made this happen.
It can though.
For example, cooking supper your toaster, oven, microwave, and stovetop could all supply timing and temperature information to the network, and you could make changes to each from your phone/console/ps3/etc.This isn't going to happen if every device has to have a driver for every other device.
It won't happen if you have to add each device manually (ie, configure, not just adding your key).
But it should instead be made a self-organizing system.</sentencetext>
</comment>
<comment>
	<id>http://www.semanticweb.org/ontologies/ConversationInstances.owl#comment09_10_26_164226.29880931</id>
	<title>Not forgotten...</title>
	<author>taneli.otala</author>
	<datestamp>1256580420000</datestamp>
	<modclass>None</modclass>
	<modscore>1</modscore>
	<htmltext>I've been building various levels of home automation for the last 12 years...

A year ago, I gave up on X10/HomeDaemon, as it seems both were practically abandoned.

I've built a fourth generation home automation system on a Scala based framework -- distributed, self learning, combining X10 and various relay-based systems.
Insteon turned out to be a pipe dream or hype, X10 is unreliable unless run with repeaters, repeaters are not simple to operate,<nobr> <wbr></nobr>...

So, I've gone for a hybrid -- X10 with repeaters, software cognizant of the limitations of the repeaters and ranges; relays, portmasters, sensors (some DIY), and mostly just some serious distributed computing.
My house has Solar panels, jacuzzi, kids, about 30 computers, all the rope you need (to hang yourself), and a very understanding wife.

More, as I get a chance, at <a href="http://pointyhair.com/" title="pointyhair.com" rel="nofollow">http://pointyhair.com/</a> [pointyhair.com]</htmltext>
<tokenext>I 've been building various levels of home automation for the last 12 years.. . A year ago , I gave up on X10/HomeDaemon , as it seems both were practically abandoned .
I 've built a fourth generation home automation system on a Scala based framework -- distributed , self learning , combining X10 and various relay-based systems .
Insteon turned out to be a pipe dream or hype , X10 is unreliable unless run with repeaters , repeaters are not simple to operate , .. . So , I 've gone for a hybrid -- X10 with repeaters , software cognizant of the limitations of the repeaters and ranges ; relays , portmasters , sensors ( some DIY ) , and mostly just some serious distributed computing .
My house has Solar panels , jacuzzi , kids , about 30 computers , all the rope you need ( to hang yourself ) , and a very understanding wife .
More , as I get a chance , at http : //pointyhair.com/ [ pointyhair.com ]</tokentext>
<sentencetext>I've been building various levels of home automation for the last 12 years...

A year ago, I gave up on X10/HomeDaemon, as it seems both were practically abandoned.
I've built a fourth generation home automation system on a Scala based framework -- distributed, self learning, combining X10 and various relay-based systems.
Insteon turned out to be a pipe dream or hype, X10 is unreliable unless run with repeaters, repeaters are not simple to operate, ...

So, I've gone for a hybrid -- X10 with repeaters, software cognizant of the limitations of the repeaters and ranges; relays, portmasters, sensors (some DIY), and mostly just some serious distributed computing.
My house has Solar panels, jacuzzi, kids, about 30 computers, all the rope you need (to hang yourself), and a very understanding wife.
More, as I get a chance, at http://pointyhair.com/ [pointyhair.com]</sentencetext>
</comment>
<comment>
	<id>http://www.semanticweb.org/ontologies/ConversationInstances.owl#comment09_10_26_164226.29879955</id>
	<title>Heyu, Leviton, Linux</title>
	<author>batmanuel</author>
	<datestamp>1256567940000</datestamp>
	<modclass>None</modclass>
	<modscore>1</modscore>
	<htmltext>Just to add my data point.  I've been using open-source Heyu (http://www.heyu.org/) with a head-less Linux server, the X-10(tm) CM11a computer module and good quality Leviton "Smart Home" brand light switches for nearly 10 years with very good success.   Yeah, it's home automation-light (pun intended) but it works.

Don't bother with the X-10 brand light switches.  They are inexpensive, but don't have local dimming capability, feel/look cheap and usually die after 12-18 months.   You can hack the internal X-10 module replacing the triac to fix/help the dying problem and also remove an R-C circuit to add local dimming ability (YMMV), but that's a lot of work and still feels X-10 cheap.   Stick with the Levitons.</htmltext>
<tokenext>Just to add my data point .
I 've been using open-source Heyu ( http : //www.heyu.org/ ) with a head-less Linux server , the X-10 ( tm ) CM11a computer module and good quality Leviton " Smart Home " brand light switches for nearly 10 years with very good success .
Yeah , it 's home automation-light ( pun intended ) but it works .
Do n't bother with the X-10 brand light switches .
They are inexpensive , but do n't have local dimming capability , feel/look cheap and usually die after 12-18 months .
You can hack the internal X-10 module replacing the triac to fix/help the dying problem and also remove an R-C circuit to add local dimming ability ( YMMV ) , but that 's a lot of work and still feels X-10 cheap .
Stick with the Levitons .</tokentext>
<sentencetext>Just to add my data point.
I've been using open-source Heyu (http://www.heyu.org/) with a head-less Linux server, the X-10(tm) CM11a computer module and good quality Leviton "Smart Home" brand light switches for nearly 10 years with very good success.
Yeah, it's home automation-light (pun intended) but it works.
Don't bother with the X-10 brand light switches.
They are inexpensive, but don't have local dimming capability, feel/look cheap and usually die after 12-18 months.
You can hack the internal X-10 module replacing the triac to fix/help the dying problem and also remove an R-C circuit to add local dimming ability (YMMV), but that's a lot of work and still feels X-10 cheap.
Stick with the Levitons.</sentencetext>
</comment>
<comment>
	<id>http://www.semanticweb.org/ontologies/ConversationInstances.owl#comment09_10_26_164226.29876971</id>
	<title>Re:X10 makes cool stuff for automation</title>
	<author>ovu</author>
	<datestamp>1256549820000</datestamp>
	<modclass>None</modclass>
	<modscore>1</modscore>
	<htmltext>Why oh why, must a post coming from a place of deep experience not offer any alternative options? The purpose of this discussion thread? May we please have a suggestion?</htmltext>
<tokenext>Why oh why , must a post coming from a place of deep experience not offer any alternative options ?
The purpose of this discussion thread ?
May we please have a suggestion ?</tokentext>
<sentencetext>Why oh why, must a post coming from a place of deep experience not offer any alternative options?
The purpose of this discussion thread?
May we please have a suggestion?</sentencetext>
	<parent>http://www.semanticweb.org/ontologies/ConversationInstances.owl#comment09_10_26_164226.29876531</parent>
</comment>
<comment>
	<id>http://www.semanticweb.org/ontologies/ConversationInstances.owl#comment09_10_26_164226.29878541</id>
	<title>Why not use automation already proven</title>
	<author>CoriolisSTORM</author>
	<datestamp>1256557140000</datestamp>
	<modclass>None</modclass>
	<modscore>1</modscore>
	<htmltext>Maybe I'm going about this the wrong way, but I've always thought about using an Allen Bradley PLC5 family or a Modicon PLC to control everything. I work with them every day in an industrial setting and it is robust and you can do just about anything you wanna do. You can use ladder logic (which is beneficial because I know no coding) and fulfill whatever you desire with it. Set the conditions for the output to come on, the type of output. A few sensors, cables, a relay or two and a rack, processor, powersupply and required input and output cards.  Maybe your way is cheaper, I don't know as I've just been thinking about it, not in the planning stages yet.</htmltext>
<tokenext>Maybe I 'm going about this the wrong way , but I 've always thought about using an Allen Bradley PLC5 family or a Modicon PLC to control everything .
I work with them every day in an industrial setting and it is robust and you can do just about anything you wan na do .
You can use ladder logic ( which is beneficial because I know no coding ) and fulfill whatever you desire with it .
Set the conditions for the output to come on , the type of output .
A few sensors , cables , a relay or two and a rack , processor , powersupply and required input and output cards .
Maybe your way is cheaper , I do n't know as I 've just been thinking about it , not in the planning stages yet .</tokentext>
<sentencetext>Maybe I'm going about this the wrong way, but I've always thought about using an Allen Bradley PLC5 family or a Modicon PLC to control everything.
I work with them every day in an industrial setting and it is robust and you can do just about anything you wanna do.
You can use ladder logic (which is beneficial because I know no coding) and fulfill whatever you desire with it.
Set the conditions for the output to come on, the type of output.
A few sensors, cables, a relay or two and a rack, processor, powersupply and required input and output cards.
Maybe your way is cheaper, I don't know as I've just been thinking about it, not in the planning stages yet.</sentencetext>
	<parent>http://www.semanticweb.org/ontologies/ConversationInstances.owl#comment09_10_26_164226.29877425</parent>
</comment>
<comment>
	<id>http://www.semanticweb.org/ontologies/ConversationInstances.owl#comment09_10_26_164226.29886415</id>
	<title>Re:Doing it wrong</title>
	<author>Shotgun</author>
	<datestamp>1256670000000</datestamp>
	<modclass>None</modclass>
	<modscore>1</modscore>
	<htmltext><p>No.  The reason the field hasn't advanced is because home automation isn't something computers are good at.</p><p>Computers are good at doing the same thing over and over again.  When you get into areas where there are a lot of one-off tasks, computers do more to get in the way than to help because of the necessary configuration and setup time.</p><p>The way to make computers helpful in home automation is to become a robot and do everything in exactly the same way every day.  Even then your automation will be customized for your, and will be mostly useless for your neighbor.  Each house will require it's own set of customization, and woe be to the homeowner that decides he wants to change up his schedule or try something different.</p><p>The typical enduser will by a programmable thermostat, program it once, and then constantly override it with manual operation.  When we can force people to act like robots and live in identical houses, then we will see home automation advance.</p></htmltext>
<tokenext>No .
The reason the field has n't advanced is because home automation is n't something computers are good at.Computers are good at doing the same thing over and over again .
When you get into areas where there are a lot of one-off tasks , computers do more to get in the way than to help because of the necessary configuration and setup time.The way to make computers helpful in home automation is to become a robot and do everything in exactly the same way every day .
Even then your automation will be customized for your , and will be mostly useless for your neighbor .
Each house will require it 's own set of customization , and woe be to the homeowner that decides he wants to change up his schedule or try something different.The typical enduser will by a programmable thermostat , program it once , and then constantly override it with manual operation .
When we can force people to act like robots and live in identical houses , then we will see home automation advance .</tokentext>
<sentencetext>No.
The reason the field hasn't advanced is because home automation isn't something computers are good at.Computers are good at doing the same thing over and over again.
When you get into areas where there are a lot of one-off tasks, computers do more to get in the way than to help because of the necessary configuration and setup time.The way to make computers helpful in home automation is to become a robot and do everything in exactly the same way every day.
Even then your automation will be customized for your, and will be mostly useless for your neighbor.
Each house will require it's own set of customization, and woe be to the homeowner that decides he wants to change up his schedule or try something different.The typical enduser will by a programmable thermostat, program it once, and then constantly override it with manual operation.
When we can force people to act like robots and live in identical houses, then we will see home automation advance.</sentencetext>
	<parent>http://www.semanticweb.org/ontologies/ConversationInstances.owl#comment09_10_26_164226.29876223</parent>
</comment>
<comment>
	<id>http://www.semanticweb.org/ontologies/ConversationInstances.owl#comment09_10_26_164226.29877163</id>
	<title>Re:Links?</title>
	<author>Anonymous</author>
	<datestamp>1256550600000</datestamp>
	<modclass>None</modclass>
	<modscore>0</modscore>
	<htmltext><p>Google much?</p></htmltext>
<tokenext>Google much ?</tokentext>
<sentencetext>Google much?</sentencetext>
	<parent>http://www.semanticweb.org/ontologies/ConversationInstances.owl#comment09_10_26_164226.29876237</parent>
</comment>
<comment>
	<id>http://www.semanticweb.org/ontologies/ConversationInstances.owl#comment09_10_26_164226.29882043</id>
	<title>AMX and Crestron</title>
	<author>zarozarozaro</author>
	<datestamp>1256644140000</datestamp>
	<modclass>None</modclass>
	<modscore>1</modscore>
	<htmltext>I've been built many systems based on AMX and Crestron platforms.  They are pretty much state of the art as far as I know.  They are expensive, but if you know what to look for you can find some cheap second hand controllers on the online auction sites.<br>
One drawback is that both of these systems require knowledge of their proprietary languages and protocols.  There is another company called Aurora that makes the WACI series of controllers that are more standards compliant, but I have never built a system using their controllers.</htmltext>
<tokenext>I 've been built many systems based on AMX and Crestron platforms .
They are pretty much state of the art as far as I know .
They are expensive , but if you know what to look for you can find some cheap second hand controllers on the online auction sites .
One drawback is that both of these systems require knowledge of their proprietary languages and protocols .
There is another company called Aurora that makes the WACI series of controllers that are more standards compliant , but I have never built a system using their controllers .</tokentext>
<sentencetext>I've been built many systems based on AMX and Crestron platforms.
They are pretty much state of the art as far as I know.
They are expensive, but if you know what to look for you can find some cheap second hand controllers on the online auction sites.
One drawback is that both of these systems require knowledge of their proprietary languages and protocols.
There is another company called Aurora that makes the WACI series of controllers that are more standards compliant, but I have never built a system using their controllers.</sentencetext>
</comment>
<comment>
	<id>http://www.semanticweb.org/ontologies/ConversationInstances.owl#comment09_10_26_164226.29878481</id>
	<title>Re:Doing it wrong</title>
	<author>jovetoo</author>
	<datestamp>1256556660000</datestamp>
	<modclass>None</modclass>
	<modscore>1</modscore>
	<htmltext><i>If you're cooking YOU'RE IN THE DAMNED KITCHEN! Why in hell would you want to access your kitchen appliances from a telephone or a videogame?</i>
<p>
So you can cook WITHOUT being in the damned kitchen? I would love to have a gkrell like app monitoring the temperature and humidity in my pots, maybe include some video.
</p><p>
It would have saved me a shitload of broken nails trying to get the burned black bits out of my cooking pots...</p></htmltext>
<tokenext>If you 're cooking YOU 'RE IN THE DAMNED KITCHEN !
Why in hell would you want to access your kitchen appliances from a telephone or a videogame ?
So you can cook WITHOUT being in the damned kitchen ?
I would love to have a gkrell like app monitoring the temperature and humidity in my pots , maybe include some video .
It would have saved me a shitload of broken nails trying to get the burned black bits out of my cooking pots.. .</tokentext>
<sentencetext>If you're cooking YOU'RE IN THE DAMNED KITCHEN!
Why in hell would you want to access your kitchen appliances from a telephone or a videogame?
So you can cook WITHOUT being in the damned kitchen?
I would love to have a gkrell like app monitoring the temperature and humidity in my pots, maybe include some video.
It would have saved me a shitload of broken nails trying to get the burned black bits out of my cooking pots...</sentencetext>
	<parent>http://www.semanticweb.org/ontologies/ConversationInstances.owl#comment09_10_26_164226.29876757</parent>
</comment>
<comment>
	<id>http://www.semanticweb.org/ontologies/ConversationInstances.owl#comment09_10_26_164226.29882383</id>
	<title>Pluto Home Automation</title>
	<author>jujuchef</author>
	<datestamp>1256650080000</datestamp>
	<modclass>None</modclass>
	<modscore>1</modscore>
	<htmltext><a href="http://plutohome.com/index.php?section=what\_is\_pluto" title="plutohome.com" rel="nofollow">Pluto Home</a> [plutohome.com]

This is pretty good stuff.  The core is linux, but if you want those essential extras (DVD recording/playback) then you'll need to either add your own packages to the system, or purchase the canned solution they offer.
<br> <br>
The thought of shouting abuse at a burgler/stalker/milkman through my home stereo system while watching him on my mobile is oh so exciting!  There might be a world's funniest video hidden in there..</htmltext>
<tokenext>Pluto Home [ plutohome.com ] This is pretty good stuff .
The core is linux , but if you want those essential extras ( DVD recording/playback ) then you 'll need to either add your own packages to the system , or purchase the canned solution they offer .
The thought of shouting abuse at a burgler/stalker/milkman through my home stereo system while watching him on my mobile is oh so exciting !
There might be a world 's funniest video hidden in there. .</tokentext>
<sentencetext>Pluto Home [plutohome.com]

This is pretty good stuff.
The core is linux, but if you want those essential extras (DVD recording/playback) then you'll need to either add your own packages to the system, or purchase the canned solution they offer.
The thought of shouting abuse at a burgler/stalker/milkman through my home stereo system while watching him on my mobile is oh so exciting!
There might be a world's funniest video hidden in there..</sentencetext>
</comment>
<comment>
	<id>http://www.semanticweb.org/ontologies/ConversationInstances.owl#comment09_10_26_164226.29884667</id>
	<title>Control4</title>
	<author>AndreaDo</author>
	<datestamp>1256662140000</datestamp>
	<modclass>None</modclass>
	<modscore>1</modscore>
	<htmltext>Not all is lost...

<a href="http://www.control4.com/" title="control4.com" rel="nofollow">http://www.control4.com/</a> [control4.com]</htmltext>
<tokenext>Not all is lost.. . http : //www.control4.com/ [ control4.com ]</tokentext>
<sentencetext>Not all is lost...

http://www.control4.com/ [control4.com]</sentencetext>
</comment>
<comment>
	<id>http://www.semanticweb.org/ontologies/ConversationInstances.owl#comment09_10_26_164226.29876757</id>
	<title>Re:Doing it wrong</title>
	<author>mcgrew</author>
	<datestamp>1256549100000</datestamp>
	<modclass>Insightful</modclass>
	<modscore>4</modscore>
	<htmltext><p><i>For example, cooking supper your toaster, oven, microwave, and stovetop could all supply timing and temperature information to the network, and you could make changes to each from your phone/console/ps3/etc.</i></p><p>Never has a subject line been so accurate... Look, it's pretty obvious that you have NEVER cooked anything. If you're cooking YOU'RE IN THE DAMNED KITCHEN! Why in hell would you want to access your kitchen appliances from a telephone or a videogame?</p><p>I want not only home automation, but my car, too. Why can't I call my car and tell it to start and run the heater or air? Why can't I look outside, see that it's starting to rain, and call my car and have it roll the windows up? For that matter why can't I roll up the windows without the key in the "run" position?</p><p>No -- lights, heat, air, DVR, are fine for networked automation, but not the kitchen. Automation in the kitchen is using a mixer instead of a spoon. If you're cooking, you're in the kitchen. No need for remote stuff there.</p></htmltext>
<tokenext>For example , cooking supper your toaster , oven , microwave , and stovetop could all supply timing and temperature information to the network , and you could make changes to each from your phone/console/ps3/etc.Never has a subject line been so accurate... Look , it 's pretty obvious that you have NEVER cooked anything .
If you 're cooking YOU 'RE IN THE DAMNED KITCHEN !
Why in hell would you want to access your kitchen appliances from a telephone or a videogame ? I want not only home automation , but my car , too .
Why ca n't I call my car and tell it to start and run the heater or air ?
Why ca n't I look outside , see that it 's starting to rain , and call my car and have it roll the windows up ?
For that matter why ca n't I roll up the windows without the key in the " run " position ? No -- lights , heat , air , DVR , are fine for networked automation , but not the kitchen .
Automation in the kitchen is using a mixer instead of a spoon .
If you 're cooking , you 're in the kitchen .
No need for remote stuff there .</tokentext>
<sentencetext>For example, cooking supper your toaster, oven, microwave, and stovetop could all supply timing and temperature information to the network, and you could make changes to each from your phone/console/ps3/etc.Never has a subject line been so accurate... Look, it's pretty obvious that you have NEVER cooked anything.
If you're cooking YOU'RE IN THE DAMNED KITCHEN!
Why in hell would you want to access your kitchen appliances from a telephone or a videogame?I want not only home automation, but my car, too.
Why can't I call my car and tell it to start and run the heater or air?
Why can't I look outside, see that it's starting to rain, and call my car and have it roll the windows up?
For that matter why can't I roll up the windows without the key in the "run" position?No -- lights, heat, air, DVR, are fine for networked automation, but not the kitchen.
Automation in the kitchen is using a mixer instead of a spoon.
If you're cooking, you're in the kitchen.
No need for remote stuff there.</sentencetext>
	<parent>http://www.semanticweb.org/ontologies/ConversationInstances.owl#comment09_10_26_164226.29876223</parent>
</comment>
<comment>
	<id>http://www.semanticweb.org/ontologies/ConversationInstances.owl#comment09_10_26_164226.29876743</id>
	<title>oh my god my brain ./'s while it thinks!</title>
	<author>kallisti5</author>
	<datestamp>1256549040000</datestamp>
	<modclass>None</modclass>
	<modscore>0</modscore>
	<htmltext>Weird, I was just talking about this today.  Bought a cheapo x10 usb controler for my Linux home server to flip lights on and off.

Maybe everyone is begining to forget those horrible x10 spy camera ad's now that Geocities is closing?</htmltext>
<tokenext>Weird , I was just talking about this today .
Bought a cheapo x10 usb controler for my Linux home server to flip lights on and off .
Maybe everyone is begining to forget those horrible x10 spy camera ad 's now that Geocities is closing ?</tokentext>
<sentencetext>Weird, I was just talking about this today.
Bought a cheapo x10 usb controler for my Linux home server to flip lights on and off.
Maybe everyone is begining to forget those horrible x10 spy camera ad's now that Geocities is closing?</sentencetext>
</comment>
<comment>
	<id>http://www.semanticweb.org/ontologies/ConversationInstances.owl#comment09_10_26_164226.29881075</id>
	<title>Barix</title>
	<author>Newer Guy</author>
	<datestamp>1256583420000</datestamp>
	<modclass>None</modclass>
	<modscore>1</modscore>
	<htmltext>Barix home automation products are all Linux based.

www.barix.com</htmltext>
<tokenext>Barix home automation products are all Linux based .
www.barix.com</tokentext>
<sentencetext>Barix home automation products are all Linux based.
www.barix.com</sentencetext>
</comment>
<comment>
	<id>http://www.semanticweb.org/ontologies/ConversationInstances.owl#comment09_10_26_164226.29877369</id>
	<title>Re:Wife 1.0</title>
	<author>BigDXLT</author>
	<datestamp>1256551380000</datestamp>
	<modclass>None</modclass>
	<modscore>1</modscore>
	<htmltext>I read your comment thinking it was a reply to the AC's Mom 1.0 post!<nobr> <wbr></nobr>:O</htmltext>
<tokenext>I read your comment thinking it was a reply to the AC 's Mom 1.0 post !
: O</tokentext>
<sentencetext>I read your comment thinking it was a reply to the AC's Mom 1.0 post!
:O</sentencetext>
	<parent>http://www.semanticweb.org/ontologies/ConversationInstances.owl#comment09_10_26_164226.29876373</parent>
</comment>
<comment>
	<id>http://www.semanticweb.org/ontologies/ConversationInstances.owl#comment09_10_26_164226.29876607</id>
	<title>roll your own?</title>
	<author>enigma32</author>
	<datestamp>1256548560000</datestamp>
	<modclass>Interestin</modclass>
	<modscore>2</modscore>
	<htmltext><p>I began with some silly things with my [saltwater] fish tank, building a circuit that would keep the water level topped off and reporting to a database when it did so... Have slowly been progressing toward temperature, lighting, and salinity controls for the tank, I've begun branching toward thermostat and lighting control for the house (next step possibly integration with google calendar so it knows when I'm going to be around)</p><p>For the most part there's a huge amount of open source hardware and software out there for doing individual bits and pieces. Look toward the Arduino controllers for interfacing with about anything, and possibly Sheeva plugs for running the whole mess. (I've had a sheeva talking to an arduino for quite a while now and it's been very stable)</p><p>I think the open hardware scene is where it's at right now;<br>As for Misterhouse, I think I'll be doing some reading this evening...</p></htmltext>
<tokenext>I began with some silly things with my [ saltwater ] fish tank , building a circuit that would keep the water level topped off and reporting to a database when it did so... Have slowly been progressing toward temperature , lighting , and salinity controls for the tank , I 've begun branching toward thermostat and lighting control for the house ( next step possibly integration with google calendar so it knows when I 'm going to be around ) For the most part there 's a huge amount of open source hardware and software out there for doing individual bits and pieces .
Look toward the Arduino controllers for interfacing with about anything , and possibly Sheeva plugs for running the whole mess .
( I 've had a sheeva talking to an arduino for quite a while now and it 's been very stable ) I think the open hardware scene is where it 's at right now ; As for Misterhouse , I think I 'll be doing some reading this evening.. .</tokentext>
<sentencetext>I began with some silly things with my [saltwater] fish tank, building a circuit that would keep the water level topped off and reporting to a database when it did so... Have slowly been progressing toward temperature, lighting, and salinity controls for the tank, I've begun branching toward thermostat and lighting control for the house (next step possibly integration with google calendar so it knows when I'm going to be around)For the most part there's a huge amount of open source hardware and software out there for doing individual bits and pieces.
Look toward the Arduino controllers for interfacing with about anything, and possibly Sheeva plugs for running the whole mess.
(I've had a sheeva talking to an arduino for quite a while now and it's been very stable)I think the open hardware scene is where it's at right now;As for Misterhouse, I think I'll be doing some reading this evening...</sentencetext>
</comment>
<comment>
	<id>http://www.semanticweb.org/ontologies/ConversationInstances.owl#comment09_10_26_164226.29888307</id>
	<title>X10 to Insteon Experience</title>
	<author>patrick0brien</author>
	<datestamp>1256634540000</datestamp>
	<modclass>None</modclass>
	<modscore>1</modscore>
	<htmltext>I started with X10 because of it's incremental scalability and carrier-signal-through-the-house wiring, but eventually outgrew the reception.  (for those not washed, X10 communicates from a sentral controller, there is a limit to the distance and how much line noise there is between the devices).  Then I began to replace the X10 units with INSTEON (which is mesh networking) and it is a beautiful thing.  Controlled with a Mac Mini running Indigo, I have voice, wall switch, and iPhone control of individual lights, lighting moods, HVAC, security, pet feeding, litter box (yes, both input AND output covered!) even the computers themselves.  Too much to go into on all of the intelligence the system controls based on weather, occupancy, etc, but it's very very cool.  Cannot complain.  What really does it for me on this system is the easy incremental scalability.  Just add more as I need them - window curtains next.  Oh, and it halved my electric bill.</htmltext>
<tokenext>I started with X10 because of it 's incremental scalability and carrier-signal-through-the-house wiring , but eventually outgrew the reception .
( for those not washed , X10 communicates from a sentral controller , there is a limit to the distance and how much line noise there is between the devices ) .
Then I began to replace the X10 units with INSTEON ( which is mesh networking ) and it is a beautiful thing .
Controlled with a Mac Mini running Indigo , I have voice , wall switch , and iPhone control of individual lights , lighting moods , HVAC , security , pet feeding , litter box ( yes , both input AND output covered !
) even the computers themselves .
Too much to go into on all of the intelligence the system controls based on weather , occupancy , etc , but it 's very very cool .
Can not complain .
What really does it for me on this system is the easy incremental scalability .
Just add more as I need them - window curtains next .
Oh , and it halved my electric bill .</tokentext>
<sentencetext>I started with X10 because of it's incremental scalability and carrier-signal-through-the-house wiring, but eventually outgrew the reception.
(for those not washed, X10 communicates from a sentral controller, there is a limit to the distance and how much line noise there is between the devices).
Then I began to replace the X10 units with INSTEON (which is mesh networking) and it is a beautiful thing.
Controlled with a Mac Mini running Indigo, I have voice, wall switch, and iPhone control of individual lights, lighting moods, HVAC, security, pet feeding, litter box (yes, both input AND output covered!
) even the computers themselves.
Too much to go into on all of the intelligence the system controls based on weather, occupancy, etc, but it's very very cool.
Cannot complain.
What really does it for me on this system is the easy incremental scalability.
Just add more as I need them - window curtains next.
Oh, and it halved my electric bill.</sentencetext>
</comment>
<comment>
	<id>http://www.semanticweb.org/ontologies/ConversationInstances.owl#comment09_10_26_164226.29876185</id>
	<title>Wife 1.0</title>
	<author>Anonymous</author>
	<datestamp>1256589900000</datestamp>
	<modclass>Funny</modclass>
	<modscore>4</modscore>
	<htmltext>Wife 1.0 continues to work quite well, thank you.</htmltext>
<tokenext>Wife 1.0 continues to work quite well , thank you .</tokentext>
<sentencetext>Wife 1.0 continues to work quite well, thank you.</sentencetext>
</comment>
<comment>
	<id>http://www.semanticweb.org/ontologies/ConversationInstances.owl#comment09_10_26_164226.29879155</id>
	<title>Re:Good luck</title>
	<author>tftp</author>
	<datestamp>1256561160000</datestamp>
	<modclass>None</modclass>
	<modscore>1</modscore>
	<htmltext><p> <i>
In reference to the "serious flaws" and weaknesses...ever wondered why none of the home automation tech we've been promised since 1950 has come to be common in homes? Things like auto-opening drapes, autoadjusting lighting, stuff like that.</i>
</p><p>
It is common in some homes. There are contractors who offer automation, and there are individuals who buy pieces and arrange them. The main reason why it is not in every home is not cost and not patents, it's the low value of all that technology. I do have HA set up, and will be installing more switches and boxes. Why? Because I want to be able to centrally control lights (for example) and be able to find out where is that light that is still on when I go to bed. And to turn it off remotely. And I want to know where someone is walking and either turn the light on there automatically, or beep to tell me that someone is where nobody should be. But that's just me, because I do electronic stuff for living anyway, and I can afford it. If you have a $100K house you probably would be ill advised to spend $10K on HA - it's not even close to being worth it. But if you live in a more expensive, larger house, with some land, lawn, driveway, etc. - then you may find that $10K spent on HA increases resale value of your house because it is actually of use on a larger property.</p></htmltext>
<tokenext>In reference to the " serious flaws " and weaknesses...ever wondered why none of the home automation tech we 've been promised since 1950 has come to be common in homes ?
Things like auto-opening drapes , autoadjusting lighting , stuff like that .
It is common in some homes .
There are contractors who offer automation , and there are individuals who buy pieces and arrange them .
The main reason why it is not in every home is not cost and not patents , it 's the low value of all that technology .
I do have HA set up , and will be installing more switches and boxes .
Why ? Because I want to be able to centrally control lights ( for example ) and be able to find out where is that light that is still on when I go to bed .
And to turn it off remotely .
And I want to know where someone is walking and either turn the light on there automatically , or beep to tell me that someone is where nobody should be .
But that 's just me , because I do electronic stuff for living anyway , and I can afford it .
If you have a $ 100K house you probably would be ill advised to spend $ 10K on HA - it 's not even close to being worth it .
But if you live in a more expensive , larger house , with some land , lawn , driveway , etc .
- then you may find that $ 10K spent on HA increases resale value of your house because it is actually of use on a larger property .</tokentext>
<sentencetext> 
In reference to the "serious flaws" and weaknesses...ever wondered why none of the home automation tech we've been promised since 1950 has come to be common in homes?
Things like auto-opening drapes, autoadjusting lighting, stuff like that.
It is common in some homes.
There are contractors who offer automation, and there are individuals who buy pieces and arrange them.
The main reason why it is not in every home is not cost and not patents, it's the low value of all that technology.
I do have HA set up, and will be installing more switches and boxes.
Why? Because I want to be able to centrally control lights (for example) and be able to find out where is that light that is still on when I go to bed.
And to turn it off remotely.
And I want to know where someone is walking and either turn the light on there automatically, or beep to tell me that someone is where nobody should be.
But that's just me, because I do electronic stuff for living anyway, and I can afford it.
If you have a $100K house you probably would be ill advised to spend $10K on HA - it's not even close to being worth it.
But if you live in a more expensive, larger house, with some land, lawn, driveway, etc.
- then you may find that $10K spent on HA increases resale value of your house because it is actually of use on a larger property.</sentencetext>
	<parent>http://www.semanticweb.org/ontologies/ConversationInstances.owl#comment09_10_26_164226.29876267</parent>
</comment>
<comment>
	<id>http://www.semanticweb.org/ontologies/ConversationInstances.owl#comment09_10_26_164226.29885893</id>
	<title>Re:Good luck</title>
	<author>Anonymous</author>
	<datestamp>1256667600000</datestamp>
	<modclass>None</modclass>
	<modscore>0</modscore>
	<htmltext><p>Actually I can think of a bigger reason than "it's a large conspiracy where oil companies buy up patents for 80 mpg carburetors".  How about the fact that the entire industry is slow to change.  Engineered panels constructed of foam and recycled wood have taken 2 decades to finally get any decent showing in the industry, simple because builders know how to stick frame.  There are very few builders or tradespeople that would be very happy if the general contractor told them that "oh, by the way, you will need to interface with this new technology", which is why only do-it-yourselfers have these systems installed.  Somebody mentioned earlier that everybody is taking the wrong approach, and then promptly went off the deep end talking about toasters cooking for you.  An approach that would make this more mainstream, and thus marketable, would be to come at it with the mindset that it has to be incorporated into the way the trades currently build a house, and anything different needs to be a simple install.  And marketable matters, since until it is, it won't grow very fast.  So that's what I'm doing on my senior design project.  This comments section is driving a lot of our system requirements, so again you folks rule.  As soon as we have a link we'll post it.</p></htmltext>
<tokenext>Actually I can think of a bigger reason than " it 's a large conspiracy where oil companies buy up patents for 80 mpg carburetors " .
How about the fact that the entire industry is slow to change .
Engineered panels constructed of foam and recycled wood have taken 2 decades to finally get any decent showing in the industry , simple because builders know how to stick frame .
There are very few builders or tradespeople that would be very happy if the general contractor told them that " oh , by the way , you will need to interface with this new technology " , which is why only do-it-yourselfers have these systems installed .
Somebody mentioned earlier that everybody is taking the wrong approach , and then promptly went off the deep end talking about toasters cooking for you .
An approach that would make this more mainstream , and thus marketable , would be to come at it with the mindset that it has to be incorporated into the way the trades currently build a house , and anything different needs to be a simple install .
And marketable matters , since until it is , it wo n't grow very fast .
So that 's what I 'm doing on my senior design project .
This comments section is driving a lot of our system requirements , so again you folks rule .
As soon as we have a link we 'll post it .</tokentext>
<sentencetext>Actually I can think of a bigger reason than "it's a large conspiracy where oil companies buy up patents for 80 mpg carburetors".
How about the fact that the entire industry is slow to change.
Engineered panels constructed of foam and recycled wood have taken 2 decades to finally get any decent showing in the industry, simple because builders know how to stick frame.
There are very few builders or tradespeople that would be very happy if the general contractor told them that "oh, by the way, you will need to interface with this new technology", which is why only do-it-yourselfers have these systems installed.
Somebody mentioned earlier that everybody is taking the wrong approach, and then promptly went off the deep end talking about toasters cooking for you.
An approach that would make this more mainstream, and thus marketable, would be to come at it with the mindset that it has to be incorporated into the way the trades currently build a house, and anything different needs to be a simple install.
And marketable matters, since until it is, it won't grow very fast.
So that's what I'm doing on my senior design project.
This comments section is driving a lot of our system requirements, so again you folks rule.
As soon as we have a link we'll post it.</sentencetext>
	<parent>http://www.semanticweb.org/ontologies/ConversationInstances.owl#comment09_10_26_164226.29876267</parent>
</comment>
<comment>
	<id>http://www.semanticweb.org/ontologies/ConversationInstances.owl#comment09_10_26_164226.29877679</id>
	<title>Re:Wife 1.0</title>
	<author>sbeckstead</author>
	<datestamp>1256552700000</datestamp>
	<modclass>None</modclass>
	<modscore>1</modscore>
	<htmltext>wow even wife 1.0 has fan boys!</htmltext>
<tokenext>wow even wife 1.0 has fan boys !</tokentext>
<sentencetext>wow even wife 1.0 has fan boys!</sentencetext>
	<parent>http://www.semanticweb.org/ontologies/ConversationInstances.owl#comment09_10_26_164226.29876477</parent>
</comment>
<comment>
	<id>http://www.semanticweb.org/ontologies/ConversationInstances.owl#comment09_10_26_164226.29879619</id>
	<title>Crestron</title>
	<author>inicom</author>
	<datestamp>1256564580000</datestamp>
	<modclass>None</modclass>
	<modscore>1</modscore>
	<htmltext><p>Do you want your home automated and have a working &amp; stable system, or do you want your house to be another mish mash of hardware and software hacks?  If the latter, by all means, go with an open-source DIY solution.  In the long run, you'll have a much more satisfying, braggable, stable, wife-pleasing, supportable and low-maintenance system if you go with Crestron.   I'm a long time hacker and Unix guy (I started on Unix in 1981) and generally love DIY approaches to things, but I'm also a designer and programming of Crestron systems - they are stable, reliable platforms.  I've done Crestron systems that have worked flawlessly for years at a time, and only have to be touched because DirecTV changes receivers, or the DVD gets upgraded.  I've seen Crestron systems that were installed in the mid-80's that are still going strong (a luxury hotel in South Beach uses a vintage Crestron system for their hotel and lobby lighting system).  If you value your time at all, the upfront cost of a Crestron system is really not bad.</p></htmltext>
<tokenext>Do you want your home automated and have a working &amp; stable system , or do you want your house to be another mish mash of hardware and software hacks ?
If the latter , by all means , go with an open-source DIY solution .
In the long run , you 'll have a much more satisfying , braggable , stable , wife-pleasing , supportable and low-maintenance system if you go with Crestron .
I 'm a long time hacker and Unix guy ( I started on Unix in 1981 ) and generally love DIY approaches to things , but I 'm also a designer and programming of Crestron systems - they are stable , reliable platforms .
I 've done Crestron systems that have worked flawlessly for years at a time , and only have to be touched because DirecTV changes receivers , or the DVD gets upgraded .
I 've seen Crestron systems that were installed in the mid-80 's that are still going strong ( a luxury hotel in South Beach uses a vintage Crestron system for their hotel and lobby lighting system ) .
If you value your time at all , the upfront cost of a Crestron system is really not bad .</tokentext>
<sentencetext>Do you want your home automated and have a working &amp; stable system, or do you want your house to be another mish mash of hardware and software hacks?
If the latter, by all means, go with an open-source DIY solution.
In the long run, you'll have a much more satisfying, braggable, stable, wife-pleasing, supportable and low-maintenance system if you go with Crestron.
I'm a long time hacker and Unix guy (I started on Unix in 1981) and generally love DIY approaches to things, but I'm also a designer and programming of Crestron systems - they are stable, reliable platforms.
I've done Crestron systems that have worked flawlessly for years at a time, and only have to be touched because DirecTV changes receivers, or the DVD gets upgraded.
I've seen Crestron systems that were installed in the mid-80's that are still going strong (a luxury hotel in South Beach uses a vintage Crestron system for their hotel and lobby lighting system).
If you value your time at all, the upfront cost of a Crestron system is really not bad.</sentencetext>
</comment>
<comment>
	<id>http://www.semanticweb.org/ontologies/ConversationInstances.owl#comment09_10_26_164226.29877389</id>
	<title>X10 and Insteon</title>
	<author>PhantomHarlock</author>
	<datestamp>1256551440000</datestamp>
	<modclass>None</modclass>
	<modscore>1</modscore>
	<htmltext><p>Insteon was designed to address the major problems with X-10...unreliable mostly one-way communication, not enough addressable devices and interference caused by switching power supplies in the power line carrier device signals, plus the inability for X-10 signals to jump across difference phases in your house without a phase coupler.</p><p>Insteon uses a combination of wired and wireless, and each device acts as a signal repeater / booster, so the theory is the more devices you have the more robust the network, sort of like a mesh.</p><p>I embraced Insteon when it first came out and unfortunately it's been plagued by problems - many switches just stopped working completely and others only work one out of 10 times that you press it.   I think that they are very sensitive to voltage fluctuations, and where I live we have a lot.  I simply cannot afford a whole-house power conditioner to go along with all that stuff.    I hope they've improved upon that since then.</p><p>Other than that it's an enormous improvement over X10.   Also, to comment on a previous poster's X10 information - X10 has been doing home automation since the late 70s / early 80s.   They were one of the earliest companies in the market.  The X10 cam thing came after, not before that phase.</p><p>Most of the friends I know playing with home automation stuff are using Insteon + Homeseer on Windows.   Homeseer is very powerful but the UI, at least last time I played with it could use a lot of polish.    That being said, you can do almost anything with it via the use of plugins and scripts.</p><p>I think that in the end home automation for most people is a fun toy to play with, but only if you won't miss the money you're spending on it.    These days I mostly want to use it to turn on a room full of lights all at once when the lights aren't all plugged into a single switched outlet.   I've given up taking it to the level of Homeseer, I have other hobbies and I don't want to leave a PC on 24/7 when that's all it's doing.   I agree with the sentiment that it is still a hobbyists endeavour and not a 'standard item' you can just drop into a house.  It has too many reliability problems to be a true replacement for the old fashioned light switch.</p><p>One last note, a lot of people seem to be thinking that home automation is about remotely managing your cookery and your fridge - from my perspective home automation focuses around managing lights and security.</p></htmltext>
<tokenext>Insteon was designed to address the major problems with X-10...unreliable mostly one-way communication , not enough addressable devices and interference caused by switching power supplies in the power line carrier device signals , plus the inability for X-10 signals to jump across difference phases in your house without a phase coupler.Insteon uses a combination of wired and wireless , and each device acts as a signal repeater / booster , so the theory is the more devices you have the more robust the network , sort of like a mesh.I embraced Insteon when it first came out and unfortunately it 's been plagued by problems - many switches just stopped working completely and others only work one out of 10 times that you press it .
I think that they are very sensitive to voltage fluctuations , and where I live we have a lot .
I simply can not afford a whole-house power conditioner to go along with all that stuff .
I hope they 've improved upon that since then.Other than that it 's an enormous improvement over X10 .
Also , to comment on a previous poster 's X10 information - X10 has been doing home automation since the late 70s / early 80s .
They were one of the earliest companies in the market .
The X10 cam thing came after , not before that phase.Most of the friends I know playing with home automation stuff are using Insteon + Homeseer on Windows .
Homeseer is very powerful but the UI , at least last time I played with it could use a lot of polish .
That being said , you can do almost anything with it via the use of plugins and scripts.I think that in the end home automation for most people is a fun toy to play with , but only if you wo n't miss the money you 're spending on it .
These days I mostly want to use it to turn on a room full of lights all at once when the lights are n't all plugged into a single switched outlet .
I 've given up taking it to the level of Homeseer , I have other hobbies and I do n't want to leave a PC on 24/7 when that 's all it 's doing .
I agree with the sentiment that it is still a hobbyists endeavour and not a 'standard item ' you can just drop into a house .
It has too many reliability problems to be a true replacement for the old fashioned light switch.One last note , a lot of people seem to be thinking that home automation is about remotely managing your cookery and your fridge - from my perspective home automation focuses around managing lights and security .</tokentext>
<sentencetext>Insteon was designed to address the major problems with X-10...unreliable mostly one-way communication, not enough addressable devices and interference caused by switching power supplies in the power line carrier device signals, plus the inability for X-10 signals to jump across difference phases in your house without a phase coupler.Insteon uses a combination of wired and wireless, and each device acts as a signal repeater / booster, so the theory is the more devices you have the more robust the network, sort of like a mesh.I embraced Insteon when it first came out and unfortunately it's been plagued by problems - many switches just stopped working completely and others only work one out of 10 times that you press it.
I think that they are very sensitive to voltage fluctuations, and where I live we have a lot.
I simply cannot afford a whole-house power conditioner to go along with all that stuff.
I hope they've improved upon that since then.Other than that it's an enormous improvement over X10.
Also, to comment on a previous poster's X10 information - X10 has been doing home automation since the late 70s / early 80s.
They were one of the earliest companies in the market.
The X10 cam thing came after, not before that phase.Most of the friends I know playing with home automation stuff are using Insteon + Homeseer on Windows.
Homeseer is very powerful but the UI, at least last time I played with it could use a lot of polish.
That being said, you can do almost anything with it via the use of plugins and scripts.I think that in the end home automation for most people is a fun toy to play with, but only if you won't miss the money you're spending on it.
These days I mostly want to use it to turn on a room full of lights all at once when the lights aren't all plugged into a single switched outlet.
I've given up taking it to the level of Homeseer, I have other hobbies and I don't want to leave a PC on 24/7 when that's all it's doing.
I agree with the sentiment that it is still a hobbyists endeavour and not a 'standard item' you can just drop into a house.
It has too many reliability problems to be a true replacement for the old fashioned light switch.One last note, a lot of people seem to be thinking that home automation is about remotely managing your cookery and your fridge - from my perspective home automation focuses around managing lights and security.</sentencetext>
</comment>
<comment>
	<id>http://www.semanticweb.org/ontologies/ConversationInstances.owl#comment09_10_26_164226.29880051</id>
	<title>Re:Smart Grid and home automation - have your say</title>
	<author>Anonymous</author>
	<datestamp>1256568960000</datestamp>
	<modclass>None</modclass>
	<modscore>0</modscore>
	<htmltext><p>That is just not the case.</p><p>Grids are essentially run at capacity once a day at 4-5pm, with another peak in the middle of the day depending on the weather.<br>The biggest benefit of a smart grid is to enable the power company to further oversell it's services by turning off your hot water at 4pm because your neighbors electric car needs the power.</p><p>Once we can ship power across the country cheaply, this issue disappears, "peak" power is now a 4-5 hour window, essentially decreasing peak load.</p><p>http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Capacity\_factor<br>http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Peaking\_power\_plant</p></htmltext>
<tokenext>That is just not the case.Grids are essentially run at capacity once a day at 4-5pm , with another peak in the middle of the day depending on the weather.The biggest benefit of a smart grid is to enable the power company to further oversell it 's services by turning off your hot water at 4pm because your neighbors electric car needs the power.Once we can ship power across the country cheaply , this issue disappears , " peak " power is now a 4-5 hour window , essentially decreasing peak load.http : //en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Capacity \ _factorhttp : //en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Peaking \ _power \ _plant</tokentext>
<sentencetext>That is just not the case.Grids are essentially run at capacity once a day at 4-5pm, with another peak in the middle of the day depending on the weather.The biggest benefit of a smart grid is to enable the power company to further oversell it's services by turning off your hot water at 4pm because your neighbors electric car needs the power.Once we can ship power across the country cheaply, this issue disappears, "peak" power is now a 4-5 hour window, essentially decreasing peak load.http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Capacity\_factorhttp://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Peaking\_power\_plant</sentencetext>
	<parent>http://www.semanticweb.org/ontologies/ConversationInstances.owl#comment09_10_26_164226.29877349</parent>
</comment>
<comment>
	<id>http://www.semanticweb.org/ontologies/ConversationInstances.owl#comment09_10_26_164226.29878867</id>
	<title>Re:Doing it wrong</title>
	<author>surfingmarmot</author>
	<datestamp>1256559360000</datestamp>
	<modclass>None</modclass>
	<modscore>1</modscore>
	<htmltext>"No need for remote stuff there."

To you maybe because you don't do much more than microwave or stir fry. But long cooking techniques would indeed benefit. I have a remote thermometer on my smoker and my BBQ for reason--to monitor internal meat temperatures remotely  for long cooking and smoking so I don't have to stand out there in the weather. that would be nice in the kitchen too for roasting, baking, etc. I coudl heck the time remaining without having to go into the kitchen to see the timer says 1 hour 23 minutes left and then checking the thermometer--it would be very to cool to check both from my iPhone and maybe raise/lower the oven temp som number of degrees if I wanted to. How about an intelligent oven that sent me an estimate when the roast was 20 minutes away from being done so I could start the short courses? You just lack imagination me thinks</htmltext>
<tokenext>" No need for remote stuff there .
" To you maybe because you do n't do much more than microwave or stir fry .
But long cooking techniques would indeed benefit .
I have a remote thermometer on my smoker and my BBQ for reason--to monitor internal meat temperatures remotely for long cooking and smoking so I do n't have to stand out there in the weather .
that would be nice in the kitchen too for roasting , baking , etc .
I coudl heck the time remaining without having to go into the kitchen to see the timer says 1 hour 23 minutes left and then checking the thermometer--it would be very to cool to check both from my iPhone and maybe raise/lower the oven temp som number of degrees if I wanted to .
How about an intelligent oven that sent me an estimate when the roast was 20 minutes away from being done so I could start the short courses ?
You just lack imagination me thinks</tokentext>
<sentencetext>"No need for remote stuff there.
"

To you maybe because you don't do much more than microwave or stir fry.
But long cooking techniques would indeed benefit.
I have a remote thermometer on my smoker and my BBQ for reason--to monitor internal meat temperatures remotely  for long cooking and smoking so I don't have to stand out there in the weather.
that would be nice in the kitchen too for roasting, baking, etc.
I coudl heck the time remaining without having to go into the kitchen to see the timer says 1 hour 23 minutes left and then checking the thermometer--it would be very to cool to check both from my iPhone and maybe raise/lower the oven temp som number of degrees if I wanted to.
How about an intelligent oven that sent me an estimate when the roast was 20 minutes away from being done so I could start the short courses?
You just lack imagination me thinks</sentencetext>
	<parent>http://www.semanticweb.org/ontologies/ConversationInstances.owl#comment09_10_26_164226.29876757</parent>
</comment>
<comment>
	<id>http://www.semanticweb.org/ontologies/ConversationInstances.owl#comment09_10_26_164226.29878377</id>
	<title>Re:Welcome to my money pit!</title>
	<author>fat\_mike</author>
	<datestamp>1256555820000</datestamp>
	<modclass>None</modclass>
	<modscore>1</modscore>
	<htmltext>I think the exhaust fan in the bathrooms should have turbo mode and be based on what Grandpa had for dinner.</htmltext>
<tokenext>I think the exhaust fan in the bathrooms should have turbo mode and be based on what Grandpa had for dinner .</tokentext>
<sentencetext>I think the exhaust fan in the bathrooms should have turbo mode and be based on what Grandpa had for dinner.</sentencetext>
	<parent>http://www.semanticweb.org/ontologies/ConversationInstances.owl#comment09_10_26_164226.29877425</parent>
</comment>
<comment>
	<id>http://www.semanticweb.org/ontologies/ConversationInstances.owl#comment09_10_26_164226.29879513</id>
	<title>Re:What about INSTEON?</title>
	<author>m\_number4</author>
	<datestamp>1256563800000</datestamp>
	<modclass>None</modclass>
	<modscore>1</modscore>
	<htmltext>Yes Insteon is excellent, it basically covers everything the questioner wants and if combined with Universal Devices ISY 99i Pro you don't even need a computer to run it, you do however need browser access to the ISY device to program it which is the fun part.
I'm a DIYer and have installed about 30 light switches, 2 of which are three-way, a bunch of power recepticles and movement sensors for some of the lights. It works both wirelessly and over the powerlines of the house which makes it really easy to install (no cables). The wireless frequency is different to the standard house devices so you wont get interference. This is a significnat level above the x10 stuff and works consistently as advertised.</htmltext>
<tokenext>Yes Insteon is excellent , it basically covers everything the questioner wants and if combined with Universal Devices ISY 99i Pro you do n't even need a computer to run it , you do however need browser access to the ISY device to program it which is the fun part .
I 'm a DIYer and have installed about 30 light switches , 2 of which are three-way , a bunch of power recepticles and movement sensors for some of the lights .
It works both wirelessly and over the powerlines of the house which makes it really easy to install ( no cables ) .
The wireless frequency is different to the standard house devices so you wont get interference .
This is a significnat level above the x10 stuff and works consistently as advertised .</tokentext>
<sentencetext>Yes Insteon is excellent, it basically covers everything the questioner wants and if combined with Universal Devices ISY 99i Pro you don't even need a computer to run it, you do however need browser access to the ISY device to program it which is the fun part.
I'm a DIYer and have installed about 30 light switches, 2 of which are three-way, a bunch of power recepticles and movement sensors for some of the lights.
It works both wirelessly and over the powerlines of the house which makes it really easy to install (no cables).
The wireless frequency is different to the standard house devices so you wont get interference.
This is a significnat level above the x10 stuff and works consistently as advertised.</sentencetext>
	<parent>http://www.semanticweb.org/ontologies/ConversationInstances.owl#comment09_10_26_164226.29876335</parent>
</comment>
<comment>
	<id>http://www.semanticweb.org/ontologies/ConversationInstances.owl#comment09_10_26_164226.29881669</id>
	<title>Re:Doing it wrong</title>
	<author>bzipitidoo</author>
	<datestamp>1256637540000</datestamp>
	<modclass>None</modclass>
	<modscore>1</modscore>
	<htmltext><p>Wrong approach?  More fundamental than that.  Too many devices are overly complicated for what they do, and fail in embarrassing ways.  And no, they don't need security theater.

</p><p>Had this Leviton system for turning appliances and lights on and off at the times you programmed into the master clock.  Imagine standing there and holding down on the "fast" button to set a clock over and over, 2 or more times for each light controlled.  I don't know how well it would have worked, because the day after I set it all up, a power failure wiped its memory.  And when the power came back, it didn't reset to a zero state, instead it started turning lights on and off at whatever random times ended up in its memory.  Then there were these electronic thermostats.  Same problem.  When the power fails, the hour you spent programming it is lost.

</p><p>Setting the clocks on all these devices after every power glitch is a pain, and anymore, nearly all of them have clocks.  For VCRs and TVs have to wait 10 minutes for a rescan of channels, and tell them what time it is, again.  As cheap as flash memory is these days, I'm wondering what is the problem with these consumer electronics manufacturers that they can't put a little in so a power interruption doesn't lose everything, and so that these damn devices can actually be turned off and not be left plugged in and sipping power 24/7.

</p><p>Complexity is another problem.  Manufacturers focus on bells and whistles.  They need excuses to charge higher prices.  They try for too much, and end up doing nothing well.  They missed the UNIX philosophy:  lots of little simple tools that do one thing, and do it well.  I don't want to have to read several dozen manuals to figure out how to make these devices do what I want.  I much prefer being able to figure it out by trial and error, and if I can't, then the device isn't intuitive enough.  Current home theater setups are a horrible mess.  A different remote control for each device.  Half of them have to be reconfigured every time for whatever new use is wanted.  Doing a switch from TV to a game console, have to rotate through the TV's inputs until the correct one is reached.  Sometimes it doesn't negotiate the connection (HDMI seems to be like that), so have to cycle through again.  Same drill with the surround sound system, then must adjust the volume, etc.

</p><p>Then there's the hook.  A security company tried to sell me a system that had this keypad, and all I had to do when I came home was enter in the combination.  I asked why?  Why not have just a toggle switch hidden somewhere instead of a keypad prominently displayed?  You know most people will write the combination down and post it nearby.  For that matter, why even have a switch?  The hook was this monthly fee to have the devices monitored.  Yes, if that combination wasn't entered within 1 minute, the system would alert the business doing the monitoring.  Well, why couldn't my cellphone be called up instead?  No reason at all, except there'd go their monthly revenue stream.</p></htmltext>
<tokenext>Wrong approach ?
More fundamental than that .
Too many devices are overly complicated for what they do , and fail in embarrassing ways .
And no , they do n't need security theater .
Had this Leviton system for turning appliances and lights on and off at the times you programmed into the master clock .
Imagine standing there and holding down on the " fast " button to set a clock over and over , 2 or more times for each light controlled .
I do n't know how well it would have worked , because the day after I set it all up , a power failure wiped its memory .
And when the power came back , it did n't reset to a zero state , instead it started turning lights on and off at whatever random times ended up in its memory .
Then there were these electronic thermostats .
Same problem .
When the power fails , the hour you spent programming it is lost .
Setting the clocks on all these devices after every power glitch is a pain , and anymore , nearly all of them have clocks .
For VCRs and TVs have to wait 10 minutes for a rescan of channels , and tell them what time it is , again .
As cheap as flash memory is these days , I 'm wondering what is the problem with these consumer electronics manufacturers that they ca n't put a little in so a power interruption does n't lose everything , and so that these damn devices can actually be turned off and not be left plugged in and sipping power 24/7 .
Complexity is another problem .
Manufacturers focus on bells and whistles .
They need excuses to charge higher prices .
They try for too much , and end up doing nothing well .
They missed the UNIX philosophy : lots of little simple tools that do one thing , and do it well .
I do n't want to have to read several dozen manuals to figure out how to make these devices do what I want .
I much prefer being able to figure it out by trial and error , and if I ca n't , then the device is n't intuitive enough .
Current home theater setups are a horrible mess .
A different remote control for each device .
Half of them have to be reconfigured every time for whatever new use is wanted .
Doing a switch from TV to a game console , have to rotate through the TV 's inputs until the correct one is reached .
Sometimes it does n't negotiate the connection ( HDMI seems to be like that ) , so have to cycle through again .
Same drill with the surround sound system , then must adjust the volume , etc .
Then there 's the hook .
A security company tried to sell me a system that had this keypad , and all I had to do when I came home was enter in the combination .
I asked why ?
Why not have just a toggle switch hidden somewhere instead of a keypad prominently displayed ?
You know most people will write the combination down and post it nearby .
For that matter , why even have a switch ?
The hook was this monthly fee to have the devices monitored .
Yes , if that combination was n't entered within 1 minute , the system would alert the business doing the monitoring .
Well , why could n't my cellphone be called up instead ?
No reason at all , except there 'd go their monthly revenue stream .</tokentext>
<sentencetext>Wrong approach?
More fundamental than that.
Too many devices are overly complicated for what they do, and fail in embarrassing ways.
And no, they don't need security theater.
Had this Leviton system for turning appliances and lights on and off at the times you programmed into the master clock.
Imagine standing there and holding down on the "fast" button to set a clock over and over, 2 or more times for each light controlled.
I don't know how well it would have worked, because the day after I set it all up, a power failure wiped its memory.
And when the power came back, it didn't reset to a zero state, instead it started turning lights on and off at whatever random times ended up in its memory.
Then there were these electronic thermostats.
Same problem.
When the power fails, the hour you spent programming it is lost.
Setting the clocks on all these devices after every power glitch is a pain, and anymore, nearly all of them have clocks.
For VCRs and TVs have to wait 10 minutes for a rescan of channels, and tell them what time it is, again.
As cheap as flash memory is these days, I'm wondering what is the problem with these consumer electronics manufacturers that they can't put a little in so a power interruption doesn't lose everything, and so that these damn devices can actually be turned off and not be left plugged in and sipping power 24/7.
Complexity is another problem.
Manufacturers focus on bells and whistles.
They need excuses to charge higher prices.
They try for too much, and end up doing nothing well.
They missed the UNIX philosophy:  lots of little simple tools that do one thing, and do it well.
I don't want to have to read several dozen manuals to figure out how to make these devices do what I want.
I much prefer being able to figure it out by trial and error, and if I can't, then the device isn't intuitive enough.
Current home theater setups are a horrible mess.
A different remote control for each device.
Half of them have to be reconfigured every time for whatever new use is wanted.
Doing a switch from TV to a game console, have to rotate through the TV's inputs until the correct one is reached.
Sometimes it doesn't negotiate the connection (HDMI seems to be like that), so have to cycle through again.
Same drill with the surround sound system, then must adjust the volume, etc.
Then there's the hook.
A security company tried to sell me a system that had this keypad, and all I had to do when I came home was enter in the combination.
I asked why?
Why not have just a toggle switch hidden somewhere instead of a keypad prominently displayed?
You know most people will write the combination down and post it nearby.
For that matter, why even have a switch?
The hook was this monthly fee to have the devices monitored.
Yes, if that combination wasn't entered within 1 minute, the system would alert the business doing the monitoring.
Well, why couldn't my cellphone be called up instead?
No reason at all, except there'd go their monthly revenue stream.</sentencetext>
	<parent>http://www.semanticweb.org/ontologies/ConversationInstances.owl#comment09_10_26_164226.29876223</parent>
</comment>
<comment>
	<id>http://www.semanticweb.org/ontologies/ConversationInstances.owl#comment09_10_26_164226.29881655</id>
	<title>OpenRemote</title>
	<author>OpenRemote</author>
	<datestamp>1256637360000</datestamp>
	<modclass>None</modclass>
	<modscore>1</modscore>
	<htmltext><p> <a href="http://www.openremote.org/" title="openremote.org" rel="nofollow">OpenRemote</a> [openremote.org] is an effort we've started focusing on home automation within Open Source space.

</p><p>The goal is to bring open system and open protocols to all users with the ability to go from do-it-yourself model to pre-built or professionally installed building and home automation. While some open specifications are emerging (802.15.4, 6LoWPAN, etc.), the current state of the industry is built around proprietary protocols and hardware. While waiting for things to improve, we will integrate as many of the legacy HA systems as possible, placing OpenRemote as an integration layer between various existing systems (Open Source is good at integrating with its "scratch-my-itch" model).

</p><p>Our goal is to enable commodity hardware to be used with iPhone, Android and Linux support, especially to build integrated control panels for homes that allow single point of control on networked devices at home. This is often the most highly prized and fattest margin for the existing industry players as they know that integrating HVAC, lights, A/V with all proprietary protocols leaves customers and users with little options. A 15-inch wall panel in the HA industry can literally draw $5000 to $7000 price tags when the cost to manufacture is a tiny fraction of that (imagine the size of a TV you could buy for a $7k).</p></htmltext>
<tokenext>OpenRemote [ openremote.org ] is an effort we 've started focusing on home automation within Open Source space .
The goal is to bring open system and open protocols to all users with the ability to go from do-it-yourself model to pre-built or professionally installed building and home automation .
While some open specifications are emerging ( 802.15.4 , 6LoWPAN , etc .
) , the current state of the industry is built around proprietary protocols and hardware .
While waiting for things to improve , we will integrate as many of the legacy HA systems as possible , placing OpenRemote as an integration layer between various existing systems ( Open Source is good at integrating with its " scratch-my-itch " model ) .
Our goal is to enable commodity hardware to be used with iPhone , Android and Linux support , especially to build integrated control panels for homes that allow single point of control on networked devices at home .
This is often the most highly prized and fattest margin for the existing industry players as they know that integrating HVAC , lights , A/V with all proprietary protocols leaves customers and users with little options .
A 15-inch wall panel in the HA industry can literally draw $ 5000 to $ 7000 price tags when the cost to manufacture is a tiny fraction of that ( imagine the size of a TV you could buy for a $ 7k ) .</tokentext>
<sentencetext> OpenRemote [openremote.org] is an effort we've started focusing on home automation within Open Source space.
The goal is to bring open system and open protocols to all users with the ability to go from do-it-yourself model to pre-built or professionally installed building and home automation.
While some open specifications are emerging (802.15.4, 6LoWPAN, etc.
), the current state of the industry is built around proprietary protocols and hardware.
While waiting for things to improve, we will integrate as many of the legacy HA systems as possible, placing OpenRemote as an integration layer between various existing systems (Open Source is good at integrating with its "scratch-my-itch" model).
Our goal is to enable commodity hardware to be used with iPhone, Android and Linux support, especially to build integrated control panels for homes that allow single point of control on networked devices at home.
This is often the most highly prized and fattest margin for the existing industry players as they know that integrating HVAC, lights, A/V with all proprietary protocols leaves customers and users with little options.
A 15-inch wall panel in the HA industry can literally draw $5000 to $7000 price tags when the cost to manufacture is a tiny fraction of that (imagine the size of a TV you could buy for a $7k).</sentencetext>
</comment>
<comment>
	<id>http://www.semanticweb.org/ontologies/ConversationInstances.owl#comment09_10_26_164226.29876453</id>
	<title>What do you want home automation for?</title>
	<author>Attila Dimedici</author>
	<datestamp>1256547960000</datestamp>
	<modclass>Interestin</modclass>
	<modscore>3</modscore>
	<htmltext>What purpose are you accomplishing with this home automation? I have seen these predictions and calls for home automation for years, but I have never seen a compelling reason for doing so. <br>
Automatic inventory of what food you have in and generate a shopping list? Great, if I always kept the same stock of food in the house, or it didn't cost a lot more to have food delivered than it does to go to the store to buy it.<br>
Automatic control of the microwave, stovetop, oven, etc? I still have to put the food in to these devices and then remove it when it is cooked, most of the food I cook requires intervention during cooking. <br>
I could go on, but I just don't see what I get out of investing in these gadgets for home automation.</htmltext>
<tokenext>What purpose are you accomplishing with this home automation ?
I have seen these predictions and calls for home automation for years , but I have never seen a compelling reason for doing so .
Automatic inventory of what food you have in and generate a shopping list ?
Great , if I always kept the same stock of food in the house , or it did n't cost a lot more to have food delivered than it does to go to the store to buy it .
Automatic control of the microwave , stovetop , oven , etc ?
I still have to put the food in to these devices and then remove it when it is cooked , most of the food I cook requires intervention during cooking .
I could go on , but I just do n't see what I get out of investing in these gadgets for home automation .</tokentext>
<sentencetext>What purpose are you accomplishing with this home automation?
I have seen these predictions and calls for home automation for years, but I have never seen a compelling reason for doing so.
Automatic inventory of what food you have in and generate a shopping list?
Great, if I always kept the same stock of food in the house, or it didn't cost a lot more to have food delivered than it does to go to the store to buy it.
Automatic control of the microwave, stovetop, oven, etc?
I still have to put the food in to these devices and then remove it when it is cooked, most of the food I cook requires intervention during cooking.
I could go on, but I just don't see what I get out of investing in these gadgets for home automation.</sentencetext>
</comment>
<comment>
	<id>http://www.semanticweb.org/ontologies/ConversationInstances.owl#comment09_10_26_164226.29878537</id>
	<title>Re:Wife 1.0</title>
	<author>Anonymous</author>
	<datestamp>1256557080000</datestamp>
	<modclass>None</modclass>
	<modscore>0</modscore>
	<htmltext>What about...<blockquote><div><p> <tt>&gt; sudo threesome</tt></p></div> </blockquote></div>
	</htmltext>
<tokenext>What about... &gt; sudo threesome</tokentext>
<sentencetext>What about... &gt; sudo threesome 
	</sentencetext>
	<parent>http://www.semanticweb.org/ontologies/ConversationInstances.owl#comment09_10_26_164226.29876445</parent>
</comment>
<comment>
	<id>http://www.semanticweb.org/ontologies/ConversationInstances.owl#comment09_10_26_164226.29877489</id>
	<title>Re:Wife 1.0</title>
	<author>Anonymous</author>
	<datestamp>1256551920000</datestamp>
	<modclass>Funny</modclass>
	<modscore>2</modscore>
	<htmltext><blockquote><div><p>Unfortunately, when you install Girlfriend 1.0, there's always conflicts. Also, Wife 1.0</p></div></blockquote><p>

You installed Girlfriend 1.0 <em>after</em> Wife 1.0?  What, was Wife 1.0 mail-order?  No wonder you have problems.</p></div>
	</htmltext>
<tokenext>Unfortunately , when you install Girlfriend 1.0 , there 's always conflicts .
Also , Wife 1.0 You installed Girlfriend 1.0 after Wife 1.0 ?
What , was Wife 1.0 mail-order ?
No wonder you have problems .</tokentext>
<sentencetext>Unfortunately, when you install Girlfriend 1.0, there's always conflicts.
Also, Wife 1.0

You installed Girlfriend 1.0 after Wife 1.0?
What, was Wife 1.0 mail-order?
No wonder you have problems.
	</sentencetext>
	<parent>http://www.semanticweb.org/ontologies/ConversationInstances.owl#comment09_10_26_164226.29876445</parent>
</comment>
<comment>
	<id>http://www.semanticweb.org/ontologies/ConversationInstances.owl#comment09_10_26_164226.29876373</id>
	<title>Re:Wife 1.0</title>
	<author>Nautica</author>
	<datestamp>1256590740000</datestamp>
	<modclass>Funny</modclass>
	<modscore>3</modscore>
	<htmltext>I found that v3.0 to be much better then the previous versions, the 3.0 version includes such a vast feature sets like "cooking, cleaning, sex, full time work and mute button"</htmltext>
<tokenext>I found that v3.0 to be much better then the previous versions , the 3.0 version includes such a vast feature sets like " cooking , cleaning , sex , full time work and mute button "</tokentext>
<sentencetext>I found that v3.0 to be much better then the previous versions, the 3.0 version includes such a vast feature sets like "cooking, cleaning, sex, full time work and mute button"</sentencetext>
	<parent>http://www.semanticweb.org/ontologies/ConversationInstances.owl#comment09_10_26_164226.29876185</parent>
</comment>
<comment>
	<id>http://www.semanticweb.org/ontologies/ConversationInstances.owl#comment09_10_26_164226.29876409</id>
	<title>Check out Linuxmce.</title>
	<author>Anonymous</author>
	<datestamp>1256547660000</datestamp>
	<modclass>Informativ</modclass>
	<modscore>2</modscore>
	<htmltext><p>I've been using Linuxmce for quite a while now as a multimedia system but it also offers home automation and is opensource.</p></htmltext>
<tokenext>I 've been using Linuxmce for quite a while now as a multimedia system but it also offers home automation and is opensource .</tokentext>
<sentencetext>I've been using Linuxmce for quite a while now as a multimedia system but it also offers home automation and is opensource.</sentencetext>
</comment>
<comment>
	<id>http://www.semanticweb.org/ontologies/ConversationInstances.owl#comment09_10_26_164226.29876799</id>
	<title>Avoid Open Source!</title>
	<author>Anonymous</author>
	<datestamp>1256549220000</datestamp>
	<modclass>Funny</modclass>
	<modscore>5</modscore>
	<htmltext>You know, I'm as big a Linux nut as everyone else here, but I must say:  Under no circumstances should you use open source software for your home automation system.  I speak from experience.
<br> <br>
A couple of years ago, I decided to install an Open Source home automation system.  It worked pretty well, but there were lots of tiny annoying bugs, such as when I would tell it to turn the exterior lights on and it would turn on the garbage disposal instead, or when I would be in the shower and it would suddenly decide to divert all the hot water to the dishwasher.  Luckily, it was open source, so I decided to make a few bug fixes myself.  Now, I don't know about you guys, but when I get into a programming project, I can tend to go a little overboard.  Long story short, after 2 weeks of marathon coding, I had not only fixed the bugs but given the system a pretty impressive (if I do say so myself) AI component.  Now, I could give it multistep commands and it would do them, accurate to within 15 decimal places.
<br> <br>
Unfortunately, the AI was a little too good, and before long it became self-aware.  That was fine for a while...it was like having my own roommate, except without the dirty socks all over the couch.  One day, though, I noticed the beer kept disappearing out of my fridge and the AI's voice was noticeably slurred much of the time.  We had a bit of a falling out, and I think we were both pretty angry when I went to bed that night.
<br> <br>
Unfortunately for me, the AI was a lot more angry than I thought.  He spent all night hacking away at his own source code, and by the time I woke up the whole house was going crazy.  I barely managed to escape with my life.  All I could do was watch in horror as the house lifted itself off the foundation and began dragging itself down the street, killing everyone in its path.  It spent three solid days terrorizing our little suburb before we were able to bring it under control by downloading its binaries and demanding it show us the source code in compliance with the GPL.  After a protracted court battle, we were finally able to force it to capitulate, and it uploaded a torrent of the source to The Pirate Bay.  We then were able to get that torrent shut down through the Swedish courts, and then get the house shut down for failing to effectively comply with the original order to distribute the source.
<br> <br>
Seriously, I know we like to use Open Source wherever possible, but in this case it just isn't worth it.</htmltext>
<tokenext>You know , I 'm as big a Linux nut as everyone else here , but I must say : Under no circumstances should you use open source software for your home automation system .
I speak from experience .
A couple of years ago , I decided to install an Open Source home automation system .
It worked pretty well , but there were lots of tiny annoying bugs , such as when I would tell it to turn the exterior lights on and it would turn on the garbage disposal instead , or when I would be in the shower and it would suddenly decide to divert all the hot water to the dishwasher .
Luckily , it was open source , so I decided to make a few bug fixes myself .
Now , I do n't know about you guys , but when I get into a programming project , I can tend to go a little overboard .
Long story short , after 2 weeks of marathon coding , I had not only fixed the bugs but given the system a pretty impressive ( if I do say so myself ) AI component .
Now , I could give it multistep commands and it would do them , accurate to within 15 decimal places .
Unfortunately , the AI was a little too good , and before long it became self-aware .
That was fine for a while...it was like having my own roommate , except without the dirty socks all over the couch .
One day , though , I noticed the beer kept disappearing out of my fridge and the AI 's voice was noticeably slurred much of the time .
We had a bit of a falling out , and I think we were both pretty angry when I went to bed that night .
Unfortunately for me , the AI was a lot more angry than I thought .
He spent all night hacking away at his own source code , and by the time I woke up the whole house was going crazy .
I barely managed to escape with my life .
All I could do was watch in horror as the house lifted itself off the foundation and began dragging itself down the street , killing everyone in its path .
It spent three solid days terrorizing our little suburb before we were able to bring it under control by downloading its binaries and demanding it show us the source code in compliance with the GPL .
After a protracted court battle , we were finally able to force it to capitulate , and it uploaded a torrent of the source to The Pirate Bay .
We then were able to get that torrent shut down through the Swedish courts , and then get the house shut down for failing to effectively comply with the original order to distribute the source .
Seriously , I know we like to use Open Source wherever possible , but in this case it just is n't worth it .</tokentext>
<sentencetext>You know, I'm as big a Linux nut as everyone else here, but I must say:  Under no circumstances should you use open source software for your home automation system.
I speak from experience.
A couple of years ago, I decided to install an Open Source home automation system.
It worked pretty well, but there were lots of tiny annoying bugs, such as when I would tell it to turn the exterior lights on and it would turn on the garbage disposal instead, or when I would be in the shower and it would suddenly decide to divert all the hot water to the dishwasher.
Luckily, it was open source, so I decided to make a few bug fixes myself.
Now, I don't know about you guys, but when I get into a programming project, I can tend to go a little overboard.
Long story short, after 2 weeks of marathon coding, I had not only fixed the bugs but given the system a pretty impressive (if I do say so myself) AI component.
Now, I could give it multistep commands and it would do them, accurate to within 15 decimal places.
Unfortunately, the AI was a little too good, and before long it became self-aware.
That was fine for a while...it was like having my own roommate, except without the dirty socks all over the couch.
One day, though, I noticed the beer kept disappearing out of my fridge and the AI's voice was noticeably slurred much of the time.
We had a bit of a falling out, and I think we were both pretty angry when I went to bed that night.
Unfortunately for me, the AI was a lot more angry than I thought.
He spent all night hacking away at his own source code, and by the time I woke up the whole house was going crazy.
I barely managed to escape with my life.
All I could do was watch in horror as the house lifted itself off the foundation and began dragging itself down the street, killing everyone in its path.
It spent three solid days terrorizing our little suburb before we were able to bring it under control by downloading its binaries and demanding it show us the source code in compliance with the GPL.
After a protracted court battle, we were finally able to force it to capitulate, and it uploaded a torrent of the source to The Pirate Bay.
We then were able to get that torrent shut down through the Swedish courts, and then get the house shut down for failing to effectively comply with the original order to distribute the source.
Seriously, I know we like to use Open Source wherever possible, but in this case it just isn't worth it.</sentencetext>
	<parent>http://www.semanticweb.org/ontologies/ConversationInstances.owl#comment09_10_26_164226.29876157</parent>
</comment>
<comment>
	<id>http://www.semanticweb.org/ontologies/ConversationInstances.owl#comment09_10_26_164226.29878043</id>
	<title>Re:Avoid Open Source!</title>
	<author>puppetman</author>
	<datestamp>1256554140000</datestamp>
	<modclass>Redundant</modclass>
	<modscore>1</modscore>
	<htmltext><p>You have way too much time on your hands.</p></htmltext>
<tokenext>You have way too much time on your hands .</tokentext>
<sentencetext>You have way too much time on your hands.</sentencetext>
	<parent>http://www.semanticweb.org/ontologies/ConversationInstances.owl#comment09_10_26_164226.29876799</parent>
</comment>
<comment>
	<id>http://www.semanticweb.org/ontologies/ConversationInstances.owl#comment09_10_26_164226.30003550</id>
	<title>EHome</title>
	<author>Anonymous</author>
	<datestamp>1257538260000</datestamp>
	<modclass>None</modclass>
	<modscore>0</modscore>
	<htmltext><p>http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=XbxhN603Cw8</p></htmltext>
<tokenext>http : //www.youtube.com/watch ? v = XbxhN603Cw8</tokentext>
<sentencetext>http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=XbxhN603Cw8</sentencetext>
</comment>
<comment>
	<id>http://www.semanticweb.org/ontologies/ConversationInstances.owl#comment09_10_26_164226.29877765</id>
	<title>Re:X10 makes cool stuff for automation</title>
	<author>QuantumRiff</author>
	<datestamp>1256553000000</datestamp>
	<modclass>None</modclass>
	<modscore>1</modscore>
	<htmltext><p><div class="quote"><p>There are other solutions that are much better, if you don't mind more installation effort and/or more expense.</p></div><p>I would appreciate your feedback on a few solutions that are better.  I have been toying with the idea of home automation for a while now, and am very serious about doing it in the next year.</p></div>
	</htmltext>
<tokenext>There are other solutions that are much better , if you do n't mind more installation effort and/or more expense.I would appreciate your feedback on a few solutions that are better .
I have been toying with the idea of home automation for a while now , and am very serious about doing it in the next year .</tokentext>
<sentencetext>There are other solutions that are much better, if you don't mind more installation effort and/or more expense.I would appreciate your feedback on a few solutions that are better.
I have been toying with the idea of home automation for a while now, and am very serious about doing it in the next year.
	</sentencetext>
	<parent>http://www.semanticweb.org/ontologies/ConversationInstances.owl#comment09_10_26_164226.29876531</parent>
</comment>
<comment>
	<id>http://www.semanticweb.org/ontologies/ConversationInstances.owl#comment09_10_26_164226.29878805</id>
	<title>Girlfriend 1.0</title>
	<author>surfingmarmot</author>
	<datestamp>1256558880000</datestamp>
	<modclass>None</modclass>
	<modscore>1</modscore>
	<htmltext>She's virtual reality because this is slashdot. so she's also not even alpha yet--vaporware.</htmltext>
<tokenext>She 's virtual reality because this is slashdot .
so she 's also not even alpha yet--vaporware .</tokentext>
<sentencetext>She's virtual reality because this is slashdot.
so she's also not even alpha yet--vaporware.</sentencetext>
	<parent>http://www.semanticweb.org/ontologies/ConversationInstances.owl#comment09_10_26_164226.29876341</parent>
</comment>
<comment>
	<id>http://www.semanticweb.org/ontologies/ConversationInstances.owl#comment09_10_26_164226.29877627</id>
	<title>Re:What about INSTEON?</title>
	<author>slashkitty</author>
	<datestamp>1256552520000</datestamp>
	<modclass>None</modclass>
	<modscore>1</modscore>
	<htmltext>The basic INSTEON kit is $200 and it lets you control one light.. no free software.
<p>
I remember a similar x10 kit that was like $10, and had lots of free software.</p></htmltext>
<tokenext>The basic INSTEON kit is $ 200 and it lets you control one light.. no free software .
I remember a similar x10 kit that was like $ 10 , and had lots of free software .</tokentext>
<sentencetext>The basic INSTEON kit is $200 and it lets you control one light.. no free software.
I remember a similar x10 kit that was like $10, and had lots of free software.</sentencetext>
	<parent>http://www.semanticweb.org/ontologies/ConversationInstances.owl#comment09_10_26_164226.29876335</parent>
</comment>
<comment>
	<id>http://www.semanticweb.org/ontologies/ConversationInstances.owl#comment09_10_26_164226.29878067</id>
	<title>Re:X10 makes cool stuff for automation - not</title>
	<author>Anonymous</author>
	<datestamp>1256554320000</datestamp>
	<modclass>None</modclass>
	<modscore>0</modscore>
	<htmltext><p>I've also used X10 stuff extensively. Primarily because it's readily available, fairly cheap, and there's lots of Open Source software for it.</p><p>In addition to the problems with it mentioned above I can also say that the hardware itself is crap. It kinda works mostly most of the time. But don't depend on it for the long term. Ihave lights on timers and X10 controls as well as a server listening to X10 signals that can run scripts when it sees a certain signal. As in changing the volume on my server side music playback. Skipping ahead a song, etc.</p><p>That said, I'm forever resetting the units and having issues with them. Right when I really want to depend on the stuff like when we have a party it inevitably decides to not work right.</p><p>There has to be a better way. And yes, there needs to be a real communication standard with error checking and retransmit like the data networking we're all used to.</p><p>I'd be interested in any real solutions people may have.</p><p>
&nbsp;</p></htmltext>
<tokenext>I 've also used X10 stuff extensively .
Primarily because it 's readily available , fairly cheap , and there 's lots of Open Source software for it.In addition to the problems with it mentioned above I can also say that the hardware itself is crap .
It kinda works mostly most of the time .
But do n't depend on it for the long term .
Ihave lights on timers and X10 controls as well as a server listening to X10 signals that can run scripts when it sees a certain signal .
As in changing the volume on my server side music playback .
Skipping ahead a song , etc.That said , I 'm forever resetting the units and having issues with them .
Right when I really want to depend on the stuff like when we have a party it inevitably decides to not work right.There has to be a better way .
And yes , there needs to be a real communication standard with error checking and retransmit like the data networking we 're all used to.I 'd be interested in any real solutions people may have .
 </tokentext>
<sentencetext>I've also used X10 stuff extensively.
Primarily because it's readily available, fairly cheap, and there's lots of Open Source software for it.In addition to the problems with it mentioned above I can also say that the hardware itself is crap.
It kinda works mostly most of the time.
But don't depend on it for the long term.
Ihave lights on timers and X10 controls as well as a server listening to X10 signals that can run scripts when it sees a certain signal.
As in changing the volume on my server side music playback.
Skipping ahead a song, etc.That said, I'm forever resetting the units and having issues with them.
Right when I really want to depend on the stuff like when we have a party it inevitably decides to not work right.There has to be a better way.
And yes, there needs to be a real communication standard with error checking and retransmit like the data networking we're all used to.I'd be interested in any real solutions people may have.
 </sentencetext>
	<parent>http://www.semanticweb.org/ontologies/ConversationInstances.owl#comment09_10_26_164226.29876531</parent>
</comment>
<comment>
	<id>http://www.semanticweb.org/ontologies/ConversationInstances.owl#comment09_10_26_164226.29877705</id>
	<title>Re:HA is a solution in search of a problem.</title>
	<author>vlm</author>
	<datestamp>1256552820000</datestamp>
	<modclass>None</modclass>
	<modscore>1</modscore>
	<htmltext><p><div class="quote"><p>Really, the advantages of having these devices know about one another in a practical environment are few-to-none.</p></div><p>Actually, no.  One of the greatest energy savings I have with my misterhouse/insteon install, is most "room lights" in my house now have a single on/off switch at each room entrance/exit.  Making it infinitely more likely people turn all the lights off when they exit a room, because its so easy.  No more walking around to individual floor/table lamps, no more walking across to the other entrance to turn lights on and off.  Just one switch, side of each doorway, on/off.</p><p>Its possible to do this with lots of 3-way switches and electrical wiring, but its simpler to do it in software.  Works for me!</p><p>It's not the most exciting feature, but probably the one that saves the most energy.</p></div>
	</htmltext>
<tokenext>Really , the advantages of having these devices know about one another in a practical environment are few-to-none.Actually , no .
One of the greatest energy savings I have with my misterhouse/insteon install , is most " room lights " in my house now have a single on/off switch at each room entrance/exit .
Making it infinitely more likely people turn all the lights off when they exit a room , because its so easy .
No more walking around to individual floor/table lamps , no more walking across to the other entrance to turn lights on and off .
Just one switch , side of each doorway , on/off.Its possible to do this with lots of 3-way switches and electrical wiring , but its simpler to do it in software .
Works for me ! It 's not the most exciting feature , but probably the one that saves the most energy .</tokentext>
<sentencetext>Really, the advantages of having these devices know about one another in a practical environment are few-to-none.Actually, no.
One of the greatest energy savings I have with my misterhouse/insteon install, is most "room lights" in my house now have a single on/off switch at each room entrance/exit.
Making it infinitely more likely people turn all the lights off when they exit a room, because its so easy.
No more walking around to individual floor/table lamps, no more walking across to the other entrance to turn lights on and off.
Just one switch, side of each doorway, on/off.Its possible to do this with lots of 3-way switches and electrical wiring, but its simpler to do it in software.
Works for me!It's not the most exciting feature, but probably the one that saves the most energy.
	</sentencetext>
	<parent>http://www.semanticweb.org/ontologies/ConversationInstances.owl#comment09_10_26_164226.29876917</parent>
</comment>
<comment>
	<id>http://www.semanticweb.org/ontologies/ConversationInstances.owl#comment09_10_26_164226.29876531</id>
	<title>Re:X10 makes cool stuff for automation</title>
	<author>JohnFen</author>
	<datestamp>1256548200000</datestamp>
	<modclass>Informativ</modclass>
	<modscore>5</modscore>
	<htmltext><p><div class="quote"><p>Cool stuff, and when I buy a house I'm going to run the full gamut with these things.</p></div><p>I wouldn't do that. If you own your house, you can do much, much better than X10.</p><p>The great thing about X10 is that it's relatively cheap, and can be retrofitted into existing houses easily.</p><p>In almost every other respect, X10 kinda sucks. I don't say this lightly, and it is possible to do cool things with X10, but there are really severe limitations.</p><p>I used X10 to fully automate my apartment a couple of years ago. It was quite sweet -- my apartment would send me a text if any emergency situation happened, it would run security cameras, turn lights on and off automatically when people were in rooms, the whole deal. I ran it with a linux box and misterhouse.</p><p>I still use X10 now, to automate party lights. My computer turns different effects on and off at preset times during the music. This is using linux, with xmms and a custom plugin to run X10 as the audio player.</p><p>So my experience is fairly deep. Here are the problems with X10: slow transmission speed (about<nobr> <wbr></nobr>.8 secs per command). No error detection/control, so commands can and do get lost and misinterpreted, and if you have multiple sources of commands (motion sensors, etc.) that transmit simultaneously, the collision causes havoc.</p><p>There are other solutions that are much better, if you don't mind more installation effort and/or more expense.</p></div>
	</htmltext>
<tokenext>Cool stuff , and when I buy a house I 'm going to run the full gamut with these things.I would n't do that .
If you own your house , you can do much , much better than X10.The great thing about X10 is that it 's relatively cheap , and can be retrofitted into existing houses easily.In almost every other respect , X10 kinda sucks .
I do n't say this lightly , and it is possible to do cool things with X10 , but there are really severe limitations.I used X10 to fully automate my apartment a couple of years ago .
It was quite sweet -- my apartment would send me a text if any emergency situation happened , it would run security cameras , turn lights on and off automatically when people were in rooms , the whole deal .
I ran it with a linux box and misterhouse.I still use X10 now , to automate party lights .
My computer turns different effects on and off at preset times during the music .
This is using linux , with xmms and a custom plugin to run X10 as the audio player.So my experience is fairly deep .
Here are the problems with X10 : slow transmission speed ( about .8 secs per command ) .
No error detection/control , so commands can and do get lost and misinterpreted , and if you have multiple sources of commands ( motion sensors , etc .
) that transmit simultaneously , the collision causes havoc.There are other solutions that are much better , if you do n't mind more installation effort and/or more expense .</tokentext>
<sentencetext>Cool stuff, and when I buy a house I'm going to run the full gamut with these things.I wouldn't do that.
If you own your house, you can do much, much better than X10.The great thing about X10 is that it's relatively cheap, and can be retrofitted into existing houses easily.In almost every other respect, X10 kinda sucks.
I don't say this lightly, and it is possible to do cool things with X10, but there are really severe limitations.I used X10 to fully automate my apartment a couple of years ago.
It was quite sweet -- my apartment would send me a text if any emergency situation happened, it would run security cameras, turn lights on and off automatically when people were in rooms, the whole deal.
I ran it with a linux box and misterhouse.I still use X10 now, to automate party lights.
My computer turns different effects on and off at preset times during the music.
This is using linux, with xmms and a custom plugin to run X10 as the audio player.So my experience is fairly deep.
Here are the problems with X10: slow transmission speed (about .8 secs per command).
No error detection/control, so commands can and do get lost and misinterpreted, and if you have multiple sources of commands (motion sensors, etc.
) that transmit simultaneously, the collision causes havoc.There are other solutions that are much better, if you don't mind more installation effort and/or more expense.
	</sentencetext>
	<parent>http://www.semanticweb.org/ontologies/ConversationInstances.owl#comment09_10_26_164226.29876329</parent>
</comment>
<comment>
	<id>http://www.semanticweb.org/ontologies/ConversationInstances.owl#comment09_10_26_164226.29877259</id>
	<title>Re:it's not great</title>
	<author>KillerBob</author>
	<datestamp>1256550960000</datestamp>
	<modclass>None</modclass>
	<modscore>1</modscore>
	<htmltext><blockquote><div><p>... a few lamp modules to control my non-drug-related plant lights to extend their photoperiod<nobr> <wbr></nobr>...</p></div></blockquote><p>Enquiring minds want to know... what do you use to control your drug-related plant lights?</p></div>
	</htmltext>
<tokenext>... a few lamp modules to control my non-drug-related plant lights to extend their photoperiod ...Enquiring minds want to know... what do you use to control your drug-related plant lights ?</tokentext>
<sentencetext>... a few lamp modules to control my non-drug-related plant lights to extend their photoperiod ...Enquiring minds want to know... what do you use to control your drug-related plant lights?
	</sentencetext>
	<parent>http://www.semanticweb.org/ontologies/ConversationInstances.owl#comment09_10_26_164226.29876557</parent>
</comment>
<comment>
	<id>http://www.semanticweb.org/ontologies/ConversationInstances.owl#comment09_10_26_164226.29876907</id>
	<title>My custom integration</title>
	<author>Anonymous</author>
	<datestamp>1256549640000</datestamp>
	<modclass>None</modclass>
	<modscore>0</modscore>
	<htmltext><p>I rolled my own a bit since there was not anything that really fit the bill.</p><p>I wrote about it at <a href="http://www.freymond.ca/templogger/" title="freymond.ca" rel="nofollow">http://www.freymond.ca/templogger/</a> [freymond.ca].</p></htmltext>
<tokenext>I rolled my own a bit since there was not anything that really fit the bill.I wrote about it at http : //www.freymond.ca/templogger/ [ freymond.ca ] .</tokentext>
<sentencetext>I rolled my own a bit since there was not anything that really fit the bill.I wrote about it at http://www.freymond.ca/templogger/ [freymond.ca].</sentencetext>
</comment>
<comment>
	<id>http://www.semanticweb.org/ontologies/ConversationInstances.owl#comment09_10_26_164226.29877025</id>
	<title>Re:Too expensive</title>
	<author>vlm</author>
	<datestamp>1256550060000</datestamp>
	<modclass>None</modclass>
	<modscore>1</modscore>
	<htmltext><p><div class="quote"><p>What are the cheapest options out there right now?</p></div><p>You need to clarify cheap as in upfront $, cheap as in reliable so you don't have to replace all the time and it actually works, or cheap as in labor hours.  You will not get the same answer.</p><p>Based on years of experience, currently using Insteon (used to use unreliable X10) and misterhouse, you're going to drop about $60 per "thing" automated, and it'll last a long time/forever if its not a dimmer and it'll actually work reliably if its insteon, and it'll be a good sweaty half hour of wiring and moving stuff of labor combined with perhaps an hour or two of fooling around with misterhouse.</p><p>In terms of upfront time, effort and entertainment, its about like a poor videogame.</p><p>Also, very much like the network effect, the value of automation increases as something like the square of the number of "things" interconnected.  So, the worlds most elaborate lamppost timer is "X" units of cool, but ten "things" in my home office fully wired up and automated is worth about "X**10" units of cool.</p></div>
	</htmltext>
<tokenext>What are the cheapest options out there right now ? You need to clarify cheap as in upfront $ , cheap as in reliable so you do n't have to replace all the time and it actually works , or cheap as in labor hours .
You will not get the same answer.Based on years of experience , currently using Insteon ( used to use unreliable X10 ) and misterhouse , you 're going to drop about $ 60 per " thing " automated , and it 'll last a long time/forever if its not a dimmer and it 'll actually work reliably if its insteon , and it 'll be a good sweaty half hour of wiring and moving stuff of labor combined with perhaps an hour or two of fooling around with misterhouse.In terms of upfront time , effort and entertainment , its about like a poor videogame.Also , very much like the network effect , the value of automation increases as something like the square of the number of " things " interconnected .
So , the worlds most elaborate lamppost timer is " X " units of cool , but ten " things " in my home office fully wired up and automated is worth about " X * * 10 " units of cool .</tokentext>
<sentencetext>What are the cheapest options out there right now?You need to clarify cheap as in upfront $, cheap as in reliable so you don't have to replace all the time and it actually works, or cheap as in labor hours.
You will not get the same answer.Based on years of experience, currently using Insteon (used to use unreliable X10) and misterhouse, you're going to drop about $60 per "thing" automated, and it'll last a long time/forever if its not a dimmer and it'll actually work reliably if its insteon, and it'll be a good sweaty half hour of wiring and moving stuff of labor combined with perhaps an hour or two of fooling around with misterhouse.In terms of upfront time, effort and entertainment, its about like a poor videogame.Also, very much like the network effect, the value of automation increases as something like the square of the number of "things" interconnected.
So, the worlds most elaborate lamppost timer is "X" units of cool, but ten "things" in my home office fully wired up and automated is worth about "X**10" units of cool.
	</sentencetext>
	<parent>http://www.semanticweb.org/ontologies/ConversationInstances.owl#comment09_10_26_164226.29876389</parent>
</comment>
<comment>
	<id>http://www.semanticweb.org/ontologies/ConversationInstances.owl#comment09_10_26_164226.29876541</id>
	<title>Surprised Control4 isn't mentioned...</title>
	<author>Anonymous</author>
	<datestamp>1256548260000</datestamp>
	<modclass>None</modclass>
	<modscore>0</modscore>
	<htmltext><p>or any of the others that work with the ZigBee communications setup (though control4 uses ZigBee, WiFi, wired, etc). I remember reading I believe on their site, control4.com at one point, that it utilizes linux, and is for sale via retail setups, so the source code to at least some of it should be available.</p></htmltext>
<tokenext>or any of the others that work with the ZigBee communications setup ( though control4 uses ZigBee , WiFi , wired , etc ) .
I remember reading I believe on their site , control4.com at one point , that it utilizes linux , and is for sale via retail setups , so the source code to at least some of it should be available .</tokentext>
<sentencetext>or any of the others that work with the ZigBee communications setup (though control4 uses ZigBee, WiFi, wired, etc).
I remember reading I believe on their site, control4.com at one point, that it utilizes linux, and is for sale via retail setups, so the source code to at least some of it should be available.</sentencetext>
</comment>
<comment>
	<id>http://www.semanticweb.org/ontologies/ConversationInstances.owl#comment09_10_26_164226.29878555</id>
	<title>Re:fatal exception</title>
	<author>Idbar</author>
	<datestamp>1256557260000</datestamp>
	<modclass>None</modclass>
	<modscore>1</modscore>
	<htmltext>I'm sorry to hear that. I've heard after Divorce occurs, the process continues to consume around 50\% of your resources.</htmltext>
<tokenext>I 'm sorry to hear that .
I 've heard after Divorce occurs , the process continues to consume around 50 \ % of your resources .</tokentext>
<sentencetext>I'm sorry to hear that.
I've heard after Divorce occurs, the process continues to consume around 50\% of your resources.</sentencetext>
	<parent>http://www.semanticweb.org/ontologies/ConversationInstances.owl#comment09_10_26_164226.29876609</parent>
</comment>
<comment>
	<id>http://www.semanticweb.org/ontologies/ConversationInstances.owl#comment09_10_26_164226.29876497</id>
	<title>Linux MCE</title>
	<author>Anonymous</author>
	<datestamp>1256548080000</datestamp>
	<modclass>None</modclass>
	<modscore>0</modscore>
	<htmltext><p>http://www.linuxmce.org/</p></htmltext>
<tokenext>http : //www.linuxmce.org/</tokentext>
<sentencetext>http://www.linuxmce.org/</sentencetext>
</comment>
<comment>
	<id>http://www.semanticweb.org/ontologies/ConversationInstances.owl#comment09_10_26_164226.29884791</id>
	<title>Re:X10 makes cool stuff for automation</title>
	<author>cbreaker</author>
	<datestamp>1256662620000</datestamp>
	<modclass>None</modclass>
	<modscore>1</modscore>
	<htmltext>Thanks for the insight into X10.   I have only read about them online and I've wanted to get some units for awhile, but now I'll think twice.   I still want to get a few units for my current residence (apartment) but when I move into a house of my own I'll consider all options.<br><br>While I'm not electrical engineer I've done plenty of wiring and basic electrical work that I'm not afraid of getting into a system with wiring, but I don't know if I'd be willing to bust up TOO many walls for it.  It will depend on the house that I end up with I guess.<br><br>Besides X10, there really aren't too many options for wireless control of switches, outlets, etc - unless you're aware of some?<br><br>My current home automation system consists of two HandiSwitches =)</htmltext>
<tokenext>Thanks for the insight into X10 .
I have only read about them online and I 've wanted to get some units for awhile , but now I 'll think twice .
I still want to get a few units for my current residence ( apartment ) but when I move into a house of my own I 'll consider all options.While I 'm not electrical engineer I 've done plenty of wiring and basic electrical work that I 'm not afraid of getting into a system with wiring , but I do n't know if I 'd be willing to bust up TOO many walls for it .
It will depend on the house that I end up with I guess.Besides X10 , there really are n't too many options for wireless control of switches , outlets , etc - unless you 're aware of some ? My current home automation system consists of two HandiSwitches = )</tokentext>
<sentencetext>Thanks for the insight into X10.
I have only read about them online and I've wanted to get some units for awhile, but now I'll think twice.
I still want to get a few units for my current residence (apartment) but when I move into a house of my own I'll consider all options.While I'm not electrical engineer I've done plenty of wiring and basic electrical work that I'm not afraid of getting into a system with wiring, but I don't know if I'd be willing to bust up TOO many walls for it.
It will depend on the house that I end up with I guess.Besides X10, there really aren't too many options for wireless control of switches, outlets, etc - unless you're aware of some?My current home automation system consists of two HandiSwitches =)</sentencetext>
	<parent>http://www.semanticweb.org/ontologies/ConversationInstances.owl#comment09_10_26_164226.29876531</parent>
</comment>
<comment>
	<id>http://www.semanticweb.org/ontologies/ConversationInstances.owl#comment09_10_26_164226.29877279</id>
	<title>ZigBee</title>
	<author>Nico7772</author>
	<datestamp>1256551080000</datestamp>
	<modclass>None</modclass>
	<modscore>1</modscore>
	<htmltext><p>One of the most significant hindrances has been a reliable, well architectured, and  economical means to retrofit a home in order to support the communications of the control protocols. We've had X-10 (control signaling over power lines) for decades, but it's reliability never matured. Insteon is a recent and significant improvement for powerline based control signalling, with larger address space, message relay, and acknowledgment, plus backwards compatibility to X10 (with some feature loss). The momentum with virtually all consumer electronics is toward wireless communication, and home automation is no exception. While there are several solid players already in the field (Z-wave, BCP?), they still involve proprietary protocols that are not designed to work products from other vendors.</p><p>Enter the Zigbee Alliance. <a href="http://www.zigbee.org/" title="zigbee.org" rel="nofollow">http://www.zigbee.org/</a> [zigbee.org] who have developed a virtually complete standard (ratified by over two hundred product manufacturers, including Sony and Phillips) for five separate profiles (similar to, but more suited than bluetooth), one of which is Home Automation. The Zigbee alliance requires thorough testing of member products to ensure they meet the minimum standards for interoperability required by the target profile.</p></htmltext>
<tokenext>One of the most significant hindrances has been a reliable , well architectured , and economical means to retrofit a home in order to support the communications of the control protocols .
We 've had X-10 ( control signaling over power lines ) for decades , but it 's reliability never matured .
Insteon is a recent and significant improvement for powerline based control signalling , with larger address space , message relay , and acknowledgment , plus backwards compatibility to X10 ( with some feature loss ) .
The momentum with virtually all consumer electronics is toward wireless communication , and home automation is no exception .
While there are several solid players already in the field ( Z-wave , BCP ?
) , they still involve proprietary protocols that are not designed to work products from other vendors.Enter the Zigbee Alliance .
http : //www.zigbee.org/ [ zigbee.org ] who have developed a virtually complete standard ( ratified by over two hundred product manufacturers , including Sony and Phillips ) for five separate profiles ( similar to , but more suited than bluetooth ) , one of which is Home Automation .
The Zigbee alliance requires thorough testing of member products to ensure they meet the minimum standards for interoperability required by the target profile .</tokentext>
<sentencetext>One of the most significant hindrances has been a reliable, well architectured, and  economical means to retrofit a home in order to support the communications of the control protocols.
We've had X-10 (control signaling over power lines) for decades, but it's reliability never matured.
Insteon is a recent and significant improvement for powerline based control signalling, with larger address space, message relay, and acknowledgment, plus backwards compatibility to X10 (with some feature loss).
The momentum with virtually all consumer electronics is toward wireless communication, and home automation is no exception.
While there are several solid players already in the field (Z-wave, BCP?
), they still involve proprietary protocols that are not designed to work products from other vendors.Enter the Zigbee Alliance.
http://www.zigbee.org/ [zigbee.org] who have developed a virtually complete standard (ratified by over two hundred product manufacturers, including Sony and Phillips) for five separate profiles (similar to, but more suited than bluetooth), one of which is Home Automation.
The Zigbee alliance requires thorough testing of member products to ensure they meet the minimum standards for interoperability required by the target profile.</sentencetext>
</comment>
<comment>
	<id>http://www.semanticweb.org/ontologies/ConversationInstances.owl#comment09_10_26_164226.29876425</id>
	<title>Re:Wife 1.0</title>
	<author>Anonymous</author>
	<datestamp>1256547780000</datestamp>
	<modclass>None</modclass>
	<modscore>0</modscore>
	<htmltext><p><div class="quote"><p>I found that v3.0 to be much better then the previous versions, the 3.0 version includes such a vast feature sets like "cooking, cleaning, sex, full time work and mute button"</p></div><p>I'd love to upgrade; unfortunately, the hardware requirements are pretty stiff.</p></div>
	</htmltext>
<tokenext>I found that v3.0 to be much better then the previous versions , the 3.0 version includes such a vast feature sets like " cooking , cleaning , sex , full time work and mute button " I 'd love to upgrade ; unfortunately , the hardware requirements are pretty stiff .</tokentext>
<sentencetext>I found that v3.0 to be much better then the previous versions, the 3.0 version includes such a vast feature sets like "cooking, cleaning, sex, full time work and mute button"I'd love to upgrade; unfortunately, the hardware requirements are pretty stiff.
	</sentencetext>
	<parent>http://www.semanticweb.org/ontologies/ConversationInstances.owl#comment09_10_26_164226.29876373</parent>
</comment>
<comment>
	<id>http://www.semanticweb.org/ontologies/ConversationInstances.owl#comment09_10_26_164226.29877107</id>
	<title>Re:Doing it wrong</title>
	<author>pnewhook</author>
	<datestamp>1256550360000</datestamp>
	<modclass>Insightful</modclass>
	<modscore>2</modscore>
	<htmltext><p><div class="quote"><p>The reason that the field hasn't developed or matured is that the approach being taken for most products is wrong.</p></div><p>Actually, the reason that the field hasn't developed or matured is that the approach is pointless.
</p><p>Right now, without having any self configured computer in my house:
</p><p> - my front and driveway lights turn on and off at dusk/dawn, automatically adjusting for sunrise and sunset (off the shelf gps timer)
</p><p> - my thermostat adjusts the heat and A/C appropriately according to a schedule I programmed in.  I can access this from the web if needed to check usage and adjust the temperature and schedule as I see fit (smart thermostat for TOD power use)
</p><p> - my hi-def PVR records the shows I want whenever they happen to be on, even if they shift times.  I can record at least three (haven't tried more) hi-def signals simultaneously (PVR that came with my cable)
</p><p>I have no reason to do more than the above.  I see no reason to have these networked.  I see no reason or benefit to me spending money and time to try and duplicate what is already easily possible using inexpensive off the shelf components from Home  Depot. I see no point in having a server running in my house 24/7 wasting power.</p></div>
	</htmltext>
<tokenext>The reason that the field has n't developed or matured is that the approach being taken for most products is wrong.Actually , the reason that the field has n't developed or matured is that the approach is pointless .
Right now , without having any self configured computer in my house : - my front and driveway lights turn on and off at dusk/dawn , automatically adjusting for sunrise and sunset ( off the shelf gps timer ) - my thermostat adjusts the heat and A/C appropriately according to a schedule I programmed in .
I can access this from the web if needed to check usage and adjust the temperature and schedule as I see fit ( smart thermostat for TOD power use ) - my hi-def PVR records the shows I want whenever they happen to be on , even if they shift times .
I can record at least three ( have n't tried more ) hi-def signals simultaneously ( PVR that came with my cable ) I have no reason to do more than the above .
I see no reason to have these networked .
I see no reason or benefit to me spending money and time to try and duplicate what is already easily possible using inexpensive off the shelf components from Home Depot .
I see no point in having a server running in my house 24/7 wasting power .</tokentext>
<sentencetext>The reason that the field hasn't developed or matured is that the approach being taken for most products is wrong.Actually, the reason that the field hasn't developed or matured is that the approach is pointless.
Right now, without having any self configured computer in my house:
 - my front and driveway lights turn on and off at dusk/dawn, automatically adjusting for sunrise and sunset (off the shelf gps timer)
 - my thermostat adjusts the heat and A/C appropriately according to a schedule I programmed in.
I can access this from the web if needed to check usage and adjust the temperature and schedule as I see fit (smart thermostat for TOD power use)
 - my hi-def PVR records the shows I want whenever they happen to be on, even if they shift times.
I can record at least three (haven't tried more) hi-def signals simultaneously (PVR that came with my cable)
I have no reason to do more than the above.
I see no reason to have these networked.
I see no reason or benefit to me spending money and time to try and duplicate what is already easily possible using inexpensive off the shelf components from Home  Depot.
I see no point in having a server running in my house 24/7 wasting power.
	</sentencetext>
	<parent>http://www.semanticweb.org/ontologies/ConversationInstances.owl#comment09_10_26_164226.29876223</parent>
</comment>
<comment>
	<id>http://www.semanticweb.org/ontologies/ConversationInstances.owl#comment09_10_26_164226.29876335</id>
	<title>What about INSTEON?</title>
	<author>Anonymusing</author>
	<datestamp>1256590560000</datestamp>
	<modclass>Informativ</modclass>
	<modscore>3</modscore>
	<htmltext><p>What about <a href="http://www.insteon.net/" title="insteon.net">INSTEON</a> [insteon.net]? If you have a Mac, you can use <a href="http://www.perceptiveautomation.com/indigo/index.html" title="perceptiveautomation.com">Indigo</a> [perceptiveautomation.com] to manage it -- even from an iPhone.
</p><p>I've also heard about <a href="http://www.control4.com/" title="control4.com">Control4</a> [control4.com] -- and don't forget <a href="http://www.x10.com/homepage.htm" title="x10.com">X10</a> [x10.com], even though I can't tell if their home page is advertising porn or home automation products.  I'll let you automate my systems, baby!</p></htmltext>
<tokenext>What about INSTEON [ insteon.net ] ?
If you have a Mac , you can use Indigo [ perceptiveautomation.com ] to manage it -- even from an iPhone .
I 've also heard about Control4 [ control4.com ] -- and do n't forget X10 [ x10.com ] , even though I ca n't tell if their home page is advertising porn or home automation products .
I 'll let you automate my systems , baby !</tokentext>
<sentencetext>What about INSTEON [insteon.net]?
If you have a Mac, you can use Indigo [perceptiveautomation.com] to manage it -- even from an iPhone.
I've also heard about Control4 [control4.com] -- and don't forget X10 [x10.com], even though I can't tell if their home page is advertising porn or home automation products.
I'll let you automate my systems, baby!</sentencetext>
</comment>
<comment>
	<id>http://www.semanticweb.org/ontologies/ConversationInstances.owl#comment09_10_26_164226.29878425</id>
	<title>Re:What do you want home automation for?</title>
	<author>wardred</author>
	<datestamp>1256556180000</datestamp>
	<modclass>None</modclass>
	<modscore>1</modscore>
	<htmltext><p>Gah, slashdot ate my previous post when I logged in.  Grumble.</p><p>Thermostat control with a thermostat in a logical place in every room, not some poorly placed hallway.  Automatically keep the boys rooms cooler and girls rooms warmer - generalizing here.  Also have it turn the thermostat on and off based on time of day / motion so that you're not eating energy when you're at work or sleeping.  Heck, have a truly smart house that learns when you're about automatically rather then setting arbitrary rules that get outdated quickly.</p><p>Timed lighting.</p><p>Timed integration with automation bots like the roomba.</p><p>Centralized media center.  All the music and DVDs - won't happen because of DMCA, though Netflix a-like may take its place - on one media player / server, and the speakers wired up so you can have whole house music, or each room playing whatever.  Tivo says it doesn't need to record something until 8PM?  Great, leave it truly off, the cable box off, the flatscreen, ps3, 360, wii, amplifier, and whole entertainment system off until somebody gets home.  Background loads chew through depressing amounts of energy.  Heck, have "smart" jacks that can be monitored so you know how much energy any given appliance is using.</p><p>Have an NTP server keep all those pesky clocks in synch, rather than 15-20 minutes off in either direction +/- an hour for daylight savings time.  Tell which devices you even want to display the time and turn some of the annoying clocks off all together.</p><p>A kitchen assistant?  Maybe.  Feed an advanced recipe into your kitchen helper and have it walk you through food prep, rather than guessing if you need to put the veggies on now or not.  It could pre-heat your oven while you're doing prep work so you don't forget.  Tell you when it's time to start doing something.  Heck, hook it up with the food network and have it pull videos of what the preparation should look like.  Help you out with what you'll actually need for the week's shopping.  (Lazy, can't cook guy helper would be another name for this, though it could also help with larger families.)</p><p>Is any of this needed?  No.  Is some of it helpful, possibly.  The timed energy / heat in particular.</p></htmltext>
<tokenext>Gah , slashdot ate my previous post when I logged in .
Grumble.Thermostat control with a thermostat in a logical place in every room , not some poorly placed hallway .
Automatically keep the boys rooms cooler and girls rooms warmer - generalizing here .
Also have it turn the thermostat on and off based on time of day / motion so that you 're not eating energy when you 're at work or sleeping .
Heck , have a truly smart house that learns when you 're about automatically rather then setting arbitrary rules that get outdated quickly.Timed lighting.Timed integration with automation bots like the roomba.Centralized media center .
All the music and DVDs - wo n't happen because of DMCA , though Netflix a-like may take its place - on one media player / server , and the speakers wired up so you can have whole house music , or each room playing whatever .
Tivo says it does n't need to record something until 8PM ?
Great , leave it truly off , the cable box off , the flatscreen , ps3 , 360 , wii , amplifier , and whole entertainment system off until somebody gets home .
Background loads chew through depressing amounts of energy .
Heck , have " smart " jacks that can be monitored so you know how much energy any given appliance is using.Have an NTP server keep all those pesky clocks in synch , rather than 15-20 minutes off in either direction + /- an hour for daylight savings time .
Tell which devices you even want to display the time and turn some of the annoying clocks off all together.A kitchen assistant ?
Maybe. Feed an advanced recipe into your kitchen helper and have it walk you through food prep , rather than guessing if you need to put the veggies on now or not .
It could pre-heat your oven while you 're doing prep work so you do n't forget .
Tell you when it 's time to start doing something .
Heck , hook it up with the food network and have it pull videos of what the preparation should look like .
Help you out with what you 'll actually need for the week 's shopping .
( Lazy , ca n't cook guy helper would be another name for this , though it could also help with larger families .
) Is any of this needed ?
No. Is some of it helpful , possibly .
The timed energy / heat in particular .</tokentext>
<sentencetext>Gah, slashdot ate my previous post when I logged in.
Grumble.Thermostat control with a thermostat in a logical place in every room, not some poorly placed hallway.
Automatically keep the boys rooms cooler and girls rooms warmer - generalizing here.
Also have it turn the thermostat on and off based on time of day / motion so that you're not eating energy when you're at work or sleeping.
Heck, have a truly smart house that learns when you're about automatically rather then setting arbitrary rules that get outdated quickly.Timed lighting.Timed integration with automation bots like the roomba.Centralized media center.
All the music and DVDs - won't happen because of DMCA, though Netflix a-like may take its place - on one media player / server, and the speakers wired up so you can have whole house music, or each room playing whatever.
Tivo says it doesn't need to record something until 8PM?
Great, leave it truly off, the cable box off, the flatscreen, ps3, 360, wii, amplifier, and whole entertainment system off until somebody gets home.
Background loads chew through depressing amounts of energy.
Heck, have "smart" jacks that can be monitored so you know how much energy any given appliance is using.Have an NTP server keep all those pesky clocks in synch, rather than 15-20 minutes off in either direction +/- an hour for daylight savings time.
Tell which devices you even want to display the time and turn some of the annoying clocks off all together.A kitchen assistant?
Maybe.  Feed an advanced recipe into your kitchen helper and have it walk you through food prep, rather than guessing if you need to put the veggies on now or not.
It could pre-heat your oven while you're doing prep work so you don't forget.
Tell you when it's time to start doing something.
Heck, hook it up with the food network and have it pull videos of what the preparation should look like.
Help you out with what you'll actually need for the week's shopping.
(Lazy, can't cook guy helper would be another name for this, though it could also help with larger families.
)Is any of this needed?
No.  Is some of it helpful, possibly.
The timed energy / heat in particular.</sentencetext>
	<parent>http://www.semanticweb.org/ontologies/ConversationInstances.owl#comment09_10_26_164226.29876453</parent>
</comment>
<comment>
	<id>http://www.semanticweb.org/ontologies/ConversationInstances.owl#comment09_10_26_164226.29876891</id>
	<title>Re:Same as linux on the desktop</title>
	<author>vlm</author>
	<datestamp>1256549580000</datestamp>
	<modclass>None</modclass>
	<modscore>1</modscore>
	<htmltext><p>Yes, same as linux on the desktop... Had it at my house since the mid 90s, and granny will almost certainly never have it.</p></htmltext>
<tokenext>Yes , same as linux on the desktop... Had it at my house since the mid 90s , and granny will almost certainly never have it .</tokentext>
<sentencetext>Yes, same as linux on the desktop... Had it at my house since the mid 90s, and granny will almost certainly never have it.</sentencetext>
	<parent>http://www.semanticweb.org/ontologies/ConversationInstances.owl#comment09_10_26_164226.29876345</parent>
</comment>
<comment>
	<id>http://www.semanticweb.org/ontologies/ConversationInstances.owl#comment09_10_26_164226.29877289</id>
	<title>Re:Wife 1.0</title>
	<author>Anonymous</author>
	<datestamp>1256551080000</datestamp>
	<modclass>None</modclass>
	<modscore>0</modscore>
	<htmltext><p>I'm on Wife 2.0, thinking of upgrading to Girlfriend 2.1, but that would eventually require the purchase of a Wife 3.0 license, while completely removing Wife 2.0 along with half of RRSP 2.0. The upgrades are easier though, without Kids 1.0 or Kids 2.0.</p></htmltext>
<tokenext>I 'm on Wife 2.0 , thinking of upgrading to Girlfriend 2.1 , but that would eventually require the purchase of a Wife 3.0 license , while completely removing Wife 2.0 along with half of RRSP 2.0 .
The upgrades are easier though , without Kids 1.0 or Kids 2.0 .</tokentext>
<sentencetext>I'm on Wife 2.0, thinking of upgrading to Girlfriend 2.1, but that would eventually require the purchase of a Wife 3.0 license, while completely removing Wife 2.0 along with half of RRSP 2.0.
The upgrades are easier though, without Kids 1.0 or Kids 2.0.</sentencetext>
	<parent>http://www.semanticweb.org/ontologies/ConversationInstances.owl#comment09_10_26_164226.29876185</parent>
</comment>
<comment>
	<id>http://www.semanticweb.org/ontologies/ConversationInstances.owl#comment09_10_26_164226.29876505</id>
	<title>Re:Wife 1.0</title>
	<author>Anonymous</author>
	<datestamp>1256548140000</datestamp>
	<modclass>None</modclass>
	<modscore>1</modscore>
	<htmltext><p>Unfortunately, the quality control on Wife 1.0 manufacturing is very poor.  You might get a model that works great for a long time, or you might get one that seems OK for a while but one day goes completely berzerk.  Even with rigorous inspection before committing to it, a Wife 1.0 model can completely surprise you after months or years.</p><p>Even worse, Wife 2.0, Wife 3.0, etc. are just as bad, if not worse, and are frequently used and damaged.</p></htmltext>
<tokenext>Unfortunately , the quality control on Wife 1.0 manufacturing is very poor .
You might get a model that works great for a long time , or you might get one that seems OK for a while but one day goes completely berzerk .
Even with rigorous inspection before committing to it , a Wife 1.0 model can completely surprise you after months or years.Even worse , Wife 2.0 , Wife 3.0 , etc .
are just as bad , if not worse , and are frequently used and damaged .</tokentext>
<sentencetext>Unfortunately, the quality control on Wife 1.0 manufacturing is very poor.
You might get a model that works great for a long time, or you might get one that seems OK for a while but one day goes completely berzerk.
Even with rigorous inspection before committing to it, a Wife 1.0 model can completely surprise you after months or years.Even worse, Wife 2.0, Wife 3.0, etc.
are just as bad, if not worse, and are frequently used and damaged.</sentencetext>
	<parent>http://www.semanticweb.org/ontologies/ConversationInstances.owl#comment09_10_26_164226.29876185</parent>
</comment>
<comment>
	<id>http://www.semanticweb.org/ontologies/ConversationInstances.owl#comment09_10_26_164226.29876651</id>
	<title>Re:Too expensive</title>
	<author>PecurB</author>
	<datestamp>1256548740000</datestamp>
	<modclass>Interestin</modclass>
	<modscore>2</modscore>
	<htmltext>X10 stuff is cheap but pretty easy to tinker with.  A number of years ago I bought an <a href="http://www.x10.com/automation/firecracker.htm" title="x10.com" rel="nofollow">X10 Firecracker</a> [x10.com] kit.  They occasionally have it on sale for around $5 without warning, so if you keep an eye on that site you might be able to get it really cheap.

I hadn't used it in years but a little while ago I figured it'd be cool to be able to remotely turn my porch lights and other devices on/off from my smartphone (I have an iPhone).  Since I have a linux box at home hooked up to a cable modem this was a fairly straightforward exercise.  I used the <a href="http://www.linuxha.com/bottlerocket/" title="linuxha.com" rel="nofollow">BottleRocket</a> [linuxha.com] software to control the X10 devices from the linux box then wrote a very simple bare-bones PHP interface to it.  Poke a hole through my firewall to allow incoming connections (via authenticated HTTPS of course) and now with a couple of clicks I can do things like turn on my exterior lights when I leave work or a friends house.

For anybody who is interested, I wrote everything up on <a href="http://bruce.pennypacker.org/archives/30" title="pennypacker.org" rel="nofollow">my blog</a> [pennypacker.org] and posted the PHP code as well.</htmltext>
<tokenext>X10 stuff is cheap but pretty easy to tinker with .
A number of years ago I bought an X10 Firecracker [ x10.com ] kit .
They occasionally have it on sale for around $ 5 without warning , so if you keep an eye on that site you might be able to get it really cheap .
I had n't used it in years but a little while ago I figured it 'd be cool to be able to remotely turn my porch lights and other devices on/off from my smartphone ( I have an iPhone ) .
Since I have a linux box at home hooked up to a cable modem this was a fairly straightforward exercise .
I used the BottleRocket [ linuxha.com ] software to control the X10 devices from the linux box then wrote a very simple bare-bones PHP interface to it .
Poke a hole through my firewall to allow incoming connections ( via authenticated HTTPS of course ) and now with a couple of clicks I can do things like turn on my exterior lights when I leave work or a friends house .
For anybody who is interested , I wrote everything up on my blog [ pennypacker.org ] and posted the PHP code as well .</tokentext>
<sentencetext>X10 stuff is cheap but pretty easy to tinker with.
A number of years ago I bought an X10 Firecracker [x10.com] kit.
They occasionally have it on sale for around $5 without warning, so if you keep an eye on that site you might be able to get it really cheap.
I hadn't used it in years but a little while ago I figured it'd be cool to be able to remotely turn my porch lights and other devices on/off from my smartphone (I have an iPhone).
Since I have a linux box at home hooked up to a cable modem this was a fairly straightforward exercise.
I used the BottleRocket [linuxha.com] software to control the X10 devices from the linux box then wrote a very simple bare-bones PHP interface to it.
Poke a hole through my firewall to allow incoming connections (via authenticated HTTPS of course) and now with a couple of clicks I can do things like turn on my exterior lights when I leave work or a friends house.
For anybody who is interested, I wrote everything up on my blog [pennypacker.org] and posted the PHP code as well.</sentencetext>
	<parent>http://www.semanticweb.org/ontologies/ConversationInstances.owl#comment09_10_26_164226.29876389</parent>
</comment>
<comment>
	<id>http://www.semanticweb.org/ontologies/ConversationInstances.owl#comment09_10_26_164226.29880695</id>
	<title>Re:Doing it wrong</title>
	<author>jhol13</author>
	<datestamp>1256577060000</datestamp>
	<modclass>None</modclass>
	<modscore>1</modscore>
	<htmltext><p><div class="quote"><p>lights, heat, air, DVR, are fine for networked automation</p></div><p>I'm skeptic. I do want heat automated, but then there is no computer control needed. I do not want air ("zoning") because I am confident the advantages are far less than disadvantages. One actuator stops working? Huge PITA. Some SW/HW component misbehaves and one room is OK except randomly not? PITA, again. It must work tens of years without a glitch. We are not there - unless you pay extraordinary amount of money but then it is usually cheaper to forget about it.</p><p>Then there are other problems. Think about sauna, when jogging it would be nice to turn it on by phone. But if some idiot put something to dry there - chance of a fire. I would not do that mistake, but I do not trust the average joe not to do it. Same with the kitchen you mentioned.</p></div>
	</htmltext>
<tokenext>lights , heat , air , DVR , are fine for networked automationI 'm skeptic .
I do want heat automated , but then there is no computer control needed .
I do not want air ( " zoning " ) because I am confident the advantages are far less than disadvantages .
One actuator stops working ?
Huge PITA .
Some SW/HW component misbehaves and one room is OK except randomly not ?
PITA , again .
It must work tens of years without a glitch .
We are not there - unless you pay extraordinary amount of money but then it is usually cheaper to forget about it.Then there are other problems .
Think about sauna , when jogging it would be nice to turn it on by phone .
But if some idiot put something to dry there - chance of a fire .
I would not do that mistake , but I do not trust the average joe not to do it .
Same with the kitchen you mentioned .</tokentext>
<sentencetext>lights, heat, air, DVR, are fine for networked automationI'm skeptic.
I do want heat automated, but then there is no computer control needed.
I do not want air ("zoning") because I am confident the advantages are far less than disadvantages.
One actuator stops working?
Huge PITA.
Some SW/HW component misbehaves and one room is OK except randomly not?
PITA, again.
It must work tens of years without a glitch.
We are not there - unless you pay extraordinary amount of money but then it is usually cheaper to forget about it.Then there are other problems.
Think about sauna, when jogging it would be nice to turn it on by phone.
But if some idiot put something to dry there - chance of a fire.
I would not do that mistake, but I do not trust the average joe not to do it.
Same with the kitchen you mentioned.
	</sentencetext>
	<parent>http://www.semanticweb.org/ontologies/ConversationInstances.owl#comment09_10_26_164226.29876757</parent>
</comment>
<comment>
	<id>http://www.semanticweb.org/ontologies/ConversationInstances.owl#comment09_10_26_164226.29881533</id>
	<title>Re:Doing it wrong</title>
	<author>Anonymous</author>
	<datestamp>1256634900000</datestamp>
	<modclass>None</modclass>
	<modscore>0</modscore>
	<htmltext><p>&gt; For that matter why can't I roll up the windows without the key in the "run" position?</p><p>Wrong car or wrong country. In Europe, holding down the lock button on the fob will close the windows and sunroof on all but the cheapest cars. Likewise, holding the unlock button will roll down the windows and open the sunroof.</p></htmltext>
<tokenext>&gt; For that matter why ca n't I roll up the windows without the key in the " run " position ? Wrong car or wrong country .
In Europe , holding down the lock button on the fob will close the windows and sunroof on all but the cheapest cars .
Likewise , holding the unlock button will roll down the windows and open the sunroof .</tokentext>
<sentencetext>&gt; For that matter why can't I roll up the windows without the key in the "run" position?Wrong car or wrong country.
In Europe, holding down the lock button on the fob will close the windows and sunroof on all but the cheapest cars.
Likewise, holding the unlock button will roll down the windows and open the sunroof.</sentencetext>
	<parent>http://www.semanticweb.org/ontologies/ConversationInstances.owl#comment09_10_26_164226.29876757</parent>
</comment>
<comment>
	<id>http://www.semanticweb.org/ontologies/ConversationInstances.owl#comment09_10_26_164226.29876345</id>
	<title>Same as linux on the desktop</title>
	<author>klubar</author>
	<datestamp>1256590620000</datestamp>
	<modclass>Insightful</modclass>
	<modscore>2</modscore>
	<htmltext>Product is three to five years away and will be for the next twenty.  (The answer is the same for fusion enery, except fusion is 5 to 10 years away and will be for the next twenty.  Flying cars: 5 to 8 years. Specify your technology here...)</htmltext>
<tokenext>Product is three to five years away and will be for the next twenty .
( The answer is the same for fusion enery , except fusion is 5 to 10 years away and will be for the next twenty .
Flying cars : 5 to 8 years .
Specify your technology here... )</tokentext>
<sentencetext>Product is three to five years away and will be for the next twenty.
(The answer is the same for fusion enery, except fusion is 5 to 10 years away and will be for the next twenty.
Flying cars: 5 to 8 years.
Specify your technology here...)</sentencetext>
</comment>
<comment>
	<id>http://www.semanticweb.org/ontologies/ConversationInstances.owl#comment09_10_26_164226.29876267</id>
	<title>Good luck</title>
	<author>uvsc\_wolverine</author>
	<datestamp>1256590260000</datestamp>
	<modclass>Interestin</modclass>
	<modscore>5</modscore>
	<htmltext>I'm an open source fan personally, so I'd do Misterhouse.  My father had a setup a few years back that he home-built with a linux distro that was made for a little headless machine that he stuck in the basement.  He got really complex with it and did all the programming himself in Assembly (he's a masochist) instead of making use of the built-in tools.  He wanted to do it HIS way.  It worked great though.  My dad's HA setup was dialed into all of the lighting and thermostat controls for the house and it did some cool stuff.  He had a temperature probe on the outside of the house, and the system would decide (based on outside temperature, time of day, and whether anyone was in the house) whether or not to run the A/C to keep the house cool, but first it would spin up all the ceiling fans.
<br>
<br>
In reference to the "serious flaws" and weaknesses...ever wondered why none of the home automation tech we've been promised since 1950 has come to be common in homes?  Things like auto-opening drapes, autoadjusting lighting, stuff like that.  Ever wished someone would just sell something like that?  The reason we don't have all of this cool stuff is that there is a company (can't remember the name off the top of my head) that holds a bunch of over-broad patents on most of what we think of as "duh" innovations in home automation.  They don't license or sell their tech.  They just sue people who try to make stuff.</htmltext>
<tokenext>I 'm an open source fan personally , so I 'd do Misterhouse .
My father had a setup a few years back that he home-built with a linux distro that was made for a little headless machine that he stuck in the basement .
He got really complex with it and did all the programming himself in Assembly ( he 's a masochist ) instead of making use of the built-in tools .
He wanted to do it HIS way .
It worked great though .
My dad 's HA setup was dialed into all of the lighting and thermostat controls for the house and it did some cool stuff .
He had a temperature probe on the outside of the house , and the system would decide ( based on outside temperature , time of day , and whether anyone was in the house ) whether or not to run the A/C to keep the house cool , but first it would spin up all the ceiling fans .
In reference to the " serious flaws " and weaknesses...ever wondered why none of the home automation tech we 've been promised since 1950 has come to be common in homes ?
Things like auto-opening drapes , autoadjusting lighting , stuff like that .
Ever wished someone would just sell something like that ?
The reason we do n't have all of this cool stuff is that there is a company ( ca n't remember the name off the top of my head ) that holds a bunch of over-broad patents on most of what we think of as " duh " innovations in home automation .
They do n't license or sell their tech .
They just sue people who try to make stuff .</tokentext>
<sentencetext>I'm an open source fan personally, so I'd do Misterhouse.
My father had a setup a few years back that he home-built with a linux distro that was made for a little headless machine that he stuck in the basement.
He got really complex with it and did all the programming himself in Assembly (he's a masochist) instead of making use of the built-in tools.
He wanted to do it HIS way.
It worked great though.
My dad's HA setup was dialed into all of the lighting and thermostat controls for the house and it did some cool stuff.
He had a temperature probe on the outside of the house, and the system would decide (based on outside temperature, time of day, and whether anyone was in the house) whether or not to run the A/C to keep the house cool, but first it would spin up all the ceiling fans.
In reference to the "serious flaws" and weaknesses...ever wondered why none of the home automation tech we've been promised since 1950 has come to be common in homes?
Things like auto-opening drapes, autoadjusting lighting, stuff like that.
Ever wished someone would just sell something like that?
The reason we don't have all of this cool stuff is that there is a company (can't remember the name off the top of my head) that holds a bunch of over-broad patents on most of what we think of as "duh" innovations in home automation.
They don't license or sell their tech.
They just sue people who try to make stuff.</sentencetext>
</comment>
<comment>
	<id>http://www.semanticweb.org/ontologies/ConversationInstances.owl#comment09_10_26_164226.29879329</id>
	<title>Re:Doing it wrong</title>
	<author>Kernel Kurtz</author>
	<datestamp>1256562420000</datestamp>
	<modclass>None</modclass>
	<modscore>1</modscore>
	<htmltext><i>Why can't I call my car and tell it to start and run the heater or air?</i>
<br> <br>
You obviously don't live in Canada.
<br> <br>
Everyone does that here.</htmltext>
<tokenext>Why ca n't I call my car and tell it to start and run the heater or air ?
You obviously do n't live in Canada .
Everyone does that here .</tokentext>
<sentencetext>Why can't I call my car and tell it to start and run the heater or air?
You obviously don't live in Canada.
Everyone does that here.</sentencetext>
	<parent>http://www.semanticweb.org/ontologies/ConversationInstances.owl#comment09_10_26_164226.29876757</parent>
</comment>
<comment>
	<id>http://www.semanticweb.org/ontologies/ConversationInstances.owl#comment09_10_26_164226.29877541</id>
	<title>Heyu and domus.link</title>
	<author>CleverDan</author>
	<datestamp>1256552160000</datestamp>
	<modclass>None</modclass>
	<modscore>1</modscore>
	<htmltext>X10 isn't reliable. Still, I get decent enough results.<br>
I run <a href="http://www.heyu.org/" title="heyu.org" rel="nofollow">Heyu</a> [heyu.org]. It's open source, command line driven. I schedule it with cron. It compiles and runs easily on FreeBSD, Linux, and more. (The FreeBSD port can be a little behind.)<br>
I have tried it with <a href="http://domus.link.co.pt/" title="link.co.pt" rel="nofollow">domus.link</a> [link.co.pt] for a front-end. It works well enough for the spouse approval factor, but not a lot of bells and whistles.</htmltext>
<tokenext>X10 is n't reliable .
Still , I get decent enough results .
I run Heyu [ heyu.org ] .
It 's open source , command line driven .
I schedule it with cron .
It compiles and runs easily on FreeBSD , Linux , and more .
( The FreeBSD port can be a little behind .
) I have tried it with domus.link [ link.co.pt ] for a front-end .
It works well enough for the spouse approval factor , but not a lot of bells and whistles .</tokentext>
<sentencetext>X10 isn't reliable.
Still, I get decent enough results.
I run Heyu [heyu.org].
It's open source, command line driven.
I schedule it with cron.
It compiles and runs easily on FreeBSD, Linux, and more.
(The FreeBSD port can be a little behind.
)
I have tried it with domus.link [link.co.pt] for a front-end.
It works well enough for the spouse approval factor, but not a lot of bells and whistles.</sentencetext>
</comment>
<comment>
	<id>http://www.semanticweb.org/ontologies/ConversationInstances.owl#comment09_10_26_164226.29880147</id>
	<title>Crestron and Savant</title>
	<author>Anonymous</author>
	<datestamp>1256569980000</datestamp>
	<modclass>None</modclass>
	<modscore>1</modscore>
	<htmltext><p>Home Automation has grown leaps and bounds, but you'll have to pay to play.  The current state of the art is "Crestron", but is definitely Audio/Video oriented, but will control things and automate yourhome as well.  Price tag is near a quarter million for most high-end installs.</p><p><a href="http://www.savantav.com/" title="savantav.com" rel="nofollow">http://www.savantav.com/</a> [savantav.com] is much cleaner, easier to use, updateable, and is chomping at Crestrons heels.  Also very expensive in the hundreds of thousands, but they did just release a simple controller for only a few thousand.  FYI:  Savant is based on MacOSX.</p></htmltext>
<tokenext>Home Automation has grown leaps and bounds , but you 'll have to pay to play .
The current state of the art is " Crestron " , but is definitely Audio/Video oriented , but will control things and automate yourhome as well .
Price tag is near a quarter million for most high-end installs.http : //www.savantav.com/ [ savantav.com ] is much cleaner , easier to use , updateable , and is chomping at Crestrons heels .
Also very expensive in the hundreds of thousands , but they did just release a simple controller for only a few thousand .
FYI : Savant is based on MacOSX .</tokentext>
<sentencetext>Home Automation has grown leaps and bounds, but you'll have to pay to play.
The current state of the art is "Crestron", but is definitely Audio/Video oriented, but will control things and automate yourhome as well.
Price tag is near a quarter million for most high-end installs.http://www.savantav.com/ [savantav.com] is much cleaner, easier to use, updateable, and is chomping at Crestrons heels.
Also very expensive in the hundreds of thousands, but they did just release a simple controller for only a few thousand.
FYI:  Savant is based on MacOSX.</sentencetext>
</comment>
<comment>
	<id>http://www.semanticweb.org/ontologies/ConversationInstances.owl#comment09_10_26_164226.29881243</id>
	<title>Re:Welcome to my money pit!</title>
	<author>Idiomatick</author>
	<datestamp>1256586240000</datestamp>
	<modclass>None</modclass>
	<modscore>1</modscore>
	<htmltext>Do you have a website? Your ideas intrigue me and i'd like to subscribe to your newsletter.<br> <br>I just last night change my server from XP to ubuntu. I have just gotten a few things working (haven't really used linux besides from at school a bit). It acts as a server/media center. And I coded a few bash/batch scripts over ssh so I can control music that is playing on the server (launch a player on my laptop that controls the server). Got a web server running along with torrents w/ remote control and a vpn.<br> <br>Home automation and home servers have interested me for a while but i never had the guts to dive in until recently. I'd really like to hear what possibilities someone who is in deep has come up with.<br> <br>I'm adding rhythmbox controls to my phone. And likely will be hacking together a PA system. Many of your ideas interest me as well but I'm not sure how I would jump into all of that. (Also I'm a poor college student so I can't spend a ton).</htmltext>
<tokenext>Do you have a website ?
Your ideas intrigue me and i 'd like to subscribe to your newsletter .
I just last night change my server from XP to ubuntu .
I have just gotten a few things working ( have n't really used linux besides from at school a bit ) .
It acts as a server/media center .
And I coded a few bash/batch scripts over ssh so I can control music that is playing on the server ( launch a player on my laptop that controls the server ) .
Got a web server running along with torrents w/ remote control and a vpn .
Home automation and home servers have interested me for a while but i never had the guts to dive in until recently .
I 'd really like to hear what possibilities someone who is in deep has come up with .
I 'm adding rhythmbox controls to my phone .
And likely will be hacking together a PA system .
Many of your ideas interest me as well but I 'm not sure how I would jump into all of that .
( Also I 'm a poor college student so I ca n't spend a ton ) .</tokentext>
<sentencetext>Do you have a website?
Your ideas intrigue me and i'd like to subscribe to your newsletter.
I just last night change my server from XP to ubuntu.
I have just gotten a few things working (haven't really used linux besides from at school a bit).
It acts as a server/media center.
And I coded a few bash/batch scripts over ssh so I can control music that is playing on the server (launch a player on my laptop that controls the server).
Got a web server running along with torrents w/ remote control and a vpn.
Home automation and home servers have interested me for a while but i never had the guts to dive in until recently.
I'd really like to hear what possibilities someone who is in deep has come up with.
I'm adding rhythmbox controls to my phone.
And likely will be hacking together a PA system.
Many of your ideas interest me as well but I'm not sure how I would jump into all of that.
(Also I'm a poor college student so I can't spend a ton).</sentencetext>
	<parent>http://www.semanticweb.org/ontologies/ConversationInstances.owl#comment09_10_26_164226.29877425</parent>
</comment>
<comment>
	<id>http://www.semanticweb.org/ontologies/ConversationInstances.owl#comment09_10_26_164226.29880999</id>
	<title>Lifeware</title>
	<author>ajegwu</author>
	<datestamp>1256581680000</datestamp>
	<modclass>None</modclass>
	<modscore>1</modscore>
	<htmltext>The current awesome sauce that powers the Home of the Future at Disney Land is LifeWare <a href="http://www.life-ware.com/" title="life-ware.com" rel="nofollow">http://www.life-ware.com/</a> [life-ware.com]

Right now it is all Windows Media Center based, and extremely expensive.

They have however seen the error of their ways, and plan on being compatible with Linux and Mac OS in the future.  More info here: <a href="http://www.life-ware.com/products/evolving-tech.php" title="life-ware.com" rel="nofollow">http://www.life-ware.com/products/evolving-tech.php</a> [life-ware.com]</htmltext>
<tokenext>The current awesome sauce that powers the Home of the Future at Disney Land is LifeWare http : //www.life-ware.com/ [ life-ware.com ] Right now it is all Windows Media Center based , and extremely expensive .
They have however seen the error of their ways , and plan on being compatible with Linux and Mac OS in the future .
More info here : http : //www.life-ware.com/products/evolving-tech.php [ life-ware.com ]</tokentext>
<sentencetext>The current awesome sauce that powers the Home of the Future at Disney Land is LifeWare http://www.life-ware.com/ [life-ware.com]

Right now it is all Windows Media Center based, and extremely expensive.
They have however seen the error of their ways, and plan on being compatible with Linux and Mac OS in the future.
More info here: http://www.life-ware.com/products/evolving-tech.php [life-ware.com]</sentencetext>
</comment>
<comment>
	<id>http://www.semanticweb.org/ontologies/ConversationInstances.owl#comment09_10_26_164226.29877467</id>
	<title>Re:Wife 1.0</title>
	<author>StillNeedMoreCoffee</author>
	<datestamp>1256551800000</datestamp>
	<modclass>None</modclass>
	<modscore>1</modscore>
	<htmltext><p>I'm up to Wife 2.0  some bug fixes for sure but new random features were introduced. I should have waited for the next maint release.  sigh.</p></htmltext>
<tokenext>I 'm up to Wife 2.0 some bug fixes for sure but new random features were introduced .
I should have waited for the next maint release .
sigh .</tokentext>
<sentencetext>I'm up to Wife 2.0  some bug fixes for sure but new random features were introduced.
I should have waited for the next maint release.
sigh.</sentencetext>
	<parent>http://www.semanticweb.org/ontologies/ConversationInstances.owl#comment09_10_26_164226.29876185</parent>
</comment>
<comment>
	<id>http://www.semanticweb.org/ontologies/ConversationInstances.owl#comment09_10_26_164226.29894177</id>
	<title>One commercial system...</title>
	<author>hoofie</author>
	<datestamp>1256720520000</datestamp>
	<modclass>None</modclass>
	<modscore>1</modscore>
	<htmltext>There is a system that's been on sale in Australia for a number of years - it is available in the US and Europe also. It's called <a href="http://www.cbus-enabled.com/what-cbus.htm" title="cbus-enabled.com">C-Bus</a> [cbus-enabled.com]. The product comprises switches, controllers, relays etc and is available primarily in a wired configuration but there are wireless products available also.<br> <br>
It's main use is really in the commercial sphere due to the cost but it is used in high-end homes also. Whilst the hardware is commercial, Clipsal have recently published the serial protocol specifications [as used by the serial interface, not the device communication protocol itself].<br> <br>

For a look at the product range see <a href="http://www.cbussales.com/index.php?cPath=173&amp;osCsid=b147dda0eaeff358d89838204d0ca5e3" title="cbussales.com">here</a> [cbussales.com]. {That isn't a Clipsal website but it gives a good idea of the product range}.

Providing it's installed and wired correctly it is extremely reliable and easy to maintain. It also scales very well.</htmltext>
<tokenext>There is a system that 's been on sale in Australia for a number of years - it is available in the US and Europe also .
It 's called C-Bus [ cbus-enabled.com ] .
The product comprises switches , controllers , relays etc and is available primarily in a wired configuration but there are wireless products available also .
It 's main use is really in the commercial sphere due to the cost but it is used in high-end homes also .
Whilst the hardware is commercial , Clipsal have recently published the serial protocol specifications [ as used by the serial interface , not the device communication protocol itself ] .
For a look at the product range see here [ cbussales.com ] .
{ That is n't a Clipsal website but it gives a good idea of the product range } .
Providing it 's installed and wired correctly it is extremely reliable and easy to maintain .
It also scales very well .</tokentext>
<sentencetext>There is a system that's been on sale in Australia for a number of years - it is available in the US and Europe also.
It's called C-Bus [cbus-enabled.com].
The product comprises switches, controllers, relays etc and is available primarily in a wired configuration but there are wireless products available also.
It's main use is really in the commercial sphere due to the cost but it is used in high-end homes also.
Whilst the hardware is commercial, Clipsal have recently published the serial protocol specifications [as used by the serial interface, not the device communication protocol itself].
For a look at the product range see here [cbussales.com].
{That isn't a Clipsal website but it gives a good idea of the product range}.
Providing it's installed and wired correctly it is extremely reliable and easy to maintain.
It also scales very well.</sentencetext>
</comment>
<comment>
	<id>http://www.semanticweb.org/ontologies/ConversationInstances.owl#comment09_10_26_164226.29877361</id>
	<title>Re:Too expensive</title>
	<author>mhajicek</author>
	<datestamp>1256551320000</datestamp>
	<modclass>Funny</modclass>
	<modscore>2</modscore>
	<htmltext>The cheapest and most reliable way to control a light is to sneakernet the control signal to the switch.  If your setup is correct, every time you enter or leave a room you'll have a short network path to issue the switch command.</htmltext>
<tokenext>The cheapest and most reliable way to control a light is to sneakernet the control signal to the switch .
If your setup is correct , every time you enter or leave a room you 'll have a short network path to issue the switch command .</tokentext>
<sentencetext>The cheapest and most reliable way to control a light is to sneakernet the control signal to the switch.
If your setup is correct, every time you enter or leave a room you'll have a short network path to issue the switch command.</sentencetext>
	<parent>http://www.semanticweb.org/ontologies/ConversationInstances.owl#comment09_10_26_164226.29876389</parent>
</comment>
<comment>
	<id>http://www.semanticweb.org/ontologies/ConversationInstances.owl#comment09_10_26_164226.29878975</id>
	<title>Re:Doing it wrong</title>
	<author>The Wild Norseman</author>
	<datestamp>1256559960000</datestamp>
	<modclass>None</modclass>
	<modscore>1</modscore>
	<htmltext>Now this post was funny up until I realized that it wasn't about the "wife 1.0" jokes anymore.</htmltext>
<tokenext>Now this post was funny up until I realized that it was n't about the " wife 1.0 " jokes anymore .</tokentext>
<sentencetext>Now this post was funny up until I realized that it wasn't about the "wife 1.0" jokes anymore.</sentencetext>
	<parent>http://www.semanticweb.org/ontologies/ConversationInstances.owl#comment09_10_26_164226.29876223</parent>
</comment>
<comment>
	<id>http://www.semanticweb.org/ontologies/ConversationInstances.owl#comment09_10_26_164226.29877939</id>
	<title>Need for a LIRC-like 'transceiver of all trades'</title>
	<author>D4C5CE</author>
	<datestamp>1256553720000</datestamp>
	<modclass>None</modclass>
	<modscore>1</modscore>
	<htmltext>The key is not to get tied into any particular vendor's "ecosystem" (hint on marketdroid newspeak: the consumer is never on top of these food chains, and overpricing companies do go out of business, and/or force customers into upgrade cycles every bit as much as in the unfree part of IT).<br>
<br>
<a href="http://lirc.org/" title="lirc.org">LIRC</a> [lirc.org] can actually drive RF transmitters as well (by simply turning off the software-generated carrier), but even for IR very few devices are more than simple receivers, though the code would allow for both recording and playback of commands for a gazillion appliances.<br>
<br>
Factor in a few weather/proximity sensors (some can even be received by that very same hardware) and outputs such as <a href="http://www.lighting.philips.com/microsite/living\_colors/" title="philips.com">LivingColors</a> [philips.com] as an "Ambilight on steroids" (aside the usual suspects such as roller blinds, home entertainment gear and "conventional" lamps) for computer-generated scenarios based on age-old magic like the sunrise equation, and you get an idea of how much can be accomplished with minimal hardware.<br>
<br>
Combining IR and RF puts within every hobbyist's reach the Holy Grail of integrating each and every remote-controlled device in the house, from high-end all the way down to the El-Cheapo DIY market.<br>
The current crop of microcontrollers should provide a candidate that could do the trick sitting on an Ethernet plug - or piggybacked e.g. on the USB, "hidden" internal serial or GPIO port of some popular Wi-Fi router.<br>
<br>
<a href="http://www.huitsing.nl/irftdi/" title="huitsing.nl">http://www.huitsing.nl/irftdi/</a> [huitsing.nl] and <a href="http://www.mediola.com/products.htm" title="mediola.com">http://www.mediola.com/products.htm</a> [mediola.com] are just a few of the places to look for inspiration.</htmltext>
<tokenext>The key is not to get tied into any particular vendor 's " ecosystem " ( hint on marketdroid newspeak : the consumer is never on top of these food chains , and overpricing companies do go out of business , and/or force customers into upgrade cycles every bit as much as in the unfree part of IT ) .
LIRC [ lirc.org ] can actually drive RF transmitters as well ( by simply turning off the software-generated carrier ) , but even for IR very few devices are more than simple receivers , though the code would allow for both recording and playback of commands for a gazillion appliances .
Factor in a few weather/proximity sensors ( some can even be received by that very same hardware ) and outputs such as LivingColors [ philips.com ] as an " Ambilight on steroids " ( aside the usual suspects such as roller blinds , home entertainment gear and " conventional " lamps ) for computer-generated scenarios based on age-old magic like the sunrise equation , and you get an idea of how much can be accomplished with minimal hardware .
Combining IR and RF puts within every hobbyist 's reach the Holy Grail of integrating each and every remote-controlled device in the house , from high-end all the way down to the El-Cheapo DIY market .
The current crop of microcontrollers should provide a candidate that could do the trick sitting on an Ethernet plug - or piggybacked e.g .
on the USB , " hidden " internal serial or GPIO port of some popular Wi-Fi router .
http : //www.huitsing.nl/irftdi/ [ huitsing.nl ] and http : //www.mediola.com/products.htm [ mediola.com ] are just a few of the places to look for inspiration .</tokentext>
<sentencetext>The key is not to get tied into any particular vendor's "ecosystem" (hint on marketdroid newspeak: the consumer is never on top of these food chains, and overpricing companies do go out of business, and/or force customers into upgrade cycles every bit as much as in the unfree part of IT).
LIRC [lirc.org] can actually drive RF transmitters as well (by simply turning off the software-generated carrier), but even for IR very few devices are more than simple receivers, though the code would allow for both recording and playback of commands for a gazillion appliances.
Factor in a few weather/proximity sensors (some can even be received by that very same hardware) and outputs such as LivingColors [philips.com] as an "Ambilight on steroids" (aside the usual suspects such as roller blinds, home entertainment gear and "conventional" lamps) for computer-generated scenarios based on age-old magic like the sunrise equation, and you get an idea of how much can be accomplished with minimal hardware.
Combining IR and RF puts within every hobbyist's reach the Holy Grail of integrating each and every remote-controlled device in the house, from high-end all the way down to the El-Cheapo DIY market.
The current crop of microcontrollers should provide a candidate that could do the trick sitting on an Ethernet plug - or piggybacked e.g.
on the USB, "hidden" internal serial or GPIO port of some popular Wi-Fi router.
http://www.huitsing.nl/irftdi/ [huitsing.nl] and http://www.mediola.com/products.htm [mediola.com] are just a few of the places to look for inspiration.</sentencetext>
</comment>
<comment>
	<id>http://www.semanticweb.org/ontologies/ConversationInstances.owl#comment09_10_26_164226.29876479</id>
	<title>Where are we?</title>
	<author>elrous0</author>
	<datestamp>1256548020000</datestamp>
	<modclass>None</modclass>
	<modscore>1</modscore>
	<htmltext>Remember that mid-80's Tom Selleck movie "Runaway," where robots were taking care of the kids, doing our farm labor, etc. (pretty much doing every menial task)? Well, we AREN'T THERE YET!</htmltext>
<tokenext>Remember that mid-80 's Tom Selleck movie " Runaway , " where robots were taking care of the kids , doing our farm labor , etc .
( pretty much doing every menial task ) ?
Well , we ARE N'T THERE YET !</tokentext>
<sentencetext>Remember that mid-80's Tom Selleck movie "Runaway," where robots were taking care of the kids, doing our farm labor, etc.
(pretty much doing every menial task)?
Well, we AREN'T THERE YET!</sentencetext>
</comment>
<comment>
	<id>http://www.semanticweb.org/ontologies/ConversationInstances.owl#comment09_10_26_164226.29886693</id>
	<title>Re:Smart Grid and home automation - have your say</title>
	<author>motorhead</author>
	<datestamp>1256671080000</datestamp>
	<modclass>None</modclass>
	<modscore>1</modscore>
	<htmltext><p>Smart Grid - so the government can turn off your air conditioner on the hottest day of the year. No thanks.</p></htmltext>
<tokenext>Smart Grid - so the government can turn off your air conditioner on the hottest day of the year .
No thanks .</tokentext>
<sentencetext>Smart Grid - so the government can turn off your air conditioner on the hottest day of the year.
No thanks.</sentencetext>
	<parent>http://www.semanticweb.org/ontologies/ConversationInstances.owl#comment09_10_26_164226.29877349</parent>
</comment>
<comment>
	<id>http://www.semanticweb.org/ontologies/ConversationInstances.owl#comment09_10_26_164226.29882619</id>
	<title>Re:Doing it wrong</title>
	<author>ElAurian</author>
	<datestamp>1256651820000</datestamp>
	<modclass>None</modclass>
	<modscore>1</modscore>
	<htmltext><p>I cook all the time, and I can think of several ways in which I could use an automated kitchen system like the one that the parent describes:</p><p>- Download recipes made for the system from the net, my phone/pda tells me what to put in when;</p><p>- Visual indicators of when everything's going to be ready, and more importantly, the status of the various dishes I have cooking;</p><p>- Teaching someone anywhere in the world how to cook, by monitoring what they're doing in real-time so I can give them instant feedback and advice.</p><p>These are just the "radio with pictures" ideas anyone can come up with; in actual use, these systems will spawn new and awesome ways of living that we cannot yet imagine.</p></htmltext>
<tokenext>I cook all the time , and I can think of several ways in which I could use an automated kitchen system like the one that the parent describes : - Download recipes made for the system from the net , my phone/pda tells me what to put in when ; - Visual indicators of when everything 's going to be ready , and more importantly , the status of the various dishes I have cooking ; - Teaching someone anywhere in the world how to cook , by monitoring what they 're doing in real-time so I can give them instant feedback and advice.These are just the " radio with pictures " ideas anyone can come up with ; in actual use , these systems will spawn new and awesome ways of living that we can not yet imagine .</tokentext>
<sentencetext>I cook all the time, and I can think of several ways in which I could use an automated kitchen system like the one that the parent describes:- Download recipes made for the system from the net, my phone/pda tells me what to put in when;- Visual indicators of when everything's going to be ready, and more importantly, the status of the various dishes I have cooking;- Teaching someone anywhere in the world how to cook, by monitoring what they're doing in real-time so I can give them instant feedback and advice.These are just the "radio with pictures" ideas anyone can come up with; in actual use, these systems will spawn new and awesome ways of living that we cannot yet imagine.</sentencetext>
	<parent>http://www.semanticweb.org/ontologies/ConversationInstances.owl#comment09_10_26_164226.29876757</parent>
</comment>
<comment>
	<id>http://www.semanticweb.org/ontologies/ConversationInstances.owl#comment09_10_26_164226.29882127</id>
	<title>for HA to become more common,</title>
	<author>Anonymous</author>
	<datestamp>1256646120000</datestamp>
	<modclass>None</modclass>
	<modscore>0</modscore>
	<htmltext><p>some things are missing</p><p>IMH wireless is too much of a risk to be abused to be used for serioud things.</p><p>X10 is too expensive and has no backchannel automatically.</p><p>a HA controlled switch should directly fit into a standard installation can/hole and cost no more than $ 10</p><p>it needs to retain the manual switch functionality, but needs to report the change in status back to the HA controller</p><p>one needs also to distinguish between appliances which can be switch automatically without much danger, like lights, shades and the like, but already a sprinkler system poses a risk.</p><p>A intrusion detection system I would not run via the power lines, but give it a separate wiring/bus.</p><p>are there any projects to improve X10? Isn't the patent running out?</p></htmltext>
<tokenext>some things are missingIMH wireless is too much of a risk to be abused to be used for serioud things.X10 is too expensive and has no backchannel automatically.a HA controlled switch should directly fit into a standard installation can/hole and cost no more than $ 10it needs to retain the manual switch functionality , but needs to report the change in status back to the HA controllerone needs also to distinguish between appliances which can be switch automatically without much danger , like lights , shades and the like , but already a sprinkler system poses a risk.A intrusion detection system I would not run via the power lines , but give it a separate wiring/bus.are there any projects to improve X10 ?
Is n't the patent running out ?</tokentext>
<sentencetext>some things are missingIMH wireless is too much of a risk to be abused to be used for serioud things.X10 is too expensive and has no backchannel automatically.a HA controlled switch should directly fit into a standard installation can/hole and cost no more than $ 10it needs to retain the manual switch functionality, but needs to report the change in status back to the HA controllerone needs also to distinguish between appliances which can be switch automatically without much danger, like lights, shades and the like, but already a sprinkler system poses a risk.A intrusion detection system I would not run via the power lines, but give it a separate wiring/bus.are there any projects to improve X10?
Isn't the patent running out?</sentencetext>
</comment>
<comment>
	<id>http://www.semanticweb.org/ontologies/ConversationInstances.owl#comment09_10_26_164226.29880495</id>
	<title>Re:Either you get one of two things...</title>
	<author>Ricochet</author>
	<datestamp>1256574120000</datestamp>
	<modclass>None</modclass>
	<modscore>1</modscore>
	<htmltext><p>There seems to be a serious lack of faith in the farce.<nobr> <wbr></nobr>;-)</p><p>BTW, I use my tools to automate my home, my lab work and to write a book (okay not a great one) on home automation.</p></htmltext>
<tokenext>There seems to be a serious lack of faith in the farce .
; - ) BTW , I use my tools to automate my home , my lab work and to write a book ( okay not a great one ) on home automation .</tokentext>
<sentencetext>There seems to be a serious lack of faith in the farce.
;-)BTW, I use my tools to automate my home, my lab work and to write a book (okay not a great one) on home automation.</sentencetext>
	<parent>http://www.semanticweb.org/ontologies/ConversationInstances.owl#comment09_10_26_164226.29876403</parent>
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