<article>
	<id>http://www.semanticweb.org/ontologies/ConversationInstances.owl#article10_01_31_1545245</id>
	<title>Newzbin.com Usenet Indexing Trial Set To Begin Next Week</title>
	<author>Soulskill</author>
	<datestamp>1264956960000</datestamp>
	<htmltext>An anonymous reader writes <i>"Only a few weeks after a jury <a href="http://yro.slashdot.org/story/10/01/15/174249/In-UK-Oink-Admin-Cleared-of-Fraud">acquitted Alan Ellis</a>, the owner of the BitTorrent site 'OinK's Pink Palace,' of copyright infringement, another <a href="http://www.slyck.com/story1904\_Newzbin\_Trial\_Begins\_Next\_Week\_in\_London">high profile case is about to start</a> next week, this time for the newsgroup side of things. The MPA (Motion Picture Association) trial against Newzbin.com, a website that indexes NZB files and content on the newsgroups, will begin in London on Monday.  Will lightning strike twice in favor of website indexing?"</i>
Torrentfreak points out <a href="http://torrentfreak.com/usenet-indexer-prepares-for-mpaa-high-court-battle-100130/">one major difference between the cases</a>: "Ellis&rsquo;s charge was one of fraud, allegedly conducted by an individual and dealt with under criminal law, while that leveled against Newzbin is one of allowing and inducing illegal copying, i.e copyright infringement, but carried out by a bona fide company under civil law."</htmltext>
<tokenext>An anonymous reader writes " Only a few weeks after a jury acquitted Alan Ellis , the owner of the BitTorrent site 'OinK 's Pink Palace, ' of copyright infringement , another high profile case is about to start next week , this time for the newsgroup side of things .
The MPA ( Motion Picture Association ) trial against Newzbin.com , a website that indexes NZB files and content on the newsgroups , will begin in London on Monday .
Will lightning strike twice in favor of website indexing ?
" Torrentfreak points out one major difference between the cases : " Ellis    s charge was one of fraud , allegedly conducted by an individual and dealt with under criminal law , while that leveled against Newzbin is one of allowing and inducing illegal copying , i.e copyright infringement , but carried out by a bona fide company under civil law .
"</tokentext>
<sentencetext>An anonymous reader writes "Only a few weeks after a jury acquitted Alan Ellis, the owner of the BitTorrent site 'OinK's Pink Palace,' of copyright infringement, another high profile case is about to start next week, this time for the newsgroup side of things.
The MPA (Motion Picture Association) trial against Newzbin.com, a website that indexes NZB files and content on the newsgroups, will begin in London on Monday.
Will lightning strike twice in favor of website indexing?
"
Torrentfreak points out one major difference between the cases: "Ellis’s charge was one of fraud, allegedly conducted by an individual and dealt with under criminal law, while that leveled against Newzbin is one of allowing and inducing illegal copying, i.e copyright infringement, but carried out by a bona fide company under civil law.
"</sentencetext>
</article>
<comment>
	<id>http://www.semanticweb.org/ontologies/ConversationInstances.owl#comment10_01_31_1545245.30972568</id>
	<title>Re:What</title>
	<author>zonky</author>
	<datestamp>1264969380000</datestamp>
	<modclass>Insightful</modclass>
	<modscore>2</modscore>
	<htmltext>So it's more like dmoz?  They link to copyright material as well- it's up to the user to judge if they have a valid license to view the work.

Newzbin is a service that can aid copyright holders, nad allow them to get usenet posts cancelled with the newsgroup providers.</htmltext>
<tokenext>So it 's more like dmoz ?
They link to copyright material as well- it 's up to the user to judge if they have a valid license to view the work .
Newzbin is a service that can aid copyright holders , nad allow them to get usenet posts cancelled with the newsgroup providers .</tokentext>
<sentencetext>So it's more like dmoz?
They link to copyright material as well- it's up to the user to judge if they have a valid license to view the work.
Newzbin is a service that can aid copyright holders, nad allow them to get usenet posts cancelled with the newsgroup providers.</sentencetext>
	<parent>http://www.semanticweb.org/ontologies/ConversationInstances.owl#comment10_01_31_1545245.30971630</parent>
</comment>
<comment>
	<id>http://www.semanticweb.org/ontologies/ConversationInstances.owl#comment10_01_31_1545245.30971772</id>
	<title>Never heard of newzbin.com before</title>
	<author>Anonymous</author>
	<datestamp>1264965000000</datestamp>
	<modclass>Insightful</modclass>
	<modscore>3</modscore>
	<htmltext><p>Now I have. Thanks MPAA.</p></htmltext>
<tokenext>Now I have .
Thanks MPAA .</tokentext>
<sentencetext>Now I have.
Thanks MPAA.</sentencetext>
</comment>
<comment>
	<id>http://www.semanticweb.org/ontologies/ConversationInstances.owl#comment10_01_31_1545245.30972974</id>
	<title>Re:Why not "cyberlocker" sites?</title>
	<author>misexistentialist</author>
	<datestamp>1264971540000</datestamp>
	<modclass>Interestin</modclass>
	<modscore>4</modscore>
	<htmltext>Legal fantasies of "intent" and "enabling" are problematic for index sites, but Rapidshare just operates servers, which the law of the universe declares legal. The copyright holders therefore are working to force storage providers and ISPs to start making indexes, because storing, distributing, and indexing pirated material is definitely illegal. (See <a href="http://yro.slashdot.org/story/09/06/24/1647251/Rapidshare-Ordered-To-Filter-Content" title="slashdot.org">http://yro.slashdot.org/story/09/06/24/1647251/Rapidshare-Ordered-To-Filter-Content</a> [slashdot.org]) That this requires universal censorship is of no concern to corporations and the politicians that obey them.</htmltext>
<tokenext>Legal fantasies of " intent " and " enabling " are problematic for index sites , but Rapidshare just operates servers , which the law of the universe declares legal .
The copyright holders therefore are working to force storage providers and ISPs to start making indexes , because storing , distributing , and indexing pirated material is definitely illegal .
( See http : //yro.slashdot.org/story/09/06/24/1647251/Rapidshare-Ordered-To-Filter-Content [ slashdot.org ] ) That this requires universal censorship is of no concern to corporations and the politicians that obey them .</tokentext>
<sentencetext>Legal fantasies of "intent" and "enabling" are problematic for index sites, but Rapidshare just operates servers, which the law of the universe declares legal.
The copyright holders therefore are working to force storage providers and ISPs to start making indexes, because storing, distributing, and indexing pirated material is definitely illegal.
(See http://yro.slashdot.org/story/09/06/24/1647251/Rapidshare-Ordered-To-Filter-Content [slashdot.org]) That this requires universal censorship is of no concern to corporations and the politicians that obey them.</sentencetext>
	<parent>http://www.semanticweb.org/ontologies/ConversationInstances.owl#comment10_01_31_1545245.30971676</parent>
</comment>
<comment>
	<id>http://www.semanticweb.org/ontologies/ConversationInstances.owl#comment10_01_31_1545245.30971362</id>
	<title>Sigh</title>
	<author>Andorin</author>
	<datestamp>1264961880000</datestamp>
	<modclass>Interestin</modclass>
	<modscore>5</modscore>
	<htmltext>Unlike, say, The Pirate Bay, Newzbin.com will apparently cooperate with takedown requests. Yet they're getting sued anyway.<br>
<br>
Way to be a shining example of rationality there, MPA.</htmltext>
<tokenext>Unlike , say , The Pirate Bay , Newzbin.com will apparently cooperate with takedown requests .
Yet they 're getting sued anyway .
Way to be a shining example of rationality there , MPA .</tokentext>
<sentencetext>Unlike, say, The Pirate Bay, Newzbin.com will apparently cooperate with takedown requests.
Yet they're getting sued anyway.
Way to be a shining example of rationality there, MPA.</sentencetext>
</comment>
<comment>
	<id>http://www.semanticweb.org/ontologies/ConversationInstances.owl#comment10_01_31_1545245.30973248</id>
	<title>Second rule of Usenet</title>
	<author>jonaskoelker</author>
	<datestamp>1264930140000</datestamp>
	<modclass>None</modclass>
	<modscore>1</modscore>
	<htmltext><p><div class="quote"><p>Somebody has been breaking the first rule of [...]</p></div><p>FTFY.</p></div>
	</htmltext>
<tokenext>Somebody has been breaking the first rule of [ ... ] FTFY .</tokentext>
<sentencetext>Somebody has been breaking the first rule of [...]FTFY.
	</sentencetext>
	<parent>http://www.semanticweb.org/ontologies/ConversationInstances.owl#comment10_01_31_1545245.30971336</parent>
</comment>
<comment>
	<id>http://www.semanticweb.org/ontologies/ConversationInstances.owl#comment10_01_31_1545245.30977238</id>
	<title>Re:First rule of Usenet</title>
	<author>Anonymous</author>
	<datestamp>1264958100000</datestamp>
	<modclass>None</modclass>
	<modscore>0</modscore>
	<htmltext><p><div class="quote"><p>Somebody has been breaking the first rule of Usenet</p></div><p>No kissing on the first date?</p></div>
	</htmltext>
<tokenext>Somebody has been breaking the first rule of UsenetNo kissing on the first date ?</tokentext>
<sentencetext>Somebody has been breaking the first rule of UsenetNo kissing on the first date?
	</sentencetext>
	<parent>http://www.semanticweb.org/ontologies/ConversationInstances.owl#comment10_01_31_1545245.30971336</parent>
</comment>
<comment>
	<id>http://www.semanticweb.org/ontologies/ConversationInstances.owl#comment10_01_31_1545245.30972100</id>
	<title>Re:Why not "cyberlocker" sites?</title>
	<author>nurb432</author>
	<datestamp>1264966680000</datestamp>
	<modclass>Interestin</modclass>
	<modscore>2</modscore>
	<htmltext><p><div class="quote"><p>Why are all these cases aimed at people who merely index content?</p>  </div><p>Because its easier to show in the court what is going on ' look, the have this web page here that says you can download xyz'. And then present pretty graphics to the judge. Trying to explain packets and p2p clients would be harder and risky.</p><p>And if they shut down 99\% of the public sites, they have succeeded in their task. They know they cant ever stop the hardcore, but if they can get to the casual down loader, they will be happy.</p></div>
	</htmltext>
<tokenext>Why are all these cases aimed at people who merely index content ?
Because its easier to show in the court what is going on ' look , the have this web page here that says you can download xyz' .
And then present pretty graphics to the judge .
Trying to explain packets and p2p clients would be harder and risky.And if they shut down 99 \ % of the public sites , they have succeeded in their task .
They know they cant ever stop the hardcore , but if they can get to the casual down loader , they will be happy .</tokentext>
<sentencetext>Why are all these cases aimed at people who merely index content?
Because its easier to show in the court what is going on ' look, the have this web page here that says you can download xyz'.
And then present pretty graphics to the judge.
Trying to explain packets and p2p clients would be harder and risky.And if they shut down 99\% of the public sites, they have succeeded in their task.
They know they cant ever stop the hardcore, but if they can get to the casual down loader, they will be happy.
	</sentencetext>
	<parent>http://www.semanticweb.org/ontologies/ConversationInstances.owl#comment10_01_31_1545245.30971676</parent>
</comment>
<comment>
	<id>http://www.semanticweb.org/ontologies/ConversationInstances.owl#comment10_01_31_1545245.30971238</id>
	<title>Lightning</title>
	<author>Anonymous</author>
	<datestamp>1264960860000</datestamp>
	<modclass>None</modclass>
	<modscore>0</modscore>
	<htmltext>It never strikes the same place twice.</htmltext>
<tokenext>It never strikes the same place twice .</tokentext>
<sentencetext>It never strikes the same place twice.</sentencetext>
</comment>
<comment>
	<id>http://www.semanticweb.org/ontologies/ConversationInstances.owl#comment10_01_31_1545245.30973012</id>
	<title>Re:Why not "cyberlocker" sites?</title>
	<author>Kjella</author>
	<datestamp>1264928580000</datestamp>
	<modclass>None</modclass>
	<modscore>1</modscore>
	<htmltext><p>Basically, I think it is because they'll only do cases where they think they'll win something. For example, quite early on Usenet servers scored some pretty fundamental victories against copyright so they're attacking indexers instead which could put a cramp in Usenet's style. I think the biggest danger is that by attacking Rapidshare and Megaupload, is that they'll kill off files without password because those could be scanned and filtered. I suspect shortly after a victory against them, a new set of file hosts would show up where having a passworded archive is <b>mandatory</b> and you must get info/pass from another service. People will still pay for the bandwidth and it'll be a win-win for everyone but the *AAs.</p></htmltext>
<tokenext>Basically , I think it is because they 'll only do cases where they think they 'll win something .
For example , quite early on Usenet servers scored some pretty fundamental victories against copyright so they 're attacking indexers instead which could put a cramp in Usenet 's style .
I think the biggest danger is that by attacking Rapidshare and Megaupload , is that they 'll kill off files without password because those could be scanned and filtered .
I suspect shortly after a victory against them , a new set of file hosts would show up where having a passworded archive is mandatory and you must get info/pass from another service .
People will still pay for the bandwidth and it 'll be a win-win for everyone but the * AAs .</tokentext>
<sentencetext>Basically, I think it is because they'll only do cases where they think they'll win something.
For example, quite early on Usenet servers scored some pretty fundamental victories against copyright so they're attacking indexers instead which could put a cramp in Usenet's style.
I think the biggest danger is that by attacking Rapidshare and Megaupload, is that they'll kill off files without password because those could be scanned and filtered.
I suspect shortly after a victory against them, a new set of file hosts would show up where having a passworded archive is mandatory and you must get info/pass from another service.
People will still pay for the bandwidth and it'll be a win-win for everyone but the *AAs.</sentencetext>
	<parent>http://www.semanticweb.org/ontologies/ConversationInstances.owl#comment10_01_31_1545245.30971676</parent>
</comment>
<comment>
	<id>http://www.semanticweb.org/ontologies/ConversationInstances.owl#comment10_01_31_1545245.30974162</id>
	<title>Re:Indexing is not a crime</title>
	<author>furbyhater</author>
	<datestamp>1264934760000</datestamp>
	<modclass>Interestin</modclass>
	<modscore>2</modscore>
	<htmltext><p><div class="quote"><p>If indexing is a crime, then it is only a very very small step<nobr> <wbr></nobr>... Keep walking down that path, and soon we loose all our digital freedoms...</p></div><p>Massive exaggeration?

Newsbin handpicks warez (or even posts them themselves), then creates nzb files and garnishes them with detailed descriptions, only to charge a small fee from everyone who wants access to their "catalog". Quite different from a simple aggregator.

The proliferation of NZBs is destroying the usenet community (most current usenet lusers have probably never even read a group. It's just something equivalent to rapidshare to them, but with moar 1334).</p></div>
	</htmltext>
<tokenext>If indexing is a crime , then it is only a very very small step ... Keep walking down that path , and soon we loose all our digital freedoms...Massive exaggeration ?
Newsbin handpicks warez ( or even posts them themselves ) , then creates nzb files and garnishes them with detailed descriptions , only to charge a small fee from everyone who wants access to their " catalog " .
Quite different from a simple aggregator .
The proliferation of NZBs is destroying the usenet community ( most current usenet lusers have probably never even read a group .
It 's just something equivalent to rapidshare to them , but with moar 1334 ) .</tokentext>
<sentencetext>If indexing is a crime, then it is only a very very small step ... Keep walking down that path, and soon we loose all our digital freedoms...Massive exaggeration?
Newsbin handpicks warez (or even posts them themselves), then creates nzb files and garnishes them with detailed descriptions, only to charge a small fee from everyone who wants access to their "catalog".
Quite different from a simple aggregator.
The proliferation of NZBs is destroying the usenet community (most current usenet lusers have probably never even read a group.
It's just something equivalent to rapidshare to them, but with moar 1334).
	</sentencetext>
	<parent>http://www.semanticweb.org/ontologies/ConversationInstances.owl#comment10_01_31_1545245.30972326</parent>
</comment>
<comment>
	<id>http://www.semanticweb.org/ontologies/ConversationInstances.owl#comment10_01_31_1545245.30973126</id>
	<title>Allowing?</title>
	<author>Spad</author>
	<datestamp>1264929300000</datestamp>
	<modclass>None</modclass>
	<modscore>1</modscore>
	<htmltext><p>"Allowing illegal copying?"</p><p>If you're not part of the solution...then you're probably allowing illegal copying. In fact, right now I'm allowing illegal copying, I'm also allowing illegal drug use, murder, rape, public indecency and numerous other crimes - guess I should turn myself in right now.</p></htmltext>
<tokenext>" Allowing illegal copying ?
" If you 're not part of the solution...then you 're probably allowing illegal copying .
In fact , right now I 'm allowing illegal copying , I 'm also allowing illegal drug use , murder , rape , public indecency and numerous other crimes - guess I should turn myself in right now .</tokentext>
<sentencetext>"Allowing illegal copying?
"If you're not part of the solution...then you're probably allowing illegal copying.
In fact, right now I'm allowing illegal copying, I'm also allowing illegal drug use, murder, rape, public indecency and numerous other crimes - guess I should turn myself in right now.</sentencetext>
</comment>
<comment>
	<id>http://www.semanticweb.org/ontologies/ConversationInstances.owl#comment10_01_31_1545245.30975540</id>
	<title>Re:Never heard of newzbin.com before</title>
	<author>psyron</author>
	<datestamp>1264943460000</datestamp>
	<modclass>None</modclass>
	<modscore>1</modscore>
	<htmltext><a href="http://nzbmatrix.com/" title="nzbmatrix.com" rel="nofollow">NZBMatrix</a> [nzbmatrix.com] is an alternative. One off fee of (IIRC) $10 for full retention, well worth it. I've nearly stopped using torrents altogether since finding that site.</htmltext>
<tokenext>NZBMatrix [ nzbmatrix.com ] is an alternative .
One off fee of ( IIRC ) $ 10 for full retention , well worth it .
I 've nearly stopped using torrents altogether since finding that site .</tokentext>
<sentencetext>NZBMatrix [nzbmatrix.com] is an alternative.
One off fee of (IIRC) $10 for full retention, well worth it.
I've nearly stopped using torrents altogether since finding that site.</sentencetext>
	<parent>http://www.semanticweb.org/ontologies/ConversationInstances.owl#comment10_01_31_1545245.30971772</parent>
</comment>
<comment>
	<id>http://www.semanticweb.org/ontologies/ConversationInstances.owl#comment10_01_31_1545245.30976354</id>
	<title>Re:What</title>
	<author>Kirijini</author>
	<datestamp>1264949040000</datestamp>
	<modclass>Informativ</modclass>
	<modscore>3</modscore>
	<htmltext><p><div class="quote"><p>Newzbin... [is] a common carrier, just like google.</p></div><p>I understand what you're trying to say, but "common carrier" isn't the right terminology.  The term "common carrier" has an important legal meaning, on top of the general idea that it refers to a service provider that is open to the public.</p><p>Common carriers, like airlines, railroads, telephone networks, grain elevators (not kidding - in the 1800s, grain elevators were considered by the courts to be "common carriers") are business that are "affected with a public interest," and are <i>regulated</i>.  Typically they have unusual liability standards, are forbidden from discriminating, and in return may have special privileges vis-a-vis public right of ways and eminent domain powers.</p><p>Google is not a common carrier.  Neither is newzbin.  ISPs aren't common carriers either - they've been desperately fighting for years to avoid being classified as common carriers, and thus become subject to the kinds of regulations that come with that title.</p><p>Let me put it this way - if Newzbin was a common carrier, then a poster on a newsgroup somewhere would be able to sue Newzbin if it didn't index that post within a reasonable amount of time.  Likewise with Google - if it was a common carrier, then it would be liable to the owners of websites that it either negligently didn't index (overlooked somehow) or purposefully didn't list (like that website with photos of Michelle Obama made to look like a monkey).</p></div>
	</htmltext>
<tokenext>Newzbin... [ is ] a common carrier , just like google.I understand what you 're trying to say , but " common carrier " is n't the right terminology .
The term " common carrier " has an important legal meaning , on top of the general idea that it refers to a service provider that is open to the public.Common carriers , like airlines , railroads , telephone networks , grain elevators ( not kidding - in the 1800s , grain elevators were considered by the courts to be " common carriers " ) are business that are " affected with a public interest , " and are regulated .
Typically they have unusual liability standards , are forbidden from discriminating , and in return may have special privileges vis-a-vis public right of ways and eminent domain powers.Google is not a common carrier .
Neither is newzbin .
ISPs are n't common carriers either - they 've been desperately fighting for years to avoid being classified as common carriers , and thus become subject to the kinds of regulations that come with that title.Let me put it this way - if Newzbin was a common carrier , then a poster on a newsgroup somewhere would be able to sue Newzbin if it did n't index that post within a reasonable amount of time .
Likewise with Google - if it was a common carrier , then it would be liable to the owners of websites that it either negligently did n't index ( overlooked somehow ) or purposefully did n't list ( like that website with photos of Michelle Obama made to look like a monkey ) .</tokentext>
<sentencetext>Newzbin... [is] a common carrier, just like google.I understand what you're trying to say, but "common carrier" isn't the right terminology.
The term "common carrier" has an important legal meaning, on top of the general idea that it refers to a service provider that is open to the public.Common carriers, like airlines, railroads, telephone networks, grain elevators (not kidding - in the 1800s, grain elevators were considered by the courts to be "common carriers") are business that are "affected with a public interest," and are regulated.
Typically they have unusual liability standards, are forbidden from discriminating, and in return may have special privileges vis-a-vis public right of ways and eminent domain powers.Google is not a common carrier.
Neither is newzbin.
ISPs aren't common carriers either - they've been desperately fighting for years to avoid being classified as common carriers, and thus become subject to the kinds of regulations that come with that title.Let me put it this way - if Newzbin was a common carrier, then a poster on a newsgroup somewhere would be able to sue Newzbin if it didn't index that post within a reasonable amount of time.
Likewise with Google - if it was a common carrier, then it would be liable to the owners of websites that it either negligently didn't index (overlooked somehow) or purposefully didn't list (like that website with photos of Michelle Obama made to look like a monkey).
	</sentencetext>
	<parent>http://www.semanticweb.org/ontologies/ConversationInstances.owl#comment10_01_31_1545245.30971568</parent>
</comment>
<comment>
	<id>http://www.semanticweb.org/ontologies/ConversationInstances.owl#comment10_01_31_1545245.30976952</id>
	<title>Re:Sigh</title>
	<author>rdnetto</author>
	<datestamp>1264955520000</datestamp>
	<modclass>Interestin</modclass>
	<modscore>2</modscore>
	<htmltext><p>Mininova also complied with takedown requests. They got sued, and now they're effectively dead.</p></htmltext>
<tokenext>Mininova also complied with takedown requests .
They got sued , and now they 're effectively dead .</tokentext>
<sentencetext>Mininova also complied with takedown requests.
They got sued, and now they're effectively dead.</sentencetext>
	<parent>http://www.semanticweb.org/ontologies/ConversationInstances.owl#comment10_01_31_1545245.30971362</parent>
</comment>
<comment>
	<id>http://www.semanticweb.org/ontologies/ConversationInstances.owl#comment10_01_31_1545245.30983354</id>
	<title>Illegal how?</title>
	<author>Anonymous</author>
	<datestamp>1265048520000</datestamp>
	<modclass>None</modclass>
	<modscore>0</modscore>
	<htmltext><p>"leveled against Newzbin is one of allowing and inducing illegal copying"</p><p>I'm sure the British Library has a "Mein Kampf" in it indexes but you could hardly accuse them of allowing or inducing Nazism.</p><p>I'm a fan of Newzbin. So many times I've missed a programme on the BBC or Sky and haven't recorded it and I can often get it via Newzbin. However it should be noted Newzbin don't supply the programme - I use Astraweb for that. It's they that hold the data. If Newzbin didn't exist I can still get the programmes from Astraweb. I pay my TV license fee and my subscription to Sky. This is no different to me recording via my PVR. In fact I almost consider newzbin as part of my PVR.</p><p>Now if I were downloading brand new movies - well that's a whole new area and that I can fully understand being illegal. But I don't download movies just UK TV that I've already paid the BBC and Sky for and had it pressed the button would be on my Sky+ box (PVR).</p></htmltext>
<tokenext>" leveled against Newzbin is one of allowing and inducing illegal copying " I 'm sure the British Library has a " Mein Kampf " in it indexes but you could hardly accuse them of allowing or inducing Nazism.I 'm a fan of Newzbin .
So many times I 've missed a programme on the BBC or Sky and have n't recorded it and I can often get it via Newzbin .
However it should be noted Newzbin do n't supply the programme - I use Astraweb for that .
It 's they that hold the data .
If Newzbin did n't exist I can still get the programmes from Astraweb .
I pay my TV license fee and my subscription to Sky .
This is no different to me recording via my PVR .
In fact I almost consider newzbin as part of my PVR.Now if I were downloading brand new movies - well that 's a whole new area and that I can fully understand being illegal .
But I do n't download movies just UK TV that I 've already paid the BBC and Sky for and had it pressed the button would be on my Sky + box ( PVR ) .</tokentext>
<sentencetext>"leveled against Newzbin is one of allowing and inducing illegal copying"I'm sure the British Library has a "Mein Kampf" in it indexes but you could hardly accuse them of allowing or inducing Nazism.I'm a fan of Newzbin.
So many times I've missed a programme on the BBC or Sky and haven't recorded it and I can often get it via Newzbin.
However it should be noted Newzbin don't supply the programme - I use Astraweb for that.
It's they that hold the data.
If Newzbin didn't exist I can still get the programmes from Astraweb.
I pay my TV license fee and my subscription to Sky.
This is no different to me recording via my PVR.
In fact I almost consider newzbin as part of my PVR.Now if I were downloading brand new movies - well that's a whole new area and that I can fully understand being illegal.
But I don't download movies just UK TV that I've already paid the BBC and Sky for and had it pressed the button would be on my Sky+ box (PVR).</sentencetext>
</comment>
<comment>
	<id>http://www.semanticweb.org/ontologies/ConversationInstances.owl#comment10_01_31_1545245.30974170</id>
	<title>2 Things</title>
	<author>chucklebutte</author>
	<datestamp>1264934820000</datestamp>
	<modclass>None</modclass>
	<modscore>0</modscore>
	<htmltext><p>First OMG Indexing! Get M$ and all other OS's that have indexing capabilities and put them in court and sue them too!</p><p>Second, fuck they finally find newsgroups after almost 20 years? Damnit the last and most sacred of all places for pirates, its its or haven or heaven which ever you prefer... Either way you slice it this sucks.</p></htmltext>
<tokenext>First OMG Indexing !
Get M $ and all other OS 's that have indexing capabilities and put them in court and sue them too ! Second , fuck they finally find newsgroups after almost 20 years ?
Damnit the last and most sacred of all places for pirates , its its or haven or heaven which ever you prefer... Either way you slice it this sucks .</tokentext>
<sentencetext>First OMG Indexing!
Get M$ and all other OS's that have indexing capabilities and put them in court and sue them too!Second, fuck they finally find newsgroups after almost 20 years?
Damnit the last and most sacred of all places for pirates, its its or haven or heaven which ever you prefer... Either way you slice it this sucks.</sentencetext>
</comment>
<comment>
	<id>http://www.semanticweb.org/ontologies/ConversationInstances.owl#comment10_01_31_1545245.30972370</id>
	<title>Just in case we got many choices</title>
	<author>Anonymous</author>
	<datestamp>1264968180000</datestamp>
	<modclass>None</modclass>
	<modscore>0</modscore>
	<htmltext><p>for a list http://www.dmoz.org//Computers/Usenet/Search/NZB//<br>I personaly like www.binsearch.info</p><p>I don't mind publicizing usenet because most regular computer users never figure out how to use it, and since most of them moved to torrents the amount of virus moved aswell. USENET is better than netflix or ondemand.</p></htmltext>
<tokenext>for a list http : //www.dmoz.org//Computers/Usenet/Search/NZB//I personaly like www.binsearch.infoI do n't mind publicizing usenet because most regular computer users never figure out how to use it , and since most of them moved to torrents the amount of virus moved aswell .
USENET is better than netflix or ondemand .</tokentext>
<sentencetext>for a list http://www.dmoz.org//Computers/Usenet/Search/NZB//I personaly like www.binsearch.infoI don't mind publicizing usenet because most regular computer users never figure out how to use it, and since most of them moved to torrents the amount of virus moved aswell.
USENET is better than netflix or ondemand.</sentencetext>
</comment>
<comment>
	<id>http://www.semanticweb.org/ontologies/ConversationInstances.owl#comment10_01_31_1545245.30974300</id>
	<title>Re:Why not "cyberlocker" sites?</title>
	<author>furbyhater</author>
	<datestamp>1264935420000</datestamp>
	<modclass>None</modclass>
	<modscore>1</modscore>
	<htmltext>It's easier if you can file suit in the US.
<br>
Always go after the weakest preys first, you'll have it easier once you have set a precedence.
<br>
The **AAs are being paid a lot by the studios and needs to look busy doing something, but without piracy a lot of the **AA dudes/dudettes would probably be out of work.</htmltext>
<tokenext>It 's easier if you can file suit in the US .
Always go after the weakest preys first , you 'll have it easier once you have set a precedence .
The * * AAs are being paid a lot by the studios and needs to look busy doing something , but without piracy a lot of the * * AA dudes/dudettes would probably be out of work .</tokentext>
<sentencetext>It's easier if you can file suit in the US.
Always go after the weakest preys first, you'll have it easier once you have set a precedence.
The **AAs are being paid a lot by the studios and needs to look busy doing something, but without piracy a lot of the **AA dudes/dudettes would probably be out of work.</sentencetext>
	<parent>http://www.semanticweb.org/ontologies/ConversationInstances.owl#comment10_01_31_1545245.30971676</parent>
</comment>
<comment>
	<id>http://www.semanticweb.org/ontologies/ConversationInstances.owl#comment10_01_31_1545245.30973190</id>
	<title>Isn't newzbin.com's index created manually?</title>
	<author>Anonymous</author>
	<datestamp>1264929720000</datestamp>
	<modclass>None</modclass>
	<modscore>1</modscore>
	<htmltext><p>I can see true automatic search engines like newzleech.com and binsearch.info being able to use this "we are just a search engine" defense, but NewzBin apparently uses humans to create the index. Stupid, and also an obvious step towards supporting piracy...</p></htmltext>
<tokenext>I can see true automatic search engines like newzleech.com and binsearch.info being able to use this " we are just a search engine " defense , but NewzBin apparently uses humans to create the index .
Stupid , and also an obvious step towards supporting piracy.. .</tokentext>
<sentencetext>I can see true automatic search engines like newzleech.com and binsearch.info being able to use this "we are just a search engine" defense, but NewzBin apparently uses humans to create the index.
Stupid, and also an obvious step towards supporting piracy...</sentencetext>
</comment>
<comment>
	<id>http://www.semanticweb.org/ontologies/ConversationInstances.owl#comment10_01_31_1545245.30972032</id>
	<title>Freedom</title>
	<author>nurb432</author>
	<datestamp>1264966500000</datestamp>
	<modclass>None</modclass>
	<modscore>1</modscore>
	<htmltext><p>Takes another hit.</p></htmltext>
<tokenext>Takes another hit .</tokentext>
<sentencetext>Takes another hit.</sentencetext>
</comment>
<comment>
	<id>http://www.semanticweb.org/ontologies/ConversationInstances.owl#comment10_01_31_1545245.30973046</id>
	<title>Re:What</title>
	<author>Spad</author>
	<datestamp>1264928760000</datestamp>
	<modclass>Informativ</modclass>
	<modscore>2</modscore>
	<htmltext><p>Incorrect. Its editors create "reports" from the Usenet feeds that it pulls in from various providers (though you can still browse the feeds directly if you prefer).</p><p>That said, Newzbin's content is simply a function of the content of the newsgroups on Usenet; if people only posted non-infringing material to them, then there would only be non-infringing material to report.</p></htmltext>
<tokenext>Incorrect .
Its editors create " reports " from the Usenet feeds that it pulls in from various providers ( though you can still browse the feeds directly if you prefer ) .That said , Newzbin 's content is simply a function of the content of the newsgroups on Usenet ; if people only posted non-infringing material to them , then there would only be non-infringing material to report .</tokentext>
<sentencetext>Incorrect.
Its editors create "reports" from the Usenet feeds that it pulls in from various providers (though you can still browse the feeds directly if you prefer).That said, Newzbin's content is simply a function of the content of the newsgroups on Usenet; if people only posted non-infringing material to them, then there would only be non-infringing material to report.</sentencetext>
	<parent>http://www.semanticweb.org/ontologies/ConversationInstances.owl#comment10_01_31_1545245.30971630</parent>
</comment>
<comment>
	<id>http://www.semanticweb.org/ontologies/ConversationInstances.owl#comment10_01_31_1545245.30991730</id>
	<title>Not for Google</title>
	<author>Bractus</author>
	<datestamp>1265047440000</datestamp>
	<modclass>None</modclass>
	<modscore>1</modscore>
	<htmltext>Will not apply for Google!
Small fishes die first.</htmltext>
<tokenext>Will not apply for Google !
Small fishes die first .</tokentext>
<sentencetext>Will not apply for Google!
Small fishes die first.</sentencetext>
</comment>
<comment>
	<id>http://www.semanticweb.org/ontologies/ConversationInstances.owl#comment10_01_31_1545245.30972172</id>
	<title>Re:First rule of Usenet</title>
	<author>Anonymous</author>
	<datestamp>1264967100000</datestamp>
	<modclass>None</modclass>
	<modscore>0</modscore>
	<htmltext><p>You just broke it again you insensitive clod!</p></htmltext>
<tokenext>You just broke it again you insensitive clod !</tokentext>
<sentencetext>You just broke it again you insensitive clod!</sentencetext>
	<parent>http://www.semanticweb.org/ontologies/ConversationInstances.owl#comment10_01_31_1545245.30971336</parent>
</comment>
<comment>
	<id>http://www.semanticweb.org/ontologies/ConversationInstances.owl#comment10_01_31_1545245.30971460</id>
	<title>Why is indexing illegal?</title>
	<author>klashn</author>
	<datestamp>1264962660000</datestamp>
	<modclass>Informativ</modclass>
	<modscore>2</modscore>
	<htmltext>Newzbin is not providing material for download, but instead just providing information.
Google does the same thing... Clicking the first link on google from the search 'office 2007 download warez' this website showed up:<br>
<a href="http://www.mydigitallife.info/2006/11/13/download-microsoft-office-2007-system-enterprise-edition-final-rtm-full-suite-retail-cd-with-bt-torrent/" title="mydigitallife.info" rel="nofollow">http://www.mydigitallife.info/2006/11/13/download-microsoft-office-2007-system-enterprise-edition-final-rtm-full-suite-retail-cd-with-bt-torrent/</a> [mydigitallife.info] They're offering Office 2007 as a torrent file</htmltext>
<tokenext>Newzbin is not providing material for download , but instead just providing information .
Google does the same thing... Clicking the first link on google from the search 'office 2007 download warez ' this website showed up : http : //www.mydigitallife.info/2006/11/13/download-microsoft-office-2007-system-enterprise-edition-final-rtm-full-suite-retail-cd-with-bt-torrent/ [ mydigitallife.info ] They 're offering Office 2007 as a torrent file</tokentext>
<sentencetext>Newzbin is not providing material for download, but instead just providing information.
Google does the same thing... Clicking the first link on google from the search 'office 2007 download warez' this website showed up:
http://www.mydigitallife.info/2006/11/13/download-microsoft-office-2007-system-enterprise-edition-final-rtm-full-suite-retail-cd-with-bt-torrent/ [mydigitallife.info] They're offering Office 2007 as a torrent file</sentencetext>
</comment>
<comment>
	<id>http://www.semanticweb.org/ontologies/ConversationInstances.owl#comment10_01_31_1545245.30974094</id>
	<title>Re:Why not "cyberlocker" sites?</title>
	<author>tkinnun0</author>
	<datestamp>1264934340000</datestamp>
	<modclass>None</modclass>
	<modscore>1</modscore>
	<htmltext>Because Newzbin have set up their business such that the easier it is for their users to pirate stuff the more they get paid.</htmltext>
<tokenext>Because Newzbin have set up their business such that the easier it is for their users to pirate stuff the more they get paid .</tokentext>
<sentencetext>Because Newzbin have set up their business such that the easier it is for their users to pirate stuff the more they get paid.</sentencetext>
	<parent>http://www.semanticweb.org/ontologies/ConversationInstances.owl#comment10_01_31_1545245.30971676</parent>
</comment>
<comment>
	<id>http://www.semanticweb.org/ontologies/ConversationInstances.owl#comment10_01_31_1545245.30971622</id>
	<title>Re:Why is indexing illegal?</title>
	<author>antek9</author>
	<datestamp>1264963800000</datestamp>
	<modclass>Funny</modclass>
	<modscore>4</modscore>
	<htmltext>Ok, but it's so easy to take down Google. You know how it works, just enter 'google' into Google... As a collateral, you will also break the Internet that way, but what does the MPA care, anyway.</htmltext>
<tokenext>Ok , but it 's so easy to take down Google .
You know how it works , just enter 'google ' into Google... As a collateral , you will also break the Internet that way , but what does the MPA care , anyway .</tokentext>
<sentencetext>Ok, but it's so easy to take down Google.
You know how it works, just enter 'google' into Google... As a collateral, you will also break the Internet that way, but what does the MPA care, anyway.</sentencetext>
	<parent>http://www.semanticweb.org/ontologies/ConversationInstances.owl#comment10_01_31_1545245.30971460</parent>
</comment>
<comment>
	<id>http://www.semanticweb.org/ontologies/ConversationInstances.owl#comment10_01_31_1545245.30984162</id>
	<title>Illegal?</title>
	<author>Anonymous</author>
	<datestamp>1265051760000</datestamp>
	<modclass>None</modclass>
	<modscore>0</modscore>
	<htmltext><p>"leveled against Newzbin is one of allowing and inducing illegal copying"</p><p>I'm sure the British Library has a "Mein Kampf" in it indexes but you could hardly accuse them of allowing or inducing Nazism.</p><p>I'm a fan of Newzbin. So many times I've missed a programme on the BBC or Sky and haven't recorded it and I can often get it via Newzbin. I pay my TV license fee and my subscription to Sky. This is no different to me recording via my PVR. In fact I almost consider newzbin as part of my PVR.</p><p>Now if I were downloading brand new movies - well that's a whole new area and that I can fully understand being illegal. But I don't download movies just UK TV that I've already paid the BBC and Sky for and had it pressed the button would be on my Sky+ box (PVR).</p></htmltext>
<tokenext>" leveled against Newzbin is one of allowing and inducing illegal copying " I 'm sure the British Library has a " Mein Kampf " in it indexes but you could hardly accuse them of allowing or inducing Nazism.I 'm a fan of Newzbin .
So many times I 've missed a programme on the BBC or Sky and have n't recorded it and I can often get it via Newzbin .
I pay my TV license fee and my subscription to Sky .
This is no different to me recording via my PVR .
In fact I almost consider newzbin as part of my PVR.Now if I were downloading brand new movies - well that 's a whole new area and that I can fully understand being illegal .
But I do n't download movies just UK TV that I 've already paid the BBC and Sky for and had it pressed the button would be on my Sky + box ( PVR ) .</tokentext>
<sentencetext>"leveled against Newzbin is one of allowing and inducing illegal copying"I'm sure the British Library has a "Mein Kampf" in it indexes but you could hardly accuse them of allowing or inducing Nazism.I'm a fan of Newzbin.
So many times I've missed a programme on the BBC or Sky and haven't recorded it and I can often get it via Newzbin.
I pay my TV license fee and my subscription to Sky.
This is no different to me recording via my PVR.
In fact I almost consider newzbin as part of my PVR.Now if I were downloading brand new movies - well that's a whole new area and that I can fully understand being illegal.
But I don't download movies just UK TV that I've already paid the BBC and Sky for and had it pressed the button would be on my Sky+ box (PVR).</sentencetext>
</comment>
<comment>
	<id>http://www.semanticweb.org/ontologies/ConversationInstances.owl#comment10_01_31_1545245.30973302</id>
	<title>Re:Sigh</title>
	<author>the1337g33k</author>
	<datestamp>1264930380000</datestamp>
	<modclass>Flamebait</modclass>
	<modscore>1</modscore>
	<htmltext>Newzbin does comply with takedown requests however they don't make it easy on them at all.

<a href="http://docs.newzbin.com/index.php/Newzbin:Item\_Removal" title="newzbin.com" rel="nofollow">http://docs.newzbin.com/index.php/Newzbin:Item\_Removal</a> [newzbin.com]</htmltext>
<tokenext>Newzbin does comply with takedown requests however they do n't make it easy on them at all .
http : //docs.newzbin.com/index.php/Newzbin : Item \ _Removal [ newzbin.com ]</tokentext>
<sentencetext>Newzbin does comply with takedown requests however they don't make it easy on them at all.
http://docs.newzbin.com/index.php/Newzbin:Item\_Removal [newzbin.com]</sentencetext>
	<parent>http://www.semanticweb.org/ontologies/ConversationInstances.owl#comment10_01_31_1545245.30971362</parent>
</comment>
<comment>
	<id>http://www.semanticweb.org/ontologies/ConversationInstances.owl#comment10_01_31_1545245.30971336</id>
	<title>First rule of Usenet</title>
	<author>Anonymous</author>
	<datestamp>1264961580000</datestamp>
	<modclass>Funny</modclass>
	<modscore>5</modscore>
	<htmltext><p>Somebody has been breaking the first rule of Usenet</p></htmltext>
<tokenext>Somebody has been breaking the first rule of Usenet</tokentext>
<sentencetext>Somebody has been breaking the first rule of Usenet</sentencetext>
</comment>
<comment>
	<id>http://www.semanticweb.org/ontologies/ConversationInstances.owl#comment10_01_31_1545245.30971630</id>
	<title>Re:What</title>
	<author>Anonymous</author>
	<datestamp>1264963860000</datestamp>
	<modclass>None</modclass>
	<modscore>0</modscore>
	<htmltext><p>It's not an automatic indexer, it's users submit the nzbs.</p></htmltext>
<tokenext>It 's not an automatic indexer , it 's users submit the nzbs .</tokentext>
<sentencetext>It's not an automatic indexer, it's users submit the nzbs.</sentencetext>
	<parent>http://www.semanticweb.org/ontologies/ConversationInstances.owl#comment10_01_31_1545245.30971568</parent>
</comment>
<comment>
	<id>http://www.semanticweb.org/ontologies/ConversationInstances.owl#comment10_01_31_1545245.30971676</id>
	<title>Why not "cyberlocker" sites?</title>
	<author>mister\_playboy</author>
	<datestamp>1264964160000</datestamp>
	<modclass>Interestin</modclass>
	<modscore>5</modscore>
	<htmltext><p>Why are all these cases aimed at people who merely index content?  Filehosters like Rapidshare and Megaupload are not only actually hosting and distributing the files themselves, but their whole business revolves around copyright infringement.  People pay for premium service to download more illegal stuff faster, and they generate so much ad money from high traffic only because of the infringing files they make available.  Finally, they would be a more logical target for civil suit since they actually have money to loose.</p><p>I have no sympathy for either of the *AAs and I understand some of these points apply to other sites to some extent, but I don't understand why they choose to overlook the juiciest targets.</p></htmltext>
<tokenext>Why are all these cases aimed at people who merely index content ?
Filehosters like Rapidshare and Megaupload are not only actually hosting and distributing the files themselves , but their whole business revolves around copyright infringement .
People pay for premium service to download more illegal stuff faster , and they generate so much ad money from high traffic only because of the infringing files they make available .
Finally , they would be a more logical target for civil suit since they actually have money to loose.I have no sympathy for either of the * AAs and I understand some of these points apply to other sites to some extent , but I do n't understand why they choose to overlook the juiciest targets .</tokentext>
<sentencetext>Why are all these cases aimed at people who merely index content?
Filehosters like Rapidshare and Megaupload are not only actually hosting and distributing the files themselves, but their whole business revolves around copyright infringement.
People pay for premium service to download more illegal stuff faster, and they generate so much ad money from high traffic only because of the infringing files they make available.
Finally, they would be a more logical target for civil suit since they actually have money to loose.I have no sympathy for either of the *AAs and I understand some of these points apply to other sites to some extent, but I don't understand why they choose to overlook the juiciest targets.</sentencetext>
</comment>
<comment>
	<id>http://www.semanticweb.org/ontologies/ConversationInstances.owl#comment10_01_31_1545245.30972946</id>
	<title>Re:Indexing is not a crime</title>
	<author>iamhassi</author>
	<datestamp>1264971360000</datestamp>
	<modclass>Insightful</modclass>
	<modscore>5</modscore>
	<htmltext><i>"Newzbin should be found guilty of indexing"</i>
<br> <br>
Then I think <a href="http://www.google.com/search?q=\%22Windows+XP+Professional\%22+\%22Belarc+Advisor+Current+Profile\%22+key:" title="google.com">Google should be found guilty of indexing</a> [google.com].  After all that link provided me with thousands of valid Windows XP CD keys, and Google indexed those sites and provided me with the information, that's illegal, right?  <a href="http://it.slashdot.org/article.pl?sid=07/05/24/136207" title="slashdot.org">Oops, google just gave me valid credit card numbers!</a> [slashdot.org]
<br> <br>
When will Google and all the search engines of the world be brought up on charges and this madness end!?</htmltext>
<tokenext>" Newzbin should be found guilty of indexing " Then I think Google should be found guilty of indexing [ google.com ] .
After all that link provided me with thousands of valid Windows XP CD keys , and Google indexed those sites and provided me with the information , that 's illegal , right ?
Oops , google just gave me valid credit card numbers !
[ slashdot.org ] When will Google and all the search engines of the world be brought up on charges and this madness end !
?</tokentext>
<sentencetext>"Newzbin should be found guilty of indexing"
 
Then I think Google should be found guilty of indexing [google.com].
After all that link provided me with thousands of valid Windows XP CD keys, and Google indexed those sites and provided me with the information, that's illegal, right?
Oops, google just gave me valid credit card numbers!
[slashdot.org]
 
When will Google and all the search engines of the world be brought up on charges and this madness end!
?</sentencetext>
	<parent>http://www.semanticweb.org/ontologies/ConversationInstances.owl#comment10_01_31_1545245.30971340</parent>
</comment>
<comment>
	<id>http://www.semanticweb.org/ontologies/ConversationInstances.owl#comment10_01_31_1545245.30971568</id>
	<title>What</title>
	<author>Anonymous</author>
	<datestamp>1264963380000</datestamp>
	<modclass>Informativ</modclass>
	<modscore>5</modscore>
	<htmltext><p>There's an enormous difference between The Pirates Bay and newsbinz.</p><p>Newzbin just automatically trawls all the binary newsgroups and automatically creates and index of what it finds.  It's a common carrier, just like google.  The fact that the binary newgroups have an enormous amount of pirated content is no more the fault of newzbin than the fact that the internet is choc full of disturbing porn is the fault of google.</p><p>The Pirates Bay, OTOH, is a site where the admins deliberately remove pirated content that was mislabeled from the site.  This, as well as the site name, makes their database deliberately biased to help with piracy.  Maybe that is illegal and maybe it isn't, but the point is, what TPB does is different than what newzbin does.</p></htmltext>
<tokenext>There 's an enormous difference between The Pirates Bay and newsbinz.Newzbin just automatically trawls all the binary newsgroups and automatically creates and index of what it finds .
It 's a common carrier , just like google .
The fact that the binary newgroups have an enormous amount of pirated content is no more the fault of newzbin than the fact that the internet is choc full of disturbing porn is the fault of google.The Pirates Bay , OTOH , is a site where the admins deliberately remove pirated content that was mislabeled from the site .
This , as well as the site name , makes their database deliberately biased to help with piracy .
Maybe that is illegal and maybe it is n't , but the point is , what TPB does is different than what newzbin does .</tokentext>
<sentencetext>There's an enormous difference between The Pirates Bay and newsbinz.Newzbin just automatically trawls all the binary newsgroups and automatically creates and index of what it finds.
It's a common carrier, just like google.
The fact that the binary newgroups have an enormous amount of pirated content is no more the fault of newzbin than the fact that the internet is choc full of disturbing porn is the fault of google.The Pirates Bay, OTOH, is a site where the admins deliberately remove pirated content that was mislabeled from the site.
This, as well as the site name, makes their database deliberately biased to help with piracy.
Maybe that is illegal and maybe it isn't, but the point is, what TPB does is different than what newzbin does.</sentencetext>
</comment>
<comment>
	<id>http://www.semanticweb.org/ontologies/ConversationInstances.owl#comment10_01_31_1545245.30975252</id>
	<title>The presiding judge</title>
	<author>wiplash</author>
	<datestamp>1264941840000</datestamp>
	<modclass>None</modclass>
	<modscore>0</modscore>
	<htmltext>A tiny bit of interesting information that a quick bit of googling revealed about the presiding judge - Mr. Justice Kitchin<br> <br>
From <a href="http://www.thelawyer.com/judges-survey-judgment-day/122303.article" title="thelawyer.com" rel="nofollow">here</a> [thelawyer.com]:<br> <br>

<i>Mr Justice Kitchin - One of the newest justices, Kitchin J has made an immediate impact with his clear and thoughtful judgments on IP matters. One IP litigator describes him as "eminently sensible and a very nice bloke". His first year has seen only one judgment appealed, which was dismissed in the Court of Appeal. Most people who have had cases before Kitchin J have agreed he is "a star in the making".</i> <br> <br>

Seems he was also nominated to be a member of the Patents Court <i>[citation needed]</i>... so it appears he seems to have some prior experience and expertise in this particular area.</htmltext>
<tokenext>A tiny bit of interesting information that a quick bit of googling revealed about the presiding judge - Mr. Justice Kitchin From here [ thelawyer.com ] : Mr Justice Kitchin - One of the newest justices , Kitchin J has made an immediate impact with his clear and thoughtful judgments on IP matters .
One IP litigator describes him as " eminently sensible and a very nice bloke " .
His first year has seen only one judgment appealed , which was dismissed in the Court of Appeal .
Most people who have had cases before Kitchin J have agreed he is " a star in the making " .
Seems he was also nominated to be a member of the Patents Court [ citation needed ] ... so it appears he seems to have some prior experience and expertise in this particular area .</tokentext>
<sentencetext>A tiny bit of interesting information that a quick bit of googling revealed about the presiding judge - Mr. Justice Kitchin 
From here [thelawyer.com]: 

Mr Justice Kitchin - One of the newest justices, Kitchin J has made an immediate impact with his clear and thoughtful judgments on IP matters.
One IP litigator describes him as "eminently sensible and a very nice bloke".
His first year has seen only one judgment appealed, which was dismissed in the Court of Appeal.
Most people who have had cases before Kitchin J have agreed he is "a star in the making".
Seems he was also nominated to be a member of the Patents Court [citation needed]... so it appears he seems to have some prior experience and expertise in this particular area.</sentencetext>
</comment>
<comment>
	<id>http://www.semanticweb.org/ontologies/ConversationInstances.owl#comment10_01_31_1545245.30973762</id>
	<title>Re:Indexing is not a crime</title>
	<author>dissy</author>
	<datestamp>1264932720000</datestamp>
	<modclass>None</modclass>
	<modscore>1</modscore>
	<htmltext><p><div class="quote"><p>Newzbin should be found guilty of indexing</p></div><p>Fortunately for you, they are.  Indexing is exactly what they do.<br>Fortunately for everyone else, indexing is not a crime.</p><p>It's pretty much like saying both you and I are guilty of posting messages to slashdot.</p></div>
	</htmltext>
<tokenext>Newzbin should be found guilty of indexingFortunately for you , they are .
Indexing is exactly what they do.Fortunately for everyone else , indexing is not a crime.It 's pretty much like saying both you and I are guilty of posting messages to slashdot .</tokentext>
<sentencetext>Newzbin should be found guilty of indexingFortunately for you, they are.
Indexing is exactly what they do.Fortunately for everyone else, indexing is not a crime.It's pretty much like saying both you and I are guilty of posting messages to slashdot.
	</sentencetext>
	<parent>http://www.semanticweb.org/ontologies/ConversationInstances.owl#comment10_01_31_1545245.30971340</parent>
</comment>
<comment>
	<id>http://www.semanticweb.org/ontologies/ConversationInstances.owl#comment10_01_31_1545245.30982072</id>
	<title>Do it yourself</title>
	<author>Baki</author>
	<datestamp>1265043600000</datestamp>
	<modclass>None</modclass>
	<modscore>1</modscore>
	<htmltext><p>Is there any software available to do the indexing yourself? Just let it run every day on the groups you're interested in, feed it with the article lists posted since last time, and build the index yourself at home. That should be quite feasable. After a few months, you would have your private nzb index.</p></htmltext>
<tokenext>Is there any software available to do the indexing yourself ?
Just let it run every day on the groups you 're interested in , feed it with the article lists posted since last time , and build the index yourself at home .
That should be quite feasable .
After a few months , you would have your private nzb index .</tokentext>
<sentencetext>Is there any software available to do the indexing yourself?
Just let it run every day on the groups you're interested in, feed it with the article lists posted since last time, and build the index yourself at home.
That should be quite feasable.
After a few months, you would have your private nzb index.</sentencetext>
</comment>
<comment>
	<id>http://www.semanticweb.org/ontologies/ConversationInstances.owl#comment10_01_31_1545245.30974416</id>
	<title>Re:What</title>
	<author>Aladrin</author>
	<datestamp>1264936140000</datestamp>
	<modclass>None</modclass>
	<modscore>1</modscore>
	<htmltext><p>While Newzbin does do automatic indexing, it also does manual indexing using human 'editors'.  They are responsible for categorizing and labeling things.</p></htmltext>
<tokenext>While Newzbin does do automatic indexing , it also does manual indexing using human 'editors' .
They are responsible for categorizing and labeling things .</tokentext>
<sentencetext>While Newzbin does do automatic indexing, it also does manual indexing using human 'editors'.
They are responsible for categorizing and labeling things.</sentencetext>
	<parent>http://www.semanticweb.org/ontologies/ConversationInstances.owl#comment10_01_31_1545245.30971568</parent>
</comment>
<comment>
	<id>http://www.semanticweb.org/ontologies/ConversationInstances.owl#comment10_01_31_1545245.30977094</id>
	<title>Re:Why not "cyberlocker" sites?</title>
	<author>emkyooess</author>
	<datestamp>1264956840000</datestamp>
	<modclass>None</modclass>
	<modscore>0</modscore>
	<htmltext><p>I've honestly never used those sites for anything even approaching illegal or illicit.  However, few weeks go by that I don't use them for legitimate downloads.  Game mod teams often use them for their releases, for example.</p></htmltext>
<tokenext>I 've honestly never used those sites for anything even approaching illegal or illicit .
However , few weeks go by that I do n't use them for legitimate downloads .
Game mod teams often use them for their releases , for example .</tokentext>
<sentencetext>I've honestly never used those sites for anything even approaching illegal or illicit.
However, few weeks go by that I don't use them for legitimate downloads.
Game mod teams often use them for their releases, for example.</sentencetext>
	<parent>http://www.semanticweb.org/ontologies/ConversationInstances.owl#comment10_01_31_1545245.30971676</parent>
</comment>
<comment>
	<id>http://www.semanticweb.org/ontologies/ConversationInstances.owl#comment10_01_31_1545245.30971862</id>
	<title>Re:First rule of Usenet</title>
	<author>trum4n</author>
	<datestamp>1264965660000</datestamp>
	<modclass>None</modclass>
	<modscore>1</modscore>
	<htmltext>And the second one....</htmltext>
<tokenext>And the second one... .</tokentext>
<sentencetext>And the second one....</sentencetext>
	<parent>http://www.semanticweb.org/ontologies/ConversationInstances.owl#comment10_01_31_1545245.30971336</parent>
</comment>
<comment>
	<id>http://www.semanticweb.org/ontologies/ConversationInstances.owl#comment10_01_31_1545245.30972532</id>
	<title>Re:Never heard of newzbin.com before</title>
	<author>Anonymous</author>
	<datestamp>1264969140000</datestamp>
	<modclass>None</modclass>
	<modscore>0</modscore>
	<htmltext><p>Want an invite?</p></htmltext>
<tokenext>Want an invite ?</tokentext>
<sentencetext>Want an invite?</sentencetext>
	<parent>http://www.semanticweb.org/ontologies/ConversationInstances.owl#comment10_01_31_1545245.30971772</parent>
</comment>
<comment>
	<id>http://www.semanticweb.org/ontologies/ConversationInstances.owl#comment10_01_31_1545245.30971340</id>
	<title>Indexing is not a crime</title>
	<author>BadAnalogyGuy</author>
	<datestamp>1264961640000</datestamp>
	<modclass>Insightful</modclass>
	<modscore>2</modscore>
	<htmltext><p>When I was a kid I used to ride a Frankie Hill board to school everyday. We were big into the whole anti-establishment thing in those days, smoking dope after school and drinking until blitzed on the roof of my friend's house. And we always saw the harassment we got from cops for tearing up private property as something that ought to be changed. Skateboarding, as we used to say, is not a crime.</p><p>Nowadays, I'm a little wiser and a little more flush with cash. I can see now how the truck grinds and rail slides were tearing up the things we were essentially vandalizing. It's not something that I'm especially proud of, but I can't say I have any regrets. It's just something that we kids had to do to escape the overbearing oppression our middle class parents were putting on us.</p><p>Likewise, indexing newsgroups (and websites) is something that just happens. It's almost impossible to effectively know what is going through the pipes without going in and performing filtering explicitly. Newzbin should be found guilty of indexing, but we should all be defiantly flicking off the MPA and declaring that indexing is not a crime.</p></htmltext>
<tokenext>When I was a kid I used to ride a Frankie Hill board to school everyday .
We were big into the whole anti-establishment thing in those days , smoking dope after school and drinking until blitzed on the roof of my friend 's house .
And we always saw the harassment we got from cops for tearing up private property as something that ought to be changed .
Skateboarding , as we used to say , is not a crime.Nowadays , I 'm a little wiser and a little more flush with cash .
I can see now how the truck grinds and rail slides were tearing up the things we were essentially vandalizing .
It 's not something that I 'm especially proud of , but I ca n't say I have any regrets .
It 's just something that we kids had to do to escape the overbearing oppression our middle class parents were putting on us.Likewise , indexing newsgroups ( and websites ) is something that just happens .
It 's almost impossible to effectively know what is going through the pipes without going in and performing filtering explicitly .
Newzbin should be found guilty of indexing , but we should all be defiantly flicking off the MPA and declaring that indexing is not a crime .</tokentext>
<sentencetext>When I was a kid I used to ride a Frankie Hill board to school everyday.
We were big into the whole anti-establishment thing in those days, smoking dope after school and drinking until blitzed on the roof of my friend's house.
And we always saw the harassment we got from cops for tearing up private property as something that ought to be changed.
Skateboarding, as we used to say, is not a crime.Nowadays, I'm a little wiser and a little more flush with cash.
I can see now how the truck grinds and rail slides were tearing up the things we were essentially vandalizing.
It's not something that I'm especially proud of, but I can't say I have any regrets.
It's just something that we kids had to do to escape the overbearing oppression our middle class parents were putting on us.Likewise, indexing newsgroups (and websites) is something that just happens.
It's almost impossible to effectively know what is going through the pipes without going in and performing filtering explicitly.
Newzbin should be found guilty of indexing, but we should all be defiantly flicking off the MPA and declaring that indexing is not a crime.</sentencetext>
</comment>
<comment>
	<id>http://www.semanticweb.org/ontologies/ConversationInstances.owl#comment10_01_31_1545245.30972326</id>
	<title>Re:Indexing is not a crime</title>
	<author>SkyLeach</author>
	<datestamp>1264967880000</datestamp>
	<modclass>Insightful</modclass>
	<modscore>5</modscore>
	<htmltext><p>wait... wat?</p><p>"found guilty of indexing"!?!?</p><p>wtf does that mean exactly?  Guilty of writing a program to search data?  Guilty of writing a program to search data and then letting others view the results?</p><p>The only way that the MPAA/RIAA even know what is out there is by doing the same thing, the only difference being they aren't providing a service, they are angry about what they found.</p><p>What we find ourselves faced with is the guilt or innocence of someone writing software and then *giving away the software and/or the results of the software*.  If indexing is a crime, then it is only a very very small step to say that writing software that gives others access to "features" of their hardware that the manufacturer doesn't want to give access to is illegal.  After all, without VLC and mplayer it would be pretty easy for Quicktime/iTunes and Microsoft Media player to lock down the watching of illegal movies and listening of illegal music.</p><p>Keep walking down that path, and soon we loose all our digital freedoms...</p></htmltext>
<tokenext>wait.. .
wat ? " found guilty of indexing " ! ? !
? wtf does that mean exactly ?
Guilty of writing a program to search data ?
Guilty of writing a program to search data and then letting others view the results ? The only way that the MPAA/RIAA even know what is out there is by doing the same thing , the only difference being they are n't providing a service , they are angry about what they found.What we find ourselves faced with is the guilt or innocence of someone writing software and then * giving away the software and/or the results of the software * .
If indexing is a crime , then it is only a very very small step to say that writing software that gives others access to " features " of their hardware that the manufacturer does n't want to give access to is illegal .
After all , without VLC and mplayer it would be pretty easy for Quicktime/iTunes and Microsoft Media player to lock down the watching of illegal movies and listening of illegal music.Keep walking down that path , and soon we loose all our digital freedoms.. .</tokentext>
<sentencetext>wait...
wat?"found guilty of indexing"!?!
?wtf does that mean exactly?
Guilty of writing a program to search data?
Guilty of writing a program to search data and then letting others view the results?The only way that the MPAA/RIAA even know what is out there is by doing the same thing, the only difference being they aren't providing a service, they are angry about what they found.What we find ourselves faced with is the guilt or innocence of someone writing software and then *giving away the software and/or the results of the software*.
If indexing is a crime, then it is only a very very small step to say that writing software that gives others access to "features" of their hardware that the manufacturer doesn't want to give access to is illegal.
After all, without VLC and mplayer it would be pretty easy for Quicktime/iTunes and Microsoft Media player to lock down the watching of illegal movies and listening of illegal music.Keep walking down that path, and soon we loose all our digital freedoms...</sentencetext>
	<parent>http://www.semanticweb.org/ontologies/ConversationInstances.owl#comment10_01_31_1545245.30971340</parent>
</comment>
<comment>
	<id>http://www.semanticweb.org/ontologies/ConversationInstances.owl#comment10_01_31_1545245.30980252</id>
	<title>Re:Indexing is not a crime</title>
	<author>Anonymous</author>
	<datestamp>1265035860000</datestamp>
	<modclass>None</modclass>
	<modscore>0</modscore>
	<htmltext><blockquote><div><p>Keep walking down that path, and soon we loose all our digital freedoms...</p></div></blockquote><p>I say we loose them all!  Viva la revolucion!</p></div>
	</htmltext>
<tokenext>Keep walking down that path , and soon we loose all our digital freedoms...I say we loose them all !
Viva la revolucion !</tokentext>
<sentencetext>Keep walking down that path, and soon we loose all our digital freedoms...I say we loose them all!
Viva la revolucion!
	</sentencetext>
	<parent>http://www.semanticweb.org/ontologies/ConversationInstances.owl#comment10_01_31_1545245.30972326</parent>
</comment>
<comment>
	<id>http://www.semanticweb.org/ontologies/ConversationInstances.owl#comment10_01_31_1545245.30982106</id>
	<title>Re:Sigh</title>
	<author>Anonymous</author>
	<datestamp>1265043660000</datestamp>
	<modclass>None</modclass>
	<modscore>0</modscore>
	<htmltext><p>Who cares if it's easy?  Suing someone is a <i>far</i> more difficult process, and costs money. Removal requests are nearly free.</p></htmltext>
<tokenext>Who cares if it 's easy ?
Suing someone is a far more difficult process , and costs money .
Removal requests are nearly free .</tokentext>
<sentencetext>Who cares if it's easy?
Suing someone is a far more difficult process, and costs money.
Removal requests are nearly free.</sentencetext>
	<parent>http://www.semanticweb.org/ontologies/ConversationInstances.owl#comment10_01_31_1545245.30973302</parent>
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