<article>
	<id>http://www.semanticweb.org/ontologies/ConversationInstances.owl#article10_01_19_1653240</id>
	<title>Virtual Currency Becomes Real In South Korea</title>
	<author>Soulskill</author>
	<datestamp>1263925740000</datestamp>
	<htmltext>garylian writes <i>"Massively is reporting that the South Korean Supreme Court has stated that virtual currency is the equivalent of real-world money.  For those of you who might not be drawing the link, the core there is that selling in-game currency for real money is <a href="http://www.massively.com/2010/01/13/korea-rules-that-virtual-currencies-can-be-exchanged-for-real-mo/">essentially just an exchange of currency</a> and perfectly legal in South Korea. This could have sweeping implications for RMT operations the world over, not to mention free-to-play games and... well, online games in general.  The <a href="http://joongangdaily.joins.com/article/view.asp?aid=2915126">official story is available online</a> from JoongAng Daily."</i></htmltext>
<tokenext>garylian writes " Massively is reporting that the South Korean Supreme Court has stated that virtual currency is the equivalent of real-world money .
For those of you who might not be drawing the link , the core there is that selling in-game currency for real money is essentially just an exchange of currency and perfectly legal in South Korea .
This could have sweeping implications for RMT operations the world over , not to mention free-to-play games and... well , online games in general .
The official story is available online from JoongAng Daily .
"</tokentext>
<sentencetext>garylian writes "Massively is reporting that the South Korean Supreme Court has stated that virtual currency is the equivalent of real-world money.
For those of you who might not be drawing the link, the core there is that selling in-game currency for real money is essentially just an exchange of currency and perfectly legal in South Korea.
This could have sweeping implications for RMT operations the world over, not to mention free-to-play games and... well, online games in general.
The official story is available online from JoongAng Daily.
"</sentencetext>
</article>
<comment>
	<id>http://www.semanticweb.org/ontologies/ConversationInstances.owl#comment10_01_19_1653240.30823042</id>
	<title>Re:So that means WoW gold is legal tender?</title>
	<author>Anonymous</author>
	<datestamp>1263932160000</datestamp>
	<modclass>Insightful</modclass>
	<modscore>2</modscore>
	<htmltext>I think what we need here is a car analogy.  A Ford truck is not legal tender, however it has Real value.  This court decision just says that in game currency is like Ford trucks.  It has real value - it is not legal tender - but because it has value the law has a basis for decisions involving these properties.  So any transaction or theft involving in game 'currencies' is handled the same as transaction or theft involving Ford trucks.</htmltext>
<tokenext>I think what we need here is a car analogy .
A Ford truck is not legal tender , however it has Real value .
This court decision just says that in game currency is like Ford trucks .
It has real value - it is not legal tender - but because it has value the law has a basis for decisions involving these properties .
So any transaction or theft involving in game 'currencies ' is handled the same as transaction or theft involving Ford trucks .</tokentext>
<sentencetext>I think what we need here is a car analogy.
A Ford truck is not legal tender, however it has Real value.
This court decision just says that in game currency is like Ford trucks.
It has real value - it is not legal tender - but because it has value the law has a basis for decisions involving these properties.
So any transaction or theft involving in game 'currencies' is handled the same as transaction or theft involving Ford trucks.</sentencetext>
	<parent>http://www.semanticweb.org/ontologies/ConversationInstances.owl#comment10_01_19_1653240.30822482</parent>
</comment>
<comment>
	<id>http://www.semanticweb.org/ontologies/ConversationInstances.owl#comment10_01_19_1653240.30822438</id>
	<title>Re:Legal?</title>
	<author>zerosomething</author>
	<datestamp>1263930120000</datestamp>
	<modclass>Interestin</modclass>
	<modscore>2</modscore>
	<htmltext>Casinos do it all the time. Private currency isn't illegal</htmltext>
<tokenext>Casinos do it all the time .
Private currency is n't illegal</tokentext>
<sentencetext>Casinos do it all the time.
Private currency isn't illegal</sentencetext>
	<parent>http://www.semanticweb.org/ontologies/ConversationInstances.owl#comment10_01_19_1653240.30822326</parent>
</comment>
<comment>
	<id>http://www.semanticweb.org/ontologies/ConversationInstances.owl#comment10_01_19_1653240.30854114</id>
	<title>Mistaken currency concepts.</title>
	<author>Erick Lionheart</author>
	<datestamp>1264077960000</datestamp>
	<modclass>None</modclass>
	<modscore>1</modscore>
	<htmltext>Many posters rail at "virtual" currency and indicate it is bogus because you can't pay your taxes with WoW gold, or trade it on FOREX.
<br>
<br>
I would encourage those slashdotters to check up on Philippines Pesos, or even Chinese Yuan.

<br>
<br>
1) AFAIK You can't pay your taxes in any currency but the legal tender of said country (Euro is an official currency, but can't pay your US taxes with those)
<br>
2) You can't exchange certain country's currencies on the FOREX market. If you have Philippine Pesos, you can pretty much only exchange them for something else (including another currency) in the Philippines.
<br>

<br>
The only difference with most game currency is that those exchanges are not overseen by the "government" (game company), but done on a black market. If Blizz "prints" lots of money (or there is a dupe), value will go down fast. It's happened in many games. A sudden crackdown on gold farmers will drive currency value up. Same with a new expensive gold sink.
<br>
<br>

With your Chinese Yuan, you can get services in China only. With your WoW gold you can get services in WoW only. I'm pretty sure there's a market for wow gold in nearly every country out there. Likely easier to monetize that, if you really wanted to, than some leftover Chinese yuans you might find in a drawer...
<br>
<br>

There is well enough activity and services available in MMO's that a lot of those currencies have "real" value and something like an exchange rate. I don't see where the issue is with that though. When you've paid $10 to watch a movie in a theater, you only have the experience of it left afterwards. if you pay $10 to get some wow gold and get a flying mount, you get an experience as well.
<br>
<br>

Disclaimer: I own <a href="http://www.gamersloot.net/" title="gamersloot.net" rel="nofollow">http://www.gamersloot.net/</a> [gamersloot.net] and we -used- to offer in-game gold/services a long while back (now mostly just cd-keys)</htmltext>
<tokenext>Many posters rail at " virtual " currency and indicate it is bogus because you ca n't pay your taxes with WoW gold , or trade it on FOREX .
I would encourage those slashdotters to check up on Philippines Pesos , or even Chinese Yuan .
1 ) AFAIK You ca n't pay your taxes in any currency but the legal tender of said country ( Euro is an official currency , but ca n't pay your US taxes with those ) 2 ) You ca n't exchange certain country 's currencies on the FOREX market .
If you have Philippine Pesos , you can pretty much only exchange them for something else ( including another currency ) in the Philippines .
The only difference with most game currency is that those exchanges are not overseen by the " government " ( game company ) , but done on a black market .
If Blizz " prints " lots of money ( or there is a dupe ) , value will go down fast .
It 's happened in many games .
A sudden crackdown on gold farmers will drive currency value up .
Same with a new expensive gold sink .
With your Chinese Yuan , you can get services in China only .
With your WoW gold you can get services in WoW only .
I 'm pretty sure there 's a market for wow gold in nearly every country out there .
Likely easier to monetize that , if you really wanted to , than some leftover Chinese yuans you might find in a drawer.. . There is well enough activity and services available in MMO 's that a lot of those currencies have " real " value and something like an exchange rate .
I do n't see where the issue is with that though .
When you 've paid $ 10 to watch a movie in a theater , you only have the experience of it left afterwards .
if you pay $ 10 to get some wow gold and get a flying mount , you get an experience as well .
Disclaimer : I own http : //www.gamersloot.net/ [ gamersloot.net ] and we -used- to offer in-game gold/services a long while back ( now mostly just cd-keys )</tokentext>
<sentencetext>Many posters rail at "virtual" currency and indicate it is bogus because you can't pay your taxes with WoW gold, or trade it on FOREX.
I would encourage those slashdotters to check up on Philippines Pesos, or even Chinese Yuan.
1) AFAIK You can't pay your taxes in any currency but the legal tender of said country (Euro is an official currency, but can't pay your US taxes with those)

2) You can't exchange certain country's currencies on the FOREX market.
If you have Philippine Pesos, you can pretty much only exchange them for something else (including another currency) in the Philippines.
The only difference with most game currency is that those exchanges are not overseen by the "government" (game company), but done on a black market.
If Blizz "prints" lots of money (or there is a dupe), value will go down fast.
It's happened in many games.
A sudden crackdown on gold farmers will drive currency value up.
Same with a new expensive gold sink.
With your Chinese Yuan, you can get services in China only.
With your WoW gold you can get services in WoW only.
I'm pretty sure there's a market for wow gold in nearly every country out there.
Likely easier to monetize that, if you really wanted to, than some leftover Chinese yuans you might find in a drawer...



There is well enough activity and services available in MMO's that a lot of those currencies have "real" value and something like an exchange rate.
I don't see where the issue is with that though.
When you've paid $10 to watch a movie in a theater, you only have the experience of it left afterwards.
if you pay $10 to get some wow gold and get a flying mount, you get an experience as well.
Disclaimer: I own http://www.gamersloot.net/ [gamersloot.net] and we -used- to offer in-game gold/services a long while back (now mostly just cd-keys)</sentencetext>
</comment>
<comment>
	<id>http://www.semanticweb.org/ontologies/ConversationInstances.owl#comment10_01_19_1653240.30825870</id>
	<title>Re:The real reason</title>
	<author>Anonymous</author>
	<datestamp>1263901620000</datestamp>
	<modclass>None</modclass>
	<modscore>0</modscore>
	<htmltext><p>shut up, nerd. i'll sell whatever virtual money i want WITHOUT tax. do something.</p></htmltext>
<tokenext>shut up , nerd .
i 'll sell whatever virtual money i want WITHOUT tax .
do something .</tokentext>
<sentencetext>shut up, nerd.
i'll sell whatever virtual money i want WITHOUT tax.
do something.</sentencetext>
	<parent>http://www.semanticweb.org/ontologies/ConversationInstances.owl#comment10_01_19_1653240.30822718</parent>
</comment>
<comment>
	<id>http://www.semanticweb.org/ontologies/ConversationInstances.owl#comment10_01_19_1653240.30822494</id>
	<title>Re:Legal?</title>
	<author>suso</author>
	<datestamp>1263930300000</datestamp>
	<modclass>None</modclass>
	<modscore>1</modscore>
	<htmltext><p>There are a variety of regional currencies in the U.S. that are usually part of local economic interests.  I think there is some clause that allows them. There is an article for it on wikipedia somewhere.</p></htmltext>
<tokenext>There are a variety of regional currencies in the U.S. that are usually part of local economic interests .
I think there is some clause that allows them .
There is an article for it on wikipedia somewhere .</tokentext>
<sentencetext>There are a variety of regional currencies in the U.S. that are usually part of local economic interests.
I think there is some clause that allows them.
There is an article for it on wikipedia somewhere.</sentencetext>
	<parent>http://www.semanticweb.org/ontologies/ConversationInstances.owl#comment10_01_19_1653240.30822326</parent>
</comment>
<comment>
	<id>http://www.semanticweb.org/ontologies/ConversationInstances.owl#comment10_01_19_1653240.30822564</id>
	<title>Clueless gamer blog gets it wrong</title>
	<author>Animats</author>
	<datestamp>1263930480000</datestamp>
	<modclass>Informativ</modclass>
	<modscore>5</modscore>
	<htmltext><p>
The gamer blog has it wrong, the article poster didn't help, and the Slashdot "editors" blew it as usual.
Read the <a href="http://joongangdaily.joins.com/article/view.asp?aid=2915126" title="joins.com">article in JoongAng Daily</a> [joins.com] (which they offer in English).  The key issue here is that online gambling is illegal in Korea, and two game players were charged criminally for making money from an online game.  The Supreme Court of Korea ruled that they were not gambling, so they don't get fined.
</p><p>
This decision doesn't affect relationships between players and game operators.  It's not about EULA enforceability or property rights.  It's a criminal law issue.  If you trade game currency, you're not going to be fined or go to jail in Korea.  Whether a game site can ban you is a separate issue.</p></htmltext>
<tokenext>The gamer blog has it wrong , the article poster did n't help , and the Slashdot " editors " blew it as usual .
Read the article in JoongAng Daily [ joins.com ] ( which they offer in English ) .
The key issue here is that online gambling is illegal in Korea , and two game players were charged criminally for making money from an online game .
The Supreme Court of Korea ruled that they were not gambling , so they do n't get fined .
This decision does n't affect relationships between players and game operators .
It 's not about EULA enforceability or property rights .
It 's a criminal law issue .
If you trade game currency , you 're not going to be fined or go to jail in Korea .
Whether a game site can ban you is a separate issue .</tokentext>
<sentencetext>
The gamer blog has it wrong, the article poster didn't help, and the Slashdot "editors" blew it as usual.
Read the article in JoongAng Daily [joins.com] (which they offer in English).
The key issue here is that online gambling is illegal in Korea, and two game players were charged criminally for making money from an online game.
The Supreme Court of Korea ruled that they were not gambling, so they don't get fined.
This decision doesn't affect relationships between players and game operators.
It's not about EULA enforceability or property rights.
It's a criminal law issue.
If you trade game currency, you're not going to be fined or go to jail in Korea.
Whether a game site can ban you is a separate issue.</sentencetext>
</comment>
<comment>
	<id>http://www.semanticweb.org/ontologies/ConversationInstances.owl#comment10_01_19_1653240.30822756</id>
	<title>Re:What implications will this have for the Won?</title>
	<author>DeadPixels</author>
	<datestamp>1263931140000</datestamp>
	<modclass>None</modclass>
	<modscore>1</modscore>
	<htmltext>The only way I could see this having an impact was if a game developer decided to purposely screw with the in-game economy by causing massive inflation or something similar, and this would probably only impact the Won if it was a game that had enough people trading or paying "Real Money" for the virtual currency. <br> <br>If you manage to somehow obtain 500 million in virtual currency, you could theoretically sell it all to customers. However, that's no different than what the company that makes the game is doing, and they're not causing the Won to devalue.<br> <br>Plus, even if someone does make money off of the sale of virtual currency, they're still getting it in Won and then they're likely spending that Won in South Korea, but now on non-virtual products and services.<br> <br>I still think it's a little silly to pay money for virtual currency, but whatever floats your boat, I guess.</htmltext>
<tokenext>The only way I could see this having an impact was if a game developer decided to purposely screw with the in-game economy by causing massive inflation or something similar , and this would probably only impact the Won if it was a game that had enough people trading or paying " Real Money " for the virtual currency .
If you manage to somehow obtain 500 million in virtual currency , you could theoretically sell it all to customers .
However , that 's no different than what the company that makes the game is doing , and they 're not causing the Won to devalue .
Plus , even if someone does make money off of the sale of virtual currency , they 're still getting it in Won and then they 're likely spending that Won in South Korea , but now on non-virtual products and services .
I still think it 's a little silly to pay money for virtual currency , but whatever floats your boat , I guess .</tokentext>
<sentencetext>The only way I could see this having an impact was if a game developer decided to purposely screw with the in-game economy by causing massive inflation or something similar, and this would probably only impact the Won if it was a game that had enough people trading or paying "Real Money" for the virtual currency.
If you manage to somehow obtain 500 million in virtual currency, you could theoretically sell it all to customers.
However, that's no different than what the company that makes the game is doing, and they're not causing the Won to devalue.
Plus, even if someone does make money off of the sale of virtual currency, they're still getting it in Won and then they're likely spending that Won in South Korea, but now on non-virtual products and services.
I still think it's a little silly to pay money for virtual currency, but whatever floats your boat, I guess.</sentencetext>
	<parent>http://www.semanticweb.org/ontologies/ConversationInstances.owl#comment10_01_19_1653240.30822348</parent>
</comment>
<comment>
	<id>http://www.semanticweb.org/ontologies/ConversationInstances.owl#comment10_01_19_1653240.30822654</id>
	<title>Re:The real reason</title>
	<author>Anonymous</author>
	<datestamp>1263930780000</datestamp>
	<modclass>Interestin</modclass>
	<modscore>3</modscore>
	<htmltext>Also, doesn't converting other currencies to virtual currency cause a duplication of the money? I mean, you give the company your Korean won and they have to make you some cash.

Well, unless they move the money to you from a virtual vault they own, and to have such a thing they'd have to change the whole system.</htmltext>
<tokenext>Also , does n't converting other currencies to virtual currency cause a duplication of the money ?
I mean , you give the company your Korean won and they have to make you some cash .
Well , unless they move the money to you from a virtual vault they own , and to have such a thing they 'd have to change the whole system .</tokentext>
<sentencetext>Also, doesn't converting other currencies to virtual currency cause a duplication of the money?
I mean, you give the company your Korean won and they have to make you some cash.
Well, unless they move the money to you from a virtual vault they own, and to have such a thing they'd have to change the whole system.</sentencetext>
	<parent>http://www.semanticweb.org/ontologies/ConversationInstances.owl#comment10_01_19_1653240.30822238</parent>
</comment>
<comment>
	<id>http://www.semanticweb.org/ontologies/ConversationInstances.owl#comment10_01_19_1653240.30826346</id>
	<title>Re:Not really surprising</title>
	<author>Anonymous</author>
	<datestamp>1263904260000</datestamp>
	<modclass>None</modclass>
	<modscore>0</modscore>
	<htmltext><p>Didn't you just enumerate some of the intrinsic values of gold, thus rendering your final sentence ludicrous?<br>And wouldn't the intrinsic value of money be its use in trade?</p><p>I believe what's being referred to here is an eternal value, a "standard" value, if you will. Clearly the worth of money is and always has been an illusion - but it's certainly a very useful illusion.</p></htmltext>
<tokenext>Did n't you just enumerate some of the intrinsic values of gold , thus rendering your final sentence ludicrous ? And would n't the intrinsic value of money be its use in trade ? I believe what 's being referred to here is an eternal value , a " standard " value , if you will .
Clearly the worth of money is and always has been an illusion - but it 's certainly a very useful illusion .</tokentext>
<sentencetext>Didn't you just enumerate some of the intrinsic values of gold, thus rendering your final sentence ludicrous?And wouldn't the intrinsic value of money be its use in trade?I believe what's being referred to here is an eternal value, a "standard" value, if you will.
Clearly the worth of money is and always has been an illusion - but it's certainly a very useful illusion.</sentencetext>
	<parent>http://www.semanticweb.org/ontologies/ConversationInstances.owl#comment10_01_19_1653240.30823008</parent>
</comment>
<comment>
	<id>http://www.semanticweb.org/ontologies/ConversationInstances.owl#comment10_01_19_1653240.30823612</id>
	<title>Re:Guaranteed by Whom?</title>
	<author>Anonymous</author>
	<datestamp>1263934620000</datestamp>
	<modclass>None</modclass>
	<modscore>0</modscore>
	<htmltext><p><div class="quote"><p>Virtual currency is just 1's and 0's on a computer (our real currency is more like that now than it ever was). How easy would it be to create the equivalent of glass beads in our virtual wampum on-line society?</p></div><p>If you create a lot of virtual glass beads and then try to exchange them for real-world currency, you end up with a supply-demand problem.  Right now, that is essentially an unregulated retail market: gold farmers post whatever price they're willing to sell gold, and gold buyers either accept or reject the price.  In that market, if a gold farmer find an exploit or other means of printing virtual glass beads, he can convert them to real-world cash wherever his monopoly will allow.  By declaring that this virtual currency purchase is essentially identical to currency exchange, SK transfers it from a retail, bubble-gum-like market to a regulated, public, exchange-based market.  That means trades will be bid &amp; negotiated, with the results posted publicly, and there will be much more dynamic competition between both gold-sellers and gold-buyers.  In that case, finding an exploit to make free gold would rapidly crush the market and make said effortless currency worthless.  Same as the US printing dollars to pay off its debts.</p><p>Presumably, it means there will be a WoW-Gold:SKW entry added to all the forex markets.  It is to laugh.</p></div>
	</htmltext>
<tokenext>Virtual currency is just 1 's and 0 's on a computer ( our real currency is more like that now than it ever was ) .
How easy would it be to create the equivalent of glass beads in our virtual wampum on-line society ? If you create a lot of virtual glass beads and then try to exchange them for real-world currency , you end up with a supply-demand problem .
Right now , that is essentially an unregulated retail market : gold farmers post whatever price they 're willing to sell gold , and gold buyers either accept or reject the price .
In that market , if a gold farmer find an exploit or other means of printing virtual glass beads , he can convert them to real-world cash wherever his monopoly will allow .
By declaring that this virtual currency purchase is essentially identical to currency exchange , SK transfers it from a retail , bubble-gum-like market to a regulated , public , exchange-based market .
That means trades will be bid &amp; negotiated , with the results posted publicly , and there will be much more dynamic competition between both gold-sellers and gold-buyers .
In that case , finding an exploit to make free gold would rapidly crush the market and make said effortless currency worthless .
Same as the US printing dollars to pay off its debts.Presumably , it means there will be a WoW-Gold : SKW entry added to all the forex markets .
It is to laugh .</tokentext>
<sentencetext>Virtual currency is just 1's and 0's on a computer (our real currency is more like that now than it ever was).
How easy would it be to create the equivalent of glass beads in our virtual wampum on-line society?If you create a lot of virtual glass beads and then try to exchange them for real-world currency, you end up with a supply-demand problem.
Right now, that is essentially an unregulated retail market: gold farmers post whatever price they're willing to sell gold, and gold buyers either accept or reject the price.
In that market, if a gold farmer find an exploit or other means of printing virtual glass beads, he can convert them to real-world cash wherever his monopoly will allow.
By declaring that this virtual currency purchase is essentially identical to currency exchange, SK transfers it from a retail, bubble-gum-like market to a regulated, public, exchange-based market.
That means trades will be bid &amp; negotiated, with the results posted publicly, and there will be much more dynamic competition between both gold-sellers and gold-buyers.
In that case, finding an exploit to make free gold would rapidly crush the market and make said effortless currency worthless.
Same as the US printing dollars to pay off its debts.Presumably, it means there will be a WoW-Gold:SKW entry added to all the forex markets.
It is to laugh.
	</sentencetext>
	<parent>http://www.semanticweb.org/ontologies/ConversationInstances.owl#comment10_01_19_1653240.30822474</parent>
</comment>
<comment>
	<id>http://www.semanticweb.org/ontologies/ConversationInstances.owl#comment10_01_19_1653240.30824456</id>
	<title>Re:Not really surprising</title>
	<author>multipart/mixed</author>
	<datestamp>1263895380000</datestamp>
	<modclass>None</modclass>
	<modscore>1</modscore>
	<htmltext><p>&gt; Neither does real gold, unless you happen to need to make really<br>&gt; really thin wires, or build something which is extremely reflective,<br>&gt; or actually make use of gold's natural properties in some other way.</p><p>I can cover regular connectors with very thin layers of gold, and sell them to audiophiles for significantly more than the original cost of the connectors and the gold-plating process.</p><p>Also, I can put a piece of carbon into a band of gold and give it to a female, in exchange for several months of sex. The carbon, without the gold, would only yield a few days of sex.</p><p>Therefore, gold has a very high intrinsic value.</p></htmltext>
<tokenext>&gt; Neither does real gold , unless you happen to need to make really &gt; really thin wires , or build something which is extremely reflective , &gt; or actually make use of gold 's natural properties in some other way.I can cover regular connectors with very thin layers of gold , and sell them to audiophiles for significantly more than the original cost of the connectors and the gold-plating process.Also , I can put a piece of carbon into a band of gold and give it to a female , in exchange for several months of sex .
The carbon , without the gold , would only yield a few days of sex.Therefore , gold has a very high intrinsic value .</tokentext>
<sentencetext>&gt; Neither does real gold, unless you happen to need to make really&gt; really thin wires, or build something which is extremely reflective,&gt; or actually make use of gold's natural properties in some other way.I can cover regular connectors with very thin layers of gold, and sell them to audiophiles for significantly more than the original cost of the connectors and the gold-plating process.Also, I can put a piece of carbon into a band of gold and give it to a female, in exchange for several months of sex.
The carbon, without the gold, would only yield a few days of sex.Therefore, gold has a very high intrinsic value.</sentencetext>
	<parent>http://www.semanticweb.org/ontologies/ConversationInstances.owl#comment10_01_19_1653240.30823008</parent>
</comment>
<comment>
	<id>http://www.semanticweb.org/ontologies/ConversationInstances.owl#comment10_01_19_1653240.30822484</id>
	<title>Pay up</title>
	<author>G2GAlone</author>
	<datestamp>1263930240000</datestamp>
	<modclass>None</modclass>
	<modscore>1</modscore>
	<htmltext>South Korea is going to have to pay for this mistake...</htmltext>
<tokenext>South Korea is going to have to pay for this mistake.. .</tokentext>
<sentencetext>South Korea is going to have to pay for this mistake...</sentencetext>
</comment>
<comment>
	<id>http://www.semanticweb.org/ontologies/ConversationInstances.owl#comment10_01_19_1653240.30822238</id>
	<title>The real reason</title>
	<author>Anonymous</author>
	<datestamp>1263929460000</datestamp>
	<modclass>Insightful</modclass>
	<modscore>4</modscore>
	<htmltext><p>It's lucrative for the government to say that. After all, now they can add tax between exchanges, in top of the service costs too.</p></htmltext>
<tokenext>It 's lucrative for the government to say that .
After all , now they can add tax between exchanges , in top of the service costs too .</tokentext>
<sentencetext>It's lucrative for the government to say that.
After all, now they can add tax between exchanges, in top of the service costs too.</sentencetext>
</comment>
<comment>
	<id>http://www.semanticweb.org/ontologies/ConversationInstances.owl#comment10_01_19_1653240.30827946</id>
	<title>Re:The real reason</title>
	<author>Ihmhi</author>
	<datestamp>1263918240000</datestamp>
	<modclass>None</modclass>
	<modscore>1</modscore>
	<htmltext><p>We have plenty of virtual currency floating around out there without even talking about games. See things like <a href="http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Bank\_run" title="wikipedia.org">bank runs</a> [wikipedia.org].</p><p>For instance, I don't believe any bank anywhere has the cash on hand for all its customers. Casinos aren't required to have enough money to cover all of the chips they have on the floor.</p></htmltext>
<tokenext>We have plenty of virtual currency floating around out there without even talking about games .
See things like bank runs [ wikipedia.org ] .For instance , I do n't believe any bank anywhere has the cash on hand for all its customers .
Casinos are n't required to have enough money to cover all of the chips they have on the floor .</tokentext>
<sentencetext>We have plenty of virtual currency floating around out there without even talking about games.
See things like bank runs [wikipedia.org].For instance, I don't believe any bank anywhere has the cash on hand for all its customers.
Casinos aren't required to have enough money to cover all of the chips they have on the floor.</sentencetext>
	<parent>http://www.semanticweb.org/ontologies/ConversationInstances.owl#comment10_01_19_1653240.30822654</parent>
</comment>
<comment>
	<id>http://www.semanticweb.org/ontologies/ConversationInstances.owl#comment10_01_19_1653240.30823098</id>
	<title>Re:Legal?</title>
	<author>JonStewartMill</author>
	<datestamp>1263932340000</datestamp>
	<modclass>None</modclass>
	<modscore>1</modscore>
	<htmltext>FWIW, I think I read something about it in a Wikipedia article on the Tenth Amendment to the US Constitution.</htmltext>
<tokenext>FWIW , I think I read something about it in a Wikipedia article on the Tenth Amendment to the US Constitution .</tokentext>
<sentencetext>FWIW, I think I read something about it in a Wikipedia article on the Tenth Amendment to the US Constitution.</sentencetext>
	<parent>http://www.semanticweb.org/ontologies/ConversationInstances.owl#comment10_01_19_1653240.30822494</parent>
</comment>
<comment>
	<id>http://www.semanticweb.org/ontologies/ConversationInstances.owl#comment10_01_19_1653240.30825426</id>
	<title>Re:Not really surprising</title>
	<author>Anonymous</author>
	<datestamp>1263899640000</datestamp>
	<modclass>None</modclass>
	<modscore>0</modscore>
	<htmltext><p>I could be wrong but it seems like you just listed a bunch of gold's intrinsic values (especially the "natural properties" one).</p></htmltext>
<tokenext>I could be wrong but it seems like you just listed a bunch of gold 's intrinsic values ( especially the " natural properties " one ) .</tokentext>
<sentencetext>I could be wrong but it seems like you just listed a bunch of gold's intrinsic values (especially the "natural properties" one).</sentencetext>
	<parent>http://www.semanticweb.org/ontologies/ConversationInstances.owl#comment10_01_19_1653240.30823008</parent>
</comment>
<comment>
	<id>http://www.semanticweb.org/ontologies/ConversationInstances.owl#comment10_01_19_1653240.30826952</id>
	<title>Re:So that means WoW gold is legal tender?</title>
	<author>shutdown -p now</author>
	<datestamp>1263908520000</datestamp>
	<modclass>None</modclass>
	<modscore>1</modscore>
	<htmltext><p>Real money != legal tender.</p><p>If I come from US to Canada with a stack of greenbacks in my pocket, that's "real money", and will be counted whenever anyone assesses how much I own, for any legal purpose. If I have a friend mail me more bucks, that will be income, and it will be taxed as such in Canada. However, I won't be able to use those bucks to pay my debts in Canada (unless the creditor voluntarily agrees to accept them - whereas with Canadian dollars, he wouldn't have a choice to refuse).</p></htmltext>
<tokenext>Real money ! = legal tender.If I come from US to Canada with a stack of greenbacks in my pocket , that 's " real money " , and will be counted whenever anyone assesses how much I own , for any legal purpose .
If I have a friend mail me more bucks , that will be income , and it will be taxed as such in Canada .
However , I wo n't be able to use those bucks to pay my debts in Canada ( unless the creditor voluntarily agrees to accept them - whereas with Canadian dollars , he would n't have a choice to refuse ) .</tokentext>
<sentencetext>Real money != legal tender.If I come from US to Canada with a stack of greenbacks in my pocket, that's "real money", and will be counted whenever anyone assesses how much I own, for any legal purpose.
If I have a friend mail me more bucks, that will be income, and it will be taxed as such in Canada.
However, I won't be able to use those bucks to pay my debts in Canada (unless the creditor voluntarily agrees to accept them - whereas with Canadian dollars, he wouldn't have a choice to refuse).</sentencetext>
	<parent>http://www.semanticweb.org/ontologies/ConversationInstances.owl#comment10_01_19_1653240.30822482</parent>
</comment>
<comment>
	<id>http://www.semanticweb.org/ontologies/ConversationInstances.owl#comment10_01_19_1653240.30823630</id>
	<title>Let's launder money</title>
	<author>Yuioup</author>
	<datestamp>1263934680000</datestamp>
	<modclass>None</modclass>
	<modscore>1</modscore>
	<htmltext><p>INSERT INTO Wallet (amount) VALUES (1000000000.00)<br>GO</p><p>UPDATE Player SET Status = ReallyRich<br>GO</p></htmltext>
<tokenext>INSERT INTO Wallet ( amount ) VALUES ( 1000000000.00 ) GOUPDATE Player SET Status = ReallyRichGO</tokentext>
<sentencetext>INSERT INTO Wallet (amount) VALUES (1000000000.00)GOUPDATE Player SET Status = ReallyRichGO</sentencetext>
</comment>
<comment>
	<id>http://www.semanticweb.org/ontologies/ConversationInstances.owl#comment10_01_19_1653240.30824518</id>
	<title>Re:Legal?</title>
	<author>Nadaka</author>
	<datestamp>1263895680000</datestamp>
	<modclass>None</modclass>
	<modscore>1</modscore>
	<htmltext><p>So if in game currency is now legal currency... Does that mean that a game company can generate billions of dollars of cash and exchange it for the real thing?</p></htmltext>
<tokenext>So if in game currency is now legal currency... Does that mean that a game company can generate billions of dollars of cash and exchange it for the real thing ?</tokentext>
<sentencetext>So if in game currency is now legal currency... Does that mean that a game company can generate billions of dollars of cash and exchange it for the real thing?</sentencetext>
	<parent>http://www.semanticweb.org/ontologies/ConversationInstances.owl#comment10_01_19_1653240.30822326</parent>
</comment>
<comment>
	<id>http://www.semanticweb.org/ontologies/ConversationInstances.owl#comment10_01_19_1653240.30822426</id>
	<title>Re:The real reason</title>
	<author>tacarat</author>
	<datestamp>1263930120000</datestamp>
	<modclass>Interestin</modclass>
	<modscore>2</modscore>
	<htmltext>Yep.  Considering that they've been taxing game transactions transparently for years, I guess this is just catching up.<br> <br>

What?  They haven't?  Old school arcade players bought additional health in Gauntlet.  The tax was rolled into the $0.25 purchase price.  Continues (which are basically extra lives in a game) are the same thing.  I'm sure there are other examples, but the taxman getting a cut on such "microtransactions" is nothing new.  They just needed a way to do it with some of the newer setups.<br> <br>

Granted, now the problem is that this may have negative ramifications for the games due to the higher level of multiplayer interaction.  Would duping become a crime equivalent to counterfeiting and thus carry big jail time?</htmltext>
<tokenext>Yep .
Considering that they 've been taxing game transactions transparently for years , I guess this is just catching up .
What ? They have n't ?
Old school arcade players bought additional health in Gauntlet .
The tax was rolled into the $ 0.25 purchase price .
Continues ( which are basically extra lives in a game ) are the same thing .
I 'm sure there are other examples , but the taxman getting a cut on such " microtransactions " is nothing new .
They just needed a way to do it with some of the newer setups .
Granted , now the problem is that this may have negative ramifications for the games due to the higher level of multiplayer interaction .
Would duping become a crime equivalent to counterfeiting and thus carry big jail time ?</tokentext>
<sentencetext>Yep.
Considering that they've been taxing game transactions transparently for years, I guess this is just catching up.
What?  They haven't?
Old school arcade players bought additional health in Gauntlet.
The tax was rolled into the $0.25 purchase price.
Continues (which are basically extra lives in a game) are the same thing.
I'm sure there are other examples, but the taxman getting a cut on such "microtransactions" is nothing new.
They just needed a way to do it with some of the newer setups.
Granted, now the problem is that this may have negative ramifications for the games due to the higher level of multiplayer interaction.
Would duping become a crime equivalent to counterfeiting and thus carry big jail time?</sentencetext>
	<parent>http://www.semanticweb.org/ontologies/ConversationInstances.owl#comment10_01_19_1653240.30822238</parent>
</comment>
<comment>
	<id>http://www.semanticweb.org/ontologies/ConversationInstances.owl#comment10_01_19_1653240.30822718</id>
	<title>Re:The real reason</title>
	<author>hey!</author>
	<datestamp>1263930960000</datestamp>
	<modclass>Insightful</modclass>
	<modscore>3</modscore>
	<htmltext><p>It's not the *government* saying that. It's the courts.</p><p>I have serious doubts about the article summary and title here.  Reading the article behind the article, it seems that the courts haven't ruled that in game money is "real", otherwise they'd be taxing in-game transactions.   It's just saying that in-game money can be sold.</p><p>It seems reasonable that they should treat the sale of in game things (currency or objects) like any other kind of sale of any other kind of property. Why should you be able to earn in-game money and sell it without tax, while somebody selling the fruits of his labor in something else has to pay tax? Or vice versa?</p></htmltext>
<tokenext>It 's not the * government * saying that .
It 's the courts.I have serious doubts about the article summary and title here .
Reading the article behind the article , it seems that the courts have n't ruled that in game money is " real " , otherwise they 'd be taxing in-game transactions .
It 's just saying that in-game money can be sold.It seems reasonable that they should treat the sale of in game things ( currency or objects ) like any other kind of sale of any other kind of property .
Why should you be able to earn in-game money and sell it without tax , while somebody selling the fruits of his labor in something else has to pay tax ?
Or vice versa ?</tokentext>
<sentencetext>It's not the *government* saying that.
It's the courts.I have serious doubts about the article summary and title here.
Reading the article behind the article, it seems that the courts haven't ruled that in game money is "real", otherwise they'd be taxing in-game transactions.
It's just saying that in-game money can be sold.It seems reasonable that they should treat the sale of in game things (currency or objects) like any other kind of sale of any other kind of property.
Why should you be able to earn in-game money and sell it without tax, while somebody selling the fruits of his labor in something else has to pay tax?
Or vice versa?</sentencetext>
	<parent>http://www.semanticweb.org/ontologies/ConversationInstances.owl#comment10_01_19_1653240.30822238</parent>
</comment>
<comment>
	<id>http://www.semanticweb.org/ontologies/ConversationInstances.owl#comment10_01_19_1653240.30824716</id>
	<title>Re:Whats the diff?</title>
	<author>ArbitraryDescriptor</author>
	<datestamp>1263896760000</datestamp>
	<modclass>None</modclass>
	<modscore>1</modscore>
	<htmltext>I don't think this case means what you (or TFS) think it means.  I can't read the massively article  at work, but the JoongAng article just seems to suggest these guys ran afoul of some regulation meant to prevent exchanging real money via on-line gambling and they were to be fined 8 million won as a result.  The judge ruled that, because the game in question was skill based (not luck based), it was not gambling, and they were acquitted.  <br> <br>Acquitted of what, I don't know.  The article was kind of vague on that.</htmltext>
<tokenext>I do n't think this case means what you ( or TFS ) think it means .
I ca n't read the massively article at work , but the JoongAng article just seems to suggest these guys ran afoul of some regulation meant to prevent exchanging real money via on-line gambling and they were to be fined 8 million won as a result .
The judge ruled that , because the game in question was skill based ( not luck based ) , it was not gambling , and they were acquitted .
Acquitted of what , I do n't know .
The article was kind of vague on that .</tokentext>
<sentencetext>I don't think this case means what you (or TFS) think it means.
I can't read the massively article  at work, but the JoongAng article just seems to suggest these guys ran afoul of some regulation meant to prevent exchanging real money via on-line gambling and they were to be fined 8 million won as a result.
The judge ruled that, because the game in question was skill based (not luck based), it was not gambling, and they were acquitted.
Acquitted of what, I don't know.
The article was kind of vague on that.</sentencetext>
	<parent>http://www.semanticweb.org/ontologies/ConversationInstances.owl#comment10_01_19_1653240.30822332</parent>
</comment>
<comment>
	<id>http://www.semanticweb.org/ontologies/ConversationInstances.owl#comment10_01_19_1653240.30823850</id>
	<title>sounds like another case of..</title>
	<author>Anonymous</author>
	<datestamp>1263892440000</datestamp>
	<modclass>None</modclass>
	<modscore>0</modscore>
	<htmltext><p>Koreans trying to be clever but not very..it could create a credit bubble, whereby many people are caught holding aden and other in-game currency.<br>If Lineage suddenly went out of fashion or another game swept in and became very popular, you'd have a lot of people rushing to sell in-game currency in general, which could even have economic knock-on effects, particularly mp3 players and hand-held gadgets that are popular amongst mmorpg players.</p></htmltext>
<tokenext>Koreans trying to be clever but not very..it could create a credit bubble , whereby many people are caught holding aden and other in-game currency.If Lineage suddenly went out of fashion or another game swept in and became very popular , you 'd have a lot of people rushing to sell in-game currency in general , which could even have economic knock-on effects , particularly mp3 players and hand-held gadgets that are popular amongst mmorpg players .</tokentext>
<sentencetext>Koreans trying to be clever but not very..it could create a credit bubble, whereby many people are caught holding aden and other in-game currency.If Lineage suddenly went out of fashion or another game swept in and became very popular, you'd have a lot of people rushing to sell in-game currency in general, which could even have economic knock-on effects, particularly mp3 players and hand-held gadgets that are popular amongst mmorpg players.</sentencetext>
	<parent>http://www.semanticweb.org/ontologies/ConversationInstances.owl#comment10_01_19_1653240.30822348</parent>
</comment>
<comment>
	<id>http://www.semanticweb.org/ontologies/ConversationInstances.owl#comment10_01_19_1653240.30822642</id>
	<title>So fix the headline</title>
	<author>tomhudson</author>
	<datestamp>1263930720000</datestamp>
	<modclass>Funny</modclass>
	<modscore>2</modscore>
	<htmltext>"Real Currency Becomes Virtual(ly worthless) in US".
<p>
This message was brought to you by the Fed.</p></htmltext>
<tokenext>" Real Currency Becomes Virtual ( ly worthless ) in US " .
This message was brought to you by the Fed .</tokentext>
<sentencetext>"Real Currency Becomes Virtual(ly worthless) in US".
This message was brought to you by the Fed.</sentencetext>
	<parent>http://www.semanticweb.org/ontologies/ConversationInstances.owl#comment10_01_19_1653240.30822312</parent>
</comment>
<comment>
	<id>http://www.semanticweb.org/ontologies/ConversationInstances.owl#comment10_01_19_1653240.30822454</id>
	<title>Re:Legal?</title>
	<author>istartedi</author>
	<datestamp>1263930180000</datestamp>
	<modclass>Informativ</modclass>
	<modscore>2</modscore>
	<htmltext><p>You're probably referring to the "Liberty Dollar".</p><p>Issuing a competing, aka "complementary" currency is not illegal!
See, Ithaca hours, the Matole Petole, and a number of others.</p><p>What made the Liberty coins illegal was that they had
too close a resemblance to actual US currency, and were being
advertised in ways that might lead people to believe they were
legal tender.  There may have been some other frauds revolving
around the organization that sold them also.</p><p>The fact that they minted silver (and maybe gold too, I don't
recall) didn't make them illegal.  The aforementioned Petole
is silver, and nobody bothers them.  They don't try to pass their
coins off as valid US currency though, just 1.0 oz. fine silver.
Nothing illegal about that.</p></htmltext>
<tokenext>You 're probably referring to the " Liberty Dollar " .Issuing a competing , aka " complementary " currency is not illegal !
See , Ithaca hours , the Matole Petole , and a number of others.What made the Liberty coins illegal was that they had too close a resemblance to actual US currency , and were being advertised in ways that might lead people to believe they were legal tender .
There may have been some other frauds revolving around the organization that sold them also.The fact that they minted silver ( and maybe gold too , I do n't recall ) did n't make them illegal .
The aforementioned Petole is silver , and nobody bothers them .
They do n't try to pass their coins off as valid US currency though , just 1.0 oz .
fine silver .
Nothing illegal about that .</tokentext>
<sentencetext>You're probably referring to the "Liberty Dollar".Issuing a competing, aka "complementary" currency is not illegal!
See, Ithaca hours, the Matole Petole, and a number of others.What made the Liberty coins illegal was that they had
too close a resemblance to actual US currency, and were being
advertised in ways that might lead people to believe they were
legal tender.
There may have been some other frauds revolving
around the organization that sold them also.The fact that they minted silver (and maybe gold too, I don't
recall) didn't make them illegal.
The aforementioned Petole
is silver, and nobody bothers them.
They don't try to pass their
coins off as valid US currency though, just 1.0 oz.
fine silver.
Nothing illegal about that.</sentencetext>
	<parent>http://www.semanticweb.org/ontologies/ConversationInstances.owl#comment10_01_19_1653240.30822326</parent>
</comment>
<comment>
	<id>http://www.semanticweb.org/ontologies/ConversationInstances.owl#comment10_01_19_1653240.30822482</id>
	<title>So that means WoW gold is legal tender?</title>
	<author>Anonymous</author>
	<datestamp>1263930240000</datestamp>
	<modclass>Insightful</modclass>
	<modscore>2</modscore>
	<htmltext><p>I can go to a bank in South Korea and exchange my WoW gold for Won? No? Then how about EvE's ISK? No?</p><p>Why could that be? Maybe because the issuers of that "currency" are <i>companies</i>, not countries, and no country on this planet backs it with its real economy? And "forging" it is about as trivial as changing a few lines in a database because no game company follows banking standards concerning security (not to mention auditing)? And let's not talk about Blizzard or CCP letting those printing presses roll whenever they feel like without any oversight from any kind of national bank.</p><p>In short, the whole deal is BS squared.</p></htmltext>
<tokenext>I can go to a bank in South Korea and exchange my WoW gold for Won ?
No ? Then how about EvE 's ISK ?
No ? Why could that be ?
Maybe because the issuers of that " currency " are companies , not countries , and no country on this planet backs it with its real economy ?
And " forging " it is about as trivial as changing a few lines in a database because no game company follows banking standards concerning security ( not to mention auditing ) ?
And let 's not talk about Blizzard or CCP letting those printing presses roll whenever they feel like without any oversight from any kind of national bank.In short , the whole deal is BS squared .</tokentext>
<sentencetext>I can go to a bank in South Korea and exchange my WoW gold for Won?
No? Then how about EvE's ISK?
No?Why could that be?
Maybe because the issuers of that "currency" are companies, not countries, and no country on this planet backs it with its real economy?
And "forging" it is about as trivial as changing a few lines in a database because no game company follows banking standards concerning security (not to mention auditing)?
And let's not talk about Blizzard or CCP letting those printing presses roll whenever they feel like without any oversight from any kind of national bank.In short, the whole deal is BS squared.</sentencetext>
</comment>
<comment>
	<id>http://www.semanticweb.org/ontologies/ConversationInstances.owl#comment10_01_19_1653240.30822332</id>
	<title>Whats the diff?</title>
	<author>mishehu</author>
	<datestamp>1263929760000</datestamp>
	<modclass>Interestin</modclass>
	<modscore>2</modscore>
	<htmltext>What is the difference between this and the S.K. gov't simply deeming that any money earned on the sale of "virtual currency" would be subject to income tax?  That is, assuming they have an income tax there, which I do not know myself.  I suspect that the US IRS and respective state gov'ts would take this opinion...</htmltext>
<tokenext>What is the difference between this and the S.K .
gov't simply deeming that any money earned on the sale of " virtual currency " would be subject to income tax ?
That is , assuming they have an income tax there , which I do not know myself .
I suspect that the US IRS and respective state gov'ts would take this opinion.. .</tokentext>
<sentencetext>What is the difference between this and the S.K.
gov't simply deeming that any money earned on the sale of "virtual currency" would be subject to income tax?
That is, assuming they have an income tax there, which I do not know myself.
I suspect that the US IRS and respective state gov'ts would take this opinion...</sentencetext>
</comment>
<comment>
	<id>http://www.semanticweb.org/ontologies/ConversationInstances.owl#comment10_01_19_1653240.30826096</id>
	<title>Re:Clueless gamer blog gets it wrong</title>
	<author>Anonymous</author>
	<datestamp>1263902820000</datestamp>
	<modclass>Insightful</modclass>
	<modscore>1</modscore>
	<htmltext><p>Exactly. This verdict has no implications whatsoever for anyone outside South Korea, since online gaming is never classed as gambling in any other country I know. It's just a case of an editor on Massively not actually reading the article, jumping to ridiculous conclusions, and the<nobr> <wbr></nobr>/. jumps the bandwagon.</p></htmltext>
<tokenext>Exactly .
This verdict has no implications whatsoever for anyone outside South Korea , since online gaming is never classed as gambling in any other country I know .
It 's just a case of an editor on Massively not actually reading the article , jumping to ridiculous conclusions , and the / .
jumps the bandwagon .</tokentext>
<sentencetext>Exactly.
This verdict has no implications whatsoever for anyone outside South Korea, since online gaming is never classed as gambling in any other country I know.
It's just a case of an editor on Massively not actually reading the article, jumping to ridiculous conclusions, and the /.
jumps the bandwagon.</sentencetext>
	<parent>http://www.semanticweb.org/ontologies/ConversationInstances.owl#comment10_01_19_1653240.30822564</parent>
</comment>
<comment>
	<id>http://www.semanticweb.org/ontologies/ConversationInstances.owl#comment10_01_19_1653240.30824112</id>
	<title>Re:Not really surprising</title>
	<author>noidentity</author>
	<datestamp>1263893640000</datestamp>
	<modclass>None</modclass>
	<modscore>1</modscore>
	<htmltext>Never mind the fact that unlike every other currency, precious metals (gold and silver) have held their value for centuries.</htmltext>
<tokenext>Never mind the fact that unlike every other currency , precious metals ( gold and silver ) have held their value for centuries .</tokentext>
<sentencetext>Never mind the fact that unlike every other currency, precious metals (gold and silver) have held their value for centuries.</sentencetext>
	<parent>http://www.semanticweb.org/ontologies/ConversationInstances.owl#comment10_01_19_1653240.30823008</parent>
</comment>
<comment>
	<id>http://www.semanticweb.org/ontologies/ConversationInstances.owl#comment10_01_19_1653240.30822444</id>
	<title>The only thing I need to know is...</title>
	<author>YojimboJango</author>
	<datestamp>1263930120000</datestamp>
	<modclass>None</modclass>
	<modscore>1</modscore>
	<htmltext>Can I pay my taxes with it?</htmltext>
<tokenext>Can I pay my taxes with it ?</tokentext>
<sentencetext>Can I pay my taxes with it?</sentencetext>
</comment>
<comment>
	<id>http://www.semanticweb.org/ontologies/ConversationInstances.owl#comment10_01_19_1653240.30824388</id>
	<title>Re:If this remains the case</title>
	<author>JesseMcDonald</author>
	<datestamp>1263895020000</datestamp>
	<modclass>None</modclass>
	<modscore>1</modscore>
	<htmltext><p>The problem with attempting to implement electronic cash is that <em>physical</em> cash only exists because it was grandfathered in. Under current regulations, anyone introducing cash today would be charged with money laundering due to the lack of records. Electronic cash has been attempted several times, and the result is always the same.</p></htmltext>
<tokenext>The problem with attempting to implement electronic cash is that physical cash only exists because it was grandfathered in .
Under current regulations , anyone introducing cash today would be charged with money laundering due to the lack of records .
Electronic cash has been attempted several times , and the result is always the same .</tokentext>
<sentencetext>The problem with attempting to implement electronic cash is that physical cash only exists because it was grandfathered in.
Under current regulations, anyone introducing cash today would be charged with money laundering due to the lack of records.
Electronic cash has been attempted several times, and the result is always the same.</sentencetext>
	<parent>http://www.semanticweb.org/ontologies/ConversationInstances.owl#comment10_01_19_1653240.30822366</parent>
</comment>
<comment>
	<id>http://www.semanticweb.org/ontologies/ConversationInstances.owl#comment10_01_19_1653240.30822366</id>
	<title>If this remains the case</title>
	<author>JoshuaZ</author>
	<datestamp>1263929880000</datestamp>
	<modclass>Informativ</modclass>
	<modscore>3</modscore>
	<htmltext>They need to do better jobs keeping track of currency levels in different games. As virtual currency becomes more common in game settings, better cryptography needs to be used to make sure that people don't change the numbers. Similarly, there becomes issues with income taxes and the like. In the long run we should probably all switch to cryptographically anonymous currency anyways which can be easily implemented using blind signatures <a href="http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Blind\_signature" title="wikipedia.org">http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Blind\_signature</a> [wikipedia.org] so that even the bankers don't know who used which bills for which transactions. Unfortunately, many large institutions (such as governments) will likely resist such systems because they lead to a substantial loss of control.</htmltext>
<tokenext>They need to do better jobs keeping track of currency levels in different games .
As virtual currency becomes more common in game settings , better cryptography needs to be used to make sure that people do n't change the numbers .
Similarly , there becomes issues with income taxes and the like .
In the long run we should probably all switch to cryptographically anonymous currency anyways which can be easily implemented using blind signatures http : //en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Blind \ _signature [ wikipedia.org ] so that even the bankers do n't know who used which bills for which transactions .
Unfortunately , many large institutions ( such as governments ) will likely resist such systems because they lead to a substantial loss of control .</tokentext>
<sentencetext>They need to do better jobs keeping track of currency levels in different games.
As virtual currency becomes more common in game settings, better cryptography needs to be used to make sure that people don't change the numbers.
Similarly, there becomes issues with income taxes and the like.
In the long run we should probably all switch to cryptographically anonymous currency anyways which can be easily implemented using blind signatures http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Blind\_signature [wikipedia.org] so that even the bankers don't know who used which bills for which transactions.
Unfortunately, many large institutions (such as governments) will likely resist such systems because they lead to a substantial loss of control.</sentencetext>
</comment>
<comment>
	<id>http://www.semanticweb.org/ontologies/ConversationInstances.owl#comment10_01_19_1653240.30867580</id>
	<title>Re:The real reason</title>
	<author>c0sine</author>
	<datestamp>1264190220000</datestamp>
	<modclass>None</modclass>
	<modscore>1</modscore>
	<htmltext>&gt; it seems that the courts haven't ruled that in game money is "real"...

It sounds like the paper crap which accepted as a legal tender in most countries is any more real than these candy wrappers from S. Korea<nobr> <wbr></nobr>:-(</htmltext>
<tokenext>&gt; it seems that the courts have n't ruled that in game money is " real " .. . It sounds like the paper crap which accepted as a legal tender in most countries is any more real than these candy wrappers from S. Korea : - (</tokentext>
<sentencetext>&gt; it seems that the courts haven't ruled that in game money is "real"...

It sounds like the paper crap which accepted as a legal tender in most countries is any more real than these candy wrappers from S. Korea :-(</sentencetext>
	<parent>http://www.semanticweb.org/ontologies/ConversationInstances.owl#comment10_01_19_1653240.30822718</parent>
</comment>
<comment>
	<id>http://www.semanticweb.org/ontologies/ConversationInstances.owl#comment10_01_19_1653240.30823550</id>
	<title>Re:Legal?</title>
	<author>JesseMcDonald</author>
	<datestamp>1263934260000</datestamp>
	<modclass>None</modclass>
	<modscore>1</modscore>
	<htmltext><p><div class="quote"><p>What made the Liberty coins illegal was that they had too close a resemblance to actual US currency...</p></div><p>Have you ever actually <em>seen</em> a Liberty Dollar? Among other things, they're (a) made of silver, unlike any current US coin; (b) much larger than any current US coin; (c) printed with a different design; (d) labeled with a different motto; (e) have "libertydollar.org" on the back; etc. In short, they are nothing like any current US currency. Here's a picture, in case you don't believe me: <a href="http://www.city-data.com/forum/attachments/politics-other-controversies/42956d1244231459-feds-arrest-liberty-dollar-folks-ldf\_silver\_large.jpg" title="city-data.com">Liberty Dollar</a> [city-data.com].</p><p><div class="quote"><p>...and were being advertised in ways that might lead people to believe they were legal tender.</p></div><p>There was some trouble with individual Liberty Dollars users not specifically stating that they were paying with real money, as opposed to legal tender, but to the best of my knowledge the organization itself never advertised Liberty Dollars as legal tender, and in fact went out of its way to point out the difference and advise its customers not to label it as such. What would be the point, after all, of taking valuable silver coins and passing them off as worthless legal tender?</p></div>
	</htmltext>
<tokenext>What made the Liberty coins illegal was that they had too close a resemblance to actual US currency...Have you ever actually seen a Liberty Dollar ?
Among other things , they 're ( a ) made of silver , unlike any current US coin ; ( b ) much larger than any current US coin ; ( c ) printed with a different design ; ( d ) labeled with a different motto ; ( e ) have " libertydollar.org " on the back ; etc .
In short , they are nothing like any current US currency .
Here 's a picture , in case you do n't believe me : Liberty Dollar [ city-data.com ] ....and were being advertised in ways that might lead people to believe they were legal tender.There was some trouble with individual Liberty Dollars users not specifically stating that they were paying with real money , as opposed to legal tender , but to the best of my knowledge the organization itself never advertised Liberty Dollars as legal tender , and in fact went out of its way to point out the difference and advise its customers not to label it as such .
What would be the point , after all , of taking valuable silver coins and passing them off as worthless legal tender ?</tokentext>
<sentencetext>What made the Liberty coins illegal was that they had too close a resemblance to actual US currency...Have you ever actually seen a Liberty Dollar?
Among other things, they're (a) made of silver, unlike any current US coin; (b) much larger than any current US coin; (c) printed with a different design; (d) labeled with a different motto; (e) have "libertydollar.org" on the back; etc.
In short, they are nothing like any current US currency.
Here's a picture, in case you don't believe me: Liberty Dollar [city-data.com]....and were being advertised in ways that might lead people to believe they were legal tender.There was some trouble with individual Liberty Dollars users not specifically stating that they were paying with real money, as opposed to legal tender, but to the best of my knowledge the organization itself never advertised Liberty Dollars as legal tender, and in fact went out of its way to point out the difference and advise its customers not to label it as such.
What would be the point, after all, of taking valuable silver coins and passing them off as worthless legal tender?
	</sentencetext>
	<parent>http://www.semanticweb.org/ontologies/ConversationInstances.owl#comment10_01_19_1653240.30822454</parent>
</comment>
<comment>
	<id>http://www.semanticweb.org/ontologies/ConversationInstances.owl#comment10_01_19_1653240.30822838</id>
	<title>Scrip?</title>
	<author>pete-classic</author>
	<datestamp>1263931380000</datestamp>
	<modclass>None</modclass>
	<modscore>1</modscore>
	<htmltext><p>Is this different than <a href="http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Scrip" title="wikipedia.org">scrip</a> [wikipedia.org] in <em>any</em> meaningful way?</p><p>-Peter</p></htmltext>
<tokenext>Is this different than scrip [ wikipedia.org ] in any meaningful way ? -Peter</tokentext>
<sentencetext>Is this different than scrip [wikipedia.org] in any meaningful way?-Peter</sentencetext>
</comment>
<comment>
	<id>http://www.semanticweb.org/ontologies/ConversationInstances.owl#comment10_01_19_1653240.30823564</id>
	<title>I Pay All of My Bills......</title>
	<author>Anonymous</author>
	<datestamp>1263934380000</datestamp>
	<modclass>None</modclass>
	<modscore>0</modscore>
	<htmltext><p>with wii points.</p></htmltext>
<tokenext>with wii points .</tokentext>
<sentencetext>with wii points.</sentencetext>
</comment>
<comment>
	<id>http://www.semanticweb.org/ontologies/ConversationInstances.owl#comment10_01_19_1653240.30823736</id>
	<title>My virtual currency</title>
	<author>AP31R0N</author>
	<datestamp>1263892020000</datestamp>
	<modclass>None</modclass>
	<modscore>1</modscore>
	<htmltext><p>i wrote a thing about an international virtual currency.  The basis was 1 hour of unskilled labor would be 100 credits.  Each credit has an entry in the database as to who owns it at the moment.  Small transactions could be done with a private/public key transaction.  Bigger transactions require more authentication.</p><p>The serial of a credit would be 128b.  The first eight being the date of it's release into the system in CRC32, leaving 96b for the rest of the serial.  That gives us an insane amount of credits even if the population hit 12B.  The date would be a quick means to verify that the number of the credit someone is trying to spend isn't some random number.</p><p>Money enters the system by an employer and employee agreeing to do the transaction in this system for the minimum wage.  Since money enters the system in batches, it could keep value tightly controlled.  It would also address some problems with gulfs in currency/labor values ($1 doesn't buy shit here, but could buy a big meal elsewhere).  People who are to be paid more than minimum wage must be paid in a transaction of already release currency.</p><p>It would be purely virtual and transactions would be tracked, making it less useful for criminal enterprise.</p></htmltext>
<tokenext>i wrote a thing about an international virtual currency .
The basis was 1 hour of unskilled labor would be 100 credits .
Each credit has an entry in the database as to who owns it at the moment .
Small transactions could be done with a private/public key transaction .
Bigger transactions require more authentication.The serial of a credit would be 128b .
The first eight being the date of it 's release into the system in CRC32 , leaving 96b for the rest of the serial .
That gives us an insane amount of credits even if the population hit 12B .
The date would be a quick means to verify that the number of the credit someone is trying to spend is n't some random number.Money enters the system by an employer and employee agreeing to do the transaction in this system for the minimum wage .
Since money enters the system in batches , it could keep value tightly controlled .
It would also address some problems with gulfs in currency/labor values ( $ 1 does n't buy shit here , but could buy a big meal elsewhere ) .
People who are to be paid more than minimum wage must be paid in a transaction of already release currency.It would be purely virtual and transactions would be tracked , making it less useful for criminal enterprise .</tokentext>
<sentencetext>i wrote a thing about an international virtual currency.
The basis was 1 hour of unskilled labor would be 100 credits.
Each credit has an entry in the database as to who owns it at the moment.
Small transactions could be done with a private/public key transaction.
Bigger transactions require more authentication.The serial of a credit would be 128b.
The first eight being the date of it's release into the system in CRC32, leaving 96b for the rest of the serial.
That gives us an insane amount of credits even if the population hit 12B.
The date would be a quick means to verify that the number of the credit someone is trying to spend isn't some random number.Money enters the system by an employer and employee agreeing to do the transaction in this system for the minimum wage.
Since money enters the system in batches, it could keep value tightly controlled.
It would also address some problems with gulfs in currency/labor values ($1 doesn't buy shit here, but could buy a big meal elsewhere).
People who are to be paid more than minimum wage must be paid in a transaction of already release currency.It would be purely virtual and transactions would be tracked, making it less useful for criminal enterprise.</sentencetext>
</comment>
<comment>
	<id>http://www.semanticweb.org/ontologies/ConversationInstances.owl#comment10_01_19_1653240.30823432</id>
	<title>Poor analogy...</title>
	<author>Pollux</author>
	<datestamp>1263933780000</datestamp>
	<modclass>None</modclass>
	<modscore>1</modscore>
	<htmltext><p><i>The core there is that selling in-game currency for real money is essentially just an exchange of currency and perfectly legal in South Korea.</i></p><p>Applying that logic domestically, does that mean that I can mail all my old arcade tokens to the IRS to help pay my taxes?</p></htmltext>
<tokenext>The core there is that selling in-game currency for real money is essentially just an exchange of currency and perfectly legal in South Korea.Applying that logic domestically , does that mean that I can mail all my old arcade tokens to the IRS to help pay my taxes ?</tokentext>
<sentencetext>The core there is that selling in-game currency for real money is essentially just an exchange of currency and perfectly legal in South Korea.Applying that logic domestically, does that mean that I can mail all my old arcade tokens to the IRS to help pay my taxes?</sentencetext>
</comment>
<comment>
	<id>http://www.semanticweb.org/ontologies/ConversationInstances.owl#comment10_01_19_1653240.30822968</id>
	<title>Re:Legal?</title>
	<author>pclminion</author>
	<datestamp>1263931800000</datestamp>
	<modclass>None</modclass>
	<modscore>1</modscore>
	<htmltext><p>It was never intended as a competing currency. The government has, after the fact, DECLARED that it is equivalent to real currency. You cannot, in most sane countries, be prosecuted for something you did before it was a crime. And if the intention of the government was to make virtual currency illegal, they could have just declared it so, rather than saying it's the same as real currency. Obviously the intention is to be able to tax transactions made in game worlds with actual tax.</p><p>Of course, since the two currencies have been declared equivalent, I don't see why I couldn't just pay my taxes in virtual gold. They're the same thing right?</p></htmltext>
<tokenext>It was never intended as a competing currency .
The government has , after the fact , DECLARED that it is equivalent to real currency .
You can not , in most sane countries , be prosecuted for something you did before it was a crime .
And if the intention of the government was to make virtual currency illegal , they could have just declared it so , rather than saying it 's the same as real currency .
Obviously the intention is to be able to tax transactions made in game worlds with actual tax.Of course , since the two currencies have been declared equivalent , I do n't see why I could n't just pay my taxes in virtual gold .
They 're the same thing right ?</tokentext>
<sentencetext>It was never intended as a competing currency.
The government has, after the fact, DECLARED that it is equivalent to real currency.
You cannot, in most sane countries, be prosecuted for something you did before it was a crime.
And if the intention of the government was to make virtual currency illegal, they could have just declared it so, rather than saying it's the same as real currency.
Obviously the intention is to be able to tax transactions made in game worlds with actual tax.Of course, since the two currencies have been declared equivalent, I don't see why I couldn't just pay my taxes in virtual gold.
They're the same thing right?</sentencetext>
	<parent>http://www.semanticweb.org/ontologies/ConversationInstances.owl#comment10_01_19_1653240.30822326</parent>
</comment>
<comment>
	<id>http://www.semanticweb.org/ontologies/ConversationInstances.owl#comment10_01_19_1653240.30824452</id>
	<title>Re:So that means WoW gold is legal tender?</title>
	<author>Anonymous</author>
	<datestamp>1263895380000</datestamp>
	<modclass>None</modclass>
	<modscore>0</modscore>
	<htmltext><p><div class="quote"><p>  These virtual currencies are more stable than a great many national currencies.</p></div><p>You seem to be forgetting that not only can in-game currency creation be easily controlled by the company running the MMOG, the destruction of in-game currency is almost as easy for them.  If the company decides there is too much currency in the in-game then "sinks" (e.g. costs for things like vaults, NPC repair services, high-priced luxury goods only available through NPCs, etc...)  can be implemented or increased quickly and usually without significant tantrums from the players.  Today the only way a real-world government can to the analogous is through increasing fees and taxes (100 or even 50 years ago they could create less money for a few years than the estimated rate of currency destruction, but far too much of our economy is electronic for that to work now), which in a participatory government requires legislation.  It's the last part that makes it infeasible for any non-authoritarian government to exert the same level of tweaking to its economy that the creators of EvE enjoy.  Remember that any functioning MMOG economy, including EvE's, is on the macro-scale a planned economy; no matter how much players can trade in-game wealth among themselves, the total wealth is controlled by the game's company because they determine how and under what circumstances wealth is both introduced and removed from the system.</p></div>
	</htmltext>
<tokenext>These virtual currencies are more stable than a great many national currencies.You seem to be forgetting that not only can in-game currency creation be easily controlled by the company running the MMOG , the destruction of in-game currency is almost as easy for them .
If the company decides there is too much currency in the in-game then " sinks " ( e.g .
costs for things like vaults , NPC repair services , high-priced luxury goods only available through NPCs , etc... ) can be implemented or increased quickly and usually without significant tantrums from the players .
Today the only way a real-world government can to the analogous is through increasing fees and taxes ( 100 or even 50 years ago they could create less money for a few years than the estimated rate of currency destruction , but far too much of our economy is electronic for that to work now ) , which in a participatory government requires legislation .
It 's the last part that makes it infeasible for any non-authoritarian government to exert the same level of tweaking to its economy that the creators of EvE enjoy .
Remember that any functioning MMOG economy , including EvE 's , is on the macro-scale a planned economy ; no matter how much players can trade in-game wealth among themselves , the total wealth is controlled by the game 's company because they determine how and under what circumstances wealth is both introduced and removed from the system .</tokentext>
<sentencetext>  These virtual currencies are more stable than a great many national currencies.You seem to be forgetting that not only can in-game currency creation be easily controlled by the company running the MMOG, the destruction of in-game currency is almost as easy for them.
If the company decides there is too much currency in the in-game then "sinks" (e.g.
costs for things like vaults, NPC repair services, high-priced luxury goods only available through NPCs, etc...)  can be implemented or increased quickly and usually without significant tantrums from the players.
Today the only way a real-world government can to the analogous is through increasing fees and taxes (100 or even 50 years ago they could create less money for a few years than the estimated rate of currency destruction, but far too much of our economy is electronic for that to work now), which in a participatory government requires legislation.
It's the last part that makes it infeasible for any non-authoritarian government to exert the same level of tweaking to its economy that the creators of EvE enjoy.
Remember that any functioning MMOG economy, including EvE's, is on the macro-scale a planned economy; no matter how much players can trade in-game wealth among themselves, the total wealth is controlled by the game's company because they determine how and under what circumstances wealth is both introduced and removed from the system.
	</sentencetext>
	<parent>http://www.semanticweb.org/ontologies/ConversationInstances.owl#comment10_01_19_1653240.30822986</parent>
</comment>
<comment>
	<id>http://www.semanticweb.org/ontologies/ConversationInstances.owl#comment10_01_19_1653240.30822840</id>
	<title>"Taxes" ? dont be fools.</title>
	<author>unity100</author>
	<datestamp>1263931380000</datestamp>
	<modclass>None</modclass>
	<modscore>1</modscore>
	<htmltext><p>taxes were always there. it didnt matter zit if you converted cash into something from virtual currency or from sale of your old underwear. as soon as you have incurred income, it was taxable.</p></htmltext>
<tokenext>taxes were always there .
it didnt matter zit if you converted cash into something from virtual currency or from sale of your old underwear .
as soon as you have incurred income , it was taxable .</tokentext>
<sentencetext>taxes were always there.
it didnt matter zit if you converted cash into something from virtual currency or from sale of your old underwear.
as soon as you have incurred income, it was taxable.</sentencetext>
</comment>
<comment>
	<id>http://www.semanticweb.org/ontologies/ConversationInstances.owl#comment10_01_19_1653240.30824032</id>
	<title>Re:The real reason</title>
	<author>HungryHobo</author>
	<datestamp>1263893340000</datestamp>
	<modclass>None</modclass>
	<modscore>1</modscore>
	<htmltext><p>Yes, there's a difference between considering ingame money to be "real money" and considering it to be an item or goods which can be sold.<br>Considering monopoly money to be real money would be stupid.<br>However considering the little paper slips that come in the box to be something you actually own and can sell to other people without the permission of the company which makes monopoly box sets is quite different.</p><p>Now this does bring up the question of: if I'm running a really big monopoly game why shouldn't I be able to write into the rules whatever I like? That to keep playing everyone has to stand on their head and sing the star spangled banner once every 3 turns to avoid being kicked out of the game or that players can't trade the game pieces between each other for real money.</p><p>People have to remember, even if that piece of armour looks shiny and that mount frisky it's still as much a part of the game as that monster printed on the Magic cards and if you're making your own game it's your rules.</p></htmltext>
<tokenext>Yes , there 's a difference between considering ingame money to be " real money " and considering it to be an item or goods which can be sold.Considering monopoly money to be real money would be stupid.However considering the little paper slips that come in the box to be something you actually own and can sell to other people without the permission of the company which makes monopoly box sets is quite different.Now this does bring up the question of : if I 'm running a really big monopoly game why should n't I be able to write into the rules whatever I like ?
That to keep playing everyone has to stand on their head and sing the star spangled banner once every 3 turns to avoid being kicked out of the game or that players ca n't trade the game pieces between each other for real money.People have to remember , even if that piece of armour looks shiny and that mount frisky it 's still as much a part of the game as that monster printed on the Magic cards and if you 're making your own game it 's your rules .</tokentext>
<sentencetext>Yes, there's a difference between considering ingame money to be "real money" and considering it to be an item or goods which can be sold.Considering monopoly money to be real money would be stupid.However considering the little paper slips that come in the box to be something you actually own and can sell to other people without the permission of the company which makes monopoly box sets is quite different.Now this does bring up the question of: if I'm running a really big monopoly game why shouldn't I be able to write into the rules whatever I like?
That to keep playing everyone has to stand on their head and sing the star spangled banner once every 3 turns to avoid being kicked out of the game or that players can't trade the game pieces between each other for real money.People have to remember, even if that piece of armour looks shiny and that mount frisky it's still as much a part of the game as that monster printed on the Magic cards and if you're making your own game it's your rules.</sentencetext>
	<parent>http://www.semanticweb.org/ontologies/ConversationInstances.owl#comment10_01_19_1653240.30822718</parent>
</comment>
<comment>
	<id>http://www.semanticweb.org/ontologies/ConversationInstances.owl#comment10_01_19_1653240.30823352</id>
	<title>Misinterpretation</title>
	<author>Anonymous</author>
	<datestamp>1263933480000</datestamp>
	<modclass>None</modclass>
	<modscore>0</modscore>
	<htmltext><p><div class="quote"><p>Massively is reporting that the South Korean Supreme Court has stated that virtual currency is the equivalent of real-world money.</p></div><p>Um no they didn't...</p><p>Dependents bought items and in-game currency then resold those items for cash. The gov got pissed and said it was gambling then fined the 2 guys. The court then ruled that they were not gambling but earning cash by selling/trading a good that held VALUE. This has more to do w/ virtual items/goods having a VALUE and less to do w/ a transfer of currency. I wouldn't go as far to say that Aden = $$$ but more to the likes of Aden = VALUE kind of like how a car has a value, but is not directly $$$, it's a good and not a currency.</p><p>Car analogy for the<nobr> <wbr></nobr>/. crowd...</p></div>
	</htmltext>
<tokenext>Massively is reporting that the South Korean Supreme Court has stated that virtual currency is the equivalent of real-world money.Um no they did n't...Dependents bought items and in-game currency then resold those items for cash .
The gov got pissed and said it was gambling then fined the 2 guys .
The court then ruled that they were not gambling but earning cash by selling/trading a good that held VALUE .
This has more to do w/ virtual items/goods having a VALUE and less to do w/ a transfer of currency .
I would n't go as far to say that Aden = $ $ $ but more to the likes of Aden = VALUE kind of like how a car has a value , but is not directly $ $ $ , it 's a good and not a currency.Car analogy for the / .
crowd.. .</tokentext>
<sentencetext>Massively is reporting that the South Korean Supreme Court has stated that virtual currency is the equivalent of real-world money.Um no they didn't...Dependents bought items and in-game currency then resold those items for cash.
The gov got pissed and said it was gambling then fined the 2 guys.
The court then ruled that they were not gambling but earning cash by selling/trading a good that held VALUE.
This has more to do w/ virtual items/goods having a VALUE and less to do w/ a transfer of currency.
I wouldn't go as far to say that Aden = $$$ but more to the likes of Aden = VALUE kind of like how a car has a value, but is not directly $$$, it's a good and not a currency.Car analogy for the /.
crowd...
	</sentencetext>
</comment>
<comment>
	<id>http://www.semanticweb.org/ontologies/ConversationInstances.owl#comment10_01_19_1653240.30824560</id>
	<title>Re:Not really surprising</title>
	<author>Anonymous</author>
	<datestamp>1263895860000</datestamp>
	<modclass>Insightful</modclass>
	<modscore>3</modscore>
	<htmltext><p><i>actually make use of gold's natural properties in some other way. Don't delude yourself. There is no such thing as "intrinsic value."</i></p><p>Of course gold has intrinsic value. Just not very much intrinsic value.</p><p>The vast majority of the current price of gold is due to the fact that people think it has value, which is the same reason the US dollar or Euro has value.</p><p>I like <a href="http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Warren\_Buffett" title="wikipedia.org" rel="nofollow">Warren Buffet's</a> [wikipedia.org] quote on gold:</p><p>It gets dug out of the ground in Africa, or someplace. Then we melt it down, dig another hole, bury it again and pay people to stand around guarding it. It has no utility. Anyone watching from Mars would be scratching their head.</p></div>
	</htmltext>
<tokenext>actually make use of gold 's natural properties in some other way .
Do n't delude yourself .
There is no such thing as " intrinsic value .
" Of course gold has intrinsic value .
Just not very much intrinsic value.The vast majority of the current price of gold is due to the fact that people think it has value , which is the same reason the US dollar or Euro has value.I like Warren Buffet 's [ wikipedia.org ] quote on gold : It gets dug out of the ground in Africa , or someplace .
Then we melt it down , dig another hole , bury it again and pay people to stand around guarding it .
It has no utility .
Anyone watching from Mars would be scratching their head .</tokentext>
<sentencetext>actually make use of gold's natural properties in some other way.
Don't delude yourself.
There is no such thing as "intrinsic value.
"Of course gold has intrinsic value.
Just not very much intrinsic value.The vast majority of the current price of gold is due to the fact that people think it has value, which is the same reason the US dollar or Euro has value.I like Warren Buffet's [wikipedia.org] quote on gold:It gets dug out of the ground in Africa, or someplace.
Then we melt it down, dig another hole, bury it again and pay people to stand around guarding it.
It has no utility.
Anyone watching from Mars would be scratching their head.
	</sentencetext>
	<parent>http://www.semanticweb.org/ontologies/ConversationInstances.owl#comment10_01_19_1653240.30823008</parent>
</comment>
<comment>
	<id>http://www.semanticweb.org/ontologies/ConversationInstances.owl#comment10_01_19_1653240.30822948</id>
	<title>Re:Sweet!</title>
	<author>Anonymous</author>
	<datestamp>1263931740000</datestamp>
	<modclass>None</modclass>
	<modscore>0</modscore>
	<htmltext><p>And you can retire at LVL 65.</p></htmltext>
<tokenext>And you can retire at LVL 65 .</tokentext>
<sentencetext>And you can retire at LVL 65.</sentencetext>
	<parent>http://www.semanticweb.org/ontologies/ConversationInstances.owl#comment10_01_19_1653240.30822346</parent>
</comment>
<comment>
	<id>http://www.semanticweb.org/ontologies/ConversationInstances.owl#comment10_01_19_1653240.30823596</id>
	<title>Monopoly Money</title>
	<author>Anonymous</author>
	<datestamp>1263934560000</datestamp>
	<modclass>None</modclass>
	<modscore>0</modscore>
	<htmltext><p>Does anyone know the current exchange rate?</p></htmltext>
<tokenext>Does anyone know the current exchange rate ?</tokentext>
<sentencetext>Does anyone know the current exchange rate?</sentencetext>
</comment>
<comment>
	<id>http://www.semanticweb.org/ontologies/ConversationInstances.owl#comment10_01_19_1653240.30823464</id>
	<title>Re:Not really surprising</title>
	<author>Anonymous</author>
	<datestamp>1263933960000</datestamp>
	<modclass>None</modclass>
	<modscore>0</modscore>
	<htmltext><p>Gold is virtually worthless. The real(industrial) demand is really low, gold is recyclable, and we have a lot "just sitting there".<br>The real value of gold should be based of the cost of recycling it, not "OMG, it look nice and people are investing in it!"</p></htmltext>
<tokenext>Gold is virtually worthless .
The real ( industrial ) demand is really low , gold is recyclable , and we have a lot " just sitting there " .The real value of gold should be based of the cost of recycling it , not " OMG , it look nice and people are investing in it !
"</tokentext>
<sentencetext>Gold is virtually worthless.
The real(industrial) demand is really low, gold is recyclable, and we have a lot "just sitting there".The real value of gold should be based of the cost of recycling it, not "OMG, it look nice and people are investing in it!
"</sentencetext>
	<parent>http://www.semanticweb.org/ontologies/ConversationInstances.owl#comment10_01_19_1653240.30822470</parent>
</comment>
<comment>
	<id>http://www.semanticweb.org/ontologies/ConversationInstances.owl#comment10_01_19_1653240.30831562</id>
	<title>Re:</title>
	<author>clint999</author>
	<datestamp>1264001400000</datestamp>
	<modclass>None</modclass>
	<modscore>-1</modscore>
	<htmltext><p><div class="quote"><p>I'm no expert, but what definitely looks wrong to me there is the use of the word "Dollar."  If I sell you a lump of silver for $20, fine.  But if I sell you something that says "$20 dollars" on it, with the explicit (or clearly implied) promise that it will always be worth $20 USD, that is not fine.  That is forgery, because it implies the faith &amp; credit of the US govt for my made-up currency.</p></div></div>
	</htmltext>
<tokenext>I 'm no expert , but what definitely looks wrong to me there is the use of the word " Dollar .
" If I sell you a lump of silver for $ 20 , fine .
But if I sell you something that says " $ 20 dollars " on it , with the explicit ( or clearly implied ) promise that it will always be worth $ 20 USD , that is not fine .
That is forgery , because it implies the faith &amp; credit of the US govt for my made-up currency .</tokentext>
<sentencetext>I'm no expert, but what definitely looks wrong to me there is the use of the word "Dollar.
"  If I sell you a lump of silver for $20, fine.
But if I sell you something that says "$20 dollars" on it, with the explicit (or clearly implied) promise that it will always be worth $20 USD, that is not fine.
That is forgery, because it implies the faith &amp; credit of the US govt for my made-up currency.
	</sentencetext>
</comment>
<comment>
	<id>http://www.semanticweb.org/ontologies/ConversationInstances.owl#comment10_01_19_1653240.30824162</id>
	<title>Re:Not really surprising</title>
	<author>Anonymous</author>
	<datestamp>1263893880000</datestamp>
	<modclass>None</modclass>
	<modscore>0</modscore>
	<htmltext><p>BUT RON PAUL SAID</p></htmltext>
<tokenext>BUT RON PAUL SAID</tokentext>
<sentencetext>BUT RON PAUL SAID</sentencetext>
	<parent>http://www.semanticweb.org/ontologies/ConversationInstances.owl#comment10_01_19_1653240.30823008</parent>
</comment>
<comment>
	<id>http://www.semanticweb.org/ontologies/ConversationInstances.owl#comment10_01_19_1653240.30823178</id>
	<title>Re:Not really surprising</title>
	<author>Monkeedude1212</author>
	<datestamp>1263932700000</datestamp>
	<modclass>None</modclass>
	<modscore>1</modscore>
	<htmltext><p>But <b>all</b> real world Currency has an exchange rate across the globe - which is all backed by gold.</p><p>You can print more money, which will depreciate the value of the currency, or you can stock it up - increasing its value, or alternately, you can buy or sell the "Gold" you hold to alter its worth that way.</p><p>Virtual Currency however, is an entirely different mix altogether. Only the government can print legal tender (legally). Virtual currency is dependant entirely on the games developers. They could decide to give you more "gold" for Bosses, Dailies, etc. They could decide to remove everyones in game gold, or the company could shut down, there are no legal ramifications to what they must do. There are going to have to be some additions to the EULA garnering that while Virtual currency equals real money, it does not, in any way, have to remain in your pockets, and at any time could be reclaimed by the developer, or forgotten entirely.</p><p>Since I'm sure most of the worlds gold buyers are NOT actually South Korean, and actually from foreign markets (Like the US) - it's removing the amount currency in the buyers market (essentially) while increasing the amount in South Korean markets.</p><p>Oh Hey, look, GoldFarmers.com just turned in 10,000 USD dollars for Korean currency, now the treasury has less, so the Korean Dollar goes up. Guess what, the US Treasury still has the same amount.</p><p>Very smart move by South Korea - dangerous to the western world.</p></htmltext>
<tokenext>But all real world Currency has an exchange rate across the globe - which is all backed by gold.You can print more money , which will depreciate the value of the currency , or you can stock it up - increasing its value , or alternately , you can buy or sell the " Gold " you hold to alter its worth that way.Virtual Currency however , is an entirely different mix altogether .
Only the government can print legal tender ( legally ) .
Virtual currency is dependant entirely on the games developers .
They could decide to give you more " gold " for Bosses , Dailies , etc .
They could decide to remove everyones in game gold , or the company could shut down , there are no legal ramifications to what they must do .
There are going to have to be some additions to the EULA garnering that while Virtual currency equals real money , it does not , in any way , have to remain in your pockets , and at any time could be reclaimed by the developer , or forgotten entirely.Since I 'm sure most of the worlds gold buyers are NOT actually South Korean , and actually from foreign markets ( Like the US ) - it 's removing the amount currency in the buyers market ( essentially ) while increasing the amount in South Korean markets.Oh Hey , look , GoldFarmers.com just turned in 10,000 USD dollars for Korean currency , now the treasury has less , so the Korean Dollar goes up .
Guess what , the US Treasury still has the same amount.Very smart move by South Korea - dangerous to the western world .</tokentext>
<sentencetext>But all real world Currency has an exchange rate across the globe - which is all backed by gold.You can print more money, which will depreciate the value of the currency, or you can stock it up - increasing its value, or alternately, you can buy or sell the "Gold" you hold to alter its worth that way.Virtual Currency however, is an entirely different mix altogether.
Only the government can print legal tender (legally).
Virtual currency is dependant entirely on the games developers.
They could decide to give you more "gold" for Bosses, Dailies, etc.
They could decide to remove everyones in game gold, or the company could shut down, there are no legal ramifications to what they must do.
There are going to have to be some additions to the EULA garnering that while Virtual currency equals real money, it does not, in any way, have to remain in your pockets, and at any time could be reclaimed by the developer, or forgotten entirely.Since I'm sure most of the worlds gold buyers are NOT actually South Korean, and actually from foreign markets (Like the US) - it's removing the amount currency in the buyers market (essentially) while increasing the amount in South Korean markets.Oh Hey, look, GoldFarmers.com just turned in 10,000 USD dollars for Korean currency, now the treasury has less, so the Korean Dollar goes up.
Guess what, the US Treasury still has the same amount.Very smart move by South Korea - dangerous to the western world.</sentencetext>
	<parent>http://www.semanticweb.org/ontologies/ConversationInstances.owl#comment10_01_19_1653240.30822470</parent>
</comment>
<comment>
	<id>http://www.semanticweb.org/ontologies/ConversationInstances.owl#comment10_01_19_1653240.30822326</id>
	<title>Legal?</title>
	<author>MozeeToby</author>
	<datestamp>1263929760000</datestamp>
	<modclass>None</modclass>
	<modscore>1</modscore>
	<htmltext><p>Is minting a competing currency legal in South Korea?  I thought it was illegal in the States, I seem to remember some libertarians a while back trying to set up a gold standard currency that would have competed with the dollar and they got closed down.</p></htmltext>
<tokenext>Is minting a competing currency legal in South Korea ?
I thought it was illegal in the States , I seem to remember some libertarians a while back trying to set up a gold standard currency that would have competed with the dollar and they got closed down .</tokentext>
<sentencetext>Is minting a competing currency legal in South Korea?
I thought it was illegal in the States, I seem to remember some libertarians a while back trying to set up a gold standard currency that would have competed with the dollar and they got closed down.</sentencetext>
</comment>
<comment>
	<id>http://www.semanticweb.org/ontologies/ConversationInstances.owl#comment10_01_19_1653240.30823698</id>
	<title>Re:The real reason</title>
	<author>alonsoac</author>
	<datestamp>1263891780000</datestamp>
	<modclass>None</modclass>
	<modscore>1</modscore>
	<htmltext><p><div class="quote"><p>It's not the *government* saying that. It's the courts.</p></div><p>South Korea's government is divided into three branches: executive, judicial, and legislative. So yes the courts are part of the government.</p></div>
	</htmltext>
<tokenext>It 's not the * government * saying that .
It 's the courts.South Korea 's government is divided into three branches : executive , judicial , and legislative .
So yes the courts are part of the government .</tokentext>
<sentencetext>It's not the *government* saying that.
It's the courts.South Korea's government is divided into three branches: executive, judicial, and legislative.
So yes the courts are part of the government.
	</sentencetext>
	<parent>http://www.semanticweb.org/ontologies/ConversationInstances.owl#comment10_01_19_1653240.30822718</parent>
</comment>
<comment>
	<id>http://www.semanticweb.org/ontologies/ConversationInstances.owl#comment10_01_19_1653240.30822966</id>
	<title>PVP and thieving...</title>
	<author>$1uck</author>
	<datestamp>1263931800000</datestamp>
	<modclass>Funny</modclass>
	<modscore>3</modscore>
	<htmltext>So in a game such as EQ (the only MMO I've played) you could kill people (on pvp servers) and take their gold.  Clearly this is part of the game, but is it something you could be arrested for now?</htmltext>
<tokenext>So in a game such as EQ ( the only MMO I 've played ) you could kill people ( on pvp servers ) and take their gold .
Clearly this is part of the game , but is it something you could be arrested for now ?</tokentext>
<sentencetext>So in a game such as EQ (the only MMO I've played) you could kill people (on pvp servers) and take their gold.
Clearly this is part of the game, but is it something you could be arrested for now?</sentencetext>
</comment>
<comment>
	<id>http://www.semanticweb.org/ontologies/ConversationInstances.owl#comment10_01_19_1653240.30823066</id>
	<title>Re:Legal?</title>
	<author>JonStewartMill</author>
	<datestamp>1263932220000</datestamp>
	<modclass>None</modclass>
	<modscore>1</modscore>
	<htmltext>The <a href="http://www.libertydollar.org/ld/news-stories/index.htm" title="libertydollar.org" rel="nofollow">"Liberty Dollar"</a> [libertydollar.org] is alive and well -- at least according to its proponents.</htmltext>
<tokenext>The " Liberty Dollar " [ libertydollar.org ] is alive and well -- at least according to its proponents .</tokentext>
<sentencetext>The "Liberty Dollar" [libertydollar.org] is alive and well -- at least according to its proponents.</sentencetext>
	<parent>http://www.semanticweb.org/ontologies/ConversationInstances.owl#comment10_01_19_1653240.30822326</parent>
</comment>
<comment>
	<id>http://www.semanticweb.org/ontologies/ConversationInstances.owl#comment10_01_19_1653240.30822474</id>
	<title>Guaranteed by Whom?</title>
	<author>Anonymous</author>
	<datestamp>1263930240000</datestamp>
	<modclass>Interestin</modclass>
	<modscore>3</modscore>
	<htmltext><p>Given that the "currency" (units, seashells, whatever) have some intrinsic value in that you put labor into the creation of some sort of work product there needs to be a guarantee of the currency, someone or some-thing (government, bank, etc...) who backs up that currency with assets. Also an exchange would need to be established to control the conversion of this new currency into other units. If you do not have these mechanisms in place then your new currency is as valuable as wampum was to the American Indians.</p><p>When the European powers moved into the Americas they discovered that wampum was being used as a currency for the exchange of services and commodities and as a means of having portable wealth. The colonies, companies and fur-trappers would bring in mass-produced glass beads from Europe where they had very little value and exchange these to the Indians for furs, food and land. Within a few decades the entire system of wampum devalued itself and had collapsed.</p><p>Virtual currency is just 1's and 0's on a computer (our real currency is more like that now than it ever was). How easy would it be to create the equivalent of glass beads in our virtual wampum on-line society?</p></htmltext>
<tokenext>Given that the " currency " ( units , seashells , whatever ) have some intrinsic value in that you put labor into the creation of some sort of work product there needs to be a guarantee of the currency , someone or some-thing ( government , bank , etc... ) who backs up that currency with assets .
Also an exchange would need to be established to control the conversion of this new currency into other units .
If you do not have these mechanisms in place then your new currency is as valuable as wampum was to the American Indians.When the European powers moved into the Americas they discovered that wampum was being used as a currency for the exchange of services and commodities and as a means of having portable wealth .
The colonies , companies and fur-trappers would bring in mass-produced glass beads from Europe where they had very little value and exchange these to the Indians for furs , food and land .
Within a few decades the entire system of wampum devalued itself and had collapsed.Virtual currency is just 1 's and 0 's on a computer ( our real currency is more like that now than it ever was ) .
How easy would it be to create the equivalent of glass beads in our virtual wampum on-line society ?</tokentext>
<sentencetext>Given that the "currency" (units, seashells, whatever) have some intrinsic value in that you put labor into the creation of some sort of work product there needs to be a guarantee of the currency, someone or some-thing (government, bank, etc...) who backs up that currency with assets.
Also an exchange would need to be established to control the conversion of this new currency into other units.
If you do not have these mechanisms in place then your new currency is as valuable as wampum was to the American Indians.When the European powers moved into the Americas they discovered that wampum was being used as a currency for the exchange of services and commodities and as a means of having portable wealth.
The colonies, companies and fur-trappers would bring in mass-produced glass beads from Europe where they had very little value and exchange these to the Indians for furs, food and land.
Within a few decades the entire system of wampum devalued itself and had collapsed.Virtual currency is just 1's and 0's on a computer (our real currency is more like that now than it ever was).
How easy would it be to create the equivalent of glass beads in our virtual wampum on-line society?</sentencetext>
</comment>
<comment>
	<id>http://www.semanticweb.org/ontologies/ConversationInstances.owl#comment10_01_19_1653240.30826362</id>
	<title>game of skill and your take is a bet / Prize and y</title>
	<author>Joe The Dragon</author>
	<datestamp>1263904320000</datestamp>
	<modclass>None</modclass>
	<modscore>1</modscore>
	<htmltext><p>game of skill and your take is a bet / Prize and you can lose if you lose. But it then may fail under gambling laws / other laws. To the point of this game is not legal in this state.</p><p>Will there be a NJ ver of WOW and other games like it? like there are for skill arcade redemption games? NGC will have to take a look at the game code be for it can be played in NV?</p></htmltext>
<tokenext>game of skill and your take is a bet / Prize and you can lose if you lose .
But it then may fail under gambling laws / other laws .
To the point of this game is not legal in this state.Will there be a NJ ver of WOW and other games like it ?
like there are for skill arcade redemption games ?
NGC will have to take a look at the game code be for it can be played in NV ?</tokentext>
<sentencetext>game of skill and your take is a bet / Prize and you can lose if you lose.
But it then may fail under gambling laws / other laws.
To the point of this game is not legal in this state.Will there be a NJ ver of WOW and other games like it?
like there are for skill arcade redemption games?
NGC will have to take a look at the game code be for it can be played in NV?</sentencetext>
	<parent>http://www.semanticweb.org/ontologies/ConversationInstances.owl#comment10_01_19_1653240.30823530</parent>
</comment>
<comment>
	<id>http://www.semanticweb.org/ontologies/ConversationInstances.owl#comment10_01_19_1653240.30823234</id>
	<title>Re:Legal?</title>
	<author>hitmark</author>
	<datestamp>1263932940000</datestamp>
	<modclass>None</modclass>
	<modscore>1</modscore>
	<htmltext><p>technically, the only thing that makes a currency "legal" is if a national leadership will accept it as payment for taxes.</p><p>anything else is basically a IOU for services or products.</p><p>hell, as most money is being circulated electronically these days, i cant really tell a diff between virtual and real money any more.</p></htmltext>
<tokenext>technically , the only thing that makes a currency " legal " is if a national leadership will accept it as payment for taxes.anything else is basically a IOU for services or products.hell , as most money is being circulated electronically these days , i cant really tell a diff between virtual and real money any more .</tokentext>
<sentencetext>technically, the only thing that makes a currency "legal" is if a national leadership will accept it as payment for taxes.anything else is basically a IOU for services or products.hell, as most money is being circulated electronically these days, i cant really tell a diff between virtual and real money any more.</sentencetext>
	<parent>http://www.semanticweb.org/ontologies/ConversationInstances.owl#comment10_01_19_1653240.30822326</parent>
</comment>
<comment>
	<id>http://www.semanticweb.org/ontologies/ConversationInstances.owl#comment10_01_19_1653240.30822450</id>
	<title>RMTs?</title>
	<author>Anonymous</author>
	<datestamp>1263930180000</datestamp>
	<modclass>Offtopic</modclass>
	<modscore>-1</modscore>
	<htmltext><p><i>This could have sweeping implications for RMT operations the world over,</i></p><p>I don't see how this would have an effect on Registered Massage Therapists.  Although it may have an effect for Unregistered Massage Therapists, especially since its Korea doing it.</p></htmltext>
<tokenext>This could have sweeping implications for RMT operations the world over,I do n't see how this would have an effect on Registered Massage Therapists .
Although it may have an effect for Unregistered Massage Therapists , especially since its Korea doing it .</tokentext>
<sentencetext>This could have sweeping implications for RMT operations the world over,I don't see how this would have an effect on Registered Massage Therapists.
Although it may have an effect for Unregistered Massage Therapists, especially since its Korea doing it.</sentencetext>
</comment>
<comment>
	<id>http://www.semanticweb.org/ontologies/ConversationInstances.owl#comment10_01_19_1653240.30823950</id>
	<title>Re:The real reason</title>
	<author>Knara</author>
	<datestamp>1263892980000</datestamp>
	<modclass>None</modclass>
	<modscore>1</modscore>
	<htmltext>Over in one.  Good show.</htmltext>
<tokenext>Over in one .
Good show .</tokentext>
<sentencetext>Over in one.
Good show.</sentencetext>
	<parent>http://www.semanticweb.org/ontologies/ConversationInstances.owl#comment10_01_19_1653240.30822238</parent>
</comment>
<comment>
	<id>http://www.semanticweb.org/ontologies/ConversationInstances.owl#comment10_01_19_1653240.30823314</id>
	<title>Re:Sweet!</title>
	<author>PGOER</author>
	<datestamp>1263933300000</datestamp>
	<modclass>None</modclass>
	<modscore>0</modscore>
	<htmltext>Does this mean I can write off my time in the virtual brothels... er... I mean, massage therrapests?  Will I have to claim the +50 gold pieces as income?  Where do I fill that in on the W2 form?  I think my next character is going to be 10th LVL Accountant.</htmltext>
<tokenext>Does this mean I can write off my time in the virtual brothels... er... I mean , massage therrapests ?
Will I have to claim the + 50 gold pieces as income ?
Where do I fill that in on the W2 form ?
I think my next character is going to be 10th LVL Accountant .</tokentext>
<sentencetext>Does this mean I can write off my time in the virtual brothels... er... I mean, massage therrapests?
Will I have to claim the +50 gold pieces as income?
Where do I fill that in on the W2 form?
I think my next character is going to be 10th LVL Accountant.</sentencetext>
	<parent>http://www.semanticweb.org/ontologies/ConversationInstances.owl#comment10_01_19_1653240.30822346</parent>
</comment>
<comment>
	<id>http://www.semanticweb.org/ontologies/ConversationInstances.owl#comment10_01_19_1653240.30825702</id>
	<title>Re:The real reason</title>
	<author>Naturalis Philosopho</author>
	<datestamp>1263900840000</datestamp>
	<modclass>Insightful</modclass>
	<modscore>4</modscore>
	<htmltext>I think you better take a hard look at how currency is currently issued by real governments. It's been a long time since the gold and silver standards made money even somewhat real, and even longer since a piece of eight made money ultimately real. Heck, an argument could be made that outside of barter we all use the equivalent of star trek type credits already. All the courts are really saying here is that online currency is a form of property like any other than can be bought and sold.</htmltext>
<tokenext>I think you better take a hard look at how currency is currently issued by real governments .
It 's been a long time since the gold and silver standards made money even somewhat real , and even longer since a piece of eight made money ultimately real .
Heck , an argument could be made that outside of barter we all use the equivalent of star trek type credits already .
All the courts are really saying here is that online currency is a form of property like any other than can be bought and sold .</tokentext>
<sentencetext>I think you better take a hard look at how currency is currently issued by real governments.
It's been a long time since the gold and silver standards made money even somewhat real, and even longer since a piece of eight made money ultimately real.
Heck, an argument could be made that outside of barter we all use the equivalent of star trek type credits already.
All the courts are really saying here is that online currency is a form of property like any other than can be bought and sold.</sentencetext>
	<parent>http://www.semanticweb.org/ontologies/ConversationInstances.owl#comment10_01_19_1653240.30822654</parent>
</comment>
<comment>
	<id>http://www.semanticweb.org/ontologies/ConversationInstances.owl#comment10_01_19_1653240.30824194</id>
	<title>Re:PVP and thieving...</title>
	<author>ThosLives</author>
	<datestamp>1263894060000</datestamp>
	<modclass>None</modclass>
	<modscore>1</modscore>
	<htmltext><p>Personally I think it makes sense to tax transactions from real-world currency to game-world currency.  Essentially this is because the person trading real-world currency for some in-game asset is essentially purchasing the labor of the person who allocated those in-game resources.</p><p>What gets seriously complicated though is when you consider transactions that take place entirely within the confines of the game universe. Consider one player where a player spends time to get in-game currency units, and another who spends time to create an in-game item, and they exchange.  If this was in the "real world" something like VAT or sales tax would be levied. The question is - what tax would be levied in the virtual world? The pithy comments like "when I can pay my taxes with in-game assets..." are actually pretty insightful.</p><p>Essentially trading real currency for virtual assets is like paying a performer at a concert: you can convert currency into entertainment but you can't really convert that entertainment into anything else.</p><p>For taxation of all in-game transactions, you'd have to have some mechanism to convert in-game activities back into real-world currency in some reasonable manner. Consider someone singing to themselves in their home: the person is creating "entertainment assets" but should those be taxed? What about if they are singing for their friends? This would be my argument against taxing sole in-game transactions.</p><p>Requiring taxes for all transactions would essentially force all game participants into real money traders, because they would have to sell assets to obtain currency to pay taxes (since game assets are not fungible like real-world currency).  Either that or, terribly, people would have to pay out-of-pocket for their in-game "assets" which would be a hard pill to swallow. In fact, I'd assert that the latter would either put all virtual games out of business, or at best severely limit their business, or cause all game-players to essentially be relabeled criminals.</p></htmltext>
<tokenext>Personally I think it makes sense to tax transactions from real-world currency to game-world currency .
Essentially this is because the person trading real-world currency for some in-game asset is essentially purchasing the labor of the person who allocated those in-game resources.What gets seriously complicated though is when you consider transactions that take place entirely within the confines of the game universe .
Consider one player where a player spends time to get in-game currency units , and another who spends time to create an in-game item , and they exchange .
If this was in the " real world " something like VAT or sales tax would be levied .
The question is - what tax would be levied in the virtual world ?
The pithy comments like " when I can pay my taxes with in-game assets... " are actually pretty insightful.Essentially trading real currency for virtual assets is like paying a performer at a concert : you can convert currency into entertainment but you ca n't really convert that entertainment into anything else.For taxation of all in-game transactions , you 'd have to have some mechanism to convert in-game activities back into real-world currency in some reasonable manner .
Consider someone singing to themselves in their home : the person is creating " entertainment assets " but should those be taxed ?
What about if they are singing for their friends ?
This would be my argument against taxing sole in-game transactions.Requiring taxes for all transactions would essentially force all game participants into real money traders , because they would have to sell assets to obtain currency to pay taxes ( since game assets are not fungible like real-world currency ) .
Either that or , terribly , people would have to pay out-of-pocket for their in-game " assets " which would be a hard pill to swallow .
In fact , I 'd assert that the latter would either put all virtual games out of business , or at best severely limit their business , or cause all game-players to essentially be relabeled criminals .</tokentext>
<sentencetext>Personally I think it makes sense to tax transactions from real-world currency to game-world currency.
Essentially this is because the person trading real-world currency for some in-game asset is essentially purchasing the labor of the person who allocated those in-game resources.What gets seriously complicated though is when you consider transactions that take place entirely within the confines of the game universe.
Consider one player where a player spends time to get in-game currency units, and another who spends time to create an in-game item, and they exchange.
If this was in the "real world" something like VAT or sales tax would be levied.
The question is - what tax would be levied in the virtual world?
The pithy comments like "when I can pay my taxes with in-game assets..." are actually pretty insightful.Essentially trading real currency for virtual assets is like paying a performer at a concert: you can convert currency into entertainment but you can't really convert that entertainment into anything else.For taxation of all in-game transactions, you'd have to have some mechanism to convert in-game activities back into real-world currency in some reasonable manner.
Consider someone singing to themselves in their home: the person is creating "entertainment assets" but should those be taxed?
What about if they are singing for their friends?
This would be my argument against taxing sole in-game transactions.Requiring taxes for all transactions would essentially force all game participants into real money traders, because they would have to sell assets to obtain currency to pay taxes (since game assets are not fungible like real-world currency).
Either that or, terribly, people would have to pay out-of-pocket for their in-game "assets" which would be a hard pill to swallow.
In fact, I'd assert that the latter would either put all virtual games out of business, or at best severely limit their business, or cause all game-players to essentially be relabeled criminals.</sentencetext>
	<parent>http://www.semanticweb.org/ontologies/ConversationInstances.owl#comment10_01_19_1653240.30822966</parent>
</comment>
<comment>
	<id>http://www.semanticweb.org/ontologies/ConversationInstances.owl#comment10_01_19_1653240.30825234</id>
	<title>so, can I go to jail for mugging someone's avatar</title>
	<author>Khashishi</author>
	<datestamp>1263898920000</datestamp>
	<modclass>None</modclass>
	<modscore>1</modscore>
	<htmltext><p>and taking their gold?</p></htmltext>
<tokenext>and taking their gold ?</tokentext>
<sentencetext>and taking their gold?</sentencetext>
</comment>
<comment>
	<id>http://www.semanticweb.org/ontologies/ConversationInstances.owl#comment10_01_19_1653240.30826254</id>
	<title>Re:The real reason</title>
	<author>Anonymous</author>
	<datestamp>1263903600000</datestamp>
	<modclass>None</modclass>
	<modscore>0</modscore>
	<htmltext><p>And why is the judicial system not a branch of the government?</p></htmltext>
<tokenext>And why is the judicial system not a branch of the government ?</tokentext>
<sentencetext>And why is the judicial system not a branch of the government?</sentencetext>
	<parent>http://www.semanticweb.org/ontologies/ConversationInstances.owl#comment10_01_19_1653240.30822718</parent>
</comment>
<comment>
	<id>http://www.semanticweb.org/ontologies/ConversationInstances.owl#comment10_01_19_1653240.30823720</id>
	<title>Re:PVP and thieving...</title>
	<author>KWolfe81</author>
	<datestamp>1263891900000</datestamp>
	<modclass>None</modclass>
	<modscore>1</modscore>
	<htmltext>Yup.  So in the future, feel free to kill people online, just make sure you don't rob from their cold dead corpses...</htmltext>
<tokenext>Yup .
So in the future , feel free to kill people online , just make sure you do n't rob from their cold dead corpses.. .</tokentext>
<sentencetext>Yup.
So in the future, feel free to kill people online, just make sure you don't rob from their cold dead corpses...</sentencetext>
	<parent>http://www.semanticweb.org/ontologies/ConversationInstances.owl#comment10_01_19_1653240.30822966</parent>
</comment>
<comment>
	<id>http://www.semanticweb.org/ontologies/ConversationInstances.owl#comment10_01_19_1653240.30822348</id>
	<title>What implications will this have for the Won?</title>
	<author>suso</author>
	<datestamp>1263929820000</datestamp>
	<modclass>Insightful</modclass>
	<modscore>2</modscore>
	<htmltext><p>I wonder if this will make the value of the South Korean Won drop.  Because it would almost make it possible to print money. Of course I guess you'd just need to value different game's currencies differently and then have published exchange rates.  Its interesting.</p></htmltext>
<tokenext>I wonder if this will make the value of the South Korean Won drop .
Because it would almost make it possible to print money .
Of course I guess you 'd just need to value different game 's currencies differently and then have published exchange rates .
Its interesting .</tokentext>
<sentencetext>I wonder if this will make the value of the South Korean Won drop.
Because it would almost make it possible to print money.
Of course I guess you'd just need to value different game's currencies differently and then have published exchange rates.
Its interesting.</sentencetext>
</comment>
<comment>
	<id>http://www.semanticweb.org/ontologies/ConversationInstances.owl#comment10_01_19_1653240.30822544</id>
	<title>Criminal charges for "steeling" gold?</title>
	<author>Anonymous</author>
	<datestamp>1263930420000</datestamp>
	<modclass>None</modclass>
	<modscore>0</modscore>
	<htmltext><p>So hacking an account and taking someones gold is now a criminal act the same as mugging is?  Cool!</p></htmltext>
<tokenext>So hacking an account and taking someones gold is now a criminal act the same as mugging is ?
Cool !</tokentext>
<sentencetext>So hacking an account and taking someones gold is now a criminal act the same as mugging is?
Cool!</sentencetext>
</comment>
<comment>
	<id>http://www.semanticweb.org/ontologies/ConversationInstances.owl#comment10_01_19_1653240.30827364</id>
	<title>Re:The real reason</title>
	<author>MBraynard</author>
	<datestamp>1263912180000</datestamp>
	<modclass>None</modclass>
	<modscore>1</modscore>
	<htmltext>Only if you can pay the taxes with ingame currency, too.</htmltext>
<tokenext>Only if you can pay the taxes with ingame currency , too .</tokentext>
<sentencetext>Only if you can pay the taxes with ingame currency, too.</sentencetext>
	<parent>http://www.semanticweb.org/ontologies/ConversationInstances.owl#comment10_01_19_1653240.30822238</parent>
</comment>
<comment>
	<id>http://www.semanticweb.org/ontologies/ConversationInstances.owl#comment10_01_19_1653240.30824496</id>
	<title>Re:Legal?</title>
	<author>Dalambertian</author>
	<datestamp>1263895560000</datestamp>
	<modclass>None</modclass>
	<modscore>1</modscore>
	<htmltext>Speaking of the gold standard, is it too late to start the Joule standard? As in, $1 would be worth exactly 5MJ (or something similar). Would it help/hurt the world's economy?</htmltext>
<tokenext>Speaking of the gold standard , is it too late to start the Joule standard ?
As in , $ 1 would be worth exactly 5MJ ( or something similar ) .
Would it help/hurt the world 's economy ?</tokentext>
<sentencetext>Speaking of the gold standard, is it too late to start the Joule standard?
As in, $1 would be worth exactly 5MJ (or something similar).
Would it help/hurt the world's economy?</sentencetext>
	<parent>http://www.semanticweb.org/ontologies/ConversationInstances.owl#comment10_01_19_1653240.30822326</parent>
</comment>
<comment>
	<id>http://www.semanticweb.org/ontologies/ConversationInstances.owl#comment10_01_19_1653240.30822848</id>
	<title>Money for nothing....</title>
	<author>Anonymous</author>
	<datestamp>1263931380000</datestamp>
	<modclass>None</modclass>
	<modscore>1</modscore>
	<htmltext><p>Virtual = Not real.</p><p>From <a href="http://dictionary.reference.com/browse/virtual" title="reference.com">http://dictionary.reference.com/browse/virtual</a> [reference.com]<br>(Just one of many definitions)<br>Existing or resulting in essence or effect though not in actual fact, form, or name: the virtual extinction of the buffalo.</p><p>Scenario<br>You lend person A $20.00, they repay you with electronic credits or virtual gaming money.  What if you don't play electronic games?  The owner of the game company doesn't give you the physical $20.00 for relinquishing the electronic credits or electronic gaming money.  This will not bode well....</p></htmltext>
<tokenext>Virtual = Not real.From http : //dictionary.reference.com/browse/virtual [ reference.com ] ( Just one of many definitions ) Existing or resulting in essence or effect though not in actual fact , form , or name : the virtual extinction of the buffalo.ScenarioYou lend person A $ 20.00 , they repay you with electronic credits or virtual gaming money .
What if you do n't play electronic games ?
The owner of the game company does n't give you the physical $ 20.00 for relinquishing the electronic credits or electronic gaming money .
This will not bode well... .</tokentext>
<sentencetext>Virtual = Not real.From http://dictionary.reference.com/browse/virtual [reference.com](Just one of many definitions)Existing or resulting in essence or effect though not in actual fact, form, or name: the virtual extinction of the buffalo.ScenarioYou lend person A $20.00, they repay you with electronic credits or virtual gaming money.
What if you don't play electronic games?
The owner of the game company doesn't give you the physical $20.00 for relinquishing the electronic credits or electronic gaming money.
This will not bode well....</sentencetext>
</comment>
<comment>
	<id>http://www.semanticweb.org/ontologies/ConversationInstances.owl#comment10_01_19_1653240.30822570</id>
	<title>Re:Currency value manipulation</title>
	<author>Opportunist</author>
	<datestamp>1263930480000</datestamp>
	<modclass>None</modclass>
	<modscore>1</modscore>
	<htmltext><p>Only 'cause it's the US that's doing it. C'mon, how long have you been on this planet that you don't know that?</p></htmltext>
<tokenext>Only 'cause it 's the US that 's doing it .
C'mon , how long have you been on this planet that you do n't know that ?</tokentext>
<sentencetext>Only 'cause it's the US that's doing it.
C'mon, how long have you been on this planet that you don't know that?</sentencetext>
	<parent>http://www.semanticweb.org/ontologies/ConversationInstances.owl#comment10_01_19_1653240.30822312</parent>
</comment>
<comment>
	<id>http://www.semanticweb.org/ontologies/ConversationInstances.owl#comment10_01_19_1653240.30823008</id>
	<title>Re:Not really surprising</title>
	<author>pclminion</author>
	<datestamp>1263931980000</datestamp>
	<modclass>Insightful</modclass>
	<modscore>5</modscore>
	<htmltext><p> <em>their currency is just as virtual as online virtual currency -- it has no actual intrinsic value.</em> </p><p>Neither does real gold, unless you happen to need to make really really thin wires, or build something which is extremely reflective, or actually make use of gold's natural properties in some other way. Don't delude yourself. There is no such thing as "intrinsic value."</p></htmltext>
<tokenext>their currency is just as virtual as online virtual currency -- it has no actual intrinsic value .
Neither does real gold , unless you happen to need to make really really thin wires , or build something which is extremely reflective , or actually make use of gold 's natural properties in some other way .
Do n't delude yourself .
There is no such thing as " intrinsic value .
"</tokentext>
<sentencetext> their currency is just as virtual as online virtual currency -- it has no actual intrinsic value.
Neither does real gold, unless you happen to need to make really really thin wires, or build something which is extremely reflective, or actually make use of gold's natural properties in some other way.
Don't delude yourself.
There is no such thing as "intrinsic value.
"</sentencetext>
	<parent>http://www.semanticweb.org/ontologies/ConversationInstances.owl#comment10_01_19_1653240.30822470</parent>
</comment>
<comment>
	<id>http://www.semanticweb.org/ontologies/ConversationInstances.owl#comment10_01_19_1653240.30822814</id>
	<title>What about FOREX?</title>
	<author>tacokill</author>
	<datestamp>1263931320000</datestamp>
	<modclass>None</modclass>
	<modscore>1</modscore>
	<htmltext>So I can trade these currencies on any one of a number of currency exchanges, such as Forex?  (/sarchasm)
<br>
<br>
I am recalling all of the statutory and regulatory requirements for currency traders.  It goes without saying, they are substantial.  Does that mean each player in the game needs to be regulated as a currency trader and follow the same regulatory requirements?   What if you have multiple accounts?  Does that mean you are now a hedge fund with a whole new set of regs?  Can I go short on these currencies?  If so, how would the mechanics of that work?  etc, etc, etc....
<br>
<br>
Lastly, what safeguards are in place to make sure it is a fair marketplace and noone can "corner the market" or otherwise manipulate it in an illegal way?
<br>
<br>
With about 5 minutes of armchair regulatory and legal analysis I can already see this is going to have significant unintended consequences.
<br>
(Bonus points:  Currency traders --- what other regs do you have to follow that would not work on a virtual currency in a game?)</htmltext>
<tokenext>So I can trade these currencies on any one of a number of currency exchanges , such as Forex ?
( /sarchasm ) I am recalling all of the statutory and regulatory requirements for currency traders .
It goes without saying , they are substantial .
Does that mean each player in the game needs to be regulated as a currency trader and follow the same regulatory requirements ?
What if you have multiple accounts ?
Does that mean you are now a hedge fund with a whole new set of regs ?
Can I go short on these currencies ?
If so , how would the mechanics of that work ?
etc , etc , etc... . Lastly , what safeguards are in place to make sure it is a fair marketplace and noone can " corner the market " or otherwise manipulate it in an illegal way ?
With about 5 minutes of armchair regulatory and legal analysis I can already see this is going to have significant unintended consequences .
( Bonus points : Currency traders --- what other regs do you have to follow that would not work on a virtual currency in a game ?
)</tokentext>
<sentencetext>So I can trade these currencies on any one of a number of currency exchanges, such as Forex?
(/sarchasm)


I am recalling all of the statutory and regulatory requirements for currency traders.
It goes without saying, they are substantial.
Does that mean each player in the game needs to be regulated as a currency trader and follow the same regulatory requirements?
What if you have multiple accounts?
Does that mean you are now a hedge fund with a whole new set of regs?
Can I go short on these currencies?
If so, how would the mechanics of that work?
etc, etc, etc....


Lastly, what safeguards are in place to make sure it is a fair marketplace and noone can "corner the market" or otherwise manipulate it in an illegal way?
With about 5 minutes of armchair regulatory and legal analysis I can already see this is going to have significant unintended consequences.
(Bonus points:  Currency traders --- what other regs do you have to follow that would not work on a virtual currency in a game?
)</sentencetext>
</comment>
<comment>
	<id>http://www.semanticweb.org/ontologies/ConversationInstances.owl#comment10_01_19_1653240.30822628</id>
	<title>MARINA.</title>
	<author>Qui-Gon Jinn</author>
	<datestamp>1263930720000</datestamp>
	<modclass>Funny</modclass>
	<modscore>2</modscore>
	<htmltext><p>Transfer all your WoW gold to me, for me.</p></htmltext>
<tokenext>Transfer all your WoW gold to me , for me .</tokentext>
<sentencetext>Transfer all your WoW gold to me, for me.</sentencetext>
</comment>
<comment>
	<id>http://www.semanticweb.org/ontologies/ConversationInstances.owl#comment10_01_19_1653240.30826474</id>
	<title>Re:Guaranteed by Whom?</title>
	<author>evilWurst</author>
	<datestamp>1263904860000</datestamp>
	<modclass>None</modclass>
	<modscore>1</modscore>
	<htmltext><p>Virtual inflation by 'printing' more money isn't what I'd worry about; it's already an existing problem with paper money (see Zimbabwe for just how bad it can get in the present day).</p><p>What I'd worry about is the unstable transition back from virtual to real. For starters, data is easier to lose than paper, through software and hardware faults and hacks. But more in the forefront is that buying physical stuff with virtual money is hard (unless it's government backed by the equivalent value of official paper money, at a fixed rate). WoW gold won't get me cereal at the supermarket, and 100\% of it evaporates in a puff of smoke if Blizzard folds.</p><p>And in a system of limited trade between virtual money and real goods, it kind of has all the flaws of a potential bank run; if there's any threat to the value of the virtual currency, some physical vendors will stop accepting it, triggering a run on the ones that still do as everyone tries to convert their maybe-soon-worthless digital latinum into tangible stuff. So you end up ruining indvidual accouts, the game economy, AND the physical vendors who got caught holding the bag of bits when the music stopped.</p></htmltext>
<tokenext>Virtual inflation by 'printing ' more money is n't what I 'd worry about ; it 's already an existing problem with paper money ( see Zimbabwe for just how bad it can get in the present day ) .What I 'd worry about is the unstable transition back from virtual to real .
For starters , data is easier to lose than paper , through software and hardware faults and hacks .
But more in the forefront is that buying physical stuff with virtual money is hard ( unless it 's government backed by the equivalent value of official paper money , at a fixed rate ) .
WoW gold wo n't get me cereal at the supermarket , and 100 \ % of it evaporates in a puff of smoke if Blizzard folds.And in a system of limited trade between virtual money and real goods , it kind of has all the flaws of a potential bank run ; if there 's any threat to the value of the virtual currency , some physical vendors will stop accepting it , triggering a run on the ones that still do as everyone tries to convert their maybe-soon-worthless digital latinum into tangible stuff .
So you end up ruining indvidual accouts , the game economy , AND the physical vendors who got caught holding the bag of bits when the music stopped .</tokentext>
<sentencetext>Virtual inflation by 'printing' more money isn't what I'd worry about; it's already an existing problem with paper money (see Zimbabwe for just how bad it can get in the present day).What I'd worry about is the unstable transition back from virtual to real.
For starters, data is easier to lose than paper, through software and hardware faults and hacks.
But more in the forefront is that buying physical stuff with virtual money is hard (unless it's government backed by the equivalent value of official paper money, at a fixed rate).
WoW gold won't get me cereal at the supermarket, and 100\% of it evaporates in a puff of smoke if Blizzard folds.And in a system of limited trade between virtual money and real goods, it kind of has all the flaws of a potential bank run; if there's any threat to the value of the virtual currency, some physical vendors will stop accepting it, triggering a run on the ones that still do as everyone tries to convert their maybe-soon-worthless digital latinum into tangible stuff.
So you end up ruining indvidual accouts, the game economy, AND the physical vendors who got caught holding the bag of bits when the music stopped.</sentencetext>
	<parent>http://www.semanticweb.org/ontologies/ConversationInstances.owl#comment10_01_19_1653240.30822474</parent>
</comment>
<comment>
	<id>http://www.semanticweb.org/ontologies/ConversationInstances.owl#comment10_01_19_1653240.30824066</id>
	<title>Re:Not really surprising</title>
	<author>FatdogHaiku</author>
	<datestamp>1263893460000</datestamp>
	<modclass>None</modclass>
	<modscore>1</modscore>
	<htmltext><p><div class="quote"><p> <em>their currency is just as virtual as online virtual currency -- it has no actual intrinsic value.</em> </p><p>Neither does real gold, unless you happen to need to make really really thin wires, or build something which is extremely reflective, or actually make use of gold's natural properties in some other way. Don't delude yourself. There is no such thing as "intrinsic value."</p></div><p>While intrinsic value may be illusory,  actual value is not. You pointed out a very few of golds finer points (missing my number one which is very good conductivity and number two which is an awesome resistance to corrosion), but the fact that it IS so useful along it's relative scarcity make it worth having even if you personally have no application for it. It can be sold or traded for almost anything, and if things get real bad you could cast it into bullets (for shooting your more upper class werewolves perhaps). <br> <br>The utility and  scarcity of commodities give them inherent, if fluctuating, value.</p></div>
	</htmltext>
<tokenext>their currency is just as virtual as online virtual currency -- it has no actual intrinsic value .
Neither does real gold , unless you happen to need to make really really thin wires , or build something which is extremely reflective , or actually make use of gold 's natural properties in some other way .
Do n't delude yourself .
There is no such thing as " intrinsic value .
" While intrinsic value may be illusory , actual value is not .
You pointed out a very few of golds finer points ( missing my number one which is very good conductivity and number two which is an awesome resistance to corrosion ) , but the fact that it IS so useful along it 's relative scarcity make it worth having even if you personally have no application for it .
It can be sold or traded for almost anything , and if things get real bad you could cast it into bullets ( for shooting your more upper class werewolves perhaps ) .
The utility and scarcity of commodities give them inherent , if fluctuating , value .</tokentext>
<sentencetext> their currency is just as virtual as online virtual currency -- it has no actual intrinsic value.
Neither does real gold, unless you happen to need to make really really thin wires, or build something which is extremely reflective, or actually make use of gold's natural properties in some other way.
Don't delude yourself.
There is no such thing as "intrinsic value.
"While intrinsic value may be illusory,  actual value is not.
You pointed out a very few of golds finer points (missing my number one which is very good conductivity and number two which is an awesome resistance to corrosion), but the fact that it IS so useful along it's relative scarcity make it worth having even if you personally have no application for it.
It can be sold or traded for almost anything, and if things get real bad you could cast it into bullets (for shooting your more upper class werewolves perhaps).
The utility and  scarcity of commodities give them inherent, if fluctuating, value.
	</sentencetext>
	<parent>http://www.semanticweb.org/ontologies/ConversationInstances.owl#comment10_01_19_1653240.30823008</parent>
</comment>
<comment>
	<id>http://www.semanticweb.org/ontologies/ConversationInstances.owl#comment10_01_19_1653240.30828386</id>
	<title>Re:So that means WoW gold is legal tender?</title>
	<author>Anonymous</author>
	<datestamp>1263922200000</datestamp>
	<modclass>None</modclass>
	<modscore>0</modscore>
	<htmltext>Bobby Kotick would cream himself if he got a licence to print WoW money.</htmltext>
<tokenext>Bobby Kotick would cream himself if he got a licence to print WoW money .</tokentext>
<sentencetext>Bobby Kotick would cream himself if he got a licence to print WoW money.</sentencetext>
	<parent>http://www.semanticweb.org/ontologies/ConversationInstances.owl#comment10_01_19_1653240.30822482</parent>
</comment>
<comment>
	<id>http://www.semanticweb.org/ontologies/ConversationInstances.owl#comment10_01_19_1653240.30823648</id>
	<title>Re:If this remains the case</title>
	<author>KitsuneSoftware</author>
	<datestamp>1263891600000</datestamp>
	<modclass>None</modclass>
	<modscore>1</modscore>
	<htmltext><p>It's not a question of cryptography, it's a question of accounting. Consider:</p><ol> <li>Alice creates a character in <em>"Second World of Runes Online"</em>.</li><li>Alice starts of with 10 gold pieces.</li><li>Alice has a memory poking tool, and uses it to change that 10gp into (1&lt;&lt;31)gp.</li></ol><p>If the game is written <strong>badly</strong>, it will let Alice get away with this. If the game is written <strong>properly</strong>, the server isn't listening to her client, and will only let her spend 10gp no matter what her client claims to have. For reasons of supply and demand, I am sure that every MMOG that has ever suffered from gold farmers is written properly in this regard.</p></htmltext>
<tokenext>It 's not a question of cryptography , it 's a question of accounting .
Consider : Alice creates a character in " Second World of Runes Online " .Alice starts of with 10 gold pieces.Alice has a memory poking tool , and uses it to change that 10gp into ( 1If the game is written badly , it will let Alice get away with this .
If the game is written properly , the server is n't listening to her client , and will only let her spend 10gp no matter what her client claims to have .
For reasons of supply and demand , I am sure that every MMOG that has ever suffered from gold farmers is written properly in this regard .</tokentext>
<sentencetext>It's not a question of cryptography, it's a question of accounting.
Consider: Alice creates a character in "Second World of Runes Online".Alice starts of with 10 gold pieces.Alice has a memory poking tool, and uses it to change that 10gp into (1If the game is written badly, it will let Alice get away with this.
If the game is written properly, the server isn't listening to her client, and will only let her spend 10gp no matter what her client claims to have.
For reasons of supply and demand, I am sure that every MMOG that has ever suffered from gold farmers is written properly in this regard.</sentencetext>
	<parent>http://www.semanticweb.org/ontologies/ConversationInstances.owl#comment10_01_19_1653240.30822366</parent>
</comment>
<comment>
	<id>http://www.semanticweb.org/ontologies/ConversationInstances.owl#comment10_01_19_1653240.30837546</id>
	<title>Re:So that means WoW gold is legal tender?</title>
	<author>Opportunist</author>
	<datestamp>1263982020000</datestamp>
	<modclass>None</modclass>
	<modscore>1</modscore>
	<htmltext><p>All right and fine, but the Fed will not simply shut down the US if it doesn't deem it profitable anymore.</p><p>Be afraid if they could...</p></htmltext>
<tokenext>All right and fine , but the Fed will not simply shut down the US if it does n't deem it profitable anymore.Be afraid if they could.. .</tokentext>
<sentencetext>All right and fine, but the Fed will not simply shut down the US if it doesn't deem it profitable anymore.Be afraid if they could...</sentencetext>
	<parent>http://www.semanticweb.org/ontologies/ConversationInstances.owl#comment10_01_19_1653240.30822986</parent>
</comment>
<comment>
	<id>http://www.semanticweb.org/ontologies/ConversationInstances.owl#comment10_01_19_1653240.30823774</id>
	<title>Re:Money for nothing....</title>
	<author>Anonymous</author>
	<datestamp>1263892140000</datestamp>
	<modclass>None</modclass>
	<modscore>0</modscore>
	<htmltext><p>bad example - what if your local trade is using seashells? 20 bucks printed on paper are equally worthless if you don't play in the same economic sandbox.</p></htmltext>
<tokenext>bad example - what if your local trade is using seashells ?
20 bucks printed on paper are equally worthless if you do n't play in the same economic sandbox .</tokentext>
<sentencetext>bad example - what if your local trade is using seashells?
20 bucks printed on paper are equally worthless if you don't play in the same economic sandbox.</sentencetext>
	<parent>http://www.semanticweb.org/ontologies/ConversationInstances.owl#comment10_01_19_1653240.30822848</parent>
</comment>
<comment>
	<id>http://www.semanticweb.org/ontologies/ConversationInstances.owl#comment10_01_19_1653240.30823886</id>
	<title>real</title>
	<author>Anonymous</author>
	<datestamp>1263892620000</datestamp>
	<modclass>None</modclass>
	<modscore>0</modscore>
	<htmltext><p>shit just got real</p></htmltext>
<tokenext>shit just got real</tokentext>
<sentencetext>shit just got real</sentencetext>
</comment>
<comment>
	<id>http://www.semanticweb.org/ontologies/ConversationInstances.owl#comment10_01_19_1653240.30824196</id>
	<title>From someone who lived there, snake oil?</title>
	<author>Anonymous</author>
	<datestamp>1263894060000</datestamp>
	<modclass>Informativ</modclass>
	<modscore>1</modscore>
	<htmltext><p>yes there is: food, air, fresh water, security for your family, comfortable shelter, tools, transportation, fuel, weapons. They are the real currencies of the world.<br>&amp; btw knowing the xenophobic Koreans, they can use this in 2 ways to screw over foreigner living in their coutry (which the little racists tend to do)</p><p>1. Devaluation of in-game credit strategy: They can specify in a contract that you be paid in a legal tender to the value of xx korean won.<br>
&nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; Of course this would mean you're paid partly in in-game currency. As it devalues, u have nothing. This is exactly what I'd expect from Korean people who are unmatched in treachery. Only the Cambodians are more treacherous. They could always revert to this strategy if things went sour. They're Koreans!</p><p>2. Inflation of in-game credit strategy: This would imply that foreigners would never be allowed to get the in-game currency. Koreans would rush to buy the in-game currency and dump won, perhaps to increase economic competitiveness with China through a cheaper won. Crazy as it sounds, Koreans do things in a one for all and all for one way just like this. The danger with this is, you could end up hurting your domestic economy as if the in-game currency collapsed with a panic, mmorpg players (usually the poorer element of Korean society) would become more poor and buy even less mp3 players and hand-held gadgets and other things that mmorpg players buy.<br>Strangely enough, this seems more likely, as foreigners are already forbidden from being members of Korean-based email, chat, and mmorpg sites! I used to live there! It's a xenophobic society.</p><p>My analysis:<br>Koreans operate socially on the jung system. If you're family you're sacred, otherwise you're less than shit. 'Compassion' in Korea doesn't exist in the way we understand it - it's just nepotism, family, old-boys clubs.<br>It's a strategy to compete with China by forcing devaluation of the Korean won (hence making exporters more competitive. If you know anything about economics, you'll know a devalued currency is always going to make your exporters cheaper.) at the expense of the poorer elements of Korean society. Korea has a track record of never giving a shi.t about it's poorer citizens/netizens so that would also fit the jigsaw puzzle. The poorer would have less money to buy Korean goods, but it's really the export market that Koreans care about anyway.<br>In summary, they're going after a devaluation strategy.</p></htmltext>
<tokenext>yes there is : food , air , fresh water , security for your family , comfortable shelter , tools , transportation , fuel , weapons .
They are the real currencies of the world.&amp; btw knowing the xenophobic Koreans , they can use this in 2 ways to screw over foreigner living in their coutry ( which the little racists tend to do ) 1 .
Devaluation of in-game credit strategy : They can specify in a contract that you be paid in a legal tender to the value of xx korean won .
      Of course this would mean you 're paid partly in in-game currency .
As it devalues , u have nothing .
This is exactly what I 'd expect from Korean people who are unmatched in treachery .
Only the Cambodians are more treacherous .
They could always revert to this strategy if things went sour .
They 're Koreans ! 2 .
Inflation of in-game credit strategy : This would imply that foreigners would never be allowed to get the in-game currency .
Koreans would rush to buy the in-game currency and dump won , perhaps to increase economic competitiveness with China through a cheaper won .
Crazy as it sounds , Koreans do things in a one for all and all for one way just like this .
The danger with this is , you could end up hurting your domestic economy as if the in-game currency collapsed with a panic , mmorpg players ( usually the poorer element of Korean society ) would become more poor and buy even less mp3 players and hand-held gadgets and other things that mmorpg players buy.Strangely enough , this seems more likely , as foreigners are already forbidden from being members of Korean-based email , chat , and mmorpg sites !
I used to live there !
It 's a xenophobic society.My analysis : Koreans operate socially on the jung system .
If you 're family you 're sacred , otherwise you 're less than shit .
'Compassion ' in Korea does n't exist in the way we understand it - it 's just nepotism , family , old-boys clubs.It 's a strategy to compete with China by forcing devaluation of the Korean won ( hence making exporters more competitive .
If you know anything about economics , you 'll know a devalued currency is always going to make your exporters cheaper .
) at the expense of the poorer elements of Korean society .
Korea has a track record of never giving a shi.t about it 's poorer citizens/netizens so that would also fit the jigsaw puzzle .
The poorer would have less money to buy Korean goods , but it 's really the export market that Koreans care about anyway.In summary , they 're going after a devaluation strategy .</tokentext>
<sentencetext>yes there is: food, air, fresh water, security for your family, comfortable shelter, tools, transportation, fuel, weapons.
They are the real currencies of the world.&amp; btw knowing the xenophobic Koreans, they can use this in 2 ways to screw over foreigner living in their coutry (which the little racists tend to do)1.
Devaluation of in-game credit strategy: They can specify in a contract that you be paid in a legal tender to the value of xx korean won.
      Of course this would mean you're paid partly in in-game currency.
As it devalues, u have nothing.
This is exactly what I'd expect from Korean people who are unmatched in treachery.
Only the Cambodians are more treacherous.
They could always revert to this strategy if things went sour.
They're Koreans!2.
Inflation of in-game credit strategy: This would imply that foreigners would never be allowed to get the in-game currency.
Koreans would rush to buy the in-game currency and dump won, perhaps to increase economic competitiveness with China through a cheaper won.
Crazy as it sounds, Koreans do things in a one for all and all for one way just like this.
The danger with this is, you could end up hurting your domestic economy as if the in-game currency collapsed with a panic, mmorpg players (usually the poorer element of Korean society) would become more poor and buy even less mp3 players and hand-held gadgets and other things that mmorpg players buy.Strangely enough, this seems more likely, as foreigners are already forbidden from being members of Korean-based email, chat, and mmorpg sites!
I used to live there!
It's a xenophobic society.My analysis:Koreans operate socially on the jung system.
If you're family you're sacred, otherwise you're less than shit.
'Compassion' in Korea doesn't exist in the way we understand it - it's just nepotism, family, old-boys clubs.It's a strategy to compete with China by forcing devaluation of the Korean won (hence making exporters more competitive.
If you know anything about economics, you'll know a devalued currency is always going to make your exporters cheaper.
) at the expense of the poorer elements of Korean society.
Korea has a track record of never giving a shi.t about it's poorer citizens/netizens so that would also fit the jigsaw puzzle.
The poorer would have less money to buy Korean goods, but it's really the export market that Koreans care about anyway.In summary, they're going after a devaluation strategy.</sentencetext>
	<parent>http://www.semanticweb.org/ontologies/ConversationInstances.owl#comment10_01_19_1653240.30823008</parent>
</comment>
<comment>
	<id>http://www.semanticweb.org/ontologies/ConversationInstances.owl#comment10_01_19_1653240.30822346</id>
	<title>Sweet!</title>
	<author>Anonymous</author>
	<datestamp>1263929820000</datestamp>
	<modclass>Funny</modclass>
	<modscore>5</modscore>
	<htmltext>Every time you die in-game you can write off the armor repair costs on your taxes!</htmltext>
<tokenext>Every time you die in-game you can write off the armor repair costs on your taxes !</tokentext>
<sentencetext>Every time you die in-game you can write off the armor repair costs on your taxes!</sentencetext>
</comment>
<comment>
	<id>http://www.semanticweb.org/ontologies/ConversationInstances.owl#comment10_01_19_1653240.30823530</id>
	<title>Re:PVP and thieving...</title>
	<author>syousef</author>
	<datestamp>1263934200000</datestamp>
	<modclass>None</modclass>
	<modscore>1</modscore>
	<htmltext><p><i>So in a game such as EQ (the only MMO I've played) you could kill people (on pvp servers) and take their gold. Clearly this is part of the game, but is it something you could be arrested for now?</i></p><p>Only if you don't pay your "I just killed me a player" tax.</p></htmltext>
<tokenext>So in a game such as EQ ( the only MMO I 've played ) you could kill people ( on pvp servers ) and take their gold .
Clearly this is part of the game , but is it something you could be arrested for now ? Only if you do n't pay your " I just killed me a player " tax .</tokentext>
<sentencetext>So in a game such as EQ (the only MMO I've played) you could kill people (on pvp servers) and take their gold.
Clearly this is part of the game, but is it something you could be arrested for now?Only if you don't pay your "I just killed me a player" tax.</sentencetext>
	<parent>http://www.semanticweb.org/ontologies/ConversationInstances.owl#comment10_01_19_1653240.30822966</parent>
</comment>
<comment>
	<id>http://www.semanticweb.org/ontologies/ConversationInstances.owl#comment10_01_19_1653240.30822986</id>
	<title>Re:So that means WoW gold is legal tender?</title>
	<author>Anonymous</author>
	<datestamp>1263931920000</datestamp>
	<modclass>Interestin</modclass>
	<modscore>2</modscore>
	<htmltext><p>The supply of the US Dollar is controlled by the Federal Reserve, a private company.  It's directors are appointed by the US government, but, still, private company.  The US has been pretty bad about "letting the presses roll" over the past year or so - exchange markets sort that out very quickly.  These virtual currencies are more stable than a great many national currencies.  EvE's ISK supply is overseen by economic professionals (a smart move by the game company!), also more than can be said for some countries.</p><p>That's the thing about money - it's all pretty much BS, but it works anyway.</p></htmltext>
<tokenext>The supply of the US Dollar is controlled by the Federal Reserve , a private company .
It 's directors are appointed by the US government , but , still , private company .
The US has been pretty bad about " letting the presses roll " over the past year or so - exchange markets sort that out very quickly .
These virtual currencies are more stable than a great many national currencies .
EvE 's ISK supply is overseen by economic professionals ( a smart move by the game company !
) , also more than can be said for some countries.That 's the thing about money - it 's all pretty much BS , but it works anyway .</tokentext>
<sentencetext>The supply of the US Dollar is controlled by the Federal Reserve, a private company.
It's directors are appointed by the US government, but, still, private company.
The US has been pretty bad about "letting the presses roll" over the past year or so - exchange markets sort that out very quickly.
These virtual currencies are more stable than a great many national currencies.
EvE's ISK supply is overseen by economic professionals (a smart move by the game company!
), also more than can be said for some countries.That's the thing about money - it's all pretty much BS, but it works anyway.</sentencetext>
	<parent>http://www.semanticweb.org/ontologies/ConversationInstances.owl#comment10_01_19_1653240.30822482</parent>
</comment>
<comment>
	<id>http://www.semanticweb.org/ontologies/ConversationInstances.owl#comment10_01_19_1653240.30823218</id>
	<title>Re:Sweet!</title>
	<author>undecim</author>
	<datestamp>1263932880000</datestamp>
	<modclass>Funny</modclass>
	<modscore>2</modscore>
	<htmltext>I'm sure there are many quests in various MMOs that count as charitable donations</htmltext>
<tokenext>I 'm sure there are many quests in various MMOs that count as charitable donations</tokentext>
<sentencetext>I'm sure there are many quests in various MMOs that count as charitable donations</sentencetext>
	<parent>http://www.semanticweb.org/ontologies/ConversationInstances.owl#comment10_01_19_1653240.30822346</parent>
</comment>
<comment>
	<id>http://www.semanticweb.org/ontologies/ConversationInstances.owl#comment10_01_19_1653240.30822846</id>
	<title>Where does this lead?</title>
	<author>Anonymous</author>
	<datestamp>1263931380000</datestamp>
	<modclass>None</modclass>
	<modscore>0</modscore>
	<htmltext><p>If virtual currency now has value, a player vs player encounter where you steal someone's gold can land you in jail now for theft?<br>I can't wait until they give in game characters legal status and start charging people with murder... (though someone founding PETM [People for the Ethical Treatment of Monsters] might be amusing).</p><p>This is why realism in games continues to be a bad idea.  The next thing you know, we'll be paying real taxes on our purchases of "Gold Spear+1".</p></htmltext>
<tokenext>If virtual currency now has value , a player vs player encounter where you steal someone 's gold can land you in jail now for theft ? I ca n't wait until they give in game characters legal status and start charging people with murder... ( though someone founding PETM [ People for the Ethical Treatment of Monsters ] might be amusing ) .This is why realism in games continues to be a bad idea .
The next thing you know , we 'll be paying real taxes on our purchases of " Gold Spear + 1 " .</tokentext>
<sentencetext>If virtual currency now has value, a player vs player encounter where you steal someone's gold can land you in jail now for theft?I can't wait until they give in game characters legal status and start charging people with murder... (though someone founding PETM [People for the Ethical Treatment of Monsters] might be amusing).This is why realism in games continues to be a bad idea.
The next thing you know, we'll be paying real taxes on our purchases of "Gold Spear+1".</sentencetext>
</comment>
<comment>
	<id>http://www.semanticweb.org/ontologies/ConversationInstances.owl#comment10_01_19_1653240.30824102</id>
	<title>Re:Sweet!</title>
	<author>wtbname</author>
	<datestamp>1263893580000</datestamp>
	<modclass>None</modclass>
	<modscore>1</modscore>
	<htmltext><p>Bah,</p><p>Back in my day, your armor was collected by the person who killed you, your taxes went to a police force that only patrolled in cities, and all offenses were punishable by instant death. On the bright side, most thieves could be marked by their pure white death shroud and a propensity for sidling up next to you suspiciously.</p></htmltext>
<tokenext>Bah,Back in my day , your armor was collected by the person who killed you , your taxes went to a police force that only patrolled in cities , and all offenses were punishable by instant death .
On the bright side , most thieves could be marked by their pure white death shroud and a propensity for sidling up next to you suspiciously .</tokentext>
<sentencetext>Bah,Back in my day, your armor was collected by the person who killed you, your taxes went to a police force that only patrolled in cities, and all offenses were punishable by instant death.
On the bright side, most thieves could be marked by their pure white death shroud and a propensity for sidling up next to you suspiciously.</sentencetext>
	<parent>http://www.semanticweb.org/ontologies/ConversationInstances.owl#comment10_01_19_1653240.30822346</parent>
</comment>
<comment>
	<id>http://www.semanticweb.org/ontologies/ConversationInstances.owl#comment10_01_19_1653240.30822636</id>
	<title>Re:What implications will this have for the Won?</title>
	<author>Dr. Spork</author>
	<datestamp>1263930720000</datestamp>
	<modclass>None</modclass>
	<modscore>1</modscore>
	<htmltext>Yeah, it's just like that time when the Dollar tanked when Zimbabwe started printing those <a href="http://elainemeinelsupkis.typepad.com/ezmoneymatters/2008/04/japan-struggles.html" title="typepad.com">hundred million dollar bills</a> [typepad.com]? Oh wait, except that didn't happen at all. (Hint: nobody even suggested that there would be a fixed exchange rate between virtual currency and the Won.)</htmltext>
<tokenext>Yeah , it 's just like that time when the Dollar tanked when Zimbabwe started printing those hundred million dollar bills [ typepad.com ] ?
Oh wait , except that did n't happen at all .
( Hint : nobody even suggested that there would be a fixed exchange rate between virtual currency and the Won .
)</tokentext>
<sentencetext>Yeah, it's just like that time when the Dollar tanked when Zimbabwe started printing those hundred million dollar bills [typepad.com]?
Oh wait, except that didn't happen at all.
(Hint: nobody even suggested that there would be a fixed exchange rate between virtual currency and the Won.
)</sentencetext>
	<parent>http://www.semanticweb.org/ontologies/ConversationInstances.owl#comment10_01_19_1653240.30822348</parent>
</comment>
<comment>
	<id>http://www.semanticweb.org/ontologies/ConversationInstances.owl#comment10_01_19_1653240.30822514</id>
	<title>Re:What implications will this have for the Won?</title>
	<author>wizardforce</author>
	<datestamp>1263930360000</datestamp>
	<modclass>None</modclass>
	<modscore>1</modscore>
	<htmltext><p>No.  If the in game currency supplu increases, its value exchanged relative to the Won or any other currency for that matter, goes down.  Printing more in game currency does not decrease the value of other currencies.</p></htmltext>
<tokenext>No .
If the in game currency supplu increases , its value exchanged relative to the Won or any other currency for that matter , goes down .
Printing more in game currency does not decrease the value of other currencies .</tokentext>
<sentencetext>No.
If the in game currency supplu increases, its value exchanged relative to the Won or any other currency for that matter, goes down.
Printing more in game currency does not decrease the value of other currencies.</sentencetext>
	<parent>http://www.semanticweb.org/ontologies/ConversationInstances.owl#comment10_01_19_1653240.30822348</parent>
</comment>
<comment>
	<id>http://www.semanticweb.org/ontologies/ConversationInstances.owl#comment10_01_19_1653240.30823642</id>
	<title>Re:Legal?</title>
	<author>megamerican</author>
	<datestamp>1263934740000</datestamp>
	<modclass>None</modclass>
	<modscore>1</modscore>
	<htmltext><p>It's really only illegal if you are somewhat successful.</p><p>The FBI went after Liberty Dollar, which sold and real gold and silver coins and encouraged people and business to use them voluntarily instead of a Federal Reserve Note.</p><p>The legal tender law doesn't apply to people using other currencies in private transactions. It basically means that banks and people can't force you to pay anything but dollars on debt that you owe. However, here is a gem from the <a href="http://www.libertydollar.org/legal/pdf/06042009\_doj\_pr.pdf" title="libertydollar.org">FBI Press release:</a> [libertydollar.org] </p><p><div class="quote"><p>&ldquo;People understand that there is only one legal currency in the United States. When groups try to replace the U.S. dollar with coins and bills that don&rsquo;t hold the same value, it affects the economy. Consumers were using their hard-earned money to buy goods and services, then getting fake change in return,&rdquo; said Owen Harris, the Special Agent in Charge of the Charlotte Division of the FBI. &ldquo;No one in this country is above or beyond the law, and our law enforcement partners will continue to bring violators to justice.</p></div><p>There are so many things wrong and hilariously ironic with this statement I'll let it stand as is.</p><p>The FBI's basic argument was that the liberty dollar looked too much like "real money" and they must preserve the monopoly of the Federal Reserve to "save the economy."</p><p>Gee, thanks!</p></div>
	</htmltext>
<tokenext>It 's really only illegal if you are somewhat successful.The FBI went after Liberty Dollar , which sold and real gold and silver coins and encouraged people and business to use them voluntarily instead of a Federal Reserve Note.The legal tender law does n't apply to people using other currencies in private transactions .
It basically means that banks and people ca n't force you to pay anything but dollars on debt that you owe .
However , here is a gem from the FBI Press release : [ libertydollar.org ]    People understand that there is only one legal currency in the United States .
When groups try to replace the U.S. dollar with coins and bills that don    t hold the same value , it affects the economy .
Consumers were using their hard-earned money to buy goods and services , then getting fake change in return ,    said Owen Harris , the Special Agent in Charge of the Charlotte Division of the FBI .
   No one in this country is above or beyond the law , and our law enforcement partners will continue to bring violators to justice.There are so many things wrong and hilariously ironic with this statement I 'll let it stand as is.The FBI 's basic argument was that the liberty dollar looked too much like " real money " and they must preserve the monopoly of the Federal Reserve to " save the economy .
" Gee , thanks !</tokentext>
<sentencetext>It's really only illegal if you are somewhat successful.The FBI went after Liberty Dollar, which sold and real gold and silver coins and encouraged people and business to use them voluntarily instead of a Federal Reserve Note.The legal tender law doesn't apply to people using other currencies in private transactions.
It basically means that banks and people can't force you to pay anything but dollars on debt that you owe.
However, here is a gem from the FBI Press release: [libertydollar.org] “People understand that there is only one legal currency in the United States.
When groups try to replace the U.S. dollar with coins and bills that don’t hold the same value, it affects the economy.
Consumers were using their hard-earned money to buy goods and services, then getting fake change in return,” said Owen Harris, the Special Agent in Charge of the Charlotte Division of the FBI.
“No one in this country is above or beyond the law, and our law enforcement partners will continue to bring violators to justice.There are so many things wrong and hilariously ironic with this statement I'll let it stand as is.The FBI's basic argument was that the liberty dollar looked too much like "real money" and they must preserve the monopoly of the Federal Reserve to "save the economy.
"Gee, thanks!
	</sentencetext>
	<parent>http://www.semanticweb.org/ontologies/ConversationInstances.owl#comment10_01_19_1653240.30822326</parent>
</comment>
<comment>
	<id>http://www.semanticweb.org/ontologies/ConversationInstances.owl#comment10_01_19_1653240.30822312</id>
	<title>Currency value manipulation</title>
	<author>Anonymous</author>
	<datestamp>1263929700000</datestamp>
	<modclass>Insightful</modclass>
	<modscore>2</modscore>
	<htmltext>So we can sue Linden Labs for currency manipulation cause... oh wait the US does that all the time so I guess it's legal?</htmltext>
<tokenext>So we can sue Linden Labs for currency manipulation cause... oh wait the US does that all the time so I guess it 's legal ?</tokentext>
<sentencetext>So we can sue Linden Labs for currency manipulation cause... oh wait the US does that all the time so I guess it's legal?</sentencetext>
</comment>
<comment>
	<id>http://www.semanticweb.org/ontologies/ConversationInstances.owl#comment10_01_19_1653240.30822470</id>
	<title>Not really surprising</title>
	<author>multipart/mixed</author>
	<datestamp>1263930180000</datestamp>
	<modclass>Insightful</modclass>
	<modscore>4</modscore>
	<htmltext><p>Assuming the South Korean currency is not backed something solid (like gold), then their currency is just as virtual as online virtual currency -- it has no actual intrinsic value.</p></htmltext>
<tokenext>Assuming the South Korean currency is not backed something solid ( like gold ) , then their currency is just as virtual as online virtual currency -- it has no actual intrinsic value .</tokentext>
<sentencetext>Assuming the South Korean currency is not backed something solid (like gold), then their currency is just as virtual as online virtual currency -- it has no actual intrinsic value.</sentencetext>
</comment>
<comment>
	<id>http://www.semanticweb.org/ontologies/ConversationInstances.owl#comment10_01_19_1653240.30822612</id>
	<title>Lucrative for me, too!</title>
	<author>IndigoDarkwolf</author>
	<datestamp>1263930660000</datestamp>
	<modclass>None</modclass>
	<modscore>1</modscore>
	<htmltext>I just need to get a job at Blizzard.</htmltext>
<tokenext>I just need to get a job at Blizzard .</tokentext>
<sentencetext>I just need to get a job at Blizzard.</sentencetext>
	<parent>http://www.semanticweb.org/ontologies/ConversationInstances.owl#comment10_01_19_1653240.30822238</parent>
</comment>
<comment>
	<id>http://www.semanticweb.org/ontologies/ConversationInstances.owl#comment10_01_19_1653240.30825228</id>
	<title>Re:Legal?</title>
	<author>timeOday</author>
	<datestamp>1263898920000</datestamp>
	<modclass>None</modclass>
	<modscore>1</modscore>
	<htmltext>I'm no expert, but what definitely looks wrong to me there is the use of the word "Dollar."  If I sell you a lump of silver for $20, fine.  But if I sell you something that says "$20 dollars" on it, with the explicit (or clearly implied) promise that it will always be worth $20 USD, that is not fine.  That is forgery, because it implies the faith &amp; credit of the US govt for my made-up currency.</htmltext>
<tokenext>I 'm no expert , but what definitely looks wrong to me there is the use of the word " Dollar .
" If I sell you a lump of silver for $ 20 , fine .
But if I sell you something that says " $ 20 dollars " on it , with the explicit ( or clearly implied ) promise that it will always be worth $ 20 USD , that is not fine .
That is forgery , because it implies the faith &amp; credit of the US govt for my made-up currency .</tokentext>
<sentencetext>I'm no expert, but what definitely looks wrong to me there is the use of the word "Dollar.
"  If I sell you a lump of silver for $20, fine.
But if I sell you something that says "$20 dollars" on it, with the explicit (or clearly implied) promise that it will always be worth $20 USD, that is not fine.
That is forgery, because it implies the faith &amp; credit of the US govt for my made-up currency.</sentencetext>
	<parent>http://www.semanticweb.org/ontologies/ConversationInstances.owl#comment10_01_19_1653240.30823550</parent>
</comment>
<thread>
	<id>http://www.semanticweb.org/ontologies/ConversationInstances.owl#thread_10_01_19_1653240_29</id>
	<commentlist>http://www.semanticweb.org/ontologies/ConversationInstances.owl#comment10_01_19_1653240.30823774
http://www.semanticweb.org/ontologies/ConversationInstances.owl#comment10_01_19_1653240.30822848
</commentlist>
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