<article>
	<id>http://www.semanticweb.org/ontologies/ConversationInstances.owl#article09_06_04_1859255</id>
	<title>One Approach To  Open Source Code Contribution and Testing</title>
	<author>timothy</author>
	<datestamp>1244144580000</datestamp>
	<htmltext>An anonymous reader writes <i>"<a href="http://krow.net/">Brian Aker</a>, one of the  core developers of <a href="http://mysql.com/">MySQL</a>, has written up a lengthy blog on how the <a href="http://launchpad.net/drizzle">Drizzle</a> fork is <a href="http://krow.livejournal.com/638654.html">handling both its code contributions and its testing</a>. He has listed the tools they use and how they work with their processes. He also makes an interesting statement about the signing of corporate code-contribution agreements and how there are some, including Rasmus (creator of PHP), who refuse to sign them."</i></htmltext>
<tokenext>An anonymous reader writes " Brian Aker , one of the core developers of MySQL , has written up a lengthy blog on how the Drizzle fork is handling both its code contributions and its testing .
He has listed the tools they use and how they work with their processes .
He also makes an interesting statement about the signing of corporate code-contribution agreements and how there are some , including Rasmus ( creator of PHP ) , who refuse to sign them .
"</tokentext>
<sentencetext>An anonymous reader writes "Brian Aker, one of the  core developers of MySQL, has written up a lengthy blog on how the Drizzle fork is handling both its code contributions and its testing.
He has listed the tools they use and how they work with their processes.
He also makes an interesting statement about the signing of corporate code-contribution agreements and how there are some, including Rasmus (creator of PHP), who refuse to sign them.
"</sentencetext>
</article>
<comment>
	<id>http://www.semanticweb.org/ontologies/ConversationInstances.owl#comment09_06_04_1859255.28214425</id>
	<title>Re:all-your-code-is-ours</title>
	<author>Anonymous</author>
	<datestamp>1244107140000</datestamp>
	<modclass>Offtopic</modclass>
	<modscore>-1</modscore>
	<htmltext><tt>By reading this post you hereby agree that all code written by you from now until the year 20009 belongs to me.</tt></htmltext>
<tokenext>By reading this post you hereby agree that all code written by you from now until the year 20009 belongs to me .</tokentext>
<sentencetext>By reading this post you hereby agree that all code written by you from now until the year 20009 belongs to me.</sentencetext>
	<parent>http://www.semanticweb.org/ontologies/ConversationInstances.owl#comment09_06_04_1859255.28214185</parent>
</comment>
<comment>
	<id>http://www.semanticweb.org/ontologies/ConversationInstances.owl#comment09_06_04_1859255.28217377</id>
	<title>open source fags dominated by aids</title>
	<author>Anonymous</author>
	<datestamp>1244124480000</datestamp>
	<modclass>None</modclass>
	<modscore>0</modscore>
	<htmltext>do you open source? than stay away from me faggot homo fag.</htmltext>
<tokenext>do you open source ?
than stay away from me faggot homo fag .</tokentext>
<sentencetext>do you open source?
than stay away from me faggot homo fag.</sentencetext>
</comment>
<comment>
	<id>http://www.semanticweb.org/ontologies/ConversationInstances.owl#comment09_06_04_1859255.28215605</id>
	<title>Re:If this is not the first post...</title>
	<author>Hognoxious</author>
	<datestamp>1244113080000</datestamp>
	<modclass>None</modclass>
	<modscore>1</modscore>
	<htmltext><blockquote><div><p>smear honey about my asshole and testicles and roll around on a fire-ants' nest.</p></div></blockquote><p>Do all of that, wait for the wounds to almost heal and do it again, twice.  Or use MySQL.</p><p>Close call.</p></div>
	</htmltext>
<tokenext>smear honey about my asshole and testicles and roll around on a fire-ants ' nest.Do all of that , wait for the wounds to almost heal and do it again , twice .
Or use MySQL.Close call .</tokentext>
<sentencetext>smear honey about my asshole and testicles and roll around on a fire-ants' nest.Do all of that, wait for the wounds to almost heal and do it again, twice.
Or use MySQL.Close call.
	</sentencetext>
	<parent>http://www.semanticweb.org/ontologies/ConversationInstances.owl#comment09_06_04_1859255.28213989</parent>
</comment>
<comment>
	<id>http://www.semanticweb.org/ontologies/ConversationInstances.owl#comment09_06_04_1859255.28214477</id>
	<title>Re:all-your-code-is-ours</title>
	<author>MobyDisk</author>
	<datestamp>1244107440000</datestamp>
	<modclass>None</modclass>
	<modscore>1</modscore>
	<htmltext>HR is not meant to protect employees.  They are mindless robots, there to insulate the company from employees who might sue them.  They just hand-down absurd contracts and rules, that everyone must constantly violate, so that they always have a leg to stand on when they fire someone.  Blame litigious Americans for necessitating this stupidity.
<br>
<br>
I had a similar experience to yours where I was joining a company and my boss, and his boss, overrode the standard contract when I refused to sign the non-compete.  I had to stick to my guns until the 11th hour, but they agreed it was dumb.  It was a small company with no HR department.
<br>
<br>
Compare that to a company with 28k employees, with a big HR department, where the drones simply did not understand the concept that contracts can change.  It was the paper everyone signed - they had no comprehension of what it meant, no idea who wrote it or why, or what it did.  They were completely divorced from the needs of the company, oblivious to the complaints of my manager, or me.  My lawyer informed me the contract was meaningless and unenforceable, so I signed it.  (It wasn't a non-compete though, phew!).
<br>
<br>
And that second company that is constantly in the top 10 - 50 companies to work for, internationally, on multiple different surveys.</htmltext>
<tokenext>HR is not meant to protect employees .
They are mindless robots , there to insulate the company from employees who might sue them .
They just hand-down absurd contracts and rules , that everyone must constantly violate , so that they always have a leg to stand on when they fire someone .
Blame litigious Americans for necessitating this stupidity .
I had a similar experience to yours where I was joining a company and my boss , and his boss , overrode the standard contract when I refused to sign the non-compete .
I had to stick to my guns until the 11th hour , but they agreed it was dumb .
It was a small company with no HR department .
Compare that to a company with 28k employees , with a big HR department , where the drones simply did not understand the concept that contracts can change .
It was the paper everyone signed - they had no comprehension of what it meant , no idea who wrote it or why , or what it did .
They were completely divorced from the needs of the company , oblivious to the complaints of my manager , or me .
My lawyer informed me the contract was meaningless and unenforceable , so I signed it .
( It was n't a non-compete though , phew ! ) .
And that second company that is constantly in the top 10 - 50 companies to work for , internationally , on multiple different surveys .</tokentext>
<sentencetext>HR is not meant to protect employees.
They are mindless robots, there to insulate the company from employees who might sue them.
They just hand-down absurd contracts and rules, that everyone must constantly violate, so that they always have a leg to stand on when they fire someone.
Blame litigious Americans for necessitating this stupidity.
I had a similar experience to yours where I was joining a company and my boss, and his boss, overrode the standard contract when I refused to sign the non-compete.
I had to stick to my guns until the 11th hour, but they agreed it was dumb.
It was a small company with no HR department.
Compare that to a company with 28k employees, with a big HR department, where the drones simply did not understand the concept that contracts can change.
It was the paper everyone signed - they had no comprehension of what it meant, no idea who wrote it or why, or what it did.
They were completely divorced from the needs of the company, oblivious to the complaints of my manager, or me.
My lawyer informed me the contract was meaningless and unenforceable, so I signed it.
(It wasn't a non-compete though, phew!).
And that second company that is constantly in the top 10 - 50 companies to work for, internationally, on multiple different surveys.</sentencetext>
	<parent>http://www.semanticweb.org/ontologies/ConversationInstances.owl#comment09_06_04_1859255.28214185</parent>
</comment>
<comment>
	<id>http://www.semanticweb.org/ontologies/ConversationInstances.owl#comment09_06_04_1859255.28214191</id>
	<title>Linux is an OS for virgins</title>
	<author>Anonymous</author>
	<datestamp>1244149140000</datestamp>
	<modclass>Troll</modclass>
	<modscore>-1</modscore>
	<htmltext>Linux just isn't ready for the desktop yet. It may be ready for the web servers that you nerds use to distribute your TRON fanzines and personal Dungeons and Dragons web-sights across the world wide web, but the average computer user isn't going to spend months learning how to use a CLI and then hours compiling packages so that they can get a workable graphic interface to check their mail with, especially not when they already have a Windows machine that does its job perfectly well and is backed by a major corporation, as opposed to Linux which is only supported by a few unemployed nerds living in their mother's basement somewhere. The last thing I want is a level 5 dwarf (haha) providing me my OS.</htmltext>
<tokenext>Linux just is n't ready for the desktop yet .
It may be ready for the web servers that you nerds use to distribute your TRON fanzines and personal Dungeons and Dragons web-sights across the world wide web , but the average computer user is n't going to spend months learning how to use a CLI and then hours compiling packages so that they can get a workable graphic interface to check their mail with , especially not when they already have a Windows machine that does its job perfectly well and is backed by a major corporation , as opposed to Linux which is only supported by a few unemployed nerds living in their mother 's basement somewhere .
The last thing I want is a level 5 dwarf ( haha ) providing me my OS .</tokentext>
<sentencetext>Linux just isn't ready for the desktop yet.
It may be ready for the web servers that you nerds use to distribute your TRON fanzines and personal Dungeons and Dragons web-sights across the world wide web, but the average computer user isn't going to spend months learning how to use a CLI and then hours compiling packages so that they can get a workable graphic interface to check their mail with, especially not when they already have a Windows machine that does its job perfectly well and is backed by a major corporation, as opposed to Linux which is only supported by a few unemployed nerds living in their mother's basement somewhere.
The last thing I want is a level 5 dwarf (haha) providing me my OS.</sentencetext>
	<parent>http://www.semanticweb.org/ontologies/ConversationInstances.owl#comment09_06_04_1859255.28213989</parent>
</comment>
<comment>
	<id>http://www.semanticweb.org/ontologies/ConversationInstances.owl#comment09_06_04_1859255.28214743</id>
	<title>Marketing</title>
	<author>Anonymous</author>
	<datestamp>1244108880000</datestamp>
	<modclass>Insightful</modclass>
	<modscore>3</modscore>
	<htmltext><p>A drizzle is a display of rain that is rather unimpressive. Also, it's a prelude to heavy rain and getting soaked and miserable. On the Drizzle website is a picture of a rainy cloud, which at least in western cultures is an image associated with things that are unhappy.</p><p>At this point in their project I think that some smart marketing is more important than nitpicking over code.</p></htmltext>
<tokenext>A drizzle is a display of rain that is rather unimpressive .
Also , it 's a prelude to heavy rain and getting soaked and miserable .
On the Drizzle website is a picture of a rainy cloud , which at least in western cultures is an image associated with things that are unhappy.At this point in their project I think that some smart marketing is more important than nitpicking over code .</tokentext>
<sentencetext>A drizzle is a display of rain that is rather unimpressive.
Also, it's a prelude to heavy rain and getting soaked and miserable.
On the Drizzle website is a picture of a rainy cloud, which at least in western cultures is an image associated with things that are unhappy.At this point in their project I think that some smart marketing is more important than nitpicking over code.</sentencetext>
</comment>
<comment>
	<id>http://www.semanticweb.org/ontologies/ConversationInstances.owl#comment09_06_04_1859255.28218373</id>
	<title>eliza</title>
	<author>seetumail</author>
	<datestamp>1244135880000</datestamp>
	<modclass>Troll</modclass>
	<modscore>-1</modscore>
	<htmltext>That's really true.I am in favor of the views that have been posted about this website.I was looking for a website of similar nature and finally i found one for myself.
Actually i wanted some info regardin the topic.Thanks so much for posting it here

Eliza
<a href="http://www.backup-sensor.com/" title="backup-sensor.com" rel="nofollow">parking sensor</a> [backup-sensor.com]</htmltext>
<tokenext>That 's really true.I am in favor of the views that have been posted about this website.I was looking for a website of similar nature and finally i found one for myself .
Actually i wanted some info regardin the topic.Thanks so much for posting it here Eliza parking sensor [ backup-sensor.com ]</tokentext>
<sentencetext>That's really true.I am in favor of the views that have been posted about this website.I was looking for a website of similar nature and finally i found one for myself.
Actually i wanted some info regardin the topic.Thanks so much for posting it here

Eliza
parking sensor [backup-sensor.com]</sentencetext>
</comment>
<comment>
	<id>http://www.semanticweb.org/ontologies/ConversationInstances.owl#comment09_06_04_1859255.28217789</id>
	<title>your delusion</title>
	<author>Anonymous</author>
	<datestamp>1244129520000</datestamp>
	<modclass>None</modclass>
	<modscore>0</modscore>
	<htmltext><p>you think that because you got away with it, you are worth your salt.</p><p>i guarantee you there are thousands of people who are worth their salt, who had to suck it up and sign it anyways, because they had to eat and pay rent, and there was no enlightened CFO to come fix things</p><p>it is really stupid to assume that 'good people' will always get excepted from the idiotic rules of society.... and its also stupid to assume that those who didnt get excepted somehow 'did not stand by their principles'.</p><p>people who really stand by their principles usually get punished for it, they are not the ones that get special exceptions and rewards by magical genies in the corporate hierarchy. see General Taguba for example.</p></htmltext>
<tokenext>you think that because you got away with it , you are worth your salt.i guarantee you there are thousands of people who are worth their salt , who had to suck it up and sign it anyways , because they had to eat and pay rent , and there was no enlightened CFO to come fix thingsit is really stupid to assume that 'good people ' will always get excepted from the idiotic rules of society.... and its also stupid to assume that those who didnt get excepted somehow 'did not stand by their principles'.people who really stand by their principles usually get punished for it , they are not the ones that get special exceptions and rewards by magical genies in the corporate hierarchy .
see General Taguba for example .</tokentext>
<sentencetext>you think that because you got away with it, you are worth your salt.i guarantee you there are thousands of people who are worth their salt, who had to suck it up and sign it anyways, because they had to eat and pay rent, and there was no enlightened CFO to come fix thingsit is really stupid to assume that 'good people' will always get excepted from the idiotic rules of society.... and its also stupid to assume that those who didnt get excepted somehow 'did not stand by their principles'.people who really stand by their principles usually get punished for it, they are not the ones that get special exceptions and rewards by magical genies in the corporate hierarchy.
see General Taguba for example.</sentencetext>
	<parent>http://www.semanticweb.org/ontologies/ConversationInstances.owl#comment09_06_04_1859255.28214185</parent>
</comment>
<comment>
	<id>http://www.semanticweb.org/ontologies/ConversationInstances.owl#comment09_06_04_1859255.28216177</id>
	<title>Re:all-your-code-is-ours</title>
	<author>Anonymous</author>
	<datestamp>1244116260000</datestamp>
	<modclass>Interestin</modclass>
	<modscore>3</modscore>
	<htmltext><p>I'm an employer.</p><p>I'm going to offer good pay, full-time schedule, excellent (expensive!) medical/health benefits, a courteous and comfortable work environment, and in exchange, I want you to work for me. I have no desire to pay you to start up a competing company - do that on your own dime like I did. I don't care if you want to build a PHP thingie that keeps track of your MP3 collection, but if you come up with a useful idea while working on our products and decide to keep it for yourself rather than provide it, that would piss me off - it's my dime that you developed it with!</p><p>I'm not asking you to never work for anyone else, I really don't care much what you do after you quit. But while you're working for me, I do expect you to (ahem) work for me.</p><p>Really, what is wrong with that arrangement?</p></htmltext>
<tokenext>I 'm an employer.I 'm going to offer good pay , full-time schedule , excellent ( expensive !
) medical/health benefits , a courteous and comfortable work environment , and in exchange , I want you to work for me .
I have no desire to pay you to start up a competing company - do that on your own dime like I did .
I do n't care if you want to build a PHP thingie that keeps track of your MP3 collection , but if you come up with a useful idea while working on our products and decide to keep it for yourself rather than provide it , that would piss me off - it 's my dime that you developed it with ! I 'm not asking you to never work for anyone else , I really do n't care much what you do after you quit .
But while you 're working for me , I do expect you to ( ahem ) work for me.Really , what is wrong with that arrangement ?</tokentext>
<sentencetext>I'm an employer.I'm going to offer good pay, full-time schedule, excellent (expensive!
) medical/health benefits, a courteous and comfortable work environment, and in exchange, I want you to work for me.
I have no desire to pay you to start up a competing company - do that on your own dime like I did.
I don't care if you want to build a PHP thingie that keeps track of your MP3 collection, but if you come up with a useful idea while working on our products and decide to keep it for yourself rather than provide it, that would piss me off - it's my dime that you developed it with!I'm not asking you to never work for anyone else, I really don't care much what you do after you quit.
But while you're working for me, I do expect you to (ahem) work for me.Really, what is wrong with that arrangement?</sentencetext>
	<parent>http://www.semanticweb.org/ontologies/ConversationInstances.owl#comment09_06_04_1859255.28214385</parent>
</comment>
<comment>
	<id>http://www.semanticweb.org/ontologies/ConversationInstances.owl#comment09_06_04_1859255.28214145</id>
	<title>Re:Here's my approach</title>
	<author>Anonymous</author>
	<datestamp>1244148900000</datestamp>
	<modclass>Offtopic</modclass>
	<modscore>0</modscore>
	<htmltext>And closed source code is always perfect?</htmltext>
<tokenext>And closed source code is always perfect ?</tokentext>
<sentencetext>And closed source code is always perfect?</sentencetext>
	<parent>http://www.semanticweb.org/ontologies/ConversationInstances.owl#comment09_06_04_1859255.28214031</parent>
</comment>
<comment>
	<id>http://www.semanticweb.org/ontologies/ConversationInstances.owl#comment09_06_04_1859255.28214281</id>
	<title>If I signed a code-contribution agreement</title>
	<author>Monkeedude1212</author>
	<datestamp>1244106360000</datestamp>
	<modclass>Interestin</modclass>
	<modscore>2</modscore>
	<htmltext><p>Saying that anything I invent or discover (or along those lines) during my time working at my company - and in my spare time I decide to make Flash games...</p><p>Does that make my hobby-work belongs to a company that holds no interest in it? If it gets sponsored on a website could they claim rights?</p></htmltext>
<tokenext>Saying that anything I invent or discover ( or along those lines ) during my time working at my company - and in my spare time I decide to make Flash games...Does that make my hobby-work belongs to a company that holds no interest in it ?
If it gets sponsored on a website could they claim rights ?</tokentext>
<sentencetext>Saying that anything I invent or discover (or along those lines) during my time working at my company - and in my spare time I decide to make Flash games...Does that make my hobby-work belongs to a company that holds no interest in it?
If it gets sponsored on a website could they claim rights?</sentencetext>
</comment>
<comment>
	<id>http://www.semanticweb.org/ontologies/ConversationInstances.owl#comment09_06_04_1859255.28214829</id>
	<title>Re:If I signed a code-contribution agreement</title>
	<author>bennomatic</author>
	<datestamp>1244109240000</datestamp>
	<modclass>None</modclass>
	<modscore>1</modscore>
	<htmltext>A friend of mine had a great idea which turned into a great product (that you probably have several copies of, even if you don't know it) that turned into a successful company.  Knowing his own limitations--he's a tech guy, not a business person--he effectively hired someone to take over the reigns.  CEO, COO, CFO and all, so they could eventually go public.
<br> <br>
He stayed on as the president and CTO, and in the process of turning into a public-ready company, he effectively signed over everything.  Once, over beers, he was talking about how he already knew the next few ideas he wanted to explore, but he couldn't talk about them or write them down because all of that would be discoverable, that they would legally be company property.
<br> <br>
I would say that was sad, but just a few months ago, I looked him up, and he had sold his interest in the company for over $20 million dollars less than 10 years after founding it.  Not even including the salary I'm sure he maintained during his tenure, that's not a bad amount to force you to limit your output of ideas for a decade.
<br> <br>
Don't know if he's gone on to the other ideas.  I'm sure some of them have already been done in the intervening time, but it looks like he basically spends his time with a technology think-tank.  Not a bad gig if you can get it.</htmltext>
<tokenext>A friend of mine had a great idea which turned into a great product ( that you probably have several copies of , even if you do n't know it ) that turned into a successful company .
Knowing his own limitations--he 's a tech guy , not a business person--he effectively hired someone to take over the reigns .
CEO , COO , CFO and all , so they could eventually go public .
He stayed on as the president and CTO , and in the process of turning into a public-ready company , he effectively signed over everything .
Once , over beers , he was talking about how he already knew the next few ideas he wanted to explore , but he could n't talk about them or write them down because all of that would be discoverable , that they would legally be company property .
I would say that was sad , but just a few months ago , I looked him up , and he had sold his interest in the company for over $ 20 million dollars less than 10 years after founding it .
Not even including the salary I 'm sure he maintained during his tenure , that 's not a bad amount to force you to limit your output of ideas for a decade .
Do n't know if he 's gone on to the other ideas .
I 'm sure some of them have already been done in the intervening time , but it looks like he basically spends his time with a technology think-tank .
Not a bad gig if you can get it .</tokentext>
<sentencetext>A friend of mine had a great idea which turned into a great product (that you probably have several copies of, even if you don't know it) that turned into a successful company.
Knowing his own limitations--he's a tech guy, not a business person--he effectively hired someone to take over the reigns.
CEO, COO, CFO and all, so they could eventually go public.
He stayed on as the president and CTO, and in the process of turning into a public-ready company, he effectively signed over everything.
Once, over beers, he was talking about how he already knew the next few ideas he wanted to explore, but he couldn't talk about them or write them down because all of that would be discoverable, that they would legally be company property.
I would say that was sad, but just a few months ago, I looked him up, and he had sold his interest in the company for over $20 million dollars less than 10 years after founding it.
Not even including the salary I'm sure he maintained during his tenure, that's not a bad amount to force you to limit your output of ideas for a decade.
Don't know if he's gone on to the other ideas.
I'm sure some of them have already been done in the intervening time, but it looks like he basically spends his time with a technology think-tank.
Not a bad gig if you can get it.</sentencetext>
	<parent>http://www.semanticweb.org/ontologies/ConversationInstances.owl#comment09_06_04_1859255.28214281</parent>
</comment>
<comment>
	<id>http://www.semanticweb.org/ontologies/ConversationInstances.owl#comment09_06_04_1859255.28215803</id>
	<title>OI thank you for your time</title>
	<author>Anonymous</author>
	<datestamp>1244114220000</datestamp>
	<modclass>Offtopic</modclass>
	<modscore>-1</modscore>
	<htmltext><A HREF="http://goat.cx/" title="goat.cx" rel="nofollow">goiNg to continUe,</a> [goat.cx]</htmltext>
<tokenext>goiNg to continUe , [ goat.cx ]</tokentext>
<sentencetext>goiNg to continUe, [goat.cx]</sentencetext>
</comment>
<comment>
	<id>http://www.semanticweb.org/ontologies/ConversationInstances.owl#comment09_06_04_1859255.28245049</id>
	<title>Re:all-your-code-is-ours</title>
	<author>Anonymous</author>
	<datestamp>1244376300000</datestamp>
	<modclass>None</modclass>
	<modscore>0</modscore>
	<htmltext><p>"   Really, what is wrong with that arrangement?"</p><p>
&nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; Nothing is wrong with that arrangement, but you have companies that think if you come up with some idea at home, code it at home, in your own time, that the company still owns the results.    That's a problem.</p></htmltext>
<tokenext>" Really , what is wrong with that arrangement ?
"           Nothing is wrong with that arrangement , but you have companies that think if you come up with some idea at home , code it at home , in your own time , that the company still owns the results .
That 's a problem .</tokentext>
<sentencetext>"   Really, what is wrong with that arrangement?
"
          Nothing is wrong with that arrangement, but you have companies that think if you come up with some idea at home, code it at home, in your own time, that the company still owns the results.
That's a problem.</sentencetext>
	<parent>http://www.semanticweb.org/ontologies/ConversationInstances.owl#comment09_06_04_1859255.28216177</parent>
</comment>
<comment>
	<id>http://www.semanticweb.org/ontologies/ConversationInstances.owl#comment09_06_04_1859255.28219081</id>
	<title>Re:all-your-code-is-ours</title>
	<author>stephanruby</author>
	<datestamp>1244144340000</datestamp>
	<modclass>None</modclass>
	<modscore>1</modscore>
	<htmltext><blockquote><div><p>I have no desire to pay you to start up a competing company</p></div></blockquote><p>
A *competing* company? Yeah, sure. That's a reasonable request. What about a non-competing piece of software?</p><blockquote><div><p>I don't care if you want to build a PHP thingie that keeps track of your MP3 collection</p></div></blockquote><p>
I have to ask because a "PHP thingie" for personal use is one thing, but what about a useful piece of software which is clearly not related to your business in any way shape or form.</p></div>
	</htmltext>
<tokenext>I have no desire to pay you to start up a competing company A * competing * company ?
Yeah , sure .
That 's a reasonable request .
What about a non-competing piece of software ? I do n't care if you want to build a PHP thingie that keeps track of your MP3 collection I have to ask because a " PHP thingie " for personal use is one thing , but what about a useful piece of software which is clearly not related to your business in any way shape or form .</tokentext>
<sentencetext>I have no desire to pay you to start up a competing company
A *competing* company?
Yeah, sure.
That's a reasonable request.
What about a non-competing piece of software?I don't care if you want to build a PHP thingie that keeps track of your MP3 collection
I have to ask because a "PHP thingie" for personal use is one thing, but what about a useful piece of software which is clearly not related to your business in any way shape or form.
	</sentencetext>
	<parent>http://www.semanticweb.org/ontologies/ConversationInstances.owl#comment09_06_04_1859255.28216177</parent>
</comment>
<comment>
	<id>http://www.semanticweb.org/ontologies/ConversationInstances.owl#comment09_06_04_1859255.28225231</id>
	<title>Re:all-your-code-is-ours</title>
	<author>cervo</author>
	<datestamp>1244227500000</datestamp>
	<modclass>Flamebait</modclass>
	<modscore>0</modscore>
	<htmltext>P.S.  You're an idiot</htmltext>
<tokenext>P.S .
You 're an idiot</tokentext>
<sentencetext>P.S.
You're an idiot</sentencetext>
	<parent>http://www.semanticweb.org/ontologies/ConversationInstances.owl#comment09_06_04_1859255.28216177</parent>
</comment>
<comment>
	<id>http://www.semanticweb.org/ontologies/ConversationInstances.owl#comment09_06_04_1859255.28214389</id>
	<title>Re:all-your-code-is-ours</title>
	<author>Anonymous</author>
	<datestamp>1244106900000</datestamp>
	<modclass>Interestin</modclass>
	<modscore>3</modscore>
	<htmltext><p>Seconded.</p><p>When I came to work for my current employer, there was an ambiguously worded section that could be taken to mean that they owned any code I wrote whether at work, or on my own time. I talked to the divisional controller and had a clarifying statement inserted to put a division between work done on the company dime, and anything I did outside of that. They didn't have any problem with that, and it hasn't negatively impacted my working relationship with anyone here.</p></htmltext>
<tokenext>Seconded.When I came to work for my current employer , there was an ambiguously worded section that could be taken to mean that they owned any code I wrote whether at work , or on my own time .
I talked to the divisional controller and had a clarifying statement inserted to put a division between work done on the company dime , and anything I did outside of that .
They did n't have any problem with that , and it has n't negatively impacted my working relationship with anyone here .</tokentext>
<sentencetext>Seconded.When I came to work for my current employer, there was an ambiguously worded section that could be taken to mean that they owned any code I wrote whether at work, or on my own time.
I talked to the divisional controller and had a clarifying statement inserted to put a division between work done on the company dime, and anything I did outside of that.
They didn't have any problem with that, and it hasn't negatively impacted my working relationship with anyone here.</sentencetext>
	<parent>http://www.semanticweb.org/ontologies/ConversationInstances.owl#comment09_06_04_1859255.28214185</parent>
</comment>
<comment>
	<id>http://www.semanticweb.org/ontologies/ConversationInstances.owl#comment09_06_04_1859255.28216695</id>
	<title>Re:all-your-code-is-ours</title>
	<author>Xtifr</author>
	<datestamp>1244119260000</datestamp>
	<modclass>Funny</modclass>
	<modscore>5</modscore>
	<htmltext><p><div class="quote"><p>I refused to sign an all-your-code-belongs-to-us agreement at my current employer, and almost didn't get the job because of it.</p></div><p>They almost always have a place for you to fill in exemptions for code/inventions you already owned before coming to work for them.  As a Debian developer, I always just fill in "Debian GNU/Linux" in the exemption spot, and no one has ever objected, despite the fact that that's a hole big enough to drive a dozen web servers, eight web browsers, thirty-two Content Management Systems, four word processors, seventy-five programmer's editors, nine complete GUI toolkits, thirty-six programming languages, four hundred and seventy three games of varying quality, twenty-one window managers, forty-five email clients, a partridge in a pear tree*, and Goddess knows what else through.  I used to try to explain the truly massive implications of those three simple words, but everyone (HR, manager or engineer) always said, "that's fine, we don't have a problem with it", so I stopped bothering.</p><p>Of course, it may help that I'm in California where employee rights laws are generally pretty strong.</p><p>* all numbers just guesses--I actually think that Debian may have <em>three</em> partridges in pear trees somewhere in its repositories.</p></div>
	</htmltext>
<tokenext>I refused to sign an all-your-code-belongs-to-us agreement at my current employer , and almost did n't get the job because of it.They almost always have a place for you to fill in exemptions for code/inventions you already owned before coming to work for them .
As a Debian developer , I always just fill in " Debian GNU/Linux " in the exemption spot , and no one has ever objected , despite the fact that that 's a hole big enough to drive a dozen web servers , eight web browsers , thirty-two Content Management Systems , four word processors , seventy-five programmer 's editors , nine complete GUI toolkits , thirty-six programming languages , four hundred and seventy three games of varying quality , twenty-one window managers , forty-five email clients , a partridge in a pear tree * , and Goddess knows what else through .
I used to try to explain the truly massive implications of those three simple words , but everyone ( HR , manager or engineer ) always said , " that 's fine , we do n't have a problem with it " , so I stopped bothering.Of course , it may help that I 'm in California where employee rights laws are generally pretty strong .
* all numbers just guesses--I actually think that Debian may have three partridges in pear trees somewhere in its repositories .</tokentext>
<sentencetext>I refused to sign an all-your-code-belongs-to-us agreement at my current employer, and almost didn't get the job because of it.They almost always have a place for you to fill in exemptions for code/inventions you already owned before coming to work for them.
As a Debian developer, I always just fill in "Debian GNU/Linux" in the exemption spot, and no one has ever objected, despite the fact that that's a hole big enough to drive a dozen web servers, eight web browsers, thirty-two Content Management Systems, four word processors, seventy-five programmer's editors, nine complete GUI toolkits, thirty-six programming languages, four hundred and seventy three games of varying quality, twenty-one window managers, forty-five email clients, a partridge in a pear tree*, and Goddess knows what else through.
I used to try to explain the truly massive implications of those three simple words, but everyone (HR, manager or engineer) always said, "that's fine, we don't have a problem with it", so I stopped bothering.Of course, it may help that I'm in California where employee rights laws are generally pretty strong.
* all numbers just guesses--I actually think that Debian may have three partridges in pear trees somewhere in its repositories.
	</sentencetext>
	<parent>http://www.semanticweb.org/ontologies/ConversationInstances.owl#comment09_06_04_1859255.28214185</parent>
</comment>
<comment>
	<id>http://www.semanticweb.org/ontologies/ConversationInstances.owl#comment09_06_04_1859255.28225201</id>
	<title>Re:all-your-code-is-ours</title>
	<author>cervo</author>
	<datestamp>1244227380000</datestamp>
	<modclass>None</modclass>
	<modscore>1</modscore>
	<htmltext>1) If it is related to the work at work then yes you should have first right to it.  Ie if you are paying your employee to work on an operating system and they develop a new scheduling algorithm then you have rights to it.  However if the employee offers you the algorithm and you are like no it's not part of our scheduled project and then he goes on to develop it on his own time (without using any company resources) and it becomes the next big thing you can't go back and claim you have rights on it.
a) note if you are a super international company with like 10 lines of business and your employee is working in IT for 1 line of business but creates something else for one of the other 9 lines of business, then that is tricky.....  Especially since you are paying them to work on your 1 line of business but not the others....
<br> <br>
I would say there is a fairness doctrine.  If you invent something related to your job, you should offer it to your employer first.  Otherwise as long as you develop it on your own time and equipment you should have all rights.
<br> <br>
2) Stuff done on the employee's own time belongs to the employee and not you.  If he/she is working on it during work hours or using equipment that you gave him/her then you have a claim.  If it is being worked on in his/her own time and equipment then no you shouldn't have a claim on it.  Assuming it's not an idea that was thought up as a result of work (in which case in fairness you deserve at least an offer to use it).
<br> <br>
But I agree with some agreements.  It should be obvious but I see why there need to be legal agreements to say keep your employers shit secret.  After all it's not fair to go leaking out customer lists or other data you have access to.  Also leaking out your employer's software secrets/proprietary algorithms should be a no no.  But there is also the issue of gaining experience and on the job knowledge.  That you should take with you.  And the line between technique and proprietary software secrets is a slippery one.  Especially on "obvious" inventions.  Still there is no way you should be giving or using any source code from your employer to anyone (unless it is under an open source license that permits it and your employer makes it available for distribution so anyone can access it).  On the other hand because you wrote a binary search for your employer that doesn't mean you can't go writing a binary search for anyone else.  Or because you write some new indexing scheme for a database file using a btree/hash table/etc. does not mean you shouldn't be able to do that for anyone else....<br> <br>

And that's the bottom line.  If you're paying me to be a junior developer why the fuck should I give you stuff I develop that you would pay someone 5 or 10 times my salary to create for free.  Let's say you are paying me 80,000 to work on your database system.  I do that 40 hours per week or whatever, you keep me busy full time.  My main job is doing reports for business users.  Meanwhile at home I create a revolutionary new database system.  This is a trickier case because you could argue it is related to what I do at work.  However using a database for reporting and developing one are completely different.  If I was working for Oracle on their core engine there would be an issue.  But as my job is reporting for end users and not database engine design I would say it's not related at all to what you're paying for and you have no claim as long as I don't work on it during work hours.<br> <br>

But let's say you pay me to work on a project.  Then I work on that project and in my own time I create another project that is closely related.  Then you probably have a claim on my project if you want.  But if you are paying me as a grunt developer and I deliver you a full project where I was a project manager/qa tester/architect/developer and you just take it and don't give me a bonus, percentage of the revenue, promotion, etc. I'm going to quit.  And I'm going to go invent something to bury you and give it away for free.</htmltext>
<tokenext>1 ) If it is related to the work at work then yes you should have first right to it .
Ie if you are paying your employee to work on an operating system and they develop a new scheduling algorithm then you have rights to it .
However if the employee offers you the algorithm and you are like no it 's not part of our scheduled project and then he goes on to develop it on his own time ( without using any company resources ) and it becomes the next big thing you ca n't go back and claim you have rights on it .
a ) note if you are a super international company with like 10 lines of business and your employee is working in IT for 1 line of business but creates something else for one of the other 9 lines of business , then that is tricky..... Especially since you are paying them to work on your 1 line of business but not the others... . I would say there is a fairness doctrine .
If you invent something related to your job , you should offer it to your employer first .
Otherwise as long as you develop it on your own time and equipment you should have all rights .
2 ) Stuff done on the employee 's own time belongs to the employee and not you .
If he/she is working on it during work hours or using equipment that you gave him/her then you have a claim .
If it is being worked on in his/her own time and equipment then no you should n't have a claim on it .
Assuming it 's not an idea that was thought up as a result of work ( in which case in fairness you deserve at least an offer to use it ) .
But I agree with some agreements .
It should be obvious but I see why there need to be legal agreements to say keep your employers shit secret .
After all it 's not fair to go leaking out customer lists or other data you have access to .
Also leaking out your employer 's software secrets/proprietary algorithms should be a no no .
But there is also the issue of gaining experience and on the job knowledge .
That you should take with you .
And the line between technique and proprietary software secrets is a slippery one .
Especially on " obvious " inventions .
Still there is no way you should be giving or using any source code from your employer to anyone ( unless it is under an open source license that permits it and your employer makes it available for distribution so anyone can access it ) .
On the other hand because you wrote a binary search for your employer that does n't mean you ca n't go writing a binary search for anyone else .
Or because you write some new indexing scheme for a database file using a btree/hash table/etc .
does not mean you should n't be able to do that for anyone else... . And that 's the bottom line .
If you 're paying me to be a junior developer why the fuck should I give you stuff I develop that you would pay someone 5 or 10 times my salary to create for free .
Let 's say you are paying me 80,000 to work on your database system .
I do that 40 hours per week or whatever , you keep me busy full time .
My main job is doing reports for business users .
Meanwhile at home I create a revolutionary new database system .
This is a trickier case because you could argue it is related to what I do at work .
However using a database for reporting and developing one are completely different .
If I was working for Oracle on their core engine there would be an issue .
But as my job is reporting for end users and not database engine design I would say it 's not related at all to what you 're paying for and you have no claim as long as I do n't work on it during work hours .
But let 's say you pay me to work on a project .
Then I work on that project and in my own time I create another project that is closely related .
Then you probably have a claim on my project if you want .
But if you are paying me as a grunt developer and I deliver you a full project where I was a project manager/qa tester/architect/developer and you just take it and do n't give me a bonus , percentage of the revenue , promotion , etc .
I 'm going to quit .
And I 'm going to go invent something to bury you and give it away for free .</tokentext>
<sentencetext>1) If it is related to the work at work then yes you should have first right to it.
Ie if you are paying your employee to work on an operating system and they develop a new scheduling algorithm then you have rights to it.
However if the employee offers you the algorithm and you are like no it's not part of our scheduled project and then he goes on to develop it on his own time (without using any company resources) and it becomes the next big thing you can't go back and claim you have rights on it.
a) note if you are a super international company with like 10 lines of business and your employee is working in IT for 1 line of business but creates something else for one of the other 9 lines of business, then that is tricky.....  Especially since you are paying them to work on your 1 line of business but not the others....
 
I would say there is a fairness doctrine.
If you invent something related to your job, you should offer it to your employer first.
Otherwise as long as you develop it on your own time and equipment you should have all rights.
2) Stuff done on the employee's own time belongs to the employee and not you.
If he/she is working on it during work hours or using equipment that you gave him/her then you have a claim.
If it is being worked on in his/her own time and equipment then no you shouldn't have a claim on it.
Assuming it's not an idea that was thought up as a result of work (in which case in fairness you deserve at least an offer to use it).
But I agree with some agreements.
It should be obvious but I see why there need to be legal agreements to say keep your employers shit secret.
After all it's not fair to go leaking out customer lists or other data you have access to.
Also leaking out your employer's software secrets/proprietary algorithms should be a no no.
But there is also the issue of gaining experience and on the job knowledge.
That you should take with you.
And the line between technique and proprietary software secrets is a slippery one.
Especially on "obvious" inventions.
Still there is no way you should be giving or using any source code from your employer to anyone (unless it is under an open source license that permits it and your employer makes it available for distribution so anyone can access it).
On the other hand because you wrote a binary search for your employer that doesn't mean you can't go writing a binary search for anyone else.
Or because you write some new indexing scheme for a database file using a btree/hash table/etc.
does not mean you shouldn't be able to do that for anyone else.... 

And that's the bottom line.
If you're paying me to be a junior developer why the fuck should I give you stuff I develop that you would pay someone 5 or 10 times my salary to create for free.
Let's say you are paying me 80,000 to work on your database system.
I do that 40 hours per week or whatever, you keep me busy full time.
My main job is doing reports for business users.
Meanwhile at home I create a revolutionary new database system.
This is a trickier case because you could argue it is related to what I do at work.
However using a database for reporting and developing one are completely different.
If I was working for Oracle on their core engine there would be an issue.
But as my job is reporting for end users and not database engine design I would say it's not related at all to what you're paying for and you have no claim as long as I don't work on it during work hours.
But let's say you pay me to work on a project.
Then I work on that project and in my own time I create another project that is closely related.
Then you probably have a claim on my project if you want.
But if you are paying me as a grunt developer and I deliver you a full project where I was a project manager/qa tester/architect/developer and you just take it and don't give me a bonus, percentage of the revenue, promotion, etc.
I'm going to quit.
And I'm going to go invent something to bury you and give it away for free.</sentencetext>
	<parent>http://www.semanticweb.org/ontologies/ConversationInstances.owl#comment09_06_04_1859255.28216177</parent>
</comment>
<comment>
	<id>http://www.semanticweb.org/ontologies/ConversationInstances.owl#comment09_06_04_1859255.28214331</id>
	<title>Re:Here's my approach</title>
	<author>harryandthehenderson</author>
	<datestamp>1244106600000</datestamp>
	<modclass>None</modclass>
	<modscore>1</modscore>
	<htmltext>Did he say so?  Just because one criticizes the quality of open source code doesn't mean you think closed source code is perfection.</htmltext>
<tokenext>Did he say so ?
Just because one criticizes the quality of open source code does n't mean you think closed source code is perfection .</tokentext>
<sentencetext>Did he say so?
Just because one criticizes the quality of open source code doesn't mean you think closed source code is perfection.</sentencetext>
	<parent>http://www.semanticweb.org/ontologies/ConversationInstances.owl#comment09_06_04_1859255.28214145</parent>
</comment>
<comment>
	<id>http://www.semanticweb.org/ontologies/ConversationInstances.owl#comment09_06_04_1859255.28217301</id>
	<title>Re:all-your-code-is-ours</title>
	<author>Anonymous</author>
	<datestamp>1244123760000</datestamp>
	<modclass>None</modclass>
	<modscore>1</modscore>
	<htmltext><p>If you pay someone to work on X, and he comes up with a useful idea about Y while waiting for X to compile, should you own that idea about Y?</p></htmltext>
<tokenext>If you pay someone to work on X , and he comes up with a useful idea about Y while waiting for X to compile , should you own that idea about Y ?</tokentext>
<sentencetext>If you pay someone to work on X, and he comes up with a useful idea about Y while waiting for X to compile, should you own that idea about Y?</sentencetext>
	<parent>http://www.semanticweb.org/ontologies/ConversationInstances.owl#comment09_06_04_1859255.28216177</parent>
</comment>
<comment>
	<id>http://www.semanticweb.org/ontologies/ConversationInstances.owl#comment09_06_04_1859255.28214583</id>
	<title>Emoticons</title>
	<author>Anonymous</author>
	<datestamp>1244108100000</datestamp>
	<modclass>Insightful</modclass>
	<modscore>2</modscore>
	<htmltext>Is it really necessary to have 6 smilie faces in the article? I wonder how many also show up in the Drizzle source. I also find it interesting that the author opts for the less common "no-nose smilie face"<nobr> <wbr></nobr>:)</htmltext>
<tokenext>Is it really necessary to have 6 smilie faces in the article ?
I wonder how many also show up in the Drizzle source .
I also find it interesting that the author opts for the less common " no-nose smilie face " : )</tokentext>
<sentencetext>Is it really necessary to have 6 smilie faces in the article?
I wonder how many also show up in the Drizzle source.
I also find it interesting that the author opts for the less common "no-nose smilie face" :)</sentencetext>
</comment>
<comment>
	<id>http://www.semanticweb.org/ontologies/ConversationInstances.owl#comment09_06_04_1859255.28214031</id>
	<title>Here's my approach</title>
	<author>buttmanchu</author>
	<datestamp>1244148420000</datestamp>
	<modclass>Troll</modclass>
	<modscore>-1</modscore>
	<htmltext>Delete it since most open sores "programmers" are shit.</htmltext>
<tokenext>Delete it since most open sores " programmers " are shit .</tokentext>
<sentencetext>Delete it since most open sores "programmers" are shit.</sentencetext>
</comment>
<comment>
	<id>http://www.semanticweb.org/ontologies/ConversationInstances.owl#comment09_06_04_1859255.28213989</id>
	<title>If this is not the first post...</title>
	<author>Anonymous</author>
	<datestamp>1244148240000</datestamp>
	<modclass>Offtopic</modclass>
	<modscore>-1</modscore>
	<htmltext>I will smear honey about my asshole and testicles and roll around on a fire-ants' nest.

As always, links to pictures would be posted!</htmltext>
<tokenext>I will smear honey about my asshole and testicles and roll around on a fire-ants ' nest .
As always , links to pictures would be posted !</tokentext>
<sentencetext>I will smear honey about my asshole and testicles and roll around on a fire-ants' nest.
As always, links to pictures would be posted!</sentencetext>
</comment>
<comment>
	<id>http://www.semanticweb.org/ontologies/ConversationInstances.owl#comment09_06_04_1859255.28219663</id>
	<title>Re:all-your-code-is-ours</title>
	<author>dna\_(c)(tm)(r)</author>
	<datestamp>1244195820000</datestamp>
	<modclass>None</modclass>
	<modscore>1</modscore>
	<htmltext><p><div class="quote"><p>[...]it's my dime that you developed it with!</p></div><p>It's about balance of power between 2 parties.</p><p>If the developer more or less steals your ideas or time, he's doing you wrong.</p><p>If you steel his ideas you did not pay for, you do wrong. An over extending contract enables you to do just that.</p><p>As a consultant I often work on clients software but in the mean time I develop some stuff I want for my business  and other customers at night/weekend. I've had very interesting experiences learning how to use things (technologies, products). But until now I've never seen any idea worth copying, never mind stealing, in 'Enterprise' software.</p></div>
	</htmltext>
<tokenext>[ ... ] it 's my dime that you developed it with ! It 's about balance of power between 2 parties.If the developer more or less steals your ideas or time , he 's doing you wrong.If you steel his ideas you did not pay for , you do wrong .
An over extending contract enables you to do just that.As a consultant I often work on clients software but in the mean time I develop some stuff I want for my business and other customers at night/weekend .
I 've had very interesting experiences learning how to use things ( technologies , products ) .
But until now I 've never seen any idea worth copying , never mind stealing , in 'Enterprise ' software .</tokentext>
<sentencetext>[...]it's my dime that you developed it with!It's about balance of power between 2 parties.If the developer more or less steals your ideas or time, he's doing you wrong.If you steel his ideas you did not pay for, you do wrong.
An over extending contract enables you to do just that.As a consultant I often work on clients software but in the mean time I develop some stuff I want for my business  and other customers at night/weekend.
I've had very interesting experiences learning how to use things (technologies, products).
But until now I've never seen any idea worth copying, never mind stealing, in 'Enterprise' software.
	</sentencetext>
	<parent>http://www.semanticweb.org/ontologies/ConversationInstances.owl#comment09_06_04_1859255.28216177</parent>
</comment>
<comment>
	<id>http://www.semanticweb.org/ontologies/ConversationInstances.owl#comment09_06_04_1859255.28217505</id>
	<title>Re:all-your-code-is-ours</title>
	<author>Anonymous</author>
	<datestamp>1244125860000</datestamp>
	<modclass>None</modclass>
	<modscore>0</modscore>
	<htmltext><p>In my case, refusing to sign the contract reduced it from just over 24 pages of legalese to 3 pages.</p><p>I noted that the "all of your current IP" conditions included plant and animal breeders rights, and asked if they wanted notarized copies of 20 years of breeding records.</p></htmltext>
<tokenext>In my case , refusing to sign the contract reduced it from just over 24 pages of legalese to 3 pages.I noted that the " all of your current IP " conditions included plant and animal breeders rights , and asked if they wanted notarized copies of 20 years of breeding records .</tokentext>
<sentencetext>In my case, refusing to sign the contract reduced it from just over 24 pages of legalese to 3 pages.I noted that the "all of your current IP" conditions included plant and animal breeders rights, and asked if they wanted notarized copies of 20 years of breeding records.</sentencetext>
	<parent>http://www.semanticweb.org/ontologies/ConversationInstances.owl#comment09_06_04_1859255.28214185</parent>
</comment>
<comment>
	<id>http://www.semanticweb.org/ontologies/ConversationInstances.owl#comment09_06_04_1859255.28214185</id>
	<title>all-your-code-is-ours</title>
	<author>Red Flayer</author>
	<datestamp>1244149080000</datestamp>
	<modclass>Insightful</modclass>
	<modscore>5</modscore>
	<htmltext>I don't write code anymore.  At all.  It's not my source of income, and I value other hobbies higher.<br> <br>Yet I refused to sign an all-your-code-belongs-to-us agreement at my current employer, and almost didn't get the job because of it.  The HR red-tape machine couldn't deal with a process exception, so the CFO of the company had to step in to resolve the issue on their end with their legal team.<br> <br>The reason I'm sharing it is this: the clueless HR drones are the ones enforcing the sign-it-or-go-away policy.  If you're worth your salt, and the company management is good, they'll make exceptions.  And from a principles point of view, you probably shouldn't work from a company that wants to enslave you.</htmltext>
<tokenext>I do n't write code anymore .
At all .
It 's not my source of income , and I value other hobbies higher .
Yet I refused to sign an all-your-code-belongs-to-us agreement at my current employer , and almost did n't get the job because of it .
The HR red-tape machine could n't deal with a process exception , so the CFO of the company had to step in to resolve the issue on their end with their legal team .
The reason I 'm sharing it is this : the clueless HR drones are the ones enforcing the sign-it-or-go-away policy .
If you 're worth your salt , and the company management is good , they 'll make exceptions .
And from a principles point of view , you probably should n't work from a company that wants to enslave you .</tokentext>
<sentencetext>I don't write code anymore.
At all.
It's not my source of income, and I value other hobbies higher.
Yet I refused to sign an all-your-code-belongs-to-us agreement at my current employer, and almost didn't get the job because of it.
The HR red-tape machine couldn't deal with a process exception, so the CFO of the company had to step in to resolve the issue on their end with their legal team.
The reason I'm sharing it is this: the clueless HR drones are the ones enforcing the sign-it-or-go-away policy.
If you're worth your salt, and the company management is good, they'll make exceptions.
And from a principles point of view, you probably shouldn't work from a company that wants to enslave you.</sentencetext>
</comment>
<comment>
	<id>http://www.semanticweb.org/ontologies/ConversationInstances.owl#comment09_06_04_1859255.28220743</id>
	<title>Re:Marketing</title>
	<author>Anonymous</author>
	<datestamp>1244208360000</datestamp>
	<modclass>None</modclass>
	<modscore>0</modscore>
	<htmltext><blockquote><div><p>[Drizzle is] a prelude to heavy rain and getting soaked and miserable.</p></div></blockquote><p>
You've never experienced Bastard Rain? You know, the sort of heavy drizzle that doesn't <i>seem</i> to be making you wet, until you get to your destination and you look down at your sodden clothes and...<br>
<br>
"Bastard!"<br>
<br>
Maybe it's a British thing...</p></div>
	</htmltext>
<tokenext>[ Drizzle is ] a prelude to heavy rain and getting soaked and miserable .
You 've never experienced Bastard Rain ?
You know , the sort of heavy drizzle that does n't seem to be making you wet , until you get to your destination and you look down at your sodden clothes and.. .
" Bastard ! " Maybe it 's a British thing.. .</tokentext>
<sentencetext>[Drizzle is] a prelude to heavy rain and getting soaked and miserable.
You've never experienced Bastard Rain?
You know, the sort of heavy drizzle that doesn't seem to be making you wet, until you get to your destination and you look down at your sodden clothes and...
"Bastard!"

Maybe it's a British thing...
	</sentencetext>
	<parent>http://www.semanticweb.org/ontologies/ConversationInstances.owl#comment09_06_04_1859255.28214743</parent>
</comment>
<comment>
	<id>http://www.semanticweb.org/ontologies/ConversationInstances.owl#comment09_06_04_1859255.28214007</id>
	<title>News: David Carradine alive and well! Hoax death.</title>
	<author>Anonymous</author>
	<datestamp>1244148360000</datestamp>
	<modclass>Offtopic</modclass>
	<modscore>-1</modscore>
	<htmltext><p>Apparently Carradine was eaten by wolves on the Connecticut turn-pike. All reports say he was delicious.</p></htmltext>
<tokenext>Apparently Carradine was eaten by wolves on the Connecticut turn-pike .
All reports say he was delicious .</tokentext>
<sentencetext>Apparently Carradine was eaten by wolves on the Connecticut turn-pike.
All reports say he was delicious.</sentencetext>
</comment>
<comment>
	<id>http://www.semanticweb.org/ontologies/ConversationInstances.owl#comment09_06_04_1859255.28219393</id>
	<title>Re:all-your-code-is-ours</title>
	<author>Crayon Kid</author>
	<datestamp>1244235420000</datestamp>
	<modclass>None</modclass>
	<modscore>1</modscore>
	<htmltext><blockquote><div><p>Really, what is wrong with that arrangement?</p></div></blockquote><p>It's not realistic, that's all.</p><p>Programmers get dozens of ideas while working on whatever it is they're working on. What do you propose to do about it? Short of keeping their brains in a jar, I mean. They will share those ideas, IF they feel motivated and IF they work environment is responsive enough to new ideas. Is yours?</p><p>I've worked in many companies who took a bit too much of the "plantation owner" approach towards the programmers, and then wondered why they never contributed ideas or, indeed, why productivity itself suffered. At some point, the programmer tells himself "screw this", starts doing the bare minimum and keeps the ideas to himself.</p><p>Also it would be good to remember that an idea, by itself, is nothing. It needs testing, it needs refining. At least half of the ideas that pop-up while programming would prove to be unfeasible in some way, if tested out.</p><p>Also, you can't shut the brain down at will. A good programmer is a person whose brain is a finely tuned instrument, who loves his work and who thinks of it in the most odd places and occasions. Furthermore, sources of input are all intertwined. So when a programmer gets an idea, it may happen anytime, anyplace, in response to stimuli that may have come from anywhere, including (but not exclusively) the workplace.</p><p>Who's to say what had the defining merit for an idea? It may have been the work he does for you, but then again it may not. If you're deluded into thinking that programming is a 9-5 job and that programmers don't explore other areas of thinking (arts, math, tech, history, philosophy, sports, hobbies) on their own, then you've already fallen into the slave driver rut.</p><p>My advice: treat programmers nicely, motivate them to contribute and feel they're doing themselves a service when they bring forth ideas, and count on their professional ethics. But remember that you'll never own all their ideas, and that using a heavy-handed approach will drive them away and STILL not get them to share their ideas.</p></div>
	</htmltext>
<tokenext>Really , what is wrong with that arrangement ? It 's not realistic , that 's all.Programmers get dozens of ideas while working on whatever it is they 're working on .
What do you propose to do about it ?
Short of keeping their brains in a jar , I mean .
They will share those ideas , IF they feel motivated and IF they work environment is responsive enough to new ideas .
Is yours ? I 've worked in many companies who took a bit too much of the " plantation owner " approach towards the programmers , and then wondered why they never contributed ideas or , indeed , why productivity itself suffered .
At some point , the programmer tells himself " screw this " , starts doing the bare minimum and keeps the ideas to himself.Also it would be good to remember that an idea , by itself , is nothing .
It needs testing , it needs refining .
At least half of the ideas that pop-up while programming would prove to be unfeasible in some way , if tested out.Also , you ca n't shut the brain down at will .
A good programmer is a person whose brain is a finely tuned instrument , who loves his work and who thinks of it in the most odd places and occasions .
Furthermore , sources of input are all intertwined .
So when a programmer gets an idea , it may happen anytime , anyplace , in response to stimuli that may have come from anywhere , including ( but not exclusively ) the workplace.Who 's to say what had the defining merit for an idea ?
It may have been the work he does for you , but then again it may not .
If you 're deluded into thinking that programming is a 9-5 job and that programmers do n't explore other areas of thinking ( arts , math , tech , history , philosophy , sports , hobbies ) on their own , then you 've already fallen into the slave driver rut.My advice : treat programmers nicely , motivate them to contribute and feel they 're doing themselves a service when they bring forth ideas , and count on their professional ethics .
But remember that you 'll never own all their ideas , and that using a heavy-handed approach will drive them away and STILL not get them to share their ideas .</tokentext>
<sentencetext>Really, what is wrong with that arrangement?It's not realistic, that's all.Programmers get dozens of ideas while working on whatever it is they're working on.
What do you propose to do about it?
Short of keeping their brains in a jar, I mean.
They will share those ideas, IF they feel motivated and IF they work environment is responsive enough to new ideas.
Is yours?I've worked in many companies who took a bit too much of the "plantation owner" approach towards the programmers, and then wondered why they never contributed ideas or, indeed, why productivity itself suffered.
At some point, the programmer tells himself "screw this", starts doing the bare minimum and keeps the ideas to himself.Also it would be good to remember that an idea, by itself, is nothing.
It needs testing, it needs refining.
At least half of the ideas that pop-up while programming would prove to be unfeasible in some way, if tested out.Also, you can't shut the brain down at will.
A good programmer is a person whose brain is a finely tuned instrument, who loves his work and who thinks of it in the most odd places and occasions.
Furthermore, sources of input are all intertwined.
So when a programmer gets an idea, it may happen anytime, anyplace, in response to stimuli that may have come from anywhere, including (but not exclusively) the workplace.Who's to say what had the defining merit for an idea?
It may have been the work he does for you, but then again it may not.
If you're deluded into thinking that programming is a 9-5 job and that programmers don't explore other areas of thinking (arts, math, tech, history, philosophy, sports, hobbies) on their own, then you've already fallen into the slave driver rut.My advice: treat programmers nicely, motivate them to contribute and feel they're doing themselves a service when they bring forth ideas, and count on their professional ethics.
But remember that you'll never own all their ideas, and that using a heavy-handed approach will drive them away and STILL not get them to share their ideas.
	</sentencetext>
	<parent>http://www.semanticweb.org/ontologies/ConversationInstances.owl#comment09_06_04_1859255.28216177</parent>
</comment>
<comment>
	<id>http://www.semanticweb.org/ontologies/ConversationInstances.owl#comment09_06_04_1859255.28214029</id>
	<title>fst pst</title>
	<author>Anonymous</author>
	<datestamp>1244148420000</datestamp>
	<modclass>Offtopic</modclass>
	<modscore>-1</modscore>
	<htmltext><p>hihi</p></htmltext>
<tokenext>hihi</tokentext>
<sentencetext>hihi</sentencetext>
</comment>
<comment>
	<id>http://www.semanticweb.org/ontologies/ConversationInstances.owl#comment09_06_04_1859255.28214909</id>
	<title>Re:Emoticons</title>
	<author>Anonymous</author>
	<datestamp>1244109600000</datestamp>
	<modclass>None</modclass>
	<modscore>0</modscore>
	<htmltext><p>Did you say less common? Who wastes time adding a nose?</p></htmltext>
<tokenext>Did you say less common ?
Who wastes time adding a nose ?</tokentext>
<sentencetext>Did you say less common?
Who wastes time adding a nose?</sentencetext>
	<parent>http://www.semanticweb.org/ontologies/ConversationInstances.owl#comment09_06_04_1859255.28214583</parent>
</comment>
<comment>
	<id>http://www.semanticweb.org/ontologies/ConversationInstances.owl#comment09_06_04_1859255.28214385</id>
	<title>Re:all-your-code-is-ours</title>
	<author>Anonymous</author>
	<datestamp>1244106900000</datestamp>
	<modclass>Insightful</modclass>
	<modscore>2</modscore>
	<htmltext><i>And from a principles point of view, you probably shouldn't work from a company that wants to enslave you.</i> <br>
While this is nice in principle, nearly every company wants to enslave you and even those that don't want you to sign similar slips of paper to work for them.  I love my job and they really don't want to enslave me, but when I came in I didn't have the leverage to not sign.  Good for you that you were but for the rest of us:  Odds are they won't bother with following through with something like that unless a) it is in competition (or perceived competition) with the company or b) it is interfering with your performance or c) they can leverage it into something that would rake in large profits with little expenditure.</htmltext>
<tokenext>And from a principles point of view , you probably should n't work from a company that wants to enslave you .
While this is nice in principle , nearly every company wants to enslave you and even those that do n't want you to sign similar slips of paper to work for them .
I love my job and they really do n't want to enslave me , but when I came in I did n't have the leverage to not sign .
Good for you that you were but for the rest of us : Odds are they wo n't bother with following through with something like that unless a ) it is in competition ( or perceived competition ) with the company or b ) it is interfering with your performance or c ) they can leverage it into something that would rake in large profits with little expenditure .</tokentext>
<sentencetext>And from a principles point of view, you probably shouldn't work from a company that wants to enslave you.
While this is nice in principle, nearly every company wants to enslave you and even those that don't want you to sign similar slips of paper to work for them.
I love my job and they really don't want to enslave me, but when I came in I didn't have the leverage to not sign.
Good for you that you were but for the rest of us:  Odds are they won't bother with following through with something like that unless a) it is in competition (or perceived competition) with the company or b) it is interfering with your performance or c) they can leverage it into something that would rake in large profits with little expenditure.</sentencetext>
	<parent>http://www.semanticweb.org/ontologies/ConversationInstances.owl#comment09_06_04_1859255.28214185</parent>
</comment>
<comment>
	<id>http://www.semanticweb.org/ontologies/ConversationInstances.owl#comment09_06_04_1859255.28215407</id>
	<title>Regression testing? No onerous coding contracts?</title>
	<author>pongo000</author>
	<datestamp>1244112060000</datestamp>
	<modclass>None</modclass>
	<modscore>1</modscore>
	<htmltext><p>Seems to me Perl developers, among others, have been doing this for years.  Where's the news here?</p></htmltext>
<tokenext>Seems to me Perl developers , among others , have been doing this for years .
Where 's the news here ?</tokentext>
<sentencetext>Seems to me Perl developers, among others, have been doing this for years.
Where's the news here?</sentencetext>
</comment>
<comment>
	<id>http://www.semanticweb.org/ontologies/ConversationInstances.owl#comment09_06_04_1859255.28214655</id>
	<title>Re:all-your-code-is-ours</title>
	<author>gambino21</author>
	<datestamp>1244108460000</datestamp>
	<modclass>None</modclass>
	<modscore>1</modscore>
	<htmltext>I agree with your opinion about not signing an agreement like this, but I believe the blog post is referring to something slightly different.  Many open source projects require contributors to sign an agreement that basically say that the code you are contributing does not have existing copyright restrictions.  This is a little different than the employer/employee contracts that says all your code/work/ideas/children created during employment belong to the company.  The contributor license at <a href="http://www.apache.org/licenses/icla.txt" title="apache.org">apache</a> [apache.org] for example, I think is more aimed at preventing them from being sued in case someone uploads all their company's proprietary code to an open source project.</htmltext>
<tokenext>I agree with your opinion about not signing an agreement like this , but I believe the blog post is referring to something slightly different .
Many open source projects require contributors to sign an agreement that basically say that the code you are contributing does not have existing copyright restrictions .
This is a little different than the employer/employee contracts that says all your code/work/ideas/children created during employment belong to the company .
The contributor license at apache [ apache.org ] for example , I think is more aimed at preventing them from being sued in case someone uploads all their company 's proprietary code to an open source project .</tokentext>
<sentencetext>I agree with your opinion about not signing an agreement like this, but I believe the blog post is referring to something slightly different.
Many open source projects require contributors to sign an agreement that basically say that the code you are contributing does not have existing copyright restrictions.
This is a little different than the employer/employee contracts that says all your code/work/ideas/children created during employment belong to the company.
The contributor license at apache [apache.org] for example, I think is more aimed at preventing them from being sued in case someone uploads all their company's proprietary code to an open source project.</sentencetext>
	<parent>http://www.semanticweb.org/ontologies/ConversationInstances.owl#comment09_06_04_1859255.28214185</parent>
</comment>
<comment>
	<id>http://www.semanticweb.org/ontologies/ConversationInstances.owl#comment09_06_04_1859255.28223343</id>
	<title>Re:all-your-code-is-ours</title>
	<author>Anonymous</author>
	<datestamp>1244220240000</datestamp>
	<modclass>None</modclass>
	<modscore>0</modscore>
	<htmltext><p>I think ethically you should disclose every idea that entered you head have since they own them. I had any idea to pimp out the cute receptionist, or I should say you have an idea. You&#226;(TM)re welcome.</p></htmltext>
<tokenext>I think ethically you should disclose every idea that entered you head have since they own them .
I had any idea to pimp out the cute receptionist , or I should say you have an idea .
You   ( TM ) re welcome .</tokentext>
<sentencetext>I think ethically you should disclose every idea that entered you head have since they own them.
I had any idea to pimp out the cute receptionist, or I should say you have an idea.
Youâ(TM)re welcome.</sentencetext>
	<parent>http://www.semanticweb.org/ontologies/ConversationInstances.owl#comment09_06_04_1859255.28216177</parent>
</comment>
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