<article>
	<id>http://www.semanticweb.org/ontologies/ConversationInstances.owl#article09_11_17_2245241</id>
	<title>Hackers Broke Into Brazil Power Grid Operator's Website Last Thursday</title>
	<author>kdawson</author>
	<datestamp>1258458060000</datestamp>
	<htmltext>An anonymous reader writes <i>"A week ago, 60 Minutes had a story (we <a href="//it.slashdot.org/story/09/11/09/0012226/Massive-Power-Outages-In-Brazil-Caused-By-Hackers">picked it up too</a>) claiming that hackers had caused power outages in Brazil. While this assertion is now believed to be in error, hackers were inspired by the story actually to do what was claimed. Last Thursday, they <a href="http://translate.google.com/translate?js=y&amp;prev=\_t&amp;hl=en&amp;ie=UTF-8&amp;u=http\%3A\%2F\%2Fg1.globo.com\%2FNoticias\%2FTecnologia\%2F0\%2C\%2CMUL1380926-6174\%2C00-HACKERS\%2BINVADIRAM\%2BSITE\%2BDIZ\%2BONS.html&amp;sl=pt&amp;tl=en">broke into ONS, the operator of the grid</a> (Google translation; <a href="http://g1.globo.com/Noticias/Tecnologia/0,,MUL1380926-6174,00-HACKERS+INVADIRAM+SITE+DIZ+ONS.html">Portuguese original</a>). DarkReading has <a href="http://darkreading.com/blog/archives/2009/11/how\_to\_hack\_a\_b.html">specific details on the SQL injection vulnerabilities</a> the hackers probably used."</i></htmltext>
<tokenext>An anonymous reader writes " A week ago , 60 Minutes had a story ( we picked it up too ) claiming that hackers had caused power outages in Brazil .
While this assertion is now believed to be in error , hackers were inspired by the story actually to do what was claimed .
Last Thursday , they broke into ONS , the operator of the grid ( Google translation ; Portuguese original ) .
DarkReading has specific details on the SQL injection vulnerabilities the hackers probably used .
"</tokentext>
<sentencetext>An anonymous reader writes "A week ago, 60 Minutes had a story (we picked it up too) claiming that hackers had caused power outages in Brazil.
While this assertion is now believed to be in error, hackers were inspired by the story actually to do what was claimed.
Last Thursday, they broke into ONS, the operator of the grid (Google translation; Portuguese original).
DarkReading has specific details on the SQL injection vulnerabilities the hackers probably used.
"</sentencetext>
</article>
<comment>
	<id>http://www.semanticweb.org/ontologies/ConversationInstances.owl#comment09_11_17_2245241.30137700</id>
	<title>Re:Really....</title>
	<author>mr exploiter</author>
	<datestamp>1258464180000</datestamp>
	<modclass>Interestin</modclass>
	<modscore>2</modscore>
	<htmltext>That's not how things work in practice. Remote monitoring from anywhere in the world is too tempting. You can take a look at what kind of thing SCADA vendors are selling to realize things are getting worse before they're getting better.</htmltext>
<tokenext>That 's not how things work in practice .
Remote monitoring from anywhere in the world is too tempting .
You can take a look at what kind of thing SCADA vendors are selling to realize things are getting worse before they 're getting better .</tokentext>
<sentencetext>That's not how things work in practice.
Remote monitoring from anywhere in the world is too tempting.
You can take a look at what kind of thing SCADA vendors are selling to realize things are getting worse before they're getting better.</sentencetext>
	<parent>http://www.semanticweb.org/ontologies/ConversationInstances.owl#comment09_11_17_2245241.30137340</parent>
</comment>
<comment>
	<id>http://www.semanticweb.org/ontologies/ConversationInstances.owl#comment09_11_17_2245241.30137872</id>
	<title>Power regs</title>
	<author>Anonymous</author>
	<datestamp>1258465200000</datestamp>
	<modclass>None</modclass>
	<modscore>0</modscore>
	<htmltext><p>I don't know what the regs are in Brazil, but in the US, NERC limits how the Generation and SCADA systems may be connected.  There is to be no way to get to the Generation or SCADA systems from outside them.</p><p>Data is only allowed to be pushed out from those systems, and even better it should be pushed to a secured DMZ where only trusted systems can, with read-only access, pick up the data (since you have to get customer data back out somehow for the billing systems, etc.).  Nothing should be allowed into the DMZ from non-Generation / SCADA networks.  That means even the power utilities non-Generation or non-SCADA systems can't get to any of these networks/systems, period.  The Generation and SCADA systems should not be able to get to any other networks than this secured DMZ.</p><p>If these simple rules are followed, there is no way to affect the grid from the Internet, or even the regular power utility corporate network.  However, sadly, for different reasons these obvious security guards are bypassed.</p></htmltext>
<tokenext>I do n't know what the regs are in Brazil , but in the US , NERC limits how the Generation and SCADA systems may be connected .
There is to be no way to get to the Generation or SCADA systems from outside them.Data is only allowed to be pushed out from those systems , and even better it should be pushed to a secured DMZ where only trusted systems can , with read-only access , pick up the data ( since you have to get customer data back out somehow for the billing systems , etc. ) .
Nothing should be allowed into the DMZ from non-Generation / SCADA networks .
That means even the power utilities non-Generation or non-SCADA systems ca n't get to any of these networks/systems , period .
The Generation and SCADA systems should not be able to get to any other networks than this secured DMZ.If these simple rules are followed , there is no way to affect the grid from the Internet , or even the regular power utility corporate network .
However , sadly , for different reasons these obvious security guards are bypassed .</tokentext>
<sentencetext>I don't know what the regs are in Brazil, but in the US, NERC limits how the Generation and SCADA systems may be connected.
There is to be no way to get to the Generation or SCADA systems from outside them.Data is only allowed to be pushed out from those systems, and even better it should be pushed to a secured DMZ where only trusted systems can, with read-only access, pick up the data (since you have to get customer data back out somehow for the billing systems, etc.).
Nothing should be allowed into the DMZ from non-Generation / SCADA networks.
That means even the power utilities non-Generation or non-SCADA systems can't get to any of these networks/systems, period.
The Generation and SCADA systems should not be able to get to any other networks than this secured DMZ.If these simple rules are followed, there is no way to affect the grid from the Internet, or even the regular power utility corporate network.
However, sadly, for different reasons these obvious security guards are bypassed.</sentencetext>
</comment>
<comment>
	<id>http://www.semanticweb.org/ontologies/ConversationInstances.owl#comment09_11_17_2245241.30137372</id>
	<title>Or maybe...</title>
	<author>Anonymous</author>
	<datestamp>1258462380000</datestamp>
	<modclass>Insightful</modclass>
	<modscore>2</modscore>
	<htmltext><p>They were so good the first time they left no trace of their doings and even framed it on some other probable cause.</p><p>One of the hackers (I'm guessing the one who likes polo shirts) obviously thought it'd be way cooler to take public credit. They have now revoked his invitation to DEF CON.</p></htmltext>
<tokenext>They were so good the first time they left no trace of their doings and even framed it on some other probable cause.One of the hackers ( I 'm guessing the one who likes polo shirts ) obviously thought it 'd be way cooler to take public credit .
They have now revoked his invitation to DEF CON .</tokentext>
<sentencetext>They were so good the first time they left no trace of their doings and even framed it on some other probable cause.One of the hackers (I'm guessing the one who likes polo shirts) obviously thought it'd be way cooler to take public credit.
They have now revoked his invitation to DEF CON.</sentencetext>
</comment>
<comment>
	<id>http://www.semanticweb.org/ontologies/ConversationInstances.owl#comment09_11_17_2245241.30137212</id>
	<title>full disclosure</title>
	<author>Anonymous</author>
	<datestamp>1258461660000</datestamp>
	<modclass>Insightful</modclass>
	<modscore>1</modscore>
	<htmltext><p><div class="quote"><p>And, two days after the blackout, the systems analyst Maycon Vitali, 23, revealed in the blog "Hack'n'roll" to a login page of the ONS revealed error in the validation data. The flaw could allow a hacker to send command to the database and find sensitive data from ONS.</p><p>The failure was published in the newspaper Folha de S. Paulo on Monday (16).</p></div><p>This is exactly why full disclosure is not good.</p></div>
	</htmltext>
<tokenext>And , two days after the blackout , the systems analyst Maycon Vitali , 23 , revealed in the blog " Hack'n'roll " to a login page of the ONS revealed error in the validation data .
The flaw could allow a hacker to send command to the database and find sensitive data from ONS.The failure was published in the newspaper Folha de S. Paulo on Monday ( 16 ) .This is exactly why full disclosure is not good .</tokentext>
<sentencetext>And, two days after the blackout, the systems analyst Maycon Vitali, 23, revealed in the blog "Hack'n'roll" to a login page of the ONS revealed error in the validation data.
The flaw could allow a hacker to send command to the database and find sensitive data from ONS.The failure was published in the newspaper Folha de S. Paulo on Monday (16).This is exactly why full disclosure is not good.
	</sentencetext>
</comment>
<comment>
	<id>http://www.semanticweb.org/ontologies/ConversationInstances.owl#comment09_11_17_2245241.30138370</id>
	<title>"hackers"</title>
	<author>clang\_jangle</author>
	<datestamp>1258468860000</datestamp>
	<modclass>None</modclass>
	<modscore>1</modscore>
	<htmltext><blockquote><div><p>hackers were inspired by the story actually to do what was claimed.</p></div></blockquote><p>***sigh***<br> <b> <i>Some</i></b>  "hackers, or more accurately <b> <i>some script kiddies</i> </b>. The diggification of slashdot is not at all a good thing.</p></div>
	</htmltext>
<tokenext>hackers were inspired by the story actually to do what was claimed .
* * * sigh * * * Some " hackers , or more accurately some script kiddies .
The diggification of slashdot is not at all a good thing .</tokentext>
<sentencetext>hackers were inspired by the story actually to do what was claimed.
***sigh***  Some  "hackers, or more accurately  some script kiddies .
The diggification of slashdot is not at all a good thing.
	</sentencetext>
</comment>
<comment>
	<id>http://www.semanticweb.org/ontologies/ConversationInstances.owl#comment09_11_17_2245241.30138148</id>
	<title>Re:Really....</title>
	<author>Anonymous</author>
	<datestamp>1258467240000</datestamp>
	<modclass>Interestin</modclass>
	<modscore>1</modscore>
	<htmltext><p>And yet, your bank probably uses internet based VPNs for their ATMs, because they are cheaper to run than dedicated lines.</p></htmltext>
<tokenext>And yet , your bank probably uses internet based VPNs for their ATMs , because they are cheaper to run than dedicated lines .</tokentext>
<sentencetext>And yet, your bank probably uses internet based VPNs for their ATMs, because they are cheaper to run than dedicated lines.</sentencetext>
	<parent>http://www.semanticweb.org/ontologies/ConversationInstances.owl#comment09_11_17_2245241.30137340</parent>
</comment>
<comment>
	<id>http://www.semanticweb.org/ontologies/ConversationInstances.owl#comment09_11_17_2245241.30137920</id>
	<title>Breaking News</title>
	<author>Anonymous</author>
	<datestamp>1258465380000</datestamp>
	<modclass>Funny</modclass>
	<modscore>4</modscore>
	<htmltext><p>Today hackers gained access to my bank account and increased the ballance to 100 millions dollars without alerting authorities.<br>Actually that didn't happen. My bank account is perfectly secure. There are no hackers anywhere that are smart enough to do such a thing.</p></htmltext>
<tokenext>Today hackers gained access to my bank account and increased the ballance to 100 millions dollars without alerting authorities.Actually that did n't happen .
My bank account is perfectly secure .
There are no hackers anywhere that are smart enough to do such a thing .</tokentext>
<sentencetext>Today hackers gained access to my bank account and increased the ballance to 100 millions dollars without alerting authorities.Actually that didn't happen.
My bank account is perfectly secure.
There are no hackers anywhere that are smart enough to do such a thing.</sentencetext>
</comment>
<comment>
	<id>http://www.semanticweb.org/ontologies/ConversationInstances.owl#comment09_11_17_2245241.30137298</id>
	<title>closed systems</title>
	<author>Anonymous</author>
	<datestamp>1258462080000</datestamp>
	<modclass>Funny</modclass>
	<modscore>2</modscore>
	<htmltext><p>
&nbsp; One would think critical power networks would be close systems.</p></htmltext>
<tokenext>  One would think critical power networks would be close systems .</tokentext>
<sentencetext>
  One would think critical power networks would be close systems.</sentencetext>
</comment>
<comment>
	<id>http://www.semanticweb.org/ontologies/ConversationInstances.owl#comment09_11_17_2245241.30138272</id>
	<title>Re:actually</title>
	<author>Anonymous</author>
	<datestamp>1258468140000</datestamp>
	<modclass>None</modclass>
	<modscore>0</modscore>
	<htmltext><p><div class="quote"><p>the hackers invaded the \_website\_, the ONS network of computers that actually control the system is private and not connect to the internet.</p></div><p>what you can expect from kdawson? dont even bother.</p></div>
	</htmltext>
<tokenext>the hackers invaded the \ _website \ _ , the ONS network of computers that actually control the system is private and not connect to the internet.what you can expect from kdawson ?
dont even bother .</tokentext>
<sentencetext>the hackers invaded the \_website\_, the ONS network of computers that actually control the system is private and not connect to the internet.what you can expect from kdawson?
dont even bother.
	</sentencetext>
	<parent>http://www.semanticweb.org/ontologies/ConversationInstances.owl#comment09_11_17_2245241.30137270</parent>
</comment>
<comment>
	<id>http://www.semanticweb.org/ontologies/ConversationInstances.owl#comment09_11_17_2245241.30145760</id>
	<title>Re:full disclosure</title>
	<author>n0tWorthy</author>
	<datestamp>1257099780000</datestamp>
	<modclass>None</modclass>
	<modscore>1</modscore>
	<htmltext><p>Anyone that knows anything about the utility systems (power, water, gas, sewer) knows they are run by the most insecure systems out there. There have been reports of SCADA vulnerabilities for years (GOOGLE it yourself) and many concerns expressed (http://www.darkreading.com/blog/archives/2009/04/scada\_security.html).</p><p>Once someone can get out of a compromised system and onto a utilities internal SCADA network they have total control. The best place to practice is on a relatively insecure 2nd or 3rd world network where there are few legal consequences to hacking. Once the skills are honed up and scripts can be written to control large numbers of SCADA systems at once the real fun can begin. This is one of the major objectives of terrorists (http://www.pbs.org/wgbh/pages/frontline/shows/cyberwar/vulnerable/scada.html).</p></htmltext>
<tokenext>Anyone that knows anything about the utility systems ( power , water , gas , sewer ) knows they are run by the most insecure systems out there .
There have been reports of SCADA vulnerabilities for years ( GOOGLE it yourself ) and many concerns expressed ( http : //www.darkreading.com/blog/archives/2009/04/scada \ _security.html ) .Once someone can get out of a compromised system and onto a utilities internal SCADA network they have total control .
The best place to practice is on a relatively insecure 2nd or 3rd world network where there are few legal consequences to hacking .
Once the skills are honed up and scripts can be written to control large numbers of SCADA systems at once the real fun can begin .
This is one of the major objectives of terrorists ( http : //www.pbs.org/wgbh/pages/frontline/shows/cyberwar/vulnerable/scada.html ) .</tokentext>
<sentencetext>Anyone that knows anything about the utility systems (power, water, gas, sewer) knows they are run by the most insecure systems out there.
There have been reports of SCADA vulnerabilities for years (GOOGLE it yourself) and many concerns expressed (http://www.darkreading.com/blog/archives/2009/04/scada\_security.html).Once someone can get out of a compromised system and onto a utilities internal SCADA network they have total control.
The best place to practice is on a relatively insecure 2nd or 3rd world network where there are few legal consequences to hacking.
Once the skills are honed up and scripts can be written to control large numbers of SCADA systems at once the real fun can begin.
This is one of the major objectives of terrorists (http://www.pbs.org/wgbh/pages/frontline/shows/cyberwar/vulnerable/scada.html).</sentencetext>
	<parent>http://www.semanticweb.org/ontologies/ConversationInstances.owl#comment09_11_17_2245241.30137212</parent>
</comment>
<comment>
	<id>http://www.semanticweb.org/ontologies/ConversationInstances.owl#comment09_11_17_2245241.30137680</id>
	<title>Conspiracy theorys abound!</title>
	<author>Anonymous</author>
	<datestamp>1258464000000</datestamp>
	<modclass>Insightful</modclass>
	<modscore>5</modscore>
	<htmltext><p>This is ridiculous. You can easily hack into their corporate website, but there is no way hackers got into the Brazilian power grid management system, because there is no such automated system in the first place! The central agency controlling the grid Operador Nacional do Sistema (ONS) operates the center by calling their buddies on generating station over private phone lines. Unless you are a very good voice impersonator and know all the necessary protocols, you will not get very far. That's when lack of technology is a plus.</p></htmltext>
<tokenext>This is ridiculous .
You can easily hack into their corporate website , but there is no way hackers got into the Brazilian power grid management system , because there is no such automated system in the first place !
The central agency controlling the grid Operador Nacional do Sistema ( ONS ) operates the center by calling their buddies on generating station over private phone lines .
Unless you are a very good voice impersonator and know all the necessary protocols , you will not get very far .
That 's when lack of technology is a plus .</tokentext>
<sentencetext>This is ridiculous.
You can easily hack into their corporate website, but there is no way hackers got into the Brazilian power grid management system, because there is no such automated system in the first place!
The central agency controlling the grid Operador Nacional do Sistema (ONS) operates the center by calling their buddies on generating station over private phone lines.
Unless you are a very good voice impersonator and know all the necessary protocols, you will not get very far.
That's when lack of technology is a plus.</sentencetext>
</comment>
<comment>
	<id>http://www.semanticweb.org/ontologies/ConversationInstances.owl#comment09_11_17_2245241.30137974</id>
	<title>What the hell do you mean this isn't a dupe?</title>
	<author>BlortHorc</author>
	<datestamp>1258465800000</datestamp>
	<modclass>None</modclass>
	<modscore>1</modscore>
	<htmltext><p>I'm sure I can't be the only one who saw this and thought, "You told us this, what, a week ago?". Goddamn moderators.</p><p>I think these guys were trolling jaded<nobr> <wbr></nobr>/. readers for kicks</p></htmltext>
<tokenext>I 'm sure I ca n't be the only one who saw this and thought , " You told us this , what , a week ago ? " .
Goddamn moderators.I think these guys were trolling jaded / .
readers for kicks</tokentext>
<sentencetext>I'm sure I can't be the only one who saw this and thought, "You told us this, what, a week ago?".
Goddamn moderators.I think these guys were trolling jaded /.
readers for kicks</sentencetext>
</comment>
<comment>
	<id>http://www.semanticweb.org/ontologies/ConversationInstances.owl#comment09_11_17_2245241.30145880</id>
	<title>Re:Really....</title>
	<author>n0tWorthy</author>
	<datestamp>1257100260000</datestamp>
	<modclass>None</modclass>
	<modscore>1</modscore>
	<htmltext><p>Many of these systems are locked in sheds alongside the larger transformer/switching sites. Cut the padlock and you have access to a Windows 2000 SCADA system that is on their SCADA network. Many of these also have modems and PCAnywhere. It really is scary.</p></htmltext>
<tokenext>Many of these systems are locked in sheds alongside the larger transformer/switching sites .
Cut the padlock and you have access to a Windows 2000 SCADA system that is on their SCADA network .
Many of these also have modems and PCAnywhere .
It really is scary .</tokentext>
<sentencetext>Many of these systems are locked in sheds alongside the larger transformer/switching sites.
Cut the padlock and you have access to a Windows 2000 SCADA system that is on their SCADA network.
Many of these also have modems and PCAnywhere.
It really is scary.</sentencetext>
	<parent>http://www.semanticweb.org/ontologies/ConversationInstances.owl#comment09_11_17_2245241.30137642</parent>
</comment>
<comment>
	<id>http://www.semanticweb.org/ontologies/ConversationInstances.owl#comment09_11_17_2245241.30137650</id>
	<title>Accidents....</title>
	<author>jhcaocf197912</author>
	<datestamp>1258463880000</datestamp>
	<modclass>None</modclass>
	<modscore>1</modscore>
	<htmltext>Hey Vinny, give Tommy a little ride....... make sure it looks like an accident.</htmltext>
<tokenext>Hey Vinny , give Tommy a little ride....... make sure it looks like an accident .</tokentext>
<sentencetext>Hey Vinny, give Tommy a little ride....... make sure it looks like an accident.</sentencetext>
</comment>
<comment>
	<id>http://www.semanticweb.org/ontologies/ConversationInstances.owl#comment09_11_17_2245241.30141290</id>
	<title>Rede Globo is pretty much a brazilian Faux News</title>
	<author>Anonymous</author>
	<datestamp>1257071820000</datestamp>
	<modclass>Flamebait</modclass>
	<modscore>-1</modscore>
	<htmltext><p>/.ers shouldn't be taking them seriously</p></htmltext>
<tokenext>/.ers should n't be taking them seriously</tokentext>
<sentencetext>/.ers shouldn't be taking them seriously</sentencetext>
</comment>
<comment>
	<id>http://www.semanticweb.org/ontologies/ConversationInstances.owl#comment09_11_17_2245241.30139316</id>
	<title>Re:Really....</title>
	<author>iammani</author>
	<datestamp>1258476360000</datestamp>
	<modclass>None</modclass>
	<modscore>1</modscore>
	<htmltext>VPNs?</htmltext>
<tokenext>VPNs ?</tokentext>
<sentencetext>VPNs?</sentencetext>
	<parent>http://www.semanticweb.org/ontologies/ConversationInstances.owl#comment09_11_17_2245241.30137642</parent>
</comment>
<comment>
	<id>http://www.semanticweb.org/ontologies/ConversationInstances.owl#comment09_11_17_2245241.30137692</id>
	<title>Misundestood news</title>
	<author>aylons</author>
	<datestamp>1258464120000</datestamp>
	<modclass>Informativ</modclass>
	<modscore>2</modscore>
	<htmltext>Hackers didn't broke into the ONS (national power grid operator) system. They have broken into its web site, and this has happened days after the blackout. And the website, naturally, has nothing to do with the operational servers.

There are no evidences whatsoever that last Thurday's blackout was caused by an online attack.</htmltext>
<tokenext>Hackers did n't broke into the ONS ( national power grid operator ) system .
They have broken into its web site , and this has happened days after the blackout .
And the website , naturally , has nothing to do with the operational servers .
There are no evidences whatsoever that last Thurday 's blackout was caused by an online attack .</tokentext>
<sentencetext>Hackers didn't broke into the ONS (national power grid operator) system.
They have broken into its web site, and this has happened days after the blackout.
And the website, naturally, has nothing to do with the operational servers.
There are no evidences whatsoever that last Thurday's blackout was caused by an online attack.</sentencetext>
</comment>
<comment>
	<id>http://www.semanticweb.org/ontologies/ConversationInstances.owl#comment09_11_17_2245241.30138354</id>
	<title>Re:closed systems</title>
	<author>twoDigitIq</author>
	<datestamp>1258468740000</datestamp>
	<modclass>None</modclass>
	<modscore>1</modscore>
	<htmltext>I work in IT at an energy company whose systems are tightly integrated with "the grid" and I can testify that someone with the right knowledge (or even someone well versed in the art of social engineering) could wreak havoc on the power lines here in the U.S.</htmltext>
<tokenext>I work in IT at an energy company whose systems are tightly integrated with " the grid " and I can testify that someone with the right knowledge ( or even someone well versed in the art of social engineering ) could wreak havoc on the power lines here in the U.S .</tokentext>
<sentencetext>I work in IT at an energy company whose systems are tightly integrated with "the grid" and I can testify that someone with the right knowledge (or even someone well versed in the art of social engineering) could wreak havoc on the power lines here in the U.S.</sentencetext>
	<parent>http://www.semanticweb.org/ontologies/ConversationInstances.owl#comment09_11_17_2245241.30137298</parent>
</comment>
<comment>
	<id>http://www.semanticweb.org/ontologies/ConversationInstances.owl#comment09_11_17_2245241.30139538</id>
	<title>Re:actually</title>
	<author>fluffy99</author>
	<datestamp>1258478160000</datestamp>
	<modclass>None</modclass>
	<modscore>1</modscore>
	<htmltext><p>It's a whole different ballgame if they are using vlans to isolate the control network.  Then a hacker just has to penetrate a router or take advantage of poor vlan isolation in some switches.  Plus, you're bound to have at least a few employees who just have to have their machine connected to both networks at the same time and think using two network cards is safe.</p></htmltext>
<tokenext>It 's a whole different ballgame if they are using vlans to isolate the control network .
Then a hacker just has to penetrate a router or take advantage of poor vlan isolation in some switches .
Plus , you 're bound to have at least a few employees who just have to have their machine connected to both networks at the same time and think using two network cards is safe .</tokentext>
<sentencetext>It's a whole different ballgame if they are using vlans to isolate the control network.
Then a hacker just has to penetrate a router or take advantage of poor vlan isolation in some switches.
Plus, you're bound to have at least a few employees who just have to have their machine connected to both networks at the same time and think using two network cards is safe.</sentencetext>
	<parent>http://www.semanticweb.org/ontologies/ConversationInstances.owl#comment09_11_17_2245241.30137270</parent>
</comment>
<comment>
	<id>http://www.semanticweb.org/ontologies/ConversationInstances.owl#comment09_11_17_2245241.30137354</id>
	<title>Do you believe in Coincidence?</title>
	<author>matty619</author>
	<datestamp>1258462260000</datestamp>
	<modclass>Funny</modclass>
	<modscore>3</modscore>
	<htmltext><p>60min does a story on the security of Brazil's power grid, Brazil says its not true, a few days later, they have the worst power outage in a decade, and now this story.....</p></htmltext>
<tokenext>60min does a story on the security of Brazil 's power grid , Brazil says its not true , a few days later , they have the worst power outage in a decade , and now this story.... .</tokentext>
<sentencetext>60min does a story on the security of Brazil's power grid, Brazil says its not true, a few days later, they have the worst power outage in a decade, and now this story.....</sentencetext>
</comment>
<comment>
	<id>http://www.semanticweb.org/ontologies/ConversationInstances.owl#comment09_11_17_2245241.30137694</id>
	<title>Re:Really....</title>
	<author>cdesousa</author>
	<datestamp>1258464120000</datestamp>
	<modclass>Informativ</modclass>
	<modscore>2</modscore>
	<htmltext>You should read the article (or the translation) first.... That is exactly how the system is implemented.

The original article says <p><div class="quote"><p>"A rede operativa &#233; blindada, separada da internet e operada via comando de voz", segundo informou a entidade</p></div><p>In English, </p><p><div class="quote"><p>According to the organization, "The operative network is secure, is separated from the internet, and is operated by voice command"</p></div><p> The article also says that the hackers got into the operative network but not in the operative network.</p></div>
	</htmltext>
<tokenext>You should read the article ( or the translation ) first.... That is exactly how the system is implemented .
The original article says " A rede operativa   blindada , separada da internet e operada via comando de voz " , segundo informou a entidadeIn English , According to the organization , " The operative network is secure , is separated from the internet , and is operated by voice command " The article also says that the hackers got into the operative network but not in the operative network .</tokentext>
<sentencetext>You should read the article (or the translation) first.... That is exactly how the system is implemented.
The original article says "A rede operativa é blindada, separada da internet e operada via comando de voz", segundo informou a entidadeIn English, According to the organization, "The operative network is secure, is separated from the internet, and is operated by voice command" The article also says that the hackers got into the operative network but not in the operative network.
	</sentencetext>
	<parent>http://www.semanticweb.org/ontologies/ConversationInstances.owl#comment09_11_17_2245241.30137340</parent>
</comment>
<comment>
	<id>http://www.semanticweb.org/ontologies/ConversationInstances.owl#comment09_11_17_2245241.30145282</id>
	<title>Re:full disclosure</title>
	<author>kalirion</author>
	<datestamp>1257097800000</datestamp>
	<modclass>None</modclass>
	<modscore>1</modscore>
	<htmltext><p>Hey everybody, I found a big red button that will blow up the world!  I'm going to make its location public so that the governments are forced to fix this little vulnerability.</p></htmltext>
<tokenext>Hey everybody , I found a big red button that will blow up the world !
I 'm going to make its location public so that the governments are forced to fix this little vulnerability .</tokentext>
<sentencetext>Hey everybody, I found a big red button that will blow up the world!
I'm going to make its location public so that the governments are forced to fix this little vulnerability.</sentencetext>
	<parent>http://www.semanticweb.org/ontologies/ConversationInstances.owl#comment09_11_17_2245241.30137816</parent>
</comment>
<comment>
	<id>http://www.semanticweb.org/ontologies/ConversationInstances.owl#comment09_11_17_2245241.30138454</id>
	<title>blackouts?</title>
	<author>Anonymous</author>
	<datestamp>1258469580000</datestamp>
	<modclass>None</modclass>
	<modscore>0</modscore>
	<htmltext><p>Man I've been having blackouts all say! It must be those damn Brazilian hackers!</p></htmltext>
<tokenext>Man I 've been having blackouts all say !
It must be those damn Brazilian hackers !</tokentext>
<sentencetext>Man I've been having blackouts all say!
It must be those damn Brazilian hackers!</sentencetext>
</comment>
<comment>
	<id>http://www.semanticweb.org/ontologies/ConversationInstances.owl#comment09_11_17_2245241.30137826</id>
	<title>Off-Grid Power</title>
	<author>Anonymous</author>
	<datestamp>1258464960000</datestamp>
	<modclass>None</modclass>
	<modscore>1</modscore>
	<htmltext>All of these breaches in power grids are only one more reason for the government to reward/subsidize off-grid (self-sufficient, solar-powered) homes.</htmltext>
<tokenext>All of these breaches in power grids are only one more reason for the government to reward/subsidize off-grid ( self-sufficient , solar-powered ) homes .</tokentext>
<sentencetext>All of these breaches in power grids are only one more reason for the government to reward/subsidize off-grid (self-sufficient, solar-powered) homes.</sentencetext>
</comment>
<comment>
	<id>http://www.semanticweb.org/ontologies/ConversationInstances.owl#comment09_11_17_2245241.30139648</id>
	<title>Re:full disclosure</title>
	<author>Anonymous</author>
	<datestamp>1258478940000</datestamp>
	<modclass>None</modclass>
	<modscore>0</modscore>
	<htmltext><p>No, full disclosure is a good thing, it keeps people on their toes.</p><p>This is why having a computer that controls power grids connected to the internet is not good.</p></htmltext>
<tokenext>No , full disclosure is a good thing , it keeps people on their toes.This is why having a computer that controls power grids connected to the internet is not good .</tokentext>
<sentencetext>No, full disclosure is a good thing, it keeps people on their toes.This is why having a computer that controls power grids connected to the internet is not good.</sentencetext>
	<parent>http://www.semanticweb.org/ontologies/ConversationInstances.owl#comment09_11_17_2245241.30137212</parent>
</comment>
<comment>
	<id>http://www.semanticweb.org/ontologies/ConversationInstances.owl#comment09_11_17_2245241.30141580</id>
	<title>Busy hackers!</title>
	<author>cpscotti</author>
	<datestamp>1257075840000</datestamp>
	<modclass>Funny</modclass>
	<modscore>2</modscore>
	<htmltext>That's why no one hacked the electronic voting system!!
The good guys were busy having fun sql-injecting stuff in some "bigger" system..</htmltext>
<tokenext>That 's why no one hacked the electronic voting system ! !
The good guys were busy having fun sql-injecting stuff in some " bigger " system. .</tokentext>
<sentencetext>That's why no one hacked the electronic voting system!!
The good guys were busy having fun sql-injecting stuff in some "bigger" system..</sentencetext>
</comment>
<comment>
	<id>http://www.semanticweb.org/ontologies/ConversationInstances.owl#comment09_11_17_2245241.30137816</id>
	<title>Re:full disclosure</title>
	<author>Anonymous</author>
	<datestamp>1258464900000</datestamp>
	<modclass>Insightful</modclass>
	<modscore>3</modscore>
	<htmltext>Seriously? You must work for the government..
<br> <br>
Your solution: Hide or pretend the vulnerability doesn't exist, or ignore the possible ramifications of its exploitation and further promote shoddy programming practices.<br>
The better solution: Make the vulnerability public so that the company is forced to do something about it immediately, hence preventing any threats (pending their programming practices improving).
<br> <br>
Full disclosure puts the responcibility on the company to keep their products/services secure, as to keeping it a secret, which puts the burden on whistleblowers fearing prosecution. <br> <br>Which world do you prefer?</htmltext>
<tokenext>Seriously ?
You must work for the government. . Your solution : Hide or pretend the vulnerability does n't exist , or ignore the possible ramifications of its exploitation and further promote shoddy programming practices .
The better solution : Make the vulnerability public so that the company is forced to do something about it immediately , hence preventing any threats ( pending their programming practices improving ) .
Full disclosure puts the responcibility on the company to keep their products/services secure , as to keeping it a secret , which puts the burden on whistleblowers fearing prosecution .
Which world do you prefer ?</tokentext>
<sentencetext>Seriously?
You must work for the government..
 
Your solution: Hide or pretend the vulnerability doesn't exist, or ignore the possible ramifications of its exploitation and further promote shoddy programming practices.
The better solution: Make the vulnerability public so that the company is forced to do something about it immediately, hence preventing any threats (pending their programming practices improving).
Full disclosure puts the responcibility on the company to keep their products/services secure, as to keeping it a secret, which puts the burden on whistleblowers fearing prosecution.
Which world do you prefer?</sentencetext>
	<parent>http://www.semanticweb.org/ontologies/ConversationInstances.owl#comment09_11_17_2245241.30137212</parent>
</comment>
<comment>
	<id>http://www.semanticweb.org/ontologies/ConversationInstances.owl#comment09_11_17_2245241.30137642</id>
	<title>Re:Really....</title>
	<author>Itninja</author>
	<datestamp>1258463820000</datestamp>
	<modclass>Insightful</modclass>
	<modscore>4</modscore>
	<htmltext>Keeping a few connected computers off the larger WAN is easy enough. But as those computer grow in number it can become more difficult to prevent someone, somewhere from opening up ssh, ftp, rdp, or some other connection-type. Then the whole LAN becomes susceptible to the evils of WAN baddies.<br> <br>And don't even get me started on the lack of physical security on 'secure' systems. If you can touch it, it's insecure.</htmltext>
<tokenext>Keeping a few connected computers off the larger WAN is easy enough .
But as those computer grow in number it can become more difficult to prevent someone , somewhere from opening up ssh , ftp , rdp , or some other connection-type .
Then the whole LAN becomes susceptible to the evils of WAN baddies .
And do n't even get me started on the lack of physical security on 'secure ' systems .
If you can touch it , it 's insecure .</tokentext>
<sentencetext>Keeping a few connected computers off the larger WAN is easy enough.
But as those computer grow in number it can become more difficult to prevent someone, somewhere from opening up ssh, ftp, rdp, or some other connection-type.
Then the whole LAN becomes susceptible to the evils of WAN baddies.
And don't even get me started on the lack of physical security on 'secure' systems.
If you can touch it, it's insecure.</sentencetext>
	<parent>http://www.semanticweb.org/ontologies/ConversationInstances.owl#comment09_11_17_2245241.30137340</parent>
</comment>
<comment>
	<id>http://www.semanticweb.org/ontologies/ConversationInstances.owl#comment09_11_17_2245241.30138000</id>
	<title>Re:SQL injection?</title>
	<author>oGMo</author>
	<datestamp>1258465920000</datestamp>
	<modclass>Funny</modclass>
	<modscore>5</modscore>
	<htmltext><tt>
"' WHERE 1=1; UPDATE plant\_employees SET status='FIRED';<nobr> <wbr></nobr>..."
</tt>

<p>Or everybody's fired!</p></htmltext>
<tokenext>" ' WHERE 1 = 1 ; UPDATE plant \ _employees SET status = 'FIRED ' ; ... " Or everybody 's fired !</tokentext>
<sentencetext>
"' WHERE 1=1; UPDATE plant\_employees SET status='FIRED'; ..."


Or everybody's fired!</sentencetext>
	<parent>http://www.semanticweb.org/ontologies/ConversationInstances.owl#comment09_11_17_2245241.30137344</parent>
</comment>
<comment>
	<id>http://www.semanticweb.org/ontologies/ConversationInstances.owl#comment09_11_17_2245241.30138308</id>
	<title>Wrong summary</title>
	<author>Anonymous</author>
	<datestamp>1258468500000</datestamp>
	<modclass>Informativ</modclass>
	<modscore>4</modscore>
	<htmltext><p>Well, first of all, the 60 minutes episode about blackouts in 2005 and 2007 provides absolutely no proof or other data about those blackouts being caused by hackers, except for two anonymous sources that suspect it was.</p><p>Second, there was no breach in the grid network, at least not know so far. What happened was that the ONS (the Brazilian electric grid operator) website was hacked.</p></htmltext>
<tokenext>Well , first of all , the 60 minutes episode about blackouts in 2005 and 2007 provides absolutely no proof or other data about those blackouts being caused by hackers , except for two anonymous sources that suspect it was.Second , there was no breach in the grid network , at least not know so far .
What happened was that the ONS ( the Brazilian electric grid operator ) website was hacked .</tokentext>
<sentencetext>Well, first of all, the 60 minutes episode about blackouts in 2005 and 2007 provides absolutely no proof or other data about those blackouts being caused by hackers, except for two anonymous sources that suspect it was.Second, there was no breach in the grid network, at least not know so far.
What happened was that the ONS (the Brazilian electric grid operator) website was hacked.</sentencetext>
</comment>
<comment>
	<id>http://www.semanticweb.org/ontologies/ConversationInstances.owl#comment09_11_17_2245241.30137594</id>
	<title>Re:Really....</title>
	<author>nametaken</author>
	<datestamp>1258463520000</datestamp>
	<modclass>Informativ</modclass>
	<modscore>3</modscore>
	<htmltext><p>They were not.  Read the article.</p><p>"there was no danger because there was no connection between its Website network and back-end control network"</p></htmltext>
<tokenext>They were not .
Read the article .
" there was no danger because there was no connection between its Website network and back-end control network "</tokentext>
<sentencetext>They were not.
Read the article.
"there was no danger because there was no connection between its Website network and back-end control network"</sentencetext>
	<parent>http://www.semanticweb.org/ontologies/ConversationInstances.owl#comment09_11_17_2245241.30137340</parent>
</comment>
<comment>
	<id>http://www.semanticweb.org/ontologies/ConversationInstances.owl#comment09_11_17_2245241.30137270</id>
	<title>actually</title>
	<author>Anonymous</author>
	<datestamp>1258461960000</datestamp>
	<modclass>Informativ</modclass>
	<modscore>5</modscore>
	<htmltext><p>the hackers invaded the \_website\_, the ONS network of computers that actually control the system is private and not connect to the internet.</p></htmltext>
<tokenext>the hackers invaded the \ _website \ _ , the ONS network of computers that actually control the system is private and not connect to the internet .</tokentext>
<sentencetext>the hackers invaded the \_website\_, the ONS network of computers that actually control the system is private and not connect to the internet.</sentencetext>
</comment>
<comment>
	<id>http://www.semanticweb.org/ontologies/ConversationInstances.owl#comment09_11_17_2245241.30137576</id>
	<title>Re:closed systems</title>
	<author>nametaken</author>
	<datestamp>1258463400000</datestamp>
	<modclass>Informativ</modclass>
	<modscore>4</modscore>
	<htmltext><p>FTA...</p><p>"ONS was notified last week of this problem. They've confirmed that, indeed, its Website was hacked. It claims to have fixed the SQL injection problems and that there was no danger because there was no connection between its Website network and back-end control network."</p></htmltext>
<tokenext>FTA... " ONS was notified last week of this problem .
They 've confirmed that , indeed , its Website was hacked .
It claims to have fixed the SQL injection problems and that there was no danger because there was no connection between its Website network and back-end control network .
"</tokentext>
<sentencetext>FTA..."ONS was notified last week of this problem.
They've confirmed that, indeed, its Website was hacked.
It claims to have fixed the SQL injection problems and that there was no danger because there was no connection between its Website network and back-end control network.
"</sentencetext>
	<parent>http://www.semanticweb.org/ontologies/ConversationInstances.owl#comment09_11_17_2245241.30137298</parent>
</comment>
<comment>
	<id>http://www.semanticweb.org/ontologies/ConversationInstances.owl#comment09_11_17_2245241.30138896</id>
	<title>Mod story down</title>
	<author>acid06</author>
	<datestamp>1258473240000</datestamp>
	<modclass>Informativ</modclass>
	<modscore>2</modscore>
	<htmltext><p>Hackers didn't "break into the grid" or anything close to that. They defaced the *website*, that's it.<br>While that is surely a shame for them, is nothing even close to a real worry.</p><p>No power outages were caused at all (and, in fact, couldn't be caused).</p><p>Now please quit posting uninformed crap.</p></htmltext>
<tokenext>Hackers did n't " break into the grid " or anything close to that .
They defaced the * website * , that 's it.While that is surely a shame for them , is nothing even close to a real worry.No power outages were caused at all ( and , in fact , could n't be caused ) .Now please quit posting uninformed crap .</tokentext>
<sentencetext>Hackers didn't "break into the grid" or anything close to that.
They defaced the *website*, that's it.While that is surely a shame for them, is nothing even close to a real worry.No power outages were caused at all (and, in fact, couldn't be caused).Now please quit posting uninformed crap.</sentencetext>
</comment>
<comment>
	<id>http://www.semanticweb.org/ontologies/ConversationInstances.owl#comment09_11_17_2245241.30137654</id>
	<title>Re:Do you believe in Coincidence?</title>
	<author>etinin</author>
	<datestamp>1258463880000</datestamp>
	<modclass>None</modclass>
	<modscore>0</modscore>
	<htmltext>I find it highly unlikely that the power plant with the second highest generation capacity in the world can be totally shut down from the internet.</htmltext>
<tokenext>I find it highly unlikely that the power plant with the second highest generation capacity in the world can be totally shut down from the internet .</tokentext>
<sentencetext>I find it highly unlikely that the power plant with the second highest generation capacity in the world can be totally shut down from the internet.</sentencetext>
	<parent>http://www.semanticweb.org/ontologies/ConversationInstances.owl#comment09_11_17_2245241.30137354</parent>
</comment>
<comment>
	<id>http://www.semanticweb.org/ontologies/ConversationInstances.owl#comment09_11_17_2245241.30137340</id>
	<title>Really....</title>
	<author>Anonymous</author>
	<datestamp>1258462200000</datestamp>
	<modclass>Insightful</modclass>
	<modscore>3</modscore>
	<htmltext>Really -no- critical system be it power, heating, cooling, etc. should be on the internet. A local network is sufficient with the main computer controlling the other computers not being connected to the internet. How hard is it to understand?</htmltext>
<tokenext>Really -no- critical system be it power , heating , cooling , etc .
should be on the internet .
A local network is sufficient with the main computer controlling the other computers not being connected to the internet .
How hard is it to understand ?</tokentext>
<sentencetext>Really -no- critical system be it power, heating, cooling, etc.
should be on the internet.
A local network is sufficient with the main computer controlling the other computers not being connected to the internet.
How hard is it to understand?</sentencetext>
</comment>
<comment>
	<id>http://www.semanticweb.org/ontologies/ConversationInstances.owl#comment09_11_17_2245241.30143878</id>
	<title>Re:Really....</title>
	<author>Anonymous</author>
	<datestamp>1257092400000</datestamp>
	<modclass>None</modclass>
	<modscore>0</modscore>
	<htmltext><p>I happen to know for a fact that the A/C system in Rush Limbaugh's Palm Beach home is accessible and controllable via the Internet, as is the system for a small university nearby...</p></htmltext>
<tokenext>I happen to know for a fact that the A/C system in Rush Limbaugh 's Palm Beach home is accessible and controllable via the Internet , as is the system for a small university nearby.. .</tokentext>
<sentencetext>I happen to know for a fact that the A/C system in Rush Limbaugh's Palm Beach home is accessible and controllable via the Internet, as is the system for a small university nearby...</sentencetext>
	<parent>http://www.semanticweb.org/ontologies/ConversationInstances.owl#comment09_11_17_2245241.30137340</parent>
</comment>
<comment>
	<id>http://www.semanticweb.org/ontologies/ConversationInstances.owl#comment09_11_17_2245241.30137344</id>
	<title>SQL injection?</title>
	<author>XanC</author>
	<datestamp>1258462200000</datestamp>
	<modclass>Funny</modclass>
	<modscore>2</modscore>
	<htmltext><p>Somebody's fired.</p></htmltext>
<tokenext>Somebody 's fired .</tokentext>
<sentencetext>Somebody's fired.</sentencetext>
</comment>
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	<commentlist>http://www.semanticweb.org/ontologies/ConversationInstances.owl#comment09_11_17_2245241.30145760
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</commentlist>
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