<article>
	<id>http://www.semanticweb.org/ontologies/ConversationInstances.owl#article09_12_04_0413235</id>
	<title>Malware Could Grab Data From Stock iPhones</title>
	<author>timothy</author>
	<datestamp>1259950800000</datestamp>
	<htmltext>Ardisson writes <i>"Swiss iPhone developer Nicolas Seriot presented last night a talk on iPhone Privacy in Geneva. He showed how a malicious application <a href="http://seriot.ch/resources/talks\_papers/iPhonePrivacy.pdf">could harvest personal data on a non-jailbroken iPhone</a> (PDF) and without using private APIs. It turns out that the email accounts, the keyboard cache content and the WiFi connection logs are fully accessible. The talk puts up several recommendations. There is also a <a href="http://github.com/nst/spyphone/">demo project on github</a>."</i></htmltext>
<tokenext>Ardisson writes " Swiss iPhone developer Nicolas Seriot presented last night a talk on iPhone Privacy in Geneva .
He showed how a malicious application could harvest personal data on a non-jailbroken iPhone ( PDF ) and without using private APIs .
It turns out that the email accounts , the keyboard cache content and the WiFi connection logs are fully accessible .
The talk puts up several recommendations .
There is also a demo project on github .
"</tokentext>
<sentencetext>Ardisson writes "Swiss iPhone developer Nicolas Seriot presented last night a talk on iPhone Privacy in Geneva.
He showed how a malicious application could harvest personal data on a non-jailbroken iPhone (PDF) and without using private APIs.
It turns out that the email accounts, the keyboard cache content and the WiFi connection logs are fully accessible.
The talk puts up several recommendations.
There is also a demo project on github.
"</sentencetext>
</article>
<comment>
	<id>http://www.semanticweb.org/ontologies/ConversationInstances.owl#comment09_12_04_0413235.30325340</id>
	<title>No worries, you will hear about it</title>
	<author>Ilgaz</author>
	<datestamp>1259949360000</datestamp>
	<modclass>None</modclass>
	<modscore>1</modscore>
	<htmltext><p>One day, one dirty rival of Apple or a psychopath will use one of these "theoretical" exploits which Apple keeps ignoring for years. You won't need to check news that day, your newspaper won't simply arrive since the Quark/Indesign Machine they use won't function.</p><p>I don't hope for it but Apple is really inviting it...</p></htmltext>
<tokenext>One day , one dirty rival of Apple or a psychopath will use one of these " theoretical " exploits which Apple keeps ignoring for years .
You wo n't need to check news that day , your newspaper wo n't simply arrive since the Quark/Indesign Machine they use wo n't function.I do n't hope for it but Apple is really inviting it.. .</tokentext>
<sentencetext>One day, one dirty rival of Apple or a psychopath will use one of these "theoretical" exploits which Apple keeps ignoring for years.
You won't need to check news that day, your newspaper won't simply arrive since the Quark/Indesign Machine they use won't function.I don't hope for it but Apple is really inviting it...</sentencetext>
	<parent>http://www.semanticweb.org/ontologies/ConversationInstances.owl#comment09_12_04_0413235.30322294</parent>
</comment>
<comment>
	<id>http://www.semanticweb.org/ontologies/ConversationInstances.owl#comment09_12_04_0413235.30321466</id>
	<title>Spreading awareness</title>
	<author>CharlyFoxtrot</author>
	<datestamp>1259869260000</datestamp>
	<modclass>None</modclass>
	<modscore>1</modscore>
	<htmltext><p>It's great that there are those making people aware of what data might be accessed by malicious apps on any platform. The question is can this be avoided ? Restricting the data this app was able to access would also stop applications from doing some pretty useful things: accessing the address book, reading files on the filesystem, autocomplete (this is the keyboard cache mentioned), accessing pictures, etc. This is a balancing act between allowing enough freedom to produce good software and being too restrictive but safer. The alternatives here are complete sandboxing of applications or some Microsoft UAS style dialogs all over the place.</p></htmltext>
<tokenext>It 's great that there are those making people aware of what data might be accessed by malicious apps on any platform .
The question is can this be avoided ?
Restricting the data this app was able to access would also stop applications from doing some pretty useful things : accessing the address book , reading files on the filesystem , autocomplete ( this is the keyboard cache mentioned ) , accessing pictures , etc .
This is a balancing act between allowing enough freedom to produce good software and being too restrictive but safer .
The alternatives here are complete sandboxing of applications or some Microsoft UAS style dialogs all over the place .</tokentext>
<sentencetext>It's great that there are those making people aware of what data might be accessed by malicious apps on any platform.
The question is can this be avoided ?
Restricting the data this app was able to access would also stop applications from doing some pretty useful things: accessing the address book, reading files on the filesystem, autocomplete (this is the keyboard cache mentioned), accessing pictures, etc.
This is a balancing act between allowing enough freedom to produce good software and being too restrictive but safer.
The alternatives here are complete sandboxing of applications or some Microsoft UAS style dialogs all over the place.</sentencetext>
</comment>
<comment>
	<id>http://www.semanticweb.org/ontologies/ConversationInstances.owl#comment09_12_04_0413235.30350618</id>
	<title>Coulda, Shoulda, Woulda</title>
	<author>konohitowa</author>
	<datestamp>1260180660000</datestamp>
	<modclass>None</modclass>
	<modscore>1</modscore>
	<htmltext><p>Yes, malware could grab data from stock iPhones in much the same way that I could be President of the United States. Wikipedia has the scoop, plus a lot of other juicy details, here: <a href="http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/United\_States\_Constitution" title="wikipedia.org">http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/United\_States\_Constitution</a> [wikipedia.org]</p><p>Granted, the probability of my becoming Prez is likely lower; particularly if my opponents find out that I hang out around here.</p></htmltext>
<tokenext>Yes , malware could grab data from stock iPhones in much the same way that I could be President of the United States .
Wikipedia has the scoop , plus a lot of other juicy details , here : http : //en.wikipedia.org/wiki/United \ _States \ _Constitution [ wikipedia.org ] Granted , the probability of my becoming Prez is likely lower ; particularly if my opponents find out that I hang out around here .</tokentext>
<sentencetext>Yes, malware could grab data from stock iPhones in much the same way that I could be President of the United States.
Wikipedia has the scoop, plus a lot of other juicy details, here: http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/United\_States\_Constitution [wikipedia.org]Granted, the probability of my becoming Prez is likely lower; particularly if my opponents find out that I hang out around here.</sentencetext>
</comment>
<comment>
	<id>http://www.semanticweb.org/ontologies/ConversationInstances.owl#comment09_12_04_0413235.30323008</id>
	<title>Re:No, no, no. This is English.</title>
	<author>Anonymous</author>
	<datestamp>1259937780000</datestamp>
	<modclass>None</modclass>
	<modscore>0</modscore>
	<htmltext><blockquote><div><p>Try this: "Last night in Geneva, noted Swiss iPhone developer Nicolas Seriot presented a talk on iPhone Privacy".</p></div></blockquote><p>The iPhone was Swiss, and he developed it?<br>Why was he on iPhone Privacy when he presented this talk?</p><p>Worst part:  The guy is suddenly "noted".  In the original text, he wasn't.  You're not just rephrasing - you're editing.  You sneaky bastard<nobr> <wbr></nobr>;)</p><p>I'll just join my fellow anonymous commenter and say that English is a relatively iffy language anyway and although the title was a mess, you'd have to be pretty daft to not understand what was meant (i.e. the ambiguities introduced by the phrasing leads only to alternatives that make no sense).</p><p>But if you -have- to rephrase, try:</p><blockquote><div><p>"Swiss developer Nicolas Seriot presented a talk in Geneva last night about iPhone Privacy"</p></div></blockquote><p>That still has issues as it leaves out that Nicolas Seriot develops for the iPhone platform; something the original text did indicate.  Adding that back in would make the sentence rather convoluted, however.</p><p>Better yet... information should be presented from most important to least important, with an interlude:</p><blockquote><div><p>"An iPhone Privacy talk was presented last night by Swiss developer Nicolas Seriot in Geneva"</p></div></blockquote></div>
	</htmltext>
<tokenext>Try this : " Last night in Geneva , noted Swiss iPhone developer Nicolas Seriot presented a talk on iPhone Privacy " .The iPhone was Swiss , and he developed it ? Why was he on iPhone Privacy when he presented this talk ? Worst part : The guy is suddenly " noted " .
In the original text , he was n't .
You 're not just rephrasing - you 're editing .
You sneaky bastard ; ) I 'll just join my fellow anonymous commenter and say that English is a relatively iffy language anyway and although the title was a mess , you 'd have to be pretty daft to not understand what was meant ( i.e .
the ambiguities introduced by the phrasing leads only to alternatives that make no sense ) .But if you -have- to rephrase , try : " Swiss developer Nicolas Seriot presented a talk in Geneva last night about iPhone Privacy " That still has issues as it leaves out that Nicolas Seriot develops for the iPhone platform ; something the original text did indicate .
Adding that back in would make the sentence rather convoluted , however.Better yet... information should be presented from most important to least important , with an interlude : " An iPhone Privacy talk was presented last night by Swiss developer Nicolas Seriot in Geneva "</tokentext>
<sentencetext>Try this: "Last night in Geneva, noted Swiss iPhone developer Nicolas Seriot presented a talk on iPhone Privacy".The iPhone was Swiss, and he developed it?Why was he on iPhone Privacy when he presented this talk?Worst part:  The guy is suddenly "noted".
In the original text, he wasn't.
You're not just rephrasing - you're editing.
You sneaky bastard ;)I'll just join my fellow anonymous commenter and say that English is a relatively iffy language anyway and although the title was a mess, you'd have to be pretty daft to not understand what was meant (i.e.
the ambiguities introduced by the phrasing leads only to alternatives that make no sense).But if you -have- to rephrase, try:"Swiss developer Nicolas Seriot presented a talk in Geneva last night about iPhone Privacy"That still has issues as it leaves out that Nicolas Seriot develops for the iPhone platform; something the original text did indicate.
Adding that back in would make the sentence rather convoluted, however.Better yet... information should be presented from most important to least important, with an interlude:"An iPhone Privacy talk was presented last night by Swiss developer Nicolas Seriot in Geneva"
	</sentencetext>
	<parent>http://www.semanticweb.org/ontologies/ConversationInstances.owl#comment09_12_04_0413235.30321926</parent>
</comment>
<comment>
	<id>http://www.semanticweb.org/ontologies/ConversationInstances.owl#comment09_12_04_0413235.30324438</id>
	<title>Re:This is news?</title>
	<author>Triela</author>
	<datestamp>1259945700000</datestamp>
	<modclass>None</modclass>
	<modscore>0</modscore>
	<htmltext><p><div class="quote"><p>Wake us up when you have a remote exploit.</p></div><p>There's a nap for that.</p></div>
	</htmltext>
<tokenext>Wake us up when you have a remote exploit.There 's a nap for that .</tokentext>
<sentencetext>Wake us up when you have a remote exploit.There's a nap for that.
	</sentencetext>
	<parent>http://www.semanticweb.org/ontologies/ConversationInstances.owl#comment09_12_04_0413235.30322294</parent>
</comment>
<comment>
	<id>http://www.semanticweb.org/ontologies/ConversationInstances.owl#comment09_12_04_0413235.30323394</id>
	<title>Who Cares</title>
	<author>wzinc</author>
	<datestamp>1259940360000</datestamp>
	<modclass>None</modclass>
	<modscore>1</modscore>
	<htmltext><p>You have to install the malicious app for it to do anything anyway. The "Send My Data to Hackers" app would not pass approval. Case closed; no big deal.</p></htmltext>
<tokenext>You have to install the malicious app for it to do anything anyway .
The " Send My Data to Hackers " app would not pass approval .
Case closed ; no big deal .</tokentext>
<sentencetext>You have to install the malicious app for it to do anything anyway.
The "Send My Data to Hackers" app would not pass approval.
Case closed; no big deal.</sentencetext>
</comment>
<comment>
	<id>http://www.semanticweb.org/ontologies/ConversationInstances.owl#comment09_12_04_0413235.30322082</id>
	<title>Ummmm...</title>
	<author>ArcadeNut</author>
	<datestamp>1259922600000</datestamp>
	<modclass>None</modclass>
	<modscore>1</modscore>
	<htmltext><p>Theres an App for that?</p></htmltext>
<tokenext>Theres an App for that ?</tokentext>
<sentencetext>Theres an App for that?</sentencetext>
</comment>
<comment>
	<id>http://www.semanticweb.org/ontologies/ConversationInstances.owl#comment09_12_04_0413235.30321646</id>
	<title>Closed system</title>
	<author>Anubis IV</author>
	<datestamp>1259958720000</datestamp>
	<modclass>Informativ</modclass>
	<modscore>3</modscore>
	<htmltext>The security the iPhone uses is called a "closed system" and an "approval process," both of which I believe we've heard about here before in great detail, and the attack they're talking about is nothing more than a trojan, essentially. There have already been a few such apps that have sprung up over the years on the iPhone (I recall hearing reports of one that harvested your contacts), but Apple has been quick to squash them so far. Whether that will continue or is even a viable strategy as things scale up remains to be seen, however.</htmltext>
<tokenext>The security the iPhone uses is called a " closed system " and an " approval process , " both of which I believe we 've heard about here before in great detail , and the attack they 're talking about is nothing more than a trojan , essentially .
There have already been a few such apps that have sprung up over the years on the iPhone ( I recall hearing reports of one that harvested your contacts ) , but Apple has been quick to squash them so far .
Whether that will continue or is even a viable strategy as things scale up remains to be seen , however .</tokentext>
<sentencetext>The security the iPhone uses is called a "closed system" and an "approval process," both of which I believe we've heard about here before in great detail, and the attack they're talking about is nothing more than a trojan, essentially.
There have already been a few such apps that have sprung up over the years on the iPhone (I recall hearing reports of one that harvested your contacts), but Apple has been quick to squash them so far.
Whether that will continue or is even a viable strategy as things scale up remains to be seen, however.</sentencetext>
</comment>
<comment>
	<id>http://www.semanticweb.org/ontologies/ConversationInstances.owl#comment09_12_04_0413235.30326872</id>
	<title>Re:This is news?</title>
	<author>IamTheRealMike</author>
	<datestamp>1259955780000</datestamp>
	<modclass>None</modclass>
	<modscore>1</modscore>
	<htmltext>Why are your goals so low? Shouldn't Apple be showing the rest of the industry how it's done?</htmltext>
<tokenext>Why are your goals so low ?
Should n't Apple be showing the rest of the industry how it 's done ?</tokentext>
<sentencetext>Why are your goals so low?
Shouldn't Apple be showing the rest of the industry how it's done?</sentencetext>
	<parent>http://www.semanticweb.org/ontologies/ConversationInstances.owl#comment09_12_04_0413235.30322294</parent>
</comment>
<comment>
	<id>http://www.semanticweb.org/ontologies/ConversationInstances.owl#comment09_12_04_0413235.30323138</id>
	<title>Re:This isn't any different from any other compute</title>
	<author>TheRaven64</author>
	<datestamp>1259938860000</datestamp>
	<modclass>None</modclass>
	<modscore>1</modscore>
	<htmltext>If they can access the keychain, then it is a flaw.  The keychain is stored encrypted and controlled by a daemon (which sets the flag preventing debuggers from attaching when it starts).  When an app requests data from the keychain, it must be authorised by the user to access that specific key.  It is not able to access any other key and the authorisation is invalidated if the binary is modified.</htmltext>
<tokenext>If they can access the keychain , then it is a flaw .
The keychain is stored encrypted and controlled by a daemon ( which sets the flag preventing debuggers from attaching when it starts ) .
When an app requests data from the keychain , it must be authorised by the user to access that specific key .
It is not able to access any other key and the authorisation is invalidated if the binary is modified .</tokentext>
<sentencetext>If they can access the keychain, then it is a flaw.
The keychain is stored encrypted and controlled by a daemon (which sets the flag preventing debuggers from attaching when it starts).
When an app requests data from the keychain, it must be authorised by the user to access that specific key.
It is not able to access any other key and the authorisation is invalidated if the binary is modified.</sentencetext>
	<parent>http://www.semanticweb.org/ontologies/ConversationInstances.owl#comment09_12_04_0413235.30321416</parent>
</comment>
<comment>
	<id>http://www.semanticweb.org/ontologies/ConversationInstances.owl#comment09_12_04_0413235.30326114</id>
	<title>Re:No, no, no. This is English.</title>
	<author>Anonymous</author>
	<datestamp>1259952840000</datestamp>
	<modclass>None</modclass>
	<modscore>0</modscore>
	<htmltext><p>Shouldn't the editors on an English-language site be native English speakers?</p><p>(what?)</p></htmltext>
<tokenext>Should n't the editors on an English-language site be native English speakers ? ( what ?
)</tokentext>
<sentencetext>Shouldn't the editors on an English-language site be native English speakers?(what?
)</sentencetext>
	<parent>http://www.semanticweb.org/ontologies/ConversationInstances.owl#comment09_12_04_0413235.30323242</parent>
</comment>
<comment>
	<id>http://www.semanticweb.org/ontologies/ConversationInstances.owl#comment09_12_04_0413235.30321926</id>
	<title>No, no, no. This is English.</title>
	<author>Anonymous</author>
	<datestamp>1259920320000</datestamp>
	<modclass>Informativ</modclass>
	<modscore>3</modscore>
	<htmltext><i>""Swiss iPhone developer Nicolas Seriot presented last night a talk on iPhone Privacy in Geneva"</i>
<br> <br>
No, Nicolas Seriot did not present a talk to "last night". Nor was was his talk about "iPhone Privacy in Geneva".
<br> <br>
Try this: "Last night in Geneva, noted Swiss iPhone developer Nicolas Seriot presented a talk on iPhone Privacy".
<br> <br>
There. Fixed that for you.</htmltext>
<tokenext>" " Swiss iPhone developer Nicolas Seriot presented last night a talk on iPhone Privacy in Geneva " No , Nicolas Seriot did not present a talk to " last night " .
Nor was was his talk about " iPhone Privacy in Geneva " .
Try this : " Last night in Geneva , noted Swiss iPhone developer Nicolas Seriot presented a talk on iPhone Privacy " .
There. Fixed that for you .</tokentext>
<sentencetext>""Swiss iPhone developer Nicolas Seriot presented last night a talk on iPhone Privacy in Geneva"
 
No, Nicolas Seriot did not present a talk to "last night".
Nor was was his talk about "iPhone Privacy in Geneva".
Try this: "Last night in Geneva, noted Swiss iPhone developer Nicolas Seriot presented a talk on iPhone Privacy".
There. Fixed that for you.</sentencetext>
</comment>
<comment>
	<id>http://www.semanticweb.org/ontologies/ConversationInstances.owl#comment09_12_04_0413235.30326862</id>
	<title>Re:iPhone security doesn't rely on APIs</title>
	<author>IamTheRealMike</author>
	<datestamp>1259955720000</datestamp>
	<modclass>None</modclass>
	<modscore>1</modscore>
	<htmltext>MMU based app sandboxing has been adopted on the mobile platform. That's how Android works (and iphone too actually - it just sucks at it).</htmltext>
<tokenext>MMU based app sandboxing has been adopted on the mobile platform .
That 's how Android works ( and iphone too actually - it just sucks at it ) .</tokentext>
<sentencetext>MMU based app sandboxing has been adopted on the mobile platform.
That's how Android works (and iphone too actually - it just sucks at it).</sentencetext>
	<parent>http://www.semanticweb.org/ontologies/ConversationInstances.owl#comment09_12_04_0413235.30321640</parent>
</comment>
<comment>
	<id>http://www.semanticweb.org/ontologies/ConversationInstances.owl#comment09_12_04_0413235.30321416</id>
	<title>This isn't any different from any other computer.</title>
	<author>Anonymous</author>
	<datestamp>1259868840000</datestamp>
	<modclass>Informativ</modclass>
	<modscore>2</modscore>
	<htmltext><p>This isn't any different from any other computer. Users can run software that has access to their personal files.</p></htmltext>
<tokenext>This is n't any different from any other computer .
Users can run software that has access to their personal files .</tokentext>
<sentencetext>This isn't any different from any other computer.
Users can run software that has access to their personal files.</sentencetext>
</comment>
<comment>
	<id>http://www.semanticweb.org/ontologies/ConversationInstances.owl#comment09_12_04_0413235.30321366</id>
	<title>FROSTY P1SS!!1!</title>
	<author>Anonymous</author>
	<datestamp>1259868180000</datestamp>
	<modclass>Flamebait</modclass>
	<modscore>-1</modscore>
	<htmltext><blockquote><div><p>He showed how a malicious application could harvest personal data on a non-jailbroken iPhone (PDF) and without using private APIs. It turns out that the email accounts, the keyboard cache content and the WiFi connection logs are fully accessible.</p></div></blockquote><p>
Apple made a shit security decision.  Suck it, Apple fanboys!</p></div>
	</htmltext>
<tokenext>He showed how a malicious application could harvest personal data on a non-jailbroken iPhone ( PDF ) and without using private APIs .
It turns out that the email accounts , the keyboard cache content and the WiFi connection logs are fully accessible .
Apple made a shit security decision .
Suck it , Apple fanboys !</tokentext>
<sentencetext>He showed how a malicious application could harvest personal data on a non-jailbroken iPhone (PDF) and without using private APIs.
It turns out that the email accounts, the keyboard cache content and the WiFi connection logs are fully accessible.
Apple made a shit security decision.
Suck it, Apple fanboys!
	</sentencetext>
</comment>
<comment>
	<id>http://www.semanticweb.org/ontologies/ConversationInstances.owl#comment09_12_04_0413235.30321752</id>
	<title>Re:This isn't any different from any other compute</title>
	<author>mjwx</author>
	<datestamp>1259917380000</datestamp>
	<modclass>Insightful</modclass>
	<modscore>4</modscore>
	<htmltext><blockquote><div><p>It is different from Android, actually. Android runs each app under a separate user ID, and one app can't access another app's data unless the other app explicitly allows it to. Typically this access will go through the standard Android permission system, so the user will see when they install the app that it's requesting permission to read their SMS logs or whatever.</p></div></blockquote><p>

Whilst I'm not disagreeing with you, Android has a very good security model and enforcing separate UID's and permissions is essential towards that but... This still wont stop the less intellectually endowed users from just clicking yes and permitting malware to read their private data.<br> <br>

To paraphrase Ron White, there is no pill to fix stupid, you cant fix stupid and neither can Google.<br> <br>

In other words we'll still suffer from the stupid acts of moronic users, the good part is that more astute users will suffer from less attacks.</p></div>
	</htmltext>
<tokenext>It is different from Android , actually .
Android runs each app under a separate user ID , and one app ca n't access another app 's data unless the other app explicitly allows it to .
Typically this access will go through the standard Android permission system , so the user will see when they install the app that it 's requesting permission to read their SMS logs or whatever .
Whilst I 'm not disagreeing with you , Android has a very good security model and enforcing separate UID 's and permissions is essential towards that but... This still wont stop the less intellectually endowed users from just clicking yes and permitting malware to read their private data .
To paraphrase Ron White , there is no pill to fix stupid , you cant fix stupid and neither can Google .
In other words we 'll still suffer from the stupid acts of moronic users , the good part is that more astute users will suffer from less attacks .</tokentext>
<sentencetext>It is different from Android, actually.
Android runs each app under a separate user ID, and one app can't access another app's data unless the other app explicitly allows it to.
Typically this access will go through the standard Android permission system, so the user will see when they install the app that it's requesting permission to read their SMS logs or whatever.
Whilst I'm not disagreeing with you, Android has a very good security model and enforcing separate UID's and permissions is essential towards that but... This still wont stop the less intellectually endowed users from just clicking yes and permitting malware to read their private data.
To paraphrase Ron White, there is no pill to fix stupid, you cant fix stupid and neither can Google.
In other words we'll still suffer from the stupid acts of moronic users, the good part is that more astute users will suffer from less attacks.
	</sentencetext>
	<parent>http://www.semanticweb.org/ontologies/ConversationInstances.owl#comment09_12_04_0413235.30321496</parent>
</comment>
<comment>
	<id>http://www.semanticweb.org/ontologies/ConversationInstances.owl#comment09_12_04_0413235.30325228</id>
	<title>It is not a desktop computer</title>
	<author>Ilgaz</author>
	<datestamp>1259948940000</datestamp>
	<modclass>None</modclass>
	<modscore>1</modscore>
	<htmltext><p>It is news on smart phones which started with lessons learned from Desktop and mobile trojans themselves. Apple ignored those lessons and now paying for it.</p><p><a href="http://wiki.forum.nokia.com/index.php/Symbian\_Platform\_Security\_Model" title="nokia.com">http://wiki.forum.nokia.com/index.php/Symbian\_Platform\_Security\_Model</a> [nokia.com]<br><a href="http://developers.sun.com/mobility/midp/articles/permissions/" title="sun.com">http://developers.sun.com/mobility/midp/articles/permissions/</a> [sun.com]<br><a href="http://technet.microsoft.com/en-us/library/cc512651.aspx" title="microsoft.com">http://technet.microsoft.com/en-us/library/cc512651.aspx</a> [microsoft.com]</p><p>In fact, security scene kind of gave up on iPhone&amp;iPod. Let whoever buys makes his/her own mind.</p></htmltext>
<tokenext>It is news on smart phones which started with lessons learned from Desktop and mobile trojans themselves .
Apple ignored those lessons and now paying for it.http : //wiki.forum.nokia.com/index.php/Symbian \ _Platform \ _Security \ _Model [ nokia.com ] http : //developers.sun.com/mobility/midp/articles/permissions/ [ sun.com ] http : //technet.microsoft.com/en-us/library/cc512651.aspx [ microsoft.com ] In fact , security scene kind of gave up on iPhone&amp;iPod .
Let whoever buys makes his/her own mind .</tokentext>
<sentencetext>It is news on smart phones which started with lessons learned from Desktop and mobile trojans themselves.
Apple ignored those lessons and now paying for it.http://wiki.forum.nokia.com/index.php/Symbian\_Platform\_Security\_Model [nokia.com]http://developers.sun.com/mobility/midp/articles/permissions/ [sun.com]http://technet.microsoft.com/en-us/library/cc512651.aspx [microsoft.com]In fact, security scene kind of gave up on iPhone&amp;iPod.
Let whoever buys makes his/her own mind.</sentencetext>
	<parent>http://www.semanticweb.org/ontologies/ConversationInstances.owl#comment09_12_04_0413235.30322294</parent>
</comment>
<comment>
	<id>http://www.semanticweb.org/ontologies/ConversationInstances.owl#comment09_12_04_0413235.30323420</id>
	<title>Microsoft vs Apple?</title>
	<author>Anonymous</author>
	<datestamp>1259940480000</datestamp>
	<modclass>Insightful</modclass>
	<modscore>4</modscore>
	<htmltext>Why is it that every time something like this is discovered for Microsoft, it's their fault because they should have provided a more secure operating system. When something like this happens for other companies, malware is a fact of life.</htmltext>
<tokenext>Why is it that every time something like this is discovered for Microsoft , it 's their fault because they should have provided a more secure operating system .
When something like this happens for other companies , malware is a fact of life .</tokentext>
<sentencetext>Why is it that every time something like this is discovered for Microsoft, it's their fault because they should have provided a more secure operating system.
When something like this happens for other companies, malware is a fact of life.</sentencetext>
</comment>
<comment>
	<id>http://www.semanticweb.org/ontologies/ConversationInstances.owl#comment09_12_04_0413235.30321668</id>
	<title>NSA will love that</title>
	<author>AHuxley</author>
	<datestamp>1259959080000</datestamp>
	<modclass>None</modclass>
	<modscore>1</modscore>
	<htmltext>In the wild Apple product that is as easy as MS.</htmltext>
<tokenext>In the wild Apple product that is as easy as MS .</tokentext>
<sentencetext>In the wild Apple product that is as easy as MS.</sentencetext>
</comment>
<comment>
	<id>http://www.semanticweb.org/ontologies/ConversationInstances.owl#comment09_12_04_0413235.30325008</id>
	<title>Re:Microsoft vs Apple?</title>
	<author>middlemen</author>
	<datestamp>1259948220000</datestamp>
	<modclass>None</modclass>
	<modscore>1</modscore>
	<htmltext><p><div class="quote"><p> When something like this happens for other companies, malware is a fact of life.</p></div><p>
Nobody likes pissing in their own pool.</p></div>
	</htmltext>
<tokenext>When something like this happens for other companies , malware is a fact of life .
Nobody likes pissing in their own pool .</tokentext>
<sentencetext> When something like this happens for other companies, malware is a fact of life.
Nobody likes pissing in their own pool.
	</sentencetext>
	<parent>http://www.semanticweb.org/ontologies/ConversationInstances.owl#comment09_12_04_0413235.30323420</parent>
</comment>
<comment>
	<id>http://www.semanticweb.org/ontologies/ConversationInstances.owl#comment09_12_04_0413235.30321490</id>
	<title>iPhone security doesn't rely on APIs</title>
	<author>iamacat</author>
	<datestamp>1259869560000</datestamp>
	<modclass>Insightful</modclass>
	<modscore>4</modscore>
	<htmltext><p>It depends on manual app approval process and ability to ban/sue developers who abuse the system. There is probably also a kill switch to delete the app from existing devices that Apple hasn't yet had to activate for catastrophic malware. Runtime-enforced security has been tried with J2ME and nobody liked the app functionality. In fact people are not willing to live with Java's limitations on desktop either. Perhaps someday such a system will become viable with much more powerful mobile hardware and better thought out security system that allows more functional legitimate apps (for example, user will be able to give an app access to some or all e-mail as an intuitive option).</p></htmltext>
<tokenext>It depends on manual app approval process and ability to ban/sue developers who abuse the system .
There is probably also a kill switch to delete the app from existing devices that Apple has n't yet had to activate for catastrophic malware .
Runtime-enforced security has been tried with J2ME and nobody liked the app functionality .
In fact people are not willing to live with Java 's limitations on desktop either .
Perhaps someday such a system will become viable with much more powerful mobile hardware and better thought out security system that allows more functional legitimate apps ( for example , user will be able to give an app access to some or all e-mail as an intuitive option ) .</tokentext>
<sentencetext>It depends on manual app approval process and ability to ban/sue developers who abuse the system.
There is probably also a kill switch to delete the app from existing devices that Apple hasn't yet had to activate for catastrophic malware.
Runtime-enforced security has been tried with J2ME and nobody liked the app functionality.
In fact people are not willing to live with Java's limitations on desktop either.
Perhaps someday such a system will become viable with much more powerful mobile hardware and better thought out security system that allows more functional legitimate apps (for example, user will be able to give an app access to some or all e-mail as an intuitive option).</sentencetext>
</comment>
<comment>
	<id>http://www.semanticweb.org/ontologies/ConversationInstances.owl#comment09_12_04_0413235.30321398</id>
	<title>Obiwan iPhonebi</title>
	<author>Anonymous</author>
	<datestamp>1259868600000</datestamp>
	<modclass>Funny</modclass>
	<modscore>4</modscore>
	<htmltext><p> I felt a great disturbance in the Smug, as if millions of fanboys suddenly cried out in terror and were suddenly silenced.</p></htmltext>
<tokenext>I felt a great disturbance in the Smug , as if millions of fanboys suddenly cried out in terror and were suddenly silenced .</tokentext>
<sentencetext> I felt a great disturbance in the Smug, as if millions of fanboys suddenly cried out in terror and were suddenly silenced.</sentencetext>
</comment>
<comment>
	<id>http://www.semanticweb.org/ontologies/ConversationInstances.owl#comment09_12_04_0413235.30325380</id>
	<title>Which MS product? Mobile?</title>
	<author>Ilgaz</author>
	<datestamp>1259949600000</datestamp>
	<modclass>None</modclass>
	<modscore>1</modscore>
	<htmltext><p>Trust me, it won't be that easy on Windows Mobile. Windows Mobile has a security model similar to Symbian and J2ME.</p></htmltext>
<tokenext>Trust me , it wo n't be that easy on Windows Mobile .
Windows Mobile has a security model similar to Symbian and J2ME .</tokentext>
<sentencetext>Trust me, it won't be that easy on Windows Mobile.
Windows Mobile has a security model similar to Symbian and J2ME.</sentencetext>
	<parent>http://www.semanticweb.org/ontologies/ConversationInstances.owl#comment09_12_04_0413235.30321668</parent>
</comment>
<comment>
	<id>http://www.semanticweb.org/ontologies/ConversationInstances.owl#comment09_12_04_0413235.30325424</id>
	<title>Worth the read</title>
	<author>mindspring</author>
	<datestamp>1259949780000</datestamp>
	<modclass>Offtopic</modclass>
	<modscore>0</modscore>
	<htmltext>Well worth the read. Thanks for sharing this information. I got a chance to know about this.</htmltext>
<tokenext>Well worth the read .
Thanks for sharing this information .
I got a chance to know about this .</tokentext>
<sentencetext>Well worth the read.
Thanks for sharing this information.
I got a chance to know about this.</sentencetext>
</comment>
<comment>
	<id>http://www.semanticweb.org/ontologies/ConversationInstances.owl#comment09_12_04_0413235.30325982</id>
	<title>run, scream, panic!  not.</title>
	<author>Sandbags</author>
	<datestamp>1259952240000</datestamp>
	<modclass>None</modclass>
	<modscore>1</modscore>
	<htmltext><p>Apple may not have the best approval process based on how engineers review apps for functionality, but this is NOT the only process apps go through...</p><p>Apple has a whole series of programs that crawl the source code of each app (which is how apps are submitted, not in compiled form).  First of all, they look for apps that touch unapproved APIs, and summarily reject them (with thus far 1 exception noted recently, and they were told not to include that function in their next release...)  next, any app that accesses contact information, account information, or sends and receives data from external sources is HIGHLY scrutinized, far more than other apps.  Red flags are reised by scripts and programs analyzing code, and people read THE CODE to see what the app does, in addition to simply using it.</p><p>Further, all connectivity in and out of the devices used for app testing is monitored.</p><p>Any app entering the apple review process that attempt to copy and distribute user data will be quickly and easily spotted.</p><p>In the very early days of the app review process, many of these automated tools did not exist, and several apps that violated apple's policies did slip through.  This has been resolved, in the favor of reject first, appeal and release second.  Getting an app that violates user security, or steals data, through the app store at this time can basically be considdered a non-existant threat.  Even if they could, you still have to convince people to download the app, and run the app, for it to do anything...  which means the apps going to actually have to be a developed program with a hidden tojan.  Also, any app that accesses contact information or location information has a pop-up by the iPhone OS security subsystem requiring user authorixzation, so an app that does so better have a good reason for doing it the user will believe...<nobr> <wbr></nobr>...and what's it going to get?  contacts?  e-mail addresses?  It can't get passwords, it can't monitor your website activity through safari, you have no file system for it to read files in...  even IF there was a realeased threat, what it can get is negligible and worthless.</p></htmltext>
<tokenext>Apple may not have the best approval process based on how engineers review apps for functionality , but this is NOT the only process apps go through...Apple has a whole series of programs that crawl the source code of each app ( which is how apps are submitted , not in compiled form ) .
First of all , they look for apps that touch unapproved APIs , and summarily reject them ( with thus far 1 exception noted recently , and they were told not to include that function in their next release... ) next , any app that accesses contact information , account information , or sends and receives data from external sources is HIGHLY scrutinized , far more than other apps .
Red flags are reised by scripts and programs analyzing code , and people read THE CODE to see what the app does , in addition to simply using it.Further , all connectivity in and out of the devices used for app testing is monitored.Any app entering the apple review process that attempt to copy and distribute user data will be quickly and easily spotted.In the very early days of the app review process , many of these automated tools did not exist , and several apps that violated apple 's policies did slip through .
This has been resolved , in the favor of reject first , appeal and release second .
Getting an app that violates user security , or steals data , through the app store at this time can basically be considdered a non-existant threat .
Even if they could , you still have to convince people to download the app , and run the app , for it to do anything... which means the apps going to actually have to be a developed program with a hidden tojan .
Also , any app that accesses contact information or location information has a pop-up by the iPhone OS security subsystem requiring user authorixzation , so an app that does so better have a good reason for doing it the user will believe... ...and what 's it going to get ?
contacts ? e-mail addresses ?
It ca n't get passwords , it ca n't monitor your website activity through safari , you have no file system for it to read files in... even IF there was a realeased threat , what it can get is negligible and worthless .</tokentext>
<sentencetext>Apple may not have the best approval process based on how engineers review apps for functionality, but this is NOT the only process apps go through...Apple has a whole series of programs that crawl the source code of each app (which is how apps are submitted, not in compiled form).
First of all, they look for apps that touch unapproved APIs, and summarily reject them (with thus far 1 exception noted recently, and they were told not to include that function in their next release...)  next, any app that accesses contact information, account information, or sends and receives data from external sources is HIGHLY scrutinized, far more than other apps.
Red flags are reised by scripts and programs analyzing code, and people read THE CODE to see what the app does, in addition to simply using it.Further, all connectivity in and out of the devices used for app testing is monitored.Any app entering the apple review process that attempt to copy and distribute user data will be quickly and easily spotted.In the very early days of the app review process, many of these automated tools did not exist, and several apps that violated apple's policies did slip through.
This has been resolved, in the favor of reject first, appeal and release second.
Getting an app that violates user security, or steals data, through the app store at this time can basically be considdered a non-existant threat.
Even if they could, you still have to convince people to download the app, and run the app, for it to do anything...  which means the apps going to actually have to be a developed program with a hidden tojan.
Also, any app that accesses contact information or location information has a pop-up by the iPhone OS security subsystem requiring user authorixzation, so an app that does so better have a good reason for doing it the user will believe... ...and what's it going to get?
contacts?  e-mail addresses?
It can't get passwords, it can't monitor your website activity through safari, you have no file system for it to read files in...  even IF there was a realeased threat, what it can get is negligible and worthless.</sentencetext>
</comment>
<comment>
	<id>http://www.semanticweb.org/ontologies/ConversationInstances.owl#comment09_12_04_0413235.30325026</id>
	<title>Re:No, no, no. This is English.</title>
	<author>ThrowAwaySociety</author>
	<datestamp>1259948280000</datestamp>
	<modclass>None</modclass>
	<modscore>1</modscore>
	<htmltext><p><div class="quote"><p>If you'd step outside your own borders once in awhile, you'd recognize this sentence structure as something that works in a foreign language, but has been translated into English by a non-native speaker.</p></div><p>Yes, hence the subject line.</p><p><div class="quote"><p>Constructive criticism is useful, but please don't be unkind.</p></div><p>What part of that post was "unkind?" It was a fairly straightforward, if blunt, explanation of why the sentence structure makes its meaning ambiguous and how it could be clarified.</p></div>
	</htmltext>
<tokenext>If you 'd step outside your own borders once in awhile , you 'd recognize this sentence structure as something that works in a foreign language , but has been translated into English by a non-native speaker.Yes , hence the subject line.Constructive criticism is useful , but please do n't be unkind.What part of that post was " unkind ?
" It was a fairly straightforward , if blunt , explanation of why the sentence structure makes its meaning ambiguous and how it could be clarified .</tokentext>
<sentencetext>If you'd step outside your own borders once in awhile, you'd recognize this sentence structure as something that works in a foreign language, but has been translated into English by a non-native speaker.Yes, hence the subject line.Constructive criticism is useful, but please don't be unkind.What part of that post was "unkind?
" It was a fairly straightforward, if blunt, explanation of why the sentence structure makes its meaning ambiguous and how it could be clarified.
	</sentencetext>
	<parent>http://www.semanticweb.org/ontologies/ConversationInstances.owl#comment09_12_04_0413235.30323242</parent>
</comment>
<comment>
	<id>http://www.semanticweb.org/ontologies/ConversationInstances.owl#comment09_12_04_0413235.30326004</id>
	<title>Re:FROSTY P1SS!!1!</title>
	<author>sbeckstead</author>
	<datestamp>1259952360000</datestamp>
	<modclass>None</modclass>
	<modscore>0</modscore>
	<htmltext>You can actually do the same thing with every operating system out there.  So suck it non Apple fan boys!  There are even demo apps for android and windows mobile.</htmltext>
<tokenext>You can actually do the same thing with every operating system out there .
So suck it non Apple fan boys !
There are even demo apps for android and windows mobile .</tokentext>
<sentencetext>You can actually do the same thing with every operating system out there.
So suck it non Apple fan boys!
There are even demo apps for android and windows mobile.</sentencetext>
	<parent>http://www.semanticweb.org/ontologies/ConversationInstances.owl#comment09_12_04_0413235.30321366</parent>
</comment>
<comment>
	<id>http://www.semanticweb.org/ontologies/ConversationInstances.owl#comment09_12_04_0413235.30322294</id>
	<title>This is news?</title>
	<author>argent</author>
	<datestamp>1259927220000</datestamp>
	<modclass>Informativ</modclass>
	<modscore>3</modscore>
	<htmltext><p>You install an application on your computer. That application has access to stuff stored on your computer. This is news?</p><p>Wake us up when you have a remote exploit.</p></htmltext>
<tokenext>You install an application on your computer .
That application has access to stuff stored on your computer .
This is news ? Wake us up when you have a remote exploit .</tokentext>
<sentencetext>You install an application on your computer.
That application has access to stuff stored on your computer.
This is news?Wake us up when you have a remote exploit.</sentencetext>
</comment>
<comment>
	<id>http://www.semanticweb.org/ontologies/ConversationInstances.owl#comment09_12_04_0413235.30327178</id>
	<title>Re:No, no, no. This is English.</title>
	<author>sootman</author>
	<datestamp>1259956860000</datestamp>
	<modclass>None</modclass>
	<modscore>1</modscore>
	<htmltext><p>&gt; There. Fixed that for you.</p><p>Hmm, I'm looking for the joke, but either I'm not seeing it or it wasn't funny.</p><p>Oh, wait, you <em>actually fixed it for him.</em> Gotcha. Nice work.<nobr> <wbr></nobr>:-)</p></htmltext>
<tokenext>&gt; There .
Fixed that for you.Hmm , I 'm looking for the joke , but either I 'm not seeing it or it was n't funny.Oh , wait , you actually fixed it for him .
Gotcha. Nice work .
: - )</tokentext>
<sentencetext>&gt; There.
Fixed that for you.Hmm, I'm looking for the joke, but either I'm not seeing it or it wasn't funny.Oh, wait, you actually fixed it for him.
Gotcha. Nice work.
:-)</sentencetext>
	<parent>http://www.semanticweb.org/ontologies/ConversationInstances.owl#comment09_12_04_0413235.30321926</parent>
</comment>
<comment>
	<id>http://www.semanticweb.org/ontologies/ConversationInstances.owl#comment09_12_04_0413235.30321762</id>
	<title>Re:Interesting sources...</title>
	<author>Serious Callers Only</author>
	<datestamp>1259917620000</datestamp>
	<modclass>Interestin</modclass>
	<modscore>2</modscore>
	<htmltext><p><div class="quote"><p>One other thing of note is that a great deal of this involves poking about in<nobr> <wbr></nobr>/var/mobile/... at preference and temporary files....Even if you obsfucated the string the filesystem could simply report if anything under that directory were being accessed and what the call stack was like, though I think it unlikely they would go to these lengths.</p></div><p>They'd be better just to lock down access to the files which apps have no business accessing directly - get system apps to save their preferences elsewhere for example, or restrict permissions artificially for sandboxed apps via the filesystem apis and refuse access to all files except the sandbox. That way even if someone gets past the filters (that's a game of whack-a-mole really, and the current controls are easy to defeat) they cannot access the files.</p><p>They need to move to restricting access fully at the point of access, not scanning for possible violations at one point in the process (apps may not access files when tested for example).</p><p>Also I do think apps that need access to address book records should be forced to ask for permission first (as with location), as often users will not want to provide that information and games etc have no business knowing it.</p></div>
	</htmltext>
<tokenext>One other thing of note is that a great deal of this involves poking about in /var/mobile/... at preference and temporary files....Even if you obsfucated the string the filesystem could simply report if anything under that directory were being accessed and what the call stack was like , though I think it unlikely they would go to these lengths.They 'd be better just to lock down access to the files which apps have no business accessing directly - get system apps to save their preferences elsewhere for example , or restrict permissions artificially for sandboxed apps via the filesystem apis and refuse access to all files except the sandbox .
That way even if someone gets past the filters ( that 's a game of whack-a-mole really , and the current controls are easy to defeat ) they can not access the files.They need to move to restricting access fully at the point of access , not scanning for possible violations at one point in the process ( apps may not access files when tested for example ) .Also I do think apps that need access to address book records should be forced to ask for permission first ( as with location ) , as often users will not want to provide that information and games etc have no business knowing it .</tokentext>
<sentencetext>One other thing of note is that a great deal of this involves poking about in /var/mobile/... at preference and temporary files....Even if you obsfucated the string the filesystem could simply report if anything under that directory were being accessed and what the call stack was like, though I think it unlikely they would go to these lengths.They'd be better just to lock down access to the files which apps have no business accessing directly - get system apps to save their preferences elsewhere for example, or restrict permissions artificially for sandboxed apps via the filesystem apis and refuse access to all files except the sandbox.
That way even if someone gets past the filters (that's a game of whack-a-mole really, and the current controls are easy to defeat) they cannot access the files.They need to move to restricting access fully at the point of access, not scanning for possible violations at one point in the process (apps may not access files when tested for example).Also I do think apps that need access to address book records should be forced to ask for permission first (as with location), as often users will not want to provide that information and games etc have no business knowing it.
	</sentencetext>
	<parent>http://www.semanticweb.org/ontologies/ConversationInstances.owl#comment09_12_04_0413235.30321440</parent>
</comment>
<comment>
	<id>http://www.semanticweb.org/ontologies/ConversationInstances.owl#comment09_12_04_0413235.30321440</id>
	<title>Interesting sources...</title>
	<author>SuperKendall</author>
	<datestamp>1259868960000</datestamp>
	<modclass>Informativ</modclass>
	<modscore>5</modscore>
	<htmltext><p>There's actually not much surprising here (at least for an iPhone developer) but two things were interesting:</p><p>1) It can read EXIF data from your image library (including GPS tags if any) by just reading the library directly.  In theory you are not supposed to do that, and go through an API - which annoyingly gives you only raw image data with no EXIF.</p><p>2) Your "location" is reported, without the dialog that normally arises asking you if you want to reveal your location.  Alarming at first, until you look and realize what it's really done is found the last location Maps knew about.  Since you don't run Maps all the time this data really doesn't mean that much and is not real time as you get with real CoreLocation calls.</p><p>One other thing of note is that a great deal of this involves poking about in<nobr> <wbr></nobr>/var/mobile/... at preference and temporary files.  Given that Apple is now scanning for strings in app review, I'm not sure if an app that included these techniques would actually make it to the app store.  Even if you obsfucated the string the filesystem could simply report if anything under that directory were being accessed and what the call stack was like, though I think it unlikely they would go to these lengths.</p></htmltext>
<tokenext>There 's actually not much surprising here ( at least for an iPhone developer ) but two things were interesting : 1 ) It can read EXIF data from your image library ( including GPS tags if any ) by just reading the library directly .
In theory you are not supposed to do that , and go through an API - which annoyingly gives you only raw image data with no EXIF.2 ) Your " location " is reported , without the dialog that normally arises asking you if you want to reveal your location .
Alarming at first , until you look and realize what it 's really done is found the last location Maps knew about .
Since you do n't run Maps all the time this data really does n't mean that much and is not real time as you get with real CoreLocation calls.One other thing of note is that a great deal of this involves poking about in /var/mobile/... at preference and temporary files .
Given that Apple is now scanning for strings in app review , I 'm not sure if an app that included these techniques would actually make it to the app store .
Even if you obsfucated the string the filesystem could simply report if anything under that directory were being accessed and what the call stack was like , though I think it unlikely they would go to these lengths .</tokentext>
<sentencetext>There's actually not much surprising here (at least for an iPhone developer) but two things were interesting:1) It can read EXIF data from your image library (including GPS tags if any) by just reading the library directly.
In theory you are not supposed to do that, and go through an API - which annoyingly gives you only raw image data with no EXIF.2) Your "location" is reported, without the dialog that normally arises asking you if you want to reveal your location.
Alarming at first, until you look and realize what it's really done is found the last location Maps knew about.
Since you don't run Maps all the time this data really doesn't mean that much and is not real time as you get with real CoreLocation calls.One other thing of note is that a great deal of this involves poking about in /var/mobile/... at preference and temporary files.
Given that Apple is now scanning for strings in app review, I'm not sure if an app that included these techniques would actually make it to the app store.
Even if you obsfucated the string the filesystem could simply report if anything under that directory were being accessed and what the call stack was like, though I think it unlikely they would go to these lengths.</sentencetext>
</comment>
<comment>
	<id>http://www.semanticweb.org/ontologies/ConversationInstances.owl#comment09_12_04_0413235.30323060</id>
	<title>Re:No, no, no. This is English.</title>
	<author>intheshelter</author>
	<datestamp>1259938200000</datestamp>
	<modclass>None</modclass>
	<modscore>1</modscore>
	<htmltext>Forest vs Trees?  Maybe you could focus on the forest a little more and quit worry about anal grammar corrections?</htmltext>
<tokenext>Forest vs Trees ?
Maybe you could focus on the forest a little more and quit worry about anal grammar corrections ?</tokentext>
<sentencetext>Forest vs Trees?
Maybe you could focus on the forest a little more and quit worry about anal grammar corrections?</sentencetext>
	<parent>http://www.semanticweb.org/ontologies/ConversationInstances.owl#comment09_12_04_0413235.30321926</parent>
</comment>
<comment>
	<id>http://www.semanticweb.org/ontologies/ConversationInstances.owl#comment09_12_04_0413235.30321640</id>
	<title>Re:iPhone security doesn't rely on APIs</title>
	<author>0ld\_d0g</author>
	<datestamp>1259958660000</datestamp>
	<modclass>None</modclass>
	<modscore>1</modscore>
	<htmltext><p>What happened to MMU based security? User &amp; Kernel address space division seems to work for desktop OSs. Why hasn't it been adopted for the mobile platform?</p></htmltext>
<tokenext>What happened to MMU based security ?
User &amp; Kernel address space division seems to work for desktop OSs .
Why has n't it been adopted for the mobile platform ?</tokentext>
<sentencetext>What happened to MMU based security?
User &amp; Kernel address space division seems to work for desktop OSs.
Why hasn't it been adopted for the mobile platform?</sentencetext>
	<parent>http://www.semanticweb.org/ontologies/ConversationInstances.owl#comment09_12_04_0413235.30321490</parent>
</comment>
<comment>
	<id>http://www.semanticweb.org/ontologies/ConversationInstances.owl#comment09_12_04_0413235.30324172</id>
	<title>And this would be why...</title>
	<author>Anonymous</author>
	<datestamp>1259944500000</datestamp>
	<modclass>None</modclass>
	<modscore>0</modscore>
	<htmltext><p>And this would be why there is an app approval process, controlled by Apple and why you can't just load any app you want onto a non-jailbroken phone...</p><p>Apple's review process would see and flag apps such as this and not allow them on the app store, and thus not allow them to be placed onto non-jailbroken phones - thus rendering this entire "exploit" a bunch of bunk.</p><p>Not much of an exploit if it can't ever get onto the phones in the first place!</p></htmltext>
<tokenext>And this would be why there is an app approval process , controlled by Apple and why you ca n't just load any app you want onto a non-jailbroken phone...Apple 's review process would see and flag apps such as this and not allow them on the app store , and thus not allow them to be placed onto non-jailbroken phones - thus rendering this entire " exploit " a bunch of bunk.Not much of an exploit if it ca n't ever get onto the phones in the first place !</tokentext>
<sentencetext>And this would be why there is an app approval process, controlled by Apple and why you can't just load any app you want onto a non-jailbroken phone...Apple's review process would see and flag apps such as this and not allow them on the app store, and thus not allow them to be placed onto non-jailbroken phones - thus rendering this entire "exploit" a bunch of bunk.Not much of an exploit if it can't ever get onto the phones in the first place!</sentencetext>
</comment>
<comment>
	<id>http://www.semanticweb.org/ontologies/ConversationInstances.owl#comment09_12_04_0413235.30326328</id>
	<title>Re:No, no, no. This is English.</title>
	<author>sbeckstead</author>
	<datestamp>1259953680000</datestamp>
	<modclass>None</modclass>
	<modscore>1</modscore>
	<htmltext>"There." Is not a sentence, I though you were using English...</htmltext>
<tokenext>" There .
" Is not a sentence , I though you were using English.. .</tokentext>
<sentencetext>"There.
" Is not a sentence, I though you were using English...</sentencetext>
	<parent>http://www.semanticweb.org/ontologies/ConversationInstances.owl#comment09_12_04_0413235.30321926</parent>
</comment>
<comment>
	<id>http://www.semanticweb.org/ontologies/ConversationInstances.owl#comment09_12_04_0413235.30321496</id>
	<title>Re:This isn't any different from any other compute</title>
	<author>Mr2001</author>
	<datestamp>1259869620000</datestamp>
	<modclass>Informativ</modclass>
	<modscore>5</modscore>
	<htmltext><p>It is different from Android, actually. Android runs each app under a separate user ID, and one app can't access another app's data unless the other app explicitly allows it to. Typically this access will go through the standard Android permission system, so the user will see when they install the app that it's requesting permission to read their SMS logs or whatever.</p></htmltext>
<tokenext>It is different from Android , actually .
Android runs each app under a separate user ID , and one app ca n't access another app 's data unless the other app explicitly allows it to .
Typically this access will go through the standard Android permission system , so the user will see when they install the app that it 's requesting permission to read their SMS logs or whatever .</tokentext>
<sentencetext>It is different from Android, actually.
Android runs each app under a separate user ID, and one app can't access another app's data unless the other app explicitly allows it to.
Typically this access will go through the standard Android permission system, so the user will see when they install the app that it's requesting permission to read their SMS logs or whatever.</sentencetext>
	<parent>http://www.semanticweb.org/ontologies/ConversationInstances.owl#comment09_12_04_0413235.30321416</parent>
</comment>
<comment>
	<id>http://www.semanticweb.org/ontologies/ConversationInstances.owl#comment09_12_04_0413235.30324430</id>
	<title>Re:This isn't any different from any other compute</title>
	<author>Inda</author>
	<datestamp>1259945700000</datestamp>
	<modclass>None</modclass>
	<modscore>1</modscore>
	<htmltext>I hit my thumb with a hammer once. Make that twice, three times, four... I'll probably do it again in my lifetime.<br><br>Can you, as an astute user, claim that you've never hit OK to a dialog by mistake? Maybe you were expecting one dialog, but received another.</htmltext>
<tokenext>I hit my thumb with a hammer once .
Make that twice , three times , four... I 'll probably do it again in my lifetime.Can you , as an astute user , claim that you 've never hit OK to a dialog by mistake ?
Maybe you were expecting one dialog , but received another .</tokentext>
<sentencetext>I hit my thumb with a hammer once.
Make that twice, three times, four... I'll probably do it again in my lifetime.Can you, as an astute user, claim that you've never hit OK to a dialog by mistake?
Maybe you were expecting one dialog, but received another.</sentencetext>
	<parent>http://www.semanticweb.org/ontologies/ConversationInstances.owl#comment09_12_04_0413235.30321752</parent>
</comment>
<comment>
	<id>http://www.semanticweb.org/ontologies/ConversationInstances.owl#comment09_12_04_0413235.30327958</id>
	<title>Re:This isn't any different from any other compute</title>
	<author>Pollardito</author>
	<datestamp>1259917200000</datestamp>
	<modclass>None</modclass>
	<modscore>1</modscore>
	<htmltext>So basically you're saying Android is doing as much as it can do about what it can control, and not much about things it can't control.  None of that is good news for Apple who is not doing enough of the former and pissing off a lot of people with their attempts at the latter.</htmltext>
<tokenext>So basically you 're saying Android is doing as much as it can do about what it can control , and not much about things it ca n't control .
None of that is good news for Apple who is not doing enough of the former and pissing off a lot of people with their attempts at the latter .</tokentext>
<sentencetext>So basically you're saying Android is doing as much as it can do about what it can control, and not much about things it can't control.
None of that is good news for Apple who is not doing enough of the former and pissing off a lot of people with their attempts at the latter.</sentencetext>
	<parent>http://www.semanticweb.org/ontologies/ConversationInstances.owl#comment09_12_04_0413235.30321752</parent>
</comment>
<comment>
	<id>http://www.semanticweb.org/ontologies/ConversationInstances.owl#comment09_12_04_0413235.30323242</id>
	<title>Re:No, no, no. This is English.</title>
	<author>Anonymous</author>
	<datestamp>1259939460000</datestamp>
	<modclass>None</modclass>
	<modscore>1</modscore>
	<htmltext><p>If you'd step outside your own borders once in awhile, you'd recognize this sentence structure as something that works in a foreign language, but has been translated into English by a non-native speaker.  Constructive criticism is useful, but please don't be unkind.</p></htmltext>
<tokenext>If you 'd step outside your own borders once in awhile , you 'd recognize this sentence structure as something that works in a foreign language , but has been translated into English by a non-native speaker .
Constructive criticism is useful , but please do n't be unkind .</tokentext>
<sentencetext>If you'd step outside your own borders once in awhile, you'd recognize this sentence structure as something that works in a foreign language, but has been translated into English by a non-native speaker.
Constructive criticism is useful, but please don't be unkind.</sentencetext>
	<parent>http://www.semanticweb.org/ontologies/ConversationInstances.owl#comment09_12_04_0413235.30321926</parent>
</comment>
<comment>
	<id>http://www.semanticweb.org/ontologies/ConversationInstances.owl#comment09_12_04_0413235.30322216</id>
	<title>Who uses Stock iPhones anymore?</title>
	<author>redstar427</author>
	<datestamp>1259925720000</datestamp>
	<modclass>Funny</modclass>
	<modscore>4</modscore>
	<htmltext><p>This baby is overclocked and water cooled, running at 2.3 Ghz!<br>It's so fast when talking on the phone, my friends sound like Alvin and the Chipmunks.</p></htmltext>
<tokenext>This baby is overclocked and water cooled , running at 2.3 Ghz ! It 's so fast when talking on the phone , my friends sound like Alvin and the Chipmunks .</tokentext>
<sentencetext>This baby is overclocked and water cooled, running at 2.3 Ghz!It's so fast when talking on the phone, my friends sound like Alvin and the Chipmunks.</sentencetext>
</comment>
<comment>
	<id>http://www.semanticweb.org/ontologies/ConversationInstances.owl#comment09_12_04_0413235.30323910</id>
	<title>Re:This isn't any different from any other compute</title>
	<author>Zebedeu</author>
	<datestamp>1259943180000</datestamp>
	<modclass>None</modclass>
	<modscore>1</modscore>
	<htmltext><p><div class="quote"><p>Typically this access will go through the standard Android permission system, so the user will see when they install the app that it's requesting permission to read their SMS logs or whatever.</p></div><p>Which to me is a missing feature in Android -- the ability to enable/disable each permission individually.<br>As it stands now, you're presented with a laundry list of permissions which the app requests upon installation, and you either accept it wholesale, or cancel the installation.</p><p>I think Java ME does it correctly. You can look at the app's properties and enable/disable each policy, and even set it to ask once, or everytime that feature runs.</p><p>Sure, this would break the business model of most of those advertisements-supported apps (just disable internet access if it's not required for anything else), but the user would get much better control and security in return.</p></div>
	</htmltext>
<tokenext>Typically this access will go through the standard Android permission system , so the user will see when they install the app that it 's requesting permission to read their SMS logs or whatever.Which to me is a missing feature in Android -- the ability to enable/disable each permission individually.As it stands now , you 're presented with a laundry list of permissions which the app requests upon installation , and you either accept it wholesale , or cancel the installation.I think Java ME does it correctly .
You can look at the app 's properties and enable/disable each policy , and even set it to ask once , or everytime that feature runs.Sure , this would break the business model of most of those advertisements-supported apps ( just disable internet access if it 's not required for anything else ) , but the user would get much better control and security in return .</tokentext>
<sentencetext>Typically this access will go through the standard Android permission system, so the user will see when they install the app that it's requesting permission to read their SMS logs or whatever.Which to me is a missing feature in Android -- the ability to enable/disable each permission individually.As it stands now, you're presented with a laundry list of permissions which the app requests upon installation, and you either accept it wholesale, or cancel the installation.I think Java ME does it correctly.
You can look at the app's properties and enable/disable each policy, and even set it to ask once, or everytime that feature runs.Sure, this would break the business model of most of those advertisements-supported apps (just disable internet access if it's not required for anything else), but the user would get much better control and security in return.
	</sentencetext>
	<parent>http://www.semanticweb.org/ontologies/ConversationInstances.owl#comment09_12_04_0413235.30321752</parent>
</comment>
<comment>
	<id>http://www.semanticweb.org/ontologies/ConversationInstances.owl#comment09_12_04_0413235.30323204</id>
	<title>Re:Interesting sources...</title>
	<author>TheRaven64</author>
	<datestamp>1259939220000</datestamp>
	<modclass>Informativ</modclass>
	<modscore>2</modscore>
	<htmltext>Scanning for strings is pretty easy to circumvent.  You can just concatenate the path components in code.  'var' and 'mobile' are quite innocuous strings.  The same is true for private APIs, by the way, because Objective-C lets you look up both classes and methods by name.</htmltext>
<tokenext>Scanning for strings is pretty easy to circumvent .
You can just concatenate the path components in code .
'var ' and 'mobile ' are quite innocuous strings .
The same is true for private APIs , by the way , because Objective-C lets you look up both classes and methods by name .</tokentext>
<sentencetext>Scanning for strings is pretty easy to circumvent.
You can just concatenate the path components in code.
'var' and 'mobile' are quite innocuous strings.
The same is true for private APIs, by the way, because Objective-C lets you look up both classes and methods by name.</sentencetext>
	<parent>http://www.semanticweb.org/ontologies/ConversationInstances.owl#comment09_12_04_0413235.30321440</parent>
</comment>
<comment>
	<id>http://www.semanticweb.org/ontologies/ConversationInstances.owl#comment09_12_04_0413235.30323418</id>
	<title>Oh no! The computer has my data!</title>
	<author>VeryVito</author>
	<datestamp>1259940480000</datestamp>
	<modclass>None</modclass>
	<modscore>1</modscore>
	<htmltext>The other day I downloaded a contact manager to my iphone, and was shocked and dismayed to realize it had access to all my contacts. Something tells me the personal finance apps I sometimes used might actually have access to some of my financial data!

In other words... what a dumb presentation. Of course trusted applications running on a computer will have access to some of the data on that same computer. Otherwise, what's the point? Would saving all this data on your desktop be any safer?

How can I live in a world where computers can do things?!!</htmltext>
<tokenext>The other day I downloaded a contact manager to my iphone , and was shocked and dismayed to realize it had access to all my contacts .
Something tells me the personal finance apps I sometimes used might actually have access to some of my financial data !
In other words... what a dumb presentation .
Of course trusted applications running on a computer will have access to some of the data on that same computer .
Otherwise , what 's the point ?
Would saving all this data on your desktop be any safer ?
How can I live in a world where computers can do things ? !
!</tokentext>
<sentencetext>The other day I downloaded a contact manager to my iphone, and was shocked and dismayed to realize it had access to all my contacts.
Something tells me the personal finance apps I sometimes used might actually have access to some of my financial data!
In other words... what a dumb presentation.
Of course trusted applications running on a computer will have access to some of the data on that same computer.
Otherwise, what's the point?
Would saving all this data on your desktop be any safer?
How can I live in a world where computers can do things?!
!</sentencetext>
</comment>
<comment>
	<id>http://www.semanticweb.org/ontologies/ConversationInstances.owl#comment09_12_04_0413235.30326676</id>
	<title>Re:No, no, no. This is English.</title>
	<author>Jay L</author>
	<datestamp>1259954820000</datestamp>
	<modclass>None</modclass>
	<modscore>1</modscore>
	<htmltext><blockquote><div><p>No, Nicolas Seriot did not present a talk to "last night". Nor was was his talk about "iPhone Privacy in Geneva".</p></div></blockquote><p>And from you, we should take advice?</p></div>
	</htmltext>
<tokenext>No , Nicolas Seriot did not present a talk to " last night " .
Nor was was his talk about " iPhone Privacy in Geneva " .And from you , we should take advice ?</tokentext>
<sentencetext>No, Nicolas Seriot did not present a talk to "last night".
Nor was was his talk about "iPhone Privacy in Geneva".And from you, we should take advice?
	</sentencetext>
	<parent>http://www.semanticweb.org/ontologies/ConversationInstances.owl#comment09_12_04_0413235.30321926</parent>
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-http://www.semanticweb.org/ontologies/ConversationInstances.owl#comment09_12_04_0413235.30321496
--http://www.semanticweb.org/ontologies/ConversationInstances.owl#comment09_12_04_0413235.30321752
---http://www.semanticweb.org/ontologies/ConversationInstances.owl#comment09_12_04_0413235.30327958
---http://www.semanticweb.org/ontologies/ConversationInstances.owl#comment09_12_04_0413235.30323910
---http://www.semanticweb.org/ontologies/ConversationInstances.owl#comment09_12_04_0413235.30324430
-http://www.semanticweb.org/ontologies/ConversationInstances.owl#comment09_12_04_0413235.30323138
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	<id>http://www.semanticweb.org/ontologies/ConversationInstances.owl#conversation09_12_04_0413235.9</id>
	<commentlist>http://www.semanticweb.org/ontologies/ConversationInstances.owl#comment09_12_04_0413235.30323420
-http://www.semanticweb.org/ontologies/ConversationInstances.owl#comment09_12_04_0413235.30325008
</commentlist>
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<conversation>
	<id>http://www.semanticweb.org/ontologies/ConversationInstances.owl#conversation09_12_04_0413235.7</id>
	<commentlist>http://www.semanticweb.org/ontologies/ConversationInstances.owl#comment09_12_04_0413235.30322082
</commentlist>
</conversation>
<conversation>
	<id>http://www.semanticweb.org/ontologies/ConversationInstances.owl#conversation09_12_04_0413235.0</id>
	<commentlist>http://www.semanticweb.org/ontologies/ConversationInstances.owl#comment09_12_04_0413235.30322294
-http://www.semanticweb.org/ontologies/ConversationInstances.owl#comment09_12_04_0413235.30325340
-http://www.semanticweb.org/ontologies/ConversationInstances.owl#comment09_12_04_0413235.30324438
-http://www.semanticweb.org/ontologies/ConversationInstances.owl#comment09_12_04_0413235.30326872
-http://www.semanticweb.org/ontologies/ConversationInstances.owl#comment09_12_04_0413235.30325228
</commentlist>
</conversation>
<conversation>
	<id>http://www.semanticweb.org/ontologies/ConversationInstances.owl#conversation09_12_04_0413235.11</id>
	<commentlist>http://www.semanticweb.org/ontologies/ConversationInstances.owl#comment09_12_04_0413235.30321398
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<conversation>
	<id>http://www.semanticweb.org/ontologies/ConversationInstances.owl#conversation09_12_04_0413235.1</id>
	<commentlist>http://www.semanticweb.org/ontologies/ConversationInstances.owl#comment09_12_04_0413235.30321926
-http://www.semanticweb.org/ontologies/ConversationInstances.owl#comment09_12_04_0413235.30326676
-http://www.semanticweb.org/ontologies/ConversationInstances.owl#comment09_12_04_0413235.30327178
-http://www.semanticweb.org/ontologies/ConversationInstances.owl#comment09_12_04_0413235.30323242
--http://www.semanticweb.org/ontologies/ConversationInstances.owl#comment09_12_04_0413235.30326114
--http://www.semanticweb.org/ontologies/ConversationInstances.owl#comment09_12_04_0413235.30325026
-http://www.semanticweb.org/ontologies/ConversationInstances.owl#comment09_12_04_0413235.30326328
-http://www.semanticweb.org/ontologies/ConversationInstances.owl#comment09_12_04_0413235.30323008
-http://www.semanticweb.org/ontologies/ConversationInstances.owl#comment09_12_04_0413235.30323060
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<conversation>
	<id>http://www.semanticweb.org/ontologies/ConversationInstances.owl#conversation09_12_04_0413235.12</id>
	<commentlist>http://www.semanticweb.org/ontologies/ConversationInstances.owl#comment09_12_04_0413235.30325982
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<conversation>
	<id>http://www.semanticweb.org/ontologies/ConversationInstances.owl#conversation09_12_04_0413235.4</id>
	<commentlist>http://www.semanticweb.org/ontologies/ConversationInstances.owl#comment09_12_04_0413235.30321668
-http://www.semanticweb.org/ontologies/ConversationInstances.owl#comment09_12_04_0413235.30325380
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<conversation>
	<id>http://www.semanticweb.org/ontologies/ConversationInstances.owl#conversation09_12_04_0413235.13</id>
	<commentlist>http://www.semanticweb.org/ontologies/ConversationInstances.owl#comment09_12_04_0413235.30321466
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<conversation>
	<id>http://www.semanticweb.org/ontologies/ConversationInstances.owl#conversation09_12_04_0413235.10</id>
	<commentlist>http://www.semanticweb.org/ontologies/ConversationInstances.owl#comment09_12_04_0413235.30321366
-http://www.semanticweb.org/ontologies/ConversationInstances.owl#comment09_12_04_0413235.30326004
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<conversation>
	<id>http://www.semanticweb.org/ontologies/ConversationInstances.owl#conversation09_12_04_0413235.2</id>
	<commentlist>http://www.semanticweb.org/ontologies/ConversationInstances.owl#comment09_12_04_0413235.30321646
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<conversation>
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	<commentlist>http://www.semanticweb.org/ontologies/ConversationInstances.owl#comment09_12_04_0413235.30321490
-http://www.semanticweb.org/ontologies/ConversationInstances.owl#comment09_12_04_0413235.30321640
--http://www.semanticweb.org/ontologies/ConversationInstances.owl#comment09_12_04_0413235.30326862
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<conversation>
	<id>http://www.semanticweb.org/ontologies/ConversationInstances.owl#conversation09_12_04_0413235.3</id>
	<commentlist>http://www.semanticweb.org/ontologies/ConversationInstances.owl#comment09_12_04_0413235.30323394
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