<article>
	<id>http://www.semanticweb.org/ontologies/ConversationInstances.owl#article09_05_28_029216</id>
	<title>Understanding Addiction-Based Game Design</title>
	<author>Soulskill</author>
	<datestamp>1243503300000</datestamp>
	<htmltext><a href="mailto:spidweb@spiderwebsoftware.com" rel="nofollow">spidweb</a> writes <i>"The common theory is that games like <em>World of Warcraft</em> are addictive. But what are the exact qualities that make it so? Are there specific elements of the design that can be pulled out, distilled, and used at will to <a href="http://rpgvault.ign.com/articles/986/986323p1.html">give a game drug-like properties</a>? Is it wrong to do so? A new article at IGN RPG Vault attempts to isolates the exact qualities that go into making an addiction-based design. From the article: 'If a game uses rewards of any sort to entice you to experience highly repetitive content, you should see what it's trying to do and which of your buttons it's trying to press. If you don't mind, that's cool, but you should understand it.'"</i></htmltext>
<tokenext>spidweb writes " The common theory is that games like World of Warcraft are addictive .
But what are the exact qualities that make it so ?
Are there specific elements of the design that can be pulled out , distilled , and used at will to give a game drug-like properties ?
Is it wrong to do so ?
A new article at IGN RPG Vault attempts to isolates the exact qualities that go into making an addiction-based design .
From the article : 'If a game uses rewards of any sort to entice you to experience highly repetitive content , you should see what it 's trying to do and which of your buttons it 's trying to press .
If you do n't mind , that 's cool , but you should understand it .
' "</tokentext>
<sentencetext>spidweb writes "The common theory is that games like World of Warcraft are addictive.
But what are the exact qualities that make it so?
Are there specific elements of the design that can be pulled out, distilled, and used at will to give a game drug-like properties?
Is it wrong to do so?
A new article at IGN RPG Vault attempts to isolates the exact qualities that go into making an addiction-based design.
From the article: 'If a game uses rewards of any sort to entice you to experience highly repetitive content, you should see what it's trying to do and which of your buttons it's trying to press.
If you don't mind, that's cool, but you should understand it.
'"</sentencetext>
</article>
<comment>
	<id>http://www.semanticweb.org/ontologies/ConversationInstances.owl#comment09_05_28_029216.28122431</id>
	<title>it's people</title>
	<author>po134</author>
	<datestamp>1243519680000</datestamp>
	<modclass>None</modclass>
	<modscore>1</modscore>
	<htmltext>It's not as much the games as the way the gameplay let us interact with other people with in-game chat or over TS/Ventrilo. For me, when I play video games online it's about people and not the game itself, although the game as to allow such cooperative gameplay. Good examples are TF2, WoW, L4D, etc.<br> <br>I personally don't quit playing because of the community that our servers built around the players (GT every 2 months, lan each year, etc) that makes me come back every night and far from the game itself (sometime we play like user but we have the greatest fun at just talking to each other and talking about everything.)<br> <br> To me this addiction is not really one with the game but with social interactions THROUGH the games.</htmltext>
<tokenext>It 's not as much the games as the way the gameplay let us interact with other people with in-game chat or over TS/Ventrilo .
For me , when I play video games online it 's about people and not the game itself , although the game as to allow such cooperative gameplay .
Good examples are TF2 , WoW , L4D , etc .
I personally do n't quit playing because of the community that our servers built around the players ( GT every 2 months , lan each year , etc ) that makes me come back every night and far from the game itself ( sometime we play like user but we have the greatest fun at just talking to each other and talking about everything .
) To me this addiction is not really one with the game but with social interactions THROUGH the games .</tokentext>
<sentencetext>It's not as much the games as the way the gameplay let us interact with other people with in-game chat or over TS/Ventrilo.
For me, when I play video games online it's about people and not the game itself, although the game as to allow such cooperative gameplay.
Good examples are TF2, WoW, L4D, etc.
I personally don't quit playing because of the community that our servers built around the players (GT every 2 months, lan each year, etc) that makes me come back every night and far from the game itself (sometime we play like user but we have the greatest fun at just talking to each other and talking about everything.
)  To me this addiction is not really one with the game but with social interactions THROUGH the games.</sentencetext>
</comment>
<comment>
	<id>http://www.semanticweb.org/ontologies/ConversationInstances.owl#comment09_05_28_029216.28127495</id>
	<title>Goals</title>
	<author>zhar</author>
	<datestamp>1243539720000</datestamp>
	<modclass>None</modclass>
	<modscore>1</modscore>
	<htmltext>To begin with, I have not RTFA (damn you websense!) nor have I ever played WoW. But I can give some examples of addictive games that I have played, such as Sid Meier's Pirates! As many other posters have pointed out, one of the features that they feel makes WoW addictive is the social interaction. This has no appeal for me, which is why MMORPG's haven't ever really captivated me the way most single player games have. I think that the addictiveness has to take into account both the nature of the players and also the player's goals. In the case of Pirates! the game became very addicting because the quests that would be given to you could be accomplished in about 20 minutes each. This, coupled with a fairly intuitive control scheme using just the number pad on the keyboard made for a great pick up and play kind of game, but always having the ability to complete a particular quest in 20 minutes or less triggers a "just one more" kind of play style where I lose track of time and next thing I know I've been playing for 14 hours with minimal breaks. Having short, attainable goals that tie into a long term goal provides a sense of accomplishment that produces a desire to keep on playing without interruption.</htmltext>
<tokenext>To begin with , I have not RTFA ( damn you websense !
) nor have I ever played WoW .
But I can give some examples of addictive games that I have played , such as Sid Meier 's Pirates !
As many other posters have pointed out , one of the features that they feel makes WoW addictive is the social interaction .
This has no appeal for me , which is why MMORPG 's have n't ever really captivated me the way most single player games have .
I think that the addictiveness has to take into account both the nature of the players and also the player 's goals .
In the case of Pirates !
the game became very addicting because the quests that would be given to you could be accomplished in about 20 minutes each .
This , coupled with a fairly intuitive control scheme using just the number pad on the keyboard made for a great pick up and play kind of game , but always having the ability to complete a particular quest in 20 minutes or less triggers a " just one more " kind of play style where I lose track of time and next thing I know I 've been playing for 14 hours with minimal breaks .
Having short , attainable goals that tie into a long term goal provides a sense of accomplishment that produces a desire to keep on playing without interruption .</tokentext>
<sentencetext>To begin with, I have not RTFA (damn you websense!
) nor have I ever played WoW.
But I can give some examples of addictive games that I have played, such as Sid Meier's Pirates!
As many other posters have pointed out, one of the features that they feel makes WoW addictive is the social interaction.
This has no appeal for me, which is why MMORPG's haven't ever really captivated me the way most single player games have.
I think that the addictiveness has to take into account both the nature of the players and also the player's goals.
In the case of Pirates!
the game became very addicting because the quests that would be given to you could be accomplished in about 20 minutes each.
This, coupled with a fairly intuitive control scheme using just the number pad on the keyboard made for a great pick up and play kind of game, but always having the ability to complete a particular quest in 20 minutes or less triggers a "just one more" kind of play style where I lose track of time and next thing I know I've been playing for 14 hours with minimal breaks.
Having short, attainable goals that tie into a long term goal provides a sense of accomplishment that produces a desire to keep on playing without interruption.</sentencetext>
</comment>
<comment>
	<id>http://www.semanticweb.org/ontologies/ConversationInstances.owl#comment09_05_28_029216.28122175</id>
	<title>Mabinogi</title>
	<author>Anonymous</author>
	<datestamp>1243518360000</datestamp>
	<modclass>None</modclass>
	<modscore>0</modscore>
	<htmltext><p>Don't like subscriptions? Play a free-to-play game, with or without the optional pay-for customization/makes-the-game-easier stuff.</p><p>I prefer Mabinogi. I can drop it at any time, and come back days or months later, and I haven't wasted money on it, or anything that expires, and don't have to pay to start playing again.</p></htmltext>
<tokenext>Do n't like subscriptions ?
Play a free-to-play game , with or without the optional pay-for customization/makes-the-game-easier stuff.I prefer Mabinogi .
I can drop it at any time , and come back days or months later , and I have n't wasted money on it , or anything that expires , and do n't have to pay to start playing again .</tokentext>
<sentencetext>Don't like subscriptions?
Play a free-to-play game, with or without the optional pay-for customization/makes-the-game-easier stuff.I prefer Mabinogi.
I can drop it at any time, and come back days or months later, and I haven't wasted money on it, or anything that expires, and don't have to pay to start playing again.</sentencetext>
</comment>
<comment>
	<id>http://www.semanticweb.org/ontologies/ConversationInstances.owl#comment09_05_28_029216.28125801</id>
	<title>Re:Subscription based addiction</title>
	<author>Feyshtey</author>
	<datestamp>1243534320000</datestamp>
	<modclass>None</modclass>
	<modscore>1</modscore>
	<htmltext>I'd be interested in hearing what the longest period of time you've played a game is in terms of months or years it's kept your interest.
<br> <br>
I used to buy games every 2-6 weeks. I'd purchase a game, get completely sucked in, play the hell out of it till I solved it, and shelve it for the next title. There are the odd few I pull back off the shelf for revisits about once a year (BF2, Starcraft, C&amp;C, CivIV, etc.). But nothing has ever held my interest for periods of years like World of Warcraft, and Everquest before it.
<br> <br>
There's truth in stating that MMO's are generally a repetitive process. Kill X, for Y, rinse, repeat and continue for the 'big' goodies. But I would pose a question: Is it worthy of consideration that the story offsets the repetitive experience?
<br> <br>
The addictive nature of the game is certainly added to by the 'dangling carrot', and the next little reward that the player drives toward. But I find that the storylines are interesting and engaging, and the impact I have in them (albeit largely an illusion) combines for a more compelling experience. Isn't the ability to effectively tell interesting stories that collectively builds into a game-world with a rich and extensive lore as large a factor in labeling a title a "good game"?
<br> <br>
Bottom line for me is that I can continue playing WoW discovering and exploring new storylines and learning more lore (while, admittedly, being a sucker for the dangling carrot as well), for years. Conversely I can be stimulated intellectually by only so many sessions of the same easily solved puzzle games, or headshots from botters and cheats.</htmltext>
<tokenext>I 'd be interested in hearing what the longest period of time you 've played a game is in terms of months or years it 's kept your interest .
I used to buy games every 2-6 weeks .
I 'd purchase a game , get completely sucked in , play the hell out of it till I solved it , and shelve it for the next title .
There are the odd few I pull back off the shelf for revisits about once a year ( BF2 , Starcraft , C&amp;C , CivIV , etc. ) .
But nothing has ever held my interest for periods of years like World of Warcraft , and Everquest before it .
There 's truth in stating that MMO 's are generally a repetitive process .
Kill X , for Y , rinse , repeat and continue for the 'big ' goodies .
But I would pose a question : Is it worthy of consideration that the story offsets the repetitive experience ?
The addictive nature of the game is certainly added to by the 'dangling carrot ' , and the next little reward that the player drives toward .
But I find that the storylines are interesting and engaging , and the impact I have in them ( albeit largely an illusion ) combines for a more compelling experience .
Is n't the ability to effectively tell interesting stories that collectively builds into a game-world with a rich and extensive lore as large a factor in labeling a title a " good game " ?
Bottom line for me is that I can continue playing WoW discovering and exploring new storylines and learning more lore ( while , admittedly , being a sucker for the dangling carrot as well ) , for years .
Conversely I can be stimulated intellectually by only so many sessions of the same easily solved puzzle games , or headshots from botters and cheats .</tokentext>
<sentencetext>I'd be interested in hearing what the longest period of time you've played a game is in terms of months or years it's kept your interest.
I used to buy games every 2-6 weeks.
I'd purchase a game, get completely sucked in, play the hell out of it till I solved it, and shelve it for the next title.
There are the odd few I pull back off the shelf for revisits about once a year (BF2, Starcraft, C&amp;C, CivIV, etc.).
But nothing has ever held my interest for periods of years like World of Warcraft, and Everquest before it.
There's truth in stating that MMO's are generally a repetitive process.
Kill X, for Y, rinse, repeat and continue for the 'big' goodies.
But I would pose a question: Is it worthy of consideration that the story offsets the repetitive experience?
The addictive nature of the game is certainly added to by the 'dangling carrot', and the next little reward that the player drives toward.
But I find that the storylines are interesting and engaging, and the impact I have in them (albeit largely an illusion) combines for a more compelling experience.
Isn't the ability to effectively tell interesting stories that collectively builds into a game-world with a rich and extensive lore as large a factor in labeling a title a "good game"?
Bottom line for me is that I can continue playing WoW discovering and exploring new storylines and learning more lore (while, admittedly, being a sucker for the dangling carrot as well), for years.
Conversely I can be stimulated intellectually by only so many sessions of the same easily solved puzzle games, or headshots from botters and cheats.</sentencetext>
	<parent>http://www.semanticweb.org/ontologies/ConversationInstances.owl#comment09_05_28_029216.28120933</parent>
</comment>
<comment>
	<id>http://www.semanticweb.org/ontologies/ConversationInstances.owl#comment09_05_28_029216.28121385</id>
	<title>Addiction??</title>
	<author>eclectro</author>
	<datestamp>1243512120000</datestamp>
	<modclass>Funny</modclass>
	<modscore>2</modscore>
	<htmltext><p>It started when you controlled a little yellow circle that went around swallowing blue pills.</p></htmltext>
<tokenext>It started when you controlled a little yellow circle that went around swallowing blue pills .</tokentext>
<sentencetext>It started when you controlled a little yellow circle that went around swallowing blue pills.</sentencetext>
</comment>
<comment>
	<id>http://www.semanticweb.org/ontologies/ConversationInstances.owl#comment09_05_28_029216.28123029</id>
	<title>study civilization iv</title>
	<author>circletimessquare</author>
	<datestamp>1243522500000</datestamp>
	<modclass>Interestin</modclass>
	<modscore>2</modscore>
	<htmltext><p>i had to forcibly destroy the disc in order to have a life</p><p>for me, it was a combination of the engrossing micromanagement (which you see with WoW and its endless loot management) and that insistent "just one more turn..." urging that moves you to devote 5 more minutes to the game that turns into 5 hours. that urging is the desire to see the completion of small goalposts, like building a wonder or taking a border city from the spanish or the indians, which is also discussed in regards to WoW</p></htmltext>
<tokenext>i had to forcibly destroy the disc in order to have a lifefor me , it was a combination of the engrossing micromanagement ( which you see with WoW and its endless loot management ) and that insistent " just one more turn... " urging that moves you to devote 5 more minutes to the game that turns into 5 hours .
that urging is the desire to see the completion of small goalposts , like building a wonder or taking a border city from the spanish or the indians , which is also discussed in regards to WoW</tokentext>
<sentencetext>i had to forcibly destroy the disc in order to have a lifefor me, it was a combination of the engrossing micromanagement (which you see with WoW and its endless loot management) and that insistent "just one more turn..." urging that moves you to devote 5 more minutes to the game that turns into 5 hours.
that urging is the desire to see the completion of small goalposts, like building a wonder or taking a border city from the spanish or the indians, which is also discussed in regards to WoW</sentencetext>
</comment>
<comment>
	<id>http://www.semanticweb.org/ontologies/ConversationInstances.owl#comment09_05_28_029216.28126345</id>
	<title>Re:Rewards.</title>
	<author>tnk1</author>
	<datestamp>1243536240000</datestamp>
	<modclass>None</modclass>
	<modscore>1</modscore>
	<htmltext><p>I have to ask how you can tolerate the grind.  And before I go farther, let me state that I was a WoW guild leader and raided 5 days a week before I stopped playing, so I am not in any way pretending to be some person who sneers at WoW players.  My first level 60 was within a few months of the game starting, and I had numerous 70s and 60+ characters in BC.</p><p>Still, by the end of it all, the only thing that was vaguely interesting about it was working with the other people.  Badges of Justice, honor points, reputation grinds all had some value, but once you got one or two specific items, I couldn't see the point any more.  Eventually I found that I had a full set of bank tabs, as well as a guild bank full of crap that once perhaps had some value, but after a few weeks or months became total junk.  I have tabs full of epic gems, patterns and gear that are now entirely worthless, or almost so.  The most unique thing I have is the flaming bird mount from Kaelthas and even eventually flying that around and being Oooed and Ahhhed at got a little dull.</p><p>Does the achievement system actually help with that?  Or is there something else?</p><p>Maybe I just burned out quickly on having to lead raids and the gear came a little too easy because I was always in raids, but even when I wasn't a leader, I actually quit once and was ready to stay away until I was almost begged to come play again by RL friends.  Doesn't the same thing get to you after awhile?</p><p>I think WoW is a great game that was well worth my time, but now just the thought of logging in again makes me want to stab my eyes out.  I wonder how it has lasted this long for others.  I totally get the "replacement for actual RL achievement" concept, because as a minion at my job, it was a real interesting situation to manage 20-100 people and actually be in charge, but eventually, you start to realize that being the boss is as much a crap job as anything else is if you try and do it right.</p><p>Anyway, I have just been wondering about that, because when I left and came back, I saw people who had never stopped playing the game, and today I can Armory people on my server who were around from the old days.</p></htmltext>
<tokenext>I have to ask how you can tolerate the grind .
And before I go farther , let me state that I was a WoW guild leader and raided 5 days a week before I stopped playing , so I am not in any way pretending to be some person who sneers at WoW players .
My first level 60 was within a few months of the game starting , and I had numerous 70s and 60 + characters in BC.Still , by the end of it all , the only thing that was vaguely interesting about it was working with the other people .
Badges of Justice , honor points , reputation grinds all had some value , but once you got one or two specific items , I could n't see the point any more .
Eventually I found that I had a full set of bank tabs , as well as a guild bank full of crap that once perhaps had some value , but after a few weeks or months became total junk .
I have tabs full of epic gems , patterns and gear that are now entirely worthless , or almost so .
The most unique thing I have is the flaming bird mount from Kaelthas and even eventually flying that around and being Oooed and Ahhhed at got a little dull.Does the achievement system actually help with that ?
Or is there something else ? Maybe I just burned out quickly on having to lead raids and the gear came a little too easy because I was always in raids , but even when I was n't a leader , I actually quit once and was ready to stay away until I was almost begged to come play again by RL friends .
Does n't the same thing get to you after awhile ? I think WoW is a great game that was well worth my time , but now just the thought of logging in again makes me want to stab my eyes out .
I wonder how it has lasted this long for others .
I totally get the " replacement for actual RL achievement " concept , because as a minion at my job , it was a real interesting situation to manage 20-100 people and actually be in charge , but eventually , you start to realize that being the boss is as much a crap job as anything else is if you try and do it right.Anyway , I have just been wondering about that , because when I left and came back , I saw people who had never stopped playing the game , and today I can Armory people on my server who were around from the old days .</tokentext>
<sentencetext>I have to ask how you can tolerate the grind.
And before I go farther, let me state that I was a WoW guild leader and raided 5 days a week before I stopped playing, so I am not in any way pretending to be some person who sneers at WoW players.
My first level 60 was within a few months of the game starting, and I had numerous 70s and 60+ characters in BC.Still, by the end of it all, the only thing that was vaguely interesting about it was working with the other people.
Badges of Justice, honor points, reputation grinds all had some value, but once you got one or two specific items, I couldn't see the point any more.
Eventually I found that I had a full set of bank tabs, as well as a guild bank full of crap that once perhaps had some value, but after a few weeks or months became total junk.
I have tabs full of epic gems, patterns and gear that are now entirely worthless, or almost so.
The most unique thing I have is the flaming bird mount from Kaelthas and even eventually flying that around and being Oooed and Ahhhed at got a little dull.Does the achievement system actually help with that?
Or is there something else?Maybe I just burned out quickly on having to lead raids and the gear came a little too easy because I was always in raids, but even when I wasn't a leader, I actually quit once and was ready to stay away until I was almost begged to come play again by RL friends.
Doesn't the same thing get to you after awhile?I think WoW is a great game that was well worth my time, but now just the thought of logging in again makes me want to stab my eyes out.
I wonder how it has lasted this long for others.
I totally get the "replacement for actual RL achievement" concept, because as a minion at my job, it was a real interesting situation to manage 20-100 people and actually be in charge, but eventually, you start to realize that being the boss is as much a crap job as anything else is if you try and do it right.Anyway, I have just been wondering about that, because when I left and came back, I saw people who had never stopped playing the game, and today I can Armory people on my server who were around from the old days.</sentencetext>
	<parent>http://www.semanticweb.org/ontologies/ConversationInstances.owl#comment09_05_28_029216.28120979</parent>
</comment>
<comment>
	<id>http://www.semanticweb.org/ontologies/ConversationInstances.owl#comment09_05_28_029216.28123481</id>
	<title>Re:Companionship is addictive</title>
	<author>geminidomino</author>
	<datestamp>1243524540000</datestamp>
	<modclass>Funny</modclass>
	<modscore>4</modscore>
	<htmltext><p><div class="quote"><p>There is a pretty funny theory that the vast majority of WoW players are well-respected professionals who play the game in their free time.</p></div><p>[citation REALLY fucking needed]</p><p>The paid spokespeople on TV (Captain Kirk, B.A Baracus, etc...) are not "the vast majority" of players.</p><p><div class="quote"><p> Through the playing of WoW, they not only practice their leadership skills, but also organizational skills and planning skills.</p></div><p>Leadership skills?</p><p>"How I mine fish?"<br>"Can someone give me 10 silver?"<nobr> <wbr></nobr>/unequip armor +<nobr> <wbr></nobr>/dance on mailbox</p><p>Alexander the Fucking Great they're not...</p><p>Seriously, WHO holds this "theory?" They need to be sterilized for the sake of evolution.</p><p>(Not flaming parent, just REALLY amused)</p></div>
	</htmltext>
<tokenext>There is a pretty funny theory that the vast majority of WoW players are well-respected professionals who play the game in their free time .
[ citation REALLY fucking needed ] The paid spokespeople on TV ( Captain Kirk , B.A Baracus , etc... ) are not " the vast majority " of players .
Through the playing of WoW , they not only practice their leadership skills , but also organizational skills and planning skills.Leadership skills ?
" How I mine fish ?
" " Can someone give me 10 silver ?
" /unequip armor + /dance on mailboxAlexander the Fucking Great they 're not...Seriously , WHO holds this " theory ?
" They need to be sterilized for the sake of evolution .
( Not flaming parent , just REALLY amused )</tokentext>
<sentencetext>There is a pretty funny theory that the vast majority of WoW players are well-respected professionals who play the game in their free time.
[citation REALLY fucking needed]The paid spokespeople on TV (Captain Kirk, B.A Baracus, etc...) are not "the vast majority" of players.
Through the playing of WoW, they not only practice their leadership skills, but also organizational skills and planning skills.Leadership skills?
"How I mine fish?
""Can someone give me 10 silver?
" /unequip armor + /dance on mailboxAlexander the Fucking Great they're not...Seriously, WHO holds this "theory?
" They need to be sterilized for the sake of evolution.
(Not flaming parent, just REALLY amused)
	</sentencetext>
	<parent>http://www.semanticweb.org/ontologies/ConversationInstances.owl#comment09_05_28_029216.28120937</parent>
</comment>
<comment>
	<id>http://www.semanticweb.org/ontologies/ConversationInstances.owl#comment09_05_28_029216.28121249</id>
	<title>Re:Companionship is addictive</title>
	<author>MrMista\_B</author>
	<datestamp>1243510440000</datestamp>
	<modclass>Troll</modclass>
	<modscore>0</modscore>
	<htmltext><p>Huh, rather long to be a troll. Just flamebait then?</p></htmltext>
<tokenext>Huh , rather long to be a troll .
Just flamebait then ?</tokentext>
<sentencetext>Huh, rather long to be a troll.
Just flamebait then?</sentencetext>
	<parent>http://www.semanticweb.org/ontologies/ConversationInstances.owl#comment09_05_28_029216.28120937</parent>
</comment>
<comment>
	<id>http://www.semanticweb.org/ontologies/ConversationInstances.owl#comment09_05_28_029216.28125681</id>
	<title>Re:Addictive design</title>
	<author>Hatta</author>
	<datestamp>1243533900000</datestamp>
	<modclass>None</modclass>
	<modscore>1</modscore>
	<htmltext><p><i>'Right' or 'wrong' is irrelevant to them, only 'legal' and 'illegal</i></p><p>And often, not even that.  The costs of breaking the law often out weigh the profits to be had, so they do.</p></htmltext>
<tokenext>'Right ' or 'wrong ' is irrelevant to them , only 'legal ' and 'illegalAnd often , not even that .
The costs of breaking the law often out weigh the profits to be had , so they do .</tokentext>
<sentencetext>'Right' or 'wrong' is irrelevant to them, only 'legal' and 'illegalAnd often, not even that.
The costs of breaking the law often out weigh the profits to be had, so they do.</sentencetext>
	<parent>http://www.semanticweb.org/ontologies/ConversationInstances.owl#comment09_05_28_029216.28121373</parent>
</comment>
<comment>
	<id>http://www.semanticweb.org/ontologies/ConversationInstances.owl#comment09_05_28_029216.28129665</id>
	<title>Re:Subscription based addiction</title>
	<author>illumin8</author>
	<datestamp>1243503000000</datestamp>
	<modclass>Interestin</modclass>
	<modscore>3</modscore>
	<htmltext><blockquote><div><p>If I'm addicted to a bought-outright game, it's because it's a good game.</p></div></blockquote><p>I remember reading an interview with some of the developers behind Diablo and Diablo 2, which are some of the most addictive games ever made.  They said they specifically designed the loot mechanic to be like a slot machine.  Slot machine creators have scientifically determined the exact intervals of time between rewards (payout).  They have analyzed human behavior to the point where they know that after a certain number of minutes you will get bored, so just before that time, all of a sudden you'll see a green drop, or some other epic loot.  This reward mechanism is so addictive that it can keep you playing for hours.  Just look at any casino and all of the old ladies pumping quarters into slot machines for hours on end and you can see how addictive the timed reward mechanics are.</p><p>Successful video games like Diablo and WoW have used these same type of reward mechanics to create millions of highly addicted gamers.  See <a href="http://thesillyaddiction.com/2008/06/absent-friends-diablo-2/" title="thesillyaddiction.com">giving up addiction to Diablo 2</a> [thesillyaddiction.com] for a personal experience.</p></div>
	</htmltext>
<tokenext>If I 'm addicted to a bought-outright game , it 's because it 's a good game.I remember reading an interview with some of the developers behind Diablo and Diablo 2 , which are some of the most addictive games ever made .
They said they specifically designed the loot mechanic to be like a slot machine .
Slot machine creators have scientifically determined the exact intervals of time between rewards ( payout ) .
They have analyzed human behavior to the point where they know that after a certain number of minutes you will get bored , so just before that time , all of a sudden you 'll see a green drop , or some other epic loot .
This reward mechanism is so addictive that it can keep you playing for hours .
Just look at any casino and all of the old ladies pumping quarters into slot machines for hours on end and you can see how addictive the timed reward mechanics are.Successful video games like Diablo and WoW have used these same type of reward mechanics to create millions of highly addicted gamers .
See giving up addiction to Diablo 2 [ thesillyaddiction.com ] for a personal experience .</tokentext>
<sentencetext>If I'm addicted to a bought-outright game, it's because it's a good game.I remember reading an interview with some of the developers behind Diablo and Diablo 2, which are some of the most addictive games ever made.
They said they specifically designed the loot mechanic to be like a slot machine.
Slot machine creators have scientifically determined the exact intervals of time between rewards (payout).
They have analyzed human behavior to the point where they know that after a certain number of minutes you will get bored, so just before that time, all of a sudden you'll see a green drop, or some other epic loot.
This reward mechanism is so addictive that it can keep you playing for hours.
Just look at any casino and all of the old ladies pumping quarters into slot machines for hours on end and you can see how addictive the timed reward mechanics are.Successful video games like Diablo and WoW have used these same type of reward mechanics to create millions of highly addicted gamers.
See giving up addiction to Diablo 2 [thesillyaddiction.com] for a personal experience.
	</sentencetext>
	<parent>http://www.semanticweb.org/ontologies/ConversationInstances.owl#comment09_05_28_029216.28120933</parent>
</comment>
<comment>
	<id>http://www.semanticweb.org/ontologies/ConversationInstances.owl#comment09_05_28_029216.28121225</id>
	<title>Re:Companionship is addictive</title>
	<author>Anonymous</author>
	<datestamp>1243510260000</datestamp>
	<modclass>Interestin</modclass>
	<modscore>4</modscore>
	<htmltext><p>Anecdotally, my best friend from high school pulls down six figures at an international oil firm. He's an engineer, finds natural gas all day. He's one of the smartest guys I know. He pulls down 24 hour shift routinely.</p><p>What does he do in his very limited spare time? Runs raids in WoW with all of his fellow engineers. He has multiple accounts, each with multiple Level 80s on them.</p><p>Somehow I think your stereotype of "FATBALL LIVES AT HOME WITH MOMMY LOL" falls flat.</p></htmltext>
<tokenext>Anecdotally , my best friend from high school pulls down six figures at an international oil firm .
He 's an engineer , finds natural gas all day .
He 's one of the smartest guys I know .
He pulls down 24 hour shift routinely.What does he do in his very limited spare time ?
Runs raids in WoW with all of his fellow engineers .
He has multiple accounts , each with multiple Level 80s on them.Somehow I think your stereotype of " FATBALL LIVES AT HOME WITH MOMMY LOL " falls flat .</tokentext>
<sentencetext>Anecdotally, my best friend from high school pulls down six figures at an international oil firm.
He's an engineer, finds natural gas all day.
He's one of the smartest guys I know.
He pulls down 24 hour shift routinely.What does he do in his very limited spare time?
Runs raids in WoW with all of his fellow engineers.
He has multiple accounts, each with multiple Level 80s on them.Somehow I think your stereotype of "FATBALL LIVES AT HOME WITH MOMMY LOL" falls flat.</sentencetext>
	<parent>http://www.semanticweb.org/ontologies/ConversationInstances.owl#comment09_05_28_029216.28120937</parent>
</comment>
<comment>
	<id>http://www.semanticweb.org/ontologies/ConversationInstances.owl#comment09_05_28_029216.28121451</id>
	<title>Re:Companionship is addictive</title>
	<author>Opportunist</author>
	<datestamp>1243512840000</datestamp>
	<modclass>Interestin</modclass>
	<modscore>4</modscore>
	<htmltext><p>If you're actually looking for "efficient management" in MMOs, you might have to look to other MMOs. I know of a few EvE guilds that are ran more ruthlessly than the worst (RL) corporation you've ever worked for. Where you're told when and where to be online, what ship to fly, what skills to learn, what equipment to outfit, if you're a fighter. Where you're told how much ore you are to mine in a given amount of time, if you're a miner. Where you're told what to produce and where to get it, if you're builder or transporter. All with levels of management who have to report what they're doing, with set goals that have to be met, and if you don't meet it, well, it's been a pleasure to work with you, you have 24 hours to leave our space before we open fire on you.</p><p>That's not playing anymore, though. That's worse than working a second job. That's working a second job and paying to do it.</p></htmltext>
<tokenext>If you 're actually looking for " efficient management " in MMOs , you might have to look to other MMOs .
I know of a few EvE guilds that are ran more ruthlessly than the worst ( RL ) corporation you 've ever worked for .
Where you 're told when and where to be online , what ship to fly , what skills to learn , what equipment to outfit , if you 're a fighter .
Where you 're told how much ore you are to mine in a given amount of time , if you 're a miner .
Where you 're told what to produce and where to get it , if you 're builder or transporter .
All with levels of management who have to report what they 're doing , with set goals that have to be met , and if you do n't meet it , well , it 's been a pleasure to work with you , you have 24 hours to leave our space before we open fire on you.That 's not playing anymore , though .
That 's worse than working a second job .
That 's working a second job and paying to do it .</tokentext>
<sentencetext>If you're actually looking for "efficient management" in MMOs, you might have to look to other MMOs.
I know of a few EvE guilds that are ran more ruthlessly than the worst (RL) corporation you've ever worked for.
Where you're told when and where to be online, what ship to fly, what skills to learn, what equipment to outfit, if you're a fighter.
Where you're told how much ore you are to mine in a given amount of time, if you're a miner.
Where you're told what to produce and where to get it, if you're builder or transporter.
All with levels of management who have to report what they're doing, with set goals that have to be met, and if you don't meet it, well, it's been a pleasure to work with you, you have 24 hours to leave our space before we open fire on you.That's not playing anymore, though.
That's worse than working a second job.
That's working a second job and paying to do it.</sentencetext>
	<parent>http://www.semanticweb.org/ontologies/ConversationInstances.owl#comment09_05_28_029216.28120937</parent>
</comment>
<comment>
	<id>http://www.semanticweb.org/ontologies/ConversationInstances.owl#comment09_05_28_029216.28120933</id>
	<title>Subscription based addiction</title>
	<author>Anonymous</author>
	<datestamp>1243507440000</datestamp>
	<modclass>Interestin</modclass>
	<modscore>5</modscore>
	<htmltext>If a game has me hooked, addicted, and I play it for hours at a time for weeks on end- fine. I'm getting enjoyment, the developers get money, everybody wins. But it seems to me that the games that pull me in the most are those I buy outright, not the WOW-alikes that are subscription based. Surely if you're paying monthly there's always going to be a pressure on Devs to create addictive play? If I'm addicted to a bought-outright game, it's <i>because it's a good game</i>. That can't always be said for pay monthly games- the grind, the acheivements, the high-level horsie you just have to own- do they really add to the game, or do they just feed your addiction?</htmltext>
<tokenext>If a game has me hooked , addicted , and I play it for hours at a time for weeks on end- fine .
I 'm getting enjoyment , the developers get money , everybody wins .
But it seems to me that the games that pull me in the most are those I buy outright , not the WOW-alikes that are subscription based .
Surely if you 're paying monthly there 's always going to be a pressure on Devs to create addictive play ?
If I 'm addicted to a bought-outright game , it 's because it 's a good game .
That ca n't always be said for pay monthly games- the grind , the acheivements , the high-level horsie you just have to own- do they really add to the game , or do they just feed your addiction ?</tokentext>
<sentencetext>If a game has me hooked, addicted, and I play it for hours at a time for weeks on end- fine.
I'm getting enjoyment, the developers get money, everybody wins.
But it seems to me that the games that pull me in the most are those I buy outright, not the WOW-alikes that are subscription based.
Surely if you're paying monthly there's always going to be a pressure on Devs to create addictive play?
If I'm addicted to a bought-outright game, it's because it's a good game.
That can't always be said for pay monthly games- the grind, the acheivements, the high-level horsie you just have to own- do they really add to the game, or do they just feed your addiction?</sentencetext>
</comment>
<comment>
	<id>http://www.semanticweb.org/ontologies/ConversationInstances.owl#comment09_05_28_029216.28145179</id>
	<title>Re:Companionship is addictive</title>
	<author>TempeTerra</author>
	<datestamp>1243598580000</datestamp>
	<modclass>None</modclass>
	<modscore>1</modscore>
	<htmltext><p>Interesting that you should mention those games; they're the same ones I keep coming back to (well, not nethack. Too perverse. But other roguelikes). I would also add X-COM (the original or Terror from the Deep), and honourabe mention to Alpha Centauri even though it's Civilisation in all but name.</p><p>Something to do with randomly generated but coherent maps really scratches an itch for me. It also stops the AI from cheating by being customised for a specific map. I think one of the big failures of the X-COM remakes has been that they sacrifice the jigsaw puzzle maps of the original for 'ooo 3d rendered, but only four maps'.</p><p>I would welcome suggestions of other games that do similar random content generation.</p></htmltext>
<tokenext>Interesting that you should mention those games ; they 're the same ones I keep coming back to ( well , not nethack .
Too perverse .
But other roguelikes ) .
I would also add X-COM ( the original or Terror from the Deep ) , and honourabe mention to Alpha Centauri even though it 's Civilisation in all but name.Something to do with randomly generated but coherent maps really scratches an itch for me .
It also stops the AI from cheating by being customised for a specific map .
I think one of the big failures of the X-COM remakes has been that they sacrifice the jigsaw puzzle maps of the original for 'ooo 3d rendered , but only four maps'.I would welcome suggestions of other games that do similar random content generation .</tokentext>
<sentencetext>Interesting that you should mention those games; they're the same ones I keep coming back to (well, not nethack.
Too perverse.
But other roguelikes).
I would also add X-COM (the original or Terror from the Deep), and honourabe mention to Alpha Centauri even though it's Civilisation in all but name.Something to do with randomly generated but coherent maps really scratches an itch for me.
It also stops the AI from cheating by being customised for a specific map.
I think one of the big failures of the X-COM remakes has been that they sacrifice the jigsaw puzzle maps of the original for 'ooo 3d rendered, but only four maps'.I would welcome suggestions of other games that do similar random content generation.</sentencetext>
	<parent>http://www.semanticweb.org/ontologies/ConversationInstances.owl#comment09_05_28_029216.28122549</parent>
</comment>
<comment>
	<id>http://www.semanticweb.org/ontologies/ConversationInstances.owl#comment09_05_28_029216.28122893</id>
	<title>Not just MMOs</title>
	<author>VGPowerlord</author>
	<datestamp>1243521960000</datestamp>
	<modclass>Insightful</modclass>
	<modscore>2</modscore>
	<htmltext><p>Disclaimer: I have played WoW in the past.</p><p>It's not just MMOs that are addicting.  Any online game can be addicting.  Heck, even offline games can be addicting.</p><p>Currently, Team Fortress 2 for the PC is my addiction.  One of the communities I'm part of has their own server and is currently thinking about getting a second one due to its popularity.</p><p>It's fun because you play against people you know and, unlike World of Warcraft, it doesn't matter how little or much you play, as your character never really changes.</p><p>Of course, Valve continuing to release updates has made it easier to convince some of my friends to play.  It helped a lot when Valve had the sale on The Orange Box for $10 a few weeks ago, though...</p></htmltext>
<tokenext>Disclaimer : I have played WoW in the past.It 's not just MMOs that are addicting .
Any online game can be addicting .
Heck , even offline games can be addicting.Currently , Team Fortress 2 for the PC is my addiction .
One of the communities I 'm part of has their own server and is currently thinking about getting a second one due to its popularity.It 's fun because you play against people you know and , unlike World of Warcraft , it does n't matter how little or much you play , as your character never really changes.Of course , Valve continuing to release updates has made it easier to convince some of my friends to play .
It helped a lot when Valve had the sale on The Orange Box for $ 10 a few weeks ago , though.. .</tokentext>
<sentencetext>Disclaimer: I have played WoW in the past.It's not just MMOs that are addicting.
Any online game can be addicting.
Heck, even offline games can be addicting.Currently, Team Fortress 2 for the PC is my addiction.
One of the communities I'm part of has their own server and is currently thinking about getting a second one due to its popularity.It's fun because you play against people you know and, unlike World of Warcraft, it doesn't matter how little or much you play, as your character never really changes.Of course, Valve continuing to release updates has made it easier to convince some of my friends to play.
It helped a lot when Valve had the sale on The Orange Box for $10 a few weeks ago, though...</sentencetext>
</comment>
<comment>
	<id>http://www.semanticweb.org/ontologies/ConversationInstances.owl#comment09_05_28_029216.28121421</id>
	<title>Casino-like games from Blizzard</title>
	<author>Jack Zombie</author>
	<datestamp>1243512660000</datestamp>
	<modclass>Interestin</modclass>
	<modscore>2</modscore>
	<htmltext><p>Actually, a Blizzard developer said in an old interview that they closely copied the 'constant rewards' system of casinos' slot machines when developing Diablo. They're not doing this at random.</p><p>I know it's on the Internet, but I've tried looking and couldn't find it. If someone could find that one or two paragraph quote, it would be great for discussion.</p></div>
	</htmltext>
<tokenext>Actually , a Blizzard developer said in an old interview that they closely copied the 'constant rewards ' system of casinos ' slot machines when developing Diablo .
They 're not doing this at random.I know it 's on the Internet , but I 've tried looking and could n't find it .
If someone could find that one or two paragraph quote , it would be great for discussion .</tokentext>
<sentencetext>Actually, a Blizzard developer said in an old interview that they closely copied the 'constant rewards' system of casinos' slot machines when developing Diablo.
They're not doing this at random.I know it's on the Internet, but I've tried looking and couldn't find it.
If someone could find that one or two paragraph quote, it would be great for discussion.
	</sentencetext>
</comment>
<comment>
	<id>http://www.semanticweb.org/ontologies/ConversationInstances.owl#comment09_05_28_029216.28127181</id>
	<title>Re:Subscription based addiction</title>
	<author>brkello</author>
	<datestamp>1243538820000</datestamp>
	<modclass>None</modclass>
	<modscore>1</modscore>
	<htmltext>So you are saying that MMO's are only addictive and can not be good games? Who are you to say what others find fun or not fun?  Non-MMOs like Disgaea are fun, addictive, and have plenty of grinding to keep you addicted so you can level up every item in the game to its highest level.  I guess a game is a game to me.  MMOs are just games with a community aspect to it that get updated often.  There are good ones and bad ones.  The social aspect and the adding of new goals can keep people hooked, but that doesn't mean it can't be a good game.</htmltext>
<tokenext>So you are saying that MMO 's are only addictive and can not be good games ?
Who are you to say what others find fun or not fun ?
Non-MMOs like Disgaea are fun , addictive , and have plenty of grinding to keep you addicted so you can level up every item in the game to its highest level .
I guess a game is a game to me .
MMOs are just games with a community aspect to it that get updated often .
There are good ones and bad ones .
The social aspect and the adding of new goals can keep people hooked , but that does n't mean it ca n't be a good game .</tokentext>
<sentencetext>So you are saying that MMO's are only addictive and can not be good games?
Who are you to say what others find fun or not fun?
Non-MMOs like Disgaea are fun, addictive, and have plenty of grinding to keep you addicted so you can level up every item in the game to its highest level.
I guess a game is a game to me.
MMOs are just games with a community aspect to it that get updated often.
There are good ones and bad ones.
The social aspect and the adding of new goals can keep people hooked, but that doesn't mean it can't be a good game.</sentencetext>
	<parent>http://www.semanticweb.org/ontologies/ConversationInstances.owl#comment09_05_28_029216.28120933</parent>
</comment>
<comment>
	<id>http://www.semanticweb.org/ontologies/ConversationInstances.owl#comment09_05_28_029216.28123451</id>
	<title>Re:Companionship is addictive</title>
	<author>Sj0</author>
	<datestamp>1243524420000</datestamp>
	<modclass>None</modclass>
	<modscore>1</modscore>
	<htmltext><p>Sounds more like "Fucking moron is a moron" to me.</p><p>The guy makes 6-figures, barely ever has free time, and instead of seeing the actual world, decides instead to play a video game about seeing the virtual world?</p></htmltext>
<tokenext>Sounds more like " Fucking moron is a moron " to me.The guy makes 6-figures , barely ever has free time , and instead of seeing the actual world , decides instead to play a video game about seeing the virtual world ?</tokentext>
<sentencetext>Sounds more like "Fucking moron is a moron" to me.The guy makes 6-figures, barely ever has free time, and instead of seeing the actual world, decides instead to play a video game about seeing the virtual world?</sentencetext>
	<parent>http://www.semanticweb.org/ontologies/ConversationInstances.owl#comment09_05_28_029216.28121225</parent>
</comment>
<comment>
	<id>http://www.semanticweb.org/ontologies/ConversationInstances.owl#comment09_05_28_029216.28121141</id>
	<title>Nothing Really New</title>
	<author>Valen0</author>
	<datestamp>1243509420000</datestamp>
	<modclass>Informativ</modclass>
	<modscore>4</modscore>
	<htmltext><p>The conclusion that this article makes are not really new. Nick Yee did similar studies on MMOG addiction with EverQuest many years ago. These were the studies that I could find:</p><p><a href="http://www.nickyee.com/eqt/skinner.html" title="nickyee.com">The Norrathian Scrolls: The Virtual Skinner Box</a> [nickyee.com]</p><p><a href="http://www.nickyee.com/hub/addiction/home.html" title="nickyee.com">Ariadne: Understanding Game Addiction</a> [nickyee.com]</p></htmltext>
<tokenext>The conclusion that this article makes are not really new .
Nick Yee did similar studies on MMOG addiction with EverQuest many years ago .
These were the studies that I could find : The Norrathian Scrolls : The Virtual Skinner Box [ nickyee.com ] Ariadne : Understanding Game Addiction [ nickyee.com ]</tokentext>
<sentencetext>The conclusion that this article makes are not really new.
Nick Yee did similar studies on MMOG addiction with EverQuest many years ago.
These were the studies that I could find:The Norrathian Scrolls: The Virtual Skinner Box [nickyee.com]Ariadne: Understanding Game Addiction [nickyee.com]</sentencetext>
</comment>
<comment>
	<id>http://www.semanticweb.org/ontologies/ConversationInstances.owl#comment09_05_28_029216.28121277</id>
	<title>Obligatory</title>
	<author>skrolle2</author>
	<datestamp>1243510740000</datestamp>
	<modclass>None</modclass>
	<modscore>1</modscore>
	<htmltext><p>First post! You received 25xp. DING! You reached level 5.</p></htmltext>
<tokenext>First post !
You received 25xp .
DING ! You reached level 5 .</tokentext>
<sentencetext>First post!
You received 25xp.
DING! You reached level 5.</sentencetext>
</comment>
<comment>
	<id>http://www.semanticweb.org/ontologies/ConversationInstances.owl#comment09_05_28_029216.28127411</id>
	<title>Re:Companionship is addictive</title>
	<author>brkello</author>
	<datestamp>1243539480000</datestamp>
	<modclass>None</modclass>
	<modscore>1</modscore>
	<htmltext>Um, that's not truth.  I find it funny how Slashdot would mod you to oblivion for making that statement about people who play video games in general, but since it is popular to bash WoW, and those who play it, on here, it gets modded +5.<br> <br>Truth is there are all sort of people who play.  And yeah, I take it personally because I play.  I am a 30 something who plays for two soccer teams and am quite athletic.  I have a very successful career and own my house.  I play first chair second violin in a local orchestra.  I also have a good looking girl friend and plenty of amazing friends.<br> <br>I play WoW because I find it fun.  The nicest thing I can think to say to you is: Fuck you for stereotyping people.  I expect better from this site and its mods.</htmltext>
<tokenext>Um , that 's not truth .
I find it funny how Slashdot would mod you to oblivion for making that statement about people who play video games in general , but since it is popular to bash WoW , and those who play it , on here , it gets modded + 5 .
Truth is there are all sort of people who play .
And yeah , I take it personally because I play .
I am a 30 something who plays for two soccer teams and am quite athletic .
I have a very successful career and own my house .
I play first chair second violin in a local orchestra .
I also have a good looking girl friend and plenty of amazing friends .
I play WoW because I find it fun .
The nicest thing I can think to say to you is : Fuck you for stereotyping people .
I expect better from this site and its mods .</tokentext>
<sentencetext>Um, that's not truth.
I find it funny how Slashdot would mod you to oblivion for making that statement about people who play video games in general, but since it is popular to bash WoW, and those who play it, on here, it gets modded +5.
Truth is there are all sort of people who play.
And yeah, I take it personally because I play.
I am a 30 something who plays for two soccer teams and am quite athletic.
I have a very successful career and own my house.
I play first chair second violin in a local orchestra.
I also have a good looking girl friend and plenty of amazing friends.
I play WoW because I find it fun.
The nicest thing I can think to say to you is: Fuck you for stereotyping people.
I expect better from this site and its mods.</sentencetext>
	<parent>http://www.semanticweb.org/ontologies/ConversationInstances.owl#comment09_05_28_029216.28120937</parent>
</comment>
<comment>
	<id>http://www.semanticweb.org/ontologies/ConversationInstances.owl#comment09_05_28_029216.28121533</id>
	<title>Re:It should be obvious that it's rewarding play.</title>
	<author>Anonymous</author>
	<datestamp>1243513860000</datestamp>
	<modclass>None</modclass>
	<modscore>0</modscore>
	<htmltext><p>The reward is the dopamine release when you "accomplish" something.  They have things divided up so you get that at every level: when you kill the mob, when you kill the mob that has the item, when you finish killing 214 mobs to get the 10 items, when you actually turn in the quest, when you complete the chain of quest, when you "level"...</p><p>And spread out just enough that you keep wanting only a little more, and never feel like you're <em>done</em>.</p><p>If you divide up your real daily tasks like that, you could accomplish some pretty intense focus, I'll bet.</p></htmltext>
<tokenext>The reward is the dopamine release when you " accomplish " something .
They have things divided up so you get that at every level : when you kill the mob , when you kill the mob that has the item , when you finish killing 214 mobs to get the 10 items , when you actually turn in the quest , when you complete the chain of quest , when you " level " ...And spread out just enough that you keep wanting only a little more , and never feel like you 're done.If you divide up your real daily tasks like that , you could accomplish some pretty intense focus , I 'll bet .</tokentext>
<sentencetext>The reward is the dopamine release when you "accomplish" something.
They have things divided up so you get that at every level: when you kill the mob, when you kill the mob that has the item, when you finish killing 214 mobs to get the 10 items, when you actually turn in the quest, when you complete the chain of quest, when you "level"...And spread out just enough that you keep wanting only a little more, and never feel like you're done.If you divide up your real daily tasks like that, you could accomplish some pretty intense focus, I'll bet.</sentencetext>
	<parent>http://www.semanticweb.org/ontologies/ConversationInstances.owl#comment09_05_28_029216.28121105</parent>
</comment>
<comment>
	<id>http://www.semanticweb.org/ontologies/ConversationInstances.owl#comment09_05_28_029216.28121411</id>
	<title>It's a blend</title>
	<author>Anonymous</author>
	<datestamp>1243512480000</datestamp>
	<modclass>Insightful</modclass>
	<modscore>5</modscore>
	<htmltext><p>WoW's "addictive" nature is a blend of many components.</p><p>First and foremost, it's the reward system. Human beings do things due to rewards. That's how we work. We used to hunt and gather, and our reward was meat and berries. We went, we did, we got something, we were pleased. In today's world, that doesn't work out anymore so well. Usually, the reward you get is abstracted away from your work too far for you to make that connection. We work a month and eventually, our accout grows a bit. But we don't see how they are connected. It's not like I get some kind of micropayment for every line of code I write or debug.</p><p>Even if, what kind of reward is money? It's again an abstract concept that has no "real" value until it's redeemed for what you actually want.</p><p>WoW gives you very directly reward for actions. First, there's that fanfare playing when you accomplish something (don't you think that doesn't matter! It tells you "you did that well", it praises you), you get some goods (more or less useful), what really counts, though, is that the game acknowledges that you actually "did something".</p><p>The next part is user interaction and commitment. Since people do rely on each other and have to, you are guilt tripped into playing even if you don't want to. They need a healer/tank/whatever or they can't accomplish their goal. Your decision to stay away from it lets four (or 24, or 39) people down. This in turn makes the player feel appreciated, welcome and needed. And trust me, today, a lot of people feel like they ain't needed or appreciated. Or even welcome.</p><p>The sense of accomplishment, where you feel like you progress. Today, again, we don't really get that feeling very often. You might, in school, when you ascend through the classes towards graduation. In your workplace? Maybe stuck in a burger flipper job? Where do you progress? Where does your life go to? WoW tells you exactly where it's heading. You can watch your progress by watching your level and the kind of outfit you wear. More over, everyone else, not just a small subset of people who happen to judge success by the same yard stick as you, everyone in the game can appreciate what you have "done", because everyone else uses the same gauge to measure success: Level and equipment.</p><p>Yet at the same time, there's still the feeling of having no responsibility, it's still a no-commitment thing. You could just log off and nobody could hold it against you. There ain't any real life issues to deal with should you decide to just leave. No job that you'll lose, no family you would lose, no class you could fail, just because you decided you don't wanna anymore.</p></htmltext>
<tokenext>WoW 's " addictive " nature is a blend of many components.First and foremost , it 's the reward system .
Human beings do things due to rewards .
That 's how we work .
We used to hunt and gather , and our reward was meat and berries .
We went , we did , we got something , we were pleased .
In today 's world , that does n't work out anymore so well .
Usually , the reward you get is abstracted away from your work too far for you to make that connection .
We work a month and eventually , our accout grows a bit .
But we do n't see how they are connected .
It 's not like I get some kind of micropayment for every line of code I write or debug.Even if , what kind of reward is money ?
It 's again an abstract concept that has no " real " value until it 's redeemed for what you actually want.WoW gives you very directly reward for actions .
First , there 's that fanfare playing when you accomplish something ( do n't you think that does n't matter !
It tells you " you did that well " , it praises you ) , you get some goods ( more or less useful ) , what really counts , though , is that the game acknowledges that you actually " did something " .The next part is user interaction and commitment .
Since people do rely on each other and have to , you are guilt tripped into playing even if you do n't want to .
They need a healer/tank/whatever or they ca n't accomplish their goal .
Your decision to stay away from it lets four ( or 24 , or 39 ) people down .
This in turn makes the player feel appreciated , welcome and needed .
And trust me , today , a lot of people feel like they ai n't needed or appreciated .
Or even welcome.The sense of accomplishment , where you feel like you progress .
Today , again , we do n't really get that feeling very often .
You might , in school , when you ascend through the classes towards graduation .
In your workplace ?
Maybe stuck in a burger flipper job ?
Where do you progress ?
Where does your life go to ?
WoW tells you exactly where it 's heading .
You can watch your progress by watching your level and the kind of outfit you wear .
More over , everyone else , not just a small subset of people who happen to judge success by the same yard stick as you , everyone in the game can appreciate what you have " done " , because everyone else uses the same gauge to measure success : Level and equipment.Yet at the same time , there 's still the feeling of having no responsibility , it 's still a no-commitment thing .
You could just log off and nobody could hold it against you .
There ai n't any real life issues to deal with should you decide to just leave .
No job that you 'll lose , no family you would lose , no class you could fail , just because you decided you do n't wan na anymore .</tokentext>
<sentencetext>WoW's "addictive" nature is a blend of many components.First and foremost, it's the reward system.
Human beings do things due to rewards.
That's how we work.
We used to hunt and gather, and our reward was meat and berries.
We went, we did, we got something, we were pleased.
In today's world, that doesn't work out anymore so well.
Usually, the reward you get is abstracted away from your work too far for you to make that connection.
We work a month and eventually, our accout grows a bit.
But we don't see how they are connected.
It's not like I get some kind of micropayment for every line of code I write or debug.Even if, what kind of reward is money?
It's again an abstract concept that has no "real" value until it's redeemed for what you actually want.WoW gives you very directly reward for actions.
First, there's that fanfare playing when you accomplish something (don't you think that doesn't matter!
It tells you "you did that well", it praises you), you get some goods (more or less useful), what really counts, though, is that the game acknowledges that you actually "did something".The next part is user interaction and commitment.
Since people do rely on each other and have to, you are guilt tripped into playing even if you don't want to.
They need a healer/tank/whatever or they can't accomplish their goal.
Your decision to stay away from it lets four (or 24, or 39) people down.
This in turn makes the player feel appreciated, welcome and needed.
And trust me, today, a lot of people feel like they ain't needed or appreciated.
Or even welcome.The sense of accomplishment, where you feel like you progress.
Today, again, we don't really get that feeling very often.
You might, in school, when you ascend through the classes towards graduation.
In your workplace?
Maybe stuck in a burger flipper job?
Where do you progress?
Where does your life go to?
WoW tells you exactly where it's heading.
You can watch your progress by watching your level and the kind of outfit you wear.
More over, everyone else, not just a small subset of people who happen to judge success by the same yard stick as you, everyone in the game can appreciate what you have "done", because everyone else uses the same gauge to measure success: Level and equipment.Yet at the same time, there's still the feeling of having no responsibility, it's still a no-commitment thing.
You could just log off and nobody could hold it against you.
There ain't any real life issues to deal with should you decide to just leave.
No job that you'll lose, no family you would lose, no class you could fail, just because you decided you don't wanna anymore.</sentencetext>
</comment>
<comment>
	<id>http://www.semanticweb.org/ontologies/ConversationInstances.owl#comment09_05_28_029216.28125335</id>
	<title>Re:Weak Article</title>
	<author>geekoid</author>
	<datestamp>1243532580000</datestamp>
	<modclass>None</modclass>
	<modscore>1</modscore>
	<htmltext><p>Wow, your attitude can't be more elitists.</p><p>You assume everyone who goes there knows all you do, you assume you know everything there is about the subject. Guess what? Not everyone ahs your experience, and even you were a noob.</p></htmltext>
<tokenext>Wow , your attitude ca n't be more elitists.You assume everyone who goes there knows all you do , you assume you know everything there is about the subject .
Guess what ?
Not everyone ahs your experience , and even you were a noob .</tokentext>
<sentencetext>Wow, your attitude can't be more elitists.You assume everyone who goes there knows all you do, you assume you know everything there is about the subject.
Guess what?
Not everyone ahs your experience, and even you were a noob.</sentencetext>
	<parent>http://www.semanticweb.org/ontologies/ConversationInstances.owl#comment09_05_28_029216.28122351</parent>
</comment>
<comment>
	<id>http://www.semanticweb.org/ontologies/ConversationInstances.owl#comment09_05_28_029216.28124659</id>
	<title>Re:It's a blend</title>
	<author>Quirkz</author>
	<datestamp>1243529580000</datestamp>
	<modclass>None</modclass>
	<modscore>1</modscore>
	<htmltext>Blend, eh? So it's like coffee? I hear that's pretty addictive, too.<p>

I think the answer is to outlaw blends. All or nothing. None of this "take the best of one thing and combine it with the best of the other" stuff.</p></htmltext>
<tokenext>Blend , eh ?
So it 's like coffee ?
I hear that 's pretty addictive , too .
I think the answer is to outlaw blends .
All or nothing .
None of this " take the best of one thing and combine it with the best of the other " stuff .</tokentext>
<sentencetext>Blend, eh?
So it's like coffee?
I hear that's pretty addictive, too.
I think the answer is to outlaw blends.
All or nothing.
None of this "take the best of one thing and combine it with the best of the other" stuff.</sentencetext>
	<parent>http://www.semanticweb.org/ontologies/ConversationInstances.owl#comment09_05_28_029216.28121411</parent>
</comment>
<comment>
	<id>http://www.semanticweb.org/ontologies/ConversationInstances.owl#comment09_05_28_029216.28124191</id>
	<title>Re:Companionship is addictive</title>
	<author>Anonymous</author>
	<datestamp>1243527840000</datestamp>
	<modclass>None</modclass>
	<modscore>0</modscore>
	<htmltext><p>Maybe I'm the exception too the rule, but I'm a commercially successful developer with a wife who also plays, both of us have multiple maxed characters, in a top end raiding guild.</p><p>In work life I manage a team of globally disparate developers delivering million dollar projects for some of the largest corporate entities in the world.</p><p>I guess I don't quite fit your stereotype. With subscription numbers in the millions the attempt to stereotype the typical WoW player is endeavor destined to fail, simple numbers dictate that there are only so many basement dwelling, parent subsided geeks in existence.</p><p>Why do we enjoy playing? For myself work involves complex problems (both technical and soft), high pressure and high steaks, WoW provides the opportunity to escape from this serious cut throat world, and interact with a meaningless fantasy environment without consequence. To be brutal its better than hookers and coke, consider it a cheap habit.</p></htmltext>
<tokenext>Maybe I 'm the exception too the rule , but I 'm a commercially successful developer with a wife who also plays , both of us have multiple maxed characters , in a top end raiding guild.In work life I manage a team of globally disparate developers delivering million dollar projects for some of the largest corporate entities in the world.I guess I do n't quite fit your stereotype .
With subscription numbers in the millions the attempt to stereotype the typical WoW player is endeavor destined to fail , simple numbers dictate that there are only so many basement dwelling , parent subsided geeks in existence.Why do we enjoy playing ?
For myself work involves complex problems ( both technical and soft ) , high pressure and high steaks , WoW provides the opportunity to escape from this serious cut throat world , and interact with a meaningless fantasy environment without consequence .
To be brutal its better than hookers and coke , consider it a cheap habit .</tokentext>
<sentencetext>Maybe I'm the exception too the rule, but I'm a commercially successful developer with a wife who also plays, both of us have multiple maxed characters, in a top end raiding guild.In work life I manage a team of globally disparate developers delivering million dollar projects for some of the largest corporate entities in the world.I guess I don't quite fit your stereotype.
With subscription numbers in the millions the attempt to stereotype the typical WoW player is endeavor destined to fail, simple numbers dictate that there are only so many basement dwelling, parent subsided geeks in existence.Why do we enjoy playing?
For myself work involves complex problems (both technical and soft), high pressure and high steaks, WoW provides the opportunity to escape from this serious cut throat world, and interact with a meaningless fantasy environment without consequence.
To be brutal its better than hookers and coke, consider it a cheap habit.</sentencetext>
	<parent>http://www.semanticweb.org/ontologies/ConversationInstances.owl#comment09_05_28_029216.28120937</parent>
</comment>
<comment>
	<id>http://www.semanticweb.org/ontologies/ConversationInstances.owl#comment09_05_28_029216.28124405</id>
	<title>Re:Companionship is addictive</title>
	<author>Anonymous</author>
	<datestamp>1243528620000</datestamp>
	<modclass>None</modclass>
	<modscore>0</modscore>
	<htmltext><p>If that is even close to accurate, then you're also going to find FBI agents doing raids with suspected terrorists and trying to infiltrate their guilds...</p></htmltext>
<tokenext>If that is even close to accurate , then you 're also going to find FBI agents doing raids with suspected terrorists and trying to infiltrate their guilds.. .</tokentext>
<sentencetext>If that is even close to accurate, then you're also going to find FBI agents doing raids with suspected terrorists and trying to infiltrate their guilds...</sentencetext>
	<parent>http://www.semanticweb.org/ontologies/ConversationInstances.owl#comment09_05_28_029216.28121477</parent>
</comment>
<comment>
	<id>http://www.semanticweb.org/ontologies/ConversationInstances.owl#comment09_05_28_029216.28120979</id>
	<title>Rewards.</title>
	<author>Kavorkian\_scarf</author>
	<datestamp>1243507920000</datestamp>
	<modclass>Insightful</modclass>
	<modscore>4</modscore>
	<htmltext>Well it didn't post my last comment.
I was addicted to the rewards that were available to me, and the clear cut, investment required for them. Do this X many times, get this in return. Kill X many of this, and get this.
I was and still am(sorta) addicted to wow. I<nobr> <wbr></nobr>/played my main over 200days(pre BC), id been there since it went live, with 5 other mains all 60 with alot of<nobr> <wbr></nobr>/played time on them. It was mostly a replacement for the lack of things I had to show for myself.
Before people jump down my throat, its not like I sat in my room all day playing (almost) I was a social recluse by choice, I enjoyed my life as it was, and I just found that I lacked the disciplin and the means of which to obtain the things I wanted for myself. WoW was my answer.</htmltext>
<tokenext>Well it did n't post my last comment .
I was addicted to the rewards that were available to me , and the clear cut , investment required for them .
Do this X many times , get this in return .
Kill X many of this , and get this .
I was and still am ( sorta ) addicted to wow .
I /played my main over 200days ( pre BC ) , id been there since it went live , with 5 other mains all 60 with alot of /played time on them .
It was mostly a replacement for the lack of things I had to show for myself .
Before people jump down my throat , its not like I sat in my room all day playing ( almost ) I was a social recluse by choice , I enjoyed my life as it was , and I just found that I lacked the disciplin and the means of which to obtain the things I wanted for myself .
WoW was my answer .</tokentext>
<sentencetext>Well it didn't post my last comment.
I was addicted to the rewards that were available to me, and the clear cut, investment required for them.
Do this X many times, get this in return.
Kill X many of this, and get this.
I was and still am(sorta) addicted to wow.
I /played my main over 200days(pre BC), id been there since it went live, with 5 other mains all 60 with alot of /played time on them.
It was mostly a replacement for the lack of things I had to show for myself.
Before people jump down my throat, its not like I sat in my room all day playing (almost) I was a social recluse by choice, I enjoyed my life as it was, and I just found that I lacked the disciplin and the means of which to obtain the things I wanted for myself.
WoW was my answer.</sentencetext>
</comment>
<comment>
	<id>http://www.semanticweb.org/ontologies/ConversationInstances.owl#comment09_05_28_029216.28121741</id>
	<title>missing the point?</title>
	<author>Anonymous</author>
	<datestamp>1243515840000</datestamp>
	<modclass>None</modclass>
	<modscore>0</modscore>
	<htmltext><p>not sure, but I feel that quite some of you are actually missing the point: it seems as if many assumed that only obese, unemployed fastfood lovers could become addicted, whereas 6-figure-earning engineers were imune.<br>just because one seems more pathetic than the other one doesnt mean anything.</p><p>which brings me to the second point: who is actually more pathetic, or better phrased, who should we be more concerned about: those that want to be someone else in virtual worlds because their life is not as thez would like it to be, or those that have monez and power in real life and try to follow their greedy-power-hunger even in virtual worlds? sorry talking cliches here.</p><p>so, what the point of discussions should be:<br>- when is someone addicted<br>- what effects / risks / dangers does it have<br>- what makes it addictive</p></htmltext>
<tokenext>not sure , but I feel that quite some of you are actually missing the point : it seems as if many assumed that only obese , unemployed fastfood lovers could become addicted , whereas 6-figure-earning engineers were imune.just because one seems more pathetic than the other one doesnt mean anything.which brings me to the second point : who is actually more pathetic , or better phrased , who should we be more concerned about : those that want to be someone else in virtual worlds because their life is not as thez would like it to be , or those that have monez and power in real life and try to follow their greedy-power-hunger even in virtual worlds ?
sorry talking cliches here.so , what the point of discussions should be : - when is someone addicted- what effects / risks / dangers does it have- what makes it addictive</tokentext>
<sentencetext>not sure, but I feel that quite some of you are actually missing the point: it seems as if many assumed that only obese, unemployed fastfood lovers could become addicted, whereas 6-figure-earning engineers were imune.just because one seems more pathetic than the other one doesnt mean anything.which brings me to the second point: who is actually more pathetic, or better phrased, who should we be more concerned about: those that want to be someone else in virtual worlds because their life is not as thez would like it to be, or those that have monez and power in real life and try to follow their greedy-power-hunger even in virtual worlds?
sorry talking cliches here.so, what the point of discussions should be:- when is someone addicted- what effects / risks / dangers does it have- what makes it addictive</sentencetext>
</comment>
<comment>
	<id>http://www.semanticweb.org/ontologies/ConversationInstances.owl#comment09_05_28_029216.28121663</id>
	<title>Re:Companionship is addictive</title>
	<author>Krneki</author>
	<datestamp>1243515180000</datestamp>
	<modclass>None</modclass>
	<modscore>1</modscore>
	<htmltext>I doubt you can be a good leader if you are an asshole in real life.<br><br>In the same way as in real life, you have to know how to socialize in the game. If you don't know how to follow the rules and respect your team mates you are out.</htmltext>
<tokenext>I doubt you can be a good leader if you are an asshole in real life.In the same way as in real life , you have to know how to socialize in the game .
If you do n't know how to follow the rules and respect your team mates you are out .</tokentext>
<sentencetext>I doubt you can be a good leader if you are an asshole in real life.In the same way as in real life, you have to know how to socialize in the game.
If you don't know how to follow the rules and respect your team mates you are out.</sentencetext>
	<parent>http://www.semanticweb.org/ontologies/ConversationInstances.owl#comment09_05_28_029216.28120937</parent>
</comment>
<comment>
	<id>http://www.semanticweb.org/ontologies/ConversationInstances.owl#comment09_05_28_029216.28126005</id>
	<title>Re:Companionship is addictive</title>
	<author>Anonymous</author>
	<datestamp>1243535100000</datestamp>
	<modclass>None</modclass>
	<modscore>0</modscore>
	<htmltext><p><div class="quote"><p>The statistician in me says<nobr> <wbr></nobr>...</p></div><p>... the average depth of this lake is just a half meter... let's swim!</p></div>
	</htmltext>
<tokenext>The statistician in me says ...... the average depth of this lake is just a half meter... let 's swim !</tokentext>
<sentencetext>The statistician in me says ...... the average depth of this lake is just a half meter... let's swim!
	</sentencetext>
	<parent>http://www.semanticweb.org/ontologies/ConversationInstances.owl#comment09_05_28_029216.28121477</parent>
</comment>
<comment>
	<id>http://www.semanticweb.org/ontologies/ConversationInstances.owl#comment09_05_28_029216.28122549</id>
	<title>Re:Companionship is addictive</title>
	<author>Anonymous</author>
	<datestamp>1243520280000</datestamp>
	<modclass>Interestin</modclass>
	<modscore>2</modscore>
	<htmltext><p>Personally, I don't care much for companionship in a game.  I've never been much into multiplayer games at all.  The game I find really addictive is Civilization.  That and Nethack.  The "Just..one..more..turn!" appeal of these games that entire nights, or even weekends can disappear into them.</p><p>I don't play much of either any more, I spend more time expanding my collection of classic consoles.  But my point is, there's something besides just surrogate socializing that makes games addictive.</p></htmltext>
<tokenext>Personally , I do n't care much for companionship in a game .
I 've never been much into multiplayer games at all .
The game I find really addictive is Civilization .
That and Nethack .
The " Just..one..more..turn !
" appeal of these games that entire nights , or even weekends can disappear into them.I do n't play much of either any more , I spend more time expanding my collection of classic consoles .
But my point is , there 's something besides just surrogate socializing that makes games addictive .</tokentext>
<sentencetext>Personally, I don't care much for companionship in a game.
I've never been much into multiplayer games at all.
The game I find really addictive is Civilization.
That and Nethack.
The "Just..one..more..turn!
" appeal of these games that entire nights, or even weekends can disappear into them.I don't play much of either any more, I spend more time expanding my collection of classic consoles.
But my point is, there's something besides just surrogate socializing that makes games addictive.</sentencetext>
	<parent>http://www.semanticweb.org/ontologies/ConversationInstances.owl#comment09_05_28_029216.28120937</parent>
</comment>
<comment>
	<id>http://www.semanticweb.org/ontologies/ConversationInstances.owl#comment09_05_28_029216.28123611</id>
	<title>Education:  Why can't it be more addictive</title>
	<author>Protocron</author>
	<datestamp>1243525200000</datestamp>
	<modclass>None</modclass>
	<modscore>1</modscore>
	<htmltext><p>What the hell is wrong with this society?  We have people holed up in their rooms playing these MMORPG's and they're not learning anything except how to raid and grind.  They could be doing learning through grinding just as easily.  If only we had people developing these kid of games.  Could you imagine a kid/teenager/basement dweller saying, "I'm addicted to Calculus!!!!"  Or, "I hate the grind between Partical Physics PHD 1.1 and Partical Physics 1.2."<br>We/they play these games with stupid rewards for something that is completely intangible.  At the very best you could say that these games are teaching people who to function in a team environment and how to organize projects.  That's really about it.<br>Oh MMORPG why can you be more educational.</p></htmltext>
<tokenext>What the hell is wrong with this society ?
We have people holed up in their rooms playing these MMORPG 's and they 're not learning anything except how to raid and grind .
They could be doing learning through grinding just as easily .
If only we had people developing these kid of games .
Could you imagine a kid/teenager/basement dweller saying , " I 'm addicted to Calculus ! ! ! !
" Or , " I hate the grind between Partical Physics PHD 1.1 and Partical Physics 1.2 .
" We/they play these games with stupid rewards for something that is completely intangible .
At the very best you could say that these games are teaching people who to function in a team environment and how to organize projects .
That 's really about it.Oh MMORPG why can you be more educational .</tokentext>
<sentencetext>What the hell is wrong with this society?
We have people holed up in their rooms playing these MMORPG's and they're not learning anything except how to raid and grind.
They could be doing learning through grinding just as easily.
If only we had people developing these kid of games.
Could you imagine a kid/teenager/basement dweller saying, "I'm addicted to Calculus!!!!
"  Or, "I hate the grind between Partical Physics PHD 1.1 and Partical Physics 1.2.
"We/they play these games with stupid rewards for something that is completely intangible.
At the very best you could say that these games are teaching people who to function in a team environment and how to organize projects.
That's really about it.Oh MMORPG why can you be more educational.</sentencetext>
</comment>
<comment>
	<id>http://www.semanticweb.org/ontologies/ConversationInstances.owl#comment09_05_28_029216.28123061</id>
	<title>I havent had time to post lately.</title>
	<author>LaminatorX</author>
	<datestamp>1243522740000</datestamp>
	<modclass>Funny</modclass>
	<modscore>2</modscore>
	<htmltext><p>I've been playing Heroin Hero 60 hours/week.  Someday I'll catch that pesky dragon!</p></htmltext>
<tokenext>I 've been playing Heroin Hero 60 hours/week .
Someday I 'll catch that pesky dragon !</tokentext>
<sentencetext>I've been playing Heroin Hero 60 hours/week.
Someday I'll catch that pesky dragon!</sentencetext>
</comment>
<comment>
	<id>http://www.semanticweb.org/ontologies/ConversationInstances.owl#comment09_05_28_029216.28121649</id>
	<title>Re:Firsty posty!</title>
	<author>gbjbaanb</author>
	<datestamp>1243515180000</datestamp>
	<modclass>None</modclass>
	<modscore>1</modscore>
	<htmltext><p>you jest, but there are other sites like Slashdot that offer rewards that are addictive. ServerFault and StackOverflow for example, has posts and comments from people laughingly saying that they are addicted to them, posting answers and questions in order to be awarded points along with a leaderboard and badges.</p><p>They are game-like, you keep in wanting to 'level up'. Ultimately its pointless (ha!) but we keep on wanting to play. I think its a social thing, where our position in society is mirrored (in a simple way) to a real-life social hierarchy. We all want to be the alpha male and win the herd of females. Which, in itself is why girls don't like the same games we play, they like the sexual thrill of chase games like pacman rather than the compete-for-position games men like.</p></htmltext>
<tokenext>you jest , but there are other sites like Slashdot that offer rewards that are addictive .
ServerFault and StackOverflow for example , has posts and comments from people laughingly saying that they are addicted to them , posting answers and questions in order to be awarded points along with a leaderboard and badges.They are game-like , you keep in wanting to 'level up' .
Ultimately its pointless ( ha !
) but we keep on wanting to play .
I think its a social thing , where our position in society is mirrored ( in a simple way ) to a real-life social hierarchy .
We all want to be the alpha male and win the herd of females .
Which , in itself is why girls do n't like the same games we play , they like the sexual thrill of chase games like pacman rather than the compete-for-position games men like .</tokentext>
<sentencetext>you jest, but there are other sites like Slashdot that offer rewards that are addictive.
ServerFault and StackOverflow for example, has posts and comments from people laughingly saying that they are addicted to them, posting answers and questions in order to be awarded points along with a leaderboard and badges.They are game-like, you keep in wanting to 'level up'.
Ultimately its pointless (ha!
) but we keep on wanting to play.
I think its a social thing, where our position in society is mirrored (in a simple way) to a real-life social hierarchy.
We all want to be the alpha male and win the herd of females.
Which, in itself is why girls don't like the same games we play, they like the sexual thrill of chase games like pacman rather than the compete-for-position games men like.</sentencetext>
	<parent>http://www.semanticweb.org/ontologies/ConversationInstances.owl#comment09_05_28_029216.28121101</parent>
</comment>
<comment>
	<id>http://www.semanticweb.org/ontologies/ConversationInstances.owl#comment09_05_28_029216.28123401</id>
	<title>Re:Companionship is addictive</title>
	<author>Maxo-Texas</author>
	<datestamp>1243524240000</datestamp>
	<modclass>None</modclass>
	<modscore>1</modscore>
	<htmltext><p>Everquest was addictive.</p><p>Running a 60 person guild for 24 months gave me a lot of the skills I use in my job running a team of 9.<br>It gave me a ton of experience dealing with politics.<br>It made me aware that a small core of people are rock solid- so you need to value them.<br>It really opened up my eyes about how many people are users (the best do not even see it themselves- they view themselves as good people).<br>But as long as they get what they need reasonably consistently, they stay.<br>It opened my eyes how fleeting "we'll always be buds" really is.</p><p>As an old D&amp;D hound, it was the closest thing to heaven.  if my hands had not gone bad, I'd be playing today.</p><p>Very irritating dealing with the "ubers" tho.  If I play again someday-- it will be when I'm retired and can be "uber" as well.</p></htmltext>
<tokenext>Everquest was addictive.Running a 60 person guild for 24 months gave me a lot of the skills I use in my job running a team of 9.It gave me a ton of experience dealing with politics.It made me aware that a small core of people are rock solid- so you need to value them.It really opened up my eyes about how many people are users ( the best do not even see it themselves- they view themselves as good people ) .But as long as they get what they need reasonably consistently , they stay.It opened my eyes how fleeting " we 'll always be buds " really is.As an old D&amp;D hound , it was the closest thing to heaven .
if my hands had not gone bad , I 'd be playing today.Very irritating dealing with the " ubers " tho .
If I play again someday-- it will be when I 'm retired and can be " uber " as well .</tokentext>
<sentencetext>Everquest was addictive.Running a 60 person guild for 24 months gave me a lot of the skills I use in my job running a team of 9.It gave me a ton of experience dealing with politics.It made me aware that a small core of people are rock solid- so you need to value them.It really opened up my eyes about how many people are users (the best do not even see it themselves- they view themselves as good people).But as long as they get what they need reasonably consistently, they stay.It opened my eyes how fleeting "we'll always be buds" really is.As an old D&amp;D hound, it was the closest thing to heaven.
if my hands had not gone bad, I'd be playing today.Very irritating dealing with the "ubers" tho.
If I play again someday-- it will be when I'm retired and can be "uber" as well.</sentencetext>
	<parent>http://www.semanticweb.org/ontologies/ConversationInstances.owl#comment09_05_28_029216.28120937</parent>
</comment>
<comment>
	<id>http://www.semanticweb.org/ontologies/ConversationInstances.owl#comment09_05_28_029216.28136405</id>
	<title>Re:Rewards.</title>
	<author>SL Baur</author>
	<datestamp>1243594740000</datestamp>
	<modclass>None</modclass>
	<modscore>1</modscore>
	<htmltext><p><div class="quote"><p>Does the achievement system actually help with that? Or is there something else?</p></div><p>The achievement system helps a lot.  I'm a carebear not a raider type and I find that collecting titles is fun.</p></div>
	</htmltext>
<tokenext>Does the achievement system actually help with that ?
Or is there something else ? The achievement system helps a lot .
I 'm a carebear not a raider type and I find that collecting titles is fun .</tokentext>
<sentencetext>Does the achievement system actually help with that?
Or is there something else?The achievement system helps a lot.
I'm a carebear not a raider type and I find that collecting titles is fun.
	</sentencetext>
	<parent>http://www.semanticweb.org/ontologies/ConversationInstances.owl#comment09_05_28_029216.28126345</parent>
</comment>
<comment>
	<id>http://www.semanticweb.org/ontologies/ConversationInstances.owl#comment09_05_28_029216.28123337</id>
	<title>Re:Subscription based addiction</title>
	<author>Anonymous</author>
	<datestamp>1243523940000</datestamp>
	<modclass>Interestin</modclass>
	<modscore>3</modscore>
	<htmltext>A few years ago I was in a relationship with someone who became addicted to WoW. In the course of the 8 months roughly that she lived with me her main character alone had well over 150 days played time. She was kicked out University because she was skipping classes to play WoW and was unable to hold down a job as she frequently called in sick in order to Raid/Farm. She became increasingly withdrawn from all aspects of real life including personal hygiene and maintained zero relationships in real life, managing to scare off even this hardcore nerd.</htmltext>
<tokenext>A few years ago I was in a relationship with someone who became addicted to WoW .
In the course of the 8 months roughly that she lived with me her main character alone had well over 150 days played time .
She was kicked out University because she was skipping classes to play WoW and was unable to hold down a job as she frequently called in sick in order to Raid/Farm .
She became increasingly withdrawn from all aspects of real life including personal hygiene and maintained zero relationships in real life , managing to scare off even this hardcore nerd .</tokentext>
<sentencetext>A few years ago I was in a relationship with someone who became addicted to WoW.
In the course of the 8 months roughly that she lived with me her main character alone had well over 150 days played time.
She was kicked out University because she was skipping classes to play WoW and was unable to hold down a job as she frequently called in sick in order to Raid/Farm.
She became increasingly withdrawn from all aspects of real life including personal hygiene and maintained zero relationships in real life, managing to scare off even this hardcore nerd.</sentencetext>
	<parent>http://www.semanticweb.org/ontologies/ConversationInstances.owl#comment09_05_28_029216.28120933</parent>
</comment>
<comment>
	<id>http://www.semanticweb.org/ontologies/ConversationInstances.owl#comment09_05_28_029216.28122275</id>
	<title>Re:Thanks for the heads up about rpg progress ques</title>
	<author>jonaskoelker</author>
	<datestamp>1243518900000</datestamp>
	<modclass>None</modclass>
	<modscore>1</modscore>
	<htmltext><p>It randomly generated my character name as "Inoob"</p><p>I don't like it<nobr> <wbr></nobr>:(</p></htmltext>
<tokenext>It randomly generated my character name as " Inoob " I do n't like it : (</tokentext>
<sentencetext>It randomly generated my character name as "Inoob"I don't like it :(</sentencetext>
	<parent>http://www.semanticweb.org/ontologies/ConversationInstances.owl#comment09_05_28_029216.28121245</parent>
</comment>
<comment>
	<id>http://www.semanticweb.org/ontologies/ConversationInstances.owl#comment09_05_28_029216.28123215</id>
	<title>Re:Companionship is addictive</title>
	<author>aicrules</author>
	<datestamp>1243523340000</datestamp>
	<modclass>None</modclass>
	<modscore>1</modscore>
	<htmltext>Hopefully he's very high 6 figures otherwise he's just a 40K a year worker who does a buttload of overtime.</htmltext>
<tokenext>Hopefully he 's very high 6 figures otherwise he 's just a 40K a year worker who does a buttload of overtime .</tokentext>
<sentencetext>Hopefully he's very high 6 figures otherwise he's just a 40K a year worker who does a buttload of overtime.</sentencetext>
	<parent>http://www.semanticweb.org/ontologies/ConversationInstances.owl#comment09_05_28_029216.28121225</parent>
</comment>
<comment>
	<id>http://www.semanticweb.org/ontologies/ConversationInstances.owl#comment09_05_28_029216.28121771</id>
	<title>Addictive ?</title>
	<author>Anonymous</author>
	<datestamp>1243515960000</datestamp>
	<modclass>None</modclass>
	<modscore>0</modscore>
	<htmltext>what made wow addictive? is a really good question i played the game for a year raided engame for a bit on my free time tought i had to invest some time on it to be able to raid every instance in a year. after that i just stopped playing. so i dont consider WoW addictive on the other hand plant vs zombies and peggle are like CRACK.</htmltext>
<tokenext>what made wow addictive ?
is a really good question i played the game for a year raided engame for a bit on my free time tought i had to invest some time on it to be able to raid every instance in a year .
after that i just stopped playing .
so i dont consider WoW addictive on the other hand plant vs zombies and peggle are like CRACK .</tokentext>
<sentencetext>what made wow addictive?
is a really good question i played the game for a year raided engame for a bit on my free time tought i had to invest some time on it to be able to raid every instance in a year.
after that i just stopped playing.
so i dont consider WoW addictive on the other hand plant vs zombies and peggle are like CRACK.</sentencetext>
</comment>
<comment>
	<id>http://www.semanticweb.org/ontologies/ConversationInstances.owl#comment09_05_28_029216.28152395</id>
	<title>This is why I refuse to buy WOW</title>
	<author>OnomatopoeiaSound</author>
	<datestamp>1243678140000</datestamp>
	<modclass>None</modclass>
	<modscore>1</modscore>
	<htmltext>I want to buy WOW. Many of my friends play WOW. I played the free trial for it, and enjoyed it quite a bit, despite the pacing being a bit too slow for my standards. However, I get addicted to things quite easily. I know that if I start playing WOW, the other facets of my life will take the back seat. I even have a bit of trouble focussing on other things besides Dungeons And Dragons sometimes. (I know, I'm a geek). Basically, I know that I would enjoy WOW, and by extention other MMORPGs, just a little bit too much. The only reason why I let myself play other video games is that the ones that I'm interested in have an ending. So no matter how addicted I get, there will come a point where I have to stop playing, for at least a little while.</htmltext>
<tokenext>I want to buy WOW .
Many of my friends play WOW .
I played the free trial for it , and enjoyed it quite a bit , despite the pacing being a bit too slow for my standards .
However , I get addicted to things quite easily .
I know that if I start playing WOW , the other facets of my life will take the back seat .
I even have a bit of trouble focussing on other things besides Dungeons And Dragons sometimes .
( I know , I 'm a geek ) .
Basically , I know that I would enjoy WOW , and by extention other MMORPGs , just a little bit too much .
The only reason why I let myself play other video games is that the ones that I 'm interested in have an ending .
So no matter how addicted I get , there will come a point where I have to stop playing , for at least a little while .</tokentext>
<sentencetext>I want to buy WOW.
Many of my friends play WOW.
I played the free trial for it, and enjoyed it quite a bit, despite the pacing being a bit too slow for my standards.
However, I get addicted to things quite easily.
I know that if I start playing WOW, the other facets of my life will take the back seat.
I even have a bit of trouble focussing on other things besides Dungeons And Dragons sometimes.
(I know, I'm a geek).
Basically, I know that I would enjoy WOW, and by extention other MMORPGs, just a little bit too much.
The only reason why I let myself play other video games is that the ones that I'm interested in have an ending.
So no matter how addicted I get, there will come a point where I have to stop playing, for at least a little while.</sentencetext>
</comment>
<comment>
	<id>http://www.semanticweb.org/ontologies/ConversationInstances.owl#comment09_05_28_029216.28129245</id>
	<title>Formal Definition of Addictive</title>
	<author>Anonymous</author>
	<datestamp>1243501560000</datestamp>
	<modclass>None</modclass>
	<modscore>0</modscore>
	<htmltext><p>The classical definition of addictive contains three separate elements:</p><p>1) reinforcing -- it stimulates some "do it again" circuit in the brain.  This is what most people casually call addictive.<br>2) withdrawal symptoms<br>3) dose escalation</p><p>You can see it's based on opiates.  If you apply it strictly to someone who has been smoking two packs a day for thirty<br>years, you can create an argument that cigarettes don't fit the formal definition (#3), even tho actually claiming that<br>cigarettes aren't addictive makes you look like an ass.</p><p>But if anyone is looking up anything from scientific literature, don't omit "reinforcing" as a search term.</p><p>Also include the word "craving".</p><p>I remain puzzled by an article a decade or two back in the journal Science, which "revealed" the<br>"discovery" that a major factor in cocaine addicts relapsing was "craving".  What puzzles is how this merits a journal<br>article, instead of a "Duh", but maybe establishing "craving" as a formal term in addiction research was reason enough.</p></htmltext>
<tokenext>The classical definition of addictive contains three separate elements : 1 ) reinforcing -- it stimulates some " do it again " circuit in the brain .
This is what most people casually call addictive.2 ) withdrawal symptoms3 ) dose escalationYou can see it 's based on opiates .
If you apply it strictly to someone who has been smoking two packs a day for thirtyyears , you can create an argument that cigarettes do n't fit the formal definition ( # 3 ) , even tho actually claiming thatcigarettes are n't addictive makes you look like an ass.But if anyone is looking up anything from scientific literature , do n't omit " reinforcing " as a search term.Also include the word " craving " .I remain puzzled by an article a decade or two back in the journal Science , which " revealed " the " discovery " that a major factor in cocaine addicts relapsing was " craving " .
What puzzles is how this merits a journalarticle , instead of a " Duh " , but maybe establishing " craving " as a formal term in addiction research was reason enough .</tokentext>
<sentencetext>The classical definition of addictive contains three separate elements:1) reinforcing -- it stimulates some "do it again" circuit in the brain.
This is what most people casually call addictive.2) withdrawal symptoms3) dose escalationYou can see it's based on opiates.
If you apply it strictly to someone who has been smoking two packs a day for thirtyyears, you can create an argument that cigarettes don't fit the formal definition (#3), even tho actually claiming thatcigarettes aren't addictive makes you look like an ass.But if anyone is looking up anything from scientific literature, don't omit "reinforcing" as a search term.Also include the word "craving".I remain puzzled by an article a decade or two back in the journal Science, which "revealed" the"discovery" that a major factor in cocaine addicts relapsing was "craving".
What puzzles is how this merits a journalarticle, instead of a "Duh", but maybe establishing "craving" as a formal term in addiction research was reason enough.</sentencetext>
	<parent>http://www.semanticweb.org/ontologies/ConversationInstances.owl#comment09_05_28_029216.28120929</parent>
</comment>
<comment>
	<id>http://www.semanticweb.org/ontologies/ConversationInstances.owl#comment09_05_28_029216.28121713</id>
	<title>Re:Companionship is addictive</title>
	<author>WeirdingWay</author>
	<datestamp>1243515600000</datestamp>
	<modclass>None</modclass>
	<modscore>1</modscore>
	<htmltext>Very limited spare time yet he has multiple 80s in an expansion that hasn't been out that long? Either he's doing something illegal (purchasing multiple accounts), or you're full of crap.</htmltext>
<tokenext>Very limited spare time yet he has multiple 80s in an expansion that has n't been out that long ?
Either he 's doing something illegal ( purchasing multiple accounts ) , or you 're full of crap .</tokentext>
<sentencetext>Very limited spare time yet he has multiple 80s in an expansion that hasn't been out that long?
Either he's doing something illegal (purchasing multiple accounts), or you're full of crap.</sentencetext>
	<parent>http://www.semanticweb.org/ontologies/ConversationInstances.owl#comment09_05_28_029216.28121225</parent>
</comment>
<comment>
	<id>http://www.semanticweb.org/ontologies/ConversationInstances.owl#comment09_05_28_029216.28130079</id>
	<title>Re:Companionship is addictive</title>
	<author>illumin8</author>
	<datestamp>1243504800000</datestamp>
	<modclass>None</modclass>
	<modscore>1</modscore>
	<htmltext><blockquote><div><p>But we all know the truth. It's 30 year old lardballs who still live with their parents that play this game. The lack of friends and human companionship drives them to seek out online communities where they can be accepted as who they portray themselves as rather than for who they, unfortunately, are.</p></div></blockquote><p>Speak for yourself.  I'm 35 years old, engaged to be married, exercise 3-4 times a week, have a full time job, and play WoW about 2-3 nights a week for a few hours.  Most of the people in my guild are also professionals in their 30s with wives, kids, and real lives outside the game.</p><p>The stereotype of a teenager or 30-something playing in their mom's basement is just a stereotype.  Sure there are a few of those because games like WoW appeal to someone with an infinite amount of free time, but the vast majority of the 11+ million subscribers probably only log on a couple times a week.</p></div>
	</htmltext>
<tokenext>But we all know the truth .
It 's 30 year old lardballs who still live with their parents that play this game .
The lack of friends and human companionship drives them to seek out online communities where they can be accepted as who they portray themselves as rather than for who they , unfortunately , are.Speak for yourself .
I 'm 35 years old , engaged to be married , exercise 3-4 times a week , have a full time job , and play WoW about 2-3 nights a week for a few hours .
Most of the people in my guild are also professionals in their 30s with wives , kids , and real lives outside the game.The stereotype of a teenager or 30-something playing in their mom 's basement is just a stereotype .
Sure there are a few of those because games like WoW appeal to someone with an infinite amount of free time , but the vast majority of the 11 + million subscribers probably only log on a couple times a week .</tokentext>
<sentencetext>But we all know the truth.
It's 30 year old lardballs who still live with their parents that play this game.
The lack of friends and human companionship drives them to seek out online communities where they can be accepted as who they portray themselves as rather than for who they, unfortunately, are.Speak for yourself.
I'm 35 years old, engaged to be married, exercise 3-4 times a week, have a full time job, and play WoW about 2-3 nights a week for a few hours.
Most of the people in my guild are also professionals in their 30s with wives, kids, and real lives outside the game.The stereotype of a teenager or 30-something playing in their mom's basement is just a stereotype.
Sure there are a few of those because games like WoW appeal to someone with an infinite amount of free time, but the vast majority of the 11+ million subscribers probably only log on a couple times a week.
	</sentencetext>
	<parent>http://www.semanticweb.org/ontologies/ConversationInstances.owl#comment09_05_28_029216.28120937</parent>
</comment>
<comment>
	<id>http://www.semanticweb.org/ontologies/ConversationInstances.owl#comment09_05_28_029216.28121105</id>
	<title>It should be obvious that it's rewarding play.</title>
	<author>Anonymous</author>
	<datestamp>1243509060000</datestamp>
	<modclass>None</modclass>
	<modscore>1</modscore>
	<htmltext><p>The question is, why do we consider what we get in exchange, rewards?</p><p>In the case of WoW achievements, do we accept little achievement titles because we are trying to see how far we can get for ourselves, or are we doing it out of a sense of competition with friends or other people, or both? It's interesting to try to figure out how they've made the environment to encourage strangers to treat each other more as friends, (pug parties and raids) and how they've encouraged the sense of personal accomplishment through the gradual lore reveal of quests, and at what point that all breaks down and becomes endless grind. But then how do we explain the people who just get on to beat the crap out of each other in battlegrounds?</p></htmltext>
<tokenext>The question is , why do we consider what we get in exchange , rewards ? In the case of WoW achievements , do we accept little achievement titles because we are trying to see how far we can get for ourselves , or are we doing it out of a sense of competition with friends or other people , or both ?
It 's interesting to try to figure out how they 've made the environment to encourage strangers to treat each other more as friends , ( pug parties and raids ) and how they 've encouraged the sense of personal accomplishment through the gradual lore reveal of quests , and at what point that all breaks down and becomes endless grind .
But then how do we explain the people who just get on to beat the crap out of each other in battlegrounds ?</tokentext>
<sentencetext>The question is, why do we consider what we get in exchange, rewards?In the case of WoW achievements, do we accept little achievement titles because we are trying to see how far we can get for ourselves, or are we doing it out of a sense of competition with friends or other people, or both?
It's interesting to try to figure out how they've made the environment to encourage strangers to treat each other more as friends, (pug parties and raids) and how they've encouraged the sense of personal accomplishment through the gradual lore reveal of quests, and at what point that all breaks down and becomes endless grind.
But then how do we explain the people who just get on to beat the crap out of each other in battlegrounds?</sentencetext>
</comment>
<comment>
	<id>http://www.semanticweb.org/ontologies/ConversationInstances.owl#comment09_05_28_029216.28121763</id>
	<title>Re:Companionship is addictive</title>
	<author>umghhh</author>
	<datestamp>1243515900000</datestamp>
	<modclass>None</modclass>
	<modscore>1</modscore>
	<htmltext>While for<nobr> <wbr></nobr>/.ers living in seclusion of parents' house basement may be true the rest of your theory (about seeking companionship) is probably less applicable. The article specifically underlines  certain way 'computer gaming' in particular makes you addictive. Granted that you have to be at least interested in games in the first place but what happens next is another thing. Psychologist I saw once in tely claimed that by ensuring small steps (levels) and getting rewards after passing each is the best way to achieve addiction especially if really unpredictable and unpleasant things like death or prosecution are excluded from virtual world (in this sense you can start your 'life' anew if things go terrible wrong). That seems to be the same as what TFA claims.</htmltext>
<tokenext>While for /.ers living in seclusion of parents ' house basement may be true the rest of your theory ( about seeking companionship ) is probably less applicable .
The article specifically underlines certain way 'computer gaming ' in particular makes you addictive .
Granted that you have to be at least interested in games in the first place but what happens next is another thing .
Psychologist I saw once in tely claimed that by ensuring small steps ( levels ) and getting rewards after passing each is the best way to achieve addiction especially if really unpredictable and unpleasant things like death or prosecution are excluded from virtual world ( in this sense you can start your 'life ' anew if things go terrible wrong ) .
That seems to be the same as what TFA claims .</tokentext>
<sentencetext>While for /.ers living in seclusion of parents' house basement may be true the rest of your theory (about seeking companionship) is probably less applicable.
The article specifically underlines  certain way 'computer gaming' in particular makes you addictive.
Granted that you have to be at least interested in games in the first place but what happens next is another thing.
Psychologist I saw once in tely claimed that by ensuring small steps (levels) and getting rewards after passing each is the best way to achieve addiction especially if really unpredictable and unpleasant things like death or prosecution are excluded from virtual world (in this sense you can start your 'life' anew if things go terrible wrong).
That seems to be the same as what TFA claims.</sentencetext>
	<parent>http://www.semanticweb.org/ontologies/ConversationInstances.owl#comment09_05_28_029216.28120937</parent>
</comment>
<comment>
	<id>http://www.semanticweb.org/ontologies/ConversationInstances.owl#comment09_05_28_029216.28121245</id>
	<title>Thanks for the heads up about rpg progress quest!</title>
	<author>turing\_m</author>
	<datestamp>1243510380000</datestamp>
	<modclass>Interestin</modclass>
	<modscore>4</modscore>
	<htmltext><p><a href="http://www.progressquest.com/" title="progressquest.com">http://www.progressquest.com/</a> [progressquest.com]</p><p>The character creation screen alone is worth the download. I don't think I've laughed that hard since Airplane.</p><p>(And it's in the Ubuntu repositories. You gotta love Ubuntu.)</p></htmltext>
<tokenext>http : //www.progressquest.com/ [ progressquest.com ] The character creation screen alone is worth the download .
I do n't think I 've laughed that hard since Airplane .
( And it 's in the Ubuntu repositories .
You got ta love Ubuntu .
)</tokentext>
<sentencetext>http://www.progressquest.com/ [progressquest.com]The character creation screen alone is worth the download.
I don't think I've laughed that hard since Airplane.
(And it's in the Ubuntu repositories.
You gotta love Ubuntu.
)</sentencetext>
</comment>
<comment>
	<id>http://www.semanticweb.org/ontologies/ConversationInstances.owl#comment09_05_28_029216.28132865</id>
	<title>Re:Companionship is addictive</title>
	<author>Laserwulf</author>
	<datestamp>1243517940000</datestamp>
	<modclass>None</modclass>
	<modscore>1</modscore>
	<htmltext><p><div class="quote"><p>Yeah, but I doubt that there's a WoW player that's a illiterate mass-murdering celebrity billionaire terrorist!</p></div><p>Osama bin Laden <i>might</i> play WoW, though.</p></div>
	</htmltext>
<tokenext>Yeah , but I doubt that there 's a WoW player that 's a illiterate mass-murdering celebrity billionaire terrorist ! Osama bin Laden might play WoW , though .</tokentext>
<sentencetext>Yeah, but I doubt that there's a WoW player that's a illiterate mass-murdering celebrity billionaire terrorist!Osama bin Laden might play WoW, though.
	</sentencetext>
	<parent>http://www.semanticweb.org/ontologies/ConversationInstances.owl#comment09_05_28_029216.28122681</parent>
</comment>
<comment>
	<id>http://www.semanticweb.org/ontologies/ConversationInstances.owl#comment09_05_28_029216.28131153</id>
	<title>Re:It's a blend</title>
	<author>shut\_up\_man</author>
	<datestamp>1243509300000</datestamp>
	<modclass>None</modclass>
	<modscore>1</modscore>
	<htmltext><p>Well said. An additional important point (IMO) is that WoW is many games in one, all interconnected. Depending on your personal preference, you can spend time questing, pvping, raiding, crafting, building faction reputation, trading on the auction house, doing achievements or even metagaming with item stat spreadsheets and talent combinations.</p><p>All of these mini-games give rewards that help other mini-games. If you spend the time building up your crafting skills, you can make weapons or armor, and that helps with raiding. Some achievements give flying mounts, which make questing and gathering faster and easier.</p><p>The interconnectedness is another level of design magic, I think. Don't like pvp? Knock over those dungeons. Don't like raiding? Quest away. Plus, when players are sick and tired of raiding, they can spend a few hours in the arena, or just toddle around doing some quests and earning some gold.</p><p>It's as if in real life, when you were sick of playing football with your friends, you could go home and chop wood so that next time your football skills would be a little bit better.</p></htmltext>
<tokenext>Well said .
An additional important point ( IMO ) is that WoW is many games in one , all interconnected .
Depending on your personal preference , you can spend time questing , pvping , raiding , crafting , building faction reputation , trading on the auction house , doing achievements or even metagaming with item stat spreadsheets and talent combinations.All of these mini-games give rewards that help other mini-games .
If you spend the time building up your crafting skills , you can make weapons or armor , and that helps with raiding .
Some achievements give flying mounts , which make questing and gathering faster and easier.The interconnectedness is another level of design magic , I think .
Do n't like pvp ?
Knock over those dungeons .
Do n't like raiding ?
Quest away .
Plus , when players are sick and tired of raiding , they can spend a few hours in the arena , or just toddle around doing some quests and earning some gold.It 's as if in real life , when you were sick of playing football with your friends , you could go home and chop wood so that next time your football skills would be a little bit better .</tokentext>
<sentencetext>Well said.
An additional important point (IMO) is that WoW is many games in one, all interconnected.
Depending on your personal preference, you can spend time questing, pvping, raiding, crafting, building faction reputation, trading on the auction house, doing achievements or even metagaming with item stat spreadsheets and talent combinations.All of these mini-games give rewards that help other mini-games.
If you spend the time building up your crafting skills, you can make weapons or armor, and that helps with raiding.
Some achievements give flying mounts, which make questing and gathering faster and easier.The interconnectedness is another level of design magic, I think.
Don't like pvp?
Knock over those dungeons.
Don't like raiding?
Quest away.
Plus, when players are sick and tired of raiding, they can spend a few hours in the arena, or just toddle around doing some quests and earning some gold.It's as if in real life, when you were sick of playing football with your friends, you could go home and chop wood so that next time your football skills would be a little bit better.</sentencetext>
	<parent>http://www.semanticweb.org/ontologies/ConversationInstances.owl#comment09_05_28_029216.28121411</parent>
</comment>
<comment>
	<id>http://www.semanticweb.org/ontologies/ConversationInstances.owl#comment09_05_28_029216.28122813</id>
	<title>It's About Conscious Choice</title>
	<author>genoese</author>
	<datestamp>1243521540000</datestamp>
	<modclass>None</modclass>
	<modscore>1</modscore>
	<htmltext><p>We should have exhausted this question when cigarette companies were caught enhancing nicotine levels in their product, in order to increase addiction, which enhances profit.</p><p>Consumers must have the opportunity to make conscious choices and give informed consent when consuming anything known (or reasonably suspected) to be habit-forming. I have no desire to form a nanny state, but folks need to know what they're getting.</p></htmltext>
<tokenext>We should have exhausted this question when cigarette companies were caught enhancing nicotine levels in their product , in order to increase addiction , which enhances profit.Consumers must have the opportunity to make conscious choices and give informed consent when consuming anything known ( or reasonably suspected ) to be habit-forming .
I have no desire to form a nanny state , but folks need to know what they 're getting .</tokentext>
<sentencetext>We should have exhausted this question when cigarette companies were caught enhancing nicotine levels in their product, in order to increase addiction, which enhances profit.Consumers must have the opportunity to make conscious choices and give informed consent when consuming anything known (or reasonably suspected) to be habit-forming.
I have no desire to form a nanny state, but folks need to know what they're getting.</sentencetext>
</comment>
<comment>
	<id>http://www.semanticweb.org/ontologies/ConversationInstances.owl#comment09_05_28_029216.28121347</id>
	<title>Re:Companionship is addictive</title>
	<author>Dunbal</author>
	<datestamp>1243511580000</datestamp>
	<modclass>Funny</modclass>
	<modscore>2</modscore>
	<htmltext><p><i>He's an engineer, finds natural gas all day.</i></p><p>Hell, I guess I will be seeing him at my place soon, especially after burrito night.</p></htmltext>
<tokenext>He 's an engineer , finds natural gas all day.Hell , I guess I will be seeing him at my place soon , especially after burrito night .</tokentext>
<sentencetext>He's an engineer, finds natural gas all day.Hell, I guess I will be seeing him at my place soon, especially after burrito night.</sentencetext>
	<parent>http://www.semanticweb.org/ontologies/ConversationInstances.owl#comment09_05_28_029216.28121225</parent>
</comment>
<comment>
	<id>http://www.semanticweb.org/ontologies/ConversationInstances.owl#comment09_05_28_029216.28121979</id>
	<title>Calling Wesley Crusher...</title>
	<author>Bones3D\_mac</author>
	<datestamp>1243517100000</datestamp>
	<modclass>None</modclass>
	<modscore>1</modscore>
	<htmltext><p>Well, if Star Trek: The Next Generation was any indication of such issues being relevant in our world, you might want to look at some of these upcoming games and toys coming out that you play using brain waves... such as Mattel's upcoming <a href="http://www.amazon.com/Mattel-P2639-Mindflex-Game/dp/B001UEUHCG" title="amazon.com">MindFlex</a> [amazon.com] toy and the Emotiv <a href="http://www.emotiv.com/corporate/2\_0/2\_1.htm" title="emotiv.com">Epoc</a> [emotiv.com] headset controller for PC gaming applications.</p><p>As for addictive properties, there still needs to be some sort of "reward" system to act as feedback, like a strategic TENS unit shock into certain areas of the body that would be desirable, such as what you keep hearing stories about regarding lab animals becoming "wired" and externally controlled.</p><p>The "addiction" of games like WoW is a bit different and tends to be based almost entirely on participating as part of a "group", not unlike the awkward life of school children jockeying for recognition. If you have to question this from an ethics standpoint, then just about any situation where you are forced to compete against others to gain something would need to be questioned as well.</p><p>Which brings us to an interesting question... is the desire to live the product of addiction?</p></htmltext>
<tokenext>Well , if Star Trek : The Next Generation was any indication of such issues being relevant in our world , you might want to look at some of these upcoming games and toys coming out that you play using brain waves... such as Mattel 's upcoming MindFlex [ amazon.com ] toy and the Emotiv Epoc [ emotiv.com ] headset controller for PC gaming applications.As for addictive properties , there still needs to be some sort of " reward " system to act as feedback , like a strategic TENS unit shock into certain areas of the body that would be desirable , such as what you keep hearing stories about regarding lab animals becoming " wired " and externally controlled.The " addiction " of games like WoW is a bit different and tends to be based almost entirely on participating as part of a " group " , not unlike the awkward life of school children jockeying for recognition .
If you have to question this from an ethics standpoint , then just about any situation where you are forced to compete against others to gain something would need to be questioned as well.Which brings us to an interesting question... is the desire to live the product of addiction ?</tokentext>
<sentencetext>Well, if Star Trek: The Next Generation was any indication of such issues being relevant in our world, you might want to look at some of these upcoming games and toys coming out that you play using brain waves... such as Mattel's upcoming MindFlex [amazon.com] toy and the Emotiv Epoc [emotiv.com] headset controller for PC gaming applications.As for addictive properties, there still needs to be some sort of "reward" system to act as feedback, like a strategic TENS unit shock into certain areas of the body that would be desirable, such as what you keep hearing stories about regarding lab animals becoming "wired" and externally controlled.The "addiction" of games like WoW is a bit different and tends to be based almost entirely on participating as part of a "group", not unlike the awkward life of school children jockeying for recognition.
If you have to question this from an ethics standpoint, then just about any situation where you are forced to compete against others to gain something would need to be questioned as well.Which brings us to an interesting question... is the desire to live the product of addiction?</sentencetext>
</comment>
<comment>
	<id>http://www.semanticweb.org/ontologies/ConversationInstances.owl#comment09_05_28_029216.28123259</id>
	<title>Not in the Game Design</title>
	<author>PegamooseG</author>
	<datestamp>1243523520000</datestamp>
	<modclass>None</modclass>
	<modscore>1</modscore>
	<htmltext><p>I don't think game addiction is in the game design itself.  I think the addiction is in the player's obsessive-compulsive behavior towards reaching a personal goal.  I used to be addicted to Lemmings.  I'd stay up late playing, because I wanted to get those Lemmings past one... more... level.  "Just one more" is a common catch phrase around people I know how have some form of game addiction.
</p><p>My mom gets addicted to simple games very easily.  In the original version of MS Windows's Freecell, she heard that ever 32,000+ levels were win-able, and she was obsessed with beating each one, just to see if she could.  She completed all of them except for the one level which was proven impossible to beat.
</p><p>The addiction is in the people, not in the game.  I think you can design any game, give the player some kind of mission to keep in mind, and make the game somewhat difficult to reach that goal, but not impossible.  Then, once they do obtain their goal, give the player a way to keep striving for something even better ("Sorry, Mario... The princess is in the next castle."). Ex.  See if you can beat this game of solitaire.  You beat it?  Okay, now try again, but quicker this time.  You beat that, too?  Okay, now try it with more cards.  Etc.</p></htmltext>
<tokenext>I do n't think game addiction is in the game design itself .
I think the addiction is in the player 's obsessive-compulsive behavior towards reaching a personal goal .
I used to be addicted to Lemmings .
I 'd stay up late playing , because I wanted to get those Lemmings past one... more... level .
" Just one more " is a common catch phrase around people I know how have some form of game addiction .
My mom gets addicted to simple games very easily .
In the original version of MS Windows 's Freecell , she heard that ever 32,000 + levels were win-able , and she was obsessed with beating each one , just to see if she could .
She completed all of them except for the one level which was proven impossible to beat .
The addiction is in the people , not in the game .
I think you can design any game , give the player some kind of mission to keep in mind , and make the game somewhat difficult to reach that goal , but not impossible .
Then , once they do obtain their goal , give the player a way to keep striving for something even better ( " Sorry , Mario... The princess is in the next castle. " ) .
Ex. See if you can beat this game of solitaire .
You beat it ?
Okay , now try again , but quicker this time .
You beat that , too ?
Okay , now try it with more cards .
Etc .</tokentext>
<sentencetext>I don't think game addiction is in the game design itself.
I think the addiction is in the player's obsessive-compulsive behavior towards reaching a personal goal.
I used to be addicted to Lemmings.
I'd stay up late playing, because I wanted to get those Lemmings past one... more... level.
"Just one more" is a common catch phrase around people I know how have some form of game addiction.
My mom gets addicted to simple games very easily.
In the original version of MS Windows's Freecell, she heard that ever 32,000+ levels were win-able, and she was obsessed with beating each one, just to see if she could.
She completed all of them except for the one level which was proven impossible to beat.
The addiction is in the people, not in the game.
I think you can design any game, give the player some kind of mission to keep in mind, and make the game somewhat difficult to reach that goal, but not impossible.
Then, once they do obtain their goal, give the player a way to keep striving for something even better ("Sorry, Mario... The princess is in the next castle.").
Ex.  See if you can beat this game of solitaire.
You beat it?
Okay, now try again, but quicker this time.
You beat that, too?
Okay, now try it with more cards.
Etc.</sentencetext>
</comment>
<comment>
	<id>http://www.semanticweb.org/ontologies/ConversationInstances.owl#comment09_05_28_029216.28122351</id>
	<title>Weak Article</title>
	<author>whisper\_jeff</author>
	<datestamp>1243519200000</datestamp>
	<modclass>Insightful</modclass>
	<modscore>2</modscore>
	<htmltext>For an article on ign, a site frequented by gamers, the article is really weak. I would expect something like that from a local newspaper rather than something published on a site read by people already knowledgeable regarding the subject. The article spends a lot of time explaining concepts and ideas that are already obvious to anyone who even remotely considers themselves a gamer (the regular audience of ign, for example). I was hoping it would then build upon those basic concepts that I already knew to present an interesting or novel theory but - no - that was it. A very disappointing read and not worth the time...<br> <br>
As a note, a big part of my disappointment is I feel this would be a very interesting topic to discuss so reading an intelligent article on the subject would be great but this is not that article...<br> <br>
In my opinionated opinion.</htmltext>
<tokenext>For an article on ign , a site frequented by gamers , the article is really weak .
I would expect something like that from a local newspaper rather than something published on a site read by people already knowledgeable regarding the subject .
The article spends a lot of time explaining concepts and ideas that are already obvious to anyone who even remotely considers themselves a gamer ( the regular audience of ign , for example ) .
I was hoping it would then build upon those basic concepts that I already knew to present an interesting or novel theory but - no - that was it .
A very disappointing read and not worth the time.. . As a note , a big part of my disappointment is I feel this would be a very interesting topic to discuss so reading an intelligent article on the subject would be great but this is not that article.. . In my opinionated opinion .</tokentext>
<sentencetext>For an article on ign, a site frequented by gamers, the article is really weak.
I would expect something like that from a local newspaper rather than something published on a site read by people already knowledgeable regarding the subject.
The article spends a lot of time explaining concepts and ideas that are already obvious to anyone who even remotely considers themselves a gamer (the regular audience of ign, for example).
I was hoping it would then build upon those basic concepts that I already knew to present an interesting or novel theory but - no - that was it.
A very disappointing read and not worth the time... 
As a note, a big part of my disappointment is I feel this would be a very interesting topic to discuss so reading an intelligent article on the subject would be great but this is not that article... 
In my opinionated opinion.</sentencetext>
</comment>
<comment>
	<id>http://www.semanticweb.org/ontologies/ConversationInstances.owl#comment09_05_28_029216.28121487</id>
	<title>Re:Companionship is addictive</title>
	<author>areusche</author>
	<datestamp>1243513440000</datestamp>
	<modclass>None</modclass>
	<modscore>1</modscore>
	<htmltext>Games like WoW or Simcity for that matter have no addicting effect. This isn't like heroin or cocaine for that matter. I was "addicted" to Sim City 4, and guess what happened? I got tired of playing it. That doesn't tend to happen with most hard drugs out there on the street. To this day i refuse to play WoW on the premise that I only need to pay once (like a hit). I don't need a "prescription" of WoW.</htmltext>
<tokenext>Games like WoW or Simcity for that matter have no addicting effect .
This is n't like heroin or cocaine for that matter .
I was " addicted " to Sim City 4 , and guess what happened ?
I got tired of playing it .
That does n't tend to happen with most hard drugs out there on the street .
To this day i refuse to play WoW on the premise that I only need to pay once ( like a hit ) .
I do n't need a " prescription " of WoW .</tokentext>
<sentencetext>Games like WoW or Simcity for that matter have no addicting effect.
This isn't like heroin or cocaine for that matter.
I was "addicted" to Sim City 4, and guess what happened?
I got tired of playing it.
That doesn't tend to happen with most hard drugs out there on the street.
To this day i refuse to play WoW on the premise that I only need to pay once (like a hit).
I don't need a "prescription" of WoW.</sentencetext>
	<parent>http://www.semanticweb.org/ontologies/ConversationInstances.owl#comment09_05_28_029216.28120937</parent>
</comment>
<comment>
	<id>http://www.semanticweb.org/ontologies/ConversationInstances.owl#comment09_05_28_029216.28129869</id>
	<title>Didn't we beat this subject to death</title>
	<author>DRAGONWEEZEL</author>
	<datestamp>1243503960000</datestamp>
	<modclass>None</modclass>
	<modscore>1</modscore>
	<htmltext><p>with a "Chilly slobberknocker"? <a href="http://www.wowhead.com/?item=41821/" title="wowhead.com">http://www.wowhead.com/?item=41821/</a> [wowhead.com]</p></htmltext>
<tokenext>with a " Chilly slobberknocker " ?
http : //www.wowhead.com/ ? item = 41821/ [ wowhead.com ]</tokentext>
<sentencetext>with a "Chilly slobberknocker"?
http://www.wowhead.com/?item=41821/ [wowhead.com]</sentencetext>
</comment>
<comment>
	<id>http://www.semanticweb.org/ontologies/ConversationInstances.owl#comment09_05_28_029216.28123999</id>
	<title>The First Step?</title>
	<author>TimmyTurner</author>
	<datestamp>1243527060000</datestamp>
	<modclass>None</modclass>
	<modscore>1</modscore>
	<htmltext>denial...</htmltext>
<tokenext>denial.. .</tokentext>
<sentencetext>denial...</sentencetext>
</comment>
<comment>
	<id>http://www.semanticweb.org/ontologies/ConversationInstances.owl#comment09_05_28_029216.28121101</id>
	<title>Firsty posty!</title>
	<author>Anonymous</author>
	<datestamp>1243509060000</datestamp>
	<modclass>Funny</modclass>
	<modscore>5</modscore>
	<htmltext><p>I'm addicted to slashdot karma farming.</p><p>I post bland, pro-open source comments, and collect the insightful mods.<br>Sometimes I feel like posting pro-Microsoft comments, which is the<nobr> <wbr></nobr>/. equivalent of giving away all your WOW gold and money. But I just can't do it.</p></htmltext>
<tokenext>I 'm addicted to slashdot karma farming.I post bland , pro-open source comments , and collect the insightful mods.Sometimes I feel like posting pro-Microsoft comments , which is the / .
equivalent of giving away all your WOW gold and money .
But I just ca n't do it .</tokentext>
<sentencetext>I'm addicted to slashdot karma farming.I post bland, pro-open source comments, and collect the insightful mods.Sometimes I feel like posting pro-Microsoft comments, which is the /.
equivalent of giving away all your WOW gold and money.
But I just can't do it.</sentencetext>
</comment>
<comment>
	<id>http://www.semanticweb.org/ontologies/ConversationInstances.owl#comment09_05_28_029216.28121759</id>
	<title>Re:Companionship is addictive</title>
	<author>Anonymous</author>
	<datestamp>1243515900000</datestamp>
	<modclass>None</modclass>
	<modscore>0</modscore>
	<htmltext><p>With that cash i can also buy accounts at ebay</p></htmltext>
<tokenext>With that cash i can also buy accounts at ebay</tokentext>
<sentencetext>With that cash i can also buy accounts at ebay</sentencetext>
	<parent>http://www.semanticweb.org/ontologies/ConversationInstances.owl#comment09_05_28_029216.28121225</parent>
</comment>
<comment>
	<id>http://www.semanticweb.org/ontologies/ConversationInstances.owl#comment09_05_28_029216.28121477</id>
	<title>Re:Companionship is addictive</title>
	<author>Anonymous</author>
	<datestamp>1243513260000</datestamp>
	<modclass>Insightful</modclass>
	<modscore>5</modscore>
	<htmltext><p>The statistician in me says "if the number of items in a sample is large enough, you'll find an oddball that will serve as the 'see, it ain't so' example".</p><p>WoW has 10 million players. It's a given that you can pull any kind of sample even out of your ass and it will be fitting. I can, even without checking, say that the chance that there is at least one celebrity, one mass murderer, one nobel prize candidate, one illiterate, one billionaire, one terrorist... playing WoW ist ONE. The sample is big enough that it's near certain that ANY kind of group has at least ONE representative in it.</p><p>Whether your friend is the norm or the exception is another question.</p></htmltext>
<tokenext>The statistician in me says " if the number of items in a sample is large enough , you 'll find an oddball that will serve as the 'see , it ai n't so ' example " .WoW has 10 million players .
It 's a given that you can pull any kind of sample even out of your ass and it will be fitting .
I can , even without checking , say that the chance that there is at least one celebrity , one mass murderer , one nobel prize candidate , one illiterate , one billionaire , one terrorist... playing WoW ist ONE .
The sample is big enough that it 's near certain that ANY kind of group has at least ONE representative in it.Whether your friend is the norm or the exception is another question .</tokentext>
<sentencetext>The statistician in me says "if the number of items in a sample is large enough, you'll find an oddball that will serve as the 'see, it ain't so' example".WoW has 10 million players.
It's a given that you can pull any kind of sample even out of your ass and it will be fitting.
I can, even without checking, say that the chance that there is at least one celebrity, one mass murderer, one nobel prize candidate, one illiterate, one billionaire, one terrorist... playing WoW ist ONE.
The sample is big enough that it's near certain that ANY kind of group has at least ONE representative in it.Whether your friend is the norm or the exception is another question.</sentencetext>
	<parent>http://www.semanticweb.org/ontologies/ConversationInstances.owl#comment09_05_28_029216.28121225</parent>
</comment>
<comment>
	<id>http://www.semanticweb.org/ontologies/ConversationInstances.owl#comment09_05_28_029216.28125409</id>
	<title>Re:Obligatory</title>
	<author>geekoid</author>
	<datestamp>1243532880000</datestamp>
	<modclass>None</modclass>
	<modscore>1</modscore>
	<htmltext><p>Exactly what me and a friend were talking about the other day. With augmented reality will come achievement awards.<br>Imagine walking down the street the "DING! you have taken you 1 millionth step."</p><p>Achievements are like automatic goal setting. Setting goals is the number one way to improve things.</p></htmltext>
<tokenext>Exactly what me and a friend were talking about the other day .
With augmented reality will come achievement awards.Imagine walking down the street the " DING !
you have taken you 1 millionth step .
" Achievements are like automatic goal setting .
Setting goals is the number one way to improve things .</tokentext>
<sentencetext>Exactly what me and a friend were talking about the other day.
With augmented reality will come achievement awards.Imagine walking down the street the "DING!
you have taken you 1 millionth step.
"Achievements are like automatic goal setting.
Setting goals is the number one way to improve things.</sentencetext>
	<parent>http://www.semanticweb.org/ontologies/ConversationInstances.owl#comment09_05_28_029216.28121277</parent>
</comment>
<comment>
	<id>http://www.semanticweb.org/ontologies/ConversationInstances.owl#comment09_05_28_029216.28123097</id>
	<title>Re:Companionship is addictive</title>
	<author>Anonymous</author>
	<datestamp>1243522860000</datestamp>
	<modclass>None</modclass>
	<modscore>0</modscore>
	<htmltext><p>&gt; The sample is big enough that it's near certain that ANY kind of group has at least ONE representative in it.</p><p>Except for the group of people not playing WOW...</p></htmltext>
<tokenext>&gt; The sample is big enough that it 's near certain that ANY kind of group has at least ONE representative in it.Except for the group of people not playing WOW.. .</tokentext>
<sentencetext>&gt; The sample is big enough that it's near certain that ANY kind of group has at least ONE representative in it.Except for the group of people not playing WOW...</sentencetext>
	<parent>http://www.semanticweb.org/ontologies/ConversationInstances.owl#comment09_05_28_029216.28121477</parent>
</comment>
<comment>
	<id>http://www.semanticweb.org/ontologies/ConversationInstances.owl#comment09_05_28_029216.28123655</id>
	<title>Re:Companionship is addictive</title>
	<author>Push Latency</author>
	<datestamp>1243525440000</datestamp>
	<modclass>None</modclass>
	<modscore>1</modscore>
	<htmltext>Actually, I know many people in LOTR:O who are well-respected professionals who play in their free time.


I have lead a large, very active Kinship for almost two years, don't live at home, and find that the experience has been *enormously* edifying to my professional experience, and has definitely enhanced my ability to plan, and organize large groups of people in complex tasks.
<br> <br>
Rather than a lardball, I am a fit, 32 y.o, Harvard-graduate and technology professional, who still finds time to spend tons of time outdoors (backpacking, alpine touring), and maintain a very happy married life.  Looking through my forums at the RL (real-life) pictures of my Kinsmates shows that the proportion of members who fits your description is in synch with the general population, if not less; i.e., most are not "30 year old lardballs..."
<br> <br>
Your comment on companionship is semi-correct; I love my friends in LOTR:O, and love to spend time with them, but most of them know who I am, and what I am like in RL.  To the point of the article, yes, the entire interface is addictive, and I get frustrated with non-ethical mindless-grind content.  However, most everything fun could be described as "addictive", such as skiing, playing piano, etc.
<br> <br>
Of course, this is LOTR:O.  If you actually play "that other game", your assessment could well be correct.  I wouldn't know...</htmltext>
<tokenext>Actually , I know many people in LOTR : O who are well-respected professionals who play in their free time .
I have lead a large , very active Kinship for almost two years , do n't live at home , and find that the experience has been * enormously * edifying to my professional experience , and has definitely enhanced my ability to plan , and organize large groups of people in complex tasks .
Rather than a lardball , I am a fit , 32 y.o , Harvard-graduate and technology professional , who still finds time to spend tons of time outdoors ( backpacking , alpine touring ) , and maintain a very happy married life .
Looking through my forums at the RL ( real-life ) pictures of my Kinsmates shows that the proportion of members who fits your description is in synch with the general population , if not less ; i.e. , most are not " 30 year old lardballs... " Your comment on companionship is semi-correct ; I love my friends in LOTR : O , and love to spend time with them , but most of them know who I am , and what I am like in RL .
To the point of the article , yes , the entire interface is addictive , and I get frustrated with non-ethical mindless-grind content .
However , most everything fun could be described as " addictive " , such as skiing , playing piano , etc .
Of course , this is LOTR : O. If you actually play " that other game " , your assessment could well be correct .
I would n't know.. .</tokentext>
<sentencetext>Actually, I know many people in LOTR:O who are well-respected professionals who play in their free time.
I have lead a large, very active Kinship for almost two years, don't live at home, and find that the experience has been *enormously* edifying to my professional experience, and has definitely enhanced my ability to plan, and organize large groups of people in complex tasks.
Rather than a lardball, I am a fit, 32 y.o, Harvard-graduate and technology professional, who still finds time to spend tons of time outdoors (backpacking, alpine touring), and maintain a very happy married life.
Looking through my forums at the RL (real-life) pictures of my Kinsmates shows that the proportion of members who fits your description is in synch with the general population, if not less; i.e., most are not "30 year old lardballs..."
 
Your comment on companionship is semi-correct; I love my friends in LOTR:O, and love to spend time with them, but most of them know who I am, and what I am like in RL.
To the point of the article, yes, the entire interface is addictive, and I get frustrated with non-ethical mindless-grind content.
However, most everything fun could be described as "addictive", such as skiing, playing piano, etc.
Of course, this is LOTR:O.  If you actually play "that other game", your assessment could well be correct.
I wouldn't know...</sentencetext>
	<parent>http://www.semanticweb.org/ontologies/ConversationInstances.owl#comment09_05_28_029216.28120937</parent>
</comment>
<comment>
	<id>http://www.semanticweb.org/ontologies/ConversationInstances.owl#comment09_05_28_029216.28121343</id>
	<title>Re:Companionship is addictive</title>
	<author>Anonymous</author>
	<datestamp>1243511520000</datestamp>
	<modclass>Insightful</modclass>
	<modscore>1</modscore>
	<htmltext><p>Look, using these tired stereotypes about gamers is hardly productive to your argument. Clearly you don't know the people you are commenting on. I won't waste my typing on examples of educated, active, successful gamers with families, businesses and real lives. Suffice to say that your characterization is deeply unimaginative and flawed.<br>The question of addiction is also a bit of a stereotype, which I think is owed to the hobby-like space which gaming occupies. I believe gaming can more convincingly be compared to other multimedia entertainment, such as television, which rarely gets discussed as an addiction, owing I'm sure to the pervasive presence and acceptance which TV has in society.<br>The difference with gaming, MMO games in particular, is the they have the addition of a social element. For me, this makes them occupy a much more socially "connected" activity than watching sitcom reruns on the boobtube...</p></htmltext>
<tokenext>Look , using these tired stereotypes about gamers is hardly productive to your argument .
Clearly you do n't know the people you are commenting on .
I wo n't waste my typing on examples of educated , active , successful gamers with families , businesses and real lives .
Suffice to say that your characterization is deeply unimaginative and flawed.The question of addiction is also a bit of a stereotype , which I think is owed to the hobby-like space which gaming occupies .
I believe gaming can more convincingly be compared to other multimedia entertainment , such as television , which rarely gets discussed as an addiction , owing I 'm sure to the pervasive presence and acceptance which TV has in society.The difference with gaming , MMO games in particular , is the they have the addition of a social element .
For me , this makes them occupy a much more socially " connected " activity than watching sitcom reruns on the boobtube.. .</tokentext>
<sentencetext>Look, using these tired stereotypes about gamers is hardly productive to your argument.
Clearly you don't know the people you are commenting on.
I won't waste my typing on examples of educated, active, successful gamers with families, businesses and real lives.
Suffice to say that your characterization is deeply unimaginative and flawed.The question of addiction is also a bit of a stereotype, which I think is owed to the hobby-like space which gaming occupies.
I believe gaming can more convincingly be compared to other multimedia entertainment, such as television, which rarely gets discussed as an addiction, owing I'm sure to the pervasive presence and acceptance which TV has in society.The difference with gaming, MMO games in particular, is the they have the addition of a social element.
For me, this makes them occupy a much more socially "connected" activity than watching sitcom reruns on the boobtube...</sentencetext>
	<parent>http://www.semanticweb.org/ontologies/ConversationInstances.owl#comment09_05_28_029216.28120937</parent>
</comment>
<comment>
	<id>http://www.semanticweb.org/ontologies/ConversationInstances.owl#comment09_05_28_029216.28122593</id>
	<title>Re:Companionship is addictive</title>
	<author>Toad-san</author>
	<datestamp>1243520460000</datestamp>
	<modclass>None</modclass>
	<modscore>1</modscore>
	<htmltext><p>I don't think so.</p><p>I'm FAR more antisocial and loner (with ALL my characters) in WoW than I am in the Real World.  No guilds, solo everything, no instances, rarely do battlegrounds.  Characters on three servers, all of which are PvE and not PvP.  But the only role-playing I'll do is to have an accent.  I used to give away low-level enchants and bags to lowbies, but don't even do that any more.  Yep, antisocial as hell.  Because that's not the part of the game that attracts me.</p><p>So I for one definitely don't play WoW (for years now, and a LOT of hours weekly) for the companionship or society of others.  And I fit the first part of your description (professional playing in offtime for entertainment, relaxation, escape), rather than the second.</p></htmltext>
<tokenext>I do n't think so.I 'm FAR more antisocial and loner ( with ALL my characters ) in WoW than I am in the Real World .
No guilds , solo everything , no instances , rarely do battlegrounds .
Characters on three servers , all of which are PvE and not PvP .
But the only role-playing I 'll do is to have an accent .
I used to give away low-level enchants and bags to lowbies , but do n't even do that any more .
Yep , antisocial as hell .
Because that 's not the part of the game that attracts me.So I for one definitely do n't play WoW ( for years now , and a LOT of hours weekly ) for the companionship or society of others .
And I fit the first part of your description ( professional playing in offtime for entertainment , relaxation , escape ) , rather than the second .</tokentext>
<sentencetext>I don't think so.I'm FAR more antisocial and loner (with ALL my characters) in WoW than I am in the Real World.
No guilds, solo everything, no instances, rarely do battlegrounds.
Characters on three servers, all of which are PvE and not PvP.
But the only role-playing I'll do is to have an accent.
I used to give away low-level enchants and bags to lowbies, but don't even do that any more.
Yep, antisocial as hell.
Because that's not the part of the game that attracts me.So I for one definitely don't play WoW (for years now, and a LOT of hours weekly) for the companionship or society of others.
And I fit the first part of your description (professional playing in offtime for entertainment, relaxation, escape), rather than the second.</sentencetext>
	<parent>http://www.semanticweb.org/ontologies/ConversationInstances.owl#comment09_05_28_029216.28120937</parent>
</comment>
<comment>
	<id>http://www.semanticweb.org/ontologies/ConversationInstances.owl#comment09_05_28_029216.28124991</id>
	<title>Understanding Addiction Based Game Design</title>
	<author>rocket rancher</author>
	<datestamp>1243531080000</datestamp>
	<modclass>Insightful</modclass>
	<modscore>2</modscore>
	<htmltext><blockquote><div><p>The common theory is that games like World of Warcraft are addictive. But what are the exact qualities that make it so?</p></div></blockquote><p>I play WoW *a lot* -- six hours/day during the week and 18 hours/day on weekends and holidays -- and I've often wondered how I let this game take over my life so thoroughly.  I think the variable rate schedule of rewards theory can explain this addiction.  It is something that I learned about in a Management 101 class two decades ago.  What makes anything addictive, according to the theory we were taught as nascent managers, is having a variable rate at which rewards are delivered.   It is what makes gamblers come back to the dice table again and again, and it is why unions work so hard to establish uniform wage scales.  My company introduced "Spot Awards" and the policy governing the awards explicitly states that managers should make sure that the awards are distributed at random intervals.  The variable-rate schedule of rewards can produce game-aholics as effectively as it can work-aholics.</p><p>Is Blizz deliberately using the variable rate schedule of rewards to bind us to the game?  Of course they are.  In WoW, the variable rate schedule of rewards is easy to see.  How does Blizz keep people engaged once they've reached the level cap?  The recently added "Achievement" system is one way.  Every so often, you will be rewarded with an achievement that can grant you cool stuff -- a new pet, a new mount, a new title.  The requirements for the achievements are not uniform, and often depend on the completion of other achievements which also have non-uniform requirements.  This insures that the schedule at which one completes an achievement and receives a reward will be effectively random.  You keep shelling out $15 every month to keep those rewards coming.</p></div>
	</htmltext>
<tokenext>The common theory is that games like World of Warcraft are addictive .
But what are the exact qualities that make it so ? I play WoW * a lot * -- six hours/day during the week and 18 hours/day on weekends and holidays -- and I 've often wondered how I let this game take over my life so thoroughly .
I think the variable rate schedule of rewards theory can explain this addiction .
It is something that I learned about in a Management 101 class two decades ago .
What makes anything addictive , according to the theory we were taught as nascent managers , is having a variable rate at which rewards are delivered .
It is what makes gamblers come back to the dice table again and again , and it is why unions work so hard to establish uniform wage scales .
My company introduced " Spot Awards " and the policy governing the awards explicitly states that managers should make sure that the awards are distributed at random intervals .
The variable-rate schedule of rewards can produce game-aholics as effectively as it can work-aholics.Is Blizz deliberately using the variable rate schedule of rewards to bind us to the game ?
Of course they are .
In WoW , the variable rate schedule of rewards is easy to see .
How does Blizz keep people engaged once they 've reached the level cap ?
The recently added " Achievement " system is one way .
Every so often , you will be rewarded with an achievement that can grant you cool stuff -- a new pet , a new mount , a new title .
The requirements for the achievements are not uniform , and often depend on the completion of other achievements which also have non-uniform requirements .
This insures that the schedule at which one completes an achievement and receives a reward will be effectively random .
You keep shelling out $ 15 every month to keep those rewards coming .</tokentext>
<sentencetext>The common theory is that games like World of Warcraft are addictive.
But what are the exact qualities that make it so?I play WoW *a lot* -- six hours/day during the week and 18 hours/day on weekends and holidays -- and I've often wondered how I let this game take over my life so thoroughly.
I think the variable rate schedule of rewards theory can explain this addiction.
It is something that I learned about in a Management 101 class two decades ago.
What makes anything addictive, according to the theory we were taught as nascent managers, is having a variable rate at which rewards are delivered.
It is what makes gamblers come back to the dice table again and again, and it is why unions work so hard to establish uniform wage scales.
My company introduced "Spot Awards" and the policy governing the awards explicitly states that managers should make sure that the awards are distributed at random intervals.
The variable-rate schedule of rewards can produce game-aholics as effectively as it can work-aholics.Is Blizz deliberately using the variable rate schedule of rewards to bind us to the game?
Of course they are.
In WoW, the variable rate schedule of rewards is easy to see.
How does Blizz keep people engaged once they've reached the level cap?
The recently added "Achievement" system is one way.
Every so often, you will be rewarded with an achievement that can grant you cool stuff -- a new pet, a new mount, a new title.
The requirements for the achievements are not uniform, and often depend on the completion of other achievements which also have non-uniform requirements.
This insures that the schedule at which one completes an achievement and receives a reward will be effectively random.
You keep shelling out $15 every month to keep those rewards coming.
	</sentencetext>
</comment>
<comment>
	<id>http://www.semanticweb.org/ontologies/ConversationInstances.owl#comment09_05_28_029216.28120929</id>
	<title>Frost Posh</title>
	<author>Anonymous</author>
	<datestamp>1243507380000</datestamp>
	<modclass>None</modclass>
	<modscore>-1</modscore>
	<htmltext><p>BHLAH!</p></htmltext>
<tokenext>BHLAH !</tokentext>
<sentencetext>BHLAH!</sentencetext>
</comment>
<comment>
	<id>http://www.semanticweb.org/ontologies/ConversationInstances.owl#comment09_05_28_029216.28122247</id>
	<title>Re:Companionship is addictive</title>
	<author>hesaigo999ca</author>
	<datestamp>1243518660000</datestamp>
	<modclass>None</modclass>
	<modscore>1</modscore>
	<htmltext><p>Yes, maybe some, no.<br>Yes, many develop leadership skills (of sorts good only in the virtual game space)<br>Maybe some are tub of lards, hell if you come over and think after running a raid or 2,<br>I am a tub of lard, I will show you how I can do laundry on my 6pack.<br>No, the game is highly addictive, the only thing stopping me from playing continuously,<br>is 3 things, a girlfriend that whines all the time, the dogs that need to be walked often,<br>and a scrooge side, that will not allow me to spend on a game I bought already (supposedly).<br>I play 2 months on, 2 months off.</p></htmltext>
<tokenext>Yes , maybe some , no.Yes , many develop leadership skills ( of sorts good only in the virtual game space ) Maybe some are tub of lards , hell if you come over and think after running a raid or 2,I am a tub of lard , I will show you how I can do laundry on my 6pack.No , the game is highly addictive , the only thing stopping me from playing continuously,is 3 things , a girlfriend that whines all the time , the dogs that need to be walked often,and a scrooge side , that will not allow me to spend on a game I bought already ( supposedly ) .I play 2 months on , 2 months off .</tokentext>
<sentencetext>Yes, maybe some, no.Yes, many develop leadership skills (of sorts good only in the virtual game space)Maybe some are tub of lards, hell if you come over and think after running a raid or 2,I am a tub of lard, I will show you how I can do laundry on my 6pack.No, the game is highly addictive, the only thing stopping me from playing continuously,is 3 things, a girlfriend that whines all the time, the dogs that need to be walked often,and a scrooge side, that will not allow me to spend on a game I bought already (supposedly).I play 2 months on, 2 months off.</sentencetext>
	<parent>http://www.semanticweb.org/ontologies/ConversationInstances.owl#comment09_05_28_029216.28120937</parent>
</comment>
<comment>
	<id>http://www.semanticweb.org/ontologies/ConversationInstances.owl#comment09_05_28_029216.28121345</id>
	<title>Re:Companionship is addictive</title>
	<author>Anonymous</author>
	<datestamp>1243511520000</datestamp>
	<modclass>None</modclass>
	<modscore>0</modscore>
	<htmltext><p>I am one of those WoW playing FATBALLS you insensitive clod!</p></htmltext>
<tokenext>I am one of those WoW playing FATBALLS you insensitive clod !</tokentext>
<sentencetext>I am one of those WoW playing FATBALLS you insensitive clod!</sentencetext>
	<parent>http://www.semanticweb.org/ontologies/ConversationInstances.owl#comment09_05_28_029216.28121225</parent>
</comment>
<comment>
	<id>http://www.semanticweb.org/ontologies/ConversationInstances.owl#comment09_05_28_029216.28122681</id>
	<title>Re:Companionship is addictive</title>
	<author>bFusion</author>
	<datestamp>1243520880000</datestamp>
	<modclass>Funny</modclass>
	<modscore>3</modscore>
	<htmltext><p>Yeah, but I doubt that there's a WoW player that's a illiterate mass-murdering celebrity billionaire terrorist!</p></htmltext>
<tokenext>Yeah , but I doubt that there 's a WoW player that 's a illiterate mass-murdering celebrity billionaire terrorist !</tokentext>
<sentencetext>Yeah, but I doubt that there's a WoW player that's a illiterate mass-murdering celebrity billionaire terrorist!</sentencetext>
	<parent>http://www.semanticweb.org/ontologies/ConversationInstances.owl#comment09_05_28_029216.28121477</parent>
</comment>
<comment>
	<id>http://www.semanticweb.org/ontologies/ConversationInstances.owl#comment09_05_28_029216.28126077</id>
	<title>Re:Companionship is addictive</title>
	<author>nobodylocalhost</author>
	<datestamp>1243535340000</datestamp>
	<modclass>None</modclass>
	<modscore>1</modscore>
	<htmltext><p>You are sadly mistaken if you believe that is the case. What makes you think that someone inept socially offline would be adapt online? Honestly, the 30 yearold lardballs are those who solo all the time, and grind level all day instead of talking and socializing. And they'd quick to grief and gank you with well practiced skills. I seriously doubt they play mmos to socialize, no, I honestly believe that these people play mmos to prove they are superior in order to boost their ego.<br>You obviously haven't played enough mmo to make that kind of statements, I suggest do your research before spewing nonsense.</p></htmltext>
<tokenext>You are sadly mistaken if you believe that is the case .
What makes you think that someone inept socially offline would be adapt online ?
Honestly , the 30 yearold lardballs are those who solo all the time , and grind level all day instead of talking and socializing .
And they 'd quick to grief and gank you with well practiced skills .
I seriously doubt they play mmos to socialize , no , I honestly believe that these people play mmos to prove they are superior in order to boost their ego.You obviously have n't played enough mmo to make that kind of statements , I suggest do your research before spewing nonsense .</tokentext>
<sentencetext>You are sadly mistaken if you believe that is the case.
What makes you think that someone inept socially offline would be adapt online?
Honestly, the 30 yearold lardballs are those who solo all the time, and grind level all day instead of talking and socializing.
And they'd quick to grief and gank you with well practiced skills.
I seriously doubt they play mmos to socialize, no, I honestly believe that these people play mmos to prove they are superior in order to boost their ego.You obviously haven't played enough mmo to make that kind of statements, I suggest do your research before spewing nonsense.</sentencetext>
	<parent>http://www.semanticweb.org/ontologies/ConversationInstances.owl#comment09_05_28_029216.28120937</parent>
</comment>
<comment>
	<id>http://www.semanticweb.org/ontologies/ConversationInstances.owl#comment09_05_28_029216.28127285</id>
	<title>Re:Companionship is addictive</title>
	<author>Feyshtey</author>
	<datestamp>1243539120000</datestamp>
	<modclass>None</modclass>
	<modscore>1</modscore>
	<htmltext>Curt Schilling (Major Leage Baseball Pitcher) plays(ed) EverquestEverquest2.
<a href="http://www.joystiq.com/2006/03/16/curt-schilling-looses-the-mitt-for-the-ole-mouse-and-keyboard/" title="joystiq.com" rel="nofollow">http://www.joystiq.com/2006/03/16/curt-schilling-looses-the-mitt-for-the-ole-mouse-and-keyboard/</a> [joystiq.com]
<br> <br>
Dave Chappelle the comedian plays Warcraft.
<a href="http://www.buzzle.com/editorials/2-23-2006-89653.asp" title="buzzle.com" rel="nofollow">http://www.buzzle.com/editorials/2-23-2006-89653.asp</a> [buzzle.com]
<br> <br>
Eric Bloom from Blue Oyster Cult plays Warcraft.
<a href="http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Eric\_Bloom" title="wikipedia.org" rel="nofollow">http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Eric\_Bloom</a> [wikipedia.org]
<br> <br>
The prolific fantasy artist Ruth Thompson plays Warcraft (and I can tell you she is CERTAINLY not wanted in the attractiveness category) :
<a href="http://www.tarnishedimages.com/" title="tarnishedimages.com" rel="nofollow">http://www.tarnishedimages.com/</a> [tarnishedimages.com]
<br> <br>
I've also read that that author Michael Moorcock plays WoW. I've heard rumor of Steven King. I know with certainty about 4 semi-pro hockey players, and rumor of 4 more pro hockey players.
<br> <br>
This list could continue indefinately. And these are just the ones that I knew of offhand that were easy to find evidence for. The point being that there are plenty of very successful, influential, wealthy and talented people who find the escape of an online fantasy world to be not only entertaining, but also a healthy distraction from the pressures in their every day lives.
<br> <br>
I'm sure there are hundreds of household names that could be added to the list, if not thousands. But would you make it public knowledge if you knew you'd be judged, or worse, stalked, in the one place you might be able to socialize regularly with total anonymity? Especially if you literally couldn't leave your home with people taking photos of your every step?</htmltext>
<tokenext>Curt Schilling ( Major Leage Baseball Pitcher ) plays ( ed ) EverquestEverquest2 .
http : //www.joystiq.com/2006/03/16/curt-schilling-looses-the-mitt-for-the-ole-mouse-and-keyboard/ [ joystiq.com ] Dave Chappelle the comedian plays Warcraft .
http : //www.buzzle.com/editorials/2-23-2006-89653.asp [ buzzle.com ] Eric Bloom from Blue Oyster Cult plays Warcraft .
http : //en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Eric \ _Bloom [ wikipedia.org ] The prolific fantasy artist Ruth Thompson plays Warcraft ( and I can tell you she is CERTAINLY not wanted in the attractiveness category ) : http : //www.tarnishedimages.com/ [ tarnishedimages.com ] I 've also read that that author Michael Moorcock plays WoW .
I 've heard rumor of Steven King .
I know with certainty about 4 semi-pro hockey players , and rumor of 4 more pro hockey players .
This list could continue indefinately .
And these are just the ones that I knew of offhand that were easy to find evidence for .
The point being that there are plenty of very successful , influential , wealthy and talented people who find the escape of an online fantasy world to be not only entertaining , but also a healthy distraction from the pressures in their every day lives .
I 'm sure there are hundreds of household names that could be added to the list , if not thousands .
But would you make it public knowledge if you knew you 'd be judged , or worse , stalked , in the one place you might be able to socialize regularly with total anonymity ?
Especially if you literally could n't leave your home with people taking photos of your every step ?</tokentext>
<sentencetext>Curt Schilling (Major Leage Baseball Pitcher) plays(ed) EverquestEverquest2.
http://www.joystiq.com/2006/03/16/curt-schilling-looses-the-mitt-for-the-ole-mouse-and-keyboard/ [joystiq.com]
 
Dave Chappelle the comedian plays Warcraft.
http://www.buzzle.com/editorials/2-23-2006-89653.asp [buzzle.com]
 
Eric Bloom from Blue Oyster Cult plays Warcraft.
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Eric\_Bloom [wikipedia.org]
 
The prolific fantasy artist Ruth Thompson plays Warcraft (and I can tell you she is CERTAINLY not wanted in the attractiveness category) :
http://www.tarnishedimages.com/ [tarnishedimages.com]
 
I've also read that that author Michael Moorcock plays WoW.
I've heard rumor of Steven King.
I know with certainty about 4 semi-pro hockey players, and rumor of 4 more pro hockey players.
This list could continue indefinately.
And these are just the ones that I knew of offhand that were easy to find evidence for.
The point being that there are plenty of very successful, influential, wealthy and talented people who find the escape of an online fantasy world to be not only entertaining, but also a healthy distraction from the pressures in their every day lives.
I'm sure there are hundreds of household names that could be added to the list, if not thousands.
But would you make it public knowledge if you knew you'd be judged, or worse, stalked, in the one place you might be able to socialize regularly with total anonymity?
Especially if you literally couldn't leave your home with people taking photos of your every step?</sentencetext>
	<parent>http://www.semanticweb.org/ontologies/ConversationInstances.owl#comment09_05_28_029216.28120937</parent>
</comment>
<comment>
	<id>http://www.semanticweb.org/ontologies/ConversationInstances.owl#comment09_05_28_029216.28122765</id>
	<title>Re:Companionship is addictive</title>
	<author>Aceticon</author>
	<datestamp>1243521300000</datestamp>
	<modclass>Interestin</modclass>
	<modscore>3</modscore>
	<htmltext><p>If your theory about the need for socializing was the end all explanation for the success of Online games, then Second Life (as pure a socializing game as it could be) would be by far the most successful of them all.</p><p>The truth is that not all of us in our 30s are driven to play Online games for companionship (or are fat and live in our parent's basement<nobr> <wbr></nobr>;)).</p><p>There are multiple drivers to play online games (see the Bartle Food Groups: <a href="http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Bartle\_Test" title="wikipedia.org">http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Bartle\_Test</a> [wikipedia.org]) only one of which is Socializing.</p><p>Online games (like WoW or Unreal Tournament) have two really big differences from equivalent single player games, both little or not at all social:<br>- MMORPGs contain HUGE universes, much bigger that the largest of single player RPGs and they periodically grow. A game like WoW can keep an "explorer" type busy for months, even years.<br>- The current status of AI in games is such that playing against computer-controlled bots is less satisfying that playing against people. Part of the reason is technical: bots are incapable of complex strategical moves - and part is social: it is more satisfying to demonstrate superior skills against a fellow human than against a bot. This mostly satisfies the Achiever types.</p></htmltext>
<tokenext>If your theory about the need for socializing was the end all explanation for the success of Online games , then Second Life ( as pure a socializing game as it could be ) would be by far the most successful of them all.The truth is that not all of us in our 30s are driven to play Online games for companionship ( or are fat and live in our parent 's basement ; ) ) .There are multiple drivers to play online games ( see the Bartle Food Groups : http : //en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Bartle \ _Test [ wikipedia.org ] ) only one of which is Socializing.Online games ( like WoW or Unreal Tournament ) have two really big differences from equivalent single player games , both little or not at all social : - MMORPGs contain HUGE universes , much bigger that the largest of single player RPGs and they periodically grow .
A game like WoW can keep an " explorer " type busy for months , even years.- The current status of AI in games is such that playing against computer-controlled bots is less satisfying that playing against people .
Part of the reason is technical : bots are incapable of complex strategical moves - and part is social : it is more satisfying to demonstrate superior skills against a fellow human than against a bot .
This mostly satisfies the Achiever types .</tokentext>
<sentencetext>If your theory about the need for socializing was the end all explanation for the success of Online games, then Second Life (as pure a socializing game as it could be) would be by far the most successful of them all.The truth is that not all of us in our 30s are driven to play Online games for companionship (or are fat and live in our parent's basement ;)).There are multiple drivers to play online games (see the Bartle Food Groups: http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Bartle\_Test [wikipedia.org]) only one of which is Socializing.Online games (like WoW or Unreal Tournament) have two really big differences from equivalent single player games, both little or not at all social:- MMORPGs contain HUGE universes, much bigger that the largest of single player RPGs and they periodically grow.
A game like WoW can keep an "explorer" type busy for months, even years.- The current status of AI in games is such that playing against computer-controlled bots is less satisfying that playing against people.
Part of the reason is technical: bots are incapable of complex strategical moves - and part is social: it is more satisfying to demonstrate superior skills against a fellow human than against a bot.
This mostly satisfies the Achiever types.</sentencetext>
	<parent>http://www.semanticweb.org/ontologies/ConversationInstances.owl#comment09_05_28_029216.28120937</parent>
</comment>
<comment>
	<id>http://www.semanticweb.org/ontologies/ConversationInstances.owl#comment09_05_28_029216.28128609</id>
	<title>Re:Companionship is addictive</title>
	<author>goldaryn</author>
	<datestamp>1243542660000</datestamp>
	<modclass>None</modclass>
	<modscore>1</modscore>
	<htmltext>&gt; one celebrity, one mass murderer, one nobel prize candidate, one illiterate, one billionaire, one terrorist<br> <br>
And we have a surprise for you... he's taken the time off posting on Slashdot... he's here tonight!</htmltext>
<tokenext>&gt; one celebrity , one mass murderer , one nobel prize candidate , one illiterate , one billionaire , one terrorist And we have a surprise for you... he 's taken the time off posting on Slashdot... he 's here tonight !</tokentext>
<sentencetext>&gt; one celebrity, one mass murderer, one nobel prize candidate, one illiterate, one billionaire, one terrorist 
And we have a surprise for you... he's taken the time off posting on Slashdot... he's here tonight!</sentencetext>
	<parent>http://www.semanticweb.org/ontologies/ConversationInstances.owl#comment09_05_28_029216.28121477</parent>
</comment>
<comment>
	<id>http://www.semanticweb.org/ontologies/ConversationInstances.owl#comment09_05_28_029216.28130119</id>
	<title>My experience</title>
	<author>^\_^x</author>
	<datestamp>1243504980000</datestamp>
	<modclass>None</modclass>
	<modscore>1</modscore>
	<htmltext><p>I wrote about this several years ago after playing a few MMOs... I don't have access to the essay right now, but a few of the addictive points I remember are:<br>- When you pay a subscription fee to play an unlimited time per month, you get more value from the fee the more you play the game.<br>- Other players can observe your character and items, seemingly lending credence to them psychologically. It makes them "more real" than a single player or non-persistent game.<br>- Feeding on that, progress in the game feels more like you're actually getting something done (you're not!)<br>- You meet friends in the game, so often to keep in touch with these friends, you must keep playing the game.<br>- Also, you're compelled to play the game to keep your character on an equivalent level of progress to the others in your guild.</p><p>MMOs definitely have some additional tricks up their sleeve when it comes to compelling players to play them.</p></htmltext>
<tokenext>I wrote about this several years ago after playing a few MMOs... I do n't have access to the essay right now , but a few of the addictive points I remember are : - When you pay a subscription fee to play an unlimited time per month , you get more value from the fee the more you play the game.- Other players can observe your character and items , seemingly lending credence to them psychologically .
It makes them " more real " than a single player or non-persistent game.- Feeding on that , progress in the game feels more like you 're actually getting something done ( you 're not !
) - You meet friends in the game , so often to keep in touch with these friends , you must keep playing the game.- Also , you 're compelled to play the game to keep your character on an equivalent level of progress to the others in your guild.MMOs definitely have some additional tricks up their sleeve when it comes to compelling players to play them .</tokentext>
<sentencetext>I wrote about this several years ago after playing a few MMOs... I don't have access to the essay right now, but a few of the addictive points I remember are:- When you pay a subscription fee to play an unlimited time per month, you get more value from the fee the more you play the game.- Other players can observe your character and items, seemingly lending credence to them psychologically.
It makes them "more real" than a single player or non-persistent game.- Feeding on that, progress in the game feels more like you're actually getting something done (you're not!
)- You meet friends in the game, so often to keep in touch with these friends, you must keep playing the game.- Also, you're compelled to play the game to keep your character on an equivalent level of progress to the others in your guild.MMOs definitely have some additional tricks up their sleeve when it comes to compelling players to play them.</sentencetext>
</comment>
<comment>
	<id>http://www.semanticweb.org/ontologies/ConversationInstances.owl#comment09_05_28_029216.28124105</id>
	<title>Re:Its the rewards.</title>
	<author>Sleepy</author>
	<datestamp>1243527540000</datestamp>
	<modclass>None</modclass>
	<modscore>1</modscore>
	<htmltext><p>Damn. You'd have enough time to brew beer, from scratch (crushed grains). That's one of my hobbies, and I never have enough time for it.</p><p>All I can say is I am glad Fallout 3 is not a MMORPG.</p></htmltext>
<tokenext>Damn .
You 'd have enough time to brew beer , from scratch ( crushed grains ) .
That 's one of my hobbies , and I never have enough time for it.All I can say is I am glad Fallout 3 is not a MMORPG .</tokentext>
<sentencetext>Damn.
You'd have enough time to brew beer, from scratch (crushed grains).
That's one of my hobbies, and I never have enough time for it.All I can say is I am glad Fallout 3 is not a MMORPG.</sentencetext>
	<parent>http://www.semanticweb.org/ontologies/ConversationInstances.owl#comment09_05_28_029216.28120935</parent>
</comment>
<comment>
	<id>http://www.semanticweb.org/ontologies/ConversationInstances.owl#comment09_05_28_029216.28122667</id>
	<title>We all know the truth?</title>
	<author>Twyst3d</author>
	<datestamp>1243520880000</datestamp>
	<modclass>Insightful</modclass>
	<modscore>2</modscore>
	<htmltext><p><div class="quote"><p>There is a pretty funny theory that the vast majority of WoW players are well-respected professionals who play the game in their free time. Through the playing of WoW, they not only practice their leadership skills, but also organizational skills and planning skills. The idea is that the game reinforces and promotes cooperative game play while preserving a fun environment.</p><p>But we all know the truth. It's 30 year old lardballs who still live with their parents that play this game. The lack of friends and human companionship drives them to seek out online communities where they can be accepted as who they portray themselves as rather than for who they, unfortunately, are. Seeking companionship is one of the most primal of human urges.</p><p>I don't know how you can say the game is addictive, in that sense. I'm not addicted to breathing or eating, but I'd die without doing either of those. We are talking about something very close to the core of being a human, not a dependency developed through repeated exposure.</p></div><p>Apparently quoting the same thing old tired recycled line of "30 years olds in their mothers basements" is worth 5 points Insightful.  Who would have known?</p><p>I wont deny these 30 year olds of which you speak dont exist.  But Im quite sick of seeing that tired old line recycled.  Worse - being subjected to the gall of essentially repeating the worst most repeated joke of the last few years, and doing so with condescension towards others about a product you seem to know so little about.</p><p> The people I met in WoW.  Came from all walks of life.  Sure there may be your generic nerds in there.  But there are also doctors, singers actors, producers, truck drivers, restaurant owners, bell boys, chefs, and social workers.  And thats just the tip of the iceberg.  There are 11 million people playing this game right now.  To say its all one type of people doesnt explain why past MMOs were not nearly as successful.  But Im sure according to your 5 point INsightful original and trailblazing opinion.  The world was just waiting for a large population of people to hit 30 and then go live with their parents.  And when I say met - I mean I met these people.  I even went to one of their funerals IRL.</p><p>And more players than you think are tired parents trying desperately to get a single hour at the end of the day just for themselves.  A single hour away from their entire day spent working to provide for and take care of the family.  And even then their ghetto little hour to mellow out most times is interrupted anyways.</p><p>Is it addictive?  If you are unemployed and need an escape - very much so.  But for a good number of people.  Its an alternative to going out and spending a ton of cash on a single nights activities that provides a bare minimum of companionship and relaxation.  15$ a month vs a bare minimum of 15$ a night to go out.  Thats a hrd pitch to resist financially.</p></div>
	</htmltext>
<tokenext>There is a pretty funny theory that the vast majority of WoW players are well-respected professionals who play the game in their free time .
Through the playing of WoW , they not only practice their leadership skills , but also organizational skills and planning skills .
The idea is that the game reinforces and promotes cooperative game play while preserving a fun environment.But we all know the truth .
It 's 30 year old lardballs who still live with their parents that play this game .
The lack of friends and human companionship drives them to seek out online communities where they can be accepted as who they portray themselves as rather than for who they , unfortunately , are .
Seeking companionship is one of the most primal of human urges.I do n't know how you can say the game is addictive , in that sense .
I 'm not addicted to breathing or eating , but I 'd die without doing either of those .
We are talking about something very close to the core of being a human , not a dependency developed through repeated exposure.Apparently quoting the same thing old tired recycled line of " 30 years olds in their mothers basements " is worth 5 points Insightful .
Who would have known ? I wont deny these 30 year olds of which you speak dont exist .
But Im quite sick of seeing that tired old line recycled .
Worse - being subjected to the gall of essentially repeating the worst most repeated joke of the last few years , and doing so with condescension towards others about a product you seem to know so little about .
The people I met in WoW .
Came from all walks of life .
Sure there may be your generic nerds in there .
But there are also doctors , singers actors , producers , truck drivers , restaurant owners , bell boys , chefs , and social workers .
And thats just the tip of the iceberg .
There are 11 million people playing this game right now .
To say its all one type of people doesnt explain why past MMOs were not nearly as successful .
But Im sure according to your 5 point INsightful original and trailblazing opinion .
The world was just waiting for a large population of people to hit 30 and then go live with their parents .
And when I say met - I mean I met these people .
I even went to one of their funerals IRL.And more players than you think are tired parents trying desperately to get a single hour at the end of the day just for themselves .
A single hour away from their entire day spent working to provide for and take care of the family .
And even then their ghetto little hour to mellow out most times is interrupted anyways.Is it addictive ?
If you are unemployed and need an escape - very much so .
But for a good number of people .
Its an alternative to going out and spending a ton of cash on a single nights activities that provides a bare minimum of companionship and relaxation .
15 $ a month vs a bare minimum of 15 $ a night to go out .
Thats a hrd pitch to resist financially .</tokentext>
<sentencetext>There is a pretty funny theory that the vast majority of WoW players are well-respected professionals who play the game in their free time.
Through the playing of WoW, they not only practice their leadership skills, but also organizational skills and planning skills.
The idea is that the game reinforces and promotes cooperative game play while preserving a fun environment.But we all know the truth.
It's 30 year old lardballs who still live with their parents that play this game.
The lack of friends and human companionship drives them to seek out online communities where they can be accepted as who they portray themselves as rather than for who they, unfortunately, are.
Seeking companionship is one of the most primal of human urges.I don't know how you can say the game is addictive, in that sense.
I'm not addicted to breathing or eating, but I'd die without doing either of those.
We are talking about something very close to the core of being a human, not a dependency developed through repeated exposure.Apparently quoting the same thing old tired recycled line of "30 years olds in their mothers basements" is worth 5 points Insightful.
Who would have known?I wont deny these 30 year olds of which you speak dont exist.
But Im quite sick of seeing that tired old line recycled.
Worse - being subjected to the gall of essentially repeating the worst most repeated joke of the last few years, and doing so with condescension towards others about a product you seem to know so little about.
The people I met in WoW.
Came from all walks of life.
Sure there may be your generic nerds in there.
But there are also doctors, singers actors, producers, truck drivers, restaurant owners, bell boys, chefs, and social workers.
And thats just the tip of the iceberg.
There are 11 million people playing this game right now.
To say its all one type of people doesnt explain why past MMOs were not nearly as successful.
But Im sure according to your 5 point INsightful original and trailblazing opinion.
The world was just waiting for a large population of people to hit 30 and then go live with their parents.
And when I say met - I mean I met these people.
I even went to one of their funerals IRL.And more players than you think are tired parents trying desperately to get a single hour at the end of the day just for themselves.
A single hour away from their entire day spent working to provide for and take care of the family.
And even then their ghetto little hour to mellow out most times is interrupted anyways.Is it addictive?
If you are unemployed and need an escape - very much so.
But for a good number of people.
Its an alternative to going out and spending a ton of cash on a single nights activities that provides a bare minimum of companionship and relaxation.
15$ a month vs a bare minimum of 15$ a night to go out.
Thats a hrd pitch to resist financially.
	</sentencetext>
	<parent>http://www.semanticweb.org/ontologies/ConversationInstances.owl#comment09_05_28_029216.28120937</parent>
</comment>
<comment>
	<id>http://www.semanticweb.org/ontologies/ConversationInstances.owl#comment09_05_28_029216.28123523</id>
	<title>The only element that matters</title>
	<author>Anonymous</author>
	<datestamp>1243524720000</datestamp>
	<modclass>None</modclass>
	<modscore>0</modscore>
	<htmltext><p>As long as we're going to continue to be liberal with the term "addiction" the only element of game design that matters is this:</p><p>A highly repetitive experience (paying a monthly subscription) in exchange for a "reward" (access to a service).</p><p>Funny thing is most of non-necessities I buy use this model.  Games, internet access, cable, cellphone, even electricity.  And when one of them is cut off, my reaction is pretty much the same.  I guess I'm addicted to them all.</p><p>Now if you'll excuse me, I've got to go jack on.</p></htmltext>
<tokenext>As long as we 're going to continue to be liberal with the term " addiction " the only element of game design that matters is this : A highly repetitive experience ( paying a monthly subscription ) in exchange for a " reward " ( access to a service ) .Funny thing is most of non-necessities I buy use this model .
Games , internet access , cable , cellphone , even electricity .
And when one of them is cut off , my reaction is pretty much the same .
I guess I 'm addicted to them all.Now if you 'll excuse me , I 've got to go jack on .</tokentext>
<sentencetext>As long as we're going to continue to be liberal with the term "addiction" the only element of game design that matters is this:A highly repetitive experience (paying a monthly subscription) in exchange for a "reward" (access to a service).Funny thing is most of non-necessities I buy use this model.
Games, internet access, cable, cellphone, even electricity.
And when one of them is cut off, my reaction is pretty much the same.
I guess I'm addicted to them all.Now if you'll excuse me, I've got to go jack on.</sentencetext>
</comment>
<comment>
	<id>http://www.semanticweb.org/ontologies/ConversationInstances.owl#comment09_05_28_029216.28131475</id>
	<title>I actually read the article</title>
	<author>brkello</author>
	<datestamp>1243510980000</datestamp>
	<modclass>None</modclass>
	<modscore>1</modscore>
	<htmltext>and it didn't get very deep.  He defines addiction in games as games that offer rewards (they tend to be smaller rewards) for doing the same thing over and over again.  Of course, this is focusing on MMORPGs, but I don't see why it has to other than it is popular to bash these games right now...which is a bit odd to me...but let me explain more.<br> <br>Some of us like to game.  Whether it be RPGs, FPSs, RTSs, TBSs, MMORPGs or whatever.  There has been a negative reaction towards people who game from the general public.  Gamers don't like this.  What is the difference if we game for a few hours a night instead of watching reruns of TV shows we have already seen.  There really isn't a difference (other than gaming uses more brain power since there is actually some interaction instead of just sitting there).  But since it is newer and different from the norm, people will make fun of, write laws against, etc etc just as they did in the past for D&amp;D and rock music.<br> <br>MMORPGs are really not any different than regular games other than the regular content releases and more social aspects.  You do the same things over and over again...sure.  But you do it with different people and you are getting better at it each time you do it.  Really, not much different from traditional games like chess or go.  You are doing the same things over and over, but you are getting better and you are enjoying yourself.  Nothing really to freak out about.  But even many gamers on here are going to bash WoW because it's new and they can't spend as much time on it.  That and they probably know someone who has screwed up their lives by playing too much. <br> <br>But most people don't have issues.  Like most people can go out on weekends have a few drinks, and not get wasted.  But we all know friends who go out and drink too much.  But that is more socially acceptable.  Why?  Because we live in a society that values extroverts over introverts.  So because you don't want to go out with friends and feel more comfortable at home, you are weird.  "Why would Bob rather play WoW than come get drunk with us?  Man, that guy is a loser."  But him staying home playing WoW is his time to recharge and be happy just like for extroverts, their time to recharge is being social with friends.<br> <br>In any case, the whole MMORPG addiction thing is overblown.  It is just because it is new to society that it faces so much scrutiny.  Human beings have been finding ways to screw up their lives since the beginning of time.  This is no different.  In 100 years, people playing MMORPGs will be griping about all the holocube addicts.  Why can't they just be like everyone else and play MMORPGs?  Freaking losers.</htmltext>
<tokenext>and it did n't get very deep .
He defines addiction in games as games that offer rewards ( they tend to be smaller rewards ) for doing the same thing over and over again .
Of course , this is focusing on MMORPGs , but I do n't see why it has to other than it is popular to bash these games right now...which is a bit odd to me...but let me explain more .
Some of us like to game .
Whether it be RPGs , FPSs , RTSs , TBSs , MMORPGs or whatever .
There has been a negative reaction towards people who game from the general public .
Gamers do n't like this .
What is the difference if we game for a few hours a night instead of watching reruns of TV shows we have already seen .
There really is n't a difference ( other than gaming uses more brain power since there is actually some interaction instead of just sitting there ) .
But since it is newer and different from the norm , people will make fun of , write laws against , etc etc just as they did in the past for D&amp;D and rock music .
MMORPGs are really not any different than regular games other than the regular content releases and more social aspects .
You do the same things over and over again...sure .
But you do it with different people and you are getting better at it each time you do it .
Really , not much different from traditional games like chess or go .
You are doing the same things over and over , but you are getting better and you are enjoying yourself .
Nothing really to freak out about .
But even many gamers on here are going to bash WoW because it 's new and they ca n't spend as much time on it .
That and they probably know someone who has screwed up their lives by playing too much .
But most people do n't have issues .
Like most people can go out on weekends have a few drinks , and not get wasted .
But we all know friends who go out and drink too much .
But that is more socially acceptable .
Why ? Because we live in a society that values extroverts over introverts .
So because you do n't want to go out with friends and feel more comfortable at home , you are weird .
" Why would Bob rather play WoW than come get drunk with us ?
Man , that guy is a loser .
" But him staying home playing WoW is his time to recharge and be happy just like for extroverts , their time to recharge is being social with friends .
In any case , the whole MMORPG addiction thing is overblown .
It is just because it is new to society that it faces so much scrutiny .
Human beings have been finding ways to screw up their lives since the beginning of time .
This is no different .
In 100 years , people playing MMORPGs will be griping about all the holocube addicts .
Why ca n't they just be like everyone else and play MMORPGs ?
Freaking losers .</tokentext>
<sentencetext>and it didn't get very deep.
He defines addiction in games as games that offer rewards (they tend to be smaller rewards) for doing the same thing over and over again.
Of course, this is focusing on MMORPGs, but I don't see why it has to other than it is popular to bash these games right now...which is a bit odd to me...but let me explain more.
Some of us like to game.
Whether it be RPGs, FPSs, RTSs, TBSs, MMORPGs or whatever.
There has been a negative reaction towards people who game from the general public.
Gamers don't like this.
What is the difference if we game for a few hours a night instead of watching reruns of TV shows we have already seen.
There really isn't a difference (other than gaming uses more brain power since there is actually some interaction instead of just sitting there).
But since it is newer and different from the norm, people will make fun of, write laws against, etc etc just as they did in the past for D&amp;D and rock music.
MMORPGs are really not any different than regular games other than the regular content releases and more social aspects.
You do the same things over and over again...sure.
But you do it with different people and you are getting better at it each time you do it.
Really, not much different from traditional games like chess or go.
You are doing the same things over and over, but you are getting better and you are enjoying yourself.
Nothing really to freak out about.
But even many gamers on here are going to bash WoW because it's new and they can't spend as much time on it.
That and they probably know someone who has screwed up their lives by playing too much.
But most people don't have issues.
Like most people can go out on weekends have a few drinks, and not get wasted.
But we all know friends who go out and drink too much.
But that is more socially acceptable.
Why?  Because we live in a society that values extroverts over introverts.
So because you don't want to go out with friends and feel more comfortable at home, you are weird.
"Why would Bob rather play WoW than come get drunk with us?
Man, that guy is a loser.
"  But him staying home playing WoW is his time to recharge and be happy just like for extroverts, their time to recharge is being social with friends.
In any case, the whole MMORPG addiction thing is overblown.
It is just because it is new to society that it faces so much scrutiny.
Human beings have been finding ways to screw up their lives since the beginning of time.
This is no different.
In 100 years, people playing MMORPGs will be griping about all the holocube addicts.
Why can't they just be like everyone else and play MMORPGs?
Freaking losers.</sentencetext>
</comment>
<comment>
	<id>http://www.semanticweb.org/ontologies/ConversationInstances.owl#comment09_05_28_029216.28122973</id>
	<title>D&amp;D for those without friends ...</title>
	<author>oneiros27</author>
	<datestamp>1243522320000</datestamp>
	<modclass>Insightful</modclass>
	<modscore>2</modscore>
	<htmltext><p>Okay, maybe that's a bit harsh, but with any RPG or table top wargame, be it D&amp;D / Shadow Run / Battle Tech / Car Wars / Toon! / Paranoia / GURPs / WH40k (I'm just the listing the ones I played growing up), you had to be able to get a group together, find a convenient place for everyone, etc.</p><p>With some of 'em, where there's progress from session to session rather than stand-alone sessions, you need to get everyone to be able to show up every time -- which is a problem as people work different schedules, have kids, move further away, etc.</p><p>With online gaming, you could just drop in for an hour or two, meet up with the party, drop out when life calls (as opposed to the night when one of the player's (now wife) kept calling every hour and keeping him on the phone for 20-30 min at a time, not understanding how EVERYONE else had to stop while it was going on.</p><p>I admit, I don't play WoW -- I did play EverQuest for a bit, and I mudded for years in college, but our group tended to stick to more private groupings -- We did a fair number of LAN parties in the years after college, then later would coordinate times for Diablo, StarCraft, Age of Empires, Warcraft III, Command &amp; Conquer, Neverwinter Nights, Dawn of War, etc.  Sometimes LAN parties, but normally just a normal weeknight where we didn't have to deal with travel (as one now lives 500 miles away and the others would still take up to 2 hrs each way w/ travel, setup, etc.)</p><p>So<nobr> <wbr></nobr>... the point is<nobr> <wbr></nobr>... MMOs are more convenient than face to face.  Yes, they're less imaginative, yes, they can be less social, but we can get a game together in under an hour if someone feels the need to unwind from a stressful day at work, whereas a day of WH40K gaming might require weeks to prepare (gotta modify my figures to deal with some rules change / new tactics, etc.)</p></htmltext>
<tokenext>Okay , maybe that 's a bit harsh , but with any RPG or table top wargame , be it D&amp;D / Shadow Run / Battle Tech / Car Wars / Toon !
/ Paranoia / GURPs / WH40k ( I 'm just the listing the ones I played growing up ) , you had to be able to get a group together , find a convenient place for everyone , etc.With some of 'em , where there 's progress from session to session rather than stand-alone sessions , you need to get everyone to be able to show up every time -- which is a problem as people work different schedules , have kids , move further away , etc.With online gaming , you could just drop in for an hour or two , meet up with the party , drop out when life calls ( as opposed to the night when one of the player 's ( now wife ) kept calling every hour and keeping him on the phone for 20-30 min at a time , not understanding how EVERYONE else had to stop while it was going on.I admit , I do n't play WoW -- I did play EverQuest for a bit , and I mudded for years in college , but our group tended to stick to more private groupings -- We did a fair number of LAN parties in the years after college , then later would coordinate times for Diablo , StarCraft , Age of Empires , Warcraft III , Command &amp; Conquer , Neverwinter Nights , Dawn of War , etc .
Sometimes LAN parties , but normally just a normal weeknight where we did n't have to deal with travel ( as one now lives 500 miles away and the others would still take up to 2 hrs each way w/ travel , setup , etc .
) So ... the point is ... MMOs are more convenient than face to face .
Yes , they 're less imaginative , yes , they can be less social , but we can get a game together in under an hour if someone feels the need to unwind from a stressful day at work , whereas a day of WH40K gaming might require weeks to prepare ( got ta modify my figures to deal with some rules change / new tactics , etc .
)</tokentext>
<sentencetext>Okay, maybe that's a bit harsh, but with any RPG or table top wargame, be it D&amp;D / Shadow Run / Battle Tech / Car Wars / Toon!
/ Paranoia / GURPs / WH40k (I'm just the listing the ones I played growing up), you had to be able to get a group together, find a convenient place for everyone, etc.With some of 'em, where there's progress from session to session rather than stand-alone sessions, you need to get everyone to be able to show up every time -- which is a problem as people work different schedules, have kids, move further away, etc.With online gaming, you could just drop in for an hour or two, meet up with the party, drop out when life calls (as opposed to the night when one of the player's (now wife) kept calling every hour and keeping him on the phone for 20-30 min at a time, not understanding how EVERYONE else had to stop while it was going on.I admit, I don't play WoW -- I did play EverQuest for a bit, and I mudded for years in college, but our group tended to stick to more private groupings -- We did a fair number of LAN parties in the years after college, then later would coordinate times for Diablo, StarCraft, Age of Empires, Warcraft III, Command &amp; Conquer, Neverwinter Nights, Dawn of War, etc.
Sometimes LAN parties, but normally just a normal weeknight where we didn't have to deal with travel (as one now lives 500 miles away and the others would still take up to 2 hrs each way w/ travel, setup, etc.
)So ... the point is ... MMOs are more convenient than face to face.
Yes, they're less imaginative, yes, they can be less social, but we can get a game together in under an hour if someone feels the need to unwind from a stressful day at work, whereas a day of WH40K gaming might require weeks to prepare (gotta modify my figures to deal with some rules change / new tactics, etc.
)</sentencetext>
	<parent>http://www.semanticweb.org/ontologies/ConversationInstances.owl#comment09_05_28_029216.28121571</parent>
</comment>
<comment>
	<id>http://www.semanticweb.org/ontologies/ConversationInstances.owl#comment09_05_28_029216.28128543</id>
	<title>Re:Subscription based addiction</title>
	<author>Anonymous</author>
	<datestamp>1243542540000</datestamp>
	<modclass>None</modclass>
	<modscore>0</modscore>
	<htmltext><p>What they don't understand is that you can <b>not</b> be addicted to video games the way you can be to drugs. No matter what game you play, or fun activity you engage in, the same chemical is given out in our brain that causes "fun". So yeah, you could be addicted to having fun, however, there's no real downside there.</p></htmltext>
<tokenext>What they do n't understand is that you can not be addicted to video games the way you can be to drugs .
No matter what game you play , or fun activity you engage in , the same chemical is given out in our brain that causes " fun " .
So yeah , you could be addicted to having fun , however , there 's no real downside there .</tokentext>
<sentencetext>What they don't understand is that you can not be addicted to video games the way you can be to drugs.
No matter what game you play, or fun activity you engage in, the same chemical is given out in our brain that causes "fun".
So yeah, you could be addicted to having fun, however, there's no real downside there.</sentencetext>
	<parent>http://www.semanticweb.org/ontologies/ConversationInstances.owl#comment09_05_28_029216.28120933</parent>
</comment>
<comment>
	<id>http://www.semanticweb.org/ontologies/ConversationInstances.owl#comment09_05_28_029216.28120947</id>
	<title>Addictive ?</title>
	<author>Anonymous</author>
	<datestamp>1243507560000</datestamp>
	<modclass>Funny</modclass>
	<modscore>1</modscore>
	<htmltext><p>Well, as they package Red Bull with it...</p></htmltext>
<tokenext>Well , as they package Red Bull with it.. .</tokentext>
<sentencetext>Well, as they package Red Bull with it...</sentencetext>
</comment>
<comment>
	<id>http://www.semanticweb.org/ontologies/ConversationInstances.owl#comment09_05_28_029216.28135855</id>
	<title>Re:Companionship is addictive</title>
	<author>meimeiriver</author>
	<datestamp>1243630680000</datestamp>
	<modclass>None</modclass>
	<modscore>1</modscore>
	<htmltext><p>
<i>But we all know the truth. It's 30 year old lardballs who still live with their parents that play this game. The lack of friends and human companionship drives them to seek out online communities where they can be accepted as who they portray themselves as rather than for who they, unfortunately, are. Seeking companionship is one of the most primal of human urges.</i>
</p><p>
You're working this deal all backwards. It's real life that allows people to portray themselves as someone they, unfortunately, aren't. The cute girl with her hot body, the salesman with his endearing smile, the exec in his spiffing suit, it's all covering the inside. If we'd ever got to see who these people really are, we'de be running away screaming half the time. In worlds like WoW, however, such physicalities have fallen away. What you call 'pretending' is, in fact, often the opposite: that sweet girl you're talking to, well, she really IS sweet. That's who she really is. It's YOU, used to judging people by their outer package, who concludes she's pretending to be something she's not, should it turn out she's fugly in real life.
</p><p>
In worlds like WoW, the avatars notwithstanding, you are what you write: your inner thoughts is what attracts people to you (or repels them from you). There's no cute body to help you out. You can't jiggle your boobs to get your way, or bat your beautiful wide eyes at that policeman, and have him tear up that speeding ticket. It's all just you. Now, if that allows some people to be highly more successful, or popular, than they are/would be in real life, then only so because there's no (sometimes plain, ugly, or plain ugly) cover to judge the book by. That's a good thing, BTW.</p></htmltext>
<tokenext>But we all know the truth .
It 's 30 year old lardballs who still live with their parents that play this game .
The lack of friends and human companionship drives them to seek out online communities where they can be accepted as who they portray themselves as rather than for who they , unfortunately , are .
Seeking companionship is one of the most primal of human urges .
You 're working this deal all backwards .
It 's real life that allows people to portray themselves as someone they , unfortunately , are n't .
The cute girl with her hot body , the salesman with his endearing smile , the exec in his spiffing suit , it 's all covering the inside .
If we 'd ever got to see who these people really are , we'de be running away screaming half the time .
In worlds like WoW , however , such physicalities have fallen away .
What you call 'pretending ' is , in fact , often the opposite : that sweet girl you 're talking to , well , she really IS sweet .
That 's who she really is .
It 's YOU , used to judging people by their outer package , who concludes she 's pretending to be something she 's not , should it turn out she 's fugly in real life .
In worlds like WoW , the avatars notwithstanding , you are what you write : your inner thoughts is what attracts people to you ( or repels them from you ) .
There 's no cute body to help you out .
You ca n't jiggle your boobs to get your way , or bat your beautiful wide eyes at that policeman , and have him tear up that speeding ticket .
It 's all just you .
Now , if that allows some people to be highly more successful , or popular , than they are/would be in real life , then only so because there 's no ( sometimes plain , ugly , or plain ugly ) cover to judge the book by .
That 's a good thing , BTW .</tokentext>
<sentencetext>
But we all know the truth.
It's 30 year old lardballs who still live with their parents that play this game.
The lack of friends and human companionship drives them to seek out online communities where they can be accepted as who they portray themselves as rather than for who they, unfortunately, are.
Seeking companionship is one of the most primal of human urges.
You're working this deal all backwards.
It's real life that allows people to portray themselves as someone they, unfortunately, aren't.
The cute girl with her hot body, the salesman with his endearing smile, the exec in his spiffing suit, it's all covering the inside.
If we'd ever got to see who these people really are, we'de be running away screaming half the time.
In worlds like WoW, however, such physicalities have fallen away.
What you call 'pretending' is, in fact, often the opposite: that sweet girl you're talking to, well, she really IS sweet.
That's who she really is.
It's YOU, used to judging people by their outer package, who concludes she's pretending to be something she's not, should it turn out she's fugly in real life.
In worlds like WoW, the avatars notwithstanding, you are what you write: your inner thoughts is what attracts people to you (or repels them from you).
There's no cute body to help you out.
You can't jiggle your boobs to get your way, or bat your beautiful wide eyes at that policeman, and have him tear up that speeding ticket.
It's all just you.
Now, if that allows some people to be highly more successful, or popular, than they are/would be in real life, then only so because there's no (sometimes plain, ugly, or plain ugly) cover to judge the book by.
That's a good thing, BTW.</sentencetext>
	<parent>http://www.semanticweb.org/ontologies/ConversationInstances.owl#comment09_05_28_029216.28120937</parent>
</comment>
<comment>
	<id>http://www.semanticweb.org/ontologies/ConversationInstances.owl#comment09_05_28_029216.28124713</id>
	<title>this isn't a technical question</title>
	<author>superwiz</author>
	<datestamp>1243529820000</datestamp>
	<modclass>None</modclass>
	<modscore>1</modscore>
	<htmltext>It's a question for neuroscientists.  If the game experiences produce the same chemical reactions in the brain as the ones that occur during drug use (reuptake or inhibition of some specific neurotransmitters), then the experience is indistinguishable from drug use as far as the brain is concerned.  All the personal-responsibility arguments aside (because they can also be made about mild drug use), it's generally some re-association of flight vs fight mechanism or sexual excitation mechanism (or both).  But again, for exact details, ask a neuroscientist -- not a programmer.</htmltext>
<tokenext>It 's a question for neuroscientists .
If the game experiences produce the same chemical reactions in the brain as the ones that occur during drug use ( reuptake or inhibition of some specific neurotransmitters ) , then the experience is indistinguishable from drug use as far as the brain is concerned .
All the personal-responsibility arguments aside ( because they can also be made about mild drug use ) , it 's generally some re-association of flight vs fight mechanism or sexual excitation mechanism ( or both ) .
But again , for exact details , ask a neuroscientist -- not a programmer .</tokentext>
<sentencetext>It's a question for neuroscientists.
If the game experiences produce the same chemical reactions in the brain as the ones that occur during drug use (reuptake or inhibition of some specific neurotransmitters), then the experience is indistinguishable from drug use as far as the brain is concerned.
All the personal-responsibility arguments aside (because they can also be made about mild drug use), it's generally some re-association of flight vs fight mechanism or sexual excitation mechanism (or both).
But again, for exact details, ask a neuroscientist -- not a programmer.</sentencetext>
</comment>
<comment>
	<id>http://www.semanticweb.org/ontologies/ConversationInstances.owl#comment09_05_28_029216.28134685</id>
	<title>Re:Companionship is addictive</title>
	<author>4D6963</author>
	<datestamp>1243531620000</datestamp>
	<modclass>None</modclass>
	<modscore>1</modscore>
	<htmltext>Wow, so instead of being a broke loner who lives in his mother's basement, it's a one-dimensional workaholic who fills his downtime with only one thing. Yeah, this is so unequivocally better.</htmltext>
<tokenext>Wow , so instead of being a broke loner who lives in his mother 's basement , it 's a one-dimensional workaholic who fills his downtime with only one thing .
Yeah , this is so unequivocally better .</tokentext>
<sentencetext>Wow, so instead of being a broke loner who lives in his mother's basement, it's a one-dimensional workaholic who fills his downtime with only one thing.
Yeah, this is so unequivocally better.</sentencetext>
	<parent>http://www.semanticweb.org/ontologies/ConversationInstances.owl#comment09_05_28_029216.28121225</parent>
</comment>
<comment>
	<id>http://www.semanticweb.org/ontologies/ConversationInstances.owl#comment09_05_28_029216.28120937</id>
	<title>Companionship is addictive</title>
	<author>BadAnalogyGuy</author>
	<datestamp>1243507500000</datestamp>
	<modclass>Insightful</modclass>
	<modscore>5</modscore>
	<htmltext><p>There is a pretty funny theory that the vast majority of WoW players are well-respected professionals who play the game in their free time. Through the playing of WoW, they not only practice their leadership skills, but also organizational skills and planning skills. The idea is that the game reinforces and promotes cooperative game play while preserving a fun environment.</p><p>But we all know the truth. It's 30 year old lardballs who still live with their parents that play this game. The lack of friends and human companionship drives them to seek out online communities where they can be accepted as who they portray themselves as rather than for who they, unfortunately, are. Seeking companionship is one of the most primal of human urges.</p><p>I don't know how you can say the game is addictive, in that sense. I'm not addicted to breathing or eating, but I'd die without doing either of those. We are talking about something very close to the core of being a human, not a dependency developed through repeated exposure.</p></htmltext>
<tokenext>There is a pretty funny theory that the vast majority of WoW players are well-respected professionals who play the game in their free time .
Through the playing of WoW , they not only practice their leadership skills , but also organizational skills and planning skills .
The idea is that the game reinforces and promotes cooperative game play while preserving a fun environment.But we all know the truth .
It 's 30 year old lardballs who still live with their parents that play this game .
The lack of friends and human companionship drives them to seek out online communities where they can be accepted as who they portray themselves as rather than for who they , unfortunately , are .
Seeking companionship is one of the most primal of human urges.I do n't know how you can say the game is addictive , in that sense .
I 'm not addicted to breathing or eating , but I 'd die without doing either of those .
We are talking about something very close to the core of being a human , not a dependency developed through repeated exposure .</tokentext>
<sentencetext>There is a pretty funny theory that the vast majority of WoW players are well-respected professionals who play the game in their free time.
Through the playing of WoW, they not only practice their leadership skills, but also organizational skills and planning skills.
The idea is that the game reinforces and promotes cooperative game play while preserving a fun environment.But we all know the truth.
It's 30 year old lardballs who still live with their parents that play this game.
The lack of friends and human companionship drives them to seek out online communities where they can be accepted as who they portray themselves as rather than for who they, unfortunately, are.
Seeking companionship is one of the most primal of human urges.I don't know how you can say the game is addictive, in that sense.
I'm not addicted to breathing or eating, but I'd die without doing either of those.
We are talking about something very close to the core of being a human, not a dependency developed through repeated exposure.</sentencetext>
</comment>
<comment>
	<id>http://www.semanticweb.org/ontologies/ConversationInstances.owl#comment09_05_28_029216.28121155</id>
	<title>Reward Are Also Competitive</title>
	<author>incubeous</author>
	<datestamp>1243509600000</datestamp>
	<modclass>Interestin</modclass>
	<modscore>2</modscore>
	<htmltext>Don't forget that one of the key ingredients in the MMO soup is being able to compete and flaunt your achievements to you the people you like AND the people you don't like.

It gives a sense of personal ranking and has a elitist type effect on the psyche.  It's always fun to show off your gear and make people drool.</htmltext>
<tokenext>Do n't forget that one of the key ingredients in the MMO soup is being able to compete and flaunt your achievements to you the people you like AND the people you do n't like .
It gives a sense of personal ranking and has a elitist type effect on the psyche .
It 's always fun to show off your gear and make people drool .</tokentext>
<sentencetext>Don't forget that one of the key ingredients in the MMO soup is being able to compete and flaunt your achievements to you the people you like AND the people you don't like.
It gives a sense of personal ranking and has a elitist type effect on the psyche.
It's always fun to show off your gear and make people drool.</sentencetext>
</comment>
<comment>
	<id>http://www.semanticweb.org/ontologies/ConversationInstances.owl#comment09_05_28_029216.28127645</id>
	<title>Re:study civilization iv</title>
	<author>brkello</author>
	<datestamp>1243540140000</datestamp>
	<modclass>None</modclass>
	<modscore>1</modscore>
	<htmltext>Ahh, Civ IV.  It is the only game I ever played for so long that I freaked out when someone was shining a light in to my window<nobr> <wbr></nobr>...only to realize it was the sun.</htmltext>
<tokenext>Ahh , Civ IV .
It is the only game I ever played for so long that I freaked out when someone was shining a light in to my window ...only to realize it was the sun .</tokentext>
<sentencetext>Ahh, Civ IV.
It is the only game I ever played for so long that I freaked out when someone was shining a light in to my window ...only to realize it was the sun.</sentencetext>
	<parent>http://www.semanticweb.org/ontologies/ConversationInstances.owl#comment09_05_28_029216.28123029</parent>
</comment>
<comment>
	<id>http://www.semanticweb.org/ontologies/ConversationInstances.owl#comment09_05_28_029216.28122321</id>
	<title>They aren't really addicted to the game</title>
	<author>DaveV1.0</author>
	<datestamp>1243519080000</datestamp>
	<modclass>Troll</modclass>
	<modscore>0</modscore>
	<htmltext><p>They are just losers who have no satisfaction in real life. The easy successes and minor penalty for failure make the game world more attractive than real life.</p></htmltext>
<tokenext>They are just losers who have no satisfaction in real life .
The easy successes and minor penalty for failure make the game world more attractive than real life .</tokentext>
<sentencetext>They are just losers who have no satisfaction in real life.
The easy successes and minor penalty for failure make the game world more attractive than real life.</sentencetext>
</comment>
<comment>
	<id>http://www.semanticweb.org/ontologies/ConversationInstances.owl#comment09_05_28_029216.28134311</id>
	<title>Re:Subscription based addiction</title>
	<author>SL Baur</author>
	<datestamp>1243527840000</datestamp>
	<modclass>None</modclass>
	<modscore>1</modscore>
	<htmltext><p><div class="quote"><p>I'd be interested in hearing what the longest period of time you've played a game is in terms of months or years it's kept your interest.</p></div><p>Probably the longest was rogue/hack/nethack at about 20 years.  Though that was with considerable off &amp; on time.</p><p><div class="quote"><p>I used to buy games every 2-6 weeks</p></div><p>Been there done that.</p><p>I've been subscribed to World of Warcraft for 2 1/2 ysars now.  I'm a loooooooooong ways away from spending more money on that with the subscription than I spent on GBA games that I don't want to play any more.</p><p>I'm far more of a fan of handhelds than consoles or computers.  The only console I've owned was a PS2 which didn't work - I bought it in Japan and thanks to region coding wouldn't play any English language games.  I also bought a PSP.  I haven't ever completed a game on it thanks to EA sloppy coding (the game crashes either in the middle or as I'm trying to win) or the game sucks.</p><p>GBA was a winner.  No matter where in the world I bought games they just worked and for the most part, I enjoyed them for a brief amount of time.  I've ended up finishing almost all of the GBA games I've bought.  I spent a lot of money, but I got a lot of entertainment - fair trade.</p><p>(the following is directed at the article, not the poster I'm responding to)</p><p>I like to play games.  I do not buy new games any more.  I have the 6-month subscription plan with Blizzard.  Is it really a problem that I can enjoy World of Warcraft *cheaper* than anything (die Sony die!) else?</p><p>You call it addiction, I call it pragmatic.  And besides, I play less WoW than most people watch television and I don't hear any cries about that being addictive.</p></div>
	</htmltext>
<tokenext>I 'd be interested in hearing what the longest period of time you 've played a game is in terms of months or years it 's kept your interest.Probably the longest was rogue/hack/nethack at about 20 years .
Though that was with considerable off &amp; on time.I used to buy games every 2-6 weeksBeen there done that.I 've been subscribed to World of Warcraft for 2 1/2 ysars now .
I 'm a loooooooooong ways away from spending more money on that with the subscription than I spent on GBA games that I do n't want to play any more.I 'm far more of a fan of handhelds than consoles or computers .
The only console I 've owned was a PS2 which did n't work - I bought it in Japan and thanks to region coding would n't play any English language games .
I also bought a PSP .
I have n't ever completed a game on it thanks to EA sloppy coding ( the game crashes either in the middle or as I 'm trying to win ) or the game sucks.GBA was a winner .
No matter where in the world I bought games they just worked and for the most part , I enjoyed them for a brief amount of time .
I 've ended up finishing almost all of the GBA games I 've bought .
I spent a lot of money , but I got a lot of entertainment - fair trade .
( the following is directed at the article , not the poster I 'm responding to ) I like to play games .
I do not buy new games any more .
I have the 6-month subscription plan with Blizzard .
Is it really a problem that I can enjoy World of Warcraft * cheaper * than anything ( die Sony die !
) else ? You call it addiction , I call it pragmatic .
And besides , I play less WoW than most people watch television and I do n't hear any cries about that being addictive .</tokentext>
<sentencetext>I'd be interested in hearing what the longest period of time you've played a game is in terms of months or years it's kept your interest.Probably the longest was rogue/hack/nethack at about 20 years.
Though that was with considerable off &amp; on time.I used to buy games every 2-6 weeksBeen there done that.I've been subscribed to World of Warcraft for 2 1/2 ysars now.
I'm a loooooooooong ways away from spending more money on that with the subscription than I spent on GBA games that I don't want to play any more.I'm far more of a fan of handhelds than consoles or computers.
The only console I've owned was a PS2 which didn't work - I bought it in Japan and thanks to region coding wouldn't play any English language games.
I also bought a PSP.
I haven't ever completed a game on it thanks to EA sloppy coding (the game crashes either in the middle or as I'm trying to win) or the game sucks.GBA was a winner.
No matter where in the world I bought games they just worked and for the most part, I enjoyed them for a brief amount of time.
I've ended up finishing almost all of the GBA games I've bought.
I spent a lot of money, but I got a lot of entertainment - fair trade.
(the following is directed at the article, not the poster I'm responding to)I like to play games.
I do not buy new games any more.
I have the 6-month subscription plan with Blizzard.
Is it really a problem that I can enjoy World of Warcraft *cheaper* than anything (die Sony die!
) else?You call it addiction, I call it pragmatic.
And besides, I play less WoW than most people watch television and I don't hear any cries about that being addictive.
	</sentencetext>
	<parent>http://www.semanticweb.org/ontologies/ConversationInstances.owl#comment09_05_28_029216.28125801</parent>
</comment>
<comment>
	<id>http://www.semanticweb.org/ontologies/ConversationInstances.owl#comment09_05_28_029216.28121571</id>
	<title>D&amp;D for the unimaginative</title>
	<author>boliboboli</author>
	<datestamp>1243514220000</datestamp>
	<modclass>Insightful</modclass>
	<modscore>5</modscore>
	<htmltext>The model for this game design is really from D&amp;D. E.g. Do stuff, get 'loot' randomly after an encounter, fill up the XP bar to hit the next level, improve skills, abilities, feats, etc, etc. The difference is that you don't have to go to your buddies basement(with your Doritos/Mountain Dew) and bring your dice on a Sunday afternoon to get your fix like with a video game; It's right there in your computer room. It also gives the experience to those who are imagination impaired.

The potion of the gaming industry using these 'evil' methods should be thanking Gary Gygax and Dave Arenson for the money they're making.</htmltext>
<tokenext>The model for this game design is really from D&amp;D .
E.g. Do stuff , get 'loot ' randomly after an encounter , fill up the XP bar to hit the next level , improve skills , abilities , feats , etc , etc .
The difference is that you do n't have to go to your buddies basement ( with your Doritos/Mountain Dew ) and bring your dice on a Sunday afternoon to get your fix like with a video game ; It 's right there in your computer room .
It also gives the experience to those who are imagination impaired .
The potion of the gaming industry using these 'evil ' methods should be thanking Gary Gygax and Dave Arenson for the money they 're making .</tokentext>
<sentencetext>The model for this game design is really from D&amp;D.
E.g. Do stuff, get 'loot' randomly after an encounter, fill up the XP bar to hit the next level, improve skills, abilities, feats, etc, etc.
The difference is that you don't have to go to your buddies basement(with your Doritos/Mountain Dew) and bring your dice on a Sunday afternoon to get your fix like with a video game; It's right there in your computer room.
It also gives the experience to those who are imagination impaired.
The potion of the gaming industry using these 'evil' methods should be thanking Gary Gygax and Dave Arenson for the money they're making.</sentencetext>
</comment>
<comment>
	<id>http://www.semanticweb.org/ontologies/ConversationInstances.owl#comment09_05_28_029216.28123901</id>
	<title>Addicted?  Maybe.</title>
	<author>stonecutter2</author>
	<datestamp>1243526640000</datestamp>
	<modclass>None</modclass>
	<modscore>1</modscore>
	<htmltext>I play WoW a lot because I think it's fun, and it's an amazing entertainment deal at $16 per month, for all of the hours I spend at it.  I have friends who live nearby, and we hang out in person, and we also hang out in the game doing stuff together.

What is the essence of designing a game that is addiction-based?  Replay value and a desire in the player to be an achiever.  With a subscription-based game, you have to keep people playing and wanting to play, to keep their account active.  You also need to provide ample opportunities for someone to achieve something, and then keep further achievements available to them to accomplish.  My friend who has 2 kids didn't have the time to level from 70 to 80, so he stopped playing WoW because the rewards and achievements weren't catered well enough to make him feel rewarded for his time.

World of Warcraft literally inserted an Achievement system in the game - for example, if you complete a dungeon, you get an achievement stating that you completed it.  When this system was released, although there were no specific awards for some achievements, a LOT of players just started accomplishing these achievements because it was just "something to do."  People like to feel like they accomplished something, and this achievement system gave them that chance.

Expansive content, the ability to set new goals at any time and accomplish them, sliding reward systems that are consistently extended to make you want to seek them out (but tantalizingly close enough to actually achieve them without too much frustration), these just a couple of things that will keep a subscription going and make a game addicting.</htmltext>
<tokenext>I play WoW a lot because I think it 's fun , and it 's an amazing entertainment deal at $ 16 per month , for all of the hours I spend at it .
I have friends who live nearby , and we hang out in person , and we also hang out in the game doing stuff together .
What is the essence of designing a game that is addiction-based ?
Replay value and a desire in the player to be an achiever .
With a subscription-based game , you have to keep people playing and wanting to play , to keep their account active .
You also need to provide ample opportunities for someone to achieve something , and then keep further achievements available to them to accomplish .
My friend who has 2 kids did n't have the time to level from 70 to 80 , so he stopped playing WoW because the rewards and achievements were n't catered well enough to make him feel rewarded for his time .
World of Warcraft literally inserted an Achievement system in the game - for example , if you complete a dungeon , you get an achievement stating that you completed it .
When this system was released , although there were no specific awards for some achievements , a LOT of players just started accomplishing these achievements because it was just " something to do .
" People like to feel like they accomplished something , and this achievement system gave them that chance .
Expansive content , the ability to set new goals at any time and accomplish them , sliding reward systems that are consistently extended to make you want to seek them out ( but tantalizingly close enough to actually achieve them without too much frustration ) , these just a couple of things that will keep a subscription going and make a game addicting .</tokentext>
<sentencetext>I play WoW a lot because I think it's fun, and it's an amazing entertainment deal at $16 per month, for all of the hours I spend at it.
I have friends who live nearby, and we hang out in person, and we also hang out in the game doing stuff together.
What is the essence of designing a game that is addiction-based?
Replay value and a desire in the player to be an achiever.
With a subscription-based game, you have to keep people playing and wanting to play, to keep their account active.
You also need to provide ample opportunities for someone to achieve something, and then keep further achievements available to them to accomplish.
My friend who has 2 kids didn't have the time to level from 70 to 80, so he stopped playing WoW because the rewards and achievements weren't catered well enough to make him feel rewarded for his time.
World of Warcraft literally inserted an Achievement system in the game - for example, if you complete a dungeon, you get an achievement stating that you completed it.
When this system was released, although there were no specific awards for some achievements, a LOT of players just started accomplishing these achievements because it was just "something to do.
"  People like to feel like they accomplished something, and this achievement system gave them that chance.
Expansive content, the ability to set new goals at any time and accomplish them, sliding reward systems that are consistently extended to make you want to seek them out (but tantalizingly close enough to actually achieve them without too much frustration), these just a couple of things that will keep a subscription going and make a game addicting.</sentencetext>
</comment>
<comment>
	<id>http://www.semanticweb.org/ontologies/ConversationInstances.owl#comment09_05_28_029216.28122557</id>
	<title>Game Developer Convention, 2001</title>
	<author>Teppy</author>
	<datestamp>1243520340000</datestamp>
	<modclass>Troll</modclass>
	<modscore>0</modscore>
	<htmltext>GDC, 2001 I think it was. We had a roundtable on this very topic - I was new to the games business, and there's all these absolute game design legends sitting around the table. At first the discussion was really good - ways that games can be made more addictive, for instance by varying the reward payout schedule to be more like a slot machine, or by alternating between risky feeling and safe feeling gameplay, etc.
<br>
<br>
Then the discussion kinda took a turn for the wuss - "Well, we *can* make games more addictive, but *should* we?" And each person that spoke was trying to look more socially conscious than the last.
<br>
<br>
Then the designer of Tetris - holy shit, Alexey Pajitnov himself, stands up and says "What the hell are you people talking about? I CHERISH the times I'm addicted to games. What else am I going to do? Read some stupid book?"
<br>
<br>
The discussion got back on a proper track.</htmltext>
<tokenext>GDC , 2001 I think it was .
We had a roundtable on this very topic - I was new to the games business , and there 's all these absolute game design legends sitting around the table .
At first the discussion was really good - ways that games can be made more addictive , for instance by varying the reward payout schedule to be more like a slot machine , or by alternating between risky feeling and safe feeling gameplay , etc .
Then the discussion kinda took a turn for the wuss - " Well , we * can * make games more addictive , but * should * we ?
" And each person that spoke was trying to look more socially conscious than the last .
Then the designer of Tetris - holy shit , Alexey Pajitnov himself , stands up and says " What the hell are you people talking about ?
I CHERISH the times I 'm addicted to games .
What else am I going to do ?
Read some stupid book ?
" The discussion got back on a proper track .</tokentext>
<sentencetext>GDC, 2001 I think it was.
We had a roundtable on this very topic - I was new to the games business, and there's all these absolute game design legends sitting around the table.
At first the discussion was really good - ways that games can be made more addictive, for instance by varying the reward payout schedule to be more like a slot machine, or by alternating between risky feeling and safe feeling gameplay, etc.
Then the discussion kinda took a turn for the wuss - "Well, we *can* make games more addictive, but *should* we?
" And each person that spoke was trying to look more socially conscious than the last.
Then the designer of Tetris - holy shit, Alexey Pajitnov himself, stands up and says "What the hell are you people talking about?
I CHERISH the times I'm addicted to games.
What else am I going to do?
Read some stupid book?
"


The discussion got back on a proper track.</sentencetext>
</comment>
<comment>
	<id>http://www.semanticweb.org/ontologies/ConversationInstances.owl#comment09_05_28_029216.28123277</id>
	<title>Re:Subscription based addiction</title>
	<author>mqduck</author>
	<datestamp>1243523580000</datestamp>
	<modclass>Insightful</modclass>
	<modscore>2</modscore>
	<htmltext><p><div class="quote"><p>If a game has me hooked, addicted, and I play it for hours at a time for weeks on end- fine.</p></div><p>You could say the same thing about drugs. Actually, you could say the same thing about drugs and I'd agree. If you're a user, or even an addict, and happy, that's fantastic. But that's hardly proof that addiction isn't insidious.</p></div>
	</htmltext>
<tokenext>If a game has me hooked , addicted , and I play it for hours at a time for weeks on end- fine.You could say the same thing about drugs .
Actually , you could say the same thing about drugs and I 'd agree .
If you 're a user , or even an addict , and happy , that 's fantastic .
But that 's hardly proof that addiction is n't insidious .</tokentext>
<sentencetext>If a game has me hooked, addicted, and I play it for hours at a time for weeks on end- fine.You could say the same thing about drugs.
Actually, you could say the same thing about drugs and I'd agree.
If you're a user, or even an addict, and happy, that's fantastic.
But that's hardly proof that addiction isn't insidious.
	</sentencetext>
	<parent>http://www.semanticweb.org/ontologies/ConversationInstances.owl#comment09_05_28_029216.28120933</parent>
</comment>
<comment>
	<id>http://www.semanticweb.org/ontologies/ConversationInstances.owl#comment09_05_28_029216.28123509</id>
	<title>Re:It's a blend</title>
	<author>mdarksbane</author>
	<datestamp>1243524660000</datestamp>
	<modclass>None</modclass>
	<modscore>1</modscore>
	<htmltext><p>You might add the feeling of continuity, of building something.</p><p>Your character gets stronger and better the longer you play. Your guild gets farther along in instances, and becomes closer friends. Even your personal skills and knowledge increase the longer you play.</p><p>As long as there is an opportunity to continue to build you have a strong reason to come back. You're invested in your character, in your guild, in your skills.</p><p>Both times I quit WoW it was because the accomplishments available to my character had dried up, and my guild had collapsed. I no longer had anything to work for, or anything holding me to the game. And even then it was still hard - I honestly really miss my character sometimes.</p><p>People like to build something - the longer you let what they build last (and continue to be interesting to build) the longer they will want to stay.</p></htmltext>
<tokenext>You might add the feeling of continuity , of building something.Your character gets stronger and better the longer you play .
Your guild gets farther along in instances , and becomes closer friends .
Even your personal skills and knowledge increase the longer you play.As long as there is an opportunity to continue to build you have a strong reason to come back .
You 're invested in your character , in your guild , in your skills.Both times I quit WoW it was because the accomplishments available to my character had dried up , and my guild had collapsed .
I no longer had anything to work for , or anything holding me to the game .
And even then it was still hard - I honestly really miss my character sometimes.People like to build something - the longer you let what they build last ( and continue to be interesting to build ) the longer they will want to stay .</tokentext>
<sentencetext>You might add the feeling of continuity, of building something.Your character gets stronger and better the longer you play.
Your guild gets farther along in instances, and becomes closer friends.
Even your personal skills and knowledge increase the longer you play.As long as there is an opportunity to continue to build you have a strong reason to come back.
You're invested in your character, in your guild, in your skills.Both times I quit WoW it was because the accomplishments available to my character had dried up, and my guild had collapsed.
I no longer had anything to work for, or anything holding me to the game.
And even then it was still hard - I honestly really miss my character sometimes.People like to build something - the longer you let what they build last (and continue to be interesting to build) the longer they will want to stay.</sentencetext>
	<parent>http://www.semanticweb.org/ontologies/ConversationInstances.owl#comment09_05_28_029216.28121411</parent>
</comment>
<comment>
	<id>http://www.semanticweb.org/ontologies/ConversationInstances.owl#comment09_05_28_029216.28126089</id>
	<title>Re:Companionship is addictive</title>
	<author>ewenix</author>
	<datestamp>1243535340000</datestamp>
	<modclass>None</modclass>
	<modscore>1</modscore>
	<htmltext><p><div class="quote"><p>Somehow I think your stereotype of "FATBALL LIVES AT HOME WITH MOMMY LOL" falls flat.</p></div><p>

Agreed.<br>  None of the WoW players people I personally know<br> (meaning I regularly see them with my own eyes out in the real world)<br> fit into that lardball living with mommy sterotype.<br>  I'm sure there are plenty of them out there though.</p><p>
Personally, I don't care for raids and I only tolerate battlegrounds for better gear and to satisfy the occasional desire for PvP.<br>
I enjoy questing alone or in small groups.  Doing the same quests again as a different class and race puts enough difference in to keep it from becoming mundane for me.  When I'm tired of that, I can always suck it up and roll an Alliance character and play the other side.
</p></div>
	</htmltext>
<tokenext>Somehow I think your stereotype of " FATBALL LIVES AT HOME WITH MOMMY LOL " falls flat .
Agreed. None of the WoW players people I personally know ( meaning I regularly see them with my own eyes out in the real world ) fit into that lardball living with mommy sterotype .
I 'm sure there are plenty of them out there though .
Personally , I do n't care for raids and I only tolerate battlegrounds for better gear and to satisfy the occasional desire for PvP .
I enjoy questing alone or in small groups .
Doing the same quests again as a different class and race puts enough difference in to keep it from becoming mundane for me .
When I 'm tired of that , I can always suck it up and roll an Alliance character and play the other side .</tokentext>
<sentencetext>Somehow I think your stereotype of "FATBALL LIVES AT HOME WITH MOMMY LOL" falls flat.
Agreed.  None of the WoW players people I personally know (meaning I regularly see them with my own eyes out in the real world) fit into that lardball living with mommy sterotype.
I'm sure there are plenty of them out there though.
Personally, I don't care for raids and I only tolerate battlegrounds for better gear and to satisfy the occasional desire for PvP.
I enjoy questing alone or in small groups.
Doing the same quests again as a different class and race puts enough difference in to keep it from becoming mundane for me.
When I'm tired of that, I can always suck it up and roll an Alliance character and play the other side.

	</sentencetext>
	<parent>http://www.semanticweb.org/ontologies/ConversationInstances.owl#comment09_05_28_029216.28121225</parent>
</comment>
<comment>
	<id>http://www.semanticweb.org/ontologies/ConversationInstances.owl#comment09_05_28_029216.28128201</id>
	<title>Would you announce that you played?</title>
	<author>Feyshtey</author>
	<datestamp>1243541700000</datestamp>
	<modclass>None</modclass>
	<modscore>1</modscore>
	<htmltext>There's an obvious stereotype of gamers that they are weak minded idiots addicted to computer games. They are either pasty-faced pimpled teenage geeks or fat 30+ social rejects who still live with their parents. In whatever case, they must not be able to handle real life, or can't control their emotions, and fall victim to these addictive games designed to ruin their lives. But the reality is more people in America play computer games than not. (http://www.npd.com/press/releases/press\_090520.html) In fact, more people play video games than go out to movies. And these gamers aren't just shriveling up in their parent's basements.
<br> <br>
Considering this stereotype, how many people like Curt Schilling and Doug Glanville (MLB players, <a href="http://www.boston.com/news/globe/living/articles/2003/12/04/schillings\_got\_his\_online\_game\_face\_on/)would" title="boston.com" rel="nofollow">http://www.boston.com/news/globe/living/articles/2003/12/04/schillings\_got\_his\_online\_game\_face\_on/)would</a> [boston.com] openly admit to playing MMO's?
<br> <br>
Consider further the impact of that information becoming public on the playability of MMO's for celebrities. Would you risk having your anonymous personal entertainment fall prey to the same stalkers and paparazi-type wacko's constantly hassling you like they do when you leave your house? Or would you keep the fact that you play as closely held as possible so that you had some avenue of socialization in your life that was genuine, instead of the ass-kissing and intrusion that you consistently face in real life?
<br> <br>
There are many many famous people who play. I posted a few with evidence here already. But in the same position I'd keep my mouth shut as most of them do.
<br> <br>
I know of a famous person who played Everquest. That person's ID got out, and they ended up quitting because of it. The enjoyment of the game was completely ruined when their identity was revealed.
<br> <br>
When you start thinking in these terms its easy to reconcile that there are plenty of people that lead perfectly pruductive and healthy lives that -also- play computer games. It is not the games themselves that are a destructive force in some lives. It is the addictive personality of some people who play games that is used as ammo to demonize that which some others are ignorant of.</htmltext>
<tokenext>There 's an obvious stereotype of gamers that they are weak minded idiots addicted to computer games .
They are either pasty-faced pimpled teenage geeks or fat 30 + social rejects who still live with their parents .
In whatever case , they must not be able to handle real life , or ca n't control their emotions , and fall victim to these addictive games designed to ruin their lives .
But the reality is more people in America play computer games than not .
( http : //www.npd.com/press/releases/press \ _090520.html ) In fact , more people play video games than go out to movies .
And these gamers are n't just shriveling up in their parent 's basements .
Considering this stereotype , how many people like Curt Schilling and Doug Glanville ( MLB players , http : //www.boston.com/news/globe/living/articles/2003/12/04/schillings \ _got \ _his \ _online \ _game \ _face \ _on/ ) would [ boston.com ] openly admit to playing MMO 's ?
Consider further the impact of that information becoming public on the playability of MMO 's for celebrities .
Would you risk having your anonymous personal entertainment fall prey to the same stalkers and paparazi-type wacko 's constantly hassling you like they do when you leave your house ?
Or would you keep the fact that you play as closely held as possible so that you had some avenue of socialization in your life that was genuine , instead of the ass-kissing and intrusion that you consistently face in real life ?
There are many many famous people who play .
I posted a few with evidence here already .
But in the same position I 'd keep my mouth shut as most of them do .
I know of a famous person who played Everquest .
That person 's ID got out , and they ended up quitting because of it .
The enjoyment of the game was completely ruined when their identity was revealed .
When you start thinking in these terms its easy to reconcile that there are plenty of people that lead perfectly pruductive and healthy lives that -also- play computer games .
It is not the games themselves that are a destructive force in some lives .
It is the addictive personality of some people who play games that is used as ammo to demonize that which some others are ignorant of .</tokentext>
<sentencetext>There's an obvious stereotype of gamers that they are weak minded idiots addicted to computer games.
They are either pasty-faced pimpled teenage geeks or fat 30+ social rejects who still live with their parents.
In whatever case, they must not be able to handle real life, or can't control their emotions, and fall victim to these addictive games designed to ruin their lives.
But the reality is more people in America play computer games than not.
(http://www.npd.com/press/releases/press\_090520.html) In fact, more people play video games than go out to movies.
And these gamers aren't just shriveling up in their parent's basements.
Considering this stereotype, how many people like Curt Schilling and Doug Glanville (MLB players, http://www.boston.com/news/globe/living/articles/2003/12/04/schillings\_got\_his\_online\_game\_face\_on/)would [boston.com] openly admit to playing MMO's?
Consider further the impact of that information becoming public on the playability of MMO's for celebrities.
Would you risk having your anonymous personal entertainment fall prey to the same stalkers and paparazi-type wacko's constantly hassling you like they do when you leave your house?
Or would you keep the fact that you play as closely held as possible so that you had some avenue of socialization in your life that was genuine, instead of the ass-kissing and intrusion that you consistently face in real life?
There are many many famous people who play.
I posted a few with evidence here already.
But in the same position I'd keep my mouth shut as most of them do.
I know of a famous person who played Everquest.
That person's ID got out, and they ended up quitting because of it.
The enjoyment of the game was completely ruined when their identity was revealed.
When you start thinking in these terms its easy to reconcile that there are plenty of people that lead perfectly pruductive and healthy lives that -also- play computer games.
It is not the games themselves that are a destructive force in some lives.
It is the addictive personality of some people who play games that is used as ammo to demonize that which some others are ignorant of.</sentencetext>
</comment>
<comment>
	<id>http://www.semanticweb.org/ontologies/ConversationInstances.owl#comment09_05_28_029216.28121373</id>
	<title>Addictive design</title>
	<author>hcetSJ</author>
	<datestamp>1243512000000</datestamp>
	<modclass>None</modclass>
	<modscore>1</modscore>
	<htmltext><blockquote><div><p>Are there specific elements of the design that can be pulled out, distilled, and used at will to give a game drug-like properties? Is it wrong to do so?</p></div></blockquote><p>
Might as well be asking:</p><blockquote><div><p>Are there specific compounds in cigarettes that can be used to make them addictive? Is it wrong to do so?</p></div></blockquote><p>
The fact of the matter is that cigarette companies (and computer game companies) have no one to answer to but their customers and share holders, and both will be happiest when they produce the most addictive product possible. 'Right' or 'wrong' is irrelevant to them, only 'legal' and 'illegal,' so if we want to prevent the creation of addictive games, our only recourse is legislation.
</p><p>Further reading: <a href="http://www.amazon.com/dp/0307277992/?tag=filmfriends-20" title="amazon.com">Supercapitalism</a> [amazon.com] by Robert Reich</p></div>
	</htmltext>
<tokenext>Are there specific elements of the design that can be pulled out , distilled , and used at will to give a game drug-like properties ?
Is it wrong to do so ?
Might as well be asking : Are there specific compounds in cigarettes that can be used to make them addictive ?
Is it wrong to do so ?
The fact of the matter is that cigarette companies ( and computer game companies ) have no one to answer to but their customers and share holders , and both will be happiest when they produce the most addictive product possible .
'Right ' or 'wrong ' is irrelevant to them , only 'legal ' and 'illegal, ' so if we want to prevent the creation of addictive games , our only recourse is legislation .
Further reading : Supercapitalism [ amazon.com ] by Robert Reich</tokentext>
<sentencetext>Are there specific elements of the design that can be pulled out, distilled, and used at will to give a game drug-like properties?
Is it wrong to do so?
Might as well be asking:Are there specific compounds in cigarettes that can be used to make them addictive?
Is it wrong to do so?
The fact of the matter is that cigarette companies (and computer game companies) have no one to answer to but their customers and share holders, and both will be happiest when they produce the most addictive product possible.
'Right' or 'wrong' is irrelevant to them, only 'legal' and 'illegal,' so if we want to prevent the creation of addictive games, our only recourse is legislation.
Further reading: Supercapitalism [amazon.com] by Robert Reich
	</sentencetext>
</comment>
<comment>
	<id>http://www.semanticweb.org/ontologies/ConversationInstances.owl#comment09_05_28_029216.28129141</id>
	<title>I Played for a While</title>
	<author>GypC</author>
	<datestamp>1243501200000</datestamp>
	<modclass>None</modclass>
	<modscore>1</modscore>
	<htmltext>It was fun at first, but eventually became nothing but tedious questing and dealing with negative assholes. Come to think of it, this was also my experience with methamphetamines...</htmltext>
<tokenext>It was fun at first , but eventually became nothing but tedious questing and dealing with negative assholes .
Come to think of it , this was also my experience with methamphetamines.. .</tokentext>
<sentencetext>It was fun at first, but eventually became nothing but tedious questing and dealing with negative assholes.
Come to think of it, this was also my experience with methamphetamines...</sentencetext>
</comment>
<comment>
	<id>http://www.semanticweb.org/ontologies/ConversationInstances.owl#comment09_05_28_029216.28127577</id>
	<title>Which theory again?</title>
	<author>ascii</author>
	<datestamp>1243539900000</datestamp>
	<modclass>None</modclass>
	<modscore>1</modscore>
	<htmltext><p>"The common theory is that games like World of Warcraft are addictive."</p><p>Please enlighten me: exactly which theory is that?</p></htmltext>
<tokenext>" The common theory is that games like World of Warcraft are addictive .
" Please enlighten me : exactly which theory is that ?</tokentext>
<sentencetext>"The common theory is that games like World of Warcraft are addictive.
"Please enlighten me: exactly which theory is that?</sentencetext>
</comment>
<comment>
	<id>http://www.semanticweb.org/ontologies/ConversationInstances.owl#comment09_05_28_029216.28125915</id>
	<title>Re:D&amp;D for the unimaginative</title>
	<author>Anonymous</author>
	<datestamp>1243534680000</datestamp>
	<modclass>None</modclass>
	<modscore>0</modscore>
	<htmltext><p>I was just saying yesterday that WoW is like D&amp;D without the imagination.  I played D&amp;D (actually Warhammer 1st - close enough)for a year-ish, and Wow for 6 months-ish.  I got bored with the people, so I quit.  But the pencil-paper RPG, I would play again in a heartbeat if I had the chance, and knew some people to play.</p><p>The real value in it for me was two-fold:<br>First, being able to come up with creative solutions for problems.  You have to have a good DM for that.  One who plays for the game, not the control.<br>Second, and most importantly - the companionship with other funny and intelligent people.  Maybe we are all basement dwelling nerds.  Even nerds need people, no matter how much being ostracized (sp?) by mainstream society may have driven us into seclusion.  Maybe slashdot doesn't remember what high school was like.  More likely they do, because in earnest, how many of us were jocks or cheerleaders.</p><p>I got into Wow hoping that it may be sort of similar.  No dice.  Maybe 1 out of 10 (?) were cool enough.  Maybe 1 out of 1000 were really looking for some social outlet.  For everyone else it seemed to be an opportunity to be even more antisocial, but amongst 2k of your peers.  In fact, the discussion forums on the 'tubes seem to be the same.</p></htmltext>
<tokenext>I was just saying yesterday that WoW is like D&amp;D without the imagination .
I played D&amp;D ( actually Warhammer 1st - close enough ) for a year-ish , and Wow for 6 months-ish .
I got bored with the people , so I quit .
But the pencil-paper RPG , I would play again in a heartbeat if I had the chance , and knew some people to play.The real value in it for me was two-fold : First , being able to come up with creative solutions for problems .
You have to have a good DM for that .
One who plays for the game , not the control.Second , and most importantly - the companionship with other funny and intelligent people .
Maybe we are all basement dwelling nerds .
Even nerds need people , no matter how much being ostracized ( sp ?
) by mainstream society may have driven us into seclusion .
Maybe slashdot does n't remember what high school was like .
More likely they do , because in earnest , how many of us were jocks or cheerleaders.I got into Wow hoping that it may be sort of similar .
No dice .
Maybe 1 out of 10 ( ?
) were cool enough .
Maybe 1 out of 1000 were really looking for some social outlet .
For everyone else it seemed to be an opportunity to be even more antisocial , but amongst 2k of your peers .
In fact , the discussion forums on the 'tubes seem to be the same .</tokentext>
<sentencetext>I was just saying yesterday that WoW is like D&amp;D without the imagination.
I played D&amp;D (actually Warhammer 1st - close enough)for a year-ish, and Wow for 6 months-ish.
I got bored with the people, so I quit.
But the pencil-paper RPG, I would play again in a heartbeat if I had the chance, and knew some people to play.The real value in it for me was two-fold:First, being able to come up with creative solutions for problems.
You have to have a good DM for that.
One who plays for the game, not the control.Second, and most importantly - the companionship with other funny and intelligent people.
Maybe we are all basement dwelling nerds.
Even nerds need people, no matter how much being ostracized (sp?
) by mainstream society may have driven us into seclusion.
Maybe slashdot doesn't remember what high school was like.
More likely they do, because in earnest, how many of us were jocks or cheerleaders.I got into Wow hoping that it may be sort of similar.
No dice.
Maybe 1 out of 10 (?
) were cool enough.
Maybe 1 out of 1000 were really looking for some social outlet.
For everyone else it seemed to be an opportunity to be even more antisocial, but amongst 2k of your peers.
In fact, the discussion forums on the 'tubes seem to be the same.</sentencetext>
	<parent>http://www.semanticweb.org/ontologies/ConversationInstances.owl#comment09_05_28_029216.28121571</parent>
</comment>
<comment>
	<id>http://www.semanticweb.org/ontologies/ConversationInstances.owl#comment09_05_28_029216.28122143</id>
	<title>Isn't it obvious?</title>
	<author>Random2</author>
	<datestamp>1243518120000</datestamp>
	<modclass>None</modclass>
	<modscore>1</modscore>
	<htmltext>Mouses and keyboards actually come with small needles that infuse cocaine into the blood of the player, addicting them to the game. It's why these pay-per-month games cost so much.</htmltext>
<tokenext>Mouses and keyboards actually come with small needles that infuse cocaine into the blood of the player , addicting them to the game .
It 's why these pay-per-month games cost so much .</tokentext>
<sentencetext>Mouses and keyboards actually come with small needles that infuse cocaine into the blood of the player, addicting them to the game.
It's why these pay-per-month games cost so much.</sentencetext>
</comment>
<comment>
	<id>http://www.semanticweb.org/ontologies/ConversationInstances.owl#comment09_05_28_029216.28121667</id>
	<title>Re:Rewards.</title>
	<author>Anonymous</author>
	<datestamp>1243515300000</datestamp>
	<modclass>None</modclass>
	<modscore>0</modscore>
	<htmltext><p>I've done that twice. Once I fell in, the other time circumstances came to the rescue. It wasn't WoW, but a game very similar.</p><p>It really is a dangerous trap, that you don't really see coming, and it takes a hell of a lot of motivation to get out of.</p></htmltext>
<tokenext>I 've done that twice .
Once I fell in , the other time circumstances came to the rescue .
It was n't WoW , but a game very similar.It really is a dangerous trap , that you do n't really see coming , and it takes a hell of a lot of motivation to get out of .</tokentext>
<sentencetext>I've done that twice.
Once I fell in, the other time circumstances came to the rescue.
It wasn't WoW, but a game very similar.It really is a dangerous trap, that you don't really see coming, and it takes a hell of a lot of motivation to get out of.</sentencetext>
	<parent>http://www.semanticweb.org/ontologies/ConversationInstances.owl#comment09_05_28_029216.28120979</parent>
</comment>
<comment>
	<id>http://www.semanticweb.org/ontologies/ConversationInstances.owl#comment09_05_28_029216.28124689</id>
	<title>You have to have an addictive personality</title>
	<author>Animats</author>
	<datestamp>1243529760000</datestamp>
	<modclass>None</modclass>
	<modscore>1</modscore>
	<htmltext><p>
This sort of thing appeals to people with an addictive personality.  I tried EverQuest once, and after about an hour, lost interest.  Once I've seen the highlights in a game, it's not that interesting.
</p><p>
You really see this if you go to Vegas.  I once went to Vegas for COMDEX (back when it mattered) and was booked into a casino/hotel.  I watched a bus tour come in.  The people got off the bus, and went straight to the slot machines.  You'd think they'd check in, go to their room, take a shower, check out the entertainment guide to see what's going on, and then go out.  Nah.  Pure Skinner box behavior.  It's depressing just to watch them.</p></htmltext>
<tokenext>This sort of thing appeals to people with an addictive personality .
I tried EverQuest once , and after about an hour , lost interest .
Once I 've seen the highlights in a game , it 's not that interesting .
You really see this if you go to Vegas .
I once went to Vegas for COMDEX ( back when it mattered ) and was booked into a casino/hotel .
I watched a bus tour come in .
The people got off the bus , and went straight to the slot machines .
You 'd think they 'd check in , go to their room , take a shower , check out the entertainment guide to see what 's going on , and then go out .
Nah. Pure Skinner box behavior .
It 's depressing just to watch them .</tokentext>
<sentencetext>
This sort of thing appeals to people with an addictive personality.
I tried EverQuest once, and after about an hour, lost interest.
Once I've seen the highlights in a game, it's not that interesting.
You really see this if you go to Vegas.
I once went to Vegas for COMDEX (back when it mattered) and was booked into a casino/hotel.
I watched a bus tour come in.
The people got off the bus, and went straight to the slot machines.
You'd think they'd check in, go to their room, take a shower, check out the entertainment guide to see what's going on, and then go out.
Nah.  Pure Skinner box behavior.
It's depressing just to watch them.</sentencetext>
</comment>
<comment>
	<id>http://www.semanticweb.org/ontologies/ConversationInstances.owl#comment09_05_28_029216.28122783</id>
	<title>Re:Companionship is addictive</title>
	<author>Anonymous</author>
	<datestamp>1243521360000</datestamp>
	<modclass>None</modclass>
	<modscore>0</modscore>
	<htmltext><p>Dear areusche,</p><p>If you don't like that hit of WoW, why don't you try me instead?  Just one easy payment of $49.95 and you can play with me all you want!</p><p>Sincerely,<br>Guild Wars</p></htmltext>
<tokenext>Dear areusche,If you do n't like that hit of WoW , why do n't you try me instead ?
Just one easy payment of $ 49.95 and you can play with me all you want ! Sincerely,Guild Wars</tokentext>
<sentencetext>Dear areusche,If you don't like that hit of WoW, why don't you try me instead?
Just one easy payment of $49.95 and you can play with me all you want!Sincerely,Guild Wars</sentencetext>
	<parent>http://www.semanticweb.org/ontologies/ConversationInstances.owl#comment09_05_28_029216.28121487</parent>
</comment>
<comment>
	<id>http://www.semanticweb.org/ontologies/ConversationInstances.owl#comment09_05_28_029216.28162463</id>
	<title>D&amp;D for those with a life</title>
	<author>justinlee37</author>
	<datestamp>1243775820000</datestamp>
	<modclass>None</modclass>
	<modscore>1</modscore>
	<htmltext><p>It's also less time-consuming than D&amp;D. Putting content together in a way that is effective and engaging can be a huge nightmare, and unless everything is highly coordinated and all of the players as well as the DM "do their homework" (IE, study and prepare for the game outside of play time) even a simple scene can take hours to run. Furthermore, everybody always wants to roll dice on friday night or saturday night. There is so much else to do on those nights (like have a date with a lady). So D&amp;D doesn't just take up time, it takes up prime time. Whereas a nice game of Deux Ex, or Baldur's Gate, or Vampire: Bloodlines can be enjoyed on any night, with little to no planning, and comes conveniently pre-packaged.</p><p>But yeah, World of Warcraft is totally lame.</p></htmltext>
<tokenext>It 's also less time-consuming than D&amp;D .
Putting content together in a way that is effective and engaging can be a huge nightmare , and unless everything is highly coordinated and all of the players as well as the DM " do their homework " ( IE , study and prepare for the game outside of play time ) even a simple scene can take hours to run .
Furthermore , everybody always wants to roll dice on friday night or saturday night .
There is so much else to do on those nights ( like have a date with a lady ) .
So D&amp;D does n't just take up time , it takes up prime time .
Whereas a nice game of Deux Ex , or Baldur 's Gate , or Vampire : Bloodlines can be enjoyed on any night , with little to no planning , and comes conveniently pre-packaged.But yeah , World of Warcraft is totally lame .</tokentext>
<sentencetext>It's also less time-consuming than D&amp;D.
Putting content together in a way that is effective and engaging can be a huge nightmare, and unless everything is highly coordinated and all of the players as well as the DM "do their homework" (IE, study and prepare for the game outside of play time) even a simple scene can take hours to run.
Furthermore, everybody always wants to roll dice on friday night or saturday night.
There is so much else to do on those nights (like have a date with a lady).
So D&amp;D doesn't just take up time, it takes up prime time.
Whereas a nice game of Deux Ex, or Baldur's Gate, or Vampire: Bloodlines can be enjoyed on any night, with little to no planning, and comes conveniently pre-packaged.But yeah, World of Warcraft is totally lame.</sentencetext>
	<parent>http://www.semanticweb.org/ontologies/ConversationInstances.owl#comment09_05_28_029216.28121571</parent>
</comment>
<comment>
	<id>http://www.semanticweb.org/ontologies/ConversationInstances.owl#comment09_05_28_029216.28120935</id>
	<title>Its the rewards.</title>
	<author>Anonymous</author>
	<datestamp>1243507440000</datestamp>
	<modclass>Insightful</modclass>
	<modscore>5</modscore>
	<htmltext><p>As a wowtard myself i was addicted to the game for a while, back when it was still up and coming. I can say that, for at least myself, I was addicted to the time invested vs rewards you could achieve. I would pour my time into real life hobbies and the payoffs from those were far less interesting, and nowhere near as cool as those that I could achieve in WOW. Yes I was a social recluse, but that's life.<br>My<nobr> <wbr></nobr>/played time on my main toon, before BC was released, was over 200 days. Add to that 4 other 60's with about 10 days game time to level each, plus time spent in pvp with them, rep farming, yeah. It wasn't nearly as destructive as some other people report it was for them, but I was still addicted to the rewards I could achieve, because it was so clear how to do things, and how to get what you wanted. There are many other aspects to it of course, but that was the kicker for me.</p></htmltext>
<tokenext>As a wowtard myself i was addicted to the game for a while , back when it was still up and coming .
I can say that , for at least myself , I was addicted to the time invested vs rewards you could achieve .
I would pour my time into real life hobbies and the payoffs from those were far less interesting , and nowhere near as cool as those that I could achieve in WOW .
Yes I was a social recluse , but that 's life.My /played time on my main toon , before BC was released , was over 200 days .
Add to that 4 other 60 's with about 10 days game time to level each , plus time spent in pvp with them , rep farming , yeah .
It was n't nearly as destructive as some other people report it was for them , but I was still addicted to the rewards I could achieve , because it was so clear how to do things , and how to get what you wanted .
There are many other aspects to it of course , but that was the kicker for me .</tokentext>
<sentencetext>As a wowtard myself i was addicted to the game for a while, back when it was still up and coming.
I can say that, for at least myself, I was addicted to the time invested vs rewards you could achieve.
I would pour my time into real life hobbies and the payoffs from those were far less interesting, and nowhere near as cool as those that I could achieve in WOW.
Yes I was a social recluse, but that's life.My /played time on my main toon, before BC was released, was over 200 days.
Add to that 4 other 60's with about 10 days game time to level each, plus time spent in pvp with them, rep farming, yeah.
It wasn't nearly as destructive as some other people report it was for them, but I was still addicted to the rewards I could achieve, because it was so clear how to do things, and how to get what you wanted.
There are many other aspects to it of course, but that was the kicker for me.</sentencetext>
</comment>
<comment>
	<id>http://www.semanticweb.org/ontologies/ConversationInstances.owl#comment09_05_28_029216.28127999</id>
	<title>Re:Weak Article</title>
	<author>Metsys</author>
	<datestamp>1243541160000</datestamp>
	<modclass>None</modclass>
	<modscore>1</modscore>
	<htmltext><p>I agree. The article was pretty weak. The article talks about reward systems (items, XP bar, etc.) but that's not what makes games like WoW more addictive than every other RPG that has the same reward system. Some would say polish, which WoW most certainly does have, but that's not reason enough to be disproportionally committed to a game. Many Slashdotters have pointed out the community aspect of WoW as being a main contributor to its addictiveness, which is true, but there's one other important factor about addictiveness that I'm surprised I haven't seen discussed in articles about the topic, probably because they don't understand the psychology behind things like this.</p><p>The reason why WoW is so addictive is because the gameplay changes the more you play it.</p><p>At Level 1 there's tons of new areas to explore, leveling happens quickly, new abilities are different and exciting, and you are safe from the Alliance (I played Horde). Playing with friends was fun and informal. The game was casual and I could play whenever I wanted to because I could complete quests on my own.</p><p>Then we gained enough levels were we had to go into the contested regions of the game to continue playing, which meant that we were getting ganked by the Alliance constantly. We banded together into slightly larger groups for safety, leveling took longer, we hated the Alliance so we would go out of our way to kill them when the opportunity would permit, and the game slowly became less about adventuring and more about PvP and survival.</p><p>To continue leveling up you were expected to join a guild so you can go on regular raids, if one of your friends didn't make you join a guild already. Leveling took even longer, good items were harder to find because you had to share between 15+ people, the best items are dropped on raids so that's more incentive to run them, and people are now depending on you to be present at the raids, so you now have a schedule to keep.</p><p>So a game that started out as a relatively casual game that I've seen people get their non-gamer wives and girlfriends to play, slowly turns into a commitment. You can't just log in and play whenever you want, you have to be ready to run Molten Core every Tuesday and Thursday at 7pm, and that commitment develops so subtly you don't know what's going on unless you know what to look for, which is why I stopped playing after a few months. The incentives to play the game, and therefore your commitment to it, slowly changes in the same way the chances of winning penny slots changes the more you play it. WoW was designed so that the first 10 levels has such a wide reward system that most types of people can get into it, regardless of their reasons for playing games. As you level up the incentive and reward system becomes more narrow and more concentrated until the players become the type of gamer that Blizzard&#226;"or indeed any other game company&#226;"wants you to be: a committed paying gamer, and for all the statistically right reasons.</p></htmltext>
<tokenext>I agree .
The article was pretty weak .
The article talks about reward systems ( items , XP bar , etc .
) but that 's not what makes games like WoW more addictive than every other RPG that has the same reward system .
Some would say polish , which WoW most certainly does have , but that 's not reason enough to be disproportionally committed to a game .
Many Slashdotters have pointed out the community aspect of WoW as being a main contributor to its addictiveness , which is true , but there 's one other important factor about addictiveness that I 'm surprised I have n't seen discussed in articles about the topic , probably because they do n't understand the psychology behind things like this.The reason why WoW is so addictive is because the gameplay changes the more you play it.At Level 1 there 's tons of new areas to explore , leveling happens quickly , new abilities are different and exciting , and you are safe from the Alliance ( I played Horde ) .
Playing with friends was fun and informal .
The game was casual and I could play whenever I wanted to because I could complete quests on my own.Then we gained enough levels were we had to go into the contested regions of the game to continue playing , which meant that we were getting ganked by the Alliance constantly .
We banded together into slightly larger groups for safety , leveling took longer , we hated the Alliance so we would go out of our way to kill them when the opportunity would permit , and the game slowly became less about adventuring and more about PvP and survival.To continue leveling up you were expected to join a guild so you can go on regular raids , if one of your friends did n't make you join a guild already .
Leveling took even longer , good items were harder to find because you had to share between 15 + people , the best items are dropped on raids so that 's more incentive to run them , and people are now depending on you to be present at the raids , so you now have a schedule to keep.So a game that started out as a relatively casual game that I 've seen people get their non-gamer wives and girlfriends to play , slowly turns into a commitment .
You ca n't just log in and play whenever you want , you have to be ready to run Molten Core every Tuesday and Thursday at 7pm , and that commitment develops so subtly you do n't know what 's going on unless you know what to look for , which is why I stopped playing after a few months .
The incentives to play the game , and therefore your commitment to it , slowly changes in the same way the chances of winning penny slots changes the more you play it .
WoW was designed so that the first 10 levels has such a wide reward system that most types of people can get into it , regardless of their reasons for playing games .
As you level up the incentive and reward system becomes more narrow and more concentrated until the players become the type of gamer that Blizzard   " or indeed any other game company   " wants you to be : a committed paying gamer , and for all the statistically right reasons .</tokentext>
<sentencetext>I agree.
The article was pretty weak.
The article talks about reward systems (items, XP bar, etc.
) but that's not what makes games like WoW more addictive than every other RPG that has the same reward system.
Some would say polish, which WoW most certainly does have, but that's not reason enough to be disproportionally committed to a game.
Many Slashdotters have pointed out the community aspect of WoW as being a main contributor to its addictiveness, which is true, but there's one other important factor about addictiveness that I'm surprised I haven't seen discussed in articles about the topic, probably because they don't understand the psychology behind things like this.The reason why WoW is so addictive is because the gameplay changes the more you play it.At Level 1 there's tons of new areas to explore, leveling happens quickly, new abilities are different and exciting, and you are safe from the Alliance (I played Horde).
Playing with friends was fun and informal.
The game was casual and I could play whenever I wanted to because I could complete quests on my own.Then we gained enough levels were we had to go into the contested regions of the game to continue playing, which meant that we were getting ganked by the Alliance constantly.
We banded together into slightly larger groups for safety, leveling took longer, we hated the Alliance so we would go out of our way to kill them when the opportunity would permit, and the game slowly became less about adventuring and more about PvP and survival.To continue leveling up you were expected to join a guild so you can go on regular raids, if one of your friends didn't make you join a guild already.
Leveling took even longer, good items were harder to find because you had to share between 15+ people, the best items are dropped on raids so that's more incentive to run them, and people are now depending on you to be present at the raids, so you now have a schedule to keep.So a game that started out as a relatively casual game that I've seen people get their non-gamer wives and girlfriends to play, slowly turns into a commitment.
You can't just log in and play whenever you want, you have to be ready to run Molten Core every Tuesday and Thursday at 7pm, and that commitment develops so subtly you don't know what's going on unless you know what to look for, which is why I stopped playing after a few months.
The incentives to play the game, and therefore your commitment to it, slowly changes in the same way the chances of winning penny slots changes the more you play it.
WoW was designed so that the first 10 levels has such a wide reward system that most types of people can get into it, regardless of their reasons for playing games.
As you level up the incentive and reward system becomes more narrow and more concentrated until the players become the type of gamer that Blizzardâ"or indeed any other game companyâ"wants you to be: a committed paying gamer, and for all the statistically right reasons.</sentencetext>
	<parent>http://www.semanticweb.org/ontologies/ConversationInstances.owl#comment09_05_28_029216.28122351</parent>
</comment>
<comment>
	<id>http://www.semanticweb.org/ontologies/ConversationInstances.owl#comment09_05_28_029216.28125259</id>
	<title>What makes them habit forming is</title>
	<author>geekoid</author>
	<datestamp>1243532220000</datestamp>
	<modclass>None</modclass>
	<modscore>1</modscore>
	<htmltext><p>Achievements.</p></htmltext>
<tokenext>Achievements .</tokentext>
<sentencetext>Achievements.</sentencetext>
</comment>
<comment>
	<id>http://www.semanticweb.org/ontologies/ConversationInstances.owl#comment09_05_28_029216.28126993</id>
	<title>Re:study civilization iv</title>
	<author>Ifandbut</author>
	<datestamp>1243538280000</datestamp>
	<modclass>None</modclass>
	<modscore>1</modscore>
	<htmltext><p>However, just breaking the disc does not prevent you from playing WoW. Even if you reformatted your computer you can easily download the game from Blizzard's website.</p><p>The best solution would be to shout your account information in Trade chat and wait for someone to change your password. Then you just have to prevent yourself from e-mailing Blizzard that your account got stolen.</p></htmltext>
<tokenext>However , just breaking the disc does not prevent you from playing WoW .
Even if you reformatted your computer you can easily download the game from Blizzard 's website.The best solution would be to shout your account information in Trade chat and wait for someone to change your password .
Then you just have to prevent yourself from e-mailing Blizzard that your account got stolen .</tokentext>
<sentencetext>However, just breaking the disc does not prevent you from playing WoW.
Even if you reformatted your computer you can easily download the game from Blizzard's website.The best solution would be to shout your account information in Trade chat and wait for someone to change your password.
Then you just have to prevent yourself from e-mailing Blizzard that your account got stolen.</sentencetext>
	<parent>http://www.semanticweb.org/ontologies/ConversationInstances.owl#comment09_05_28_029216.28123029</parent>
</comment>
<comment>
	<id>http://www.semanticweb.org/ontologies/ConversationInstances.owl#comment09_05_28_029216.28121089</id>
	<title>Am pretty much addicted to CoH:OF</title>
	<author>freedom\_india</author>
	<datestamp>1243508940000</datestamp>
	<modclass>None</modclass>
	<modscore>1</modscore>
	<htmltext><p>...the sheer compexity of the game, its realistic shots and firing, its amazing amount of sound and real-time weaponry all make it like wonderful that i wanna play forever.<br>OTOH i hate Railroads. Why? it can't play decent with a 64-bit OS, damn slow when it comes to running (i have a powerful enough comp that makes Crysis cry) due to its bugs, multi-processor issues, etc.</p></htmltext>
<tokenext>...the sheer compexity of the game , its realistic shots and firing , its amazing amount of sound and real-time weaponry all make it like wonderful that i wan na play forever.OTOH i hate Railroads .
Why ? it ca n't play decent with a 64-bit OS , damn slow when it comes to running ( i have a powerful enough comp that makes Crysis cry ) due to its bugs , multi-processor issues , etc .</tokentext>
<sentencetext>...the sheer compexity of the game, its realistic shots and firing, its amazing amount of sound and real-time weaponry all make it like wonderful that i wanna play forever.OTOH i hate Railroads.
Why? it can't play decent with a 64-bit OS, damn slow when it comes to running (i have a powerful enough comp that makes Crysis cry) due to its bugs, multi-processor issues, etc.</sentencetext>
</comment>
<comment>
	<id>http://www.semanticweb.org/ontologies/ConversationInstances.owl#comment09_05_28_029216.28122637</id>
	<title>Re:Companionship is addictive</title>
	<author>gparent</author>
	<datestamp>1243520640000</datestamp>
	<modclass>None</modclass>
	<modscore>1</modscore>
	<htmltext><p><div class="quote"><p>But we all know the truth. It's 30 year old lardballs who still live with their parents that play this game. The lack of friends and human companionship drives them to seek out online communities where they can be accepted as who they portray themselves as rather than for who they, unfortunately, are. Seeking companionship is one of the most primal of human urges.</p></div><p>Are you serious? This should be modded +5 Funny, not Insightful. I've played WoW for many months, and have taken long breaks 3 times already. The breaks were <b>not</b> forced, they were a decision I made because I was simply tired of the game, and no, I did not experience withdrawal. I'm also perfectly capable of raiding 4 hours a day 3 days a week <b>and</b> seeing my friends on the other nights I'm not raiding. I have no such social issues you speak of, and I play in a guild where many players are playing with their girlfriends/wives.<br> <br>
You seriously need to take a step back and look at the reality. The media did something to you. I'm not the only one who's playing WoW and who also has a social life. Most of the players I've played with are this way, although I have seen (mostly younger players) people doing bad in school because of their 'addiction'. It does happen, but the majority of players are not this way.</p></div>
	</htmltext>
<tokenext>But we all know the truth .
It 's 30 year old lardballs who still live with their parents that play this game .
The lack of friends and human companionship drives them to seek out online communities where they can be accepted as who they portray themselves as rather than for who they , unfortunately , are .
Seeking companionship is one of the most primal of human urges.Are you serious ?
This should be modded + 5 Funny , not Insightful .
I 've played WoW for many months , and have taken long breaks 3 times already .
The breaks were not forced , they were a decision I made because I was simply tired of the game , and no , I did not experience withdrawal .
I 'm also perfectly capable of raiding 4 hours a day 3 days a week and seeing my friends on the other nights I 'm not raiding .
I have no such social issues you speak of , and I play in a guild where many players are playing with their girlfriends/wives .
You seriously need to take a step back and look at the reality .
The media did something to you .
I 'm not the only one who 's playing WoW and who also has a social life .
Most of the players I 've played with are this way , although I have seen ( mostly younger players ) people doing bad in school because of their 'addiction' .
It does happen , but the majority of players are not this way .</tokentext>
<sentencetext>But we all know the truth.
It's 30 year old lardballs who still live with their parents that play this game.
The lack of friends and human companionship drives them to seek out online communities where they can be accepted as who they portray themselves as rather than for who they, unfortunately, are.
Seeking companionship is one of the most primal of human urges.Are you serious?
This should be modded +5 Funny, not Insightful.
I've played WoW for many months, and have taken long breaks 3 times already.
The breaks were not forced, they were a decision I made because I was simply tired of the game, and no, I did not experience withdrawal.
I'm also perfectly capable of raiding 4 hours a day 3 days a week and seeing my friends on the other nights I'm not raiding.
I have no such social issues you speak of, and I play in a guild where many players are playing with their girlfriends/wives.
You seriously need to take a step back and look at the reality.
The media did something to you.
I'm not the only one who's playing WoW and who also has a social life.
Most of the players I've played with are this way, although I have seen (mostly younger players) people doing bad in school because of their 'addiction'.
It does happen, but the majority of players are not this way.
	</sentencetext>
	<parent>http://www.semanticweb.org/ontologies/ConversationInstances.owl#comment09_05_28_029216.28120937</parent>
</comment>
<comment>
	<id>http://www.semanticweb.org/ontologies/ConversationInstances.owl#comment09_05_28_029216.28122967</id>
	<title>Re:Companionship is addictive</title>
	<author>ausekilis</author>
	<datestamp>1243522260000</datestamp>
	<modclass>None</modclass>
	<modscore>1</modscore>
	<htmltext>The saddest part of your story is that it's true. I know a guy whose only "management" experience was being a raid leader for a couple years. He interviewed for a management job, and got it, solely because he was able to organize and keep track of ~40 people on a regular basis.</htmltext>
<tokenext>The saddest part of your story is that it 's true .
I know a guy whose only " management " experience was being a raid leader for a couple years .
He interviewed for a management job , and got it , solely because he was able to organize and keep track of ~ 40 people on a regular basis .</tokentext>
<sentencetext>The saddest part of your story is that it's true.
I know a guy whose only "management" experience was being a raid leader for a couple years.
He interviewed for a management job, and got it, solely because he was able to organize and keep track of ~40 people on a regular basis.</sentencetext>
	<parent>http://www.semanticweb.org/ontologies/ConversationInstances.owl#comment09_05_28_029216.28120937</parent>
</comment>
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