<article>
	<id>http://www.semanticweb.org/ontologies/ConversationInstances.owl#article09_06_01_0040204</id>
	<title>When Your Backhoe Cuts "Black" Fiber</title>
	<author>timothy</author>
	<datestamp>1243861740000</datestamp>
	<htmltext><a href="http://2600.com/" rel="nofollow">bernieS</a> writes <i>"The Washington Post describes what happens when a construction <a href="http://www.washingtonpost.com/wp-dyn/content/article/2009/05/30/AR2009053002114\_pf.html">backhoe accidentally cuts buried fiber so secret that it doesn't appear on public maps</a> &mdash; and what happens when the Men in Black SUVs appear out of nowhere.  Apparently, the numerous secret fiber and utility lines used by government intelligence agencies are being dug up with increasing frequency with all the increased construction projects in the DC area.  It's amazing how quickly they get repaired!"</i></htmltext>
<tokenext>bernieS writes " The Washington Post describes what happens when a construction backhoe accidentally cuts buried fiber so secret that it does n't appear on public maps    and what happens when the Men in Black SUVs appear out of nowhere .
Apparently , the numerous secret fiber and utility lines used by government intelligence agencies are being dug up with increasing frequency with all the increased construction projects in the DC area .
It 's amazing how quickly they get repaired !
"</tokentext>
<sentencetext>bernieS writes "The Washington Post describes what happens when a construction backhoe accidentally cuts buried fiber so secret that it doesn't appear on public maps — and what happens when the Men in Black SUVs appear out of nowhere.
Apparently, the numerous secret fiber and utility lines used by government intelligence agencies are being dug up with increasing frequency with all the increased construction projects in the DC area.
It's amazing how quickly they get repaired!
"</sentencetext>
</article>
<comment>
	<id>http://www.semanticweb.org/ontologies/ConversationInstances.owl#comment09_06_01_0040204.28163875</id>
	<title>Completely fallacious and sensationalized nonsense</title>
	<author>kriston</author>
	<datestamp>1243787640000</datestamp>
	<modclass>Interestin</modclass>
	<modscore>5</modscore>
	<htmltext><p>This fallacious story is featured all over the the local news today here in DC<br>The problem is not that the lines aren't mapped--they ARE mapped just like any other utility.<br>The real problem is that the maps aren't perfect.</p><p>Here's the real scoop:<br>There have been nearly 40 cable cuts in Tysons since the Metro line to Dulles started construction.<br>There is a government-owned antenna tower on the highest hill in Tysons, too.<br>The ACTUAL problem is that Tysons Corner is the center of the Eastern USA internet capacity.  Sure, MAE-East was here, but it's moved to Ashburn, and those lines still cross through Tysons Corner.<br>Naturally, government lines are part of the rats nest that the Metro must tunnel through.</p><p>Bottom line is: all the lines are mapped but the maps aren't perfect.<br>The agencies do not bury secret cables.  To do so would not only be dangerous, it would be silly.<br>They're just cables like any other.</p><p>In other news, that big hill on Rte. 123 had been restricted to heavy trucks after test cores indicated faulty soil but that restriction has been lifted.</p></htmltext>
<tokenext>This fallacious story is featured all over the the local news today here in DCThe problem is not that the lines are n't mapped--they ARE mapped just like any other utility.The real problem is that the maps are n't perfect.Here 's the real scoop : There have been nearly 40 cable cuts in Tysons since the Metro line to Dulles started construction.There is a government-owned antenna tower on the highest hill in Tysons , too.The ACTUAL problem is that Tysons Corner is the center of the Eastern USA internet capacity .
Sure , MAE-East was here , but it 's moved to Ashburn , and those lines still cross through Tysons Corner.Naturally , government lines are part of the rats nest that the Metro must tunnel through.Bottom line is : all the lines are mapped but the maps are n't perfect.The agencies do not bury secret cables .
To do so would not only be dangerous , it would be silly.They 're just cables like any other.In other news , that big hill on Rte .
123 had been restricted to heavy trucks after test cores indicated faulty soil but that restriction has been lifted .</tokentext>
<sentencetext>This fallacious story is featured all over the the local news today here in DCThe problem is not that the lines aren't mapped--they ARE mapped just like any other utility.The real problem is that the maps aren't perfect.Here's the real scoop:There have been nearly 40 cable cuts in Tysons since the Metro line to Dulles started construction.There is a government-owned antenna tower on the highest hill in Tysons, too.The ACTUAL problem is that Tysons Corner is the center of the Eastern USA internet capacity.
Sure, MAE-East was here, but it's moved to Ashburn, and those lines still cross through Tysons Corner.Naturally, government lines are part of the rats nest that the Metro must tunnel through.Bottom line is: all the lines are mapped but the maps aren't perfect.The agencies do not bury secret cables.
To do so would not only be dangerous, it would be silly.They're just cables like any other.In other news, that big hill on Rte.
123 had been restricted to heavy trucks after test cores indicated faulty soil but that restriction has been lifted.</sentencetext>
</comment>
<comment>
	<id>http://www.semanticweb.org/ontologies/ConversationInstances.owl#comment09_06_01_0040204.28165361</id>
	<title>Re:Ok...</title>
	<author>backwardMechanic</author>
	<datestamp>1243849260000</datestamp>
	<modclass>None</modclass>
	<modscore>1</modscore>
	<htmltext>Nobody. They come and find you. Did this in the UK with a bunch of volunteers laying cycle-path. We had a visit from a helicopter, tools down, sign here to say you won't touch this hole again, official secrets act and all. And a bunch of very upset volunteers. We did our homework, we had notified, checked for services, etc. Thanks HMG, you made us look bad and took no responsibility. Oh, and it wasn't fibre. It was a freakin' gas main!</htmltext>
<tokenext>Nobody .
They come and find you .
Did this in the UK with a bunch of volunteers laying cycle-path .
We had a visit from a helicopter , tools down , sign here to say you wo n't touch this hole again , official secrets act and all .
And a bunch of very upset volunteers .
We did our homework , we had notified , checked for services , etc .
Thanks HMG , you made us look bad and took no responsibility .
Oh , and it was n't fibre .
It was a freakin ' gas main !</tokentext>
<sentencetext>Nobody.
They come and find you.
Did this in the UK with a bunch of volunteers laying cycle-path.
We had a visit from a helicopter, tools down, sign here to say you won't touch this hole again, official secrets act and all.
And a bunch of very upset volunteers.
We did our homework, we had notified, checked for services, etc.
Thanks HMG, you made us look bad and took no responsibility.
Oh, and it wasn't fibre.
It was a freakin' gas main!</sentencetext>
	<parent>http://www.semanticweb.org/ontologies/ConversationInstances.owl#comment09_06_01_0040204.28162819</parent>
</comment>
<comment>
	<id>http://www.semanticweb.org/ontologies/ConversationInstances.owl#comment09_06_01_0040204.28164083</id>
	<title>Re:Our tax dollars at work.</title>
	<author>Opportunist</author>
	<datestamp>1243789680000</datestamp>
	<modclass>Insightful</modclass>
	<modscore>3</modscore>
	<htmltext><p>It's actually worse. Because now they are KNOWN to be super-secret government lines.</p><p>I mean, think about it: You dig up a cable that shouldn't be there and rip it apart. You hop off your 'dozer and still stare at the wire, wondering wtf it's doing here, while a suspiciously unmarked car screeches to halt next to you, out come a few suits and tell you you didn't see anything (sneaky-stealthy as our secret policemen are). They could just as well guard it with a similar tape they use for high voltage wires here (they put in yellow-red plastic tape about half a foot above high power wires and gas lines, so when you dig it up you KNOW you shouldn't dig any deeper) and mark it "secret government wire, do not dig deeper".</p><p>Mark it as a gas line, mark it as high voltage lines, hell, mark it as sewage pipes, but not marking it at all is asking for trouble.</p></htmltext>
<tokenext>It 's actually worse .
Because now they are KNOWN to be super-secret government lines.I mean , think about it : You dig up a cable that should n't be there and rip it apart .
You hop off your 'dozer and still stare at the wire , wondering wtf it 's doing here , while a suspiciously unmarked car screeches to halt next to you , out come a few suits and tell you you did n't see anything ( sneaky-stealthy as our secret policemen are ) .
They could just as well guard it with a similar tape they use for high voltage wires here ( they put in yellow-red plastic tape about half a foot above high power wires and gas lines , so when you dig it up you KNOW you should n't dig any deeper ) and mark it " secret government wire , do not dig deeper " .Mark it as a gas line , mark it as high voltage lines , hell , mark it as sewage pipes , but not marking it at all is asking for trouble .</tokentext>
<sentencetext>It's actually worse.
Because now they are KNOWN to be super-secret government lines.I mean, think about it: You dig up a cable that shouldn't be there and rip it apart.
You hop off your 'dozer and still stare at the wire, wondering wtf it's doing here, while a suspiciously unmarked car screeches to halt next to you, out come a few suits and tell you you didn't see anything (sneaky-stealthy as our secret policemen are).
They could just as well guard it with a similar tape they use for high voltage wires here (they put in yellow-red plastic tape about half a foot above high power wires and gas lines, so when you dig it up you KNOW you shouldn't dig any deeper) and mark it "secret government wire, do not dig deeper".Mark it as a gas line, mark it as high voltage lines, hell, mark it as sewage pipes, but not marking it at all is asking for trouble.</sentencetext>
	<parent>http://www.semanticweb.org/ontologies/ConversationInstances.owl#comment09_06_01_0040204.28163015</parent>
</comment>
<comment>
	<id>http://www.semanticweb.org/ontologies/ConversationInstances.owl#comment09_06_01_0040204.28163299</id>
	<title>Re:Under pressure...</title>
	<author>Anonymous</author>
	<datestamp>1243783080000</datestamp>
	<modclass>Informativ</modclass>
	<modscore>5</modscore>
	<htmltext><p>I hate to say it, but no, not really. My podunk base in podunk, minnesota applies the same security and cryptography. For example one of our systems that contains NO secret information, NO C&amp;C abilities, and NO administrative rights requires an *18 character* password that must be changed monthly. One each: letter, upper case letter, number, special character, no words, nothing similar to your last 6 passwords etc. And this is behind our secure two-factor login system and on a secure network. And yet, when the base upgraded to fiber, it was done by 3 guys working out of a rented U-Haul truck. Watched it with my own eyes.</p><p>This is just the gov't doing what it does best.</p><p>-b</p></htmltext>
<tokenext>I hate to say it , but no , not really .
My podunk base in podunk , minnesota applies the same security and cryptography .
For example one of our systems that contains NO secret information , NO C&amp;C abilities , and NO administrative rights requires an * 18 character * password that must be changed monthly .
One each : letter , upper case letter , number , special character , no words , nothing similar to your last 6 passwords etc .
And this is behind our secure two-factor login system and on a secure network .
And yet , when the base upgraded to fiber , it was done by 3 guys working out of a rented U-Haul truck .
Watched it with my own eyes.This is just the gov't doing what it does best.-b</tokentext>
<sentencetext>I hate to say it, but no, not really.
My podunk base in podunk, minnesota applies the same security and cryptography.
For example one of our systems that contains NO secret information, NO C&amp;C abilities, and NO administrative rights requires an *18 character* password that must be changed monthly.
One each: letter, upper case letter, number, special character, no words, nothing similar to your last 6 passwords etc.
And this is behind our secure two-factor login system and on a secure network.
And yet, when the base upgraded to fiber, it was done by 3 guys working out of a rented U-Haul truck.
Watched it with my own eyes.This is just the gov't doing what it does best.-b</sentencetext>
	<parent>http://www.semanticweb.org/ontologies/ConversationInstances.owl#comment09_06_01_0040204.28162827</parent>
</comment>
<comment>
	<id>http://www.semanticweb.org/ontologies/ConversationInstances.owl#comment09_06_01_0040204.28162911</id>
	<title>Re:Ok...</title>
	<author>camperdave</author>
	<datestamp>1243779780000</datestamp>
	<modclass>Funny</modclass>
	<modscore>5</modscore>
	<htmltext><i>How we supposed to know it's there if it's top secret and we don't have clearance?</i> <br> <br>
Well, all you have to do is read the cable.  It says "Top Secret Cable.  Do Not Cut" right on it.</htmltext>
<tokenext>How we supposed to know it 's there if it 's top secret and we do n't have clearance ?
Well , all you have to do is read the cable .
It says " Top Secret Cable .
Do Not Cut " right on it .</tokentext>
<sentencetext>How we supposed to know it's there if it's top secret and we don't have clearance?
Well, all you have to do is read the cable.
It says "Top Secret Cable.
Do Not Cut" right on it.</sentencetext>
	<parent>http://www.semanticweb.org/ontologies/ConversationInstances.owl#comment09_06_01_0040204.28162819</parent>
</comment>
<comment>
	<id>http://www.semanticweb.org/ontologies/ConversationInstances.owl#comment09_06_01_0040204.28164109</id>
	<title>Re:Our tax dollars at work.</title>
	<author>Anonymous</author>
	<datestamp>1243789980000</datestamp>
	<modclass>None</modclass>
	<modscore>0</modscore>
	<htmltext><p><i>The government does a half-assed job securing its own computers, but they'll lock down what's between the computers... that's like having a convoy that's well protected, then having that same convoy deliver without any security detail.</i> </p><p>I've said for a long time that it's the same with businesses that use your credit card or other personal data. They make a big deal about using "secure web pages". Then they let any bozo have unsecured access to it.</p><p>In compliance with the<nobr> <wbr></nobr>/. requirement to bolster any point, no matter how insignificant, with an automotive analogy, I hereby submit the one I've used for years. It's like sending gold bullion in an armored truck from A to B. In each case, the truck backs up to a closed roll-down door. With the back of the truck firmly locked to the wall, the door is rolled up, the truck doors are opened into the secure facility (at either end) and the gold transferred between the truck and the facility. Then the truck doors are closed, the door is rolled down and the tuck leaves. But, at the destination, the gold is left sitting out where it can be messed with by any passer-by.</p><p>I mention this because something similar once happened to me. Back when a 20 meg (not gig) disk drive for a mini-computer was about two feet x three feet x 18 inches tall (and cost a few thousand dollars), some outfit delivered one to us. After waiting an adequate amount of time, I called the outfit to ask where the drive was. They said it had been delivered three days earlier.</p><p>Down at the loading dock, I was told they'd been wondering when someone would be by to pick it up. Like "Maybe when you tell me it's there, guys". Not their job, I guess, even though it was about a fifteen-foot square dock, which was left open to the street all day long, with no one with a direct view of it from their office.</p><p>BTW, on another occasion, we ordered a line printer (a few hundred pounds worth) from the same vendor. There were huge delays (many weeks) in getting it to us, when they said it would be just a few days. By the time it was finally delivered (with no forewarning) the building's only freight elevator had been out of service for a week, with two weeks remaining to complete the work. Since it was only a very old two-story (plus basement) building, there were no other interior passenger elevators. </p><p>The bozos who had caused the delay due to their poor scheduling had to eat the cost to rent some specialized equipment to hump the printer up a short flight of stairs to the front of the building, then up another long flight up to the destination floor.</p><p>The Six Ps of Success -- Proper Planning Prevents Piss Poor Performance.</p></htmltext>
<tokenext>The government does a half-assed job securing its own computers , but they 'll lock down what 's between the computers... that 's like having a convoy that 's well protected , then having that same convoy deliver without any security detail .
I 've said for a long time that it 's the same with businesses that use your credit card or other personal data .
They make a big deal about using " secure web pages " .
Then they let any bozo have unsecured access to it.In compliance with the / .
requirement to bolster any point , no matter how insignificant , with an automotive analogy , I hereby submit the one I 've used for years .
It 's like sending gold bullion in an armored truck from A to B. In each case , the truck backs up to a closed roll-down door .
With the back of the truck firmly locked to the wall , the door is rolled up , the truck doors are opened into the secure facility ( at either end ) and the gold transferred between the truck and the facility .
Then the truck doors are closed , the door is rolled down and the tuck leaves .
But , at the destination , the gold is left sitting out where it can be messed with by any passer-by.I mention this because something similar once happened to me .
Back when a 20 meg ( not gig ) disk drive for a mini-computer was about two feet x three feet x 18 inches tall ( and cost a few thousand dollars ) , some outfit delivered one to us .
After waiting an adequate amount of time , I called the outfit to ask where the drive was .
They said it had been delivered three days earlier.Down at the loading dock , I was told they 'd been wondering when someone would be by to pick it up .
Like " Maybe when you tell me it 's there , guys " .
Not their job , I guess , even though it was about a fifteen-foot square dock , which was left open to the street all day long , with no one with a direct view of it from their office.BTW , on another occasion , we ordered a line printer ( a few hundred pounds worth ) from the same vendor .
There were huge delays ( many weeks ) in getting it to us , when they said it would be just a few days .
By the time it was finally delivered ( with no forewarning ) the building 's only freight elevator had been out of service for a week , with two weeks remaining to complete the work .
Since it was only a very old two-story ( plus basement ) building , there were no other interior passenger elevators .
The bozos who had caused the delay due to their poor scheduling had to eat the cost to rent some specialized equipment to hump the printer up a short flight of stairs to the front of the building , then up another long flight up to the destination floor.The Six Ps of Success -- Proper Planning Prevents Piss Poor Performance .</tokentext>
<sentencetext>The government does a half-assed job securing its own computers, but they'll lock down what's between the computers... that's like having a convoy that's well protected, then having that same convoy deliver without any security detail.
I've said for a long time that it's the same with businesses that use your credit card or other personal data.
They make a big deal about using "secure web pages".
Then they let any bozo have unsecured access to it.In compliance with the /.
requirement to bolster any point, no matter how insignificant, with an automotive analogy, I hereby submit the one I've used for years.
It's like sending gold bullion in an armored truck from A to B. In each case, the truck backs up to a closed roll-down door.
With the back of the truck firmly locked to the wall, the door is rolled up, the truck doors are opened into the secure facility (at either end) and the gold transferred between the truck and the facility.
Then the truck doors are closed, the door is rolled down and the tuck leaves.
But, at the destination, the gold is left sitting out where it can be messed with by any passer-by.I mention this because something similar once happened to me.
Back when a 20 meg (not gig) disk drive for a mini-computer was about two feet x three feet x 18 inches tall (and cost a few thousand dollars), some outfit delivered one to us.
After waiting an adequate amount of time, I called the outfit to ask where the drive was.
They said it had been delivered three days earlier.Down at the loading dock, I was told they'd been wondering when someone would be by to pick it up.
Like "Maybe when you tell me it's there, guys".
Not their job, I guess, even though it was about a fifteen-foot square dock, which was left open to the street all day long, with no one with a direct view of it from their office.BTW, on another occasion, we ordered a line printer (a few hundred pounds worth) from the same vendor.
There were huge delays (many weeks) in getting it to us, when they said it would be just a few days.
By the time it was finally delivered (with no forewarning) the building's only freight elevator had been out of service for a week, with two weeks remaining to complete the work.
Since it was only a very old two-story (plus basement) building, there were no other interior passenger elevators.
The bozos who had caused the delay due to their poor scheduling had to eat the cost to rent some specialized equipment to hump the printer up a short flight of stairs to the front of the building, then up another long flight up to the destination floor.The Six Ps of Success -- Proper Planning Prevents Piss Poor Performance.</sentencetext>
	<parent>http://www.semanticweb.org/ontologies/ConversationInstances.owl#comment09_06_01_0040204.28162903</parent>
</comment>
<comment>
	<id>http://www.semanticweb.org/ontologies/ConversationInstances.owl#comment09_06_01_0040204.28171587</id>
	<title>The black vans are a give-away</title>
	<author>Tired and Emotional</author>
	<datestamp>1243886640000</datestamp>
	<modclass>None</modclass>
	<modscore>1</modscore>
	<htmltext>If you have got a covert cable, surely you would have covert surveillance too. I simply can't imagine obvious spy types rolling up and saying "you just cut our super-secret cable". At the very least I would expect a fake comms company as cover.
<p>
So this sounds like an urban myth to me.</p></htmltext>
<tokenext>If you have got a covert cable , surely you would have covert surveillance too .
I simply ca n't imagine obvious spy types rolling up and saying " you just cut our super-secret cable " .
At the very least I would expect a fake comms company as cover .
So this sounds like an urban myth to me .</tokentext>
<sentencetext>If you have got a covert cable, surely you would have covert surveillance too.
I simply can't imagine obvious spy types rolling up and saying "you just cut our super-secret cable".
At the very least I would expect a fake comms company as cover.
So this sounds like an urban myth to me.</sentencetext>
</comment>
<comment>
	<id>http://www.semanticweb.org/ontologies/ConversationInstances.owl#comment09_06_01_0040204.28166177</id>
	<title>Re:Are we sure they're secret cables?</title>
	<author>markyd123</author>
	<datestamp>1243860480000</datestamp>
	<modclass>None</modclass>
	<modscore>1</modscore>
	<htmltext>Maybe that's what's happening here.<nobr> <wbr></nobr>...or maybe that's what they *want* us to think..<nobr> <wbr></nobr>;)</htmltext>
<tokenext>Maybe that 's what 's happening here .
...or maybe that 's what they * want * us to think.. ; )</tokentext>
<sentencetext>Maybe that's what's happening here.
...or maybe that's what they *want* us to think.. ;)</sentencetext>
	<parent>http://www.semanticweb.org/ontologies/ConversationInstances.owl#comment09_06_01_0040204.28163557</parent>
</comment>
<comment>
	<id>http://www.semanticweb.org/ontologies/ConversationInstances.owl#comment09_06_01_0040204.28163731</id>
	<title>Re:Security Through Obscurity is not security</title>
	<author>The Rizz</author>
	<datestamp>1243786260000</datestamp>
	<modclass>Insightful</modclass>
	<modscore>2</modscore>
	<htmltext><p><div class="quote"><p>fiber optic bundles have a copper core so they can be found by magnetic detectors (and the "blue stake people") to avoid being hit by a backhoe strike.   It's more unlikely that the contractor failed to check for the cable than the Federal Government has special backhoe-attracting cable.</p></div><p>Then again, if they were trying to keep it secret, odds are they would have laid fiber without the copper core so it <i> <b>couldn't</b> </i> be found by magnetic detectors.</p></div>
	</htmltext>
<tokenext>fiber optic bundles have a copper core so they can be found by magnetic detectors ( and the " blue stake people " ) to avoid being hit by a backhoe strike .
It 's more unlikely that the contractor failed to check for the cable than the Federal Government has special backhoe-attracting cable.Then again , if they were trying to keep it secret , odds are they would have laid fiber without the copper core so it could n't be found by magnetic detectors .</tokentext>
<sentencetext>fiber optic bundles have a copper core so they can be found by magnetic detectors (and the "blue stake people") to avoid being hit by a backhoe strike.
It's more unlikely that the contractor failed to check for the cable than the Federal Government has special backhoe-attracting cable.Then again, if they were trying to keep it secret, odds are they would have laid fiber without the copper core so it  couldn't  be found by magnetic detectors.
	</sentencetext>
	<parent>http://www.semanticweb.org/ontologies/ConversationInstances.owl#comment09_06_01_0040204.28163379</parent>
</comment>
<comment>
	<id>http://www.semanticweb.org/ontologies/ConversationInstances.owl#comment09_06_01_0040204.28163351</id>
	<title>Mysterious fibres, government conspiracy?</title>
	<author>Anonymous</author>
	<datestamp>1243783560000</datestamp>
	<modclass>None</modclass>
	<modscore>0</modscore>
	<htmltext><p>Must be morgellons!</p></htmltext>
<tokenext>Must be morgellons !</tokentext>
<sentencetext>Must be morgellons!</sentencetext>
</comment>
<comment>
	<id>http://www.semanticweb.org/ontologies/ConversationInstances.owl#comment09_06_01_0040204.28164555</id>
	<title>Cut plenty of things with my backhoe.</title>
	<author>Anonymous</author>
	<datestamp>1243794300000</datestamp>
	<modclass>Interestin</modclass>
	<modscore>2</modscore>
	<htmltext><p>I haven't cut anything majorly serious in my time because usually the really serious things scare the boss enough that he'll meet the people who're supposed to come out and detect all the stuff.  Makes sure they actually check for the lines and paint where they are instead of finding point A and point B and assuming they run in a straight line.</p><p>But I've cut yard electrical lines servicing a garage because people swore it ran in a straight line, and sure enough it zigzaged around a tree, around the corner of their driveway...not enough electricity to cause any serious problems.  But annoying.</p><p>One job had a major gas line running through the front yard, but they weren't sure if it ran straight with the road or ran diagonal.  They also told us it was only six inches deep on first check.  So call em back up, tell em to come out and check it again since we're putting in a driveway and need to cut down about 18 inches deep where it was marked.  Sure enough they come out and dig and about 2 feet later...still no gas pipe.  On this same job I cut through a power line powering the household.....it ran to their garage, then to their house.  Was supposed to be couple feet deep and it was barely six inches under the asphalt.  It ran diagonal from the pole, then made a perpendicular cross at the driveway...then diagonal again...and when going to the house it ran along the driveway for a bit then diagonal.  It's like they plan on making sure you cut the hell out of their lines.  When the guy came out for the repair, he was pissed talking about billing us etc etc.  Until he was shown that it wasn't deep enough, and then he found out that the wire wasn't even the right gauge for that kind of install and says they need to redo the entire thing to get the house proper power.  Said he thinks it would probably kill the appliances in the house (they bought it a few months prior).</p><p>Cut through underground drain pipes for people's down spouts that run to the storm sewer.......and their leech pipes to help drain their yards in the poor drainage areas.  They put em in 20-30 years ago and they don't have a clue how they ran them, but they'll tell you something to try to help you out anyway.  Wouldn't be surprised if they intended you to hit them so you'd have to repair em and make sure they are clear of stuff and working.</p><p>Was working at an old school, turned bus/maintenance building.  Which used to be where there was something to do with trains...grain silo or something.  Found some tracks, but they weren't in the way and they didn't want to pay to remove em.  Then we got down deep repairing their bus parking lot which was basically mud underneath, found a bunch of unmarked stuff.  Power lines, found a couple of huge underground tanks that had been capped off but never filled.  So they had these two massive underground tanks breaking down with no way to access them, and they weren't filled with concrete or stone.  So if they had caved in, they would have had some massive problems.  Considering it was in a water sensitive area, and those tanks were within 30-50 feet of a good size creek.  Give you an idea of the size of these tanks.  They were deep enough we sent a guy in on a harness...about 10 feet of rope he wasn't to the bottom.  But he said you could easily store a single axle dump truck inside of both of them.  So 12-15 feet tall, and 15-20 feet long.  And one may have been bigger than that.  At this same location we pulled a concrete ball out of the ground that used to be a flag pole base.  That concrete ball took two machines to lift into the back of a dump truck with it's tail gate off....and that was after it was jack hammered to make it small enough to fit.  Someone went totally crazy with the concrete on that flag pole, unless it was a thousand feet or so tall.</p><p>Then you get into locations where it was residential turn commercial.  And you see these places where they have sections of their parking lot that's just crumbling and sinking...and does so for years.  Then you discover that the guy who was in cha</p></htmltext>
<tokenext>I have n't cut anything majorly serious in my time because usually the really serious things scare the boss enough that he 'll meet the people who 're supposed to come out and detect all the stuff .
Makes sure they actually check for the lines and paint where they are instead of finding point A and point B and assuming they run in a straight line.But I 've cut yard electrical lines servicing a garage because people swore it ran in a straight line , and sure enough it zigzaged around a tree , around the corner of their driveway...not enough electricity to cause any serious problems .
But annoying.One job had a major gas line running through the front yard , but they were n't sure if it ran straight with the road or ran diagonal .
They also told us it was only six inches deep on first check .
So call em back up , tell em to come out and check it again since we 're putting in a driveway and need to cut down about 18 inches deep where it was marked .
Sure enough they come out and dig and about 2 feet later...still no gas pipe .
On this same job I cut through a power line powering the household.....it ran to their garage , then to their house .
Was supposed to be couple feet deep and it was barely six inches under the asphalt .
It ran diagonal from the pole , then made a perpendicular cross at the driveway...then diagonal again...and when going to the house it ran along the driveway for a bit then diagonal .
It 's like they plan on making sure you cut the hell out of their lines .
When the guy came out for the repair , he was pissed talking about billing us etc etc .
Until he was shown that it was n't deep enough , and then he found out that the wire was n't even the right gauge for that kind of install and says they need to redo the entire thing to get the house proper power .
Said he thinks it would probably kill the appliances in the house ( they bought it a few months prior ) .Cut through underground drain pipes for people 's down spouts that run to the storm sewer.......and their leech pipes to help drain their yards in the poor drainage areas .
They put em in 20-30 years ago and they do n't have a clue how they ran them , but they 'll tell you something to try to help you out anyway .
Would n't be surprised if they intended you to hit them so you 'd have to repair em and make sure they are clear of stuff and working.Was working at an old school , turned bus/maintenance building .
Which used to be where there was something to do with trains...grain silo or something .
Found some tracks , but they were n't in the way and they did n't want to pay to remove em .
Then we got down deep repairing their bus parking lot which was basically mud underneath , found a bunch of unmarked stuff .
Power lines , found a couple of huge underground tanks that had been capped off but never filled .
So they had these two massive underground tanks breaking down with no way to access them , and they were n't filled with concrete or stone .
So if they had caved in , they would have had some massive problems .
Considering it was in a water sensitive area , and those tanks were within 30-50 feet of a good size creek .
Give you an idea of the size of these tanks .
They were deep enough we sent a guy in on a harness...about 10 feet of rope he was n't to the bottom .
But he said you could easily store a single axle dump truck inside of both of them .
So 12-15 feet tall , and 15-20 feet long .
And one may have been bigger than that .
At this same location we pulled a concrete ball out of the ground that used to be a flag pole base .
That concrete ball took two machines to lift into the back of a dump truck with it 's tail gate off....and that was after it was jack hammered to make it small enough to fit .
Someone went totally crazy with the concrete on that flag pole , unless it was a thousand feet or so tall.Then you get into locations where it was residential turn commercial .
And you see these places where they have sections of their parking lot that 's just crumbling and sinking...and does so for years .
Then you discover that the guy who was in cha</tokentext>
<sentencetext>I haven't cut anything majorly serious in my time because usually the really serious things scare the boss enough that he'll meet the people who're supposed to come out and detect all the stuff.
Makes sure they actually check for the lines and paint where they are instead of finding point A and point B and assuming they run in a straight line.But I've cut yard electrical lines servicing a garage because people swore it ran in a straight line, and sure enough it zigzaged around a tree, around the corner of their driveway...not enough electricity to cause any serious problems.
But annoying.One job had a major gas line running through the front yard, but they weren't sure if it ran straight with the road or ran diagonal.
They also told us it was only six inches deep on first check.
So call em back up, tell em to come out and check it again since we're putting in a driveway and need to cut down about 18 inches deep where it was marked.
Sure enough they come out and dig and about 2 feet later...still no gas pipe.
On this same job I cut through a power line powering the household.....it ran to their garage, then to their house.
Was supposed to be couple feet deep and it was barely six inches under the asphalt.
It ran diagonal from the pole, then made a perpendicular cross at the driveway...then diagonal again...and when going to the house it ran along the driveway for a bit then diagonal.
It's like they plan on making sure you cut the hell out of their lines.
When the guy came out for the repair, he was pissed talking about billing us etc etc.
Until he was shown that it wasn't deep enough, and then he found out that the wire wasn't even the right gauge for that kind of install and says they need to redo the entire thing to get the house proper power.
Said he thinks it would probably kill the appliances in the house (they bought it a few months prior).Cut through underground drain pipes for people's down spouts that run to the storm sewer.......and their leech pipes to help drain their yards in the poor drainage areas.
They put em in 20-30 years ago and they don't have a clue how they ran them, but they'll tell you something to try to help you out anyway.
Wouldn't be surprised if they intended you to hit them so you'd have to repair em and make sure they are clear of stuff and working.Was working at an old school, turned bus/maintenance building.
Which used to be where there was something to do with trains...grain silo or something.
Found some tracks, but they weren't in the way and they didn't want to pay to remove em.
Then we got down deep repairing their bus parking lot which was basically mud underneath, found a bunch of unmarked stuff.
Power lines, found a couple of huge underground tanks that had been capped off but never filled.
So they had these two massive underground tanks breaking down with no way to access them, and they weren't filled with concrete or stone.
So if they had caved in, they would have had some massive problems.
Considering it was in a water sensitive area, and those tanks were within 30-50 feet of a good size creek.
Give you an idea of the size of these tanks.
They were deep enough we sent a guy in on a harness...about 10 feet of rope he wasn't to the bottom.
But he said you could easily store a single axle dump truck inside of both of them.
So 12-15 feet tall, and 15-20 feet long.
And one may have been bigger than that.
At this same location we pulled a concrete ball out of the ground that used to be a flag pole base.
That concrete ball took two machines to lift into the back of a dump truck with it's tail gate off....and that was after it was jack hammered to make it small enough to fit.
Someone went totally crazy with the concrete on that flag pole, unless it was a thousand feet or so tall.Then you get into locations where it was residential turn commercial.
And you see these places where they have sections of their parking lot that's just crumbling and sinking...and does so for years.
Then you discover that the guy who was in cha</sentencetext>
</comment>
<comment>
	<id>http://www.semanticweb.org/ontologies/ConversationInstances.owl#comment09_06_01_0040204.28163491</id>
	<title>Re:No surprise here...</title>
	<author>Anonymous</author>
	<datestamp>1243784460000</datestamp>
	<modclass>Funny</modclass>
	<modscore>1</modscore>
	<htmltext><p><div class="quote"><p>A former roommate of mine works for the FBI as a network technician and carries a gun when goes to a location.  He would neither confirm nor deny that some network issues deserve to be shot on sight.</p></div><p>The gun is for issues flagged as PEBKAC right?</p></div>
	</htmltext>
<tokenext>A former roommate of mine works for the FBI as a network technician and carries a gun when goes to a location .
He would neither confirm nor deny that some network issues deserve to be shot on sight.The gun is for issues flagged as PEBKAC right ?</tokentext>
<sentencetext>A former roommate of mine works for the FBI as a network technician and carries a gun when goes to a location.
He would neither confirm nor deny that some network issues deserve to be shot on sight.The gun is for issues flagged as PEBKAC right?
	</sentencetext>
	<parent>http://www.semanticweb.org/ontologies/ConversationInstances.owl#comment09_06_01_0040204.28163055</parent>
</comment>
<comment>
	<id>http://www.semanticweb.org/ontologies/ConversationInstances.owl#comment09_06_01_0040204.28163405</id>
	<title>Tysons Metro is a boondoggle</title>
	<author>schwit1</author>
	<datestamp>1243783860000</datestamp>
	<modclass>None</modclass>
	<modscore>1</modscore>
	<htmltext>I live on the west end of Tysons and expect the Metro will increase my property value. But the $5.2B($900M is federal) cost of this project will never come close to being financially justifiable. As with most government projects I expect that price tag to double before completion.</htmltext>
<tokenext>I live on the west end of Tysons and expect the Metro will increase my property value .
But the $ 5.2B ( $ 900M is federal ) cost of this project will never come close to being financially justifiable .
As with most government projects I expect that price tag to double before completion .</tokentext>
<sentencetext>I live on the west end of Tysons and expect the Metro will increase my property value.
But the $5.2B($900M is federal) cost of this project will never come close to being financially justifiable.
As with most government projects I expect that price tag to double before completion.</sentencetext>
</comment>
<comment>
	<id>http://www.semanticweb.org/ontologies/ConversationInstances.owl#comment09_06_01_0040204.28163065</id>
	<title>Re:My Dad</title>
	<author>Anonymous</author>
	<datestamp>1243780980000</datestamp>
	<modclass>Interestin</modclass>
	<modscore>5</modscore>
	<htmltext>Was it on his property? How deep was it? If Verizon ran a shallow cable across his land they should be liable. One farmer here in Victoria, Australia sued Telstra (a big telco) because they ran twisted pair inside his boundary. His equipment dug it up and now that land is useless for farming because his produce is full if little bits of copper wire. It took a while but he won the case.</htmltext>
<tokenext>Was it on his property ?
How deep was it ?
If Verizon ran a shallow cable across his land they should be liable .
One farmer here in Victoria , Australia sued Telstra ( a big telco ) because they ran twisted pair inside his boundary .
His equipment dug it up and now that land is useless for farming because his produce is full if little bits of copper wire .
It took a while but he won the case .</tokentext>
<sentencetext>Was it on his property?
How deep was it?
If Verizon ran a shallow cable across his land they should be liable.
One farmer here in Victoria, Australia sued Telstra (a big telco) because they ran twisted pair inside his boundary.
His equipment dug it up and now that land is useless for farming because his produce is full if little bits of copper wire.
It took a while but he won the case.</sentencetext>
	<parent>http://www.semanticweb.org/ontologies/ConversationInstances.owl#comment09_06_01_0040204.28162839</parent>
</comment>
<comment>
	<id>http://www.semanticweb.org/ontologies/ConversationInstances.owl#comment09_06_01_0040204.28167457</id>
	<title>No one sees secret cable.....</title>
	<author>cooperaaaron</author>
	<datestamp>1243868640000</datestamp>
	<modclass>None</modclass>
	<modscore>0</modscore>
	<htmltext>And, reading all of these stories about buried cables and whatnot, it seems to me that noone has seen people putting IN the cables.  Do black suites get dirty diggin' or do they hire someone to bury cable?  Seems to me that someone should have seen the cable going in, or do they just work at night ?</htmltext>
<tokenext>And , reading all of these stories about buried cables and whatnot , it seems to me that noone has seen people putting IN the cables .
Do black suites get dirty diggin ' or do they hire someone to bury cable ?
Seems to me that someone should have seen the cable going in , or do they just work at night ?</tokentext>
<sentencetext>And, reading all of these stories about buried cables and whatnot, it seems to me that noone has seen people putting IN the cables.
Do black suites get dirty diggin' or do they hire someone to bury cable?
Seems to me that someone should have seen the cable going in, or do they just work at night ?</sentencetext>
</comment>
<comment>
	<id>http://www.semanticweb.org/ontologies/ConversationInstances.owl#comment09_06_01_0040204.28163557</id>
	<title>Are we sure they're secret cables?</title>
	<author>Anonymous</author>
	<datestamp>1243784940000</datestamp>
	<modclass>Insightful</modclass>
	<modscore>4</modscore>
	<htmltext><p>If I were trying to keep a cable secret, I'd make sure the real cable was clearly recorded on the maps as something totally innocuous and not connected to anything secret at all. If it got cut, it'd get repaired per normal procedure for the kind of cable it's marked as (and I'll have sufficient backups that I don't need to make the repair an attention-grabbing rush job). Then I'd lay a few completely unused but highly suspicious-looking decoy cables, making sure they occasionally got cut and that there was a suitably public trying-to-look-not-public scramble to repair them. That way anybody trying to find my cables was likely to glom onto the ones I was trying to keep hidden, and probably wouldn't even bother looking at "backup equipment monitoring line, sewage pumping station 37, Department of Public Works".</p></htmltext>
<tokenext>If I were trying to keep a cable secret , I 'd make sure the real cable was clearly recorded on the maps as something totally innocuous and not connected to anything secret at all .
If it got cut , it 'd get repaired per normal procedure for the kind of cable it 's marked as ( and I 'll have sufficient backups that I do n't need to make the repair an attention-grabbing rush job ) .
Then I 'd lay a few completely unused but highly suspicious-looking decoy cables , making sure they occasionally got cut and that there was a suitably public trying-to-look-not-public scramble to repair them .
That way anybody trying to find my cables was likely to glom onto the ones I was trying to keep hidden , and probably would n't even bother looking at " backup equipment monitoring line , sewage pumping station 37 , Department of Public Works " .</tokentext>
<sentencetext>If I were trying to keep a cable secret, I'd make sure the real cable was clearly recorded on the maps as something totally innocuous and not connected to anything secret at all.
If it got cut, it'd get repaired per normal procedure for the kind of cable it's marked as (and I'll have sufficient backups that I don't need to make the repair an attention-grabbing rush job).
Then I'd lay a few completely unused but highly suspicious-looking decoy cables, making sure they occasionally got cut and that there was a suitably public trying-to-look-not-public scramble to repair them.
That way anybody trying to find my cables was likely to glom onto the ones I was trying to keep hidden, and probably wouldn't even bother looking at "backup equipment monitoring line, sewage pumping station 37, Department of Public Works".</sentencetext>
</comment>
<comment>
	<id>http://www.semanticweb.org/ontologies/ConversationInstances.owl#comment09_06_01_0040204.28164975</id>
	<title>Re:My Dad</title>
	<author>noidentity</author>
	<datestamp>1243799760000</datestamp>
	<modclass>None</modclass>
	<modscore>1</modscore>
	<htmltext><blockquote><div><p>My dad cut through a cell phone line[...]</p></div>
</blockquote><p>I guess back in his day cell phones had a long wire... be thankful they're now wireless!</p></div>
	</htmltext>
<tokenext>My dad cut through a cell phone line [ ... ] I guess back in his day cell phones had a long wire... be thankful they 're now wireless !</tokentext>
<sentencetext>My dad cut through a cell phone line[...]
I guess back in his day cell phones had a long wire... be thankful they're now wireless!
	</sentencetext>
	<parent>http://www.semanticweb.org/ontologies/ConversationInstances.owl#comment09_06_01_0040204.28162839</parent>
</comment>
<comment>
	<id>http://www.semanticweb.org/ontologies/ConversationInstances.owl#comment09_06_01_0040204.28163861</id>
	<title>Been There- Done That</title>
	<author>b4upoo</author>
	<datestamp>1243787460000</datestamp>
	<modclass>Interestin</modclass>
	<modscore>3</modscore>
	<htmltext><p>        I worked installing street lights and traffic lights as well as all the underground material that connects them right on top of some government lines. In one case I was on top of coral, limestone and sandstone covered by side walks and under the over hangs of numerous businesses. We had little short shovels and picks and had to dig 4x4ft. holes nine feet deep through that rock every hundred feet or so for many miles. Striking the buried cable, even with a hand tool, would have resulted in financial disaster. Little things like the US Air Force depended on those lines. It is also a big issue near the Florida Keys as boat anchors tend disrupt cables that relate to national defence.</p></htmltext>
<tokenext>I worked installing street lights and traffic lights as well as all the underground material that connects them right on top of some government lines .
In one case I was on top of coral , limestone and sandstone covered by side walks and under the over hangs of numerous businesses .
We had little short shovels and picks and had to dig 4x4ft .
holes nine feet deep through that rock every hundred feet or so for many miles .
Striking the buried cable , even with a hand tool , would have resulted in financial disaster .
Little things like the US Air Force depended on those lines .
It is also a big issue near the Florida Keys as boat anchors tend disrupt cables that relate to national defence .</tokentext>
<sentencetext>        I worked installing street lights and traffic lights as well as all the underground material that connects them right on top of some government lines.
In one case I was on top of coral, limestone and sandstone covered by side walks and under the over hangs of numerous businesses.
We had little short shovels and picks and had to dig 4x4ft.
holes nine feet deep through that rock every hundred feet or so for many miles.
Striking the buried cable, even with a hand tool, would have resulted in financial disaster.
Little things like the US Air Force depended on those lines.
It is also a big issue near the Florida Keys as boat anchors tend disrupt cables that relate to national defence.</sentencetext>
</comment>
<comment>
	<id>http://www.semanticweb.org/ontologies/ConversationInstances.owl#comment09_06_01_0040204.28163055</id>
	<title>No surprise here...</title>
	<author>creimer</author>
	<datestamp>1243780860000</datestamp>
	<modclass>None</modclass>
	<modscore>1</modscore>
	<htmltext>A former roommate of mine works for the FBI as a network technician and carries a gun when goes to a location.  He would neither confirm nor deny that some network issues deserve to be shot on sight.</htmltext>
<tokenext>A former roommate of mine works for the FBI as a network technician and carries a gun when goes to a location .
He would neither confirm nor deny that some network issues deserve to be shot on sight .</tokentext>
<sentencetext>A former roommate of mine works for the FBI as a network technician and carries a gun when goes to a location.
He would neither confirm nor deny that some network issues deserve to be shot on sight.</sentencetext>
</comment>
<comment>
	<id>http://www.semanticweb.org/ontologies/ConversationInstances.owl#comment09_06_01_0040204.28163921</id>
	<title>Re:Security Through Obscurity is not security</title>
	<author>kriston</author>
	<datestamp>1243788000000</datestamp>
	<modclass>Interestin</modclass>
	<modscore>3</modscore>
	<htmltext><p>This is total nonsense.  They're telecommunications cables just like the others.  They are mapped.  They were accidentally cut.  There is so much telecom in Tysons Corner it's expected to happen.</p><p>The only thing I have to say about your "security through obscurity" comment is that you are wrong.  Even with physical access to such fiber, and if you could conceivably receive the optical signal therein with your MWM fiber receiver (that you took 3 days to splice into the data stream), the encryption on the line stops you dead cold.</p><p>The real story is that the construction rojects, in particular Metro rail to Dulles, is causing all kinds of logisticaly headaches and accidental fiber cuts.<br>There is no real security concern here, even with regards to denial-of-service.</p></htmltext>
<tokenext>This is total nonsense .
They 're telecommunications cables just like the others .
They are mapped .
They were accidentally cut .
There is so much telecom in Tysons Corner it 's expected to happen.The only thing I have to say about your " security through obscurity " comment is that you are wrong .
Even with physical access to such fiber , and if you could conceivably receive the optical signal therein with your MWM fiber receiver ( that you took 3 days to splice into the data stream ) , the encryption on the line stops you dead cold.The real story is that the construction rojects , in particular Metro rail to Dulles , is causing all kinds of logisticaly headaches and accidental fiber cuts.There is no real security concern here , even with regards to denial-of-service .</tokentext>
<sentencetext>This is total nonsense.
They're telecommunications cables just like the others.
They are mapped.
They were accidentally cut.
There is so much telecom in Tysons Corner it's expected to happen.The only thing I have to say about your "security through obscurity" comment is that you are wrong.
Even with physical access to such fiber, and if you could conceivably receive the optical signal therein with your MWM fiber receiver (that you took 3 days to splice into the data stream), the encryption on the line stops you dead cold.The real story is that the construction rojects, in particular Metro rail to Dulles, is causing all kinds of logisticaly headaches and accidental fiber cuts.There is no real security concern here, even with regards to denial-of-service.</sentencetext>
	<parent>http://www.semanticweb.org/ontologies/ConversationInstances.owl#comment09_06_01_0040204.28163379</parent>
</comment>
<comment>
	<id>http://www.semanticweb.org/ontologies/ConversationInstances.owl#comment09_06_01_0040204.28163031</id>
	<title>Re:Our tax dollars at work.</title>
	<author>Anonymous</author>
	<datestamp>1243780800000</datestamp>
	<modclass>Insightful</modclass>
	<modscore>4</modscore>
	<htmltext><p>That wasn't terrorism.  That was good old fashioned espionage.  Spies and saboteurs are related to terrorists, in that they're all tools of "total warfare" doctrine, but it's not the same thing.</p></htmltext>
<tokenext>That was n't terrorism .
That was good old fashioned espionage .
Spies and saboteurs are related to terrorists , in that they 're all tools of " total warfare " doctrine , but it 's not the same thing .</tokentext>
<sentencetext>That wasn't terrorism.
That was good old fashioned espionage.
Spies and saboteurs are related to terrorists, in that they're all tools of "total warfare" doctrine, but it's not the same thing.</sentencetext>
	<parent>http://www.semanticweb.org/ontologies/ConversationInstances.owl#comment09_06_01_0040204.28162903</parent>
</comment>
<comment>
	<id>http://www.semanticweb.org/ontologies/ConversationInstances.owl#comment09_06_01_0040204.28162827</id>
	<title>Under pressure...</title>
	<author>Roskolnikov</author>
	<datestamp>1243779360000</datestamp>
	<modclass>Insightful</modclass>
	<modscore>4</modscore>
	<htmltext><p>Having seen lines ran in pressurized pipes (pressure drop... alarms) and break location by reflection it doesn't shock me at all to see this; being spooks you would think they would use easements or dig deeper than usual<br>to secure such things, but like most work I bet it was contracted out to the cheapest labor they could trust.</p><p>I will say though, not listing the location suggests much; if they are afraid that someone could tap into fiber without detection it most likely means they are already doing so, sometimes the thing you fear the most reveals much about your current state.</p></htmltext>
<tokenext>Having seen lines ran in pressurized pipes ( pressure drop... alarms ) and break location by reflection it does n't shock me at all to see this ; being spooks you would think they would use easements or dig deeper than usualto secure such things , but like most work I bet it was contracted out to the cheapest labor they could trust.I will say though , not listing the location suggests much ; if they are afraid that someone could tap into fiber without detection it most likely means they are already doing so , sometimes the thing you fear the most reveals much about your current state .</tokentext>
<sentencetext>Having seen lines ran in pressurized pipes (pressure drop... alarms) and break location by reflection it doesn't shock me at all to see this; being spooks you would think they would use easements or dig deeper than usualto secure such things, but like most work I bet it was contracted out to the cheapest labor they could trust.I will say though, not listing the location suggests much; if they are afraid that someone could tap into fiber without detection it most likely means they are already doing so, sometimes the thing you fear the most reveals much about your current state.</sentencetext>
</comment>
<comment>
	<id>http://www.semanticweb.org/ontologies/ConversationInstances.owl#comment09_06_01_0040204.28164091</id>
	<title>Re:Doesn't surprise me</title>
	<author>Nefarious Wheel</author>
	<datestamp>1243789800000</datestamp>
	<modclass>Funny</modclass>
	<modscore>2</modscore>
	<htmltext><p><div class="quote"><p>However the contractors started working and found a room with a lead door, 15" concrete walls, a chair and a small observation window. </p></div><p>Ignoring for the moment the fear of radioactive spiders, arbitrarily green physicists or other subcultural agents, I presume someone poked a radiation-measuring instrument in the general direction of the inside of that room?</p></div>
	</htmltext>
<tokenext>However the contractors started working and found a room with a lead door , 15 " concrete walls , a chair and a small observation window .
Ignoring for the moment the fear of radioactive spiders , arbitrarily green physicists or other subcultural agents , I presume someone poked a radiation-measuring instrument in the general direction of the inside of that room ?</tokentext>
<sentencetext>However the contractors started working and found a room with a lead door, 15" concrete walls, a chair and a small observation window.
Ignoring for the moment the fear of radioactive spiders, arbitrarily green physicists or other subcultural agents, I presume someone poked a radiation-measuring instrument in the general direction of the inside of that room?
	</sentencetext>
	<parent>http://www.semanticweb.org/ontologies/ConversationInstances.owl#comment09_06_01_0040204.28163017</parent>
</comment>
<comment>
	<id>http://www.semanticweb.org/ontologies/ConversationInstances.owl#comment09_06_01_0040204.28167127</id>
	<title>Re:Under pressure...</title>
	<author>aicrules</author>
	<datestamp>1243867080000</datestamp>
	<modclass>None</modclass>
	<modscore>1</modscore>
	<htmltext>And it's almost certainly a violation of policy for you to post this policy as you're immediately degrading said policy's ability to provide security.</htmltext>
<tokenext>And it 's almost certainly a violation of policy for you to post this policy as you 're immediately degrading said policy 's ability to provide security .</tokentext>
<sentencetext>And it's almost certainly a violation of policy for you to post this policy as you're immediately degrading said policy's ability to provide security.</sentencetext>
	<parent>http://www.semanticweb.org/ontologies/ConversationInstances.owl#comment09_06_01_0040204.28163299</parent>
</comment>
<comment>
	<id>http://www.semanticweb.org/ontologies/ConversationInstances.owl#comment09_06_01_0040204.28164081</id>
	<title>"Seconds"?</title>
	<author>Anonymous</author>
	<datestamp>1243789680000</datestamp>
	<modclass>Offtopic</modclass>
	<modscore>-1</modscore>
	<htmltext><p>How could someone show up in seconds? I am prepared to accept that one end of that fiber was in that area, but they had to go to the car, and drive out. Tyson's corner is not exactly Bumfuck, Iowa that cars can turn any which way they wish.</p></htmltext>
<tokenext>How could someone show up in seconds ?
I am prepared to accept that one end of that fiber was in that area , but they had to go to the car , and drive out .
Tyson 's corner is not exactly Bumfuck , Iowa that cars can turn any which way they wish .</tokentext>
<sentencetext>How could someone show up in seconds?
I am prepared to accept that one end of that fiber was in that area, but they had to go to the car, and drive out.
Tyson's corner is not exactly Bumfuck, Iowa that cars can turn any which way they wish.</sentencetext>
</comment>
<comment>
	<id>http://www.semanticweb.org/ontologies/ConversationInstances.owl#comment09_06_01_0040204.28164487</id>
	<title>Re:Our tax dollars at work.</title>
	<author>tibman</author>
	<datestamp>1243793460000</datestamp>
	<modclass>None</modclass>
	<modscore>1</modscore>
	<htmltext><p>The vast majority of gov computers are used for email, memos, excel, and making fancy powerpoint/impress presentations for the next weekly training meeting.  But there are very important systems throughout the world that depend on a secure transport system.</p><p>My guess is these lines weren't public accessible cables anyways.  The DOD has many separate networks that mirror the internet in every way except they don't actually touch the "net"<nobr> <wbr></nobr>.. or each other.  Who cares if they aren't in the public record?  Even if the public paid for them, they aren't for public use.  Security always has it's downsides i guess</p></htmltext>
<tokenext>The vast majority of gov computers are used for email , memos , excel , and making fancy powerpoint/impress presentations for the next weekly training meeting .
But there are very important systems throughout the world that depend on a secure transport system.My guess is these lines were n't public accessible cables anyways .
The DOD has many separate networks that mirror the internet in every way except they do n't actually touch the " net " .. or each other .
Who cares if they are n't in the public record ?
Even if the public paid for them , they are n't for public use .
Security always has it 's downsides i guess</tokentext>
<sentencetext>The vast majority of gov computers are used for email, memos, excel, and making fancy powerpoint/impress presentations for the next weekly training meeting.
But there are very important systems throughout the world that depend on a secure transport system.My guess is these lines weren't public accessible cables anyways.
The DOD has many separate networks that mirror the internet in every way except they don't actually touch the "net" .. or each other.
Who cares if they aren't in the public record?
Even if the public paid for them, they aren't for public use.
Security always has it's downsides i guess</sentencetext>
	<parent>http://www.semanticweb.org/ontologies/ConversationInstances.owl#comment09_06_01_0040204.28162903</parent>
</comment>
<comment>
	<id>http://www.semanticweb.org/ontologies/ConversationInstances.owl#comment09_06_01_0040204.28177261</id>
	<title>Re:Under pressure...</title>
	<author>Anonymous</author>
	<datestamp>1243872900000</datestamp>
	<modclass>None</modclass>
	<modscore>0</modscore>
	<htmltext><p>Yeah, the operation was called Ivy Bells. It cost millions of dollars back then. We had to send subs down there with divers risking their lives until one day Ronald Pelton (an NSA analyst) went to Soviet embassy and sold the info to the Ruskies for $35K. </p><p>It is funny how we spend millions of dollars on this cool advanced technology and the Russians can spend less than \%1 by hacking people.</p><p>At the end of the day, none of that mattered that much. All these spy games were just that, expensive show-offs.</p></htmltext>
<tokenext>Yeah , the operation was called Ivy Bells .
It cost millions of dollars back then .
We had to send subs down there with divers risking their lives until one day Ronald Pelton ( an NSA analyst ) went to Soviet embassy and sold the info to the Ruskies for $ 35K .
It is funny how we spend millions of dollars on this cool advanced technology and the Russians can spend less than \ % 1 by hacking people.At the end of the day , none of that mattered that much .
All these spy games were just that , expensive show-offs .</tokentext>
<sentencetext>Yeah, the operation was called Ivy Bells.
It cost millions of dollars back then.
We had to send subs down there with divers risking their lives until one day Ronald Pelton (an NSA analyst) went to Soviet embassy and sold the info to the Ruskies for $35K.
It is funny how we spend millions of dollars on this cool advanced technology and the Russians can spend less than \%1 by hacking people.At the end of the day, none of that mattered that much.
All these spy games were just that, expensive show-offs.</sentencetext>
	<parent>http://www.semanticweb.org/ontologies/ConversationInstances.owl#comment09_06_01_0040204.28163959</parent>
</comment>
<comment>
	<id>http://www.semanticweb.org/ontologies/ConversationInstances.owl#comment09_06_01_0040204.28166717</id>
	<title>Re:Completely fallacious and sensationalized nonse</title>
	<author>Critical Facilities</author>
	<datestamp>1243864800000</datestamp>
	<modclass>Interestin</modclass>
	<modscore>2</modscore>
	<htmltext><p><div class="quote"><p>The problem is not that the lines aren't mapped--they ARE mapped just like any other utility.
The real problem is that the maps aren't perfect.</p></div><p>Irrelevant.  As I explained <a href="http://slashdot.org/comments.pl?sid=1251621&amp;cid=28166327" title="slashdot.org">here</a> [slashdot.org],  there are very effective methods of locating utilities (quite accurately I might add) that are either missing from a map, or are incorrectly drawn on the map.  I do agree that this story seems to be quite sensationalized,  and still maintain that the contractor did not do his/her due diligence prior to digging.</p></div>
	</htmltext>
<tokenext>The problem is not that the lines are n't mapped--they ARE mapped just like any other utility .
The real problem is that the maps are n't perfect.Irrelevant .
As I explained here [ slashdot.org ] , there are very effective methods of locating utilities ( quite accurately I might add ) that are either missing from a map , or are incorrectly drawn on the map .
I do agree that this story seems to be quite sensationalized , and still maintain that the contractor did not do his/her due diligence prior to digging .</tokentext>
<sentencetext>The problem is not that the lines aren't mapped--they ARE mapped just like any other utility.
The real problem is that the maps aren't perfect.Irrelevant.
As I explained here [slashdot.org],  there are very effective methods of locating utilities (quite accurately I might add) that are either missing from a map, or are incorrectly drawn on the map.
I do agree that this story seems to be quite sensationalized,  and still maintain that the contractor did not do his/her due diligence prior to digging.
	</sentencetext>
	<parent>http://www.semanticweb.org/ontologies/ConversationInstances.owl#comment09_06_01_0040204.28163875</parent>
</comment>
<comment>
	<id>http://www.semanticweb.org/ontologies/ConversationInstances.owl#comment09_06_01_0040204.28168149</id>
	<title>Re:My Dad</title>
	<author>JerryLove</author>
	<datestamp>1243871580000</datestamp>
	<modclass>None</modclass>
	<modscore>1</modscore>
	<htmltext><p>I wasn't aware that they were allowed to run cable across (non-easment) private property to begin with.</p><p>I understand in the CIA's case if they do this, but running cable to a cell tower across a private farm? Did your dad forget that he let them do that, or buy the farm after it was done?</p></htmltext>
<tokenext>I was n't aware that they were allowed to run cable across ( non-easment ) private property to begin with.I understand in the CIA 's case if they do this , but running cable to a cell tower across a private farm ?
Did your dad forget that he let them do that , or buy the farm after it was done ?</tokentext>
<sentencetext>I wasn't aware that they were allowed to run cable across (non-easment) private property to begin with.I understand in the CIA's case if they do this, but running cable to a cell tower across a private farm?
Did your dad forget that he let them do that, or buy the farm after it was done?</sentencetext>
	<parent>http://www.semanticweb.org/ontologies/ConversationInstances.owl#comment09_06_01_0040204.28162839</parent>
</comment>
<comment>
	<id>http://www.semanticweb.org/ontologies/ConversationInstances.owl#comment09_06_01_0040204.28163363</id>
	<title>Re:Ok...</title>
	<author>Anonymous</author>
	<datestamp>1243783620000</datestamp>
	<modclass>None</modclass>
	<modscore>1</modscore>
	<htmltext><p>If you call 811 and have the underground utilities marked, it's my understanding that you're good to go. If you hit something you weren't told about, not your problem.</p><p>If you *don't* call to have them located and you dig something up, you're pretty much on the hook for the whole shebang.</p></htmltext>
<tokenext>If you call 811 and have the underground utilities marked , it 's my understanding that you 're good to go .
If you hit something you were n't told about , not your problem.If you * do n't * call to have them located and you dig something up , you 're pretty much on the hook for the whole shebang .</tokentext>
<sentencetext>If you call 811 and have the underground utilities marked, it's my understanding that you're good to go.
If you hit something you weren't told about, not your problem.If you *don't* call to have them located and you dig something up, you're pretty much on the hook for the whole shebang.</sentencetext>
	<parent>http://www.semanticweb.org/ontologies/ConversationInstances.owl#comment09_06_01_0040204.28162819</parent>
</comment>
<comment>
	<id>http://www.semanticweb.org/ontologies/ConversationInstances.owl#comment09_06_01_0040204.28170531</id>
	<title>This is not the fiber you're looking for...</title>
	<author>Anonymous</author>
	<datestamp>1243882260000</datestamp>
	<modclass>None</modclass>
	<modscore>0</modscore>
	<htmltext><p>...move along.</p><p>*waves hand*</p></htmltext>
<tokenext>...move along .
* waves hand *</tokentext>
<sentencetext>...move along.
*waves hand*</sentencetext>
</comment>
<comment>
	<id>http://www.semanticweb.org/ontologies/ConversationInstances.owl#comment09_06_01_0040204.28163117</id>
	<title>Happens in business also</title>
	<author>JavaManJim</author>
	<datestamp>1243781580000</datestamp>
	<modclass>Interestin</modclass>
	<modscore>2</modscore>
	<htmltext><p>Way back when I graduated college and started work for a major USA oil company.</p><p>The IT department had a neat graphics printer. Oil companies generally have a lot of money resulting in great toys. One of the experienced IT developers said; "Watch, this graphics printer prints the coolest maps!". That map had printed just an interesting six inches on its way to 30". Then security showed up. Confiscated the map. Shut down the terminal and printer. And wrote everyone up. Security said about ten words. Then left. We looked at each other mystified and shrugged.</p><p>Oh yes, the oil company could and did hire all sorts of experts. Those security folks likely had serious experience.</p><p>Thanks,<br>The J</p></htmltext>
<tokenext>Way back when I graduated college and started work for a major USA oil company.The IT department had a neat graphics printer .
Oil companies generally have a lot of money resulting in great toys .
One of the experienced IT developers said ; " Watch , this graphics printer prints the coolest maps ! " .
That map had printed just an interesting six inches on its way to 30 " .
Then security showed up .
Confiscated the map .
Shut down the terminal and printer .
And wrote everyone up .
Security said about ten words .
Then left .
We looked at each other mystified and shrugged.Oh yes , the oil company could and did hire all sorts of experts .
Those security folks likely had serious experience.Thanks,The J</tokentext>
<sentencetext>Way back when I graduated college and started work for a major USA oil company.The IT department had a neat graphics printer.
Oil companies generally have a lot of money resulting in great toys.
One of the experienced IT developers said; "Watch, this graphics printer prints the coolest maps!".
That map had printed just an interesting six inches on its way to 30".
Then security showed up.
Confiscated the map.
Shut down the terminal and printer.
And wrote everyone up.
Security said about ten words.
Then left.
We looked at each other mystified and shrugged.Oh yes, the oil company could and did hire all sorts of experts.
Those security folks likely had serious experience.Thanks,The J</sentencetext>
</comment>
<comment>
	<id>http://www.semanticweb.org/ontologies/ConversationInstances.owl#comment09_06_01_0040204.28173269</id>
	<title>Re:Under pressure...</title>
	<author>Anonymous</author>
	<datestamp>1243849320000</datestamp>
	<modclass>None</modclass>
	<modscore>0</modscore>
	<htmltext><p><i>rented U-Haul truck</i> </p><p>You wouldn't expect the CIA to use a truck marked "CIA Cable Crafters", would you?</p></htmltext>
<tokenext>rented U-Haul truck You would n't expect the CIA to use a truck marked " CIA Cable Crafters " , would you ?</tokentext>
<sentencetext>rented U-Haul truck You wouldn't expect the CIA to use a truck marked "CIA Cable Crafters", would you?</sentencetext>
	<parent>http://www.semanticweb.org/ontologies/ConversationInstances.owl#comment09_06_01_0040204.28163299</parent>
</comment>
<comment>
	<id>http://www.semanticweb.org/ontologies/ConversationInstances.owl#comment09_06_01_0040204.28163003</id>
	<title>Re:Ok...</title>
	<author>genner</author>
	<datestamp>1243780560000</datestamp>
	<modclass>None</modclass>
	<modscore>1</modscore>
	<htmltext><p><div class="quote"><p>So who you supposed to notify when you dig?  If the fiber is secret, nobody's going to tell you where it's at, and nobody's going to 'fess up about the ownership of said fiber.</p><p>
And who do you make the check out to when you <b>do</b> cut it?  Or would a 'Hey, how the hell can <b>we</b> know when we cut a top secret fiber?  How we supposed to know it's there if it's top secret and we don't have clearance???' defense work in court when the other guy's lawyers come at you for damages?</p></div><p>Considering how often they cut fiber that is on the map and get away with it, I doubt this would be a problem.</p></div>
	</htmltext>
<tokenext>So who you supposed to notify when you dig ?
If the fiber is secret , nobody 's going to tell you where it 's at , and nobody 's going to 'fess up about the ownership of said fiber .
And who do you make the check out to when you do cut it ?
Or would a 'Hey , how the hell can we know when we cut a top secret fiber ?
How we supposed to know it 's there if it 's top secret and we do n't have clearance ? ? ?
' defense work in court when the other guy 's lawyers come at you for damages ? Considering how often they cut fiber that is on the map and get away with it , I doubt this would be a problem .</tokentext>
<sentencetext>So who you supposed to notify when you dig?
If the fiber is secret, nobody's going to tell you where it's at, and nobody's going to 'fess up about the ownership of said fiber.
And who do you make the check out to when you do cut it?
Or would a 'Hey, how the hell can we know when we cut a top secret fiber?
How we supposed to know it's there if it's top secret and we don't have clearance???
' defense work in court when the other guy's lawyers come at you for damages?Considering how often they cut fiber that is on the map and get away with it, I doubt this would be a problem.
	</sentencetext>
	<parent>http://www.semanticweb.org/ontologies/ConversationInstances.owl#comment09_06_01_0040204.28162819</parent>
</comment>
<comment>
	<id>http://www.semanticweb.org/ontologies/ConversationInstances.owl#comment09_06_01_0040204.28167545</id>
	<title>And above all that...</title>
	<author>Leuf</author>
	<datestamp>1243869060000</datestamp>
	<modclass>None</modclass>
	<modscore>1</modscore>
	<htmltext>Gophers with frikkin laser beams.</htmltext>
<tokenext>Gophers with frikkin laser beams .</tokentext>
<sentencetext>Gophers with frikkin laser beams.</sentencetext>
	<parent>http://www.semanticweb.org/ontologies/ConversationInstances.owl#comment09_06_01_0040204.28163769</parent>
</comment>
<comment>
	<id>http://www.semanticweb.org/ontologies/ConversationInstances.owl#comment09_06_01_0040204.28163017</id>
	<title>Doesn't surprise me</title>
	<author>Anonymous</author>
	<datestamp>1243780620000</datestamp>
	<modclass>Interestin</modclass>
	<modscore>5</modscore>
	<htmltext><p>There is a lot of cable in the ground even for civil use that isn't really on the plans. But the government and it's agencies really have a thing for not documenting anything for whatever reason.</p><p>I work in a building that was commissioned by the Atomic Energy Commission for the Manhattan Project. It should've been torn down a long time ago but it was more expensive to do that than to renovate it. Right now we're inheriting the 2nd floor of the building where they have been empty since the end of the Cold War (I recently found a stash of unopened era software) but nobody has any plans to the original layout (they went missing somewhere in the 50's) so the DoE did a (nuclear and structural) survey of the site and mapped it out. However the contractors started working and found a room with a lead door, 15" concrete walls, a chair and a small observation window. Needed to do a whole new nuclear survey and remap the whole thing by an internal team. The architect recreated his plans with the new data and found out that there is a bunch of space missing on the (currently empty) 3rd floor. We're not yet renovating there but for some or another reason the decision was made from higher up to leave the 3rd floor untouched until we really need that space.</p></htmltext>
<tokenext>There is a lot of cable in the ground even for civil use that is n't really on the plans .
But the government and it 's agencies really have a thing for not documenting anything for whatever reason.I work in a building that was commissioned by the Atomic Energy Commission for the Manhattan Project .
It should 've been torn down a long time ago but it was more expensive to do that than to renovate it .
Right now we 're inheriting the 2nd floor of the building where they have been empty since the end of the Cold War ( I recently found a stash of unopened era software ) but nobody has any plans to the original layout ( they went missing somewhere in the 50 's ) so the DoE did a ( nuclear and structural ) survey of the site and mapped it out .
However the contractors started working and found a room with a lead door , 15 " concrete walls , a chair and a small observation window .
Needed to do a whole new nuclear survey and remap the whole thing by an internal team .
The architect recreated his plans with the new data and found out that there is a bunch of space missing on the ( currently empty ) 3rd floor .
We 're not yet renovating there but for some or another reason the decision was made from higher up to leave the 3rd floor untouched until we really need that space .</tokentext>
<sentencetext>There is a lot of cable in the ground even for civil use that isn't really on the plans.
But the government and it's agencies really have a thing for not documenting anything for whatever reason.I work in a building that was commissioned by the Atomic Energy Commission for the Manhattan Project.
It should've been torn down a long time ago but it was more expensive to do that than to renovate it.
Right now we're inheriting the 2nd floor of the building where they have been empty since the end of the Cold War (I recently found a stash of unopened era software) but nobody has any plans to the original layout (they went missing somewhere in the 50's) so the DoE did a (nuclear and structural) survey of the site and mapped it out.
However the contractors started working and found a room with a lead door, 15" concrete walls, a chair and a small observation window.
Needed to do a whole new nuclear survey and remap the whole thing by an internal team.
The architect recreated his plans with the new data and found out that there is a bunch of space missing on the (currently empty) 3rd floor.
We're not yet renovating there but for some or another reason the decision was made from higher up to leave the 3rd floor untouched until we really need that space.</sentencetext>
</comment>
<comment>
	<id>http://www.semanticweb.org/ontologies/ConversationInstances.owl#comment09_06_01_0040204.28163175</id>
	<title>Re:Under pressure...</title>
	<author>bgerlich</author>
	<datestamp>1243782000000</datestamp>
	<modclass>None</modclass>
	<modscore>1</modscore>
	<htmltext>Maybe the reason the location of the cable was "secret" is because the cable was laid without proper procedures and paperwork.
<br> <br>
Maybe there were no fancy detection systems, just a couple of guys waiting in an empty lot around the corner and a middle management guy in a murky office somewhere praying for the cable not to get cut and hoping that he will avoid the shitstorm coming his way. It's not like the construction site was a secret and it's not like those things pop up overnight.</htmltext>
<tokenext>Maybe the reason the location of the cable was " secret " is because the cable was laid without proper procedures and paperwork .
Maybe there were no fancy detection systems , just a couple of guys waiting in an empty lot around the corner and a middle management guy in a murky office somewhere praying for the cable not to get cut and hoping that he will avoid the shitstorm coming his way .
It 's not like the construction site was a secret and it 's not like those things pop up overnight .</tokentext>
<sentencetext>Maybe the reason the location of the cable was "secret" is because the cable was laid without proper procedures and paperwork.
Maybe there were no fancy detection systems, just a couple of guys waiting in an empty lot around the corner and a middle management guy in a murky office somewhere praying for the cable not to get cut and hoping that he will avoid the shitstorm coming his way.
It's not like the construction site was a secret and it's not like those things pop up overnight.</sentencetext>
	<parent>http://www.semanticweb.org/ontologies/ConversationInstances.owl#comment09_06_01_0040204.28162827</parent>
</comment>
<comment>
	<id>http://www.semanticweb.org/ontologies/ConversationInstances.owl#comment09_06_01_0040204.28164209</id>
	<title>When my Backhoe...</title>
	<author>dreemernj</author>
	<datestamp>1243790760000</datestamp>
	<modclass>Redundant</modclass>
	<modscore>0</modscore>
	<htmltext>When my backhoe gets out of line I give it a backslap to the backface.</htmltext>
<tokenext>When my backhoe gets out of line I give it a backslap to the backface .</tokentext>
<sentencetext>When my backhoe gets out of line I give it a backslap to the backface.</sentencetext>
</comment>
<comment>
	<id>http://www.semanticweb.org/ontologies/ConversationInstances.owl#comment09_06_01_0040204.28164883</id>
	<title>Re:Our tax dollars at work.</title>
	<author>omglolbah</author>
	<datestamp>1243798320000</datestamp>
	<modclass>None</modclass>
	<modscore>1</modscore>
	<htmltext><p>Amusingly you hit the mark quite well in one sense...</p><p>Many cables are pressurized to help detect breaks in the outer layers before the signal degrades.</p><p>Putting cables in pipes is common, at least in the offshore/onshore oil/gas industry. You really dont want your cables exposed in such an environment<nobr> <wbr></nobr>;)</p></htmltext>
<tokenext>Amusingly you hit the mark quite well in one sense...Many cables are pressurized to help detect breaks in the outer layers before the signal degrades.Putting cables in pipes is common , at least in the offshore/onshore oil/gas industry .
You really dont want your cables exposed in such an environment ; )</tokentext>
<sentencetext>Amusingly you hit the mark quite well in one sense...Many cables are pressurized to help detect breaks in the outer layers before the signal degrades.Putting cables in pipes is common, at least in the offshore/onshore oil/gas industry.
You really dont want your cables exposed in such an environment ;)</sentencetext>
	<parent>http://www.semanticweb.org/ontologies/ConversationInstances.owl#comment09_06_01_0040204.28163291</parent>
</comment>
<comment>
	<id>http://www.semanticweb.org/ontologies/ConversationInstances.owl#comment09_06_01_0040204.28162811</id>
	<title>Obligatory slurs</title>
	<author>Anonymous</author>
	<datestamp>1243779240000</datestamp>
	<modclass>Troll</modclass>
	<modscore>-1</modscore>
	<htmltext><p>My back ho's will cut black fiber, but it costs extra.</p></htmltext>
<tokenext>My back ho 's will cut black fiber , but it costs extra .</tokentext>
<sentencetext>My back ho's will cut black fiber, but it costs extra.</sentencetext>
</comment>
<comment>
	<id>http://www.semanticweb.org/ontologies/ConversationInstances.owl#comment09_06_01_0040204.28165177</id>
	<title>Re:Our tax dollars at work.</title>
	<author>Anonymous</author>
	<datestamp>1243889760000</datestamp>
	<modclass>None</modclass>
	<modscore>0</modscore>
	<htmltext><p>Did these plans include the software?</p><p>Modern fighters are aerodynamically <b>un</b>stable. It's what gives them such awesome agility, but only when controlled by the right software, which took quite a lot of simulator time to get right. Even if <i>other nation</i> stole the software too, I doubt they'd be able to build the plane so exactly to the stolen specs that the software could fly it. Just a little bit off, such as using a different metal alloy, could make it differently unstable in a way the software can't correct for.</p></htmltext>
<tokenext>Did these plans include the software ? Modern fighters are aerodynamically unstable .
It 's what gives them such awesome agility , but only when controlled by the right software , which took quite a lot of simulator time to get right .
Even if other nation stole the software too , I doubt they 'd be able to build the plane so exactly to the stolen specs that the software could fly it .
Just a little bit off , such as using a different metal alloy , could make it differently unstable in a way the software ca n't correct for .</tokentext>
<sentencetext>Did these plans include the software?Modern fighters are aerodynamically unstable.
It's what gives them such awesome agility, but only when controlled by the right software, which took quite a lot of simulator time to get right.
Even if other nation stole the software too, I doubt they'd be able to build the plane so exactly to the stolen specs that the software could fly it.
Just a little bit off, such as using a different metal alloy, could make it differently unstable in a way the software can't correct for.</sentencetext>
	<parent>http://www.semanticweb.org/ontologies/ConversationInstances.owl#comment09_06_01_0040204.28162903</parent>
</comment>
<comment>
	<id>http://www.semanticweb.org/ontologies/ConversationInstances.owl#comment09_06_01_0040204.28166545</id>
	<title>Seeing it first hand</title>
	<author>Anonymous</author>
	<datestamp>1243863600000</datestamp>
	<modclass>Interestin</modclass>
	<modscore>1</modscore>
	<htmltext><p>I actually live and work right in this area and my company has been the victim of severed fiber several times in just the past 2 years.  Usually it's phone call after phone call to get someone to even move on it.  Once the finally acknowledge there is an issue they can't move on it until they hit a maintenance window of 11PM because they have to take down connectivity for the FAA at Dulles International to resolve it.  If anything I'm jealous at that kind of response time they have.</p></htmltext>
<tokenext>I actually live and work right in this area and my company has been the victim of severed fiber several times in just the past 2 years .
Usually it 's phone call after phone call to get someone to even move on it .
Once the finally acknowledge there is an issue they ca n't move on it until they hit a maintenance window of 11PM because they have to take down connectivity for the FAA at Dulles International to resolve it .
If anything I 'm jealous at that kind of response time they have .</tokentext>
<sentencetext>I actually live and work right in this area and my company has been the victim of severed fiber several times in just the past 2 years.
Usually it's phone call after phone call to get someone to even move on it.
Once the finally acknowledge there is an issue they can't move on it until they hit a maintenance window of 11PM because they have to take down connectivity for the FAA at Dulles International to resolve it.
If anything I'm jealous at that kind of response time they have.</sentencetext>
</comment>
<comment>
	<id>http://www.semanticweb.org/ontologies/ConversationInstances.owl#comment09_06_01_0040204.28162825</id>
	<title>Two Ends of the Cable</title>
	<author>superid</author>
	<datestamp>1243779360000</datestamp>
	<modclass>None</modclass>
	<modscore>1</modscore>
	<htmltext><p>I see that ONE end of the cable is the NSA's, but I wonder where the other one goes....</p></htmltext>
<tokenext>I see that ONE end of the cable is the NSA 's , but I wonder where the other one goes... .</tokentext>
<sentencetext>I see that ONE end of the cable is the NSA's, but I wonder where the other one goes....</sentencetext>
</comment>
<comment>
	<id>http://www.semanticweb.org/ontologies/ConversationInstances.owl#comment09_06_01_0040204.28163247</id>
	<title>Re:Wow...</title>
	<author>Anonymous</author>
	<datestamp>1243782540000</datestamp>
	<modclass>Insightful</modclass>
	<modscore>0</modscore>
	<htmltext><p><div class="quote"><p>Pretty crazy. Makes me happy I don't live near there.</p></div><p>Why?  Because you'd somehow be inconvenienced when the NSA's fiber optic cable gets accidentally severed?</p><p>Jeez... if you're going to try for a first post without being a troll, at least have something intelligent to say.</p></div>
	</htmltext>
<tokenext>Pretty crazy .
Makes me happy I do n't live near there.Why ?
Because you 'd somehow be inconvenienced when the NSA 's fiber optic cable gets accidentally severed ? Jeez... if you 're going to try for a first post without being a troll , at least have something intelligent to say .</tokentext>
<sentencetext>Pretty crazy.
Makes me happy I don't live near there.Why?
Because you'd somehow be inconvenienced when the NSA's fiber optic cable gets accidentally severed?Jeez... if you're going to try for a first post without being a troll, at least have something intelligent to say.
	</sentencetext>
	<parent>http://www.semanticweb.org/ontologies/ConversationInstances.owl#comment09_06_01_0040204.28162795</parent>
</comment>
<comment>
	<id>http://www.semanticweb.org/ontologies/ConversationInstances.owl#comment09_06_01_0040204.28177321</id>
	<title>Re:Are we sure they're secret cables?</title>
	<author>Anonymous</author>
	<datestamp>1243873500000</datestamp>
	<modclass>None</modclass>
	<modscore>0</modscore>
	<htmltext><p>Perhaps the one that was cut *was* a decoy...</p></htmltext>
<tokenext>Perhaps the one that was cut * was * a decoy.. .</tokentext>
<sentencetext>Perhaps the one that was cut *was* a decoy...</sentencetext>
	<parent>http://www.semanticweb.org/ontologies/ConversationInstances.owl#comment09_06_01_0040204.28163557</parent>
</comment>
<comment>
	<id>http://www.semanticweb.org/ontologies/ConversationInstances.owl#comment09_06_01_0040204.28163685</id>
	<title>Re:Ok...</title>
	<author>Tuoqui</author>
	<datestamp>1243785840000</datestamp>
	<modclass>None</modclass>
	<modscore>1</modscore>
	<htmltext><p>Oh sure that's handy if you have your top secret CIA Ground Penetrating X-Ray Imaging device. Oh right...</p></htmltext>
<tokenext>Oh sure that 's handy if you have your top secret CIA Ground Penetrating X-Ray Imaging device .
Oh right.. .</tokentext>
<sentencetext>Oh sure that's handy if you have your top secret CIA Ground Penetrating X-Ray Imaging device.
Oh right...</sentencetext>
	<parent>http://www.semanticweb.org/ontologies/ConversationInstances.owl#comment09_06_01_0040204.28162911</parent>
</comment>
<comment>
	<id>http://www.semanticweb.org/ontologies/ConversationInstances.owl#comment09_06_01_0040204.28165149</id>
	<title>Re:Our tax dollars at work.</title>
	<author>goldcd</author>
	<datestamp>1243889280000</datestamp>
	<modclass>Interestin</modclass>
	<modscore>2</modscore>
	<htmltext>If they'd just turned up a couple of days later in AT&amp;T outfits, then this would never have been a story.
So for the sake of getting their fibre back on-line immediately, they've 'lost' the secret value - actually, they've now definitely flagged it as 'secret'</htmltext>
<tokenext>If they 'd just turned up a couple of days later in AT&amp;T outfits , then this would never have been a story .
So for the sake of getting their fibre back on-line immediately , they 've 'lost ' the secret value - actually , they 've now definitely flagged it as 'secret'</tokentext>
<sentencetext>If they'd just turned up a couple of days later in AT&amp;T outfits, then this would never have been a story.
So for the sake of getting their fibre back on-line immediately, they've 'lost' the secret value - actually, they've now definitely flagged it as 'secret'</sentencetext>
	<parent>http://www.semanticweb.org/ontologies/ConversationInstances.owl#comment09_06_01_0040204.28163187</parent>
</comment>
<comment>
	<id>http://www.semanticweb.org/ontologies/ConversationInstances.owl#comment09_06_01_0040204.28163291</id>
	<title>Re:Our tax dollars at work.</title>
	<author>aaarrrgggh</author>
	<datestamp>1243783020000</datestamp>
	<modclass>Interestin</modclass>
	<modscore>4</modscore>
	<htmltext><p>Hell, just put the fiber <b>in</b> a 4" gas line!  Valves become a little problem, but you could have some cast with a bypass for the fiber to pass through.</p></htmltext>
<tokenext>Hell , just put the fiber in a 4 " gas line !
Valves become a little problem , but you could have some cast with a bypass for the fiber to pass through .</tokentext>
<sentencetext>Hell, just put the fiber in a 4" gas line!
Valves become a little problem, but you could have some cast with a bypass for the fiber to pass through.</sentencetext>
	<parent>http://www.semanticweb.org/ontologies/ConversationInstances.owl#comment09_06_01_0040204.28163015</parent>
</comment>
<comment>
	<id>http://www.semanticweb.org/ontologies/ConversationInstances.owl#comment09_06_01_0040204.28167029</id>
	<title>Re:Ok...</title>
	<author>Anonymous</author>
	<datestamp>1243866600000</datestamp>
	<modclass>None</modclass>
	<modscore>0</modscore>
	<htmltext><p>You forgot mention that the cable was never cut because it was never there and neither were the serious men who weren't fixing the nonexistant cable.</p></htmltext>
<tokenext>You forgot mention that the cable was never cut because it was never there and neither were the serious men who were n't fixing the nonexistant cable .</tokentext>
<sentencetext>You forgot mention that the cable was never cut because it was never there and neither were the serious men who weren't fixing the nonexistant cable.</sentencetext>
	<parent>http://www.semanticweb.org/ontologies/ConversationInstances.owl#comment09_06_01_0040204.28163103</parent>
</comment>
<comment>
	<id>http://www.semanticweb.org/ontologies/ConversationInstances.owl#comment09_06_01_0040204.28164575</id>
	<title>Re:Are we sure they're secret cables?</title>
	<author>jeff4747</author>
	<datestamp>1243794540000</datestamp>
	<modclass>None</modclass>
	<modscore>1</modscore>
	<htmltext><blockquote><div><p>I'd make sure the real cable was clearly recorded on the maps as something totally innocuous and not connected to anything secret at all.</p></div></blockquote><p>Um...how would you accurately record the location of your secret cables, yet not have them lead to a "secret" location?</p><p>If your map is accurate, the cable leads into some three-letter agency's building.</p><p>If the cable doesn't lead into such a building, your map is inaccurate.</p></div>
	</htmltext>
<tokenext>I 'd make sure the real cable was clearly recorded on the maps as something totally innocuous and not connected to anything secret at all.Um...how would you accurately record the location of your secret cables , yet not have them lead to a " secret " location ? If your map is accurate , the cable leads into some three-letter agency 's building.If the cable does n't lead into such a building , your map is inaccurate .</tokentext>
<sentencetext>I'd make sure the real cable was clearly recorded on the maps as something totally innocuous and not connected to anything secret at all.Um...how would you accurately record the location of your secret cables, yet not have them lead to a "secret" location?If your map is accurate, the cable leads into some three-letter agency's building.If the cable doesn't lead into such a building, your map is inaccurate.
	</sentencetext>
	<parent>http://www.semanticweb.org/ontologies/ConversationInstances.owl#comment09_06_01_0040204.28163557</parent>
</comment>
<comment>
	<id>http://www.semanticweb.org/ontologies/ConversationInstances.owl#comment09_06_01_0040204.28162795</id>
	<title>Wow...</title>
	<author>Anonymous</author>
	<datestamp>1243779120000</datestamp>
	<modclass>Offtopic</modclass>
	<modscore>-1</modscore>
	<htmltext>Pretty crazy. Makes me happy I don't live near there.

Oh, and first post, I guess.</htmltext>
<tokenext>Pretty crazy .
Makes me happy I do n't live near there .
Oh , and first post , I guess .</tokentext>
<sentencetext>Pretty crazy.
Makes me happy I don't live near there.
Oh, and first post, I guess.</sentencetext>
</comment>
<comment>
	<id>http://www.semanticweb.org/ontologies/ConversationInstances.owl#comment09_06_01_0040204.28163451</id>
	<title>origin of the mistake</title>
	<author>omi5cron</author>
	<datestamp>1243784220000</datestamp>
	<modclass>None</modclass>
	<modscore>1</modscore>
	<htmltext>someone put it there to begin with. are there stealth ninja line crews/ backhoe operators?  if so, their creds need to be revoked or pulled!! maybe its like the mob-- have them install it, then make them "disappear". color me flabbergasted that the gov. screwed up!!</htmltext>
<tokenext>someone put it there to begin with .
are there stealth ninja line crews/ backhoe operators ?
if so , their creds need to be revoked or pulled ! !
maybe its like the mob-- have them install it , then make them " disappear " .
color me flabbergasted that the gov .
screwed up !
!</tokentext>
<sentencetext>someone put it there to begin with.
are there stealth ninja line crews/ backhoe operators?
if so, their creds need to be revoked or pulled!!
maybe its like the mob-- have them install it, then make them "disappear".
color me flabbergasted that the gov.
screwed up!
!</sentencetext>
</comment>
<comment>
	<id>http://www.semanticweb.org/ontologies/ConversationInstances.owl#comment09_06_01_0040204.28165887</id>
	<title>Re:Our tax dollars at work.</title>
	<author>Anonymous</author>
	<datestamp>1243857180000</datestamp>
	<modclass>None</modclass>
	<modscore>0</modscore>
	<htmltext><p>Actually It's been done, I remember seeing some sort of sempra energy corperate gloss sheet on placing fiber *inside* the gas pipes, The Idea was to use the pipe as a sort of already in place conduit so streets would not have to be dug.</p></htmltext>
<tokenext>Actually It 's been done , I remember seeing some sort of sempra energy corperate gloss sheet on placing fiber * inside * the gas pipes , The Idea was to use the pipe as a sort of already in place conduit so streets would not have to be dug .</tokentext>
<sentencetext>Actually It's been done, I remember seeing some sort of sempra energy corperate gloss sheet on placing fiber *inside* the gas pipes, The Idea was to use the pipe as a sort of already in place conduit so streets would not have to be dug.</sentencetext>
	<parent>http://www.semanticweb.org/ontologies/ConversationInstances.owl#comment09_06_01_0040204.28163291</parent>
</comment>
<comment>
	<id>http://www.semanticweb.org/ontologies/ConversationInstances.owl#comment09_06_01_0040204.28163271</id>
	<title>Re:No surprise here...</title>
	<author>Gen. Malaise</author>
	<datestamp>1243782900000</datestamp>
	<modclass>None</modclass>
	<modscore>1</modscore>
	<htmltext>Im a private sector tech who does the same thing..... parts of Brooklyn and the Bronx require a similar response....</htmltext>
<tokenext>Im a private sector tech who does the same thing..... parts of Brooklyn and the Bronx require a similar response... .</tokentext>
<sentencetext>Im a private sector tech who does the same thing..... parts of Brooklyn and the Bronx require a similar response....</sentencetext>
	<parent>http://www.semanticweb.org/ontologies/ConversationInstances.owl#comment09_06_01_0040204.28163055</parent>
</comment>
<comment>
	<id>http://www.semanticweb.org/ontologies/ConversationInstances.owl#comment09_06_01_0040204.28164023</id>
	<title>Ah, the dreaded....</title>
	<author>idiotnot</author>
	<datestamp>1243789080000</datestamp>
	<modclass>Interestin</modclass>
	<modscore>2</modscore>
	<htmltext><p>...as my old boss, a radio engineer, termed it:  "backhoe fade."</p><p>Happened to one of our transmitter sites.  We switched to a microwave STL, which just had to be retired (only about 4 years later), because of a new skyscraper going in.<nobr> <wbr></nobr>:-/</p><p>So, back to the telco lines.....</p><p>As for the CLAN cut, I'm guessing this is probably a protocol violation somewhere.  In many installations I've seen, even in secured areas, this stuff is encased in concrete.</p></htmltext>
<tokenext>...as my old boss , a radio engineer , termed it : " backhoe fade .
" Happened to one of our transmitter sites .
We switched to a microwave STL , which just had to be retired ( only about 4 years later ) , because of a new skyscraper going in .
: -/So , back to the telco lines.....As for the CLAN cut , I 'm guessing this is probably a protocol violation somewhere .
In many installations I 've seen , even in secured areas , this stuff is encased in concrete .</tokentext>
<sentencetext>...as my old boss, a radio engineer, termed it:  "backhoe fade.
"Happened to one of our transmitter sites.
We switched to a microwave STL, which just had to be retired (only about 4 years later), because of a new skyscraper going in.
:-/So, back to the telco lines.....As for the CLAN cut, I'm guessing this is probably a protocol violation somewhere.
In many installations I've seen, even in secured areas, this stuff is encased in concrete.</sentencetext>
</comment>
<comment>
	<id>http://www.semanticweb.org/ontologies/ConversationInstances.owl#comment09_06_01_0040204.28164605</id>
	<title>Re:Our tax dollars at work.</title>
	<author>blitzkrieg3</author>
	<datestamp>1243794900000</datestamp>
	<modclass>Funny</modclass>
	<modscore>3</modscore>
	<htmltext><p><div class="quote"><p>that's like having a convoy that's well protected, then having that same convoy deliver without any security detail.</p></div><p>Repeat after me, "The internet is <em>not</em> a big truck, it is a <a href="http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=f99PcP0aFNE" title="youtube.com">series of tubes</a> [youtube.com]"
<br> <br>
I can't believe it's 5 hours and no one has yet made this joke...</p></div>
	</htmltext>
<tokenext>that 's like having a convoy that 's well protected , then having that same convoy deliver without any security detail.Repeat after me , " The internet is not a big truck , it is a series of tubes [ youtube.com ] " I ca n't believe it 's 5 hours and no one has yet made this joke.. .</tokentext>
<sentencetext>that's like having a convoy that's well protected, then having that same convoy deliver without any security detail.Repeat after me, "The internet is not a big truck, it is a series of tubes [youtube.com]"
 
I can't believe it's 5 hours and no one has yet made this joke...
	</sentencetext>
	<parent>http://www.semanticweb.org/ontologies/ConversationInstances.owl#comment09_06_01_0040204.28162903</parent>
</comment>
<comment>
	<id>http://www.semanticweb.org/ontologies/ConversationInstances.owl#comment09_06_01_0040204.28163763</id>
	<title>Re:Our tax dollars at work.</title>
	<author>sumdumass</author>
	<datestamp>1243786500000</datestamp>
	<modclass>Interestin</modclass>
	<modscore>4</modscore>
	<htmltext><blockquote><div><p> <i>The government does a half-assed job securing its own computers, but they'll lock down what's between the computers... that's like having a convoy that's well protected, then having that same convoy deliver without any security detail.</i></p></div> </blockquote><p> Not really, these computer systems are no where near the internet. They are secured by strict access restrictions (physical security) and the lack of interconnection to places without that.</p><p>In short, and to keep with your military convoy scenario, you can't really think of this convoy as a regular supply convoy behind the lines. Think of it as the one the president is in when touring the camps and the others are just running supplies to relatively safe camps. These systems serviced by the secrete fiber are something completely different then the main systems you keep hearing about with the breaches. Those systems use publicly accessible and most likely publicly documented lines.</p></div>
	</htmltext>
<tokenext>The government does a half-assed job securing its own computers , but they 'll lock down what 's between the computers... that 's like having a convoy that 's well protected , then having that same convoy deliver without any security detail .
Not really , these computer systems are no where near the internet .
They are secured by strict access restrictions ( physical security ) and the lack of interconnection to places without that.In short , and to keep with your military convoy scenario , you ca n't really think of this convoy as a regular supply convoy behind the lines .
Think of it as the one the president is in when touring the camps and the others are just running supplies to relatively safe camps .
These systems serviced by the secrete fiber are something completely different then the main systems you keep hearing about with the breaches .
Those systems use publicly accessible and most likely publicly documented lines .</tokentext>
<sentencetext> The government does a half-assed job securing its own computers, but they'll lock down what's between the computers... that's like having a convoy that's well protected, then having that same convoy deliver without any security detail.
Not really, these computer systems are no where near the internet.
They are secured by strict access restrictions (physical security) and the lack of interconnection to places without that.In short, and to keep with your military convoy scenario, you can't really think of this convoy as a regular supply convoy behind the lines.
Think of it as the one the president is in when touring the camps and the others are just running supplies to relatively safe camps.
These systems serviced by the secrete fiber are something completely different then the main systems you keep hearing about with the breaches.
Those systems use publicly accessible and most likely publicly documented lines.
	</sentencetext>
	<parent>http://www.semanticweb.org/ontologies/ConversationInstances.owl#comment09_06_01_0040204.28162903</parent>
</comment>
<comment>
	<id>http://www.semanticweb.org/ontologies/ConversationInstances.owl#comment09_06_01_0040204.28163015</id>
	<title>Re:Our tax dollars at work.</title>
	<author>Anonymous</author>
	<datestamp>1243780620000</datestamp>
	<modclass>Interestin</modclass>
	<modscore>5</modscore>
	<htmltext><p>Really! Just mark it as a 4" natural gas line. Any backhoe operator worth his salt knows that cooked backhoe guy isn't a pretty sight.</p></htmltext>
<tokenext>Really !
Just mark it as a 4 " natural gas line .
Any backhoe operator worth his salt knows that cooked backhoe guy is n't a pretty sight .</tokentext>
<sentencetext>Really!
Just mark it as a 4" natural gas line.
Any backhoe operator worth his salt knows that cooked backhoe guy isn't a pretty sight.</sentencetext>
	<parent>http://www.semanticweb.org/ontologies/ConversationInstances.owl#comment09_06_01_0040204.28162817</parent>
</comment>
<comment>
	<id>http://www.semanticweb.org/ontologies/ConversationInstances.owl#comment09_06_01_0040204.28168497</id>
	<title>And...</title>
	<author>BiggoronSword</author>
	<datestamp>1243872960000</datestamp>
	<modclass>None</modclass>
	<modscore>1</modscore>
	<htmltext>What does this have to do with Jack Bauer?</htmltext>
<tokenext>What does this have to do with Jack Bauer ?</tokentext>
<sentencetext>What does this have to do with Jack Bauer?</sentencetext>
</comment>
<comment>
	<id>http://www.semanticweb.org/ontologies/ConversationInstances.owl#comment09_06_01_0040204.28163319</id>
	<title>Marked Range to determine fault and payee</title>
	<author>sunfly</author>
	<datestamp>1243783260000</datestamp>
	<modclass>None</modclass>
	<modscore>1</modscore>
	<htmltext>In most states the contractor is only liable if the line is marked properly and within a reasonable distance from the mark.  The utility will bill the contractor for repairs if the cable/pipe/line is cut within 3 feet (in my state anyway) of the mark.  The biggest problem is utilities unable to mark their buried lines within 3' (they don't know exactly were it is either).</htmltext>
<tokenext>In most states the contractor is only liable if the line is marked properly and within a reasonable distance from the mark .
The utility will bill the contractor for repairs if the cable/pipe/line is cut within 3 feet ( in my state anyway ) of the mark .
The biggest problem is utilities unable to mark their buried lines within 3 ' ( they do n't know exactly were it is either ) .</tokentext>
<sentencetext>In most states the contractor is only liable if the line is marked properly and within a reasonable distance from the mark.
The utility will bill the contractor for repairs if the cable/pipe/line is cut within 3 feet (in my state anyway) of the mark.
The biggest problem is utilities unable to mark their buried lines within 3' (they don't know exactly were it is either).</sentencetext>
	<parent>http://www.semanticweb.org/ontologies/ConversationInstances.owl#comment09_06_01_0040204.28162819</parent>
</comment>
<comment>
	<id>http://www.semanticweb.org/ontologies/ConversationInstances.owl#comment09_06_01_0040204.28163735</id>
	<title>Re:Doesn't surprise me</title>
	<author>macshit</author>
	<datestamp>1243786320000</datestamp>
	<modclass>None</modclass>
	<modscore>1</modscore>
	<htmltext><p>Gee that actually sounds like a pretty cool location to work...
<br>(what city is this building in?)</p></htmltext>
<tokenext>Gee that actually sounds like a pretty cool location to work.. . ( what city is this building in ?
)</tokentext>
<sentencetext>Gee that actually sounds like a pretty cool location to work...
(what city is this building in?
)</sentencetext>
	<parent>http://www.semanticweb.org/ontologies/ConversationInstances.owl#comment09_06_01_0040204.28163017</parent>
</comment>
<comment>
	<id>http://www.semanticweb.org/ontologies/ConversationInstances.owl#comment09_06_01_0040204.28169449</id>
	<title>Re:Our tax dollars at work.</title>
	<author>AlHunt</author>
	<datestamp>1243876980000</datestamp>
	<modclass>None</modclass>
	<modscore>1</modscore>
	<htmltext><blockquote><div><p>Repeat after me, "The internet is not a big truck, it is a series of tubes"</p></div> </blockquote><p>Not only is Internet a big truck, in India it's delivered by <a href="http://news.bbc.co.uk/1/hi/technology/6506193.stm" title="bbc.co.uk">trucks, buses and motorcycles</a> [bbc.co.uk].</p></div>
	</htmltext>
<tokenext>Repeat after me , " The internet is not a big truck , it is a series of tubes " Not only is Internet a big truck , in India it 's delivered by trucks , buses and motorcycles [ bbc.co.uk ] .</tokentext>
<sentencetext>Repeat after me, "The internet is not a big truck, it is a series of tubes" Not only is Internet a big truck, in India it's delivered by trucks, buses and motorcycles [bbc.co.uk].
	</sentencetext>
	<parent>http://www.semanticweb.org/ontologies/ConversationInstances.owl#comment09_06_01_0040204.28164605</parent>
</comment>
<comment>
	<id>http://www.semanticweb.org/ontologies/ConversationInstances.owl#comment09_06_01_0040204.28163959</id>
	<title>Re:Under pressure...</title>
	<author>sumdumass</author>
	<datestamp>1243788540000</datestamp>
	<modclass>Interestin</modclass>
	<modscore>4</modscore>
	<htmltext><p>During the cold war, we regularly taped into Russia's fiber and copper lines. They did the same to us or so we expected then to have because we could do it to them. The Russians weren't exactly stupid.</p><p>We even have/had subs who's entire job was to find under sea cables coming off the coast of Russia and place <a href="http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Operation\_Ivy\_Bells" title="wikipedia.org">bell taps on them.</a> [wikipedia.org]</p><p>Fiber can be tapped in much the same way except you need to get around or near the actual fiber lines. This means a cut in the sheath surrounding the bundle. I can't find a reference but I do remember a positive pressurized device that would encapsulate a undersea cable allowing the sheathing to be removed and patched without the sea water penetrating. This same device could probably be used to defeat a pressurized line buried in the ground too. Just stick a regulator on the end of a stout hypodermic needle and penetrate the line, wait for the pressure to equalize and then work with relative impunity.</p></htmltext>
<tokenext>During the cold war , we regularly taped into Russia 's fiber and copper lines .
They did the same to us or so we expected then to have because we could do it to them .
The Russians were n't exactly stupid.We even have/had subs who 's entire job was to find under sea cables coming off the coast of Russia and place bell taps on them .
[ wikipedia.org ] Fiber can be tapped in much the same way except you need to get around or near the actual fiber lines .
This means a cut in the sheath surrounding the bundle .
I ca n't find a reference but I do remember a positive pressurized device that would encapsulate a undersea cable allowing the sheathing to be removed and patched without the sea water penetrating .
This same device could probably be used to defeat a pressurized line buried in the ground too .
Just stick a regulator on the end of a stout hypodermic needle and penetrate the line , wait for the pressure to equalize and then work with relative impunity .</tokentext>
<sentencetext>During the cold war, we regularly taped into Russia's fiber and copper lines.
They did the same to us or so we expected then to have because we could do it to them.
The Russians weren't exactly stupid.We even have/had subs who's entire job was to find under sea cables coming off the coast of Russia and place bell taps on them.
[wikipedia.org]Fiber can be tapped in much the same way except you need to get around or near the actual fiber lines.
This means a cut in the sheath surrounding the bundle.
I can't find a reference but I do remember a positive pressurized device that would encapsulate a undersea cable allowing the sheathing to be removed and patched without the sea water penetrating.
This same device could probably be used to defeat a pressurized line buried in the ground too.
Just stick a regulator on the end of a stout hypodermic needle and penetrate the line, wait for the pressure to equalize and then work with relative impunity.</sentencetext>
	<parent>http://www.semanticweb.org/ontologies/ConversationInstances.owl#comment09_06_01_0040204.28162827</parent>
</comment>
<comment>
	<id>http://www.semanticweb.org/ontologies/ConversationInstances.owl#comment09_06_01_0040204.28163187</id>
	<title>Re:Our tax dollars at work.</title>
	<author>Anonymous</author>
	<datestamp>1243782060000</datestamp>
	<modclass>Interestin</modclass>
	<modscore>5</modscore>
	<htmltext><p> The reality is more likely laziness and ego, of believing they are above the law. They just couldn't be bothered doing the appropriate paper work and now as a result are spending tens of thousands of dollars repairing no longer secret cables, which have now been identified as bring emphatically secret by the cables being hidden and subject to high risk of being accidentally dug up. Of course as a contractor you could sue the government for any delays caused by the government delaying access while they repair the undeclared cable.</p></htmltext>
<tokenext>The reality is more likely laziness and ego , of believing they are above the law .
They just could n't be bothered doing the appropriate paper work and now as a result are spending tens of thousands of dollars repairing no longer secret cables , which have now been identified as bring emphatically secret by the cables being hidden and subject to high risk of being accidentally dug up .
Of course as a contractor you could sue the government for any delays caused by the government delaying access while they repair the undeclared cable .</tokentext>
<sentencetext> The reality is more likely laziness and ego, of believing they are above the law.
They just couldn't be bothered doing the appropriate paper work and now as a result are spending tens of thousands of dollars repairing no longer secret cables, which have now been identified as bring emphatically secret by the cables being hidden and subject to high risk of being accidentally dug up.
Of course as a contractor you could sue the government for any delays caused by the government delaying access while they repair the undeclared cable.</sentencetext>
	<parent>http://www.semanticweb.org/ontologies/ConversationInstances.owl#comment09_06_01_0040204.28162817</parent>
</comment>
<comment>
	<id>http://www.semanticweb.org/ontologies/ConversationInstances.owl#comment09_06_01_0040204.28162903</id>
	<title>Re:Our tax dollars at work.</title>
	<author>Celeste R</author>
	<datestamp>1243779720000</datestamp>
	<modclass>Interestin</modclass>
	<modscore>5</modscore>
	<htmltext><p>Oh, and I have to wonder a little:  there's very little infrastructure terrorism, instead there's much more information terrorism at work.  (i.e. the Pentagon hack that lost us the plans to the next air superiority fighter).</p><p>The government does a half-assed job securing its own computers, but they'll lock down what's between the computers...  that's like having a convoy that's well protected, then having that same convoy deliver without any security detail.</p></htmltext>
<tokenext>Oh , and I have to wonder a little : there 's very little infrastructure terrorism , instead there 's much more information terrorism at work .
( i.e. the Pentagon hack that lost us the plans to the next air superiority fighter ) .The government does a half-assed job securing its own computers , but they 'll lock down what 's between the computers... that 's like having a convoy that 's well protected , then having that same convoy deliver without any security detail .</tokentext>
<sentencetext>Oh, and I have to wonder a little:  there's very little infrastructure terrorism, instead there's much more information terrorism at work.
(i.e. the Pentagon hack that lost us the plans to the next air superiority fighter).The government does a half-assed job securing its own computers, but they'll lock down what's between the computers...  that's like having a convoy that's well protected, then having that same convoy deliver without any security detail.</sentencetext>
	<parent>http://www.semanticweb.org/ontologies/ConversationInstances.owl#comment09_06_01_0040204.28162817</parent>
</comment>
<comment>
	<id>http://www.semanticweb.org/ontologies/ConversationInstances.owl#comment09_06_01_0040204.28163221</id>
	<title>Interesting story,</title>
	<author>Anonymous</author>
	<datestamp>1243782420000</datestamp>
	<modclass>None</modclass>
	<modscore>0</modscore>
	<htmltext> but I think it would have been fun to see the MIB faces if instead of a construction crew there was a ships anchor sticking out of the hole.</htmltext>
<tokenext>but I think it would have been fun to see the MIB faces if instead of a construction crew there was a ships anchor sticking out of the hole .</tokentext>
<sentencetext> but I think it would have been fun to see the MIB faces if instead of a construction crew there was a ships anchor sticking out of the hole.</sentencetext>
</comment>
<comment>
	<id>http://www.semanticweb.org/ontologies/ConversationInstances.owl#comment09_06_01_0040204.28166823</id>
	<title>Hide it in plain sight?</title>
	<author>bradley13</author>
	<datestamp>1243865460000</datestamp>
	<modclass>None</modclass>
	<modscore>1</modscore>
	<htmltext>Wouldn't it make more sense to just put the darn things on the map? I mean, anyone trying to spy on the agencies is as likely to look for stuff being buried that never appears on maps. Better to just pretend it's "yet another fiber", and encrypt the contents. It would also save these needless interruptions of service...</htmltext>
<tokenext>Would n't it make more sense to just put the darn things on the map ?
I mean , anyone trying to spy on the agencies is as likely to look for stuff being buried that never appears on maps .
Better to just pretend it 's " yet another fiber " , and encrypt the contents .
It would also save these needless interruptions of service.. .</tokentext>
<sentencetext>Wouldn't it make more sense to just put the darn things on the map?
I mean, anyone trying to spy on the agencies is as likely to look for stuff being buried that never appears on maps.
Better to just pretend it's "yet another fiber", and encrypt the contents.
It would also save these needless interruptions of service...</sentencetext>
</comment>
<comment>
	<id>http://www.semanticweb.org/ontologies/ConversationInstances.owl#comment09_06_01_0040204.28163747</id>
	<title>Re:Ok...</title>
	<author>hibernia</author>
	<datestamp>1243786380000</datestamp>
	<modclass>None</modclass>
	<modscore>1</modscore>
	<htmltext><p>It's state law in Nebraska to call before you dig
(<a href="http://www.ne-diggers.com/" title="ne-diggers.com" rel="nofollow">http://www.ne-diggers.com/</a> [ne-diggers.com]). Most other states should have something similar.
</p><p>What the hotline does it send out notice to various utility companies and they look to see if it impacts them and do a locate if needed.
</p><p>The rule of thumb, as I understand it, if they do the locate and you hit something not marked in the area you are digging, that particular utility that is at fault.
</p></htmltext>
<tokenext>It 's state law in Nebraska to call before you dig ( http : //www.ne-diggers.com/ [ ne-diggers.com ] ) .
Most other states should have something similar .
What the hotline does it send out notice to various utility companies and they look to see if it impacts them and do a locate if needed .
The rule of thumb , as I understand it , if they do the locate and you hit something not marked in the area you are digging , that particular utility that is at fault .</tokentext>
<sentencetext>It's state law in Nebraska to call before you dig
(http://www.ne-diggers.com/ [ne-diggers.com]).
Most other states should have something similar.
What the hotline does it send out notice to various utility companies and they look to see if it impacts them and do a locate if needed.
The rule of thumb, as I understand it, if they do the locate and you hit something not marked in the area you are digging, that particular utility that is at fault.
</sentencetext>
	<parent>http://www.semanticweb.org/ontologies/ConversationInstances.owl#comment09_06_01_0040204.28162819</parent>
</comment>
<comment>
	<id>http://www.semanticweb.org/ontologies/ConversationInstances.owl#comment09_06_01_0040204.28163729</id>
	<title>Re:Ok...</title>
	<author>v1</author>
	<datestamp>1243786200000</datestamp>
	<modclass>None</modclass>
	<modscore>1</modscore>
	<htmltext><p>somehow this whole idea of "secret fiber" reminds me of "secret laws", things you can do that will get you arrested that aren't on the open books.</p><p>I think in this case they just come out and quickly fix it themselves and tell you not to talk about it, they don't hold you liable or monetarily responsible.</p></htmltext>
<tokenext>somehow this whole idea of " secret fiber " reminds me of " secret laws " , things you can do that will get you arrested that are n't on the open books.I think in this case they just come out and quickly fix it themselves and tell you not to talk about it , they do n't hold you liable or monetarily responsible .</tokentext>
<sentencetext>somehow this whole idea of "secret fiber" reminds me of "secret laws", things you can do that will get you arrested that aren't on the open books.I think in this case they just come out and quickly fix it themselves and tell you not to talk about it, they don't hold you liable or monetarily responsible.</sentencetext>
	<parent>http://www.semanticweb.org/ontologies/ConversationInstances.owl#comment09_06_01_0040204.28162819</parent>
</comment>
<comment>
	<id>http://www.semanticweb.org/ontologies/ConversationInstances.owl#comment09_06_01_0040204.28164627</id>
	<title>!news</title>
	<author>Anonymous</author>
	<datestamp>1243795140000</datestamp>
	<modclass>None</modclass>
	<modscore>0</modscore>
	<htmltext>Someone please tag this !news, the event the article references happened years ago. Stupid newspapers digging up old crap and passing it as new on a slow news day...</htmltext>
<tokenext>Someone please tag this ! news , the event the article references happened years ago .
Stupid newspapers digging up old crap and passing it as new on a slow news day.. .</tokentext>
<sentencetext>Someone please tag this !news, the event the article references happened years ago.
Stupid newspapers digging up old crap and passing it as new on a slow news day...</sentencetext>
</comment>
<comment>
	<id>http://www.semanticweb.org/ontologies/ConversationInstances.owl#comment09_06_01_0040204.28164143</id>
	<title>Re:Ok...</title>
	<author>sponga</author>
	<datestamp>1243790340000</datestamp>
	<modclass>Interestin</modclass>
	<modscore>4</modscore>
	<htmltext><p>You call the USA, literally.</p><p>USA= Underground Service Alert<br>The number is 811 and you have to call 2 days prior to when you begin your work to cover your ass in court in case you hit any power/gas lines.</p><p>I am thinking that they didn't trench this line but use a pressurized piston to push the line/pipe through the ground soil, that is the cheap way to do it these days and it is like sideways drilling. They don't always go perfectly straight at the same elevation, most likely they tried to push this line under a building and came too close to the foundation working area where they are most likely to dig.<br>4 feet down is gas lines, about 6 feet you start hitting electrical/sewer to put it into perspective.</p><p>They send out gas line crews and electric company officals to paint mark where all the lines are located so you do not him them.</p><p>Now I work with a Civil Engineer and our main business is road construction, we have hit everything you can think of from Native American graves to fiber lines that run to ammo depot bunkers for security. You would think something this top secret fiber lines would be buried deeper or it would be encased in red cement around the top or sand to give warning you are about to hit it. They usually pour red colored cement(electrical) or sand on top(gas lines), so that when you are digging and start to hit the red stuff it will give you a warning.</p><p>My favorite was the mile long tunnel at Fort McCarthur in San Pedros, CA that ran under the hill there. Some of the oldest IBM machines I have ever seen were there collecting dust and huge generators.</p></htmltext>
<tokenext>You call the USA , literally.USA = Underground Service AlertThe number is 811 and you have to call 2 days prior to when you begin your work to cover your ass in court in case you hit any power/gas lines.I am thinking that they did n't trench this line but use a pressurized piston to push the line/pipe through the ground soil , that is the cheap way to do it these days and it is like sideways drilling .
They do n't always go perfectly straight at the same elevation , most likely they tried to push this line under a building and came too close to the foundation working area where they are most likely to dig.4 feet down is gas lines , about 6 feet you start hitting electrical/sewer to put it into perspective.They send out gas line crews and electric company officals to paint mark where all the lines are located so you do not him them.Now I work with a Civil Engineer and our main business is road construction , we have hit everything you can think of from Native American graves to fiber lines that run to ammo depot bunkers for security .
You would think something this top secret fiber lines would be buried deeper or it would be encased in red cement around the top or sand to give warning you are about to hit it .
They usually pour red colored cement ( electrical ) or sand on top ( gas lines ) , so that when you are digging and start to hit the red stuff it will give you a warning.My favorite was the mile long tunnel at Fort McCarthur in San Pedros , CA that ran under the hill there .
Some of the oldest IBM machines I have ever seen were there collecting dust and huge generators .</tokentext>
<sentencetext>You call the USA, literally.USA= Underground Service AlertThe number is 811 and you have to call 2 days prior to when you begin your work to cover your ass in court in case you hit any power/gas lines.I am thinking that they didn't trench this line but use a pressurized piston to push the line/pipe through the ground soil, that is the cheap way to do it these days and it is like sideways drilling.
They don't always go perfectly straight at the same elevation, most likely they tried to push this line under a building and came too close to the foundation working area where they are most likely to dig.4 feet down is gas lines, about 6 feet you start hitting electrical/sewer to put it into perspective.They send out gas line crews and electric company officals to paint mark where all the lines are located so you do not him them.Now I work with a Civil Engineer and our main business is road construction, we have hit everything you can think of from Native American graves to fiber lines that run to ammo depot bunkers for security.
You would think something this top secret fiber lines would be buried deeper or it would be encased in red cement around the top or sand to give warning you are about to hit it.
They usually pour red colored cement(electrical) or sand on top(gas lines), so that when you are digging and start to hit the red stuff it will give you a warning.My favorite was the mile long tunnel at Fort McCarthur in San Pedros, CA that ran under the hill there.
Some of the oldest IBM machines I have ever seen were there collecting dust and huge generators.</sentencetext>
	<parent>http://www.semanticweb.org/ontologies/ConversationInstances.owl#comment09_06_01_0040204.28162819</parent>
</comment>
<comment>
	<id>http://www.semanticweb.org/ontologies/ConversationInstances.owl#comment09_06_01_0040204.28162819</id>
	<title>Ok...</title>
	<author>Anonymous</author>
	<datestamp>1243779300000</datestamp>
	<modclass>Insightful</modclass>
	<modscore>4</modscore>
	<htmltext>So who you supposed to notify when you dig?  If the fiber is secret, nobody's going to tell you where it's at, and nobody's going to 'fess up about the ownership of said fiber.<p>
And who do you make the check out to when you <b>do</b> cut it?  Or would a 'Hey, how the hell can <b>we</b> know when we cut a top secret fiber?  How we supposed to know it's there if it's top secret and we don't have clearance???' defense work in court when the other guy's lawyers come at you for damages?</p></htmltext>
<tokenext>So who you supposed to notify when you dig ?
If the fiber is secret , nobody 's going to tell you where it 's at , and nobody 's going to 'fess up about the ownership of said fiber .
And who do you make the check out to when you do cut it ?
Or would a 'Hey , how the hell can we know when we cut a top secret fiber ?
How we supposed to know it 's there if it 's top secret and we do n't have clearance ? ? ?
' defense work in court when the other guy 's lawyers come at you for damages ?</tokentext>
<sentencetext>So who you supposed to notify when you dig?
If the fiber is secret, nobody's going to tell you where it's at, and nobody's going to 'fess up about the ownership of said fiber.
And who do you make the check out to when you do cut it?
Or would a 'Hey, how the hell can we know when we cut a top secret fiber?
How we supposed to know it's there if it's top secret and we don't have clearance???
' defense work in court when the other guy's lawyers come at you for damages?</sentencetext>
</comment>
<comment>
	<id>http://www.semanticweb.org/ontologies/ConversationInstances.owl#comment09_06_01_0040204.28163785</id>
	<title>Re:Happens in business also</title>
	<author>Anonymous</author>
	<datestamp>1243786680000</datestamp>
	<modclass>None</modclass>
	<modscore>0</modscore>
	<htmltext><p>Clearly you had found the map of Dick Cheney's undisclosed location.</p></htmltext>
<tokenext>Clearly you had found the map of Dick Cheney 's undisclosed location .</tokentext>
<sentencetext>Clearly you had found the map of Dick Cheney's undisclosed location.</sentencetext>
	<parent>http://www.semanticweb.org/ontologies/ConversationInstances.owl#comment09_06_01_0040204.28163117</parent>
</comment>
<comment>
	<id>http://www.semanticweb.org/ontologies/ConversationInstances.owl#comment09_06_01_0040204.28164853</id>
	<title>Types of fiber</title>
	<author>Iffie</author>
	<datestamp>1243797900000</datestamp>
	<modclass>None</modclass>
	<modscore>0</modscore>
	<htmltext>So you have
- common fiber (no prefix, in normal conduits)
- dirty fiber (fiber dug into the ground without much protection)
- black fiber (fiber burried in unexpected places that nobody is supposed to know of)</htmltext>
<tokenext>So you have - common fiber ( no prefix , in normal conduits ) - dirty fiber ( fiber dug into the ground without much protection ) - black fiber ( fiber burried in unexpected places that nobody is supposed to know of )</tokentext>
<sentencetext>So you have
- common fiber (no prefix, in normal conduits)
- dirty fiber (fiber dug into the ground without much protection)
- black fiber (fiber burried in unexpected places that nobody is supposed to know of)</sentencetext>
</comment>
<comment>
	<id>http://www.semanticweb.org/ontologies/ConversationInstances.owl#comment09_06_01_0040204.28166101</id>
	<title>Re:Completely fallacious and sensationalized nonse</title>
	<author>mindstormpt</author>
	<datestamp>1243859820000</datestamp>
	<modclass>None</modclass>
	<modscore>1</modscore>
	<htmltext><p>I don't know about the US, but in Portugal there was at least one. About 10 years ago, when digging the foundations for the Lisbon El Corte Ingles <a href="http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/File:El\_Corte\_Ingl\%C3\%A9s\_Lisboa\_1.jpg" title="wikipedia.org">store</a> [wikipedia.org], an unmarked NATO underground cable was cut, and work had to be suspended.</p><p>Of course there were no SUVs, no gag orders, no misteries - it was publicly discussed actually. Now, I don't recall the complete details, so it's entirely possible that it was a legacy from the cold war, and that all cables nowadays are mapped.</p></htmltext>
<tokenext>I do n't know about the US , but in Portugal there was at least one .
About 10 years ago , when digging the foundations for the Lisbon El Corte Ingles store [ wikipedia.org ] , an unmarked NATO underground cable was cut , and work had to be suspended.Of course there were no SUVs , no gag orders , no misteries - it was publicly discussed actually .
Now , I do n't recall the complete details , so it 's entirely possible that it was a legacy from the cold war , and that all cables nowadays are mapped .</tokentext>
<sentencetext>I don't know about the US, but in Portugal there was at least one.
About 10 years ago, when digging the foundations for the Lisbon El Corte Ingles store [wikipedia.org], an unmarked NATO underground cable was cut, and work had to be suspended.Of course there were no SUVs, no gag orders, no misteries - it was publicly discussed actually.
Now, I don't recall the complete details, so it's entirely possible that it was a legacy from the cold war, and that all cables nowadays are mapped.</sentencetext>
	<parent>http://www.semanticweb.org/ontologies/ConversationInstances.owl#comment09_06_01_0040204.28163875</parent>
</comment>
<comment>
	<id>http://www.semanticweb.org/ontologies/ConversationInstances.owl#comment09_06_01_0040204.28162985</id>
	<title>Re:Two Ends of the Cable</title>
	<author>DigiShaman</author>
	<datestamp>1243780440000</datestamp>
	<modclass>Insightful</modclass>
	<modscore>4</modscore>
	<htmltext><p>Up the tax payers ass, naturally.</p></htmltext>
<tokenext>Up the tax payers ass , naturally .</tokentext>
<sentencetext>Up the tax payers ass, naturally.</sentencetext>
	<parent>http://www.semanticweb.org/ontologies/ConversationInstances.owl#comment09_06_01_0040204.28162825</parent>
</comment>
<comment>
	<id>http://www.semanticweb.org/ontologies/ConversationInstances.owl#comment09_06_01_0040204.28174431</id>
	<title>Re:Ok...</title>
	<author>Anonymous</author>
	<datestamp>1243853640000</datestamp>
	<modclass>None</modclass>
	<modscore>0</modscore>
	<htmltext><p>Wow, you guys have a whole lot better of direct burial fiber than the companies in Canada tent to use,</p><p>Terraspan Networks tends to run 6 strand "vertical channel" in what MAY be a 12-18" trench, for what they call: "quick-fiber". cuts like a 14/2.</p><p>to be fair, they can trench ~2-3KM (about 1.25-1.8miles) of the stuff a day.</p></htmltext>
<tokenext>Wow , you guys have a whole lot better of direct burial fiber than the companies in Canada tent to use,Terraspan Networks tends to run 6 strand " vertical channel " in what MAY be a 12-18 " trench , for what they call : " quick-fiber " .
cuts like a 14/2.to be fair , they can trench ~ 2-3KM ( about 1.25-1.8miles ) of the stuff a day .</tokentext>
<sentencetext>Wow, you guys have a whole lot better of direct burial fiber than the companies in Canada tent to use,Terraspan Networks tends to run 6 strand "vertical channel" in what MAY be a 12-18" trench, for what they call: "quick-fiber".
cuts like a 14/2.to be fair, they can trench ~2-3KM (about 1.25-1.8miles) of the stuff a day.</sentencetext>
	<parent>http://www.semanticweb.org/ontologies/ConversationInstances.owl#comment09_06_01_0040204.28163769</parent>
</comment>
<comment>
	<id>http://www.semanticweb.org/ontologies/ConversationInstances.owl#comment09_06_01_0040204.28163381</id>
	<title>Re:My Dad</title>
	<author>Anonymous</author>
	<datestamp>1243783680000</datestamp>
	<modclass>None</modclass>
	<modscore>1</modscore>
	<htmltext>I actually have planted rhubarb many times in my life and may I ask why in THE HELL your old man used a bulldozer to plant rhubarb?  You guys 'bored' on the farm and need to find a reason to bring out the big toys to play?</htmltext>
<tokenext>I actually have planted rhubarb many times in my life and may I ask why in THE HELL your old man used a bulldozer to plant rhubarb ?
You guys 'bored ' on the farm and need to find a reason to bring out the big toys to play ?</tokentext>
<sentencetext>I actually have planted rhubarb many times in my life and may I ask why in THE HELL your old man used a bulldozer to plant rhubarb?
You guys 'bored' on the farm and need to find a reason to bring out the big toys to play?</sentencetext>
	<parent>http://www.semanticweb.org/ontologies/ConversationInstances.owl#comment09_06_01_0040204.28162839</parent>
</comment>
<comment>
	<id>http://www.semanticweb.org/ontologies/ConversationInstances.owl#comment09_06_01_0040204.28167879</id>
	<title>Re:My Dad</title>
	<author>kriston</author>
	<datestamp>1243870320000</datestamp>
	<modclass>None</modclass>
	<modscore>1</modscore>
	<htmltext><p>The party responsible for the damage does have some protection if they had already called your area's "one call" utility locator system.  In our area it's called "Miss Utility."  The name is so clever I had to mention it.  Some areas it's even a 3-digit phone number like "811."  If the lines weren't marked by the utility locator and you damage them you can get some relief from liability but ONLY if you called the locator and allowed enough time for the lines to be marked.</p></htmltext>
<tokenext>The party responsible for the damage does have some protection if they had already called your area 's " one call " utility locator system .
In our area it 's called " Miss Utility .
" The name is so clever I had to mention it .
Some areas it 's even a 3-digit phone number like " 811 .
" If the lines were n't marked by the utility locator and you damage them you can get some relief from liability but ONLY if you called the locator and allowed enough time for the lines to be marked .</tokentext>
<sentencetext>The party responsible for the damage does have some protection if they had already called your area's "one call" utility locator system.
In our area it's called "Miss Utility.
"  The name is so clever I had to mention it.
Some areas it's even a 3-digit phone number like "811.
"  If the lines weren't marked by the utility locator and you damage them you can get some relief from liability but ONLY if you called the locator and allowed enough time for the lines to be marked.</sentencetext>
	<parent>http://www.semanticweb.org/ontologies/ConversationInstances.owl#comment09_06_01_0040204.28164015</parent>
</comment>
<comment>
	<id>http://www.semanticweb.org/ontologies/ConversationInstances.owl#comment09_06_01_0040204.28163103</id>
	<title>Re:Ok...</title>
	<author>Todd Fisher</author>
	<datestamp>1243781340000</datestamp>
	<modclass>Funny</modclass>
	<modscore>5</modscore>
	<htmltext><i>So who you supposed to notify when you dig?</i>  You're not.  That's the secret part of it.<br> <br>
<i>If the fiber is secret, nobody's going to tell you where it's at, and nobody's going to 'fess up about the ownership of said fiber.</i> Correct, that's why the serious men who pull up to the site and get busy fixing it don't tell you who they are.<br> <br>
<i>And who do you make the check out to when you do cut it?</i> The serious men will not ask for payment<br> <br>
<i>Or would a 'Hey, how the hell can we know when we cut a top secret fiber?</i> Rule #1 of accidentally cutting "black" fiber: Do not talk smack to the serious men.<br> <br>
<i>How we supposed to know it's there if it's top secret and we don't have clearance???</i> See Rule #1.<br> <br>
<i>defense work in court when the other guy's lawyers come at you for damages?</i>There will be nothing to go to court about.</htmltext>
<tokenext>So who you supposed to notify when you dig ?
You 're not .
That 's the secret part of it .
If the fiber is secret , nobody 's going to tell you where it 's at , and nobody 's going to 'fess up about the ownership of said fiber .
Correct , that 's why the serious men who pull up to the site and get busy fixing it do n't tell you who they are .
And who do you make the check out to when you do cut it ?
The serious men will not ask for payment Or would a 'Hey , how the hell can we know when we cut a top secret fiber ?
Rule # 1 of accidentally cutting " black " fiber : Do not talk smack to the serious men .
How we supposed to know it 's there if it 's top secret and we do n't have clearance ? ? ?
See Rule # 1 . defense work in court when the other guy 's lawyers come at you for damages ? There will be nothing to go to court about .</tokentext>
<sentencetext>So who you supposed to notify when you dig?
You're not.
That's the secret part of it.
If the fiber is secret, nobody's going to tell you where it's at, and nobody's going to 'fess up about the ownership of said fiber.
Correct, that's why the serious men who pull up to the site and get busy fixing it don't tell you who they are.
And who do you make the check out to when you do cut it?
The serious men will not ask for payment 
Or would a 'Hey, how the hell can we know when we cut a top secret fiber?
Rule #1 of accidentally cutting "black" fiber: Do not talk smack to the serious men.
How we supposed to know it's there if it's top secret and we don't have clearance???
See Rule #1. 
defense work in court when the other guy's lawyers come at you for damages?There will be nothing to go to court about.</sentencetext>
	<parent>http://www.semanticweb.org/ontologies/ConversationInstances.owl#comment09_06_01_0040204.28162819</parent>
</comment>
<comment>
	<id>http://www.semanticweb.org/ontologies/ConversationInstances.owl#comment09_06_01_0040204.28163869</id>
	<title>Re:Our tax dollars at work.</title>
	<author>Anonymous</author>
	<datestamp>1243787520000</datestamp>
	<modclass>Informativ</modclass>
	<modscore>2</modscore>
	<htmltext><p>Most likely you/the contractor couldn't sue the government for anything in this case. This is Washington DC and congress has the final say in everything that goes on in Washington. If Congress ok'd the lines in the first place, then congress would have to grant the ability to suit over them in order to allow you to sue. This is part of the sovereign immunity that all US governments enjoy.</p><p>More then likely, the lines were placed in back during the cold war and possibly upgraded since then. Intercepting communications during the cold war by taping fiber lines or even copper lines was a real and seen threat. We did it to them and they did it to us. Ego and Laziness really has nothing to do with it. Especially when congress has ultimate control over DC. Many people forget that Washing DC is a territory/district, not a state and the constitution specifically give congress control of it.</p><p>As for being secrete, they still can be secrete. There are probably alternate paths that the fiber channels cover and the only real difference is that now someone would have either keep a signal live on these lines to detect any interruption or drive the path several times a day to check for any digging or anything around them. IF nothing is detected, they would still be good for backup routes if ever needed, if something is ever detected, then replacing them through another location and just making the existing lines public would work just as well.</p></htmltext>
<tokenext>Most likely you/the contractor could n't sue the government for anything in this case .
This is Washington DC and congress has the final say in everything that goes on in Washington .
If Congress ok 'd the lines in the first place , then congress would have to grant the ability to suit over them in order to allow you to sue .
This is part of the sovereign immunity that all US governments enjoy.More then likely , the lines were placed in back during the cold war and possibly upgraded since then .
Intercepting communications during the cold war by taping fiber lines or even copper lines was a real and seen threat .
We did it to them and they did it to us .
Ego and Laziness really has nothing to do with it .
Especially when congress has ultimate control over DC .
Many people forget that Washing DC is a territory/district , not a state and the constitution specifically give congress control of it.As for being secrete , they still can be secrete .
There are probably alternate paths that the fiber channels cover and the only real difference is that now someone would have either keep a signal live on these lines to detect any interruption or drive the path several times a day to check for any digging or anything around them .
IF nothing is detected , they would still be good for backup routes if ever needed , if something is ever detected , then replacing them through another location and just making the existing lines public would work just as well .</tokentext>
<sentencetext>Most likely you/the contractor couldn't sue the government for anything in this case.
This is Washington DC and congress has the final say in everything that goes on in Washington.
If Congress ok'd the lines in the first place, then congress would have to grant the ability to suit over them in order to allow you to sue.
This is part of the sovereign immunity that all US governments enjoy.More then likely, the lines were placed in back during the cold war and possibly upgraded since then.
Intercepting communications during the cold war by taping fiber lines or even copper lines was a real and seen threat.
We did it to them and they did it to us.
Ego and Laziness really has nothing to do with it.
Especially when congress has ultimate control over DC.
Many people forget that Washing DC is a territory/district, not a state and the constitution specifically give congress control of it.As for being secrete, they still can be secrete.
There are probably alternate paths that the fiber channels cover and the only real difference is that now someone would have either keep a signal live on these lines to detect any interruption or drive the path several times a day to check for any digging or anything around them.
IF nothing is detected, they would still be good for backup routes if ever needed, if something is ever detected, then replacing them through another location and just making the existing lines public would work just as well.</sentencetext>
	<parent>http://www.semanticweb.org/ontologies/ConversationInstances.owl#comment09_06_01_0040204.28163187</parent>
</comment>
<comment>
	<id>http://www.semanticweb.org/ontologies/ConversationInstances.owl#comment09_06_01_0040204.28178821</id>
	<title>Damn cephalopods</title>
	<author>sydbarrett74</author>
	<datestamp>1243976340000</datestamp>
	<modclass>None</modclass>
	<modscore>1</modscore>
	<htmltext>I bet it was a bunch of pesky cephalopods that did it again!</htmltext>
<tokenext>I bet it was a bunch of pesky cephalopods that did it again !</tokentext>
<sentencetext>I bet it was a bunch of pesky cephalopods that did it again!</sentencetext>
</comment>
<comment>
	<id>http://www.semanticweb.org/ontologies/ConversationInstances.owl#comment09_06_01_0040204.28164909</id>
	<title>Re:Doesn't surprise me</title>
	<author>Tokerat</author>
	<datestamp>1243798740000</datestamp>
	<modclass>None</modclass>
	<modscore>1</modscore>
	<htmltext><p><div class="quote"><p>There's space... missing... on the 3rd floor?</p></div><p>The entrance to John Malkovitch's head is up there.</p></div>
	</htmltext>
<tokenext>There 's space... missing... on the 3rd floor ? The entrance to John Malkovitch 's head is up there .</tokentext>
<sentencetext>There's space... missing... on the 3rd floor?The entrance to John Malkovitch's head is up there.
	</sentencetext>
	<parent>http://www.semanticweb.org/ontologies/ConversationInstances.owl#comment09_06_01_0040204.28163659</parent>
</comment>
<comment>
	<id>http://www.semanticweb.org/ontologies/ConversationInstances.owl#comment09_06_01_0040204.28163769</id>
	<title>Re:Ok...</title>
	<author>v1</author>
	<datestamp>1243786560000</datestamp>
	<modclass>Interestin</modclass>
	<modscore>4</modscore>
	<htmltext><p>For the important stuff they also do a lot more to protect it.</p><p>For example, fiber backbones around here are quite the setup.  They bury the cable itself at least 4 ft down.  It's an armored cable that is designed to be completely undamaged by being run over by a caterpillar on asphalt and nearly impossible to break by stretching. (kevlar cord backbone, PVC spar with six fiber tubes, corrugated steel armor, antivarmint/self-sealing resin, and 1/8" very tough PVC jacket).  One foot above that they bury a wide red streamer that's very elastic and hard to cut.  If your backhoe gets to that first it's really hard to miss because you'll stretch it out of the ground like a rubber band.  And all the dirt they use to fill in the trench is stained red.  I don't know how effective the red stain ends up being, but it may be something that a backhoe operator would be much more likely to notice during his work than you or I.</p></htmltext>
<tokenext>For the important stuff they also do a lot more to protect it.For example , fiber backbones around here are quite the setup .
They bury the cable itself at least 4 ft down .
It 's an armored cable that is designed to be completely undamaged by being run over by a caterpillar on asphalt and nearly impossible to break by stretching .
( kevlar cord backbone , PVC spar with six fiber tubes , corrugated steel armor , antivarmint/self-sealing resin , and 1/8 " very tough PVC jacket ) .
One foot above that they bury a wide red streamer that 's very elastic and hard to cut .
If your backhoe gets to that first it 's really hard to miss because you 'll stretch it out of the ground like a rubber band .
And all the dirt they use to fill in the trench is stained red .
I do n't know how effective the red stain ends up being , but it may be something that a backhoe operator would be much more likely to notice during his work than you or I .</tokentext>
<sentencetext>For the important stuff they also do a lot more to protect it.For example, fiber backbones around here are quite the setup.
They bury the cable itself at least 4 ft down.
It's an armored cable that is designed to be completely undamaged by being run over by a caterpillar on asphalt and nearly impossible to break by stretching.
(kevlar cord backbone, PVC spar with six fiber tubes, corrugated steel armor, antivarmint/self-sealing resin, and 1/8" very tough PVC jacket).
One foot above that they bury a wide red streamer that's very elastic and hard to cut.
If your backhoe gets to that first it's really hard to miss because you'll stretch it out of the ground like a rubber band.
And all the dirt they use to fill in the trench is stained red.
I don't know how effective the red stain ends up being, but it may be something that a backhoe operator would be much more likely to notice during his work than you or I.</sentencetext>
	<parent>http://www.semanticweb.org/ontologies/ConversationInstances.owl#comment09_06_01_0040204.28162893</parent>
</comment>
<comment>
	<id>http://www.semanticweb.org/ontologies/ConversationInstances.owl#comment09_06_01_0040204.28163379</id>
	<title>Security Through Obscurity is not security</title>
	<author>Anonymous</author>
	<datestamp>1243783680000</datestamp>
	<modclass>Interestin</modclass>
	<modscore>2</modscore>
	<htmltext>It's a shame that the agencies entrusted with our country's security don't have the training in real security.  Security through obscurity is not security; it's a sham.  If these "black cables" were properly identified as "fiber optic conduits" they would be as much of a nontarget as any other.
<p>
On another note, fiber optic bundles have a copper core so they can be found by magnetic detectors (and the "blue stake people") to avoid being hit by a backhoe strike.   It's more unlikely that the contractor failed to check for the cable than the Federal Government has special backhoe-attracting cable.
</p><p>
E</p></htmltext>
<tokenext>It 's a shame that the agencies entrusted with our country 's security do n't have the training in real security .
Security through obscurity is not security ; it 's a sham .
If these " black cables " were properly identified as " fiber optic conduits " they would be as much of a nontarget as any other .
On another note , fiber optic bundles have a copper core so they can be found by magnetic detectors ( and the " blue stake people " ) to avoid being hit by a backhoe strike .
It 's more unlikely that the contractor failed to check for the cable than the Federal Government has special backhoe-attracting cable .
E</tokentext>
<sentencetext>It's a shame that the agencies entrusted with our country's security don't have the training in real security.
Security through obscurity is not security; it's a sham.
If these "black cables" were properly identified as "fiber optic conduits" they would be as much of a nontarget as any other.
On another note, fiber optic bundles have a copper core so they can be found by magnetic detectors (and the "blue stake people") to avoid being hit by a backhoe strike.
It's more unlikely that the contractor failed to check for the cable than the Federal Government has special backhoe-attracting cable.
E</sentencetext>
</comment>
<comment>
	<id>http://www.semanticweb.org/ontologies/ConversationInstances.owl#comment09_06_01_0040204.28164063</id>
	<title>Operation Ivy Bells</title>
	<author>Anonymous</author>
	<datestamp>1243789440000</datestamp>
	<modclass>None</modclass>
	<modscore>0</modscore>
	<htmltext><p>The Russians left out the "Top Secret" part, but they clearly marked their secret communications cables with "Do Not Anchor". This had an unfortunate side effect.</p></htmltext>
<tokenext>The Russians left out the " Top Secret " part , but they clearly marked their secret communications cables with " Do Not Anchor " .
This had an unfortunate side effect .</tokentext>
<sentencetext>The Russians left out the "Top Secret" part, but they clearly marked their secret communications cables with "Do Not Anchor".
This had an unfortunate side effect.</sentencetext>
	<parent>http://www.semanticweb.org/ontologies/ConversationInstances.owl#comment09_06_01_0040204.28162911</parent>
</comment>
<comment>
	<id>http://www.semanticweb.org/ontologies/ConversationInstances.owl#comment09_06_01_0040204.28162915</id>
	<title>Re:My Dad</title>
	<author>Dachannien</author>
	<datestamp>1243779780000</datestamp>
	<modclass>None</modclass>
	<modscore>1</modscore>
	<htmltext><p>That better be some damn tasty rhubarb.</p></htmltext>
<tokenext>That better be some damn tasty rhubarb .</tokentext>
<sentencetext>That better be some damn tasty rhubarb.</sentencetext>
	<parent>http://www.semanticweb.org/ontologies/ConversationInstances.owl#comment09_06_01_0040204.28162839</parent>
</comment>
<comment>
	<id>http://www.semanticweb.org/ontologies/ConversationInstances.owl#comment09_06_01_0040204.28186317</id>
	<title>Re:Ok...</title>
	<author>badkarmadayaccount</author>
	<datestamp>1243974060000</datestamp>
	<modclass>None</modclass>
	<modscore>1</modscore>
	<htmltext><p>Candlejack, Candlejack, Candle... ^&amp;\%(^*(^)NO CARRIER&amp;^&amp;*^(*^\%*(#$}{}}{this may be valid perl}</p></htmltext>
<tokenext>Candlejack , Candlejack , Candle... ^ &amp; \ % ( ^ * ( ^ ) NO CARRIER&amp; ^ &amp; * ^ ( * ^ \ % * ( # $ } { } } { this may be valid perl }</tokentext>
<sentencetext>Candlejack, Candlejack, Candle... ^&amp;\%(^*(^)NO CARRIER&amp;^&amp;*^(*^\%*(#$}{}}{this may be valid perl}</sentencetext>
	<parent>http://www.semanticweb.org/ontologies/ConversationInstances.owl#comment09_06_01_0040204.28163035</parent>
</comment>
<comment>
	<id>http://www.semanticweb.org/ontologies/ConversationInstances.owl#comment09_06_01_0040204.28162973</id>
	<title>Re:Our tax dollars at work.</title>
	<author>Anonymous</author>
	<datestamp>1243780320000</datestamp>
	<modclass>Interestin</modclass>
	<modscore>1</modscore>
	<htmltext><p>     The solution I would use, since they know there's a big dig in that area.. these agencies should have:<br>
&nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; 1) gotten someone with the clearance to map out these classified lines.<br>
&nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; 2) Give some foremen etc. working on the dig just a block-by-block set of overlays to show their secret fiber.  That way it won't reveal where it's going to or coming from, no actual information leak, but they know line exists in order to move it.</p><p>
&nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; Although... if they can withstand these unplanned outages OK, I suppose running out the SUVs post-cut works *shrug*.</p></htmltext>
<tokenext>The solution I would use , since they know there 's a big dig in that area.. these agencies should have :           1 ) gotten someone with the clearance to map out these classified lines .
          2 ) Give some foremen etc .
working on the dig just a block-by-block set of overlays to show their secret fiber .
That way it wo n't reveal where it 's going to or coming from , no actual information leak , but they know line exists in order to move it .
          Although... if they can withstand these unplanned outages OK , I suppose running out the SUVs post-cut works * shrug * .</tokentext>
<sentencetext>     The solution I would use, since they know there's a big dig in that area.. these agencies should have:
          1) gotten someone with the clearance to map out these classified lines.
          2) Give some foremen etc.
working on the dig just a block-by-block set of overlays to show their secret fiber.
That way it won't reveal where it's going to or coming from, no actual information leak, but they know line exists in order to move it.
          Although... if they can withstand these unplanned outages OK, I suppose running out the SUVs post-cut works *shrug*.</sentencetext>
	<parent>http://www.semanticweb.org/ontologies/ConversationInstances.owl#comment09_06_01_0040204.28162817</parent>
</comment>
<comment>
	<id>http://www.semanticweb.org/ontologies/ConversationInstances.owl#comment09_06_01_0040204.28163621</id>
	<title>So does "Black" Fiber ...</title>
	<author>arthurpaliden</author>
	<datestamp>1243785420000</datestamp>
	<modclass>Funny</modclass>
	<modscore>2</modscore>
	<htmltext>Use black light ??</htmltext>
<tokenext>Use black light ?
?</tokentext>
<sentencetext>Use black light ?
?</sentencetext>
</comment>
<comment>
	<id>http://www.semanticweb.org/ontologies/ConversationInstances.owl#comment09_06_01_0040204.28168387</id>
	<title>DC increased construction?</title>
	<author>Anonymous</author>
	<datestamp>1243872480000</datestamp>
	<modclass>None</modclass>
	<modscore>0</modscore>
	<htmltext><p>I'm glad the government can afford to build things because I sure can't.  For that matter, backhoes should randomly dig holes around DC.  Think of all the jobs this would create fixing broken utilities. Shovel ready! Stimulus!</p></htmltext>
<tokenext>I 'm glad the government can afford to build things because I sure ca n't .
For that matter , backhoes should randomly dig holes around DC .
Think of all the jobs this would create fixing broken utilities .
Shovel ready !
Stimulus !</tokentext>
<sentencetext>I'm glad the government can afford to build things because I sure can't.
For that matter, backhoes should randomly dig holes around DC.
Think of all the jobs this would create fixing broken utilities.
Shovel ready!
Stimulus!</sentencetext>
</comment>
<comment>
	<id>http://www.semanticweb.org/ontologies/ConversationInstances.owl#comment09_06_01_0040204.28164735</id>
	<title>Re:Are we sure they're secret cables?</title>
	<author>SlashRSlashN</author>
	<datestamp>1243796520000</datestamp>
	<modclass>None</modclass>
	<modscore>1</modscore>
	<htmltext><p>Or better yet, do all that, then throw a few unmarked "red flag" cables down and act like it's a matter of immediate national security the instant they get cut.</p><p>The public thinks you have secret cables, and they're still clueless.</p></htmltext>
<tokenext>Or better yet , do all that , then throw a few unmarked " red flag " cables down and act like it 's a matter of immediate national security the instant they get cut.The public thinks you have secret cables , and they 're still clueless .</tokentext>
<sentencetext>Or better yet, do all that, then throw a few unmarked "red flag" cables down and act like it's a matter of immediate national security the instant they get cut.The public thinks you have secret cables, and they're still clueless.</sentencetext>
	<parent>http://www.semanticweb.org/ontologies/ConversationInstances.owl#comment09_06_01_0040204.28163557</parent>
</comment>
<comment>
	<id>http://www.semanticweb.org/ontologies/ConversationInstances.owl#comment09_06_01_0040204.28163593</id>
	<title>The solution is obvious...</title>
	<author>crimbil</author>
	<datestamp>1243785240000</datestamp>
	<modclass>Funny</modclass>
	<modscore>4</modscore>
	<htmltext>Using the TSA model (shoes, liquids, etc.) the only possible solution is to prohibit backhoe use.

Remember, when backhoes are outlawed, only terrorists will have backhoes. Why, right now there could be huge numbers of terrorists in heavy equipment training classes, just planning and waiting for the opportunity to dig up phone, internet, power, water, and gas lines throughout the USA. And without any of the things supplied by those lines, just think of what would happen to the children. You may now commence with the hysteria. Alert the press.</htmltext>
<tokenext>Using the TSA model ( shoes , liquids , etc .
) the only possible solution is to prohibit backhoe use .
Remember , when backhoes are outlawed , only terrorists will have backhoes .
Why , right now there could be huge numbers of terrorists in heavy equipment training classes , just planning and waiting for the opportunity to dig up phone , internet , power , water , and gas lines throughout the USA .
And without any of the things supplied by those lines , just think of what would happen to the children .
You may now commence with the hysteria .
Alert the press .</tokentext>
<sentencetext>Using the TSA model (shoes, liquids, etc.
) the only possible solution is to prohibit backhoe use.
Remember, when backhoes are outlawed, only terrorists will have backhoes.
Why, right now there could be huge numbers of terrorists in heavy equipment training classes, just planning and waiting for the opportunity to dig up phone, internet, power, water, and gas lines throughout the USA.
And without any of the things supplied by those lines, just think of what would happen to the children.
You may now commence with the hysteria.
Alert the press.</sentencetext>
</comment>
<comment>
	<id>http://www.semanticweb.org/ontologies/ConversationInstances.owl#comment09_06_01_0040204.28163255</id>
	<title>Re:My Dad</title>
	<author>BiggerIsBetter</author>
	<datestamp>1243782600000</datestamp>
	<modclass>None</modclass>
	<modscore>1</modscore>
	<htmltext><p><div class="quote"><p>My dad cut through a cell phone line about a month ago with his bulldozer (he lives on a farm) when we was clearing some soil for his rhubarb.</p></div><p>One assumes he was doing this on his own land, and that he didn't know the line was there... so that suggests it was put down without his knowledge or consent?</p></div>
	</htmltext>
<tokenext>My dad cut through a cell phone line about a month ago with his bulldozer ( he lives on a farm ) when we was clearing some soil for his rhubarb.One assumes he was doing this on his own land , and that he did n't know the line was there... so that suggests it was put down without his knowledge or consent ?</tokentext>
<sentencetext>My dad cut through a cell phone line about a month ago with his bulldozer (he lives on a farm) when we was clearing some soil for his rhubarb.One assumes he was doing this on his own land, and that he didn't know the line was there... so that suggests it was put down without his knowledge or consent?
	</sentencetext>
	<parent>http://www.semanticweb.org/ontologies/ConversationInstances.owl#comment09_06_01_0040204.28162839</parent>
</comment>
<comment>
	<id>http://www.semanticweb.org/ontologies/ConversationInstances.owl#comment09_06_01_0040204.28163471</id>
	<title>Talk to the hand</title>
	<author>Anonymous</author>
	<datestamp>1243784400000</datestamp>
	<modclass>None</modclass>
	<modscore>0</modscore>
	<htmltext><p>I worked with a construction company a couple of years back and we had these guys turn up one day when we cut a cable.    They started with their intimidation and he told them if you want me to sort this out give me some details and I'll give you a quote otherwise get out of my space.    They wouldn't give any details so he said fine and turned his back on them and walked away.    They stood there for a while and then jumped back into their cars and left.</p><p>In the end we didn't fix the cable and weren't aware that anyone else did either.     We just kept on going and back filled the hole a day or two later.</p><p>Still don't know who they were, what the cable did and whether it was fixed but on that day it seems like if you ignore them they go away.</p></div>
	</htmltext>
<tokenext>I worked with a construction company a couple of years back and we had these guys turn up one day when we cut a cable .
They started with their intimidation and he told them if you want me to sort this out give me some details and I 'll give you a quote otherwise get out of my space .
They would n't give any details so he said fine and turned his back on them and walked away .
They stood there for a while and then jumped back into their cars and left.In the end we did n't fix the cable and were n't aware that anyone else did either .
We just kept on going and back filled the hole a day or two later.Still do n't know who they were , what the cable did and whether it was fixed but on that day it seems like if you ignore them they go away .</tokentext>
<sentencetext>I worked with a construction company a couple of years back and we had these guys turn up one day when we cut a cable.
They started with their intimidation and he told them if you want me to sort this out give me some details and I'll give you a quote otherwise get out of my space.
They wouldn't give any details so he said fine and turned his back on them and walked away.
They stood there for a while and then jumped back into their cars and left.In the end we didn't fix the cable and weren't aware that anyone else did either.
We just kept on going and back filled the hole a day or two later.Still don't know who they were, what the cable did and whether it was fixed but on that day it seems like if you ignore them they go away.
	</sentencetext>
</comment>
<comment>
	<id>http://www.semanticweb.org/ontologies/ConversationInstances.owl#comment09_06_01_0040204.28165555</id>
	<title>Re:Ok...</title>
	<author>Anonymous</author>
	<datestamp>1243852380000</datestamp>
	<modclass>None</modclass>
	<modscore>0</modscore>
	<htmltext><p>You may laugh, but over here there are actually lines marked "State property -- Priority". Not on maps, but printed on the cable itself.</p></htmltext>
<tokenext>You may laugh , but over here there are actually lines marked " State property -- Priority " .
Not on maps , but printed on the cable itself .</tokentext>
<sentencetext>You may laugh, but over here there are actually lines marked "State property -- Priority".
Not on maps, but printed on the cable itself.</sentencetext>
	<parent>http://www.semanticweb.org/ontologies/ConversationInstances.owl#comment09_06_01_0040204.28162911</parent>
</comment>
<comment>
	<id>http://www.semanticweb.org/ontologies/ConversationInstances.owl#comment09_06_01_0040204.28165591</id>
	<title>Always carry a length of fiber</title>
	<author>Slashcrap</author>
	<datestamp>1243852860000</datestamp>
	<modclass>Funny</modclass>
	<modscore>4</modscore>
	<htmltext><p>That way if you're ever lost in a desert, you can just lay it in the ground and wait.</p><p>When the backhoe operator cuts it, ask him to rescue you.</p></htmltext>
<tokenext>That way if you 're ever lost in a desert , you can just lay it in the ground and wait.When the backhoe operator cuts it , ask him to rescue you .</tokentext>
<sentencetext>That way if you're ever lost in a desert, you can just lay it in the ground and wait.When the backhoe operator cuts it, ask him to rescue you.</sentencetext>
</comment>
<comment>
	<id>http://www.semanticweb.org/ontologies/ConversationInstances.owl#comment09_06_01_0040204.28165531</id>
	<title>A hint</title>
	<author>SmallFurryCreature</author>
	<datestamp>1243852140000</datestamp>
	<modclass>None</modclass>
	<modscore>1</modscore>
	<htmltext>Don't sue the guys who can answer the question "you and what army" with "that is classified information, citizen #674572".</htmltext>
<tokenext>Do n't sue the guys who can answer the question " you and what army " with " that is classified information , citizen # 674572 " .</tokentext>
<sentencetext>Don't sue the guys who can answer the question "you and what army" with "that is classified information, citizen #674572".</sentencetext>
	<parent>http://www.semanticweb.org/ontologies/ConversationInstances.owl#comment09_06_01_0040204.28163187</parent>
</comment>
<comment>
	<id>http://www.semanticweb.org/ontologies/ConversationInstances.owl#comment09_06_01_0040204.28164729</id>
	<title>Re:Our tax dollars at work.</title>
	<author>sxpert</author>
	<datestamp>1243796460000</datestamp>
	<modclass>Informativ</modclass>
	<modscore>2</modscore>
	<htmltext><p>In effect, you are somewhat right. those pipes are hermetically sealed and under pressure, and have the fiber cable inside.<br>when a break occurs, they can detect it by the loss of pressure</p></htmltext>
<tokenext>In effect , you are somewhat right .
those pipes are hermetically sealed and under pressure , and have the fiber cable inside.when a break occurs , they can detect it by the loss of pressure</tokentext>
<sentencetext>In effect, you are somewhat right.
those pipes are hermetically sealed and under pressure, and have the fiber cable inside.when a break occurs, they can detect it by the loss of pressure</sentencetext>
	<parent>http://www.semanticweb.org/ontologies/ConversationInstances.owl#comment09_06_01_0040204.28163015</parent>
</comment>
<comment>
	<id>http://www.semanticweb.org/ontologies/ConversationInstances.owl#comment09_06_01_0040204.28162817</id>
	<title>Our tax dollars at work.</title>
	<author>Anonymous</author>
	<datestamp>1243779300000</datestamp>
	<modclass>Insightful</modclass>
	<modscore>5</modscore>
	<htmltext><p>There are reasons why it's important that public records are kept.</p><p>If they wanted to keep people from knowing where or what exactly it was, they could simply have marked it as something it wasn't..  and beyond that, they could encrypt what goes on that fiber.</p><p>They aren't without options; and ultimately they're currently fighting the system, and putting our tax dollars to work in ways that could be prevented.</p><p>It's understandable that they want to keep secrets secret, but isn't covering it up going to draw more attention than fudging the paperwork?</p></htmltext>
<tokenext>There are reasons why it 's important that public records are kept.If they wanted to keep people from knowing where or what exactly it was , they could simply have marked it as something it was n't.. and beyond that , they could encrypt what goes on that fiber.They are n't without options ; and ultimately they 're currently fighting the system , and putting our tax dollars to work in ways that could be prevented.It 's understandable that they want to keep secrets secret , but is n't covering it up going to draw more attention than fudging the paperwork ?</tokentext>
<sentencetext>There are reasons why it's important that public records are kept.If they wanted to keep people from knowing where or what exactly it was, they could simply have marked it as something it wasn't..  and beyond that, they could encrypt what goes on that fiber.They aren't without options; and ultimately they're currently fighting the system, and putting our tax dollars to work in ways that could be prevented.It's understandable that they want to keep secrets secret, but isn't covering it up going to draw more attention than fudging the paperwork?</sentencetext>
</comment>
<comment>
	<id>http://www.semanticweb.org/ontologies/ConversationInstances.owl#comment09_06_01_0040204.28163035</id>
	<title>Re:Ok...</title>
	<author>Bob9113</author>
	<datestamp>1243780800000</datestamp>
	<modclass>None</modclass>
	<modscore>1</modscore>
	<htmltext><p><i>So who you supposed to notify when you dig?</i></p><p>Notification is easy: You go into the bathroom, turn on the water, and quietly whisper where you are planning to dig. They'll hear.<nobr> <wbr></nobr>:)</p></htmltext>
<tokenext>So who you supposed to notify when you dig ? Notification is easy : You go into the bathroom , turn on the water , and quietly whisper where you are planning to dig .
They 'll hear .
: )</tokentext>
<sentencetext>So who you supposed to notify when you dig?Notification is easy: You go into the bathroom, turn on the water, and quietly whisper where you are planning to dig.
They'll hear.
:)</sentencetext>
	<parent>http://www.semanticweb.org/ontologies/ConversationInstances.owl#comment09_06_01_0040204.28162819</parent>
</comment>
<comment>
	<id>http://www.semanticweb.org/ontologies/ConversationInstances.owl#comment09_06_01_0040204.28167825</id>
	<title>Re:Our tax dollars at work.</title>
	<author>Pollardito</author>
	<datestamp>1243870140000</datestamp>
	<modclass>None</modclass>
	<modscore>1</modscore>
	<htmltext>But in the low event that someone does break through your line, showing up in three black SUVs seconds later is about the worst thing you can do to minimize the exposure...hence the Washington Post article seeing readers worldwide.  Can't they mark the lines somehow so that the line-cutter calls some [possibly fake] utility, and then the call is forwarded to the right people to come in and move the line themselves?  The article takes pains to detail that these guys are cutting lines accidentally all the time (government or no), but it was the black SUVs that were memorable.</htmltext>
<tokenext>But in the low event that someone does break through your line , showing up in three black SUVs seconds later is about the worst thing you can do to minimize the exposure...hence the Washington Post article seeing readers worldwide .
Ca n't they mark the lines somehow so that the line-cutter calls some [ possibly fake ] utility , and then the call is forwarded to the right people to come in and move the line themselves ?
The article takes pains to detail that these guys are cutting lines accidentally all the time ( government or no ) , but it was the black SUVs that were memorable .</tokentext>
<sentencetext>But in the low event that someone does break through your line, showing up in three black SUVs seconds later is about the worst thing you can do to minimize the exposure...hence the Washington Post article seeing readers worldwide.
Can't they mark the lines somehow so that the line-cutter calls some [possibly fake] utility, and then the call is forwarded to the right people to come in and move the line themselves?
The article takes pains to detail that these guys are cutting lines accidentally all the time (government or no), but it was the black SUVs that were memorable.</sentencetext>
	<parent>http://www.semanticweb.org/ontologies/ConversationInstances.owl#comment09_06_01_0040204.28163643</parent>
</comment>
<comment>
	<id>http://www.semanticweb.org/ontologies/ConversationInstances.owl#comment09_06_01_0040204.28163877</id>
	<title>Re:Ok...</title>
	<author>digitalunity</author>
	<datestamp>1243787640000</datestamp>
	<modclass>None</modclass>
	<modscore>1</modscore>
	<htmltext><p>Well, seeing as the NSA is supposedly using DPI on all internet traffic they can get their hands on through AT&amp;T pipes, seems to me the following email would work, addressed to the DOD's assigned AT&amp;T Sales rep:</p><p>From: digitalunity@myhost.com<br>To: sdonahoe@att.com<br>Subject: digging<br>Hi Sean,<br>I plan to dig at 123 Anderson St., DC(see attached street drawings) and if you wouldn't mind, please pass it on to your customers that we may be cutting lines that don't appear on the official utility map.</p><p>thxbye.<br>.</p><p>This has a double effect. The AT&amp;T sales rep might actually pass it on to the people that need to know, and if not, the NSA will pass it on for them!</p></htmltext>
<tokenext>Well , seeing as the NSA is supposedly using DPI on all internet traffic they can get their hands on through AT&amp;T pipes , seems to me the following email would work , addressed to the DOD 's assigned AT&amp;T Sales rep : From : digitalunity @ myhost.comTo : sdonahoe @ att.comSubject : diggingHi Sean,I plan to dig at 123 Anderson St. , DC ( see attached street drawings ) and if you would n't mind , please pass it on to your customers that we may be cutting lines that do n't appear on the official utility map.thxbye..This has a double effect .
The AT&amp;T sales rep might actually pass it on to the people that need to know , and if not , the NSA will pass it on for them !</tokentext>
<sentencetext>Well, seeing as the NSA is supposedly using DPI on all internet traffic they can get their hands on through AT&amp;T pipes, seems to me the following email would work, addressed to the DOD's assigned AT&amp;T Sales rep:From: digitalunity@myhost.comTo: sdonahoe@att.comSubject: diggingHi Sean,I plan to dig at 123 Anderson St., DC(see attached street drawings) and if you wouldn't mind, please pass it on to your customers that we may be cutting lines that don't appear on the official utility map.thxbye..This has a double effect.
The AT&amp;T sales rep might actually pass it on to the people that need to know, and if not, the NSA will pass it on for them!</sentencetext>
	<parent>http://www.semanticweb.org/ontologies/ConversationInstances.owl#comment09_06_01_0040204.28163035</parent>
</comment>
<comment>
	<id>http://www.semanticweb.org/ontologies/ConversationInstances.owl#comment09_06_01_0040204.28165363</id>
	<title>rentacops in jumpsuits</title>
	<author>Anonymous</author>
	<datestamp>1243849260000</datestamp>
	<modclass>None</modclass>
	<modscore>0</modscore>
	<htmltext><p>While it is cute that they can afford to keep a few carfuls of rentacops on standby a block away in case the fibre is cut,</p><p>What where they gonna do really?  Tell them to splice the cable again pronto?<br>Did the rentacops bring their own splicing equipment to fix the cable   or ddi they only show up for show?</p><p>I dont belive for one second that the guys showing up were not minimum wage rentacops. If they werent, you really need to look into how your taxmone is wasted.</p></htmltext>
<tokenext>While it is cute that they can afford to keep a few carfuls of rentacops on standby a block away in case the fibre is cut,What where they gon na do really ?
Tell them to splice the cable again pronto ? Did the rentacops bring their own splicing equipment to fix the cable or ddi they only show up for show ? I dont belive for one second that the guys showing up were not minimum wage rentacops .
If they werent , you really need to look into how your taxmone is wasted .</tokentext>
<sentencetext>While it is cute that they can afford to keep a few carfuls of rentacops on standby a block away in case the fibre is cut,What where they gonna do really?
Tell them to splice the cable again pronto?Did the rentacops bring their own splicing equipment to fix the cable   or ddi they only show up for show?I dont belive for one second that the guys showing up were not minimum wage rentacops.
If they werent, you really need to look into how your taxmone is wasted.</sentencetext>
</comment>
<comment>
	<id>http://www.semanticweb.org/ontologies/ConversationInstances.owl#comment09_06_01_0040204.28163119</id>
	<title>Dark black fiber?</title>
	<author>Anonymous</author>
	<datestamp>1243781580000</datestamp>
	<modclass>None</modclass>
	<modscore>1</modscore>
	<htmltext><p>It makes me wonder if there's dark black fiber. Or is it black dark fiber... Either way, it's fiber that you don't know is there, and doesn't transmit any data.

</p><p>So if you cut it, does it make a noise?</p></htmltext>
<tokenext>It makes me wonder if there 's dark black fiber .
Or is it black dark fiber... Either way , it 's fiber that you do n't know is there , and does n't transmit any data .
So if you cut it , does it make a noise ?</tokentext>
<sentencetext>It makes me wonder if there's dark black fiber.
Or is it black dark fiber... Either way, it's fiber that you don't know is there, and doesn't transmit any data.
So if you cut it, does it make a noise?</sentencetext>
</comment>
<comment>
	<id>http://www.semanticweb.org/ontologies/ConversationInstances.owl#comment09_06_01_0040204.28166389</id>
	<title>Efficient Government</title>
	<author>CokeBear</author>
	<datestamp>1243862640000</datestamp>
	<modclass>Insightful</modclass>
	<modscore>2</modscore>
	<htmltext><p>Provides a handy counter-example to anyone who wants to point to government as inherently inefficient. Clearly it can be efficient when it wants to be.</p></htmltext>
<tokenext>Provides a handy counter-example to anyone who wants to point to government as inherently inefficient .
Clearly it can be efficient when it wants to be .</tokentext>
<sentencetext>Provides a handy counter-example to anyone who wants to point to government as inherently inefficient.
Clearly it can be efficient when it wants to be.</sentencetext>
</comment>
<comment>
	<id>http://www.semanticweb.org/ontologies/ConversationInstances.owl#comment09_06_01_0040204.28163643</id>
	<title>Re:Our tax dollars at work.</title>
	<author>Anonymous</author>
	<datestamp>1243785540000</datestamp>
	<modclass>Interestin</modclass>
	<modscore>4</modscore>
	<htmltext><p>Part of the problem is they are <i>moving</i> lines.  In this case half of the job was digging for construction and the other half was digging up and moving known utilities out of the way of the construction.  So if you show them where your "gas lines" are at, they are likely to try to <i>move</i> some of them to get them out of their way.  And then they are statistically a lot more likely to be discovered for what they are than if they just don't tell you and hope you don't try to move a line on top of one of theirs or dig a tunnel through it.</p></htmltext>
<tokenext>Part of the problem is they are moving lines .
In this case half of the job was digging for construction and the other half was digging up and moving known utilities out of the way of the construction .
So if you show them where your " gas lines " are at , they are likely to try to move some of them to get them out of their way .
And then they are statistically a lot more likely to be discovered for what they are than if they just do n't tell you and hope you do n't try to move a line on top of one of theirs or dig a tunnel through it .</tokentext>
<sentencetext>Part of the problem is they are moving lines.
In this case half of the job was digging for construction and the other half was digging up and moving known utilities out of the way of the construction.
So if you show them where your "gas lines" are at, they are likely to try to move some of them to get them out of their way.
And then they are statistically a lot more likely to be discovered for what they are than if they just don't tell you and hope you don't try to move a line on top of one of theirs or dig a tunnel through it.</sentencetext>
	<parent>http://www.semanticweb.org/ontologies/ConversationInstances.owl#comment09_06_01_0040204.28163015</parent>
</comment>
<comment>
	<id>http://www.semanticweb.org/ontologies/ConversationInstances.owl#comment09_06_01_0040204.28163857</id>
	<title>Re:Security Through Obscurity is not security</title>
	<author>Darth\_brooks</author>
	<datestamp>1243787400000</datestamp>
	<modclass>Insightful</modclass>
	<modscore>2</modscore>
	<htmltext><p>Your comment is a contradiction. On one hand, you say by not acknowledging the cable's existence, the cable is insecure. The better solution, is to acknowledge the cable (that apparently no one knows about) because then no one will know about it because its existence as a 'secret' cable will be.....wait for it.....obscured by the fact that there are other cables! Ta da! You've invented a new form of 'security' by 'obscuring' the cables existence. Bully for you.</p><p>"Security through obscurity" is a catchphrase that somehow implies that obscurity is on its face an invalid tool. It's not. It never will be. Ever. If it wasn't, infantrymen would be running around in fashionable day-glo orange jumpsuits with pretty pastel helmets. "Security through obscurity" is *only* a bad thing when it's the only means used to secure something When used in conjunction with other methods and tools, it's a great benefit.</p><p>Example: Set up a public facing SSH server on port 22. Watch what happens to your log files after about 24 hours. They'll start filling up with break-in attempts. Now move the server up to a non-registered port. 99.9\% of those break-in attempts disappear. Why? The bots don't see an active server, so they move on. Can the service still be found? yes. Can the bots start hammering away on the new port? yes. But, by obscuring the port that SSH listens on, have I made the machine dramatically more secure? Maybe not dramatically, but it's slightly more secure. I still need to enforce password policy. I should still install a tool like Denyhosts. But I've taken a huge step to cut down the chances that some bot will get lucky and crack a login/password in a drive-by attack.</p><p>I'm going to go out on a limb and say that the links getting cut have some level of redundancy. Somewhere in the planning stages, this kind of event has to have come up, and I'll put money on there being a contingency in effect.</p></htmltext>
<tokenext>Your comment is a contradiction .
On one hand , you say by not acknowledging the cable 's existence , the cable is insecure .
The better solution , is to acknowledge the cable ( that apparently no one knows about ) because then no one will know about it because its existence as a 'secret ' cable will be.....wait for it.....obscured by the fact that there are other cables !
Ta da !
You 've invented a new form of 'security ' by 'obscuring ' the cables existence .
Bully for you .
" Security through obscurity " is a catchphrase that somehow implies that obscurity is on its face an invalid tool .
It 's not .
It never will be .
Ever. If it was n't , infantrymen would be running around in fashionable day-glo orange jumpsuits with pretty pastel helmets .
" Security through obscurity " is * only * a bad thing when it 's the only means used to secure something When used in conjunction with other methods and tools , it 's a great benefit.Example : Set up a public facing SSH server on port 22 .
Watch what happens to your log files after about 24 hours .
They 'll start filling up with break-in attempts .
Now move the server up to a non-registered port .
99.9 \ % of those break-in attempts disappear .
Why ? The bots do n't see an active server , so they move on .
Can the service still be found ?
yes. Can the bots start hammering away on the new port ?
yes. But , by obscuring the port that SSH listens on , have I made the machine dramatically more secure ?
Maybe not dramatically , but it 's slightly more secure .
I still need to enforce password policy .
I should still install a tool like Denyhosts .
But I 've taken a huge step to cut down the chances that some bot will get lucky and crack a login/password in a drive-by attack.I 'm going to go out on a limb and say that the links getting cut have some level of redundancy .
Somewhere in the planning stages , this kind of event has to have come up , and I 'll put money on there being a contingency in effect .</tokentext>
<sentencetext>Your comment is a contradiction.
On one hand, you say by not acknowledging the cable's existence, the cable is insecure.
The better solution, is to acknowledge the cable (that apparently no one knows about) because then no one will know about it because its existence as a 'secret' cable will be.....wait for it.....obscured by the fact that there are other cables!
Ta da!
You've invented a new form of 'security' by 'obscuring' the cables existence.
Bully for you.
"Security through obscurity" is a catchphrase that somehow implies that obscurity is on its face an invalid tool.
It's not.
It never will be.
Ever. If it wasn't, infantrymen would be running around in fashionable day-glo orange jumpsuits with pretty pastel helmets.
"Security through obscurity" is *only* a bad thing when it's the only means used to secure something When used in conjunction with other methods and tools, it's a great benefit.Example: Set up a public facing SSH server on port 22.
Watch what happens to your log files after about 24 hours.
They'll start filling up with break-in attempts.
Now move the server up to a non-registered port.
99.9\% of those break-in attempts disappear.
Why? The bots don't see an active server, so they move on.
Can the service still be found?
yes. Can the bots start hammering away on the new port?
yes. But, by obscuring the port that SSH listens on, have I made the machine dramatically more secure?
Maybe not dramatically, but it's slightly more secure.
I still need to enforce password policy.
I should still install a tool like Denyhosts.
But I've taken a huge step to cut down the chances that some bot will get lucky and crack a login/password in a drive-by attack.I'm going to go out on a limb and say that the links getting cut have some level of redundancy.
Somewhere in the planning stages, this kind of event has to have come up, and I'll put money on there being a contingency in effect.</sentencetext>
	<parent>http://www.semanticweb.org/ontologies/ConversationInstances.owl#comment09_06_01_0040204.28163379</parent>
</comment>
<comment>
	<id>http://www.semanticweb.org/ontologies/ConversationInstances.owl#comment09_06_01_0040204.28164015</id>
	<title>Re:My Dad</title>
	<author>sumdumass</author>
	<datestamp>1243789080000</datestamp>
	<modclass>Interestin</modclass>
	<modscore>4</modscore>
	<htmltext><p>A buddy of mine cut a copper phone cable a few years back running some drain tile to the drainage ditch along the road. They didn't get the helocopters of FBI but a couple of verizon trucks kept running up and down the road. Finally one of them pulls in the drive and asked is anyone was doing any construction around there. They said no but then remembered putting the drain tile in and offered that.</p><p>They ended up using the backhoe to dig up access to the line, the guy used a signal wand to find it. The guy and someone else worked for about 6 hours patching 500 some copper lines back together. His total bill was around $6,000 but he ended up getting it cut in half because they were about a foot outside of the right of way. Unfortunately, they placed the drain tile into the right of way so it would have been cut either way so they split the difference. I guess the bill would have been a little more if Verizon would have had to send it's own backhoe out.</p><p>They told a story of a fiber line being cut on the other side of the road (fiber on one side and the older copper on the other) that cost the guy 1 million per day that it was down. I guess whoever cuts the line pays for the lost service too. Hope that give you an idea of how much the bill will be.</p></htmltext>
<tokenext>A buddy of mine cut a copper phone cable a few years back running some drain tile to the drainage ditch along the road .
They did n't get the helocopters of FBI but a couple of verizon trucks kept running up and down the road .
Finally one of them pulls in the drive and asked is anyone was doing any construction around there .
They said no but then remembered putting the drain tile in and offered that.They ended up using the backhoe to dig up access to the line , the guy used a signal wand to find it .
The guy and someone else worked for about 6 hours patching 500 some copper lines back together .
His total bill was around $ 6,000 but he ended up getting it cut in half because they were about a foot outside of the right of way .
Unfortunately , they placed the drain tile into the right of way so it would have been cut either way so they split the difference .
I guess the bill would have been a little more if Verizon would have had to send it 's own backhoe out.They told a story of a fiber line being cut on the other side of the road ( fiber on one side and the older copper on the other ) that cost the guy 1 million per day that it was down .
I guess whoever cuts the line pays for the lost service too .
Hope that give you an idea of how much the bill will be .</tokentext>
<sentencetext>A buddy of mine cut a copper phone cable a few years back running some drain tile to the drainage ditch along the road.
They didn't get the helocopters of FBI but a couple of verizon trucks kept running up and down the road.
Finally one of them pulls in the drive and asked is anyone was doing any construction around there.
They said no but then remembered putting the drain tile in and offered that.They ended up using the backhoe to dig up access to the line, the guy used a signal wand to find it.
The guy and someone else worked for about 6 hours patching 500 some copper lines back together.
His total bill was around $6,000 but he ended up getting it cut in half because they were about a foot outside of the right of way.
Unfortunately, they placed the drain tile into the right of way so it would have been cut either way so they split the difference.
I guess the bill would have been a little more if Verizon would have had to send it's own backhoe out.They told a story of a fiber line being cut on the other side of the road (fiber on one side and the older copper on the other) that cost the guy 1 million per day that it was down.
I guess whoever cuts the line pays for the lost service too.
Hope that give you an idea of how much the bill will be.</sentencetext>
	<parent>http://www.semanticweb.org/ontologies/ConversationInstances.owl#comment09_06_01_0040204.28162839</parent>
</comment>
<comment>
	<id>http://www.semanticweb.org/ontologies/ConversationInstances.owl#comment09_06_01_0040204.28163353</id>
	<title>Security by obscurity?</title>
	<author>Anonymous</author>
	<datestamp>1243783560000</datestamp>
	<modclass>None</modclass>
	<modscore>0</modscore>
	<htmltext><p>Ahh yes, the ultimate in security by obscurity, kind of like making Google blur sensitive areas: "Attention terrorists! This here blurred area is super-secret!"</p><p>In this case? "Attention terrorists! The black fiber is here!"</p><p>If their crypto was truly secure, they should feel comfortable blasting that stuff down "white fiber"--whether dedicated, leased, or even across the Internet.</p><p>And if they must have "dark" fiber, what's the best response if it gets cut during construction? Probably to let it go and quietly repair it. Making a scene about it just makes it worse.</p><p>My home burglar alarm uses GSM, and is impervious to someone accidentally or intentionally cutting lines to my house. So don't tell me the feds rely on hard wiring for anything really crucial.</p></htmltext>
<tokenext>Ahh yes , the ultimate in security by obscurity , kind of like making Google blur sensitive areas : " Attention terrorists !
This here blurred area is super-secret !
" In this case ?
" Attention terrorists !
The black fiber is here !
" If their crypto was truly secure , they should feel comfortable blasting that stuff down " white fiber " --whether dedicated , leased , or even across the Internet.And if they must have " dark " fiber , what 's the best response if it gets cut during construction ?
Probably to let it go and quietly repair it .
Making a scene about it just makes it worse.My home burglar alarm uses GSM , and is impervious to someone accidentally or intentionally cutting lines to my house .
So do n't tell me the feds rely on hard wiring for anything really crucial .</tokentext>
<sentencetext>Ahh yes, the ultimate in security by obscurity, kind of like making Google blur sensitive areas: "Attention terrorists!
This here blurred area is super-secret!
"In this case?
"Attention terrorists!
The black fiber is here!
"If their crypto was truly secure, they should feel comfortable blasting that stuff down "white fiber"--whether dedicated, leased, or even across the Internet.And if they must have "dark" fiber, what's the best response if it gets cut during construction?
Probably to let it go and quietly repair it.
Making a scene about it just makes it worse.My home burglar alarm uses GSM, and is impervious to someone accidentally or intentionally cutting lines to my house.
So don't tell me the feds rely on hard wiring for anything really crucial.</sentencetext>
</comment>
<comment>
	<id>http://www.semanticweb.org/ontologies/ConversationInstances.owl#comment09_06_01_0040204.28163811</id>
	<title>I call shenanigans...</title>
	<author>Anonymous</author>
	<datestamp>1243787040000</datestamp>
	<modclass>Insightful</modclass>
	<modscore>1</modscore>
	<htmltext>... This doesn't sound like it really happened. Within moments someone came. Yeah, right. There is NO way to have turn-around that fast and still stay inconspicuous. They would have to be a local and very conspicuous outfit, which defeats the purpose of having a black-ops in the first place. All that withstanding, an incident usually has to go up a chain, a with human links connecting the automated ones, and there's no way in hell most outfits, let alone the government can get humans orchestrated that effeciently. This is all mostly or entirely lies, I'm pretty sure.</htmltext>
<tokenext>... This does n't sound like it really happened .
Within moments someone came .
Yeah , right .
There is NO way to have turn-around that fast and still stay inconspicuous .
They would have to be a local and very conspicuous outfit , which defeats the purpose of having a black-ops in the first place .
All that withstanding , an incident usually has to go up a chain , a with human links connecting the automated ones , and there 's no way in hell most outfits , let alone the government can get humans orchestrated that effeciently .
This is all mostly or entirely lies , I 'm pretty sure .</tokentext>
<sentencetext>... This doesn't sound like it really happened.
Within moments someone came.
Yeah, right.
There is NO way to have turn-around that fast and still stay inconspicuous.
They would have to be a local and very conspicuous outfit, which defeats the purpose of having a black-ops in the first place.
All that withstanding, an incident usually has to go up a chain, a with human links connecting the automated ones, and there's no way in hell most outfits, let alone the government can get humans orchestrated that effeciently.
This is all mostly or entirely lies, I'm pretty sure.</sentencetext>
</comment>
<comment>
	<id>http://www.semanticweb.org/ontologies/ConversationInstances.owl#comment09_06_01_0040204.28163669</id>
	<title>Re:Our tax dollars at work.</title>
	<author>v1</author>
	<datestamp>1243785780000</datestamp>
	<modclass>Insightful</modclass>
	<modscore>4</modscore>
	<htmltext><p><i>ego, of believing they are above the law</i></p><p>Where have <b>YOU</b> been lately?  They <i>are</i> above the law.</p></htmltext>
<tokenext>ego , of believing they are above the lawWhere have YOU been lately ?
They are above the law .</tokentext>
<sentencetext>ego, of believing they are above the lawWhere have YOU been lately?
They are above the law.</sentencetext>
	<parent>http://www.semanticweb.org/ontologies/ConversationInstances.owl#comment09_06_01_0040204.28163187</parent>
</comment>
<comment>
	<id>http://www.semanticweb.org/ontologies/ConversationInstances.owl#comment09_06_01_0040204.28165391</id>
	<title>Re:Our tax dollars at work.</title>
	<author>ionix5891</author>
	<datestamp>1243849800000</datestamp>
	<modclass>None</modclass>
	<modscore>1</modscore>
	<htmltext><p>we also get added self destruct option<nobr> <wbr></nobr>:D</p></htmltext>
<tokenext>we also get added self destruct option : D</tokentext>
<sentencetext>we also get added self destruct option :D</sentencetext>
	<parent>http://www.semanticweb.org/ontologies/ConversationInstances.owl#comment09_06_01_0040204.28163291</parent>
</comment>
<comment>
	<id>http://www.semanticweb.org/ontologies/ConversationInstances.owl#comment09_06_01_0040204.28172767</id>
	<title>Re:Security Through Obscurity is not security</title>
	<author>m50d</author>
	<datestamp>1243847460000</datestamp>
	<modclass>None</modclass>
	<modscore>1</modscore>
	<htmltext><i>But, by obscuring the port that SSH listens on, have I made the machine dramatically more secure? Maybe not dramatically, but it's slightly more secure.</i> <p>No, it's less secure - now, you can no longer be sure you have no obvious vulnerabilities, and people who go after your machine specifically have a good chance of finding them. Wheras if you run it on the standard port, you can tell you have no easy open holes by the way your website hasn't been defaced yet.</p></htmltext>
<tokenext>But , by obscuring the port that SSH listens on , have I made the machine dramatically more secure ?
Maybe not dramatically , but it 's slightly more secure .
No , it 's less secure - now , you can no longer be sure you have no obvious vulnerabilities , and people who go after your machine specifically have a good chance of finding them .
Wheras if you run it on the standard port , you can tell you have no easy open holes by the way your website has n't been defaced yet .</tokentext>
<sentencetext>But, by obscuring the port that SSH listens on, have I made the machine dramatically more secure?
Maybe not dramatically, but it's slightly more secure.
No, it's less secure - now, you can no longer be sure you have no obvious vulnerabilities, and people who go after your machine specifically have a good chance of finding them.
Wheras if you run it on the standard port, you can tell you have no easy open holes by the way your website hasn't been defaced yet.</sentencetext>
	<parent>http://www.semanticweb.org/ontologies/ConversationInstances.owl#comment09_06_01_0040204.28163857</parent>
</comment>
<comment>
	<id>http://www.semanticweb.org/ontologies/ConversationInstances.owl#comment09_06_01_0040204.28162839</id>
	<title>My Dad</title>
	<author>Anonymous</author>
	<datestamp>1243779480000</datestamp>
	<modclass>Interestin</modclass>
	<modscore>5</modscore>
	<htmltext><p>My dad cut through a cell phone line about a month ago with his bulldozer (he lives on a farm) when we was clearing some soil for his rhubarb.  About 30 minutes later a helicopter was circling overhead.  Soon there after he met with a FBI agent who showed up on scene.  The Verizon workers showed up after that and about 12 hours later the line was patched.  This wasnt a fiber line, just a normal cell line, but they took it pretty seriously.  We havent gotten a bill in the mail yet, but we are expecting one any day.</p></htmltext>
<tokenext>My dad cut through a cell phone line about a month ago with his bulldozer ( he lives on a farm ) when we was clearing some soil for his rhubarb .
About 30 minutes later a helicopter was circling overhead .
Soon there after he met with a FBI agent who showed up on scene .
The Verizon workers showed up after that and about 12 hours later the line was patched .
This wasnt a fiber line , just a normal cell line , but they took it pretty seriously .
We havent gotten a bill in the mail yet , but we are expecting one any day .</tokentext>
<sentencetext>My dad cut through a cell phone line about a month ago with his bulldozer (he lives on a farm) when we was clearing some soil for his rhubarb.
About 30 minutes later a helicopter was circling overhead.
Soon there after he met with a FBI agent who showed up on scene.
The Verizon workers showed up after that and about 12 hours later the line was patched.
This wasnt a fiber line, just a normal cell line, but they took it pretty seriously.
We havent gotten a bill in the mail yet, but we are expecting one any day.</sentencetext>
</comment>
<comment>
	<id>http://www.semanticweb.org/ontologies/ConversationInstances.owl#comment09_06_01_0040204.28162867</id>
	<title>Nothing to see here ...</title>
	<author>Anonymous</author>
	<datestamp>1243779540000</datestamp>
	<modclass>None</modclass>
	<modscore>0</modscore>
	<htmltext><p>... move along, please.</p></htmltext>
<tokenext>... move along , please .</tokentext>
<sentencetext>... move along, please.</sentencetext>
</comment>
<comment>
	<id>http://www.semanticweb.org/ontologies/ConversationInstances.owl#comment09_06_01_0040204.28164359</id>
	<title>Re:Security Through Obscurity is not security</title>
	<author>Anonymous</author>
	<datestamp>1243792140000</datestamp>
	<modclass>None</modclass>
	<modscore>0</modscore>
	<htmltext><p>Copper is weakly diamagnetic (i.e. repulsive) so you cannot locate it at room temperature with metal detectors.</p><p>What you can detect with a backhoe is the warning tape generally planted a foot above the cable stating: "STOP! BURIED CABLE!"</p></htmltext>
<tokenext>Copper is weakly diamagnetic ( i.e .
repulsive ) so you can not locate it at room temperature with metal detectors.What you can detect with a backhoe is the warning tape generally planted a foot above the cable stating : " STOP !
BURIED CABLE !
"</tokentext>
<sentencetext>Copper is weakly diamagnetic (i.e.
repulsive) so you cannot locate it at room temperature with metal detectors.What you can detect with a backhoe is the warning tape generally planted a foot above the cable stating: "STOP!
BURIED CABLE!
"</sentencetext>
	<parent>http://www.semanticweb.org/ontologies/ConversationInstances.owl#comment09_06_01_0040204.28163379</parent>
</comment>
<comment>
	<id>http://www.semanticweb.org/ontologies/ConversationInstances.owl#comment09_06_01_0040204.28166509</id>
	<title>Fishy summary</title>
	<author>icepick72</author>
	<datestamp>1243863360000</datestamp>
	<modclass>None</modclass>
	<modscore>1</modscore>
	<htmltext>Why would the government have "secret" cables buried in public sight? And why would they not instead use forms of encryption instead of the actual unsecet cables.</htmltext>
<tokenext>Why would the government have " secret " cables buried in public sight ?
And why would they not instead use forms of encryption instead of the actual unsecet cables .</tokentext>
<sentencetext>Why would the government have "secret" cables buried in public sight?
And why would they not instead use forms of encryption instead of the actual unsecet cables.</sentencetext>
</comment>
<comment>
	<id>http://www.semanticweb.org/ontologies/ConversationInstances.owl#comment09_06_01_0040204.28162893</id>
	<title>Re:Ok...</title>
	<author>Anonymous</author>
	<datestamp>1243779660000</datestamp>
	<modclass>Informativ</modclass>
	<modscore>2</modscore>
	<htmltext><p>Many states have a requirement to call a locater service X days before you dig. You call one number and all the utilities come out and mark their stuff. Then, when you dig if you cut something that wasn't marked, it isn't your problem. Cut something marked and you pay.</p><p>I can only guess why super-duper secret fiber wasn't buried a little deeper than usual to avoid this kind of thing.</p></htmltext>
<tokenext>Many states have a requirement to call a locater service X days before you dig .
You call one number and all the utilities come out and mark their stuff .
Then , when you dig if you cut something that was n't marked , it is n't your problem .
Cut something marked and you pay.I can only guess why super-duper secret fiber was n't buried a little deeper than usual to avoid this kind of thing .</tokentext>
<sentencetext>Many states have a requirement to call a locater service X days before you dig.
You call one number and all the utilities come out and mark their stuff.
Then, when you dig if you cut something that wasn't marked, it isn't your problem.
Cut something marked and you pay.I can only guess why super-duper secret fiber wasn't buried a little deeper than usual to avoid this kind of thing.</sentencetext>
	<parent>http://www.semanticweb.org/ontologies/ConversationInstances.owl#comment09_06_01_0040204.28162819</parent>
</comment>
<comment>
	<id>http://www.semanticweb.org/ontologies/ConversationInstances.owl#comment09_06_01_0040204.28163659</id>
	<title>Re:Doesn't surprise me</title>
	<author>Anonymous</author>
	<datestamp>1243785660000</datestamp>
	<modclass>Funny</modclass>
	<modscore>1</modscore>
	<htmltext><p>There's space... missing... on the 3rd floor?</p><p>I think you need something more than an architect to worry about that one! Where's Doctor Who when he's needed?</p></htmltext>
<tokenext>There 's space... missing... on the 3rd floor ? I think you need something more than an architect to worry about that one !
Where 's Doctor Who when he 's needed ?</tokentext>
<sentencetext>There's space... missing... on the 3rd floor?I think you need something more than an architect to worry about that one!
Where's Doctor Who when he's needed?</sentencetext>
	<parent>http://www.semanticweb.org/ontologies/ConversationInstances.owl#comment09_06_01_0040204.28163017</parent>
</comment>
<comment>
	<id>http://www.semanticweb.org/ontologies/ConversationInstances.owl#comment09_06_01_0040204.28165003</id>
	<title>Red Clay</title>
	<author>Anonymous</author>
	<datestamp>1243886580000</datestamp>
	<modclass>None</modclass>
	<modscore>0</modscore>
	<htmltext><p>Our ground is red clay here, so everything is red colored.</p></htmltext>
<tokenext>Our ground is red clay here , so everything is red colored .</tokentext>
<sentencetext>Our ground is red clay here, so everything is red colored.</sentencetext>
	<parent>http://www.semanticweb.org/ontologies/ConversationInstances.owl#comment09_06_01_0040204.28163769</parent>
</comment>
<comment>
	<id>http://www.semanticweb.org/ontologies/ConversationInstances.owl#comment09_06_01_0040204.28166261</id>
	<title>Re:Ok...</title>
	<author>Anonymous</author>
	<datestamp>1243861140000</datestamp>
	<modclass>None</modclass>
	<modscore>0</modscore>
	<htmltext><p>This guy must have one of those fancy light pens I keep thinking I remember.  I think.  No wait... I don't.  Nevermind.</p></htmltext>
<tokenext>This guy must have one of those fancy light pens I keep thinking I remember .
I think .
No wait... I do n't .
Nevermind .</tokentext>
<sentencetext>This guy must have one of those fancy light pens I keep thinking I remember.
I think.
No wait... I don't.
Nevermind.</sentencetext>
	<parent>http://www.semanticweb.org/ontologies/ConversationInstances.owl#comment09_06_01_0040204.28163103</parent>
</comment>
<comment>
	<id>http://www.semanticweb.org/ontologies/ConversationInstances.owl#comment09_06_01_0040204.28166621</id>
	<title>What.....</title>
	<author>hesaigo999ca</author>
	<datestamp>1243864080000</datestamp>
	<modclass>None</modclass>
	<modscore>1</modscore>
	<htmltext><p>&gt;Mr.Presidetn....this is general McMasters....we are in deep trouble, sir..<br>&gt; Go ahead, explain your situation...<br>&gt;We are 1500 leagues udner the sea, with full nuclear capability, and we have intercepted a comm link from our starboard...<br>sir, we think this might be a pirate submarine....sir?....hellllllo?<br>&gt;.............peep,peep,peep....<br>&gt;dang...that's the third time this week!</p><p>You know if this is actually related to me missing out on some of my cable last month, I want a refund!</p></htmltext>
<tokenext>&gt; Mr.Presidetn....this is general McMasters....we are in deep trouble , sir.. &gt; Go ahead , explain your situation... &gt; We are 1500 leagues udner the sea , with full nuclear capability , and we have intercepted a comm link from our starboard...sir , we think this might be a pirate submarine....sir ? ....hellllllo ? &gt; .............peep,peep,peep.... &gt; dang...that 's the third time this week ! You know if this is actually related to me missing out on some of my cable last month , I want a refund !</tokentext>
<sentencetext>&gt;Mr.Presidetn....this is general McMasters....we are in deep trouble, sir..&gt; Go ahead, explain your situation...&gt;We are 1500 leagues udner the sea, with full nuclear capability, and we have intercepted a comm link from our starboard...sir, we think this might be a pirate submarine....sir?....hellllllo?&gt;.............peep,peep,peep....&gt;dang...that's the third time this week!You know if this is actually related to me missing out on some of my cable last month, I want a refund!</sentencetext>
</comment>
<comment>
	<id>http://www.semanticweb.org/ontologies/ConversationInstances.owl#comment09_06_01_0040204.28165071</id>
	<title>Re:Ok...</title>
	<author>Anonymous</author>
	<datestamp>1243887840000</datestamp>
	<modclass>None</modclass>
	<modscore>0</modscore>
	<htmltext><p><div class="quote"><p>See Rule #1.</p></div><p>Only applies during a raid.</p></div>
	</htmltext>
<tokenext>See Rule # 1.Only applies during a raid .</tokentext>
<sentencetext>See Rule #1.Only applies during a raid.
	</sentencetext>
	<parent>http://www.semanticweb.org/ontologies/ConversationInstances.owl#comment09_06_01_0040204.28163103</parent>
</comment>
<thread>
	<id>http://www.semanticweb.org/ontologies/ConversationInstances.owl#thread_09_06_01_0040204_12</id>
	<commentlist>http://www.semanticweb.org/ontologies/ConversationInstances.owl#comment09_06_01_0040204.28162839
http://www.semanticweb.org/ontologies/ConversationInstances.owl#comment09_06_01_0040204.28163065
</commentlist>
</thread>
<thread>
	<id>http://www.semanticweb.org/ontologies/ConversationInstances.owl#thread_09_06_01_0040204_51</id>
	<commentlist>http://www.semanticweb.org/ontologies/ConversationInstances.owl#comment09_06_01_0040204.28162839
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</commentlist>
</thread>
<thread>
	<id>http://www.semanticweb.org/ontologies/ConversationInstances.owl#thread_09_06_01_0040204_37</id>
	<commentlist>http://www.semanticweb.org/ontologies/ConversationInstances.owl#comment09_06_01_0040204.28162839
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</commentlist>
</thread>
<thread>
	<id>http://www.semanticweb.org/ontologies/ConversationInstances.owl#thread_09_06_01_0040204_13</id>
	<commentlist>http://www.semanticweb.org/ontologies/ConversationInstances.owl#comment09_06_01_0040204.28162819
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</commentlist>
</thread>
<thread>
	<id>http://www.semanticweb.org/ontologies/ConversationInstances.owl#thread_09_06_01_0040204_6</id>
	<commentlist>http://www.semanticweb.org/ontologies/ConversationInstances.owl#comment09_06_01_0040204.28162817
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</commentlist>
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<thread>
	<id>http://www.semanticweb.org/ontologies/ConversationInstances.owl#thread_09_06_01_0040204_44</id>
	<commentlist>http://www.semanticweb.org/ontologies/ConversationInstances.owl#comment09_06_01_0040204.28162819
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</commentlist>
</thread>
<thread>
	<id>http://www.semanticweb.org/ontologies/ConversationInstances.owl#thread_09_06_01_0040204_27</id>
	<commentlist>http://www.semanticweb.org/ontologies/ConversationInstances.owl#comment09_06_01_0040204.28162827
http://www.semanticweb.org/ontologies/ConversationInstances.owl#comment09_06_01_0040204.28163959
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</commentlist>
</thread>
<thread>
	<id>http://www.semanticweb.org/ontologies/ConversationInstances.owl#thread_09_06_01_0040204_20</id>
	<commentlist>http://www.semanticweb.org/ontologies/ConversationInstances.owl#comment09_06_01_0040204.28163379
http://www.semanticweb.org/ontologies/ConversationInstances.owl#comment09_06_01_0040204.28163857
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</commentlist>
</thread>
<thread>
	<id>http://www.semanticweb.org/ontologies/ConversationInstances.owl#thread_09_06_01_0040204_5</id>
	<commentlist>http://www.semanticweb.org/ontologies/ConversationInstances.owl#comment09_06_01_0040204.28162817
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</commentlist>
</thread>
<thread>
	<id>http://www.semanticweb.org/ontologies/ConversationInstances.owl#thread_09_06_01_0040204_43</id>
	<commentlist>http://www.semanticweb.org/ontologies/ConversationInstances.owl#comment09_06_01_0040204.28162795
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<thread>
	<id>http://www.semanticweb.org/ontologies/ConversationInstances.owl#thread_09_06_01_0040204_34</id>
	<commentlist>http://www.semanticweb.org/ontologies/ConversationInstances.owl#comment09_06_01_0040204.28163557
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<thread>
	<id>http://www.semanticweb.org/ontologies/ConversationInstances.owl#thread_09_06_01_0040204_10</id>
	<commentlist>http://www.semanticweb.org/ontologies/ConversationInstances.owl#comment09_06_01_0040204.28162817
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<thread>
	<id>http://www.semanticweb.org/ontologies/ConversationInstances.owl#thread_09_06_01_0040204_62</id>
	<commentlist>http://www.semanticweb.org/ontologies/ConversationInstances.owl#comment09_06_01_0040204.28163875
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</commentlist>
</thread>
<thread>
	<id>http://www.semanticweb.org/ontologies/ConversationInstances.owl#thread_09_06_01_0040204_58</id>
	<commentlist>http://www.semanticweb.org/ontologies/ConversationInstances.owl#comment09_06_01_0040204.28162817
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